North Dakota Mass-Murder Mystery

A continuation.

Someone on another forum said a past employee had been charged with terrorizing the company a while back but offered no link.

Oh, geez. Somebody better call Margie in, t' investigate the malfeasance.

I haven't seen any speculation that has been verified so I'd take it all with a huge grain of salt.

What do we know so far?

Reposting the employee slideshow.

Poor Jose no last name. I hope he has a good alibi.

Jackie has crazy Ramona Singer eyes.

I'm still going with the murder/suicide angle with Adam Faust who was supposedly an employee there for eight years but not on the employee webpage...

[quote] so I'd take it all with a huge grain of salt.

Perhaps that’s how they died - by ingesting a huge grain of salt.

What we know so far...and it's damn little:

Colonal Mustard Gas.

Who is the ginger in the jammies?

We know Ben is a vers bottom, has random tattoos and would like to live in NYC. And after that ... not much

R11 Do keep up, darling. He makes up about half of the initial thread.

R10, are you also R490 from the prior thread?

It's one thing to make fun of public figures, but it's not this random guy's fault there was a mass murder at his work and now to ridicule him because he's connected in it.

This is one of the few times I would say dataloungers have gone too far. As far as we know he's not even involved in the murders--he just happens to work there. We're mocking a random bystander.

Hon, I have no interest in ‘keeping up’ with nonsense

I just wanted to know the name of the torso that keeps floating by my scrolling.

If you can’t help, then run back to your breathless updates about another (yawn) mass murder in shithole USA

You would think Ben would have taken this part off the homepage at least until things shake out.

A Family Owned Quality Service For over 20 years we have collected rents, advised, and provided financial statements for our clients. As a family owned and operated company, we take pride in giving our clients a top quality service. Our hands-on approach to property management gives us a competitive advantage over other companies.

I'm surprised how high the rent is out there.

I’m sure Ben’s approach is hands on.

[quote] I'm surprised how high the rent is out there.

A rock of meth?

Has the dog semen at the scene been explained yet?

R15 Fuck off overly concerned Frau.

Like I said on the last thread, Ben is an adult with a public profile, and a social media presence that he has not set to "private". No one is trying to do him harm. Everything we know about him, comes from him.

"A random bystander" Give me a fucking break.

Mm, not sure R14. I am R1 from that thread though.

Adam Fuehrer is the one at the way back of the group photo (to the viewer's left), isn't he?

Nope, I hadn't seen that R14. Oops.

We are not mocking Ben. We are hoping to cultivate his affection in order to get inside information. Detective work often involves moral compromises. It’s not for the squeamish.

Poisoned lutefisk & lefse.

I'm a Ben Barnes troll but I'm going to start moonlighting as a Ben P troll.

Ben Pace should be "adopted" by Lee Pace. A whole new world would open up for DL's Favorite NoDak Lad.

[quote]We are not mocking Ben. We are hoping to cultivate his affection in order to get inside information.

Personally, I’m trying to cultivate his affection to get inside something, but it’s not information.

This place sounds like a shithole. Everyone except Ben sounds limited:

"We are also told several community businesses have been helpful in offering up surveillance video -- but they are having difficulty accessing it. Leading them to reach out to individual I-T people who have access to the footage."

Oy vey!

[quote] Everyone except Ben sounds limited:

Some of Ben’s quotes from the last thread were not up to DL grammatical and spelling standards.

r32 True, but at least he tries. Poor lad.

You guys should leave him alone. The kid never asked for this attention.

He’s posted about the incident since it occurred.

R31, It's Bismarck-Mandan, Jake.

Ben is sweet, but I want more info on Mr Scarfy, the hot top. His mixing of work boots and neck accessories intrigues me

Do you think Ben is reading here?

I have to believe Ben is aware of us bitches by now

Any news in the last few hours? I am so intrigued by this. I have been home this week w bronchitis and in so bored.

I doubt Ben is here, unless one of you bitches have DMed him and clued him in. There would be no way to read through all the stores about this event on every local tv station and newspaper if he just googled. Also, I find it highly unlikely that he has a google alert set up for his name, as he’s not an aspiring InstaHo. Besides, his name is a pretty common one so it would be hard to wade through all the false positives. He might have been the social media person for the company but he’s obviously not that internet savvy since all his personal accounts are public, a real no-no when it’s your profession.

Fess up, have any of you tried to contact this guy?

I, myself, have not.

Here's something interesting. The company held a storage auction on the 29th of March. Maybe they auctioned off items belonging to a disgruntled customer, one who couldn't pay their bills.

I think it would be wise to focus on the case and not Ben. I do not want these threads to be deleted!

[quote], The company held a storage auction on the 29th of March.

Was it called “Your Self Storage”?

Wow, this is straight out of the first season of Ozark.

Why the freak out that these threads might get deleted because of discussing Ben? Settle down, Beavis.

Live stream if you're interested, they're going to interview the daughters of the victims.

r49 Link is not linking. Interesting that the daughters are going to speak when there is so little information being released.

Waiting for Jackie to give a press conference...

I watched it, R50. They were on for about 30 seconds, crying, saying how much they'd miss their parents, and wondering how anyone could kill them. One of them has anxiety and the step dad would talk her through anxiety attacks.

They dun died.

I doubt these cops are doing a good job.

Asked on the last thread but it ended before I got a reply:

Does anyone else see a bulge in OP’s pic or is that the fabric bunching?

I think that's a bulge, R55.

Hey gurl heeeeey

Anyone hear from Ginny in Billing today?

The local TV station's Twitter has some more info... there was a rumor that another body was found, but police are denying it, plus there was police activity/a search in a field behind a McDonald's near RJR, but police were also refusing to comment on whether it was connected to the homicide investigation.

Heyyyy

The Washington Post is on it!

I fucked Ben in his onesie

The locals are getting irate

I'd be irate too if the police said no one else was at risk, no murder weapon was found on scene and the killer was still at large.

The key detail in that pathetically punctuated MyNDNow article is that the Mandan police have never had a multiple-homicide investigation. What assurances do the surviving RJR Maintenance and Management employees have that the murderer won't be coming for them next?

R64, are you the Evening Punctuationist?

r65 I am not the Evening Punctuationist. The Evening Punctuation attributes his posts and usually mentions his assistant Randolf. I am a frustrated armchair detective in a coastal area, brainstorming ideas for a murder mystery: "Staff Cuts Announced." Names and likenesses will be changed to protect the innocent, but more importantly, me.

Sorry to be so incommunicado all day but these memorials don't arrange themselves you know. The police still say the staff lunch room is out of the question, so I'm afraid it'll have to be the Lipschitz Room over at the lodge. They've been very accommodating over there though if they offer me one more pickled egg monstrosity, I'm going to lose my temper. It's bad enough their contribution to the Memorial Meal vis apparently going to be two of their king-size jars of pickled eggs. Honestly, how on earth they kept their food licence as long as they did is beyond me. Luckily my continuous crying spasms have meant I've been left in peace for most of the day and have the Memorial Meal pretty much all planned. Now I know we're none of us at our best in the face of such a heinous crime, but that's no reason for us to just show up as a group with 18 different Bundt cakes just because nobody bothered to cast an eye at my rather detailed sign up sheet for mourners. I don't want a repeat of the meal following Jenny-Lee's "accidental" gun misadventure last spring-I bet most big city burn wards have never seen THAT much jello. You'll see by my list, I'm not expecting any miracles...little HopSyng is invited to bring some of her wonderful Thai...creations. However, the rest of us will be sticking to normal food. Ginny from Billing

The focus on Ben is extremely creepy.

Best thing for them really. Their therapy was going nowhere.

I can't help it, I'm worried about our Ben. Don't you think it would be very hard in him being gay in a little town? It surely cant be easy for him, who does he really have to talk to, especially after a tragedy like this?

My hopes are that he's secretly reading these threads and that he knows that there are many of us concerned for his emotional as well as his physical wellbeing, especially since they haven't caught the perp.

Ben, if you're reading this, I hope that you would find the strength to reveal yourself to us. There are many of us here who are concerned and would like to help you and even set up a fund to help you move. I hope that you have some form of moral support to get through this terrible time.

R70 is frightening.

Oh lord R70 lots of gay men grow up and survive the Midwest. Where do you think half the guys from SF and LA are from?

Check out the comments on Ben's latest instagram post. He knows about this place now, if he didn't before. Which one of you bitches buckled?

R64 I'm hoping/thinking that bc of the experience of local law enforcement, national attention, and the ghost-perp leaving everyone in confusion that this has been escalated to the Feds. Would also explain the vacuum on clear, explicit information from being disclosed.

R70 You sound like you're talking to a Ouija board.

Who the fuck is cozymonsterincorporated?

r75 I'm guessing r70

If I were a Midwest gayling whose coworkers (the ones I considered friends) met a shocking and grisly death, I do not believe i would seek comfort among strangers obsessing about the bulge in my onesie.

No, I don't have any social media, R76.

Apropos of nothing, Ben looks to me how I'd imagine a real-life modern day Archie Andrews would.

R73, thanks for pointing that out. I hate it when some asshole has to go and ruin our fun. He’ll probably make all his social media private now.

Will they use a wood chipper to prepare for the funerals?

R80 I would have thought he would have made it private right away. Maybe he likes some of the attention? I don't mean that in a cunty way.

[quote]I have to believe Ben is aware of us bitches by now

The second he finds out about this thread, it's gone, just like when you psychopaths hassled that goofy couple because some rando posted a link to their wedding blog here -- someone waa even threatening them. Same happened with the water charity lady and others.

That's one reason why I've never understood the "DL doesn't have trolls" folks, because posting this guy's personal info and then talking about him like he's a murderer or a porn star, then constantly asking "HAS HE NOTICED ME YET?!?!" is 100% trolling.

Link to the comments on his Instagram post please.

I hope you’ve saved these threads because they will be gone.

Who are his people?

Datalounge comment on his insta got deleted...

Good. Now all of the Marys on here mourning this thread's IMMINENT DELETION can take a fucking break now.

How is Mr Scarfy?

Scarfy is spending the night w Alex-blond-hockey guy.

We have a new DL record! I have read all the posts on both threads, 690 posts and no one has yet said "what was on their iPod?"!!!!! Or "can I have their stuff?"!!!

You're slipping DL!

I'm with you r91 It might be time to shake the Almond Roca can to call in the sleuth-Frauen. They squeezed out every last drop of intel in the Chris Watts threads.

Agree r92. On first thread, we summoned Marge and another frau. Can't remember her equally funny name. Apparently, other posters kicked Marge off the crack team as she had bungled last year's scandalous ding dong ditch it investigation over in Grand Fork, ND.

[quote]I'd be irate too if the police said no one else was at risk, no murder weapon was found on scene and the killer was still at large.

Amen to this.

[quote]Oh lord [R70] lots of gay men grow up and survive the Midwest. Where do you think half the guys from SF and LA are from?

You're making his point, r72. How they survive the Midwest is by leaving it and heading for SF or LA.

[quote]Datalounge comment on his insta got deleted...

Which is his instagram? There are at least 5 Ben Pace accounts.

It's the one with his picture on it, Rose.

Google doesn't show them with pictures, r97. But thank you very much.

He reminds me of the big-dicked B'way actor who's also on NCIS: LA.

Ben better get that ass to the big city before he's too old for hot rich daddies.

[quote]I'd be irate too if the police said no one else was at risk, no murder weapon was found on scene and the killer was still at large.

Seriously. I can't believe the cops actually had the nerve to claim no one is at risk when the killer is still out there.

Even if the person doesn't plan on killing anyone else, he (probably a he) could easily kill someone if cornered while they are trying to evade detection.

Send in the Feds or this will never come together.

It shouldn't hard even for bumbling little local cops to figure out who this person is r102. I mean this was a very targeted crime.

Speaking only for myself, but there are so many crimes I dismiss as uninteresting. Then there are the ones like this, where something is “off”. And it’s because the stupid police say stupid things.

Like the murder/suicide by Nichol Olsen where the sheriff said he doubted the ME’s finding. Or the Sherri Papini case where they stuck to the narrative that two Latinas kidnapped and tortured the pretty blonde mommy.

The general public is pretty stupid in general, but plenty of people can smell a rat.

[quote]690 posts and no one has yet said "what was on their iPod?"!!!!! Or "can I have their stuff?"!!!

That's because the nosy old biddies are too busy posting all the personally identifying information they can find on him, while the eldergays are too busy dreaming about taking advantage of a distraught and naive young guy by sending him cash so he can "escape" North Dakota. No time to meme.

Meanwhile, the cops remain fully committed to doing absolutely nothing to help the victims left behind or to make the community feel secure.

Fantastic, all around.

Seriously, R104. I'm certain the police are telling lies about the case. Maybe it's because they think it's best for the investigation, but I suspect there's something less noble going on here.

No updates except the press asking "Why the hell aren't there any updates?"

This case reminds me of In Cold Blood. Bleak plains setting, inept local cops who've never seen such a big crime before, etc.

And we're all Truman Capote.

You've withheld clues and information that made it impossible for us to guess who did it!

[quote]Google doesn't show them with pictures, R97. But thank you very much.

Wait. So you have an Instagram account but looked for his profile through google?!

The wife did it.

She called 911 to report the crime to make it look like she discovered the bodies.

Doing CPR on one or more of her victims would explain why she had blood all over her.

She is so ‘distraught’ after finding them they have her in the hospital recovering, that is why there is no threat to the community.

Cops know she did it and are questioning staff about any martial issues or inter office fueds that point to her.

She could possibly have an accomplice - the person who drove the truck to/away from scene at 7am.

Possibly an affair with a co-worker and they wanted the husband gone. Others were collateral damage to make it look like a robbery or crime vs the obvious just killing her husband.

That’s my 2cents.

^ marital issues

R111 that actually makes a lot of sense...

[quote] "I haven't seen any speculation that has been verified so I'd take it all with a huge grain of salt.—Anonymous"

The "Huge Grain Of Salt" Troll.

Interesting R111. If not the wife then another family member, which might explain why they said there was no danger to the public.

[quote]She could possibly have an accomplice - the person who drove the truck to/away from scene at 7am.

This is the only part of your theory I’m not sure about. I think that person was just an employee dropping off his personal car and taking a company vehicle to start work for the day.

Other than that, very interesting and, from what we know to date, solid theory.

R110 Six of one...

Either place showed me five or six different versions of Ben Pace, so I thought I'd ask. Why do you get such a hard-on shaming me for that, you vicious cunt?

[quote]Why do you get such a hard-on shaming me for that, you vicious cunt?

Hey asshole, I asked a question. I’m not the one who called you Rose or shamed you ya twat. If you think me asking you a question is shaming you, maybe that’s your actual shame at your stupidity shining through.

Or, r118, you're more of a cunt than you realize.

R111. Very astute. Best analysis yet. Thanks.

Do you really think the wife could have stabbed/chopped up all the bodies by herself? Accomplice maybe?

If Jackie stayed behind after committing the murders, then where did the weapon go?

The lack of murder weapon indicates the killer left.

I'm convinced they were shot and the police don't want to admit that for some reason. It would be almost impossible for a single person to stab four people to death one at a time.

If there had been some kind of chemical or gas used to kill everyone at once, the responders and the person doing CPR wouldn't have been able to be in the building for any length of time.

Plus I want to know when all of the victims arrived at work... There ought to be surveillance video from earlier, like the night before?

They do have outdoor surveillance because they know that one car showed up, then a few minutes later an RJR truck left. The building itself surely has surveillance, too. It would be ridiculous to be dealing with money for rent payments (as well as storing keys and repair equipment) and not have security cameras.

That's why I think they know who did it. Either they have footage and know who it was, or the security cameras were turned off, limiting the suspects to just a handful.

Why they're being so cagey about it is the big question.

I am so engrossed in this as I have been off work this week and am bored. But, I think it has to be simply police in a small town facing their first big national case and they are afraid to make any footfaults in this age of social media. Thus they are just overplaying the quietness card. Not cool though because normal people wonder if there is a fucking killer roaming their neighborhoods.

[quote]Do you really think the wife could have stabbed/chopped up all the bodies by herself? Accomplice maybe?

I don’t think so. BUT, what if she shot them and THEN chopped them up after they were dead? Though I can’t imagine why other than an incredible rage.

R127 here. I didn’t mean I don’t think so to her having an accomplice, but to the first part:

[quote]Do you really think the wife could have stabbed/chopped up all the bodies by herself?

^ she might have shot them then driven the forklift back and forth over them. One article said they had a warehouse section in building. Must have had a forklift for boxes of cleaning supplies etc for rental mgmt

The warehouse part made me think they might have died from carbon monoxide poisoning, but if someone was able to hang around long enough to try CPR, that doesn't seem likely.

No one here is wishing to take advantage of Ben, R105.

We do know for sure that there are 4 job openings .

Poison to disable, then a stab-fest?

[quote]Doing CPR on one or more of her victims would explain why she had blood all over her.

Good theory, R111, but where did you read that she (wife, Jackie Fakler) was even at the scene, much less covered in blood?

[quote]No one here is wishing to take advantage of Ben, [R105].

Of course not. You just come off as leering, obsessive trolls.

R134, I’m not r111, but I think he was speculating that if she was at the scene, to explain the blood on her (from murdering the people) that a reasonable excuse would be because she was doing CPR. In other words, she was setting up an alibi.

I haven’t read anything about the wife. For all we know she’s down in Florida or something.

My Stephen King brain is going a mile a minute on this. I'm addicted. What the fuck, was it aliens or something? (Not you Jose).

R136 This article states that Jackie went back to the office on Wednesday.

Yes r138, it specifies she went back to work on Wednesday when everyone else did. It didn’t say she wasn’t there the day of the murders.

I think the fact we haven't heard a single word from Jackie or someone representing Jackie pretty much points to her. She had the means, and many potential motives could have been at play (an affair, jealousy, revenge, or she just snapped). She has either lawyered up or, as I mentioned earlier, is in a psych ward. Possibly both. Hence, no "official" suspect, yet public is safe.

She does have those Ramona Singer crazy eyes!

R140. Dumbass, she's back at work.

A friend who saw Jackie and her (now dead) husband at a restaurant the day before the murders told the press she wasn't able to get hold of them to find out what was going on. That was before the names of the deceased were released.

We speculated that she was missing, but once they re-opened Wednesday, we realized she was still around.

The best we can tell, none of the employees are missing.

[quote]She has either lawyered up or, as I mentioned earlier, is in a psych ward.

There are only a small handful of articles out there, yet some of you can't be bothered to read them.

We know the place is back open, but do we know Jackie is back at work? Would YOU be just a couple of days after your husband was brutally murdered?

If she is back at work, like no big deal, that's even weirder.

She’s got a business to run.

[quote] My Stephen King brain is going a mile a minute on this. I'm addicted.

Me too, r137. I haven't been so titillated since MH370 went down.

What would it take for me to lose interest in this? Cause of deaths, identification and capture of suspect, time(s) of attack. Forensic investigators would know the latter, the medical examiner the first.

r143 or any other poster, If you don't mind sharing the article that states everyone (minus the dead people let's hope) is back at work, that would be much appreciated.

From R138

[quote] The mood at the company was somber as a police officer monitored the parking lot and workers quietly talked with one another outside before the company opened Wednesday morning. Company co-owner Jackie Fakler, whose husband was among the dead, also returned to work.

People share articles all the time on this thread, the problem is many don’t bother to read them.

R147 Thanks for the tip.

I don't think we should assume that all of these "never seen anything like it" statements mean that the murders were especially gruesome or freakish. From the Washington Post:

[quote]"the crime is unprecedented in recent Mandan history. She said she has worked at the department for 42 years and that the city hasn’t seen another quadruple homicide in that time. Monday’s body count alone exceeded the total number of homicides in Mandan from 2013 to 2017, the most recent year of crime data available. In those five years, city police reported just three murders."

So even if it was a plain straightforward shooting, the Manadan police still have quite literally never seen anything like it. And if it had been really gory, they'd still be cleaning the building. It's crazy to me that they've allowed people back to work though. That's a huge building -- are we supposed to believe that they scoured every inch of the place for clues in only three days?

[quote]That's a huge building -- are we supposed to believe that they scoured every inch of the place for clues in only three days?

Reading about true crime is one of my hobbies. If there is one common theme in the cases I've read about, it's that the smaller the town, the more likely the local police will bungle the investigation.

I don't know why the police wouldn't accept the help of the FBI. They don't seem to have much experience in this type of crime.. a rare occurrence in that area.

R149 Many thanks!

And yeah, I'm sure they need to run the place, but to me it is indeed odd that she would be back so soon.

They have already brought in the state criminal investigators who are actually local (Mandan is just across the river from the state capital).

The thread on Reddit in North Dakota has some interesting tidbits. The "best" being that the victims heads were missing which is why it was hard to identify the victims. Whoever discovered the bodies had a heart attack at the scene which is why EMTs were called for a medical assist, then they discovered the crime scene. Police were searching a field a half mile from the office earlier today.

Holy fuck r156!!!!! Good work. Jesus, now I'm even more engrossed. Heads chopped off?????!!!!!! Fuckkkkkkkkkkkkk

R156 Sounds like the co-owner wife was the one who found them.

Wow! (Who knew North Dakota had its own subreddit?)

Decapitation would fit in with "they didn't do this to themselves."

I'm reading /r/northdakota and the anecdotes from people who know family of the deceased re claiming shooting.

Headless Bodies Found Where Topped Boy Works!

So, are we supposed to be impressed?

Wait—“missing” as in detached or “missing” as in not there?

I'd guessed decapitation in the first thread, but I wasn't really serious. Here's the subreddit

r156 FANTASTIC FIND! Holy shit! I'm wigging out here. Mary! I know, but come on...decapitation? All of them? That takes some work one would imagine. So, there had to be more than one person involved.

Are bath salts a thing out there? This sounds more insane by the second.

MORE! MORE!

So why won’t the police SAY it was a shooting?

They’re being coy drama queens. This is their one moment to get the country’s attention and they went for it.

This is starting to sound like a cartel killing. Be as theatrical as possible to send a message to the people you're trying to get in line.

So maybe they had a tip about that field they were searching yesterday as a possible site for the heads.

r160 retracting -- i'm leaning toward decapitation. Maybe the police are telling the townsfolk they're not in danger so they don't get itchy trigger fingers and go all George Zimmerman on each other.

R165, I missed that. Well, it would explain why the ID was difficult. And why they wouldn’t give the daughter more details. And why it was “rare” and something they hadn’t seen before.

But really, if someone did that and hadn’t been caught, the police shouldn’t tell the public that there’s no danger. Someone who does that is extremely dangerous.

THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE!

Get Brad Pitt on the case

Oh hey if this was a targeted killing, as the Mandan police are surmising, then it's possible, with four people being dead, that there could be more than one murderer, right?

^ if all four were decapitated, I have to believe it was more than one perpetrator. That's a lot of work.

How long does it take to chop a head off? Let alone four of the fuckers

If they were out or dead already, it wouldn't be that hard. A strong guy with a heavy sword or cleaver should be able to do it in a few chops. I could see ND being the sort of place where a lot of weird knife or sword collectors, or historical re-enactor types live. In fact the local Society for Creative Anachronism is based out of Bismarck!

R162 was joking, but Anne Boleyn was decapitated with a sword.

I know too much about this subject. I read up on it when the first wave of beheading videos came out. Long story short it takes a LOT of work and strength to decapitate someone with a blade that has no sort of mechanical assist (e.g. guillotine, chainsaw). Not to mention time to get the job done. Were they shot first to immobilize and then beheaded? Although, I guess a chainsaw hasn't been ruled out, I would think they would still be cleaning up the mess. This is absolutely bizarre as fuck.

The police seldom solve anything. How most criminals get caught: Ex- spouse, lover, friend or relative with a grudge decides to get revenge & spills the beans.

They may have stored tools in the building for apartment repairs and work on their properties. Could have been chainsaws all over the place in there!

Following decapitation angle, four victims, multiple suspects, not a domestic violence incident, harm against the company intended.

Maybe RJR fucked up and auctioned off the contents of the wrong storage unit.

I DON'T KNOW WHO ATE MY YOPLAIT BUT SOMEONE'S GOING TO PAY FOR THIS

I don’t buy the beheadings theory. With the police saying the suspect(s) posed no danger to the public and the employees back at work already? I mean I won’t come near that building if I’ve known people were just decapitated left and right. By what? Phantom terrorrists?

I love you R156 and R161.

R179, I was thinking that.

Also, I would imagine that RJR would have surveillance cameras inside the facility. In the warehouse, because equipment theft and workmen’s comp scams. And in the offices (or reception) because tenants dropping off payments and maybe it wasn’t always checks, but cash. I’d think that their insurance carrier would require it.

If the cameras were turned off, who would know how to do that?

On a whim I googled "Bismark Drug Bust" and got this article. I think the murders could be a drug cartel revenge killing for snitching on these 2 guys. Property management companies are often involved in investigations. Cops would know it's a revenge killing because they worked the case and got info from the landlord. That's why they know the public is safe and the killing was isolated to this location. . This would also explain why the employees are all so tight-lipped, their lives depend on it. Ben, you in danger girl. Come to NY where you'll be safe.

r185 Those ears on the demented elf guy can't be real. What a couple of snuggle bunnies those two are.

Oh God, R185. Now I'm really worried about Ben.

R185. Excellent work. Best theory yet.

This is some fucked-up Hereditary Bird Box business right here.

Does the guy with the big ears have a lump growing out the back of his neck?

R185 probably right, and way ahead of the bumbling cops.

R185 You should send your theory in to the Washington Post. Excellent work!

Don't state authorities or the Feds get involved in multiple murders in small jurisdictions with limited resources? By this point in other investigations, one usually reads about other agencies assisting.

Reading the local Reddit, it states that it most likely involves DV. I am proud to say that as a queer New Yorker my first thought was -- DIANA VREELAND??!!! but then later googled and found Domestic Violence.

Still -- the thought of Diana Vreeland shouting "I want those HEADS CHOPPED RIGHT OFF!!" to a league of female assistants does delight.

Come to New York, Ben -- we'll tell you about this sort of thing

I love you, R194. You’re a true DLer.

Not DV; it involves DP.

I'm about ready to sponsor Ben myself to help him get out of the situation. He needs to get away from ND as soon as he possibly can.

Evidence points to wife swapping group.

Ben Pace left the grisly murder scene and is now the coatcheck boy at 54 Below.

R197 I really do find it interesting that Ben is keeping his SM accounts open. Ben, if you are reading this, give us a sign. Post something saying "Yes, I would like a GoFundMe set up to get me the fuck out of here" and we will make it happen.

R185. You insipired me to do some sleuthing. Below is an excerpt from WaPo or Fox News (sorry) regarding tactics of El Chapo and other drug cartels operating in the US:

There’s beheading by chainsaw - a rumored favored method of Guzmán, who is said to feature in a 2010 video doing exactly that to murder victim Hugo Hernandez. Even worse, Hernandez's face was reportedly peeled off after he was killed and stitched on a football.R185. You inspired me to do some sleuthing. Below is from an article in WaPo or Fox News (sorry) regarding tactics of El Chapo and other drug cartels operating in the US:

^ bad copy paste. Sorry. You get it

[quote]Still -- the thought of Diana Vreeland shouting "I want those HEADS CHOPPED RIGHT OFF!!" to a league of female assistants does delight.

WHY DON'T YOU . . . arbitrarily decapitate your acquaintances and then make off with their heads, as is customary in the Mohammedan regions?

I don't think he's safe there, R200. First off, it's North Dakota, and life can't be easy for him there. Secondly, he's the one who responded to reviews of the business online. If the murders were committed by a disgruntled customer, Ben could be in serious danger. What if, (heaven forbid) Ben actually responded to the killer or unknowingly communicated with him?

Ben, if you're reading here, give us a sign like R200 suggests. Maybe put something like "I'd like a NYC fund" on your Facebook, so we can be sure it's you and that you are willing to be the beneficiary of some sort of trust fund to help you.

As if. You pathetic stalkers couldn’t come up with bus fare to Fargo.

I wonder if he did see the post on his Instagram that we were here? Maybe he didn't delete it, but the poster chickened out and deleted it themselves before he saw it? Shit, I hope not. Ben! *waves arms* Over here!

No one is stalking him, R205, some of us are worried for his safety, and you have no earthly clue what I can and cannot afford.

Are you worried for the safety of the rest of the employees or just the twink? Stalker.

For all of them actually, but I doubt that any of the others desperately need or have the desire to leave the state, R208.

^deranged and deluded

R209, what makes you think needs or wants to leave? You guys are creepy af.

I think reply 203 is slightly racist but loaded with bizzaz!

The local police refused FBI help?

I did not know that could be done. Just assumed that if the Feds “ask” to assist, they take over.

What are you talking about, R210, R211? Ben himself expressed a desire to live in NY, someone linked a post of his in the previous thread that said exactly that. Can you blame him? He's gay and stuck in a small town in a red state, and he's just experienced a terrible trauma. The bumbling police don't have a suspect so I'd say that he (and the others) could very well be in danger.

Several of you have become creepy stalkers, rubberneckers, of a grisly scene that involves a cute Twink. GROSS. And the OP's pic is in BAD TASTE for crissakes those people are going through hell.

I am sure some of you are the same damaged trolls who went on and on about that maniac who tangled his wife and kids.

There is a limit to freedom of TASTEFUL speech, and you've crossed it.

who strangled.

r215 Settle down, Beavis. Ben is an adult. His social media accounts are open. No one is wishing him harm. Quite the opposite.

Is there a transcript of the first responder audio file someone linked to?

The fact that not one employee has leaked or "sold" their views to the media says they are scared as hell. Which speaks to the hit man/drug cartel theory. I wonder if we will ever get the full story.

A couple salivating comments of appreciation from basement dwelling eldertrolls on DL would have been sufficient. Then move on. You have no role in this guy's life. A couple of you think you're cute with your sleuthing and dumbass comments, but you're just trolling on this young man.

I am interested in this case, R220, not Ben. Is that ok with you?

If state police are now involved, surely there must be some gossip beyond a single reddit thread.

Fucking bored as hell, where’s the dirt from local forums?

yeah so start a new thread. The OP's isn't cute -- its revolting, on behalf of DL'ers of a certain age. The guy isn't an instaho.

MARY!

El Chapo spin-off gangs could easily cross into the US via the Canadian-North Dakota border since Trump and his minions don't give a shit about that one.

If Ben was over thirty, homely or fat, the "do-gooders" in this thread would have zero interest in him. In fact, y'all would be typing, "The killers should have offed that troll & put him out of his misery!".

So true, r226. So true.

Typical.

How is the photo revolting, R223?

This thread has been rendered boring by all of the Ben obsession.

They’re having a 4 person memorial service.

I assume that doesn’t include release of the bodies.

How can chainsaws be a viable possibility in this situation if the wife tried to administer CPR?

R228 - because he certainly didn't take and post that photo with any conception of it being put to LEAD a thread of unknown Internet elder gays salivating over him, during a multiple murder of his own colleagues. That you don't understand that shows your absence of taste and decorum (around DEATH and TRAGEDY) not to mention your low IQ.

The whole his social media is open excuse is stupid.

Maybe he's stupid to know how to make it private. Anyone think of that?

Uh, he's a millennial, he knows how to make his accounts private, r233.

R234 that's the first time anyone has ever said a millennial knows anything on this website

He posted that photo himself to share with everyone he knew and all comers, so it’s just terrible to imagine how he’d feel that total strangers are looking at it.

The ALL CAPS are for outraged FRAU EMPHASIS!!

Freddie Chainsaw?

Of the Newport Chainsaws?

This case is fascinating. Being that it's so tight lipped, by the police, makes it more so. I hope we do find out what really happened. There are some good theories on here.

CPR would have been pointless on decapitated bodies.

Think positively, r240!

Hmm....Ben just posted the oddest thing on his Facebook.

^^^ does one have to have a FB account to view this "oddest thing?"

I'm not sure how to link Facebook posts, R243, sorry.

What is it??

It's his confession.

“The light is around the corner, I promise. ❤️😔”

Is that anything to do with the Press Conference scheduled tomorrow at the RJR Maintenance & Management office?

Huh.

They should charge and do a pay per view.

Interesting.

Folks, folks, let’s all calm down.

This is nothing to lose our heads over!

[quote]I'm not sure how to link Facebook posts, R243, sorry.

Uh, do you know how to copy and paste? Dick.

Even the press conference announcement seems creepy...

will it be, April D...

Linky stinky, r255.

Link at R255:

"We're sorry! The page you are looking for cannot be found."

Link

R258 It better not be Mr Scarfy

Right before R185 I said "DRUG CARTEL!!" And sure enough...

If they were decapitated, this is a drug cartel thing , NO DOUBT!!!!!

This sounds like something on Ozark on Netflix.

I just had a thought...what if it was Ben after all?

Ben's not a millennial, R234.

Quick, sleuths, do any of the employees live in Washburn? Where does Jackie live?

I think we all know who it is.

Who, who, R263?

Unfortunately the link doesn’t say much. A person (no gender) detained.

That’s it. Not arrested, no more information. This tight-lipped bullshit by the police needs to stop.

[quote] How can chainsaws be a viable possibility in this situation if the wife tried to administer CPR?

Use your heads, people.

Which one?

Suspect detained

The Reddit thread sure snoozed out.

Someone in that fucking dump must know something. Spill!

Police just identified the suspect as a Ben Pace, an employee of the company. No motive has been given. Anyone know any more details about who this might be and why he would do it?

Huh. It's the company holding the press conference, not the police? Did I read that right?

🙄 R271, that's why he updated his Facebook an hour ago.

The arrest was of someone who lived in an RJR owned property.

r273 How do you know? Link?

r274 if you click the link at r258 it's been updated with a video that talks about it.

Since no one’s posting anything interesting, here’s some related info from a (local) Dee Plorable.

Adam Fuehrer was 42 years old when he died April 1 2019. Conviction date is 11/26/1984. Either North Dakota has no age minimum for sexual offenses or Dee Plorable got a D grade in primary school math.

Anyone who tags the FBI in their tweet is a little touched

I’ll admit I didn’t really read it.

She is off the rails but who knows.

R277, the deplorable says it was Adam's father who was a convicted child molester, not Adam himself.

What a twat. For one thing, she doesn’t think the FBI knew that? For another, she’s impugning this guy and clearly implying it was him. Only when someone called her out did this bitch say it was his father. And what would his father have fuck all to do with this?

Did she check Grandad’s criminal history, too?

Cunt.

Read the whole thread, R282....she's a deplorable for sure, but apparently Adam has a long criminal record too. I hate her, but she does say clearly that it was Adam's father who was the pedo....

I have to say that the drug cartel with chainsaws is a more vivid scenario. Angry tenant shooting office workers seems so trite and unimaginative.

How do I give CPR to someone who doesn’t have a head?! He doesn’t have a head!

They didn't say that the person lived in a RJR property, R273.

Remind me again, how much are your condo payments, Rose?

You’re right, R283. She’s definitely fucked in the head. She’s got them saying he was “wining and dining with the Clintons and Obamas.” Dear lord.

Yes they did, r286.

R270 . Ben is ambitious. He's in school. He just wanted to get a head.

You're right, R298, sorry, missed the beginning.

I am really interested to see how "disgruntled tenant" = four decapitated people, buk OK. Otherwise, I'm with r284 on this.

How does one person kill four people without using a gun? There had to be more people involved.

^^Yet the public is not in danger, either?

What are you talking about, Mandan PD?

R291, no apologies necessary, though I will say very classy of you, considering we’re on an anonymous board and you could’ve just ignored it. Things are going fast now, it’s not easy to take in all the information.

North Dakota is a shit hole!

North Dakota is barely a real civilization. Just land with the occasional people.

Has it been stated no guns were used? A shotgun at close will pretty much decapitate a person, or st the very least obliterate their face beyond recognition.

That’s....pretty disgruntled.

[quote]They didn't say that the person lived in a RJR property, [R273].

It's at the 2:22 mark in the video. Anything else you want us to spoon-feed to you?

A person of interest has been detained. No new information other than that in the link.

I love how ToRe is demanding a full FBI investigation because the owners were wining and dining with the "Obama's and Clinton's". Not only does she not understand correct apostrophe usage, she's a deplorable moron. But I guess there's no other kind.

Maybe it was this pretty miss.

why is Toe's picture so heavily filtered while not even showing her face

Greengrocer’s apostrophes at large in North Dakota.

Local constabulary remains mum.

*remain

Trista Reynolds, the woman at R303's link, is human garbage. Her Facebook cover photo, which was updated yesterday, is of a dead infant in a coffin.

What trash, R307...

What kind of word salad interview is this with the Chief of Police?

What a troll!

God, why did I click on R107's link... I wonder what happened to the poor baby.

And, Booger butts?

Mandan police held press conference- arrested some guy named Chad Isaak.

Victims stabbed and shot.

Some more info

Trailer park involved

You bitch.

Trailer+ park=meth.

Dr. Chad T Isaak is a Chiropractic Specialist in Washburn, North Dakota. He graduated with honors from Palmer College Chiropractic - Davenport in 2006.

Could this be him??

That's him, R316. He apparently went to work later in the day!!

I knew it wasn't the wife, this crime didnt seem like a woman.

The police's hot tip were four bills left by Dr. Chad T Isaak on the premises for "headache cures".

So what was isaaks motive??

Subluxation.

Your better class of chiropractors live in trailer *courts.*

No photos of him?

Why was a chiro living in a trailer park? Don’t they make decent money? The chiro I went to here in Manhattan lived in a nice NJ suburb. And another one I know has a summer place in Rhinebeck. Not too shabby.

Here, r323.

He looks like Chris Elliott

Mr. Li, of Mr. Li’s Moxibustion Clinic, is an unindicted co-conspirator.

“Next time it won’t be just your chakras I rearrange!”

"Dr" Isaak looks like we would be covered in scabs.

[Quote]The location where the suspect lived was a mobile home park managed by RJR, but police are not sure if that is part of the motive, Ziegler said.

Killing his landlord?

^he would be

Thanks r325. Not what I expected.

Follow the money! How much did Ma and Pa fork over to pave his way into the elite ranks of Palmer College Chiropractic - Davenport??

The word, r328, is scabrous.

Yeah, Tore doesn’t believe it’s the chiropractor.

Old and Busted: Miss Golightly

New, Still Busted: ToRe

So this is looking like a dispute over trailer park rent? Oh honey.

There's got to be more to it than that, R336.

Chris Isaak's family is from ND. This chiro must be a relation of his. What a wicked thing.

I do believe this is meth-related.

More info

So now I wonder if the local cops and state investigators knew what they were doing all along. Maybe they didn't bungle a thing and were keeping their lips sealed on purpose?

This article has a very cleaned-up picture.

I think that it shows a lot of discipline to say nothing in the first days after a crime like this. I never bought that the police were incompetent solely because few details were known.

Is Chad family?

That is a very...bold look in r341.

^ Yeah, I'm getting "early '90s Falcon porn star"

Weird. Those two (at r341 and r340) don't even look alike at all.

Someone just wrote a Google review of Chad's business and said it's not the same guy. Rumor at this point, of course.

I second the question that a chiropractor is living in a trailer? And that's one....handsome woman he's working on in R325. And the cleaned up photo can't be the same person in R325 and The Heavy article...can it??

I appreciate the positioning of the crime scene tape right next to that hideous ensemble in r341.

Talk about a cry for help!

It doesn't look like the same guy to me, R346.

Arrest! Arrest!

Apparently no beheadings. How lame.

You mean you can't trust anonymous posters on the internet r350?!

Did local police MARY! this whole thing?

Because I’m not seeing the payoff I was promised in the dramatically coy previews.

The killer, allegedly.

They wanted to withhold information because they didnt want the killer to know they knew who he was and was coming for him r352.

True, r252. Now they are saying the (alleged) killer, Chad Isaak, was a tenant in a trailer park managed by RJR, but they are not sure if this relates to the motive. So, they are open to the possibility that his being their tenant was some kind of bizarre coincidence?

R354 is so dull, I can’t be bothered to finish this senten

R341, they have removed that photo and posted a note saying it was published in error.

This is why the police need to provide some info. Now some other guy is getting blamed for a multiple murder in the press because everyone is flying blind.

And I'll bet anything we will find out there were no stabbings, just gunshot wounds, and the police were downplaying it on purpose.

They were small town cops who said it was the 'worst they'd ever seen.'

All that means is it was worse than when Billy's uncle fell into the grain silo and suffocated, swallowed up in the silo's corn kernels, with the medical examiner reporting that his mouth, nose, and lungs were full of grain.

Now that we know who the killer is, we need a few questions answered.

1. Sizemeat?

2. Are their nudes?

3. Does he escort, and does he charge extra for the "One Around The Trailer Court Experience"?

Any amenities?

Interesting that they identified the suspect's vehicle from other security cameras in the area -- guess there were none in the building itself? Crazy.

Websleuths has a commenter who knew Isaak. Said he was an odd duck but easygoing and kind and a good chiropractor. May have been a little gay, not that there’s anything wrong with it.

Another sleuth said he was divorced in the early 2000s and has a daughter. Wow.

R349, missed it by that much.

R362, are we sure it’s the chiropractor. Someone upthread just said:

[quote]they have removed that photo and posted a note saying it was published in error. This is why the police need to provide some info. Now some other guy is getting blamed for a multiple murder in the press because everyone is flying blind.

What I still don’t get is, even if two seconds after the bodies were discovered the police knew it was this guy, how could they be so confident in saying the public was not in danger? Their suspect murdered four people! Who knows what he’s capable of?

I called it first, during the early part of the first thread, that it would be a renter.

I suppose there might be some drug or dick angle to it, as well. Maybe "Dr." death was cooking meth and maybe he was dicking someone in that company.

Chad Isaak did a bad, bad, thing.

In hindsight, I understand the police keeping very quiet. It was smart, even though we wanted more information! lol. The suspect is really a surprise.. a Chiropractor (sp)? Some on here had good theories, more interesting.. ha.

If there really were both stab wounds and gunshot wounds, then I would assume it was drug related, as in he shot everyone and then went fucko bazoo on the bodies.

He is also apparently an ex-military medic so we may be dealing with PTSD or similar.

The guy in the mugshot does not at all look like the chiropractor in the old news article or the high school yearbook photo posted on Heavy. I do wonder if we're going to find out later today that it's a different guy.

But Heavy also lists Jackie as one of the victims so maybe THEY'RE the ones who screwed up.

R365 = Babu

Are we sure it’s the chiropractor? Someone posted

they have removed that photo and posted a note saying it was published in error. This is why the police need to provide some info. Now some other guy is getting blamed for a multiple murder in the press because everyone is flying blind.

Is there going to be a DL watch party for the RJR press conference this afternoon/evening? I wonder if Ben will be the spokesman? He's the host of all of RJR's social media videos.

Me too.

The person whos picture was mistakenly posted, is the guy at R341. Picture at R325, looks like the "cleaned up" version of the guy in the mugshots. An ugly crime in every meaning of the word.

[quote]Isaak's next door neighbor, Dale Ronholdt, says he was in the neighborhood during the arrest. Ronholdt says [bold]the police were prepared with many officers. When he saw that amount of law enforcement gathered, he says RJR was the first thing that came to his mind.[/bold]

Gee, Chiefy, I thought the public was safe and had nothing to fear from this guy. Yet it was necessary for all these cops to arrest him? Silly us, of course he wouldn’t have harmed a member (or should I say MORE members) of the public.

Chief, you’re an idiot.

If this guy is as meth-y as he sounds, then the public probably DID have a lot to worry about.

Well, the article at R341 DID remove the photo of Isaak they had, but they still have the article titled "ND Chiropractor Chad Isaak Charged In Monday Mandan Quadruple Murder."

If it was a different Isaak, you'd think we'd know by now. But the fact that the photos don't seem to match is really odd.

If you type in [italic] chad isaak chiropractor north dakota [/italic] on Google Image Search, three rows down you can still see the photo The Count used for Isaak.

Did a Tineye search on it and it turns out they used the photo of a different chiropractor in town, a guy named Erik. That's why they took it down.

The picture on Heavy of Chad Isaak in the newspaper article still doesn't look like the mugshot, though.

So no decapitation? A fucking chiro that lives in a trailer park? What happened to the "worst thing first responders had ever seen"? This is too lame for words. Ugh.

Chris Isaak is from another shithole known as Stockton, California. No tie-in here, unless some distant relative. I can't get that song out of my head now though.

That is where Chris Isaak grew up r379, but his father moved there from North Dakota.

Love Chris Isaak.

I wonder if Ben is going to listen to Chris Isaak ever again.

Interesting, that I haven't heard about this murder on news stations, even GMA. I learned about on on DL.. scrolling down the recent topics the other day.

Ben needs Chris Isaak now more than ever!

It’s just a garden-variety sordid mass murder unless you focus on the ancillary twink.

Yeah I'm not surprised this case isn't leading the national news programs r383. People get murdered in America all the time.

R385, the thing that made this interesting was the secrecy surrounding the manner of death and the claim that the general public wasn’t in danger (I think the public was in danger. Someone who could kill four people and evade police for a few days sounds dangerous to me.)

Now it’s a lot less interesting to me.

What time is the press conference at?

I still need to know the motive and why the killer chiropractor lived in an RV.

Meth and meth, R389.

LOL at the people trying to blame this on a female poisoner

Still raises more questions r390.

OK, how about this: The public was not in danger because they had him under surveillance almost immediately, they just needed time to make their case. Mystery solved. Anyway, the main thing is that Ben and the others (even the deplorables ) are safe. Though I think he should still move to NY, unless he finds Brokeback love with Scarf guy.

Are we going to have a viewing party? What is the best link to stream it on?

If one wants to capture the public imagination one must create drama and spectacle.

Press Conference is at 4 PM Central time. Still need to find a streaming link.

[quote]What time is the press conference at?

Oh, dear!

R396 The press conference will be live on RJR's Facebook page, and if you don't want to do that, I think this local news channel will have it. They have all of the LOCAL! BREAKING! COVERAGE!!

R398 Much appreciated as I don't have a FB acct. Thanks!

Will Ben be there? I'm at work so fill me in!!

What’s the word?

First court appearance for the suspect -- judge sets bond at $1,000,000 cash

What was he carrying away in his jacket?

The press conference starts in 15 min. Hoping for a Ben sighting.

Here's the link for those of you without Facebook.

Thanks for the link, r405!

[quote]judge sets bond at $1,000,000 cash

That’s all? To a chiropractor living in a trailer park, er, excuse me, a trailer court, that’s gotta be pocket change.

Ben isn't speaking. he's in the background looking somber.

I hope he says something soon, R408!

Is he at least wearing the pink outfit ?

It's Jackie giving the conference. They should have let Ben do it.

The crying in the background is so extra.

Who keeps wailing?

Is scarf guy there?

I'm at work, can someone do a play by play?

It was lame. Jackie thanked the community, gave a little bit of a eulogy for each person, some employees cried loudly in the background, and Ben hugged one of his co-workers.

Meanwhile, here's a bit more about Chad. I can't believe this twit took all of his murder gear home with him when there's a rapidly-flowing river right next to the RJR building.

Ben looked upset and he just updated his Facebook.

[quote] I am shattered. My heart is not okay. ❤️

Ben, we are here for you! Someone friend the poor guy and send support! I would if he was on twitter, but I don't see that option.

The press conference.

Guys, go to the RJR Facebook and watch the video "Blood Drive Day." Ben looks particularly adorable.

He's hot af in that, R420. I'd flip him over and pound him all night.

[quote]Ben, we are here for you! Someone friend the poor guy and send support! I would if he was on twitter, but I don't see that option.

Or you could just go to any of RJR’s SM platforms and offer to support to EVERYONE involved in this.

Oh, that’s right, you old disgusting pervs only care about the twink, not actually offering support for this tragedy. Right, I forgot.

r350 = Mohammed bin Salman

[quote] Killing his landlord?

Yes. C-I-L-L my landlord!

#saveben

R421 bringing his unique touch of class and decorum to funerals nationwide.

[quote] In hindsight, I understand the police keeping very quiet. It was smart, even though we wanted more information!

I'm always surprised at these threads when people conclude that a police decision to withold details is a sign of incompetence. Instead, it shows discipline and suggests they have a target, or at least a strategy, in mind.

R426, the video in question wasn't at a funeral, jeez.

Chad Isaak's court appearance. He's charged w/ 4 murders.

I know this cunt would never be able to afford to bail out, but I'm surprised he was even offered bail.

Any word on motive yet? The guy stabbed them multiple times on top of shooting them. One of the victims died from a slit throat. It was especially violent but at the same time carefully planned and covered up.

Why the need to kill so many, especially since nobody reports him having gone off his rocker. He looks terrible though. Maybe it is still drug related somehow.

My fear that this highly dramatic and entertaining (sorry about the deaths of course) story would have a dull ending has sadly proven to be true.

I don't think we will see a Part 3.

Snoozeville

Drugs.

[quote]Why the need to kill so many

You don’t kill one person and leave three witnesses.

Or, when you go to kill one person, and 3 others are sitting there, you hold off on the crime. Especially since you're willing to plan things and cover up things.

A chiropractor is generally in a "helping profession" so something must have snapped for him to become a butcher.

R436, you do realize you’re applying logic to someone who shot and stabbed four people, right?

Obviously smarts isn’t his forte.

I’m still not good with the police saying there was no danger to the public. Even if they had him under surveillance, he’s cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs. How did they know they’d be able to stop him if he wanted to kill again? They don’t know his motive, so they didn’t know if he’d do it again. That’s bogus.

Except for the ginger hair and the beard, Chad resembles my late brother: eye colour, eyelid shape, forehead, nose, skin colour. It's disturbing to see murderers who closely resemble dead relatives.

R439, I agree with you. That was the oddest part about this investigation. I chalk it up to inexperience re: the investigators, who were walking a tight line and didn’t want to set off panic, but it was a huge misstep in my opinion.

Did they figure out it was him because the victims all had nice, straight spines?

Maybe they DID know the motive. Though I doubt they did. But if they didn't it's inexplicable to have been so blasé.

The photo in the article at R341 is not Isaak. The online article now notes the mistake.

The photo is of this guy, Dr. Eric Isaacson

He hasn’t killed anyone, yet.

Most killers don't kill again. There are very, very few killers who run around killing people indiscriminately. Murderers have the lowest recidivism rates of any type of criminal

R446 has a point.

Something must have made him very angry to go in and stab and shoot all those people. I hope they find the frau who tormented him. If she's not already dead, she certainly has a lot of explaining to do.

If the police had him under surveillance the whole time then he really wasn't a threat. They just needed time and privacy to build their case before the arrest. I actually think the police here did a pretty good job.

Now, onto more important matters at hand, who will play all the key characters in the Lifetime film adaptation? I vote Dakota Lohan for Ben.

Good choice, R449!

Why do you think there is a name for serial killers r477? Serial killers are a completely different breed of people and do not represent most people who committ murders.

Speak now, DLers!

The real mystery to me is why you bitches are going on and on about that UGLY ass twink Ben .he looks like a fucking salamander!

Uh huh, R453. And what do you look like?

R451, serial killers kill their victims one at a time, killers who kill a bunch of people all at once are mass murderers

R447 doesn't seem to get it, either.

"Something must have made him very angry to go in and stab and shoot all those people. I hope they find the frau who tormented him. If she's not already dead, she certainly has a lot of explaining to do."

The same misogynists who say shit like that were probably the ones trying to pin this on a female despite the fact that maybe 5% of mass shooters are female. I'm surprised we didn't also get the "It must have been a Muslim terrorist!" type responses

R456 couldn't recognize parody if it crawled into his lap with a fist full of daisies.

Uh, I realize the post was a parody - I was talking about the kind of people he was parodying (i.e. MRA trolls)

R456, I’m a woman and thought it was possible when we didn’t know how they died.

Women do kill people, you know.

R459 is polishing her very chic and smart looking pistol.

"Women do kill people, you know."

Sigh, learn how to read. No one ever said women never kill, just that they are far less likely to do so than men. The idiots saying it was a woman were proven wrong. NEXT!

More bizarre details of the crime.

He brought a change of clothes. Also the whole thing including the clothing change only took 15 minutes (plus I’m sure he had to wash the victims’ blood off before exiting too.)

“Surveillance video shows the assailant entering RJR wearing brightly colored clothing, then leaving in dark clothing about 15 minutes later.”

Such an odd mix of overkill/excess violence with meticulous planning and coverup

I’ve been following this case all week because I grew up in Bismarck. Just now wondered if it had been mentioned on DL. Surprised to find such long threads on it!

As soon as I heard the news of murders in Mandan, I knew I’d have at least one small connection, if not more...Turns out my nephew works about a block away from RJR, I had a random sexual encounter with a relative of Ben’s at a party in high school, and the guy who owns the mobile home park where Isaak lived sat across from me in home room in junior high back in 1977.

Someone I talked to in Bismarck also said it was thought they were decapitated. One autopsy report stated the cause of death as a result of a cut to the throat, so maybe that’s where this comes from. I can’t remember which of the victims it was but I seem to recall it was Lois Cobb.

R464 ...you fucked Bens' Dad? You fucking whore home wrecker

We already knew, r445. It was explained up thread.

I do wish DLers would read a thread once in a while.

For the love of Ben, all I want to know is how is Mr Scarfy??

Moral: Never trust a health care professional who lives in a trailer park.

The decapitation rumors started almost immediately on Twitter from the QAnon types. There's no reason to believe there was any decapitation.

More likely a meth head shot them then got stabby with the bodies.

In one of the news articles they have the MacDonald’s witness saying it looked like he was carrying something inside his jacket when he was going to his truck. Sorry, have no link for it.

It may have been "meticulously planned" but he was stupid to park his getaway car at a McDonalds.

Just because he had a plan, doesn't mean that it was a GOOD plan.

Again, they found all of the murder gear in his house--er..trailer.

[quote]where Morton County Assistant State's Attorney Gabrielle Goter argued that the killings "show a level of preplanning and a level of intent to disguise his actions" that suggested that witnesses and others could be at risk if he is freed.

So no one was at risk when this guy was free, at least according the Chief, but now that he’s apprehended he’s a threat?

I will never understand the press there not insisting on clarification when he continued to make that statement.

[quote]More likely a meth head shot them then got stabby with the bodies.

You may be right, but are meth heads usually functioning members of society? I don’t know enough about that drug other than what you see on TV shows like Cops and LivePD.

Also, can chiropractors prescribe drugs? That may be an angle, too.

They can't prescribe drugs, but he could have gotten drugs from anywhere.

I'm trying to remember which news article it was, but somewhere someone said that as soon as they heard about the murders at RJR, they thought immediately of Isaak. Something must have been going on.

HELLO. PLEASE TELL THE YOUNG GINGER TO CONTACT BILL TAYLOR. GOD BLESS.

He's not really ginger, apparently. The hair on his head is back to brown like it was in that old news article profiling him as a chiropractor, but the beard is still orange.

Hmm, yeah, it looks like the orange is growing out -- see above his ear and the shorter hairs on his chin.

Strange that his rent was always paid on time and he always kept his property well maintained. So I guess it wasn't a renter dispute? Good grief, this is a strange crime.

[quote]The crying in the background is so extra.

[quote]Who keeps wailing?

What is wrong with you assholes to constantly trash everyone Ben works for, then sit with starry eyes while fantasizing about contacting him and sending him money so he'll come hop on your post-retirement face?

You can't possibly be for real, so why are you so determined to make contact with a victim in order to hurt their feelings, or worse?

Good one, R477! I thoroughly enjoyed that.

Surveillance cameras take all the fun out of spree killing.

Fuck off R466

Go police another thread

....

Well, from r483’s post we know one thing: Bismarck is large enough to have its own Tribune.

The only thing I know about Bismarck I learned on The Honeymooners: The Raccoon Lodge’s cemetery is there.

I don't care what the police have suggested so far I'm sticking with my original guess (from the first group photo) that Bill C (William Cobb) is the shooter. He was fighting with his wife, he shot her then shot the others. In desperation he then killed himself.

The decapitation rumors started with the businesses neighboring the crime scene. Things they heard led them to think decapitation may have been involved.

Still nothing about the motive? The overkill suggests some sort of a love triangle, real or imagined, or some drug involvement. I read an article yesterday with an interview with a patient of Isaak's. She said that he called on Monday asking to move her appointment to later at 4 p.m. She said that nothing seemed amiss. He was just Chad as usual, which is pretty eerie considering what had transpired that morning.

What does it take a for a medical professional, albeit not from the most reputable branch, to live in a trailer park when housing must be incredibly cheap in the area. Strange that there doesn't yet seem to be anyone from his past commenting.

Are we still considering setting up a trust for Ben?

[Quote] Bismarck is large enough to have its own Tribune.

It's a bustling metropolis by ND standards! A whole 72k people.

Well, they could have been stabbed, shot AND decapitated. But if he was only in there for 15 minutes, there wouldn’t have been time.

Who called 911? How was he not COVERED in blood?

I thought the owner might have called.

I saw that article too, r487, and that interview.

It sent a chill down my spine when she said that.

R490 All that plus he picked up all the spent shell casings (9) and took them with him. He did a lot in those 15 minutes. And yes I would think he would have been covered in blood which he must have washed off before leaving the scene.

R487, nope, there is still no motive. Nothing makes sense. A navy medic, nursing school graduate, and honors Palmer College medical professional whacks out at age 44. He had one marriage in Hawaii with one grown child. Lived alone in a tiny town with a dog, not a few miles from the tiny town he grew up in, and with living parents nearby.

R493, I read that the gun was a revolver, thus no need to pick up shells. And he tears it apart and soaks it in bleach, then hides it in his freezer instead of tossing it in the Missouri River. Clearly, his brain wasn't working right. Still can’t figure out WHAT set him off.

[quote]I read that the gun was a revolver, thus no need to pick up shells.

R494, did you see the link at R462?

[quote]MANDAN, N.D. (AP) — A North Dakota man charged Friday with killing four people at a business that manages the mobile home park where he lives tried to avoid detection [bold]by picking up shell casings[/bold], changing his clothing, and cleaning a knife and gun with bleach, according to court documents.

[quote]At his home, they found clothing matching what they had seen on video, nine spent shell casings...

I’m sorry for being so dense, but who made the 911 call?

They haven’t released that information yet, r496, nor the recording of the call itself.

Interesting that Jackie and her family are excluded from the donations collected for the victims' families.

[quote] RJR Maintenance & Management [quote] April 2 at 5:39 PM · [quote] In regards to any donations collected: [quote] All items (cash,food, paper products, etc.) will be split between the Cobb and Fuehrer families. We would also like to extend our complete gratitude to our beautiful community at this time. [quote] We cannot thank you all enough for the generosity and support. [quote] UPDATE: [quote] There are two accounts set up at Capital Credit Union for both families

Ugh.....formatting.

[quote] RJR Maintenance & Management

[quote] April 2 at 5:39 PM ·

[quote] In regards to any donations collected:

[quote] All items (cash,food, paper products, etc.) will be split between the Cobb and Fuehrer families. We would also like to extend our complete gratitude to our beautiful community at this time.

[quote] We cannot thank you all enough for the generosity and support.

[quote] UPDATE:

[quote] There are two accounts set up at Capital Credit Union for both families

r70 It's me, Ben! You're right, I can use the financial help. Send the cheques to Carl Brotonolowski, South Jersey Shore NJ. Thanks!

Where do his parents live, R494?

R486, the best I can tell, it started with QAnon first, but there was lots of speculation from people early on that the lack of quick identification of the bodies meant a gruesome crime scene, which they guessed might mean decapitation.

The earliest mention I see of it from people who allegedly know folks in Mandan is on Reddit starting on the 3rd, which was after the tweet. There may be an earlier example and I just can't find it.

[quote]How was he not COVERED in blood?

He had a change of clothing apparently. He went in with bright-colored clothing, then left wearing dark clothing.

Thanks for answering my questions. Seriously.

There are still so many. Guess I’ll just have to be patient.

[quote] [R451], serial killers kill their victims one at a time, killers who kill a bunch of people all at once are mass murderers

Actually, they're called spree killers or rampage killers, but you're right, they are aren't the same thing which is why there is a different nomenclature.

What was the motive? It can't only be about eviction.

I think spree or rampage killer suggests multiple crime scenes within a short period of time; serial killer is multiple victims over a long period of time with a pause between crimes; mass killing is your garden variety multiple-victim event.

Nothing about motive at all. Maybe he's not talking. More about Isaak. Typical "he kept to himself." The previous owner of the trailer park said he was a good tenant who always paid his rent on time. He doesn't sound like the type who would need to be evicted.

Get a load of his office sign. What would you think if you saw that while on a stroll down the town's main drag?

“He said he had a dentist appointment that was going to bleed over into my appointment,” said Sorenson, who was his patient for 10 years.

"bleed over"?

“bleed over.” Unfortunate choice of words.

Again, why did a chiropractor live in a trailer park? Since 2014.

I hope his dog is ok.

R511 Chiropractors don't make the same money they used to. Workers Comp has made it much harder for practitioners to get reimbursed for claimant treatments, which was a big source of income. Many are struggling, even here in fancy pants Marin County, where practically everyone has a chiropractor.

Interesting that the previous owner of the trailer park had no problem with Isaak, but then something happened when RJR took over last year. The police say RJR was specifically targeted but that's all we know.

He owned his own trailer so his rent had to have been almost nothing, and worst case scenario for him would be to have to move the trailer to another park. What could have possibly happened to cause him to shoot and stab everybody there?

One of the posters on WS said she lives in the area and that two of the other local chiros are doing well, live in newer, bigger homes and drive new vehicles. Something had to have gone wrong for this guy to be in the financial position he was in. How expensive can lot rent at a trailer park be? I understand he was being evicted, but we don't know his eviction was due to rent. Perhaps he was causing other problems for RJR as well as being behind on rent?

If he was a model tenant before and then suddenly just a few months after a new property management company takes over he's already being evicted, that suggests either new rules (maybe an additional security deposit or rules that would require repairs or replacement of the trailer), or maybe they were selling some of the property and forcing tenants to move.

A bad drug habit could easily explain his lack of money and his trailer park digs.

The error message on their now-scrubbed "Our story" page sure is ironic.

[quote]This is somewhat embarrassing, isn’t it?

I’ve been reading the FB comments on the local news stations. Many posters say absolutely CI was NOT being evicted. Locals say there was NO ISSUE with the dog or paying rent. Everything was just fine.

If any of you posters want to post a reputable source which has anything about eviction - go ahead.

But as it stands right now, Chad Isaak’s motive is still unknown and nonsensical.

I've seen nothing about eviction either, R518. I've read multiple sources saying he always paid his rent on time.

I don’t really understand the puzzlement about the motive. There may not be a logical motive, like profit or love triangle. Sometimes unstable people do illogical things. Why did that crazy-eyed fella shoot up a movie theater in Colorado?

It could be something really stupid that Isaak built up into a grudge. Someone cut him off in traffic, took his clothing out of the dryer at the laundromat, who knows?

I get a strong incel vibe from this one.

I wonder if the suspect is somehow related to the singer Chris Isaak. Chris Isaak's father is from North Dakota.

Why did Ben delete his grindr?

Looking it up online, the only places I can find talking about eviction are a couple Reddit posts and a thread on a notorious white supremacist forum. Seriously.

This crime has brought out the trolls all over, I guess because of the lack of details. It lets the crazies basically superimpose their own theories onto the murders.

He has an ex-wife and daughter who lives with her mother. Child support and/or alimony may have been taking a substantial amount of his income.

Been trying to find that article where some guy said (paraphrased) "I hate to say it, but when I saw all the police cars near RJR, the first thing I thought of was Chad."

Absolutely no idea where I read it so if anyone remembers, let me know.

Anyhow, when looking for the article I found two comments on FB from people who seem to live near there saying RJR doesn't even deal with rent -- no idea if that's true, but if so, it might explain why there were no security cameras inside the building.

Oh, and apparently the police took so long to get the mugshot out to the press that not one but TWO local chiropractors were identified as Isaak, which is funny to me for some reason. The Erik guy we already saw, as well as a chiro named Steve.

I remember reading the exact same thing, r525, but like you I don't remember where or want to go on a search.

Found a mention of it but it's not the same article I saw earlier. Sounds like a neighbor saw Chad get arrested and thought immediately that it was about the RJR murders:

[quote]Isaak’s next door neighbor, Dale Ronholdt, says he was in the neighborhood during the arrest. Ronholdt says the police were prepared with many officers. When he saw that amount of law enforcement gathered, he says RJR was the first thing that came to his mind.

[quote]Ronholdt says Isaak is a fairly well-known chiropractor in Washburn.

[quote]He says he’d watch Isaak’s dog from time to time, and never heard the him complain about RJR.

[quote]We do know that the management company took over running the Northview RV Park park just last summer.

[quote]took his clothing out of the dryer at the laundromat

Now THOSE scumbags deserve it!

His daughter is 22 years old, R524. Why would she be receiving child support? And, R525, i’ve read that there were security cameras in the building and that at least one of the murders was captured on camera.

Um.. people who said, leave Ben alone..well, he puts himself out there on his FB and Instagram, like in R450 photo. You do that...you are at risk for a thread to be about you, or worse. Selfie attention ho(s)... no sympathy.

Someone has started a "Justice for the RJR Maintenance & Management Victims" case Discussion group on Facebook that already has 2,700 members.

Still unknown motive?

Some ideas:

RJR gave him a warning about the mini meth lab in his trailer (or some other illegal or nuisance activity), after a neighbor complained when they took over as the new management company. (unlikely)

He's just crazy and/or methed out and mass killed for kicks. (highly unlikely)

He wanted sole access to some female romantic interest of one of the dead males. The others were just collateral damage. (good possibility)

He was paid by the co-owner/wife and/or her kids, to do away with her husband, and the others were just collateral damage. (best possibility)

Small town and many of these people know each other. The motive was financial and/or romantic, like it always is.

If the wife hired him to kill her husband, she chose . . . Poorly.

^ Poor choice of hitman is usually the case.

R533, makes sense. I think there’s some meth involved.

His chiropractor sign has a touch of pretension:

"Doctor" written at the top, with his name "Chad Isaak" on the bottom. No mention of "Chiropractics", unless he thought that skeleton image was supposed to cover it. Instead, the sign is misleading. At first glance, one might think an ACTUAL "doctor" practices there.

Maybe I'm nitpicking but that choice of misleading and omitting wordage on his sign flags him as pretentious at LEAST, and someone who isn't entirely honest.

Shady. He might've been involved in some petty pharmaceutical dealings or embezzling or various other vices people in a small town would pay for and since he was the baddest ass that Mrs. RJR (or whoever else hired him) had ever heard of, she solicited him for a lucrative assignment. He was criminal enough to do it, but not smart enough in spite of being a "doctor", to get away with it.

[quote]Oh, and apparently the police took so long to get the mugshot out to the press that not one but TWO local chiropractors were identified as Isaak, which is funny to me for some reason. The Erik guy we already saw, as well as a chiro named Steve.

The reporting on this case was generally abysmal.

Can’t imagine any legitimate MD putting a skeleton on their signage.

Maybe Jackie has a meth problem and she hired him to get rid of her husband so she could collect insurance.

[quote] [R533], makes sense. I think there’s some meth involved.

Meth may have been involved by virtue of him and/or whover else inloved using it, and I'd bet a lot of people in that little town use it. But I doubt meth provided a MOTIVE.

Agree, R537

If Mrs. RJR is the one with a meth problem and hired CI to knock off her hubby, the others could have been collateral damage.

Does anyone know if either Mrs or Mr RJR have a criminal record? What about the Cobbs?

It happened on April 1, so it might have been a chiropractic-al joke.

Mobile homes , don't buy one .

It’s true, r546. They attract tornadoes.

I would think if the Mrs. was involved, he would’ve sung already and she’d be arrested. I doubt he’s going to jail without taking her down.

^ Maybe he has, or police are still investigating. Just because the media isn't privy to what the police are doing doesn't mean nothing's happening.

Patience.

I really do think the wife was involved. She was way too composed during this whole thing. Her husband's body wasn't even cold and she was back to work. Then the pathetic press conference. Something is hinky here.

Cops look at spouses and family members as suspects for good reason: They are usually involved.

If the wife had been involved, Ben would know and I hardly think he’d continue to work for her.

Ben doesn't know shit.

Maybe it's a cabal of murderous chiropractors and they were planning some "Strangers on a Train" thing and were planning on killing each other's targets to throw off suspicion.

God, the dl misogynist parade is desperate to blame this on a woman

So the wife is a meth addict?!

R554, you should write a script for "Meth Heads on a Train"

r555 Go cradle your mug elsewhere.

Property management company owner Jackie Fakler (Melissa McCarthy) is enraged by her husband's refusal to finalize their divorce. She strikes up a conversation with her chiropractor, Chad Isaak (Jason Statham), and unwittingly sets in motion a deadly chain of events. Psychopathic Chad kills Jackie's husband, and three of her employees, then urges Jackie to reciprocate by killing his ex-wife. Meanwhile, Jackie is murder suspect number one.

Would it really be all that surprising to find that Jackie was behind the whole thing?

r558, go spew your right-wing incel MRA crap elsewhere. Meanwhile, in the real world, the vast majority of homicides are done by men.

^ True. But spouses of homicide victims, both male and female, are obvious suspects.

The number of male spouses who kill is far greater than the number of female spouses who kill

It still happens though r563. It could have been a hit (at the direction of the wife) gone wrong. Maybe they were only expecting the husband to be there at the time, but the others showed up and were collateral damage.

Why would Jackie be "an obvious suspect" when we have the actual suspect in custody already?

We don't need another suspect and it's weird to see people inventing a story for seemingly no reason.

R565 Just because we don't "need" another suspect by your standards, doesn't mean there isn't someone else involved who hasn't been brought in yet. An accessory is quite common and there is often a lag when suspect one and suspect two are arrested. You don't watch many true crime shows do you?

A guy who is described as a loner and as someone who keeps to himself wouldn’t have an accessory.

These cunts are nearly always described as "keeping to themselves". Of course! Do you think they want people around him/her to know what they are really up too? GTFOH. I'd keep my mouth shut too. Vague pleasantries when forced, just so I didn't come off like a weirdo. The client of his that spoke up said he seemed fine, and nothing seemed amiss. This was hours after he had done the deed.

Agree with r567 and R568, these loner types almost never have an accessory to their crimes.

The "he seemed nice, kept to himself" cliche always reminds me of an old episode of Wings where Brian says that every news story about a serial killer has a neighbor saying, "He was very quiet, always said hello. Helped me build my dog house."

[quote]Maybe they were only expecting the husband to be there at the time, but the others showed up and were collateral damage.

Except they, too, were killed in a stereotypical “rage killing.” If he just wanted to eliminate witnesses, why not pop one to head and be done with it.

Totally missed this one. Didn't see any potential for glamor

[quote]Didn't see any potential for glamor

Hello?

Part 3 awaits

Again with Ben, R573? Pathetic.

[Mwah!]

[quote][Mwah!]

...what?

💋💋

Any updates?

R574. STFU. You're an obvious newcomer here. Fuck right off if you don't care for DL etiquette.

Any news from Mr Scarfy?

Boycott the Ben faced Part III. Start another thread. Our creeping eldertrolls should not be fed.

Throw r581 in a grease fire.

What R582 said, R581.

Yeah, I don’t think that looking at the wife is MISOGYNY. It’s common sense. So many were scratching their heads that she went right back to work and gave that weird press conference - oh, excuse me, memorial - from the location of the murders. I never saw such a thing.

And just because “most murders are committed by men” doesn’t mean we can’t consider women as suspects. It’s chauvinist to want everyone to believe women are too... weak to kill. Or to get someone else to kill for them. Unless you WANT people to underestimate women for some reason.

Why is his skin so mottled looking in r583’s photo?

Well fucking said r584

"Yeah, I don’t think that looking at the wife is MISOGYNY. It’s common sense"

Um, considering that like 10% of murderers are female and the number of female MASS murderers is even smaller than that.....no, it is not common sense. Going back to work a few days after your husband dies does not make you a murderer.

"It’s chauvinist to want everyone to believe women are too... weak to kill. Or to get someone else to kill for them."

It's chauvinist to try to pin a murder committed by a man on a female with NO evidence. Blaming someone for a murder they didn't commit is pretty horrible.

"Unless you WANT people to underestimate women for some reason."

Apparently, pointing out facts and statistics means you are underestimating women.

My 80 year old mom lives in Bismarck and she remarked about how Fakler's wife didn't seem very upset or sad in any of the memorial footage that aired today. There are some pretty tough women in ND, which this could certainly be, but I thought it interesting that my mom mentioned this too. I'll be visiting her in May and one of our favorite places to go when I'm there is a produce market right next to RJR. It's going to be creepy going there from now on.

R588 Fuck Ben, and slip him some money

R588, not everyone reacts the same way to trauma.

Duh, R590.

Out to lunch.

r573 Thanks for the new thread, but given the difficulty of finding old threads, it really should have at least had North Dakota in the title.

Anyway, here it is as we are getting down to the nubs:

It's not common sense. The suspect has been found and there is nothing linking Jackie to the murders. "I thought they opened the business up too soon; therefore, she's probably a murderer" is not logic or evidence, it's simple-minded petulance from someone who thinks a news story owes them a certain amount of entertainment value.

Jackie seems very nice in that video at R592. I feel sorry for her loss.

r594 For the last fucking time, we don't know if the ONLY suspect has been found yet.

Take your own simple minded petulance and get the fuck out of here. You are tedious beyond measure.

This is all my fault. I should never have suggested shaking the Almond Roca can to get some of the sleuth Frauen help over here.

[quote]There are some pretty tough women in ND,

And your Mom must be one of them. 80 years old and living in that cold? Good for her!

[quote]You're an obvious newcomer here. Fuck right off if you don't care for DL etiquette.

Nothing you've done is about DL etiquette, you're just trolling. There's no long-standing DL history of trying to get the attention of someone whose co-workers were brutally murdered, then posting their personal info just because you get a rise out of a few people.

I started a new thread. Forgot the word "Mass" in the subject line, but it'll do.