Leaving Neverland, Part 11

Part 10

There’s already a part 11 here.

R2 That was made by a pedo apologist. I have that troll blocked. Better to use this thread for those of us who actually believe the victims.

Is Amazon still offering the free HBO trial?

My local supermarket was blasting MJ while I was shopping today. Beat It It was blasting out of the speakers. No one was outraged. People just went about their business while MJ's voice filled the store.

Who are they muting again? 😜

[quote] Better to use this thread for those of us who actually believe the victims.

It should be used by anyone who has seen the documentary.

R550 from part 10 rightly points out how crazy it is for a grown man to want to share a bed with little boys repeatedly. But that's still very much an understatement. Jackson didn't just want it. He schemed, begged, cried, bullied, bribed, cajoled, blackmailed, manipulated and risked everything to get those boys into bed. It was an obvious, grotesque obsessesion for him. Spending all his nights in bed with prepubescent and barely pubescent little boys was what he was all about and what he lived for. He was prepared to do anything to make it happen. Everything else in his life was secondary at best.

That alone (even without the NAMBLA "art" books, the nude and semi-nude photos of his little "friends" and Jordie's accurate description) should be enough for any sane person to stop supporting him. (And it should've been more than enough for those supposedly naive parents to get a fucking clue. Why do you THINK the adult man is throwing a tantrum because you might put a stop to him sharing a bed with your prepubescent son? )

I checked out the MJJ Community after seeing it mentioned here. They seem to believe MJ was Christ in the flesh.

Thanks for the thread. YES the other one is the PEDO thread.

i blocked that freaky MJ defender so I can't see its posts thank goodness

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

Has this been discussed?

Michael looks so ugly and creepy.

The pedo from the other threads is bound to find this one and start spamming it. I wish Muriel would block them. He's most likely actively abusing small boys in his own life if he thinks it's a good idea to spend hours defending Pedo Jackson.

R8 I wonder if Michael didn't half believe that himself. jehovahs witnesses, who he fell out with around the time of his biggest success, have some weird twist on the faith that the archangel Michael was transmogrified into Christ on earth, and went he went back up to heaven he was Michael again, and then reborn in some form (spiritual or physical unclear) inn1914.

maybe it was just a bad case of Bobby Brady syndrome,but by the time he was just playing mercy gigs with his brothers, he was remarking on the adoring audience, and how he had so much power ...power to bring people together, more than any politician...and it struck a really sour note of megalomania. I wouldn't be surprised if he had moments where he really believed he was some kind of demigod.

Well the performance at the Brits and the creepy art in his house sure seemed in line with that, R14.

Are you guys still doing these threads?

I could’nt watch that sick shit for 20 minutes and you people are still going on and on. Get some air.

People get the faces they deserve.

Exhibit 1

Take or leave, perspective of a former JW adherent

Gayle speaks

Re 19 The Jackson clan has no financial interest, LOL. Last weekend it was Billy Jean on blast, this week Beat it played once while I was choosing produce and picking up laundry, etc. at the grocers I could see frauen for aisles and aisles cringing and making tight smiles just tying not to hear it.

Sony sure has an enormous financial interest, having just spent $250M on music rights late last year. Sony and the family have a huge financial interest in a Broadway show scheduled to open next year. So, big money on the table and a huge social media mgt crisis team push is trying to contain the fall out. You all take the shills so seriously, many are probably paid to post. Your arguing is also disruptive, despite agreeing with you, I have had to block many posters who would not just block the trolls, as Muriel directs, and move on.

[quote] HR: Can you still listen to Michael Jackson’s music?

[quote]GK: I haven’t listened to Michael Jackson’s music in a long time.

That was true of 99% of us for 10 years up until the day he died.

So when does the hogwash......I mean....the Jackson family interview air?

I'm watching a Simpsons episode in which Bart goes into business with a Willy Wonka-type salesman, and Homer says, "Nothing makes parents happier than when an eccentric single man takes an interest in their child!" The original airdate was December 2004 - just before MJ's trial started. Makes me wonder if it was a deliberate reference.

If MJ had befriended, held hands with, and taken to bed nine-year-old girls, we would not be having this discussion. There would be no doubt; everyone would known he was a pedophile. Why is it different with boys? Do people still assume that they should secretly be pleased at being abused?

I think that is a big part of it.

Chris Brown and R. Kelly were sexually abused by older teen girls when they were 7 or 8. Both remember and have brought it up. Both claim it has not impacted them in any way. The world, and Riri may disagree.

The anger, shame, self loathing, rage toward women, seems unlikely to have no connection.

When it comes to The Simpsons references, there's "Bart Sells His Soul" from 1995: "There's no such thing as a soul. It's just something they made up to scare kids, like the boogeyman, or Michael Jackson."

It is not just Jackson and his overrated talent and hyped PR. In another thread, Diddy giving Bieber an extremely expensive sports car is brushed off. Usher, his erm, mentor, treating Beibs much like Jacko did with his boys could not possibly mean anything. Aaron Carter was given a million in gifts by Willis, including a Bentley, it was documented in a court filing. Men in that industry are wealthy, kids are being pushed by stage parents for a come up and as An Open Secret makes abundantly clear, there is very little protection for kids.

Diddy talking in the video about how he had legal guardianship of Usher when he did his first album is creepy AF. It is like some fraternity of pervs. But, seems to be how the world works, at least that world, kids not excepted. And him stressing how he and Biebs are hanging out and that Biebs is 15 is wacked.

R25 I was literally thinking about this yesterday. I wonder if this isn't a bigger deal than it is because he abused boys, not girls. I don't know why but people have this concept of boys wanting it, or boys being stronger. It's not "as bad" as if a girl was abused. If a girl is abused, it's rape. If a boy was abused chances are he wanted it, he was in on it. He's not a victim. This isn't my logic btw, I just think a lot of people see it this way, sadly.

Often the victims, too, R29.

That is exactly what Chris Brown and R. Kelly say, at 7/8 they were lucky to be molested by someone more than twice their age.

R3, R21 OP: please stop misquoting Muriel and what he "suggests." Disagreeing with someone is not an "FF" worthy offense. As you have seen, mods are not censoring posters who are critical of the film or its subjects. You have 3 FF's every 24 hours. If you do not use them on racist, homophobic, and clearly unacceptable replies (e.g. spam, illegal, snuff, etc.) then you are wasting them because that is what gets removed. Block someone you do not want to see and do not engage them at all. This is not an airport, there is no need to announce anyone's departure.

Blocking a poster does not mean you cannot see or reply to a thread they created--so no need to create divergent threads either. There are others still posting in one of three (!!) Part 10 threads now. DL etiquette has always been that (barring anything unusual) the newest related thread closer to 600 replies is the one people move to from their watch lists. Understand that you are giving the trolls exactly what they want by dividing and confusing people. Neither thread for or against will make it to 150 replies if this continues.

I'm watching an interview that some of the Jacksons gave shortly before LN aired.

[quote] Asked whether they ever found Michael Jackson's behaviour around children odd - such as sharing a bed with children - Taj replied: "I grew up in it so for me it wasn't odd. I think to the outside world, yes, it can be odd, I mean I'm not oblivious to what it sounds like.

[quote] "But when you're actually there in that atmosphere and you're around it and you're watching movies with his kids, Little Rascals or Three Stooges... it's very innocent.

[quote] "The fault of my uncle was he didn't have that bone in his body to look at it the other way. His naivety was his downfall in a way."

Taj, I'm pretty sure the fault of your uncle was that he had EXACTLY the right bone in his body to look at it the other way.

From our webbie:

Our advice: don't feed the godamned trolls.

Don't engage them, that's just giving them what they want, which is to watch you get your panties all in a knot. ================= Note, posting dozens of times in response to trolls and paid shills does nothing but derail the thread. Several posters are blocking both trolls and those with OCD. I agree with their posts but cannot deal, you are not gonna change their mind or make them stop posting, esp if they are on a paid SM team. So just block them and stop torturing your fellow haters of perv Jacko.

R31, this is not correct.

Blocking a poster does not mean you cannot see or reply to a thread they created--so no need to create divergent threads either.

Many of us have blocked the pedo trolls. If they start threads, we are not able to see the first, titled post. When known aggressive trolls/shills start threads, like here or like the Spazz/Harry Styles shill, it is not uncommon for them to be exiled to their thread, while everyone else blocks them and posts on another.

The $ at stake for their music rights investment ($250M in late 2018) and the fate of the Bway show means SONY is going to continue to fund aggressive crisis pr social media campaigns. We are all just trying to work around it as best as we can. Many got sickened by the pro-pedo posters early on and prefer to avoid them, just like his music. YMMV.

Comedy shows in the UK have had MJ pinned as a pedo since 1993 and never wavered. He hasn't been popular here for about 25 years, except with a few African Muslims.

R25 - You raise such a good point. I think you're correct in thinking that many people have a hard time seeing boys as victims in a childhood sexual abuse situation. Which is insane - I mean look at how little Wade and James were when the abuse started, It's heartbreaking. I also believe that people think even little boys should be *tough*. There's a reason its called 'toxic masculinity'.

Boys/men aren't really allowed to show the full range of human emotions. It's also why the suicide rate is so high for men.

R35 I don’t think this is true...he has more supporters in the U.K. than the U.S. Not only that, but (non-tabloid) reporters in the U.K. are being much more careful than their U.S. counterparts in slandering Jackson over the film.

His U.K. Supporters are ardent. They raised a campaign to put innocent posters on buses, which weren’t removed until people in the U.S. began complaining...

That's not true R37 . The UK news has been damning and has not minced words. They are not being careful and they have no fear of 'slandering' Jackson, it's not a legal possibility to slander the dead and especially not a dead pedophile.

The family and the Jackaloons are going to be shitting more bricks when Pellicano talks.

R35, I'm British and I have to disagree. Yes, a lot of comedy shows here have portrayed him as a paedo, but it's not true to say he hasn't been popular for 25 years. He has some pretty rabid British fans. HIStory, Number Ones and Invincible all topped the charts here, despite being released after Jordan Chandler's allegations. His farewell tour was scheduled to take place in London. And I'm not a stan - I'm one of the people who believes Jackson was guilty.

Still not enough to clean the stain R40. The fans, wherever they are located, working 24/7 can't plug all the leaks in Jackson's rotten carcass.

Pelicano will be paid-off. I doubt we'll hear a peep from him.

It's no matter R42 Jackson = Pedophile in the public consciousness now. The fans/family can smear and rant all they want.

Agreed R43 and I'm thankful for it. Jackson was a manipulative monster and a freak of the highest order. Now I just want Wade and James to win their appeal. They deserve all the $$$$.

The fans and the people who believe the allegations (or at least some of them) are not all 2 different camps. There are many of us who love(d) his music but still had issue with his at-a-minimum-questionable behavior with young boys. And I'm sure there are plenty of people who aren't fans but don't believe, and far more people who don't care about him one way or the other.

I'm not sure if it's subconscious or just my legit taste, but my love for his music is intense for his earlier stuff then starts dropping off with his output around the start of the allegations. Love the Jackson 5/Jacksons, FLOVE Off the Wall and Thriller, like Bad, Dangerous has a few good songs, HIStory has a couple good songs, and then I'm basically done.

R42 Pelicano seemed to be a fastidious person about collecting information. When he dies, I would not be surprised if some hidden data leaked forward.

That HIStory film was extremely disturbing. His segue into playing Jesus, surrounded by young kids, was also really creepy. That Brits performance was quite something, as was the one at the Super Bowl, esp giving the timing in light of the allegations.

He said a million kids died a minute after the Earth Song performance. He was a pedophile and a moron.

[quote]Usher, his erm, mentor, treating Beibs much like Jacko did with his boys could not possibly mean anything.

Usher didn’t share a bed with or rim Justin Bieber. Let’s not overreach.

We do not know specific details of who did what to Biebs. But the damage is clear and the way Puffy and Usher treated him in public is strikingly similar to Jacko. It is likely they were not the only ones. Grooming likely started young.

We do not know what Willis did to or expected from Carter, we just know the value of the gifts was $1M from a court filing. Until someone makes a documentary about it, we could not know if Willis used the phrase sell me some for extra gifts for example.

But the patterns and the damage, as with Biebs, Feldman, Robson and Safechuck are clear. Safechuck got a car, so did Carter and Biebs, for example. Puffy was not exactly subtle in the vid where he gifted Justin a car at 15 and said he would get a house at 18. How many grown men want to spend days hanging out with a pretty 15 year old boy and why? Bet he would be a hella more discrete with his mentees now but then, it was covered, but everyone looked away. Talking about getting legal guardianship of Usher when he was underage also seems curious. Talking about Justin as his boy is creepy. The patterns are unmistakeable, as is the long term harm.

R50 types deranged. Bieber was already a huge star at that point and if anything, Usher and Puffy were the ones benefiting from the publicity.

CSA really messes kids up. Look at Mac, Wade, James, Aaron, Biebs, Britney, Selena, and the rest of the Disney, Nic and Barney kids as well as teens who were extras on Singer films. Self hatred and secrecy leads to the self destructive behavior all of the above were/are known for. And they, like Wade and James, may struggle to understand why.

A key takeaway of LN is awareness of grooming patterns. Career come ups if the adult and kid are in the same industry/sport, one on one attention to an unrelated kid, gifts of money and cars, grooming of families and gifts of houses and loans if the adult is wealthy, smaller stuff for people of regular means. Predators/exploiters are not just actors and singers but coaches, teachers, neighbors, youth pastors, or parents of other kids. Many are married, even Sandusky. Some predators may be other kids who have been abused or exposed to porn at really young ages. Looking away from obvious grooming might feel more comfortable but kids deserve more.

R52 You may be well intentioned but what you're prescribing will no doubt lead to a witch hunt mentality.

R52 Your post is also troubling in that openly gay men are often the first people targeted for suspicion. Pay attention to what your saying. We should protect children. But regarding every act toward a child as suspicious can lead to nightmarish consequences and break apart extended families.

James Safechuck at 41

Michael Jackson at 41

Karma is a bitch.

Emmy nominations for Sept 2019. As Leaving Neverland aired before May it should be eligible this year. Dan Reed already has two Emmy Nominations, a Peabody Award and nine BAFTA wins. The 2019 nominations should be announced by mid-July and 'Leaving Neverland' should be leading the pack for an award for Outstanding Documentary or Nonfiction.

It better at least be nominated and get the respect it deserves.

When was Britney molested? I have never heard this , and it doesn't count if it came from Courtney Love.

It’s all guesswork with regards to Britney.

She was sexually active at 14 but how uncommon is that in small town Louisiana?

Agreed R58. Dan Reed deserves *all* the awards.

Roses are red

Violets are blue

MJ was a pedo

OP is one too.

R50 is a known conspiracy theorist poster who thinks 'social media teams' (especially from Sony) invade DL to 'control conversations'. He even thinks the Spaz Troll is a paid shill.

He also believes that all teenage performers get 'passed round' older men. He thinks this happened to Bieber and the One Direction kids too.

He's an odd, super paranoid individual.

Sick, sick monster

R50 is that weirdo who thinks all the handsome men in Hollywood and London are closeted. He's on all the threads screaming about social media teams and bearding.

[quote]Pelicano will be paid-off.

By whom, Tito? Granny and Janet aren't going to spend their money.

Sony is the one with the most financial risk it seems to me. They just spent $250 million on music rights at the end of 2018. It is pretty imperative for the Bway show to open and for this to be contained if they are to recoup that $, never mind make a profit. It stands to reason that they are the ones banking the crisis pr, including social media teams. It may also have something to do with celeb silence as actors and musicians with Sony ties are urged to say nothing. The family/estate just GOT that $250M, they are grasping and greedy but do not have the tools in their arsenal that Sony does, to contain, pay off, push back, etc.

Agree 100% R68. Sony may even be paying the family of grifters to push the campaign.

I don't know, I left a negative comment on MJ Instagram and it stayed up. You'd think they would delete all the negative comments.

R68 Those who can't argue facts resort to conspiracy theories. I was just about to joke about the celeb silence you actually mention it and appear to be dead serious. This is entertaining. What could Sony be threatening these celebs with?

Single best piece I've read about the pedophile Michael Jackson - from today's Guardian

It was easier to convince ourselves that this grown man who idolised Peter Pan was merely a harmless childlike weirdo- from the Guardian

Jordan Chandler's description of Michael Jackson's genitals did match.

[quote] Sony is the one with the most financial risk it seems to me. They just spent $250 million on music rights at the end of 2018.

That was a daft move from Sony. The #MeToo movement had been going strong for a while for that point. And they thought banking that kind of money on the legacy of the most famous alleged child molester of all time was a good bet?

Countdown to the big opening of the Sony MJ musical on Broadway.

Protesters throwing bloody little boy underwear onto the stage will make the show a must-see.

R74 Only because Sneddon said so. We know, for example, that he guessed Michael was circumcised. This was wrong. Also, he had vitiligo, so patches on any part of his skin was hardly a shocking revelation. All of the evidence is circumstantial in the end, and it becomes considerably less convincing by the time Jackson supporters get done explaining it. Then I end up reading 50 replies of "but he slept with children" and just shake my head.

Will the show really go on, R76 ?

It may go on in London or another country.

I hate to say it, but there might still be an audience for his shows. I was at the domain in Austin eating lunch and the place next door was blasting Beat It. I also heard he is still being played on Sirius and he was even played at Sundance parties after the premiere.

[quote]MJ haters truly believe that the gigantic number of kids who have slept with Michael Jackson...

Opening a defense of Michael Jackson with a statement like this is all kinds of wrong.

R81 Where is that reply in the thread?

It was in thread 10 and I read it after the thread had been filled, used by the info apologist to justify the fact that out of the hundreds of kids that slept with MJ, only “four” complained.

Pedo apologist

Grown men don't sleep with boys. MJ was a revolting pedo.

Katt Williams on Michael Jackson in 2006. Funny as shit and spot on. Absolutely destroys that nose shrinking pedophile. From Pimp Chronicles

Thanks for sharing R86 - on point

We need to remember that a lot of the boys he abused won't come forward because of the embarrassment of admitting to it and the mess it could make of their marriages etc, all these years later. Not everyone wants the stigma of CSA attached to them forever. Victims feel the stigma almost as much as abusers, esp if the interaction was 'gay' and they are straight.

Agreed, & Jackson was incredibly manipulative as well. I 100% think that Omer Bhatti was a victim. He slept with Jackson every night he was in the US from Norway. Will he ever tell the truth? I'm really blown away by both Wade & James. I watched the Oprah 'After Neverland' special. They are both so lovely and so impressive. Power to the survivors.

Interesting doc

You're nuts R91! Get help

Jesus, R91 is a twisted, depraved pervert, just like Jacko himself. All these crude sexual imaginings.

Safechuck came across as subdued, but sane and sensible, unlike R91. Who calls people 'retards' in 2019, anyway?

R93 Lol, funny of you to talk about crude sexual imaging. Try that pedophille-oriented 4 hour documentary that creepy egg head Dan Reed put out, 'tard.

R93 You're the same person who posted this about an unarmed murder victim! Talk about the pot calling the kettle black:

"Of course the local Negro-Americans are “outraged” over the verdict that their precious criminal was shot to death like the criminal thug he was."

I seriously question the mental health of some MJ fans.

MJ is just one example of mass media losing control of the narrative. So many people online are doing better reporting than the journalists who are paid millions of dollars. Spreading misinformation and pathetic attempts at virtue signalling that anyone with half a brain can see from miles away.

Barbra Streisand was defending pedophila, not Michael Jackson. The media can't even be relied upon to get something that simple correct. Disgusting.

His supporters are insane.

They say Michael Jackson was victim because of his traumatic treatment by Joe. Funny how his 9 siblings didn’t publically carry Webster around like a doll.

They say Michael was a victim because he was and 80s megastar. Funny how Madonna, Prince, Bruce Springsteen, George Michael, Jon Bon Jovi and Phil Collins didn’t sleep with little boys.

Michael Jackson was a monster. How anybody listens to his 80's retro tunes is beyond me.

You cannot listen to his music without thinking about his victims and his crimes.

Let's face it, Barbra is a washed up lounge singer from another era. She has an awful voice.

His fans are really mentally ill. All of the stan accounts on Instagram/Twitter - these people are NUTS. Which makes coming forward as a survivor of abuse even more remarkable. Who would want to have these freaks on your back?

Celebrity worship is making our country a much dumber place. Stan by Enimem was a cautionary tale, not something to dedicate your life to.

Here's LaToya discussing her freak brother. Pity she couldn't have hooked him up to a Fentanyl drip years ago.

Shame that disgusting Michael didn't overdose on Fentanyl, true, R103. But such was his vast tolerance for opiates that a huge dose of Fentanyl to him was probably like us taking a Solpadeine tablet ( a mild painkiller in the UK with just 10mg of codeine per tablet).

Michael needed huge does of drugs to drown out all of the abuse he had committed.

Mute the pedo monster!

Keep it up MJ fans. We are winning. Fortunately, this doc came at a time where people are more distrustful of the media and their attempts to mischaracterize, sensationalize, or outright lie.

R103 Ironic that MJ haters pretend to be compassionate toward victims yet show videos of Latoya when she was being physically and mentally abused by her evil ex.

Nah, the MJ straightjacket crew are losing big time R107. Just wait until the gag orders end tick tock on the pedo clock.

Siri, what's the single most disturbing thing mankind has ever created?

R110 #puke

I like this one better

Still the best piece about LV IMO

The New York Times, I'll pass

Wade Robson and James Safechuck = perfect schadenfreude

Could not agree more

R116 The author sounded like a typical frau until I got to the part about her still having posters of Wade Robson (?) on her walls in her thirties. No doubt she felt slighted since she didn't get to fuck him since Wade hit on every piece of female ass he came across, including one who was reportedly underage.

R116 I'm sorry, but if you think this documentary had a bigger effect than a few companies distancing themselves (temporarily no less), then you're just projecting your own desires onto reality. The total cost to Jackson's estate is probably less than the 70k in penalties and legal fees assessed against Wade and James. The public is already moving on to the next "big thing." Jussie and the Mueller probe...this is yesterday's news.

Nobody likes your rotting corpse of a pedo king R117

I agree with the sentiment of stopping to dance to his music. People just have to get de-conditioned to having his music play at weddings, dance classes, parties etc... I think it will take a while. It starts with DJs and people in charge of the music. For me, I can't separate the man from the music, he used his stardom to molest children. He doesn't deserve continued icon status.

As for James and Wade, while I am a total supporter, I don't know if they should get any money from the estate. They had their chance to out him when he was alive and they didn't take the opportunity. Michael was able to get away with molesting more boys because of their inaction and Jordan and Gavin were deemed liars. While I understand why they did what they did, I think there has to be consequences to that choice.

R120 The 93 case may be more complicated for some, but anyone who still believes Gavin after the fiasco that was the 2005 trial is completely dense. The only way you could believe his story is if you believed him and his family were kidnapped by Jackson and forced to rebut the Bashir documentary which Jackson didn't even air.

R121 Agreed. Remember when the mother came out and said she was abused also at Neverland? Complete shitshow of a family, including the kid.

When Meseareu asked Gavin at the stand, "Why are you so mad at Michael", he replied, "Because he stopped calling". Yeah, they were kidnapped alright.

LMAO

R120 - I came out as a CSA victim after my abuser died. It's pretty normal. They wield great control over us - even as adults. I really wish that people understood the psychological impacts of CSA more. James & Wade were used as sexual playthings by a monster. Their lives will never be the same. Therapy alone will cost thousands. They deserve a massive settlement.

R125 I'm happy you have all the proof you need. No need to look into the evidence..

R120, why would you want to benefit the abuser's estate? Refusing to let them sue only rewards MJ's abusive behavior. It's saying, if you really traumatize your victims, you deserve to get away with it.

R125 Who knows what they deserve, but the courts have made it clear to the tune of 70k that it will not come from the Estate.

R125, in no way am I marginalizing their abuse and suffering, however, they actively participated in getting the man acquitted. I know they were manipulated, but once they did that, they passed up any potential settlement. That's actually one of my arguments to the people who defend Michael. They could have gotten money from him if they told him they would go public. We know he paid a lot of money in hush money, but they never did that.

R127, I don't. I wish his estate would go bankrupt. As stated above, I have an issue with them helping him get away with it. Logically I know they were used as pawns and were traumatized, but it's a little hard to swallow. I would have loved to have seen Michael in prison and really suffer the consequences of his actions.

James and Wade will lose their appeal. The only way this documentary could have benefited them is if more "victims" came forward, which would have happened by now. The documentary itself not only doesn't provide any additional evidence, but offers even more contradictions to their depositions. As far as leveraging this documentary for public support, even that seems to be waning at this point. Both Wade and James rely on emotional manipulation. Whenever they deal in specifics, things fall apart, like this latest thing about the train station.

If Jussie Smollet couldn't be held accountable with all that mountain of evidence, there is no way these proven liars will get a dime.

More victims will come forward it takes time & undoubtedly they would meet with attorneys first. The Jacko stans on Datalounge are the worst thing about this site. How devoid of conscience are you to be OK with a grown man rimming a 7 year old? Y’all are sick.

The 1 in 6 Statistic - Sexual Abuse and Assault of Boys and Men

Myths and Facts About Male Sexual Abuse and Assault

Many people have absorbed the myths to some extent. Below, we outline the myths and the facts—to encourage understanding and healing.

R130 Exactly.

This mockumentary is just sick/disturbing claims, creepy music and dim lighting. These people watch this gross slander for 4 hours, no wonder they walk away feeling that MJ is a monster after tugging your emotions through 4 hours of depressing and grotesque stories.

It is gross isn’t it R136? And also completely true. Your idol was a sick POS.

I'm sure grotesque MJ drugged these boys too. He was surrounded by drugs and what better way to molest them?

R129, it would have been wonderful to see MJ in prison. He would swear up and down that he wasn't addicted to anything and then die within 24 hours of a massive seizure from cold turkeying off industrial quantities of benzos.

Do the pro Jackson trolls deny that he was a junkie as well?

Remember that women who released a white dove for every count Jackson was found not guilty of back in 2005? What was she going to do if he WAS found guilty? Eat fried dove for dinner every night for the next two weeks? Or just let fourteen doves hang around in her house for the rest of their lives?

Places where James had allegedly had sex with Jackson. Updated.

Places where 7 year old Robson was RAPED by Jackson, you mean.

I always wondered who that guy was on Usenet who claimed Jackson abused them? He talked about being drugged and this was way before the second trial where we learned about Jesus juice.

Are there any traces of that still online, R144?

R143 Lol, Safechuck's story is falling apart rapidly. His timeline was already extremely iffy from the beginning, and the threatening call nonsense only further put him in.

R144 There was a guy who wrote online around 1996/97 and swore that he and other kids were drugged and abused by MJ, and Michael must be stopped, I remember the posters didn't take him seriously and asked him why didn't he report that to the police instead of ranting online. chilling!

OMG R141 I lol'ed - sad but true. MJ fans are the most insane. They make Trumpster's look like MENSA members (not really, but they are crazy)

[quote] More victims will come forward

I'm not sure that's true. I fully believe there are plenty of MJ's victims out there, but they may well look at the way James and Wade have been treated by Jackson's stans and decide they want no part of it. I would be genuinely concerned for my safety if I were one of those two. The fanbase really does border on religious. I've actually read a few tweets from fans who say that James and Wade were so attracted to Jackson that they've concocted fantasies in which he molested them. It's disturbing as fuck.

What you say seems likely, R149. Jordan Chandler has apparently been stalked and harassed by MJ fans for most of his life.

R147 I don't find it weird at all. Jackson had receiving overwhelmingly negative press coverage during and after the 93 allegations. It's not like people only started rumors after 2000. Anyway, even those who believe Jackson is a pedophile disbelieve the Arvizos. It's shocking that the haters are still hitching themselves to them when they were so thoroughly discredited during the 05 trial. There is footage on Youtube of the Arvizos fighting back tears and gushing about how amazing Jackson was and if the kids could call him daddy and all that crap. Keep in mind that this was supposed to be the time Gavin was being molested and being held captive according to the prosecution. But keep mentioning that case. It only makes you look foolish.

R150, I'm (pleasantly) surprised Jordan Chandler has lived this long, actually.

[quote] I'm not sure that's true. I fully believe there are plenty of MJ's victims out there, but they may well look at the way James and Wade have been treated by Jackson's stans and decide they want no part of it.

Another catch 22. All his supposed victims can come out gushing about how great a person he was and the haters will say they are being groomed from beyond the grave or getting checks in the mail. However, if they stay silent, that must mean they are concerned for their safety.

Yeah, you're right R149 - the fans are a cult of Jim Jones level devotees. They are beyond insane. That subject alone would make a great albeit terrifying documentary.

Also why I think it's incredible that Wade and James came forward. I mean they are truly brave. On the Oprah special James stated he did it to help other survivors. He has such a pure heart - that one.

Surprise, surprise, they showed compassion to Jackson where he showed none to them. I think you will find this is not uncommon among victims and abusers.

R156 The Arivizos? They were taking advantage and those close to Jackson warned him to stay away from them.

If this weren't bonkers enough, Martin Bashir told Jackson to invite children to his home for the documentary so Jackson decided to invite one of the kids who he knew who survived cancer. He even told him to hold Gavin's hand during the interview.

There could be a sex tape and some of them would still claim he was innocent.

R157 Wade and James, who spared Jackson the humiliation by waiting until he died to come forward.

The media is rapidly losing internet in the near-pornographic fiction of known grifters Wade and his autist friend James.

R159 But there isn't, because it never happened. Next news story, please.

The only news worthy story now is how Jackson is being purged from our collective consciousness. Babs Streisand and the rest of his supporters can be scrubbed away with him.

R147. I was curious, so went to the Google,group,archive and put in a few search terms like Jackson abused drugged 1997

I ran across someonemwhomfitsmyiurmdescription, with multiple posts and responses including the one below in the middle of a conversation. It was in alt.showbiz.gossip,and the posters handle was StopHM.

" I accused Michael Jackson and as such without any doubts he knows where I am and who I am. It's a terrible thing to have your body violated but to add salt to the victims wound by drugging them so that they won't be able to fight back or remember the attack is even more heinous. That to me is the ultimate forced silence. I am not sure how many other victims are out there but we all know he paid one of them off. I don't beleive that my experience with him drugging me is unique. No, I strongly believe that there are a few others Michael used his drugs on. The victim feels everything is normal and okay, night time comes the victim goes to sleep and Michael waits. Waits for you to be in a deep enough sleep not to wake up when he gives you the drug. The victim under the circumstances should not even wake up during the attack but I did. I was so drugged that I could not stop him and quickly passed right back out again.

I feel that he will continue to get away with raping and molesting young victims if no one knows that he uses drugs on the victims. After all, if the victim has no memory or what little memory they may have seem like a dream, especially if they come around and they are dazed from the drugs then Michael Jackson is in no danger of there ever being another Jordy.

I hope that by speaking out the next person Michael Jackson attempts to harm will have more information than I had and don't make the same mistake I made in trusting him. I also, hope that one day the legal authorities will be able to stop Michael and he is made to publicly apologize to all his victims and I won't stop telling what happened to me. Yes, I am a victim who survived Michael Jackson's attempt to force me into a drug induced silence. I survived the lie that "you were only dreaming" and I will continue to be vocal until the FBI or Tom Sneddon or some other legal agency catches and brings him to Justice.

I urge everyone who has ever been a victim of a crime, family member of a victim or just plain concerned to write the FBI or Tom Sneddon. Ask them to go back and re-interview the boys about their Dreams they had while they were with Michael Jackson because some of them may have come around long enough to remember what happened to them but thinking it was only a dream.

Help Stop The Abuse". I couldn't figure out how to link it

I hope I'm not taking his statements out of context, but I do remember McCauley Culkin saying he fell asleep in various locations all over Neverland.

R164 I believe him

R164 That's nonsense, but then again you believe Gavin and his crazy family so...

I would not be surprised at all if this latest round of accusations against Jackson was just a precursor to get them warmed up, to get them used to hearing even more horrific and lurid claims.

If I wanted to accuse someone of abuse, I wouldn't go to the police. I'd post anonymously on a gossip message board with no verifiable information including time or place, or even my age. Judging from the vocabulary, he would have to be significantly older than Jackson's accusers (since this was 96). Sorry but MJ is not Bill Cosby.

R166 StopHM got some grief in that conversation thread. he also wrote, among his responses:

" >It seems that my main purpose for using usenet has been misunderstood. It has > taken me a long time to gather my strength and courage to speak out. After > being victimized the road for me has been a long and difficult road to > recovery. Recently, I have been speaking out to everyone who will listen and > I do mean EVERYONE. "

Interesting to me, in that thread there is a poster named Melody Clark who says, with no source or other basis toexplain, that Sean Lennon was "caught in flagrante delicto" with MJ, ( which she then asserts he probably would not have processed it as abuse given his upbringing.).

I myself had never before heard anything about Sean being observed in some kind of suspicious clutch with Jackson.

It's obvious now why he had his own home grown kids. He even had them look like the boys he perferred. Notice how the only time he didn't have a 'special friend' around were in his last days?

R170 Unsure of your diagnosis, but it's probably a safe bet that it has something to do with white trash whores smoking meth while they had rotting little shit-bags festering in their guts.

So my suspicions were correct. MJ was always awash in drugs, so of course he slipped Rohypnol into their coca cola. Grotesque.

R172, are you into scat? You seem obsessed with faeces, here and elsewhere.

I wish Michael's psyche would be explored more. Like why he fixated on a certain demographic, i.e. certain age and white kids or as DL says, white adjacent. Never any black kids around. Are these these kids what he wanted to look like at that age? Also why he turned himself into white woman. I get that his father criticized his dark skin and large nose as a child, but would that make someone hate themselves so much that they butcher their face? He was a sick man, but also fascinating.

R175, I don't understand why he looked like a woman from the nose up, but had a strong, masculine jaw, I believe he even got a jaw and/or chin implants.

As to why he fixated on prepubescent white boys, I think that's what he wanted to be. On one of the MJ threads someone mentioned that he wanted a blonde white boy to play him in a biopic of the Jackson 5. Once they met him, James Safechuck, Wade Robson, and Jordan Chandler started to dress like him, maybe it was a power move, a show of dominance, but it could also be that he saw his ideal self in them.

I also think he did to these boys what was done to him at their age. When he hit puberty he was no longer considered "cute," and the Jackson 5 were no longer popular, in other words, he felt rejected. When he became an adult, he turned around and did the same thing to his young "friends." (I'm not excusing or condoning his behaviour).

Wish Jackson had fucked those liars in their youth, ample punishment for their asses after faking an attack. I, like many, laugh whenever I rewatch clips from the doc. Esp. the wedding scene, my favorite bit of nonsense. Really wish he would have tapped those boys HARD in their lying asses.

I would love to know the process by which he bleached his skin to that uniform color. Creams don't cut it for a whole body transformation. Did his dermo sandblast him? Seems like it would be an intensive ongoing treatment.

r178, a police search after his death turned up these elements of "the process by which he bleached his skin":

"A search of the Beverly Hills residence he was renting when he died June 25 turned up 18 tubes of Benoquin, a skin-whitening cream...Investigators also found 19 tubes of the skin-bleaching agent hydroquinone...."

It seems he slathered himself with these creams constantly.

R178, he used Benoquin. It's permanent and leaves the skin chalk white. The descriptions in his autopsy report indicate he was still conspicuously spotty on areas that are easily and/or usually covered.

Wade Robson is Saddam

Here's the thread about the Usenet story. I hope that guy is okay, wherever he is.

Idiotic that until recently their were fans still around that denied Michael had ever had any surgery to his face, let alone bleached his skin. No leap of faith necessary for these people to see with their own eyes he was a hopeless pedophile too.

Still no explanation from the Streisand camp to why she thought it was okay to defend the actions of an adult who preyed sexually on small boys?

It’s obvious they were counting on a settlement and didn’t think it would go this far and are now trying to erase the truth. Clearly they underestemated the fanbase but we know the drill; we have been dealing with this kinda stuff for years and years.

The estate has done the right thing by not giving them anything and fighting back. People who don't know the facts would assume guilt if they settled anyway.

Fake train story is also blowing up. Leaving Neverland is quickpy being further debunked. They shouldn’t have strayed so far from their depositions in going on TV.

Hilarious that so many fans don't seem at all convinced that he is innocent, yet still want to defend him anyway. Take the counter-statements back to MJJCommunity boards, 99.9% of people here think that he is guilty.

It's small things, but they do help: If you're having a party or wedding, ask the DJ specifically not to play Michael Jackson music. Don't dance to his music if it's played in public.

Yes, the estate is innocent, but they shouldn't profit from Michael Jackson's crimes.

Very interesting that the Jacksons are Jehovah's Witnesses. I see a lot of the way they, and the way they use their fans to use tactics, counter augments and reject questions all very reminiscent of the way JWs are able to live in a state of constant denial. And if they "say something enough times" it will become true.

I always wanted to know that R178. I've had hyperpigmentation on small areas and it's VERY hard to get rid of it, even with bleaching creams. How he got his entire face/body to go from black to so white is beyond me. That's why his face was always covered and/or he carried an umbrella, you must use sunscreen with skin lighteners.

R189 Lol, I'm sure that'll bankrupt them.

I really don't understand pedo troll isn't blocked? I have him blocked, but I logged in from another device & he's talking about his wish for victims of sexual violence to be anally raped? The guy is seriously deranged and to be honest he seems dangerous.

Leaving Neverland continues to unravel.

R193 That just confirms that there are people who are trying to make the Jackson defenders look bad. The majority of those who are hurling insults are the haters.

Jackson Supporters... You won't find this much crazy outside of a Manson Family reunion!

You won't notice the difference r192 nobody's inviting you to any parties or weddings.

R197 Hey! I'll have you know I was in James and Michael's fake wedding.

Will Janet mention MJ in the HOF ceremony?

Fans are grasping at straws. James said he was abused in a room above the train station. He didn't say it was the train station. That room would be there with or without the train station. Lastly, everyone is supposed to have video like memory when memory is reconstructive. You remember childhood abuse, the acts, etc but you aren't keeping a calendar of exact dates. These Jackson fans are truly crazy

A monster in plain sight. Omer Bhatti basically appears as Jackson's *partner* in numerous photos etc. It's so, so-so,sick. All these boys worshipped him. He was in a position most paedophiles would kill for.

R200 There is no other building that can sub for a train station. LN even shows the main train station as James is narrating. It wasn't a house. It wasn't a treehouse. It's a freaking train station. I'd say this is pretty important since it's not the first thing James got wrong even though he's had years to get his story straight.

He really was hiding in plain sight, in front of millions. During the documentary I realized just how inappropriate it all was. I mean he was taking these kids to movie sets, Hollywood functions etc... what grown man does that? Celebrity men don't even do that with their legal aged thots. Holding hands, whispering and giggling. I mean he even moved them in to take care of his kids. The photographs I've seen with many of the kids, looked like family portraits. I believe Hollywood knew. I don't think Kat Williams pulled the 'licking little boys booty holes' line out of nowhere. That was very specific. Michael probably molested hundreds of boys through the years.

To his defenders answer this, if it was all so innocent, why did he lie and call Jordan his cousin and Omer his son?

Michael Jackson with Secret Son Omer Bhatti Jet Ski video

R202 Yep! Another day, another lie torn apart. Taj and the rebuttal crew are going to have their work cut out for them debunking all of the lies.

Still waiting for Dan Reed to explain how James Safechuck and Michael Jackson could have had sex in a train station that was one to two years away from being built and completed as told in Leaving Neverland. Don't think "he loved Michael" will work this time.

MJ asking his sound engineer Bruce to alter things for him and always signing it with "love". Guess Michael was grooming everyone, huh!

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

Michael Jackson's former rabbi says he thinks that he was guilty:

"I don’t believe that the shame and guilt being experienced by their parents in general – maybe their mothers, in particular – is feigned."

"We’ve never heard allegations that were this detailed. We’ve never really seen the faces of the accusers as they make these allegations and we’ve never really heard the family members who had to shoulder that pain."

"Burning M Jackson's CDs is the right thing to do"

Leaving Proof Behind: The Disgrace of ‘Leaving Neverland’

Since the MJ haters love Daily Mail and other tabloids for information. Here's one:

Michael Jackson sex abuse claims 'disproved by victim Wade Robson's own MUM'

Is it possible to treat vitiligo effectively by darkening your skin, rather then lightening it?

Wade Robson says MJ told him at 23 that if he told anyone they would both go to jail.

What grown man thinks he'll go to jail for talking about child abuse? Glad the judge didn't buy that nonsense.

MJ ridiculously initiated a rumor that Omar Bahati was his son, most probably to justify the presence of Omar with him everywhere especially after the Chandler scandal.

Wonder if the MJ Haters/Leaving Neverland truthers really believe that Gavin Arvizo and his family were kidnapped and held hostage at Neverland?

Rabbi Shmuley Boteach, Jewish leader once warned Jackson that he could not be “the child’s messiah”.

[quote]Fans are grasping at straws.

Agreed, R200, and apparently so is the MJ estate... here's just one example of the twisted "logic" they're using to defend the pedo-freak:

[quote]Wade Robson‘s story in “Leaving Neverland” is no doubt captivating, but those who were closest to Michael Jackson claim Robson twisted the facts to make the alleged abuse more sensational for the HBO documentary. Sources within the Michael Jackson Estate and Jackson family tell The Blast they believe Robson is telling a different story, in Dan Reed‘s “Leaving Neverland,” than what he said under oath during his 2016 deposition as part of the civil case he filed against MJ. According to court documents, in 2016 Robson said the first alleged incident of abuse occurred while his family was still at Neverland and his sister was sleeping upstairs in Jackson’s room. However, in “Leaving Neverland,” he claims Jackson convinced Robson’s parents to leave him alone with the singer while they went on a trip to the Grand Canyon, and it was then that Jackson allegedly performed oral sex on him for the first time and kissed him. Our sources claim the change in the story for the first description of alleged abuse is “more dramatic,” and “not the story he told under oath in his deposition.”

So... Jacko first diddling Wade through his undies while the Robsons were at Neverland and Jacko first sucking Wade's little boi-cock while the Robsons were at the Grand Canyon are somehow contradictory statements and a "change in the story"... WTF...?!

Rabbi Boteach is Roseanne's closest friend and a publicity whore but now wer'e supposed to take what he says seriously. Please.

I feel this is the beginning of the end for Wade and James. It's been an avalanche in the last 24 hours regarding the train station and Joy Robson's deposition. I think they will face near unanimous condemnation even before Taj makes his documentary.

R218 Wade went with his family to the Grand Canyon so that lie has been debunked.

What's his wife's ethnicity? She seems like a grifter too. And R220 this is only the beginning. The news cycle has already moved on, it's the MJ innocent crew and a lone celebrity or two keeping tabloids still writing about it; the next time anyone thinks of these two will be when their "sex abuse" narrative is attacked by the Jackson estate and their house is seized for the 70k they owe them.

R216 Most of them do. They report tabloid facts as truth and yet they call us truthers.

Says Jackson's former rabbi: "Jackson is a uniquely American tragedy".

MJ was Muslim, but his "rabbi friend" thinks he's guilty so that makes perfect sense.

R224 Glad that MJ had other Jewish friends. Boteach and Geller were both awful.

Safechuck is 41. Entirely too old to be playing games making up stories about getting his anus licked by a pop star 30 years ago. You missed your shot. Nice try, but no dice. He looks like a weirdo, and is that fat white woman his wife or GF?

Give it up you apologist. No amount of defamation you sling at towards Wade, James and whoever else comes out in the future, is going to change the fact that it is now accepted as FACT that Michael Jackson was a pedophile.

The Rabbi Shumley Boteach tapes reveal that Jackson was a drugged-out, delusional, tragic moron.

James and Wade wanted fame and fortune so badly that they decided to conspire to sentence their friends and family, especially their mothers' to a lifetime of extreme guilt and shame.

I believe that, but I was also so easily entertained that I thought that Michael Jackson's overproduced, mediocre pop music was good.

It's especially chilling in those rabbi's tapes that he says he wanted to be buried with children.

JACKSON: I always said, if I have to die, I want to be buried right where there's children. Wherever there's children, I want them next to me. I would feel safer that way. I want them next to me. I need the spirit protecting me.

I always see that in my mind. I see myself. I hate to see it like that. I see myself lying there with children next to me to protect me.

BOTEACH: Why are they protecting you? What are they protecting you from?

JACKSON: I see them as protection. I see them as, like I told you, like angels.

Fuck Michael Jackson was a monster of epic proportions. A lot of this denial is rife within the black community. Talking about childhood sexual abuse is taboo. How could all the Jacko kin readily see Jackson with all this little boys and not SAY anything. They are culpable. They should live in poverty and despair for the rest of their lives. Creeps.

R231, that is just... damn.

JABBA’s out of her fucking mind knowing how true and accurate Leaving Neverland is.

It’s so obvious by her going into overdrive trying to discredit the victims.

JABBA, your continued shit show gives me and my friends hours of laughs. We read your posts and HOWL with laughter.

Oops, James caught in another lie. A photograph has emerged with MJ, whose appearance had already drastically changed, and the Safechuck family taken only weeks before the 93 allegations. This of course contradicts Safechuck's narrative that he had no contact with Michael until after Michael called and asked James to defend him. Is It Scary was in the middle of shooting but scrapped after the allegations. This doesn't look good for you James.

My grandmother (fully Caucasian) had vitiligo and used heavy pancake foundation to blewn and conceal areas of depigmentation; there are better concealing makeups now and some, even very dark skinned people, use makeup to even out the complexion and hide the white spots. There are light therapies (UVA, psoralen) that can improve vitiligo or control it. Small areas can be re-pigmented with used of corticocosteroid creams.

R231 Did he ever volunteer what he was actually afraid was coming for him? He rests in peace I guess, but I like to think of him yelling like he was Catherine Deneuve in a dusty box with a heavy lid.

The truest thing Michael Jackson ever said was, "I'm bad, I'm bad, chamone."

R238 LMAO

R235 Everyone in their right mind knows Wade is completely untruthful but now James is totally being exposed too. Unbelievable. But good. He was their fallback whenever you called out any of Wade's BS. I guess at the end of the day all of James' opportunistic crap is coming to light also.

When they said they wanted to get out "the truth," I bet they weren't expecting all these lies in their past to decimate their story.

When I try to educate someone on the blatant falsehood of these two insane allegations, I find they have no idea what Leaving Neverland is or who these grifters . When I explain it is two new accusers claiming he abused them too--they always say that the men ought to be ashamed and let him rest in peace. I agree, and end the conversation there.

It's so great that the majority of the public isn't even bothered to watch this garbage, and it's 15 minutes of fame started fading the week after it was released. You know what won't fade, though? The 70k in legal fees that broke James and Wade will have to pay for their failed lawsuit attempt. It's a great time to be a MJ fan.

How do you accomplish that, retard JABBA/R241? Go door to door like the Jehovahs do?

R242 Awwww.. Another of Jabba's pathetic attempts to give its name away. Poor Jabba got its feelings hurt hating on MJ?

This ‘documentary’ is a disgrace to the art of visual information media. Perhaps it wouldn’t be so insulting to the viewer (and of course to the subject, Michael Jackson) if it were made clear that every second of it is based solely on the word of two men and not whatsoever — as one would be forgiven for expecting from something described as a documentary — in fact. Furthermore, I find it reprehensible that these men apparently resorted to such excruciatingly detailed descriptions of such heinous acts, in other words to rely on sheer shock value, to distract the audience away from the stories’ lack of continuity, credibility, and factual corroboration.

Michael Jackson was first accused of child molestation in 1993-1994 by a man who held a grudge against him and wanted money. He is literally recorded as saying he didn’t know or care if his son had actually been molested, and that all he cared about was ruining Michael’s career. His name is Evan Chandler and the telephone recordings are available on YouTube. Evan also manipulated his son Jordan into agreeing with the story he’d concocted. Dozens of families were interviewed by police (none of whom said anything incriminating), Michael’s house was raided for evidence (nothing was found), Michael himself was subjected to being photographed naked to see if Jordan would correctly describe how he looked without clothes (Jordan’s description didn’t match Michael’s body), and there were two grand jury hearings (neither of which granted the Chandlers any support for their case). The case was eventually settled out of court but the Chandlers were completely able to file a criminal case. They did not.

In 2005, there was an allegation that did lead to a criminal trial. Michael was tried on twelve counts of inappropriate behaviour with a minor, and two additional misdemeanours. The handling of this trial was absurd. The prosecution falsified and tampered with evidence, changed their story several times, couldn’t answer relevant questions, and generally didn’t provide enough of a case to indicate anything other than Michael’s innocence. He was found unanimously by the jury to be not guilty on all counts.

Additionally, for ten years, the FBI carried out a secret investigation on Michael (I’m not actually sure of the dates) and during that time found nothing to indicate his guilt. Nothing. In ten years. The Federal Bureau of Investigation. Professional finder-outers. This film references evidence (jewellery, for example) that the FBI either found irrelevant or didn’t find. Which you implying: that the FBI is careless or inept?

The information is all freely available, for those who care to look beyond tabloid clickbait. We have access to so much knowledge, and yet so many choose to remain ignorant. It’s disheartening.

And let’s not even get into how shameful it is that these men once defended Michael. Robson in particular voluntarily testified under oath as a GROWN MAN in defence of Michael, and both he and Safechuck signed declarations to the same effect. Michael left this world believing he had two more genuine friends than he really did (well, more acquaintances, really), and that is sad. I genuinely wonder how these two sick people can live with themselves. Why not go to court, win the case, and prove themselves as credible? If they have 4 hours of material, they’re bound to win, right? Except wrong. Because it’s all FALSE.

This is deplorable. This should be illegal. This is the worst joke I’ve heard in years. I cannot condemn this filth enough (because of the character limit). DO NOT WASTE YOUR TIME AND MONEY SUPPORTING LIES. SEEK TRUTH AND INTEGRITY. SUPPORT GENUINE VICTIMS INSTEAD.

R237 spoiler :(

Yes, yes and yes. I hope Dan Reed knows how important this doc has been to childhood sexual abuse survivors. This piece is great.

That never works, retard JABBA/R243. But do continue to try.

Great website, It destroys many of the inconsistencies in the documentary. Safechuck is so dishonest, hope his life insurance is in order for when all of his lies put him in hiding LOL.

Interesting blog about the destructive effects of LN

[quote] Why is the “woke” crowd so determinedly asleep at the wheel on this?

Wokeness is a mental illness. Kathy Griffin is a good example of how it can turn someone insane. Jamie Lee Curtis appears to have early onset. Breaks my heart.

[quote]How do you accomplish that, retard JABBA/[R241]? Go door to door like the Jehovahs do?

Now THAT I would actually love to encounter at my front door step one day.

Why does Safechuck look so mentally ill? Now that all his Jackson meet-ups are being disproven what's his excuse for acting and looking like a punk now?

[quote]Why does Safechuck look so mentally ill?

Are you really so heartless?

R253 Heartless? He knew what he was getting into when he launched a bunch of false allegations for money. Him and that cow of a wife don't know what they've gotten into going after an innocent man.

Oprah is reportedly removing all traces of LN from her social media. I think this might be coming to an end sooner than we thought. Thank goodness. The last 24 hours we exposed the train station lie, the grand canyon lie, the MJ returning to Safechuck in 93 after the allegations lie. This may just be the tip of the iceberg. Ironically, Safechuck's story may be the first to completely unravel, but Wade is looking much worse too especially after the fact finders leaped onto his mother's previous depositions.

R249 That was a powerful read. Was shocked to find out it was published before the documentary even aired and how so many lies were already on full display. The case against LN should be even stronger now in the wake of everything that's been discovered just within the last few days. No surprise that such a well researched and comprehensive article would have been ignored in favor of baseless hit pieces .

The pedo troll doesn’t sleep

R256 Agreed--so glad the truth is coming out. It's been assured that none of these guys will get any money (in fact they owe 10s of Gs to the estate), but I genuinely do not think I (or others) will be satisfied until their reputation is destroyed completely as they tried and failed to do with Jackson. Glad to see such a tenacious MJ fanbase against the Leaving Neverland truthers.

[quote]Agreed--so glad the truth is coming out. It's been assured that none of these guys will get any money (in fact they owe 10s of Gs to the estate), but I genuinely do not think I (or others) will be satisfied until their reputation is destroyed completely as they tried and failed to do with Jackson. Glad to see such a tenacious MJ fanbase against the Leaving Neverland truthers.

"Tenacious MJ fanbase," LOL (or in other words, crazed, lunatic pedo-defending freaks who love their "Thriller" LP more than they love either truth, justice, or common decency)... honey, you're only "agreeing" with yourself here, that much is clear.

Another 3rd rate entertainer and 1st rate creeper defends the pedo.

Yeah, just go to bed already, "Taj"...

R260 Great to see black entertainers coming out in support of Jackson. This is very much a racially motivated issue. The blood of Emmett Till rests at the feet of Safechuck and Robson. Glad they are finally getting their comeuppance.

OMG, seriously, R262...?! LOL, you moron, this has absolutely NOTHING to do with race (until people like YOU decide to pull the race card, when there is literally ZERO other defense upon which to rely)... and please, just save it with your ridiculous "blood of Emmett Till" crap. Just pathetic...

The sexual corruption of children has nothing to do with race and impacts all sectors of society equally. Now isn't the time for virtue-signaling. It's a time to understand that victims have a point of view which has no reason to be any longer suppressed.

Thank you, R264...

R264 Listening does not mean automatically believe.

The investigative work being done now should have been done by those making the film or other reputable journalists. Their depositions should have been enough to create doubt about their claims, but these new findings blow up their stories like nothing else has before

This is definitely a race issue that gets to the core of our society. People like Oprah, who the black community has watched with a distrustful eye for years, are complicit in the disenfranchisement and disparaging representation of African Americans in the media. Her presence in this documentary harms its perception and reception among black people, which is why so many have turned on her tacit hatred of Jackson and endorsement of this one-sided mockumentary. As someone previously tweeted:

"This is America. Black man vindicated in court. Vindicated by the FBI. Vindicated by two investigations. Vindicated by hundreds of witnesses. Two white men change their stories after twenty years. Claim they lied under oath. Seek lots of money."

The reality is that he was vindicated. By being found not guilty and having the investigations dropped he was cleared of blame and responsibility for these false allegations. Vindicated. He had his day in court and was set free. No other nation on earth allows the slander of members of one racial group by another the way that the white media has demonstrated in trying to destroy Jackson's legacy. Thankfully, they underestimated the cost in taking down the legacy of the greatest, top-selling entertainer of all time. This is just the beginning.

Oh really, R267. Care to summarize what some of these incredible new finding are? Because I still have not heard one piece of data that casts even a single shadow of doubt effectively on what the accusers have said so far. They are solid and believable to the point that even Jackson's own rabbi, the person to whom MJ confessed his darkest secrets believes the accusers, Wade and James over Jackson.

And once again, just a little comic relief, LOL...

R269 I suggest going back to parts 9 and 10 to reread the incredibly large number of lies in their lawsuits concerning even the most basic details about when they met Jackson, when/where the alleged abuse began, when it stopped, and numerous other major red flags and pure contradictions in their sworn oaths and declarations.

The non-existent train station, impossible "threatening" phone call, "our secret project" book proposal, and the numerous other massive timeline failures in the story just add on to the ever-increasing doubt that Michael Jackson was anything but kinder than he should have been to these two and their families.

R269 Also, again Jackson was Muslim (and uncircumcised FWIW.) That Rabbi "friend" according to the article is hardly anyone he would have "confessed his darkest secrets" to as you say.

[quote]The pedo troll doesn’t sleep

I know, R257, and he/she/they/it is absolutely insufferable (and somehow determined to change a "narrative" which is now forever unchangeable)...

R272 Jackson only confessed to the rabbi on tape that he hoped to have his body "buried along side children" when he died. If that isn't sick and twisted, then I don't know what is.

R271 ALL a waste of time and a pile of BS! You are clearly no Angela Lansbury when it comes to detective work, so don't give up your day job yet honey!

R272 Thinks she is.......

The Jacko-stans here are clearly demented, LOL... and as much as we are told (repeatedly) to not engage them... I mean, FUCK...! How can we not? It's like asking folks to turn their pretty little rubber-neck heads away from a horrific road accident, LOL... god, these people are truly disgusting...

Jackson fan does not really think for a minute that R271 is evidence that holds up to scrutiny on any level.

They are CLEARLY aware that Jackson is guilty, and are simply enjoying the perverse thrill of defending a person who they actually believe was entitled to rape small children while they were walking the earth.

I wonder how far the estate will go in seizing assets to enforce the 70k+ judgement(s) against Wade and James. Should they be as ruthless as these two with their false allegations?

Their failure to tap into the men's bank accounts and drain what little they had with a court order is just further proof the MJ legacy was more kind and forgiving than these men. If I were the estate lawyers I would have put a repo order on their cars as they were leaving Sundance. Better man, alright...

Nitpicking on details that an abused 10-year year old is likely to forget offers no proof in my book.

Exactly, R279... I mean, for fuck's sake, these boys were literally SEVEN and TEN years old when the abuse began... seriously, who among us can remember exact (and sordid) details from such a young age...?! The Jacko-stans will literally go to ANY lengths to defend their Mighty Pedophile...

Updated the public list of Jackson defenders:

Barbra Streisand

Will.i.am

Brigitte Nielsen

Wendy Williams

Monique

Left out Diana Ross (for now); who complained but has so far not defended or tried to justify MJ's perversions like the others. Also Madonna, who has defended in the past but who wisely zipped up her trapper for this round of accusations.

Also out are Culkin, Paris Jackson and Aaron Carter who are clearly broken down and mind fucked individuals, unable to reach any sensible conclusions on their own.

Shame on these sick 2nd and 3rd rate (at best) entertainers who should have known better... Defending pedophiles after the fact, is like committing a double rape against the child who was harmed in the first place. Defending pure evil for the sake of their own pathetic egos.

I wonder how Barbra Streisand will feel if a pair of bloody stained children's underware finds its way onto her painted white mic at her next Hyde Park gig?

Interesting how the scummy fans have turned their attention from Robson to Safechuck, now having no qualms about insulting him. He was exempt at first as they saw Wade as more kickable. but they are so desperate they now kick Safechuck, even tho' he has universal support and sympathy ( minus those infected with the Jackson fan plague of course ). Very brave of the victims to put themselves at risk from these demented and obsessed 'fans'. The shitty fans really have no life it seems, their dread at the truth is pathetic. They worship a drug addled pedophile who was so ashamed of his race he dyed his own skin. Jackson was also dumb. For all his wealth and influence he never improved his mind, it was all Hollywood blockbusters and candy. He could have sampled the best of everything but his taste only extended as far as trash, trash painted gold, like a Trump or Liberace. His real passion was not music and certainly not helping children , it was getting into bed and sexual situations with pretty young ( sickeningly young ) boys, so I guess it makes sense for the world's most proficient child molester to use all the riches at his disposal to lure his target of pretty young boys, hence the funfair etc . A grown man doesn't turn his home into the Pleasure Island from Pinocchio other than for nefarious reasons. Dying was the best career and life move that Jackson, a cloying. sniveling, squeaking, mincing freak could have made. Jackson = pedophile now and forever.

Well said, R284!

Wacko sure did love the ladies...

"I've touched children all over the world" (at 3:11, LOL)...

"Little Billy's Not My Lover"... yeah right, pedo.

The Jackson Bunch:

[quote] Nitpicking on details that an abused 10-year year old is likely to forget offers no proof in my book.

It's not nitpicking. James and Wade's lawsuits got dismissed on substantive grounds, and now they are changing their stories yet again. For goodness sake, Wade even admits to knowingly lying in 2005 to protect MJ's kids while still claiming to not know at the time he suffered abuse. He says that he had sex with Jackson almost every day "in the beginning of their relationship" even though the train station wasn't completed until 94 and other places he mentioned were still under construction. He described the movie theater wrong, failed to mention the security cameras around the pool and jacuzzi, said he was estranged from Jackson around the time of the Chandler allegations, even though a photo emerged with him and jackson only days or weeks before the news broke, his bizarre account of being threatened with perjury after previously defending Jackson. There is Joy Robson saying in both depositions taken years apart that she took Wade with her to the Grand Canyon. I mean, what the fuck else do you need?

[quote] He says that he had sex with Jackson almost every day "in the beginning of their relationship"

Was talking about James there.

Macaulay finally breaks his silence...

And, of course... no "Leaving Neverland, Part XX" thread would be complete without this little gem:

Jackson hated being black and leaned on the black community only when he got into trouble. He was a disgusting pedophile and just seeing images of his sister yesterday made me sick. Truly.

His fans are worse than Trumpsters they're Sandyhook truthers. They literally wish death on the victims.

[quote] His real passion was not music and certainly not helping children , it was getting into bed and sexual situations with pretty young ( sickeningly young ) boys, so I guess it makes sense for the world's most proficient child molester to use all the riches at his disposal to lure his target of pretty young boys, hence the funfair etc .

Right. He didn't at all devote his life to being the best all around entertainer in the world or writing and performing thousands of songs in front of a global audience. Ridiculous comment.

[quote]His fans are worse than Trumpsters they're Sandyhook truthers. They literally wish death on the victims.

Correct, R294... case in point, here are two delightful Jacko-stan comments from the "other" Part 11 thread:

[quote]I'd love to run into James Safechuck on the street...good thing he can't afford security since he's broke as fuck.

[quote]I'll be saying the same thing when the rebuttal documentary comes out, and James Safechuck is the victim of a fatal attack for his repeated lies.

Celebrity worship at it's finest, y'all...

Ugh, R296 - they're really sick people. It 's amazing that James, Wade, Jordan, Gavin, etc came forward at all with this bunch of psychopaths out there.

[quote]Is it possible to treat vitiligo effectively by darkening your skin, rather then lightening it?

Absolutely, as there are waterproof skin dyes that can be matched to any natural skin tone. But, Jacko chose the more extreme and less safe route of bleaching his skin with chemicals because he hated being a black man - to the point that he covered his fingertips with tape to hide his black skin underneath his nails; butchered his nose; wore non-ethnic wigs; married white women, and paid at least one of them to have white babies for him.

[quote]and just seeing images of his sister yesterday made me sick. Truly.

The Margaret White wig did her no favors. But at least it did stop her from performing.

Sorry, but Janet never belonged in the Rn'R hall of fame anyhow.

[quote]Right. He didn't at all devote his life to being the best all around entertainer in the world or writing and performing thousands of songs in front of a global audience. Ridiculous comment.

Ummm... yeah right, R295. But you're forgetting one tiny, little detail here... your beloved "Best All Around Entertainer In The World" will instead now and forevermore be best-remembered as "The Most Prolific And Creepy Weirdo Pedo Freak In The Entire Universe Who Loved To Fuck Little Boys."

Agreed R300 and she knew how demented and sick her freak brother was.

Are the MJ stans multiple people or do they change tactics? I remember from the last threads, one wrote in a certain style, more polished but still kind of dumb, and was starting threads. Then there is another who keeps bringing up race and I'm asuming they're the one who writes the violent stuff also.

As for Michael, his priority later in life was to rape boys. His impulses were so strong that he didn't even try to hide these relationships and even after he was accused, he still surrounded himself with a harem of young boys.

[quote]Then there is another who keeps bringing up race

Ah, yes... when all else fails, play the race card (you know the drill, LOL).

[quote]Are the MJ stans multiple people or do they change tactics?

Dunno, R303... but I'm guessing that the Jacko-fantard's "employer" is not agreeable to paying overtime on Saturday mornings?!?! Hmmm...

[quote]As for Michael, his priority later in life was to rape boys. His impulses were so strong that he didn't even try to hide these relationships and even after he was accused, he still surrounded himself with a harem of young boys.

Truer words were never spoken...

[quote]Agreed [R300] and she knew how demented and sick her freak brother was.

Oh man, R302... if only Janet could come clean and just admit it... WOW, what a powerful statement she could make in support of CSA survivors...

[quote]As for Michael, his priority later in life was to rape boys. His impulses were so strong that he didn't even try to hide these relationships and even after he was accused, he still surrounded himself with a harem of young boys.

Yup, R303 (and unfortunately we are ALL, by default, accessories to those crimes)... the monster was literally hiding in plain sight, as it were. Ugh...

The compulsion to keep doing it so openly despite criminal charges and tens of millions in settlements, the crazy was strong in that one!

Jackson's creepy comments about wanting children buried with him reminds me of the Egyptian pharoahs being buried with their wives and pets. Pedo MJ probably wanted a 7 year old boy holed up in some vast tomb with him so that the sick fucker could carry on raping children from beyond the grave.

Agreed R305 and Paris too. I actually don't think Paris will have peace until she comes to terms with who her father really was. She lives in lala land - I am his biological daughter, he didn't have a drug problem, he was murdered, etc. It's not going to end well for her until she breaks free from the estate/freak Jackson clan and asserts herself. I doubt she will though.

Jackson had some good songs in the 80s but that was the end of it. He had a squeaky voice and was a one trick pony as far as dancing went. Not much of a great entertainer after all. I don't get the hype.

[quote] Ugh, [R296] - they're really sick people. It 's amazing that James, Wade, Jordan, Gavin, etc came forward at all with this bunch of psychopaths out there.

Clearly the delusional ones posting here are not the Jackson stans.

Ooooh, the Jacko-stans pull out the punches, R311 (and then they refer to themselves as Jacko-stans, LOL)... god, you just can't make this shit up!

R312 There is such a thing as Jacko Stans and people like you make them look sane in comparison. Anyone who takes more than 5 minutes to research the Arvizo case would know it was absolute bullshit.

Better to have an unhealthy obsession with a celebrity than be someone who is obsessed with labeling everyone a victim despite personal testimony and contradictory evidence. That's the thing. There is not even lack of evidence. The evidence that does exist points to Jackson's innocence.

The Venn Diagram of InfoWars watchers, Michael Jackson lunactic fans, and unmedicated schzios is a circle.

R314 Jackson had no innocence. He was a pedophile who admitted for 20 years that he shared his bed nightly with boys aged 7-14.... Just the right age when boys are curious but unworldly about their sexuality, and are vulnerable to an especially devious individual who wants to take advantage. This is the only evidence a reasonable, or even mildly intelligent person needs to ferret out a predator.

Was "I'm going to Disneyland!" Jackson's code for " I going to fuck some boys"?

R316 If that's all the evidence one would need, then why are so many haters going to such lengths to defend so many logical inconsistencies in the accusers' stories? Why disregard all the evidence of Jackson sharing his bed with family members and other adults? Why do they use his ever changing appearance as proof he was committing such crimes? Why continually insult those who spent time with Jackson as a kid, calling them abuse victims or enablers? Why claim that these alleged victims receive payouts whenever they speak highly of Jackson, but then claim they are bullied when they choose to stay silent? Why compare MJ to an average citizen when there is ample evidence he couldn't leave the confines of his residence at any time without being mobbed by fans?

Why is it that Jackson's whacked out supporters never answer the hard questions? Like how do you explain the cook seeing Michael with his hand down Culkin's pants (no he never sued Michael in any way). What about the two Canadian social workers on the train who became suspicious of his behavior with Jordan? What what about Michael calling Omer his son? Jordan his cousin?

And why would people who are naturally skeptical of tabloid stories suddenly believe every tabloid allegation regarding MJ no matter how ridiculous it sounds?

Omer Bhatti was so brainwashed by Jackson & then used by his family as a cover. "See he's not a victim!!!"when he so obviously is. I think Culkin was 100% abused by Jackson & that's why he made Culkin the godfather to Paris. Kinda ensures his loyalty/silence doesn't it? MJ was sick, evil and a master manipulator.

Guessing she's an MJ fan too?

LOL, the racist white, elderly MJ haters are living in la la land posting 30 year old MADtv sketches and repeating absurd tabloid claims about cooks and maids who were fired from Neverland and lost defamation suits among other embarrassments before making a false claim against him years later.

Completely ignoring the evidence to conclude that these two white men who claimed they lied, forgot the abuse, were embarrassed, etc. overwhelms the incredible proof these accusers are lying. I’m sorry, but even white privilege didn’t let them tarnish the reputation or legacy of Michael Jackson—and if you think they did you’re just living in a bubble.

Of course. None of this matters anyway. Leaving Neverland’s fifteen minutes of fame was over two and a half weeks ago. No matter how many nonsensical interviews Reed does to try to stay in the spotlight people have moved back to the reality of not giving a shit. The only thing keeping this in the news cycle now are the numerous celebrities coming out to defend MJ. Even Oprah’s ass took a seat after she started to get attacked for supporting this mockumentary. If we’re being truly honest with each other, Jussie Smollett’s situation gained more attention than this entire stunt. I bet our illiquid accusers, James and Wade, greatly wish they would have polished their story a little more, or just kept quiet before peddling such graphic and distasteful “MJ was my lover” inspired lies before ruining their reputation and putting themselves over 70k worth of debt to the very estate of the man they tried to get 1.5 billion from.

Was checking the Leaving Neverland hashtag today. The main tag, not an alternate. MJ supporters outnumber the haters and skeptics. For those who were on the fence, James and Wade's discredited claims are more proof of his innocence.

Kat Williams on Michael Jackson:

Because deluded people like you are obsessed, R324. Stand on a street corner in ANY major American city and ask every person passing you whether Michael Jackson was a pedophile, and the vast majority will say they at least THINK he was. The support is overwhelmingly amongst shut-ins, basement dwellers, etc.

HAHAHAHAHA @ R323, those are not tabloid claims and your reply is what I was expecting. You have no answer so you make up stories. The train incident was in an FBI report and there is a copy of the report on file. He was also being investigated by the FBI for molesting 2 Mexican boys. Aren't you fond of trotting out the bullshit claim that Michael was investigated for 10 years by the FBI and cleared? All evidence that I've seen shows that the FBI let him off the hook multiple times. The cook, Phillip LeMarque, was never part of any suit an dwasnt fired. The eyewitness account he provided was direct testimony. Look it up. Are you accusing him of lying under oath? Michael himself called Omer Bhatti his son. I specifically sited those examples because they are indisputable and not from the delusional blogs, you stupid shitstain.

[quote] He was also being investigated by the FBI for molesting 2 Mexican boys. Aren't you fond of trotting out the bullshit claim that Michael was investigated for 10 years by the FBI and cleared? All evidence that I've seen shows that the FBI let him off the hook multiple times.

This part makes no sense.

[quote] The eyewitness account he provided was direct testimony.

As was the testimony of the person he claimed was abused.

[quote] Michael himself called Omer Bhatti his son.

All the Jackson treated him like a member of the family. He's still close to Jackson's children to this day. Also claims that he was never abused.

R328, it's called irony. Supporters claim he was cleared by the FBI, yet there are FBI files that point to his guilt. For one thing, he wasn't investigated for 10 years, that was untrue. The FBI was brought in a couple of times though and because of their involvement, Michael was let off even when evidence of inappropriate conduct was clear. CA police wanted the FBI to charge him with transporting a minor across (Jordan) state lines and the FBI refused. He was also being investigated for molesting 2 Mexican boys and the FBI covered that up. I believe the employee, one of many who claimed to have seen abuse, over Culkin. Culkin was not directly asked about that incident either. Why did Michael claim Omer was his son? For what reason would he try and cover up how close he was to Omer? He didn't say he was like a son, he said he might be his son. Why did he introduce Jordan as his cousin? Why did the two social workers report Michael to the conductor?

Those kids are all fucked in the head, that's why they still defend him. He did some psychological number on them.

R329 Absolutely true.

R329 The FBI shoudn't have been involved in the first place. They didn't get him off the hook. Transporting a minor across state lines is a crime when done with the purpose to engage in illegal sex or child pornography. There was no proof of either. It's a ridiculous claim because if Michael wanted to molest a young boy, he would do it behind the gates, not travel the country where he would be recognized anywhere he went. If the FBI were investigating this matter before the allegations, it would've been a media shitstorm.

[quote] He was also being investigated for molesting 2 Mexican boys and the FBI covered that up.

There is no proof of a coverup but I'll look at your source if you can provide one.

[quote] Why did Michael claim Omer was his son? For what reason would he try and cover up how close he was to Omer? He didn't say he was like a son, he said he might be his son.

How do you know exactly what he said? Why would you keep the child you're abusing around your children? Omer as an adult says nothing happened, and is protective of Jackson's family to this day.

[quote] Culkin was not directly asked about that incident either.

Yes, he must have forgotten all about it. It must be another repressed memory.

Look at what's happening with Jussie Smollet today. Just because the FBI lets you off the hook, doesn't mean you get off completely. Most likely Smollet will still be charged by the Chicago police.

R332 I doubt the FBI is going to involve itself in Smollett's case. Their best time to take over the investigation was the moment CPD began investigating the hate crime in the first place. However, the Chicago police chief declined to turn the investigation over to a credible law enforcement agency and in doing so his superiors released and vindicated Smollett. A petty financial dispute between him and the city is going to be the end of that drama.

R331, here you go. This article reports the major points of the FBI documents.

Oops and I forgot... why did Michael pay off Jason Francia to the tune of 2.5 million? 🤔 No wonder the guy died broke.

Martin Bashir (who, to Jackson supporters, is essentially Satan) said after Jackson's death that he did not believe he was a child molester. Judging by some of the tweets he's "liked" recently, his views appear to have changed.

[quote] How anyone doubts the R. Kelly and Michael Jackson allegations is beyond me 🤷‍♂️ I remember watching Jackson’s interview with @MartinBashir when I was 13. I thought it was creepy and pedo as hell back then too

[quote] @MartinBashir I rewatched your Michael Jackson interviews and it seems clear you were very alarmed at his sleeping with young boys. I’m guessing you’re not surprised about @danreed1000 ‘s Leaving Neverland ?

[quote] I went through the #LeavingNeverland documentary. Two thoughts: 1) I believe the accusers, they are extremely compelling 2) @MartinBashir who was broadly slammed for his 2003 documentary "Living with Michael Jackson" is probably feeling pretty vindicated right now

[quote] Say what you want about him. @MartinBashir, you were right sir. How much damage could have been prevented if people listened to you when you made it crystal clear that things were off w/ #MichaelJackson?

Michael Jackson was found not guilty. The local police interviewed a large number of children, particularly boys, with some relationship to Jackson's life in an effort to try and determine if there was a pattern of abuse. It did not work, because the victims did not exist. That is why the FBI closed their investigation, and also why the jury found him not guilty by unanimous consent. I trust their judgement more than Dan Reed, and certainly two white men whose only explanation for their staunch defense of him before and after his death was "I lied."

Side note: I have seen several social media screenshots showing that one (or both?) of the parents were still liking Michael Jackson themed content on Facebook after being told about the alleged abuse. Has Dan Reed put out another "he could have been seeing both" type of excuse like the Brandi incident yet?

R335 Martin Bashir isn't really Satan to MJ supporters--just not anymore credible than Dan Reed or the accusers. As a matter of fact, he was voted one of the most distrusted journalists in the U.K. Just like Dan Reed, Bashir's "documentary" is held in disrepute by those who seek to evaluate the story by using credibility instead of doctored and manipulated footage.

On MJ’s method of raising children, his comment on the documentary was:

“They are restricted, they are overly protected. I was angry at the way that his children were made to suffer”.

But what he said behind the scenes was this:

To MJ: “Your relationship with your children is spectacular. In fact, it almost makes me weep when I see you with them”.

On Neverland, his documentary comment was:

“One of the most disturbing things is the fact that many disadvantged children go to Neverland. Is a dangerous place for a vulnerable child to be”.

Here he wanted to imply that MJ was a child abuser. But what he said about Neverland behind the scenes was:

To MJ: “I was here yesterday and I saw it, and it’s nothing short of a spiritually, kind thing”.

It leaves no doubt in my mind that Bashir knew from the very beginning what kind of documentary he wanted to make and lied to MJ for months. This is why as far as I am concerned, that documentary is not a credible source of any claims against Michael Jackson.

R334 The claims of him trying to kidnap a child still doesn't sound plausible given who he was. The LAPD would have conducted their own investigation. Jackson was cleared due to lack of evidence. I don't see any proof of a coverup.

R338 Are you talking about Gavin? If so, I believe the claim was not that he kidnapped Gavin, but the entire family and held them hostage supplying them with alcohol. The mother only "escaped" by claiming she had a shopping trip and dental visit. That was a truly insane family. I wonder what ever came of them.

R338 That's from reading the article. The PDF documents are no longer available.

R339 I was actually referring to the FBI files that were summarized in that article but yes the Arvizo family were completely nuts. I did feel bad for Gavin at the time, but hopefully he was able to escape from his insane family.

R336, there was no FBI investigation, the only involvement the FBI had was covering up Michael Jackson's crimes.

R338, that's the law. It doesn't matter if he's famous; he wasn't the boy's parent. This same child, Jordan Chandler, is who later accused him of molesting him and who he settled with. It says in black and white the police wanted him charged and the FBI stepped in and wouldn't do it, due to a cover up. It says nothing about lack of evidence. He was on a train going across state lines with a child that was not his. The Mexican boys were mentioned in the FBI as well and how that was covered up. Stop the nonsense already. The man was guilty as hell. I feel ridiculous even typing responses, it is that insane not to see this man was a child rapist.

[quote]The FBI was brought in a couple of times though and because of their involvement, Michael was let off even when evidence of inappropriate conduct was clear.

Rich, white motherfuckers always get off.

You can travel with a minor across state lines if you have parental consent.

MJ is rotting in hell & anybody that is not insane knows he was a disgusting, bed-wetting pedo. If I saw MJ on somebody's playlist I'd thing they were a moron right away.

R342 Those of us who have come to the thoughtful conclusion that MJ was not guilty of these allegations, like the jury that acquitted him, on the basis of overwhelming evidence are branded "truthers." Remarkably, the people who spread that title are the same individuals who peddle conspiracy theories about secret FBI cover-ups and debunked tabloid claims from former employees who were paid many years after he fired them and they lost in their termination lawsuit. I am sorry, but there is no black man in America famous enough (even Michael Jackson) to molest white children and have the FBI "cover it up." He was innocent, end of story.

Thanks r325! A classic that will never get old.

Being found not guilty doesn't equal innocence. Some not being molested doesn't mean others weren't.

Jackson was a junkie pedophile, end of story.

^ junkie pedo and a thief he stole a lot from real musicians.

R347 You're right, being found not guilty doesn't necessarily mean you are innocent. Instead, it means that the evidence wasn't strong enough for a guilty verdict. The evidence hasn't changed with the introduction of these accusers or the film, and the numerous contradictions and lies in their lawsuits and stories only further add to the fact that the evidence is weak and insufficient. His death does not earn him a posthumous conviction, especially not one that he escaped by unanimously verdict during his lifetime.

As for the accusers, whether you find them credible or not, It's clear they participated in this documentary because they are now in heavy debt to the estate and are desperate for people to believe them.

R346, you keep repeating the same nonsense, even when you've been disproven. Everything I said has been backed up and laid out in black and white. FBI documents, no less. Yet, you're still saying they're from a tabloid. I don't normally like to belittle people who obviously have some sort of developmental issue, but in your case it's deserved. You sound like you have a very low IQ and some sort of processing disorder. You are definitely someone who would be taken in by a Jim Jones type cult. It boggles my mind that people such as yourself sit on juries like on the OJ Simpson case, Casey Anthony and yes, your beloved Michael Jackson. It's truly frightening.

R351 The FBI declined to pursue a case against Michael Jackson because there was not sufficient evidence that he committed a crime. That is the end if the story. I will repeat this again since it clearly has you quite upset:

I am sorry, but there is no black man in America famous enough (even Michael Jackson) to molest white children and have the FBI "cover it up." He was innocent, end of story.

Moreover, R351, linking to an article from the NY Post (a tabloid) with the title "FBI bares weird Jacko secrets" and claiming that:

"Everything I said has been backed up and laid out in black and white. FBI documents, no less. Yet, you're still saying they're from a tabloid."

does not suggest that I am the one who harbors "some sort of developmental issue" or a low-IQ.

R353 Those FBI files are also inaccessible

[quote]I don't normally like to belittle people who obviously have some sort of developmental issue, but in your case it's deserved.

It's pretty much a given the Jackoloons have mental deficiencies.

R355 Queue your backup support to deflect from a clear loss in argument with personal attacks.

R353, you are sooo predicable. That's why I wrote that the publication is reporting the major points from the documents. They even linked the docs in the article. Multiple outlets reported the same thing. The NY Post is not a tabloid, it's a major newspaper. Of course, it's not your holy grail of news like your mjisinnocent blogs. You are sad and pathetic. Your brain is like a brick wall. Thick, blank and nothing goes through it.

I'll humor you, this site has a copies of the documents where the cover-up is mentioned with the Mexican boys. Also shown is the document about the train incident. Oh and an added bonus, some unknown person had a restraining order against Michael.

BTW, Michael hadn't been a black man in many decades.

r356, I wasn't engaging with you, dumbass.

But, thanks for proving my post.

R358, my guess is that their wracking their feeble brain right about trying to come up with a lame excuse about the FBI documentation. I'm half expecting them to scream forgery, then of course say Michael was acquitted. Still waiting for an answer as to why Michael paid 2.5 million to the maid's son, who still testified he was molested 3x by MJ. Why Michael lied and said these kids were his relatives? It's just too easy with these people. I think Michael started to go for darker kids than Safechuck and Robson, so he could try to pass them off as his relatives. Not that it was in any way believable. He was truly diabolically evil.

R357 I am honestly surprised you are still on this. The "New York Times Post" is written in tabloid format and unaffiliated with the NY Times in case you are not an American and did not know this. Have you ever picked up one of their magazines? More importantly, does you honestly believe that a credible, major newspaper would publish an article titled: "FBI bares weird Jacko secrets." The second article from them that you posted starts off with the claim that:

"The FBI also examined an alleged “child porn” video tape labelled “Michael Jackson’s Neverland Favorites”, according to documents unearthed by Sun Online."

For starters, if you backtrack this claim, you will discover that no other reputable news organization has ever reported on it. So where did this claim come from? Well, upon further research we see that they attribute it to "the Sun" which "is a tabloid newspaper published in the United Kingdom and Republic of Ireland" according to Wikipedia. I was aware of this, and thought "why is one tabloid quoting another" and how did they "unearth" a find as explosive as this that did not receive widespread attention?

The answer might be because they admit that "It is unclear what exactly was on the tape but the request to examine it came to the FBI from the US Customs Service." So then the question becomes, how do they know it was a "child porn" video tape, and the answer is that they did not, and from the FBI's examination of what exactly it contained, the more conclusive answer is that it certainly was not child pornography.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

R359 The FBI documentation is further proof that there was not any credible evidence against Michael Jackson, which is why the investigation was closed. The person who requested the release of MJ's file was actually a fan, and maintains a website where he explains that:

"I should begin by saying that the release of Michael Jackson's FBI file was not motivated by any desire to damage his legacy or smear his name. Many of Jackson's fans are understandably distrustful of the establishment which repeatedly pursued the star on trumped up charges, but the release of Jackson's FBI file is no conspiracy. Jackson's file was requested under the Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) and I was one of those who requested it.

The FBI released roughly 300 pages on Jackson, constituting less than half of his overall file. The reason behind the withholding of the other half is yet to be made public, but it most likely consists of information on Jackson's dealings with still living figures of interest to the bureau - civil rights activists like Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson, and the various Middle Eastern businessmen and royals Michael Jackson befriended.

The released half of Jackson's FBI file supports the star's innocence entirely. Perhaps most notably, a lengthy report shows that when Jackson's Neverland Ranch was raided in 2003, the FBI went over every computer seized from the property with a fine toothcomb looking for any incriminating files or internet activity. Jackson's file contained individual summaries of the FBI's findings for each of the 16 computers. Scrawled in capital letters across each of those 16 reports - 'NOTHING'. "

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

R360, don't play stupid, oh wait.... it's amusing you choose to focus on the publication and not the fact that they provide copies of the FBI memos. The evidence, especially those FBI documents, speak volumes. No amount of talking in circles is going to change the clear facts that he was guilty and law enforcement knew. You aren't changing anyone's mind. You're just showing yourself to be a looney toon.

Inside Michael Jackson's Neverland - porn, secret 'abuse' chambers and creepy child dummies

Michael Jackson caught using creepy disguise to 'buy wedding ring for victim'

The FBI investigation is a great talking point for me, because it shows Michael Jackson was the subject of an extensive, lengthy investigation that was closed because there was no credible evidence to convince the FBI he did anything illegal.

R363 the Daily Mail is a British tabloid, who had to pay damages for insinuating Melania Trump was a prostitute. You repeatedly post tabloid after tabloid to defend your belief of how damning these FBI files are--but suggest I am the one who is developmentally delayed?

R364 I don't have to focus on the publication, when you link to a tabloid article from the Sun,, TMZ, Daily Mail, or NY Post with a nonsensical title then you have already called your own intelligence into question for believing the garbage. Now R365 you link to The Mirror--do you have any other sources of information that are not British tabloids???

R367 Sorry but Melanoma is a former prostitute that's a fact.

Michael Jackson Leaving Neverland: Viewers left 'vomiting' over graphic abuse claims

Michael Jackson Leaving Neverland sent viewers into meltdown with horrifying descriptions of sexual abuse

If Michael Jackson was innocent and merely accused by fame-hungry grifters because of his wealth and stardom, where are the similar accusations against other stars? Nobody else gets accusations of molesting 7 year olds! Much less repeatedly, over multiple decades.

R367, the FBI has stated that they did NOT perform an extensive, long-term investigation into him. Quit lying.

In case you want to actually read one of the documents and not a recursive tabloid summation of what they do not contain: I suggest this file, which details a Los Angeles field office investigation into extortion threats against Michael Jackson and others in 1992. The subject of this investigation pled guilty and was sentenced to prison in 1993.

Imagine being a fantard of dead serial child rapist how sad.

Where are your links R367? Where is the link saying Michael was investigated for 10 years and cleared? Where is the link saying Jordan Chandler recanted his story? At least we back up our claims with real publications that people have actually heard of. You just troll MJ fan blogs. Your arguments are so flimsy that I have to laugh. You are grasping, big time.

Inside Michael Jackson's second sham marriage - and how he 'snatched' their children

I love how you rapidly begin posting more stories from "The Mirror" another tabloid to cover up and deflect from the current conversation.

Celebrity cult worship needs to go.

R373

"Where are your links [R367]? Where is the link saying Michael was investigated for 10 years and cleared?"

I never claimed he was investigated for "ten years and cleared." He was investigated between 1993 and 1994 and separately between 2004 and 2005. Both instances revealed a lack of evidence and the FBI declined to take any action.

"Where is the link saying Jordan Chandler recanted his story?"

I have never claimed this either. You are just repeating "gotcha" talking points in the hopes that you can finally seize on one and regain some credibility. However, I will claim that the settlement agreement never prevented the Chandler family from participating in a criminal investigation.

"At least we back up our claims with real publications that people have actually heard of. You just troll MJ fan blogs. Your arguments are so flimsy that I have to laugh. You are grasping, big time."

I've backed up my claims with actual documents from the FBI Vault to disprove your tabloid sourced claims, and an article from the FOIA requester who asked to obtain those documents. As far as Leaving Neverland, I back my claims up (like many others) with documents showing that contrary to the accusers' assertions, their claims are either implausible or impossible due to legal or construction discrepancies.

Also, posting a handful of tabloid articles every time your numerous lies and claims are called out is a weak, ridiculous way to shift the narrative.

R377/R378, yeah, sure. Again, no amount of talking in circles and trying be clever is going to make anything you say any more credible. You haven't got a leg to stand on. So glad Michael has been exposed and the sane people of this world know what a monster the man was.

R379 You're the one bringing up pro MJ arguments that were never even brought him in the first place in order to debunk them. That sounds more like talking in circles to me.

You're the one bringing up pro MJ arguments that were never even brought up in the first place in order to debunk them. That sounds more like talking in circles to me.

How come the Jackson fans don't pool their money to buy Neverland, and open it up as an attraction and/or a place to worship their idol?

You know, since Jackson and his home were paragons of innocence and all.

R382, they could rename it Pedoland.

R370 This is my favorite reply so far, because it attempts to take a point that suggests Leaving Neverland is a lie and instead turn it around on its head to make it seem the film is more truthful. You say:

"If Michael Jackson was innocent and merely accused by fame-hungry grifters because of his wealth and stardom, where are the similar accusations against other stars? Nobody else gets accusations of molesting 7 year olds! Much less repeatedly, over multiple decades."

Leaving Neverland portrays Michael Jackson as a serial pedophile because the basic reality is that it would have to be true in order for Wade and James to be telling credible, non-isolated stories of hundreds of abuse incidents resulting from nearly every interaction with him. Otherwise, they are simply isolated and non-credible accusers who filed 4 contradictory lawsuits seeking 1.5 billion 10 years after his death.

There is a major problem though, Dan Reed could not find anyone else to support the most important and central premise of his movie. Even Gavin and Chandler had no interest in responding to his attempt to use them to corroborate his claims.His solution was instead to just heavily imply that there were many other are also abuse victims to make the claims "stick."

Of course, he was also aware that all of them either denied this claim or had never made any negative statement about their times with Jackson. Now we are at a point where Dan Reed's fans are attacking the numerous children who say they were never subjected to any illegal activity--all to support a documentary that one of the "kids" has threatened to sue HBO if the insinuation he was abused is not removed. But what about the serial abuse premise that gives Wade and James' claims a leg to stand on beyond "we lied?"

Of course, the simplest answer to address claims by many others who had almost identical experiences as Wade and James but no ever-changing abuse stories added in is that he was not a serial pedophile. However, that would make Leaving Neverland and its 4 hours of manipulation and drama considerably less reliable. So of course, they are simply lying, embarrassed, or some other nonsensical rationale for why dozens, possibly hundreds, of other kids who knew Jackson have made no claims or staunch denials of any abuse.

R382 R383 Well, we know Wade and James cannot afford it. They can't even pay the estate the 70k in legal fees and court costs owed as a result of their frivolously contradictory and comically non-successful lawsuits.

Jackson FANS, not his molestation VICTIMS, r385. Learn to read, fucktard.

Here's the 60 Minutes interview he did shortly after his arrest in 2003. At 16:42, he stands by the pronouncements he made in the Bashir documentary about how loving it is to sleep with children. At 18:57, he is asked if he would allow his children to sleep in the same bed as someone who's been accused of child molestation. He says he absolutely would allow it as long as he knew the person personally.

Surely there's no way around the fact that this is crazy? There's no reason whatsoever for any adult to sleep with children, let alone one who's been accused of abuse. Do a quick cost-benefit analysis. If you allow it, the worst that will happen is that the person in question will molest your kids. If you refuse, the worst that will happen is that... the adult and the child will sleep separately. Which isn't even a bad thing in any shape or form.

Michael Jackson was a junkie pedophile.

/thread closed

R387 Jackson had many close friends of his like Liz Taylor who he considered like family. He also had a nanny. I'm sure he would trust his children with them.

[quote]he is asked if he would allow his children to sleep in the same bed as someone who's been accused of child molestation. He says he absolutely would allow it as long as he knew the person personally.

Wow. Sick fuck was sick.

He was definitely a down low member of NAMBLA. Sick man and sick people who defend him. I wish Dan Reed would have showed this footage and other damning things in the documentary.

Answer the question, R384. Why aren’t other celebrities vulnerable to accusations of pedophilia? Nobody has accused Madonna, or George Michael, or Whitney, or Prince, or Sade, or any of the fucking Spice Girls of raping children! Why not? Surely they all have stalkers and extortionists circling! All have had wild rumors printed about them. But none have been accused of raping children. Why not?

The black community failed to give Oprah much of any credibility for using her platform to propel the the accusers' alleged abuse narratives and legal claims. Many on social media said she was supporting previous allegations by actors like Mo'Nique and others who know her and suggest she harbors a disregard for people (particularly men) of color by choosing to promote non-evidenced, unproven claims instead of more damaging and uncontested allegations against her former white friends, such as Harvey Weinstein. Moreover, many white supporters of the film's accusers used her endorsement (as another prominent black entertainer) to underplay these racial concerns.

The unabashed truth is that two white men, once strong defenders of a wealthy, deceased black man, sued his estate for for 1.5 billion in damages claiming hundreds of abuse incidents years after his death. Perhaps most alarmingly, they have produced explanations from "we lied," to "we forgot," or more shockingly "we were afraid of jail" in lieu of evidence to explain why they maintained his innocence years into adulthood when they are now in their late 30s and early 40s.

Oprah's apparent distancing of herself from Leaving Neverland, and possibly even the accusers, is a very interesting development that many will watch closely.

"@Oprah just deleted all the videos on her YT channel/social media regarding the #LeavingNeverland "documentary". Including the clips of the interview she had with the "victims"."

His estate is vulnerable to the accusations (he is dead) because Jackson was previously accused of child sexual abuse, and was unanimously acquitted by a jury of his peers. However, his sizable estate has motivated new allegations, as is apparent by one of the litigants' attempt to publish a "secret project" book draft to obtain money; and then subsequently suing with the the other middle-aged litigant when that did not work, all in an attempt to seek a 1.5 billion dollar judgement.

R392 [quote]

Why aren’t other celebrities vulnerable to accusations of pedophilia?

R392 There are many rock stars who are well known for having sex with underage girls and spending time with young groupies. People speculated about MJ because he didn't live that kind of lifestyle.

Is the Jackpedo defender a bot, or do they just furiously refresh the thread all day and night so they can fill the thread with their redundant bullshit?

R393, Are you trying to counter the video in which Michael himself says he would allow his kids to sleep with a child molester with some random MJ defender with 67 followers? Aren't you the defender who called reputable publications cited here tabloids? Oh, my sides.

He also spent a lot of time with children. It may seem strange to some but childhood and fantasy represented an escape for him. His work is heavily inspired by The Little Prince, which if you have read the book or seen the original movie, would know why. He also first started gaining fame after being in The Wiz, so I see nothing wrong with him using those works for inspiration.

MICHAEL JACKSON WAS A JUNKIE PEDOPHILE. PERIOD. END OF STORY.

R397 He never said he would allow his children to sleep with a child molester. He would never believe that anyone who was that close to him could ever harm children. He was a trusting soul.

[quote]I see nothing wrong with him using those works for inspiration.

Of course you don't, pedo lover.

[quote]He never said he would allow his children to sleep with a child molester.

Except he did say it, lying pedo lover.

Put your crack pipe down R398/ R400. Multiple boys have come forward with abuse claims, employees saw, co-workers saw, by his own admission he slept with boys, traveled with them, held hands with them, bought them and their families expensive gifts. How much proof do you need that he wasn't some innocent Peter Pan? It was all a ruse to get into young boys pants. He did allow his children to sleep with a child molester, him!

R401 R402 Your repeated use of "pedo apologist" all over DL has made the term synonymous with anyone who is able to think critically about these allegations and discuss them.

R403 The "multiple boys" who have come forward are only two prior to 10 years after his death. One was shamed in court for his family's repeated lies and claims of being kidnapped by MJ, before jurors unanimously declared he was not guilty. The other accepted a payout which the attorneys' described in their memorandum to the court as paid by the insurance company and against their and MJ's insistence. This despite numerous voice recordings showing the father clearly concocted the entire incident to get revenge on his ex-wife. The civil settlement did not preclude him or the family from taking criminal action and they haven't been heard from since.

As far as the employees, all of them were either fired, sued (successfully), discredited by the "victim," or sold their story to a British tabloid long after their relationship with Jackson was severed involuntarily.

Michael openly sang about being bad and dangerous in the 80s and we all laughed at him and called him a pussy. Sadly, he was telling the truth. The most EVIL man in pop music history.

NO man that loved children would make them suffer the indignity of sharing the same bed as an unrelated adult male. That's humiliating. Michael never "loved" children.

Oh, that's right he FAWNED over the same type of boys - cute, white, middle class little boys were his only type. Never girls, not brown skinned girls and hardly ever Asian boys. Was that fair of Jackson? That his 'innocent' love of children always extended 99% of the time to boys with same physical characteristics?

[post redacted because independent.co.uk thinks that links to their ridiculous rag are a bad thing. Somebody might want to tell them how the internet works. Or not. We don't really care. They do suck though. Our advice is that you should not click on the link and whatever you do, don't read their truly terrible articles.]

R405, provide proof or stop the lies. Jordan's father was never caught on tape saying he concotated the story for revenge on his ex-wife. He wanted Michael to pay, as he should have. Why did Michael pay Jason Francia 2.5 million? Why did Latoya say she saw checks paid as hush money? Latoya wasn't the only one who spoke of the hush money. Everyone is lying except Michael? Highly unlikely. Anyone with two eyes now knows he was hiding in plain sight with these boys.

Up to 200 million in hush money was paid. Innocent my ass.

^Concocted

R407 Speculation speculation speculation. But where are the victims? Oh yeah, they don't exist.

R408 LOL. Even DL knows the Indy is a rag. They cater their articles specifically for the 'I only read the title' Reddit crowd. If you open their articles it'll be either a speculative piece or an outright lie.

R409 You said "Jordan's father was never caught on tape saying he concotated the story for revenge on his ex-wife." He said:

_________ CHANDLER: — Michael the career will be over.

SCHWARTZ: Does that help Jordy?

CHANDLER: Michael’s career will be over.

SCHWARTZ: And does that help Jordy?

CHANDLER: It’s irrelevant to me.

-------- CHANDLER: Let me put it to you this way, Dave. Nobody in this world was allowed to come between this family of June, me and Jordy. That was the hard [tape irregularity] be the opposite. That’s evil. That’s one reason why he’s evil. I spoke to him about it, Dave. I even told him that [tape irregularity] the family.

SCHWARTZ: When did you talk to him?

CHANDLER: About that?

SCHWARTZ: Yeah. ---------

CHANDLER: I don’t know where it’ll go, but I’m saying is that when people – when you — when people cut off communication totally, you only have two choices: To forget about them, or you get frustrated by their action. I can’t forget about them. I love them. That’s it. I don’t like them. I still love Jordy, but I do not like them because I do not like the people that they’ve become, but I do love them, and because I love them I don’t want to see them [tape irregularity]. That’s why I was willing to talk. I have nothing to gain by talking. If I go through with this, I win big time. There’s no way that I lose. I’ve checked that out inside out.

SCHWARTZ: But when you say “winning,” what are you talking about, “winning”?

CHANDLER: I will get everything I want, and they will be totally — they will be destroyed forever. They will be destroyed. June is gonna lose Jordy. She will have no right to ever see him again.

R411 That is not speculation. That Jackson shared his bed with the same physical type of boy repeatedly comes from many sources, including from Jackson's own mouth on many occasions. Try harder with your rebuttals next time....

I've heard that tape before R411. It proves absolutely nothing. He never says he concocted the story that Michael molested Jordan. If he was caught saying he lied you can bet your ass Michael never would have settled.

The payouts is in court documents. Are you so desperate that you have to deem legitimate publications rags? It's funny because you site random blogs and twitter users that just state their opinions. Hardcore evidence falls on the side that he was guilty, guilty, guilty.

R319, the boy on the train was yet another victim, poor Brett Barnes. That they heard noises through the shared wall of the train car leading the social workers to contact the conductor shows how insanely risk taking Jacko was in public spaces with his harem of boys. The report is online somewhere. Brett was one of his mixed type victims, his coloring is a lot like Blanket. Poor guy show a lot of damage to this day, think he still defends Jackson.

R412, my speculation reply was in response to your assertion at R407 that "NO man that loved children would make them suffer the indignity of sharing the same bed as an unrelated adult male. That's humiliating. Michael never "loved" children."

This is entirely your opinion, which you have the right to possess, but it is nevertheless 100% speculative. You have no idea whether MJ loved children or not, or whether sharing a bed with them was an "indignity" that "no man that loved children would make them suffer." Just like I can speculate that his current accusers are producing false claims motivated by money, you can speculate that his merely sharing a bed with any of these people is "humiliating." I certainly do not think so, and neither of us was there.

R414 When you say "yet another victim, poor Brett Barnes," are you referring to the same Brett Barnes who threatened to sue Dan Reed/HBO for falsely implying he was abused, and has unequivocally defended Jackson against these allegations including the one you just mentioned?

Also, R397 - You are calling your go-to publications in this thread: Daily Mail, The Mirror, The Post, the Sun, and Express "reputable publications?" I understand that it is probably a lack of awareness that leads you to refuse to admit it but all of these are tabloid publications of the lowest journalistic standards.

R415 This is not speculation, since subject of this thread is called "Leaving Neverland", and the theme of that documentary was about two young men who clearly expressed their disgust and revulsion repeatedly at being taken to Jackson's bed and humiliated sexually as young children. If you can't contribute anything of value then fine, but do at least try and keep up with the topic of the thread.

R418 Understanding the difference between speculation and fact is a grammar school lesson...but I digress.

R418 Yes, that is one version of their experience I suppose. I prefer the lifelong testimony of both the children and later again as an adult-- Wade Robson, convincingly denying the abuse multiple times and reaffirming their great time "At Neverland" (if you will humor me.) However, this was before the choose-your-own-adventure tale spun in his unsuccessfully rejected book, each of his lawsuits, and finally "Leaving Neverland" by the remarkably self-described "Master of Deception."

I wonder if the publishers who reviewed Wade Robson's "secret project" (before the 1.5 billion dollar lawsuit of course) and refused to publish such a remarkable piece of fiction dismissed it as being inadequate, inappropriate, or simply not to one's taste?

Just watched Neverland Firsthand, probably the best looking rebuttal video so far in terms of production value. It looks like it may be part of an ongoing series. The most shocking part of all was at the end when the host reads passages from Michael Jackson Was My Lover. There are parts in Safechuck's lawsuit that are literally taken word for word from the fictional book. I never thought I'd say this but Wade is more credible than James at this point.

Since the Jackson estate is too cheap [read: they need every penny to pay off abuse victims], there is no way these defender bozos are earning 5 cents per word on defending Jackson online. So they must be doing it out of love, or to seek Jackson's approval. Oh that's right, he can't approve anything because he's dead.

R421 I will start watching it tonight--thank you for sharing. I haven't sought to watch any of the rebuttal videos in the past (I am already aware of the duplicitous behavior, blatant lies, and massive contradictions attributed to these two). I was holding out to see it all come together in a professionally produced Estate doc but I am sure the crowdfunded docs are also very good.

R422 The abuse victims who deny any inappropriate behavior but you secretly know must be victims, right? Or these two who failed to earn a dime but owe 70k in legal fees and court costs for lying numerous times and filing frivolous lawsuits? No? Then who are these people? I think you are onto something though. There's a better chance I am being paid 5 cents a word than Wade Robson and James Robson are telling the truth now about any of this.

Sony is paying plenty to protect their $250M investment in his catalog, do not be naive. They, and the estate are desperate to get the Broadway show to open.

R424 Eureka! You've got it. Anyone who believes a 30+ year old can claim to not remember that he was sexually abused hundreds of times by the world's most famous musician (until seeing someone else say it) is the perfect candidate for promoting that DataLounge is being infiltrated in a paid conspiracy to allow SONY to open their broadway show.

It's a real shame Wade didn't wait a bit longer or I am sure he would have begged for a spot just in ONE before being denied.

R425 *denied AGAIN.

[quote][R418] Understanding the difference is a grammar school lesson...but I digress.

R419 This is not speculation. It does not matter if YOU do not understand the difference between speculation and fact. Here Jackson himself clearly admits on camera he slept in the same bed with a boy who later accused him of sexual abuse:

Gavin gives his interview to police.

So why is Jackson telling a reporter that he keeps a 13 year old boy in bed beside him at night. Is he lying too?

R427 R428 R429

As another poster stated a few posts up: "The 93 case may be more complicated for some, but anyone who still believes Gavin after the fiasco that was the 2005 trial is completely dense. The only way you could believe his story is if you believed him and his family were kidnapped by Jackson and forced to rebut the Bashir documentary which Jackson didn't even air." Gavin Arvizo lied, and there is not a single thing that could convince anyone with a brain, let alone the 12 jurors who unanimously acquitted Jackson, that he was a victim of abuse.

The Bashir interview you use to try and defame Jackson is discredited in every thread as a manipulated and false portrayal of Jackson's words and behavior, some examples are at R337 of Bashir's lies (they mimic Wade Robson's behavior actually) and I suggest you read and tell me if that sounds like a credible filmmaker to you. I revive this from Part 8:

"Yes, but it is generally acknowledged that Bashir purposefully staged and omitted many details from his film to create an imbalanced and biased representation of Jackson. For example, when Michael Jackson stated that he shared his bed with the boy in the film, Bashir removed the section where the boy added that Jackson slept on the floor.

We know all of this only because Jackson had instructed his own videographer to record every interview without cutting (alongside Bashir's camera crew.) As a result, you can see what Bashir omitted and you also see the interactions between interviews. I highly recommend doing so. Bashir's journalistic practices in that documentary still affect his reputation today.

If you are truly interested in that interview, I would suggest watching: Take Two: The Footage You Were Never Meant to See (also referred to as "the rebuttal video"), which was seen on Fox in the United States. This was presented by Maury Povich and contains even more material which Bashir omitted (it is numerous.)"

Martin Bashir is a true hero. His career skyrocketed afternthat interview and he deserved all the success.

Why is the spazzy MJ troll whining on and on about white privilege? Bone white Jacko had white privilege. The whole world turned a blind eye to his evil.

R431 Bashir's reputation has been tarnished in the years since his interview. He was forced to resign from MSNBC, suspended form ABC News, and has been heavily discredited to the point of being voted the 5th Worst Briton in Channel 4's poll of "The 100 Worst Britons of All Time". Do you read before you type?

I assume from your use of the rather distinctive phrase "he deserved all the success" that you are the same person who claimed Wade and James would get "all the money." How did that work out? They owe 70k in legal fees and court costs and have lost in 4 lawsuits.

Here is what Diane Dimond posted, she is anther one that had the guts to call Michael's behavior out when no one else would.

R417, The Guardian, Telegraph, Independent and Times all think Jacko is a nefarious pedo, so stop squawking about tabloids.

R434 There you go again. Diane Dimond? Are you really falling on that sword?

Pure arrogance on the part of the Jacksons and SONY if they think these paid trolls are not doing to harm Jackson's reputation than good, the public will let go when they are ready, not when the Jackson estate says. But here we are a month later... Jackson truly got the fanclub he deserved with their pathological fear of the truth.

R417, I am 100% positive I have much more awareness of the media than you will ever hope to. The publications have millions of readers and they follow celebrity stories, hence why Michael was widely reported on. Furthermore, they reported what was in court documents and what the the FBI files said. They aren't pulling things out of their ass. Nice try though.

That's right Diane Dimond who is actually is an investigative journalist and followed him for years. Who do you quote? Wacko tweeters. I can't even think of one reputable journalist who supports Michael at this point. You need to put your energy into a more worthwhile cause than defending a dead pedophile.

R435 Unfortunately, all of the links you keep posting here come from the Mirror, NY Post (personal favorite, huh?), the Sun, and other insane tabloid online sites with titles akin to "FBI Bares Weird Jacko Secrets" like you posted earlier.

As evidenced by your attempt to defend them when called out around R353 and R367, I genuinely do not think you can figure out the difference between a salacious British tabloid and a legitimate publication outside of the USA.

I suspect you are the same person who made the nonsensical claim (again demonstrating a lack of education about British media) at R35 that was entirely too gently corrected at R37 and R40.

The pro MJ troll must be on benefits as he sits here repeating the same shit every few minutes.

R437 Again with the paid poster conspiracy theories. If Wade and James weren't dead broke and in debt to the estate to the tune of 70k, which remains unpaid, then I might also levy a similar accusation at you, who has posted just as much as I have in this thread.

I will always respect Ellen DeGeneres, Rosie O'Donnell and Katie Couric for their openly supporting the victims of Michael Jackson.

I am British and I just named four broadsheet newspapers who published articles denouncing MJ after the LN documentary.

The MJ troll is either retired or living off welfare in some grimy place like Detroit.

R349, your desperation is showing, especially when all you could muster for a defense is about the publications themselves and not what they actually printed. Diversion tactic? What they printed can easily be verified by the FBI documentation and court records. You seem to have a problem when confronted with undisputed truths.

James and Wade will win their case. Meanwhile, nobody cares about Jacko's stupid 80s songs. He was already burnt out and benzoed out by 1991. His music hasn't been relevant for decades.

R438 "That's right Diane Dimond who is actually is an investigative journalist and followed him for years. Who do you quote? Wacko tweeters."

No, I quote her--when she went on TV and claimed that she had seen a video of MJ molesting Gavin (which didn't exist) and called Victor Gutierrez one of her best sources saying of him “I have never had a doubt about this person, ever" before being sued by MJ's lawyer for repeating the first false claim which appeared in Safechuck's favorite book "Michael Jackson Was My Lover." Obsessed Michael Jackson prosecutor Tom Sneddon helped her avoid paying for that one, but he could not do the same for the numerous others who lost the defamation lawsuits.

Correction that is for R439.

R445 "James and Wade will win their case."

This is the definition of delusion.

R443 I am British and I just named four broadsheet newspapers who published articles denouncing MJ after the LN documentary. The MJ troll is either retired or living off welfare in some grimy place like Detroit.

Nice misquotation. Do you also consider the Sun, TMZ, Daily Mail, or NY Post, Express, and the mirror reputable? Because these are the ones I explicitly called out that MJ haters have shared in this thread.

They have already won in the court of public opinion. That is why no more mediocre Jackson music clogging up the airways!!!!!!!

R450 LOL. You are living in a fantasyland if you truly think his music isn't still being played all around this country and others in public venues and stores.

Sorry, any place that matters no longer plays that shit.

I cannot stop laughing at you R445. That is the funniest, albeit so obviously false thing I have read this week.

R452 Lol, okay. If you say so.

The pedo troll is probably 70, sat in the basement of some nasty Ninth Ward type accommodation. Every night he bribes his 8 year old nephew to stay in his bedroom and listen to lectures about white privilege while the Rohypnol takes effect.

SSDI all over this thread.

R455 Lol, self-awareness is a bitch, huh? Every ad hominem attack reveals more about your own life situation.

Diane Dimond had Michael's number years ago. She was right on the money! Another distortion, Diane never claimed to have seen video, she said she had learned of love letters sent to Gavin by Michael, which I totally believe.

Every single paper in the US/UK has denounced Jackson the Pedo Rapist. His music is irrelevant 80s trash for children. Nothing deep or adult about it. MJ probably asked for tracks to be written that kids could do stupid dances to, like Beat It and Thriller. All part of his evil masterplan.

R458 I totally believe you do, and her claim that the man who wrote "MJ Was My Lover" (the "Jordan Chandler diary") was also totally believable huh? "I have never had a doubt about this person, ever." Lol, okay Diane.

R459 Sure, and I'm sure you'll tell us next that Michael Jackson was never even a good artist, he just used autotune LOL.

R460, I readily admit I know nothing about Victor Gutierrez, but I don't believe anything you say. You've been called out on your lies more than once. I'll believe Diane over you any day.

I don't think he was that great. A high pitched, affected, breathy voice and some spazzy dance moves? He was always incredibly uncool, the kind of artist only little kids liked...unfortunately. Sad that your taste in music is so basic and immature.

This defender obviously has a personal stake in Jackson's reputation, and they actually think Jackson was a good entertainer because they get defensive when he's called mediocre, crap etc... Maybe an outspoken fan who has been put on retainer by SONY from the MJJcommunity boards?

R462 Simply Google his name and Michael Jackson. Michael Jackson won $2.7 million in his slander suit against him before he fled the country and never paid. No need to take my word for it. I call out lies, not spread them.

R463 You're entitled to your opinion. You are the first anti-MJ detractor I have seen go after his musical or dance talent, which in the past has been undisputed even among those who think he is guilty.

R464 Yes, as you said before I am a paid SONY representative, remember? .5 cents a word (but no benefits of course) to protect the company's investment in his broadway performance. Did I get that right?

Okay, so no answer to the question of why other comparable celebrities have never been accused of child molestation...outside of “after the first accusation, he was vulnerable to more!” As if that explains why exactly 0 children (not one, not five or more — zero!) have ever come forward saying Prince or George Michael molested them. Even though they were certainly subject to insane gossip, and probably extortion attempts, too.

Let me guess what’s next — Elvis met Priscilla when she was 14, maybe?

(And no, that MJ surrounded himself with children is not a defense here — in fact, it just shows how compulsive and abnormal his behavior was that he wouldn’t or couldn’t modify it in reaction to the first accusations)

R465, nah, I'll pass. It really doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things. It won't change my respect for Diane for her work outing Michael. I'm sure she's feeling vindicated these days.

[quote]I don't think he was that great. A high pitched, affected, breathy voice and some spazzy dance moves? He was always incredibly uncool, the kind of artist only little kids liked...unfortunately. Sad that your taste in music is so basic and immature.

And not great music for kids either. So much negativity in the lyrics of his so-called "greatest" songs e.g. women are liars, criminality is great, bad people get rewarded etc... Pretty much a sugar coated version of what gangster rappers sing about today. No depth, just negativity and shady morals. Only after his molestation accusations did he go on a "Heal the World" trip, but by then his musical ability had all but been shoot through.

R466 You've answered your own question, and others have as well.

R467 Your choice. "In order for the light to shine so brightly, the darkness must be present. " -Francis Bacon

R421 I am still watching it now. This is a remarkably well put together production. I am going to start recommending it on social media to those who express doubts after doing their research on the film's claims.

R468 No single recording artist or entertainer has eclipsed what Michael Jackson accomplished throughout his career as an entertainer and an artist. Go after the allegations, not his talent. Nonsensical claims about how terrible you think his music is do not make you seem intelligent at all.

Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and to remove all doubt.

Answering is different than regurgitating nonsense, R469, but please (!) keep going.

R470 I don't think so honey, he's only accomplishment was fooling the gullible public like you. Fooled into defending a child rapist online.

R472 Lol, again, better to be thought a fool...

It's a shame Reed stopped coming out and making excuses for the lies, omissions, and holes in the stories that keep being discovered. After he claimed that "there was no other side to the story" and explained away Brandi and Wade dating as Wade "seeing" both him and Jackson at the same time it seems like the backlash caused him to stop addressing the rebuttals.

Now, Oprah is deleting videos from her Youtube, Instagram, and Twitter accounts that support the accusers and interviewing them. Seems she is having second thoughts too. I hope she makes a statement correcting her previous failure in judgement.

Continuing thoughts on R474: She probably is doing this due to fear of the backlash she is about to receive (and receiving).. because like Dan Reed, it's clear Oprah did not did not do any research either before promoting these claims. I also suspect she has an undisclosed financial interest in the situation, but MJ fans are better than CSI detectives at digging up and evaluating claims, so I am certain the other contradictions and lies will be revealed soon.

This man was molested by a priest. He tells what he has experienced. You can even hear how the voice breaks at the climax recalling traumatic experiences. He was molested and he is crying about it--upset. What does Wade Robson do? Wade doesn't show any feelings, nothing! Sometimes it just laughs. Other times it smirks or grins. It certainly displays nothing indicating anything but a liar and sociopath who has been caught.

Not all victims react/behave the same way r477.

Diane Dimond associated with Gutierrez even though she had to have known he was a NAMBL* member. She did hype the tape. She is a joke and an awful human being.

R478 Yes, any type of behavior can just be explained away as everyone is different. No shit. Fortunately, we'll simply stick to the facts.

Sounds like he groomed Emmanuel Lewis's family in a similar way, living with them for a period of time. Lewis was supposedly Michael's first special friends.

R478 Wade's rehearsed, carefully controlled statements and the smug look on his face at Sundance did not help him at all and made him appear insincere and disingenuous. Numerous people called out his repeated grinning and laughing when answering Oprah's questions during the interview about the documentary that had just aired (about his abuse no less). This isn't proof he is lying, of course, but when he has so many different narratives of his story going around in a book draft, lawsuits, and now on film it is not a good look in combination with other evidence.

For those whose saying Jackson's music is so dated, are you saying that today's music or anything post 2000s is better? It's all been crap for nearly two decades now. Even Jackson's worst music holds up better than what's out right now.

That guy is younger than Wade and he was probably molested more recently. Wade's had a lot of therapy through the years. Besides, I'm sure we can all dig up 100 more videos of people describing their abuse in the same manner Wade did. Grasping.

I find it interesting that Diana Ross defended Michael, yet her sons were never around him. Her kids turned out pretty normal, so I think there was no chance she was letting them overnight at Neverland like the other dopey parents. She knew what was up.

R484 Diana Ross' younger ones were very close to Michael Jackson growing up. Yes, they also turned out normal. Wade and James turned out normal too. Both seemed completely unaffected by the alleged abuse until it became financially necessary to claim so. When Robson's lawyers claimed he couldn't direct or work in any way, MJ's lawyers had a field day with that claim.

R484 Fortunately we don't need to scrutinize his body language because we have facts, which are more reliable. Emotion is the only card MJ haters have left to play because everything can be rationalized as being unique to the individual.

Body language expertise is more an art than a science. I've seen two "experts" reach an entirely different conclusion based on their own subjective reasoning. Ultimately, it doesn't prove anything and does not substitute for overwhelming evidence. I like what Razorfist said in this video. Facts don't give a fuck about your feelings.

R486 What are you talking about? There is considerably more evidence to support these two were not abused than that they were. Their numerous misstatements, timeline issues, and repeated denials of any abuse overwhelm the claim they lied/forgot/didn't realize the abuse until now.

R486 My mistake, I reread your post and we were saying the same thing (more or less).

R489 No worries. I didn't find them convincing either, especially during their live interviews. Ultimately they will both be disproven by their lies and discrepancies.

R403 he wasn't some innocent Peter Pan?

Peter Pan wasn't innocent too he stole kids and as now we know now that the writer was a pedo it's possible that he wrote Peter Pan as a pedo.

Paul McCartney understands why any normal and decent member of the public does not want to hear MJ songs played in public anymore.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

Almost a full month has gone by since Leaving Neverland, and I have still not heard a single Michael Jackson song being played in any business or store I've gone to. If I ever do hear a song slip by I will email the C.E.O and request that it be stopped playing. From a business owner's point of view MJ music must be the equivalent of toxic gas being released into the isles.

Video doesn't lie. MJ went jewelry shopping with Jimmy. What Jimmy said about the ring is obviously true.

Robson's suit was dismissed because the statute of limitations ran out but the judge did not rule out that the suit had merit, R290, but you knew that already.

Jackson fan is on retainer from the Jackson estate, they like to make simple concepts elaborate and confusing so they can cash in on as many .5 cent words as possible.

Why Michael Jackson's youngest son Blanket has been 'hidden away'

[quote]Up to 200 million in hush money was paid. Innocent my ass.

Proof of Jackson's pedophilia in a nutshell. No innocent person gives even a DIME to someone making such horrible accusations against them. Period.

I wonder who paid out more hush money, Jackson to his molestation victims, or Charlie Sheen to those he infected with HIV?

Is Michael Jackson his kids' biological father? All the conspiracy theories

Motherfucker, please...of course they aren't his bio children.

[quote]The pedo troll is probably 70, sat in the basement of some nasty Ninth Ward type accommodation. Every night he bribes his 8 year old nephew to stay in his bedroom and listen to lectures about white privilege while the Rohypnol takes effect.

Truth. Only a shut-in pedo would spend all their waking time defending another pedo.

I didn't realise he released "Childhood" AFTER settling with the Chandlers. I thought it was from the early 90s. Turns out it was actually the B-side of "Scream", his comeback single after the allegations. It's strange that someone would release a video like this the year after paying off a boy who accused him of molestation.

[quote]It's strange that someone would release a video like this the year after paying off a boy who accused him of molestation.

It would be strange for a normal person, but not an arrogant, shameless pedophile.

I honestly can't understand anyone still defending this turd at this point. All the evidence, including our own eyes, points to him being a habitual pedophile. In real life, I don't know anyone who believes he was innnocent. I believe perception of him has already started to change completely where it's accepted as fact that he was a child molester. In the same way when he first had those kids many people argued they were indeed his biological offspring. Now it's overwhelmingly acknowledged that they are not.

R505 Another in a long line of, "It's true because I say so." I marvel at your intellectual depth.

[quote]Another in a long line of, "It's true because I say so."

r505 didn't say that at all, pedo lover dipshit.

Can we please just ignore the pedo defending trolls? They're not even worth a reply.

That video, my eyes! It looked like he was tryin to channel Mr. Rogers. Sick freak, hope he is burning in Hell.

r468 ??? Heal the world was before the scandal. Man in the Mirror too and it is a great inspiring "moral" song, though that one wasn't written by someone else. Then there were many neutral feel good songs like The Way You Make Me Feel Your view is definitely biased by hindsight. The music was harmless, Geez.

The music was disgusting. He admits to being a pedo in Bad, Dangerous and Smooth Criminal. Billie Jean defends his rights as an abuser too: 'the boy is not my son', so he goes ahead and rims him. Grotesque.

Billie Jean is such an ironic song. If a woman had turned up on Michael Jackson's doorstep and falsely claimed he was the father of her young son, he would have thought all his Christmases had come at once.

r511 You are joking or insane?

LOL, true r512. He would've manipulated Billie Jean into giving him the "son".

[quote]And not great music for kids either.

Neither was the crotch-grabbing dancing. Nor, was his scary appearance.

You guys can continue with the stupid jokes. Just a reminder that your side is getting massacred on Twitter. Dan Reed himself caught in a lie. It's over!

Dan Reed all but admitted that Safechuck lied in his lawsuit and alleges the abuse took place after 94 when Jackson was barely in the country and Safechuck was 16 or older.

Just for 1 year, R514!

[quote]It's over!

See ya, then!

The article at r498 says that Mark Lester is all three children's godfather. I thought Culkin was their godfather?

R517 Dan Reed just confirmed the train station inconsistency on Twitter after the court records were released. Now the moron says Safechuck got his age & the year his alleged abuse wrong. This completely contradicts his primary claim that MJ dumped them once they reached puberty. Now he's saying he abused the at 16/17--when you advance to adulthood.

It's becoming clear why Oprah is trying to delete traces of the interview and her relationship with them, but she was duped.

Reed just needs to give it up. Talk about a credibility killer...this is blowing up all over social media.

Culkin is godfather to Paris, sounds like she has more than one?

People are responding to Dan Reed with copies of the sworn declaration Safechuck filed with different dates. I speculated earlier than Dan didn't respond to this because he was hoping it would go away, but you can't ignore a train station that wasn't even built yet.

How do you move from the abuse stopped when I was a preteen to it continued when I was almost 18? It's over, Dan.

I feel sorry for the people trying to figure out how Dan Reed's 18 months of research failed to locate Safechuck's sworn declaration in the public record stating that the alleged abuse ended in 1992. Absolutely shameful. James Safechuck is now a confirmed, major liar. He's starting to make overcoat wearing Wade Robson the credible one again!

"So @danreed1000 is now saying because the story has been debunked, suddenly the end of Safechuck’s abuse was when he was 16/17 rather than 14. It’s a three year discrepancy. Just hold your hands up, don’t change the story. This is what happens when you don’t investigate properly."

Here’s Oprah trying to delete all traces...

And here she is again...

R527 She deleted videos from her Instagram, Twitter, and Youtube accounts of the interview and anything about Leaving neverland to the video. Do you think this was a coincidence as the shit is hitting the fan?

And again...

Oprah just deleted all the videos on her YT channel/social media regarding the #LeavingNeverland "documentary". Including the clips of the interview she had with the "victims".

I'm sure Oprah.com is next lol! R530

The LN supporters trying to defend this latest development is quite amusing. They sound completely insane.

R532 LMAO you're still making excuses. Even your precious Dan Reed just admitted the "abuse" must have continued until the guy was 16/17! Absolutely bonkers!

Remember when people accused the fans of only going after Wade? I'm sure they weren't expecting Safechuck's story to completely collapse first with the director admitting he lied.

R534 LMAO

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LN supporters are the delusional ones. They are now mad at Reed for not backing Safechuck's story. I guess they realize it would be more plausible had James made up the whole train station thing than him being abused at 16/17.

R536

Truth hurts, r538.

R534 I mean holy shit. This is the nail in James' coffin. His story is now completely discredited--a 3 year discrepancy in abuse dates. I thought he was replaced by Jordan Chandler, Dan.

Here's a section from his lawsuit where he says MJ stopped sexually abusing him after puberty, and how he began spending time with Brett instead of him.

R537, Personally i HAVE to give respect to Reed for choosing to reveal the truth (even if it decimated all of James' timeline, and renders all of his testimony nonsensical) than lie and say he was mistaken or something similar.

He was travelling and sleeping with MJ all through the Bad tour, you fucking loons, and you know that as does everyone. His story is stone cold fact. It doesn't matter what dates he remembers. Look up the dates for the Bad tour on Wikipedia and you know when he was abused for certain.

Sure harass one of your hero's little boyfriends AS YOU WELL KNOW HE WAS. Maybe you can silence him forever that way. Just go to hell already.

Dan Reed is a liar. I would've told him that the picture of the train station was wrong but I had to take a piss break when that part was being shown.

R542 Did you watch the film? It was after the Grammys which MJ never attended.

I wonder what Dan Reed's next film will be about.

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I mean really--I bet James is fidgeting like crazy trying to figure out a way to explain this latest misstep. I mean he was taller than Jackson at 17, and had stopped going to Neverland many years ago. Absolutely crazy how people lie and make shit up without doing any research on their claims.

R545 If Martin Bashir is any indication, Dan will probably have his reputation tarnished and be fired from several networks as he continues to "stand by" the film.

R546

Doubt Dan or Martin are losing any sleep over this. The damage is done and rightly so. Most poeple didn't need the documentary to tell us that Michael Jackson = pedophile. Hahaha

r542, ignore the pedo defending loon. She's up from her sloth nap, and will be in loonbot mode for the next 20 hours.

I wonder if Dan Reed knew...I think he figured this out a minute ago and was hoping it wouldn't blow up.

Let's be honest. It was obviously a stretch when he claimed that Wade Robson was "seeing" both Jackson and Brandi at the same time in his preteens. He was clearly insinuating that Wade had aged out.

So now that he's completely changed the timeline (contradicting every statement James has made) and saying James was abused as a 16/17 year old what does this do was Wade? There's no continuity in the story now. He miscalculated and no other "victims" came forward, in fact the exact opposite.

This is a massive blow to Safechuck's story and many on social media are saying they were duped into believing it. The lies keep stacking on, and on and on.

Paris is stupid and incredibly untalented. Chris Brown...oy

R549 Dan Reed just made the biggest admission that one of the accusers was untruthful about a key aspect of the abuse to date. He's losing something or he wouldn't have said anything.

R549 Bashir's career is destroyed. After Palin and a series of untrustworthy actions he was fired from several TV networks and voted towards the bottom of the most mistrusted Britons list.

Pedo loon - since it’s all discredited per your insane rankings, you can stop now right? Surely there must be another 40 year old man that rims 7 year olds, in need of your service?

Dan Reed has just claimed that Michael Jackson was abusing Jimmy Safechuck whilst under ACTIVE investigation for the original Jordan Chandler (bogus) allegations.

Incredible. I hope everyone is paying attention to this.

This is what fraud on a monumental scale looks like.

Yep.

Why Safechuck's train story in #LeavingNeverland is a provable lie despite Dan Reed's new claim that the alleged abuse ended later. Safechuck swore under oath it didn't.

Why claim Oprah is deleting it when her own website shows it is clearly untrue?

R554 Are you kidding? I can't wait to see all these celebrities and journalists melt down after writing the most horrendous and defamatory articles.

R558 No one said anything about the website. Your girl Oprah deleted all the videos on her YT channel/social media (Instagram & Twitter( regarding the Leaving Neverland "documentary". Including the clips of the interview she had with the "victims"."

You'll be waiting a loooong time R559. Michael Jackson was thought to be a pedophile for years fore the documentary. Nobody is changing their mind. You'll just have to spend your days and nights continuing to spam social media and websites in defense of your Messiah.

[quote] Doubt Dan or Martin are losing any sleep over this. The damage is done and rightly so. Most poeple didn't need the documentary to tell us that Michael Jackson = pedophile. Hahaha

Leaving Neverland was that much of a bust huh? Guess it's back to the Arvizo's being kidnapped and sent up on a hot air balloon.

R561 That's why SONY spent 250m on a broadway production, right? Because "Michael Jackson was thought to be a pedophile for years fore the documentary." LMAO

She deleted it because fuckwads like you were leaving revolting comments. Seriously there’s no grosser set of people than MJ fans. If you love the pedophile so much, why don’t you take up drug addiction in his honour?

Do you think Jacko diddled Blanket? His doped up father didn't give a shit about hanging him over a balcony as an infant, so it's not like he'd care about damaging that kid's soul. There's a reason why he's not talking, and being kept isolated.

R564 Lol, that's an interesting theory. Just like all the excuses you make for these two accusers' clearly fabricated claims of abuse.

Rather than admit Oprah deleted all mention of this on Youtube/social media because she no longer endorsed it, you do mental gymnastics and blame it on "revolting comments."

She could have turned off comments on Youtube or Instagram. Instead--she deleted all trace. Hilarious! Maybe James and Wade can go back to licking each other's anuses hundreds of times now that it's verified Michael never did!

Jackson definitely molested Blanket IMO. One of Jackson’s cousins stated he thought blanket was being groomed by the wacko MJ.

Link to next thread please.

R563, google is your friend. You'all find hundreds of articles from the last 15 years that detail his inappropriate behavior with children. Kat Williams, Mad TV, family Guy... all spoofed the creep. It was an open secret that was unfortunately treated as a joke. So, don't act like the documentary is what suddenly planted he was a pedophile in people's minds. SONY wasn't banking on the Metoo movement, which is finally giving these people their comeuppance. If Michael was alive today he'd be shunned and probably in jail. He should have died 20 years earlier than he did.

R565, I believe he molested both sons. That was the point of having them. Home grown so he didn't have to deal with more mother and fathers potentially exposing his child raping ways.

Lol, okay R569. I guess that's why he amassed a billion dollar estate. How much is Katt Williams worth again?

Sony spent the $ on music rights.

A Broadway show could certainly enhance the value of those rights but it is a separate thing.

Important to keep facts straight.

I mean holy shit. This is the nail in James' coffin. His story is now completely discredited--a 3 year discrepancy in abuse dates. I thought he was replaced by Jordan Chandler, Dan.

Here's a section from his lawsuit where he says MJ stopped sexually abusing him after puberty, and how he began spending time with Brett instead of him.

Definitely worth reposting, the nail in james' coffin. Social media is abandoning him like the plague and Oprah has deleted all videos with them from Youtube, Instagram and Twitter.

Why Safechuck's train story in #LeavingNeverland is a provable lie despite Dan Reed's new claim that the alleged abuse ended later. Safechuck swore under oath it didn't.

I guess Dan Reed's problem was trusting a clear mental case like James Safechuck to fabricate any aspect of the timeline. Who forgets that sexual abuse stopped when they were 16/17 instead of 13/14? Absolute bonkers!

Other People : My son was abused 😭😢

Stephanie SafeChuck : My son was abused 😂😂

🤦‍♀️ Here Stephanie is laughing erratically that she was eavesdropping and james didn't know that. Just tell me who the hell laughs while talking about your son's abuse...Only This psycho b**ch 😫

R570, is that the best you can come up with? Get it straight, nobody cares about your twitter warriors. He's guilty is most people's minds. You and your ilk can continue to gather on social media an try to find any little thing to pick apart. You'll only be preaching to the choir because no one else is interested.

Lol, R576 the story is falling apart quicker than any of us could have imagined. Safechuck's entire narrative has been proven a lie. He's officially less credible than Wade Robson and that is saying a lot!

Wade Robson to his mother and James Safechuck

The fact that after Safechuck was recently clocked about the train station gReed is basically now saying, “That’s cool. He just got his abuse dates wrong. 🙃” makes me feel like I’m being trolled. Like this shit is UN-BE-LIEVABLE.

"I am very disgusted with the people of leaving neverland, they played with peoples sympathy and feelings and only for a couple of bucks, I feel cheated as one of the people that believed this fraud in the first place"

Personal favorite:

"Remember Dan’s whole sob story of MJ moving onto Brett and abandoning him on a couch? Something that happened in 2012 according to Safechuck. But it’s okay, poor Safechuck wasn’t abandoned, now MJ would continue to abuse him through till 1994 according to Dan."

LMAO:

Guys, the Jimmy Safechuck train station inconsistency is easily answered.

You forget the Safechucks are time travelers.

#MichaelJackson #LeavingNeverland

And for one last nail in coffin of Dan Reed's response to being busted on Safechuck's train station lie in #LeavingNeverland , Safechuck's sworn statement says alleged abuse absolutely stopped after Michael started spending time with Brett Barnes, so later than 1992 impossible.

Robson and Safechuck could give Pinocchio a run for his money.

Do the pedo defenders ever get exhausted losing their shit on a daily basis?

If they are on a SM team they probably do not even care, R585.

R585 Of course that's the normal response when proven wrong? Don't act like there hasn't been LN freaks throwing vicious insults against anyone who dare even question James or Wade's story. Don't use the excuse that you haven't bothered to read the facts because you never cared to begin with.

r586, they really are scarily manic. Probably meth heads with not a tooth in their mouths.

Lol, R588 calling anyone a meth head when he's posted R536 and R546 is a little ironic.

Jackson was a pedophile even if Wade and James lied about being abused by him which they did not it wouldn't change the fact that Jackson was a serial child rapist who abused many children.

How many surgeries did MJ admit to having had, pro-pedo trolls?

Of course Jackson was a pedophile, duh.

Amen, R590. Even if they totally fabricated the entire thing, it doesn't change the fact that Michael Jackson was a pedophile for 30+ plus years. For the record, and before the bottom feeder psycho comes back, I still 100% believe Wade and James. It makes my skin crawl how these people defend a child rapist.

I still don't believe for a second that James is lying. He either got the dates or one of the many locations of the abuse wrong.

R591 According to one of Daily Mail articles he had more than 100 plastic surgeries.

Jackson defenders remind me of Bryan Singer defenders when 90% of their posts was about Michael Egan being a liar therefore Singer must be innocent lol

This guy doesn't hold back. We all knew years ago,we laughed at him then but hindsight adds a chill.

I believe Wade Robson and James Safechuck. People who are survivors of any forms of abuse, be it domestic, sexual, or whatever kind, deserve to have their voices heard.

R594, the pro-MJ stans never acknowledge that memory can be faulty in its particulars, especially for traumatized kids, but that doesn’t mean that the victims are lying or fabricating. They have a standard of perfection for the victims of Jackson’s pedophilia that the vast majority of CSA victims — or victims of sexual assault generally — could not ‘pass’.

And of course, they never apply anywhere near the same scrutiny to Jackson himself, because essentially they, like Streisand, believe that Jackson was within his rights to molest kids. He had needs, after all.

This is what’s on my heart this morning. I believe and trust that Michael Jackson was and is A magnificent incredible force to me and to many others.

STOP IN THE NAME OF LOVE

WTF!?

I did watch. And I believe James and Wade.

r596, the Spacey defenders, too. In their small minds, if one particular incident is questionable, then it somehow cancels out the other hundred.

What gets me is that they spew their shit here, as if they think a gay forum is somehow going to be more understanding about sexual assaulters/molesters.