Serving up this steaming pile of
Celebrity Gossip
Gay Politics
Gay News
and Pointless Bitchery
Since 1995

Hello and thank you for being a DL contributor. We are changing the login scheme for contributors for simpler login and to better support using multiple devices. Please click here to update your account with a username and password.

Hello. Some features on this site require registration. Please click here to register for free.

Hello and thank you for registering. Please complete the process by verifying your email address. If you can't find the email you can resend it here.

Hello. Some features on this site require a subscription. Please click here to get full access and no ads for $1.99 or less per month.

“The Times” UK Journalist blames Homosexuals for Pedophilia

“Attempts to sexualise minors are always wrong but a vocal minority of gay campaigners twist concern into prejudice”

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 20209/15/2020

She's also, unsurprisingly, a noted TERF.

by Anonymousreply 109/12/2020

It's not a gay thing - I know everyone knows that. People prey on children. Read the case summaries of any circuit court in the nation - there's a lot of men diddling young girls too - it just doesn't matter, because, well, girls and it's not "gay." And often the ones diddling boys are in hetero relationships and don't identify as gay, Not that no self-identified gay person has fucked with boys, but the it's not anymore of a problem than what I just summarized.

by Anonymousreply 209/12/2020

"a vocal minority" does not seem like she is blaming gay people per se.

by Anonymousreply 309/12/2020

Gays get blamed more than anyone r2. That’s always been a fact. They have always linked Pedophilia to Homosexuals

by Anonymousreply 409/12/2020

[quote]"a vocal minority" does not seem like she is blaming gay people per se.

“Attempts to sexualise minors are always wrong but a vocal minority of Jewish campaigners twist concern into prejudice”

by Anonymousreply 509/12/2020

So, she's a "soft" QAnoner. Has Anna Brees chimed in?

by Anonymousreply 609/12/2020

Where are all these homosexuals sexualizing minors? All the gay people I know are into social justice and hyper sensitive anything like that.

by Anonymousreply 709/12/2020

Paywall article.

by Anonymousreply 809/12/2020

The article:

In the film Cuties, a bunch of misfit girls in a Paris banlieue form a dance troupe and enter a contest where, in sexy costumes, they perform a twerking, crotch-fingering routine. The problem is these characters, and the actresses who play them, are 11 years old.

The French-Senegalese director Maïmouna Doucouré says she was exploring how pornified popular culture grooms children. Yet whatever her moral intent, the film was undeniably created by getting real little girls to spread their legs, hump the stage and caress their vulvas before cast and crew. The routine is prolonged and disturbing, and undoubtedly some of Netflix’s 193 million subscribers will bookmark it for personal “use”.

So is it legitimate to have qualms about Cuties? Netflix didn’t think so, choosing paedophilic images (since pulled) for its promotional campaign. The Daily Telegraph’s critic praised its provocation “in an age so terrified of child sexuality” and tweeted gleefully that it “pissed off all the right people”.

He presumably meant the US Christian right who have set about trying to “cancel” Netflix. Because only bigots and Mary Whitehouse prudes bang on about safeguarding or, when men talk blithely about “child sexuality”, hear clanging alarm bells.

[B]This week Exist Loudly, founded by a youth worker, Tanya Compas, with £100,000 crowd-funded in the wake of Black Lives Matter, asked for “queer black youth” aged 12 to 23 to contact it via private Twitter message. They will be paid for filling in a questionnaire giving intimate data — age, sexuality, location and vulnerability of housing (eg if they are sofa-surfing). Compas also said she’d pass on their contact details to interested others. When many pointed out that this breaches every child safety protocol, Compas accused them of bigotry in expletive-strewn tweets.

Perhaps this was a rookie error. Perhaps Stonewall, the biggest LGBT charity, might quietly advise Exist Loudly about setting up safeguarding but instead this publicly funded giant rounded on those who worried about 12-year-olds sharing secrets with adult strangers online. Didn’t they know most gay people’s sexuality is apparent by 12? Did they want a return to Section 28 which forbade the “promotion” of homosexuality in schools?

Yet many of Exist Loudly’s critics, including the black lesbian lawyer Allison Bailey, are gay themselves, but horrified by a growing trend in the LGBT community to claim exemption from rules. The trans activist Munroe Bergdorf was dropped as an NSPCC ambassador after inviting children to contact her privately via Twitter, against the charity’s express online guidance, and refused ever to concede she was wrong.[/B]

by Anonymousreply 909/12/2020

The oldest, most grotesque homophobic slur, which underpinned Section 28, was that gay men are paedophiles, not to be trusted as teachers or even parents. This myth has been rightly demolished. Yet our collective guilt has tipped the scales the other way: now anyone demanding LGBT groups adhere to normal safeguarding must be a bigot.

It is true also that gay teenagers, ostracised by families, have sought support and guidance from gay adults and historically these relationships were informal, unpoliced. Yet some were also undeniably predatory and sexual. The LGBT campaigner Peter Tatchell in a 1997 letter to The Guardian praised the Gay Men’s Press book Dares to Speak, to which he contributed an essay, as “courageous” for celebrating “intergenerational sex”.

“The positive nature of some child-adult sexual relationships is not confined to non-western cultures,” he wrote. “Several of my friends, gay and straight, male and female, had sex with adults from the ages of nine to 13. All say it … gave them great joy. Whilst it may be impossible to condone paedophilia, it is time society acknowledged the truth that not all sex involving children is unwanted, abusive and harmful.” Tatchell, who now campaigns for sex education in schools, emphasising the importance of sexual pleasure, has since distanced himself from those views.

Child sexual abuse is overwhelmingly committed, both online and in real life, by heterosexual men. Thanks to feminist campaigners, sex with an under-age girl, once shrugged off as a giggle, is seen unequivocally as criminal, while the Jimmy Savile scandals underlined the imperative of safeguarding.

Yet on the outermost margins of the LGBT movement are voices which try to posit child-sex as the next liberation struggle. In the 1970s the Paedophile Information Exchange tried to latch on to the mainstream gay movement; in 1997 Dares to Speak condemned anti-child-sex views as “hysteria”. Now on Twitter are hundreds of accounts by MAPs — Minority Attracted Persons — who reveal their AOA (Age of Attraction) as, say, 3-14 years and campaign for “MAP pride”: ie to be incorporated into the LGBT rainbow.

This notion disgusts most LGBT people and organisations. Even so, those who point out that doors are being left ajar for abusers which are shut in straight society are met with fury. Why is it OK for scantily clad 11-year-old “drag kids” to perform for dollar bills in gay bars but not for a little girl to lap-dance in a sports bar? Why are adult drag acts, including one called “Flow Job”, invited to tell toddlers fairy stories in public libraries? Why are children encouraged to mix with fetishists dressed as leather-clad “pups” at Pride marches? The answer “because gay culture is empowering” isn’t good enough.

Hyper-sexualisation of children should be challenged wherever it occurs. A film featuring 11-year-old girls dressed as hookers doesn’t reveal a society “terrified of child sexuality” but one without shame. And no child should be denied proper protection from adults just because he is gay.

by Anonymousreply 1009/12/2020

[quote]Did they want a return to Section 28 which forbade the “promotion” of homosexuality in schools?

Yes.

by Anonymousreply 1109/12/2020

My take as a British gay men.

There have been COUNTLESS examples where children who should have been protected by agencies and organisations have been let down and suffered appalling abuse.

Recently there have been cases of a reality tv star and a footballer being sent to prison for grooming kids online. The biggest kids charity in the UK has got clear advice for kids - DO NOT PRIVATE MESSAGE ADULTS - so when Munroe Bergdorf was inviting kids to message her to discuss trans issues, she was sacked as an ambassador for the charity. I believe her intentions were sincere, but she naive at best, willfully stupid thinking the rules didn't apply to her at worst. Yet she has been repeatedly defended.

[quote]This week Exist Loudly, founded by a youth worker, Tanya Compas, with £100,000 crowd-funded in the wake of Black Lives Matter, asked for “queer black youth” aged 12 to 23 to contact it via private Twitter message. They will be paid for filling in a questionnaire giving intimate data — age, sexuality, location and vulnerability of housing (eg if they are sofa-surfing). Compas also said she’d pass on their contact details to interested others. When many pointed out that this breaches every child safety protocol, Compas accused them of bigotry in expletive-strewn tweets.

Again, I can see the intentions might have been good, but it's so fucking inappropriate to ask a 12 year old child the same questions as an adult. An understanding that this was a bad move was needed but no, this was defended. It's fucking appalling.

And as for Peter Tatchell, don't go there.

by Anonymousreply 1209/12/2020

Has she deleted those tweets from earlier this year in which she called gay men misogynists and told Owen Jones he had 'childfree privilege' yet?

by Anonymousreply 1309/12/2020

She's absolutely correct. She is not "blaming" "homosexuals". She is putting the blame where it belongs - on the fringes of the alphabet soup that has hijacked the LGB community like the TRAs and those who call themselves "queer"- whatever the hell that means today.

I was appalled when I became aware of the MAPS and their open celebration of it. You can see it on lots of twitter accounts - usually accompanied by some anime avatar. I had no idea what that meant when I first saw that on someone's twitter.

Nobody should be afraid to call it out for what it is. You have to be blind or a fool not to see it.

OP needs to fuck off with its dishonest header. I do appreciate bringing the article here.

by Anonymousreply 1409/12/2020

[quote]She is not "blaming" "homosexuals".

“Attempts to sexualise minors are always wrong but a vocal minority of gay campaigners twist concern into prejudice”

by Anonymousreply 1509/12/2020

R15, the problem is that these extremists pretend to be part of the "homosexual" community when they don't belong. She seems to be taking them at their word that they are part of it. I don't see them as anything but hijackers of the gay cause who so far have succeeded in bastardizing the LGB community into some freak show that wants to actually harm the gay community.

by Anonymousreply 1609/12/2020

[quote]“Attempts to sexualise minors are always wrong but a vocal minority of gay campaigners twist concern into prejudice”

by Anonymousreply 1709/12/2020

TROLL journalist!

I really don't care, do u???!!!

by Anonymousreply 1809/12/2020

Yes, you idiot, I care that people who have tried to destroy the LGB community and movement are now seen as "the gay community" and now get to wear that proud label as they do things the gay community has rightly fought against. And, yes, they are a very vocal "minority" but so were the Ts.

by Anonymousreply 1909/12/2020

She uses the term LGBT in the article, then switches back to specifically say 'gay campaigners'.

Homophobic cunt.

by Anonymousreply 2009/12/2020

Gays and lesbians lost the narrative to the trans, then to queer, then to non-binaries. This is the final step.

by Anonymousreply 2109/12/2020

Hetero woman shitting on gays for not being subservient to her demanding pussy.

by Anonymousreply 2209/12/2020

Straight people and non-gay LGBT people have equated homosexuality to pedophilia since the beginning of time. All one needs to do is to log on to Twitter to see that attitudes haven't changed a bit.

Everyone who isn't a gay man sees gay men as pedophiles. I know people think it's ridiculous when I say this, but the only true ally gay men have is other gay men. Let this be a reminder.

by Anonymousreply 2309/12/2020

The pedophilia argument is just an excuse for homophobia. Always has been. Nowadays homophobes are getting craftier and are using "pedophilia is normalized in the gay community" as a an argument to hide their homophobia behind, because if they're outright about it they'll probably get canceled.

Times haven't changed, they never do. The world still sees gay men as the caricature we were painted to be in 'Boys Beware'. The myth of gay acceptance is a sham.

by Anonymousreply 2409/12/2020

I have said it before I will say it again. This is what I call straight projection. It is the reason straight men are not comfortable around gay men because they all think we want them no matter how fat, old or disgusting they are - because that is how they think about women. Same is true of pedophilia. It is mostly man/young girl - but it is put on us because all gay men MUST want to diddle a little boy.

by Anonymousreply 2509/12/2020

[quote] Times haven't changed, they never do. The world still sees gay men as the caricature we were painted to be in 'Boys Beware'. The myth of gay acceptance is a sham.

For the most part, that is bullshit. Times have changed and we became complacent. We let them do this to us.. We let them hijack our cause for their insanity and now it has become almost uncontrollable. People are starting to push back and I see many gays doing this - and by gay I mean honestly gay, not some hanger on.

by Anonymousreply 2609/12/2020

[quote]it is time society acknowledged the truth that not all sex involving children is unwanted, abusive and harmful.

You know what I'd like society to acknowledge? That some people are utter idiots and should never, ever comment on things about which they know very, very little, if anything. And this is one of them. Now, I think we're discussing adults and children, not children exploring their bodies with each other. We're not claiming two 9-year-olds "playing doctor" is the same as an adult and a child having sex. Childhood sexual exploration is a normal part of adolescence, but this is muddying the waters.

So, let me be clear: sex involving children is unwanted, abuse and harmful.

Sexualized play with children is unwanted, abuse and harmful.

Sexualizing children is unwanted, abuse and harmful.

Sexual imagery of children is unwanted, abuse and harmful.

There is nothing about homosexuality that condones sex involving children. There is no carve-out for gays in the law regarding sex involving children.

Sex involving children is unwanted, abuse and harmful. Period.

by Anonymousreply 2709/12/2020

Women are mainly the ones who think gay men are pedophiles. Straight men mostly hate us because they think we want to fuck them, but women just think we're all child predators.

by Anonymousreply 2809/12/2020

Fuck this homophobic cunt.

by Anonymousreply 2909/12/2020

[quote]I have said it before I will say it again. This is what I call straight projection. It is the reason straight men are not comfortable around gay men because they all think we want them no matter how fat, old or disgusting they are - because that is how they think about women. Same is true of pedophilia. It is mostly man/young girl - but it is put on us because all gay men MUST want to diddle a little boy.

Do you think it's appropriate for an 11 year old drag queen to perform a routine where he's the only child in an adult bar. and adults are throwing money at him?

Do you think it's homophobic to find it inappropriate?

Because there's a lot of people who would class that objection as bigoted.

by Anonymousreply 3009/12/2020

R4 - absolutely. There are still so many assholes here in Romania who link us to pedophiles, that it is disgusting just like this idiot. These are the times we need to stand together and fight back. The REAL pervs are these weirdos who even think of this shit, not us for wanting to be with other men.

by Anonymousreply 3109/12/2020

[quote]Why is it OK for scantily clad 11-year-old “drag kids” to perform for dollar bills in gay bars but not for a little girl to lap-dance in a sports bar? Why are adult drag acts, including one called “Flow Job”, invited to tell toddlers fairy stories in public libraries? Why are children encouraged to mix with fetishists dressed as leather-clad “pups” at Pride marches?

Go back to Sesame Street and review the units on "one of these things is not like the others".

Nice try, but... fail.

by Anonymousreply 3209/12/2020

[quote]Recently there have been cases of a reality tv star and a footballer being sent to prison for grooming kids online.

The reality star is a former [italic]X Factor[/italic] contestant who would slide into the DMs of underage twinks in their mid-teens and ask them for nudes.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 3309/12/2020

[quote] Why is it OK for scantily clad 11-year-old “drag kids” to perform for dollar bills in gay bars but not for a little girl to lap-dance in a sports bar? Why are adult drag acts, including one called “Flow Job”, invited to tell toddlers fairy stories in public libraries? Why are children encouraged to mix with fetishists dressed as leather-clad “pups” at Pride marches? The answer “because gay culture is empowering” isn’t good enough.

All her hate is being aimed specifically at gay men.

by Anonymousreply 3409/12/2020

Am I the only one who is confused here? There seems to be this weird conflation going on of trans issues, LGBTQ people, gay men, issues that happened a long time ago, things that were said a long time ago, child sex abuse, and Cuties. And the person doing a very poor job of trying to explain all this is someone who writes for a Murdoch paper which, until 2003, featured women under 18 as their Page 3 Girls. I've seen Cuties and it does a much better job than this journalist of trying to explain these issues.

by Anonymousreply 3509/12/2020

She’s just looking for an excuse to say gay men molest children.

by Anonymousreply 3609/12/2020

R27 and R30 thank you

R30 you're talking about "Desmond is Amazing" I presume? I wouldnt have a problem with him doing drag at home or for immediate family, but at a bar, at that age, I find that disturbing. His parents have also been happy for him to associate with Michael Alig who is a bit unsavoury.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 3709/12/2020

DL old fat Pedoes must be squirming in their adult nappies about this. hahahahaha

If you are not pedo, why would you care, auntie Pedo?

by Anonymousreply 3809/12/2020

R38, you're a disease.

Let me frank, I'm and extremist homosexual, if anything like this were said, to me, in public. The consequences would not be pretty.

Punch her in the throat.

by Anonymousreply 3909/12/2020

there is always an exception to the rule, like they say, and you can find the odd gay guy who is into underdeveloped boys, however in my experience, this are mostly either masculine gay tops or bisexuals guys who are more likely to have this attraction. 99.9999% of gay even more so, those who identify themselves as bottom are into big, strong, hairy, hard cocks. gay guy, unlike straight men, are simply not into petit, fragil, virgin boys to get fucked or suck their cocks. this is the type of atteaction that heterosexual men feel because they have a minimalistic sexuality, small , tiny clitoris, petit,thin, and weak femenine bodies, virgin girls, without pubic hair who have not had sex with men before. this is the reason why pedophilia is very common in straight men. when we go to a sex store we never buy the tiniest cock, we are attracted to big fat cocks.

I have a friend who used to work at a sex store in miami beach and he told me that straight guys buy a lot of toy where you insert your dick, but gays are really not into that kind of toys, gays are into dildos, and I think it makes sense because mist gays, including myself, are not into penetrating or getting sucked, we like to suck or get fucked in the ass.

by Anonymousreply 4009/12/2020

Hilarious.

Sure, the proper reaction to gays being accused of pedophilia is to "drop the T!", because it's them who make the gays look bad and give bigots the excuse to call gays pedophiles. Without the Ts the bigots can't use the pedo accusation anymore, for sure!

Oh, they still use it? Well, drop the Bs then.

Still? Well ,drop the Lesbos!

Still being accused of being pedophiles? Well, just get rid of the Drag Queens, the Leather daddies, the Bears, the sick fetish gays, the Golden Girls obsessed weirdos,... uh, who is left? I can't drop myself, can I?

by Anonymousreply 4109/12/2020

And curiously most minors suffering abuse are girls

by Anonymousreply 4209/12/2020

And gays shouldn't adopt because they could molest these poor kids. If kids get molested it should be by straight folk! You know, who can teach them all about good ol' traditional family values!

by Anonymousreply 4309/12/2020

[quote]“The Times” UK Journalist blames Homosexuals for Pedophilia

I'm sure her next article will blame pedophiles for homosexuality.

by Anonymousreply 4409/12/2020

Heterosexuals are so slow, they don't understand drag is not seen as sexual performance among gay men. Gay men are, in fact, sexually repelled by drag and they are by everything feminine; it's appeal is only as comedy, parody, and flamboyant aesthetics. Sometimes drag have trouble getting a boyfriend even in their private lives, in plain clothes, because many gay men don't like to know that their boyfriend does this sort of thing.

by Anonymousreply 4509/12/2020

"Cuties" is about young girls. The film was written by a woman - a straight woman, as far as I know. The author of the article is simply taking advantage of the controversy behind this film to revisit over old grudges against gay men. Very likely it is Owen Jones who haunts her dreams. And by the way, Owen is just a glorified SJW; and, as a SJW, his position on sexual matters is puritanical. Neither he nor, I bet, any gay men with whom this confused woman has interacted have anything to do with this matter; this is just this woman's resentment for being owned by Jones a few months back, over a completely unrelated subject (described below).

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 4609/12/2020

[quote]Heterosexuals are so slow, they don't understand drag is not seen as sexual performance among gay men. Gay men are, in fact, sexually repelled by drag and they are by everything feminine; it's appeal is only as comedy, parody, and flamboyant aesthetics. Sometimes drag have trouble getting a boyfriend even in their private lives, in plain clothes, because many gay men don't like to know that their boyfriend does this sort of thing.

Just to clarify, are you absolute okay with an 11 year old boy doing a drag act in an adult club, where no other children are present, and where the adults throw money at him as he dances?

Can someone, anyone, please make it clear they approve of this, that they don't view it as creepy but a fully appropriate activity for 11 year olds?

by Anonymousreply 4709/12/2020

The film on which she’s supposed to be writing this article in response to is about young girls and directed by a straight woman.

But she tries to make it about Peter Tatchell, Pride, and drag.

That’s homophobia.

by Anonymousreply 4809/12/2020

[quote] Can someone, anyone, please make it clear they approve of this, that they don't view it as creepy but a fully appropriate activity for 11 year olds?

The problem is that not approving of something like that isn't enough for you. You want to DROP THE T! because of a few carefully selected incidents. Like bigots want to push gays back in the closet because of some few incidents or keeping all gays from adopting kids because of cases of sexual abuse. Which is the same strategy conservatives used to trying to shut down Planned Parenthood because for like 10 to 15% of their service is providing abortions. So, screw the rest to stick it to the few bad apples.

by Anonymousreply 4909/12/2020

R48 Not only that, the film dennounces the sexualization of children

by Anonymousreply 5009/12/2020

r30 - an 11 year old drag queen performing in a bar - if his parents are there and support him and as long as he is not doing anything sexual not sure I see a problem (I mean other than the obvious an 11 year old in a bar).

Are you suggesting a drag performance is akin to pedophilia?

by Anonymousreply 5109/12/2020

R11, Munroe Bergdorf is engaging in child abuse by encouraging young kids to fuck up their bodies and trying to push them into thinking they're transgender and thus hate what they actually are.

by Anonymousreply 5209/12/2020

You are disgusting r51.

by Anonymousreply 5309/12/2020

R51, when an 11 year old is doing a trans show for a roomful of adults, that's creepy, just as an 11-year-old girl putting on a show where she dresses up as though she were an adult woman and does a sexualised (as drag is) show for a bunch of adults is sick. That's completely different from adults doing drag for adults.

by Anonymousreply 5409/12/2020

r51 - it is not a trans show. It is a drag show for entertainment. Are you failing to understand the difference between trans and drag? If 11 year old suzie gets up at Christmas and lipsync's Taylor Swift it is cute, if an 11 year boy does it - with a nice beat on his face and a fabulous wig it's pedophilia?? Now I understand who you are.

by Anonymousreply 5509/12/2020

[quote][R30] - an 11 year old drag queen performing in a bar - if his parents are there and support him and as long as he is not doing anything sexual not sure I see a problem (I mean other than the obvious an 11 year old in a bar). Are you suggesting a drag performance is akin to pedophilia?

No, I'm not comparing drag to paedophilia, I'm saying it's not fucking appropriate for an 11 year old child to be dancing in an adult venue where they are the only child and adults are throwing money at them.

You're making Janice Turner's point, that safeguarding doesn't matter in this case because the boy is in drag,

It's an 11 year old dancing in an adult club with no other kids around, with adults throwing money at them.

If it was an 11 year old girl dancing to Shake It Off or Single Ladies in an adult club with only adults watching and throwing money at them it wouldn't be appropriate, regardless of whether the parents were there.

If it's 11 year old Suzie or Desmond dancing to Shake It Off or Single Ladies at a school concert, surrounded by other kids and their parents and guardians and teachers it's not especially inappropriate, provided they're not dressed up to look like hookers.

It's not that difficult really.

by Anonymousreply 5609/12/2020

R55 If an 11 year boy lipsync's Taylor Swift in drag - with a nice beat on his face and a fabulous wig - at Christmas, which implies at home around friends and family, that's fine. At a bar with a bunch of adult strangers, I'd be questioning his parents judgement

R56 you got in before me and did it better as well

by Anonymousreply 5709/12/2020

The vast majority of sexual abuse of minors is carried out by straight men and lesbians.

by Anonymousreply 5809/12/2020

There's a fine line between being concerned about an 11 year old's well being and be a shrieking One Million Mom going on and on and on and on about "this isn't entertainment, it's FILTH!". When you have to make your point over and over again, you come off as unhinged.

by Anonymousreply 5909/13/2020

It hasn't even taken sixty posts for her defenders to go from 'she's talking about trans! she loves gays!' to 'it's common sense to be worried about gays!'

She's scum. This article isn't even a dogwhistle.

by Anonymousreply 6009/13/2020

My response to Ms. Turner: WHATEVER!!!!!

by Anonymousreply 6109/13/2020

[quote]There's a fine line between being concerned about an 11 year old's well being and be a shrieking One Million Mom going on and on and on and on about "this isn't entertainment, it's FILTH!".

There are people on this thread who think it's fine for 11 year old kids to dance in adult bars while adults throw money at them.

Screaming HOMOPHOBIA! TRANSPHOBIA! BIPHOBIA! isn't the best response.

This is what Janice Turner actually wrote

[quote]The oldest, most grotesque homophobic slur, which underpinned Section 28, was that gay men are paedophiles, not to be trusted as teachers or even parents. This myth has been rightly demolished. Yet our collective guilt has tipped the scales the other way: now anyone demanding LGBT groups adhere to normal safeguarding must be a bigot.

There are a lot of people proving her point.

by Anonymousreply 6209/13/2020

[quote]There are a lot of people proving her point.

F&F R62.

by Anonymousreply 6309/13/2020

It would be a hell of a lot easier to dismiss the article (which I agree is muddled and isn’t very good) and others like it if we in the LGBTQ whatever community, got our own house fully in order.

The exploitation of “Desmond is Amazing” is not OK, and actually no kids should be in the LGBT community. Right in this thread, someone presumably trying to stick it to Janice Turner says Desmond is fine. Er, no. Why don’t we just stop this?

Kids certainly shouldn’t be in bars in any context. That isn’t difficult. Neither is pointing out that Peter Tatchell has said some seriously worrying things in the past about minors ”consenting” to sex that he hasn’t fully recanted or apologised for. Neither is it difficult to note that “Exist Loudly” managed to block a senior person at the National Crime Agency who offered to help with safeguarding. Exist Loudly may in fact be well-meaning, but seem to think “being on the right side of history” means they can do whatever they want.

To stop this kind of garbage being written in The Times, let’s be clear that as an adult posting “I knew I was gay / trans when I was 12” doesn’t mean 12 year olds should necessarily be in adult (or mixed adult-minor) spaces, or getting adult mentorship that isn’t very carefully monitored and regulated.

Do I find this type of journalism disgusting? Yes. Do I think we aren’t helping ourselves by not rejecting Desmond’s treatment, and by championing causes like committed-to-transing-kids Mermaids (although to be fair they look like bastions of virtue compared to Exist Loudly at present) — also yes.

by Anonymousreply 6409/13/2020

Worth pointing out that R63 is the troll who posts abusive misogynistic anti-women comments in all of the trans threads.

It really is sad that someone's hatred of women allows them to reject the most basic child safeguarding positions.

by Anonymousreply 6509/13/2020

[quote]It really is sad that someone's hatred of women allows them to reject the most basic child safeguarding positions.

You're a homophobe, R65. And if you said that about JK Rowling, you'd be threatened with a lawsuit.

by Anonymousreply 6609/13/2020

R41

Best post in this thread

by Anonymousreply 6709/13/2020

r65 I am not the person you are talking about, but I would be grateful if puritanical dykes left Datalounge alone. When it comes to gay men, dykes are as bigoted and toxic as any straight can be, and that makes coexistence difficult. Too bad what Redddit did to Gender_Critical, but Datalounge doesn't exist for people like you to come up with your homophobic feminism, it exists for gay men like me.

by Anonymousreply 6809/13/2020

I'm a homophobe for thinking 11 year old boys shouldn't be dancing in adult clubs while men throw money at them.

I'm a homophobe for thinking Peter Tatchell is disgraceful for stating 9 year olds can experience "great joy" from sexual relationships with adults.

I'm a homophobe for thinking that NSPCC advice to kids on using social media should be DON'T TALK TO STRANGERS unless they're a black transgender celebrity who is also an NSPCC ambassador, in which case it's fine.

I'm a homophobe for thinking that 12 year old kids who are gay or trans kids should not be put into the same category as 21 year olds, and that organisations asking for personal information including names and addresses of 12 year olds shouldn't adhere to basic child safeguarding rules.

by Anonymousreply 6909/13/2020

You are a homophobe for trying to promote the voice of an incoherent and deranged Frau who tries to attack gay men for shit done against girls by women directors.

by Anonymousreply 7009/13/2020

[quote] Yet our collective guilt has tipped the scales the other way: now anyone demanding LGBT groups adhere to normal safeguarding must be a bigot.

[quote] There are a lot of people proving her point.

Why have this discussion before the election?

Why act all outraged about being called a troll when pushing this divisive discussion right before the election?

Why oh why does it sound more like Drop The T! than being actually concerned about kids or the Gay Community? Safeguards. Could Drop The T be the necessary step that needs to be taken as safeguard?

Why get so angry and defensive about the pushback of those who see it as an obvious Drop The T! divisive ploy? Is it because it true and you've been found out?

by Anonymousreply 7109/13/2020

[quote]Why have this discussion before the election?

Not everything that happens in the UK revolves around US politics.7

[quote]You are a homophobe for trying to promote the voice of an incoherent and deranged Frau who tries to attack gay men for shit done against girls by women directors.

Munroe Bergdorf is not a gay man.

Tanya Compas from Exist Loudly is not a gay man.

Peter Tatchell, one of the most high profile gay rights campaigners in the UK is a man.

1 out of 3 isn't bad.

by Anonymousreply 7209/13/2020

Really? Who is this supposed to be about?:

[quote]“Attempts to sexualise minors are always wrong but a vocal minority of gay campaigners twist concern into prejudice”

by Anonymousreply 7309/13/2020

I’m not the “puritanical dyke” you’re talking to R68, but I find it interesting not wanting kids in the LGBT movement is framed as “puritanical.”

Surely the whole idea of our movement in the first place was that consenting adults should be free to do as they pleased.

There is severe mission creep by orgs (such as Stonewall, which in my experience has an excessive number of straight female staff) trying to get funding by citing children as recipients of their services, and the LGBT community should reject this as a group. It’s a simple money grab but one that has easy potential to make us look bad, and we are simply doing the work for journalists like Turner.

by Anonymousreply 7409/13/2020

r72 You're forgetting Doucouré, who's the one responsible for all this brouhaha; she's not a gay man, either. So that makes 1 of 4 of the people brought up here a gay man, and 2 of 4 women. Maybe this British hag should point the fingers at her own sex instead of scapegoating us, then?

by Anonymousreply 7509/13/2020

It's about people like you.

You defend 11 year olds dancing in clubs while men throw money at them.

You defend the absence of safeguarding processes when dealing with 12 year old kids

You defend celebrities inviting kids to message them on social media.

You defend Peter Tatchell.

R64 is right, if LGBT organisations and their supporters got their houses in order and didn't feel it necessary to defend the above in order to criticise journalist like Turner, there wouldn't be this discussion.

by Anonymousreply 7609/13/2020

As if there will ever be an end to "LGBT organisations and their supporters getting their houses in order".

by Anonymousreply 7709/13/2020

R77 well how about we start by saying children shouldn’t perform in bars for adults, and see how we go.

by Anonymousreply 7809/13/2020

The problem is that some people are not happy until gays self flagellate themselves and scream MEA CULPA! MEA MAXIMA CULPA over and over again. It's easy to point out the flaws in someone else while acting all self righteous and ignore the thing you could work on yourself.

Shooting the messenger? Maybe, but the messenger shouldn't expect better.

by Anonymousreply 7909/13/2020

R71 is confused and thinks a British journalist writing in a British paper and discussing issues within a mostly British framework is all about the US election.

by Anonymousreply 8009/13/2020

R78 You're a weird one. The exploitation of children for pageants is not exclusive to nor MAINLY a gay thing.

Fucking cancel toddlers and tiaras before clutching your pearls over a 10 year old drag act you self loathing sissy

by Anonymousreply 8109/13/2020

R78 is desperate for the approval of heterosexual women from the UK for some reason

by Anonymousreply 8209/13/2020

That’s nice R79. Put your own hyperbole and whatever you’re flagellating yourself with to one side for a second.

Can we in our own community please agree children don’t belong in our bars performing for us? Like I say, that we can’t agree on that and keep trying to justify it, isn’t the best rebuttal to journalism that I agree strays into blatant homophobia, like the original article.

by Anonymousreply 8309/13/2020

[quote][R77] well how about we start by saying children shouldn’t perform in bars for adults, and see how we go.

What does that have to do with gay men? Why connect the two?

The article suggests children having a drag queen read them a story is just as sexual as that. Why not start there?

by Anonymousreply 8409/13/2020

R84, er, there are gay men in this thread saying Desmond is Amazing is just fine. The connection was made right here.

Drag Queen Storytime makes no more sense than Butch Lesbian Storytime. I have no idea why it exists.

by Anonymousreply 8509/13/2020

R83 And what has to do with what the journalist complain on the article?

Because she is complainned about a show (who she obviously didn't watch) that has nothing to do with gays, but she needs to spin her homophobia anyway

by Anonymousreply 8609/13/2020

R84 in fact — my post saying can we just agree that what’s happening to Desmond isn’t cool, was a direct response to, well, posts in this thread.

Can we agree that? Desmond shouldn’t be in a club? Should be a simple one.

If we can’t agree on that, then, like I say. The community isn’t helping ourselves. No flagellation required but also I don’t understand why it isn’t an easy “no.”

by Anonymousreply 8709/13/2020

A lot of conflagration of different ideas. Gay people are almost never attracted to prepubescent children - certainly in percentages no more than heterosexuals are and for sure in far fewer actual numbers. However, gay men are willing to entertain the notion that the age of consent (post-pubescent) needn't be fixed at age 18, as it is is in many states and countries. It's not "sexualizing minors" to recognize that many people over the age of 14 are already sexually active. They might not be making good decisions, but they are no longer physically children, and they are following biological urges to become sexually active. The problem is in creating a legal standard which applies to all in a situation where every person is a different stage of maturity. The law tends to take the most conservative approach, which is to protect the least mature by maximizing the age of consent. However, that conservative approach penalizes the more mature 16 or 17 year old who is already quite certain about what and whom he wants, as well as his sexual partner(s). That's a valid discussion and one gay men rarely engage in, because they are so sensitive about being labeled as pedophiles. At the very least, an 18 year old man shouldn't be imprisoned for decades for having sex with a consenting 16 year old adolescent boy (or girl). However, no one can deny the feelings of uncleanness that go with the picture of a 60 year old man pawing at a 16 year old. That's truly gross. How does one codify the difference into law? That's a difficult question.

NONE of this has to do with the specific characters and situations laid out in Cuties, so it was weird that the journalist tried to tie this other discussion into that film, making it seem that sexual fetishization of the prepubescent is somehow a homosexual thing.....

by Anonymousreply 8809/13/2020

[quote]Drag Queen Storytime makes no more sense than Butch Lesbian Storytime. I have no idea why it exists.

It's good for children to see drag queens.

by Anonymousreply 8909/13/2020

Some of you are missing what the article is trying to do: it's taking the anti-trans propaganda tactic of claiming trans want to sexualize kids and are all pedos, and shifting that propaganda onto gays as well.

Easy enough for these conspiratorial rightwing freaks, since they've been pushing "gays are pedos" for decades already.

In fact, I would wager that's why they're doing it. The tactic isn't working all that well against trans, so they're trying to dig up the old, well-established "gays are pedos" bullshit to try to make it look like the accusation has historical relevance. It also helps that they're already homophobic bigots so this argument comes naturally to them.

I've been telling DL for years that this anti-trans movement is anti-gay as well. They're alt-right bigots who have jumped onto a cause started by a tiny minority of radfems who hate men and trans, and the rightwing are trying to turn it into a full anti-LGBT movement. Within a couple of years the lesbians who joined in will be crying on Tumblr, asking how they could have been so wrong about all their straight lady allies.

by Anonymousreply 9009/13/2020

[quote] Can we in our own community please agree children don’t belong in our bars performing for us?

If "your" community does this on a regular basis you should start to wonder why you are a part of this particular community. You do create your own community. And no, you don't speak for my community I created myself with my LGBTQ friends. And you most certainly don't speak for the LGBT, LGBTQ, or Gay Community as a whole. So, you can drop the concerned gay One Million Mom act, nobody's buying it or throwing cash at your sorry stage.

by Anonymousreply 9109/13/2020

Marriage is between a man and a woman. If we kept to those Christian foundations that I was brought up on everything would be lovely.

by Anonymousreply 9209/13/2020

Well the U.K., where Turner is writing from, has an equal age of consent for everyone (except those in positions of responsibility with their younger charges, teachers being the best example, who cannot sleep with those they are responsible for aged 16-18) at age 16, which I would say is about right. 14 is young for many, 18 too old for a lot. In practice in the U.K., a 17 year old with his / her 15 year old girlfriend or boyfriend is not going to be prosecuted.

I agree that Cuties has nothing to do with it and Turner lost the plot and rather gave herself away there.

R90, I’m a lesbian and I think Turner has rather shown her hand here, I certainly don’t support the article she has written and do agree it’s homophobic. I just think the LGBT community is as a group not paying attention to what some weird organisations are doing.

by Anonymousreply 9309/13/2020

R87 Can you agree that homophobes that keep calling Child Protective Services on this kid's parents think you're a sick pervert for being gay, too, and shouldn't have kids?

This drag tot you're obsessed with, Desmond Napoles, is going to be just fine and meanwhile think of all the warped kids breeders keep raising that shoot up schools or become rapists.

Your self loathing is palpable and completely contemptible.

Desmond is 13. According to Jewish law he is accountable for his own actions as a young man. He'll be fine. He sends his love.

by Anonymousreply 9409/13/2020

Tell me why heterosexuals are never asked to answer for this epidemic of half naked toddlers shaking their asses for a room full of creepy old men and stage moms?

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 9509/13/2020

I don't think all lesbians agree with Turner, R93. I thought I was clear that I was talking about the teeny tiny minority of radfems and not talking about all lesbians.

by Anonymousreply 9609/13/2020

r90. It's the old school "pushing the gays on the defense" strategy. Where "the gays" are supposed to do damage control because some bigot made the ever-so-powerful PEDO accusation that, even in 2020, needs to be taken seriously even when it's thrown at us without rhyme or reason or proof. I mean, the basis of the article isn't even about the gays, but the author makes it about the gays anyway and now the gays have to respond like they are guilty of something.

by Anonymousreply 9709/13/2020

R91, I can see what you’re trying to do but your posts would work better if, like I’ve said several times, posts above didn’t defend what’s happening to Desmond. So it’s, um... this community right here, isn’t it?

One Million Mom references don’t work so well in a U.K. interest thread and believe the poster advising that Turner’s articles have probably nothing to do with the US election.

by Anonymousreply 9809/13/2020

This is disgusting. Heterosexuals are SILENT

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 9909/13/2020

The worst part R95 is that they have been asked to explain it or get rid of it off and on for decades, but they never do. A&E and Discovery and all those shitty cable channels keep it going, as do a certain viewing demographic. But you'd never see Turner write about that, for obvious reasons.

by Anonymousreply 10009/13/2020

I don’t know whether it’s the troll at R94 who is instantly liking his own posts (probably), but good grief, if there are two of you

by Anonymousreply 10109/13/2020

R101 Yes, everyone who can clock your internalized homophobia from mars has the problem and you're the only sane one here.

by Anonymousreply 10209/13/2020

[quote] One Million Mom references don’t work so well in a U.K. interest thread and believe the poster advising that Turner’s articles have probably nothing to do with the US election.

What you are willingly ignoring for some reason is that US posters use this particular UK article to further their anti trans and anti gay agenda in the US discussing it on an anonymous message board with US centric topics. But please, do go on and keep fucking this "Well, this is the UK! Pish posh!" horse.

by Anonymousreply 10309/13/2020

I liked the post at R94 (and didn't write it).

I don't know if you're a gay man, R101, but if you are I suggest you read your history and deal with your internalized homophobia. If you're not, I suggest you leave.

by Anonymousreply 10409/13/2020

Don’t forget to like your post R102. It’s been at least thirty seconds!

by Anonymousreply 10509/13/2020

These posts always devolve into rampant hyperbole, the same obvious trans troll poster and his one misogynist supporter, calling everyone British straight women (or lesbians, whichever is considered worse) and telling them to leave... zzzz

by Anonymousreply 10609/13/2020

R105 Trust me. It's not just one person here who hates you.

by Anonymousreply 10709/13/2020

You can't seem to grasp, R105, that people disagree with you.

by Anonymousreply 10809/13/2020

Oh I know, R107. See R106. You’re the other one.

Y’all have a nice day now.

by Anonymousreply 10909/13/2020

R106 It's no one's fault but UK gendercrits that they decided to infiltrate this website and publicly share the link to datalounge on their radfem twitter circles. Go fuck yourself you homophobic cunt. This is a site for GAY MEN. That you use to outwardly bash gay men and insinuate there's a pedophilia link is disgusting. Get a fucking life.

by Anonymousreply 11009/13/2020

R109 Yeah fuck off you stupid frau cunt. You've been exposed.

by Anonymousreply 11109/13/2020

R106, you just complained that someone was making non-UK references with the "One Million Moms" comments, and now you're complaining that people assume there are British posters on these threads? That's really odd.

by Anonymousreply 11209/13/2020

She's getting to that age when straight men start seeking mojobs from twinks. Naturally, she's bitter and paranoid.

by Anonymousreply 11309/13/2020

No r90, the problem is that because of the association with the trans that's been dumped on us gays, mainstream straight society thinks that all the crazy trans demands are gay demands too. Being associated with the trans brings only damage for us gays.

by Anonymousreply 11409/13/2020

She’s referring to gay men, not trans.

The ‘gay men molest children’ is a trope we’ve heard for decades.

by Anonymousreply 11509/13/2020

It used to be 'reds under the beds' and now it is 'peds under the beds'.

Must admit I'm sick of gays all being regarded as pedo's by sections of the straight community. It simply isn't true and as other people have already stated in the thread there are way more straight peds out there because there are simply far more straights.

Furthermore, a large percentage of gays don't want anything to do with children. Period.

by Anonymousreply 11609/13/2020

[quote]The oldest, most grotesque homophobic slur, which underpinned Section 28, was that gay men are paedophiles, not to be trusted as teachers or even parents. This myth has been rightly demolished. Yet our collective guilt has tipped the scales the other way: now anyone demanding LGBT groups adhere to normal safeguarding must be a bigot.

by Anonymousreply 11709/13/2020

R117, you’re not allowed to quote the actual words of the article, you’re meant to just call everyone British fraus and tell them to fuck off. Tut tut.

by Anonymousreply 11809/13/2020

[quote][R117], you’re not allowed to quote the actual words of the article, you’re meant to just call everyone British fraus and tell them to fuck off. Tut tut.

You've already admitted, elsewhere, to being a British dyke. And have criticized people on this thread for making non-British references.

by Anonymousreply 11909/13/2020

That’s the spirit, R119.

by Anonymousreply 12009/13/2020

[quote]This week Exist Loudly, founded by a youth worker, Tanya Compas, with £100,000 crowd-funded in the wake of Black Lives Matter, asked for “queer black youth” aged 12 to 23 to contact it via private Twitter message. They will be paid for filling in a questionnaire giving intimate data — age, sexuality, location and vulnerability of housing (eg if they are sofa-surfing). Compas also said she’d pass on their contact details to interested others. When many pointed out that this breaches every child safety protocol, Compas accused them of bigotry in expletive-strewn tweets.

[quote]This week Exist Loudly, founded by a youth worker, Tanya Compas, with £100,000 crowd-funded in the wake of Black Lives Matter, asked for “queer black youth” aged 12 to 23 to contact it via private Twitter message. They will be paid for filling in a questionnaire giving intimate data — age, sexuality, location and vulnerability of housing (eg if they are sofa-surfing). Compas also said she’d pass on their contact details to interested others. When many pointed out that this breaches every child safety protocol, Compas accused them of bigotry in expletive-strewn tweets.

by Anonymousreply 12109/13/2020

[quote]That’s the spirit, [R119].

Gay men have been on the receiving end of this hateful trope for decades.

You are not a gay man, R120.

We know what is being said here and have a right to discuss it among ourselves and to identify homophobes like you as the outsiders you are.

by Anonymousreply 12209/13/2020

Even worse, Compas is offering these 12-18 year old kids money to participate in her survey.

[quote]*UK BASED ONLY* We are looking for Black/Mixed Black LGBTQ+ young people aged 12-23 to complete the questionnaire. The google form should take no longer than 15 minutes to fill out and as a thank you, you will be paid £15 for your time. To receive the link for the questionnaire, all you need to do is DM us for the link!

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 12309/13/2020

R123 has also admitted to being a dyke.

by Anonymousreply 12409/13/2020

Now the age group Compas wants to "speak to" has been lowered to 12-20. Asking 12 year olds to DM him their sexuality. If you want that £15 you're going to have to say at ages 12-15 what you're sexuality is, even though you might not know at that age. Seems not enough "queer" pre-teens responded to Compas is going to scour the country looking for them.

[quote]We are now only looking to speak to Black LGBTQ+ young people aged 12-20, and Trans, non-binary and gender non-conforming Black people aged 12-23. You must live in the UK to take part. if this is you please DM us with your age, location, gender, sexuality and ethnicity!

[quote]To those that have already filed out the form, THANK YOU! You lot have moved FAST and we have been so overwhelmed by your responses. We have had over 250 submissions already and it’s not even been up for a day yet.

[quote]Just a reminder, that only those who have fully completed the questionnaire will receive payment. Payment will be sent in 2 weeks time and you will receive an email to let you know payment has been sent. We have had some CIS-straight people complete the survey and we need to reaffirm, that you MUST be LGBTQ+ to partake. In a world where straight peoples opinions are ALWAYS at the forefront, it’s time for you to step aside and let LGBTQ+ voices move to the front.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 12509/13/2020

We're not surprised dykes are siding with a straight women over gay men. I just want this to happen as quickly as possible:

[quote]Within a couple of years the lesbians who joined in will be crying on Tumblr, asking how they could have been so wrong about all their straight lady allies.

by Anonymousreply 12609/13/2020

I wonder if any of the posters here are going to try to defend the adult Tanya Compas offering money to 12-16 year olds to DM "her" their location, age and sexuality.

by Anonymousreply 12709/13/2020

I wonder if any of the posters here are going to try to defend all the young girls molested by lesbians every year.

Guess not!

Why won't they condemn?!

by Anonymousreply 12809/13/2020

Is the trans troll posting a lot here. I’m noticing a lot of skipped posts.

by Anonymousreply 12909/13/2020

I'm sure it is r129, I'm noticing lots of skipped posts too. It must be triggered!

by Anonymousreply 13009/13/2020

I'm noticing that all the trans-hating dykes also hate gay men.

As we've said a million times.

by Anonymousreply 13109/13/2020

The writer is a feminist. Feminists hate gay men. They've been accusing us of being pedos, starting with Camille Paglia.

by Anonymousreply 13209/13/2020

When Owen Jones suggested people with cleaners not force them to work during the height of the pandemic and lockdown, she insisted that was LITERAL VIOLENCE AGAINST WOMEN!!!

by Anonymousreply 13309/13/2020

She's being torn to shreds on Twitter.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 13409/13/2020

Correct Twitter link.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 13509/13/2020

An example of the tearing to shreds:

Critic: This is disgusting. You compare a widely-reviled film to trans-supportive groups in an effort to sexualize what is actually a measure of support. You should be ashamed.

Janice Turner: I say that safeguarding should apply to all groups, No exceptions. What do you disagree with about that?

Critic: Trans children are often at risk of harm from their own families. You would rather see those kids suffer than be able to seek support from outside groups, apparently.

Janice Turner: So you don’t believe LGBT children are entitled to proper safeguarding? That’s pretty dangerous & discriminatory.

Critic: I don't believe that parents are always the best actors in a child's life.

The person tweeting above is clearly fine with a recently created organisation Exist Loudly paying vulnerable LGBT 12 year olds for their personal information, despite having no formal legal safeguarding processes in place, because the article the person has clearly read makes it clear.

As a poster above said, the widely criticised Mermaids (under investigation for accidentally sharing highly confidential patient details on their website) look well organised compared to Exist Loudly.

by Anonymousreply 13609/13/2020

Why do you continue to sexualize Drag. Have you ever seen a drag performance? They dance, and lip-sync to popular music (or spoken word or older tunes) - The audience tips with money in approval of the performance. They are not throwing money at them for sex or any sexual reason. Now do I think an 11 year old belongs in a bar? No but if they want to do drag, the parents are there an approve and the only place they can do it is a drag bar and it is not breaking any laws letting them do it - what is the harm? The 11 year old is dressed as a woman - performing for gay men - probably zero chance any gay man is turned on. It is celebrating a kid who knows who he is and has the confidence to do it publicly. It is a public performance, no different than a kid doing Annie on broadway. Why you continue to sexualize a child says more about you than me.

by Anonymousreply 13709/13/2020

You're a dyke, R136. You have not lived through what gay men have. You do not get to define homophobia. You should not even be here trying to dykesplain away gay men's issues with her homophobia.

by Anonymousreply 13809/13/2020

R137, "The 11 year old [boy] is dressed as a woman - performing for gay men" - and you don't stop to ask why an 11-year-old boy is dressed as a woman and performing for adults?

An 11 year old dressed as an exaggerated version of an adult and performing for adults is always going to have question marks over it - especially an 11-year-old boy dressed as a stereotype of a hyper-sexualised adult woman, with exaggerated breasts, ass, etc. What exactly is this 11-year-old boy being taught about adult women when he dresses up as them in a caricatured way?

Drag is entirely about adult understandings (or misunderstandings) of adult sex and gender roles, in an exaggerated way. Its roots lie more likely than not in very early clubs for homosexuals in cities in the early 20th century, where young men dressed as women offered themselves to male clients.

Performing a drag act is really not appropriate for an 11 year old and you trying to trivialise it as simply lip-syncing to pop songs either shows that you're gross and disingenuous or you have no idea what drag is.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 13909/13/2020

R137, "The 11 year old [boy] is dressed as a woman - performing for gay men" - and you don't stop to ask why an 11-year-old boy is dressed as a woman and performing for adults?

An 11 year old dressed as an exaggerated version of an adult and performing for adults is always going to have question marks over it - especially an 11-year-old boy dressed as a stereotype of a hyper-sexualised adult woman, with exaggerated breasts, ass, etc. What exactly is this 11-year-old boy being taught about adult women when he dresses up as them in a caricatured way?

Drag is entirely about adult understandings (or misunderstandings) of adult sex and gender roles, in an exaggerated way. Its roots lie more likely than not in very early clubs for homosexuals in cities in the early 20th century, where young men dressed as women offered themselves to male clients.

Performing a drag act is really not appropriate for an 11 year old and you trying to trivialise it as simply lip-syncing to pop songs either shows that you're gross and disingenuous or you have no idea what drag is.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 14009/13/2020

R137, "The 11 year old [boy] is dressed as a woman - performing for gay men" - and you don't stop to ask why an 11-year-old boy is dressed as a woman and performing for adults?

An 11 year old dressed as an exaggerated version of an adult and performing for adults is always going to have question marks over it - especially an 11-year-old boy dressed as a stereotype of a hyper-sexualised adult woman, with exaggerated breasts, ass, etc. What exactly is this 11-year-old boy being taught about adult women when he dresses up as them in a caricatured way?

Drag is entirely about adult understandings (or misunderstandings) of adult sex and gender roles, in an exaggerated way. Its roots lie more likely than not in very early clubs for homosexuals in cities in the early 20th century, where young men dressed as women offered themselves to male clients.

Performing a drag act is really not appropriate for an 11 year old and you trying to trivialise it as simply lip-syncing to pop songs either shows that you're gross and disingenuous or you have no idea what drag is.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 14109/13/2020

Is Drag Queen Story Hour also a "safeguarding" hazard?

by Anonymousreply 14209/13/2020

^ No idea why that came out multiple times.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 14309/13/2020

[quote] Critic: I don't believe that parents are always the best actors in a child's life.

Very true. Just look at the religious parents pushing their kids into gay conversion therapy or into the arms of a pedo priest.

by Anonymousreply 14409/13/2020

r141 holy fuck are you misinformed. Drag is about performance. Gender illusion. Camp. Yes, it can be sexy even raunchy but that is up to the performer. Let me ask y you this? Are you against teen bodybuilders? Underaged kids oiling up their muscles and wearing skimpy posing trunks to pose for an audience of adults whooping and hollering? How about cheerleaders? Girls who are underage and wear short skirts and tight sweaters and do hyper-sexualized gymnastics for cheering adults? That picture you posted - that kid looks happy to me. And if putting on a wig and makeup and performing makes him happy I am all for it. You are adding your own perversions in your judgement because you find it hard to believe no one else finds it sexual.

by Anonymousreply 14509/13/2020

I wish my parents had encouraged me to dress up when I was young.

I tried to turn my bed cover into a dress when I was five.

by Anonymousreply 14609/13/2020

Drag is popular among gay boys and men and it always has been, but RuPaul’s Drag Race has made it mainstream. Gay boys want to express themselves, and get the chance to like never before (however there are still many barriers).

When I was a child I always wanted to wear dresses and women’s clothing. I went as Cinderella one year for Halloween because that’s what I wanted. I loved Disney princesses and I’m grateful my family let me express myself as a child. I could have been one of those boys who was murdered by their parents for being effeminate. There are so many awful parents who abuse their boys for being effeminate or wanting to do drag.

But we’re attacking parents who accept their effeminate boys and let them express themselves? It makes no sense, sorry. It is homophobic.

by Anonymousreply 14709/13/2020

The number of parents who beat their sons for displaying any effeminacy is a far greater risk than whatever this hateful cuntsack is whining about.

by Anonymousreply 14809/13/2020

This women is one of those feminists who believe gay men are gay men's biggest problem.

by Anonymousreply 14909/13/2020

[quote] When I was a child I always wanted to wear dresses and women’s clothing. I went as Cinderella one year for Halloween because that’s what I wanted. I loved Disney princesses and I’m grateful my family let me express myself as a child. I could have been one of those boys who was murdered by their parents for being effeminate. There are so many awful parents who abuse their boys for being effeminate or wanting to do drag.

Dressing as as a princess at Halloween or lip syncing to a song and doing a dance routine at a school concert or for your family is one thing.

An 11 year old dancing in a club where he is the only child and adults throw money at him as he dances is something else.

Can you really not see a difference?

by Anonymousreply 15009/13/2020

[quote] You want to DROP THE T! because of a few carefully selected incidents. Like bigots want to push gays back in the closet because of some few incidents or keeping all gays from adopting kids because of cases of sexual abuse

No, R49, that is not why the T should be dropped. It is not JUST about a few carefully selected incidents. You either haven't been paying attention to the trans extremists and their insidious movement for quite a while or you approve of the homophobic TRAs who do not believe in homosexuality.

Dragging out old scare tactics like "bigots want to push gays back in the closet" and comparing that to the very real issue of the sexualization of children and the wide acceptance of MAPS (minority attracted persons) in the trans community is a non-starter for sane people. Gay or straight. We stopped this crap dead in its tracks before and we can do it again.

by Anonymousreply 15109/13/2020

Go back to Musmnet, dyke.

by Anonymousreply 15209/13/2020

r151, trans extremists? Like Muslim extremists? Bitch, sit your ass down. You're embarrassing yourself with your bad copy and paste job of right wing fear mongering. Even for Datalounge standards.

by Anonymousreply 15309/13/2020

Lesbians do not recognize the gay men’s boundaries or spaces as places for gay men.

That’s what allows them to try and dykesplain to us about who the real homophobes are.

by Anonymousreply 15409/13/2020

I wonder if she's offended by all the sexual abuse committed by priests. I wonder if she's worried about how there's been a huge increase in adult women chasing after teenage boys? I wonder when she'll write an article about adult Muslim men marrying girls as young as 11.

Or is her pet peeve only gay men, drag queens and trannies?

by Anonymousreply 15509/13/2020

R145, cheerleaders are performing for their own age group at school if teens or over 18 if in sports competitions and teen bodybuilders are mostly over 16. That's not the same thing as an 11 year old in drag - he's more like the creepy beauty pageants for preteen girls.

R147: [quote]When I was a child I always wanted to wear dresses and women’s clothing. I went as Cinderella one year for Halloween because that’s what I wanted. I loved Disney princesses and I’m grateful my family let me express myself as a child. I could have been one of those boys who was murdered by their parents for being effeminate. There are so many awful parents who abuse their boys for being effeminate or wanting to do drag.

The problem today is young "effeminate" boys who like dressing up in women's clothes and are most likely going to grow up to be gay men are now being pushed by their parents and other adults into being "trans" or "gender queer". Desmond is a case in point (notice the endorsements in this post - he's being paid to wear a skirt, with his mother arranging these business transactions).

Someone asked Desmond what genderqueer means and he (i.e. his mother) replied "genderqueer is a spectrum of gender identities that are not exclusively masculine or feminine‍—‌identities that are outside the gender binary." Do you think Desmond actually grasps what that means? (Not that it means anything serious.)

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 15609/13/2020

Apparently Desmond is one of the "most influential activists for the LGBTQ+ community in the United States". Can you imagine the responses if a 12-year-old gay boy came out as gay and tried to be a gay rights activist?

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 15709/13/2020

Anyway, let's get back to the subject of the thread. Who here thinks it's a great idea for Tanya Compas to offer money to 12 year olds to DM her details of their sexuality and location?

by Anonymousreply 15809/13/2020

The subject as the thread was this cunt trying to suggest gay men molest children.

by Anonymousreply 15909/13/2020

It sounds like she’s talking about Shawn Dawson Syndrome: gay, childless man has poor boundaries with children, treats them like adults, says sexually inappropriate things to them, grooms them for the dance or pageant circuit, etc. Not because he’s a pedophile, but because he’s vicariously reliving his own adolescence or is using the child as his little fashion doll.

And yes - the MAP people have been hovering around LGBTQ for a while, but it’s only members of the “queer” kink crowd - straights into leather, BDSM or whatever fetish they are “oppressed” for - that actually supports MAP inclusion. Not because they are pedos, per say, but because it’s hypocritical of them to not support other people who have a paraphilia.

by Anonymousreply 16009/13/2020

[quote] She's also, unsurprisingly, a noted TERF.

Well remember the Radfem agenda is to blame men for everything all the time. Sometimes that’s going to be right, sometimes that’s going to be wrong.

by Anonymousreply 16109/13/2020

She’s not making any particular insights.

She just believes gay men molest children and wants to say it.

That’s her reaction to Cuties.

We’ve heard it before. We object from having to hear it from people who aren’t gay men on Datalounge.

by Anonymousreply 16209/13/2020

She reacting to this sort of stuff

It's more important to be woke than ask why a kid is being photographed with a naked adult

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 16309/13/2020

Or Desmond, here

Is a it appropriate for a kid to perform drag in front of adults esp when any questions asked about safeguarding are dismissed as homophobia or transphobia?

Why the concern over cuties but if it's a boy the same age, everything is okay?

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 16409/13/2020

I have never heard this word “safeguarding” said by anyone but rad fems.

by Anonymousreply 16509/13/2020

Is she the kind of woman who would not permit her kids to do anything non gender conforming?

by Anonymousreply 16609/13/2020

[quote] I wonder if she's offended by all the sexual abuse committed by priests. I wonder if she's worried about how there's been a huge increase in adult women chasing after teenage boys? I wonder when she'll write an article about adult Muslim men marrying girls as young as 11.

She’s written about some of those things too dear. But sure, keep deflecting from the issue at hand.

by Anonymousreply 16709/13/2020

It’s the trannies. They and their enablers (HRC, GLAAD, Stonewall UK) push this shit involving kids being genderqueer, which in turn pushes the sexualization of them, and then it boomerangs back on “the faggots.”

WE suffer because of retarded trans activism. This is why the concept of “LGBTQ Community” is poisonous, homophobic, and dangerous to gay men.

by Anonymousreply 16809/13/2020

[quote] trans extremists? Like Muslim extremists?

Yes. Exactly. Muslim extremists blow things up. Trans extremists try to blow up the rights of women and gays.

You have to be taking the piss if you're arguing there are no trans extremists or Muslim extremists. Or you're brain dead.

by Anonymousreply 16909/13/2020

Post the links R167.

by Anonymousreply 17009/13/2020

[quote] I have never heard this word “safeguarding” said by anyone but rad fems.

R165, then you're just fucking ignorant. In the UK there is legislation on safeguarding for both children and adults. For children there are multi-agency Local Safeguarding Children Boards (LSCBs) and this covers child-affected areas such as education. There are studies and reports over the past 2 decades that have been produced and set out safeguarding guidelines for various institutions such as National Board for Safeguarding Children in the Catholic Church.

Your trolling here is keeping you from some proper education on a subject you are too stupid to comment on. Be gone.

by Anonymousreply 17109/13/2020

Please search for "MAP" on Twitter. These people claim the have a place in the LGBT community.

by Anonymousreply 17209/13/2020

I’m going to avoid these UK threads from now on. Let the losers spout their BS propaganda because Muriel isn’t going to do anything about it. The blatant bigotry, homophobia, racism on this forum is sick.

by Anonymousreply 17309/13/2020

r150 you keep saying dancing at a club and throwing money at them. It is called tipping a performer. It is how you show appreciation to a drag artist. You tip them. It seems like the only places you have been are strip clubs where the tips are for something else. You really should go see a drag show and pull that stick out your ass.

by Anonymousreply 17409/13/2020

Right wing trolls trolling on weekends... In other news, the sky is still blue.

by Anonymousreply 17509/13/2020

R174, children are not drag artists. Period. If you are trying to condone this then you have serious issues. Are you MAP by any chance?

by Anonymousreply 17609/13/2020

r176 Oh I see you are the arbiter of what is and is not drag. A kid can't play dress up or express something other than jeans and army t-shirt and catching frogs and kissin girls...jesus fuck tard. If the boy wants to wear a dress and put on make up an do a number from Gyspy so what who cares? You really have some fucked up projections going on.

by Anonymousreply 17709/13/2020

Presumably all the people attacking this article think it's ok for Tanya Compas to offer money to 12 year olds so that they will DM her with details of their sexuality and location.

by Anonymousreply 17809/13/2020

R166, she's the type of woman who doesn't believe in gender conforming behaviour to start with, so she'd let her kids express themselves as they feel, without labelling her pre-teen son "genderqueer" just because he likes dressing up.

by Anonymousreply 17909/13/2020

I guess the question is how can we organise as gay men against this.

by Anonymousreply 18009/13/2020

Here’s the thread.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 18109/13/2020

Is the trans troll saying anything new or is it still basically “I HATE WOMEN “

by Anonymousreply 18209/13/2020

R177, don't pretend that is the same thing as what's been going on and what we're discussing.

by Anonymousreply 18309/13/2020

If your response to Cuties is something to do with boys in drag then you’re just a homophobe.

by Anonymousreply 18409/13/2020

That’s right R178, they do. Some may query the lack of Companies House, Charity Commission and data protection registration for an organisation I suspect means well but is run by clueless individuals, but it’s probably easier to call everyone rad fems of course.

Nothing new, R182. The trans troll and its supporter think identifying female posters, who have already disclosed that they’re female, is a victory (they can’t tell the difference between fraus and lesbians, but same old). Nothing, but nothing, on this planet is worse than being a (real) woman, of course. Drives them crazy.

by Anonymousreply 18509/14/2020

Please explain what the sleezefest “Cuties” has to do with LGBT. Is Maïmouna Doucouré part of the acronym, or is she just another Frau in entertainment who profits off of exploiting kids, like the dance moms who dress their toddlers in whore clothes and make them to pop their booties in front of millions of TV viewers. By the way, “Cuties” never would have never been made had a man (gay OR straight) written it.

by Anonymousreply 18609/14/2020

R186, I entirely agree that Cuties has nothing to do with the LGBT community, and attempts to conflate it with us, are very unfair by The Times & Janice Turner. I already said that above, but darn gosh, having a vagina meant I was cancelled. I also think Toddlers & Tiaras should be cancelled. But bear in mind those kids on that show are in a safer space (as fucked up as it is) than poor little Desmond is.

Can you & the balance of opinion in this thread agree that Exist Loudly raise red flags left right and centre, and that Mermaids need to have their ethos examined independently to ensure gay kids aren’t being pre-emptively transed?

At this point, being called a “frau” (lol), “dyke” (guilty) or TERF (whatever) no longer matters — I actually only care about the issues at hand.

by Anonymousreply 18709/14/2020

[quote]At this point, being called a “frau” (lol), “dyke” (guilty) or TERF (whatever) no longer matters

Misogynistic name calling is the trans troll's only "argument", because he hates women.

by Anonymousreply 18809/14/2020

[quote] The trans troll and its supporter think identifying female posters, who have already disclosed that they’re female, is a victory

It’s important when one understands ALL the homophobic defense for this woman on this thread is coming from dykes.

All the people pointing out that this is homophobic are gay men.

But gay men aren’t allowed spaces in which we can discuss our oppression that dykes don’t think they have a right to enter.

by Anonymousreply 18909/14/2020

R189, I am a “dyke” (I don’t know whether you think that word has some power it doesn’t) and I’ve already said Turner is wrong more than once. There is more than one woman on this thread on my read.

The offer was previously made by me, to stop visiting Datalounge, if gay men here would stop telling women to unquestionably accept males in their spaces or risk vitriolic abuse. Doesn’t seem that offer was accepted (I personally am happy to accept trans women in most female spaces, but it’s the decision of women, not men).

Back on topic, it’s been pointed out several times that absurdities like Desmond is Amazing and Exist Loudly give easy ammunition to the likes of Turner, and make her column seem reasonable (when it isn’t really). Instead of the thread saying, yep, screw this woman but we must make sure the LGBT community regulates itself the way it always used to, and ensured children were firmly kept out of the spaces and the whole narrative, you’re trolling about gay people being homophobic, whilst other posters are determined to die in a ditch over a “drag kid” performing for money because of course suggesting kids don’t belong in gay clubs at all is “puritanical.”

by Anonymousreply 19009/14/2020

You’re not part of my community, R190.

Those things are for gay men to discuss, but we’re not even allowed to identity who is and isn’t a gay man on these threads.

I’d like for you to leave, but I don’t believe you or any other dykes ever will, no matter what gay men do.

You don’t believe that gay men have a right to spaces solely for gay men.

Or that gay men should be the only ones who get to define, discuss, and organize against this woman’s homophobia on this thread.

If you want to start your own thread on “safeguarding” you can. But dykes want to defend this woman because of her history of homophobia and transphobia. They’ve already defended her. They agree with her.

by Anonymousreply 19109/14/2020

Same old same old from you R191, you don’t have an answer on any of the actual points, as usual.

by Anonymousreply 19209/14/2020

You missed my point.

I don’t want to “answer your points”.

I want to be have a space free of my oppressors to discuss my oppression with my gay brothers.

by Anonymousreply 19309/14/2020

Your troll status was already acknowledged, R193, along with my dykery.

by Anonymousreply 19409/14/2020

A gay man saying that they're not going to try and explain homophobia to a homophobe in a gay men's space is now trolling.

by Anonymousreply 19509/14/2020

The way the troll does it, it sure is.

by Anonymousreply 19609/15/2020

Gay men having our own spaces! That's so funny, isn't it!

by Anonymousreply 19709/15/2020

As mentioned before this supposed real & credible journalist uses one issue to make it about her, completely unrelated, own issue. Just like the anti trans, or alt/right Russian bot trolls here on DL.

by Anonymousreply 19809/15/2020

Odd how you never answer whether women can ever have their own spaces, R197. I say odd, it’s entirely predictable.

As mentioned before, I think you’re a sort of double-agent troll trying to make the trans community look ridiculous, which is not very fair.

by Anonymousreply 19909/15/2020

[quote] Odd how you never answer whether women can ever have their own spaces, [R197]. I say odd, it’s entirely predictable.

I don’t care about “womyn’s spaces!!!!!”

Gay men do exist as support humans for women.

by Anonymousreply 20009/15/2020

Do NOT

I meant

by Anonymousreply 20109/15/2020

Looks like dykes got OP greyed out.

by Anonymousreply 20209/15/2020
Loading
Need more help? Click Here.

Yes indeed, we too use "cookies." Don't you just LOVE clicking on these things on every single site you visit? I know we do! You can thank the EU parliament for making everyone in the world click on these pointless things while changing absolutely nothing. If you are interested you can take a look at our privacy/terms or if you just want to see the damn site without all this bureaucratic nonsense, click ACCEPT and we'll set a dreaded cookie to make it go away. Otherwise, you'll just have to find some other site for your pointless bitchery needs.

×

Become a contributor - post when you want with no ads!