Game of Thrones - SPOILERS

Everybody dies.

Oh, wait—that was Hamlet. Never mind.

I took this from another forum:

Ep1

Nothing MAJOR happens but...

Jon rides a dragon w/ Dany They stop to fuck and the dragons seem really into watching them get it on Cersei begrudgingly fucks Euron Bron is sent to kill Jamie and Tyrion Jon finds out the truth from Sam Jamie shows up at Winterfell in the final scene

Also edited to add that Theon saves Yara and it was everything I didn't know I needed.

I should have prefaced Sam tells Jon RIGHT after he finds out Dany killed his father and brother, it's quite sad. As he runs out of his meeting with her he runs into Bran who tell Sam that he (Sam) needs to be the one to tell Jon because Jon trust him more than anyone. So Sam finds Jon in the crypts and starts by asking Jon if he knew what she had done to his family, followed by him asking of Jon would have done that. To which Jon replies that he's killed before, but Sam maintains that he has mercy. Leading into the fact he's verified something, and then tells Jon the whole truth. Jon at first refuses to believe because he didn't want to believe that the honorable Ned Stark would have lied to him his whole life, but Same reminds him he did this for his true mother, Lyanna, to keep him safe. And he seemingly accepts this. But it's left open ended as to what this means for the future of the throne, the war, and Jon.

OK. I heard that when they arrive at Winterfell, the Northerners are pissed at Jon for allying with Dany. So Tyrion makes a speech to the Northmen at a very heated meeting with Jon and Dany & Sansa present, and he tells them they're all gonna die so they all have to work together and he is convinced his sister Cersei will send help. Then Sansa walks away from him saying, "And I always thought you were the smart one..." Of course she "knows" Cersei will do no such thing. I also heard that Sansa is chilly towards Dany and mocks Jon for bending the knee to her asking him if he was thinking with his head or his dick? Man, Sansa is tough. Gendry and Arya have a reunion. The Hound and Arya bitch at one another like old times.

I don't want Jaime to die!!!!!! There he was, facing his evil sister and she was SO mean to him! And then she almost has him killed by the Mountain! He was so hurt. You could see it in his eyes. It was horrible. One minute he's head of the armies, and then he's riding off alone in the cold, grey, wintery twilight to fight for the living, even though he only has one hand and it isn't his sword hand. I was so glad when Hodor ripped and twisted Locke's neck and broke it. Jaime referred to him as Bolton's pet rat. Ugh. Hateful man.

R3 So I guess Bronn is joining the fight at Winterfell. No way he will kill either Tyrion or Jaime.

Looking forward to more Arya Hound bickering. I enjoyed them together in season 4.

Since Jaime arrives, he'll tell them cersei isn't sending an army and Tyrion will hopefully realize his sister can't be trusted. Ever.

Here’s a summary of the first ep. Yes it’s real and yes there are spoilers.

Bronn getting a bag of gold to kill Tyrion and Jaime is really worrisome to me. I hope Bran alerts them. Of course the other thing Bran knows is what happened between Cersei and Tyrion. So if Tyrion was making a deal with Cersei to the detriment of Dany, Bran will know and he will bust them all. Go Bran!

Jon meets Cersei some time after the Battle of Winterfell, which is in ep. 3. There were pap photos of Kit and Lena filming together, coupled with rumours that there might be an offer of a political marriage in the aftermath of Jon finding out his true parentage and Euron biting it.

There’s also supposed to be 4/5 major character deaths during the battle of Winterfell. Smart money is on Jorah, Tormund, Beric, Pod and maybe Theon.

There have been a few rumblings that all of the promos are focusing on the mid-season Winterfell battle because there’s a jaw-dropping set piece at the end of the season that takes place in KL, and they want to shift focus.

Nikolaj and Gwendoline filmed a Jaime/Brienne sex scene with full-on nudity, which is going to take place in ep. 3 or 4 depending on editing. Gwen didn’t have a body double like Lena usually uses for her nude/twincest scenes.

Tyrion is supposed to be put on trial in the Dragon Pit at the end on the season. No idea how true that is, but Dinklage did film in Spain along with others.

Where did you find that, r10?

I think Gendry and Jaime will also die at Winterfell. It'd be shocking to lose a main character (jaime) halfway through the season. I hope they do that.

I don't see Jaime or Gendry dying in episode 3. Nor Jorah. I think Podrick is a goner. Possibly Tormund, Edd, and Beric. The Hound is another one. Possibly Grey Worm. He may be killed in the Battle for Winterfell in episode 3. I hope Bronn is killed too. Especially if he went north to kill the Lannisters. Rotten fucker.

The core group: Jaime, Gendry, Jon, Theon, Jorah, Brienne, the stark women, Dany, Sam, Gilly, Varys, Missandei, will get through that Winterfell battle. A lot of the Unsullied may die, too.

The Hound will survive Winterfell. He will go to King's Landing and fight the Mountain. And then they will both die.

They better make sure Ser Davos survives the battle in episode 3 or I will be pissed. I like that old dude.

If Jaime and Brienne had sex it would be in Episode 2 not 3 when the battle is happening, and not 4 when one of them is possibly dead. OTOH, if they survive the battle then yeah, I hope they do have wild hot sex, because shit.

Yeah, Bronn needs to die.

I’m over Bronn and his fucking wisecracking.

[quote]There’s also supposed to be 4/5 major character deaths during the battle of Winterfell. Smart money is on Jorah, Tormund, Beric, Pod and maybe Theon.

Beric, Podrick and Tormund are all minor.

So apart from Dany and Jon, aren’t Gendry and Brienne part Targaryean as well?

I will be satisfied if Jamie has to die, he gets to fuck Brienne first.

Imagine how profoundly shitty it would be if Jaime was to have some ignominious death, like being executed by Jon for pushing Bran.

Fuck.

Tormund is definitely a goner.

[quote]Nikolaj and Gwendoline filmed a Jaime/Brienne sex scene with full-on nudity, which is going to take place in ep. 3 or 4 depending on editing. Gwen didn’t have a body double like Lena usually uses for her nude/twincest scenes.

Fuck the people. Any dragon spoilers?!

Bronn became unlikable to me when he shit on Tyrion. In fact, when Tyrion gave Shae to Bronn and told him to put her on a boat, that's when he betrayed him. It wasn't made clear in the TV show, but I believe he fucked Tyrion then. And later he refused to be Tyrion's champion against the Mountain. Which I understand, but he was all dressed up in fine leather obviously his fortunes had improved when he went down to see him. Then, last season, when he met Tyrion at King's Landing for the big meeting, he was a sarcastic son of a bitch, talking about how he could hand the Queen two traitors, etc. So I'm over Bronn. I hope he meets death unceremoniously before the BAttle of Winterfell. And he better not harm a hair on Jaime's head.

Is there going to be a zombie Hodor?

Tyrion is going to be put on trial for treason and will be executed

I know the Hound is awful but I’ll miss him.

From way way back when they were filming in late 2017, there was a leaked script page with Tyrion discussing Jaime’s death. Happens mid season. Knowing now how tight the security on scripts were (no paper copies) it was most likely a fake, but it looked like leaks from past seasons that had proved correct.

There's a theory on Reddit about Dany becoming the night queen.

I don't see how anyone who has watched the show can insist they'll be furious if any of the characters are killed--one of the best things about this show is that anyone at all might die.

If they dared to kill off such hugely beloved characters as Ned, Robb, and Catelyn Stark, Shireen Baratheon, Queen Margaery, and King Tommen, then they'll kill off anyone. The only exception to this rule I would see is Tyrion because George RR Martin has said multiple times he's his favorite character and identifies with him the most.

Ugh I so mad at myself for reading the spoiler.

Never saw the one about Dany as the Night Queen but I have seen a bunch of predictions that she dies in childbirth, which, IMO is the laziest way to deal with her. If Dany is on the Death list, then I want her to go out literally in a blaze of glory, fighting the bad guys. I do agree with the prediction that Tyrion is executed for treason. Don't know if I believe there's another Tyrion trial. I think Jon & Sam live. I think Sansa & Gendry live. I think Missandei lives and I think Ser Jorah and Varys live. Don't know about Davos but I hope he makes it. I see Brienne & Jaime dying. I will be very sad to see them go, but die they must. So too, Grey Worm. Podrick, Edd, & Tormund will probably die during the Episode 3 battle for Winterfell and so will Beric. If they kill off Lyanna Mormont I don't want to see it. Robin Arryn, ...meh. Lord Royce? I hope not. I like him.

Here's something we haven't really discussed: The Gold Company. Will they attack the survivors in the North? Or will they turn on Cersei? As for Bronn, I'm not convinced he will kill the Lannister brothers. I think he is a cold blooded Sell Sword but I'm not convinced he's an assassin. He 's not a murder for hire guy. Or is he? Maybe so. I've heard that Euron takes out a contract on Cersei, as she takes out a hit on him. (Bronn? I can see him hired by Cersei to hit Euron more readily that go after her brothers. ) There was speculation that Arya kills Qyburn, then uses his face to kill Cersei. It has been predicted that The Hound kills The Mountain.....unless, and I believe this: The Hound is one who dies at Winterfell.

How about this- Hound dies at Winterfell but Beric Dondarrion gives him his last life and resurrects him. Then Beric dies for good. Hound goes on to fight the Mountain.

Beric has no power to resurrect anyone. Thoros of Myr was the drunken priest who resurrected Beric, and Thoros is dead. The only one with the power to resurrect anyone is Melisandre. And she left for Volantis. But she returns. I have a feeling if something happens to either Jon or Dany they will be begging Mel to do her thang.

Yes he does. He can breathe his last life into someone dead and bring them back. But then he would die. In the book he did it for dead Catelyn Stark and she came back as Lady Stoneheart.

He thinks the Hound has a special purpose-since he can see visions in the fire and whatnot- so it's possible the Hound dies and Beric decides to sacrifice himself to resurrect him.

R33, Varys is already confirmed to die alongside Melisandre. She specifically told him before leaving Westeros, that she was meant to die in Weateros and so is Varys.

R37 She said they were destined to die in Westeros, but not that they would die "beside one another or at the same time.

R36, The Books Beric has the power to breathe his last life into someone, but so far I don't recall that ever being mentioned in the HBO version.

I’m glad Gwendoline Christie gets to show it off, all 7’4” of her self.

I keep hearing about these upgraded opening credits. That 15 second clip they have floating on the web is not enough. I want to see the whole damn opening credits and I don't want to wait until Sunday. Links? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? Bueller?

The new opening credits are all made of Oreos...

Gwendoline is 6' 3" ...and Nicolaj is allegedly 6'2". But I think he's shorter. Maybe just 6' or 6' 1" at most.

Gwen said when she was reading the script for Brienne's storyline, the first time, she turned beet red and had to jump out of her chair and walk around for a bit.... now what would make Brienne do that?

Brienne and Jamie are going to FINALLY get it on, right before Jamie dies in the Battle of Winterfell.

Rather see Jaime get it on with Gendry....

R11 Most of the info comes from Reddit, but the Jaime and Brienne hooking up leak has come from a podcast that’s been kicking around for months. It disclosed that they got confirmation from multiple sources that they won’t divulge for fear of of getting them in hot water. Presumably crew members who signed NDAs.

Neither of them are dying in the Battle of Winterfell, because the fucking happens afterwards. The battle sequence is going to last 50-60 mins, while ep 3 as a whole is coming in at 80+ mins. My guess is that Bronn goes to kill Jaime during the chaos of the battle at Cersei’s request, just like the Kingsguard member attacked Tyrion at Blackwater, and then Brienne saves Jaime. Or Pod, who then dies. Cue OathSex in the aftermath. I guess it has to happen after Jaime KNOWS once and for all that Cersei was going to go through with having him killed, so that their relationship is dead and buried.

Don’t be surprised if Jaime is integral to the end of the show.

R45 Interesting. In which subreddit? The ASOIAF and GameofThrones don’t post leaks often.

R45 that makes the most sense of any rumors I've heard. Only time will tell if it's real, but it seems like it should be. I hope Brienne kills Bronn. I would love it. Especially if Jaime realizes what is about to happen.

Didn't Nikolaj have some kind of dispute about being paid for the full season even though he is not in all of the episodes, which is why it looks like Jamie will die?

Sam being the survivor at the end is the MOST PREDICTABLE ending ever. And dull.

R/freefolk r46. That’s the spoilers sub.

Jaime only appears at the very end of Episode one. The episode ends with him riding through the gates of Winterfell, and coming face to face with Bran. They look at one another, and it ends.

Bran will probably forgive him pretty quickly. They've got more important things to worry about now. I do wonder if Jaime will tell everyone else that he pushed bran out of the window or if bran will tell him to keep it between themselves.

Gwendoline Christie nude

sorry but not hot at all.

more

Great...now post Jaime nudes

R54 Lannister?

R54 Nikolaj Coster-Waldau full-frontal nude shows his penis in 'Nattevagten'

It's small right?

tinymeat?

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R56 nice bush though

Tywin so hot. Shake it!

Lord Tywin Lannister shakes dat ass

Dance, Charles, dance

Maybe during his Jewel in the Crown, White Mischief Days.

Hunny I once saw a movie with Charles & Helen Mirren when she was much younger and he was sexy in an evil dirty way.

Charles Dance is unbelievably hot in White Mischief.

yes, I saw that too.

Bran couldn't care less that Jamie pushed him. Bran has seen and knows too much for such an earthly concern. He understands why Jamie did it, and likely knows he's been trying to redeem himself.

I bet Bran doesn't even bother to tell anyone.

r61, I'm slightly aroused.

Hot Jaime was on Jimmy Kimmel last night and they were discussing rumors and fan theories, and it seemed like Nicolaj Coster Waldau seemed to accidently confirm one.

Now that it seems like those rumors may be true all I can think of is Jaime and Brienne.

If there's one thing you can bet on this season, it's that Jaime and Brienne will hook up. Gwendolyn Christie said something about 'Brienne the woman' being shown this year. They probably won't get a happy ending, but there will be sex!

I remember when NCW was being interviewed awhile ago about finally realizing how awful Cersei was and walking away, and he said something about how he had been waiting for that moment for several years, nagging D&D about how long did they expect Jaime to put up with that evil woman. LOL!

He recently said something about finally moving on and being rid of Cersei, too. And the way he talked about moving on, I felt like he was implying something. What I like about the notion, is that Cersei was reputed to be the most beautiful woman in the 7 kingdoms for years. And Brienne, especially in the books, is homely, awkward, too tall, too masculine, etc. The books make her seem like a freak, almost. Of course on TV she is awkward, not at all feminie in a traditional sense, and she definitely downplays her looks, and yet Jaime is definitely attracted to her.

R61, OMG!!! What movie is that from?!! Recently?

Is Brienne a virgin?

No, R73, that was a home movie from a party Dance gave.....

R74, yes she is.....

Charles has a very good voice. I love him. too bad he died (in the show)

Eww I don’t want Browne and Jamie hooking up. I actually detest Jamie more since his “redemption” and still find him vile. I think he was only redeemed because the female audience wants him. Has Jamie been black and poor, the female audience would’ve never let you forget he’s a rapist.

I want Briene to get it on with Tormmund.

I agree, R77. I sort of expected Jaime to try to save Tyrion. So when he showed up to help him escape, along with Varys, I was glad, but not too surprised.....but then Tyrion resolutely walks down that hallway, and it was as if he had already made up his mind. He was going to kill his father. No way was he just planning to stop in to say good bye. Then, when he realizes the depths of his father's betrayal, finding Shae in his bed, and she's calling out to Tywin the way she used to talk to Tyrion, everything spiraled way out of control.

If you watch that scene when the two confront one another, Tywin and Tyrion, and you see the coldness and fury of Tyrion, and then compare it to Tyrion expressing his "regret" to Cersei and Jaime about killing the old bastard, his regret rings very hollow. Tyrion is not someone you fuck with. If it's true that Bronn is coming for him, then Bronn ought to be worried. Yes. If I were Bronn, I'd worry more about Tyrion than Jaime. Even though Bronn has observed them both close up and knows their strengths and weaknesses, I don't think he's prepared for Tyrion. And I would not be surprised if it comes out that Bronn first betrayed Tyrion when he lied to him about putting Shae on a boat. Clearly he didn't.

R73 from Ali G Indahouse from 2002. Not a bad figure. I hope I'm that fit at his age.

He does have a sexy voice. Here he is reading some kinky fuckery

OK. If all these leaks and rumors are true there's gonna be a lot of fucking in Season 8. YOU have Dany & Jon, of course. Then w e hear that Euron and Cersei fuck. No surprise there. But then we hear Brienne and Jaime will fuck!! And Arya and Gendry. Damn. The total running time for the whole season is about 8 hours. And there are at least four couples fucking. Not bad.

Jaime and Brienne are Frau-bate material.

Jaime is bait for anyone. Male or female. The thing is, with all the fucking they are claiming for Season 8, why is Sansa never mentioned. She deserves some love. And please don't say Tyrion.

Difficult for me to get into a man that pushed a kid off a window ledge and fucks his sister.

Fraus love that shit, R85.

'Shades of Grey' and all that other Frau masturbation material.

Nonsense. Gays love that shit too. My friends and I always loved comparing notes on our favorite soap operas.

I'm not talking about soaps.

I'm talking about the ugly girl getting the sexy sister-fucker. That's the Frau Fantasy.

Gay Fraus get off on that, too, it seems.

R88, a brother and sister fucking, cheating on her husband. Her husband is wealthy and powerful and he knows his kids, his heirs, are not his, etc. That's about as soapy as it gets. And a father fucking his son's ex girlfriend? Tywin & Tyrion? Hah.

When I looked at Jaime with Cersei I thought of them as an old married couple. I never thought of them as brother and sister. It didn't work for me. Now as I think of his character, Jaime loved his family and he was misled by an evil, lustful vicious woman. He out grew her evil.

Because of the love of an ugly woman.

Ultimaten Frau Fantasy.

The Frau gets the Sexy Sister-Fucker in the end.

Jamie lanister looks bang average in those nude pics.

I think he's hot and I'm no "frau." It's funny, too because he is lean and wiry not overly muscular at all. almost too skinny. And they say he's 6' 2" . I think it's his eyes. He has sexy eyes. In fact he is a damned good looking man. I also think he is a really good actor. I think he did a lot with his character. The scenes with Gwendoline Christie and Diana Rigg, andLena, were superb.

Nikolaj is HOT.

Jamie is a sick fuck that Fraus really get turned don by.

Nikolaj isn't ugly but if you to Sweden and neighboring countries, many guys like him are walking on the street.

Season 8 will focus on the Night King's back story. The Night King is apparently the brother of Brandon "the Builder" Stark. He wants to rescue his white walker girlfriend who has been imprisoned in the Stark crypt, hence the march to Winterfell with his family.

Remember the opening scene of the first episode - there was a strange child with white walker blue eyes who had killed some free folk. So perhaps there are white walker - human hybrids.

I believe the spoilers that say Jon is the new Azor Ahai. Dany sacrifices herself to save everyone, and Jon plunges his sword into her chest just as Azor Ahai did to Nissa Nissa in order that the sword be imbued with extreme power and magic. Remember, Dany said she wasn't going to stop the wheel, she is going to break the wheel.

Dany becomes a white walker and she and Jon rule together on the Iron Throne. Perhaps they can produce a hybrid child.

That would be a trip r95.

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Game Of Thrones: 20 Fan Theories About The Targaryen Family That Make Way Too Much Sense

R84 due to all the shit she's gone through, Sansa probably wouldn't sleep with anyone she didn't trust. And the number of people she trusts, who are not related to her, is very limited. Probably only Brienne. So she she fuck Brienne. Sorry Jaime.

I wonder if it's wishful thinking on the part of fans that Jaime gets with Brienne. I can't imagine how they get there. I'm a story teller. We have this character who is very buttoned up. Stiff, formal, and awkward. She doesn't know how to be any other way. And Jaime could try to seduce her I guess, but she is so skittish I'd think he'd be scared she'd go off the deep end and curl up in a ball of fear. They have been naked together. So that might help. And she does care very deeply for him as he is now realizing he cares for her. But how do they get to the fucking part? I just don't see it. IS ee them fighting together, I see them protecting one another. Comrades. But fucking?

The hound should fuck Brienne. I don't care about her and Jamie.

A three way with the Hound, Tormund, and Brienne.

There's going to be treachery in Season 8. Because you can't just have battle with the Dead or the GC. I just hope Bran sees the treachery and warns people. Like if Bronn is there to kill the Lannisters, or if Tyrion betrays Dany, or other shit.

R100: You never heard of a moment of passion? It could definitely happen! Esp. if they feel they may die and this may be it.

I have to say. As I've watched it again, looking for specific things, or focusing on certain characters, I love the way Jaime is written. Not just his character arc, but the way he talks. He is so sharp and eloquent, and has a certain grace about him, very classy, especially as his character ripens from a smug young shit to the mature compassionate man he becomes.

It would be great if Brienne got pregnant by Jaime and her kid is raised with Dany's kid in the end. The children would embody all the major houses - Stark, Lannister and Targaryen (plus Tarth).

But this is GOT, so no happy endimgs :-(

*endings

As I think about it I believe everyone is expecting Jon to die again. It's a foregone conclusion. And a lot of people expect Dany to die. The common wisdom is either one or both will die. So I think it would be quite unexpected if they both live. I think THeon is such a tragic figure I know he will die. I guess everyone "knows" or expects Jaime to die. Cersei too. We will see secondary characters like Bronn, Edd, Podrick, Theon, Grey Worm, Tormund, Beric, Melisandre, The Hound, all die. Maybe even Davos and Jorah. But it is possible we will be surprised and Jaime, Jon, Dany, Sam, Gilly, Missandei, Brienne, Sansa,Arya, Gendry all live. Even Varys and Tyrion.

R108: This is GOT we're talking about! All the main/beloved characters will not survive. All the dragons and wolves will be killed also.

Well I want the fucking series to end with the discovery of a bunch of Dragon eggs in Asshai and they're about to hatch. Fuck it.

I will never be prepared for Jon Snow dying again.

I believe the ending has been telegraphed through foreshadowing. Remember Jon Snow advocating a deal with The Wildings? I believe, after a massive battle, he will advocate a similar detente with the Night King. This may include sacrificing Dany to make her the Night Queen. And remember, Jon was killed for making the Wilding deal.

Starks are descendants of the Night King, btw.

At some point I hope they thought about being repetitious. Women dying in childbirth, Jon getting killed... and being resurrected, Cersei using Wildfire to blow up the Sept, Tyrion using Wildfire to blow up the bay and Stannis' ships, etc. I don't want to see wildfire unless they pour it in the forest to kill zombies. I don't want jon to die...again, and no more women dying in childbirth. As Olenna would say it would be a failure of imagination. My goodness. Even Arya uses some variety in her assassinations: She slit Littlefinger's throat, she served Walder Frey's sons to him in a pie,...before she slit his throat, then she poisoned his entire family. The sons. The poison thing is way over used, though. Joffrey was poisoned, Myrcella was poisoned, Olenna was poisoned and the Sand Snakes tried to poison Bronn. And then Cersei poisoned the last living Snake. So no more poison.

Valid points r113

I've guessed the ending. Very abruptly, in the middle of the final scene, in the last ten minutes, we are in George R R Martin's study with David Benioff and Dan weiss and he says so that just about covers it. OTOH, it could be that they surprise us with multiple endings and we get to vote on who wins.

Actually, then more I think about it, the more I like it. Multiple endings. It would not surprise me if they did shoot multiple endings one each with Jon, Dany, The Night King, etc. Personally I would love it.

Remember those ravens that have hung around during certain events over the course of the series, like when Sam killed the White Walker with dragonglass? It’s no coincidence that we know Bran is now in control of them and that he’s capable of affecting events in the past. It’s more explicit in the books, because we know that he was climbing the broken tower to chase after one of the crows (they’re crows in the books), but there’s a very credible theory that Older Bran lured Younger Bran up the tower to witness Jaime and Cersei fucking so that he could be pushed and crippled; otherwise he’d never become the Three-Eyed Raven.

I think Bran was also responsible for driving Aerys mad, so that those caches of wildfire could be left under the capital. He was probably the voice that Varys heard in the flames when he was cut too.

8 Things That Will Probably Happen in 'Game of Thrones' Season 8, Episode 1

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My dreams are a bit shattered knowing with the Jaime/Brienne showmance that she and Tormund aren't going to happen, which I really wanted to see more than any other possible coupling from this show! The way he looks at and talks about her is hysterical.

Wouldn't be surprised if the end is left to be 'interpreted ' by the viewers for reboots sake. It would however leave room for more content for another series which they're desperate for.

Same here - I wanted Tormund and Brienne to mate and start a new race of giants.

The author said the books will continue.

Saw Jamie Lannister doing promos and he’s gone grey, looks much older

I love this dude and his weird smiles

Tormund looks slightly mad. He reminds me of Heidi's Grandfather in the old Shirley Temple movie.

Pay your respect

R121 That was Tormunds plan!

Getting the shakes!

I want Sansa to fuck the Hound.

He is the (genuinely) noble knight of her dreams, and he needs to get some pussy.

I want to see KCW’s ass in his sex scene with Brienne. Too many acres of glowing white flesh might be a bit much, so here’s hoping he hit the tanning bed first.

I think if Brienne and Jaime do anything romantic, it will be furtive and desperate and on the fly with most of their clothes on. Since it will likely happen in episode 4 if it happens, it will be in the aftermath of Winterfell's battle and there will be mourning for the dead and the lost, and for Winterfell which looks in most of the promos to be on fire. I hope it's not totally destroyed.

I predict tits and asses out and they'll fuck in the tower where Jaime and Cersei banged and Bran got shoved out the window.

Who Will the Three Dragon Riders Be in 'Game of Thrones' Season 8?

Isn't that a foregone conclusion? Dany, Jon, and the Night King.

Stop with this stupid shipping in this thread, who fucking cares about that,

Well, we know who the three dragon riders are based on the fact that Vyserion is ZombieDragon. If that had not happened I would have put Arya on the third dragon.

Last night I was watching the Game of thrones rerun on HBO and it was Season 6, when Bran wanders out and finds the Night King and the NK touches him. There was horror and recognition, and if the interviews or comments I've read a re true, they've said the Night King is coming after a very specific target. I believe it's Bran. Others say Bran IS the Night King. I just know that when we watched the Hodor episode, the old 3 eyed raven was the person they were after. They went into that cave to kill him.

I hope Bran isn't the Night King. And I can believe that NK is after Bran just b/c he's the Three Eyed Raven. That makes sense. They don't need to make it more complicated than that!

Why are we supposed to care who the night king is? He’s a friggin ice zombie, that’s who he is.

They’re cooming!

The. Dead. Are. Cooming

I’ve seen em

Beyond the wall.

If you’d seen what I’ve seen, you’d roon!

——-

PS — why doesn’t everyone just travel to Essos? Ice zombies can’t cross water.

4 hours to go

Why Game of Thrones Fans Saw That Hideous Dragon Twist Coming

I will miss this thread because 99% of you were fun and insightful.

Power-Ranking the Top 25 Villains in ‘Game of Thrones’ History

Nikolaj Coster-Waldau in a moment of passion with fellow Danish actor Mads Mikkelsen

Hunny, we here, we ain't gone no where...

OK. The SPOILER I found out from the Season 8 premiere is Bronn. And Jerome Flynn kind of confirmed it in an interview when he said he didn't know if we'd like Bronn so much this season. But I'm told from someone who knows someone who was there... that in the first episode, Qyburn give Bronn a huge bag of gold with instructions from Cersei that he is to kill Tyrion AND Jaime. So there it is. I was SO pissed when I Read that.

Game of Thrones season 8: Jaime Lannister heartbroken by shock death?

GAME OF THRONES favourite Jaime Lannister could be about to lose one of his greatest assets in the season eight finale as his trusted companion, Bronn, could bite the dust.

Bye Bronn!

Bronn is paid by Cuntess Cersei to kill Jaime.

2.5 hours countdown

I can't wait for this series to be over so I can cancel HBO and Showtime on shitty Rectum. Fucking overpriced and they removed cinemax as well. fuck these cable cunts. I will still have the basic coz i need to watch sports.

Nothing worth watching on HBO or Showtime anymore. all shite.

I'm watching the 60min segment on GOT. Did Brienne have a nose job? looks very fake.

15 minutes

It’s ON

Is this the new season thread, or is there another?

Jon and Bran reunited at last!!!!

Dragon Lady looking swell riding into Winterfell with Jon and her dragons.

Sansa: What do dragons eat ?

Danys: Whatever they want

😂

Arya and Jon reunited at last!!!

Tyrion and Sansa reunited

Captain Strickland has CSL for days.

Cersei, No sex until after the war lol

JON SNOW RIDES A DRAGON!!!!!!

Good for Theon- he did something right.

Now he's going to die in the North

I am lagging

I like Davos. Hope he doesn't die.

THE HOUND AN ARYA REUNITED AT LAST!

Arya and Hound reunited

Cold bitch lol

These reunions have been pretty lackluster. I thought Hound and Arya would be better.

I wish Jon give Sansa a good slap

Jorah is a handsome fucker

Poor Samwise.

I forgot about Sam scraping off Jorah's greyscale. Seems like forever ago.

No comment on the new beginning? Totally different credits sequence!

I gotta say -- there has been WAY TOO MUCH TIME between the airing of the last episode of Season 7 and the airing of this episode:

8/27/17 - 4/14/19 - 596 days or 1 year, 7 months, and approx. 3 weeks.

The big reveal

Poor Jon... that's a lot to absorb in just a few minutes.

Have we ever discussed GoT Composer cutie Ramin Djawadi?

Both Daenerys Targaryen and Jon Snow will die in Season 8. Bran will become the new night king

Do we know why it took so long to get this season? Was it just a lot of post production needed or something like that?

Link posting fail, R177.

What is with people posting links to redirectors? Just post the ACTUAL lnk!

Cersei will be killed by Arya Stark

Ooh, sexy voiced Beric and crazy Tormund. I like those guys

Well that was creepy as fuck

Arya and Sansa will survive

Finally, some action

That first scream scared the shit out of my cat. Lol.

Jaime and Bran, REUNITED!

Okay, that was less than an hour. For only six episodes this season, I thought all the episodes were going to be longer than an hour?

Did Jaime know Bran was alive?

I guess the good stuff starts next week.

You mean the bad ass stuff

Dany is fucking insufferable. And no Jon, she wouldn’t step aside for you.

The reaction

HBO has revealed run times for the shortened season eight, clocking in at 432 minutes total. The first two installments of the season will be the shortest, at 54 and 58 minutes respectively. From there, the season balloons out, with its longest episode at an hour and 22 minutes. Episode four runs for an hour and 18 minutes. The final two episodes of the series are both estimated to run for an hour and 20 minutes each.

That's interesting. I somehow thought the episodes would be around an hour and a half each. I didn't know they would be so short. Darn. I was way off.

Will those poor Stark kids ever be reunited?

Was Edmure Tully in this episode? I saw his name in the end credits, but don't remember seeing him. Or was he in the recap at the beginning, maybe?

R173 It reflects the houses that are fighting and the inroads The Night King has made.

For those of you predicting Jon and Dany are dying and Bran will be the new Night King...calm down. I've heard rumors of the end and it is not that wild! Most of the women live. The Night King is defeated to end the menace. Most people who expect a dark ending will be sorely dissapointed.

Happy ending would be so predictable and boring

I was hoping for a fairly dark ending but not Jon dying.

I’m most excited for the bitchfest between Daenerys and Sansa! You can already tell this season will be everyone in the North split between Team Dany and Team Sansa/Jon

haven't watched yet, did anyone die in this episode?

Yeah, but no one you know.

Why would you pick the side with no dragons?

R202 You can say that Cersei did! Euron killed her pride. He finally fucked a queen! I hope he wins the Game and becomes king.......

R201 Wrong. The North is against Dany right now. PERIOD. They didn't want an interloper from The South being their queen.

Auntie & Nephew Sittin' in a tree! K-I-S-S-I-N-G!

R205 Oops, I meant the central characters. So I’m thinking Arya, Samwell, Sansa, and Davos maybe heading the charge (quietly)

Also Daenerys said her dragons didn’t like the North. I think that’s significant

Whose going to tell Euron Cersei’s belly is already occupied?

R209 Cersei will probably pass the child off as his, she’s done it before with Robert (3 times!)

True r210. That’s definitely her M.O.

She'll die before the kid is born. Euron definitely will.

R202 that little kid lord Glover.

I think they’ll have to leave Winterfell.

Harry Strickland, Captain of the Golden Company, is pretty cute.

I was disappointed Sansa and the Hound didn't have a reunion.

Anyone have Spoilers for next week?

Wait, if no one but Targaryans can ride dragons, and Dany didn't know Jon was actually a Targaryan, wasn't she risking his life in getting him onto a dragon?

I thought the big clue as to whether one was a Targaryan was that only Targaryans can ride dragons.

Jon goes up to Daney and says "Hey, did you know I have a claim to the throne and you don't, Auntie?"

My favorite part of the episode:

Tyrion points out that most of the people that underestimated Sansa are dead.

Jon once again underestimating Sansa by saying that she thinks she is the smartest person in the land.

Arya disagreeing and saying that she is.

Jon is going to find out what happens when you fuck with Sansa.

Hate Sansa.

Bran was hardcore staring at Tyrion after Tyrion's chat with Sansa. That makes me think the rumors of Tyrion being a traitor are true. Interesting.

Watching Kit Harrington trying to act is like watching my grand dad trying to pass a stone.

Do I see guilt ?

I love Jaime’s arc. Once he was out of King’s Landing and away from the influence of his father and sister he really grew into his own person

Jamie looks so old!

[quote]Jon is going to find out what happens when you fuck with Sansa.

How is Jon fucking with Sansa? She's the one cunting it up when she should be supporting Jon's efforts to SAVE THE FUCKING WORLD. He went south to get the resources they must have if there's going to be any chance of survival for anyone, and he succeeded. Did she think it was all going to come for free? She's turning into Red Cersei before our eyes. It's not a good look.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

[quote]Wait, if no one but Targaryans can ride dragons, and Dany didn't know Jon was actually a Targaryan, wasn't she risking his life in getting him onto a dragon?

It was a clue, however, while it's easier for Valyrians / Targaryens to bond with a dragon and ride it, not all of them are able to do so and not every person that can ride one is a Valyrian or Targaryen. You could also chalk it up to Dany not thinking the Dragon would do something stupid to its mother's boyfriend.

[quote]How is Jon fucking with Sansa? She's the one cunting it up when she should be supporting Jon's efforts to SAVE THE FUCKING WORLD. He went south to get the resources they must have if there's going to be any chance of survival for anyone, and he succeeded. Did she think it was all going to come for free? She's turning into Red Cersei before our eyes. It's not a good look.

You realize the only reason Dany agreed to "save the world" is because Jon was willing to give her the North which also ties into the fact that she is a conqueror and not a Queen? She was most certainly not concerned about the greater good or she would have worked with him without that requirement. Even this past episode she is warning him that Sansa better fall in line or she'd have to act. She has no sense of mercy and killed Sam's parents because they wouldn't kiss her butt. All of those red flags were brought up for a reason and Jon isn't recognizing any of them.

Nothing Sansa said was wrong. She knew Cersei wasn't sending help when Jon foolishly thought she would. She knew that Jon was in love with Dany and that might be clouding his judgement. She knew Dany wouldn't do the same selfless things that Jon was/is willing to do. Most important of all she knew that none of the Northerners would trust Dany. She's not willing to earn anyone's trust at this point.

Jon's biggest mistake will be thinking that Sansa is dumb and even Arya recognizes that she's far from it. She has told him things multiple times which he has ignored and it has come back to bite him in the ass.

I’m totally with you r231. Sansa was bringing up practical matters like provisions and the cost of feeding another fucking army (along with their people)— she’s at least thinking about these things unlike idiot Jon. Dany is proving herself once again to not be fit to rule shit. I hope the show goes somewhere with what they’ve been hinting at for a while now with Dany as villain and doesn’t just let her rule because muh dragoons.

Yes r173, I had to replay it a few times. Love the broken wall and how the NK's forces are advancing into the North. I expect more blue on the edge of Winterfell next show. The credits seems to suggest that something will happen in the crypts of Winterfell and King's landing. I also don't recall a giant dragon head inside of KL, but I guess that can be a metaphor. The band on the gyrosphere shows an active fire breathing dragon.

Are we also throwing away the significance of Tyrion petting a dragon sans Dany around?

For those interested, the actor playing Ser Jorah has been casted as Batman in the Titans show. A good fit.

Do we not have an official Season 8 spoiler free thread?

[quote]Are we also throwing away the significance of Tyrion petting a dragon sans Dany around?

In the books it's hinted that Tyrion might be a Targaryen but on the show the dragons aren't prone to attacking just anyone.

Missandei and the other ladies took care of them just fine. They've also known him for years (as a friend to Dany) and knew that he was trying to help them.

As Tyrion said, “Dragons are intelligent …They have affection for their friends and fury for their enemies. I am their friend."

R233, I don't think there's an entire thread but someone did start one just for that episode.

Wtf is Sam blubbing about? His father hated him, banished him to the Night’s Watch, robbed him of his inheritance, insulted Gilly at the dinner table. Sam’s brother was ok with all that. Sam should be grateful Dany smoked them. Now he’s lord of Tarlyland & rich as hell.

Hot Pie to Arya “You're pretty!”

Gendry to Arya “You look...good.”

Arya “Wtf? I look exactly the same as I did before except I did my hair in the Ned Stark ‘do”

(If anything, she looks worse. The bangs in her previous ‘do disguised her too-short forehead. She has a threehead)

Sam did love his brother. He's crying about his death.

Am I totally misremembering the rescue beyond the wall? Didn't Dany pick up several people with her dragons?

How can Jon Snow be the One True King when he’s so wrong all the time? He fucked up at Castle Black and got stabbed to death. He fucked up in Wildingland and got shot with 3 arrows. He fucked up at Winterfell and had to be rescued by Baelish. He’s fucking a girl who has dragons. What’s does he think is going to happen if he breaks up with her?

Why did Sam love his brother? His brother scoffed at him for not hunting & never showed him any affection. . Both Randyl Tarly & Sam’s brother betrayed the Tyrells. What a bunch of hooey to show Sam all weepy at their deaths. “Boo hood I’m so sad Dany smoked my nasty pa & my hyper masc bro. They were such great guys, and loyal, too.”

What’s with all the elephant talk? Is it just to get a visual of Cersei stomping people to death at Winterfell atop her elephant? You know they’re mentioning elephants for a reason.

His brother was cute. Dickon.

I think Sam is just tender hearted.

There was a different Dickon at the dinner table in season 7

Oops, meant season 6

Heh. Cersei will have Enron Greyjoy killed right after she announces she’s pregnant with his child.

R231 That is the problem with Sansa ...she is too all knowing etc so on. IN the original book series, she is one of the ones that die in the end. Sansa being right all the time is fucking ridiculous and one dimensional. In the book series, her know it all attitude might make her fall. However in the girl power series, Sansa is some brilliant wunderkind who can do no wrong. Very boring if you ask me.

R232 Its too late for all of that. However The Battle of Winterfell will expose many of her character flaws. Like the other characters she has them...except for the perfect Sansa. I despise her more than Cersei now. Cersei is an out and out cunt. Not as bright as she thinks she is. I like that flaw Whereas Sansa is the wonderful angel. She knows more than Bran!

I hope one (or more) of the 'good' main women die- Sansa, Arya, Brienne, Dany, Lyanna Mormont. I think Cersei will be killed, but she's a villain so that's expected.

What I don't want is for most of the men to die but all the women survive. Gag me.

According to the rumors that is what will happen! The girls live the guys die. In the original pitch for the series, Jon,Dany, Bran,Tyrion and Arya survive. The rest of them die. Unfortunately the showrunners and Martin want this to be the girl power show. Sansa is the Rey(of the new shitty SJW Star Wars crap) of this piece. she can do no fucking wrong at all. What an utter bore she is.

That'd be super lame. A few men, a few women survivors. The rest dead.

Where did Sansa suddenly get her smarts from? “Sansa is the smartest person I know,” says Arya, who hasn’t seen or heard from Sansa in years.

Now they’re making Tyrion stupid. He fucked up in Mereen, he’s fucking up by believing Cersei, he’s fucking up with blind devotion to Dany. Where’s Varys? Why doesnt he offer Tyrion some wisdom? Will we ever find out what the voice in the fire answered? He & Melisandre are going to die, so they may as well spill their secrets now. And why hasn’t the Red God punished Melisandre for getting so much wrong and burning the little girl?

Ser Davos — > Joe Biden. He likes little girls (Shireen, Lady Mormont) and big girls, too (Missandre, Dany). And he’s always working for a commander in Chief

R247, I won't disagree. She is a know it all on the series but unlike some of the other characters she spent years on the show being brutalized so she gets away with it now since her "knowledge of the game" has been earned. [italic]She is also the only character who has had intimate experiences with all of the players good and bad.[/italic] So it makes sense she'd know more about Cersei's motivations since she lived with her, when someone is being manipulated or how to manipulate thanks to dealing with Little Finger & Tyrion or dealing with someone who might be insane thanks to dealing with Lysa and Ramsay.

R248, If she has a flaw, it's that she's not a physical fighter. All of the other characters can and Dany has her dragons and Jorah.

Jon Snow will die because he’s such a sad sack. I don’t know why everyone is so devoted to him. He’s a moody depressive. And I don’t like his samurai man bun.

I don’t like the way they dealt with Baelish. They should’ve imprisoned him. Then he could escape and cause more mischief. To just dispose of him like a potato skin was ignominious for such a villain. Though one did get tired of his multi-accented whispery voice and his constant references to how much he loved Catlyn Stark and how Sansa is so much more beautiful than her mother ever was.

Wtf are you talking about r247? Sansa isn’t dead in the books.

[quote]I also don't recall a giant dragon head inside of KL, but I guess that can be a metaphor.

We see them in the vaults last season when Qyburn shows off the giant dragon crossbow to Cersei by shooting one into a dragon’s skull. Robert had them removed from the throne room when he took over.

This may have already been posted: I think the dragons recognize who Jon really is, and they will choose him over Dany when the time comes. Maybe even frying her. Why are the bad guys so hot in GOT?

Euron Greyjoy & Baelish weren’t hot. Nor was Randyl Tarly or The Mountain, the Hound, Tanner, Craster, Locke, Theon, Ramsay or Joffrey

Ramsay was hot as fuckin SHIT.

More ugly bad guys

Walder Frey and his sons

Pyat Pree

Janos Slynt

Meryn Trant

Pycelle

Viserys targarean

Qyburn

Roose Bolton

[quote] hot as fucking SHIT

I don’t think Iweon Rheon is hot. He has a lantern jaw and looks a bit retarded. But I’d you think fucking shit is hot, I guess he seems hot, too

R261 yeah I don't know about all that, but that actor was WAY hot on the show. I'd love to tie up and torture some loser with him.

Samwell's father did more than rob him of his inheritance. He threatened to kill him, as I recall. He was viciously abusive to him, and yes his brother not only co-signed it, but in his timid way he also mocked Sam. Maybe Gilly will remind him, or else, Bran needs to sit down with Sam and tell him WTF happened, and if not then Dany needs to.

She didn't murder anyone. They fought against one another. She asked them more than once to bend the knee. She didn't even resist when Tyrion suggested The Wall as an option. But then Randyll Tarly insisted she couldn't tell him to go to the Wall because she was not his queen. Neither one of the Tarleys went meekly to the slaughter. They were on the wrong side and they chose their own fate in the aftermath of a battle they lost.

Also, remember when Dany first went into the library at Winterfell to meet Sam, he was very friendly and very obsequious. Even though he knew that Jon was Rhaegar's son at that moment, we saw no cunning or duplicity. He was open, friendly and even acknowledged her asking for a pardon because of stealing books from the Citadel.

It was after he was told about his family that he runs crying to Bran who takes advantage of his grief to goad him into telling Jon who he really is, AND encouraging Jon to take primacy instead of Dany. Now Jon has been treated poorly all his life and he seems to have self esteem problems, feeling undeserving of titles, even running away from titles that acknowledge his qualities of leadership.

And he does stupid things. Yes, he went south to get dragon glass and allies. But he seems to not have told anyone anything, kept no one up to date. Did no discussing or strategizing with Davos, until he tells them he pledged to House Targaryen. Unilateral decision, fine, but he should have broken it to them in a better way.

And Dany knew enough about provisions to get pissed off when Jaime took Highgarden, so she had to know Winterfell was being strained. These two. Not very thoughtful are they! And yet Jon did deliver allies and dragon glass, and the North seems churlish, insular and petty, to not realize WTF they face. And that IMO is a plot hole. How can they live in the North for centuries, and not know about White Walkers and the AoD? They knew it was more than old wives' tales. They had to.

last night's episode, those mountains where the dragons where flying with Jon and dragon mommy, are they real? so beautiful.

I don’t like when they change characters for the sake of advancing the plot. Sam’s father and brother hated him. They betrayed the Tyrells. They could’ve bent the knee to Dany....she’s got dragons and they just betrayed Olenna Tyrell. Who were they to get all noble and refuse to kneel after betraying their closest longtime ally?

Now Sam’s all boo hoo hoo over it. The old Sam wouldn’t have cared. He’d have been horrified his family betrayed the Tyrells & threw in with Cersei and the rest of the Lannisters. They had their chance to switch sides yet again, go to the wall, fight the army if the dead, but they had to be pricks about it.

Then Sansa and Arya are suddenky all knowing about Baelish, after he just saved their asses at the Battle of the Bastards. They manage to sneak up in the biggest sneak of all and kill him without his having the slightest idea what was going on? Bish, please.

Sansa suddenly becomes a Mensa Queen, runty little Arya still looks runty, but everyone is telling her she’s pretty. Tyrion has suddenly got mush between his ears after being the smart, savvy survivor through the whole series. Nobody in the North is smart enough to say, “We’ll bend the fucking knee to the lady with the dragons, there’s a war coming, we’ll need dragons & the Starks were always the wardens of the North anyway, not kings. Might as well let Jon be warden in the north and ally with the dragon lady.”

In the Battle of the Bastards, Ramsay imprisoned Rickon, then murders him in front of everyone. Didn’t it get back to Kings Landing that Rickon hadn’t been killed by Theon? Because if Rickon wasn’t dead, it stands to reason that Bran wasn’t dead, either. Jamie Lannister should at least suspect Bran is still alive.

I can’t imagine this new “enlightened” Bran being angry with Jaime, I’m sure he understands it was part of a bigger plan. I think Jaime will face the wrath of everyone else and maybe Brienne saves him

[quote]Euron Greyjoy & Baelish weren’t hot.

Aidan Gillen was cute when he was younger (he's now 50) and had zero problems being completely nude on camera for extended periods of time in his previous work.

I had no clue he was even on QaF.

Sam being upset about his father and brother isn't strange. Yes they weren't particularly nice to him but they were still his family and he always kept trying to impress them/make them like him. Plus it's another example of a Targaryen acting ruthlessly (and possibly a sign of instability).

Sansa always knew about Baelish -- that is the point. She has been the silent witness to everyone being a complete prick and has played everything close to the vest in order to survive.

The thing that makes Arya's acceptance of Sansa's intelligence seem reasonable is that Sansa clearly figured out that the game of thrones was really a game of survival back when Arya thought she was still a believer in fairy tale princes. She started to play to not get killed the moment the mountain killed his horse in the TV show -- while in the books Sansa, like Cersei -- is actually utterly stupid.

Sansa also killed Littlefinger the second she had the upper hand. Same with Ramsey. For her negotiating is all about getting in position to kill her enemies -- while her enemies are trying to kill people so they can get the throne. So Arya and Sansa are similar in that respect. They are not in the game to sit on the throne and kill anyone who stands in the way. They are interested in killing people and will sit on a throne if that is what it takes to get the right people dead.

I don't know if that makes Sansa intelligent but it makes Sansa someone Arya can now respect as intelligent.

Aidan Gillen’s been in so many tv shows he cant keep his accents straight.

Sam’s father threatened to kill Sam & he meant it (and Sam knew it). He told him he would kill him and make it look like an accident if Sam didn’t go to the Wall. Then he insulted Gilly in front of everyone, banished her to the kitchen, said he was going to take her baby from her and told Sam he wasn’t to spend another day in his house.

R270 Aiden Gillen uses his native Irish accent in GoT. He's supposed to be an outsider who rose up the ranks so it fits that he has a different accent to everyone else.

I still don’t get the Nights Watch. All these houses sent their sons to the wall like it was a great honor. Uncle Benjen, Jeor Mormont, a Targaryen and Yohn Royce’s son all go to the wall. But when Jon gets there it’s all thieves, murderers, rapists and black sheep. Yoren whatshisface recruits men for the nights watch from the dungeons in Kings Landing. The bad guys at the wall far outnumber the good guys, so why would families send their sons (like Benjen) there? Yoren himself had to go to the wall because he killed someone. Seems like a mean thing for a good family to send their sons off to this place that’s basically an ice prison

[quote]I don’t like when they change characters for the sake of advancing the plot. Sam’s father and brother hated him.

Sam still loving his dead father and brother is very in character for Sam. His father threatened to kill him and sent him away twice but he did offer to take in Gilly (despite hating wildlings) and put her to work in the kitchen and adopt her son as his grandson. Sam generally does give a shit about other people.

[quote]Who were they to get all noble and refuse to kneel after betraying their closest longtime ally?

Even Tyrion didn't think killing them was a good idea.

[quote]Then Sansa and Arya are suddenky all knowing about Baelish, after he just saved their asses at the Battle of the Bastards. They manage to sneak up in the biggest sneak of all and kill him without his having the slightest idea what was going on? Bish, please.

Baelish saved their asses? It was Sansa who asked him & the army to come despite what Jon wanted. That was after he manipulated and then killed her aunt and gave her to Ramsay Bolton to rape her nightly.

She knew him too well and was done with him once he tried to get her and Arya to turn on each other. He got too cocky and didn't think that she was paying attention while she was using his love for her to get what she wanted just like he taught her.

[quote]Nobody in the North is smart enough to say, “We’ll bend the fucking knee to the lady with the dragons, there’s a war coming, we’ll need dragons & the Starks were always the wardens of the North anyway, not kings. Might as well let Jon be warden in the north and ally with the dragon lady.”

They chose Jon but they really wanted to choose Sansa. They also know what her reputation is and know what her father did. He did kill Rickard and Brandon Stark. Even her own people know that she should give them a reason to trust her instead of just flashing her dragons.

Sam knew about Jon's parentage before Jon & Dany arrived at Winterfell. Sam was friendly and acknowledging of Dany, called her "your grace" etc asked for a pardon, and was friendly and just fine with her. Until she told him she executed his father & brother. They he gets ugly-angry and tells Jon to claim his throne. It was inartful of him. He should have thought about it. Why did Bran want him to blurt it out while he was so emotionally overwrought. And I don't blame Dany for a minute. The Tarley father & son were defiant to the end.

Jon needed to be told ASAP. Bran knew that. Who cares if Sam was upset when he told Jon? Jon handled it pretty well.

He might not next episode when he talks to Dany, but at least he knows.

The Tarlys had just killed their allies at Highgarden and stolen all the grain along with the Lannisters. They deserved to be killed.

Agree, R276. Someone needs to tell Samwell that and also needs to tell Jon. War is war and I don't agree with any of the characters who ay Dany is unstable or impulsive wantonly using her dragon power. Tyrion seems to want to build that narrative so he can justify whatever he has up his sleeve. I have a feeling Varys will not be part of it.

The preview makes it look like Dany has put Jaime on trial for killing her crazy bastard father, but she already saw Jaime at King's Landing and it was obvious he was receptive to the case she & Jon were making about fighting the AoD, so why would they have him go all the way to Winterfell just to fuck him up? That's wrong.

Sansa's not stupid in the books, she's young and naive. She's 11 when she betrays her father without understanding the consequences. By the time Petyr Baelish shoves her aunt out the moon door, Sansa's learned to hold her cards close to her chest and started to play the game. Book Sansa hasn't had a chance to become show Sansa yet, but she's clearly on her way there minus Ramsey--who's been married off to someone else.

Book Sansa seems to be nowhere near Winterfell--seems more like Martin planned to keep her at the Eyrie, which is well-positioned to withstand a long-term seige against White Walkers--dragons are pretty much the only force that could take the Eyrie.

I think Martin's original plan was to marry Sansa to Joffrey and have her side with the Lannisters against her own family, but that idea went by the wayside pretty early on.

Someone link to spoilers/rumors for the rest of the season.

There really aren’t any r279. Try the subreddit freefolk.

Tell you what. I'm really upset about Bronn. If you think about it, he could ride into Winterfell tomorrow no questions asked. No one would be surprised or suspicious to see him. Pod, Tyrion, Jaime, even Varys. Anyone who's been around the Lannisters and King's Landing would know him to be one of Tyrion or Jaime's people. The only way to know Bronn is up to no good is for either Tyrion who is suspicious by nature, to discover the crossbow and the gold and question him, or for Bran to tell them. If he ends up killing Jaime I will be SO pissed off.

YOu'd have to go back a few months to find early predictions and "leaks" about Season 8. But Freefolk Reddit is a good place to start. There was some Spanish guy who leaked the plot of Episode 1 and he was right on the money. To the last detail. He leaked it a couple of weeks ago. But much earliest there were plot summaries from all the episodes but no way to verify their credibility.

My problem is the wait. So if they did leak the plot for episode 2, then we wait 2 more weeks to find out about episode three.

So, it’s a given Bran knows everything or can some things happen without him realizing it?

I think he has to focus. Like Sam asked him if he could see something specific ( Did Lyanna Stark marry Rhaegar Targaryen) and he focused on it and he saw it. And of course he is monitoring the Whitewalkers and the AoD. He knew Arya was on her way to King's Landing to kill Cersei, but changed her mind. It's hard to say how it works with him. But he really should have known that Hearth Home wasn't safe for the Umber boy.

[quote]Bran was hardcore staring at Tyrion after Tyrion's chat with Sansa. That makes me think the rumors of Tyrion being a traitor are true. Interesting.

Tyrion a traitor to who? Dany or the North or humanity as a whole?

Thanks r285.

Bran is creepy

Wait....remind me again. Arya says in Braavos “My name is Arya Stark and I’m going home to Winterfell.” Then she sees Hot Pie and says she’s going to Kings Landing. Hot Pie says the Boltons are dead and Jon Snow is king in the north. When did Arya find out the Boltons had taken Winterfell?

Here’s a fake spoiler

The spoilers/rumor indicate several reunions, including a not-so-cheerful one between Theon and Yara. Theon apparently finds Yara as she is a prisoner at the Red Keep in Kings Landing. In typical Theon fashion, he fails to rescue her and is imprisoned alongside her instead.

——-

Fake news

Olenna Tyrell had committed treason and intended the deaths of 1000s by conspiring with the Ellaria Sand and Varys to bring Danaerys Targaryen, her 3 fire-breathing dragons, and tens of thousands of trained killers and savages to invade Westeros all because Olenna Tyrell wanted revenge against Cersei Lannister for taking out her grandson and granddaughter (she didn’t seem to care much for her own son) when defeating the High Sparrow and eliminating all his little sparrows. Olenna Tyrell deserved her fate.

Danaerys Targaryen stands on no higher moral ground than anyone else. They all are playing the game of thrones. And there’s only one rule: You win or you die.

But at least Olenna was witty.

Any characters missing Ep 1 ? Brienne ?

Brienne was next to Pod, behind Sansa, when Dany and Jon arrived.

No doubt she and her damp kickers will be ready and get some dialogue with Jaime next week.

Have an old buddy with access to the scripts. All the seasons scripts i've seen were accurate. 1. Brianne dies in Jamie's arms. 2. Daenerys has twins and dies. Cersei is attacking with her forces at the time. Cersei gets the body of Daenerys and hangs it from Kings Landing wall. 3. Most of the characters(Jon etc) are killed with wild fire at the end. 4. Arya kills Cersei. 5. The Dire Wolves are back 6. Tyrion sits on the throne and helps raise Jon and Daenerys children.

Sounds like BS r295 but I like the sound of that. So Arya is the sole survive Stark?

Yes Arya is the survivor IF this script is accurate.

I hate Jon dying but I want a kind of dark ending.

I only know one take it the bank spoiler — people in the know with NDAs are rightfully terrified of getting caught giving out spoilers — and it contradicts your spoilers, R295.

I too am aware of a plot line that is at odds with r295 involving the Lannisters (won’t say anything more) so nope, not accurate.

Isn’t Bran indebted to Jaime for his power ?

Gah, take it to the bank.

This is 295. You don't have to believe. Just watch.

Why did Bran have to be crippled to become the three eyed raven? He wouldn't have had visions if he hadn't fell?

Are Cassian and Bodhi Rook OK?

You didn’t read the scripts closely enough to realize that “Brianne” and “Jamie” are spelled Brienne and Jaime. And don’t try some autocorrect bullshit excuse.

Brienne is not dying in Jaime's arms. Jaie comes to Winterfell a cripple. He has one hand and it's not his sword hand. Too bad they can't fashion a dragonglass weapon to fit on his stump... But Brienne will probably be the one to save Jaime's life or, he will die "in the arms of the woman I love..." And Hanging Dany's dead body will not facilitate the bittersweet ending we've been promised. It would be horrific. And they will not use Wildfire to blow up King's Landing. Been there, done that.

I think Bran will tell Jaime he forgives him, Jaime will apologize, and the two of them will make peace. Obviously Dany will have other problems like Jaime killing her father. But why now? They already discussed getting together to fight the Dead people. Jaime shows up to help, and she wants to kick his ass?

Jaime should just adopt Bran. He lost his sons

Tyrion allegedly gets executed in the final episode for helping Cersei disguise the Golden Company as Lannister soldiers to attack the Starks and Targaryens. That’s all we really know about the end of the season.

In the end, it will be proved that Jaime arrives at a place of honor in his life, while Tyrion has none. I believe the rumored leak about Tyrion going on trial. I hope Varys doesn't get trapped in the same web. I notice one important thing last night. Ser Jorah. He never leaves Dany's side....except if she's with John. Jorah is her guardian angel. I've read two interviews John Bradley gave after last night's episode and he says Sam sees something cold dark and unstable in Dany and he doesn't trust her to be a good ruler. Made it seem like his opinion was hardened and he wasn't going to change. If true, Jon will have a problem with that. Certain things surprised me in this episode: Bronn getting the commission from Cersei to kill Tyrion and Jaime, and Sam going after Dany for killing his father and brother. That was unexpected.

But what happened to Cassian and Bodhi???? I MUST know!

Jorah will die for Dany. It'll be sad to see him go- he's been there from the start.

Did someone just compare posh dullard Maisie Williams’ character acting skills to that of charismatic wild man Danny Trejo?!

[quote]Sansa is the Rey(of the new shitty SJW Star Wars crap) of this piece.

There's that Russian/alt right shit again. The fuckers are all over this board.

reply 306. Actually I never realized my spellcheck did correct it. Fuck off and suck my cock you bloody cunt!!!

The proof that Emilia Clarke cannot act is in the pudding of her scenes with Kit Harington. Watching those two “act” at each other is a painful, painful experience.

I wonder if, in episode 2 Jon will discover what a swordswoman Arya is. I wonder if Sansa will tell Jon Arya was a trained assassin? When will Tyrion acknowledge Sansa and Arya executed Littlefinger? Man the learning curve is steep. The amount of news people have to catch up on is staggering.

Shoot me. It just came on HBO and I'm watching it...for the third time.

Which epi is the battle ?

Episode 3 is battle of Winterfell

You know, it occurs to me as I watch this for the third time. Dany is swanning around Winterfell in her white fur coat, and while all around her there's activity. People are working, preparing, Sansa and everyone else in the North. Even, if you think of it, Jon. Jon got "elected" King because he worked his ass off, he got down there and fought with his men, side by side, not like Ramsey sitting on his horse watching the battle. If Dany wanted to prove herself deserving of their respect and loyalty, she'd stop talking about how she's the queen, and complaining about Sansa's lack of respect and bending knees, and she'd ask Sansa and everyone else, " what needs to be done, how can I help? They could actually see her DOING something to support them instead of playing with dragons.

Dany has got to be a little crazy from that Targaryen blood running through her.

Dany has zero people skills R321. She had Missandei and Tyrion for that but she stopped listening to them a long time ago.

If Sansa told all the northerners to follow her instead of Dany today they'd all probably do it. They know who she is, what she's been through and how hard she was working when Jon wasn't around to keep them fed. Dany doesn't care that she doesn't have that and that could be a problem.

Sam's point was the Wildings refused to bend the knee and John didn't execute them. But he fails to understand that the Wildings did make peace and work with Jon. The Tarleys refused to accept defeat. Randyll Tarley in particular was bitter and insulting. He kept talking about "his queen" Cersei, and insulted Tyrion, talked about the savages, and the foreign queen, etc. He was daring her to execute him. She might have changed her mind and sent them to the Wall but for Randyl telling her she could not send him to the Wall because she was not his queen and had no authority. I still don't think she was wrong even though some characters in the story and even fans think she "murdered" them, and demonstrated a dangerous coldness. But IMO, if she'd been a man, they would have applauded her resolve. They are really scared of women having power.

The best part was Jon's face ... s-l-o-w-l-y working out how he's related to Dany. Oh, that's not good. Yep, DUDE. You're fucking your *Auntie*!

Awesoome! But it's cool - you can be King and Queen together! Go, along now and sort it out.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

If Dany thinks she gets it bad from the Northerners, recall the looks Missandei and Grey Worm received from the local yokels!

I betcha Theon is going to be among the first to die. He may even get turned into a blue eyed Zombie. His sister hugged him and she's going to drop him off and the timing couldn't be worse. He will be walking right into the mess.

R326 what did she say? My iPad's not letting me watch the video.

[quote]Sam's point was the Wildings refused to bend the knee and John didn't execute them. But he fails to understand that the Wildings did make peace and work with Jon. The Tarleys refused to accept defeat.

You're overlooking one thing and proving Sam's point: The Wildlings didn't immediately make peace and work with Jon. [italic]Jon had to earn their respect.[/italic]

Tyrion wanted to give them a chance to change their mind. Dany wanted an answer now and the rest of the men were scared of Drogon.

So....a thread supposedly about real spoilers that only had them for the first episode.

Disappointing.

Here's a spoiler that's not a spoiler: GoT is fun but it really is populated with quite a few terrible actors especially in lead roles. Kit Harington, Emilia Clarke and Lena Headey hopefully saved up those big salaries because they're not getting anymore big pay day roles after this.

R326 You're an asshole.

R331 Lena is wonderful as Cersei. Lol this thread has the worst comments.

Actually with the exception of the guy who plays Bran, the acting is damned good.

I've been really impressed with Alfie Allen's acting. I've not seen him in anything other than GOT, but he's been great as Theon. And I like Yara as well. They made a good pair.

And Tywin as well. I kind of miss him. He had such a commanding presence even if he said nothing.

I think Kit and Emilia ain't that great. Kit is merely OK. I've seen movies he's been in...terrible actor. Lena was recommended by the Dinklage to play his sister. She's not bad. Dinklage was first to sign on to the gig.

The actress that plays Yara has been all over the place since doing the show. Good for her making the best of this.

Lena and Dinklage are great. Kit and Emilia fit their roles but I'm not sure they can do much of anything else.

Alfie Allen was in au naturel on stage in Equus a few years ago. He was kinda plump back then.

I thought Alfie was pretty good but I guess I've grown weary of his pitiful, hang-dog look and he cries at the blink of an eye. Sniveling is the word. But he has done a consistent and credible performance as his character.

I think Alfie is very good. I wonder how many takes he had to do for those scenes.

Yara is good in Upstart Crow.

John Bradley is pulling out the stops in presenting his character, Samwell Tarley criticizing Dany. I wonder if his vigorous insistence on Jon claiming his birthright marks a turning point in the series regarding Dany's character arc.

I didn't like how Dany tells Jon, "Sansa doesn't like me. I get it. But she better show me respect. I am her queen." That is some shit. She struts in and simply declares she's a fucking queen and people need to bend the knee? Fuck her. Sansa is busy trying to get Winterfell ready for the battle of the survival of the human race, and Jon and Dany are going dragon riding. He seems to not even be involved in planning the defenses of Winterfell.

I think Team Sansa (or anti Dany) will be: Sam, Davos, Gendry, Arya, Theon, Jaime, Podrick and Brienne. It would be interesting if Missandei and/or Greyworm turn on Dany, but I doubt it

Varys will choose the winning side

I want to see Cleganebowl with Mountain vs. Hound and the Hound FINALLY getting even with his psycho brother.

If one Stark has to die, then let it be Sansa. JFC she has ALWAYS gotten on my nerves. Arya on the other hand is badass. The bond she and Jon have - it would be gut-wrenching should one or the other day.

I hope Davos makes it and I hope the red witch shows up again so Davos can kill her.

Sam thinks Dany is total psycho the way she was so offhand with oh yeah, I killed your father and brother. Although why Sam shed tears for them I don’t know, I guess because he’s softhearted, but it’s definitely put Dany on his radar as the crazy daughter of the mad king.

I hope Jamie and Cersei kill each other in the end. After all, she always talks about how they came into the world together and no one else understands them etc.

I always liked Tyrion but I’m starting to think maybe he’s going to have to pay for all the sins of House Lannister.

If Dany (or more likely Jon) decide that the aunt/nephew thing means no more fucking, then please Jesus bring back Daario Naharis.

*that should be should one or the other DIE

I think everyone is gonna die. They fucking deserve it...except one or two.

If Jon breaks up with Dany, she should just fuck Jorah. He's readily available...for now.

Jorah would probably die from happiness if Dany decided to fuck him. He’s been lusting after her for how many seasons now?

[quote]I hope Davos makes it and I hope the red witch shows up again so Davos can kill her.

I don't, she's my favorite character. Who says the gods are "nice." Not on GOT! Melisandre is returning from Volantis with something, some information on how to defeat the WW. Unless Bran already knows and is not telling anyone.

[quote]Sam thinks Dany is total psycho the way she was so offhand with oh yeah, I killed your father and brother. Although why Sam shed tears for them I don’t know, I guess because he’s softhearted, but it’s definitely put Dany on his radar as the crazy daughter of the mad king.

That scene emphasizes how strong family ties are in Westeros, how people [italic] almost always [/italic] side w/their family. Ah...cough, cough....Jamie, Tyrion?

[quote]I hope Jamie and Cersei kill each other in the end. After all, she always talks about how they came into the world together and no one else understands them etc.

I hope so, too. I'm thinking it will be Arya.

[quote]I always liked Tyrion but I’m starting to think maybe he’s going to have to pay for all the sins of House Lannister.

Yep and his own as well.

[quote]If Dany (or more likely Jon) decide that the aunt/nephew thing means no more fucking, then please Jesus bring back Daario Naharis.

Of course, Jon decides on more sex. Why do you think Bran thought it was so important to tell him right away? Yes, please bring back Daario - Jon & Dany have no chemistry. Even the dragons noticed!

Jaime seems pretty over Cersei... Tyrion, however...

A weird theory you never saw coming...

while grrm (Dnd) lay a spiderweb of tracks, so you do not see what happens coming, but it has been foreshadowed.

They just told us that John cannot ride a dragon very well and we know kit is the best actor stunt man for sword/foot fighting there is on the show. Okay, there is another dragon to ride, who will be the third dragon rider? This is important speculation from the books too. I have always thought it was arya, but she also has wicked stunt training. In the books she is called the cat of the canals. Now, i see the other track, SANSA. She is the Dark Horse. She is the dark sister. Cersei called sansa, little dove.

I am just calling this, just in case this happens.

No one wins the throne. The survivors will decide to rule by a senate or council structure.

[quote]Unless Bran already knows and is not telling anyone.

I think Bran has so much information floating through his head that he only spouts something out if he's actively looking for that information or if he runs across it by accident when he overhears a conversation. Like with the knife.

He knew that Jon was Dany's nephew but didn't know his parents were married (and said his last name wasn't Snow it was Sand because of his land of origin) until Sam told him and then he had to go looking through history to confirm it.

I think it was obvious that he was seeing something about Jamie but he won't tell us what it is until some dramatic moment next episode.

[quote] Okay, there is another dragon to ride, who will be the third dragon rider?

You're joking, right?

Antonia Bird's Safe

starring DL fave Aidan Gillen

Sam getting all woo woo over his father and brother is stupud. Given a chance, he knows his father would kill him and his brother wouldn't care (and night even help kill him). He goes off the deep end without even thinking about it for one second. That's not like Sam. Sam knows what war is like. He knows people get killed. He knew his father and brother were dicks. There were the enemy. Sams been evolving as a character who has wisdom and thinks logically. To have him uttterly grief stricken and bent on immediate revenge isn't him at all.

So is Night King Dany's dad, the Mad King?

Sam’s grief seemed quite real to me.

[quote]He knew his father and brother were dicks. There were the enemy. Sams been evolving as a character who has wisdom and thinks logically. To have him uttterly grief stricken and bent on immediate revenge isn't him at all.

Exactly. He didn't fear or hate his father enough that he didn't take Gilly and the baby to his home when they were on the run and needed help. He also told her that his mother and sister were nice. He clearly likes them and they clearly got along with his father and brother.

To be fair: while Sam's father did threaten his life -- he only ended up sending him off to The Wall. Then when he was angry about Gilly being a Wildling, again all he did was send Sam away while offering to do "something" for the baby and Gilly (even if he did only offer to let her work in the kitchen) even making the baby one of his heirs.

So I'd classify the relationship Sam had with him and his brother as "complicated" rather than outright hatred. It made perfect sense he was upset.

I agree with R358. Sam's father told him he would definitely have "a hunting accident" if he didn't go to the Wall. I'd say that was pretty clear. I listened to an interview with John Bradley and he said with them dead there was no hope, no chance of ever repairing those relationships, no chance of them ever knowing Sam would prove them wrong by achieving something important. So even though he was abused and treated cruelly, he was still looking for a way to prove his father wrong. In Sam's case, he survived all the vicious cruelty so he can minimize it.

The one thing I fault Dany for is not showing some compassion for Sam. She could have at least said she was so sorry this caused him such pain. She has rotten people skills. It is clear to all of us, mostly because of how he says it, that Jon Snow hates the fighting and killing, even though he is good at it. He takes no satisfaction in executing people. He was sickened by the fact that first, Olly stuck a knife in him, and then he was forced to execute him.

But again, as R358 pointed out, the character of Samwell Tarley going from shock and grief for his brother and father, to active anger at Dany seemed too extreme to me. I think D&D handled it poorly. Sam had to know his family supported the Tyrells for years. Suddenly his father & brother are Lannister supporters who participate in attacking the Tyrells and destroying their army. The Tyrells were allies of Dany's. There was a battle. What about that does Sam not get? He knows what kind of a person his father is. Did he expect his father to bend the knee and accept defeat at the hands of a woman?

Randyll Tarley chose to die. He was too proud. It was pride. What kind of man throws away land and titles like that.

Sam’s father was a dick and Dany’s father was a dick. Dany can at least agree on that with people while Samwell gets all upset. Good acting, but I didn’t like the writing.

D&D have made mistakes in the past where they changed the characters and their actions. Worst example: Khal Drogo “raping” Dany which never happened in the books. They should follow GRRM more closely for the final season and insert less of D&D.

The so-called Clegane bowl is supposed to end with a mercy killing. Hound puts Mountain out of his misery. He basically kills him after burning him.

Euron dies as intimated by the actor who plays him. Too bad he makes The Mad Queen shine.

There is a trial against Tyrion after NK and Cersei are defeated. Many of the survivors attend it. Jaime,Dany and Jon don't attend the scenes at the Dragonpit trial for Tyrion filmed in Spain. Kit and Nik were in Spain during those scenes but are not in them.......

Tyrion dying would certainly be the 'bittersweet' ending we were promised. He is a fan favorite. I can buy that.

R24 one of the dragons fries sneaky Tyrion for treason.

R365 so Hound lives?

I don't think anyone thought Euron would survive, ha.

Maybe Jon, Jaime, and Dany aren't in the scenes b/c they've already died.

Scenes of Dany putting Jaime on trial have emerged.

What would she be putting him on trial for exactly? Surely there would be others at Winterfell who have a better claim for justice, or has everyone bent the knee to Dany?

Jaime killed her father King Aerys, the Mad King.

If he's put on trial I hope Jaime finally gets to tell the full story of WHY he killed the Mad King. It should serve as a cautionary tale for Dany, but I won't hold my breath. Her ego is out of control.

Perhaps she lets him live (as her father deserved it) and sends him off to kill Cersei.

I love Dany, and I don’t see why her ego is out of control. She’s one of my favorite characters in the books and the show.

There are official shots of Jaime wearing Northern armor, he will be fine. My guess is Brienne capes for him or Sansa astutely points out that she killed Sam’s father for a lesser crime than her father committed, so pot meet kettle

Official image of Jaime

He’s looking good.

Anyway, Dany needs to die.

well Brienne is gonna make sure people know that Jaime is an honorable man, and Jon is going to tell Dany and everyone else that there's plenty of baggage to go a round, but there's no time for that bullshit because the Night King and his AoD is like right down the road. I betcha Lord Glover has blue e yes.....

If Tyrion is executed in the Dragon Pit at a trial and he is roasted, then Dany has to be there to say the magic word: "Dracarys!" I also hear some random rumor that Cersei has the Dragon pit mined with wildfire and that the dragons will set it off and destroy King's Landing. I really hope that is not true. I'm over wildfire, ya know?

R375 He looks like Chuck Norris in that pic.

I'd bet Peter Dinklege is unhappy with how Tyrion has been written. The character became sort of meandering and lost his way.

I hope they don’t do a trial. So boring. People standing around and talking, They need to go full speed balls to the wall with these last episodes.

R368 Supposedly Jon and Dany made the decision to kill Tyrion but don't appear in the Dragonpit/Death scene.

The ending is very girl power. Too inbalanced to be honest.

R377 the wildfire will be a problem. Hound uses it against Mountain then kills him. Bittersweet...between the NK and the wildfire King's Landing is done with. An end to One monarch. The wheel is broken and there will be 7 separate kingdoms. R377

R380, I agree. As Bran would say: “We don’t have any theme for this”, before he proceeds to sit in his chair and stare at things.

I hope that D&D won’t rush through season 8 just to get it over with.

Killing Tyrion is going to piss off a ton of fans. They've really lost the plot with that character. He used to be the most compelling character; at times it seemed like the show centered around him. Now he's been relegated to be yet another Daenerys hanger-on. Any betrayal he commits is just going to be a stupid plot point vs. something that actually makes sense for the character.

I hope all the dragons die, TBH.

I think Dany is going to forgive Jaimie in a very public manner in order to show that she isn't the mad queen in hope of undoing her bad start with Westeros. As soon as everyone is all on board with the savior queen in public, she will discover that Jon is the rightful heir (but unwilling to assume the throne alone) but the zombies will invade and the battle of Winterfell will hit the reset button on everything.

It is also sadly possible that Tyrion's trial is a time travel/warg thing for Bran.

I'm not going to review every comment and hope it's been mentioned before, but all that pussy and no you know what is a big spoiler.

It will be a showdown of the women. The women have gone from subservient or inconsequential players in the beginning to being the real movers and shakers of the kingdom.

I think what will happen is Cersei and Tyrion will be featured in flashback scheming on Dany. That seals Tyrion's fate. In the flashback, Tyrion will assure Cersei Dany can't have kids and her baby will be on the Iron Throne. He will tell Cersei Dany is reckless and anything can happen when she is out there riding her dragons... One thing you have to remember: When Qyburn said to Bronn, That " Queen Cersei had "something else in mind for the Targaryen girl" that struck me as a warning. So I have to wonder if Tyrion was all caught up in that.

Tyrion is going to tell Cersei that Dany is reckless? Did Tyrion hit his head and was he not aware that he was speaking to the most reckless person of all?

The whole “Tyrion is a traitor” angle is hard to believe for me, because it doesn’t make sense within the context of the narrative so far.

I’m not saying that your theory is wrong, it just doesn’t make much sense to me given Tyrion’s character on the show.

Tyrion hasn't been himself since the show got past the books. The show runners do not care for Tyrion as much as GRRM did and they absolutely suck at giving him anything to do.

The last interesting thing he did was free the dragons and since then the show has been all about Jon Snow's destiny.

I don’t understand why Benioff and Weiss were in such a hurry to end GoT. They will never be this successful again.

I'd have to agree that Peter Dinklage must be disappointed in Tyrion's arc on the show. He was one of the smartest characters. Now he just does dumb things over and over. If he flips and betrays Dany in favor of Cersei, that will be yet another stupid decision. Cersei is the most merciless ruler on the show. Dany at least can provide some justification for her actions.

I'm also over Dany and her obsession with bending the knee every five seconds. But she no doubt was raised to believe the Targaryens are the rightful rulers. She thought it was her brother Viserys until she realized she had the true dragon blood. Now she thinks it's her destiny. She's an odd character who wants to free slaves but demands fealty and will kill you if you don't. But that was how Targaryens did it when they first conquered Westeros, so no doubt she's just following her family's roadmap. But why follow the roadmap if you're here to break the wheel? So much contradiction.

Pretty funny people choose now to get all fired up about brutality on GoT. One minute Sam is in the Citadel warning everyone of the cataclysm that’s about it come and running away Friday m the Citadel because he can’t be of use there in the coming apocalypse, the next minute he’s all mopey that Dany executed his nasty assed father & brother. Dany,who had dragons and has fought the dead with Jon beyond the wall, while Sam was wiping bums at the citadel. Sam’s been warning about the dead since season two; he’s been through the wildling attack on the wall; Craster’s Keep; he knows white walkers take babies and now when help arrives in the north he’s all pissed of because Dany executed his TRAITOR father and brother? Olenna Tyrell is dead because of Randyll, Dickon and Jamie.

Fuck Sam

And Jaime is pronounce “Hy-May.” I refuse to use the misspelling of Jamie.

Sam's reaction to question Dany because she executed the assholes in his family is absolutely reasonable. She executed them for acting the way northerners act all the fucking time -- not because they had betrayed Oleanna. He cried because he always cries -- but his tears might just as much been triggered by the fact the queen with the dragons is an idiot as the shock of finding out his house has been eliminated.

The whole decision to recruit Cersie was insanely bad. They GAVE the Night King a dragon for absolutely no reason. If Dany and the dragons and her armies are not going to defeat the zombies Cersei has absolutely nothing to offer that is helpful. The Lannisters are broke and their soldiers are not that special and they don't have a stash of anything known to be useful against ice zombies. The whole plan was mind blowingly impractical and dumb from a writer's POV. No ones really had a reasonable motive to sign up for anything that happened in that episode. It was stupid in a way that made no sense.

Dany is foolish enough that I could see Jon having taken HER above the wall to see the danger where the night king takes out a dragon, etc. That makes sense and would have moved the plot forward. But the need to include Cersei in the zombie presentation just made no sense at all -- not in terms of motive, not in terms of time and not in terms of drama.

I can believe Tyrion will do something traitorous and get executed for it, but I cannot believe he would conspire with Cersei. She has hated him since he was born, he knows this, why the fuck would he go in with her now? Sure he believed she would send an army, but he was wrong. He deserves to be killed if he's dumb enough to plot with her.

I hope D&D don't make him that dumb.

It was Tyrion's brainstorm to go to Cersei with a Zombie. TO "negotiate." And then, when Cersei got up and walked out of them meeting because Jon Snow wouldn't stay in the North and remain neutral, that's when Dany should have made her move. She had all her troops, her dragons, etc, and should have taken the city. Jaime and Cersei would have been their hostages, the city would have been taken, and Euron's fleet destroyed. Done & done.

Yeah, all of a sudden, smart characters are getting stupid and stupid characters are getting smart. That’s no way to end a series. They’ll ruin the whole story. Don’t turn GoT into True Detective.

Why not go now and destroy Enron’s fleet in the middle of the night? If they’re so badly guarded that Theon could free Yara, surely then two dragons could sneak up on the fleet while Euron is sleeping off his drunken fuck and smoke the boats. Dany, Jon & Tyrion must’ve heard Yara & Elyria Sand were captured and brought to Cersei as gifts by Euron. So they must know by now their allies are being attacked by the Kings Landing crew and Cersei went back on her word. Fly by night down to KL and have a BBQ.

Jon, Tyrion and Davos are the ones who told Dany not to attack KL when she wanted to. If she had, KL would be hers, Cersei would be dead, Jamie would take over and the Lannister army would join everyone else at Winterfell.

She didn't have to rain fire on the entire population. All she had to do was march in, with her army and establish martial law. She could have the dragons in reserve to deal with the military. Incisive, just killing enemy soldiers. That fight would've been over in less than 48 hours. Minimum of blood shed. She already took out most of the Lannister army. Euron had not yet gone to Essos for the Gold Company.

R398, Brings up a good point. I know they're focused on the defense of Winterfell, but they ought to be able to multi task. Whenever they have an opportunity they ought to be trying to weaken Cersei. Defense strategy 101 is trust but verify. Varys' ought to have spies in King's Landing telling them whether or not Cersei is up to anything. Euron's arrival with the Gold Company ought to set off all kinds of alarm bells. Once they realize Euron didn't really desert her, and she has a mercenary army, once Jaime confirms that Cersei is hostile not helpful, they ought to send the dragons to torch Euron's fleet,and as much of the Gold Company as they can, in a hit & run raid. That would take all of a few hours for two dragons. Then they can turn their undivided attention to WInterfell & the Night King. Besides, the dragons don't like the cold and they'd eat better too.

Having Sam suddenly become aggressively hostile towards Dany, and having Tyrion become incredibly inept are IMO two major flaws in the way D&D wrote this. It strains credibility, especially Sam. He was very gracious and humble and open to her before she told him that she killed his father & brother. Go back and watch it, where she & Jorah walk in and introduce themselves. And Sam knew...at that moment... that Jon was Aegon Targaryen. So yeah, I g uess I understand his frustration his grief etc. but for him to go from zero to 360 in two seconds, and then have no one try to talk him down, that was just bad writing, IMO. Jon's feeble attempt was derailed when Sam switched gears to tell him about his birth mother and father.

Yeah it’s not like Randyll and Dickon were Ned Stark. They were bannermen who were overthrowing their overlord’s house, like the Karstarks did to the Starks. They got caught. Then they were given a reprieve. Bend the knee and you go free. Ned Stark bent the knee to Joffrey and the Lannisters but was killed anyway. Dany wouldn’t have killed the Tarlys if they didn’t profess open rebellion against her. Dany needs to ally with the north, the Iron Islands and others to kill the white Walkers — she doesn’t have time to fuck around with the Tarlys making trouble. In the end, Jamie agreed to fight with Dany, so the Tarlys were doubly stupid & their treachery was for nothing.

Sam whined that Jon showed mercy. So did Dany. She gave the Tarlys a chance to live, but they were too mean to take it.

So the Stark family line ends with Bran ?

Yes. A lot of the direct bloodlines in these families are close to ending. Tyrells, Starks, Lannisters, Greyjoys

Well, they thought the Targaryen bloodline was ended......

Lady Mormont is carrying on the Mormont blood line

Randyll Tarly was obviously a terrible person. I can’t remember what Dickon was like other than wanting to please his father. Even so, this story isn’t set in modern times where we cut family out of our lives for being toxic. House and family are a much bigger deal so I don’t think it was that crazy for Sam to be upset. It also isn’t just about his dad and brother. Their deaths affect his mother and sister and the future of their name.

Also it wasn’t a matter of bend the knee and go free. Bending the knee would mean submitting to and serving a descendant of the mad king who was bringing the Dothraki (aka savages) into their world. That’s not some small thing for characters like them.

But if Lyanna has children, I’m sure they would have to take the name of their father, right? Or because she’s the head of the house it changes?

Bran most likely won’t have children, same with Tyrion and Jaime, even if they all survive

[quote] Even so, this story isn’t set in modern times where we cut family out of our lives for being toxic.

W

T

F?

What show are you watching?

Tyrion KILLED his father for being toxic. Euron Greyjoy killed his brother. Stannis killed Renly Baratheon (“I saw a shape with your face kill Renly” Brienne tells Stannis). Stannis and his wife burn their daughter alive, Cersei has always wanted to kill Tyrion. Lysa Arryn tried to kill Sansa. Ramsay Bolton killed his father, stepmother and half brother.

Randyll Tarly threatened to kill Sam and he meant it. So Sam hightailed it to the wall to stay alive.

I think you missed a turn somewhere, gurl.

GoT's John Bradley: Sam Holds Sway Over Jon — But Will He Use It?

Euron, who killed his brother Baylin, swore he would kill Yara and Theon. Yara has sworn to kill Euron after Theon rescued her.

This episode did not deliver the satisfaction of the reunions. I thought Sam's reaction was overdone and silly....why not stay and ask Jorah for an explanation? WTF kind of ass walks out like that, in grief, and then immediately tells something like Jon's parentage as a sort of revenge?

And why would Jon listen to Sam at all regarding Dany? Sam is a self-admitted coward and one of my least favorite characters on this show. It makes no sense for Jon to listen to him and not Sansa or someone else with more credibility.

AND with the NK and his army coming north those assholes are looking mighty ungrateful for their dragon saviors. I'm a bit more than disgusted at this writing and directing. Sure, you don't have to like her, but at least acknowledge you're willing to work with her and understand you have no damn choice in the deal. Sansa is still playing the game, after all, and so looks as bad, if not WORSE, than Cersei. I want this bitch to die and soon. I'm sick to death of her simpering bullshit and of the actress who plays her.

I've hated this show since D&D took over. If they turn it into a girl power extravaganza, I'll hate it more. GRRM gets no more of my money or respect after stating he'd let the ending stand if he never finishes the ASOIF series.

I take your point R409 though Excluding Tyrion, all of the people you name were/are insane. Tyrion finally snapped after a lifetime of abuse and major betrayals. I’m not sure he feels justified in the present.

There’s also a difference between them taking those actions within their families and someone else coming along and doing it.

Tyrion had been taking abuse from his father and sister for years and never left them— he only snapped when Tywin was sleeping with the woman he loved and found out she was a spy

Stannis was going to kill his nephew Gendry until Davos freed him. (Davos pointed out to Stannus that Gendry was his own blood).

Craster killed his sons.

Tywin was trying to kill Tyrion. Tywin knew Tyrion didn’t kill Joffrey. It was just an excuse to kill Tyrion. Tywin wasn’t insane. He was just a mean old SOB.

Cersei killed Lancel and Kevan Lannister. She knew they were at the Sept when she blew it up.

The Mountain tried to kill Hound. It’s insinuated the Hound killed at least one parent.

There aren’t a whole lot of families in Westeros who haven’t killed kin. They’re mostly related to each other through marriages anyway.

I mean, again, a list of lunatics plus Tywin who was a monster, but more calculating. But we’re not going to see eye to eye on this. Sam isn’t like any of those people so I don’t think his reaction was odd or out of character.

The Targaryeans were always killing each other.

If Cersei has a son by Jaime, and dies in childbirth, would that be the valonquar? Because her son would also be her brother

Sam didn’t kill his father and brother.

Sams reaction was fine. The problem would be if he continues acting like that.

Most of the people saying his reaction didn’t make sense are probably people who can’t let go of a toxic relationship on their own lives.

I’m just going to post this and then I’ll let it go.

“Kinslaying is a great taboo in Westeros. Any individual who kills a member of their own family is dubbed a kinslayer, and believed to be cursed forever. Many nobles and smallfolk believe this, and thus those who slay their own blood are usually looked down upon or shunned. Across Westeros, in the religions of the old gods, the Faith of the Seven, and even of the Drowned God, men state that "no man is so accursed as the kinslayer" and that "the kinslayer is accursed in the eyes of gods and men".”

Sam is just sensitive. It’s one of the reasons why his father sent him to the wall, because he thought his son was too weak to be the Lord of the House.

R418

No -- Jaime isn't her father so her son isn't her brother.

[quote]Sam whined that Jon showed mercy. So did Dany. She gave the Tarlys a chance to live, but they were too mean to take it.

"Agree to always do what I tell you or I'll kill you - btw you have 5 minutes to decide" isn't that much of a choice.

Tyrion's idea was to give them more time to think about it.

Jon wouldn't have done that and would have probably opted to give them more time. That was Sam's point.

Also as someone else pointed out, NO ONE in the North likes her and they're only agreeing to follow her because of Jon. You can bet your ass they would have pulled the same stunt if she marched in there and demanded fealty.

Sam is fat. So I don’t care for him.

It wasn't crazy for Sam to be upset. I agree. But to go from being open and friendly to Dany and then out of anger deciding to goad Jon into seizing the crown,etc. It was implausible to me. First of all it's obvious to anyone Jon and Dany are a couple. They will probably marry. And rule jointly. So why is Sam trying to divide them? Yes he is pissed abut his family. But he takes that and makes it a political opportunity and that's what I find implausible. I'm not saying this as well as I want to but I hope you get what I mean. If it had been Tormund or Edd who had killed his father & brother how would he have reacted?

Where is Robin ? Will we see him again ?

Don't forget Edmure Tully is responsible for killing his uncle the Blackfish and all the other Tullys who were killed at Riverrun by the Lannister army.

And Khal Drogo killed his brother in law.

[quote]But to go from being open and friendly to Dany and then out of anger deciding to goad Jon into seizing the crown,etc. It was implausible to me.

R426, you forgot the part where [italic]Bran told him that he had to tell him right after he found out about his father and brother[/italic] so he didn't go from one to the other directly.

He wasn't in a rush to tell Jon prior to that. He was happily sitting in the library and avoiding the warriors marching into town rather than pulling Jon aside and explaining.

Bran is obviously playing his own "game" here manipulating events to get a certain outcome and he figured the best time for Jon to get the point would be while Sam was angry.

The only thing Dany missed when Samwell was apprised that she killed his father and brother was one sentence:

My condolences Lord Tarly.

There is a whole lot of complicated GoT in that one sentence and I wish she had said it because she freed him from their burden and elevated him to his proper position.

Dany is a megalomaniac with zero emotional intelligence. She doesn’t care about anyone’s position unless they bend the knee and lick the pussy.

I miss Daario

Do people really not understand that back in those days you either bent the knee or you died or were kept as a prisoner? Sam’s brother and father had a choice and they chose death.

End of story.

That dragon was staring at Jon, like it knows something.

Did you read what you wrote? R434 I don't think you did.

[quote]Do people really not understand that back in those days you either bent the knee

They said no.

[quote] or you died

That they did.

[quote]or were kept as a prisoner? Sam’s brother and father had a choice and they chose death.

They didn't get the option of being kept as prisoner. Other people tried to tell Dany that and she refused to do so.

So no, they got two out of three of your "choices" and THAT is the "End of Story."

R436, you’re right. They didn’t get the prisoner option, but they could have bent the knee to Dany and they refused. They both had no trouble betraying the Tyrells, did they? Dany did the right thing.

I can’t wait for a Dany to die, personally.

I get what you’re saying R426. I guess I just didn’t perceive his reaction in the same way. It didn’t feel like a political power move out of anger to me.

I’ll also say I don’t think Dany was so awful with him. When he was visibly upset she nodded that it was ok for him to leave and I saw understanding in her face. She could have done better as someone pointed out above. But she also didn’t demand he take the knee to prove he was not with his father and brother.

Even if I don’t agree, i do find these conversations fun and interesting.

R437, she only cared that they swore their allegiance to Cersei and NOT her.

Every major character or house has either screwed over someone else or been killed when they didn't. It's the Game of Thrones.

Those playing the game, along with their cohorts, will die (Sam, Hound, Sansa, Dany, Varys, Tyrion, etc.) while those not playing will live (Arya, Gendry, Davos, the NK). Jon is already dead and only alive through magic, so will die when the magic ends....which it has to.

I want Sansa to die a grisly death. She's really annoying. I hope Dany dies a hero, and Jon lives if only to find out he knows a thing or two.

R436, she did offer them to join the Night’s Watch which they also refused. 3 options.

I think Bronn will bring Cerseis' offer to the man who always told him that "no matter what they're paying you, I'll double it". He wants more than a few trunks of gold. I also don't think Tyrion will betray Dany. He's wanted to kill Cersei for too long, and has known she's wanted him dead since his birth, unless a subplot that he was recently kicked in the head by a horse is at work.

[quote]she did offer them to join the Night’s Watch which they also refused. 3 options.

Tyrion suggested the Tarleys be sent to the wall. Before Dany could answer, Dad Tarley said he wouldn’t go to the wall because he didn’t recognize any command of Dany’s. So no, she didn’t offer.

My last post was missing something, its possible that Tyrion could betray both Dany and his sister if he were to land behind Sansa, (stranger alliances have come from this show). Other than that, I don't see him dying because he believed in his beloved sister.

I could definitely see Tyrion getting behind Sansa.

[quote]he knows white walkers take babies and now when help arrives in the north he’s all pissed of because Dany executed his TRAITOR father and brother? Olenna Tyrell is dead because of Randyll, Dickon and Jamie.

Samwell couldn’t give a fuck about his family betraying the Tyrells.

He’s in shock about his vile father and asshole brother because it’s the normal human reaction of a weak man. It’s one of the few character notes the writers got right.

Sam gave up his right to inheritance when he joined the Night's Watch. The title and property pass to whoever his nearest male relative is.

Game of Thrones’ Tyrion was the game’s sharpest player. Now he’s in trouble.

Game of Thrones is more interested in payoffs than actual storytelling

It’s largely gotten rid of second acts in its many storylines, and that’s made it sloppier than ever.

"Sam gave up his right to inheritance when he joined the Night's Watch. The title and property pass to whoever his nearest male relative is."

Is that why Tywin Lannister wanted Jamie to go back to Castle Black as Lord of the manor?

The Night's Watch has effectively been dissolved as their raison d'etre was to watch the Night King.

That ended the end of last season.

Yes. Tywin always wanted Jaime but Jaime was never interested in the domestic life and likes to be busy in military pursuits. When Tyrion married Sansa they were supposed to inherit Casterly Rock but then Joffrey’s death happened. The Lannister line will most likely go extinct.

Thanks for the save, Casterly Rock^^^

Casterly Rock, R451, and yes. Tywin was disgusted that Jamie chose the Kingsguard instead of marrying well, because he needed a Lannister legacy to take over the family keep.

R452, if Tyrion survives he could very well become lord of Casterly Rock, get married, pop out a few kids.

I believe that I read that there is a NAKED fuck scene with Brienne of T and Jaime.

THERE WILL BE LANNISTERS!!!

Tyrion has to be conflicted about Dany, at least, right? He could have just pledge allegiance to her to save his life. Remember, she was going to kill him too. Now, he sees Jon Snow. After evaluating him, Tyrion might be completely behind Jon.

[quote]Tywin was disgusted that Jamie chose the Kingsguard instead of marrying well, because he needed a Lannister legacy to take over the family keep.

Wasn’t Jaime more or less manipulated into joining the KG by Cersei? Tywin was setting up Jaime to marry Lysa Tully and Cersei convinces him the only way out was to join the KG.

Yes, R457, that's accurate, but I don't think that Cersei manipulated him to join the KG. Jaime wanted to be with her - he said there was no other woman for him.

I hope we get to see Tarth this season

Cersei was Tywin’s true heir. She would have been the perfect person to lead after his death but she was born a woman. Now she’s clawed her way to being Queen

Except Tywin was right about Cersei: she's not as smart as she thinks she is.

Something is definitely off about Tyrion. He seems morose and preoccupied. I also think last episode, he seemed sort of at loose ends, not fitting in and not knowing where he belonged. There he was, wandering around with Varys and Davos, when he was probably desperate to hang out with Dany, and find out WTF was going on. He wandered up to see Sansa to have a private chit chat ( you know he was probably sizing her up for manipulation) and she proved to be a lot more formidable than he expected. In a way, Tyrion is as much a manipulator as Littlefinger was. But as he floats around Winterfell, trying to learn what is going on and how he can use it he's finding it harder. Not as smart as he thinks he is. Now if he found out from Cersei that she was waiting on Euron to bring back her new army, and he withheld it, then he is truly fucked. Also I'm finding it hard to believe that Varys has no sources of information in King's Landing anymore. I know Qyburn has taken over his little network, but surely they weren't his only spies. I'd love forBran and Varys to chat.

I wonder now that the wall has been breached if Uncle Benjen can come south to Winterfell. Remember he told Bran and Meera that there was strong magic in the wall that kept even the partial undead (like him) from crossing to the south. It would be good if he could make it to Winterfell in time for the battle. As a Night’s Watch ranger and half deadling, as well as a Stark, his counsel would be very valuable.

Benjen was killed by the army of the dead after he came to Jon's rescue. Remember when Dany flew north to rescue their expedition and Jon fell in the water? Uncle Benjen pulled Jon out, put him on his own horse, and sent him back to the Wall. Then the army mobbed Benjen.

Yeah, Benjen's probably in pieces. Unless someone duct tapes him together, he can't help.

R427 yes. Robin will be back.

[quote]she did offer them to join the Night’s Watch which they also refused. 3 options.

R422, You should take the knee here. That's not what happened. You can easily rewatch the scene.

Tyrion is the one that mentions taking the black/The Wall, putting them in a jail cell and even their betrayal of the Tyrrells.

All she cared about was their allegiance to Cersei and she blows off any other comments / options from anyone else once they tell her they won't bend the knee. Even worse, when Tyrion expects him to be beheaded, she instead decides to burn them alive which is much more brutal.

It's also interesting, when rewatching, that she talks about Cersei's lies about her and then immediately begins to intimidate them with her dragon rather than, again, actually talk to them and earn their trust. They follow her out of fear.

The way Dan and David have written Dany is where the fault lies. The character is too brittle and one dimensional. All she talks about is ruling, and bend the knee and she only showed a human side after her dragon died and she was sitting at Jon's bedside. She was brave and fierce when she rescued them, and she showed vulnerability to Jon. But she has this attitude that is demonstrably lacking in compassion and she seems too consumed with her royal destiny.

Poor Tyrion, the hand of the queen, has been replaced by the hand on the queen's clit.

I think Jon will have to start looking at her with new eyes and see her flaws. Sansa is not wrong about this. One thing is sure.They have set up the possibility for them to rule together. All this time since Vyseris's death, she believed she was the child of Destiny, the Last Targaryen. She's about to find out that she's not only not the last, but she is not the heir to the throne. Will she be willing to r step back, or rule jointly with Jon? Or will she insist on primacy? IMO Jon probably wouldn't care, but he ought to.And what kind of relationship would they have if she took the Iron Throne and forced him to take a back seat just because he loves her? My my.

Sigh. Still no spoilers.

If this series ends with Daeny and Jon both still alive, I will throw the TV out the window.

Considering the stories of the actor who plays Podrick being a douchebag, I haven't been able to see him as a "good guy" anymore. I know that's a rather immature approach to watching. but any time I see him now, I only see "douche"

As Sansa said to Arya- "The lone wolf* dies. The pack** survives"

* Jon ** Sansa, Arya and Bran ie The Starks

Can Jon like Dany not be burned since they are both Targaryens? Trying to burn Jon would certainly be a test to see if he is truly a Targaryen and prove to everyone that he is the heir to the throne and would be very dramatic to see

R474, Jon got a pretty bad burn on his hand when he killed the first wight by throwing a hot lantern at it. I don’t think Jon should attempt to pull a Daenerys. He might end up looking like a rotisserie chicken.

I wonder if the Night King is a Targaryen? He can't be burned either. He can be killed with Valerian steel . And the design he left for the at Last HEarth, with little Ned Umber as a center piece, is very similar to the sigel of House Targaryen. And he is definitely a dragon rider.

R472 stories about him being a douche, please. Is he a douche to fans or on set or what?

The Night King is Brynden Rivers, a bastard Targaryen, which is why the Targaryen sigil keeps popping up.

Brynden Rivers is the Three Eyed Crow.

Not a crow...a raven.....

r475, I believe that Dany became fireproof in the funeral pyre of Kal Drogo. Contrary to blood magic belief, I think is was because the flames were converted to dragon flames by the presence of the hatching dragon eggs. I think that the DRAGONS make people fireproof and all that has to happen is for Rhegal or Drogon to bathe the lovely Jon in dragon flame and reveal a NAKED white haired Aegon Targareon who is now fireproof. I would love to see this done in front of the Lords of the North especially Lyanna Mormont.

Pure speculation.

DRAGONS make people^^^= Dragons make TARGARYENS

R481, Dany was proven fireproof early in Season 1, shortly after she married Drogon. She put one of her dragon eggs on a hearth fire, then took it out with her hands. Her maid rushed over to soothe her burned hands, but she was unburned. When the maid took the hot egg from Dany, the maid's hands were burned. So Dany was fireproof before Drogo's funeral pyre.

R483, even before that. Remember when young Dany stepped into a hot bath?The water was steaming hot, too hot really, but she didn't even notice it. It was before her wedding.Had nothing to do with dragon eggs.

I have a feeling Dany doesn't realize, hasn't figured out what she is or what her role is.I think Daario hit on it inadvertently when he told her she was a conqueror. I think Dany is a warrior. I don't think she is a ruler. Jon is a ruler. Yes he fights bravely, but he sucks at tactics.

R471 Throw it out now! Many will hate how it ends...

The final scene has all the Starks, Dany, the Lannisters, Brienne and the Greyjoys coming together for lunch.

Then it cuts to black.

R411 Pilou already admitted that Euron has an unhappy end . One of the spoiler has him as the KOTSS in the last episode! That would be fun but Weiss and Benioff are two little pussies who are going for the girl power ending.

[quote]The way Dan and David have written Dany is where the fault lies.

R468 the way they’ve written Tyrion sucks as well.

R487

Don't you have a Marvel movie to boycott?

The awful ending is a sure bet for me. The writing is increasingly inconsistent and absurd. I hope Cersei, Dany and Sansa end up with their head in a spike, insufferable cunts the three of them and too power hungry for their own good.

The fact that you're putting Sansa on the same level as Dany and Cersei is seriously suspect R490.

Sansa spent the bulk of her time on the series being tortured by psychopaths, abused or raped.

She's only had one season where someone didn't attempt to kill her ass.

Sansa learned how to play the Game at Cersei's feet, with a masterclass from Littlefinger. She's been right about many things - from Ramsay luring Jon away from his army to trap him, to Cersei's word being worth dog shit, to Littlefinger attempting to turn the Starks on each other the same way he's turned family against family since before season 1 began. She's not a conqueror like Dany nor an egotistical ruler like Cersei - she cares most about the people in general. In that way, you're right, R491. She doesn't belong on the same level as Dany or Cersei. She's in a league all her own.

Important to note that all three women have been abused and dismissed at various times, and those experiences shaped the characters that they have become.

R492, I took issue with R490 referring to Cersei, Dany and Sansa" being "too power hungry for their own good" and that she along with the others deserved to have their "head(s) in [sic] a spike."

I thought it was pretty clear what I referring to R492.

Aaaah, I misinterpreted you, R493, my apologies. One thing I do love about all the women on this show is that they are portrayed as realistic people, flawed like we all are.

And all three of them are still playing the game while the people of Westeros face their greatest threat. They will all die.

You have to play, or you can't win. You either win, or you die.

I think it would suck if all the dragons and direwolves die. They are two of the coolest things about Game of Thrones. The direwolves are all but wiped out now. I've read that Ghost will be back this season and will be part of the showdown at Winterfell. I hope they don't just kill him off quickly. I've also read in fan theories that the dragons must die to balance things if the White Walkers are taken out. I would love at least one dragon to survive. I wonder if the prequels will have dragons? I'm sure they won't have direwolves since supposedly it's difficult and costly to film those scenes.

R494 no. Sansa is little Miss Perfect. She's right every fucking time. It is an annoying and unrealistic portrayal to the nth degree . Hopefully the Sansa gets captured and imprisoned rumor is true. Sansa hasn't seen the possibility of Cersei coming at all.

Okay maybe Sansa is not as bad as those two. If she's so intelligent she should turn Tyrion against Daenerys, she could then sit on the throne easy breezy.

The time for playing is over. This is life or death, not a power struggle for a throne that means nothing. Tyrion Cersei, Sansa, Dany, and their closest associates,, anyone playing, will die.

Dany's vision in the House of the Undead, where the throne room is destroyed and she never touches it says it all. She walks into the other room where what really mattered is there....those she loved and lost in her quest for power.

It makes sense when you know GRRM's politics and this story is his masterpiece of anti-war tomes. He's setting everyone up for a big fat lesson.

"Sansa hasn't seen the possibility of Cersei coming at all."

Not sure which show you're watching, R498.

She doesn't want the throne, R499.

R498 So 6 straight seasons of Sansa being humiliated, imprisoned, stripped, traded and raped wasn’t enough for you? Sansa has seen Cersei coming. She told Tyrion that Cersei isn’t going to help them, meaning Cersei plans to keep herself safe and pick over the pieces of whomever is left after the attack on Winterfell.

Are all the dragons male? Where do dragon eggs come from if they’re all male? From the gods?

I think this season will flop hard. I feel like there will be a gimmicky time jump that manages to be both confusing and maddening, the ending will be vanilla and Dany will reign alongside Jon...

GRRM also has an interest in female characters as well as men and eunuchs. He is also more interested in how power really works compared to the testosterone driven myths and fairy tales about power that overwhelm uncomplicated narratives. Sometimes his lack of an agenda when faced with interest creates a complicated, unexpected, but believable narrative and sometimes it just comes off as meandering. Without his input the tendency to address tropes with an eye to pick them apart for something interesting got dropped and replaced with the very real need to wrap the plot up cohesively. One of the things we now know is that without GRRM, Red Wedding moments aren't going to keep happening. At this point if everyone dies it is the end of the story.

But there was a down side to this. Tyrion stopped being a benign Richard III and became an unimportant exposition spouter. Sansa has survived without magical empowerment. Cersei is just waiting to die and trying with all her might to make us hate her as much as we hated Joffrey.

There is not faux 'girl power' agenda going on.

I understand if you are braving 4chan and reddit to find spoilers for us and reporting in the troll language they use there but it would be appreciated if you made some effort to filter out the worst of it. It sounds really stupid when you say something implying we care if a woman is strong and rate males based on their alpha or cuck status.

This is datalounge. We mostly care if a woman is fat and rate men according to how sexy they are. 4chan is lost without their beloved Stannis while Datalounge is interested in whether crazy, nasty, pasty Ramsey Bolton is fuckable or not. Even though he is dead. It is still worth debating. This issue is more important than whether some message about masculinity is being properly asserted to keep incels happy.

In GRRM’s initial outline for ASOIAF, he said that everything centers around Bran, Jon, Daenerys, Arya, and Tyrion, and that they would be the ones to survive.

I hope that this is still the case, even though he could have changed his mind in the past 20 something years.

Wait--the Podrick actor is a douchebag? Sources, please.

The line is, R500

[quote] "When you play the game of thrones, you win or you die. There is no middle ground."

However, based upon what you're saying: Cersei and Dany are playing.

Olenna, Margery, Ramsey, Little Finger, Robert, Joffrey, and countless others all played and died.

Jon doesn't want to be King but after having being their leader thrust upon him, giving it up, and then finding out he is the rightful heir based on birth, he's going to have to make a decision at some point.

Sansa, Sam, Arya and Tyrion are not playing. They're like Grey Worm and Missendai. They're just there. Both can be manipulative but the game they're playing isn't to sit on the Iron Throne. Their games are based on survival for themselves and their people but neither has shown any inclination that they want to be leader. (At least in Sansa's case people think she should be even if she has no standing.)

R507

He changed his mind. He would never have let the original outline leak if he was still 100% wedded to it.

But originally you could tell which characters he wanted to kill just by the tone he used in his chapters. He doesn't have much use for Sansa or Cersei. He wanted Jon and Arya to have the forbidden love affair. Tyrion is literally in a theater group with an underage midget girl who loves him in spite of greyscale or something. And there is a targaryan in the Golden Company? I can't even imagine how his last two books are supposed to result in anything like last season's 'magic show' zombie in a box sequence.

R509, I said you WIN or you die.

R506 is my hero.

R511, you said,

[quote]Tyrion Cersei, Sansa, Dany, and their closest associates,, anyone playing, will die.

I said they're not all playing.

I have stated my boundaries.

I kind of don’t care anymore.

It’s like a long running sitcom that starts out with a lot of characters but in the later years it whittles down to a core group of a few people doing repetitive stuff.

Sansa, Dany and Cersei were all treated as pawns early on--each is reacting to having been married off and powerless. Cersei becomes literally drunk with power--she's a bitchy alcoholic in the books and an idiot when it comes to managing the kingdom. Definitely the worst of the three. Sansa's just wising up in the books--on to the fact that Littlefinger is a ruthless murderer, but she'll be spared Ramsay Bolton.

Book Dany is more nuanced than show Dany. She stays in Mereen precisely because she wants to learn how to rule, not just conquer. She's idealistic, but ends up having to become more ruthless to deal with the ruthless opposition in Mereen. She makes the same sort of mistakes Jon does--of underestimating the opposition to reforms. The main difference is where they are and--of course--dragons. Book Dany is not ruthless by the end of the fifth book. The "She's a conqueror, not a ruler" strikes me as a D&D shortcut.

Dany does seem to fit the Azor Ahai prophecy--while Jon seems to be the Prince Who Was Promised. They're not actually the same prophecies though people in the books mash them together.

Cersei's a villain, I don't think Dany is, though I think there's a good chance she doesn't have a happily ever after. After all, once she has a kid, Drogo's coming back for her.

Sansa is playing for Queen of the North. She's playing.

One problem I have with Sansa, and I have quite a few, is that she doesn’t seek growth or wisdom as a person, she just learns (very slowly) due to things that are happening to her and people she’s surrounded by.

The way her character is written in the books is even less flattering than the way she’s portrayed on the show, especially since Ramsay is not a big part of her story.

GRRM wanted her to be a villain, different from Cersei or Ramsay, but still someone who’s selfish and betrays her family for her own benefit. Reading the books, it’s easy to tell that GRRM doesn’t have much love for her character. It’s confusing to me that Sansa has this huge fan base. All of the major characters have suffered, yet she’s the one who gets the most credit for being a victim.

Tyrion is not RIchard the #rd. Jon is more like RIchard than Tyrion. Tyrion is more like Buckingham....the question I have is who's Henry Tudor...

I’ve been seeing a lot of Jaime and Sansa arc comparisons on tumblr

Yes, R518, GRRM does like to juxtapose characters arcs. Jamie is redeemed while Sansa becomes deranged. I can see it.

Trauma can be a catalyst for growth or the source of destruction. Being the 'smartest person' doesn't equate to the most honorable or moral.

I don’t see the parallels. Jaime didn’t start off as deranged and that tumblr post looks like shipper wank.

Sansa’s arc has her moving from naïve idealist to a mature woman who can play the game without losing her humanity. Jaime goes from an arrogant cynic and loner to a man with honor who actually has people cares for outside of his awful sister.

A man sleeping with his sister is not deranged? BWWAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

WIthout losing her humanity? No trial for Ramsey....he's dog food now. So humane. And what about LF, her mentor? Was that a trial? Cut his damn throat wasn't too humane, but I guess that's what passes for it with the sadist GRRM and his mythical world.

I think I’m the only one here who likes Sansa. I don’t think she’s deranged or unreasonable at all. The North falls on her shoulders. Bran’s not himself, Arya’s doing her mercenary thing, and Jon’s too busy hanging out at Dany. Yes, they need Dany for the upcoming fight but I think Sansa has every right to be wary. She used to be fooled by beauty and charm but now she knows better

Littlefinger had his chance to defend himself. It just didn't amount to much. Ramsay Bolton was left to the mercy of his hounds--which he'd used to torture his captives. Nothing deranged about the treatment of either one. Sansa knew, firsthand, that Littlefinger was a murderer who'd destroyed her family. She knew, firsthand, that Bolton was a brutal rapist who enjoyed flaying people alive and tormenting them.

Sansa's pragmatic--which is why she's the one talking about how Winterfell's going to feed people during a seige. There's no sign of her being a villain--if anything, I'd say she's more a junior Olenna Tyrell.

I still wonder if, in the books, Martin intends to have her holed up in the Eyrie. He spends a lot of time describing its defenses and how no one's ever been able to overtake it without dragons. The war of White Walkers v. Men is clearly being planned on a much larger scale.

Ah, well, while I haven't given up on Martin publishing The Winds of Winter, I don't expect him to finish the series. Sigh.

I like Sansa.

And anyone who pretends feeding Ramsey to his own dogs wasn't great should really not watch the show. Her smirk was the best.

She is sulky and under powered on Game of Thrones. Her survival alone is an achievement.

I suspect the people who are hating on her here are the dorks who get alarmed when a young woman gets a role in a big budget superhero movie. I don't know if they are paid trolls or brainwashed tools.

[quote]I think I’m the only one here who likes Sansa.

There's literally one person here who has made 8 posts about how much they hate Sansa.

You are not the only who likes her.

I'm not sure how the books dealt with this but there are some very intriguing questions about Bran and his warging abilities. He can get into a living mans head, and he can get into animals heads. Could he cognitively manipulate any persons actions? Does that mean he could warg into a dragon? Is his warging ability limited to the living?

We don't really know because Bran is still learning how to manage and understanding the scope of his abilities. It's an interesting theory.

Sansa is the dark horse of the series, to take power. In the books Sansa is an unreliable narrator. Book readers speculate that she was involved in Joffery's poisoning. The show has done everything to keep that speculation alive. Jon would be dead if it was not for her.

[quote]Book readers speculate that she was involved in Joffery's poisoning. The show has done everything to keep that speculation alive.

Didn't Olenna confess to poisoning Joffrey last season right before she died? She also implied to Margaery after the wedding that she took him out. She said, "You don't think I'd let you marry that beast, do you?"

Maybe in the books, it'll be revealed that Sansa poisoned him, but in terms of the show, I think the speculation has been laid to rest pretty conclusively that Olenna was the culprit.

Yup. Show Sansa had nothing to do with Jeffrey's poisoning.

R511 didn't say that, R512, I did, and yes, there are many more Sansa haters here than you realize.

Trolldar is great for seeing who posted what.

So many forget how easily she betrayed her family to remain as a contender for QUEEN. Girl has not lost her ambitions and her sneaky conversations with the Lords of the North reveal her character. No, she's not changed all that much. She has no mercy....that's what everyone is claiming for Cersei.

What has she done to help in the war against the dead but keep Winterfell fed and alive for the dead meat army. Rather than play the game, she should have been prepping the North to accept Dany, if only while they fight the NK. To play this game while the Army of the dead marches towards Winterfell is telling. I hope she's more meat for the dead army.

I haven't actually watched the TV show officially. (only clips i see on youtube) I read the books and was 100% sure Oleanna killed Joffrey.

Of course Olenna killed Joffrey! "Tell Cersei. I want her to know it was me!"

I 've enjoyed watching Arya's character arc, but I haven't been as warm towards her since season 7. IMO the way D&D wrote the interaction between the sisters, just didn't work for me. I think there was a scene missing. I'm not sure if they actually shot such a scene but they could have, should have.

I'm talking about a scene with Bran. It would have been so simple. Bran sitting in his room, the door cracked open, Sansa and Arya walk in and he says, "Close the door. We need to talk about Littlefinger." End of scene.

I get it. They wanted the dramatic tension and element of surprise of having LF charged at the assembly. Little finger clearly thinks Sansa is going to try Arya, but then she says his name. But a lot of people either thought Sansa and Arya were truly enemies, or were putting on an act earlier when they were being angry with one another. I don't know it just didn't flow as organically as it could have.

The Arya/Sansa feud and Sansa's realisation of Littlefinger's machinations were easy to follow; it didn't need the handholding of Bran scene to guide Aspie viewers. Nonetheless, it didn't flow well and Arya's hostility towards Sansa and Sansa's bitterness towards Arya were things that would have been settled up with 2 or 3 lines of dialogue each that in most circumstances people would say in a "it's been years, Sister. Tell me your story" way. Without the guidance of GRRM's long repetitive and overwritten scenes to draw from, D&D are at a loss with regards to dialogue and creating expository scenes.

All I can say is thank GOD that Confederate show isn't happening.

R532 They really pushed the misdirection for the audience in order to try to pretend there was genuine suspense and that Littlefinger's death was a shocking reversal.

I think the way it failed is a perfect example of the difference between how GRRM set up his terrible betrayals and 'oh shit' moments and how the show runners interpreted his ability to make you believe that the inevitable really just isn't going to happen. No one felt we needed any extra scenes to explain WHY Oleanna poisoned Joffrey or when exactly she decided to use Sansa and Tyrion to actually administer the poison because her motives and her opinion that Cersei's hate for Tyrian was a weakness to be exploited (rather than a character flaw that deserved punishment - as Oberon thought) were laid out with clarity very early on. Sansa and Arya believing that Starks stick together really has not been illustrated in any interesting way. They failed because they didn't really allow the misdirect to be a question of whether Sansa genuinely felt she was in position to entrap Littlefinger or not. They just didn't know how to set up her 'worm turns' moment -- especially after she had already delivered her smirk as Ramsey's dogs ate him.

And that is fine. A lot of characters just need to die at this point.

Thanks R534. Good analysis.

Oh Oberyn. I miss that sexy bastard.

R353 ??? I'll have some of what you're smoking.

R501 you must be watching an alternate earth version of the show. Sansa clearly stated that Cersei is not coming. Watch the right show THEN comment.

R522 The problem with Sansa is that she has become much too flawless. Whereas every other characters has a chink in their armor. If Sansa is kidnapped by Cersei it would be an interesting move. Seeing both of them trying to out Queen each other would make for some interesting dialogue.

every other character.

It’s interesting that everyone has to love Sansa, and if you dare to dislike her character it’s because you hate all women! Even if you like Arya, Daenerys, Brienne, etc.

Yes, I have disliked her character from the beginning and nothing has changed my mind.

I don't really care about who lives or dies among the humans but I want those dragons and Ghost to survive.

R542, I do agree with you, but knowing it’s GOT, they will probably all die.

If Dany winds up as queen, she can order Sansa to marry anyone that Dany wants. Jon would never do that to Sansa, but Dany is an unknown quantity. It's no wonder that Sansa is giving Dany the side eye.

R544, you really think that’s the reason? They don’t even know if they will survive the WW attack, if Daenerys will end up on the iron throne, and Sansa is worried about her possible future husband?

Makes no sense.

Ghost for the Iron Throne.

Nymeria can be his Hand of the King

[quote]Trolldar is great for seeing who posted what.

What are you talking about? Trolldar used to be a function where you could click on a post and see all the posts that poster made. It no longer exists.

How do you recreate "trolldar"?

Arya’s story is ridiculous. She’s a little girl who trains to be an assassin, but she doesn’t seem to assassinate the people she’s supposed to kill. She kills other people instead, people she’s not supposed to kill. She goes around stealing faces when it’s forbidden. She gets stabbed 100 times by The Waif, falls into filthy water and recovers after Miss Fisher puts a bandage on her. Then she kills the Waif despite the Waif beating the crap out of her all the time because Arya is so ill prepared. Then she goes and tells Jaqen she’s not nobody - she’s somebody and she’s leaving. People who trained to be assassins aren’t allowed to leave the many faced god, but he lets her go. Then she starts murdering people using other faces. Where did she get the faces? Did she steal them? The many faced god isn’t supposed to allow that, but she just waltzes around like some samurai when she’s never proven herself able to do much except water dance.

Jaqen starts out as a cool character, but he’s just a creepy guy who kills people for money and it’s not as if the people he kills are bad people. Miss Fisher wasn’t bad - a jealous cast member wanted her part, so she paid to have Miss Fisher (Babadook) killed. That’s not cool at all. Killing people who are good at their jobs in order for incompetent people to take their places? That sucks. The many faced god is like Donald Trump. He’ll do anything for money.

When Jon rode off, he left Sansa with all the power and all the headaches. When Jon gave away his crown, he made Sansa a potential pawn again. If they all get killed by the Night King, Sansa doesn't have to worry about a future, game over. But what if they survive? Previously, Baelish told Sansa to think through all possible outcomes. Well, now a possible outcome is that some woman she doesn't know can totally fuck up Sansa's future and her family's safety, on a whim.

R547

You recreate trolldar by ignoring a poster and then clicking on the 'ignored' option on the menu at the top of the page. You can then see the posts that you made disappear when you ignored the user.

There is probably more to it that I haven't figured out involving trolls deleting cookies -- but this is what trolldar has become.

[quote]The problem with Sansa is that she has become much too flawless. Whereas every other characters has a chink in their armor.

Much too flawless? You have people complaining that Tyrion is being "written poorly" because he trusted that Cersei would send an army. Why? Because up until now he's always been right.

Sansa was nothing but flawed for years and now that she's good at manipulating people for a season or two she's, "Much too flawless!"

[quote]If Sansa is kidnapped by Cersei it would be an interesting move. Seeing both of them trying to out Queen each other would make for some interesting dialogue.

Sansa doesn't want to be Queen! All she wanted to do at first was be a Lady and she saw how horrible that turned out 3 times. Now we have no clue what she wants other than to survive and make sure Winterfell does as well.

[quote] Where did she get the faces? Did she steal them?

R548 Yes. She actually has a bag of faces that Sansa discovered and she worked with the Faceless Men a long time they just compressed it so it didn't appear to be as long. I almost forgot that until you brought it up.

R551 Sansa has become too much of a know it all. That is very boring. We know she was a naive girl who became a savvy woman. That is a a fair accompli. Sansa doesn't want to become queen,? How do you definitely know that? In her more naive days she wanted to be Joffrey's queen There is nothing to say that wouldn't become Queen of the North when the war is over.

Tyrion has been flawless...when? Killing Tywin was a dumb and implusive move. After his involvement with Dany not taking over King's Landing was a mistake. Now he's always looked out for his family.....bullshit.

Tyrion killed Tywin in the books. Joffrey's treatment of Sansa pretty much cured her of wanting to be Queen. She was interested in being Lady of Highgarden for about 2 seconds, but that's about it.

When Joffrey declared Margarey to be Queen instead of Sansa, Sansa kept a straight face until she walked out of the throne room, grinning.

Sansa has become a bit more like Littlefinger and Varys. She's stated that she's a slow learner, but she's learned. She's been around insane and power-hungry types (Cersei, Ramsay Bolton) and the schemers (Littlefinger). She took lessons from them all, especially Littlefinger, but Sansa has a conscience and the Stark family and the North are what matters to her most. I think she probably wants to be Lady of Winterfell, but I doubt she wants to be queen. She survived. Becoming queen would lower those chances given what she's seen. Sansa prefers to watch from the wings, strategize, think a few steps ahead of her enemies, and use the element of surprise to take them down.

Sansa could end up as Queen of The North in the end or the Lady of Winterfell. It would be a stretch if she rules the Seven Kingdoms at this point.

I think that Sansa is quite different than Littlefinger and Varys and Cersei and so forth because Sansa is one of the few characters who genuinely seems to realize she could be killed at any moment. Everyone else in the show genuinely behave as if people aren't getting killed left and right, secure in the idea that THEY are not subject to the same rules they use against others. Sansa behaves as if she knows she is living on borrowed time because she is surrounded by monsters.

And the actress is responsible for a lot of that. Her ability to project resting teenage bitch face, a spoiled sulk AND that sickened 'I'm genuinely liable to get murdered now' regret has elevated the character. And she did it while making her seem like a petulant teenage whiner. Sansa's tendency to cling to evil people she knew rather than trust in good potential saviors offered her in the books was written as terrible judgement -- but it played out as well earned teenage nihilism in the TV show. And now she seems smart simply because she appears to think that everybody is horrible and their taste in music is shite. In her world she is correct, not moody.

I distinctly remember a conversation Sansa and Jon had in Season 7 about Cersei. Sansa was worried about what Cersei could do, and Jon was more preoccupied with the Night King. He pointed out that the Lannister armies had never come North, that they were separated from Cersei by more than 1,000 miles, and the Night King was right around the corner. it was the conversation where Jon said,"You sound as if you admire her(Cersei) "

As someone who dislikes Sansa’s character, I have to say that I have always loved Sophie Turner’s performance.

I think one reason why (show) Sansa has this huge fan base is mostly because of Ramsay and all the bike things he put her through. That doesn’t happen in the books, since Ramsay marries Jeyne Poole, and Sansa wasn’t that nice to her in the books either.

Here's that scene R558.

They're both right in that scene and it demonstrated the problem they have currently in their relationship. He doesn't take her seriously even if she does make sense.

He's right that the Night King is a pressing problem. She's right (and keep in mind that back then the Wall was still up) that Cersei doesn't stop until she destroys her enemies. He's saying he actually has seen the Night King and she's saying that she actually knows Cersei so it doesn't matter how many miles are between them, "Everyone who's crossed her, she's found a way to murder."

Her response, "I learned a great deal from her" speaks volumes. She didn't say she didn't admire her but I think she was saying she thinks it's admirable Cersei doesn't give up. After looking at the comments on the video, one commenter brought up a good point. It did seem like Cersei "liked" Sansa in her own twisted way because it seemed like she saw a lot of herself in her.

Sansa, Arya and Bran will pull some fucked up shit to take the Iron Throne. Jon Snow better get in line.

R560 Sansa herself will find out about Cersei even more than she bargained for.

R561 No. Bran(who is not Bran anymore) is puppeting things. Don't look too much into one second of a scene with Arya and Jon (the rightful heir).

R558 Let's see The Night King is ready to destroy the fucking North and everybody in it BUT brilliant Sansa is still worried about Cersei! The showrunners didn't give Sansa a plan as a just in case scenario have they now? What shitty writing.

R563, To be fair the wall was still up protecting them and there was no "ice dragon" to destroy it yet.

At the time it made sense that she'd be more worried about Cersei. Both of them are problems.

There were all kinds of rumors going around that Cersei would kidnap Dany or Sansa and lure Jon down to King's Landing to free them, then kill Jon, Dany and Sansa. That was a rumor. No reason to believe it. Although I do have some concern about that weasel Qyburn. Remember when he gave Bronn the cross bow? Bronn first thought Qyburn was giving him a commission to go North and kill Dany. But Qyburn said no, the queen had "other plans" for the Targaryen girl. That seemed pretty scary to me.

R564 Have you been watching the show? The so-called good guys were willing to stop hostiles with Cersei and Company to fight The Night King. That is how important that menace is perceived. Yes Cersei is playing them BUT The Night King is a fucking nightmare. Poor Cersei will be shitting a brick when The Night King gets to King's Landing. All knowing Sansa doesn't know shit about him.

hostilities with The Night King

The so-called good guys were willing to stop hostilities with Cersei and Company to fight The Night King.

yes, R568 they w ere. And that's where Tyrion and Dany made their mistake. IMO. Because she had all her troops and dragons there and when Cersei walked out that first time she should have just taken King's Landing. Minimum of bloodshed.Surgical strike.

[quote]The so-called good guys were willing to stop hostilities with Cersei and Company to fight The Night King.

R568, R566 - Yes, I was watching the show but I don't think you were.

It was Jon's idea to ask Cersei for help. Bringing her proof that the White Walkers were real led to Viserion's death and possession which allowed the Night King to destroy the wall.

She decided, even after seeing the White Walkers were real, she didn't care because she had other plans now that she'd finally seen Dany and the Dragons.

It was Tyrion's idea to ask for a truce and he snuck inside to speak with her. She agreed and then .... made it clear to Jamie that she was lying.

It was her plan all along to hire soldiers to wait until the White Walkers weakened the North, and just when they thought they were safe she was going to send in the Golden Company soldiers to take it.

Had they actually taken Sansa seriously they would have gone into King's Landing, like R569 said and took Cersei out. So now even if they survive the White Walkers and Night King she's still coming to kill them all.

Furthermore, if they had of done this then not only would she not be a threat but the Wall would still be up and the fricking Ice Dragon wouldn't exist!

Part II

https://www.datalounge.com/thread/23665365-game-of-thrones-spoilers-part-ii

Part II

https://www.datalounge.com/thread/23665365

Part 2

R571 WTF? You still don't get it. You seem to be writing too many fan fiction "what if" scenarios. So tell me.....in what fucking episode did Sansa have a detailed plan to take out Cersei AND then The Night King(and for that matter his entire army)? What was her tactical military plan to achieve that objective? The show runners didn't give the genius Sansa one. Perhaps it would have better for the show to have Jon and Dany take over King's Landing THEN fight the war with The Night King. However Benioff and Weiss made a mess of it. Now they can add in Tyrion's betrayal, the destruction of Winterfell and Cersei's involvement in the aftermath of The battle for Winterfell. They probably see a literary goldmine in this mess.

BTW all of this has happened was the result of extensive meetings with George RR Martin for the ending. So I can't blame the two showrunners alone.

R574, Getting angry, baby? I get it just fine.

[quote] So tell me.....in what fucking episode did Sansa have a detailed plan to take out Cersei AND then The Night King(and for that matter his entire army)?

We never got to that point because Jon decided for everyone what they would do before anyone got to discuss it other than her saying this is probably a problem we should look at. It was a single damn scene and then he was off!

[quote]Perhaps it would have better for the show to have Jon and Dany take over King's Landing THEN fight the war with The Night King

Perhaps it would have! But we'll never know but like me, you're at least open to the idea that it may have been a better idea. However, we know what happened as a result of the idea that they went with because it was actually on screen!

[quote]However Benioff and Weiss made a mess of it. Now they can add in Tyrion's betrayal, the destruction of Winterfell and Cersei's involvement in the aftermath of The battle for Winterfell. They probably see a literary goldmine in this mess. BTW all of this has happened was the result of extensive meetings with George RR Martin for the ending. So I can't blame the two showrunners alone.

See, this is the problem. I don't care about all of this "behind the scenes" shit with the books and writers discussions. None of that changes what was already put out there.

I'm only talking about things that they actually did, the results of what they did and the logical conclusions you can draw based upon what they didn't do.

You're over here like, ARE YOU WRITING FAN FIC WHAT IF SCENARIOS!?!? While also being angry that what's physically on the screen isn't what you think should be there based upon your own perceptions of what the writers should have written and what George allegedly wanted to do. While also going, "Perhaps it would have been better for the show to have Jon and Dany take over King's Landing ..." which is what I said based upon what happened ON SCREEN since they didn't!

Good grief!

I thought Tyrion planted the seed of asking for a truce. All Jon said was that he could get a zombie for them. He said Cersei would listen to Jaime. So he went with Davos to KL to secretly meet with Jaime to propose a truce so they could deal with the AoD. And Tyrion said they'd need to show her proof. All Sansa did was tell Jon not to underestimate Cersei or to forget about her. Jon & Sansa were both dealing with the worlds they were familiar with as was pointed out up thread.Sansa was completely familiar with the threat from King's Landing/Cersei, and Jon was completely familiar with the threat of the AoD. At some point over the last five episodes both of them will realize they were both right. Sansa will see the threat of the NK, Jon will see the threat of Cersei. As this story winds to a close I can see Dany being secondary. Yes, she's the Targaryen with the dragons and the armies. But from a plot perspective, the key players are Jon & Cersei.

Arya should have killed Cersei promptly. But hindsight and all that.

This thread should be called "Game of Thrones - half-baked theories" rather than "Spoilers."

Well, R578, it's because HBO has done well to keep a lid on things. There was the Episode 1 plot leak on Reddit last week that turned out to be accurate. Last year, Season 7's plot had been pretty much leaked the whole year and even episodes were leaked online. So far, I've been impressed with HBO's lockdown of this season. So far, that is. We'll see if it keeps up.

R577 It would have been better to have finished the Cersei storyline last season and then have the final season with everyone against the Night King. This has become too much of a jumbled mess.

R576 Jon has a meeting with Cersei sometime in Season 8. In the dragon flying over KL in Bran's visions,is that Jon going to KL to rescue Sansa?

I don’t see Sansa getting kidnapped, nor Dany.

That link points out the the director David Nutter was on set, and we know he directed episodes 1,2 & 4. I can see after the Battle of Winterfell in ep 4 Jon seeking out Cersei since they lose Winterfell and are pushing south to survive.

R580, I disagree. I think they needed a second plotline, because it would have pretty boring to deal with family bickering and zombies for almost 8 hours.

I also don't think major characters will die in episode 3. I'm predicting that Tormund, Beric, Bronn and possibly Grey Worm and Podrick die in #3, maybe even Theon. (I hope they let Davos live!) But Jaime, Jon, Dany, Sansa, Arya, Brienne, Missandei, Ser Jorah, Gendry, Varys and Tyrion survive. Oh, and Sam & Gilly and Little Sam, and Bran survive. The Battle for Winterfell is going to be huge. IT will be awesome, but it won't be the only battle. I think one more, in Episode 5 at King's Landing will happen. I think Jon goes to KL to arrest Cersei. and take away her power aftershe's defeated. Except Cersei always has something up her sleeve. Please don't let it be wildfire.

Episode 5 which supposedly takes place in Kings Landing is, like Episode 3, directed by GoT's best director, the great Miguel Sapochnik. I expect some serious shit to go down in Kings Landing. If Sansa is kidnapped and brought to Cersei, I pray that they don't write Sansa as being all scared. She needs to be the Sansa we saw last week; the Sansa we saw talking smack to Ramsey Bolton pre-battle. I want her to totally stand up to Cersei; looking not afraid for one second.

I really do believe Episode 5 is Dany going crazy like her dad and finishing what he started to do; use her dragon(s) to totally fuck up Kings Landing. Arya needs to be the one that kills Cersei.

Jaime will be the one who kills Cersei and it will be some sort of mercy killing--there's no irony to Arya killing Cersei--it's just another name on her list. Though, I possible that they both do it--Arya kills her and Cersei becomes one of the living dead or white walker, done in finally by Jaime.

But there's been way too much invested in the Jaime/Cersei storyline for him not to be involved in her death.

You must be fun at parties R578.

Cersei is waiting for the north to get decimated by the white walkers. Her army will kill the northerners who come south looking for refuge. She thinks she’s safe in Kings Landing with her wine, the food from the Reach/Highgarden and her bodyguard the Mountain. Maybe she and qyburn have some green fire left. She thinks she’s very smart.

I agree that Jaime will kill Cersei, being killed by him would be the worst way to go for her and it’s the only way he can truly be free from her. I do like the idea that she turns into a white walker.

Also, the witche’s prophecy said 3 of Cersei’s children will die... so I’m assuming the baby she’s pregnant with now will be fine?

We're forgetting about THeon. He is heading North to join Jon ansa and the rest to help fight the Whitewalkers. Thanks to Yara, he knows Euron hasarrivedin King's Landing with the Gold Company and that Cersei and Euron plan to attack the survivors of the Winterfell BAttle. So Theon Bran and Jaime all know what's coming. If Tyrion knows and Bran busts him about it he is toast. The thing is, Jaime will very likely be dead by the time Tyrion goes on trial if the rumors are true. I just can't see Jaime not trying to save Tyrion no matter what.

Ugh, I hope that rumor about Tyrion secretly working with Cersei isn’t true. It just doesn’t seem like something the Tyrion we’ve seen throughout the show would do. It would be pretty crazy if JAIME was the outlier of the family

R590, Tyrion seems to have a huge ego and he really loves being the politician, negotiating, making deals, punishing people, e tc. He believes himself to be the smartest guy in the room, and he's an operator. I can see him pulling something like that. Because he has always craved his family's approval. He also felt competitive with his father.

R588, Cersei becoming the queen of the Night King was something Tom and Lorenzo suggested a couple of years ago and it's always been a bit of speculation that made a bit of sense to me--she's become more and more of a power-mad monster and the whole Night King mythos involves the coupling of a human and female white walker at Dread Fort. Also, the book's version of Maggy's prophecy--the Valonquar will wrap *his* hands around "your pale, white throat and choke the life from you."

So "valanquar" may be gender neutral, but "his" is not. The emphasis on the throat being pale and white is interesting--why is it there?

Cersei's already had three children--Joffrey who's poisoned, Myrcella (poisoned by the Sand Snakes) and Tommen (kills himself by jumping.) She won't have a fourth as Maggy the Frog's prophecy has, so far, been one of the most accurate in the books.

You know what? Cersei has been such a nasty, evil POS that I don't want to see anything less than her total downfall and destruction. Of all the villains and the evil people she is the worst.

One more thing: I don't want to see any cheap tricks in the final episodes either, with D&D "kidnapping" a principal character like Dany or Sansa or Bran or WTF ever, and then Jon and the gang rushing to King's Landing to rescue them. That would be such a cheap tactic to employ. And then trot out the wildfire to blow everything up...again...

What if Cersei privately told Tyrion that if Dany came for the city, she would blow up the entire city like she blew up the Sept? Just like the mad king had planned. What would Tyrion do to prevent that from happening?

R594, I don't see her telling him that. She would just do it. Funnily enough, I could see Qyburn telling someone about it. If he knew Cersei was a loser, I don't think he would want to go down in flames with her. He'd want to survive.

We need a new thread!

Done

Moving on

as this thread is

Closed