AOC/OMG/WTF: Will Democracy revive itself and lurch back to WOKE?

Fuck this assface.

He's consistently wrong.

Nate manages to beat broken clocks by being wrong 24 hours a day.

I like AOC but I do not see her being the candidate in 2028. She hasn’t even been able to keep her own district from swinging redder. And she needs to detach herself from Bernie or she’s getting nowhere with the base.

Sorry, OP, you lost me at:

[quote]Nate thinks

Nate’s map for the general last November was spot on, r1.

So ugly. So unfuckable.

So he wants the Democrats to risk a loss when 2028 should be an easy win?

She has a persecution complex and she's an emotional reactor; she is not a leader. People turn off when someone starts crying and/or yelling. I don't want to hear that from the average citizen much less the leader of the free world.

I've always believed she and Trump are two sides of the same coin. I could actually believe that old doorman rumor about Trump impregnating the help because I'd swear she's Trump's illegitimate child. Whine, whine, whine.

Ahh, you poor, naive citizens.

Believing there will be a nationwide election held in 2028. LOL!!

Any choice is completely moronic at this point. Who the fuck knows? is the only correct answer.

Ahh, you poor naive POTUS, R8. Believing your ass will still be upright in 2028. LOL!!

I fear the DEMS would lose then.

I understand the hype — our side is desperate for an effective public communicator after that was such a weak spot for Biden. AOC is gifted in that respect.

But if we study the actual electorate in the battleground states, understand what they are saying in all the polling data… it’s difficult to imagine Ocasio-Cortez winning Michigan or Georgia or Pennsylvania or Wisconsin against her GOP opponent. Even if that’s the execrable JD Vance.

I hope she stays in the House and becomes one of the stronger House leaders to pull us up out of where we’ll be in January 2029.

AOC’s abrasive personality might read as shrill to Dataloungers and the centrist sea slugs of the DNC, but to most young people, it comes across as authentic. She's the antithesis of the Kamalabot.

Then we are doomed.

highly doubt it will be AOC. I love her, but even I'm rooting for a moderate Dem.

A moderate Dem is only hope for the Democrats win in 2028.

If AOC is the nominee then the Dems will be fucked.

I've always backed more moderate centrists for the Democratic nomination, but Trump's success may be a sign that we need a change for 2028. Trump has motivated the average non-voter like no one before him. That's because he talks about the issues important to the base that other Republicans were too scared to do.

What if AOC can do the same with unengaged voters on our side? The massive success of her and Bernie's rallies is evident of something going on out there, and it's in all parts of the country. They said that Trump could not win a general election, and he won two.

If AOC runs in 2028, she will flop in many state primaries because many Dems aren't going to vote a far left brat woman. The people showing up to her rallies are probably far left progressives or left leaning Independents.

I agree that the party needs a moderate Dem candidate, think Bill and Barack, neither would you say are fully woke lefties. Both had 2 terms. If AOC happened to have everything fall into place and find herself POTUS, she would probably try to repair relations with all of our allies and make sure to do whatever it takes to revive the economy. She would probably not have a far-left congress to go along with anything too far out of the mainstream. She would be a troll of all trolls to MAGA which would be kinda fun to watch.

I think she has gifts and skills, and I want her to have a seat at the table as the Democratic Party reinvents itself.

I don't know that she's ready for the presidency, though. I'd really like to see her fill at least one term of a Senate seat before she runs for president.

R4, see R2.

He’s correct. This is what was expected if the Democrats lost the election. That there would be a Tea Party equivalent insurgency on the left. Look at their rallies. Idaho, Utah.

What is the viability of a Josh Shapiro/AOC ticket?

[quote] I agree that the party needs a moderate Dem candidate, think Bill and Barack, neither would you say are fully woke lefties.

We need a moderate Democrat for 2028. But, the problem is that Bernie and AOC's asshole supporters have demonized moderate Democrats. That shit started in 2016 with Bernie's dumbfuck supporters having meltdowns because Bernie didn't the nomination. Many of them voted third party for Jill Stein or stayed home on Election Day. It drives me nuts how that fucker Bernie has never been raked over the coals for the shit he and his dumbfuck supporters have helped inflict on this country. Bernie ain't no fucking hero and neither his little protege AOC.

Many of AOC's supporters who were Bernie supporters in 2016 and 2020 continue to demonize moderate Democrats. I wouldn't be surprised if many of the moderate and liberal Dems in Congress are working together behind the scenes to take down AOC. There are several nerdy and plain Jane Democratic Congresswomen who have been undergoing makeovers and also Senator Elissa Slotkin seems to be losing weight via a Ozempic or a similar drug. Those women are probably plotting to take down AOC.

R23 If Shapiro ran in 2028 and got the Dem nomination. He wouldn't pick AOC as his running mate. He's a moderate who is well aware that AOC's supporters hate moderate Democrats.

If anyone wants to get a good taste of progressives who hate moderates, watch YouTube shows like The Majority Report, Left Reckoning, Leftist Mafia, Humanist Report and other similar channels. Those progressives spew a lot of hatred towards Shapiro and other moderate Dems on their shows.

If the Democrats nominate anyone other than an older (50 - 65) straight white Christian man, they will lose. I hate to say it, but this is a basic truth. And go ahead, put a pin in this thread/comment, and come back November 8, 2028, and we'll see.

She would be Hillary 2.0--a politician that has no chance in a general election because the right has spent years making into a bogey(wo)man. Prior to 2008, no one had won the presidency from Congress since JFK in 1960. We need to start looking at governors again because people (on both sides) fucking *hate* Washington.

R26 I totally agree with you.

I follow Adam Mockler's YouTube channel and yesterday he did a community post asking people who would be their picks for the Dem nominee. Many people commented with AOC, Jasmine Crockett, and Pete Buttigieg as their picks. I did see Jon Ossoff mentioned by several people. The people who believe AOC, Crockett, or Buttigieg have a chance in 2028 are too naive.

Jasmine Crockett, that sounds like a winning ticket, with AOC of course!

AOC shat on Hillary for one-trick pony Bernie.

I like AOC, but if she's the candidate we'll lose again. Sad to say but the US has simply not advanced enough to accept a female or a gay POTUS. IMO we need a man no older than 50 who is smart as a whip in political matters, has a beat their ass, calls 'em like he sees 'em attitude, and the proven track record of doing just that.

That said, should we win I want the new guy to go after every crooked scumbag who ever worked in the Trump administration. America needs to see our own Nuremberg trials.

I think someone from the military could be a good candidate. They won't stink of Washington, will seem tough, and it will be hard for the GOP to pain them as unpatriotic (though lord knows they'll try).

White men can’t jump, but what they can do is win elections.

Guess we should all just STFU and wait for 2028 to hear which old white dude Chris Matthews and James Carville like.

If we get a fucking election in 4 years.

I'm so fucking sick of hearing people respond to Bernie and AOC like we're in 2012.

Andrew Cuomo will be ready to ascend to POTUS after cleaning up the shitstorm that is NYC.

R35 translated: Negroes terrify me!

Not only did I lose all respect for Nate, but he's also proven that he was a one trick pony who just happened to get it right and has been coasting on it since.

[quote] I think someone from the military could be a good candidate. They won't stink of Washington, will seem tough, and it will be hard for the GOP to pain them as unpatriotic (though lord knows they'll try).

Maybe, Ruben Gallego?

“To win the next election, we need to be as tame and uninteresting as possible.”

Look at who is President RIGHT NOW. This is not about appearances. Blandness will get us nowhere. It’s not enough to be “corporate, only less evil.”

Sorry, but do not nominate a woman or a minority for Democrat in 2028. Anybody else will be characterized as a DEI by the Republicans. Just get a white male back Democrat in the White House for now, we can attempt an alternative in a subsequent election.

R19 Bill and Obama would be closer to conservatism today compared to the liberal party now. Anti-gay marriage, hard on criminals, hard on illegals, hard on border control, etc.

2028 is a million years away, politically speaking.

Some unknown person will come out of the woodwork. They usually do.

I don’t think AOC wants to be President. It’s a short term position. I think she would much rather be Speaker or in the Senate.

R31 I don’t agree with this.

Kamala and Hillary were horrible and undeserving candidates.

Hillary got her political power as a wife and Kamala got VP because Biden told black women if he becomes President he’ll make a black woman VP.

And then people were trying to get Oprah and Michelle Obama lol. It was so silly.

The first female President will be a Republican woman absolutely and I don’t think Democrats will like her.

[quote] Some unknown person will come out of the woodwork. They usually do.

Yeah, it's won't be anyone who is well known right now like AOC and Jasmine Crockett. My money is on a lesser known Midwestern Congressperson from Michigan or Minnesota.

If I wanted to know where to find best tacos in Peoria, I'd be interested in what he has to say.

Trump has been in office fewer than three months of his second term. A LOT can still happen.

[quote]What is the viability of a Josh Shapiro/AOC ticket?

Doubt a Jewish person would want a member of The Squad on his ticket.

A lot of the progressive left is very anti Israel. Remember Genocide Joe. That won’t play well nationally.

A growing number of Americans have negative feelings about Israel. It’s no longer just the progressive left.

I don't know if AOC will run for president and I don't care. I got no horse in this race. I don't have any faves. She is good at grabbing the news cycle from Orange Jesus. She's good at changing the republican narrative in the news. I do know that if someone wants to be President they better start making a lot of noise now. When I vote in 2028 I will remember who stood up and tried to stop Trump. Newsome tried and failed spectacularly, Whitmer face planted like crazy, but Pritzker seems to be on point. I'm waiting for Shapiro, Moore, Bashear et al to get louder. I don't know if they wait 2 years to start campaigning after being in a bunker will be effective,

[quote] What is the viability of a Josh Shapiro/AOC ticket?

[quote] Doubt a Jewish person would want a member of The Squad on his ticket.

Yeah, Shapiro is moderate and pro-Israel. He wouldn't touch anyone on The Squad with a ten foot pole.

The Squad does or did have alliances with former and current progressive Jewish elected officials. Former Michigan Congressman Andy Levin from the now defunct Levin political dynasty family was their pal. Levin wanted a two-state solution for Palestine and Israel and pushed for the rights of Palestinians. Redistricting was done in Michigan and as result Levin had to run against moderate Congresswoman Haley Stevens in a Democratic primary in 2022.

The progressive support for Levin was hilarious because many progressives are known to whine about nepotism in politics. But, they were backing a nepo baby Levin whose father had been a Congressman and whose uncle was a US senator. The progressive support for Levin just proved that progressives are capable of their forms of elitism. When Levin lost to Stevens there were meltdowns especially among younger progressives. The younger progressives will never understand that Stevens had to work much harder in life than to get where she's at compared to Nepo Baby Andy. Stevens is constantly made fun on social media because of her very thick Michigan accent(thicker than Whitmer's accent) and odd physical mannerisms. I got to give her props because she pretty much owns up to the accent and she seems like a down to earth person.

[quote] The first female President will be a Republican woman absolutely and I don’t think Democrats will like her.

The only way Democrats would be ok with a female Republican president if it's a pro-choice Republican. But, I doubt any there will ever be any pro-choice Republicans male or female will run for POTUS

How about we lurch back to normalcy and say " Fuck you" to both extremes?

R22: The teabaggers were an astroturf operation. No real Dem analogy.

[quote] How about we lurch back to normalcy and say " Fuck you" to both extremes?

Far left asswipes like AOC, Bernie, and the Squad are just as dangerous as far right MAGAts. But, the far left crowd is never highly criticized or called out as much as the far right is in the media. As much as I loathe the far right MAGAt crowd (MTG, Mike Johnson, Boebert etc), it bugs the fuck out of me how AOC is often treated with kid gloves in the media compared to far right crowd. She should be slammed just as much as they are. Bernie should have been raked over the coals after 2016. But, again somehow a far left asshole like him manages to get off scott free.

R55: You need to get back on your meds. AOC is no threat to democracy or the rule of law. You have no flare for drawing equivalences.

Misleading title. he basically just talks about current favorables, which are predictive of nothing at this point.

R54 Agreed.

The Tea Party were never a grass roots movement. They were sponsored $$$$$$ by proxy Koch Brothers groups to be a Neo John Birch Society . Back in the 1960s the Republicans eventually rejected the original John Birchers because they knew they were pushing an extreme racist white supremacy agenda that would not only divide the country but destroy the Republican Party as they knew it,. They were correct to do so. But in 2008-2009 the Republicans in trying to counter balance Obama's presidency (black man in the White House is unacceptable) they embraced the racist Tea Party movement and brought them into their midst. All they needed was a front man that was low in character and irredeemable morally to lead them. Along came Trump and they rest is history. Trumpism replaced all the Republican so-called values. And if one individual can replace what you claim to hold so important, wasn't it all an empty facade anyway? Power mattered above all, the so-called values no longer mattered except to be used as platitudes.

Far left woke are not dangerous, just way too generous with the taxpayer's money with all their programs, not to mention way too soft on crime and immigration.

I do not fear them, just get annoyed by them.

The far right in MAGA world are trying to dismantle our country's democracy and want to install an authoritarian leader, aka Putin's political girlfriend Trump. Which is worse, there is no question the far right is worse for everyone, even other conservatives who are starting to see it too.

Democrats who swoon to AOC are the type to NEVER stop pressing the Trans Agenda as a core tenet, costing millions to vote GOP or not at all.

I have no idea why this issue animates lefties like no other. We're doomed.

[quote]The massive success of her and Bernie's rallies is evident of something going on out there...

What is the measure of a "success" of a rally? Does it write legislation, or register voters who will definitely show up and vote for the Democrat? No, we've seen it does not accomplish those things. Getting your face on tv is not "fighting for you!" in my opinion.

AOC is very popular among only two groups- Young non-voters, and Squad lefties who do not vote in her district. That's it. Her shrill demeanor and lack of any kind of legislative achievement, plus her fellowship with the Anti-Semite Caucus make her a hard "no" to me.

This whole Idaho rally with Bernie is such a stunt. What does it do for anyone but her? Nothing.

R61: AOC is popular with people who are sick of the Dems following the dictates of consultants or Wall Street---people who've had enough of Schumer or people like Buttigeig who won't talk about his father being a Marxist but says nice things about dreadful people like Mitch Daniels.

R59 Too soft on crime and immigration is not dangerous?

Even during COVID crime was a fraction of what hit was in the 90s and and at levels not seen since the early 60s. better than running gulags or tanking the economy. Trolling a bunch of talking points i no substutute for actual debate,

He works for a right-wing outfit now. [bold]The Republicans are pushing AOC for President because they think she will be the easiest to defeat in 2028.[bold] Like Nixon secretly helped McGovern win the Democratic nomination and then dumped oppo on him in the general. I take all the AOC enthusiasm with a little salt, it might be an illusion.

^ This

AOC’s views on illegal immigration is a deal breaker pfor most Americans. She wants to abolish ICE and make an easier pathway to citizenship for illegals.

That is enough for her to be out.

The Democratic Party needs a more centrist President. Both Clinton and Obama were centrists who won the White House by being centrists. They were progressive but had centrist views and that was necessary because both won after 8-12 years of Republican reign.

It is not rocket science. Don’t get a crazy left wing nut to run.

[quote] AOC is popular with people who are sick of the Dems following the dictates of consultants or Wall Street---people who've had enough of Schumer or people like Buttigeig...

You mean Chuck Schumer who got 40+ liberal judges confirmed in a 50-50 Senate which included Joe Manchin AFTER Trump was elected?

You are talking about disconnected to reality younger non-voters who had student loans forgiven, and have no idea what the Infrastructure Act and Inflation Reduction Act did for their communities and families, right? The same non-voters who let Roe v. Wade slip away because "They're ALL SO OLD!"? The same stay-at-homes who believe the Trans Agenda and Gaza concerns will sweep the Electoral College and have zero idea how our government even works, except to withhold their precious vote on election day?

Are you proving my point for me?

[quote]AOC’s views on illegal immigration is a deal breaker for most Americans. She wants to abolish ICE...

Cortez-Nixon 2028!

R68 This! The problem with liberal Gen Z is they’re looking for problems and reasons to cancel. A demand will always have to be met or they will stay at home, just as they threatened and did with the last election.

Liberal Gen Z types like crybaby David Hogg need to fucking accept that there are still going to be Dems who remain moderate.

I know DL loves Hogg, but he's going to fuck a lot of things up.

Not me! I hate David Hogg!

Ever since he started "helping", the fauxgressive left votes less, is more anti-Semitic, Trump was re-elected, and Florida has gotten redder!

Was this what he was trying to achieve?

[quote]The Democratic Party needs a more centrist President. Both Clinton and Obama were centrists who won the White House by being centrists. They were progressive but had centrist views and that was necessary because both won after 8-12 years of Republican reign.

[quote] It is not rocket science. Don’t get a crazy left wing nut to run.

The real danger with AOC in 2028 is that when she runs and inevitably loses in the Democratic primaries, most of her hardcore supporters will have meltdowns. They will pull the shit the Bernie supporters did in 2016--- meaning they will stay home on Election Day or will vote third party. Most of AOC's supporters spew a lot of unnecessary hatred towards centrist and liberal Democrats.

Yup, r73, Bernie 3.0!

R74 And yet, the DNC still hasn't learned their lesson. If they hadn't done everything they could to fuck Bernie during the primaries, maybe we'd have never ended up with Trump 1.0.

Bernie and AOC are the only democrats pulling in crowds in the tens of thousands and we're nowhere even near the midterms. Most Americans want pragmatic/economic progressivism. Poll after poll tells us that the policies Bernie and AOC platform are what they want to see. They're not talking about trans issues, they're talking about eating the rich--THAT'S the way to American's hearts.

It's the democrats, by the way, that pushed identity poltics the hardest because then they wouldn't have to talk about taxing their corporate stooges. Don't forget it was Hillary that started trolling Bernie on BLM and reparations in 2016 because all he was talking about was universal healthcare and taxing millionaires and billionaires. Kamala and Biden spent more time talking about trans issues in the last 5 years than Bernie did in his entire career.

But no, sure, keep pushing milquetoast centrist neolibs. I'm sure THIS time it will work.

Amen, R75! You just said everything I wanted to say in a post.

If the Mainstream Dems hadn't forced Hillary on us in 16 and Biden in 20, we would't be in this mess.

A lot of us are done with "milquetoast centrist neolibs". They've done NOTHING but shift the Democrat Party to the center and away from liberal causes.

Fuck that shit.

Crowd size doesn't win elections.

R76 It’s absolutely true. The left mainstream media hated Sanders and sabotaged him during primaries with negative press. Even some of his base went on to vote for Trump.

“Fake News” is REAL. Just look at the Kilmar Garcia coverage - it’s forced and fake and for a small population of the US.

Left wing media has lost its audience because the left wing media can’t manipulate anymore - probably lost a lot of people after Covid stopped being scary.

Even Rachel Maddow comes off as full of shit today.

R78 There is a faction of people who just want to vote against the establishment. They don't even necessarily have issues they are looking for in their candidate. Switching from Bernie Sanders to Donald Trump is about as from one extreme to the other that you can go in today's politics.

R78 Rachel Madow has always been a smuggy and annoying twat waffle.

Ms. Twat Waffle earns big bucks and is very generous to all kinds of LGBTQIA charities. She even tips her barber generously.

[QUOTE]Don't forget it was Hillary that started trolling Bernie on BLM and reparations in 2016[/quote]

And then the right-wing ecosystem started claiming all democrats wanted reparations.

[quote]Just look at the Kilmar Garcia coverage - it’s forced and fake and for a small population of the US.[/quote]

I thought so, too. But the Abrego-Garcia issue bothers a segment of the law-and-order types. Even in forums devoted to true crime, which are almost always pro-law enforcement, they are completely against ICE and Abrego-Garcia's kidnapping. The right-wing trolls are twisting themselves into pretzels trying to justify his detention. In addition, the Senator (who actually did something) received very favorable press. The problem is that MAGA lives in a right-wing media bubble; they don't know what's going on.

I would like to see woke come back, but in a watered down acceptable form. What we don’t need is identity politics and people screaming about pronouns and the like. There needs to be a focus on injustice, but in a way that doesn’t demonize other segments of the population. That’s partly how we ended up with Trump.

It seems a very high % of white men from 18-90, except gay men, are voting for Republicans. This is because the woke wing of the Dem party went too crazy with the gender expression and pronouns and Fox News and others knew how to exploit these guys with fear and loathing. It will take a lot to get them back, maybe losing 401k monies will do it, but the Dems have to show these guys a more moderate side too.

Thanks for posting, OP. I can't wait to hear from Bill Maher.

[quote]If they hadn't done everything they could to fuck Bernie during the primaries...

Barbara, PLEASE!

PLEASE, Barbara!

You sound insane! You are the same as the MAGAs who believe 2020 was rigged! Bernie fucked himself by receiving 4 million + FEWER primary votes than Hillary AND using the highly UN-Democratic caucus results to pad his "popularity", while raising hundreds of millions from starry-eyed young non-voters in excess of campaign finance limits and padded Jane's pockets and his own with tens of millions of dollars, AND was NEVER EVEN a Democrat! You are bananas, I imagine you're ready to help Trump win a third term!

Like it or not, AOC is currently leading the democratic party, and I don't see that dying down any time soon. We needed someone to step up, and she stepped up.

R87 We're doomed

R87 Yeah and that’s bad news.

As long as the Democratic politicians don’t get it, everyone is fucked.

The biggest talking point in conservative media now is basically Democratic politicians are out of touch with the Democratic base. They start off every news bit with “despite polls showing the Democratic public said no, this politician here did it anyway because they don’t listen to their public.”

Sadly, most Democratic voters have no idea what they want.

After presenting voters with record jobs and a dynamic economic outlook, renewed dedication to the environment and labor, the voters (non-voters) decided that "Free Palestine" and the Trans Agenda demanded they withhold their votes in some bizarre purity olympics they dreamed up.

I honestly think a huge plurality of Americans are still sitting at home smugly demanding that someone needs to "earn my vote", and they cannot be old, male or white or they will be summarily rejected!

Nate Silver on MSNBC.

I crack up at the comments on YouTube from people who think AOC could win a general election. People don't understand that she will will turn off people in various battleground states.

I am a moderate Dem who is very turned off by AOC and her screechy voice. Her open borders and tax and spend ideas are not what Americans crave at this moment. I do agree she is trying to get under Trump's skin and wish more moderates would do so. Stop sending Tim Walz out by himself, he just reminds people that we lost.

[bolld]ANYBODY[/bold] who isn't sitting with both thumbs up their ass waiting for a consultant to tell them what to feel has my vote.

A few congressmen have been making noise besides AOC and Sanders. Showing a spine counts at this point.

[quote] A few congressmen have been making noise besides AOC and Sanders. Showing a spine counts at this point.

Yes, others have been speaking out. But, for some odd reason the media only focuses on AOC and Sanders.

Pete B. will be on the Democratic ticket in 2028. Bank on it!

Meghan McCain said not to underestimate AOC and that she could be a real contender. Yikes, ugh, and pffft.

[quote]Meghan McCain said not to underestimate AOC and that she could be a real contender.

How very "Julie" of her

Meghan McCain is only pushing AOC because she knows AOC would easily lose in a general election

If AOC chooses to run in 2028, she will lose in the primaries. There are still too many Democrats in many states who aren't going to vote for a progressive. I would love for a journalist to ask AOC and Bernie why they didn't visit any areas in Michigan. Pennsylvania, Georgia, North Carolina, or the southern states.

If Bernie and AOC do another tour and visit Michigan, it will be somewhere in Rashida Slob's congressional district. They wouldn't visit Grand Rapids or areas in western Michigan because voters there still heavily lean Republican and the Democrats in those areas are mostly moderate or liberals. The only reason Congresswoman Hillary Scholten has been able to win elections in 2022 and 2024 is because she's a moderate Dem. It's the same in Oakland County, Haley Stevens wins there because she's a moderate. AOC and Bernie wouldn't be welcomed in Kent or Oakland County.

There aren't enough progressives in Michigan for AOC. She's doesn't have the appeal to win over enough moderate or liberal Democrats in Michigan. Elissa Slotkin is a moderate and that probably played into why she was able to win a US Senate race in Michigan. It's laughable that Abdul El-Sayed who is major Bernie Bro is running for Gary Peters' senate seat in Michigan. He has no fucking chance and is going to lose to either Haley Stevens or Mallory McMorrow in the Dem primary. Haley Stevens is already hated by progressives and if she wins the primary she will just ignore the progressives and move onto the next phase. Mallory McMorrow is liked by some in the progressive crowd. But, if she wins that primary, don't be surprised if the progressive crowd works quickly to vilify her. Either way, it's going to be hilarious to see Bernie douch Abdul El-Sayed lose.

Now it’s a democratic love in , soon the Dems will be fighting for the soul of the Democratic Party and its future

Depending on how well or how badly things go for AOC in this fight I’d not be surprised to see her as a major force and leader in the new American Liberal Party (ALA).

Just in time for 2028

Checks sent to the ALP will be cashed sooner. And fuck the dems.