Bold and the Beautiful, Part III: The Further Adventures of Hobo Ridge and the Slut of the Valley

Where the hell is sexy RJ? We need a shirtless scene.

He's most likely at the gym

The actor who plays RJ likely made Jaqueline Wood feel upstaged thus. . .no storyline.

One must obey Queen Ducklips.

I'm waiting for Ridge and Taylor to mention RJ left town. He works at Forrester and his absence in the takeover storyline is obvious.

Add Anthony Turpel (previous RJ) to the long list of actors DL wrongly declared would be "stars". He should be begging BB to take him back.

R5

Isn't he a gay homosexualist?

There should have been a photo featured with the thread's topic!

Weissmann is the right age for a Spencer recast on GH.

I’ve not seen him on b&b, r8. Would he be good with aristocratic mannerisms?

I think Cassadines can only be Hispanic now. For some reason they went from Greek/Russian royalty to common Brazilians.

R7 I have been saying for a week that Weismann needed to start posting thirst traps. This BB gig is dated.. Good for him for trying to keep the momentum going.

Hobo Ridge has a lot of nerve slut shaming Brooke or her daughter. He can screw or get drunk and fake marry anyone he wants and that’s fine.. He doesn’t deserve a hot piece like Brooke Logan!

Weissmann would also be a believable recast for "Reed Hellstrom" (Victoria Newman's son with J.T.) on Y&R.

The previous actor in the role (Tristan Lake Leabu) didn't seem committed to the role as more of a musician, and while not horrible, was also not that memorable (except for his throwback hippie look).

Manspreading.

Actors act R9 .

Weismann is too jewish for Uncle Frank at GH.

In theory r14. Did you happen to see the nikolas who looks like a phillipino with Down’s syndrome?

When are they going to add a laugh track to this shit-com? There are more 'misunderstandings' than Three's Company. How many times does well meaning Brooke screw up, and Ridge rushes to the arms of the 100th woman to play Taylor. Isn't Rebecca Budig a bit too young for the part? Oh well, the next Taylor will probably be 15.

She’s the same age as Brooke

R7, that's a hot photo of Christian Weissmann. When did he post that one?

R19 Ain't it? I mean...in some ways it's hotter than porn.

You want to talk porn? My son knows porn!

R21

I have watched that numerous times hehe

R22. What's his name again on CF?

I didn’t know he was on CF but he was on Sean Cody and I think his name was Nick

I always get those sites confused. Thank you!

Rebecca is at least 10 years younger than KKL. She also looks nothing like the other Taylors.

Rebecca has none of the beauty and glamour of the other Taylor’s. RB and Thorsten (Ridge) have no sexual chemistry.

Who the f()k is this boring "Electrada' creature???? Talk about brining in the 'D' team....

[quote] Rebecca has none of the beauty and glamour of the other Taylor’s.

Now, this Rebecca actress would be a believable waitress at the Pizza Hut. And Hobo Ridge could be the dishwasher.

That Luna-tic girl has been saying the same thing (to Bill) for the last week. Almost word for word.

R15 Weissmann has talked about being raised by conservative Roman Catholic parents and what a number being raised in the church did on his head when trying to come to terms with his sexuality.

Italian Frank would probably empathize.

R27, and that is why KKL should win an Emmy.

hey Luna, you're freaking out over being in jail?

Um try not killing people.

Has Weismann sucked Morrow’s dick yet?

Mindy Lewis freaked out over going to jail over stolen money (she used it to pay for her wedding to Kurt).

She was hysterical. "Daddy, I can't go to prison. They have criminals there!"

Hilarious.

[quote] and that is why KKL should win an Emmy.

a Daytime Emmy?

R36. No, a Sports Emmy, Rose!

The TVLine website has a year-end list titled "The 20+ Dumb Things TV Did This Year"

Number four on that list was B&B casting Rebecca Budig as Taylor

[quote]Daytime-TV vet Rebecca Budig is a fine, Emmy-nominated actress, to be sure. But she is so youthful that we have to remind ourselves every time she has a scene with Jacqueline MacInnes Woods, who is only 14 years her junior, that Taylor is not Steffy’s peer but her mother.

Funny how the pron son has won a Daytime Emmy, but KKL has not.

R39

What did he win for and supposedly he is straight

R40 He won for his production work on The Bay ... like Ronn Moss and Mrs. Ronn Moss ... lol.

Here are some screencaps & gifs of KKL's son spreading his legs for a cock on Sean Cody:

I heard this was an act of rebellion against the stepfather whom KKL is long divorced from.

How can you do that and be straight????

R38, I didn't know Budig was nominated for a sports Emmy!

Daytime Emmy, Rose, DAYTIME!

And, "Nick," all I can add is..."CONDOMS!"

R43 proves it. Yep, totally straight.

Okay, today (Tuesday) was a good episode (especially after a shitty recent Y&R repeat). Very sweeps/OG Friday cliffhanger.

The consensus when "Nick's" video was first released is that no "straight guy" takes a cock like that his "first time" (Right, sure Jan), maintains an erection throughout, and is able to cum while being fucked.

I guess fug RJ is out on his ass. They removed his pic from the opening credits. Long overdue. Should’ve recast him after the first week.

I haven't been a daily watcher of B&B since 2000/2001 with the whole Amber Moore baby storyline. Justin Torkildsen was my wet dream for a while. I may tune back in when "breaching the gates" or whatever it's called premieres.

Is this a good idea or bad idea?

Logan called into question Torkildsen's Emmy win.

OUCH!

Back then, there was no social media and the web was a separate entity; there were still six magazines or so.

I wouldn't be surprised if by summer, CBS goes to the Bell shows and says, "you've got to have some characters visit the Gates in MD."

But it's all stunts. No story. It's ALL going away.

Hmm. Luna has Italian mother down good! "If you stop getting letters from me, it's because I'm in a hospital bed. . .or dead."

Didn't understand today's ending

R56 I think Luna was either imagining or dreaming being released.

Makes sense.

Remy, Electra & Will were all left high up near the edge of a building at the end of today's episode, so I assume one of them is going to take a tumble in the next episode.

Let Electra fall off the building and go splat, so Will has a reason to tackle Remy and pound his ass.

Gee, will it be the Spencer heir, the Forrester grandniece or the hot ugly guy who's a stalker?

They're also only on the second floor.

Budding is 12 years younger than KKL. Hobo Ridge looks nothing like OG Ridge either.

Hobo Ridge looked like he was mounting his granddaughter when he and Taylor were in bed. This is an awful recast. They fucked up by firing Krista Allen.

[quote]Gee, will it be the Spencer heir, the Forrester grandniece or the hot ugly guy who's a stalker?

R61, well sure, Remy is the most expendable character, but unless the show wants to be really predictable, they should have something unexpected happen, like Will or Electra getting injured. If Remy just falls off the building and gets killed, it won't be much of a twist.

Maybe Remy falls into the dumpster where Liam has been living.

I loved Krista Allen, this recast is hard to swallow.

Also I skipped a few months. How is Carter with Hope? What happened to Carter and Katie?

I didn’t love krista Allen but this little girl is in over her head. Urgent intervention needed.

Krista Allen and her titties can stay away. Ugh.

They should just kill taylor off again. I never really bought the whole storyline anyway. She was brought in to get Ridge through the death of Caroline. What Dr has sex with her grieving patient?

If they kill her, they’ll just resurrect her. I’d rather she just disappear without much mention.

Carter and Katie is just never mentioned.

I remember years ago when Wyatt swung by FC to see Katie for something, Heather played their past dynamic; Just the way she said his name, "ohhh...Wyattt."

It costs nothing to do that, doesn't hurt the current story but B&B ignoring its own history is more criminal than Sally stealing FC originals.

Allegedly word on the street (now scrubbed from online) is that back then Anthony Turpel was using his then wealthy girlfriend for expensive gifts and vacations and was cheating on her. After he was let go from B&B he conned the production into gifting him RJ's wardrobe.

R71 Right. It would have made more sense if Taylor was a sex therapist/sex surrogate instead of a psychiatrist.

Taylor started out as Caroline's cancer doctor; she switched to psychiatry after she died and began looking in on Ridge

I can't see Turpel conning anyone at B&B.

Why am I supposed to care about a teen who's been on the show for three months being put in danger by a stalker ex boyfriend?

Has Scott Clifton resolved his ‘personal’ issues yet? Is all forgiven?

R76, yeah, today's episode was a little anti-climactic. Will & Remy had a brief scuffle on top of the building, and then Remy runs away. Well at least Remy lives to fight another day. Maybe he will come back for revenge.

[quote] Maybe he will come back for revenge.

Maybe Remy can kidnap Will next time, tie him up, and edge him.

Is it wrong I want Electrada to get fried?

I'm more curious as to whether Remy will still be able to keep his job at Pizza Hut.

After escaping the apartment why didn't Electra Woman just run into the Pizza Hut to get Deacon to help her?

Electra said Remy was apprehended and taken into custody. I wonder what the charges are? I can see him getting out quickly. The laws about creating fake nudes with AI are sketchy and inconsistent at best. Legal websites usually address how doing so for commercial gain is illegal. But that economic element wasn't at play here, was it? And what transpired between these two at the apartment can be manipulated by Remy as a he-said-she-said domestic between a couple of exes. Plus, he can say she broke into his place, then assaulted him. Sounds like the stuff for counterclaims, warnings and restraining orders.

That gay guy who is openly queer who plays Remy will be back!

From that preview they aired today, it looks like Luna has the hots for Will, so I might guess that she and Remy will team up somehow.

Pizza Boy He Delivers?

B&B dropped the ball with the Remy storyline. It should have played out for longer. Having Remy get arrested off-screen was anti-climactic. So yeah, hopefully we will see Crazy Luna & Crazy Remy work together in the future.

Remy's arrested

Maybe he can just call Bill and ask if he can live with Luna in Ina Hopkins' boarding mansion?

Carter and Hope take over FC with fake paperwork.

Steffy never told Finn about Liam kissing her.

Taylor looks 42. Hobo Ridge has been around for a decade plus but he will never be Ridge.

Show's a mess.

Can I take your order? Or maybe drown someone in a jacuzzi?

Oh--just a pizza? No. . .side of bees?

Just a cheese pizza! Got it. Umm. . .could I interest you in a little arson? Death to an enemy by dog attack? An accidentall fall from a balcony?

Just a pizza.

Absolutely. Thrilling stuff.

Is that Taylor? A nununuTaylor?

R89. She looks terrible there, serving cocktails at Hooters' Poconos.

it's very interesting. In the good old days, pretty much any actor could quit their soap, take a few months off, and then say to their agent -- or that talent rep Michael Bruno -- and say, 'Get me on Santa Barbara or Loving or Capitol.'

But with only four shows? It's harder to do that. It's possible that actors will have some leverage with the Gates but if that show doesn't do well it's not likely Hulu or Peacock will invest in a new or old soap.

Brooke's exit after her conversation with Sludge was hilarious, but I wished she'd shoved FauxTaylor just a little harder to cause her to fall flat on her ass with those stoopid shoes she was wearing over her head and up in the air.

B&B lost its costumer to Beyond the Gates.

tho I suspect she'll be available next year

What, are they going to put Tamara in some of Steffy's majorette stripper outfits?

Loved today's episode. But they need to keep Brooke and Ridge broken apart for a few years now. That speech was good and it went back thirty years, something this show never does because the writers don't know the history. It's time to give the viewers a reprieve from Ridge and his two vaginas. Get Brooke a guy of her own.

r96 They tried that a few times. When the whole Blief storyline was on they were going to pair her with Connor but he was kind of a dud on B&B. There was the whole Brooke is done with Ridge but when they brought on Shelia to be Brooke's friend...she worked to get Ridge and Broke back together to keep her away from Eric. They got close with Jack Wagner's character but even then they were all intertwined with sisters and daughters....The show is borderline incest. I remember at one point it looked like Ridge would have a romance with Bridget, a girl he delivered with Brooke.

They still get too much mileage out of the Ridge Brooke Taylor triangle, even though it’s much, much less without Moss and Tylo on the show anymore. History has shown he’s with neither woman for long, so this will just continue for a thousand more years.

[quote] I remember at one point it looked like Ridge would have a romance with Bridget, a girl he delivered with Brooke.

He thought Bridget was his daughter for a time, I think.

Isn't that why she was named "Bridget" - a smushname of Brooke + Ridge?

Although I don't expect a lot from B&B these days, they could have a had a little more creativity with the Remy/Will/Electra storyline. It was very similar to the Luna/Steffy/Finn storyline from last Summer -- Will rushed in to heroically save Electra from Crazy Remy the same way that Finn heroically rushed in to save Steffy from Crazy Luna.

Let's have Remy use his AI skills and put fake nudes of Will on the interwebs making it look like Will has a tiny cocklet. .. To counter this humiliation, Will plots to be the showstopper at the next Forrester fashion show by walking the runway in the nude. .. Brooke asks Hope, "Why isn't Will wearing any clothes?" .. Hope replies, "Probably because we don't have a men's line any longer."

Lather Rinse Repeat. Brooke Ridge Taylor.

If this show makes it to 2040, will the triangle take place at a nursing home where Brooke is jealous Ridge helps Taylor on the toilet?

There’s nothing to watch here if bull dyke Stephanie isn’t threatening and shoving and slapping that slut from the Valley.

R104 Hard agree. I never much liked B&B but Stephanie giving Brooke and/or Sally a hard time was the only thing that ever made it interesting.

Well that, and the early years of Ridge in a Speedo and the brother that wanted to suck his cock.

1-800-SLAP-A-HO

Brooke was such a stupid whiny tramp.

This one always me laugh because of Brooke’s reaction

R107

That is my favorite scene in all B&B history!

THEORY------>>> What if Remy is the son of Mary Warrick? He is clearly crazy enough to be related to Sheila. If Jessica Forrester can be Electras mother then surely Mary can have a child too.

My fave B&B scene ever.

Fun fact, Darlene Conley was the first actress from B&B to get a daytime emmy nomination.

R112 I thought the Logan sister with zits got a teen nom, way back in the 80's?

Damn. I miss Darlene Conley!

R107, I think that was Flannery's third Emmy (second for Steph)

R114, Darlene was a CLASS ACT and her arrival on the show in 1989 helped put it on the map.

Yikes at Ridge's line to Eric to fight fire with fire, given what is going on in LA. I hope the actors from B&B, Y&R and GH aren't affected by the fire, it's been horrible to see. That being said, Taylor's old lady shoes today stood out. My Granny had a pair just like them when she was in her 70's.

What, fires can’t affect streaming?

r117 they probably taped that show 4 months ago.

Since crazy Luna was released even though she murdered people, Remy should be in jail for all of five minutes.

Dying laughing over this “French” fragrance guru/mantrap waving her scarf around while Dope and Carter moan in delight.

Frenchie cannot act. They clearly hired a dolt. And today I realized the actress who plays Hope is physically unattractive. How would she get primo dick like Carter in real life? She has fat legs. She really doesn't need to be in a skirt.

Wasn’t Darlene Connly a big ole dyke like Susie Flannery?

I also miss Darlene Conley and Susan Flannery -- they were a big part of the show's success in those days and it hasn't been as good since Conley's death and Flannery's retirement.

r122 I never heard anything about Conely being a lesbian.

Maybe Darlene was lebanese.

I mean did she just never meet the right guy? Smoke->fire

She was married twice and has one grown child.

Darlene always seemed like a fag hag to me. Didn’t she live in WeHo?

No. She lived in Silverlake. or near Silverlake.

Two other B&B employees lived in her condo bldg. She had, what she endearingly called an 'f.u.' apartment for decades.

Actors loved to have 'f.u. apartments' so they could say 'f.u.' to their bosses, get fired, and still afford their residence.

But Darlene loved playing Sally. She earned enough to get a condo and had a nice life. She was a huge star in Italy; she was B&B's first Daytime Emmy nominee and got some fan awards, too.

She was the best.

I think she lived in Los Feliz Towers in a dee-luxe apartment (condo) in the sky.

Yes, the actress playing Dope is average at best, which makes it extra hilarious that the show has made her character irresistible to any man who comes within 20 feet of her.

R130, that's right; It was Los Feliz. I get those places mixed up.

Her bff was ex-producer John Zak.He was a producer then supervising producer for 10 years from 89-99.

John C. Zak was a big homo!

r134 Old Gory!

Ridge's bedroom filled with rose petals for Trailor, lol and POOR Brooke in tears again. A year from now, Brooke and Ridge will re-marry for the 8oth time and Trailor will be lamenting to Steffi how she can't break the hold Brooke has on Ridge.

Sixty-year olds with rose petals. Oh my sides.

It would be more like Sludge going to the bathroom to find his bottle of little blue pills, and FauXTaylor looking for a pack of K-Y Liquibeads in her purse to moisturize down there.

And speaking of sex, could Finn and Steffi look any more uncomfortable trying to balance themselves on that narrow sofa? I was hoping he'd try to move his arm and she'd fall on the floor.

Why do I zmell cum on this IKEA sofa weeth my best nose in Paree?

R137 lol, and also a woman in her fifties acting like it's her first time for the 1000th time. Didn't Taylor TWICE have her death faked??? God love B&B - it is more insane than Passions ever was.

B&B is laughable in that it refuses to move forward to its own detriment.

What's the point of redoing Taylor/Ridge/Brooke for the zillionth time when Taylor and Ridge are being played by Greenlee and Patrick Ian Thornhart?

Personally, I think KKL is capable of more. But they write the same thing over and over and over. And there are no real stakes without Moss as Ridge or a Taylor we are invested in.

The show should have brought on another sister of Stephanie's; get Kathleen Noone or Liz Hubbard to have stepped in and promise her dying sister to watch over her kids.

But the "kids" are now in their 5os and 60s.

Another mess is murderers Sheila and Luna walking around as if nothing were wrong. They can all only go to Il Giardino? really? No. Too many restaurants in LA.

KKL is such a bad actress! Cringe.

And yet Sue was so praiseworthy. "Next year Kelly."

25 years later.

R141 = The show also thinks ADULT children want their divorced parents to reconcile. What the fuck? RJ, Thomas, Steffy. They are all old enough to look at their parents and say, "you don't work well together. Move on and be happy separately".

[quote]KKL is such a bad actress! Cringe.

Well, at least KKL gave us her twinky son and his brief excursion into gay porn:

And KKL STILL hasn’t won an Emmy.

Get rid of Budig

Rebecca budig could have been a great asset to the show if cast in the right role.

She is obviously not appropriate as a Taylor recast.

…they should have made her Stephanie.

I'm waiting for Brad to announce Susan Lucci is......Bridget Forrester!!

Why does Bill have to keep it a secret that Luna is staying with him under house arrest?

How does a double murderer get out on house arrest?

R151, I'd love to see a scene in which Sheila blasts Bill for being a hypocrite, but B&B won't do that.

You'd see that on GH though.

Is Donna still with Eric? I remember back when the show started Bill Spencer Sr got Donna to pose for his secret nudie magazines. Didn't Stephanie's nut job sister cover Donna with Honey and let a bear in her cabin to kill her at one time?

Yes. Donna tattled to Brooke that Ride and Taylor were having a "romantic" evening.

It's NOT Ridge and Taylor -- it's Patrick Thornhart and Greenlee Smythe!

Seriously, WHO CARES??

R155. Um, that's Zack Slater...

Budig looked even MORE ridiculous today as Taylor---with her ex "fiancé" Eric...

I want my due----I said last winter Luna was going to make a comeback and raise hell by setting her sights on Will. I predict some tainted mints in Wills future and a baby in Lunas. Predictable but still more interesting than Perfume Penny and Grampa Eric. Luna is like Jordan on YR = an unexpected stroke of watchable villainy. Like Sheila and Deacon used to me, decades ago...

[quote]I want my due----I said last winter Luna was going to make a comeback and raise hell by setting her sights on Will. I predict some tainted mints in Wills future and a baby in Lunas.

R158, maybe Luna is going to seduce Will and we will finally get to see Crew Morrow shirtless.

[quote] Why does Bill have to keep it a secret that Luna is staying with him under house arrest?

Didn't Dollar Bill imply he used "connections" to get Luna released? Meaning whoever authorized it doesn't want it to be made public? Perhaps they got a fat bribe?

I have said it before, and I will say it again---the show needs to turn Sheila into a Leanna Love character. Sheila should write a tell all about the Forresters, Fenmores, and her engagement to Bill. When Sheila first got out of the asylum (circa 1996) she was always writing a diary. I was pretty sure then that's where they were going. Sheila is also one of the few people who knew another paternity test on Bridget was needed because (unproven) the original doctor wrote a note claiming Brooke paid her a million dollars (by Brooke) to rig the original test in Ridges favor. The doctor died and left a letter about Brookes bribe.

Where would Brooke get 1 million dollars and how would no one notice she took it? They just need to get rid of Sheila. She is a single use case character who has aged out of any use. They live in LA for god's sake. How is it Thorne, Ridge and Eric can only fuck the same three women over and over?

Brown is one of Bells pets, so I think he’d rather use her like he is now (a Pizza Hut waitress) than not at all. Even though he claims Deacon and Sheila have an upcoming storyline. Browns not going to find another job, being a MAGA twat, so the modest paycheck she gets is better than nothing.

R163. Did she sell her avocado farm?

Wait what happened to the big script all the Magas were going to do with Antoiio Sabato Jr?

Bridge is so damn popular because it appeals to the fraus watching and living vicariously through them. They will always return to and eventually end the soap on this nauseating "status quo" of a couple. A Hallmark storybook romance for the ages! 🤢🤮

Can't stand plastic emotionally fragile and petty Steffy who always acts like she has a stick up her ass.

Wait, Greenlee Smythe is the new Hunter Tylo?? How does that work?.

R164 = I think she did. She moved to Montana with her family and enjoying herself. She flies in to film---which is actually not that uncommon for daytime actors.

R164 R167 Listing records at Redfin show that the Mr. & Mr.s. Pelzer have been trying to unload that place now since 2018. No takers. It got relisted five times in 2024, the last time in November. Still for sale.

What a MAGA dump! I hope she's paying Juan and Jose minimum wage to pick those avocados!

That has to be Gary's money. They lived there before she got B&B. Not sure what he does. At one point I thought she said she had moved to Vegas because of no state Taxes.

F Kimberlin. Maga cunt.

R170 Records indicate they bought the place in 2007, long after B&B. .. She's been associated with three addresses in Henderson, NV, south of Las Vegas. .. I recall she also bought some condo out in the Palm Springs area when she was running for Congress to fulfill the residency requirement for the district - owing to why locals in the area were calling her a "carpetbagger." .. I don't think she's sold that place, so probably rents it out now for income. .. The husband owns (or has owned) some kind of boat and water sports rental business based in San Diego, California for many years. When she was running for political office, The Desert Sun (Palm Springs) reported:

[quote] According to a financial disclosure report she filed with the Clerk of the House of Representatives, Brown Pelzer and her husband, Gary, manage Action Beach, Inc, a beach and water sports rental business in San Diego and Circle S, Inc, a sports fishing business that also operates fuel docks. Brown Pelzer said she also owns ATMs throughout California, including one at the Riviera Hotel in Palm Springs.

ATMs? that's almost funny.

The tides have turned r165. It may get made these days 😨🙀

I hope Li's fucking head EXPLODES when she finds out that Finn is Luna's father. Stupid cunt.

R174 The thought of Jack cheating again would be the first thought to cross her mind than the idea Poppy possibly raped/took advantage of a then underaged/late teenaged adult Finn.

"My Mommy and Daddy are back together!!"------------Steffy today.......Seriously? Your mother screwed your uncle Rick, your uncle Thorne, your uncle Nick, and your grampa Eric. And she's the GOOD one in the "love story" of Taylor and Ridge.

Luna would be Sheila's granddaughter?

Okay. . .that's pretty good. And plays into the rule of grandparents being more like their grandchildren than the parents.

Steffy needs to grow the fuck up. God, I hate that character.

Liam is back! Yay!!!! Scott Clifton is so fucking sexy.

R179, yes, Liam has finally emerged after disappearing for the past 3 months. Does Scott Clifton look a little thin to anyone else?

Yes, Scott Clifton is hot. He also happens to be one of the worst actors on daytime. Perhaps they could just have him walk around and not say anything. Also, this "Bill housing Luna in secret" is one of the dumbest storylines this show has ever done.

R181 all true. I’ve always said this about Clifton. One of the most boring, uninteresting actors to win three Emmys. And I guess we are supposed to believe it’s the same judge who who owed a favor to Bill when Sheila got sprung, so maybe now it’s two favors? So ridiculous.

Personally I find Scott a good actor but not that attractive. Pot for every kid I guess. 🤷🏻‍♂️

I loved how "executive" Liam said he just came over to Bills from running Spencer Publications while looking like he shops at Ross dress for less. Also that cutesy comedy shtick Clifton does isn't that cute anymore.

[bold] In case you missed it............ [/bold]

The Bells are getting the Documentary treatment... (link)

The Luna Paternity results are in on Friday (the 24th).. Or are they?

Was that some Wyatt erasure today? Photo of Bill and Liam in the background, no Wyatt.

B&B would have to pay Darin Brooks for the use of his likeness in a photo. Likely that's why Wyatt wasn't in the photo.

But the show seems to have forgotten all about Wyatt. I think it's been over a year since Wyatt has been mentioned.

[quote] Scott Clifton is hot. He also happens to be one of the worst actors on daytime.

But wait! .. He's a five-time-nominated, two-time DAYTIME EMMY winner!!!

R188 2 and a half actually; one year he tied with Billy Miller. But they give you a entire Emmy anyway.

I'd like to be tied with Billy Miller please.

R189 Thanks for the correction. I now see that I didn't click on the down arrow at IMDb to see the rest of his noms. My post should also be corrected to show that he has SEVEN other nominations apart from the 2.5 wins.

R190 kind of hard now that’s he’s dead.

well at least I am guaranteed a stiffy.

Not likely. He was cremated.

Tales from the crypt…

I certainly wouldn’t mind having Scott Clifton inside me, quite deeply!

[quote]Also, this "Bill housing Luna in secret" is one of the dumbest storylines this show has ever done.

Yeah, every time someone comes to visit Bill, Luna has to run and hide. I wonder how much longer they will keep it up?

Luna will probably go outside Bill's house wearing a pair of glasses and The Baseball Cap of Invisibility with no one recognizing her.

r198 If I know my B&B there will be some disguise and prosthetics soon. "I WANT TO GO OUT" "Let me use my vast fortune to get you a disguise that rivals a spirit Halloween costume!"

Poppy has her tainted mints. Daphne has her poison scarf. And Li Key Kunt has her 1970s egg timer.

Jack is looking good. But Li is winning the Ron Moss Award for wooden overacting thus week.

Today Jack was cleared as Lunas baby daddy..... Next week Finn is going to get some very unexpected family news!

R202, yeah, they showed a preview of Finn confronting Poppy.

Poor Finn. He can’t act.

R204, with those looks, he doesn't have to.

Nice kid.

I just hope that when Luna-tic moves in with Daddy Finn and Steff-mommy, that she makes Steffy's life absolute hell.

Finn I guess is the same age as Novlan-mid 30s. So he fucked Poppy when he was a teen? I guess it’s possible, but just plain weird having him as the father. This show is so idiotic anymore.

Considering that Luna tried to kill Steffy, I don't see her moving in with them as plausible. Then again, this show is beyond dumb. BTW, have they ever said where RJ has been?

They need to drop the love triangle. It is mind numbing at this point. I feel like the focus on the fashion industry could be more interesting if they delved more into that. Bring on a new competing fashion house. Do storylines about predatory fashion photographers. The beauty and fashion world is naturally full of drama, but BB rehashes the same cliched stories.

I also hate how they will focus on only two storylines and then out of nowhere they will bring up a character who hasn't been on screen in months and give them a storyline.

Being 30 minutes (they are shameless and don't even do 22 minutes but do like 17 minutes) it seems like they can't have too many characters or storylines and it makes the show flow poorly.

B&B is written for foreign markets where they make their money. This is why the show runs through story like crazy and wraps everything up so fast.

r210 That is patronizing to the foreign audience. But regardless, the show can be better.

I do not like Poopy.

I want Jack inside me shallowly.

[quote]Bring on a new competing fashion house.

Good idea. The show hasn't been the same since the departure of Sally Spectra (Darlene Conley).

They tried it when Jaqueline bought Spectra. That did give us Ridge Jr in Bradon Beemer but it sort of fizzled. I don't know who does the Fashions don't know who does fashions on the show now but back in the hey day of the 90s, Sandra Bojin-Sedlick would design the fashions for the fashion shows. I don't know if the costume people do that anymore.

R207 It became idiotic over 10 years ago when they cut the cast in half.

I used to not quite get Ronn Moss.

Then, I realized the enigmatic cheekbones what's he really thinking WHO will Ridge choose? Brooke? Caroline? Taylor? WHO? WHO? WHO?

I thought I can't tell what he's even thinking?

And then, I realized THAT's the point. You don't know. So, you tune in tomorrow.

Putting other actors in that type of story simply doesn't work. Liam torn between Steffy and Hope? He's a goofy guy you want to have a beer with; he's not this enigmatic larger than life playboy who has it all.

The current Ridge is also a misfire. Hobo Ridge is accurate. It's like you can smell his smelly t-shirts off your screen.

Nobody cares. They're watching out of habit. And for Eric and Brooke.

[quote] Finn I guess is the same age as Novlan-mid 30s. So he fucked Poppy when he was a teen? I guess it’s possible,

Well, that's your story: having an older woman fuck a teenage boy gets played in the news. .. Has any American daytime soap ever done that story? Sounds rather foreign market telenovelish to me, not to mention porny. .. I know I've seen it happen on something from Telemundo before, with the age of consent often being lower in foreign countries. .. And the fact that Poppy is Finn's adoptive, non-bio aunt makes it more controversial. .. Where was Finn raised? Perhaps in some state where the age of consent is 16 or 17? Otherwise, they might be adding a statutory rape element to the controversy.

If this was mid-1980s ATWT, every salacious beat would be played out over 18 moths, involve the entire canvas, and crescendo in a devastating and emotionally satisfying end.

This is B&B. Li will shoot Poppy, Luna will shoot Li, Bill will shoot Luna, and three weeks later none of those ladies will ever be mentioned again.

Mints! I need mints! All this drama and unknown parentage! I need mints.

Poopy farts.

At this point, who DIDN'T Poppy fuck?

Sandra Bojin-Sedlick was the best costumer B&B ever had.

Li mentioned today that Poppy came to live with them, "When you were going to college or just finishing high school", implying he might have been 18.

I say it's gone too far. They have to make Luna Sheila's granddaighter. I want to see Steffis head spin that her perfect husband has a serial killer child.

Luna was on her way to being B&B's ingenue. I'm guessing the actress wanted out, so they accommodated her and made her the killer.

Either she realized she wanted back on, or the show threw money at her or both, so they bring her back on despite the fact that she's a killer.

Now, we have Bill being a total hypocrite -- he tried to bust Sheila but a few tears from Luna and all that's gone.

They're clearly making it up as they go along. It shows.

ENIGMATIC CHEEKBONES!!! W/W FOR YOU R217!!!

thanks R226.

I believe "enigmatic" was one of the words that appeared in BIG PRINT in the scripts.

Oh, God. They shot their wad a day early. Now tomorrow's episode will just be four scenes of Finn repteatedly asking and rephrasing the question, "Am I Luna's father?", with each ending on a close up of Poppy looking shocked or confused or embarrassed or frightened.

They aren't going to give us THAT answer on a Thursday.

What's the alternative? Brooke crying again?

Look at her fucked up face to see what damage your own tears can do.

I kind of love that Tiger-Li is Luna-tic's grandmother. Dr. Cunt.

Only by adoption, bitch! Biologically, the sow is mine!

Is this gearing towards a grooming/Me Too storyline (with the genders reversed) in regards to Finn and Poppy's past one night stand? I really hope Luna is directly related to Finn and Sheila. Steffy would lose her shit and would end up needing to be sedated or put in a strait-jacket.

they revealed the finn paternity storyline too fast.

"You put Steffy in a cage? Good job!"

R232, yeah, Finn said in today's episode that he lost his virginity to Poppy. Eww.

I noticed for the first time that the Poopy actress doesn’t have any tits. Flat as a board! Finn wouldn’t lose his virginity to a titless girl.

Finn us a Ken doll with no bump so maybe that worked out well for them.

r236 As if teen boys have standards.

r225 B&B does not throw money at any cast member.

[quote] Is this gearing towards a grooming/Me Too storyline (with the genders reversed) in regards to Finn and Poppy's past one night stand?

They chickened out on that, as Finn said, "There was nothing wrong with it. I'm adopted. I was of age." Plus, the whole scenario didn't sound like grooming. It was more like young love up on the rooftop. They even seemed to highlight that Finn and Poppy aren't that far apart in age. He said he'd just started college. She said something about that after having gotten her GED and driver's license, she'd taken off, but then needed a place to land. (IRL, the two actors are five years apart, so if they're playing that, then an 18-year old having sex with a 23-year old isn't that uncommon.)

Scott Clifton misidentifying Luke and Laura in interview with DNA magazine

R241, I can understand, maybe, Scott misspeaking; Jane played his mother and Tracy and Luke were involved or married.

But the editor should have checked in and just taken Jane Elliot out and put [Genie Francis] in brackets; send an email to the pub, notifying them of Scott's faux pas and that the edit was being made.

LOL! Yes Tony Geary and Jane Elliot went on the run to escape Frank Smith, the saved the world from being frozen by Mikos Cassadine.

There were so many gay-related questions in the interview that Clifton's brain brainfart regarding Elliot is understandable.

Scott makes me moist - down there.

That mistake could have been the magazine editor attempting to clarify for its Australian audience and inadvertently making an error

Scott needs more shirtless scenes

R247 That face isn't great.

Scott C looks ill

he's certainly cut and in shape R249

it must be hard to know when to stop.

he was SUCH a fattie before.

I think he also leans toward heavy. I remember when they resumed filming during Covid and he had immediately, it seemed, packed on the pounds.

Scott Clifton is like Billy Magnussen for me. They're both not traditionally handsome, but I find them really hot.

Scott Clifton is getting pussy like you wouldn’t believe since he divorced that cunt. GO Scott!

When Scott Clifton started at GH in 2003, he was a fattie. I was actually surprised JFP and Bob Guza cast someone so heavy in the role. Figured he must be very talented for them to overlook the weight issue. But he gradually lost the weight.

And yes, when B&B started taping again in 2020 after a four-month COVID shutdown, Clifton had put on some pounds, but quickly got that off.

Scott Clifton's first episode of GH -- December 31, 2003

r255 Scott Clicfton debuted as Dillon Q in April or May 2003. By the end of Dec. 2003, he was well established in the role and had lost a significant amount of weight, as you can see in that video.

In his first episodes, he was easily hitting 250 pounds.

I get moist down there while watching Scott.

Didn't his dad pass away? That may explain why he looks sick. La Toya Jackson looked skeletal right after Tito died. The stress from his death most likely aggravated her alleged eating disorder. It's happened to people before.

Okay, Smelly Girl has GOT to go.

"Grandaughter! Welcome to the only restaurant in Los Angeles! Have some pizza and then let's go on a killing spree!"

BB has good ratings plus global syndication. They can afford more sets.

I rarely make fun of soap acting because there just isn't enough time to fine-tune a performance in this genre, but Tanner Novlan channeled every bad soap actor in the history of soaps today. Charity Rahmer may have been more convincing.

Tanner sucks as an actor.

Tanner Novlan has always been a weak actor.

Do you think tanner would do better playing both roles of identical twins or as a character with DID/split personalities?

R265 = He can Biberty Biberty handle ONE role.

Tanner Novlan's best assets:

Let’s see the peen.

Luna should get a hobby, or a the very least start watching a daytime soap opera.

[Quote] Luna should get a hobby

My lovely grandaughter is wonderful and has lots of hobbies so you just--you just leave her alone! She collects people and puts them in cages! You might not get it. You might not understand. But that's a HOBBY. A sweet, good, old-fashioned HOBBY and I will kill ANYONE who tries to keep her from her hobby.

I talk about myself in third person.

It's ridiculous the way that Carter & Hope orgasm every time they catch a whiff of Daphne Rose's scent.

Daphne is average looking and borderline ugly.

Finn has no acting range at all. Holy geez he was so cringy today. He's the actor who thinks YELLING is "rage". ugh. Why exactly is Daphne involved in this? Who the fuck is she?

The Liberty Biberty guy earned his Emmy today!!!!! lololololol. He’s SO bad!

R275 when you’re that fucking hot, does it matter that he will never be the next Daniel Day Lewis? He’s on an escapist, daytime soap that’s been declining for 20 years. Bill Bell always said hire pretty faces, and they will learn to act. Tanner not learning much, but I’d rim him until the end of time.

Forget, Jack.

I think Finn's dad is Ronn Moss.

He's the baby that Morgan supposably aborted. That would mean Steffy would need to get a new dad. Maybe Dr. James Warwick is Steffy's and Phoebe's pop.

I have met Tanner. FWIW, he's a very nice guy. Friendly. Down to earth (as much as someone that gorgeous can be).

But, yeah, that was pretty bad. No Performer of the Week from Soap Opera Weekly for him!

I was wondering if Finn could be Scott Granger (Sr.) son. It's not that improbable that he left behind a Sperm Bank donation before he died that Sheila managed to get her hands on;. Or Thorne Forrester.

Tanner’s dumb as a box of rocks.

[quote]I have met Tanner. FWIW, he's a very nice guy. Friendly. Down to earth (as much as someone that gorgeous can be).

He's a nice Canadian boy.

did they say that Finn and Steffy were celebrating an anniversary ?

they got married in AUGUST!!

Maybe it’s a half anniversary?

LINK.....Bradley Bell yapping about BB.....As DL predicted, Sheila and Luna are going to team up. Also cast photo.....RJ is not there. He's gone. Oddly enough resident gay psycho Remy DID make the cut.

No Thomas either. I thought I read somewhere Bell had storyline for Atkinson coming up. There’s no telling. This show defies any kind of logic anymore, even when played loosely by soap standards.

Love seeing Remy.

And Sheila can teach Luna how to toss a pizza.

I don't think the show realizes that cast photos are talked about only because of who is NOT in them.

Has Crew been shirtless yet?

I don't understand how this show can be written this way.

Bill keeping Luna at his home -- his wealth could have bought another house -- and he hasn't told visitors like Will and Liam, his own family, that she's there.

What could go wrong?

Li will go bananas ape shit when she finds out that Poppy seduced her son.

[quote]Has Crew been shirtless yet?

R287, no. In an episode a few days ago Will told Electra that they could take a swim in the pool, but we never got that scene. I did notice that Crew looks scrawnier than his dad Joshua did at that age, so maybe that's why Crew is shy about not taking his shirt off.

I don't think Crew has any problem being shirtless..

ouch-------->>EX RJ is looking rough. Sad.

[quote] Li will go bananas ape shit when she finds out that Poppy seduced her son.

Given what we heard, Finn will probably dispute that he was seduced. The way they framed it, it sounded pretty mutual.

People are asking Joshua Hoffman (newest Ex RJ) about his BB status, but he doesn't respond. He is now full on gymrat. yawn.

[quote]Oddly enough resident gay psycho Remy DID make the cut.

I wonder if Remy's presence in the group photo means that he will be returning to cause more trouble for Will & Electra?

I wouldn't be mad at Sheila, Luna, Remy, Legion of Doom trio

Ex-Rj’s career has gone down the shitter.

Watch for wardrobe to occasionally repurpose some of RJ's blouses on a few of the actresses; although rumor has it that Days of our Lives has also expressed interest in buying RJ's entire closet at second-hand discount for their "Leo Stark" character.

[quote] I don't think Crew has any problem being shirtless..

But does he drain his pasta?

There was a scene when RJ found out about Zende sleeping with Luna (all part of her master plan!) and he was screaming so much he sounded like Jack McFarland going into shrill mode.

[quote]I don't think Crew has any problem being shirtless..

R290, maybe not in his personal life, but he doesn't seem ready to go shirtless on the show.

Is Crew a homosexualist?

TV Insider has declared Tanner Novlan the "Daytime Performer of the Week"!!!..........HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA

Tanner Novlan is a revelation!

Tanner Novlan taught ME a few things! WOW!

WHO is that man, that fine, intriguing actor? I'm going to make him A STAR!

I could out do Tanner Novlan any day of the week.Just be sure there's an Oscar waiting for me when I do it.

I can hardly wait to say, "DAYTIME Emmy Winner, Tanner Novlan!"

Baytime Bemmy Binner

Anyone think Brooke is going to steal Daphne Rose’s hypnotic scent to start getting Ridge to fall in love with her again? They’ve already shown Ridge to be drawn to Daphne’s “beauty”.

Sorry but Daphne looks like a streetwalker. And WHY is she helping Steffy? I have a lot of friends, but I don't offer to fuck their enemies.

Granny Brooke will stage another scintillating photo shoot for Brooke's Bedroom in the hobo's living room. He won't be able to resist!

I gruan whenever Hoboridge and TeenagerTaylor are kissing and in walks Steffy, sho then proceeds to watch them, smiling.

Who the fuck watches theur parents swapping tongue?

"Oh my God, you guys! I just love seeing Dad make you all moist, Mom! And Dad! Nice hard-on in those sweats! I'm so happy Mom is taking your pole up her hole again! Finally--you two are cumming all over each other's faces again. No more Logans!"

r310 i dunno if he had a big dick I would offer.

It's silly that Luna had to hide in the bushes outside the window when Liam came to visit.

Bill's a moron for not telling his family when he's done.

Sheila will rub his face in his hypocrisy.

I hope.

I just want Shelia to go.."you look a lot like Brad Carlton."

I am still amazed BB has not given us a Sheila/Lauren crossover. What the fuck?. Lauren pops up with Deacon last year but the show won't give long term fans even a verbal catfight between Sheila and Lauren. In the same trip Lauren brags with Steffy about Sheila being dead but doesn't even meet Finn? Assholes.

No one wants to work with Kunterlin Brown.

I hope Steffy's plot with that French skanque gets exposed quick.

"Was Daphne here? I smell her." is not a good thing.

Daphne smells like snatch juice!

Where did Katie disappear to? She hasn't been seen for weeks.

So Will doesn't get laid? What's the point? Could we please speed up Lunas Mints tricks and get her knocked up by Will. We all know that's what's going to happen.

[quote]So Will doesn't get laid? What's the point?

Yeah, it's kind of unrealistic that two young, attractive people like Will & Electra haven't done anything more than kiss after being together for months now.

Maybe Electra only fucks gay guys?.........The rumors about Remy being Bill Spencers son or Sheilas son didn't go anywhere.......I also loved that Remys apartment was 3 times larger than Deacon and Sheilas apartment.

Are they outfitting Zende (or however you spell his name) in leftover mu-mus from the André Leon Talley estate?

R324 Is Will a virgin? .. Maybe he's hesitant because he knows Electra is experienced and learned a thing or two while pegging Remy.

A tight gray sweater is not Hobo Ridge's friend.

The gay actor who plays Remy got a boner while fighting with Gums Morrow.

Remy should ply Will with some Poppy Mints, then sneak into his bed at night wearing Daphne's perfume, some crotchless panties, and an Electra wig. .. As Remy lays next to Will in the dark, silently letting him know what he wants, Goofy Will would just think, "Whoa, a girl who likes anal!"

R328, nor is it ours.

Bell should have asked Ronn Moss look-a-like Jeffrey Meek, briefly Craig on ATWT.

"No one wants to work with Kimberlin Brown"

Truth.

Today's episode was an showcase of bad acting. Good god!

R333 You missed GH because nothing was as bad as that was. Even Mumbles was WORSE than normal. He actually did this. In a scene. For no reason. Ric was talking and MB acted like he had no fucking idea of what was going on.

Christian Weissmann (Remy) with the man he calls his lover on Valentine's Day. (Click to see the message on the photo.)

R335. That's an old photo if the Chargers are playing football.

I have a feeling Remy has had a lot of lovers. Just like we all did in our 20s.

R336 People sometimes choose older photos for special occasions and attach new messages to them. Doesn't really matter, though, they're currently together. The lover (Gavin) put up this photo of them the same day with the caption, "I love love."

According to the capsule previews for this coming week, Remy is returning to the show -- it says he will start off by asking for his job back at Il Giardino.

He can have his job back if Deacon chooses, but, so help me God, I'll snap that stringbean if he falls in love with my grandaughter Luma only to turn out to also be my grandson, my uterus having spat out demon spawn for decades.

As DL has speculated, it seems like the villainy of Sheila/Remy/Luna is going to intersect. The allure of having a Spencer heir (via Will) is going to be too much for Sheila and Luna to resist. Remy will play the part of helping them break up Will and Electra. It doesn't have to make a lot of sense. Welcome to BB.

Instead of bussing tables at the pizza kitchen, Remy could probably make more money doing a couple of videos for Helix Studios as a way to introduce himself and roll out his Only Fans account.

R342 Yeah. He needs to cash in. This is not a long-term role. Just ask RJ.

Remy is a big ole queer.

LOL Remy has spent more time in jail than murderer and kidnapper Lunamint.

I was hoping that the previews for next week would feature Hope getting a vicious face slapping.

R345, Remy is still getting out of jail sooner than most people who did what he did. That's one of the things about this show (and many others of its type) that we're just expected to suspend our disbelief about. Same for Sheila, who should be in jail for life for her crimes. Psycho characters do short jail sentences in Soap world.

It doesn't surprise me that Remy is out. What were they holding him on?

R347, well, apart from posting fake nudes of Electra, he tried to hold her against her will and chased her to the top of a building and grabbed her and wouldn't let her go.

R348 ............ And?

R348 Playing devil's advocate here ...

The chase and action up on the top of the building would probably be looked at by the D.A. as an emotion-charged 'domestic' between two exes. .. And isn't Electra the one who broke in and entered Remy's apartment which is what kicked things off to begin with? .. D.A.'s usually don't want to get involved in such matters, and on the first go-around, will often issue warnings to stay away from one another, leading to restraining orders - especially since Electra wasn't physically injured. .. As I recall, when Will showed up, Electra was actually able to break free from Remy on her own, yet Will still charged at Remy and punched his lights out. A defense lawyer might ask, why isn't Electra being charged for breaking and entering nor Will being charged for assault?

As for the deepfake nudes Remy posted, I think the laws on this are just starting to appear. In fact at the time (late 2024) I imagined one of the reasons B&B may have done this story is because the subject was getting media attention in California at the time. Newsom signed some bills late in the year, but the laws didn't take effect until January 1. In the real world, what Remy did in 2024 may not be covered under the new criminal law, or at least the issue would be confused. (Electra's course of action would be civil law to sue Remy.) And even with the criminal law that was passed, it's my understanding that the punishment for first offenders is a maximum of 6 mos. in jail and/or a $1000 fine with summary probation. It would not be unbelievable to hear that Remy pleaded guilty to something less (thereby avoiding a trial) with the DA letting him go for time served, a fine, and probation. - jmho

I thought Deacon - who owns the apartment - is the one who suggested that Electra wait inside and opened the door for her. Also, Remy wouldn't let her leave - which sounds like kidnapping to me.

Since I don't recall the part about how Electra got into the apartment, you're probably right. But since she was not invited-expected by Remy, did she lie to Deacon to get in? In any event, she wasn't supposed to be there. .. But as I wrote above, everything that happened in the apartment would more than likely be looked at by the D.A. as a domestic between two exes. These conflicts with no witnesses can quickly descend into a "he-said she-said" type situation, and in the eyes of the D.A. aren't seen as being winnable at at trial. I'm in L.A. and personally know of two cases where things got far more out of hand between the couples than what we saw happen between these two. In the one, the guy was put in jail for a long weekend, but was released with no charges filed, just a restraining order. In the second, they kept the guy in holding until his partner could get all of her stuff out of the apartment they once shared. Again, no charges were filed by the D.A. despite the fact that she had to be treated at the hospital for some cuts to her face.

But they aren't exes. They were never anything more than friends.

R353 Oh, okay. I guess I misinterpreted and thought that they'd dated, since it had been mentioned that at one time they'd planned to move to New York City together. My bad.

Is Budig gone yet?

Budig ain’t going nowhere.

The problem with Budig is that she is so much shorter than Thorsten Kaye -- have you noticed that they have her wear huge heels?

R350, bravo! Nice analysis.

Now...why hasn't Carter been disbarred and arrested for fraud when he got Ridge and Steffy to sign those documents giving him control of Forrester?

Watching for the first time in a long time today. When did Zende get so fat?

Thorsten Kaye and Chris McKenna (who just sucked Frank Valentini’s dick enough to FINALLY get a job on GH) look alike. That’s all.

All the men on this show need to stay away from the Craft Services table. Liam puffs up if he eats a cupcake, Eric's chin goes straight to his chest, Bill's stomache juts out over his ridiculously tight douchebag jeans, Hobo Ridge has man boobs, and now Zende looks like he's ballooning into a Babapapa.

Is that even the same Zende r361? He has another chin now!

Zende's kaftan collection is forthcoming.

On Reddit, there's a post about how Taylor abd Steffi are awful in real life, but I can't find a link to the actual story the posters are all talking about. Apparently, Ms. Wood is falling out of favor.

Jacqueline MacUntess Would

But never heard anything about NuNuTaylor. IRL, she's besties with Greg Rikaart and his husband. They lived right next door to each other for years and years and were always goofing on each other. Still do.

Fat Zende!! And his gay shirt that doesn't fit.

Zende has MOOBS.

Zende developing into a character to fill the void left by sally Spectra.

Zende Spectra!!!

Zally.

It's February in Southern California. Why are they having an AC problem? If anything, they should have written that they're having a heating problem. There have been several periods over the last couple months in L.A. when it's been in the 40s at night. One time the temp in L.A. was lower than NYC.

I love how everyone who runs into Steffi brings up, out of the blue, how Luna put her in a cage. Imagine one of your friends was locked in a cage and traumatized. Would you just randomly bring it up? No. But here everybody isays things like, "I love these cookies! By the way, remember that time Finn's crazy cousin loved you up in a cage? That was CRAZY!"

"Carter was my best friend"-----------Ridge

I have watched this show for 30 years. The only friend you've ever had is the moving company that keeps moving your shit between Brooke's house and Taylors house.

The way Sheila was talking to Remy, it almost seemed like she was suggesting that Dollar Bill could eventually decide to have "Dario" stick around to become to his live-in houseboy so that he could be on hand to take care of other things besides the AC.

Perhaps this could evolve into an AC/DC story with Bill pounding Remy's ass when he has nothing better going on.

This would not be far-fetched for "one of the richest men in Los Angeles."

Were the writers hinting at something when Sheila told Remy, "I see a part of myself in you"? Could he be one of her grandchildren? Could he and horny Luna be destined for one of the Bell soaps cliche "relatives almost fucking" stories?

Remy is a flaming homo!

You mean to tell me that Bill doesn't have a handyman on retainer or can't go to his phone and use the Task Rabbit app?

Hilarious that "one of the richest men in Los Angeles" (per Sheila) can bribe a judge to get a murderer released from prison, yet he can't flash some cash and entice some 24/7 AC repairman to move him to the front of the line. RME.

R375 You mean could he be Mary Warwick's or Daisy's son from an offscreen teenage pregnancy? Or even Ryder's? Daisy and Ryder are both at least 35 now (in story) since they were born a few years before 1990.

Maybe a past offscreen teenage pregnancy mixed with SORAS? I'm surprised they didn't revisit Mary and Diana since unlike Daisy and Ryder they both originated on B&B and they definitely exist on that show.

Whereas Daisy, Ryder, Sarah Smythe and whoever Pheila actually was either isn't canon or is silently canon on B&B (2006-2012 had the most ridiculous storylines on Y&R, they should've fired that hack Maria Arena Bell a lot sooner).

The asinine Pheila (Shephyllis) story on Y&R was penned by Lynn Marie Latham, not Maria Arena Bell.

It's too bad that Zende (Delon de Metz) has gained so much weight -- he was very hot a few years ago:

R380 Yeah. Sorry about that. I was off by a year or so.

It might be easier to believe that Diana Carter (Marone) grew up to become Remy.

I'm not sure about this, but I think B&B is acting like the whole Marone storyline didn't happen, which means all of the story surrounding anything Marone is just never to be mentioned. I think Brooke has a Marone child, and so does Shelia, whom we'll probably never see again.

What a disgrace.

Stefffi sure came off DUMB to not connect the dots that Luna was the child Finn was talking about.

I guess that's why they had to add all that OVERDRAMATIC musak at the end so viewers wouldn't think this was a sitcom without a laugh track.

Liberty bibberty guy is so gonna win an Emmy!!!!!!

a DAYTIME Emmy

You mean a DAYTIME Bemmy

They got Remy & Luna together fast, just like DL predicted would happen.

I love alcoholic Taylor drinking beer with Ridge. She's going to need a case of Vodka when Ridge bounces back to Brooke for the umpteenth time.

Maybe her new step granddaughter will take her out.

Putting a yellow toolbox in Remy’s hand will not make him seem less gay. He just reeks of homosexuality. Put Remy with Gums Morrow. Now THEY had chemistry!

Crew inherited his dad's charm and sex appeal, but, sadly, he got mom's gums.

When's the last time BB put a hot male actor on contract? Years? I'm not counting Crew because he hasn't taken off his shirt after six months. How realistic is that?

Ironically, I'd prefer Jacob back as Lucky now instead of continuing to see Jonathan in the part; Jacob transformed from child into man.

Jonathan is still a waif.

Remy and Luna are my new favorite couple, but the rest of the show has been so over the top (like a telenovela) the last few days. How does the chick who plays Steffy have so many Emmys, granted they're Daytime Emmys, but her performance and the guy who plays her hot husband was just way too much. Even Ron Moss was like, damn, he can't act.

"Luna's father is me."

WHO TALKS LIKE THAT?

Oh, those crazy criminal kids! Who will Remy and Luna murder first?

[Quote]Who will Remy and Luna murder first?

Extra-large Zende..It'll count as a double homicide!

Watching Finn TRY to act is painful.

[quote]How does the chick who plays Steffy have so many Emmys

Probably because the competition is very weak in recent years -- there are only about 4 Daytime soaps left and many of the best actors have retired or passed on.

The Bell soaps hire beautiful people who can either act or not.

the stories keep going whether the actors can act or not.

Conversely, GH has lots of great actors; but the stories are all over the place.

R402. I dont appreciate your tone.

"I didnt know! I didn't know!"

Ron Moss Line Delivery of the Day Award goes to. . .

Every time Steffy and NuNuTaylor are in a scene all I see is how much bigger Steffy's head is compared to her mother's.

Steffy is a raging cunt she-beast!!!

[Quote]all I see is how much bigger Steffy's head is compared to her mother's.

It took them days to reattach my legs after she rode down my birth canal with that giant head and split me apart.

I’m cast my vote for Tanner as Outstanding Lead Actor at the Daytime Emmys.

Charity Rahmer is a better actor than Tanner.

This means Tanner will soon receive a Daytime Emmy nomination.

Supposedly steffys head made it through Taylor’s birth canal.

Such lousy over the top scenery chewing from someone as plastic and frozen looking as JMW. Does she use the same cosmetic surgeon as Hunter Tylo?

I've always been Team Taylor and Team Hope myself.

TVI offers its best performer(s) again. This time, I more agree with the choices.

Thorsten Kay has two DT Emmys. Billy Warlock, Julie Pinson, Justin Torkildsen, and Amelia Heinle all have DT Emmys.

Beverlee McKinsey, Grant Aleksander, Vicky Wyndham, Kathryn Hays do not.

Let's not take awards so seriously.

Why the hell would McKinsey have gotten an Emmy??? She was terrible.

You're fired, R416. From the DL. From the marriage. From this club. From the entire Web if I have anything to say about it.

I think the air would be a little sweeter without the stench of your presence!

Goodbye, R416

[quote] Let's not take awards so seriously.

Daytime Emmy Winner, Drew Tyler Bell !!

I'm laughing, because no amount loud, schmaltzy muzak tacked on at the end could make that scene between Finn and Luna work.

[quote] Beverlee McKinsey, Grant Aleksander, Vicky Wyndham, Kathryn Hays do not have Emmys.

Beverly McKinsey deserves an Emmy for her exit from Guiding Light when Jill Farren Phelps told BM to "read her contract" --------->>>

[bold] McKinsey later quipped that perhaps it was Phelps and the rest of the Guiding Light production team who should have read the contract. "They didn't read the contract! I read it very closely. I knew every word. The next day, they were all combing over the contract. Somebody said, 'Maybe Beverlee's not familiar with the contract.' Well, of course she was! She wrote it, you bozos. She wrote it! I've had this out clause since 1986. I asked for it and it was P&G that determined how much notice they wanted me to give – and they chose eight weeks." [/bold]

Today's show, that music at the end, Tanner's acting. I swear to God Brad Bell is punking daytime viewers. That was just embarrassing.

Tanner - future Oscar winner for sure!

Tanner Novlan in his modeling days:

if it makes a difference to anyone.... Tanner's a sweetheart. Nice to everyone at the show. Good family man.

Will he win a Daytime Emmy like Shemar Moore or Julie Pinson?

Who knows.

I'm sure that Tanner is a great person, but one has nothing to do with the other. He's just not a good actor, in a long line of nice guy/bad acting soap actors. Nothing against him. He's perfected the passing a kidney stone method of acting.

ITA 100% ... one truly has nothing to do with the other. He should be able to act if he's going to be in that role or any other.

There aren't as many nice guys in soaps as you might think. Correction: there are plenty of 'nice' guys.

I should have written that Tanner comes off more as kind -- like Cameron. Big difference.

Looks like next week we will see major confrontations between Steffy & Luna and Li & Poppy.

I laughed out loud during the teaser for next week when Steffy called her step daughter, "This Luna-tic"

Luna-Tic a fun insult for Luna. Reminds me of when they used to call Finns sister CRAZY DAISY on YR.

nothing will beat Greenlee Smythe calling Bianca "Lesbianca"

Blair on OLTL called Luna "Luna-tic" decades ago.

Dani on "Beyond the Gates" just referred to her ex-husband's new, young, home-wrecking wife, "Hayley," as "Fail-ey."

Poor Tanner Novlan. Most new soap actors improve over time as they get used to the medium. He’s been there 4 years, and he has actually gotten worse in his acting.

Is this Luna-tic yarn the only story they have going on? Day after day.

I'd be more interested in watching Remy set up his Chaturbate web cam and test out his Lovense before going live.

Don't forget Daphne's magic scarf! Ooh la la ...

NuGreenlee touching herself……..

Does Tanner Novlan shave his balls? I'm taking a survey...

So Luna has been pardoned? Was it Trump who did it? We know he likes to pardon violent criminals.

The Governor of California is responsible for pardoning individuals convicted of crimes by a California state court.

This is one of the stupidest legal twists every written on a daytime soap opera. We're obviously in fantasyland.

This storyline really needs to pick up. Look, we all know the "Luna wants Bill" angle. So why not do what Sheila and Daisy Carter did---drug him and fuck him and get pregnant? And if not Bill, why not slip Will the spiked drink? Geez writers....Get on with it. [bold] Will (unbelievable) virgin WILL ever get laid? [/bold]

Remy could very easily be Nick Marones son. Which makes him the son BOTH Taylor and Brooke turned their backs on.

Does Brad's writing staff have a 5 day outline let alone a 6 month Bible? Everyday feels like they just came up with the storyline and wrote it minutes before filming.

R441, I suspect they're just making it up as they go along.

Luna was posed to be the new heroine. She gets written out fast so they make her a killer.

The show wants her back so they make her feel badly she's a killed and now she's out.

[quote]The Governor of California is responsible for pardoning individuals convicted of crimes by a California state court.

R439, yeah, it's unlikely that the Governor would want to pardon a woman who has killed 2 men in cold blood and locked up another woman in a cage and nearly killed her, too.

[quote]Will (unbelievable) virgin WILL ever get laid?

R440, I agree that it's unrealistic that Will doesn't appear to have had sex yet (unless it's supposedly happened off screen). He and Electra don't seem to have done more than kiss after all this time.

My name is Will. I don't have sex in the BB Universe. I'm waiting to "make love".

Any day now, Hayes will show up and be a twenty-year old home from college.

Don't forget me!

Jack Forrester!

While Will waits to "make love," maybe Remy can offer to give him a "no-strings-attached blow job" in the gender neutral bathroom at The Pizza Hut.

Remy just oozes gay.

Hopefully Will & Remy will get some more scenes together soon.

Luna gets the Mafia kiss from Sheila next week. Right on the snacker!

Steffy must die now that these two are being teamed up. Please.

Is Sheila gonna be a lez now???

R451. That wasn't in my contract.

Sheila and Sugar were obviously galpals.

Sheila and Sugar, sitting on the bus! C-U-N-N-I-Lingus!

Matsuda and Wood playing outraged over Poppy and Luna was pretty good

I'm so tired of people being ok with psychos

Who can't wait to see JMW win her FOURTH Lead Actress Daytime Emmy!?

Sleestak should be getting nervous about her six-win record. JMW is still in her 30s.

R456. I dont like it atall

JMW deserves many Emmys for propping up the Liberty Biberty guy!

He actually is better around her.

Tanner Novlan underwear modelling:

R460. Huge balls! Skinny dick.

That's one of those boxer briefs with a built-in pouch to accentuate what you have.

JMW is procreating again. Baby No. 5 on the way.

Sorry but NOBODY needs five fucking kids. [bold] And if you are naming your brats stupid things like "Valor" and "Rise" you are probably MAGA. [/bold] Her pregnancies are probably a running joke (behind her back) on the BB set.

Is JMW Catholic? Why all the babies?

The husband looks FABULOUS!!

Based on the latest episode, they are getting Luna & Sheila together now, just as was predicted on this thread.

Why wouldn't they get together? Lunatic is Sheila's granddaughter.

Ol' Granny Sheila at the pizza hut means free cheesy bread sticks!

JMW wants more kids than Emmys.

This is going to be a shorter week than usual for B&B since Thursday and Friday will have basketball coverage on instead.

I remember when that used to be bad news or when shows would climax something big on those wednesdays.

This wasn't in March; it was Thanksgiving 1989. The Weds show ended with Sierra coming back from the dead on ATWT; couldn't wait till Monday.

Now, we have perfume lady on B&B; and Traci being duped on Y&R

Too bad BB doesn't play into the history of Cricket (Christine) and Sheila---who was married to Christines brother, Scott Grainger and kidnapped Chistine's nephew, Scotty. But I'm guessing Cricket will show up at the Forresters to act like a sad 50-year-old fangirl drooling over Danny Romalotti.

If Cricket encounters Sheila, she'll probably ask her if she can go off menu and choose her own toppings for the pizza.

R473 = Exactly..........

How 1995 Sheila would greet Cricket------>>>"Hello Christine. You and Paul must be so thrilled to be parents. Whoops. I forgot. I guess you're dead baby isn't uppermost in my mind".

The preview for next week showed Luna sitting down with Will at Il Giardino. At least it looks like something interesting may finally happen to Will's story.

R474, Bell wasn't known for his dialogue but that was brilliant; ESPECIALLY as Lauren's baby WAS uppermost in her mind as she was raising him!

Heather Tom is being honored by writing, directing and performing in an all women B&B episode.

Glad her flareup of Pinched Sphincter Syndrome has eased!

R477. Will Remy be the star of that episode?

They should spray his ass with baby oil for a sweaty encounter.

isn't that a man with her in the picture?

Damn, Jacquie is just popping out the babies.

Maybe B&B will do an all-male show and Jacqui's kids can star in it.

How 'bout an all-male show where Carter satisfies Will and Remy simultaneously.

“Wills initiation”

I'm saving my virginity for someone special.

^ But what porn do you look at when you rub one out?

He looks like he watches Lesbian Porn.

I was thinking "Hot Guys Fuck" -- yet being rather clueless that the videos focus on the guys' muscles, ass, dick, and face instead of the girl being fucked.

R481 She needs the placenta that contains half of her DNA in order to make her facial rejuvenation serum.

Friday's episode is supposed to have Luna meeting up with Will at Il Giardino.

Known on Yelp as Ill Giardia.

Hobo Ridge sounds like the name of a place.

How many cocks has heterosexualist Tanner Novlan taken bareback over the years?

Josh Morrow’s son is awkward. He’s a bad actor.

He really is. I was howling during his scene with Luna

I think Crew Morrow does okay within the parameters he works in.

At least the Will Spencer storyline looks like it could take a new twist. The closeups on the faces of Will & Luna in the final seconds of the episode made the direction a little more creative than usual.

I did find the Il Giardino scenes to be a little odd: first Will tells Electra that he wants to take their relationship to the next level while they are sitting in the middle of the restaurant for anyone to overhear, and then Luna comes along later and tells Will she wants to be a friend with benefits.

The Il Giardino scenes should have been triptych ending with Remy waltzing in and presenting hole to Will.

R464 Jacqui liked a few of Ingo’s anti-vax posts years back. She’s definitely MAGA. No vax but tons of Botox and filler. Makes sense!

Odd that Will was talking about his sex life (or lack thereof) with his Mom this week. Not a subject I would discuss with my Mother.

They should have used some history and had Katie ask Will if the acne on his butt was clearing up, advising her son that even if it isn't, he shouldn't let that deter him from pursuing a relationship, because any girl who wouldn't have sex with him because of that would show how superficial she is.

r499

Did he mention thinking of being on Sean Cody like her other son did?

Previews for next week if you need a good laugh today:

Sixty-something KKL doing her GILF routine in her pushup bra and crotchless panties again? That ought to win her a Daytime Emmy!

R501. That was KKL's (Brooke's) kid...he took it like a champ. He's very straight though...

R501 & R504, here is KKL's son bottoming like a champ:

R504, straight to bed

Granny Brooke in lingerie will be a ratings bonanza!!!!

I find it funny how they find ways to get Fynn's shirt off. He was in that scene with the little girl in a barely buttoned shirt.

I find it funny that thespiain't Tanner Novlan is the male lead of this show.

Tanner is being totally underutilized.

That shirtless scene of him in swimwear had him wearing TOTALLY BORING black board shorts.

Finn should have been wearing a snug, designer squarecut or perhaps a classic Brazilian sunga. .. This IS supposed to be a show about FASHION, isn't it? .. Also, such scenes should always feature a light-colored fabric in order to show off the goods.

Who's in charge here? .. At least Bill Bell knew to put "thespian" Ronn Moss in a Speedo.

R505. That's better than B&B these days.

R510, why hasn't Crew Morrow had a shirtless scene yet? That is the question.

So with that line about Liam's brain being deprived of oxygen, will they be taking him from moron to imbecile, or imbecile to idiot?

Ahhh am leavin ole Apple Valley an goin out to the real desert. Hobo Ridge is raaaht nex to Furnace Creek.

R505 — looks like he’s chewing gum… ughhh

It's ridiculous the way Steffy was allowed to go into the operating room while Liam was in critical condition and pester the doctors with questions.

I hope he has amnesia again.

Scott Clifton is so hot. I’d do him.

Unemployed Liam with amnesia might lead him to finding work at "Men Over 30" as a power bottom.

I LOVE Men Over 30...as friends.

CBS renews license for three years.

That's long enough for JMW to push out 3 more kids (after the 5th one she's currently incubating).

After the third one, things are probably so loose down there that they'll just drop out on their own.

If Dollar Bill can bribe the government to release serial killers and put on them on house arrest then wealthy petty emotionally unstable Forrester heiress and 38 year old high school mean girl and Karen Steffy can use her Forrester money to stand in the operating room and pester the surgical team desperately trying to save her pathetic pussy doormat of a simp Liam.

The hospital likely wouldn't even still be in business were it not for Forester donations. Certainly mot wihtout Spencer donations.

If Steffy wants to give enough money, she can stand in the operating room. Hell , she can perform the surgery herself if she forks over $20 million.

[quote] The hospital likely wouldn't even still be in business were it not for Forester donations.

Isn't the hospital they typically reference on this show said to be the real life Cedars Sinai Medical Center? It and UCLA typically jockey for the No. 1 hospital in the region.

Exteriors used for the hospital are of Cedars Sinai. But I don't believe they have ever identified it as Cedars in the dialogue.

Yes, Cedars Sinai and UCLA Medical Center are considered the top to hospitals in the Los Angeles area.

R527 I remember hearing them refer to Cedars in the dialogue several times over the years. This started early on in the show.

Thanks to Trump reversing course on tariffs for the 50th time, several minutes of today's episode was preempted by Breaking News coverage.

lol. You watch on broadcast tv? Are you 90? Serves you right to miss some.

Actually my 90 year old mother watches espn+ mostly.

R530, breaking news doesn't just interrupt broadcast tv. It interrupts it in real time on the streaming version. Sure, you can watch it later on the Paramount app without the interruption, but if you're watching it at the same time as it's broadcast on CBS, it's gonna get interrupted the same way.

The director must hate Scott Clifton. That camera angie--right up the nose--flatters no one. Add in the weird bandage wrapped around his head, and he looked fat and strangely circular.

NICK!

Give me Lesley Anne Down. They need a mature bitch.

Erika Slezak IS Jackie Marone!

Erika Slezak IS Mabel Douglas! .. John's mother.

Viki Sleestack IS the floating disembodied Darla head!

Where the hell is Remy? Did he discover Santa Monica Blvd?

Today's back-to-back scenes featuring yummy shirtless Carter and dull as dishwater NuNuTaylor certainly highlighted the fact that his tits are much bigger than hers.

But my dick is bigger AND blacker!

I burst out laughing at Luna showing up in sunglasses and a fake mustache to deliver pizza at Forrester

That was Luna??? I thought it was some Ancient Chinese Secret guy.

Luna wants some of that Will Spencer dick.

So does Remy.

Remy is so queer.

Remys real name is Jack Marone. Wait for it.....Nick returns after finding out his son was arrested.

I also think Nick is going to announce Massimos death. And maybe some info on Sheilas daughter Diana Marone.

As Diana a mature, regal woman? I can play that...

As mature and regal as Taylor.

Hopefully we will see Remy & Will in a new scene together soon:

Luna looked like she was wearing a pair of lavender Prevail® Heavy Absorbency Incontinence Underwear.

Incontinence underwear? I approve!

Beneficial Dryness Force!

R552. Youre so full of shit! Why don't you go change your Depends. Go change 'em!

Luna may have gotten a more positive response from Will if she'd been wearing a dirty jock strap stuffed with a zucchini.

What do we think of the fight between Sheila and Poppy?

R556 That poor tiramasu! I think it's beyond telling when a soap has you siding with a semi-deranged serial killer against a drug addict who groomed her own adopted then-adult teenage nephew into a one night stand and got pregnant as a result.

FINN: She's my cousin, she's my daughter, she's my cousin, she's my daughter....

I love how Bridget is around but nobody ever sees her son Logan.

I was hoping that Finn would stand-in for the daddy/daughter dance and Luna would show up! Creepy AF.

SHOCKER: Liam has an inoperable mass on his brain.

WOW! Who knew Liam had a brain ?!?!

That's a hemorrhoid, Bridget, not a mass on his brain.

R561 LOL! .. And Bridget won't admit this, but that "mass" was discovered by an orderly giving Liam a sponge bath.

Ashley Jones' frozen face... eek!

R563, yeah, I noticed that, too. Too much plastic surgery for Ashley Jones, perhaps?

Ashley Jones looks frozen faced. Why Ashley? You looked fine before. Why do this to yourself.

She's going for that Brenda Dickson look!

R566. Who?

Will Cricket Blair Teen Model run into her former sister-in-law, Sheila Grainger, this week?

Maybe Sheila can give Cricket extra cheese on her pepperoni pizza free of charge for old times' sake.

Or, more likely, she’d serve her actual crickets on pizza.

The Y&R characyers rarely run into Sheila when they visit LA. But, when they do, they all describe hher using stock B&B character ddialogue "She's a vile woman. A despicable human being. An animal."

So, if Cricket runs into Sheila, let's play a drinking game and see how drunk we get when the writers trot out the sane old lines again.

It's all so sad. Has there been a new character in the last 5 years -- 10 years? 15 years? -- who's enticed us the way Sheila did in 1990, Phyllis and Sharon and Malcolm did in 1994?

A big loss to these shows is that they're not scored or sweetened the same way. The built-in tension from the music has exposed just how boring these shows can be and are.

Who did Scott Clifton piss off? His exit story is terrible. And where is Wyatt, his BROTHER?

Does anybody really think Liam will die? This reminds me of The Last Holiday.

Finn will find a cure, only to lose Steffy to Liam in the process.

Oh, wait. This is B&B.

Liam will be miraculously cured by Thursday and this never mentioned agsin.

ROFL, r573!

Scott Cliffton has had nothing to do but twiddle his thumbs for over a year. At least this is giving him a storyline. Even if its a silly one.

But, yes, I suspect Finn will find a cure, but this crisis will make Steffy realize its Liam she loves, not Finn.

Meanwhile, Logan saint turned skank Hope will then move in on the newly single Finn.

Hmmm Then I'll convince Finn to take over the hospital and install me as head of surgery!

The surgery will make Liam realize that Finn is his one true love

Hope I told you to give him head.

Did someone say, give head?

Liam’s not gonna die. Dumb fraus believe this shit?

and where was RJ when Luna got out of jail?

YOu really can't get a family feel for these shows the way you could GL and ATWT.

How many HIPAA violations did Fynn break by blabbing Liam's medical condition to Steffy?

And why does Steffy look so awful? The last few weeks have gotten progressively worse.

I haven't watched a soap in years, what time is it on Eastern?

1:30pm on your local CBS station.

Liam's socks looked dirty.

They did. And right there, in the foreground. Someone really hates him. Between the unflattering camera angles, the knit cap that nade his face look like a wide oval, and the bad dialogue. ...someone has it out for Clifton.

I assumed that Steffi had the HCPOA since she was given all kinds of info in the hospital. But it's a stupid story.

We are going to need a PART IV to this thread soon.

Part IV here, my fellow B and B Bitches

Obviously, please include a photo in the first post of the next thread. Thank you.

I tried, r582. I pasted the link but the new thread wouldn't post until I removed the link to the photo. And it killed me because it was a great photo. Holding for Part V in case it's still relevant and in case I can get it to post then.

You can go ahead and post that photo in the new thread now.

And then post in again in Part 5 too.