What is your plan for escaping the US when it completely collapses?

I think that Europe and the Orient will collapse, before the USA.

America will last forever.

It's the refugees from other countries that will be begging to come to us.

Especially the trash from china and russia.

Ah, time for the weekly "I'm moving to Europe!" thread.

Immigration to the United States has been happening since the 1600's.

And it has never stopped.

Nice try, TROLL op.

The USA is #1 when it comes to desirability among immigrants.

The entire planet is about to become an authoritarian hellhole once CBDCs are rolled out.

These panicky-Mary 'where can I flee?!' threads have seemingly become a DL constant, we've gone down this rabbit hole at least 5 times this year.

I don’t qualify to get into Canada, which suggests that Australia and New Zealand would be similarly picky, England is too expensive, and I only speak English. Hence, I’ll be right here, thinking that the apocalypse is absolutely nowhere near as fun and stylish as my movie viewing led me to expect.

You all are some bitter bitches. Why do I continue to pay to participate?

R2

[quote]America will last forever.

Of course it will.

OP, have you been reading the new lately? The US is one of the better bets for the future.

Hawaii. To me, it's not really the USA, and it's the only option I'd consider People that know the territory can completely disappear there. You'd be surprised.

I have dual US/EU membership. I will go to Italy or France.

My grandfather was from Italy, but my dad didn't claim citizenship, I heard that makes me ineligible because he broke the chain? Wtf?

a country with closed borders OP

What about Poland, OP? Projected to be EU's new powerhouse.

is Poland near Russia and the Ukraine?

Yes, R16. But unlike Germany and France, Poland will be leading the EU soon enough.

There'll be nowhere on earth to escape to. The entire world will be adopting CBDC, and we'll all be living under a surveillance state that would make Xi Jinping blush.

Op, how much German descent do you need to qualify and how recent does it need to be?

Germans are freezing their asses off this winter, along with many other European nations and the UK. Their inflation is even worse than the US's, too.

Maybe read a newspaper sometime.

Switzerland's the world's best run country but it's too expensive. France is too full of annoying Frenchmen. So the UK it is.

In reality, nada. In my fantasies...France or England. I'll be here, though.

R20, that's right. The world is changing quickly put people aren't keeping up on what is happening.

[quote] The world is changing quickly put people aren't keeping up on what is happening.

What in the hell are you talking about?

Everything has been pretty much the same, for the past couple of years.

OP maybe you should ask these people

R19 There are a lot of factors here so it’s hard to answer. But generally, I think they had to come to the US after 1904.

I watch International HouseHunters and Mediterranean HouseHunters. I’m obsessed with the coast Spain , Portugal , France and Italy. I wish I could go there. They seem to have decent rents for gorgeous views. Why the fuck am I still here?

Because you're fat and nobody wants Americans in their countries R27.

Stay in the USA Work will set you free. Work work work The greatest joy is duty. Work work work

my ancestors were driven out of France during the French Revolution, then Haiti when the slaves had there uprising

I'm not going anywhere. Fuck them, this my home.

America will not suddenly or completely collapse. It will continue to disintegrate/degenerate, with increasing social upheaval, violence, chaos and the inability to maintain a modicum of social order and law. At that point, it will break up into smaller, easier to administer entities, giving populations greater social stability and increased quality of life.

OP, with all due respect, we neither want nor need you.

It it’s very American of you to blithely assume that we do.

R33 As if America wants everyone that we get?

mexico city, fab 2 bdrm apt for $500.....so cheap, ho's cheap too

I'm taking a time machine to go back to Ancient Rome.

Non-residents can’t stay in the eurozone countries for more than 90 days at a time. Assuming you can’t quickly qualify for a special visa . . .

Post-Brexit, could you stay, say, in France for 90 days, move to the UK for 90 more days, spend five days outside of both; then return to France for 90, and so on?

Iceland.

My partner traveled here from Mexico and got a veterinary medicine degree. He kept telling me over and over again in the past that things here are not as bad as in Mexico, but the medical system here is a complete disaster as well as many other things. He’s starting to change his mind. So we may move back there. It’s a neutral country like Switzerland and they don’t get involved in wars so you can live quietly.

It’s sad to see the United States going down

I don't know if the US will collapse but unless you're a billionaire, you won't enjoy living here. Corporations and billionaires will own most of the homes and farms, no one will be able to afford a new car, or medical care. No one will have a good pension. The middle class will become more and more the underclass, serving corporate masters. Billions of dollars will continue to fund wars while nothing is done about domastic crises like homelessness.

R40 that’s a very good point. I live in a rural area. I’ve already felt the pressure to either sell to billionaires or get blackballed by them. This is because I own a farm. I refuse to give up my farm.

I think the best way to deal with that situation is to not respond in any way and to become invisible in one way or the other while keeping your cash flow under a different name. A country boy will survive💔💪🖕👍🏽🥦😤😎🤣

I have no desire to even visit Europe, let alone move there. If I were to "escape," I'd head for either somewhere in South America, Japan, or the Caribbean.

Europe has never appealed to me for some reason. Even as a vacation spot.

Good luck R42 - with that attitude, you’ll need it.

It's not an "attitude," r43. I just have no interest in the European continent whatsoever and never have. I'll read about it and its history all day, but to be physically present upon its soil is not my cup of tea. Everything isn't for everyone. Deal with it.

If the US falls the rest of the world will tumble like dominoes. There will be no place to run and hide. We got our start fighting tyranny, might as well end on the same note.

“A coward dies a thousand deaths, a hero dies but once.” – William Shakespeare

R42 will get chewed up and spat out in South America, Japan, and the Caribbean and we all know it.

I just got fucked and bred by a former college linebacker. Men like this can't get enough of me and feel like they need to protect me. I have an army of tops on my side. I am safe from Q nuts and Trump fags.

R20 as someone living in Germany chiming in: Nobody is freezing their asses off — don't exaggerate and don't believe everything you read.

[quote]My grandfather was from Italy, but my dad didn't claim citizenship, I heard that makes me ineligible because he broke the chain?

R13 If your grandfather was born in Italy and was an Italian citizen when your father was born, it's possible to apply for Italian citizenship through grandparents. However, you can only qualify in this way if your parent has not since renounced their right to Italian citizenship, and most who came to the US never renounced their citizenship to their home country, so look into it further and perhaps consult an attorney. You can have multiple passports and citizenships because the US doesn't require people to renounce their citizenship from their home country. Based on what you said, I'm pretty sure you can get an Italian passport.

[quote]Op, how much German descent do you need to qualify and how recent does it need to be?

Immigration or securing citizenship to other countries is going to be a tough road for those Americans who can't do the simplest Google search.

Wyoming.

[quote]Non-residents can’t stay in the eurozone countries for more than 90 days at a time. Assuming you can’t quickly qualify for a special visa . . .

[quote]Post-Brexit, could you stay, say, in France for 90 days, move to the UK for 90 more days, spend five days outside of both; then return to France for 90, and so on?

R37: The 90-day rule for traveling to the 26 Schengen Zone countries within Europe is measured in a rolling 180-day calendar. Arrive 1 January and stay 90 days departing 31 March and you can't return until 180 days after 1 January (or measured from whatever the date of your arrival.) You could go back and forth multiple times provided you don't exceed 90 days in the Schengen Zone within the 180 days measures from your first arrival date. You can not move from Italy to France to extend your time frame: both are part pf the Schengen Zone and travel within it is cumulative.

American citizens may stay in the UK as tourists for up to six months.per visit. There is no stated limit on how soon you could return and repeat, however you are likely to attract the attention of immigration and border control officials who could turn you away if there were unresolved questions about your financial self-sufficiency, purpose of visit, and your non-reliance upon UK income or any broadly considered form of public assistance.

An American citizen could visit the Schengen Zone for 90 days then go to the UK for 6 months, then jump back to the Schengen Zone countries for 90 days. In theory he could jump back to the UK and repeat, or go back to the U.S. for a buffer three months and do the who thing again.

We get this thread topic so often that it spawned this thread....

I hold dual citizenship and will be heading to bella Italia upon retirement.

Not that Italy is "better" but I have more extended family there thus a better support system in my dotage.

Oh, pls.

You'll just stay in Vladivostok, Sveta.

I wouldn't go to Europe. It will be full of muslims soon.

I'll be there!

[Quote]My partner traveled here from Mexico and got a veterinary medicine degree. He kept telling me over and over again in the past that things here are not as bad as in Mexico, but the medical system here is a complete disaster as well as many other things. He’s starting to change his mind. So we may move back there. It’s a neutral country like Switzerland and they don’t get involved in wars so you can live quietly.

Good luck with that

I have Swiss, Irish, Monégasque, and American citizenships. I'm not rich so will consider marriage proposals from wealthy horse-hung men who are well groomed and polite. No need to be handsome or well-educated. Any age. Fats and Fems are welcome.

I'll live beside the ocean, leave the fire behind, swim out past the breakers and watch the world die. I'll have my big black boots and an old suitcase too.

[quote]Especially the trash from china and russia.

And the Middle East.

R8 needs to go back where she came from.

Selma, Alabama.

I'm set. With EU citizenship through two countries and (and American citizenship by birth and most of my years) I've been living very happily in Europe for a few years, from before things in the U.S. got especially odd.

Were I still in the U.S. however, I would have been looking for a new country to call home, not so much to escape "complete collapse," or whatever form that takes, but because the ideal of living in new places has always appealed to me. Early retirement in another country would have called me, not to escape one place but for the pleasure of discovery in another that was a better match for me.

Thanks R52

Sounds like a plan

if the US is crazy enough to re-elect T(increasingly Nazi-like)FG

You can stay with me. Please bring food.

I'll stay. If you love a country, you don't just leave and move on when things get tough. Why do you think so many Mexicans and South Americans are breaking into the US? They gave up on their homes. You have to stay if you really want to fix things. You can't do so from outside the nation, unless you're the president or king. If you don't fight to make things better at home, then who will? I mean, how will things ever get better again? With the best and brightest, most hard-working people, pouring out, how can there ever be true and profound reform or redemption?

Isn't it odd the way two first world nations, the US and Canada, are neighbored by a bunch of poor third world nations? They leave instead of doing the work of fixing their own country's problems. It's sad. Things never improve for Mexico et al.

I actually think the US won't completely collapse but it might enter into a protracted and painful civil war.

Having a backup plan isn't a bad idea in case of the worst scenario.

R25, I didn't click that link, but Lens Dunham did leave America. She moved to Wales. She may be back in America now, since Biden got elected. But she did leave a few years.

Seriously, it’s very complex and expensive to take up residency in another country. My friends who always threaten to leave the Country expect people to be shocked. None of them actually have the means or capacity to go settle in the Eu nor any other desirable settings. Most people who say “That does it! I’m moving to New Zealand/Canada/Switzerland, etc.” are looking more for attention than anything else.

What R68 said. The American Exceptionalists in this thread are idiotic. But that goes without saying.

I have dual citizenship through a grandparent so I am set.

[quote]If you love a country, you don't just leave and move on when things get tough.

Yeah, hon, for a lot of us that's a mighty big "if."

[Quote] I didn't click that link, but Lens Dunham did leave America. She moved to Wales. She may be back in America now, since Biden got elected. But she did leave a few years.

Lens married an Englishman. None of the people who threatened to leave @R25 made good on that promise. Pure hyperbole!

R32, that’s Russia’s plan for the US, right?

Thank goodness Biden was elected, the Democrats have held the Senate and claims of democracies demise were grossly exaggerated.

[quote][R42] will get chewed up and spat out in South America, Japan, and the Caribbean and we all know it.

Imagine being this bitter that some stranger on the internet doesn't give a good goddamn about your "precious" Europe nor wishes to visit any of its nations.

Stay mad about it, r46.

Aren't you building your luxury underground bunkers yet? Gettamoveon!

People with either financial means or genuine motivation can find attractive options of other countries in which to live. If they want to.

The truth is that money can smooth the way in some countries, money is the least of it.

Of the people who talk about changing countries, few are remotely serious, they're simply venting frustration in an "I wish I had Bezos' money" sort of way. Few have the flexibility. Few are willing to take on a big move, or have the patience to clear hurdles of visa requirements, language, different lifestyles, and unfamiliar landscapes and customs. Few would be at all comfortable taking on big, new challenges at any stage in their life. Few can be bothered to figure out the most basic outline of what's required to do it...because they know they will never take a step in that direction.

Look at the number of (non-military) U.S. citizens who live abroad. It's somewhere between 3 million and 8 million, or not more than 2% of the population. (Figures are broadly estimated and vary significantly. Even the number of U.S. college students abroad is estimated at only 300K, and almost half of them are in 5 countries.) The number of Americans living in Spain, for example, is less than 40,000, or 0.08% of the population; the American population in the UK represents 0.25% (for those DLers who complain if a British invasion of job robbers in the U.S., their percentage of the U.S. population is quite the same at 0.24%.). Americans living outside the U.S. hasn't been a big thing and isn't likely to become one.

The billionaires want us to eat bugs.

Meanwhile, they willbe eating filet mignon.

r79 Are we going to start using bottlecaps as currency, too? Radroach meat ain't cheap.

R75 prefers political instability and little brown men who will suck his cock for $2.

r81 I am a female. And you are incredibly racist. Shocker, considering the site. And Europe is becoming "browner," I'm sure you know. Which is likely the source of your bitterness.

Also r81...

You need to Google Paraguayan national race laws before you post things like that^

The world is an ugly place, America is not worse than other countries.

r84 Ok. I just did. Am I supposed to be seeing something special? Can you just point me to the specific detail that you're clearly hoping triggers the epiphany you'd like me to have regarding this matter?

R85 until recently they had a national policy of seeking out European immigration and forced interracial marriage in a effort to breed out their indigenous Guarani population. The goal was to create a national race so they'd be a homogenous country.

r86 I read that the reasoning for that started for a completely opposite goal.

[quote]In 1814, Francia issued a decree forbidding marriages between “European men” (namely, Spaniards) and women “known as Spanish” (born in Spain or of Spanish descent). European men would only be allowed to marry indigenous, mixed-race or black Paraguayan women.

[quote]By preventing the white elite from reproducing, Francia’s decree had the undeniable potential to allow the newly independent Paraguay to rise as a mixed-race nation.

It was illegal for Europeans to marry other Europeans. Mestizos could marry each other but not other mixed race or Afro-Paraguayans. It was solely for the purposes of getting rid of the elite European Spaniards and keeping the indigenous Mestizos as the dominate race in power.

Than “some” other countries, R84.

Costa Rica

Problem is most people can't move to another country. Countries have immigration systems and you have to have a residency and/or a work permit to live there. In Europe at any rate.

I'm lucky. I'm a dual US/UK citizen and have a Swiss C permit on file.

Based on this, I can say don't even think about Finland.

They will work you to the bone.

I think a Senator Herschel Walker could be disturbing enough to make people consider a move, LOL.

R91 is a frau ... an Instagram frau.

Israel, I’m Jewish, I’m not afraid of the constant conflicts with their neighbors…, I’m more afraid of Anti Semites in America

I’m hoping to rise up as a brutal warlord and seize control of the American southwest

R94 Then you would be the person to ask…… what do Israeli Jews really think of Palestinians? I’m so curious about this.

Nobody will take me. See you at the Facist Christian Floating Drumline festivals. I will be the one with the cage forced to watch withthe others.

There’s nowhere to hide. I live in SF and it would cost me thousands of dollars to move. At present, I’m perfectly fine here. Maybe in 30 years Florida will be bombing us, but right now it’s better than 99% places in the world.

[quote]There’s nowhere to hide. I live in SF and it would cost me thousands of dollars to move.

[quote]...but right now it’s better than 99% places in the world.

Do you not get out much? I suspect that in most places in the U.S. a move to another country would cost thousands of dollars, even with hippie friends and a white van. And where have you travelled that you think that San Francisco is better than 99% of places in the world? I like San Francisco but assuming you would only consider moving to a place that had a strong combination of some serious attributes, it wouldn't be difficult to come up with a list of 100 cities outside the U.S. that would equal or better many of SF's attributes.

Not so for Costa Rica r90. You only need proof of a $1,000 minimum monthly income.

OP, you’re a moron and Germany can have you. Although I think they will swiftly lose patience with you and kick you out.

If the OP and Amy Schumer leave, I'm staying

R96 They get along better than what you see on the news. Of course the extremest on both sides will always hate each other but in general all the apartheid you hear about is bullshit. Jews and Arabs in Israel work together in hospital, and even the police force....Gaza, when you could go down the streets on Google Earth was like everywhere else, nice setons and shitholes

Check out this show if its still running...its a comedy shows the life of a cop who kinda fucks up.......showing everyone working together

This is a great show too.

Um. This.

With 330 million, third largest population in the world, well, it can't make room for all of us. Many wouldn't want us -unless it's doctors and tech ppl.

I think we're stuck here to fight it out amongst ourselves. At least we're already armed for it.

A bunch of weird renegade pompous brutes and bores (and I say that with love, if possible, being one of us)

German here: tender question: are you sure? I mean, I like it here but it's not as if it's a paradise. I would strongly advise against the East, and depending on where your priorities lie - culture, arts, nightlife, education - it's better to pick a small town or a big city. My advice (if you haven't stayed for a while in Germany already): come for a holiday and try couch-hopping. There are agencies that match you with people who basically let you sleep on their couch for a couple of nights. You'll get an insight how people live here and what concerns them. This will help you get a realistic picture.