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Best affordable gay-friendly cities in the US 2021

Thinking of moving out of Los Angeles and interested in gay-friendly cities, or cities where I can meet new gay friends. Also a city that has an apprciation for art and artists. Does anyone have any recommendations?

I thought about Palm Springs, but family members I don't want to see are moving to Palm Desert.

Other areas I thought about - Colorado, New Mexico, Pacific Northwest. I'd also really like to explore the east coast, mainly Massachusetts.

I want to avoid any states filled with Trump supporters and right-wing conservatives.

by Anonymousreply 262March 3, 2022 8:31 PM

Girl, stay where you are for now. When this pandemic is over there are definitely going to be winners and losers as far as cities go and it's best to adopt a wait and see attitude before you make any big decisions.

by Anonymousreply 1February 22, 2021 11:33 PM

[quote]I want to avoid any states filled with Trump supporters and right-wing conservatives.

May I suggest Tehran, Iran?

by Anonymousreply 2February 22, 2021 11:34 PM

Ashland, Oregon?

by Anonymousreply 3February 22, 2021 11:36 PM

Atlanta.

by Anonymousreply 4February 22, 2021 11:36 PM

Raleigh NC.

Madison WI.

Nashville TN.

Richmond VA.

Are some affordable but still nice B-cities.

Nothing in the Boston area is going to be considered affordable OP.

by Anonymousreply 5February 22, 2021 11:43 PM

R1 Just getting ideas at the moment.

R4 I've thought about Georgia. Is there anyone who resides there who can tell me what it's like.

by Anonymousreply 6February 23, 2021 7:37 PM

Are there any towns close to San Francisco that are affordable?

by Anonymousreply 7February 23, 2021 7:38 PM

minneapolis. if you can tolerate the cold - it's a great city and really affordable.

by Anonymousreply 8February 23, 2021 7:42 PM

I tell ya, amazing things are happening in Assboil, Arkansas!

by Anonymousreply 9February 23, 2021 7:42 PM

Laurel Mississippi

by Anonymousreply 10February 23, 2021 7:45 PM

Gay-friendly and affordable don't tend to go hand-in-hand, unfortunately.

by Anonymousreply 11February 23, 2021 7:45 PM

Affordable in the bay area r7?! Surely you jest.

by Anonymousreply 12February 23, 2021 7:47 PM

Midland, Texas

by Anonymousreply 13February 23, 2021 7:48 PM

r7: No. At least not by most people's definitions of "close" and "affordable."

by Anonymousreply 14February 23, 2021 7:51 PM

Philly is relatively affordable and very gay friendly - there are also smaller towns like New Hope nearby. Cleveland is another city that is affordable - I actually liked it and thought was gay friendly.

by Anonymousreply 15February 23, 2021 7:58 PM

New Hope, and Central Bucks county, are no longer affordable. The area has changed with the influx of people from NYC and NJ. As for bars, there is just the Cub Room, and it isn't much. The Raven, the Cartwheel and the Prelude are gone.

by Anonymousreply 16February 23, 2021 8:01 PM

I think Boston is great, but R5 is correct, it’s hardly “affordable” by most standards.

I’m very curious why you’d be deciding against Palm Springs because of relatives in Palm Desert. First off, it’s not like they’re the same neighborhood, and secondly, perhaps it’s about time you told them to fuck right off!

by Anonymousreply 17February 23, 2021 8:05 PM

Cleveland and Columbus

Las Vegas

Omaha and Kansas City

New Orleans

by Anonymousreply 18February 23, 2021 8:08 PM

[quote]Are there any towns close to San Francisco that are affordable?

Santa Rosa maybe. Or Vallejo or Fairfield. Sacramento is farther, but more affordable.

by Anonymousreply 19February 24, 2021 1:30 AM

[quote] I’m very curious why you’d be deciding against Palm Springs because of relatives in Palm Desert. First off, it’s not like they’re the same neighborhood, and secondly, perhaps it’s about time you told them to fuck right off!

They are Trumpers and devout Christians. I don't want them just showing up at my place unannounced whenever they feel like it.

by Anonymousreply 20February 24, 2021 2:56 PM

Move to PS and tell your family not to show up unannounced, and avoid them if/when you want. You're a big boy now, YOU decided who you want to hang with.

by Anonymousreply 21February 24, 2021 3:02 PM

If you're looking for a year-round residence, just remember that Palm Springs is beastly hot for at least 4 months a year. As in you don't leave the house unless you need to.

Asheville NC is certainly gay-friendly though I don't know about the affordable part. Plus it's full-on Deplorableland in the surrounding areas, which is how Madison Cawthorne got into the House.

by Anonymousreply 22February 24, 2021 3:12 PM

Blue Ridge, Georgia

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by Anonymousreply 23February 24, 2021 3:13 PM

Anchorage is affordable and gay friendly.

by Anonymousreply 24February 24, 2021 3:14 PM

Saugatuck, MI Douglas, MI Ferndale MI Royal Oak MI Ann Arbor MI

by Anonymousreply 25February 24, 2021 3:15 PM

St. Petersburg, FL. Seriously. Lots of gays. And if you have $$, check out Gulfport FL specifically.

Here's a link to the last Pride event in 2019 (pre-covid).

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by Anonymousreply 26February 24, 2021 3:15 PM

Euerka Springs, Arkansas is a small town but has many gay owned business and various LGBT events throughout the year. Very scenic and more expensive than surrounding areas but probably way cheaper than anything on the coasts.

by Anonymousreply 27February 24, 2021 3:15 PM

Whoa. OP you need to move to PS to learn a very important lesson in self and boundaries. Also, no one really goes to palm desert.

by Anonymousreply 28February 24, 2021 3:16 PM

It's pretty sad that deplorables have made the option for gays moving to a small town in America this stressful.

by Anonymousreply 29February 24, 2021 3:18 PM

[quote]They are Trumpers and devout Christians. I don't want them just showing up at my place unannounced whenever they feel like it.

You're not required to answer your door or let anyone in your house. Just like you're not required to answer your phone.

by Anonymousreply 30February 24, 2021 3:24 PM

Is Philadelphia really that gay friendly outside of certain areas/neighborhoods? I perceived it as a bit more conservative, even though this is just word of mouth.

by Anonymousreply 31February 24, 2021 3:25 PM

Genoa City

by Anonymousreply 32February 24, 2021 3:28 PM

Are there any young gays in Palm Springs? I thought it was more of a retirement community.

by Anonymousreply 33February 24, 2021 3:28 PM

Portland, Seattle and Denver are all gay friendly but expensive. Cost of living is much less if you head out into the suburbs, but you will have to deal with more homophobes and gun slinging Trump supporters (especially outside of Denver).

by Anonymousreply 34February 24, 2021 3:31 PM

R26 I don't know if I can handle any area of Florida after seeing how many deplorables are living there.

by Anonymousreply 35February 24, 2021 3:31 PM

Why not just stay where you are?

by Anonymousreply 36February 24, 2021 3:34 PM

[quote]It's pretty sad that deplorables have made the option for gays moving to a small town in America this stressful.

No, this is not the right attitude. There are many, many small and medium-sized towns in America where no one cares if you're gay. Go where you want and make it gay. Don't be giving deplorables a veto power. If people are closed-minded you wouldn't want to live there anyway.

by Anonymousreply 37February 24, 2021 3:43 PM

Why do you even need to tell your family if you decide on PS?

by Anonymousreply 38February 24, 2021 3:46 PM

I agree with R26 on St. Pete -- it's fun and relaxed but Florida is getting more and more red. And there is a lunatic fringe. "Florida man" is not a joke.

I know it sounds weird, but many Great Lakes cities are worth checking out. Buffalo is deceptive -- there are large tracts of emptiness because so many people moved to the suburbs but stayed in the area. If a suburban life is what you want, you'll find great towns. If you're after urban housing there are some great neighborhoods, but you will also see a lot of decaying areas which is sad. Architecture and housing stock is amazing. Like most northern cities it committed the cardinal sin of putting highways along the lovely waterfront and through their famous park system. I think they're at least trying to undo a lot of the damage, however. Prices for houses are scarcely to be believed. Nice in the summer, autumn, and early winter, but winter really drags on and on, without much of a spring.

There is very little "big city" attitude, but that carries the price tag of having very little "big city" sophistication. Great food, with everything from Burmese to Polish restaurants, interesting family-owned corner bars, friendly people (at times overly so).

by Anonymousreply 39February 24, 2021 3:54 PM

[quote] Why not just stay where you are?

I would if I could afford it. Plus, I've been in Los Angeles my whole life and would like a change. I don't have may friends in any state or city I'd want to move to (Texas, Arizona) so where I go I will probably not know anyone.

by Anonymousreply 40February 24, 2021 4:27 PM

I see a lot of beautiful towns in movies. Places with nice homes and lots of trees. I always look on IMDB to see where it was filmed. I see Georgia coming up a lot.

by Anonymousreply 41February 24, 2021 4:30 PM

[quote]No, this is not the right attitude. There are many, many small and medium-sized towns in America where no one cares if you're gay. Go where you want and make it gay. Don't be giving deplorables a veto power. If people are closed-minded you wouldn't want to live there anyway.

This. Some of the greatest, most loving people who are accepting of all reside in nondescript, small communities all over the United States. A lot of this thread is highlighting narrow-minded thinking that is just reprehensible as the deplorables they bemoan. Maybe living a huge echo chamber like Los Angeles does that to a person.

With an attitude where you think of everyone as a monolithic entity that is either 'this' or 'that' indicates that Los Angeles is the perfect place for you, OP.

by Anonymousreply 42February 24, 2021 4:46 PM

[quote]Are there any young gays in Palm Springs? I thought it was more of a retirement community.

The Gay Elephant Graveyard.

by Anonymousreply 43February 24, 2021 5:01 PM

R42 and where do you live?

by Anonymousreply 44February 24, 2021 5:06 PM

[quote]I've thought about Georgia. Is there anyone who resides there who can tell me what it's like.

I would put more trust in people who don't reside there. Atlanta, New Orleans, DC...all are regional (and farther afield) magnets who Kool-Aid drinkers who gave not travelled much. Each city is filled with people who just can't stop tell you how fabulous and important their city is. But of the three, Atlanta is the shithole, the destination of every gay from Lambert, Alabama, or Toadwater, Georgia, or piss again, Mississippi. They are so happy to be out their backwater towns that Atlanta seems the greatest thing in the world.

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by Anonymousreply 45February 24, 2021 5:29 PM

R42 I never had this attitude until 2016.

by Anonymousreply 46February 24, 2021 5:40 PM

R44 & R46

I get it. Bay Area native here.

I am not proclaiming that any place is perfect but after I left California and moved to Arizona (again, it's not for everybody because of heat, culture, etc.) I have met some of the most wonderful people of my life. Some are gay men and women and they have full, productive lives and are valued members of their communities (which are full of all types of people).

All I am saying is that you would be surprised about what type of people live where and you might be pleasantly surprised as to what you may find. Back home in the Bay I couldn't tell you how many times I felt a thin veneer of homophobia in the attitudes of people who treated me in a certain (over accommodating) way because that is what they HAVE to do and would get crucified if they didn't. Here I feel free, rejuvenated, and safe. I also find myself becoming more accepting of others who are different than me because I am being given the same respect in return. Quite amazing, actually.

by Anonymousreply 47February 24, 2021 6:28 PM

Lawrence, Kansas perhaps

by Anonymousreply 48February 24, 2021 6:39 PM

I'm curious is there is anyone here who just moved to an unfamiliar city. Some place not knowing anyone or having really travelled there.

by Anonymousreply 49February 24, 2021 7:22 PM

*if (typo)

by Anonymousreply 50February 24, 2021 7:23 PM

R47 Sedona, Arizona is full of very spiritual people.

by Anonymousreply 51February 24, 2021 8:04 PM

I hear Bumfuck, Nevada is great.

by Anonymousreply 52February 24, 2021 8:09 PM

St Pete FL is a shithole. Run, far.

by Anonymousreply 53February 24, 2021 8:11 PM

NYC is quickly becoming affordable at this point

by Anonymousreply 54February 24, 2021 8:13 PM

If you want to move to Florida, Ft Lauderdale is affordable as is Tampa

by Anonymousreply 55February 24, 2021 8:14 PM

Is Palm Springs affordable?

by Anonymousreply 56February 24, 2021 8:15 PM

R51 Totally.

Although, I find that Sedona has become very commercialized and overrun in recent years.

Bisbee, AZ down south is very interesting and VERY gay. Apparently, it is 60% LGBT. Very cool town history, architecture, and setting. And close to Mexico to boot. There is some drug use that seems to have a bit of a hold on a percentage of the population but I think it is a neat little place.

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by Anonymousreply 57February 24, 2021 8:17 PM

NYC is no where near affordable. They shave $50 off the rent because of reduced demand and call it a deal.

by Anonymousreply 58February 24, 2021 8:22 PM

R58, all in good time. NYC is dead now. Everyone that can is leaving. Store and restaurants have gone out of business.

No way it will be able to support its ridiculous rents right now. Landlords will soon figure this out

by Anonymousreply 59February 24, 2021 8:40 PM

Years ago, I went to Fi Lauderdale and thought: Wow, this is right next to Miami and vey affordable. Why hasn't everyone else figured this out.

Then they gays figured it out.

by Anonymousreply 60February 24, 2021 8:41 PM

Any city is gay friendly when you set up your glory hole!

by Anonymousreply 61February 24, 2021 9:22 PM

Santa Fe, NM

Asheville, NC

Wilmington, NC

Austin, TX (though I personally hate the state of Texas)

by Anonymousreply 62February 24, 2021 9:35 PM

[quote]Is Philadelphia really that gay friendly outside of certain areas/neighborhoods? I perceived it as a bit more conservative, even though this is just word of mouth.

It is gay-friendly but it is no longer inexpensive to live in Philly. Try Columbus, Ohio. It was one of the first gay meccas in the midwest.

by Anonymousreply 63February 24, 2021 9:40 PM

R49, I just moved to Columbus,Ohio having only been here a handful of times. I moved from a small town in Ohio and just couldn't take it anymore. I'm already in a relationship and , well, old. But I love going to the grocery store and seeing all the gay couples shopping together. I'm hopeful when the pandemic is over, I'll meet some friends in old age. But travel 15 minutes outside the city, and it is depressingly Trump Country.

by Anonymousreply 64February 24, 2021 10:10 PM

I lived there from 1986-1998. It was gay-friendly back then. Yes, avoid many of the small towns, but there are many liberal arts colleges in Ohio-I think Ohio is second only to Massachusetts for the number of colleges. So many of the small towns are pretty cool.

by Anonymousreply 65February 24, 2021 10:17 PM

Try again, R65.

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by Anonymousreply 66February 24, 2021 10:36 PM

Chicago real estate is quite affordable and the Mayor is a lesbian.

by Anonymousreply 67February 24, 2021 10:38 PM

R62 No. Austin is over. It's cancelled.

by Anonymousreply 68February 24, 2021 10:38 PM

Philadelphia? I hear it has good dick. But would I find tasteful friends there who appreciate decorating and collecting? Like the Georgetown couple.

by Anonymousreply 69February 24, 2021 10:39 PM

No, but maybe a butch sous chef or two.

by Anonymousreply 70February 24, 2021 10:42 PM

We need more gays to move to Georgia and Florida to keep Georgia blue and to make Florida blue. How about we take 10 million people out of California and move them to Florida, Georgia, Alaska, North Carolina. We have made Arizona blue and as long as we can get everyone out to vote in Georgia that will go blue throughout the state. We need to take more red states away from the Republicans.

by Anonymousreply 71February 24, 2021 10:56 PM

LaCrosse, Wisconsin.

by Anonymousreply 72February 24, 2021 11:01 PM

[quote]LaCrosse, Wisconsin.

A lot of lesbians there?

by Anonymousreply 73February 24, 2021 11:07 PM

Providence, Rhode Island, anyone?

Only 10 miles to Massachusetts, and an hour to Boston, less than an hour to some Boston suburbs.

Great restaurant scene, better gay nightlife than Boston pre pandemic, Brown, Providence College, Rhode island School of Art and Design, Johnson & Wales, had two gay bathhouses until the pandemic, artsy, near NYC, Provincetown/Cape Cod/Nantucket/Martha's Vineyard/lock Island, Newport, Rhode Island beaches, Mystic Seaport and Connecticut casinos.

Some lovely neighborhoods around Brown but also dumpy areas throughout the city.

Way cheaper than Boston but not as good an economy.

by Anonymousreply 74February 25, 2021 2:43 AM

Eugene, Oregon is an affordable city and very progressive. I mean, there are sculptures celebrating Rosa Parks and author Ken Kesey in the same downtown area. Eugene is home to the University of Oregon. And it's only 90 miles south of Portland. Springfield, Oregon, is next door to Eugene and is even more affordable.

by Anonymousreply 75February 25, 2021 3:08 AM

R50 So glad you noted the typo; we never would have figured that out.

by Anonymousreply 76February 25, 2021 9:13 AM

[quote]So glad you noted the typo; we never would have figured that out.

Well, had he not, some cunt would have "Oh, dear!"-ed him at least 20 posts ago.

by Anonymousreply 77February 25, 2021 9:44 AM

Definitely Madison, WI.

by Anonymousreply 78February 25, 2021 10:24 AM

R16 I had no idea The Raven in New Hope closed! How sad! Popping over there and having a drink with my husband was the highlight of (and requisite break from) visiting family in Central Jersey for the holidays.

by Anonymousreply 79February 25, 2021 10:54 AM

[quote]Are there any young gays in Palm Springs?

Sure! There are plenty of guys under 70.

by Anonymousreply 80February 25, 2021 4:09 PM

Fort Lauderdale qualifies but it's a lame city otherwise.

by Anonymousreply 81February 25, 2021 8:31 PM

I could have written this OP...in LA too.

Consider joining the FB group, "Where Gays Retire?", has some great info and the have zoom calls featuring different cities bi-weekly/monthly.

by Anonymousreply 82February 25, 2021 8:41 PM

[quote]We need to take more red states away from the Republicans.

Another civil war ought to do that.

by Anonymousreply 83February 25, 2021 8:54 PM

[quote] Fort Lauderdale qualifies but it's a lame city otherwise.

I think it's claim to fame is that it's very close to Miami. That's about it

by Anonymousreply 84February 26, 2021 3:22 PM

Bisbee, Arizona. It's in the mountains, so it's not too hot. Lots of artist types and very gay friendly (I saw a number of rainbow flags in from of homes and businesses). City also has its own gay pride parade.

by Anonymousreply 85February 26, 2021 5:08 PM

A search for Bisbee houses over 75 or even 50 years is a real disappointment - at any price, R85.

by Anonymousreply 86February 27, 2021 4:46 PM

FL is a shithole...right wing, Evangelical, anti-education, almost totally Republican. And yeah, SoFL is gay friendly, but overpriced and surrounded by Trumpees.

by Anonymousreply 87February 27, 2021 5:08 PM

Palm Desert is very conservative from what I hear. A bunch of retired old republicans who play golf at the country club.

by Anonymousreply 88February 28, 2021 12:35 AM

Winona, Minnesota.

There are cruising spots among the lakes.

by Anonymousreply 89February 28, 2021 1:17 AM

[quote]I'm curious is there is anyone here who just moved to an unfamiliar city. Some place not knowing anyone or having really travelled there.

I moved from North Carolina to Portland, Oregon having only spent about 24 hours in Portland and only knowing 2 friends of friends here. Still here 20 years later though I'm thinking of leaving.

You have to spend at least a little time someplace first. But then you may know right away that it's for you.

by Anonymousreply 90February 28, 2021 3:31 AM

R7, midtown Sacramento and Davis, CA are gay-friendly and affordable compared to the Bay Area. You can take the Amtrak/bus or BART combo to get into SF without driving. It could work if you don't need to be in an office in SF every day. Vallejo is affordable and attracting some gay people but extremely high crime.

by Anonymousreply 91February 28, 2021 10:30 AM

My lesbian client lives in Cincinnati with her partner, and they raised their children there. Gay can make it work in a lot of surprising areas.

by Anonymousreply 92February 28, 2021 10:36 AM

Pittsburgh

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by Anonymousreply 93February 28, 2021 10:47 AM

I recommend the coastal suburbs of New Haven in CT. It’s not a cheap area but not insane like Fairfield County either. Coastline and trail access, near the restaurants/cultural spots in New Haven, on the train line to NYC and easy access to beautiful CT and RI beaches. Guilford is very gay friendly BUT the town pretty much rolls up at 8pm each night. Good if you are already partnered.

by Anonymousreply 94February 28, 2021 12:17 PM

Bisbee, Arizona

Fort Collins, Colorado

Milford, Pennsylvania

by Anonymousreply 95February 28, 2021 2:39 PM

I know this may sound nuts but move to Chicago or New York OP. Both cities have seen a decline in populations. I am a real estate agent in Chicago and I also do rentals, rents have gone significantly in the past year. I've said for years. Chicago is the last affordable big city. New York is also relatively cheaper(ish) is the past year.

by Anonymousreply 96February 28, 2021 2:44 PM

Atlanta is nice - very good gay scene - but it is a big city, lots of traffic. etc.

by Anonymousreply 97February 28, 2021 2:50 PM

You must be insane r96. Yes New York is a little cheaper than at its peak, but it is still a very, very expensive city.

Your definition of "affordable" is completely out of step with reality.

by Anonymousreply 98February 28, 2021 2:59 PM

South East Maine,,,Portland, Wells, Ogunquit. Beautiful, but cold winters.

by Anonymousreply 99February 28, 2021 4:03 PM

R99 portland ME has a great food scene, it’s cold though.

by Anonymousreply 100February 28, 2021 4:41 PM

[quote] Bisbee, Arizona

I looked on a map and couldn't help but notice how close to the border of Mexico it is. It looks like a beautiful city from looking st the photo.

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by Anonymousreply 101February 28, 2021 6:08 PM

Looking on the web I came across this site. Some of the towns here look very nice. Has anyone ever been to any of them?

I may have to plan a few trips. I am a native Californian (native Angelino to be exact) and have lived here my whole life. Never was one to travel much, but I think this Covid quarantine has really made me want to get out and explore. I am also a homebody and artist who works from home so I will really need to love my surroundings.

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by Anonymousreply 102February 28, 2021 6:32 PM

R102 Northampton MA is on my list. I go there to use the bike trails and buy my recreational weed. Nice little progressive town but about 1.5+ hours from Boston

by Anonymousreply 103February 28, 2021 6:37 PM

Houston

by Anonymousreply 104February 28, 2021 11:12 PM

R37 One really has to know who their neighbors are when they pack up and move somewhere.

by Anonymousreply 105February 28, 2021 11:27 PM

Along with being gay-friendly, take into consideration the city's crime stats. Might be best to move outside the US.

by Anonymousreply 106March 1, 2021 12:44 PM

[quote]Along with being gay-friendly, take into consideration the city's crime stats. Might be best to move outside the US.

Right on both points, R106. Otherwise many American gays would be planning their move to York, Pennsylvania (and their kitchen renovation.)

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by Anonymousreply 107March 1, 2021 2:17 PM

R107 Is that a good price for that house?

by Anonymousreply 108March 1, 2021 3:34 PM

Asheville, NC looks beautiful. Has anyone been there? How Trumpy is it?

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by Anonymousreply 109March 1, 2021 3:58 PM

Don't listen to R91

That commute is soul-suckingly bad even if you don't have to be in the Bay every day.

Seriously. Your life is too short to live ducking stray bullets in Vallejo or fighting the dead-eyed masses to and from ballSac.

by Anonymousreply 110March 1, 2021 5:12 PM

You have to really love heat in order to live in Palm Springs on a year-round basis.

by Anonymousreply 111March 1, 2021 5:51 PM

R109, Asheville is a lesbian mecca. My lesbian colleague and her partner have a second home there.

by Anonymousreply 112March 1, 2021 7:08 PM

Pay ZERO attention to R45. He's clearly a mental case with a grudge or is another one who failed in Atlanta and now wastes no opportunity to disparage it.

Atlanta like all big cities is a make it or break it place. If you make it you can have a wonderful life with all the amenities you could ask for at a much more affordable price than most cities that size. If you want quick access to the ocean, go elsewhere. Otherwise the area lakes are beautiful and the close proximity to the mountains is a big plus if you're into the great outdoors.

by Anonymousreply 113March 1, 2021 7:17 PM

Savannah, Ga. is a very gay-friendly city OP. Not a big city but it does offer a nice level of amenities. And the food is excellent. And if you're a beach lover you can be on the sand in 20 minutes.

by Anonymousreply 114March 1, 2021 7:20 PM

[quote] Philly is relatively affordable

Row homes go for half a mil and rent is also high.

by Anonymousreply 115March 1, 2021 7:23 PM

My grandmother was born in Vallejo and she lived there through her childhood. About 6 years ago I was in the area, so I drove around Vallejo a little, just because of her history there. Wow, 100 years can make a profound difference in a place. I was disappointed in how run down and derelict it appeared to me. I'm sure there are nice parts of it, but I didn't see any. It looked like the people who live there now don't care about what it looks like. On the plus side, it must be cheaper to live there than other parts of the Bay Area, and the weather was nice.

by Anonymousreply 116March 1, 2021 8:21 PM

In terms of more affordable places in the Bay Area, I lived in Vacaville briefly about a decade ago. It and Fairfield are halfway between SF and Sacramento and more affordable, or at least they were back then. From Fairfield you can use casual carpool or Amtrak to get to SF. Otherwise the commute is awful during business hours, I did it only once a week to the East Bay and hated it. Both cities are full of suburban comforts, chain restaurants, and discount shopping shopping and have a strong military presence from the nearby base.

by Anonymousreply 117March 1, 2021 9:11 PM

I moved from southern California to Seattle in the early 90's and loved it. After a decade or so, it began to wear on me and I moved to Palm Springs. The heat really got to me and I was missing the PNW, but not Seattle. I moved back north and settled in Tacoma. I love it! It's a sleepy sort of town, but Seattle is just 40 minutes away if I want to any big city stuff. Tacoma's north end has beautiful old homes, great restaurants, small independent shops. Houses in the north end start around 400k, condos 200k. I wouldn't say we really have a gay neighborhood, it's very integrated, lots of houses with pride flags. People are pretty friendly, and it's definitely a progressive city. Seattle loves to put down Tacoma, but Seattle is a city in crisis, an absolute mess. I don't know the exact figures, but I'd be willing to bet that the crime rate is higher in Seattle.

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by Anonymousreply 118March 1, 2021 9:35 PM

R108: The house in York, PA is crazy cheap. Median price for a house in the U S. is $340K. Even in backwater towns in backwater states, it is difficult to find a house of the quality, size, and good condition of the house in York. Part of the problem is that the city has a high incidence of crime; part owes to high property taxes ($15K a year for a $240K house.) A house like that in some nothing little town far from anywhere in Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi, Tennessee, Missouri...would cost significantly more.

R109: Asheville isn't very Trump-ish at all.

by Anonymousreply 119March 1, 2021 10:23 PM

I don't know, R113: I'm doing well in Atlanta, have been here for over a decade, and would leave in a heartbeat if my career would allow it. It's not that great at all. It's more affordable relative to other cities because it's so sprawling and doesn't have most big-city perks. Look at the rents/property costs in the small areas that actually resemble a city (mostly Midtown) and it's probably similar. The rest is all a suburb pretending it's not.

by Anonymousreply 120March 2, 2021 7:14 PM

I can remember when Austin would be at the top of the list, but sadly it's now as expensive as L.A.

by Anonymousreply 121March 2, 2021 7:19 PM

[quote][R109], Asheville is a lesbian mecca. My lesbian colleague and her partner have a second home there.

Shirley Hemphill was from there. Enough said.

by Anonymousreply 122March 2, 2021 7:21 PM

I've always been intrigued by Southampton, MA and the surrounding area. The Berkshires look so charming. What's the weather like during the winter? Is it solid snow from Nov-Mar?

by Anonymousreply 123March 2, 2021 7:23 PM

[quote] Along with being gay-friendly, take into consideration the city's crime stats. Might be best to move outside the US.

Why bother when they'll still take your taxes for 10 years after you renounce your citizenship?

Fine, go ahead and leave, that way when the GOP takes over it won't be your fault because you weren't here to stop them. Come to think of it, that would make it your fault.

by Anonymousreply 124March 2, 2021 7:28 PM

[quote] Why bother when they'll still take your taxes for 10 years after you renounce your citizenship?

Huh?

by Anonymousreply 125March 2, 2021 7:45 PM

"What's the weather like during the winter? Is it solid snow from Nov-Mar?"

Very cold, sometimes snowy winters. Great summers. How much cold can you stand?

by Anonymousreply 126March 4, 2021 3:23 PM

Provincetown, Mass. is ridiculously expensive now, but the cities and towns further down the cape are still somewhat affordable. Orleans, Brewster, Eastham, Harwich. More gays are buying in those towns who are priced out of P-town. They're still a short drive away.

by Anonymousreply 127March 4, 2021 4:25 PM

[quote]Why bother when they'll still take your taxes for 10 years after you renounce your citizenship?

[quote]Fine, go ahead and leave, that way when the GOP takes over it won't be your fault because you weren't here to stop them. Come to think of it, that would make it your fault.

Not even 3% of the U.S. population lives outside the U.S., and that figure includes the large number of people living temporarily outside the U.S., on work assignments, for education, etc.

The business of penalty for renouncing U.S. citizenship (and with it U.S. tax liabilities) is not so unreasonable. There is a fee of $2350; and any currently due taxes must be settled. An exit tax applies to people whose U.S. assets exceed $2M calculated to the day before they renounce citizenship or a tax liability (not income) in excess of $162K for the five consecutive years before leaving the U.S. If an exit tax applies, the amounts over allowed thresholds can be taxed at up to 23.8%. There are various deductions and allowances, including deferrals for large 401(k) and retirement accounts.

The 10-year liability for U.S. taxes thing is a myth.

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by Anonymousreply 128March 4, 2021 6:02 PM

I love the Berkshires. But it’s VERY small town and kinda remote. Much nicer than Hudson NY or some of the other upstate NY ghetto towns. Not a lot to do. A trip to NY or Boston is a weekend event. With that said, amazingly beautiful housing and environment with generally good politics - though New England reserve makes it not necessarily friendly.

by Anonymousreply 129March 4, 2021 6:16 PM

OP, we need to know if you want: urban, suburban, rural. Without that info, it’s too wide open. If you enjoy college towns, Athens, GA is totally gay-friendly, quirky, affordable. But, you’ll run out if things to do pretty quickly unless you lean toward a simple lifestyle.

As the poster stated up thread, if you lean urban, then do Chicago. But are you open to the Midwest? Chicagoland is very very blue, but once you’re in the cornfields? Red. But that’s true in every single state.

Please tell us about your interests, hobbies, age, profession, and anything else that tells us your preferences. Do you want a house or a condo? Do you want newly built (less than ten years) or historic?

by Anonymousreply 130March 4, 2021 7:15 PM

R130 Thank you for the questions. I am looking for something less urban, but within proximity of city life. I'm more of a homebody, but I do like the option of having the city available if I do desire to go out. Ideally I would like to own or rent a house. I like peace and quiet and craftsman style homes. I love trees and fall. I am an artist and enjoy being around those who appreciate art, pop culture. good music. etc. I am torn between so many beautiful places in the US, especially with all the suggestions. It would be nice to talk with others who are looking for the same, too.

by Anonymousreply 131March 4, 2021 11:20 PM

Buffalo!

by Anonymousreply 132March 4, 2021 11:31 PM

Dallas is cool and not ridiculously overpriced!!!

by Anonymousreply 133March 4, 2021 11:35 PM

R118, Tacoma seems intriguing! I love the mountain backdrop.

by Anonymousreply 134March 4, 2021 11:36 PM

Have never been to the PNW but I hear it gets pretty cold there.

by Anonymousreply 135March 5, 2021 4:26 PM

I think it is time for gay people to take over the world.

by Anonymousreply 136March 5, 2021 5:51 PM

What a drastic change it would be for someone who has lived in California their entire life. It might be wise to stay in some areas first before dropping anchor, especially considering how different the weather will be to So Cal.

by Anonymousreply 137March 5, 2021 6:55 PM

Is Wilmington really that gay friendly? Posters on other threads seemed to be of the opinion that it's not nearly as cosmopolitan as a lot of other cities in NC, or even the likes of Savannah or Charleston, despite the film industry. Any opinions on Memphis, TN? No local anti-discrimination ordinance because of state law, but that may change soon with SCOTUS.

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by Anonymousreply 138March 5, 2021 7:25 PM

[quote] Any opinions on Memphis, TN?

There is a radical faerie sactuary in Cannon County, TN.

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by Anonymousreply 139March 5, 2021 7:37 PM

I thought Wilmington NC had a pretty high crime rate?

by Anonymousreply 140March 5, 2021 8:11 PM

R138: Wilmington NC is small, with a population under 76,000 and a rather isolated location. Of course it's not as cosmopolitan as Charleston or Savannah, each of which is nearly twice the population of Wilmington and long and deep cultural history and a history of attracting outsiders

by Anonymousreply 141March 5, 2021 8:12 PM

Charleston or Savannah are brutal in the summer.

by Anonymousreply 142March 5, 2021 8:14 PM

R39 Were you born in Buffalo and left or moved here then moved away again? I'm the former. I think about leaving to find a better gay city so I wouldn't necessarily recommend it for the gay community but I guess gays everywhere are vapid cunts 🤷‍♂️ other than that it's really nice in Summer and there's usually lots to do when there's not a Pandemic. Winter on the other hand is draining AF and I'm about ready to end it all

by Anonymousreply 143March 6, 2021 1:21 AM

Wilmington, NC, is rapidly growing and has a population over 120,000 now. It is somewhat isolated from the other state metro areas, the closest being Raleigh, which is 2 hours away by interstate. A lot of retirees are flocking to the city and nearby beach towns.

It has a long history of Southern conservatism and poor race relations, but that is changing and the county narrowly went for Biden in 2020.

It has a lovely but compact historic district of 19th century homes, with only a few from the colonial era. The downtown district perched on the Cape Fear River is small and cute. It pales in comparison to Charleston and Savannah, however.

And it is deadly dull, even more boring than other North Carolina metros. But if you like Southern-style seafood and quick access to a family beach, this is the place for you.

by Anonymousreply 144March 6, 2021 1:46 AM

hey op, tacoma does sound intriguing. I looked it up too and found this NPR article: How did tacoma, wash get-to-be-america's-gayest-city?

I think this is a sign.

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by Anonymousreply 145March 6, 2021 2:03 AM

google tacoma and things to do. There is an art scene. The parks, lake and marina looks very old school san fran.

by Anonymousreply 146March 6, 2021 2:15 AM

op new house. This is charming.

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by Anonymousreply 147March 6, 2021 2:16 AM

this may be better. it's bigger. Again, so charming.

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by Anonymousreply 148March 6, 2021 2:19 AM

South Tacoma has some nice homes, tons of small craftsman and tudors, it's a little rough, but getting better. Stadium, Proctor, UPS neighborhoods have more charm, but they've become pricey. I'm in the Stadium district, my house has more than doubled in value in four years.

by Anonymousreply 149March 6, 2021 2:26 AM

I would go vacay there and see if you like it.

by Anonymousreply 150March 6, 2021 2:28 AM

R148 Wow. That is a beautiful home. Tacoma looks wonderful! I'm going to have to look into it now.

by Anonymousreply 151March 6, 2021 3:03 AM

Those mountains are volcanos.

by Anonymousreply 152March 6, 2021 3:15 AM

R147 & R148, different people like different things, but I'm not seeing charm in either of those houses which seem expensive to me for their small size, pokey little rooms and low ceilings, and poor quality of piecemeal renovations overs recent decades. A Smeg refrigerator is nice but it doesn't exude enough charm to enhance these dumpy houses.

by Anonymousreply 153March 6, 2021 3:36 AM

Very little on the market and that's driving up prices.

by Anonymousreply 154March 6, 2021 3:57 AM

I love those Tacoma houses. They are perfect. So much nicer than the dreadful open-concept, lofty ceiling monstrosities being built around L.A.

by Anonymousreply 155March 6, 2021 7:54 PM

[quote] So much nicer than the dreadful open-concept, lofty ceiling monstrosities being built around L.A.

Every time I walk into one of those ugly homes all I can think of is the echoing sound of shreiking kids bouncing off the walls. Like living in a furniture warehouse.

by Anonymousreply 156March 6, 2021 8:00 PM

NO, NO, and NO.

OP, you don't have to leave the state to find affordable housing in a gay friendly city. Sacramento is a gay friendly city with affordable housing.

by Anonymousreply 157March 6, 2021 8:11 PM

It seems to me that there are a lot of gay friendly towns and small cities couples could live happily in. The problem is the small dating pool if you are single.

by Anonymousreply 158March 6, 2021 8:24 PM

[quote] Sacramento is a gay friendly city with affordable housing.

Affordable if you want to live here. I dunno.

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by Anonymousreply 159March 7, 2021 2:54 AM

Mill Valley, CA

by Anonymousreply 160March 7, 2021 5:45 PM

Mill Valley isn't affordable, lol.

by Anonymousreply 161March 7, 2021 6:40 PM

R159...that's a joke, right?

by Anonymousreply 162March 7, 2021 7:24 PM

I’m thinking Asheville or Santa Fe

by Anonymousreply 163March 7, 2021 8:43 PM

I was looking into Asheville until Tacoma, WA was mentioned.

by Anonymousreply 164March 7, 2021 8:47 PM

I really like Santa Fe, but it feels very isolated to me.

by Anonymousreply 165March 7, 2021 8:56 PM

R165 The desert is a lot different than many places in the US. If you haven't lived out there it's good to travel there first.

by Anonymousreply 166March 7, 2021 9:00 PM

Anyone recommend the Brandywine pa area or Wilmington DE, Philly Suburbs? I was hoping to spend about $325k on a 2BR/2Ba small home with a little yard.

by Anonymousreply 167March 7, 2021 9:01 PM

I second Tacoma, I live about 20 minutes from that city. Parts of it are rough but many neighborhoods are charming and walkable. Tacoma is a smaller Seattle before Microsoft and Amazon. It's expensive because the average house price in Seattle is about $700,000. Despite the Covid shutdown I think Tacoma will continue to improve. Downtown there are brownstones, something I haven't seen in Seattle or Portland.

by Anonymousreply 168March 7, 2021 9:27 PM

Santa Fe is isolated and NOT affordable. Plus it is VERY pissy.

by Anonymousreply 169March 8, 2021 3:04 PM

R169 what do you mean by Pissy?

by Anonymousreply 170March 9, 2021 6:21 PM

They pee on you, a lot!

by Anonymousreply 171March 9, 2021 6:50 PM

I'm right where you want to be, OP. Large metro 30 minutes, famous college towns 20 minutes away, but I ain't telling! Affordable, a bit hippie with haughty retirees not from here...rednecks too though...lol. Lots of dick on the apps. Kinda...definitely...pleasantly surprised. Nature and civilization side by side.

Hilly too, but no active volcanoes.

by Anonymousreply 172March 9, 2021 7:31 PM

R170 Piss elegant gays who are all into status and money who will exclude you if you don't have these.

by Anonymousreply 173March 9, 2021 7:41 PM

I wouldn't think living in Santa Fe as elegant.

by Anonymousreply 174March 9, 2021 11:33 PM

Does anybody live in/near Ashland, Oregon? I've always been a little curious about it.

by Anonymousreply 175March 10, 2021 4:10 AM

Athens, GA

Raleigh/Durham/Chapel Hill, NC

Austin and Nashville have already peaked.

by Anonymousreply 176March 10, 2021 4:32 AM

R159, What a dump!

by Anonymousreply 177March 10, 2021 4:43 AM

Is Chico, CA expensive?

by Anonymousreply 178March 10, 2021 4:45 AM

California is comprised of one per centers and deranged, feral trash.

There’s almost nothing in between. Certainly no middle class.

Can you afford 1.3 M for a so-so tract house in a hillbilly neighborhood?

If not, California is not for you. Move to a nice college town where people actually know how to read and not just squeeze out brats.

by Anonymousreply 179March 10, 2021 4:51 AM

R179, that's news to me. I love it here.

by Anonymousreply 180March 10, 2021 4:53 AM

Im guessing r180 has never lived anywhere other than exurban California.

by Anonymousreply 181March 10, 2021 4:59 AM

R181, you guess very wrong.

by Anonymousreply 182March 10, 2021 5:00 AM

shhh, r176!

by Anonymousreply 183March 10, 2021 5:04 AM

Louisville, KY. Google it and LGBT.

MUCH more gay-friendly than larger cities around it, and quite the gay community.

Search got a thread around here

by Anonymousreply 184March 10, 2021 5:17 AM

So, r182, you admit you have lived all over the world and you realize you can have better quality of life at half the cost of living in (fundamentally hillbilly) California?

That... doesn’t make you sound smart.

by Anonymousreply 185March 10, 2021 5:39 AM

R185, well bless your heart. Cost of living is fine for partner and I and our not extravagant lifestyle (two incomes, no kids). We like the great outdoors and mountains (real mountains, not the Appalachian hills), forest, beach, wine country, and desert in close proximity. Plus a huge gay population. Other states have beauty too, but why go elsewhere when you have family/friends/roots?

Moving on now -- I don't think we're going to agree about CA, and let's not hijack the thread.

by Anonymousreply 186March 10, 2021 6:15 AM

I've heard Boise, ID is becoming the new "it" place. Extremely liberal, less than a 2 hour flight from LA, very affordable, they actually have a gay dance club, friendly people, and natural beauty. I'm thinking I might check it out to see if it's cool.

by Anonymousreply 187March 10, 2021 7:21 AM

It depends on a thousand things, but for most people the decision (I hope) doesn't hinge on what's the next big thing, the "it" place, the trendiest, the hottest. If you're happy living in a small college town, a quaint village filled with higgledy-piggledy cottages and intriguing Midsomer Murders, a picturesque spot in the countryside, a big town, a small city, a medium sized city, a big city, or a global city around which the rest of us merely orbit at a distance, the type of place/s seems most important, then narrowing it down to some places with qualities that bear investigation.

Not all gay and lesbian people need dance clubs or a gay nudist beach or a gay chorus, or a gay ex-Mormon chapter of Narc-Anon, no more than everyone who is gay needs a first-class opera house. Go to any pokey-ass little town or crossroads anywhere and you'll soon enough find that other gays have been there already, that you're not the trailblazer; open Grindr and you'll see even more clearly, though the distances between expands as the population density diminishes. The opportunity to bump the crown from the only gay in the village isn't reason enough to live in some horrible backwater, of course. But everyone has the place where they can fit happily, somewhere between gay-friendly, thriving visible gay community, and gay metropolis. Depending on your tastes and requirements and age and other things, maybe the Murder She Wrote Maine village (except actually in Maine) is the right place for you. Maybe you temper that with travel, or not.

The idea, though, of the 1970s and 1980s of gay magnet cities, meccas that called young men and young women from less fortunate spots regionally or nationally or internationally seems mostly outdated now.

by Anonymousreply 188March 10, 2021 11:13 AM

R187 No one would ever describe any place in Idaho as "extremely liberal."

by Anonymousreply 189March 10, 2021 11:20 AM

Madison, Wisconsin

by Anonymousreply 190March 10, 2021 6:38 PM

Idaho is white supremacist central.

by Anonymousreply 191March 10, 2021 6:49 PM

R187 The people moving to Idaho are white supremacists moving out of Texas, California and other border states because they want to be away from non-whites.

by Anonymousreply 192March 10, 2021 7:54 PM

Extreme weather conditions are something else to take into consideration.

by Anonymousreply 193March 10, 2021 7:57 PM

Are there any affordable cities close to Montecito, CA?

by Anonymousreply 194March 10, 2021 8:47 PM

Oprah.

by Anonymousreply 195March 10, 2021 8:50 PM

I'm surpised Solvang, CA hasn't become a hotspot for LGBT.

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by Anonymousreply 196March 10, 2021 8:53 PM

[quote] Not all gay and lesbian people need dance clubs or a gay nudist beach or a gay chorus, or a gay ex-Mormon chapter of Narc-Anon, no more than everyone who is gay needs a first-class opera house.

This is true, but it doesn't hurt to have them. Your post is very insightful. I don't know where I want to be. All I've ever lived in is a major city, so I sometimes wonder what a moderate, small town such as Boise might be like. It's supposed to have a thriving gay scene, maybe more down to earth guys, people are more contented with just everyday, nothing special life maybe.

by Anonymousreply 197March 11, 2021 3:54 AM

[quote] Not all gay and lesbian people need dance clubs or a gay nudist beach or a gay chorus, or a gay ex-Mormon chapter of Narc-Anon, no more than everyone who is gay needs a first-class opera house.

I definitely don't need any of that. I just want to live in an area where gay people are welcome. Since 2016 my opinions of America has changed. I used to think we were past all the homophobia and racism in this country, but apparently not.

by Anonymousreply 198March 11, 2021 4:58 PM

[quote] Some of the greatest, most loving people who are accepting of all reside in nondescript, small communities all over the United States. A lot of this thread is highlighting narrow-minded thinking that is just reprehensible as the deplorables they bemoan. Maybe living a huge echo chamber like Los Angeles does that to a person.

It's hard to change my way of thinking when I see numerous videos every other day of trashy hillbilly stereotypes creating chaos in some local store or voicing their support for Donald Trump. Call it what you want, but I'd like to avoid having these people as neighbors.

by Anonymousreply 199March 11, 2021 5:08 PM

I "Tasteful friends"-posted a 1929 French Normandy style house in Cleveland Heights OH that's kind of wonderful and a crazy $165k.

I had thought of Chicago (also much underpriced) as a good choice in the U.S., with good real estate choices that could find a month or two away in the deadest part of winter each year. Cleveland is another choice, smaller, rustier, but fairly liberal and with a strong gay presence for decades.

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by Anonymousreply 200March 11, 2021 7:00 PM

Idaho sort of is white supremacist central, but nonetheless Boise is at least mildly liberal now and a lot of west coasters (not just Californians) are moving there because it has a beautiful setting, the food/wine/beer scene is supposedly good and it's much less expensive.

Ditto for Salt Lake City.

by Anonymousreply 201March 12, 2021 3:32 AM

I feel like there is tons of these threads, but nobody really has the answer. Where is this great, accepting, affordable, friendly gay small town?!?!

by Anonymousreply 202March 12, 2021 5:24 AM

[quote]I feel like there is tons of these threads, but nobody really has the answer. Where is this great, accepting, affordable, friendly gay small town?!?!

It's definitely a frequently recurring topic on DL, more or a constant whether directly addressed or indirectly, but to answer your question in the most obvious way: there is no one answer.

What's a great climate for you is a miserable climate for me. You want a small town, another wants a big city, another wants a small city. What's highly affordable for you may be out of the question for me. Your criteria for what make a good village or town or city are never going to match every that of every other gay. There is no one village, no one town, no one city — and if there were,

New Hope is too small, too over, too expensive, too gay, not gay enough, too cold, too pissy, too Philly, too haunted by the ghost of Jessica Savitch, too close to Levittown, too prone to flooding, or susceptible to unfavorable climate change. No one ever agrees, least of all gays about where to live and in proximity of whom.

These threads are sounding boards to formulate a question and maybe get a fresh idea or a useful warning or the name of a place to check out online. Most people don't have a clear idea of what they would want *if* they were to move and some people love thinking about moving to some new adventure but have no clear inclination to do anything more than daydream about it.

by Anonymousreply 203March 12, 2021 9:38 AM

R203 This thread has actually opened up a lot of new ideas for me. Places I've never even thought of. I plan on visiting a few places once this pandemic is over, so keep the ideas coming.

by Anonymousreply 204March 12, 2021 3:52 PM

[quote] I feel like there is tons of these threads

Yeah, but this one is specifically looking at 2021 and beyond. One thing 2020 has opened our eyes to, be it weather, politics or a state's handing of the pandemic, is places to avoid. I can easily say that Florida and Texas are definitely off my list.

by Anonymousreply 205March 12, 2021 4:02 PM

Bump. Glad I found this thread discussion. I'm used to living in large cities, but the quality of life in these places has deteriorated quite a bit. The increasingly expensive cost-of-living makes existing quality of life not worth it, for the most part. Now that I'm getting older, (in my late 50s) I'm looking for mid-sized or smaller cities to move to in advance of retirement. I'm done with the West Coast and the Pacific Northwest, and not interested in Texas, Arizona, or New Mexico (already researched and dismissed). Been eyeing Rhode Island, Vermont, and Maine (intimidated by those long harsh winters, though) and North Carolina, Virginia, and Georgia. Any tips on cities in NC besides Asheville? That one doesn't appeal. I love Savannah, but it's become too pricey, I put Atlanta in the "large city" category so, no. How about Virginia? What's Virginia Beach like? Alexandria or Richmond?

God, I sound like a persnickety old coot! Don't care. This thread has already provided a few good suggestions, and I'm hungering for more.

by Anonymousreply 206March 24, 2021 5:19 PM

If you're considering Arizona but don't want the heat, look at Flagstaff. Large enough (65,000+ as of the 2010 census) to have a lot of what you may want, but not so big as that you can't find your way around fairly easily. LGBT friendly, the summers are comfortable and the winters, while snowy, are not too cold. The scenery is nice, it sits at the foot of the San Francisco Peaks.

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by Anonymousreply 207March 24, 2021 6:32 PM

[quote] I'm done with the West Coast and the Pacific Northwest, and not interested in Texas, Arizona, or New Mexico (already researched and dismissed).

I was considering some of those areas myself. Curious why you've written them off.

by Anonymousreply 208March 24, 2021 6:51 PM

Good Lord, stay away from Phoenix/Scottsdale!

by Anonymousreply 209March 24, 2021 7:02 PM

R209 Why (aside from the heat)?

by Anonymousreply 210March 24, 2021 7:05 PM

Some interesting towns in western VA. Charlottesville - and it’s cheaper, gentrifying western neighbor Staunton - would be interesting choices. Not extremely gay but well educated (UVA), good hospital, close enough to DC, absolutely beautiful countryside and architecture. If you go farther afield, there are some of the KKK types you saw in the 2017 thing - but generally a somewhat Southern but educated and DC-influenced town.

There are a few other quaint little small towns in the Blue Ridge Mountains - like Abingdon. Not as urbane and more remote, but pretty and still in VA. It would save you from the brutal New England winters. I love NE but a few years of 6 full months of winter from October -April made me realize I’d rather be farther south. PA and VA offer some nice, gay-friendly towns that are still close to civilization and easy trips to the major cities -DC, Philly, NY.

by Anonymousreply 211March 24, 2021 7:15 PM

R209 I agree. Snotsdale is full of pretentious people who couldn’t afford Calabasas, so they settled. They are all just trying to keep up with the Joneses in that shithole. There are much prettier places, with better people, to settle down and spend your money.

by Anonymousreply 212March 24, 2021 7:27 PM

R207 Dull dull dull

by Anonymousreply 213March 24, 2021 7:29 PM

R208 - I've written them off for personal financial reasons. I've lived in the Bay Area for over 20 years and have loved it. However, it's gotten overwhelmingly expensive and there's a deteriorating quality of life that is unsettling to witness (and experience). I want to buy, not continue to rent as I inch toward retirement. I've crunched the numbers and I can't afford to buy in any of the cities I'd wish to live in anyway. I probably could afford to buy in California cities like Fremont, Concord, Burlingame, Richmond, and etc. I've done a lot of research, and spent time in those types of areas, and they just don't appeal to me in any way. I also figured out what I'd need to live relatively comfortably on a future fixed income, and many of the mid-sized cities in California and the Pacific Northwest are all still too expensive, or will be. Research into the numerous smaller cities or large towns in the PNW didn't spark much interest for me. The weather also tends to be mor rainy and gray or colder often during the year in WA and OR. I have no expectation of receiving inheritance money or any kind of financial windfall, so I need to rely on myself for this planning and relocation. Thus, the foundation of my planning is definitely anchored to future financial stability and security.

West Coast geography is gorgeous and city life in the assorted cities quite varied. If you have the money to do so, and desire to live somewhere on the West Coast, then I say go for it. If I unexpectedly received a million dollars, I'd be singing a different tune for sure.

by Anonymousreply 214March 24, 2021 7:30 PM

R211 thank you! Been looking at Charlottesville and will look into Staunton. I prefer something larger than a town, I think. I'm pretty citified and do better in busy, vibrant places rather than quaint sleepy ones. Anything isolated and rural or too far away from a city would be a no. I experienced that sort of lifestyle most of my childhood and into young adulthood until I could GTFO of my family. I hated being so far away from "the action" then, and still do. That imprint stuck!

by Anonymousreply 215March 24, 2021 7:38 PM

R206: I think the idea of mid-sized and smaller cities makes perfect sense, particularly if you are moving to a place that you don't know well. The mid-sized and smaller cities are both more knowable and easier to find a place for yourself in them. I wanted something large enough and complex enough that could sustain the ability of discovery and surprise over time, where I could live for a long time without knowing everything there is to know about the place and being bored, with seeing the same faces every day, with eating at the same restaurants, with doing the same things, yet not so big that I had to write off whole sections of the city as too far or too difficult, etc.

The New England states you mention I know the least about, but all have appeal to me. As for the cold and long winters, it could well be easy enough to escape for a month or two each winter. It doesn't eliminate the problem altogether, but escaping during some of the darkest days goes a long way for many people. You could rent an apartment in Savannah for 6 weeks or 2 months, for instance; it won't be tropical, but it will be comparatively mild and pleasant. In Maine the area between Augusta-Rockland-Bath-Portland can be beautiful and have great architecture. Vermont has great college towns that I would consider. Rhode Island has Provincetown and overlooked Newport, a good year-round small city I think, with lots to offer. Connecticut has some possibilities, too.

North Carolina I never quite warmed to. There are some small coastal cities and large towns that are interesting, but the Raleigh-Durham area (Chapel Hill maybe its nicest bit), Charlotte, and the other bigger cities seem too chamber of commerce PR. Everything is a drive; not much in NC lends itself to not using a car much. You're right to overlook Atlanta. Other Georgian cities of any size I can't really recommend except Savannah. It is not cheap, exactly; the area where most people from away would want to live is very small, within the historic core. In Virginia the cluster of cities around Norfolk are a sprawl in my mind, the best parts expensive, and the rest not, but not appealing either. Richmond I like but it's a love it/hate it place; the adjoining Fan District and Carytown/Museum District neighborhoods are really beautiful and have wonderful houses and a good selection of restaurants, etc, but Richmond is still a city of good and bad parts. Westover Hills is a posh historic suburb in the city. Charlottesville was mentioned. It's lovely and near to DC, but a bit sprawling and rural as much as it is urban and difficult to know. Staunton, toward the southwest corner of the state, is a gorgeous town, but small, with great architecture and georgraphy and a fair number of people who have moved there for the appeal of both. For a small place it has a lot to recommend. Alexandria VA is a beautiful historic small city but no less expensive than DC just across the Potomac; it's a way of living in DC without living quite in DC, and for everyday purposes it's certainly self-contained and spitting distance to National Airport and 45-minutes to Dulles, and AMTRAK, such as its best segment is, in DC if you want to explore Baltimore or Philadelphia or NYC or Boston. Alexandria is a great place but quite expensive and too Washington for me, DC not being a favorite city. You didn't mention Charleston SC but it's an extraordinarily beautiful and livable place, but expense because everyone wants to live there.

Numbeo is a good resource if you want to do cost-of-living comparisons and look at various cost factors and how cities score in different points. (A few examples below, but figures are city-wide and would be much higher in central historic areas)

by Anonymousreply 216March 24, 2021 7:59 PM

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the Big Island of Hawaii as a gay-friendly place, especially for folks considering or in retirement. The Kona side of the island has the best weather, while the Hilo side is cheaper and has a branch of the University of Hawaii there, so lots of of young people. Of course "affordable" is relative. You can get small condos for about $150K, but $250K - $500K will buy a 3 bedroom condo or a small house in some parts. Also, less tourists here than other islands, so less traffic, and more authentic Aloha.

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by Anonymousreply 217March 24, 2021 8:09 PM

If you are West Coast, you may have difficulty blending in with Midwestern Nice (it’s a polite “fuck off”) - or gray snow three months of the year.

by Anonymousreply 218March 24, 2021 8:30 PM

[quote]Dull dull dull

Not everyone is looking for thrills.

by Anonymousreply 219March 24, 2021 8:34 PM

It's Providence, Rhode Island,

and Provincetown, Massachusetts.

People confuse these two. Providence is a medium-sized city and the state capital of Rhode Island. It's gay-friendly, and home to Brown University and the Rhode Island School of Design. Somewhat still affordable.

Provincetown is at the tip of Cape Cod in Massachusetts and is a small town of about 3000 people that explodes to over 10,000 during the hectic summer vacation months. NOT affordable. There are more affordable, but still not cheap, homes and condos further down the cape in towns like Wellfleet, Orleans, Brewster and Harwich that are a good alternative. You would still be 1 1/2 hours from Boston and/or Providence (RI), and 20-40 minutes from very gay P-town. Great for day trips to Martha's Vineyard, Nantucket, and other towns on the cape.

by Anonymousreply 220March 24, 2021 8:40 PM

Chapel Hill R176 is a bit pricey but has a low crime rate

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by Anonymousreply 221March 24, 2021 9:38 PM

[quote]How about Virginia? What's Virginia Beach like? Alexandria or Richmond?

Virginia Beach is Pat Robertson territory. Alexandria is just suburb of DC.

by Anonymousreply 222March 24, 2021 9:44 PM

What entails being gay friendly? Some people are nice and polite to your face but will look down upon you privately. Isn’t this common throughout the South and Midwest?

by Anonymousreply 223March 24, 2021 9:53 PM

R222 What about Richmond?

by Anonymousreply 224March 24, 2021 10:24 PM

R216 - your first paragraph - it's like you know me! Yes, all of that. I truly appreciate the rest of your input too. Going to do some research into some of the places you mention, and plan to visit a few of those that "call" to me.

by Anonymousreply 225March 24, 2021 10:32 PM

R216 - I had Norfolk and Portsmouth on my list as well as Alexandria. Not so sure now, and Virginia Beach isn't sounding so great either. Rhode Island has always appealed to me, and I've visited Providence a few times and loved it. Seems so pricey though. I agree escaping the rough winters by taking a vacation somewhere else is a good idea. Hadn't really occurred to me as a way to deal with winter since I haven't been in a real winter in decades.

by Anonymousreply 226March 24, 2021 10:42 PM

R226: Portsmouth, Norfolk, Newport News, and Virginia Beach are all parts of the same sprawl, along with Chesapeake, Hampton, and a few other major componrnts. Municipally distinct but experienced more as parts if the same place. The area has a trashy feel for me, and unsettled, though there are some nice micri-neighborhoods. It's the part if Virginia that feels the least a part of Virginia (to be clear, that's not a compliment in this case.)

by Anonymousreply 227March 24, 2021 10:57 PM

R227 Ugh, that's what I've been afraid of from the little bit I've researched. Fuck, maybe I should just move to a mid-sized to smaller city and just rent for the rest of my life - although it seems unwise to allow my future housing stability to rest on a landlord, who could end my tenancy on a whim for a number of reasons. On the thread "Fidelity says I'll never be able to retire" there's good discussion about financial stuff, but it has raised doubts for me about buying a condo or townhome, which has been my plan for a few years. The idea of eventually living on a fixed income and still renting sets off alarm bells for me. I don't want to be that strange old man living in the shittiest part of a busy city near a crack house because I can't afford anything better.

by Anonymousreply 228March 24, 2021 11:15 PM

Franklin, TN

Athens, GA

Wilmington, NC

by Anonymousreply 229March 24, 2021 11:26 PM

R228, there’s a very tight supply of housing for sale so you’re not supposed to buy right now. Must you move this year?

by Anonymousreply 230March 24, 2021 11:53 PM

R230 - no, no need to move this year, but I wanted to take advantage of the super low interest rates for mortgages. However, apparently it's a seller's market right now. I'll probably just have to visit a few places that interest me, and then start looking for condos or townhomes in those places to potentially buy if I want to make the move there. Seems like an intolerably slow process too because of how the pandemic has affected so much.

by Anonymousreply 231March 25, 2021 12:10 AM

Potential Small-Med Gay Friendly Cities:

Boise, ID

Charlottesville, VA

Salt Lake City/Park City, UT

Denver, CO

Charleston, SC

Columbus, OH

Vail, CO

by Anonymousreply 232March 25, 2021 1:56 AM

No one has mentioned Madison, WI yet

by Anonymousreply 233March 25, 2021 2:07 AM

id be cautious these days of the ultra liberal enclaves like Northampton or Burlington,VT,etc. as they seem to be choking on their own wokeness. It can seem stifling in a sense. My ex and i had considered moving Oberlin, Ohio years ago and i think we dodged that bullet.

by Anonymousreply 234March 25, 2021 2:21 AM

Thanks, R220. Of course, my stupid mistake, I meant Providence and typed Provincetown. Very different...once past the first five letters!

by Anonymousreply 235March 25, 2021 9:29 AM

(R184) Louisville also has all of those hot Southern college boys.

by Anonymousreply 236March 25, 2021 9:36 AM

Nashville?

by Anonymousreply 237March 26, 2021 2:36 AM

[quote]Louisville also has all of those hot Southern college boys.

What? The number of all college students is only 22,000, or just over 3% of the population. Unless you mean Southern College, but that merged with the University of Louisville -- in 1969?

Louisville is an okay place to live, it has an interesting architectural history, has decent cultural institutions and activities, and is a blue beacon in a red state. But it can be come boring fast despite the boosterism of the place, and like a lot of smaller cities, there's an airport that will require connection to another airport to get almost anywhere.

Instead, I would head north, though, and pick the big city of Chicago and plan on escaping for at least a month or two each winter. Chicago is both affordable and livable, and a big city with all that that attends but also neighborhoods that are self contained and vital.

by Anonymousreply 238March 26, 2021 9:10 AM

Livability.com's list of 100 Best Places To Live the U.S. selected from "more than 1,000 small to mid-sized cities on factors like safety, affordability, economic stability, outdoor recreation, accessibility and community engagement. This year’s list was also informed by a new metric: an “opportunity score”...including variables like job numbers, broadband access, economic resilience and growth."

This list has some interesting choices I thought, much more so than most. If you are looking at options, it might be a place to look and find that there's a city, near another you already had in mind, that you overlooked or dismissed. Anyway, a starting point obviously, not an end point.

I'm more attentive to these lists than I should be, and in the past few years they all disappoint in a HuffPost/YahooNews sort of way. Usually these are pure click bait, the Top 10, or Top 20 places to retires, for cost-of-living savings, for gays and lesbians, for whatever. Their criteria are determined by whatever source they can most easily lift their data from. A suggestion of San Francisco CA or Rye NY mentions that cost-of-living is high, but so are salaries, and other brilliant analysis. Or a Top 5 list picks one city from each state as if Missouri's best were on equal footing with Maryland's best or Massachusetts'.

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by Anonymousreply 239March 26, 2021 10:18 AM

New Orleans seems but I’m scared of the crime and racism. Are they any good gay clubs or bars in New Orleans?

by Anonymousreply 240March 26, 2021 10:22 AM

r239 Out of 100 cities on that list, there is only ONE in California--and it's SACRAMENTO? Yet it's filled with places from shithole states like the Dakotas, Florida, Texas, Arizona, and the South.

by Anonymousreply 241March 26, 2021 12:28 PM

Fair enough, R241. The same list published in 2019 listed 3 California cities: Victorville, Lancaster, and San Bernardino. Cost of living is among their criteria.

California misses out on many lists of affordable cities, particularly the list of 10, 15, or 25 cities.

And likewise California doesn't do well in a lot of lists of best cities to retire, not ranking on Travel & Leisure 2021 11 best cities to retire; CNBC's to 20 most LGBT friendly places to retire 2021, or Forbes' 22 cities for LGBT retirees 2929; but Santa Ana places in SeniorAdvice's top 20 cities for LGBT retirement 2020.

Business Insider's 50 best places to live in America 3020 include San Francisco, San Diego, San José.

Curbed's top 20 cities to move to now 2020 and Bankrate's top ten cities for 2021 overlook CA.

U.S. News & World Report's 25 best places to live in 3020-2021 includes San Francisco. Their 150 best places to live 2020-2021 includes the bumper crop of Visalia, Stockton, Modesto, Bakersfield, Fresno, Salinas, Vallejo/Fairfield, Santa Bárbara, San Diego, Sacramento, and San Francisco.

None of these lists ever gets it right, though some come a little closer and some barely try. If it's a national list it's going to include red states, shithole states, and Southern states. Texas and Florida are always over/represented it seems; Arizona, Colorado, Idaho, North Carolina, and Texas are seeing the largest incoming numbers of people relocating.

by Anonymousreply 242March 26, 2021 5:54 PM

Consider retiring abroad to Mexico or Costa Rica.

by Anonymousreply 243March 26, 2021 11:15 PM

Are there any DLers currently living in (or have lived in at one time) some of the smaller cities suggested in this thread? Please tell us about it.

by Anonymousreply 244March 26, 2021 11:51 PM

[quote] Chapel Hill [R176] is a bit pricey but has a low crime rate.

Isn't that true for most places-- high crime rate will be more affordable and visa versa?

by Anonymousreply 245March 27, 2021 12:46 AM

Some other suggestions not yet mentioned (at least I think not.) None of these will please many, or maybe any, but to my mind they gave some unique qualities

Winston-Salem NC - a nicer place than Greensboro, Raleigh-Durham, or (not recommended) Charlotte, but it is near all of them and farther yet still reasonably convenient to Asheville (2.25 hrs drive.) Property is higher quality and lower price, it voted 52% Dem and 42% Rep.

Roanoke VA - near Staunton VA in the southwest corner if the state; an attractive town, cheap, a bit artsy/hippie.

Knoxville TN - attractive city center, lots of loft conversions of historic hotels and office buildings, interesting housing stock and distinct neighborhoods, overall a fairly good job of revitalizing a downtown. Nearby Chattanooga is uglier and more pick marked by urban canning mistakes but has somehow become popular and fairly expensive. A 2.5 hr drive to Nashville which has become a bit if a traffic clogged hipster cliche, and not at all inexpensive. Memphis is grittier, poorer, but on something of a rebound, still pricier than Knoxville

Greensville SC was much hyped two or three years ago. I don't know it well at all but know people who more or less like it, but haven't heard anyone who quite loved the place. Upstate SC will always be Upstate SC for me, despite any degree of hype and hip quotient and whirring of economic engines.

Natchez MS is probably suited only for serious architecture fans, and those with a strong constitution for hearing all of your friends turn stupid and say things like, "but isn't that creepy, a whole town built on slavery? I mean, slavery was bad, right?" Yes, almost as bad as having no deeper understanding of slavery than that it was bad, right? Attractive town, beautiful setting, amazing architecture, a little blue oasis in a red stained state, good food, cheap houses, and a mayor who will pay $2500 moving expenses and $300 a month for a year to boost population.

North Carolina coastal cities/towns of Wilmington, Washington, New Bern, if you like ocean access and historic cities. Also Salisbury NC and Concord NC, both big towns/small cities near Charlotte.

Leesburg VA, Culpeper VA, Fredericksburg are towns/small cities with 18thC cores, none are cheap but each have fairly well developed centers.

Chesterton MD is a small college town of 18th and 19thC houses on a riverfront setting. Good for a quiet small town setting with easy driving access to Baltimore, DC, Philadelphia (a good location 8f you fly a lot.)

Some of the Philadelphia centered Main Line and more or less adjacent towns are really beautiful, prosperous, and villagey, with village life at your doorstep and easy access to the center of Philadelphia. Doylestown slightly to the north has been put forth in DL several times as a potential spot if gay infiltration.

by Anonymousreply 246March 27, 2021 2:04 AM

[quote] Chattanooga is uglier and more pick marked by urban canning mistakes

In English please.

by Anonymousreply 247March 27, 2021 2:12 AM

Sure, R247. That was bad. Should read:

"Chattanooga is uglier and more pock-marked by urban planning mistakes"

by Anonymousreply 248March 27, 2021 2:14 AM

R244, not me, but I mentioned earlier that my lesbian colleague and partner love Asheville. They live there part of the year and are in their late 60s. I can't say for sure if it'd have the same level of appeal for gay men.

I lived in Davis, California, which was also mentioned on this topic, as an early 20-something with an ex who was going to school at the university. I found the area gay friendly and safe but also boring. The town is very centered around the college. The biggest community event when I lived there was probably the Thursday farmer's market. There's a large retirement community there though, and it might be just fine for someone older looking for a slow pace of life and reasonable proximinity to cities. It's cheaper to live in Davis than the Bay Area but still relatively expensive.

by Anonymousreply 249March 28, 2021 9:07 AM

I wonder if Portland, OR is a good place to move in 2022. Seems like there is a lot of political turmoil and protests happening there.

by Anonymousreply 250March 3, 2022 5:02 PM

R227 I don't think I'd want to be living along the Eastern coast during hurricane season. They seem to be happening more often.

by Anonymousreply 251March 3, 2022 5:05 PM

r250 most of the 'protests' are peace marches but if you're more worried about property damage and rising taxes than righteous restorative justice, then you're probably a repuglithug and don't deserve to live in pdx or anywhere.

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by Anonymousreply 252March 3, 2022 5:12 PM

R252 Not a republithung. When I say protests I am referring to the Proud Boys. Don't start passing judgement.

by Anonymousreply 253March 3, 2022 5:15 PM

r253 so, you'd join ukraine's army but you won't fight for antifa against pdx's terrorists?

by Anonymousreply 254March 3, 2022 5:16 PM

Antifa Doesn't Exist™

by Anonymousreply 255March 3, 2022 5:17 PM

R254 when did I say any of that? wtf?!

so many triggered idiots on this forum.

by Anonymousreply 256March 3, 2022 5:17 PM

R252 Do you live in Portland?

by Anonymousreply 257March 3, 2022 5:20 PM

[quote]Is Philadelphia really that gay friendly outside of certain areas/neighborhoods? I perceived it as a bit more conservative, even though this is just word of mouth.

it is gay friendly for the most part. really, it's just poor, that colored the feeling in some areas of the city

by Anonymousreply 258March 3, 2022 5:23 PM

r256 so many homophobic racists, too. They don't want to live in a real gay ghetto or an urban center, they want to live in sprawling gentrifying condos and townouses with their caftans and martinis, listening to showtunes and dreaming about the good ol' days of segregation.

when they say gay-friendly what they mean is white and liberal.

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by Anonymousreply 259March 3, 2022 5:25 PM

r257 Oh, hell no.

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by Anonymousreply 260March 3, 2022 5:28 PM

Santa Fe is great... if you like pinon nuts and isolation.

But ultimately, it's Palm Springs-lite but with the same amount of coke heads and better architecture. Which might be a nice change of pace for those used to the greater number of meth heads that make up practically everywhere else.

ABQ just ended up too much like Phoenix or Houston. a sprawling mess except you can actually escape the suburban sprawl under twenty minutes.

Still, I prefer it to most other regions. . . but it can feel isolating, like you're living on Mars, with a greater expanse of nothingness for miles around. And locales think nothing of the miles, so you definitely need to drive for an adequate social life unless you're an eldergay. Gorgeous skylines but everything gets so fucking dusty.

Personally, I'm more apt for smaller communities outside of metros and a hustler (the other kind), I just needed ample more space.

Seriously, these days, there's very few cities and towns that are anti-lgbt. So, you should round it out more by what type of scene you're looking for.

Yes, CA might be a dumpsterfire these days but there's many more diverse options to finding a comfortable space outside of the cities but close enough to visit on the weekends, if not nightly. . . with public transport and let's be real, the freeways and highways there make it easier than most states to drive virtually to them all.

You want cities you never have to leave? Bathsalt Florida is the place to be. But outside of the east coast, west coast rivalries... Florida has earned it's fucked up reputation entirely. But it's the go to place for mega whores. (though, Charleston, SC and more the surrounding smaller towns are better for pigs.)

Texas fits for that, too - cities in which lgb rarely venture outside of them -

Dallas is more scene without the poliltics of Houston.

Politics in Houston tend to be shift from ctrl-left to alt-right every other year despite most people falling left of center - the selling point: it has more options for housing and living both in the loop and outside of it.

Austin is the more pluralist cultural center but the sprawl is the worst of the three yet there's a lot more cruising than the other two and thus, probably the most outwardly gay friendly of the three.

(Corpus Christi is the chill alternative to the three primaries.. while much smaller Galveston is workable for the eldergay on a budget that wants to airbnb couple properties to the young, dumb, hung)

But if you want to maximize your dollar while living in or in closer proximity to a metro, then consider the states that the mere mention of them causes the DL to queef. Even if they're in a red state, they tend to be blue with a sizable flats and a lgbt community.

For musical queens, there's many southern and midwestern communities that fulfill the theatre niche... and yet being a hundred more times more (albeit, often unintentionally) flaming.

Again, all depends on the vibe you're looking for.

by Anonymousreply 261March 3, 2022 6:29 PM

Most gays are never happy for long, no matter where they live. A lot of us seem to have very short attention spans and get bored easily. I've met very few younger gays who don't constantly whine about wanting to live somewhere else, even when they moved to their current city because they were bored where the were before. They're always chasing the other side of the rainbow and are too immature to figure out that it doesn't exist. No matter where they live the newness will wear off relatively quickly and it'll just be another place they yearn to leave.

Mature gays find a place where they can have a good life and stay put. When they get bored they go for short visits to other cities.

by Anonymousreply 262March 3, 2022 8:31 PM
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