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Cyd Charisse

WTF was that all about?

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by Anonymousreply 54511 hours ago

Tula! Fiinklea!!

by Anonymousreply 111/17/2020

This is what it was all about!

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by Anonymousreply 211/17/2020

And this!

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by Anonymousreply 311/17/2020

A stunningly beautiful woman and a superlative dancer who starred in two of the very greatest musicals of all time - SINGIN' IN THE RAIN and THE BAND WAGON. Not much of an actress but surely one of the most alluring women ever to appear onscreen. Her body was womanly perfection and watching her dance was thrilling - the perfect combination of strength and elegance.

by Anonymousreply 411/17/2020

Great legs.

by Anonymousreply 511/17/2020

In the infamous Rob Lowe/"Snow" Academy Awards opening, Cyd was a part of the Cocoanut Grove audience with husband Tony Martin. His first wife Alice Faye was there with husband Phil Harris.

by Anonymousreply 611/17/2020

The movie you never saw.

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by Anonymousreply 711/17/2020

I've seen the outtakes with Marilyn, R7, but not that one, and I thought I'd seen/known a lot. I didn't know that Cyd had been cast in the Polly Bergen role. Adding that to my download list!

by Anonymousreply 811/17/2020

Marilyn must have really struggled to keep her weight off during the SOMETHING's shoot because the Marilyn of SOME LIKE IT HOT and THE MISFITS would have looked like a big, blowsy tank next to sleek, toned, incredibly fit Cyd Charisse.

by Anonymousreply 911/17/2020


What is Cyd short for?

by Anonymousreply 1011/18/2020

Wikipedia entry on Cyd will explain all, R10.

by Anonymousreply 1111/18/2020

She was a beautiful woman.

by Anonymousreply 1211/18/2020

Too bad she wasn't much of a singer or actress. She would have been a terrific Phyllis in "Follies" with Jane Powell or Debbie Reynolds as Sally.

by Anonymousreply 1311/18/2020


She would have been a better Phyllis than Cloris Leachman.

by Anonymousreply 1411/20/2020

Troll thread.

OP types this from his mother's basement as Cyd Charisse dances in glory forever.

by Anonymousreply 1511/20/2020

What’s she up to these days?

by Anonymousreply 1611/20/2020

R8, Cyd is embarrassingly hammy in the few clips I've seen of her in "Something's Got to Give." She's supposed to be the vain new wife of the Dean Martin character, but she overplays the part, overexaggerating her gestures as if she was doing farce theater.

Supposedly, Marilyn complained to the producers that Cyd was padding her bra to make her breasts appear larger than hers.

by Anonymousreply 1711/20/2020

she never took a grape when offered

by Anonymousreply 1811/20/2020

She’s alright with me

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by Anonymousreply 1911/20/2020

R18 Beulah, everybody knows that you have to peel a grape before you hand it to the queen!

by Anonymousreply 2011/20/2020

Don't know if it was about Cyd Charisse or another of the French dancers who made it to Hollywood around that time, but Frank Sinatra quipped "her legs to right up to her bird" or words to that affect.

Like so many others in Hollywood at the time, Cyd Charisse and husband were staunch firm republicans.

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by Anonymousreply 2111/20/2020

Hermès always thought I was the better dancer.

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by Anonymousreply 2211/20/2020

“The man's face has more powder on it than Ann Miller's and she's giving him to me!”

by Anonymousreply 2311/20/2020

A friend who worked with her on the road in the 1970's says she was great fun....more fun than her husband.

He said her only difficulty was that the furniture had to be in the same place every night or she couldn't remember her lines and blocking.....and NO ad libbing......

He also says he ran across her in LA almost 10 years later and she remembered him and talked to him for half an hour asking about how he was doing and how his family was......

by Anonymousreply 2411/20/2020

[quote]What is Cyd short for?


by Anonymousreply 2511/20/2020

Girl Hunt Ballet.

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by Anonymousreply 2611/20/2020

R9 not so. Marilyn lost a lot of weight following gall bladder removal in 1961 and had no problems keeping it off. Her autopsy records her weighing just over 8.3 stone (53kgs). If anything she was underweight.

In much of the restored footage she looks great and the movie could have done well if she was handled well. The studio fired her mainly because they were hemorrhaging money on "Cleopatra" and wanted to cut their losses on likely extended-production costs on this.

A lot of people who claim MM was depressed over this fail to realise Dean Martin (who had final say over his leading lady) refused to make this with MM, and the studio would still have to pay him regardless if it got finished. Therefore they hired MM back shortly before she dies, with better money.

Can't remember who said it but someone famous said (cruelly) the ending was a forgone conclusion because "What man in their right mind would chose Cyd Charisse over Marilyn Monroe?!"

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by Anonymousreply 2711/20/2020

Cyd Charisse was one of those dancers that gave some little boys precocious boners when watching.

by Anonymousreply 2811/20/2020

I met her in her later years. She was still magnificent, really sweet to me a complete stranger, and had perfect memory of her episode with MM, which she was happy to share.

by Anonymousreply 2911/20/2020

R27 doesn’t have it exactly right either: I think the Wikipedia article states that Martin refused to make the film without MM, not with her. I once saw about half an hour of Something’s Got To Give on AMC I think, with Bob Dorian introduction (or that newer guy) and it was beautifully shot by Cukor. Oh well.

by Anonymousreply 3011/20/2020

She danced very very well for a long time. I think she's best in Silk Stockings because for once it suits the character to speak English like a second language. She really went the farthest with the studio produced mid-Atlantic, it usually makes her sound so false. For the flip side of Cyd, watch some of her crime dame films like Tension or Party Girl or East Side West Side. She also played many ethnicities, often with Ricardo Montalban, in movies like Sombrero and Mark of the Renegade or The Wild North.

She did better than most hanging on for a few more films after her MGM contract ended, but she must have felt it coming, going from three films a year in the 40s to one per year in the late 50s, to gap years between films by the mid 60s.

by Anonymousreply 3111/20/2020

R30 I'm so sorry, I messed up the most pertinent point, Dean Martin refused to go ahead WITHOUT Marilyn as his leading lady. What a gent.

by Anonymousreply 3211/20/2020

[R27] 116 pounds isn’t particularly thin for a 5’5” movie actress with the camera adding 10lbs and all. Marilyn lost weight due her gall bladder surgery, not due to healthy habits. She was packing on weight again near the end. When she sang Happy Birthday to JFK she looked as if she were hiding several dinner rolls in her girdle. Gay men might be dazzled by boozy, druggy, tubby, crazy Marilyn but I’ll bet that most straight guys would go for Cyd first. Cyd had a far better body and didn’t exude mental and physical ill health.

by Anonymousreply 3311/20/2020

[R27] Fox canned Marilyn’s fat, crazy ass because she was seemingly incapable of performing. Doris Day was far better in the role than the footage of Marilyn shows. But she did look great in the footage - particularly the screen texts when the weight loss was newer. She was clearly porking out as the shoot went along.

by Anonymousreply 3411/20/2020

It's amazing to compare the casting of the Cukor/MM film vs. Marty Melchor/Doris Day film. All the old school supporting cast was replaced by tv sitcom staples. The whole affairs was a big downgrade - James Garner, Polly Bergin. Wally Cox got replaced by Don Knotts!

by Anonymousreply 3511/20/2020

Hey, Marilyn -- this is NOT YOUR THREAD!

by Anonymousreply 3611/20/2020

r35 I consider James Garner a major upgrade from Dean Martin.

by Anonymousreply 3711/20/2020

on what's my line

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by Anonymousreply 3811/20/2020

[quote] In August 1960, LeRoy was heading up a drive in Hollywood to recruit others for Nixon. In addition to LeRoy, George Murphy, and Helen Hayes, the 1960 Nixon/Lodge ticket also had other Hollywood backers, including: Jimmy Stewart, Gary Cooper, Rosalind Russell, Robert Montgomery, Robert Cummings, Robert Taylor, Irene Dunn, Cesar Romero and Mary Pickford. Again in 1962, when Nixon ran for Governor of California, he found a similar roster of Hollywood supporters — among them, Jimmy Stewart, Red Skelton, Rosalind Russell, Dick Powell, June Allyson, Robert Young, Tony Martin, Cyd Charisse, Irene Dunn, Johnny Mathis, Louise Beavers, and Efrem Zimbalist, Jr.

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by Anonymousreply 3911/20/2020

I love this number from "It's Always Fair Weather" -she's adorable.

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by Anonymousreply 4011/20/2020

R33 this pic was taken one week after the JFK event, call it poking out?

R34 the clips from the unfinished movie cannot be compared to "Move Over, Darling" which is edited and perfected in the studio.

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by Anonymousreply 4111/20/2020

R37 James was a stunner

by Anonymousreply 4211/20/2020

[R35] Snob with bad taste. The supporting actors were brilliant.

by Anonymousreply 4311/20/2020

[R39] Soviet apparatchik taking names from 60 years ago. Loser and dumbass.

by Anonymousreply 4411/20/2020

R33 has it completely backwards. Straight guys love Monroe types. Gays worship Charisse types.

by Anonymousreply 4511/20/2020

[R41] Yes - clearly beginning to pork out. No discipline. That’s why Cyd is such a compelling contrast. She had it going on as a person.

by Anonymousreply 4611/20/2020

Cyd Charisse is just awful in the "Something's Got To Give" clips. Zero chemistry with Dean Martin. Humorless. Obviously they wanted someone who looked very different from Monroe but it was horrible casting.

by Anonymousreply 4711/20/2020

R46 thinks 8st is heavy for an average height woman.

In this snap, a few days before she died she was positively approaching Chrissy Metz territory....

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by Anonymousreply 4811/20/2020

R45 - exactly! The bigger girls are far more popular hence why so many handsome and fit straight guys marry chubbier women. Big boobs, big butt and thicker thighs are what almost all straight men I talk to like. Other than celebrities who beard or have marriages set up by studios or mutual interests, I haven't met a single straight guy who doesn't say models "look like little boys" or "they have no hips".

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by Anonymousreply 4911/20/2020

[R48] Alcoholic weight distribution. Cud’s incredible body speaks for itself.

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by Anonymousreply 5011/20/2020


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by Anonymousreply 5111/20/2020

[R49] Men go for health and intelligence over fat asses and stupidity.

by Anonymousreply 5211/20/2020

Her niece, Zan Charisse, played Gypsy in the 1974 Angela Lansbury production.

by Anonymousreply 5311/20/2020

[quote]What’s she up to these days?

She's fine, she sends her love!

by Anonymousreply 5411/20/2020

I love Cyd with Gene Kelly; this was supposedly her favorite of all her dances:

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by Anonymousreply 5511/20/2020

Cyd replaced Lilianne Montececchi on Broadway's "Grand Hotel"; unfortunately, I have yet to find any footage of her dancing, so we'll have to settle for Leslie Caron in the German production:

(go to 36:00 if the link doesn't)

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by Anonymousreply 5611/20/2020

]quote]She was packing on weight again near the end. When she sang Happy Birthday to JFK she looked as if she were hiding several dinner rolls in her girdle.

Um, no. I can only have one image so instead of the famous ass shot from the JFK celebration, here's one from the George Barris beach shoot, several weeks after JFK.

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by Anonymousreply 5711/20/2020

R52 - yeah cuz most straight men are soooooooo entranced by the smart girls. I can tell you one thing, the smartest and most accomplished straight women I know are single. Ditto the ones into health and fitness. Most straight men are inherently insecure deep down...they don't want to appear "less than" the "little woman". This is why you see so many young, successful white men with larger sized women or Asian/Mexican women who they are trained to think are their "inferiors". I don't care what they say to sound politically correct. The truth is as obvious as Elton was when he married a woman.

by Anonymousreply 5811/20/2020

Polly Bergen wasn't a poor replacement for Cyd Charisse. Polly could actually act.

by Anonymousreply 5911/20/2020

[[R52].The smart ones value brains, athleticism and good health - mental and physical.

by Anonymousreply 6011/20/2020

I want to know how the censors let MGM get away with those swinging beaded tassles hanging off of Cyd's erect boobs on her red dress in the Girl Hunt Ballet, seen at r26?

by Anonymousreply 6111/20/2020

[R57] Marilyn looks like a very old and unhealthy 36 in that photo. No surprise she was dead soon. The setting sunlight makes it all seem sadder.

by Anonymousreply 6211/20/2020

[quote]Polly Bergen wasn't a poor replacement for Cyd Charisse. Polly could actually act.

Polly Bergen would have been great together with Dean Martin.

by Anonymousreply 6311/20/2020

Polly Bergen is really the only funny thing in Move Over, Darling. I love the scenes where she's trying to strip Jim Garner out of his clothes. The rest is a tedious bore.

by Anonymousreply 6411/20/2020

I think Marilyn still is attractive in those clips, but she clearly looks like someone in her mid-thirties or later, and that breathy little girl voice doesn't really work for her anymore. If she would not have died, I think she would have needed to revamp her style and image a bit and move on from the blonde fantasy (I have never seen The Misfits -- maybe she did there).

by Anonymousreply 6511/20/2020

[R65] Very perceptive post. Arthur Miller wrote The Misfits and it was his vision of Marilyn that was presented in the movie as the “real” Marilyn. It was Arthur Miller interpreting Marilyn. Fascinating. The real Marilyn ended up dead in bed at the young age of 36. Yet her life still feels like a modern conundrum.

by Anonymousreply 6611/20/2020

[quote]breathy little girl voice doesn't really work for her anymore.

Good thing she didn't use if for most of the finished film then.

by Anonymousreply 6711/20/2020

Her scenes with Wally Cox are charming.

She looks like such a movie star.

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by Anonymousreply 6811/20/2020

[R58].I really don’t think it’s about being “inferior” or “superior” - but a lack of ambiguity about sex roles does simplify goals in life. Not the least of which is procreation.

by Anonymousreply 6911/20/2020

The idea was to have Marilyn do smart, cutting edge comedies - too bad it didn’t happen

by Anonymousreply 7011/20/2020

Fucking gorgeous...

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by Anonymousreply 7111/20/2020

Cyd is terrific in Silk Stockings. But then she had one of the great directors of all time to help her Rouben Mamoulian. And she and Fred Astaire are dancing to Cole Porter. The mind reels. Too bad the camera negative is disintegrating and the bluray looks like a musical version of Lawrence of Arabia.

by Anonymousreply 7211/20/2020

Pure class. What modern actress holds that title today?

by Anonymousreply 7311/20/2020

They don't dub actresses today, mostly.

by Anonymousreply 7411/20/2020

As Vicki girl

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by Anonymousreply 7511/20/2020

These were what it was all about.

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by Anonymousreply 7611/20/2020

The clip shown earlier with Marilyn and the two kids was filmed at George Cukor's house.

by Anonymousreply 7711/20/2020

[quote]The clip shown earlier with Marilyn and the two kids was filmed at George Cukor's house.

No, it was filmed at Fox. They built Cukor's house on Stage 14, including the pool, which is still there, just covered up

And they used the same sets for Move Over Darling.

by Anonymousreply 7811/20/2020

I love the name "Cyd Charisse." It sounds so glamorous like some perfumed crystal decanter.

by Anonymousreply 7911/20/2020

Her hair was often badly styled and dyed in films and it made her face look very severe. I fear Mr. Sydney Guilaroff let her down. Her makeup, too, come to think of it.

by Anonymousreply 8011/20/2020

Schyd Scharisse.

by Anonymousreply 8111/20/2020

Cyd Charisse could have been described as "gamine."

by Anonymousreply 8211/20/2020

Her daughter in law died in the American Airlines flight 191 crash in 1979.

by Anonymousreply 8311/20/2020

Cyd is leggy which is not gamine.

by Anonymousreply 8411/20/2020

This clip with her husband is... kind of awful. She should not have been allowed to sing, and it’s jaw-dropping he was a professional. He’s so lumberingly bland.

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by Anonymousreply 8511/20/2020

Cyd's roles in stock tours included Lola in "Damn Yankees" and the title part in "Illya, Darling."

by Anonymousreply 8611/20/2020

Who let him move like that? Where's Jack Cole when you need him?

by Anonymousreply 8711/20/2020

Threads are conflating w all the MM comments. Can someone post the Cyd Charisse beaver shot from when her dress twirled up during a lift and she had no panties on? We need to save this thread with 1950s natural beaver pelt. Not that bleached carpet MM painted on with a toothbrush.

by Anonymousreply 8811/20/2020

That was Maria Montez!

by Anonymousreply 8911/20/2020

In this photo you can see that Miss Charisse bleached her pubis even lighter than Marilyn’s!


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by Anonymousreply 9011/20/2020

R90 lmao

by Anonymousreply 9111/20/2020

How about Carmen Miranda?

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by Anonymousreply 9211/20/2020

That photo has to be doctored. Why is her crotch in perfect focus but not other parts of the picture at a similar distance from the lens?

by Anonymousreply 9311/20/2020

In the Girl Hunt Ballet do you look at Cyd or Fred when they are dancing together in the up-tempo bit?

by Anonymousreply 9411/20/2020


by Anonymousreply 9511/21/2020

Cyd's husband Tony Martin was a contract player at MGM in the late 1930s. He possessed a beautiful tenor's croon and was quite handsome though perhaps a little too ethnic (he was Jewish and looked Italian) for LB Mayer's tastes, and they never gave him any decent roles. His one shot at stardom was singing "You Stepped Out of a Dream" in Ziegfeld Girl, though IIRC, he's not so much seen as heard as Hedy, Lana, Judy and a host of Adrian-clad showgirls are the focus of the number. He eventually returned to MGM and appeared in some of their final musicals, including Hit the Deck and Deep in My Heart.

He made a much better living producing hit recordings and singing with big bands like Glenn Miller's and Woody Herman's, appearing on the radio and in Las Vegas, where he commanded the highest salary of that time.

He was married to Alice Faye from 1937-41 when she was Fox's biggest and busiest female star. Though their marriage was short-lived his second marriage to Cyd was one of the longest in Hollywood history, 60 years, and ended with her death in 2008. He lived to be 98 and died in 2012.

by Anonymousreply 9611/21/2020

The song @ r85 seems awkward for him. Maybe it’s not in his natural key, and it was chosen to accommodate her more limited range?

Watching that, I would never in a million years guess he was a headliner.

by Anonymousreply 9711/21/2020

Marilyn looked absolutely stunning in that clip at R68

The camera loved her.

by Anonymousreply 9811/21/2020

I think we've licked Cyd's crotch.

by Anonymousreply 9911/21/2020

Her other Party Girl number...

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by Anonymousreply 10011/21/2020

R93 - motion blur

by Anonymousreply 10111/21/2020

Why did the Party Girl MUA not match her face to her body?

by Anonymousreply 10211/21/2020

Cyd was in the ensemble of girl waitresses in 1946's The Harvey Girls and is prominently seen in a few numbers though she isn't given any dance solos.

Doe anyone know why MGM didn't cash in on her talent until the 1950s? What took them so long when they had Gene Kelly and Fred Astaire on the lot needing a great dance partner? I wonder if Arthur Freed was trying so hard to push Lucile Bremer down everyone's throats?

by Anonymousreply 10311/21/2020

Cyd & Annie

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by Anonymousreply 10411/21/2020

Lucille Bremer was pretty great in her dance numbers with Fred Astaire and her I Won't Dance with Van Johnson is one of the best things in a MGM musical. So what if she was fucking Freed.

by Anonymousreply 10511/21/2020

Cyd and Ricardo...

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by Anonymousreply 10611/21/2020

[quote]R103 Does anyone know why MGM didn't cash in on her talent until the 1950s?

Because her acting sucked?

by Anonymousreply 10711/21/2020

Well, she was 28 in 1950 and would have just been entering her dancing prime. MGM, previous to that, didn't really star expert ballerinas in their musicals. Here she is competing with Liliane...

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by Anonymousreply 10811/21/2020

I watch that Kissing Bandit dance every time it appears online! Thanks for posting, r104.

MGM perfection. The costumes, the dancing, Annie and Cyd, and OMG Ricardo and his sideburns! I've never watched the film as it actually stars Sinatra and Kathryn Grayson, lol. Am I missing anything?

by Anonymousreply 10911/21/2020

28 can be a dangerous age for a dancer, especially a ballerina, veering into old age.

by Anonymousreply 11011/21/2020

Yes, r109....his pants.

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by Anonymousreply 11111/21/2020

Ann Miller tells a story about doing that dance. She said the dresses she and Cyd wore were so heavy that it gave Ricardo a permanent injury having to lift the girls in them.

by Anonymousreply 11211/21/2020

R109 - It was a notorious bomb for Sinatra. The dance number was added late when the studio was trying to salvage the film.

by Anonymousreply 11311/21/2020

Does anyone remember when Dawn French did an imitation of Cyd in the red dress in the Girl Hunt Ballet? She is a surprisingly good dancer considering her size.

by Anonymousreply 11411/21/2020

It was about dat azz. Even gf's of mine said so.

by Anonymousreply 11511/21/2020

She was a superb Cassie, r114.

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by Anonymousreply 11611/21/2020

She had a hot ass...

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by Anonymousreply 11711/21/2020

That lady in the background is checking her out.

by Anonymousreply 11811/21/2020

She was sex on a stick!

by Anonymousreply 11911/21/2020

No Cyd Charisse thread would be complete without...

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by Anonymousreply 12011/21/2020

R61 - i'm surprised the censors allowed the shot of Fred's gun rising like an erection.

by Anonymousreply 12111/21/2020

She got sexier as she got older.

by Anonymousreply 12211/21/2020

Sad that she took to stripping to make ends meet.

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by Anonymousreply 12311/21/2020

Somethin' wrong with strippin'?

by Anonymousreply 12411/21/2020

OMG that woman in the Grand Hotel commercial always makes me laugh. So great! But also such memories of those sad plague years when everyone was dying.

by Anonymousreply 12511/21/2020

You need to pick up the last few minutes of Monroe's scenes.

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by Anonymousreply 12611/21/2020

32:30 at the link above which didn't take.

by Anonymousreply 12711/21/2020

I wonder about that platinum shade of blonde on Marilyn's hair (or wig?) and if it wasn't too harsh and aged her a bit.

by Anonymousreply 12811/21/2020

She needed aging a bit. She was 36, and hopefully aging out of sexpot roles.

by Anonymousreply 12911/21/2020

I personally think she looked gorgeous in the (uncompleted) film.

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by Anonymousreply 13011/21/2020

Watching the clips is dismaying as it looks like Marilyn is being squeezed into a typically Doris Day 1960s romcom. MM's films were always EVENTS but this looks so ordinary.

It's comparable to the debacle of watching Garbo in Two-Faced Woman, trying to turn her into a screwball heroine a la Irene Dunne, also directed by George Cukor.

Both Marilyn and Garbo ended their careers at the right time, involuntarily or not.

by Anonymousreply 13111/21/2020

Yeah, Marilyn looked much better than she had in "Some Like It Hot" and the Gable movie. The white/platinum signalled how well she might have looked in old age if she'd been able to get herself together.

by Anonymousreply 13211/21/2020

Wow - Dean Martin has been dead for over 20 years already. Time flies.

by Anonymousreply 13311/21/2020

I agree. This is the kind of stuff Doris Day did exceptionally well. Doris was beautiful but could conjure up truly comic facial expressions and voice when she need them, somewhat like Lucille Ball. Perfect for this sort of film.

Monroe had another sort of energy.

In 1962 Monroe should have done something like "Days of Wine and Roses".

by Anonymousreply 13411/21/2020

Sydney Guilaroff worked with longtime friend, Marilyn and with Director Cukor in designing the style and color she would wear in the film. Because he was still under contract to MGM, he only did Monroe's hair and not Cyd's, although they'd worked together many times at MGM. His MGM contract allowed him to work outside of that studio for individuals who were friends. These included Natalie Wood, Shirley MacLaine and Marilyn.

My own personal experiences with Cyd were negative. When I approached her in 1990 about donating a signed photo for an AIDS auction, she told me I would have to pay her $ 500.00 (cash or bank check) to secure the signed photo.

Previously, in October of 1984 when the National Film Society was scheduled to honor Guilaroff with a lifetime achievement award in Los Angeles, I approached Cyd about paying a tribute to Sydney. Elizabeth Taylor was scheduled to present the honor and a number of other stars Sydney had worked with, were to attend. Even those who could not attend (including Lucille Ball, Greer Garson, Katharine Hepburn, Doris Day, et al) sent telegrams and warm messages.

When I spoke with Cyd she told me that "...if the NFS would like to also honor me, I'd be delighted to honor Sydney., otherwise, my schedule is much too busy..."

by Anonymousreply 13511/21/2020

Birds of a feather...

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by Anonymousreply 13611/21/2020

Disappointing to hear about Cyd. I assumed that she would have been nicer than that.

by Anonymousreply 13711/21/2020

R58 is the single stupidest post I've read on this site.

by Anonymousreply 13811/21/2020

I posted Cyd on the celebs who aged well thread.

She was still impressive almost to the end.

She was a fixture in the "ladies who lunch" crowd in BH. Friendly with my boss.

My impression of her was that of a warm and engaging woman who was gracious even to the help aka me.

by Anonymousreply 13911/21/2020

She turned into an old Jewish lady. Does a Lazy eye become more prominent with age? Older people tire more easily and lazy eyes often are most pronounced when the person is tired (c.f. Bonnie Franklin on taping day).

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by Anonymousreply 14011/21/2020

Move Over, darling made money but was a critical flop. It was written by sitcom writers adn the problem with the film is that it seems like an extended sitcom. She was still #1 at the box office, but that was soon to change and her career decline/descent would soon begin.

by Anonymousreply 14111/21/2020

Perky tits and ass why didn't Dean Martin just tell Cyd to scram after Marilyn returned?

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by Anonymousreply 14211/21/2020

Isn't the plot that Dean marries Cyd after Marilyn is declared legally dead?

by Anonymousreply 14311/22/2020

Yes but once Marilyn returns she has to pose as the Swedish nanny as Dean can't bring himself to say "Hey, my first wife is back!"

by Anonymousreply 14411/22/2020

Doesn't Dean have any photos of his first wife so that Cyd recognises her? Is does he get rid of them?

by Anonymousreply 14511/22/2020

I attended the AFI Tribute to Fred Astaire in 1981. A number of people paid tribute to Astaire during the program, which was broadcast on television.

Two of Fred's leading ladies received thunderous applause and standing ovations when they spoke - Audrey Hepburn and Eleanor Powell. Cyd also spoke but only received a solid round of applause but no standing ovation. She was livid about that and complained to friends that Hepburn had made only a few musicals and was "...hardly the dancer I am..." She also noted, "Nobody even remembers who the f--k Powell is..."

by Anonymousreply 14611/22/2020

Well Audrey was beloved and Eleanor had left the business so I can understand the responses.

by Anonymousreply 14711/22/2020

Cyd sounds like a nasty bugger

by Anonymousreply 14811/22/2020

Powell was a star who carried movies by herself. She didn't need anybody else above the title. And Begin the Beguine is Fred's most famous number.

by Anonymousreply 14911/22/2020

"And Begin the Beguine is Fred's most famous number."



by Anonymousreply 15011/22/2020

According to the Donen biography Astaire was unpleasant to Audrey during the filming of Funny Face(he positively could not stand Thompson.) Even though he had starred in the musical on Broadway making its name(yes I know the movie was a different thing) he knew he was on his way out as a box office star and Hepburn was the reason the film was being made not him. Hepburn at that point was an even bigger star than he had ever been. She could have declined the AFI invitation. I would have told them to fuck off. But then Audrey was a gracious person. Or just had a reputation to uphold.

by Anonymousreply 15111/22/2020

Beguine is today his most famous number. It has an electricity which none of his other numbers can match. Contemporary audiences are more stunned by it than anything else he did. And he did many wonderful numbers.

by Anonymousreply 15211/22/2020

And Astaire in any case is pretty quickly fading as an icon of American culture. Hepburn is proving to be timeless.

by Anonymousreply 15311/22/2020

I'll believe you, r152, when you show me your polling sources.

by Anonymousreply 15411/22/2020

I wonder if Fred felt out of sorts at Paramount when Funny Face was picked up by that studio after MGM, his home studio, had to abandon it? Perhaps he didn't get the protection at Paramount to which he was accustomed? And he must have been nervous about yet another role opposite a leading lady practically old enough to be his granddaughter after the failure of Daddy Long Legs with Leslie Caron. Wasn't Funny Face his last film as a romantic hero?

Funny Face was an Audrey Hepburn film. It was all about glorifying her. She even played the title character.

by Anonymousreply 15511/22/2020

Show me your polling sources when you haven't even mentioned one number contemporary audiences would enjoy more. And how many people outside of aging gay men have even more than a nodding acquaintance with him? His audience is dying off if any of them are even left. My personal favorite is Let's Face the Music. Maybe during his lifetime it was Cheek to Cheek or Top Hat, White tails. His absolute best and one of the very best scenes in any movie in the history of film musical or not is Never Gonna Dance.

by Anonymousreply 15611/22/2020

I would offer Fred and Ginger on the rooftop dancing to Let's Face the Music and Dance as far more well-known and beloved by the average movie fan than Begin the Beguine. She's in the brilliant beaded dress with the swinging sleeves.

And I'm not the poster you're arguing with, r156. And I'm a huge Eleanor Powell fan and in awe of Begin the Beguine (which may well be technically more proficient).

by Anonymousreply 15711/22/2020

Calling it technically more proficient is not doing it justice. As if its musicality and style were taking second place. It is tap dancing as opposed to the the ballroom dancing of Let's Face the Music.

by Anonymousreply 15811/22/2020

Girl Hunt Ballet, the Hat Rack dance, You're All the World to Me, and as you mention his classic ballroom numbers with Ginger, r156. You stated Beguine is "his most famous number"...

by Anonymousreply 15911/22/2020

I wasn't even aware of Begin the Beguine until I saw it featured in That's Entertainment.

Sadly, it was in a very boring film (all of Eleanor Powell's films are boring except for her numbers) so the number wasn't viewed much until the internet separated and featured it in clips for the younger generations

by Anonymousreply 16011/22/2020

*** Guest Star ***


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by Anonymousreply 16111/22/2020

Cyd and Ava face-off.

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by Anonymousreply 16211/22/2020

[quote]Her niece, Zan Charisse, played Gypsy in the 1974 Angela Lansbury production.

Another niece, Nana Visitor, who played Kira Nerys on "Star Trek: Deep Space Nine," is Zan Charisse's sister.

by Anonymousreply 16311/22/2020

The new girls at MGM: Ava, Cyd, Lina Romay, and Gloria DeHaven. Ha!

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by Anonymousreply 16411/22/2020


by Anonymousreply 16511/22/2020

[quote]he positively could not stand Thompson

I wonder what Astaire's problem with Thompson was.

Besides the fact that she was such a dog.

by Anonymousreply 16611/22/2020

Kay was splendid and filled with bazazz, r166...

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by Anonymousreply 16711/22/2020

R165, Lina Romay, actress, singer, dancer extraordinaire. She performed with Xavier Cugat years before Abbe Lane and Charo.

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by Anonymousreply 16811/22/2020

I don't know who that is on the right in r164's photo, but It's not Gloria de Haven.

by Anonymousreply 16911/22/2020

Don't you mean Ain't Miss De Haven, r169?

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by Anonymousreply 17011/22/2020

R96 Tony Martin was a radio singer and his film appearances helped sell more records - he was never going to be an actor. And to be fair. the movie was called Ziegfeld Girl, so the focus would never be on the male singer (see Dennis Morgan in The Great Ziegfeld as well). While "Caribbean Love Song" showed him off better (unfortunately there are no clips online), "You Stepped Out Of A Dream" captured him at his best.

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by Anonymousreply 17111/22/2020

But, r171, I thought it was odd that MGM never employed Tony Martin to star opposite Judy Garland as she aged into leading lady roles. Clearly, they thought only Mickey Rooney would be believable as a love interest.

by Anonymousreply 17211/22/2020

That's the very young Carol Burnett dancer Don Crichton as one of Gloria's sailors in r170's clip. Cute!

I miss the days of variety hour TV shows that would employ so much musical and choreographic talent and spend that kind of money on sets and costumes on a weekly basis. Many of those shows were still shot in New York and kept Broadway talent busy when they weren't appearing on stage.

by Anonymousreply 17311/22/2020

"A Bombshell from Brooklyn" - Xavier Cugat & His Orchestra, featuring Brooklyn-born Lina Romay, from "Stage Door Canteen" (1943)

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by Anonymousreply 17411/22/2020

Can anyone find and post a clip of the montage they used in That's Entertainment III that begins with the Ziegfeld Girl number and then becomes gorgeous closeups of all of the MGM ladies while Tony Martin sings? I've never been able to find it online.

by Anonymousreply 17511/22/2020

Agreed, r173...

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by Anonymousreply 17611/22/2020

Tony Martin is at his best in Till the Clouds Roll by. He has two appearances. The first he and Grayson do a wonderful Make Believe and at the end a spectacular All the Things You Are. The end of that film is interesting in that there are three songs all are slow with very limited camera movement. First Martin, then Horne, then Sinatra. Imagine audiences with literally thousands of people(it opened at Radio City as the Christmas movie) sitting quietly focused on the gorgeous music and singing for that length of time as the climax of a film.

by Anonymousreply 17711/22/2020

Ava made Cyd look plain.

by Anonymousreply 17811/22/2020

Must everything be a competition???

by Anonymousreply 17911/22/2020

Ava's legs look longer than Cyd's in that photo, too. Surprised because I thought Ava was always unhappy with what she perceived to be her short legs (or was it her long torso?).

by Anonymousreply 18011/22/2020

Great fun number with Dorothy Loudon at r176! One of the straps of her Charleston dress breaks before the number is done and she just keeps dancing, oblivious to it. Live TV! How did the dress ever stay up with all of that frenetic dancing?

by Anonymousreply 18111/22/2020

The clip shown earlier with Marilyn and the two kids was filmed at George Cukor's house.

R77 That wasnt George's house, it was a studio partial reproduction of George's backyard. It was used again in Move Over, Darling and What a Way to Go.

by Anonymousreply 18211/22/2020

I have watched that number several times, r181, and this was the first time I noticed that! In other strap breaking news...second chorus girl on the left at 00:45

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by Anonymousreply 18311/22/2020

I always heard that Fred Astaire said Cyd was his best dancing partner....I could believe it.

by Anonymousreply 18411/22/2020

[quote]I don't know who that is on the right in [R164]'s photo, but It's not Gloria de Haven.

Could it be Gloria Grahame? I only know GG from her films noirs, where she looks kind of busted. This dolly sort of looks like her but cuter.

by Anonymousreply 18511/22/2020

Did any of you wear bikinis like the ones at r164? (Or maybe your mother did?). Obviously, they were cut so as to hide the "indecent" navel but I imagine if someone was active while wearing one, the navel would pop out.

by Anonymousreply 18611/22/2020

Those aren't bikinis, r186, they're a two-piece. I sold an absolutely stunning one on eBay years and years ago. I should see if I still have the pics.

by Anonymousreply 18711/22/2020

Here it is...

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by Anonymousreply 18811/22/2020

Your two piece wasn't very well displayed on that red mannequin, r188. I hope you got a decent price for it, anyway.

by Anonymousreply 18911/22/2020

R164 is it Ann Sheridan

by Anonymousreply 19011/22/2020

Believe me, it was a rough time in my life and that was the best I could muster. The original owner was a 44D and all I had to display it on was a (maybe) size 6 torso. I think I got decent money for it.

by Anonymousreply 19111/22/2020

It's not Ann Sheridan, r164. She was a Warner's gal and these MGM starlets.

I'd guess maybe Ann Rutherford but I think she might have already been too big a star (with GWTW and Andy Hardy) by the time this photo was taken to pose with up and comers in the 1940s.

by Anonymousreply 19211/22/2020

r164 - Reverse Google image search shows that the dame on the far right is pre-plastic surgery and obviously-unrecognizable starlot Gloria Grahame.

by Anonymousreply 19311/22/2020

[quote]R166 I wonder what Astaire's problem with Thompson was.

Sada was devastated to be dropped from “Royal Wedding.” But Hermes Pan threw his back out trying to lift her in rehearsal, and Fred was having [italic]none of it.

by Anonymousreply 19411/22/2020

Of course, Thompson's role was meant to be played by Dolores Gray.

by Anonymousreply 19511/22/2020

Kay had more of DV's sense of style.

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by Anonymousreply 19611/22/2020

Love her

by Anonymousreply 19711/22/2020

Oh for chrissakes, now I have to watch this...

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by Anonymousreply 19811/22/2020

^I’ll watch THAT, R198, for Suzy Parker alone! The most beautiful model ever.

by Anonymousreply 19911/22/2020

Anita Morris' wardrobe malfunction at 2;40

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by Anonymousreply 20011/22/2020

The name 'Sid' is ungracious, unfeminine, and ugly.

The name 'Sid' belongs to people like Ernest Borgnine, Walter Matthau or the grotesque Sid James.

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by Anonymousreply 20111/22/2020

Beats Stanley or Roy, r201.

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by Anonymousreply 20211/22/2020

Or Glenn.

by Anonymousreply 20311/22/2020

Cyd not Sid. And it is a Greek female name.

by Anonymousreply 20411/22/2020

[quote]She's in the brilliant beaded dress with the swinging sleeves.

I've held this dress several times. Heavy motherfucker.

by Anonymousreply 20511/22/2020

[quote] Cyd … is a Greek female name.

I went to Google and it told me that the name Cyd means … " A Public Hill" !

by Anonymousreply 20611/22/2020

Well, we all knew that about ‘er!

by Anonymousreply 20711/22/2020

"I Want to Be Your Property" - Blue Mercedes, featuring Cyd Charisse

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by Anonymousreply 20811/22/2020

There must be a reason she was chosen to play the expressionless, ungracious, grim-faced Russian automaton in 'Silk Stockings'.

by Anonymousreply 20911/22/2020

[quote]There must be a reason she was chosen to play the expressionless, ungracious, grim-faced Russian automaton in 'Silk Stockings'.

Because she was the Greta Garbo of the 1950s?

by Anonymousreply 21011/22/2020

NObody could have done this number better than Cyd.

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by Anonymousreply 21111/22/2020

[quote]Nobody could have done this number better than Cyd.

Buck could have.

by Anonymousreply 21211/22/2020

Astaire, according to the late Robert Osborne at TCM, felt upstaged by Thompson in FF because she stole the show in their musical number together, “Ring Dem Bells”. His love scenes with Hepburn were awkward; not only was he too old, but he was really a homely man. I think that Gene Kelly would have been a better fit as Dick Avery. Even though he was seventeen years Audrey Hepburn’s senior, he was far more energetic and masculine than Astaire. And definitely handsomer.

Ironically, Kelly was working with Natalie Wood in MARJORIE MORNINGSTAR while FUNNY FACE was in production. He was twenty six years older than Wood, portraying a thirty three year old entertainer. Regardless, tons more sex appeal than Bug eyed Fred.

by Anonymousreply 21311/23/2020

I believe you mean Clap Yo' Hands, r213...

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by Anonymousreply 21411/23/2020

The way the number is staged and lit, it's hard not to look at Kay, especially with her bright red vest and bare legs. Kay does most of the singing (shrilly) and Fred seems like a back up boy. I can't imagine Gene would have stood for that....he would have at least demanded red socks.

by Anonymousreply 21511/23/2020

[quote]I believe you mean Clap Yo' Hands, R213 ...

I believe you're right, R214.

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by Anonymousreply 21611/23/2020

According to Imdb, Cyd was actually offered Audrey's role first when the project was initially set up at MGM. When It moved to Paramount and Audrey was sought, she said she wouldn't do it without the guarantee of Fred's presence (though she got top billing). He was 30 years older than her. He made Silk Stockings the same year 1957 and that was his last appearance in a film musical until 1968's Finian's Rainbow.

by Anonymousreply 21711/23/2020

Gene Kelly reportedly said that whenever he saw Cyd try to act, he had to remind himself what a good dancer she was.

by Anonymousreply 21811/23/2020

Well, he was right.

by Anonymousreply 21911/23/2020

Cyd had every reason to be jealous about AH in FUNNY FACE. Hepburn could barely sing, couldn't dance on her big feet and skinny legs, and yet she had more charm in her little finger than CC had in her whole body.

by Anonymousreply 22011/23/2020

Believe it or not, Funny Face was a financial flop when it first opened and garnered some wretched reviews. It wasn't until it was reissued in 1964 after Audrey had such a huge hit with My Fair Lady that Funny Face finally turned a profit. All according to Imdb.

by Anonymousreply 22111/23/2020

I prefer DOrothy VIrginia MAgaret in Think Pink.

by Anonymousreply 22211/23/2020

[quote] Audrey had such a huge hit with My Fair Lady

I doubt poor Audrey could claim credit for that. I'd give more credit to the lyricist, the composer and Rex.

Poor's Audrey ten-year long reign was about to fizzle out into wrinkly anorexia.

by Anonymousreply 22311/23/2020

In pink or with pachyderm, r222, that gal stood out.

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by Anonymousreply 22411/23/2020

When I watch Cyd dance, I am almost always impressed with her skill and technique. She hits her marks and performs sometimes complex and intricate moves, making them seem easier than they are. My response is usually, "fine job"!

However, I am rarely bowled over and that it because I don't usually feel her heart in her dancing. There's a passion or emotional piece that seems to be missing. I also rarely find myself feeling that she is enjoying what she is doing.

I can watch Eleanor Powell or Ann Miller or Ginger Rogers, and feel they are loving what they are doing and having a glorious time doing it. Something emanates when they dance and it makes me, as the viewer, feel that joy.

Cyd has, to me, a somewhat reserved or detached and cool feel when she dances or acts. I don't regret watching her but neither do I feel absorbed by her artistry.

by Anonymousreply 22511/23/2020

I feel the opposite. Cyd was so glamorous. The others had talent, but no glamour

by Anonymousreply 22611/23/2020

Miss Finkles could dance very smoothly, but she sounded very clunky trying to read lines of script..

by Anonymousreply 22711/23/2020

Another non-singing dancer...Miss Sheree North

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by Anonymousreply 22811/23/2020

You could see her bush in Singin' In The Rain.

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by Anonymousreply 22911/23/2020

Her name sounds fancy, as if it should look like this:

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by Anonymousreply 23011/23/2020

I remember when Cyd guest starred on the Love Boat and she lip synched a song which was obviously her own voice. She was so terrible that they cut away mid song and focused on another story, leaving her "singing" as background noise.

True, she might have been a great Phyllis in Follies if she could have sung.

by Anonymousreply 23111/23/2020

Alexis Smith wasn't much of a singer but she brought great humor to the role of Phyllis and her songs in Follies. Cyd could never have put over the zingers.

by Anonymousreply 23211/23/2020

[quote]I remember when Cyd guest starred on the Love Boat and she lip synched a song which was obviously her own voice. She was so terrible that they cut away mid song and focused on another story, leaving her "singing" as background noise.

Were the "Love Boat" writers unaware that Cyd was always dubbed by other singers in her MGM musicals?

by Anonymousreply 23311/23/2020

There are a couple of YT video out there will her alleged real singing voice and she's not that bad. She's certainly not good but she doesn't descend to Lina Lamont levels.

by Anonymousreply 23411/23/2020

R226 - Ann Miller had glamour.

by Anonymousreply 23511/24/2020

I'm talkin' 'bout glamour!

by Anonymousreply 23611/24/2020


by Anonymousreply 23711/24/2020

Ann Miller was a cartoon.

An overly made up screeching cartoon.

These two women are not in the same species.

by Anonymousreply 23811/24/2020

r235, I always thought of her as kind of cheesy but your mileage may vary

by Anonymousreply 23911/24/2020

I can’t get over how no one saw how homely Ginger Rogers was. She was a blonde and had nice legs. No one looked past that. But her features were quite coarse and she had a problem with peach fuzz (which Judy Garland reminded her of when she replaced her in THE BARKLEYS OF BROADWAY). Maybe she and Astaire played well off of each other because they were both borderline fug.

by Anonymousreply 24011/24/2020

Ginger also looked pretty matronly from the 50s on, though she still insisted on presenting as a "girl", that's one of the many things that makes The First Traveling Saleslady so ridiculous.

In the 60s and 70s, even though she was still dancing and working, Ginger packed on the pounds and really took on that overpainted classic drag queen look.

by Anonymousreply 24111/24/2020

I can't get over the fact that you have never seen Ginger in her photos from the Broadway production of Girl Crazy or in the film 42nd Street or in the earlier films she did with Astaire. Yes her features hardened over time but when young she was indeed very very pretty.

by Anonymousreply 24211/24/2020

In her prime, Ginge had snap, crackle *and* pop!

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by Anonymousreply 24311/24/2020

You're just jealous, r240, because she snagged Jacques.

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by Anonymousreply 24411/24/2020

R244, it wasn't so hard to do.

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by Anonymousreply 24511/24/2020

And Dorothy was prettier than fuzzfaced Ginger.

by Anonymousreply 24611/24/2020

Too Unladylike!

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by Anonymousreply 24711/24/2020

I don't know why Ginger was so sanctimonious and cheap when you know that love tunnel saw a lot of traffic from just the five husbands alone.

by Anonymousreply 24811/24/2020

Such a...glistening...MAME.

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by Anonymousreply 24911/24/2020

Fuck Jacques! She had Lew!

by Anonymousreply 25011/24/2020

And Jimmy Stewart lost his virginity to Ginger. That's something.

She may not have been gorgeous but she had the all-American clean cut good looks that movie goers craved after the pretentious exoticism of Gloria Swanson, Marlene Dietrich and Greta Garbo. Ginger was relatable. And she did look fabulous in all of those exquisite Bernard Newman gowns in her RKO pictures with Fred. And she could be genuinely funny, I love her in The Major and Minor.

Her problem was that somewhere in the 1940s (maybe after she won her Oscar?) she began to take herself far too seriously, signed on for too many non-musical melodramas and some of those performances often verged on a sanctimonious Great Lady persona. Yet she still delivered in the few comedies she did like that decade's Roxie Hart and in the 1950s Howard Hawks comedy Monkey Business.

by Anonymousreply 25111/24/2020

He lost his virginity to Ginger? Where did you hear that?

by Anonymousreply 25211/24/2020

Ginger at kind.

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by Anonymousreply 25311/24/2020

What's ol' fuzzy face doing stinkin' up MY thread?

by Anonymousreply 25411/24/2020

We lost interest in you Cyd when we heard what a cunt you were. $500 for an autograph for an AIDs' auction? And cash or a bank check? Don't you take credit cards?

by Anonymousreply 25511/24/2020

I was donating the money to AIDS!

by Anonymousreply 25611/24/2020

I love Ginger Rogers and I think she looked great into old age. A great comedienne and dancer in those old 1930s films! She and her mother were also Christian Scientists so lucky they were quite healthy until later years.

by Anonymousreply 25711/25/2020

Fred and Ginger Dancing House Prague

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by Anonymousreply 25811/25/2020

I remember as a boy seeing a picture of Ginger in Hello Dolly. That face frightened me. I had never seen Kabuki before.

by Anonymousreply 25911/26/2020

Ginge's Dolly...

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by Anonymousreply 26011/26/2020

r259, to be fair, back in the early1960s all the Broadway divas did extremely exaggerated makeup, particularly on their eyes, as stage lighting wasn't as strong and as flattering as it is today. And that heavy mascara was the style then even on the street. Just look at photos of Streisand, Barbara Harris, Carol Channing, Tammy Grimes, Bea Lillie, Carol Burnett, even Vivien Leigh in their shows.

by Anonymousreply 26111/26/2020

Hollywood Palace...

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by Anonymousreply 26211/26/2020

Nothing like watching chorus boys dancing with a 10 foot pole.

Why was The Hollywood Palace always so cheesey? It had none of the sophistication and flair of all of those variety hours that were produced and shot in New York City.

by Anonymousreply 26311/26/2020

It gave her the chance to "spread her legs" something she did with great regularity during her years at MGM for any takers.

by Anonymousreply 26411/26/2020

Ginger's speech to Ephraim at the beginning of the clip at R260 is almost painfully sincere, from that "sincere" school of acting that some older actresses seem to adopt.

by Anonymousreply 26511/26/2020

R261, Ginger was wearing it thick even before then, to cover up her peach fuzz. She was very sensitive about it. Jean Arthur and Barbara Stanwyck had it too, but not as bad as Ginger, not nearly as bad. On Ginger it looked like bilirubin.

by Anonymousreply 26611/26/2020

Peach fuzz is easily dealt with by waxing or shaving. Nothing to wear caked on makeup over. What happens to these stars then and now is that they get so used to being made up to the max every day that they feel naked without it. Becomes a crutch and tied into self esteem. A friend saw Winona Judd at a eyeglass show where she was selling her designer frames. Made up to the max. Like stage ready in a cheesy convention centre with bad lighting. Ridiculous!

by Anonymousreply 26711/26/2020

The Barbra Streisand Egyptian eyeliner look and the dramatic eye makeup of the early '60s was inspired by La Liz's Cleopatra look.

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by Anonymousreply 26811/26/2020

Liz really started her slide into plumphood with that movie. Her face was starting to puff up.

by Anonymousreply 26911/26/2020

You see how pleasingly plump she had gotten when she has that semi nude scene when she's getting a massage. It's like thank god I can let out my stays and give Irene a day off.

by Anonymousreply 27011/26/2020

"Beat Girl" from 1960 (I think it was shot in 1959) featured the heavy eye make up look.

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by Anonymousreply 27111/26/2020

Starlet Gillian Hills with Christopher Lee.

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by Anonymousreply 27211/26/2020

More of Cyd and the Del Ray Brothers...

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by Anonymousreply 273Last Friday at 7:22 AM

So I guess that's Cyd's real "singing" voice at r273, even if pre-recorded?

by Anonymousreply 274Last Friday at 7:36 AM

I remember when Cyd Charisse made her belated Broadway debut as a replacement in "Grand Hotel," the NYT went back and reviewed the show again and was not kind about her "singing."

by Anonymousreply 275Last Friday at 8:23 AM

r273 - Her voice/delivery and look was somewhat reminiscent of Raquel.

by Anonymousreply 276Last Friday at 8:29 AM

Bullshit, r275, everything about her was *terrific*!

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by Anonymousreply 277Last Friday at 8:35 AM

She was the weakest element in "Grand Hotel" and her singing (???) caused the woman sitting behind me to remark, "She used to have such a beautiful voice and amazing range in all her old films. I guess this is what happens when you don't maintain your vocal training..."

by Anonymousreply 278Last Friday at 9:06 AM

[quote]What happens to these stars then and now is that they get so used to being made up to the max every day that they feel naked without it.

Imagine that.

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by Anonymousreply 279Last Friday at 9:13 AM

[quote]What happens to these stars then and now is that they get so used to being made up to the max every day that they feel naked without it.


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by Anonymousreply 280Last Friday at 9:14 AM

Sorry about the double post.

by Anonymousreply 281Last Friday at 9:15 AM

Marilyn actually looks good in that shot

by Anonymousreply 282Last Friday at 9:15 AM

Cyd looking great and dancing well at the age of 67 at 3:37 here:

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by Anonymousreply 283Last Friday at 3:35 PM

Oh Jesus....*that* number...

by Anonymousreply 284Last Friday at 3:41 PM

Yes, the first Mrs. Tony Martin (Alice Faye) looks wonderful.

by Anonymousreply 285Last Friday at 4:05 PM

According to Carr and several other onlookers, Cyd through a hissy fit when Tony Martin dared to walk over and greet Alice Faye during rehearsals.

by Anonymousreply 286Last Friday at 4:06 PM

[quote]Cyd through a hissy fit...

Oh, dear!

by Anonymousreply 287Last Friday at 4:15 PM

^ Cyd thought a hissy fit.

by Anonymousreply 288Last Friday at 4:18 PM

My error - THREW a hissy fit!!! Sorry 'bout that and to think I was an English Major in College.

by Anonymousreply 289Last Friday at 4:19 PM

Were you talking into an iPhone, English Major?

by Anonymousreply 290Last Friday at 4:23 PM

"Cyd through a hissy fit" is poetic.

by Anonymousreply 291Last Friday at 5:02 PM

[quote]and to think I was an English Major in College.

Apparently that college was in Turkmenistan.

by Anonymousreply 292Last Friday at 5:31 PM

How in the world did they ever get Disney to approve of Snow White being featured in that wretched number?

by Anonymousreply 293Last Friday at 5:48 PM

R293, they didn't. And that's why Disney sued the Academy for copyright infringement.

by Anonymousreply 294Last Friday at 7:21 PM

They didn't. There was much hullabaloo and Disney organized their lawyers until it was pointed out that a lawsuit against the Academy would insure that Disney never received another Oscar nomination again. Then everyone moved onto other things.

by Anonymousreply 295Last Friday at 8:34 PM

Tula Finklea would have to be one of the most Semitic names ever for a shiksa of Scottish descent.

by Anonymousreply 296Last Friday at 9:02 PM

[quote]"Cyd through a hissy fit"

It ranks up there with Jackie On Assistance.

by Anonymousreply 297Last Saturday at 8:02 AM

Through a hissy fit, cydly.

by Anonymousreply 298Last Saturday at 8:13 AM

R295 I thought the Oscars were based on merit so that Disney filing a lawsuit would have no bearing on being nominated and even winning for quality work.

by Anonymousreply 299Last Saturday at 10:52 AM

I'm sure it's already been said in here a dozen times over ( I haven't read the topic), but she was a beautiful woman/wonderful dancer who MGM attempted to turn into an actress. Her dancing was always flawless, but she was no actress! I remember watching her in the Barbara Stanwyck flick East Side, West Side (1949), and her acting was so bad that she even made Ava Gardner's (also starring) performance look brilliant in comparison! She may have gotten better in dramatic parts later, but in the beginning she was horrible.

Funny sidenote.......India Adams, who dubbed Cyd & Joan Crawford at MGM (the infamous Two-Faced Woman number) said in several interviews that Cyd was a "Cold Fish" aka Real Bitch. India said she introduced herself to Cyd years after the MGM days at a Hollywood function & informed her that she had dubbed her singing in films. Miss Adams said that Cyd looked her up and down, turned around and walked away without saying a word. Ouch!

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by Anonymousreply 300Last Saturday at 11:19 AM

Defenders of Cyd put all that behavior, and there are many examples, as her being extremely shy and introverted and easily hurt and insecure and all that. But I think the cold self-centered explanation holds more water, from the times I saw Charisse onstage and in person, including toward the end of her life.

She was fully invested in giving the public "Cyd Charisse" but unlike most other MGM stars, who understood what they signed up for and who trafficked in warmth and familiarity in their interactions with fans, Charisse always kept fans at a cold arms length. Jane Powell was a variation on this.

Debbie Reynolds, Van Johnson, June Allyson, Gloria DeHaven, Betty Garrett, Marge Champion, Janet Leigh, Angela Lansbury, Rosemary Clooney, even Carleton Carpenter couldn't have been nicer or more professional.

by Anonymousreply 301Last Saturday at 12:01 PM

R299 made me laugh with "...Oscars were based on merit..."

by Anonymousreply 302Last Saturday at 12:45 PM

r301, I'm surprised by your comment about Jane Powell. In her post-stardom interviews she always seems as sweet and warm as she did in her films. Where have you seen or heard otherwise?

by Anonymousreply 303Last Saturday at 1:03 PM

I've worked with Jane Powell and had several interactions with her before and after. She was extremely nice.

by Anonymousreply 304Last Saturday at 1:08 PM

Let me tell you about Janie Powell.

by Anonymousreply 305Last Saturday at 1:08 PM

This thread about Cyd is very enlightening. I don't think I'll be able to watch her films again without thinking: "What a cold stingy bitch!"

by Anonymousreply 306Last Saturday at 1:16 PM

Yes, R301 she's great at the interviews. Glad you had great experiences with her, R304.

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by Anonymousreply 307Last Saturday at 1:17 PM

What a great interview, r307!! Thanks for posting it.

Jane Powell doesn't come off particularly "sweet" and that's meant as a compliment.

by Anonymousreply 308Last Saturday at 1:43 PM

Joan Crawford didn't like Jane Powell. In "Conversations with Joan Crawford", she called her "that horrible screeching THING". But then Joan didn't care for too many actresses unless they were into the cunnilingus with her.

Barbara Stanwyck ran June Allyson off the set of "Executive Suite" in tears because she showed up unprepared for rehearsals. I would have loved to have seen that go down.

by Anonymousreply 309Last Saturday at 4:21 PM


by Anonymousreply 310Last Saturday at 4:24 PM

I'd never heard that Allyson story, R309. Where is it from? It's so odd, as Allyson certainly knew what would be required of her on set by that point in her career.

By 1954, she'd been making 2-3 films per year for MGM, though her long term MGM contract had ended in 1953 by mutual consent. She'd slowed down to 1 film per year in 1951-52, presumably to raise her son born in December 1950.

1953 had her in Battle Circus opposite Bogart, which was profitable, and Remains to Be Seen, her last film with Van Johnson, where she was miscast and the movie lost quite a bit of money.

In 1954 she worked at three studios: Universal (Glenn Miller Story, a top ten movie that year), MGM (Executive Suite) and Fox (Woman's World). She was the top billed female in all of them.

by Anonymousreply 311Last Saturday at 4:49 PM

[quote]Barbara Stanwyck ran June Allyson off the set of "Executive Suite" in tears because she showed up unprepared for rehearsals.

Was that the cause of her lifelong incontinence problem?

by Anonymousreply 312Last Saturday at 4:59 PM

I little allowance of rug munching would have shut Barbara RIGHT up.

by Anonymousreply 313Last Saturday at 5:03 PM

June was... unpredictable.

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by Anonymousreply 314Last Saturday at 5:09 PM

There are just a few actresses whose great popularity in its time is a big mystery to most people today and, coincidentally, they were all products of the MGM studio system:

June Allyson

Greer Garson

Kathryn Grayson

by Anonymousreply 315Last Saturday at 5:14 PM

This thread is all over the place, but I'll play: June Allyson is charming in Ggood Nnews and Llittle Lwomen among many ithers

Katherine Grayson does a good job as Magnolia in Showboat plus several other musicals of the period.

Greer Garson I'm not as familiar with, but I do believe that she turned in an Oscar-winning performance as Mrs. Miniver, which is probably the movie the world needed exactly at the time it was produced. And she did a fine job as Eleanor Roosevelt in Sunrise at Campobello.

by Anonymousreply 316Last Saturday at 5:38 PM

I liked Allyson in Good News but thought she was all wrong in Little Women (in addition to being like a decade too old)

by Anonymousreply 317Last Saturday at 5:41 PM

[quote]R315 There are just a few actresses whose great popularity in its time is a big mystery to most people today.... June Allyson, Greer Garson, Kathryn Grayson

Don’t forget me.

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by Anonymousreply 318Last Saturday at 6:15 PM

Carol Richards who dubbed Cyd's singing voice for "Brigadoon" told a similar story. She'd attended a performance by Tony Martin and was greeting him after the show - telling him how much she had enjoyed him.

Cyd arrived and Carol introduced herself, mentioning their connection through the film.

Without even so much as acknowledging her, Cyd took Tony's arm and they walked away.

by Anonymousreply 319Last Saturday at 6:23 PM

I sympathise with Sid in that situation.

Sid acknowledging the person who provided her fake voice is saying that Sid is a fake.

by Anonymousreply 320Last Saturday at 7:13 PM

[quote]Greer Garson I'm not as familiar with, but I do believe that she turned in an Oscar-winning performance as Mrs. Miniver, which is probably the movie the world needed exactly at the time it was produced. And she did a fine job as Eleanor Roosevelt in Sunrise at Campobello.

Greer Garson replaced Rosalind Russell on Broadway in "Auntie Mame."

by Anonymousreply 321Last Saturday at 7:16 PM

[quote]I sympathise with Sid in that situation. Sid acknowledging the person who provided her fake voice is saying that Sid is a fake.

And Cyd not acknowledging her showed that Cyd was a cunt.

by Anonymousreply 322Last Saturday at 7:20 PM

[quote] …not acknowledging…

I'm researching group of families from the 1860s to 1890s.

One of the main topics of discussion for the wives at that time was 'The Servant Problem' and 'Should One Use Their Name When Speaking at them?'.

by Anonymousreply 323Last Saturday at 7:32 PM

Louis B. Mayer "discovered" Greer Garson while searching for new talent in London. He brought her to Hollywood and put her in prestige pictures normally reserved for Norma Shearer. With Irving Thalberg dead, he sought fresh talent and signed on Greer, Lana, Ava, and Judy. And within a few short years Greta, Norma, Jeanette, Myrna, and Joan were out.

by Anonymousreply 324Last Saturday at 7:42 PM

Well, since we've long since evolved into a discussion on MGM musical actresses, does anyone want to talk about Esther Williams?

by Anonymousreply 325Last Saturday at 7:58 PM

I'm certainly not interested in hearing any gossip about Esther Williams.

by Anonymousreply 326Last Saturday at 8:21 PM

You forgot me, r324!!!

by Anonymousreply 327Last Sunday at 4:24 AM

To be fair, Garbo and Shearer had both had quite enough and were more than ready to voluntarily retire by 1942. And they kept their word and never appeared on film again in their long lives. Joan, not so much, of course.

And they took Gilbert Adrian with them. The MGM glamour was gone.

by Anonymousreply 328Last Sunday at 4:27 AM

Greer has made a few MGM classics are still beloved today by classic movie lovers. Goodbye Mr. Chips, Mrs Miniver, and Random Harvest. She's pretty wonderful in all three. The Valley of Decision with Gregory Peck is good too. And it flips the too older man younger woman star duo which has especially come under criticism today. Garson was in her 40s and Peck in his 20s. J Tandy is terrific in it as Peck's unpleasant wife.

by Anonymousreply 329Last Sunday at 5:49 AM


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by Anonymousreply 330Last Sunday at 5:50 AM

I’ve often wondered how Bonnie Franklin would have fit into the studio system.

I see her tap dancing her way into the hearts of millions.

by Anonymousreply 331Last Sunday at 5:59 AM

Please have your vision checked *immediately*, r331.

by Anonymousreply 332Last Sunday at 6:03 AM

She was certainly no Ann Miller!

by Anonymousreply 333Last Sunday at 6:06 AM

I love Jane Powell’s honesty and her fuck them all attitude.

by Anonymousreply 334Last Sunday at 6:20 AM

Jane was a bridesmaid at Liz's first wedding which was a big MGM staged production. Jane said though they attended school together and appeared in movies she really don't know her. Kind of like why am I this person's bridesmaid she's a work colleague.

by Anonymousreply 335Last Sunday at 6:28 AM

'didn't know her'

by Anonymousreply 336Last Sunday at 6:29 AM

I suppose they were hoping she'd be the new Jeanette...

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by Anonymousreply 337Last Sunday at 6:39 AM

[quote]Was that the cause of her lifelong incontinence problem?

It DEPENDS on who you ask?

by Anonymousreply 338Last Sunday at 6:49 AM

[quote]I'd never heard that Allyson story, [R309]. Where is it from? It's so odd, as Allyson certainly knew what would be required of her on set by that point in her career.

It was in that controversial Axel Madson bio.

by Anonymousreply 339Last Sunday at 6:53 AM

And they took Gilbert Adrian with them. The MGM glamour was gone.

Anyone who has watched Adrian's prediction of future fashions from the color insert of The Women (1939) knows that his day was nearly over. He went out on his own and made no mark whatsoever.

One day you're in...

by Anonymousreply 340Last Sunday at 7:04 AM

[quote]I’ve often wondered how Bonnie Franklin would have fit into the studio system.

That face on the big screen? Eeeeesh.

by Anonymousreply 341Last Sunday at 7:20 AM

Was Bonnie as pretty as Carol Haney?

by Anonymousreply 342Last Sunday at 7:27 AM

I'm gonna take a little nap...

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by Anonymousreply 343Last Sunday at 8:28 AM

I imagine Jane Powell was groomed to take the place Deanna Durbin never inhabited at MGM. And a threat to keep Judy Garland and June Allyson in line.

Interesting that her real name was Suzanne Burce which could have so easily been changed to the lovely Suzanne Bruce and yet they went for Jane Powell, with the all-American girl-next-door connotation of the first name and the MGM-related royalty of the last (William and Eleanor).

by Anonymousreply 344Last Sunday at 8:28 AM

Jane Powell was the name of the character in her first film, r344.

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by Anonymousreply 345Last Sunday at 9:01 AM

Deanna didn't screech her high notes they way the MGM gals least the way Jane & Kathryn did. Jeanette MacDonald must have had better training.

Jane & Kathryn voices were just irritating........

by Anonymousreply 346Last Sunday at 12:02 PM

Deanna didn't screech her high notes they way the MGM gals least the way Jane & Kathryn did. Jeanette MacDonald must have had better training.

Jane & Kathryn voices were just irritating........

by Anonymousreply 347Last Sunday at 12:02 PM

Now you're just being repetitious.

by Anonymousreply 348Last Sunday at 12:08 PM

And I turned to my friend Elmo and I said "Just look at the pins on that broad". He enthusiastically shook his head in agreement. What a dame!

by Anonymousreply 349Last Sunday at 12:13 PM

How many superb dancers can you name who did porn?

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by Anonymousreply 350Last Sunday at 12:36 PM

Can you start the list for us, R350? Because I am unfamiliar with such a thing.

by Anonymousreply 351Last Sunday at 12:42 PM

The lovely Miss Helen Wood, J.P.

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by Anonymousreply 352Last Sunday at 12:49 PM

This porn star was a "rejected dancer" in "A Chorus Line" (movie version), but that probably means he wasn't "superb."

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by Anonymousreply 353Last Sunday at 12:50 PM

Helen Wood as Joanna Moss...

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by Anonymousreply 354Last Sunday at 1:08 PM

OP - Legs. It was about legs. Legs and legs and more legs.

by Anonymousreply 355Last Sunday at 1:08 PM

Yes. Legs and legs and more legs.

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by Anonymousreply 356Last Sunday at 1:12 PM

"Darling, the legs aren't so beautiful, I just know what to do with them."

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by Anonymousreply 357Last Sunday at 1:39 PM

Marlene, it's a pity you broke them. Twice.

by Anonymousreply 358Last Sunday at 1:40 PM

Her first name came from her younger brother as a child trying to say “Sis.” Once working in Hollywood, the spelling was changed to a more exotic “Cyd.”

“Charisse” was the surname of her first husband, Nico Charisse, whom she danced with in Los Angeles and married in Paris in 1939, divorced in 1947, one son, Nicky. Married to singer Tony Martin in 1948, until her death in 2008, one son, Tony Martin, Jr.

Cyd Charisse was a Methodist and Republican.

by Anonymousreply 359Last Sunday at 1:47 PM

and a first class BITCH!!, James Mitchell, a brilliant dancer and later Palmer on "All My Children" knew Cyd and Tony and even danced with Cyd in the film, "Deep in My Heart". .

He always said she worked hard and they worked well together. He also noted, "She's a cold fish. The only thing that warms her is money..."

Mitchell also said that he confronted her once after overhearing her calling the guys who danced in the chorus, "The sissy boys..." He reminded her that he was a homosexual and she remarked, "Okay, then the sissy men..."

by Anonymousreply 360Last Sunday at 1:52 PM

[quote]And Begin the Beguine is Fred's most famous number.

Only 'cause they didn't allow black people in movies. Michael Jackson was a better dancer.

by Anonymousreply 361Last Sunday at 2:01 PM

Urban legend has it that when Garson won the Oscar, her acceptance speech was 45 minutes long.

by Anonymousreply 362Last Sunday at 2:08 PM

That's an Urban legend and NO ONE recorded it to prove its existence.

by Anonymousreply 363Last Sunday at 2:16 PM

James Mitchell also famously danced with Cyd in The Bandwagon.

His long time partner was stage and film costume designer Albert Wolsky who won two Oscars, one for All That Jazz and one for Bugsy. Albert's still with us, I believe.

by Anonymousreply 364Last Sunday at 2:22 PM

It was actually 5 minutes and 30 seconds, r362...

by Anonymousreply 365Last Sunday at 2:27 PM

Mr. Wolsky's impressive film resume...

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by Anonymousreply 366Last Sunday at 2:30 PM

His Broadway credits...

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by Anonymousreply 367Last Sunday at 2:32 PM

[quote]I sympathise with Sid in that situation.

Sid Luft?

by Anonymousreply 368Last Sunday at 2:59 PM

No. Sid Krofft.

by Anonymousreply 369Last Sunday at 3:01 PM

James Mitchell is Dream Curly for eternity. Dream Laurie is still with us and is 94. She is the only surviving member of Oklahoma's opening night(at least for featured performers as far as I know) and created the role of Louise in Carousel.

by Anonymousreply 370Last Sunday at 3:08 PM

Meryl wearing Wolsky...

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by Anonymousreply 371Last Sunday at 3:10 PM

[quote]Dream Laurie is still with us and is 94. She is the only surviving member of Oklahoma's opening night(at least for featured performers as far as I know) and created the role of Louise in Carousel.

I have a name!

by Anonymousreply 372Last Sunday at 3:36 PM

[quote]"She's a cold fish. The only thing that warms her is money..."

Well, they did say she was a Republican.

by Anonymousreply 373Last Sunday at 6:33 PM

How did someone named "Bambi Linn" not end up as a stripper?

by Anonymousreply 374Last Sunday at 6:33 PM

Would she have scored even greater success as Cyd Chartreuse?

by Anonymousreply 375Last Sunday at 6:43 PM

It's rare when a DL thread about an old Hollywood actress changes one's mind about them but this one certainly has. And, yes, I'm talking about Cyd Charisse.

by Anonymousreply 376Last Sunday at 6:51 PM

She goes into the “foul cunt” file.

by Anonymousreply 377Last Sunday at 7:27 PM

I always knew Cyd was a major bitch from way back(as in trying to get people fired for bullshit reasons) so no disillusionment here and I can go on enjoying her performances. And she even does a good enough acting job in Band Wagon. Telling her manipulative choreographer boyfriend(the ubiquitous)James Mitchell to fuck off is a good moment.

by Anonymousreply 378Last Monday at 11:52 AM

Did Nanette Fabray ever comment on Cyd? I know she was quite vocal about Oscar Levant. She outlived Cyd by more than a few years.

by Anonymousreply 379Last Monday at 12:40 PM

When she was appearing in a production of "No No Nanette" at the North Shore Music Theatre in Beverly, Massachusetts, I had the opportunity to speak with her after the show.

I commended her on her performance in "Nanette" (as Sue, the role Ruby Keeler had played) and mentioned how great she'd been in "The Bandwagon". She thanked me and said it had been an unhappy experience for her in many ways, "...because of our leading lady, who seemed to resent my being in 'her show' and went out of her way to make sure I felt unwelcome..."

I know that publicly she was more tactful about the film and did love working with Fred. Nanette was a lady and would not have said, for publication, how she felt about Cyd but I've a feeling she was more receptive to9 discussing it in private.

by Anonymousreply 380Last Monday at 12:56 PM

I saw Nanette in a play at the Ogunquit, Playhouse in Maine in the summer of 1985. After the show she was very welcoming and gracious about signing autographs and talking with audience members.

I told her how good she'd been in "The Bandwagon" and she beamed and said how much fun it had been to work with Fred, Jack and even Oscar. I said, "And Cyd, too?"

Nanette's response was "Oh was she in it too? I guess I'd forgotten..."

by Anonymousreply 381Last Monday at 1:05 PM

OMG, the Cyd bashing never ends. I love it!

by Anonymousreply 382Last Monday at 1:08 PM

Yeah, it was legs. If she got other roles, it wasn't because she got in on her dramatic talent first.

Michael Jackson was a hoofer with only one mode. He was a "better dancer" than the tappin', swingin', waltzin', etc., Fred Astaire in some other Universe.

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by Anonymousreply 383Last Monday at 1:15 PM

These anecdotes have me wondering how Cyd behaved towards DL fave Dolores Gray, who was no shrinking violet.

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by Anonymousreply 384Last Monday at 1:15 PM

The back story of It's Always Fair Weather must have been epic. Stanley and Gene hating each other as only former lovers can topped off by huge professional jealousy, Gene jealous of Michael Kidd to the point of having Kidd's big number cut out of the film and the mind reels at Dolores and Cyd working together.

Dolores ended up by kicking Michael in the balls when they worked on Destry together. Even her mother got in on it I believe slapping his face.

by Anonymousreply 385Last Monday at 1:31 PM

And Dan swanning about in Helen Rose creations.

by Anonymousreply 386Last Monday at 1:34 PM

It was also said that Dolores was set on doing her own thing in her numbers. Thankfully, Jack Cole got through to her, at least in "Thanks a Lot But No Thanks." I suspect she may have got her own way with "Music Is Better Than Words."

by Anonymousreply 387Last Monday at 1:40 PM

Cyd gives passable straight performances in East Side West Side and Tension (both 1949). She plays the good glrl so maybe there was more acting than we thought.

by Anonymousreply 388Last Monday at 1:45 PM

[quote]When she was appearing in a production of "No No Nanette" at the North Shore Music Theatre in Beverly, Massachusetts, I had the opportunity to speak with her after the show.

I took my mom to see that production. Nanette was played by DL icon Bonnie Franklin!

by Anonymousreply 389Last Monday at 3:43 PM

Nanette break!!!

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by Anonymousreply 390Last Monday at 3:46 PM

"No No Nanette" starring Nanette Fabray.

How droll.

by Anonymousreply 391Last Monday at 5:31 PM

I know Nanette had a great TV career and was one of the medium's most popular performers in the 1950s but I wonder if she really wanted to do some more film work. Other than The Bandwagon, I don't think she ever got close to a starring role. Of course she also played leading roles on Broadway in High Button Shoes and Love Life.

by Anonymousreply 392Last Monday at 6:16 PM

[quote]Of course she also played leading roles on Broadway in High Button Shoes and Love Life.

And, don't forget, Irving Berlin's final Broadway musical, "Mr. President"!

by Anonymousreply 393Last Monday at 6:18 PM

R392, Nanette attended Hollywood High School with Alexis Smith, where they competed for roles in school productions.

by Anonymousreply 394Last Monday at 6:24 PM

"Cyd gives passable straight performances in East Side West Side and Tension (both 1949). She plays the good glrl so maybe there was more acting than we thought."

I thought she was decent in Twilight For the Gods, with Rock Hudson

by Anonymousreply 395Last Monday at 6:30 PM

If Nanette had auditioned for Mame would she have had a better chance than Angela? Let's say she was as good as Angela or pretty close? Wouldn't she have been a bigger star in terms of Broadway audiences and theater party ladies for advance sales? Was Dolores Gray a serious contender? Would they really have gone for her instead of Lansbury? What other competition was there? Channing?

by Anonymousreply 396Last Monday at 6:41 PM

R385, all that sturm und drang on the set up It's Always Fair Weather, and the picture turned out to be such a miserable drag. Its apologists and/or supporters say that it was pivotal in showing how old Hollywood was ending and a new Hollywood is taking over, but did it have to be so dreary at the same time?

by Anonymousreply 397Last Monday at 6:50 PM

Nanette Fabray = Noseless Fabray.

by Anonymousreply 398Last Monday at 7:23 PM

No Nose Nanette. I saw her a rerun of The Carol Burnett Show and in profile, she almost literally has no nose. It's incredibly distracting.

by Anonymousreply 399Last Monday at 7:26 PM

When I saw her in "No No, Nanette" at North Shore Music Theater in Beverly, Mass., I had an aisle seat, and she happened to be standing right next to me for about a minute while waiting to go onstage (it's theater in the round). I tried not to stare, but I was fascinated by the fact that she had virtually no profile.

by Anonymousreply 400Last Monday at 7:38 PM

I had no idea Cyd Charisse was a bitch. She seemed so likable. Who could ever dislike Nanette Fabray?

by Anonymousreply 401Last Monday at 7:56 PM

She looked like a monkey.

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by Anonymousreply 402Last Monday at 7:57 PM

Are there any more Cyd stories? Like those of Cyd pointedly and dramatically refusing to chat with someone?

by Anonymousreply 403Last Monday at 8:02 PM

Marilyn's problem with Cyd padding her bra must have been something to be overlooked since Cyd says in the Something's Got To Give documentary Marilyn sent her a telegram asking her to be part of the film when it was to be re-started.

by Anonymousreply 404Last Tuesday at 3:35 AM

Cyd's husband once said that he always knew whom she'd been rehearsing with, because if it was Astaire (who adored her as a partner because she was ballet trained) she was fine, but if it was Kelly she came home black and blue.

Whilst Astaire was known as a perfectionist, Kelly was known as truly vicious in his rehearsal phases.

by Anonymousreply 405Last Tuesday at 4:11 AM

r405, details!

by Anonymousreply 406Last Tuesday at 4:25 AM

Cyd had huge issues with her husband's relationship with his previous wife, Alice Faye.

Faye and Martin had married in 1937 and divorced several years later. The divorce was friendly with both recognizing that they'd married very young and each had different career paths they wanted to follow.

Alice was well loved in Hollywood for her earthiness, warm personality and genuine sense of fun. It was also widely known that she'd been able to resist the advances of Fox's Zanuck, bluntly telling him off. (She later walked out on her contract when Zanuck had some of her best work cut from "Fallen Angel").

Alice also noted to friends that although her second husband, Phil Harris (to whom she was married for more than 50 years until his death) was well-equipped, he had nothing on first husband Tony Martin who was "gigantic"!!!

Alice and Phil would frequently run into Tony and Cyd in social situations and Alice and Tony always greeted one another warmly. Phil Harris also liked Tony and had no issues with their friendship. Cyd, however, treated Alice with cold indifference and found Phil to be a "loud, obnoxious drunk..."

Cyd also looked down her nose at anyone at MGM who worked for Producer Joe Pasternak. She considered the Pasternak Unit to be comparable to "traveling in steerage" and felt that doing films for the Freed Unit made her vastly superior.

She loathed Dolores Gray, calling her "Horse Face".

While audiences rightfully applauded some of Cyd's dancing expertise and beauty (although cosmetically enhanced beginning in the early 1950's), she never really connected with audiences in the way that some stars at Metro did. You never heard critics or the public saying, "I can't wait for the new Cyd Charisse film to come out..." She could not carry a picture and much of that was due to the lack of intimate connection that audiences felt when watching her. She could be admired for her dancing but was never beloved.

by Anonymousreply 407Last Tuesday at 4:27 AM

In the internet age, with YouTube, clips, and gifs, I'd say Cyd Charisse has gained a solid legacy for herself, more than some of her contemperies who connected with audiences back in the day. Her dances and performances during those dances are exciting little pieces of history and culture to many people.

by Anonymousreply 408Last Tuesday at 4:40 AM

r396 - MAME succeeded because of Angie. She brought Hollywood glamour, a relatively fresh (and freshened) face, and a surprisingly strong singing voice (ACW aside). Plus...she was also a surprisingly strong dancer. It just wouldn't have worked with Nanette. One of the many problems with doing MAME is the role requires casting a true triple threat. One that can also do a believable, charming, zany eccentricity.

by Anonymousreply 409Last Tuesday at 5:14 AM

And Glamour with a capital G, don't forget Glamour, r409. Nanette could never have provided the Glamour.

by Anonymousreply 410Last Tuesday at 5:16 AM

I love Alice Faye, her films and her singing. It's sad that she's mostly forgotten today.

by Anonymousreply 411Last Tuesday at 5:17 AM

I love the watch Alice Faye and Jack Haley and Shirley Temple tap dance in POOR LITTLE RICH GIRL......

Ugh......I could only find the colorized one on YouTube.

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by Anonymousreply 412Last Tuesday at 5:32 AM

Alice, Carmen, Busby...what else could one ask for?

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by Anonymousreply 413Last Tuesday at 5:40 AM

Oops, whow could I leave out Charlotte Greenwood???

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by Anonymousreply 414Last Tuesday at 5:59 AM

^ how...

by Anonymousreply 415Last Tuesday at 6:00 AM

Wait...Gene Kelly and Stanley Donen = lovers? I don’t believe it. Wasn’t Gene a huge homophobe?

How was Cyd in SILK STOCKINGS?

by Anonymousreply 416Last Tuesday at 6:32 AM

"Silk Stockings" was a considerable box-office failure, losing nearly 1.4 million. Reviews were mixed but both Cyd and Fred danced very well and Cyd's performance was better than usual, since she was playing a cold, standoffish character.

The best reviews belonged to Janis Paige in a supporting but memorable turn.

Kelly and Donen were lovers for several years, after Kelly's tryst with Director Vincente Minnelli which contributed to the break-up of his marriage to Judy Garland since it happened during the "shooting" of "The Pirate". Kelly was bisexual although he portrayed himself as being straight and took delight in making inappropriate anti-gay remarks. A truly nasty individual, more self-absorbed than Trump.

by Anonymousreply 417Last Tuesday at 6:37 AM

Lansbury discusses how, by the time of MAME, she had learned to sing "big" but "not nearly big enough."

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by Anonymousreply 418Last Tuesday at 6:47 AM

Dolores Gray certainly wouldn't have had any difficulty with singing big enough.

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by Anonymousreply 419Last Tuesday at 6:49 AM

r413 I never miss a Eugene Pallette musical.

by Anonymousreply 420Last Tuesday at 7:01 AM

Wow, r413, you learn something new everyday.

Now, I read that Kelly encouraged Tommy Tune to change his name, saying that it was too theatrical. And he was dismissive of people who didn’t have to talent of some sort, particularly in the movie business. He was snobby about it.

But he also championed the Nicholas Brothers, weren’t they in a very demanding dance number with him despite his movie studio’s reluctance to have a white man dancing onscreen with black people? I guess he was liberal - to a point. And he did speak of he and his brother Fred getting into fights with the neighborhood bullies because they called them sissies for being dancers.

by Anonymousreply 421Last Tuesday at 7:09 AM

[quote]R409 She brought Hollywood glamour, a relatively fresh (and freshened) face, and a surprisingly strong singing voice (ACW aside).

A Chorus Whine?

by Anonymousreply 422Last Tuesday at 7:21 AM

Cyd's 4 best known films at MGM for the Arthur Freed unit and in which she was female star, were all huge money losers at the box-office.

1. The Band Wagon" - $ 1,185,000 loss 2. Brigadoon - $ 1,555,000 loss 3. It's Always Fair Weather - $ 1,675,000 loss 4. Silk Stockings - $ 1,399,000 loss

A title she made for the Pasternak Unit ("Meet Me in Las Vegas" only lost $ 496,000 and another she made for Pasternak ("Party Girl") actually showed a profit of $ 454,000.

by Anonymousreply 423Last Tuesday at 7:22 AM

[quote]R417 Kelly was bisexual although he portrayed himself as being straight and took delight in making inappropriate anti-gay remarks.

But why chose Minnelli, of all lopsided-looking people? Was he trying to secure future jobs, even then?

by Anonymousreply 424Last Tuesday at 7:26 AM

If they married, he’d be Gene Kelly-Minnelli.

by Anonymousreply 425Last Tuesday at 7:26 AM

R423 Cyd Charisse: BOX OFFICE POISON!

by Anonymousreply 426Last Tuesday at 7:30 AM

Kelly wanted "The Pirate" to be his film and Minnelli, who was fixated on Kelly's ass, made sure it received plenty of on-screen attention. Kelly also had Minnelli in mind to direct some future projects for him since Minnelli's name had power at MGM. Those projects never occurred because Kelly moved on to other "interests"

Judy catching them going at it during production, helped push her further into an abyss.

by Anonymousreply 427Last Tuesday at 7:30 AM

[R423] Cyd Charisse: BOX OFFICE POISON!

It didn't help that Gene Kelly starred in a couple of the titles. By the mid-50's, his star had faded considerably and his films were losing vast amounts of money at the box-office.

"Invitation to the Dance" lost more than $ 2,5 million for MGM and "Les Girls" lost $ 1,635,000. Musicals with the exception of Rodgers and Hammerstein adaptations, were losing their popularity.

by Anonymousreply 428Last Tuesday at 7:40 AM

r421 - Fred Kelly = FOLLIES!

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by Anonymousreply 429Last Tuesday at 7:43 AM

r423 - Interesting that she danced with Liliane in Meet Me in Las Vegas, then replaced her in Grand Hotel...where she was...TERRIFIC!

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by Anonymousreply 430Last Tuesday at 7:50 AM

R421 - The Nicholas Brothers were in The Pirate with Gene Kelly doing the first version of "Be a Clown".

by Anonymousreply 431Last Tuesday at 7:50 AM

Keep it gay! Keep it gay! Keep it gay!

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by Anonymousreply 432Last Tuesday at 7:52 AM

Yul and Stanley.

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by Anonymousreply 433Last Tuesday at 7:55 AM

To be fair, r432, sunscreen wasn't in wide use at the time.

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by Anonymousreply 434Last Tuesday at 7:57 AM

According to James Mitchell who originated the role of Harry Beaton on Broadway in "Brigadoon", he was offered the chance to recreate the role in the film. He was under contract to MGM and had recently appeared in "The Band Wagon".

The studio, however, went with someone else but Mitchell claims it was at the insistence of Kelly.

He and Kelly had shared a sexual dalliance and Kelly felt he'd be uncomfortable having Mitchell on the set.

Mitchell danced with Charisse in "The Band Wagon" and later that year in "Deep in My Heart". He also danced with her several times on television in the 1960's. He respected her dancing skills and professionalism but never warmed to her personally and was offended by her homophobia and deliberate nastiness to anyone she perceived as being gay.

by Anonymousreply 435Last Tuesday at 8:06 AM

James Mitchell

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by Anonymousreply 436Last Tuesday at 8:58 AM

James Mitchell was hot

I was a Cyd fan but it sucks knowing she was a homophobe

by Anonymousreply 437Last Tuesday at 9:09 AM

I'm not sure that I believe that Garland caught her husband and Kelly together, since she made another movie with Gene -- Summer stock -- and was supposd to do Easter Parade with him before he was injured and replaced by Astaire.

by Anonymousreply 438Last Tuesday at 9:09 AM

The Bandwagon is a nearly perfect musical – good songs, good dancing, lots of comedy that still lands, appealing performances… It's probably among MGM's very best, I'm surprised it was a box office disappointment

by Anonymousreply 439Last Tuesday at 9:11 AM

Lansbury also had the huge advantage of being British and having that accent. In 1966 everything British was all the rage. And Lansbury truly looked glamorous. Nanette did not.

by Anonymousreply 440Last Tuesday at 9:14 AM

[quote] Lansbury truly looked glamorous.

Eh. She was kind of dough faced.

by Anonymousreply 441Last Tuesday at 9:15 AM
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by Anonymousreply 442Last Tuesday at 9:18 AM

I believe even the immortal Singing in the Rain while a success was not the huge success that On the Town and American in Paris were. Then Kelly went to Europe and made the terrible Invitation to the Dance which nobody likes and comes back to make the dipped in concrete Brigadoon.

by Anonymousreply 443Last Tuesday at 9:19 AM

"Singin' in the Rain" made a profit of $ 666,000 - not bad at all but certainly not anywhere near blockbuster or even smash hit status. "According to MGM records, during the film's initial theatrical release, it made $3,263,000 in the US and Canada and $2,367,000 internationally, earning the studio a profit of $666,000."

by Anonymousreply 444Last Tuesday at 9:22 AM

R406 - There aren't any deets, really. Kelly just worked everyone to death. Astaire demanded rehearsal till routines were perfect, but Kelly's style, with all those balletic lifts, etc., really was ruthless on the other dancers' bodies.

Kelly's reputation behind the scenes wasn't unlike that of Jerome Robbins.

by Anonymousreply 445Last Tuesday at 9:22 AM

Did someone ask for glamour?

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by Anonymousreply 446Last Tuesday at 9:23 AM

By the early 1950s, most film musicals were tanking because of a little invention called TV where Americans could watch all kinds of musical shit in their own home for free.

by Anonymousreply 447Last Tuesday at 9:24 AM

It's surprising that James Mitchell was of English stock. Even in old age, Mitchell looked like he could have been related to Ricardo Montalban.

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by Anonymousreply 448Last Tuesday at 9:25 AM

{quote] The Bandwagon is a nearly perfect musical

I can't agree.

It seems rather seedy and contrived to me. Elderly Fred and hard-faced Sid. Plus, Noseless Nanette, Pie-eyed Levant and poor old sexuagenarian Jack Buchanan dragged out of his retirement home hospital bed to make poor old Fred look comparatively young.

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by Anonymousreply 449Last Tuesday at 9:28 AM

Cyd wasn't hard faced, she was blank faced.

by Anonymousreply 450Last Tuesday at 9:30 AM

I watched "The Band Wagon" years ago. I recall it being rather bitty (granted, a charge that can be levelled at many a musical). Charisse never seemed like a leading lady. She was a specialty act. Like Ann Miller. Audiences could invest in Fred, or Judy, or Doris. Not so Charisse.

by Anonymousreply 451Last Tuesday at 9:31 AM

Vincente Minnelli's flings with Garlands co-stars was common knowledge around the Culver City lot.

After dining with her co-star in "The Clock", actor Robert Walker on the pretext of discussing his interpretation of his role, Minnelli took advantage of the very vulnerable actor who was still reeling from his broken marriage to actress Jennifer Jones.

Closeted gay actor, Tom Drake, the "boy next door" from "Meet Me in St. Louis" willingly participated in extracurricular activities with his director.

by Anonymousreply 452Last Tuesday at 10:27 AM

Tom Drake was a cutie

by Anonymousreply 453Last Tuesday at 10:28 AM

Van Johnson liked to vacation in Ogunquit, Maine. In the 1970's after a night of drinking at Valerie's Restaurant in that town, he opened up to a group of gay men sitting around the piano bar in the venue and noted that Cincente Minnelli "had better suction power than a Hoover vacuum cleaner. "

by Anonymousreply 454Last Tuesday at 10:30 AM

Van Johnson liked to vacation in gay-friendly Ogunquit, Maine.

One evening in the 1970's, he was dining and drinking at Valerie's Restaurant in that town and sitting around the piano bar with a group of gay men. He gladly shared with them that Vincente Minnelli "...had better suction power than a Hoover vacuum cleaner..."

by Anonymousreply 455Last Tuesday at 10:34 AM

God loved Nanette so much, he made this.

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by Anonymousreply 456Last Tuesday at 11:02 AM

[quote]Musicals with the exception of Rodgers and Hammerstein adaptations, were losing their popularity.


by Anonymousreply 457Last Tuesday at 12:55 PM

Those all came later, r457. We're taking about the early 1950s (pre-1955) when MGM let go of all of their musical contract players like Kelly, Astaire, Keel, Grayson, Powell, Allyson, etc. MGM, for better or worse, rarely made hits out of Broadway musicals like those you mention in your signature.

by Anonymousreply 458Last Tuesday at 1:59 PM

R454, any more Van stories? At least a couple DLers claimed to have hooked up with him in his later years

by Anonymousreply 459Last Tuesday at 2:10 PM

R458 But I thought someone here said "the Freed Unit" was closed around 1956.

by Anonymousreply 460Last Tuesday at 2:14 PM

If the Freed Unit was around after 1954-1955, it was truly just a shadow of itself. They weren't producing anything.

Though Arthur Feed is listed as the producer of 1958's GIGI, most of the executive crew was re-assembled just for that film. It was the last gasp.

by Anonymousreply 461Last Tuesday at 2:22 PM

Guys and Dolls was a big hit. I don't like it very much because it is so badly cast and I hate the too stylized sets. But it was hugely successful. I believe High Society was a big hit as well.

Wasn't the very mediocre Bells Are Ringing the last wheeze of the Freed unit? A hit in the cities and did poorly everywhere else.

by Anonymousreply 462Last Tuesday at 2:25 PM

Mitchell was cast as a Mexican farm worker by MGM for the noirish BORDER INCIDENT (49). The casting department must have been run by crazy people.

by Anonymousreply 463Last Tuesday at 2:46 PM

Circling back to Cyd, Ann Miller said she had been promised by Arthur Freed the part in Silk Stockings that Janis Paige was given. Ann said she felt so betrayed that she wanted out of her MGM contract but they said no.

by Anonymousreply 464Last Tuesday at 2:59 PM

These specialty acts were lucky to get parts in enduring classics:

Cyd Charisse in Singin' in the Rain, the Bandwagon, and Silk stockings.

Ann Miller in Easter Parade and Kiss me Kate.

by Anonymousreply 465Last Tuesday at 3:03 PM

And if MGM wasn't so good in cannibalizing itself, then That's Entertainment! might never have happened, and the memory of these performers would be fading even faster

by Anonymousreply 466Last Tuesday at 3:04 PM

People outside of DL know who Cyd and Ann are? Their contemporary audiences are dead at this point. Even us eldergays weren't going to see their movies first run.

by Anonymousreply 467Last Tuesday at 3:07 PM

[quote]People outside of DL know who Cyd and Ann are?

Do people outside of DL truly matter? But I think that anyone who has an interest in old movie musicals (and there are probably more than you might think) would be familiar with both Cyd and Ann.

by Anonymousreply 468Last Tuesday at 3:11 PM

Why did Gene Kelly get a “special” Oscar for SITR?

by Anonymousreply 469Last Tuesday at 3:12 PM

While "Show Boat" was a tremendous hit for MGM and the Freed Unit, the two follow-up Grayson-Keel pairings ("Lovely to Look At" and Cole Porter's "Kiss Me Kate") did not do very well.

Attempts to resurrect the screen operetta ("The Student Prince", "Rose Marie" and "The Merry Widow") met with only middling success.

"Love Me or Leave Me" in 1955 from Joe Pasternak, was an exception and did extraordinarily well. The soundtrack album topped the charts for months. Doris Day, not an MGM contract player, was credited with much of the reason for the success.

With the exception of the Rodgers and Hammerstein adaptations, few musicals sparkled in the latter 50's although both "The Pajama Game" and "Damn Yankess" at Warners had modest success.

"Gigi" an original screen musical did well at MGM but "Bells are Ringing" in 1960 lost about 1.7 million.

After "West Side Story" was released, there was a spate of popular musicals released including "The Music Man", "Bye, Bye Birdie", "Gypsy" and in 1964, "My Fair Lady", "Mary Poppins" and "Molly Brown". Most of these, however, were not MGM films and the days of MGM releasing 8 - 10 musicals in a year, were but a dim memory.

by Anonymousreply 470Last Tuesday at 3:16 PM

American in Paris was released after Showboat and was a tremendous hit everywhere as well. And though not Freed Seven Brides was a spectacular success.

by Anonymousreply 471Last Tuesday at 3:25 PM

[R467] Many people on DL are inexplicably preoccupied with the issue of "relevance" and are seemingly terrified of a younger person telling them they're old, when that fact is always self-evident. "No one cares..." is a favorite refrain on here. As if in 30 years 12 year-olds will know who Beyonce is and be whiling away their time on TikTok. DL is a cultural grab bag/exchange across generations and I can only assume that a certain brand of curious young person ends up here. Is Socrates irrelevant? Is Mozart? I just watched METROPOLIS from 1927 for the first time. Does that make me old and irrelevant? Treating art as historical detritus is a dangerous Philistine stance. Maybe the "relevant" people will torch the Louvre, public libraries and other culture treasures and we will all get to live in an antiseptic present shorn of all past history and art forms.

If it's being discussed on a DL thread it's relevant as far as DL is concerned. 470 and counting responses on a thread dedicated to Cyd Charisse and old Hollywood musicals proves that they matter to people.

by Anonymousreply 472Last Tuesday at 3:26 PM

I guess 7 Brides must have been the last original musical (not a Broadway adaptation) to be a big financial hit for a long time? What would have been the next one....Thoroughly Modern Millie?

by Anonymousreply 473Last Tuesday at 3:27 PM

Ooops. I'll oh dear myself and say that Gigi came between 7 Brides and Millie (I always forget Gigi wasn't based on a Broadway show).

by Anonymousreply 474Last Tuesday at 3:28 PM

Well I'll second oh dear you and tell you there was a small modest original musical with the initials MP.

by Anonymousreply 475Last Tuesday at 3:31 PM

James Mitchell:

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by Anonymousreply 476Last Tuesday at 3:32 PM

I bet he could crack walnuts with his butt cheeks.

by Anonymousreply 477Last Tuesday at 3:40 PM

Somewhere I heard a interview with Susan Lucci where she reminisced about James Mitchell (who she called Jimmy) coming up to her during a long day and dancing with her during their break and how wonderful he was. She seemed very fond of him.

Maybe because it was played on my local PBS station off and on for awhile when they would play classic movies on Saturdays and take a break from their all British mysteries all the time or play them during pledge week instead of their current rotation of concert informercials, but I had always assumed Kiss Me Kate was a decent hit. I think it has aged pretty well and is an entertaining movie. For some reason, I assumed Silk Stockings had done ok as well. It just shows that what was big at the time, might not necessarily be the movie that ages the best for later viewers.

by Anonymousreply 478Last Tuesday at 4:05 PM

Gigi was based on a hit (non-musical) play

And James Mitchell was definitely hot!

by Anonymousreply 479Last Tuesday at 4:05 PM

[quote]Gigi was based on a hit (non-musical) play

That starred Audrey Hepburn.

by Anonymousreply 480Last Tuesday at 5:07 PM

Leslie Caron couldn't sing either.

by Anonymousreply 481Last Tuesday at 5:09 PM

No, r481, she really couldn't. Years ago I worked with a woman who'd been a dancer and in a production of Can-Can with her. She said that her singing was...painful.

by Anonymousreply 482Last Tuesday at 5:16 PM

Call Betty Wand!

by Anonymousreply 483Last Tuesday at 5:18 PM

[quote] Gigi was based on a hit (non-musical) play.

I can't understand why this story could make a hit play. It's all about prostitutes, the male hero is lame and story doesn't go anywhere.

I can understand why Lerner and Loewe chose to make a musical out of the play Pygmalion but 'Gigi seemed so lame and uneventful.

by Anonymousreply 484Last Tuesday at 5:22 PM

Re The Nicholas Brothers and The Pirate. From memory we only see them in the Be A Clown first version. Were they in the scrapped Voodoo number? In one of those docos on Judy it is said that they were told to stay home until Judy was able to work but I don't think they have any scenes with her in the existing film.

by Anonymousreply 485Last Tuesday at 5:25 PM

[quote]R470 “Love Me or Leave Me" in 1955 from Joe Pasternak, was an exception and did extraordinarily well. The soundtrack album topped the charts for months.

Is that technically considered a musical? I mean, it’s about a singer and we see her at work... but I’ve never considered it a musical, exactly.

I guess it has musical [italic]numbers...[/italic]

by Anonymousreply 486Last Tuesday at 5:40 PM

I would also consider the Cabaret film a musical, r486.

by Anonymousreply 487Last Tuesday at 5:54 PM

Right. I guess ALL THAT JAZZ is in a similar format. Except for the closing number.

by Anonymousreply 488Last Tuesday at 6:01 PM

I'm listening to you, R486, and I agree with you.

by Anonymousreply 489Last Tuesday at 6:14 PM

My husband does not visit Datalounge or any other forum. I mentioned Cyd Charisse today and he laughed out loud and said, "Wow, that's a long way back!" So there are people not on Datalounge who do remember her.

by Anonymousreply 490Last Tuesday at 6:52 PM

Has anyone on this 500 post thread had much positive to say about this dead dancer named Sid?

I don't.

by Anonymousreply 491Last Tuesday at 6:56 PM

The best that could be said about her is she was a good dancer.

It begins and ends with that.

by Anonymousreply 492Last Tuesday at 7:03 PM

What I've learmed about Cyd from this thread is that she was an excellent dancer and had a good body, but average in looks, could not sing or act, got into some classic films anyway, and was a massive CUNT and seemed to enjoy being a cunt. The end.

by Anonymousreply 493Last Tuesday at 7:05 PM

Also that she hated "sissies."

by Anonymousreply 494Last Tuesday at 7:07 PM

She hated "sissies" and Nanette Fabray.

by Anonymousreply 495Last Tuesday at 7:22 PM

There was a series years ago of Dance on film which was held at the Walter Reade Theater in Lincoln Center when a lot of people who had major careers in musicals were still alive. I saw Leslie Caron, Stanley Donen and Michael Kidd speak about their lives making these films with a generous number of musical numbers which were thank god shown in 35 mm and not on video. I spoke to the curator and interviewer after one such interview and told her Cyd Charrisse would provide a great evening and she kind of looked at me and her face went white. She made no response. I felt like I had made a faux pas just bringing up her name. Cyd why were you such a bitch on wheels?

by Anonymousreply 496Last Tuesday at 8:04 PM

If she never made another musical number, that Dancing in the Dark number with Fred Astaire, set in Central Park, would seal her place in the cinematic firmament. Simple costumes, simple set but oh how smooth and how elegant.

Also, I think the audience can identify with that number because it seems as though it is something we can actually accomplish ourselves, no complicated steps or choreography to contend with.

by Anonymousreply 497Last Tuesday at 8:49 PM

While I had heard of Sheree North as a Marilyn Monroe clone. And I knew that she had a guest spot in "The Golden Girls," I didn't know that North was a dancer until someone posted that number with Jacques d'Amboise on another thread. It was so erotic, it stopped me in my tracks. Was North highly rated as a dancer?

by Anonymousreply 498Last Tuesday at 11:37 PM

[Quote] I can't understand why this story could make a hit play. It's all about prostitutes

Are you NUTS?!

by Anonymousreply 499Last Tuesday at 11:38 PM

"Also, I think the audience can identify with that number because it seems as though it is something we can actually accomplish ourselves, no complicated steps or choreography to contend with."

Yes, r497...

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by Anonymousreply 500Yesterday at 8:39 AM

It was a fucking musical, r489, you steaming turd!

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by Anonymousreply 501Yesterday at 8:46 AM

Is it a musical if all the numbers are "performance" numbers (i.e. the character is performing on a stage)?

by Anonymousreply 502Yesterday at 8:48 AM

If you're going by that definition, neither the film versions of Cabaret or Chicago would be considered musicals.

by Anonymousreply 503Yesterday at 8:52 AM

Did Fosse remark on why he did that? It makes sense in light of the decline of musicals. "Make it a movie with music" etc.

by Anonymousreply 504Yesterday at 8:55 AM

I'd buy it if it were a standard bio-pic with Doris just singing Ruth's songs as she had performed them. But the numbers got the splashy MGM Musical treatment and they bore little similarity to the way Ruth performed them. For one thing ...

"While the original plan for the show was for Etting to do a tap dance after singing "Shaking the Blues Away", she later remembered she was not a very good dancer. At the show's final rehearsal, Flo Ziegfeld told her, "Ruth, when you get through singing, just walk off the stage".

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by Anonymousreply 505Yesterday at 9:13 AM

Weren't a significant number of the splashy 30's musicals movies where the singing and dancing all took place on stage or the dance floor as part of a show?

by Anonymousreply 506Yesterday at 9:23 AM

[quote]I can't understand why this story could make a hit play. It's all about prostitutes.

Specifically, an underage prostitute in training.

by Anonymousreply 507Yesterday at 9:30 AM

I guess some of you will be picketing the next revival of "Carousel"...

by Anonymousreply 508Yesterday at 9:34 AM

r507 is the reason the word tedious was invented.

by Anonymousreply 509Yesterday at 9:37 AM

[R506] Yes, absolutely. The early musicals were usually conceived of as backstage stories about performers (Dancing Lady from 1933 is a good example). They would usually employ a flimsy boy-meets-girl plot that served as a pretext to showcase a collection of songs, most often not expressly composed for the story in question (e.g., the song Singin' in the Rain appeared in multiple musicals before the 1952 classic). It was the era of vaudeville and the musical revue. That all changed with the advent of the "integrated musical" in which the songs were composed to serve a particular plot and a story (The Wizard of Oz). Arthur Freed is usually credited with popularizing the integrated musical, although the widely-held claim that the songs in the integrated musical "advanced the plot" is mostly bogus. A song like Over the Rainbow underscores the emotion of the story - it doesn't really "advance" the plot (e.g., it's Dorothy's lament and she doesn't end up in a different place from when the song began).

by Anonymousreply 510Yesterday at 10:04 AM

It's a standard musical *want song*, r510. I would argue that if not plot advancing, it definitely deepens the character of Dorothy.

by Anonymousreply 511Yesterday at 10:22 AM

The Broadway Melody the first sound film to win a Best Oscar uses songs as performance numbers on stage, to 'sell' a song, and to advance the plot outside the framework of performing like many musicals to come.

One Hour With You, Love Me Tonight and Le Million from the very early 30s are integrated musicals using numbers both to establish character and advance the plot.

by Anonymousreply 512Yesterday at 10:33 AM

Were audiences upset or happy to see Shaking the Blues Away performed so brilliantly by Ann Miller in Easter Parade in 1948 performed again so soon and so brilliantly by Doris Day in Love Me Or Leave Me in 1955, both produced by MGM?

Which is your favorite version of the song? Mine happens to be Annie's version. And I love how she swishes around that fabulous skirt.

by Anonymousreply 513Yesterday at 12:05 PM

Day said that when Cagney started brutalizing her in the bedroom the scene had to be cut otherwise it wouldn't have gotten past the censors.

by Anonymousreply 514Yesterday at 12:09 PM

[quote]Were audiences upset or happy to see Shaking the Blues Away performed so brilliantly by Ann Miller in Easter Parade in 1948 performed again so soon and so brilliantly by Doris Day in Love Me Or Leave Me in 1955, both produced by MGM?

Seven years is a long time, and remember that there was no home video nor were these movies shown on TV regularly back then. So it's likely they'd forgotten all about it.

by Anonymousreply 515Yesterday at 12:14 PM

Ann's is more like a "truckdriver in drag" while Day's is done more in the style of Ziegfeld, as performed in "Love Me or Leave Me".

Ann is fine - enthusiastic and seeming to have a great time in her first MGM role, but it's still Ann doing what she would do variations of during the coming years. For Doris, it was a huge step away from her Warner Brothers films and a musical highlight of a gripping motion picture.

by Anonymousreply 516a day ago

R513, people still love the number. I know a few dancers(not the one in the video), and they love Ann and Cyd.

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by Anonymousreply 517a day ago

Barbershop version. This one is where the boys are.

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by Anonymousreply 518a day ago

Was Doris given a dance double for the number? Why all those long shots?? I much prefer Ann Miller's version. She is a better dancer, doesn't need backup chorus boys, and sings it better.

by Anonymousreply 519a day ago

Actually, I'd say it's Doris who looks like a "truckdriver in drag" in her version of the number, not Annie.

There was something about the way she presented herself in the later half of the 1950s, her makeup, the severe short hairdos and possibly a little weight gain, that was not as pretty as the young girl in the earlier Warner Bros musicals (Tea for Two, On Moonlight Bay, etc.) and the later fashionable Lady of the Romcoms (Pillow Talk, That Touch of Mink, etc.).

Didn't Ann Miller supposedly shoot her number with a back brace after her husband pushed her down a flight of stairs?

by Anonymousreply 520a day ago

Oh for chrissakes, you bums, they're both great.

by Anonymousreply 521a day ago

[quote]R520 Didn't Ann Miller supposedly shoot her number with a back brace after her husband pushed her down a flight of stairs?

It wasn’t her husband, it was someone from DL.

by Anonymousreply 522a day ago

I didn't *push* her, r552, I *twirled* her.

by Anonymousreply 523a day ago

The fact that it was in 1948 makes it most likely it was someone from DL.

by Anonymousreply 524a day ago

[quote]WTF was that all about?

Apparently about one of the bigger cunts at MGM.

by Anonymousreply 52521 hours ago

I watched Ziegfeld Follies today for the first time. Ooo-wee did that thing have some filler in it. In the opening number, Bring on the PINK!, I was most impressed with Cyd ending her number by going back, stepping on the moving turntable and standing there...all the time on point. Some socko numbers and...filler.

by Anonymousreply 52621 hours ago

There is quite a bit of filler in that movie. For me there are only 4 sequences that I like.

by Anonymousreply 52721 hours ago

I know there are a lot of places to watch movies nowadays, but one of the substations, Movies!, is running it this month and I intend to check it out, I have not seen it in many years. But what I do remember is that the comedy sections are dreadful

by Anonymousreply 52821 hours ago

I happen to like the Fanny Brice lottery ticket bit but the others are pure torture.

by Anonymousreply 52921 hours ago

[quote]A song like Over the Rainbow underscores the emotion of the story - it doesn't really "advance" the plot (e.g., it's Dorothy's lament and she doesn't end up in a different place from when the song began).

Only if you ignore the entire Technicolor portion of the film.

by Anonymousreply 53021 hours ago

Should've crushed that wonk-eyed cunt with my giant can of soup.

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by Anonymousreply 53121 hours ago

Annie opening Disney MGM Studios.

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by Anonymousreply 53221 hours ago

I wonder why MGM wouldn't cast Ann Miller in Silk Stockings in the Janis Paige role. Jan is fabulous but the part would have seemed to be a natural for Annie's talents and Jan wasn't even a contract player. Perhaps they considered it too much of a supporting role?

by Anonymousreply 53321 hours ago

[quote]Gay men might be dazzled by boozy, druggy, tubby, crazy Marilyn but I’ll bet that most straight guys would go for Cyd first. Cyd had a far better body and didn’t exude mental and physical ill health.

Are you insane? Marilyn was the fantasy of millions of men. She was THE sex symbol of her time.

by Anonymousreply 53421 hours ago

That's what's I watched it on, r528. And, yes, the comedy sections are pretty bad. I didn't like the Fanny Brice one, r529.

by Anonymousreply 53521 hours ago

r527 - Mine would be:

Bring on the Girls


Limehouse Blues

Babbitt and the Bromide

by Anonymousreply 53620 hours ago

What are the good sections of Ziegfeld Follies? The only ones I remember are the opening with Lucy whipping the catwomen and Judy doing The Great Lady Gives an Interview. It's really shocking how tedious the film is, considering all of the talent that was at MGM when they made it.

by Anonymousreply 53720 hours ago

Marilyn and Cyd were both gorgeous - no straight man would have turned either one down. You're crazy if you think Marilyn was "tubby"

by Anonymousreply 53820 hours ago

Ya know what Judy's Great Lady Gives an Interview needed, r537? TAP, honey, *I* gave it...TAP!

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by Anonymousreply 53920 hours ago

Lana Turner did a version too.

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by Anonymousreply 54019 hours ago

Lana Turner is almost unfailingly an embarrassment.

by Anonymousreply 54119 hours ago

[quote] …embarrassment.…

That's the word I was thinking also. I have always avoided her stuff because she always seemed so useless.

I wonder what Ingrid Bergman thought about her when they switched roles in 'Docter Jekkyl'

by Anonymousreply 54218 hours ago

Lana Turner didn't belong at MGM.

She was an low-rent broad who really belonged over at Warners or Republic with Mayo Methot and Mamie Van Doren.

by Anonymousreply 54316 hours ago

It doesn't make sense for Ann Miller to do the sketch because she was always known for her torso.

by Anonymousreply 54411 hours ago

R533 - Ann said Arthur Freed's rationale for dropping her from the film was hair color. Cyd was a brunette and he didn't want the second female lead to also be one. though I think Janis is s brunette in the film too. Ann went blonde for one film at Columbia I think but she said the peroxide damaged her hair so she would never do it again. The Silk Stockings saga in mentioned in the new bio on Ann by Peter Shelley.

by Anonymousreply 54511 hours ago
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