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Adoption horror stories

I come into contact with lots of social workers in my line of work. Apparently adopting a kid can be like adopting a pit bull. The horror stories I've heard could put most people off adopting. There are code words in adoption documents like 'sensitive', 'needs special attention', 'needs a household where (s)he will be the only child' etc. which means that the kids are fucking death. I'm not talking teens, I'm talking 5 - 11 year olds. In one case the kid was Central American, adopted by White parents. The family dog was terrified of him. Apparently one day they found the dog limping, and there was a white discharge from its anus. They went to the vet and the vet said it was human semen. The adopted son - 10 or 11 - was fucking the dog up the ass. Then the younger daughter (5 or 6) had pan while urinating. Took her to the doctor. She had gonorrhea. That was it. They returned the kid. In another case, an adopted son from some flyoveristani shithole was fostered by a family here in Portland. He had serious anger issues. He smacked his foster mom upside the head with a pan, and threw boiling frying oil over the family cat. They had to euthanize it. My friend said the foster mom confessed she would never forget the cat's yowls until the day she died. It was saturated in boiling oil. The poor thing was fried alive!

Any other horror stories of adoptive parenting?

by Anonymousreply 252September 9, 2021 12:12 AM

Adoption has been whitewashed for a long time. Many kids separated from their mother when young are going to have major problems for life. It's a real tragedy.

by Anonymousreply 1August 18, 2020 1:11 AM

R1 - what I'm saying is that most kids up for adoption are by definition damaged goods. If you're cool with that, fine, but there needs to be more transparency.

by Anonymousreply 2August 18, 2020 1:12 AM

When I was growing up, my family was terrorized by another family who beat me up, vandalized our home, killed our pets, and a bunch of other shit. A few years ago, I looked up members of the family, and saw that the matriarch was sued by an adoption agency. Of course, everything about the case was redacted, so it doesn't say why, but she was sued the same year her youngest child was born. I wonder if she tried to scam someone by promising them her kid, and likely got money/gifts from them, then reneged.

by Anonymousreply 3August 18, 2020 1:19 AM

The story about the five year old is sad. A man has fucked up her life already.

by Anonymousreply 4August 18, 2020 1:23 AM

R4 who said it was a man?

by Anonymousreply 5August 18, 2020 1:27 AM

“The story about the five year old is sad. A man has fucked up her life already.”

They love to fuck them up early, break them when they are young and they won’t complain later.

by Anonymousreply 6August 18, 2020 1:27 AM

I was adopted. Even though I am have a well above average level of success and achievement, I accept that the only place I am ever going to feel safe is in my own head. Most adoptees have a sense of floating, never truly connecting to the rest of the world. I get it.

Adoptees have higher drug and alcohol use, crime, and mental issues. Children are deeply bonded to their mothers, but there are many who are committed to re-engineering that relationship because of religion, politics, or other agendas. It really sucks.

by Anonymousreply 7August 18, 2020 1:30 AM

My heart goes out to you R7. Sounds like you are okay and made life as good as you can; i hope you have much happiness in your former years.

by Anonymousreply 8August 18, 2020 1:32 AM

At what age were you adopted? I wonder if those concerns exist for children adopted at birth?

by Anonymousreply 9August 18, 2020 1:36 AM

This is sort of an adoption story. I was friends with this couple. She was a social worker, he was a nurse. They were going to have kids but she couldn't conceive. So they figured at some point they'd adopt. They thought they'd do fostering parenting first, in order to get the hang of it.

One day I called to say hello, and the husband said they were having trouble with "the kid?" The kid? He then mumbled something about him being "thrust upon us." Seems they (well, I think it was more the wife's idea; she had the social worker mentality) were fostering a 12 year old boy with AIDS. I don't know what was going on when I called but they had him removed from their home pronto. Apparently the kid, in addition to having AIDS, was seriously mentally disturbed. He had a toy gun with an orange strip on it to identify it as a toy; he was caught at the stove, attempting to burn the strip off the toy gun, to make it seem like it was a real one. I don't know what was happening when I called but they evidently realized they couldn't handle him and had him taken away.

Later, trying to nice, they would call the group home where he was placed to see if they could take him on outings, but every time they called they were told he was "on restriction" and couldn't go. At least once he was just dumped on their doorstep by the people in charge of him; I guess they just wanted him off their hands for a while. I thought it was amazing that this very disturbed kid was placed in a home where the foster parents were so inexperienced; it was their FIRST try at foster parenting. But maybe CPS or whoever had him, just wanted to get rid of him. I also wondered why they (actually I think it was probably all the wife's idea) would agree to take on such a disturbed youngster. She said "well, he needed a home." I started to say "but yours probably wasn't the best one to place him in" but kept quiet. Anyway, sometimes I wonder what happened to that kid. He seemed like a time bomb.

The well meaning couple never attempted foster parenting again. Or, needless to say, ever adopted a child.

by Anonymousreply 10August 18, 2020 1:46 AM

These stories are why abortions should remain legal and should be easily accessible.

by Anonymousreply 11August 18, 2020 2:22 AM

After years of believing adoption was the right choice from an ethical standpoint, I now believe abortion is the most ethical. Never known adoption work out - there is always something “missing”. Why bring a child into the world to only know unhappiness? It’s cruel. Abortion = the moral choice.

by Anonymousreply 12August 18, 2020 2:42 AM

A friend adopted a 6 year old girl from a Bulgarian orphanage. Turns out she was actually 10!!!!!! She was underfed and mentally abused at the orphanage. This friend was in Bulgaria for about 1 week for the official adoption and the Agency hid so much information from her. The kid was a horror until she turned 18 and moved in with a slightly older guy with a criminal record. Luckily, my friend has not heard from her in over 10 years; however, she can't help but worry for her and will take her in if she ever returns, ugh!

by Anonymousreply 13August 18, 2020 2:56 AM

My adopted daughter has RAD - reactive attachment disorder, she is also bipolar, adhd, severe anxiety. She takes an anti psychotic and about 10 other pills a day. She is on her way to her first residential treatment facility tomorrow. the other night i had to talk her out of shaving her head bald. She is 21 now, won't work or go to school, i don't think she could do either anyway. I have spent thousands trying to get her help. I love her but she is mentally abusive to me. I hope the residential treatment works for her.

by Anonymousreply 14August 18, 2020 3:28 AM

My adopted daughter is a joy and has brought so much happiness to so many people. I got her a few months after she was born, and she spent that time with a foster family. Her foster mother said she was the best baby she ever had. China now allows their own people to adopt, so I understand that the only children coming out of there now have serious disabilities. I live in an area with a lot of Asian people, so I'm sure that helped. I've had more than my fair share of shit in life, but getting her and being her mother is the best thing I've done.

by Anonymousreply 15August 18, 2020 4:10 AM

At least you can return an adopted child.

by Anonymousreply 16August 18, 2020 4:14 AM

I see the results of adoption in medical records frequently. It isn't pretty. Even if the kid was yanked early and/or enormous amounts of $$/therapy were in play.

Someone here a while back said the adoption was okay until the 70's

Before you were getting kids from out of wedlock girls etc. Now, the pool is drugs, more drugs, criminality and mental illness.

I sincerely hate saying it, but I have seen enough WTF in medical records to know I wouldn't be able to do it.

by Anonymousreply 17August 18, 2020 4:19 AM

[quote]Someone here a while back said the adoption was okay until the 70's.

When it was just white babies made in the USA.

by Anonymousreply 18August 18, 2020 4:42 AM

R17, my best friend growing up was adopted, as were her two siblings. They were born in the late 70s and early 80s, and their adoptive parents were teachers. They all seemed well-adjusted.

by Anonymousreply 19August 18, 2020 5:03 AM

R12's dumb comment calls out what you're all not allowing for and that is that adopting a child after it has passed through the baby stage is never going to be the same type of childhood as a child born and raised by its birth parents. That is neither here nor there and doesn't and shouldn't have any determination over whether the adoption is a success. These mis-managed expectations are central to the observational so-determined 'failure' of adoptions. Like duh R1 wow how insightful that children facing often extreme difficulties and upheaval in early life may experience problems later in life. What will you come up with next? R2 describing kids as damaged goods? Those in glass houses...

by Anonymousreply 20August 18, 2020 5:06 AM

The only adoption horror story I can think of is me, as an adoptee, coming on to a message board only to find a thread started by some asshole trying to tell me I'm damaged goods.

I don't know how I've made it this far in life without fucking a dog or boiling a cat!

Seriously, OP, get fucked.

My adoptive parents loved me to the moon and back and I am very well-adjusted.

Your biological parents raised an ignorant, stupid shitbag.

by Anonymousreply 21August 18, 2020 5:29 AM

R21 this thread is so bizarre. Based on the insight offered here we can trace some of the greatest monsters in human history to their status as adoptees. Oh, wait...

by Anonymousreply 22August 18, 2020 7:19 AM

I've known dozens of adopted kids who are perfectly well-adjusted and a couple who are not. So maybe it's just the law of averages that says that some adoptees will turn out to have serious problems. One out of every 5 Americans has some degree of mental illness, according to many studies, and the vast majority of those were NOT adopted, so EVERY child is a crap shoot. If we're going on that basis, human beings should just stop procreating for safety's sake. . Granted that Eastern European adoptees will have had a much higher likelihood of fetal alcohol syndrome, and as someone mentioned, Chinese adoptees now will have a physical disability, still, otherwise, in most cases, the kids are going to be given a shot at a better life than they would have had with their birth parents. One friend has adopted 10 (TEN) kids from China, all born with hearing loss. She gets them over here, gets them fitted up with cochlear implants, and raises them. So far so good.

by Anonymousreply 23August 18, 2020 8:06 AM

I'm biracial and was adopted as an infant. My parents provided me with unconditional love, a very nurturing and stable environment and instilled self esteem and confidence in me. My older brother is also biracial and adopted. We were as close as any traditional family and actually looked like my parent's biological children, had they been so blessed with having.

Not all adoptions, even those that cross racial boundaries in the mid 60's turn out to be horror stories and tales of tragic mulattos.

by Anonymousreply 24August 18, 2020 10:59 AM

R11 and one major reason surrogacy should be against the law.

by Anonymousreply 25August 18, 2020 11:12 AM

Hitler's platform was that Jews were defective and must be dealt with. I see a lot of parallels in this thread.

by Anonymousreply 26August 18, 2020 11:13 AM

My nieces and nephew have an adopted cousin and love him the same as they love their bio cousins. Some of the comments here are alarming.

by Anonymousreply 27August 18, 2020 11:17 AM

Thank you, R21! This thread is absolutely bizarre. The adopted people I've met are no different than those raised by their biological parents. Actually, the most fucked up people have been those who were abandoned by one parent, and raised by the other biological parent (who seemed to resent their kid(s)). The worst quality I've experienced from an adopted person is a woman I worked with who was overly-eager to please. She was so cool, but she would go overboard in trying to get others to like her.

Sadly, gays and lesbians are in the best position to give adopted kids good homes, but people are going to use this thread as a way to encourage surrogacy. Fortunately for them, custom made babies are just as capable of growing up to become assholes.

by Anonymousreply 28August 18, 2020 11:33 AM

[quote] but people are going to use this thread as a way to encourage surrogacy.

Glad you said it first.

by Anonymousreply 29August 18, 2020 11:39 AM

“...here in Poland”? Uh huh.

by Anonymousreply 30August 18, 2020 11:46 AM

I’m glad I had an abortion!

by Anonymousreply 31August 18, 2020 11:47 AM

OP = Ryan Murphy

by Anonymousreply 32August 18, 2020 11:49 AM

Watching how some adoptions work out over time has altered my opinion on the importance of genetics when it comes to mental illness.

by Anonymousreply 33August 18, 2020 12:17 PM

[quote]At what age were you adopted? I wonder if those concerns exist for children adopted at birth?

Not any more than for kids being raised by their birth parents, in my experience.

I'm adopted, and my parents had to deal with the burden of a kid who made the honor roll, stayed out of trouble in school (I was a nerd who played Middle Earth RPG with my nerdy friends), never got anyone pregnant, drove his dad to physical therapy in the afternoons as a teen, and earned free ride scholarships to college. [italic]quelle horreur![/italic]

Similarly, most people I know who were adopted turned out just fine. I only know of one friend who's had a lot of difficulties with her adopted child, taken in from a war-torn African country at kindergarten age, and he eventually shaped up once he got out of school and started working.

by Anonymousreply 34August 18, 2020 12:48 PM

Two good friends of mine (husband and wife - husband worked with me many years ago) came up with the stupid idea 16 years ago to adopt 2 Russian orphans. They went through one of these agencies that I consider nothing more than child selling operations. I told them from day one I thought it was the stupidest idea I'd ever heard. Neither one of them is, or ever has been, even remotely prepared to raise children. But the agency found 2 sisters who were being housed in separate orphanages in Murmansk, Russia. The sisters were 10 and 8. They weren't orphans. Their parents were still alive, but apparently both were scum and had turned the children over to their grandmother who was already raising some of her other grandchildren. She became overwhelmed and had to place the 2 sisters in orphanages. My friends flew to Murmansk and spent 2 weeks there before they were allowed to bring the girls home. It has been 16 years of pure hell. The younger daughter was diagnosed bi-polar, and the older one is just a nasty piece of work. The younger one has been in jail more times than I can count. Since they were adopted their parents have both had serious health woes. The husband has had a heart attack and at 76 is now suffering from dementia. The mother has had 2 strokes and is now in a wheelchair much of the time. They've both been attacked repeatedly by the girls and beaten bloody. The younger one got herself pregnant by an illegal alien (Mexican) and was living with him and his mother until they had all they could take of her insanity and threw her out. That was 2+ years ago. They kept the baby and she has not seen her son since, and apparently doesn't care. She just got out of jail after being in for 6 months on a probation violation. The parents have a restraining order against her but she continues to show up in the middle of the night when she gets kicked out of whoever's home she's been sleeping in. Because of his dementia the husband will allow her into the house and then the wife ends up calling the police when she finds out the girl is there, but she's always gone before the cops get there. The younger daughter stole their car in the middle of the night a year ago, she has no drivers license, and she and a friend promptly wrecked it (it was totaled), and the idiot cops didn't even arrest her for it. They just brought her home.

It's a sad situation, and as I told the wife on the phone recently during one of her weekly sob sessions, "you don't live in a home, you live in an insane asylum". The saddest thing is nothing is going to change until the husband dies and she can go into a nursing home. Until then those 2 girls are going to continually make their lives hell.

by Anonymousreply 35August 18, 2020 12:51 PM

[quote] I was adopted. Even though I am have a well above average level of success and achievement, I accept that the only place I am ever going to feel safe is in my own head. Most adoptees have a sense of floating, never truly connecting to the rest of the world. I get it.

This gave me chills. I could have written it myself. I was adopted as an infant by WONDERFUL parents. I am, by any reasonable metric, a decent and successful person. But I am also entirely alone and unconnected, unable (or unwilling?) to form real connections with others.

My brother (also adopted) is much the same. He has severe addiction and mental illness issues. I was, at least, spared that.

Until the last year or so, I was unaware that this was common in adoptees.

by Anonymousreply 36August 18, 2020 12:56 PM

I was adopted at three days old. I'm 37 now. I met my birth mother when I was 20.

I've struggled a lot in life. I was bullied constantly as a kid. It was in part to being gay; but I also noticed the other adopted kids I knew were bullied too, and we all were oddballs. I always found that interesting. I wonder if anyone has ever studied the connection between adoption and bullying.

Anyway, I have struggled with drugs and alcohol, bipolar disorder, and suicidal thoughts most of my life. I've never been able to maintain a long-term romantic relationship. I do have some long-term fuck buddies who are as emotionally messed up as me (so on some level, it works). Friendships are also a struggle for me. Any interpersonal relationship takes a lot of time, effort, and frankly, heartache, and most of the time I don't deem them worth it.

Interestingly, I'd say my problems stem from genetics as much as they stem from the adoption. My birth mother has serious psychological issues that have never been addressed. She is extremely intelligent and yet has worked as a hotel maid her entire adult life. (Nothing wrong with that; but this is a woman who was able to teach herself to read Japanese.)  She's a coke head too.

I feel that either way I would have been screwed. She had some other children whom she kept, and she proved to be a totally aloof, neglectful parent. Although I've had serious issues with my adopted parents, they are upper middle class and at least provided financial stability.

On balance, I think I'd have had a worse outcome had I not been adopted.

by Anonymousreply 37August 18, 2020 1:00 PM

My mom was adopted from the Georgia Tann orphanage. I posted above about my adopted daughter being mentally ill. I didnt mean to be disrespectful to other adoptees. I was just sharing my experience

by Anonymousreply 38August 18, 2020 1:03 PM

Also there could be a correlation/causation issue here- children are adopted by infertile couples, or who for some biological/emotional/psychological reason can't have kids. Or maybe waited too long and might be set in their ways.

Parenting is a learning process, most people are bad at it, and it's good to have a genetic investment in the child "these are my genes, they reflect upon me".

I am unwilling to merely blame the adopted as "defective". I think at a biological level, if you can't have kids there COULD BE a legitimate reason you shouldn't parent. And if a kid requires MORE patience, MORE love, and MORE investment, adopted parents might be at a disadvantage.

And actually, the second an adopted parent blames the child as "defective", they prove they're bad parents, same as biological.

Children are innocent.

by Anonymousreply 39August 18, 2020 1:08 PM

I was adopted. Nobody knows my actual date of birth. I lived first in England with my adoptive parents, when I was very little. Apparently my bio mother was a prostitute and abused me so badly I seemed retarded. What they didn't know, is that my adoptive mother was also a prostitute, and had connections with the mafia. I was one of several adopted children . My New mummy soon left my first ' dad ' and took us to NYC, where she resumed her activities. There was a long and confusing string of daddies. We lived in a rent controlled flat. There were other children, bio and adopted. One of my daddies took to fucking me and my youngest sister. When mother found out, she blamed me and hit me with a telephone, then she threw me out of the house. My adoptive daddy disowned me. My sisters became addicts. One died from an AIDS related illness. My brother committed suicide. My mother's john continued fucking me, and eventually married me. I'm rich now. I took my little brother with me. My husband is so much older, in a little while, I'll be free. Eventually I was the lucky one. Go figure.

by Anonymousreply 40August 18, 2020 1:24 PM

You judgey cunts do realise that these poor kids don't choose their lot in life, don't you? They didn't choose to be brought into this world, they didn't choose to be thrown away by their parents, didn't choose their mental illness, didn't choose to be born drug dependent, angry, unloved, abused, etc. etc., yet you assholes choose to be assholes.

by Anonymousreply 41August 18, 2020 1:40 PM

'Even though I am have a well above average level of success and achievement,'

Not in the literary sense, clearly.

by Anonymousreply 42August 18, 2020 1:41 PM

[quote] I am unwilling to merely blame the adopted as "defective". I think at a biological level, if you can't have kids there COULD BE a legitimate reason you shouldn't parent.

Perhaps there are people who need the pregnancy aspect, or some was of sublimating it, in order to prepare themselves. Most expectant parents I've known change quite a bit before the birth even happens.

by Anonymousreply 43August 18, 2020 1:41 PM

I had neighbors who used to foster parent. They had this one little girl, she was 5. One day I was visiting and my friend left the room to make coffee and I was talking to the little girl. I was sitting on the lounge. She came over to me and thrust her pelvis onto my knee and said 'fuck me!' I was shocked and mortified. I leapt up from the lounge and went into the kitchen to tell my friend, her foster mother.

The girl had been born drug dependent to a woman who was a junkie. From the age of two her mother used to pimp the girl out to men for sex. The girl was bipolar and suicidal and one day lay behind the tyres of the car and asked my friend to run her over. Another time she was playing in a tree and i told her to get down, she pointed to between her legs and said 'touch me'.

All this was reported to the foster authorities and the girl was no longer allowed alone in a room with any man after that and she had to wear shorts or pants and not dresses. She used to masturbate all the time too, In the end she went back to her real mother!!! I imagine that girl is probably dead now.

by Anonymousreply 44August 18, 2020 1:50 PM

The main problem with any adoption, the agencies, even the legit ones, never fully disclose the backgrounds of the biological parents. Four of my relatives were adopted as babies. Two are perfectly normal people, they are decent hard working adults with their own families and both have great jobs.

The other two have always been trouble, even as children. One is now in their 50s and a hopeless alcoholic and druggie. Due to his drug and alcohol abuse, he was thrown out of the Marines, He's never been able to work long term, not sure was he's doing now. Last I heard, he was doing maintenance at some office complex. He was extremely spoiled as a child, yet I feel that had little to do with how he's ended up.

I've always felt genes play a huge part in alcoholism, drug abuse and mental illness. It seems the agency didn't tell my relatives about the baby's parents.

The other adopted relative is female, she's a lazy boozy sloth who managed to hook a rich man. She's very attractive and charming, but utterly evil and manipulative. She has three kids, now teens, which she barely raised, she'd leave them with her parents while going on endless vacations with her rich husband. Besides designer clothes, she addicted to gambling.

Thankfully, I never see either of these relatives, they're the types you'd only see at weddings and funerals.

by Anonymousreply 45August 18, 2020 1:54 PM

r45 I've always felt genes play a huge part in alcoholism, drug abuse and mental illness.

then why are you being so judgmental?

by Anonymousreply 46August 18, 2020 1:57 PM

[quote][R45] I've always felt genes play a huge part in alcoholism, drug abuse and mental illness. then why are you being so judgmental?

Judgmental? WTF are you talking about? Reading comprehension problems?

I made myself very clear. Obviously, the parents of my two normal adopted cousins were NOT the products of bad genes. Their parents were teens, they were obviously too young to raise babies, so they were put up for adoption.

Neither are druggies, alcoholics or violent people.

Are you really this dense?

by Anonymousreply 47August 18, 2020 2:04 PM

I know one couple with three biological kids and one adopted kid. Every time I see them they are usually complaining about the adopted one which is ridiculous because the bio kids are so much worse, real nightmares.

I wonder if this happens a lot to adopted kids, that they are treated differently and criticized more than the other kids in the family.

by Anonymousreply 48August 18, 2020 2:08 PM

None of this is necessarily innate to adopted children. I come from an apparently respectable upper middle class family. Outwardly we look all picket fences and roses but behind the Stepford facade we're all fucking nuts from genetic mental illness. My mother and her children all have some form of major depression/bipolar/alcoholism and it's been in her family for generations. It's no ones fault, it's just dodgy genes.

We're fortunate in that my father is fine and healthy and has been able to do well for himself which in a way hides the illness and cray cray in our family. A lot of his money goes on psychiatric bills and keeping up appearances, but we're all still psychos, albeit in Ralph Lauren. Even if i were straight I'd never have children because of these highly inheritable mental illnesses.

by Anonymousreply 49August 18, 2020 2:10 PM

r47 Sweetie, you got some anger issues

by Anonymousreply 50August 18, 2020 2:11 PM

I was adopted as a baby and I had a great childhood and I have a great family. We’re truly connected and we take of each other. I’ve never been treated differently.

by Anonymousreply 51August 18, 2020 2:14 PM

I was adopted as a baby and I had a great childhood and I have a great family. We’re truly connected and we take of each other. I’ve never been treated differently.

by Anonymousreply 52August 18, 2020 2:14 PM

God made some of you monsters gay so that no child would be exposed to you

by Anonymousreply 53August 18, 2020 2:16 PM

[quote] God made some of you monsters gay so that no child would be exposed to you

bigot

by Anonymousreply 54August 18, 2020 2:18 PM

r54 Common sense

by Anonymousreply 55August 18, 2020 2:20 PM

How's that bigotry?

by Anonymousreply 56August 18, 2020 2:21 PM

bigot

by Anonymousreply 57August 18, 2020 2:21 PM

Suggesting that someone who clearly has no compassion or empathy probably shouldn't be a parent is not bigotry.

by Anonymousreply 58August 18, 2020 2:25 PM

Nice to hear from you, Boris @ r53.

Say hi to the other inquisitors at the Chechnyan concentration camp in between electrocutions!

by Anonymousreply 59August 18, 2020 3:04 PM

Then what does that have to do with "God making some people gay," r58?

And who is this God fellow, anyway?

by Anonymousreply 60August 18, 2020 3:05 PM

Good adoption agencies are key. My sister has some adopted children and had to jump through a lot of hoops before they gave them her first child.

One of their rules is that for first time parents, they need to be placed with infants. The reasoning is that if a child is older, there is likely to be trauma and they have to be sure the parents can handle it.

My nephews and nieces are grown now, but they have always been generous, loving, and remarkable people.

by Anonymousreply 61August 18, 2020 5:39 PM

This seems to be the topic du jour today

by Anonymousreply 62August 18, 2020 5:41 PM

A childhood friend was adopted and she turned out fine. She was curious about her biological parents but feared what she might find out about them so she did not try to find them.

My aunt adopted 2 girls born to the same mother who couldn’t get her act together. The girls were around 3 and 4 and had some psychological issues related to their environment

The girls got counseling and a good stable, loving home. They are now grown women with their own families.

by Anonymousreply 63August 18, 2020 6:07 PM

I've known so many adopted people, including a family member, who were adopted and none of them had any issues like what is being described. They were just as likely to have issues than any other non-adopted person.

Growing up in the 90s, when divorce was rampant (it seems like people don't divorce like they used to), that was what would really fuck kids up - divorce.

These horror stories you're spouting reminds me of Rachel Lynde warning Marilla that Anne of Green Gables would poison the well or set their house on fire. Shame on you.

by Anonymousreply 64August 18, 2020 6:23 PM

I'm glad to hear your experiences have been positive, r64. I have known a number of adopted people in my life, in addition to being an adoptee.

Yes, first-person experience, sure. But every single adoptee I've known has struggled with relationships to a lesser or greater degree.

As far as mental health goes: according to this study, adopted siblings are 4x more likely to attempt suicide than non-adopted siblings:

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 65August 18, 2020 6:30 PM

Adoption before the 70s/80s was totally different than today, there were few supports for pregnant young women decades ago, birth control/abortion wasn't as easily accessible, and there was still a sense of shame for a single young woman to be pregnant. Adoption in those days wasn't uncommon and there were more healthy babies available who came from relatively normal bio parents.

Today, a young woman who gets pregnant can have an abortion, use the abortion pill OR keep her baby since there are far more supports for young women these days (at least that's how it is here in Canada were adoption is a very difficult process and there are few newborns available).

Simply put, the stock of healthy newborns is low and the stock of older, more challenged children is higher.

by Anonymousreply 66August 18, 2020 7:01 PM

So this thread is just an amalgam of sensational, totally exaggerated anecdotes (with no burden of proof) that are supposed to give an overall verdict on the place of adoption in society? And while we’re at it gives a free for all to make xenophobic comments, judgmental innuendo about mental illness, addiction, and some sort of vague hint of the presence of evil in children? All based on what...”my sisters friends aunts adoptive child did an awful thing I think?”?

The only people that I have known since childhood that were ‘problem children’ were brought up by their birth parents. Does this mean that people should stop having babies? This is all just so unscientific. Totally redundant. Why not just title the thread “say mean things about fictitious children so that you feel powerful for 6 seconds”.

by Anonymousreply 67August 18, 2020 7:10 PM

Some people should never be allowed to have children: prostitutes, junkies, habitual criminals, they all need to forcibly sterilised.

by Anonymousreply 68August 18, 2020 7:28 PM

[quote]So this thread is just an amalgam of sensational, totally exaggerated anecdotes (with no burden of proof) that are supposed to give an overall verdict on the place of adoption in society?

You must be new around here.

by Anonymousreply 69August 18, 2020 7:30 PM

Also, r68, do see the study I posted at r65.

by Anonymousreply 70August 18, 2020 7:35 PM

All too often, this is the result:

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 71August 18, 2020 7:35 PM

Do I need to tell my truth again ?

by Anonymousreply 72August 18, 2020 7:38 PM

But children need a chance in life...here on DL there are so many open minded people. I don’t mean adopt the psychos but you’ll sense it soon enough after talking and meeting with a child.

by Anonymousreply 73August 18, 2020 7:41 PM

But children need a chance in life...here on DL there are so many open minded people. I don’t mean adopt the psychos but you’ll sense it soon enough after talking and meeting with a child.

by Anonymousreply 74August 18, 2020 7:41 PM

Some adoptions go well, some don’t, some are a horror show.

But you can never convince me that a child abandoned by its birth parents as its welcome to life isn’t going to grow up with some broken core issues.

by Anonymousreply 75August 18, 2020 7:44 PM

Damn it! R75

Our life mission was to convince you otherwise.

by Anonymousreply 76August 18, 2020 7:46 PM

I have a cousin who let her desire to know all about her "birth parents" nearly consume her entire life. She was spoiled and treated like a princess by the couple who adopted her (my uncle and his wife). At age 10, she found out she was adopted from her bitch of a grandmother, who was explaining why she was treated so much better than other kids in the family. The questions began and never stopped. She could tell her parents knew where she came from, but they would never tell.

Somehow she got it into her head her mother was another relative of ours, and would not stop hammering everyone involved with the woman. There were no official adoption records, so she swore up and down it had to be a relative. It turns out she was wrong.

Years after her parents died, she did a DNA test via Ancestry and found "blood" relatives that way. She eventually discovered her mother was just a neighbor of her parents from years ago, who was single and got knocked up and couldn't afford to have a child. My uncle and his wife just took the girl, nothing official involved.

At first she communicated (via email) with two "blood" sisters and then started emailing her birth mother. The birth mother acted as if she was interested in meeting, but always found excuses, delaying a visit. My cousin lives in Missouri and the mother was in Arkansas! What an exhausting trip!

Eventually my cousin received an email from one of her half-sisters, telling her to stop contacting their mother. Turns out my cousin contacting her brought back all kinds of horrible memories, as the pregnancy had been the result of a rape. The mother tried, but she couldn't get over that fact.

So for over 30 years she had wondered and worried about where she came from, only to find out she was the result of a rape and that the woman who gave birth to her wanted nothing to do with her. She wasn't the epitome of great mental health to begin with, but now she's gotten worse. Rarely leaves her house and if you mention my uncle and aunt to her, she has nothing but vile things to say about them for ruining her life, when all they did was try to give her a great one. They weren't perfect, but at least she didn't end up in an orphanage!

by Anonymousreply 77August 18, 2020 7:46 PM

I must be in the minority. I was adopted and have never had an issue with it. My parents have more than once told me they're perfectly fine if I wish to locate my bio parents. It's just never occurred to me to divert my time and energy in that direction.

by Anonymousreply 78August 18, 2020 7:50 PM

R75 why not? It’s about being loved and about being taken care of, not being treated differently, being part of a family. You’re selling my parents and family short.

R75 I beg to differ. Not saying it’s the same for everyone but There are also many children who are raised by a father that isn’t their biological father, does it make him less of a parent? For gays and people who believe love is love I feel some of you are still stuck in square thinking. Open up. It’s liberating. I had no biological parent in my life and I was happy, loved and maybe lucky too.

by Anonymousreply 79August 18, 2020 7:52 PM

I feel the same way R78 and my parents never said I couldn’t go look for my biological parents. Everything is ok. I suppose we know what our relationship with our (non bio) parents and family mean. To love is to let go. To not go for restrictions. I am grateful. I suppose you are too?

by Anonymousreply 80August 18, 2020 7:55 PM

Being the “good child” who thinks it’s no issue to be separated at birth is an extremely common response to adoption. Many adoptees consciously or subconsciously think it will protect them from a second abandonment. They often build sunny, pleasing personalities that conceal any pain: Example: Kristin Chenoweth.

by Anonymousreply 81August 18, 2020 7:57 PM

R81 as a newborn one has no such sentiments

by Anonymousreply 82August 18, 2020 7:58 PM

I worked with a guy whose brother and his wife fostered a boy who was roughly 8 or 9 years old who had been severely sexually abused his whole life by a man who raised him. It was a mess. From day one the boy became attached to the foster dad and called him "Dad", but called the foster mom by her first name. He was unable to receive affection from the mom but constantly asked for from the dad.

The boy would constantly take his clothes off and walk around with an erection and his finger inserted in his anus. It was a self-soothing type of thing. He would insert small objects or toys in his anus and then ask for help removing them(!) He obsessively masturbated. He'd try to come in the shower when the dad was showering. One night the dad woke up and the little boy was holding the dad's penis. The list goes on and on.

The boy was at an age where they thought they could correct his behavior and he would grow out of it, but they were overwhelmed. Ultimately, the boy was caught being sexual with a neighbor boy during a play-date and the jig was up. They sent him back. The dad was scared of being accused of sexually molesting him. They reported to the social worker any time anything happened just to be safe, but still.

My friend babysat the kid one night, and they were watching Star Wars and the kid was laying on the floor and during the movie my friend looked down and the kid had removed his pajama bottoms and was masturbating! I asked what he did, and he said, "I just let him finish and pretended like I didn't see him!" lol.

by Anonymousreply 83August 18, 2020 8:10 PM

My partner of many years recently discovered he had twin half-sisters via his philandering liar of a father. They were adopted out at birth and now my partner is thrilled to have them in his life, and even more disgusted with his dead father.

The sisters were raised Mormon but are "not really in the Mormon mold." Their experience as adoptees was okay (for them - we see the effects of male dominance and growing up in a cult). The parents had a natural daughter when the twins were about 6, which changed their world. But they were the ones who stuck with and took care of the parents, while the biological daughter skipped away and didn't do anything.

The girls just really needed to know something about their parents. They found their birth mother and another sister she had put up for adoption when widowed after her first husband died when she was about 20, plus two sons the woman had in her two marriages. The mother would have nothing to do with them but they have established relationships with the adopted sister and with their brothers.

My partner went to meet the sister at their birthday. It was a tremendous experience for them all, including the other adopted sister.

Thank you, all you who have shared your experience here.

by Anonymousreply 84August 18, 2020 8:11 PM

r83 is supremely disturbing.

by Anonymousreply 85August 18, 2020 8:15 PM

R83, I also knew of a foster, then adopted, child of a cousin who had been sexually abused and exposed to drugs and other abuse from early on. He also had uncontrollable issues with acting out sexually, although in his case it was with both men and women. He even grabbed (well, attacked) a social worker while she was driving when he was about 10. Eventually the cousin released him to a group home setting, because he had become violent and they feared for their adopted daughter, who has cerebral palsy and developmental issues. And when the kid turned 18 he ended up going back to be with his natural family. He could not "give them up." Since then he has been incarcerated at times.

by Anonymousreply 86August 18, 2020 8:16 PM

Note how R67 in her screed against the non-scientific posts on the DL relies on her own anecdotal data to defend her position.

Honey, you're too short for that gesture. You may be partly right, but you ain't the one to talk about science.

by Anonymousreply 87August 18, 2020 8:20 PM

[quote] Some people should never be allowed to have children

Having children is easy. But mercy, raising the little darlings can be quite a challenge!

You can give them all the love and care in the world, but sometimes they turn into resentful monsters, or even worse, pint-sized harlots.

by Anonymousreply 88August 18, 2020 8:23 PM

R67 there's a strong predilection on this board propagate an eugenicist outlook. this is bringing that in through the backdoor ("something MUST BE WRONG with these reject children. i mean, if your parents don't keep you, they were obviously defective and therefore you must be defective too. and even though you may have suffered a lot early in life, toobad sosad you don't deserve any more chances because you were born of defectives).

sick psyop board handlers around here trying to stir up racial, gender, and all kinds of discord and hatred among the gay community. thread after thread after thread of this bullshit, so much so that they must be testing these ideas here for ultimate wide deployment (seen firsthand early testing of disinfo campaigns surrounding the pandemic that propagated outward before real data and real science had even gotten off the ground). the DL community must be a vital demographic for study by the disinfo campaigners, all probably on a payroll somewhere.

and many seem to fall for it.

by Anonymousreply 89August 18, 2020 8:30 PM

You have to take a LOT of what's shared here with an ENORMOUS grain of salt

That said, there's certainly a lot of gay men on this board that do not exactly have the most evolved, nuanced opinions about the world and others who inhabit it.

by Anonymousreply 90August 18, 2020 8:33 PM

Speaking of adoption identity crisis,I've known several individuals who were adopted across cultural/racial lines. Four raised in Europe and three in America ,and I have to say that the American adoptees seem slightly more ..angst ridden about the ethnicity aspect then the Europeans, though they are actually all well adjusted individuals and seem to have solid relationships with their parents. All leading normal healthy lives, nothing remotely like some of the cases described here. I just find it interesting that the American raised ones are a little more focused on ethnic identity because on the surface the US is a far more diverse (and mixed) society. Perhaps in a more homogeneous society, you just look it at it like " it is what it is" while Americans are always trying to find their so called tribe.

by Anonymousreply 91August 18, 2020 8:47 PM

Growing up adopted - whether you know it or not- means continually being around people who are not genetically similar to you. That alone can cause problems, but when parents obscure the adoption it is much worse.

Before I met my birth family, I would always scan around the street or room or elevator looking closely at others. It wasn’t conscious, but I was hoping to find someone like me. I stopped without any conscious effort the day I met my birth mother. This is extremely common among adoptees.

by Anonymousreply 92August 18, 2020 8:49 PM

I thought I was adopted until I was 15. That's when I found my missing birth certificate. Needless to say I was pretty bummed out to discover there wasn't an awesome family out there missing a son! lol.

by Anonymousreply 93August 18, 2020 8:54 PM

R87 whooooooosh.

I did that on purpose to emphasize how ineffective a strategy it is. And the suggestion for people to stop having babies based off that was to draw attention to the silliness of some of the suggestions here re abortion v adoption based on such flimsy anecdotal evidence. Was half of your brain adopted to another family as a child?

by Anonymousreply 94August 18, 2020 9:01 PM

MY EX PARTNER WAS ADOPTED , HE DID CRACK AND COKE BEHIND MY BACK AND TRIED TO MURDER ME.

by Anonymousreply 95August 18, 2020 9:03 PM

My friend was adopted and had a wonderful childhood and adored her siblings and parents. Her family was so great that she had no desire to ever look for her birth parents. She was told they were high school sweethearts who weren't ready to be parents and were each headed to college.

Get this... She gets curious about her Ethnicity so she joins Ancestry.com and sends in her spit. Boom! "You have a match!" That story she was told was a total lie made up by the adoption agency! Turns out she was the product of an affair and one of her parents was a celebrity!!!! And she had a sibling! Someone was truly sloppy in the early 70s!!!

by Anonymousreply 96August 18, 2020 9:04 PM

[quote] Adoption horror stories

I have a note or two on this topic.....

by Anonymousreply 97August 18, 2020 9:43 PM

Totally useless story unless you name the celebrity.

by Anonymousreply 98August 18, 2020 9:52 PM

From my perspective as an adoptee I think people make too much of similarities based on biology. I got some things from my biological parents (artistic talent, over-sensitivity to cholesterol meds), but personality wise I clearly take after my adoptive mother. Same temper, same disposition, same tendency to worrywart, lots of the same tastes and interests. It's been my experience that nurture is the stronger influence than nature.

by Anonymousreply 99August 18, 2020 10:01 PM

Are you fuckin' crazy??? I'm not that dumb, r98!

by Anonymousreply 100August 18, 2020 10:14 PM

r99 the replication crisis aside, I remember reading some study that concluded that as adults, adopted siblings had no more in common than any two people picked from society at random.

Also, stories of identical twins raised apart and then reunited as adults show they share uncanny things. Like, taste in music, or type of cologne worn, or physical appearance of their spouse.

I'm r37. I share the same awkward laugh with my birth mother. My half-sister noticed it right away. We also share an appetite for cocaine. I developed a serious problem before I knew it was her drug of choice. Perhaps the most uncanny thing though: when I was very young, I loved butterflies. For several years in elementary school, I even wanted to become an entomologist. Well, my biological father, whom I only met once (he passed away a few years ago), was a very avid butterfly watcher and active in a local butterfly club.

(My adoption was private and my parents knew nothing about my biological parents until I was an adult.)

by Anonymousreply 101August 18, 2020 10:50 PM

Adoption horror stories go both ways. One appalling case was that of Dennis Jurgens, who was tortured and eventually killed by his adoptive mother Lois Jurgens. She and her pathetic milquetoast husband Harold got their hands on him after his teenage mother gave him up for adoption. She was told that if she did the baby would "have everything." The Jurgens looked good on paper; pathetic Harold had a good job, they were church goers, they lived in a decent house. They had already adopted one child, a meek, inactive boy named Robert. But they wanted more children. They wanted a CATHOLIC child. Dennis's mother had put on his birth certificate that he was Catholic, so they wanted him, although when they first saw him Lois Jurgens didn't like him much; she thought he was "sloppy fat" and his feet were too wide and he had a protruding belly button. He was also very active and playful; she didn't like that either. But they took him when he was one year old. He was three when he was killed.

She punched him, slapped him, force fed him his own vomit, kept him tied up in a crib, dug into his anus to remove his stool when she wanted him to have a bowel movement, dug into the back of his ears with her fingernails, poured scalding water on his genitals. At his autopsy there were marks on his penis that looked like bites and his scrotum had a tear in it. Finally he died of peritonitis due a a hole in his bowel that occurred when she threw him down some stairs. Although his body was covered with bruises and wounds no one thought to do an investigation. Lois Jurgens had a brother who was a law enforcement officer; it seems that helped keep things under wraps. Although a a child died mysteriously in their care, the Jurgens eventually adopted FIVE more children and Lois Jurgens abused the hell out of them, too. Two of the kids ran away; the authorities finally stepped in and the Jurgens eventually had all of the parental rights terminated. That was the end of that, right? Not quite.

Many years later Jerry Sherwood, attempting to reconnect with her son, tried to find out what happened to him. Finding out that he died covered in bruises she took it upon herself to find out what happened. There finally was an investigation and Lois Jurgens was finally arrested. It was found out that adoption officials knew her medical records stated that she was seriously mentally ill and "may go on at paranoid schizophrenia" but still she was allowed to adopt children. Her first adopted child Robert testified against her, telling the jury of the awful abuse she inflicted on Dennis. She was found guilty of manslaughter and did only eight years in prison. Her pathetic husband Harold remained loyal to her.

"A Death In White Bear Lake" by Barry Siegel tells the story of what happened to Dennis Jurgens. It's a very good book. Hard to read, but everyone should know about what happened to Dennis Jurgens.

by Anonymousreply 102August 18, 2020 11:28 PM

Wow.

Even *I* am shocked and horrified.

by Anonymousreply 103August 18, 2020 11:38 PM

Many of my gay friends have adopted kids. So far, they all seem fine. Don’t predict any will become serial killers

by Anonymousreply 104August 18, 2020 11:45 PM

It's not just adopted kids which have issues. Friends of ours have a 9 year old boy who we are convinced will become school shooter or serial killer someday. He's fucking weird as shit. Speaks a weird made up language to himself, has public meltdowns often, tells his parents he's going to MURDER them - not kill, MURDER.

He gives us the creeps we don't go to their house anymore.

by Anonymousreply 105August 19, 2020 12:01 AM

Available on Kindle.

by Anonymousreply 106August 19, 2020 12:36 AM

He's just an Aspie r105

by Anonymousreply 107August 19, 2020 12:39 AM

A lot of autistic kids are totally wacko. Sometimes their parent kills them. And they tend to get light sentences for doing so. I guess the jury and judge have a lot of sympathy for them.

by Anonymousreply 108August 19, 2020 12:39 AM

He's just an Aspie r105

by Anonymousreply 109August 19, 2020 12:40 AM

Gad, what a disturbing thread. An adopted friend of mine recently passed away after years and years of health issues. Supposedly the birth mother was a prostitute, also with severe health issues. This poor woman (my friend) suffered from every condition in the book. She finally died of bladder cancer at 54. I can only surmise that the majority of her medical issues were genetic. She also suffered knowing she was a 'throwaway child', as she put it.

by Anonymousreply 110August 19, 2020 1:11 AM

I actually resubscribed to DL answer[R80]'s question. But first, allow me to inject a small bit of humour into my reply. If I was approached by some BBC television reporter on the street and asked, "Ahem, ahem... would you care to share your deepest secret fear with all of our viewers on BBC Channel Four this evening, sir?" I'd squint the squintiest squint, and in my best sotto voce voice, say, "To be TLDRd on Data Lounge. Now get out of my face, you oik."

So, here goes... I knew I was adopted in Brooklyn, NY. So, naturally, I believed I was conceived there in June 1959. Fast forward to June of 2014. A friend of mine who is psychic told me I wasn't conceived in NY. At the time he told me this I had vivid sensations that the bio mother was under draconian pressure to terminate the pregnancy. She refused as it was an act of love (the bio father never knew of the pregnancy).

The bio mother traveled to Brooklyn, gave birth to me, and returned home. To know I was a wanted child, by a couple who couldn't conceive of one on their own (ectopic pregnancy is where the sperm fertilizes the egg in the fallopian tube. It's very painful to pass the blastocyst, and the pregnancy is aborted, before it even began).

I've always joked with my father (my other died in 2013), "You wanted a healthy white baby boy. And you got one!"

by Anonymousreply 111August 19, 2020 1:29 AM

Usually it’s the kids who didn’t bond with a maternal figure and/or were neglected/abused before the age of 4 who are the most difficult to rehabilitate. They typically come from foreign orphanages, saddled with conditions like severe personality disorders and RAD, which will unfortunately affect them for a lifetime.

I think the U.S. Christian pro-life movement is in large part a cynical ploy to increase the inventory of healthy, adoptable newborns so that American couples who want to adopt don’t have to resort to obtaining foreign, disabled or psychologically damaged kids. Also, these conservative groups want to prevent gay couples from adopting, which conveniently increases the supply of babies for straight couples.

by Anonymousreply 112August 19, 2020 1:50 AM

read my plays

by Anonymousreply 113August 19, 2020 2:11 AM

The US has far more domestic adoptions than other first world countries: something like 110,000 per year vs a figure only in the hundreds.

Out of idle curiosity I began reading the Reddit page on Adoption and adoptee blogs recently. I was genuinely shocked to find out how many (evidently not all) adoptees *hate* adoption. They see it as rich infertile couples stealing the babies of the poor. There is an incredible amount of resentment at their adoptive parents and many stories of being treated poorly, certainly relative to any biokids they had. A lot of people feel that being adopted permanently fucked them up. A lot of 'I wish I had been aborted' type comments. There does seem to be a growing anti-adoption movement online.

by Anonymousreply 114August 19, 2020 2:19 AM

That's because the US doesn't provide a lot of social supports to women in need, R114. Here in Canada, it would be unheard of for a young single woman to give her baby up for adoption due to poverty. We need to do better of course, but here, women have 18 months of paid maternity leave and there's more financial support for them compared to American women. Most adoptions here are from the foster care system and there's very, very few newborns/infants being given up voluntarily.

by Anonymousreply 115August 19, 2020 2:33 AM

SHE’S ADOPTED!!!!!!

by Anonymousreply 116August 19, 2020 3:11 AM

Anybody read "The Broken Cord" by Michael Dorris? It was a beautifully written book, but what a depressing story. Dorris, a college professor, wanted to be a father REALLY bad. It was "pure want", as he put it. Because he believed (it may or may not have been true) he had Native American ancestry he adopted a Native American toddler named Abel (he's called Adam in the book). The child had a myriad of health problems (seizures being the worst of them), had been abused and was diagnosed as "learning disabled." He didn't believe it. He thought that with love and good medical care and good schooling and being in a loving home would make his condition improve. But it never did. He was permanently retarded, as it turns out from FAS, Fetal Alcohol Syndrome. His birth mother drank heavily while pregnant. The book recounts Dorris's frustrated and unending attempts to help his adopted son learn, become independent, develop relationships with other people. But nothing helped. He remained retarded, and although he was "sweet" he was seemed incapable of caring for himself or even being interested in much of anything.

You'd think Dorris might have though he had his hands full with one mentally disabled child but he went on to adopt TWO more Native American children, a boy and a girl. They both suffered the effects of FAS but to a lesser degree than Abel. Dorris married the writer Louise Erdrich and they had three biological children. So now they SIX children, three of them with serious problems. What the hell were they thinking?

Able died at age 23 or 24. Never having learned to look both ways before crossing the street he was hit by a car. His adopted brother Sava, became a career criminal. His adopted sister Madeline, got involved in Satanism and was so delusional she thought the poverty-stricken reservation where she came from was the same as the happy community in "Dances With Wolves." As an FAS parent, Dorris said that you try to "seek solutions, ideas and regimens to penetrate the fog that blocks your son's or daughter's ability to comprehend rules, retain information, or even be curious." But he finally realized that he had to admit defeat: "Brain surgery hasn't worked. Anger hasn't worked. Patience hasn't worked. Love hasn't worked." NOTHING can be done to undo the damage done to children with FAS.

Dorris's adopted children Sava and Madeline later accused him of abuse and sexual molestation. SInce they were both mentally unstable they were not exactly credible. One of his biological daughters, one with an overactive imagination (she told one of her teachers she was "from Venus") made some accusations of abuse too. Nothing was ever proven, but Dorris was devastated; his marriage was ending and he was accused of being a child molester. I don't really think he was. He ended up committing suicide. From beginning to end, this tale is dark. And it all started with Michael Dorris's desire to be a father to an abandoned, mentally disabled child. What a tragedy.

by Anonymousreply 117August 19, 2020 3:14 AM

R114 you are correct in a sense...there IS a contingency of very vocal anti-adoption adoptees (imagine the amount of self-loathing that mentality entails). But to think that they are representative in any way of all adoptees is false. The many, many adoptees out there who are content with their lot in life and grateful for the opportunities adoption has provided them tend not to go onto online adoption groups and forums. You will get a VERY skewed sample in those groups. I was in a couple of adoption-related Facebook groups way back when, and got myself booted fairly quickly. Those people are absolutely determined to be miserable, and they blame all of their misery on the fact that they're adopted. Nothing infuriates them more than the idea of a happy, well-adjusted, adoptee.

by Anonymousreply 118August 19, 2020 3:14 AM

If you're going to adopt a kid, for god's sake TELL HIM when he's a little kid, don't spring it on the kid as an adult!

by Anonymousreply 119August 19, 2020 3:15 AM

Not so much a horror story, but here goes: my mother was adopted after two tragic pregnancies her adopted parents endured (one stillborn daughter and stillborn twin boys). My grandmother always said she didn't know who my mother's biological parents were. After my grandmother died, in her file of important papers, were my mom's adoption papers that confirmed she had known all long. It gets worse: my grandmother clipped the biological father's obituary notice out of the paper and had it folded-up in her wallet. My mom just found that last year...

by Anonymousreply 120August 19, 2020 3:20 AM

R120 did you leave out something? What did your mom know all along?

by Anonymousreply 121August 19, 2020 3:25 AM

R121, R120 means the grandmother knew the mother’s bio parents’ identity all along.

by Anonymousreply 122August 19, 2020 3:30 AM

Gay men are always whinging that society judges them, and yet in my experience, gay men are the most judgmental people I know.

by Anonymousreply 123August 19, 2020 3:31 AM

[quote]R110 An adopted friend of mine recently passed away after years and years of health issues. Supposedly the birth mother was a prostitute, also with severe health issues.

Face it - adoptees are all SONS OF BITCHES!

by Anonymousreply 124August 19, 2020 3:32 AM

ALL ADOPTED CHILDREN SHOULD BE PUT TO DEATH IMMEDIATELY

by Anonymousreply 125August 19, 2020 3:35 AM

R116 That fat thing?

by Anonymousreply 126August 19, 2020 3:36 AM

[quote]R21 The only adoption horror story I can think of is me, as an adoptee, coming on to a message board only to find a thread started by some asshole trying to tell me I'm damaged goods.

You’re not allowed to post here, refuse!

Just kidding. Some adoptees are okay.

by Anonymousreply 127August 19, 2020 3:37 AM

Let's attack poor defenseless children who've been through hell to make ourselves feel better.

by Anonymousreply 128August 19, 2020 3:37 AM
Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 129August 19, 2020 3:37 AM

[quote]R102 Adoption horror stories go both ways. One appalling case was that of Dennis Jurgens, who was tortured and eventually killed by his adoptive mother

That’s why I would never put a child up for adoption. You’d spend your whole life wondering, “Gee, I HOPE they’re okay.”

And in this sick world, they very well might not be.

by Anonymousreply 130August 19, 2020 3:48 AM

r121 Sorry, my grandmother had known all along who the birth parents were, even though she denied it, so my mother found out the biological parents identities at age 47, after the biological parents were both dead. I could kick my ass for not destroying that obituary notice in my grandmother's wallet.

by Anonymousreply 131August 19, 2020 4:05 AM

So what happened, R131? Was your mother badly affected by learning her parents’ identities?

by Anonymousreply 132August 19, 2020 4:15 AM

[quote]If you're going to adopt a kid, for god's sake TELL HIM when he's a little kid, don't spring it on the kid as an adult!

Amen to that. I'm not sure when my parents told me, but I definitely knew by the time I started nursery school. Having it explained as a simple fact when I was very young made it no big deal. I can see how it would be traumatic to discover as a teenager, adult, or even after the deaths of one's parents though.

by Anonymousreply 133August 19, 2020 5:36 AM

If I had to grade my parents, I'd give them a B-. They are good, kind, loving people who have their issues.

I always knew I was adopted (I'm biracial, they are white) but I remember asking about my real mommy when I was 5 or so and my mom burst into tears. she denies doing this now, but it remained a topic I tiptoed around for my childhood. She gave me some basic info, but I always questioned if she lied. A few years ago (I'm 30 now) the laws in my birth state changed and I was able to access my records. It was everything my mom had said, with slightly more detail.

Unfortunately for me, my bio mom's name might as well have been Jane Smith, it's THAT common. I've done the DNA match sites. Met a few likely "second cousins" who have never heard of her and whose own birth stories are as crazy as mine.

by Anonymousreply 134August 19, 2020 6:15 AM

My best friend from elementary school was adopted. His adoptive father had two daughters from a previous marriage but they were much older and already moved out so he may as well have been an only child. I remember he always said the most awful things about his biological mother like that he hated her, she was a bitch, and that he'd never forgive her for abandoning him. He always had a bad streak. Teachers hated him and he was always getting punished for something. We pretty much drifted apart in middle school and he found new friends. But it wasn't long after that his adoptive father died. From what I hear, he couldn't cope with the loss and completely fell to pieces. He got heavily into drugs for years and ended up spending some time in prison after we graduated.

by Anonymousreply 135August 19, 2020 12:51 PM

R133 I agree, my parents told me the truth from the beginning and it never became an issue.

I am grateful for my parents. My sister always had issues and felt rejected in a way, she eventually met both her biological parents and it ended in tears and she was more hurt than before she ever met them. I guess it’s sometimes hard to understand that there’s a reason why some people are unfit to raise kids and kudos to the ones who realise it when they’re expecting a little one and instead try to offer the child a better life than they can offer.

by Anonymousreply 136August 19, 2020 3:07 PM

R136, sometimes people who don’t meet their birth parents young, idolize them and imagine they are everything they want a parent to be. No one could live up to their standard, let alone people who gave up their kid because they knew they were unfit for whatever reason. Of course that type of parent isn’t Mary Poppins, “practically perfect in every way.” People that think parents that gave up their child are going to be great parents when they find them are delusional. And that delusion just makes them unhappy because the real, living adoptive parents could never live up to that ideal. They blame the adoptive parents for not giving them every single thing they want, imagining their bio parents are like Santa Claus. If they were that great, they never would have given them up in the first place.

A guy I knew was a very irresponsible person and heavy drinker and drug user, and his then wife left him for another man with a good job when their daughter was two. That was more for survival than anything. The other man married her, and gave her daughter everything. The daughter couldn’t remember her bio father at all. She went to college for four years and wanted her stepfather to pay for more schooling. He said I’ve done my part, look for your dad to pay if you want more.

She tracked down her dad, and found him. He was happy to see her, but still totally irresponsible and had no money. All his money went to drugs and booze and he had nothing to give her. She was a lot like him, liked a lot of the same things. She talked to him on the phone for a year or so, finally realized he had no money to give her and never spoke to him again. At least she woke up. Her mother warned her what she would find, but she refused to listen, convinced her dad had pulled himself together, had a great job, house and car and was ready to hand her his life savings. He rented a dump and had nothing.

I know another woman whose mother left the alcoholic, violent baby daddy when the baby was just a few months old. That woman hated and blamed her mother her entire life for leaving her father. She was aware that he only came to see her drunk afterwards, a couple of times. The sitter was told not to let him in if he was drunk. He was never sober so she never saw him. She angrily complained for decades after that “her dad loved her but he was kept from me.” Years after he died, I helped her track down his family. He had died, but she had a half sibling that had been in contact with him. He never spent a dime to support her, wouldn’t marry her mother (this was long ago when that was a big scandal), and she was known as a bastard at a time when that was really bad. He was drunk constantly, lived in a shithole and never saw her sober either. He turned up drunk at a birthday. When her mother said, you’re supposed to give her a gift or money, he turned out his pockets and threw a few coins at the girl. The mother threw him out. The girl’s mother was very angry and resentful at his behavior and struggled horribly to raise her child with no support. That daughter said her father was a scumbag, and resented the sister whose mother took her away. She thought she had it easier. She and her mother had gone through hell having him around. He was arrested for public drunkenness, kept getting fired for drunkenness. His death was a relief to her. So that’s the “wonderful dad that was kept from me” the first daughter missed.

Adopted kids need to realize, if they’re not in your life, there’s a good reason. They could be very bad people you’re better off without. At least they were incapable of caring for kids properly. A lot of people never change either.

by Anonymousreply 137August 19, 2020 3:53 PM

R134 here. I never idolized my birth mother because I knew the basics (girl was a MESS). I did get a little choked up when I read my birth profile and it said "visibly distraught at having to separate from her son". If she's still alive, I'd just love to find out how her life turned out that way and if she ever got better. And finding out what of my personality comes from her.

by Anonymousreply 138August 19, 2020 4:01 PM

Please put trigger warning on animal abuse stories, please!

by Anonymousreply 139August 19, 2020 4:04 PM

Confirms my anti-natalist beliefs. Having children is inherently bad. Abortion is a moral choice. Or, hey, maybe act like gay men did for 25 years and use a condom. Oh no - you don’t even have to do that - just take a pill. But hey, if you make a mistake, you can get an abortion. I have no sympathy for “accidental” children.

by Anonymousreply 140August 19, 2020 4:16 PM

R138, I would imagine that it would help both parties (the birth parent and the adopted child) for the birth mother to see that the kid turned out ok. The birth mother probably wonders about the kid everyday and might feel less guilt to see that the kid had an alright life. Even if the parties don't maintain a long-term relationship, a single meeting will bring some closure and answer some nagging questions for both parties.

by Anonymousreply 141August 19, 2020 4:17 PM

In my papers it says my biological mother came from a very wealthy family and her father didn’t accept the boyfriend and was outraged by the unplanned pregnancy. It looks like she didn’t want to be cut off so she went abroad for approx 3 months gave birth to me, put me up for adoption and returned home.

Never felt the need to meet her or find her. I’m not angry, I just don’t feel a connection.

by Anonymousreply 142August 19, 2020 4:19 PM

A cousin had a baby as a teen, in the late 60s / early 70s. She lived in the deep south with her grandparents, who forced her to give up the baby for adoption. A few years later, she had another child, which she kept. The mother later became hooked on drugs and hooked up with some awful men. Thank god that first baby escaped. I don't believe anyone has ever heard from her.

by Anonymousreply 143August 19, 2020 4:24 PM

R138, a lot of times mental illness is a reason why people can’t pull themselves together. My mother was mentally ill her entire life. She never pulled herself together. Things just got worse as she aged, and that’s common. To make matters worse, her first husband was a mess too and their descendants are not doing well. Their kids were more or less functional in their twenties, now they are in their fifties and just a mess. They shouldn’t have had kids. But since they were doing better when they were younger, they didn’t realize what they were passing on until it was too late.

If anything, if you could find out your mother’s medical history that might be good. But I’ve been through a lot of hell dealing with half relatives who are not okay. Sometimes you need to protect yourself from inviting very messed up people into your life. Especially if you are doing well and they aren’t. You can become a target for them. People desperately looking for family don’t realize they may just be looked at as a mark. Not family. If you’re better adjusted than they are, you’re looking for a wholesome family and they may be just looking for their next hit. Be aware the standards you were raised with very likely do not apply to strangers raised completely differently. They likely would not think as you do about anything. Or maybe even value you as a person.

It’s also very likely the people involved would not be honest with you about mental illness or problems in the family and would outright lie in order not to frighten you off. Many times mentally ill people are in denial and refuse to take their meds. Drug and alcohol abusers are often in denial too. So you may be inviting some real problems into your life that couldn’t be gotten rid of so easily. If someone is drowning, they may see you as a lifeline and not a person.

It sounds like your bio mom thought she was doing her best for you, and it’s likely she was. I’m not trying to scare you or be negative, I’ve just been through a lot with people who cared nothing for me, and it took me a long time to realize how totally detached they were. I meant nothing to them. People assume that because someone is related by blood, there’s a strong natural bond there. That’s not always true and you need to be prepared to face the true situation and not idealize it or imagine a bond the others don’t feel. You can’t wish a family into existence.

by Anonymousreply 144August 19, 2020 4:26 PM

My birth mother is tough, but surrendering me broke her inside. She was 19 and women were legally fired from jobs or refused employment for having a child out of wedlock.

I have scars, but I see deep damage in her that will never be repaired. American social pressures crushed a rebellous, smart, and sassy young woman. Two years after my birth, she was on her feet and making more money than my adoptive family ever made. Whenever she visits, my partner laughs at how similar she and I are and how different my adoptive parents are.

by Anonymousreply 145August 19, 2020 9:18 PM

I want to know what will become of all the border children separated from parents. They will need to DNA test everyone to see that they are returned to the correct people. These kids will no doubt be forever fucked up from this disturbing situation. If parents can't be located, are deceased or not on board with taking these kids back, then there will be a shit-ton of messed up people roaming the streets.

by Anonymousreply 146August 19, 2020 11:47 PM

My sister had a child out of wedlock in the 1980s and at the age of two years my parents got custody of him. He’s turned out to be a great young man with a good career and is extremely popular and highly spoken of among his friends.

His mother went on to have two more children with a heroin addict. She herself is bipolar and very highly strung. Both kids have had serious issues; the girl with cutting and low self-esteem and the son has been a rent boy,is a drug addict and an alcoholic and has been in and out of trouble with the law for the last 10 years. She exposed her two kids to multiple boyfriends and violent relationships and an instability which no kid could endure.

From what I can see providing a child with a loving and stable and structured environment is the key to turning out a well adjusted kid, but genetics have a significant effect too.

by Anonymousreply 147August 20, 2020 2:30 AM

R147, it’s been my personal experience that someone with one bad parent may struggle to live a normal life, but people with two bad parents are just fucked. It’s very hard to overcome bad genes on both sides. A lot of people have one bad parent and do okay in the end.

by Anonymousreply 148August 20, 2020 2:41 AM

Wow. There’s a lot of stories up thread about the biological mothers universally being mentally ill drug addict messes!

I thing usually the case is they’re young, unmarried, or financially unstable and cannot raise a child alone.

by Anonymousreply 149August 20, 2020 6:14 AM

^^ THINK - not “thing”

by Anonymousreply 150August 20, 2020 6:14 AM

Nowadays even young, unmarried, and/or financially unstable women are encouraged to keep their children, r149. The social service community seems to be totally focused on keeping kids with their birth mother unless there's a very serious issue such as substance abuse or violence (incl. violent men in the picture). So it takes quite a lot to get parental rights terminated and a kid put up for adoption these days.

But I was also under the impression that most (legal) adoptions these days are open, in the sense that the kid always has the right to know about the birth parents, certainly when they turn 18, to the extent that the parents can be found. I think completely "closed" adoptions aren't even possible in most states any more (?)

by Anonymousreply 151August 20, 2020 12:17 PM

I wouldn’t know, over here the name and date of birth of the mother are known. I don’t know if that makes it easy to find her....

by Anonymousreply 152August 20, 2020 1:33 PM

Closed adoptions still happen, but open adoptions are much more common these days. I don't know what the exact percentage is.

by Anonymousreply 153August 20, 2020 4:28 PM

[quote]R152 I wouldn’t know, over here the name and date of birth [bold]of the mother [/bold]are known. I don’t know if that makes it easy to find her....

Of both father and mother, here.

by Anonymousreply 154August 20, 2020 4:41 PM

I don’t see how open adoptions without the mother’s consent are a good idea. What if she was raped by a violent crazy person and the kid grows up to be a violent crazy person? Also, it could be a way for a violent abusive father to talk the kid into releasing the mother’s location. Really bad idea. If the people involved want to be found, they can voluntarily register.

by Anonymousreply 155August 20, 2020 4:45 PM

R155 why would you think it's without the mother's consent? It's typically her choice

by Anonymousreply 156August 20, 2020 4:52 PM

Many modern laws are set up to benefit children, not parents.

It varies from state to state, but if parents don’t want to be found, tough luck. You can’t rewrite history and undo the fact you had a child. The (sound) thinking is That knowing where you came from and how you ended up here are very basic facts of life that individuals have a right to know.

There are also hereditary medical issues that can be beneficial to know. Doctors regularly ask, “Is there a history of X in your family,” and adoptees cannot protect themselves, or their own children, if they don’t know these things.

by Anonymousreply 157August 20, 2020 4:57 PM

R157, your argument and reality don’t really match up. I have a copy of my original birth certificate only because my birth mother got one for me. Without her consent, I have zero right to the document. Similarly, in many states that have opened records, the mother can file to block any release.

by Anonymousreply 158August 20, 2020 5:02 PM

[quote]R158 I have a copy of my original birth certificate only because my birth mother got one for me. Without her consent, I have zero right to the document.

The argument is, Why should another person have access to knowledge about you that you yourself can’t access when you come of age? Why should your own identity be in another’s hands?

by Anonymousreply 159August 20, 2020 5:09 PM

R159, 100% agree with you. In many cases, it just not the law.

by Anonymousreply 160August 20, 2020 5:10 PM

Also, you would not believe how many times the records got “destroyed in a fire” according to some judgmental bureaucratic cog. There are also nice ones who accidentally leave the files out on the counter and take a coffee break. And there is a commando group that basically pays people off to get into the records for adoptees who are willing to pay.

by Anonymousreply 161August 20, 2020 5:14 PM

[quote]R159 100% agree with you. In many cases, it’s just not the law.

Yes - I was just trying to illustrate the thinking behind the laws which exist in some states.

by Anonymousreply 162August 20, 2020 5:18 PM

We adopted our now 10-year old daughter as a newborn. The mother had eight or nine children previously – the most recent two or three were also adopted out as newborns. The eldest four were removed from the birth mother's home, returned, removed again, then put into foster homes. The fifth and sixth ended up in the custody of their bio fathers. Number six's father was killed in a DUI crash, the daughter walked a mile in the dark to summon help, and was a local news mini-celebrity for a few weeks. She was our daughter's half-sister.

Our daughter was six when DCFS contacted us and asked if we wanted to foster/adopt this girl. They sent over her file, which was about five inches thick. She was eleven and had been suspended from school for sharing dick pics on her phone with classmates. There was a history of running away and animal abuse. We declined.

I feel terrible about this because my daughter occasionally asks about her birth mom. We tell her only that she was sick and could not raise a child and wanted to make sure she would have the best life possible, that she is the best thing that ever happened to us (true), and that when she is 18, we can find out whatever she wants to know about her birth mother. The thing is, I know who she is, where she lives, and that our daughter has at least eight older (half-)siblings. Our daughter tells me when she has had a dream about her "sister" and her "birth mom." It breaks my heart, because I have no way to comprehend the feelings of abandonment she feels.

The birth mother was a meth head and was infected with Hep C and syphilis when she gave birth. Our daughter thankfully did not contract congenital syphilis and did not suffer any chemical withdrawals. We met her when she was one day old. She underwent a lot of blood testing in her first 24 months of life; we saw how the antibodies she had for Hep C decrease over time until they disappeared. The bio mother gave the ER staff a fame, but since she was a frequent flyer, they knew exactly who she was. She delivered via C section, but left the hospital less than eight hours after delivery AMA and disappeared. Because she neglected to wait for the social worker to sign away parental rights, we had to foster our daughter for two years before the court declared her a ward of the state and approved the adoption.

Today, our daughter is a well-adjusted ten year old. Except for the occasional questions about her birth mother, she never brings it up. She is a voracious reader and does well in school. The abandonment feelings tend to rise when she had school work that requires students to talk or write about their families. The third grade family tree was hard on her, despite the fact that of the 28 kids in her class, 6 were adopted plus the teacher was herself adopted. Why this teacher chose such a project is beyond me, since during our conference, she mentioned the difficulty that our daughter and the other adopted kids had. Thankfully, she has never threatened to run away to try to find the birth mother.

by Anonymousreply 163August 20, 2020 5:21 PM

^^ "fame" = fake name

by Anonymousreply 164August 20, 2020 5:23 PM

R163 as an adoptee, I think your daughter will be hurt if/when she finds out you had the answers to her questions and didn't tell her. I always suspected my parents were withholding info from me (mom was very touchy about the subject) and I was glad that my suspicions were proven wrong. It sounds like a very messy situation, but I think you should be honest with her. I knew from an early age that my biomom was a druggie mess and the only way it affected me was "yeah, I better stay away from that shit." I didn't even smoke pot for the first time until I was 25.

by Anonymousreply 165August 20, 2020 5:25 PM

R163, please consider asking the teacher to avoid this assignment in the future. Adoptees can be completely blind and lack awareness. Some go way overboard, insisting how much they are similar to people with whom they share no genes.

Adoptees often make bitter jokes about these DNA and family tree exercises. It’s a pretty universal (and shitty) memory.

by Anonymousreply 166August 20, 2020 5:27 PM

As a fellow adopted person R165 I agree honesty is the most important thing but I feel the real parents(the ones who take care of their child, yes it’s their child) can be honest and explain the biological parents weren’t able to take care of a child. It’s really not that complicated and details aren’t necessary. You don’t need to know your mom was a crack whore. You might need to know she wasn’t able to take care of a child so she did what was best for the baby.

by Anonymousreply 167August 20, 2020 5:51 PM

R167 as a fellow spawn of a junkie, I think it's important for a kid to know as they approach the experimental teen years. I could've easily had access to drugs during those years and knowing it was extra-risky for me was what kept me away.

And I can only speak from my experience, but if I had known my parents had all the answers to my background and lied to me about it, that would've caused real damage to our relationship.

by Anonymousreply 168August 20, 2020 6:00 PM

My first real boyfriend was adopted at 2 weeks old by an upper middle class couple. His adopted mother apparently had been battling cancer wich is why she couldnt conceive. I dont know how or why the agencies would have let that happen,but it was the early 60s . He grew up the first 6 years watching his mother fight,then die from cancer. His adoptive father was an insurance executive and spent most of his time flying all over the world,so he was raised by their housekeeper since the mother was always in and out of the hospital. The mother died when he was 6,and the father remarried within a couple of years . At first his step mother was all lovey dovey and the like,then she spit out 2 kids in rapid succession and dropped all pretense of caring about him. Not only that,she fired the housekeeper who was basically the only mother he really knew. He was never abused per se,but he was treated with indifference. When he hit his teens he started rebelling ,ended up doing drugs,getting into trouble with the law etc. He was gorgeous,a mix of Italian and french , but so stunted emotionally he couldnt keep a mate for long before his demons came out . He was one of those who loved you mightily,until you loved him back then the emotional abuse began. Everyone who ever made the mistake of falling in love with him (myself included) left the relationship an emotional wreck. I remember I told him "You hate yourself so much that you hate anyone who doesnt hate you as much as you hate yourself" . I recently reconnected with him via FB and 35+ years later hes a wreck with a string of failed relationships and even 2 kids (who hate him) . He broke my heart badly,but Im forever grateful I didnt get stuck with him for years. He was nothing but misery to anyone who ever cared for him.

by Anonymousreply 169August 20, 2020 6:13 PM

[quote]R155 I don’t see how open adoptions without the mother’s consent are a good idea. What if she was raped by a violent crazy person and the kid grows up to be a violent crazy person? Also, it could be a way for a violent abusive father to talk the kid into releasing the mother’s location. Really bad idea.

I’m having trouble picturing these scenarios as stated.

by Anonymousreply 170August 20, 2020 6:57 PM

I did an ancestry dna test and later was contacted on their website by a guy who was a match as my first cousin. Apparently my aunt gave him up for adoption and he was hoping I could give him answers. I asked him if he wanted ke to reach out to my aunt and I did, but she denied it all. Very confusing situation. It is pretty clear to me she is his mother, but wants nothing to do with it for some reason.

by Anonymousreply 171August 20, 2020 7:17 PM

[quote]r167 I feel the real parents (the ones who take care of their child, yes it’s their child) can be honest and explain the biological parents weren’t able to take care of a child.

The term “real” (as in “real parents”) is emotional, and not specific enough. In an adoption, there are multiple parents who are all real, even if not all their identities are known. There are two biological parents, and one or more adoptive parents. Those people are all real.

And many people appreciate living in reality.

by Anonymousreply 172August 20, 2020 7:19 PM

[quote]R171 Apparently my aunt gave him up for adoption and he was hoping I could give him answers. I asked him if he wanted me to reach out to my aunt and I did, but she denied it all. Very confusing situation. It is pretty clear to me she is his mother, but wants nothing to do with it for some reason.

She may react differently if contacted by her child, directly. And some birth parents have spent decades denying they have a child out there (from embarrassment or guilt, or a desire for privacy), so that’s just the way their response is automatically set up now. It’s just ingrained.

But if their child actually contacts them, or looks them in the eye, and says “such and such information has lead me to you,” that could be a different situation. And, sometimes it’s a process - they might first deny it... but, as time goes on, get comfortable discussing the truth.

by Anonymousreply 173August 20, 2020 7:31 PM

^^ or of course, they might never want to discuss the truth.

by Anonymousreply 174August 20, 2020 7:33 PM

R173, my “cousin” informed me they had exchanged anonymous letters (it was a closed adoption but they could reach out to each other theough the adoption agency) and my aunt had told him in the letter she didnt want to meet him. It is a really sad situation. After thinking a lot about it I decided to leave the situation alone. If my mom (my aunt’s sister) was alive, I think that is what her advice to me would have been

by Anonymousreply 175August 20, 2020 7:34 PM

I’m curious what kind of person your aunt is, R175.

Is she habitually cold?

by Anonymousreply 176August 20, 2020 7:37 PM

R175 I'd give him any relevant medical info and let it go.

by Anonymousreply 177August 20, 2020 7:40 PM

I dont know her well enough. My mother and her had a lifelong feud and we kept our distance. Once my mom died I was in touch with my aunt here and there as I felt it was my last connection to my mom. My aunt is very close to her children and grandkids. I believe this guy is the son of my aunt and her former husband (who is also the father of her other kids), based on how my “cousin” described his dad. It is just an odd situation.

by Anonymousreply 178August 20, 2020 7:41 PM

It must feel terrible for R178's cousin, to be rejected by his birth mom twice. Maybe someday one of R178's cousins will buy an Ancestry.com test for fun and learn the truth. Some of these birth parents have to be nervous about the thought of their family members stumbling upon their secret.

by Anonymousreply 179August 20, 2020 7:53 PM

My mom found out who her (now deceased) birth mother was, and when I sent a picture to my mom’s newly found half sister, she said “I don’t see a resemblance.” But she also shared that her husband said, [italic]“WELL, I DO!!”[/italic]

So there can be emotional blockage, for whatever reason.

by Anonymousreply 180August 20, 2020 8:05 PM

I feel like my family’s situation is pretty rare considering the stories I’m reading here.

My Aunt and Uncle couldn’t have children, and decided in their late 30’s they wanted to adopt. They thought they would try foster care and then move on to domestic infant adoption. They mainly fostered babies and toddlers who were usually reunited with the birth parents fairly quickly, but they got an emergency placement of two teenage siblings a 14 year old boy and a 15 year old girl. They were removed from their birth parents because the birth parents were drug addicts and basically left the kids to raise themselves in rural meth country.

My Aunt and Uncle immediately got attached and 2 months in they knew they wanted to adopt them, so they did. It was kind of a scandalous to the elderly members of the family because my aunt and uncle are well to do and they didn’t understand why they didn’t adopt a newborn. A few years later, they did end up completing 2 domestic open infant adoptions. My cousins who were adopted as babies have an amazing relationship with their birth parents (mom and dad, all were teenagers) and their birth grandparents!

I love all my cousins and I feel very lucky to have them.

by Anonymousreply 181August 20, 2020 8:15 PM

R159, you don’t have the right to stalk or terrorize anybody else, why do you think you have the right to stalk or terrorize your birth mother? You don’t know what happened to her, or how traumatic it may be for her. The idea that “I have the right to do anything I want to my birth mother, consent be damned” is not a loophole that excludes normal prohibitions of all other laws.

Your argument that bio kids have the right to relentlessly stalk bio relatives without their consent is just an argument for abortion. If that’s the only way women don’t have to live in fear for the rest of their lives, guess what they’re going to do?

by Anonymousreply 182August 20, 2020 8:38 PM

My former coworker remarried in her 40s and adopted kids with her new husband. They could only score an open adoption. In fact, it was so open that the bio dad had visitation with their daughter from the very beginning. The kid is 16 now, and she tells them that she can't wait to move the hell out of there and never come back. I tell them, "all 16-year-olds say that to their parents."

by Anonymousreply 183August 20, 2020 8:41 PM

R170, then you must be in denial. Genetics are a powerful influence on people’s behavior. I’ve watched it in my own family. One branch of the family is on the fourth generation of mentally ill people (that we know of). A couple of those people are very erratic and easily angered. I would not want either of those people to turn up on my doorstep unannounced. They both lie constantly, have drug and alcohol issues (both parents were children of alcoholics and one parent’s entire family are alcoholics and drug abusers) and are impossible to deal with. Both are mentally ill, steal and have alienated a lot of people.

Would you want these people to turn up on your doorstep, having no idea about how they turned out? Keep in mind one is constantly trying to talk their way into people’s homes and then can’t be gotten rid of. Once the police had to pick them up bodily and carry them out because they refused to leave. They’ve driven away friends and family. Unfortunately both these people had kids. The one I still know about’s kids turned out very messed up. That’s the fourth generation.

I guess you think rapists are not scum bags or rape doesn’t exist. What sort of people do you think rape women or beat and threaten women? Lovely people? Do you think no woman ever wants to get away from an abusive parter? I can see why these women don’t want to be found, or raise children from these events. They’re afraid. And they have every reason to think a violent stalker might try to enlist their child to help them find the mother, so they can beat or kill her. Women live in fear for the rest of their lives after these types of events. Thinking every single adoption comes from a consenting partner is irrational. Women give up children for adoption because something is wrong. This isn’t the 1950s any more.

by Anonymousreply 184August 20, 2020 8:57 PM

This is the most bizarre frau thread ever. Why is it on Datalounge? I'm almost certain that one person alone is responsible for over 40 of these posts. But I don't have the desire to test my theory at the moment.

by Anonymousreply 185August 20, 2020 9:44 PM

[quote]R182 Your argument that bio kids have the right to relentlessly stalk bio relatives without their consent is just an argument for abortion.

You can save your breath and shut the fuck up now.

No one said that would be okay.

by Anonymousreply 186August 20, 2020 11:24 PM

R172 from the point of view of the adopted child, I won’t pretend biological parents are any type of family to me. They’re not part of my life, I’m fine with that but I also don’t want to pretend they are important in some way. To me personally they aren’t and to each his own.

by Anonymousreply 187August 21, 2020 12:19 AM

I have one friend who was adopted who has major issues with it, and is a very vocal advocate for adoptee rights. My godmother also adopted two children. The family moved to New Zealand, and her son went on to become a leading cabinet member in the NZ government Her daughter is also very successful in education in that country.

by Anonymousreply 188August 21, 2020 12:44 AM

I wasn’t adopted, but my counselor thinks that I should attend a support group for people who were adopted. I just found out last year, in my 40’s, that my dad isn’t my biological father. I found out because I did a DNA test, and didn’t match with anyone on my paternal side (the man who raised me took a test with the same company so he should’ve shown up). I also didn’t look like anyone else in my family. It turns out that I’m not even close to the racial makeup that I thought I was. My mom told me that she was dating the man that raised me and my biological dad at the same time. Biological dad was supposedly separated from his wife, but I don’t know if that was actually true. My man that raised me treated me like shit my entire life. He was so abusive, mentally and physically. My biological father died in the 90’s. I sent an email to my biological half sister explaining my situation and got no response. One of my bio half brothers is in prison for domestic violence, resisting arrest, and assaulting an officer. Another brother died of what appears to be a drug overdose. I have struggled with alcoholism and depression for years, and it scares the shit out of me. I obviously have crap genes, and it is terrifying. I also feel like my entire life is a lie. At the same time, my life probably turned out better than if I were raised by my single mother and a married man. He went on to have 4-5 other kids, and none of them seem even remotely ‘normal’. Abortion would’ve been the best option, to be honest. I think that my soul would’ve went elsewhere, if that makes sense.

by Anonymousreply 189August 21, 2020 1:11 AM

I answer my daughter's questions in what I believe is an age-appropriate way. I answer all her questions. I never say that I do not want to talk about her adoption or that her questions hurt my feelings (they do not). So I am not withholding information that she asks for. For example, she has never asked if I knew where her mother lives or her name, for that matter. She has asked whether I know if she has siblings, especially any sisters, to which I reply that yes, it is very likely that her birth mother had other children before her. She has asked if I knew their names, which, aside from the one whose father died, I do not.

The next questions will likely be more probing, according to most of what I have read about it. I am prepared for questions and I will continue to give her information in a way she can understand. When she was little, around five, she told me that she thought I was not telling her the truth. So she asked me tons of questions (and repeated many of them) until she did not have any more to ask. I answered every question she had and she seemed to be satisfied. I do not want to keep stuff from her, but at ten years old, she is not developmentally, cognitively ready to know the whole truth.

I will say this: it is not easy for her, necessarily, since my husband clams up when she asks him about these matters. In fact, one day he lashed out at me because she told him I had told her that she probably had blood siblings. We discussed these issues with the social workers and counselor a long time ago: be truthful and accurate, but in a way that she can understand based on her age.

by Anonymousreply 190August 21, 2020 1:12 AM

R190, this is not going to end well for you all.

by Anonymousreply 191August 21, 2020 1:19 AM

[quote]R185 This is the most bizarre frau thread ever. Why is it on Datalounge?

Because there are people here who are adopted, related to adopted people, have adopted children, or have put children up for adoption.

Does that answer your question?

by Anonymousreply 192August 21, 2020 1:28 AM

R189, I’m sorry you went through all that. Wishing you peace and happiness.

Some of these recent posts have made me think of “Blue Jasmine”. One of the themes is that the sisters are from different “stock”. Jasmine is supposed to be superior because she always had been more refined and classy, but she - SPOILER! - deteriorates mentally.

by Anonymousreply 193August 21, 2020 1:31 AM

[quote]As a fellow adopted person [R165] I agree honesty is the most important thing but I feel the real parents(the ones who take care of their child, yes it’s their child) can be honest and explain the biological parents weren’t able to take care of a child. It’s really not that complicated and details aren’t necessary. You don’t need to know your mom was a crack whore. You might need to know she wasn’t able to take care of a child so she did what was best for the baby.

Yeah, while I had no particular curiosity about my bio parents growing up, I always just assumed I was the child of a too-young unwed mother. My parents revealed what they knew about my bio Mom unasked in my early 20s, and the scenario I assumed proved true. I didn't feel as if them knowing info they hadn't volunteered before was any kind of betrayal. Of course, I'd never asked for it, and having had wonderful adoptive parents I never yearned for any sort of connection with the biological ones.

by Anonymousreply 194August 21, 2020 1:52 AM

I think adoptees search for their birth parents not because they plan to forge a deep relationship (thought that might be the best case scenario) or to find a new family. They’re just naturally curious, and would like to know more about where they came from...who these people were, for better or worse.

As one adoptee wrote, “Can you imagine never having heard your mother’s voice?”

by Anonymousreply 195August 21, 2020 2:14 AM

R195 a mother is someone who raises and loves you. Not a person who happened to give birth to you. So yes I am perfectly happy never hearing the voices of those who conceived me, it’s the least of my worries, but I would give anything to tell my mom one more time how much I love her. I miss her. No she didn’t give birth to me but passed away too soon

by Anonymousreply 196August 21, 2020 2:38 AM

OMG... we get it, r196. To you there is one and ONLY ONE mother. Most people don’t feel that detached from their history, though. It’s unnatural.

by Anonymousreply 197August 21, 2020 2:48 AM

R197 She IS his history, you putz . Why are you so invested in putting down his beliefs ? Go on then,find your bio mom. But dont be surprised when shes nothing like the fantasy youve concocted in your mind.

by Anonymousreply 198August 21, 2020 3:06 AM

Thanks R198 you understand what’s real.

by Anonymousreply 199August 21, 2020 3:12 AM

Regarding the Adoption subreddit, a good number of the adoptee posters on there were born in China in the late 80’s/90’s when the China Baby Adoption boom hit. Many were adopted by well meaning white Christians and Mormons but grew up in very whitewashed communities with no awareness of their culture. I think anyone would be resentful for that.

by Anonymousreply 200August 21, 2020 4:19 AM

R200 It's quite natural for one to think that, but I know three adoptees who wanted nothing to do with their "original" cultures. I know of several who adopted, all cases the children were Asian, a female Korean infant, a Chinese male young boy, and a Vietnamese female infant.

In each of these cases, the Jewish adoptive families were very much interested in these cultures, and wanted their children to to have a connection. The Korean girl came from a well known agency which only dealt with Korean children, held summer camps, and even offered organised trips to Korea for adoptees, and their families.

Only much later in life as a young woman, she began to have a vague fleeting interest in Korean culture, yet never wanted to visit Korea. Wasn't a fan of the cuisine either. Oddly enough, this agency has many former adoptees who become adoptive parents for Korean children. She and her husband did choose to adopt, but chose a Chinese boy. He's learning English, and they're happy, yet he isn't very affectionate, and may not bond as closely as she had with her family. (most likely due to his age, he was in an orphanage)

The Chinese child had rejected anything and everything Chinese. His parents had sought out a Mandarin speaking Psychologist for him when he was young, and his English was poor. As soon as his language improved, he no longer wanted to speak Mandarin, and demanded a different counselor. His parents were very much into Chinese art, and history, and exposed him to much, yet he has a very bad view of Chinese people, and wants everything to be Western. He claims to hate Chinese food as well. He's doing well otherwise, yet has no Chinese friends, and has extreme views on the current situation in China. He's callously Anti-Chinese.

The Vietnamese girl was also introduced to her culture by way of some Christian friends of her parents. Their friends' church had sponsored, and helped several Vietnamese families emigrate during the 1970s and 80s. She later told her adoptive parents she hated them for dragging her to meet these other Vietnamese, felt it was forced, and was embarrassing. Perhaps because they had their families, and she did not? Who can say now. She does have an appreciation for Vietnamese food, and ate much of it visiting those other families when she was young. That's her only real connection to her culture however.

Both the Korean girl and the Vietnamese girl learnt their mums were prostitutes. I've often wondered if that has anything to do with their resentment of their own cultures. I don't think there are easy answers as regards culture. The two women have married Jewish men. The Chinese fellow is still somewhat a young man, and single, yet he has never dated any Asian ladies.

by Anonymousreply 201August 21, 2020 6:00 AM

[quote]r198 She IS his history, you putz . Why are you so invested in putting down his beliefs?

Because he’s not stating “his belief”, he’s been spouting up and down this thread, swearing that all birth parents mean nothing. If that were true, no one would be interested in looking for theirs. Good, bad, or indifferent, people have a desire to know where they came from. Otherwise there would be no sites like ancestry.com

[quote] Go on then,find your bio mom. But dont be surprised when shes nothing like the fantasy youve concocted in your mind.

I did find my mother’s birth family for her. Like most adoptees she had always wanted to know who her birth family was and what the circumstances of her first year were, prior to being adopted. So while working in a law firm, I read a lot about adoption in general and solicited three different states for the records that remained, and at last pieced her birth mother’s history together. My mother flew to the state she was born in and met surviving relatives, who were lovely to her and were able to tell her what this woman had been like. It turns out they looked very similar, and their personalities were also alike.

It did give my mom a sense of closure. And she still adored her adopted parents, who gave her a wonderful life. But there were others, before them, who gave her life, too.

by Anonymousreply 202August 21, 2020 7:04 AM

^^ a nice gesture they made to my mom is they gave her an old family Christmas tree ornament that had her birth mother’s name engraved on it. Each of the (many) siblings - mostly gone now - had a personalized one.

Now it hangs on my mother’s tree each year, mixed in with all the usual stuff.

by Anonymousreply 203August 21, 2020 7:20 AM

R202 to me they nothing. True. I never spent time with them. I was adopted as a baby. I’m fine with other people having different sentiments. Personally I don’t see the point in digging into the bio family. I wouldn’t want to know the hereditary diseases and problems and I feel complete and emotionally fine without them. I know more adoptees and the people searching for their birth mother always have mental or emotional problems. They are looking for answers outside themselves instead of within. I don’t know any stories that ended well like your mother’s(I’m happy for her). Sometimes the birth mother doesn’t want anything to do with the child either. In my brother’s case.

Something like ancestry/DNA research is a different story. It has little to do with just biological parents.I haven’t tried it but I could imagine it’s interesting to see how much of a world citizen one may or may not be.

by Anonymousreply 204August 21, 2020 7:21 AM

Mean nothing

by Anonymousreply 205August 21, 2020 7:22 AM

As an adoptee, I searched for my birth parents for one reason and one reason only: I was curious.

There was a part of my life story that I didn't know, and I wanted to know it.

I wasn't looking for a second Mommy or Daddy. I didn't want to launch myself like a live grenade into another family. I was just curious.

I wasn't opposed to the idea of having some sort of relationship with the bios, I didn't care one way or the other...just like with any other strangers.

I've found that the majority of adoptees that make up the online adoptee groups are the malcontents. The perpetual victims. The ones who go through life bemoaning the fact that they were adopted, and blaming everything wrong in their life on the fact that they're adopted. It's a mentality I don't subscribe to. These people don't speak for all adoptees, most of whom are just fine, but you never hear from them because they're not spending their time in online adoptee groups, crying about their primal wound.

by Anonymousreply 206August 21, 2020 1:22 PM

R206 well said. Couldn’t agree more. It’s really about mental stability it’s not about or looking alike what many seem to think. It’s not a given thing for bio families either.

by Anonymousreply 207August 21, 2020 1:29 PM

Same R206 I want information, not another mommy. I have a place to go every Christmas, I'm good.

by Anonymousreply 208August 21, 2020 4:05 PM

[quote] r153 I don’t see how open adoptions without the mother’s consent are a good idea... it could be a way for a violent abusive father to talk the kid into releasing the mother’s location. Really bad idea.

It’s probably hard to be objective about what the adoption experience is like, because everyone bases their view on what they, or their friends/family members went through.

I’ve never heard of a rapist finding their child that was put up for adoption and then somehow forging a relationship with him (or her) in order to search for the birth mother, game the adoptee into making contact, and then using the info to terrorize the birth mother all over again... but hey, if that was r153’s experience, who am I to take that away?

(Or maybe they’re just stating it oddly.)

by Anonymousreply 209August 21, 2020 4:58 PM

[quote]R158 I have a copy of my original birth certificate only because my birth mother got one for me. Without her consent, I have zero right to the document. Similarly, in many states that have opened records, the mother can file to block any release.

There are usually ways around this if one really wants to know and is diligent. For instance, if the adoption was handled through the Catholic Charities organization, they will fight you to the ends of the earth before releasing anything. But the files will also (probably) be at City Hall where the adopted family lives, as well as the town the child was born in. Duplicates can also be in the state office. And the adoption agency will have a set.

Most of those offices will send you the records with identifying names, towns, etc. blacked out, but if you’re working from several sets of redacted documents, they will be blacked out by hand in different ways. Sympathetic employees might also do a kind of half hearted job at blacking stuff out, and one can make out quite a bit... or at least count the number of letters in a name, town, etc. going by what appears in the lines above and below the blacked out word.

If a government office refuses to release files, you can petition the court to get them unsealed, which can go either way. It just depends on which judge you end up in front of.

Really... in life, if one’s committed, you can get a lot done.

by Anonymousreply 210August 21, 2020 5:47 PM

My partner’s family (including his grandmother) just met his biological uncle that was put up for adoption when he was 3 YEARS OLD! His grandmother was engaged to his grandfather, before he went off to war. She got pregnant with another man’s baby while he was away. She had the baby (poor, from a small town, and no access to abortion). The baby daddy basically abandoned her. Grandfather came back from war, and got her pregnant again. He told her that he would only marry her if she got rid of the kid that wasn’t his. She adopted the boy out to someone in a neighboring town, and they didn’t speak of it until after the Grandfather died. Partner’s mom went with Grandma to meet the man she gave up as a child, and said it was the most awkward thing ever. They talked about the weather. I was horrified by this story, but partner’s mom said it was for the best because her dad would’ve made that child’s life a living hell.

by Anonymousreply 211August 21, 2020 6:51 PM

I am r37 ...

Anyway, I just came across this, which I find interesting:

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 212December 21, 2020 10:01 AM

This is the 2nd story on Datalounge in recent months featuring a cat that died in a greasefire. I'm calling troll.

by Anonymousreply 213December 21, 2020 12:21 PM

Adoption does not work. Abortion does.

by Anonymousreply 214December 21, 2020 1:04 PM

I've got plenty.

by Anonymousreply 215December 21, 2020 2:01 PM

There are some dangerous social workers and religious groups out there who want to go after adopted children (also foster children). I have heard bizarre and deeply vile comments. These are the same nutjobs that do conversion therapy and exorcisms. We need LAWS to protect these children now (even when they are adults.)

by Anonymousreply 216December 21, 2020 2:34 PM

A few old acquaintances of mine have struggled for years with their charming and sociopathic adopted son Joel. They sent him to numerous therapists but he doesn't get any better, just slyer. He's now 19 and has ingratiated himself into the life of his elderly neighbor. Last I heard, he was pretending to share the neighbors' interest in classical music and TCM films. It's deeply concerning.

by Anonymousreply 217December 21, 2020 3:16 PM

Marry me r217

by Anonymousreply 218December 21, 2020 3:17 PM

I was adopted from Ireland. Came to the US when I was almost 2 1/2 years old. My adoptive parents divorced when I was about 6 years old. Might adoptive dad was an alcoholic. My adoptive mom was a heavy drinker. It wasn't the best situation or the worst. I have physically and mentally/emotionally abused by my adoptive mom. It was so hard to reconcile because I knew she loved me very much. I'm not totally fucked up, just enough.

I was pretty much a good kid. I was a natural athlete and participated in sports. I was told I could be an Olympic swimmer or diver. I was also told I could be pro tennis player. Due to my moms drinking I had to drop out of those because she was too undependable to get me to my coaching. My mom never came to any of my sporting events. I did receive the best athlete award in 8th grade and she did come for that. In high school I didn't participate in sports and was a loner. I've just kind of existed through life.

I'm 64 years old now and have looked back on my life many times. One recurring thing is I have only been happy a few times in my life. Always happy when I adopted my dogs. Happy when I bought my first home. I don't love easily, but when I do it is a very deep love. I do have a good sense of humor and can find humor in a lot of things. I just wanted to be happy and that has eluded me.

by Anonymousreply 219December 21, 2020 5:08 PM

I completely understand how you feel r219

by Anonymousreply 220December 21, 2020 5:10 PM

Here is the story R213 referenced. Scalded cats in Portland. OP, you're getting stale.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 221December 21, 2020 5:26 PM

I think adopted and fostered children need new laws to protect them. They should get universal health care for life and legal protection. They also need protection with probate.

by Anonymousreply 222December 22, 2020 11:17 AM

I've told parts of this at other times in other threads so apologies to anyone who has read parts of this before.

Obviously every adoptee's story is slightly different. I can only speak for myself from personal anecdotal experience. There is a lot of adoption in my family. My Dad was born to an impoverished teenage mother and was adopted out of an orphanage (in Canada!) as an infant. My biological father denied paternity, long before DNA tests, and my Dad adopted me as a young child. And then my parents, after having one biological child together, decided it would be better to help abused and unwanted than to contribute to world overpopulation so they became foster parents and adopted/gained permanent guardianship over an additional seven children, from four biological mothers.

1) Fostering/adopting a child who had no home or safe home is a wonderful thing. It can be a blessing for all involved. My Dad won the lottery of life with the loving, middle-class parents who adopted him.

2) Being interested or not interested in finding your biological parents is no reflection on the love and bond you have with your adoptive parents.

3) All teenagers are a-holes at times.

4) Losing access to your birth mother can create issues around abandonment no matter how loving your adoptive parents are.

5) Genetics ARE very important and denying their impact is a great disservice to all involved. My parents, who were great parents on many levels, thought environment was everything when they were younger and my younger siblings unfortunately paid the price for that view. For instance, they refused to to admit any anything was different with my sister with severe ADHD - which denied her needed services as a child. And as hippies with no underlying propensity to addiction, they set a terrible example to my siblings who had alcoholic and junkie parents. I think they still believe it is all about will power and anyone should be able to use in moderation. I wish they had said to my siblings, "You can never drink. You can never try cocaine or heroin. It doesn't matter that we can. We have different genetic make-ups" That's what I tell my nieces and nephews; Aunt ElderLez can drink my glass of wine and be fine, but you will won't. Take care of yourself and don't put yourself through the hell your mother has gone through."

6) Environment matters too. My siblings are, for the most part, kind, hard-working, well nourished people because of my parents. I have a sense of humor thanks to my Dad (Mom and biological father are serious people.)

7) Not being exposed to people genetically like you can cause alienation, For instance my Dad, we've discovered, comes from a family full of dyslexics, but growing up he felt like a freak because he couldn't learn to read.

8) Not being exposed to people genetically like you can cause you to double down on genetic characteristics. I know this is counter-intuitive, but hear me out. As a teenager I rebelled against my parents and wanted to be my own person. Since I never met my biological paternal family the easiest way to rebel was to embrace what I thought was "me", but was really "them." When I met them in my thirties I was amazed at all the little quirks we shared that I'd never seen in anyone else. About a year later I realized that half of those quirks were really annoying and I'd better lose them.

by Anonymousreply 223December 22, 2020 6:23 PM

Two stories: Growing up there were two boys who were adopted (big dark secret in suburbia!) who were fun and easy-going. Lovely and loving parents. The older one hit a rough patch at puberty (had they told him?) and he started a lot of fights. My older brother works with he older one for the county and says he's a great guy, and even lost his stutter. The other joined the Air Force and has been around the world, but we've all lost contact with him. My brother's coworker hears from him now and then and he's doing well but there isn't much of a relationship now that the parents are gone.. Truly inspiring.

My niece is the most loving, caring, and empathetic person imaginable. Single by choice she began fostering the cutest little kid in the world. The birth mother can't stay sober long enough to show up in court to petition for "my baby" to come home -- as well as always missing those damned abortion appointments! -- and the birth father is in jail more than out of it. We all loved him so much. The kid was great until the mandated visits to and by the parents turned this kid into a ball of uncontrollable rage and violence. My niece used to think that if she could just keep him away from them for a solid year she and the kid would stand a chance. Nope, the state says a child's best place is with his parents. This sweet little boy who was capable of putting a smile on your face has, in four years, become a terror that no one wants to touch. My niece lost him to a "forever home" and within eight months they had to surrender him. We all miss him dreadfully and are in some sort of mournful fugue. Tragic. Simply tragic.

by Anonymousreply 224December 22, 2020 6:38 PM

Unfortunately, I'm beginning to find out that at least in my case adopting a pit bull is a nightmare. Hard to get any real training sessions in with Covid 19 precautions also.

by Anonymousreply 225December 22, 2020 6:45 PM

A friend of mine from college, a very respected lawyer, paid a fortune to adopt a child from Malaysia.

She suspected something was off right away, but ignored her instincts. Plus they had already bonded.

At age 5, she realized the “child” was actually a cat!

by Anonymousreply 226December 22, 2020 6:47 PM
Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 227December 22, 2020 6:47 PM

I have a rescue pit bull lab mix and he's delightful. There are boarding dog training places still in business around here. Can you send your dog off to a retraining camp, R225?

by Anonymousreply 228December 22, 2020 7:00 PM

Carroll O'Connor adopted and the adoptee suicided.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 229December 24, 2020 10:28 PM

They should outlaw using adopted kids as slaves is angelina's kids

by Anonymousreply 230December 30, 2020 11:23 PM

Human connection is very complicated. I can see some adoptions working wonderfully and others amounting to years of tears and broken hearted efforts.

Obviously, the most successful position to start from is a healthy mother giving birth to a healthy baby, one she is simply unable to care for. The older an infant is, the more challenging bonding will be.....and of course other factors like abuse and/or the addiction issues of a birth parent can further challenge any adoption.

I appreciate anyone who wants to take on parenting but I also know that, like animal adoptions and rescue, not every case can be a success. Love, food and shelter is not enough for every child, just like it cannot perform miracles for every abused animal.

It does seem to me that far too many women and couples (especially LGBT couples) have "baby rabies" and think they simply cannot exist unless they have a crotch dropping running around. There have been thousands of horror stories of families who tried adopting children with FES, etc. and had horrible experiences. There has to be a better way.

by Anonymousreply 231December 30, 2020 11:45 PM

I was adopted R231 and told my story upthread. I think some of the problem for women, years ago, had pressure to become mothers. My adoptive mother really didn't want kids, she wanted to be an actress and singer, but her family forbid such a profession. So she got married and when they couldn't have kids they adopted. Neither one of them was suited for parenthood, but it was what society expected. I think they both would have been happy if they didn't have kids or even married.

by Anonymousreply 232December 30, 2020 11:50 PM

[quote] I am, by any reasonable metric, a decent and successful person. But I am also entirely alone and unconnected, unable (or unwilling?) to form real connections with others. My brother (also adopted) is much the same. He has severe addiction and mental illness issues. Sorry to hear that, R36. Could that be a false correlation, though?

To take myself as an example; I'm not adopted, and was raised by both of my birth parents (in fact, smothered by my mother) as well as my aunts & uncles & cousins and my grandmother (we lived on a farm/compound Deliverance-style, don't ask), yet I have had chronic walking depression since I hit puberty and persistent feelings of disconnection exactly as you describe. One counsellor memorably described my relationship life as 'abnormal'. By a psychological yardstick, I'm considered to be mildly Aspergic and schizotypal, probably due to something slightly genetic amiss and not due to the way I was brought up.

by Anonymousreply 233December 30, 2020 11:56 PM

It's not quite what's being discussed here but I found out I have a half sibling out there and I am glad that I decided not to contact them. Hearing someone describe such a thing as flinging themselves into someone's life like a firecracker is a very sobering thought.

(They have my info on Ancestry.com - if they want to connect, they can)

by Anonymousreply 234December 30, 2020 11:59 PM

I knew a man who was adopted after being found abandoned in a handbag in Victoria Station. He was raised in an upper-class home and lived a good life until he decided to marry. His future mother-in-law was horrified that he did not know who his real parents were, so she adamantly objected to the marriage.

Luckily by chance, it was discovered that he was the son of wealthy man and had been abandoned accidentally by his nurse, who confessed the whole tale. Everyone was satisfied and the marriage went on as planned.

by Anonymousreply 235December 31, 2020 12:46 AM

^^^I think I saw that movie on Hallmark!

by Anonymousreply 236December 31, 2020 3:34 AM

Why is this EST not yet redlined? It was already established that the storyline and location are an adaptation of another EST thread from a few weeks ago.

by Anonymousreply 237December 31, 2020 3:54 AM

r228: that would happen if I had a say in it, but I'm dealing at times with the emotional process of a woman who seems to think very irrationallyabout pets

by Anonymousreply 238December 31, 2020 6:19 PM

I knew a really nice older couple, live in one of the wealthiest zip codes in the US and are good people. They adopted two boys, both are grown now and useless addicts. The wife confided in me she regretted adopting them when it was all said and done. I would never adopt given the risks

by Anonymousreply 239January 1, 2021 2:39 PM

Talking about your children and family members as useless is Dehumanization. It is a clear sign of serious, long term abuse. This is why there needs to be better laws that protect Adopted and Fostered Children. They need universal health care for life and legal services.

by Anonymousreply 240January 1, 2021 7:39 PM

R229 Carroll Oconnor loved his son deeply . He fought for years getting treatment for his son's drug addiction ,and even sued the dealer who sold him the drugs he od'ed on . You could see his pain written all over his face after his son died . His son got addicted to drugs after a car accident when he was a teen . Not a good example, hon.

by Anonymousreply 241January 2, 2021 2:07 AM

Addiction is involuntary. It involves brain chemistry. A person has no control over whether they are addicted to a substance or not.

I think you just want to hurt people. That you want to hurt children, and also destroy families. You are a sociopath.

by Anonymousreply 242January 2, 2021 4:28 AM

Early 1940s, my grandparents seemed to not be able to have children and decided to adopt, but wanted a baby. There was one available, but he had a three year old brother they were told needed to be adopted as well. They agreed, and at the last minute, they rescinded the baby’s adoption and only the three year old, my father, got adopted. They took him home and changed his name even though he was old enough to know and use his name. Then they promptly got pregnant and had a biological child of their own. My father was always treated like a second class child.

by Anonymousreply 243January 2, 2021 4:52 AM

So R243 what was the horror of the adoption? How was your father treated as a "second class child."

by Anonymousreply 244January 2, 2021 5:00 AM

The thread proves we need better laws to protect adopted and fostered children. Also, they need universal health care for life and legal services.

by Anonymousreply 245January 2, 2021 11:54 PM

R245, everybody needs healthcare for life, not just adopted people. If they aren’t willing to do it for other people, why should adopted people be a privileged class? As far as free lawyers for life, you’ve got to be kidding. That’s never happening.

by Anonymousreply 246January 3, 2021 1:05 AM

universal health care for ALL. that fine by me.

There needs to be laws though to protect Adopted and Foster Children. Obliviously, they are being targeted by nutjobs. Why should a Democratic Society enact or improve laws to protect people being targeted by nutjobs? To protect them from the nutjobs who are targeting them, (a duh).

by Anonymousreply 247January 3, 2021 2:41 AM

This thread went off the deep end.

by Anonymousreply 248January 3, 2021 2:48 AM

Well R248 adoption horror stories are not linear.

by Anonymousreply 249January 3, 2021 2:57 AM

R247, who are you targeting?

by Anonymousreply 250January 3, 2021 2:59 AM

The people I know who’ve been adopted or adopted had a pretty easy time in all but one case. The kids struggled with feeling like they didn’t belong or wanting to know their parents. It turned out okay for them there was no birth parent drama thankfully. They turned out to be normal people who gave up their baby because they weren’t ready for them.

The only exception was a friend I had in high school who was adopted but allowed contact with her biological mom. She was born with FAS. It would always effect her negatively when she visited her. Her mother was an alcoholic and would get drunk during visits and yell and throw things. I don’t know why she was allowed visits maybe my friend wasn’t telling any adults? She ended up dropping out around 15 and had spent her life on and off drugs. I lost track of her about ten years ago.

by Anonymousreply 251January 3, 2021 3:12 AM

R67, is a sanctimonious asshole who sits on a throne from his ivory tower feeling smug. He has no idea how the real world works

by Anonymousreply 252September 9, 2021 12:12 AM
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