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One or Two Spaces After A Period?

Recent studies show that the old "two spaces after a period" rule makes texts easier for readers to process mentally.

What`s the rule here on DL?

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by Anonymousreply 223April 12, 2021 10:59 PM

It’s still two you butthole licker. You have to be a millennial.

by Anonymousreply 1November 13, 2019 3:12 PM

In typing class in my high school we were taught to put 2 spaces after a period. But that was when typewriters were still used and they used monospaced characters (all characters had the same width).

With the Advent of "desktop publishing" in the late 1980s and 1990s, the spacing of characters became much more sophisticated, and each typeface came with a width table. The software (Aldus PageMaker, etc.) could set the type in the manner of professional typesetting and the new generation of laser printers could reproduce it accurately, especially when Adobe's PostScript language became commonly used.

This made sentence endings look right even without the double spaces, so the double spaces became irrelevant, and that custom was discarded along with everyone throwing their old typewriters away.

by Anonymousreply 2November 13, 2019 3:16 PM

Two just looks better. One makes everything look crowded.

Two just looks better. One makes everything look crowded.

Note the difference in the examples above

by Anonymousreply 3November 13, 2019 3:26 PM

Two. And while we're on the subject (and we are), there are still 2 commas used in a list of 3 items. This is called the Oxford Comma, children. Lawsuits have been won and lost over the lack of that last comma before the "and" / "or.

You may now resume with your regular programming.

by Anonymousreply 4November 13, 2019 3:27 PM

It’s two. The colon rule has changed to one space.

by Anonymousreply 5November 13, 2019 3:27 PM

Two is no longer standard, since most word processing applications add the space automatically. I learned this from a millennial recently. You’ll have to change, I hope you’re going to be ok!

by Anonymousreply 6November 13, 2019 3:28 PM

What does your colon have to do with twenty eight days between your periods ?

by Anonymousreply 7November 13, 2019 3:30 PM

One unless using a manual typewriter as others have said. Two looks like you're "aged"

by Anonymousreply 8November 13, 2019 3:31 PM

r3 they look the same, DL automatically removes extra spaces.

by Anonymousreply 9November 13, 2019 3:31 PM

Over 50 years old = two spaces after a period. Under 50 years old = one space after a period.

by Anonymousreply 10November 13, 2019 3:33 PM

This is an amazingly crafted thread, it will send some into a tailspin or nostalgia and mental illness. Waiting for the multi-paragraph replies!

by Anonymousreply 11November 13, 2019 3:35 PM

Unless you're typing on a typewriter, two spaces after a period are unnecessary. Fonts are programmed to automatically adjust kerning. In other words, if you add an extra space after a period, you're revealing yourself as the dinosaur you are.

by Anonymousreply 12November 13, 2019 3:35 PM

🙅[italic] Two Steps Forward.

One step back.

by Anonymousreply 13November 13, 2019 3:36 PM

It's always 2 spaces after a period, unless you're some sort of uneducated oaf.

by Anonymousreply 14November 13, 2019 3:37 PM

R7 fuck that was a good one. Still laughing

by Anonymousreply 15November 13, 2019 3:39 PM

🙊 The vast majority of the #DataLoungeGrammarPolice are currently glued to their screens watching the Impeachment Hearings.

by Anonymousreply 16November 13, 2019 3:40 PM

Two spaces after a period. Always. No Millennial exception.

by Anonymousreply 17November 13, 2019 3:40 PM

I never heard of two spaces after a period. What the?

by Anonymousreply 18November 13, 2019 3:43 PM

One, you old cunts. Two looks archaic and suggests dementia.

by Anonymousreply 19November 13, 2019 3:45 PM

Paging The Evening Punctuationist!

by Anonymousreply 20November 13, 2019 3:45 PM

I work for a Fortune 100 company. Our global branding guidelines includes a section on punctuation in written communications. For at least the past 20 years, it has been one space after a period.

by Anonymousreply 21November 13, 2019 3:46 PM

One space after a period, duh. P.S. I'm 61.

by Anonymousreply 22November 13, 2019 3:49 PM

Those of us who learned touch typing on a typewriter many eons ago are programmed to hit the space bar twice after a period. It's just automatic. It's hard to "un-learn" after so many years.

by Anonymousreply 23November 13, 2019 3:51 PM

This thread will end in angry tears and much cyber-flouncing out the door.

by Anonymousreply 24November 13, 2019 3:51 PM

I'm boycotting punctuation.

It's a waste of time and space.

by Anonymousreply 25November 13, 2019 3:51 PM

R4

So is the “Oxford Comma” something like

“Dick ate bacon, eggs, and toast for breakfast”.

And the non-Oxford Comma

“Jane ate spaghetti, salad and garlic bread for dinner”?

by Anonymousreply 26November 13, 2019 3:52 PM

The ad for Biktarvy that is popping up says one space after a period. See, not everyone is stuck in the 19th century.

by Anonymousreply 27November 13, 2019 3:55 PM

Give me a minute to check out the Sacred Tablets on which the Ten Commandments were written, and we'll take it from there.

by Anonymousreply 28November 13, 2019 3:57 PM

😴 Snooze Fest ?

..... Snoozefest ?

..... #SnoozeFest ?

by Anonymousreply 29November 13, 2019 3:59 PM

Some software automatically converts double spaces to single. That includes the software that DL runs on. I put 2 spaces after each period when typing this reply. The software changed them to single spaces. Double spaces are no longer needed since kerning and width tables became commonly used. Just do a single space after a period.

by Anonymousreply 30November 13, 2019 4:01 PM

Most online applications do not render double spaces. Unless you're writing your fanfic on a typewriter, double-spacing is no longer necessary.

by Anonymousreply 31November 13, 2019 4:04 PM

For what it's worth, I'm an older millennial and I was always taught two spaces after a period in my typing and computer classes, starting in elementary school through high school.

by Anonymousreply 32November 13, 2019 4:10 PM

It's worth nothing, R32.

by Anonymousreply 33November 13, 2019 4:13 PM

I figured as much, R33.

by Anonymousreply 34November 13, 2019 4:15 PM

r32, it means you were taught by out of touch geezers.

by Anonymousreply 35November 13, 2019 4:20 PM

Ok Boomer

by Anonymousreply 36November 13, 2019 4:31 PM

Speaking of which should "quid pro quo" always be italicized?

by Anonymousreply 37November 13, 2019 4:38 PM

[quote] It's always 2 spaces after a period, unless you're some sort of uneducated oaf.

Oh the moronic irony in your statement. Two spaces are always used if you are typing with a traditional typewriter, or using a monospaced "font" on a computer, as they give all the characters equal spacing, making the distinction between sentences more difficult, which is why a double space is the standard in that context. In modern typesetting (using typefaces), different characters take up varying amounts of space and so they are set closer together, making the single space the standard, as delineating sentences is much easier.

I'm a graphic designer by profession, and if I ever submitted my resume and cover letter with two spaces after every sentence, any design dept. or ad agency, etc., with even minimal standards would regard my submission as unprofessional and most likely toss it in the trash.

In all of my typography and design courses, the one space rule was always emphasized. Even the major word processing style guides recommend using one period. The one vs. two space argument has been going on since the birth of desktop publishing, and the people who insist on two spaces, are wrong. Period.

by Anonymousreply 38November 13, 2019 4:42 PM

r2 above has it. The two-space convention was based on the physical limitations of typewriters, traditional typesetting for printing, and kerning.

Continuing to use two-spaces now that the spacing between letters has changed is like insisting on using any outdated approach when technology works better.

by Anonymousreply 39November 13, 2019 4:42 PM

Typewriters. Why not mention rotary phones as well?

by Anonymousreply 40November 13, 2019 4:46 PM

I use two spaces, before or after my period.

by Anonymousreply 41November 13, 2019 4:51 PM

[quote]Typewriters. Why not mention rotary phones as well?

You really are pretty uninformed - and unable to read since it's spelled out in previous responses - if you don't understand why and how typewriters are germane to a discussion about typesetting and spacing.

There is usually a reason for everything. Changing things as simple as spacing standards or as complicated as foreign policy requires an understanding of that reason in order to avoid problems.

by Anonymousreply 42November 13, 2019 4:53 PM

R42, honey, I understand it, okay? It's just amusing to see references to typewriters at all. I was one of the first ones on this thread to say it's one space after a period. Calm down.

by Anonymousreply 43November 13, 2019 5:00 PM

I have to admit, the two-space rule was beaten into me in grade school. I will probably never be able to unlearn that.

by Anonymousreply 44November 13, 2019 5:02 PM

WHY DOES WORD PUT IN TWO SPACES? WHY DOES WORD SHOW IT AS AN ERROR WHEN THERE AREN'T TWO SPACES? MOST OF ALL OP WOULD IT HAVE KILLED YOU TO HAVE POSTED A PICTURE? WOULD IT? WOULD IT REALLY HAVE BEEN THAT BAD? WHAT THE FUCK WERE YOU THINKING??? YOU INCONSIDERATE ASSHOLE!! NEXT TIME AT LEAST POST A PIC OR A LINK. YOU MIGHT EVEN TRY DOING A SEARCH BECAUSE IM SURE THERE’s ALREADY BEEN A GODDAMN THREAD ON THIS!!!!

by Anonymousreply 45November 13, 2019 5:02 PM

AND I HATE EVERYONE ON THIS THREAD!!! EVERYONE!!

by Anonymousreply 46November 13, 2019 5:03 PM

I’m hoping that everyone is going to treat themselves to a session with a psychiatrist.

by Anonymousreply 47November 13, 2019 5:06 PM

r46 The feeling is mutual.

by Anonymousreply 48November 13, 2019 5:06 PM

r26 Yes, that is the Oxford comma. Without the second comma, you are talking about two things: (1) spaghetti, and (2) bread that is made with salad and garlic.

by Anonymousreply 49November 13, 2019 5:06 PM

Someone's off her meds again. R45 R46

by Anonymousreply 50November 13, 2019 5:06 PM

R36...Ok, Brat!

by Anonymousreply 51November 13, 2019 5:09 PM

😘 [italic] How can you not 💞 DataLounge ?

by Anonymousreply 52November 13, 2019 5:11 PM

Do whatever you want. When you put two spaces, your reader assumes you're over 55, which isn't a terrible thing but know that that's what happens.

by Anonymousreply 53November 13, 2019 5:12 PM

I want to hear more about the space in r5's colon.

by Anonymousreply 54November 13, 2019 5:13 PM

[quote]WHY DOES WORD PUT IN TWO SPACES? WHY DOES WORD SHOW IT AS AN ERROR WHEN THERE AREN'T TWO SPACES?

Because you've set it that way?

And you may be interested to know that the default for Word is a single space, not double space, after a period. It is actually somewhat tedious to set it to do double spaces and NOT show a grammar error.

But, thank you for your OUTRAGE.

by Anonymousreply 55November 13, 2019 5:14 PM

It is and always has been two spaces. Everywhere. I learned all this kind of stuff in the 2nd grade. I'm not boasting or trying to show off. I'm forever grateful I was educated during two decades when education, not metal detectors, took priority in public schools here in The Colonies.

by Anonymousreply 56November 13, 2019 5:26 PM

I understood the arguments on both sides, that two spaces aided readability on typed pages while one space was easier to read in electronic messages. I was taught two spaces and kept it until a boss mandated single spaces (seriously, a boss instructed her staff to do this). I've gone back to two since being freed from her treacherous grip. Oh, and R4, bless you. Vive la virgule Oxford!

by Anonymousreply 57November 13, 2019 5:32 PM

r56, and all the others insisting that the only correct way is two spaces, your way of thinking is why it is so hard for people under 40 to get hired. The rules have changed because the equipment has changed and you refuse to change your thinking. Digging your heels in on an issue like this shows that you are unwilling to adapt. What other outmoded styles are you clinging to?

I also learned two spaces after a period. I also learned that you address a business letter "To Whom It May Concern" or "Dear Sir or Madame" but long, long ago learned that neither of these salutations are acceptable anymore.

by Anonymousreply 58November 13, 2019 5:33 PM

Cheryl does not have periods.

by Anonymousreply 59November 13, 2019 5:34 PM

Look, R53 Cunt, I'm over 55 and I've always made it one space after a period.

by Anonymousreply 60November 13, 2019 5:36 PM

Two spaces. And if you don't do it, my typing teacher, Miss Taylor will rap you across the knuckles with her yardstick.

by Anonymousreply 61November 13, 2019 5:37 PM

r58 I'm a boomer. Why is "To Whom It May Concern" not acceptable? Also, we still use "Dear Sir or Madam" in my law firm (big law). I've seen "Dear Reader," but it seems to have gone away in recent years.

by Anonymousreply 62November 13, 2019 5:38 PM

I use two spaces.

by Anonymousreply 63November 13, 2019 5:49 PM

^^^And has a rotary phone.^^^

by Anonymousreply 64November 13, 2019 5:52 PM

I’m not following this thread anymore. You people are going to send me back Payne Whitney.

by Anonymousreply 65November 13, 2019 5:57 PM

F I D D L E S T I C K S !

by Anonymousreply 66November 13, 2019 6:16 PM

It's now one space after a period. However, IMO, it's still easier to read something that has two spaces after a period, especially in long paragraphs. Also, there are periods within sentences (abbreviations, acronyms, etc.), so it's nice when a period (that ends a sentence) can have more space following it.

by Anonymousreply 67November 13, 2019 6:23 PM

R62, not R58, but must admit, before my retirement, my former (much younger) boss had asked me to use certain "templates", rather than my own free-form old standards. I began to take notice of receiving general correspondence with "To Whom It Concerns", however nothing at all similar could be found amongst the recommended templates.

I'm British, my boss was Indian, and we were both doing business from the US with strictly European companies. I simply made other attributions for the changes, but am curious what most people attribute this to. I'm ready to acknowledge I'm obsolete, (sixties vintage here), but do like to keep up. Please advise R58.

by Anonymousreply 68November 13, 2019 6:28 PM

I still use "To Whom It May Concern" if I'm sending important correspondence and don't know the name of the person in charge / responsible. My Microsoft Word software (2019 version) still does an auto-complete of "To Whom It May Concern." I've never heard of any changes.

by Anonymousreply 69November 13, 2019 6:33 PM

"To whom it may concern" is not interchangeable with "Dear Sir/Madam" and should be used sparingly as it is most often used incorrectly.

"To Whom" implies that whatever is being noted in the correspondence is of concern to the recipient, rather than the sender as is more often the case.

by Anonymousreply 70November 13, 2019 6:36 PM

[R58] my bad. When we type instead of speak sometimes just part of the whole idea or concept gets across. And you wrote something that goes exactly with what happened when I was typing my reply. I began corresponding online with a friend in Amsterdam in 2001. He would finish a sentence and leave a space between the final word and the period or what he used. "Was I frantic ?" I'd constantly ask him why he did this and have since found out it is done, or can be done that way. I use the system I was taught.

What I do have difficult with is functionally illiterate adults whose spelling and grammar is embarrassing. I hope this clears up my obviously flawed original reply.

by Anonymousreply 71November 13, 2019 6:38 PM

Re: use of To Whom It May Concern: Back in the days before word processors, email and the internet, the only feasible option for addressing a letter to a company was by using the phrase "To Whom It May Concern." The phrase is an old and formal way of saying "for anyone reading this letter." It's generic, not personalized and doesn't appeal to most people. There are some instances where it will suffice, but generally there are better options.

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by Anonymousreply 72November 13, 2019 6:48 PM

One, if you are using a word processor. (Decided LONG ago....)

by Anonymousreply 73November 13, 2019 6:52 PM

All right you filthy viper cunts. I have to eat my words. But at least I did a GODDAMN SEARCH!! Which is more than I can say for the rest of you. MLA requires ONE space after punctuation.

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by Anonymousreply 74November 13, 2019 6:53 PM

I may not be an expert on punctuation, but I certainly am an expert on [italic] PRIORITIES !

by Anonymousreply 75November 13, 2019 7:10 PM

One meal or two between sunrise and sunset ?

One meal or two between Monday and Friday ?

by Anonymousreply 76November 13, 2019 7:14 PM

Read.

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by Anonymousreply 77November 13, 2019 7:24 PM

R60, your reading comprehension skills suck. Go back and reread what I wrote. People will assume--maybe incorrectly.

by Anonymousreply 78November 13, 2019 7:39 PM

One or two depends on the brand/communications guidelines you use for work.

For personal correspondence, use one … please. Using punctuation already dates you. Pretty soon, we will all be writing in lower case words, abbreviations and emojis.

MS -Word doesn't change one space to two automatically. Check your setting to see what spacing is set to and change it one space after a period.

by Anonymousreply 79November 13, 2019 8:09 PM

I type with a pencil.

by Anonymousreply 80November 13, 2019 8:12 PM

I type with a quill.

by Anonymousreply 81November 13, 2019 8:15 PM

All you need is two spaces a day and a sensible dinner.

by Anonymousreply 82November 13, 2019 8:16 PM

Fuck you Marie. The Normal.dot template of Word and the Normal Style are set to two periods you cunt. You have to manually modify it to one period you menstruating monster. I hate you, you old hag!!

by Anonymousreply 83November 13, 2019 8:28 PM

[quote] Paging The Evening Punctuationist!

Thank you, dear. I got your page. I am skiing in Flumserberg with my assistant, Randolf; but this is important, so I will take a moment.

I have held off on commenting because anything that gets people interested in punctuation is obviously a good thing.

There is much controversy in the punctuation world as you might have also read up-thread. The reality of it is thus:

Oldsters use “two spaces” which is still acceptable in any typeset; however, I bow to modern ways and “one space” is the wave of the future and the preferred use on these computer things and similar devices.

by Anonymousreply 84November 13, 2019 8:44 PM

Honestly, it's been a very very long time, but in my day, after my period, I needed a lot of space.

by Anonymousreply 85November 13, 2019 8:58 PM

I work in publishing. Have for my whole life.

No question: One space after a period. Two spaces and you're clearly someone over 50 who took a typing course back in 1974.

by Anonymousreply 86November 13, 2019 9:11 PM

It’s been a long post and I feel at this time it would just better if I left the Datalounge. This decision has been difficult to come to but I don’t need this stress anymore. So I’m formally leaving the Datalounge because of this horrible thread and all the awful people on it. I hope you all get shingles.

by Anonymousreply 87November 13, 2019 9:13 PM

TWO spaces, motherfuckers. Allow your copy to breathe and have life. One space junks up the message.

by Anonymousreply 88November 13, 2019 9:23 PM

Two spaces, even in a text.

by Anonymousreply 89November 13, 2019 9:24 PM

You two-spacers are too spacey, stop abusing the young'uns. Two spaces is just wrong today.

by Anonymousreply 90November 13, 2019 9:26 PM

R37

Generally not. Italics are mostly reserved for foreign words/expressions that haven't entered common usage in English. I'd say quid pro quo is pretty commonly understood among English speakers.

I say this as someone who worked as a proofreader for over a decade.

by Anonymousreply 91November 13, 2019 9:32 PM

[quote]TWO spaces, motherfuckers. Allow your copy to breathe and have life. One space junks up the message.

Coming from someone who only used ONE space after his period.

by Anonymousreply 92November 13, 2019 9:33 PM

Clearly, generic letters should be addressed to "Yo, asshole".

by Anonymousreply 93November 13, 2019 9:35 PM

R29

Not exactly. You'd need an additional "and" to make that the case. If it's "Jane ate spaghetti, salad and garlic bread" what's that random comma doing there after "spaghetti"? If you want to say she's eating "salad and garlic bread", you'd need something like this: “Jane ate spaghetti and salad and garlic bread for dinner”

It would be even more clear it's "salad-and-garlic bread" if it's hyphenated like I did here.

Most examples of the utility of the Oxford comma are actually faulty parallelism. In those cases the Oxford comma clarifies confusion to the reader (but not to anyone who hears the sentence spoken out loud), but doesn't make the sentence correct.

If you say "I like cooking, my family, and my dog" out loud, it sounds like you're a monster regardless of any use of the Oxford comma. Using correct parallelism clarifies things: "I like cooking and spending time with my family and my dog."

I'm an Oxford comma stan because it clarifies when a statement is not an appositive: "I'd like to thank my parents, Gandhi and God" is hilarious, but probably inaccurate. The Oxford comma fixes it: "I'd like to thank my parents, Gandhi, and God." Although, if you say it out loud, it still would make you sound delusional, so it would be better to rework it to avoid confusion: "I'd like to thank God, Gandhi, and my parents." That's the change I would make if I were proofing a speech someone was planning on making.

by Anonymousreply 94November 13, 2019 9:46 PM

Two spaces if you're nasty!

by Anonymousreply 95November 13, 2019 9:50 PM

[quote]Coming from someone who only used ONE space after his period.

R92. I always use two spaces after a period; however, DL auto adjusts when posting the response and always makes it one space. But DL is wrong!

by Anonymousreply 96November 13, 2019 9:51 PM

DL is not wrong, in this case, it's you.

by Anonymousreply 97November 13, 2019 9:53 PM

Girls! Girls! Stop it! You’re all annoying!

Either one is acceptable these days.

by Anonymousreply 98November 13, 2019 10:10 PM

I learned to type on a typewriter like this, so it's always been two spaces for me.

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by Anonymousreply 99November 13, 2019 10:12 PM

[quote]Fuck you Marie. The Normal.dot template of Word and the Normal Style are set to two periods you cunt. You have to manually modify it to one period you menstruating monster. I hate you, you old hag!!

You may or may not be working on the Normal.dot template. What I said is still applicable.

[italic]you menstruating monster. I hate you, you old hag!! [/italic]

r83 Please get help. Punctuation usually does not illicit such a strong reaction. Were you abused by someone obsessed with grammar, someone who perhaps used antiquated punctuation, someone who wrote in copperplate?

by Anonymousreply 100November 13, 2019 10:23 PM

R99 I bet you're not using that typewriter now, so you need to fix the habit.

by Anonymousreply 101November 13, 2019 10:28 PM

Fuck, I'm really fucking old now. Semi-retired education consultant/administrator. I had no fucking idea that one space was the preferred style... MLA style sheets etc. Just got on DL about a year ago and now I understand how I am easing into senescence. Thank you fucking much for documenting my slide into the fucking grave.

What next? They're and their are the same because they sound a like, right? It's and its... oh fucking forget it.

by Anonymousreply 102November 13, 2019 10:29 PM

R101, You're not the boss of me!

by Anonymousreply 103November 13, 2019 10:30 PM

^^ R102 alike. I also read recently that millennials are driven to anxiety attacks because perceiving boomers' use of ellipses (in texts and emails) seems so discounting and passive-aggressive. They read it as "whatev'" …

So ….

by Anonymousreply 104November 13, 2019 10:32 PM

r104 - yeah millennials hate ellipses, in particular the response

ok.....

Please you 👍🏻 when indicating you are okay with something. The OK emoji (👌) can be a white supremacist symbol. The victory sign (✌️) also means peace is an all-purpose acknowledgement.

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by Anonymousreply 105November 13, 2019 10:45 PM

[quote][R92]. I always use two spaces after a period; however, DL auto adjusts when posting the response and always makes it one space. But DL is wrong!

Hmmm. I wonder if that's really true. We should probably test that. If it really does do auto-correct, then I would, of course, apologize.

by Anonymousreply 106November 13, 2019 10:47 PM

^^^ He's not lying. DL does remove the extraneous space as I had inserted them consistently.

Apologies for mocking the post.

You are, of course, still wrong about inserting the extra space.

by Anonymousreply 107November 13, 2019 10:48 PM

Two spaces. Always. It's quite the struggle when working with a character-limited field, though - especially Twitter. People argue that it is outdated and used only because of typewriters v. word processors, but I was tought (and believe!) the purpose is to distinguish between the spacing of just words (1) and full thoughts (sentences, 2).

Also, yes to the Oxford comma. Also, Chicago style in-text citations - at the footer of a paper - is the best format. APA SUCKS AND LOOKS HIDEOUS. Finally, effect CAN be a fucking VERB and I use it that way often.

One thing I no longer do is use tab when beginning paragraphs. Two spaces is ingrained within me, but that tab rule no longer is. I think since word processing/electronic correspondence doesn't require saving paper you can space out the paragraphs enough where the indentation is no longer necessary.

by Anonymousreply 108November 14, 2019 3:14 AM

One, you tired old twats. One. You never see two anywhere.

by Anonymousreply 109November 14, 2019 3:18 AM

This is all fine. But you can't tell me the space after that period there in my first sentence is larger than the space before "fine" or the one after "But."

[quote]What`s the rule here on DL?

Now, how (why?) did OP do that with the apostrophe?

by Anonymousreply 110November 14, 2019 5:24 AM

R9 I think DL does it because that's what html automatically does.

And I think you can add the two spaces at DL by typing in the html code for such spacing, which actually uses the old typesetting spacing "en" and/or "em."

Using R3's sentences:

Two just looks better. One makes everything look crowded.

Two just looks better.   One makes everything look crowded.

Note the difference in the examples above?

by Anonymousreply 111November 14, 2019 5:38 AM

Look at any reputable newspaper, book or website: one space.

I can't believe we're arguing about this, but it's fun, and classic DataLounge.

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by Anonymousreply 112November 14, 2019 5:40 AM

Yes, R111, I see the difference. Once space looks better. Two spaces is too much. In a paragraph, you would get "rivers" of space as wide as the Mississippi running through your text.

Does anyone really have trouble figuring out that a new sentence has started when there's only one space? Isn't the period followed by one space and a capital letter enough?

I learned the two-space method on a typewriter a long, long time ago. When PC's with word processing programs (WordStar first, then WordPerfect, which seemed like the most spectacular thing ever, at the time) arrived in early '80s, I switched to one space because ... well, I don't remember why now. But one-space is now standard everywhere, to the point that two-space, in modern typefaces, looks like too much.

by Anonymousreply 113November 14, 2019 6:20 AM

Always two spaces. It is much easier to read, which it was the convention to being with. Typing was a required at my all girls Catholic HS and I am ever so grateful it was. I heard bad stories of people w/o training having a bad adjustment to anything requiring a keyboard. I'm 55 so it's likely a generational thing, like kids aren't taught cursive or penmanship in grade school anymore. I guess they just pick up typing over the years or become really efficient at using their thumbs on phones?

by Anonymousreply 114November 14, 2019 6:29 AM

Thank you, R114 and all the other folks who associate two-spacing with being old. I'm a one-spacer. I feel old most of the time (I'm 62, so I actually am old), but for a few brief moments, this thread has made me feel young.

I wonder if one-spacing is linked to the age at which one switched from typewriter to computer. I was an early adopter; no typewriters for me (except envelopes) since I was 26 or so. Could that make a difference?

by Anonymousreply 115November 14, 2019 6:36 AM

^ which IS WHY it was the convention to being with

by Anonymousreply 116November 14, 2019 6:37 AM

Not reading all 114 responses but clearly DLEGs are going to say two spaces because #ItsAlways1982OnDL but R86 nails it

by Anonymousreply 117November 14, 2019 6:37 AM

[quote]I wonder if one-spacing is linked to the age at which one switched from typewriter to computer.

I switched from an IBM Selectric (work) and a Corona (I think) manual for school in '88, so I was 24. I was a later adopter than you. I don't think that's a factor, though. It's just the training. If you do something for an entire semester and then realize, decades later, that it might not be the current convention is very weird. Regardless, I think it's visually easier to follow the flow of text with a distinction between the use of commas and periods.

What R86 said really intrigues me. He must really be a young 'un if he's been in publishing "his whole life." My understanding is that the convention switched over in the advent of word processing (back in '82 and '83 the law firm I worked for transitioned to computers, but only the legal secretaries had them. I was a Girl Friday, so Selectric for me.)

So why did it go from two spaces to one?

by Anonymousreply 118November 14, 2019 6:58 AM

[quote] So why did it go from two spaces to one?

I've been trying to remember that, R118. I sort of have a vague recollection that in some early WP programs, using two spaces after a period did something bad. Either it messed up the spacing of the paragraph or it did something to commands. In those days, there was no WYSIWYG (ha! initials from the past!). Your screen showed the codes, which you turned on and turned off by typing a command - usually shift, control or alt + a function key. Thus, you couldn't see exactly what your document would look like until you printed it.

I [italic]think[/italic] putting in two spaces after a period could result in funky formatting, like a space at the start of a paragraph, or something like that.

We should all be used to that problem - the DL software is also not WYSIWYG, as the many screwed-up lists you see on the site demonstrate.

by Anonymousreply 119November 14, 2019 7:37 AM

I was never taught two spaces after a period. It looks ridiculous to me.

by Anonymousreply 120November 14, 2019 7:43 AM

^^Forgot to add: I distinctly remember having to train myself to stop using two spaces after a period. This would have been around 1983-84, on a PC, using WordPerfect. I just don't remember why.

by Anonymousreply 121November 14, 2019 7:44 AM

I learned to type on a manual typewriter back in the 60s. And it was touch-typing, where you ordinarily don't look at the keyboard. So it's something that's been pretty much hard-wired in me for a long time. I never said that I preferred one way or another. But there are sometimes good reasons for those of us who never even used an electric typewriter, much less a word processor, until our habits had already been set.

by Anonymousreply 122November 14, 2019 8:37 AM

This one is probably apocryphal since back then (and even now) some of us were total noobs in word processing, coding, etc. One "explanation" I've heard is that adding the extra space between sentences ate up too much memory, so documents were kept shorter by removing the period. I know, it sounds sketchy, but I recall hearing it. I didn't know whether to believe it or not because I had no basis to understand it.

by Anonymousreply 123November 14, 2019 8:52 AM

This article explains why two spaces started, and why it's no longer required.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 124November 14, 2019 9:10 AM

It’s two you little brats. Now get off my lawn.

by Anonymousreply 125November 14, 2019 9:16 AM

I skip the punctuation altogether. It's hard enough drawing those crude pictures on the walls of my cave.

by Anonymousreply 126November 14, 2019 12:54 PM

Spelling doesn't matter either, as long as the reader knows what you mean, it's all good bro!

by Anonymousreply 127November 14, 2019 1:24 PM

A bit off topic, but I had the choice between jerking off to gay porn or reading this thread. I choose this thread and I don't regret my decision. Congrats, guys.

And when it comes to the Oxford comma this never gets old.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 128November 14, 2019 2:31 PM

My apologies. I CHOSE this thread ...

by Anonymousreply 129November 14, 2019 2:32 PM

What is going on in OP's pic? No capital letters after the period? WTF?

by Anonymousreply 130November 14, 2019 2:41 PM

If you use any up to date MS Word or Grammarly application, it'll show a tinted underscore -where you leave two spaces- for what it is: a mistake.

by Anonymousreply 131November 14, 2019 7:45 PM

R130 I'm more concerned with OP trying to use the grave accent [`] where there should be an apostrophe [']. WTF?

by Anonymousreply 132November 14, 2019 7:51 PM

R131 Doesn't Word still allow one to just go in and simply change the default one space to "two spaces after a sentence" under the settings for punctuation conventions?

by Anonymousreply 133November 14, 2019 8:01 PM

Yes, you regress MS Word settings to be wrong.

by Anonymousreply 134November 14, 2019 8:12 PM

I'm not worthy.

by Anonymousreply 135November 14, 2019 8:17 PM

R86 It's apparent your "whole life" is under thirty years.

by Anonymousreply 136November 14, 2019 8:22 PM

LETSBEGLADWEDONOTLIVEINCLASSICALTIMESWHERETHEYDIDNOTUSESPACESORPERIODSBETWEENWORDSORSENTENCESANDTHEYHADONLYCAPITALLETTERS

by Anonymousreply 137November 14, 2019 8:41 PM

^^ There were no spaces in my post. DL did that.

by Anonymousreply 138November 14, 2019 8:43 PM

Two live as one, one live as two, under the bamboo tree.

by Anonymousreply 139November 14, 2019 8:45 PM

di-dah-di-dah-di-dah

by Anonymousreply 140November 14, 2019 8:48 PM

ONE.

Two looks and is old fashioned.

by Anonymousreply 141November 14, 2019 8:50 PM

There you have it.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 142November 14, 2019 8:55 PM

It's one space, unless you're a pearl clutching prisspot.

by Anonymousreply 143November 14, 2019 8:59 PM

I guess we two-spacers have lost the Space Race.

by Anonymousreply 144November 14, 2019 9:27 PM

I have no issue with one space after a period. After all, you have the capital letter that follows as another indication that a new sentence is beginning. But I actually prefer the old-timey convention of two spaces after a colon, as a kind of stop or pause before what's to follow. And I think two spaces actually goes along with the idea that the writer is setting something apart or emphasizing what's coming up.

by Anonymousreply 145November 14, 2019 9:34 PM

[italic] I before E

Except after C

Or when sounded as A

In neighbor & way

by Anonymousreply 146November 14, 2019 10:42 PM

These days it should be considered a blessing to receive a letter that doesn't begin with "Whazzup?"

by Anonymousreply 147November 14, 2019 10:50 PM

I'm over 40 and two spaces looks wrong to me so fuck off with this ageist shit already. It's getting old.

by Anonymousreply 148November 14, 2019 11:09 PM

The only thing that should come after a period is a tampon, paid for by the state.

by Anonymousreply 149November 14, 2019 11:22 PM

What R148. I said it as well. Assholes.

by Anonymousreply 150November 14, 2019 11:28 PM

This is why we need a Spaceforce.

by Anonymousreply 151November 15, 2019 12:34 AM

R146 Sounds like something ancIEent or wEIrd or quite forEIgn, but definitely not an exact scIEnce.

by Anonymousreply 152November 15, 2019 12:38 AM

I need spaces for my Morse code. Just messing with you young whippersnappers.

by Anonymousreply 153November 15, 2019 1:02 AM

R146 it is weigh not way.

by Anonymousreply 154November 15, 2019 1:04 AM

Try sending smoke signals on a windy day.

by Anonymousreply 155November 15, 2019 3:03 AM

😱 No Weigh, R254 !

by Anonymousreply 156November 15, 2019 3:06 AM

di-dah-di-dah-di-dah

Works for me.

by Anonymousreply 157November 15, 2019 3:16 AM

Two spaces. Even when I'm texting, it will only automatically enter in a period for me at the end of a sentence without me having to type it if I use two spaces.

And also another vote for the Oxford comma.

by Anonymousreply 158November 15, 2019 3:37 AM

It's two spaces. I'm not about to take lessons on spacing from people who don't even know how to write cursive.

by Anonymousreply 159November 15, 2019 3:41 AM

R159 Amen, sister

by Anonymousreply 160November 15, 2019 3:48 AM

TWO spaces allow your copy to breathe life so you can read the fucking thing without getting bogged down in a pile of shit.

by Anonymousreply 161November 15, 2019 5:19 AM

I'm in my mid 40s. Was taught the two spaces in school all the way through college. That changed in the mid to late 1990s. When it changed, I just started using a single space. It really doesn't take much effort to change. When I see people at work type with two spaces, I laugh...especially at the ones my age or younger. They seem quaint.

by Anonymousreply 162November 15, 2019 5:55 AM

[quote]Two just looks better. One makes everything look crowded.

[quote]Two just looks better. One makes everything look crowded.

[quote]Note the difference in the examples above

R3's examples look identical because DL corrects multiple spaces down to one.

by Anonymousreply 163November 15, 2019 5:59 AM

R163, that has been pointed out about a hundred times so far in this thread. I mean, really, all you had to do was read the first ten posts. And, you even went to all that trouble to quote everything properly. Did you really think that 100+ other posters had no idea what was going on? Hubris.

by Anonymousreply 164November 15, 2019 6:26 AM

Of all the things you were taught in school, THIS is the rule you choose to follow? It’s one space now. It’s been one space for at least 30 years. Look at published works. Look at online articles. It isn’t just DL that automatically converts two spaces to one. It’s the norm. Welcome to the late 20th century.

by Anonymousreply 165November 15, 2019 7:09 AM

It's not just the last 30 years, kids. Any published text that used proportionally-spaced fonts or typefaces inserted one space after a period. Look at any book or magazine from the 1950s, 1960s, etc., even back in the 19th century.

by Anonymousreply 166November 15, 2019 11:24 AM

I love how the MLA style sheet handles the question:

[quote] Leave one space after a period or other concluding punctuation mark, unless your (ancient dinosaur) instructor (who learned to type on a manual Royal DeLuxe typewriter from the 1940's when he was a gayling still can't get over it and) prefers two spaces. Whichever spacing you choose, be sure to use it consistently throughout your paper. See the MLA's formatting guidelines for more information. Jul 27, 2016

by Anonymousreply 167November 15, 2019 7:47 PM

Queens who insist on two spaces as correct, but still can't parse its from it's or to from too:

S--a--d--z

by Anonymousreply 168November 15, 2019 8:07 PM

"I'm not about to take lessons on spacing from people who don't even know how to write cursive."

R159, I've known how to write cursive since I was in the third grade. And it's one space.

by Anonymousreply 169November 15, 2019 8:12 PM

Since the MLA at R167 doesn't seem to know how to make "1940" into plural (HINT: no apostrophe!), I would have doubts about following any of their other guidelines. .

by Anonymousreply 170November 15, 2019 8:40 PM

Yes, apostrophe abuse is much worse than double-spacing. I'm not being sarcastic!

by Anonymousreply 171November 15, 2019 9:19 PM

While we´re at it, if s sentence ends with a word or phrase in quotation marks, does the period go inside or after the closing quotation mark?

Example:

He said my remark was "ageist".

or

He said my remark was "ageist."

by Anonymousreply 172November 15, 2019 11:15 PM

r172 Depends on which side of the Atlantic you're on.

by Anonymousreply 173November 15, 2019 11:38 PM

For most printed material, the period goes inside the quotation mark.

by Anonymousreply 174November 15, 2019 11:40 PM

It might depend if you're British or American.

by Anonymousreply 175November 15, 2019 11:44 PM

[quote] He said my remark was "ageist".

[quote] or

[quote] He said my remark was "ageist."

American here. If it's at the end of a sentence, the period goes inside the quotation marks. So, the second example would be correct.

by Anonymousreply 176November 15, 2019 11:49 PM

R176, I'm American, too, but our rule is less sensible than the British rule. The period goes inside the quotation marks if it belongs to the quote. If it doesn't, it goes outside. In this example, "he said my remark was 'ageist'. " is most sensible. That's the rule I follow and wish Americans would adopt. It does require more thinking, which may be the reason it has not caught on here , but it's a more logical system.

by Anonymousreply 177November 16, 2019 12:28 AM

Is the dress blue or gold?

by Anonymousreply 178November 16, 2019 12:32 AM

One tap of the space bar.

by Anonymousreply 179November 16, 2019 12:34 AM

If you are having a period, I would prefer two spaces between us, not one.

by Anonymousreply 180November 16, 2019 12:54 AM

This guy must be a DLer.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 181November 16, 2019 1:51 AM

Always two for me. See?

by Anonymousreply 182November 16, 2019 2:58 AM

You can type 60, 100, or 160 WPM. It's one space after a period.

by Anonymousreply 183November 16, 2019 4:26 AM

[quote]While we´re at it

Wait, is OP back or there another DL citizen who goes to an awful lot of trouble to type an apostrophe?

by Anonymousreply 184November 16, 2019 5:16 AM

Two spaces, motherfuckers. Allow your copy to breathe! It looks so much better and readable.

One space makes everything look so cumbersome, heavy and uninviting.

by Anonymousreply 185November 16, 2019 5:41 AM

Two spaces, Great.

by Anonymousreply 186November 16, 2019 5:48 AM

R185, I suggest from now on, you put two spaces between all words and three spaces between sentences. Think of all the breathing the words could do with all that space. If you're going to be a troglodyte, at least be original.

It's one space. If you use two, you will be judged as old. I can even affect your ability to get a job because if you haven't kept up on that, you probably haven't kept up on a lot of other stuff, either, and no one wants to hire an old person who is unwilling to adapt to the modern world.

by Anonymousreply 187November 16, 2019 5:51 AM

R187 You don't seem to realize. Being perceived as old, or even actually being old is not a crime. Now is it an insult. Now, fuck off, Greta.

by Anonymousreply 188November 16, 2019 5:54 AM

R188, was the type on the 'posted by' line of my post too small for you to read? Also, grammar is your friend. You might want to look into a book on the topic.

At 45, I consider myself getting close to being considered an "old person" (especially since, generationally, there are so many young people) but I'm not one that refuses to adapt. Grow up, Gramps, because even people your own age are going to think you're old if you refuse to change or adapt to any changes in society as a whole.

by Anonymousreply 189November 16, 2019 6:19 AM

^ Like spaces are so fucking important.

by Anonymousreply 190November 16, 2019 6:24 AM

R190, the refusal to change when the rest of society has already done so is indicative of other issues.

And, you aren't even using the "Greta" insult correctly. I've already said I'm 45 years old. Did you not understand its context when explained above?

by Anonymousreply 191November 16, 2019 6:49 AM

Perhaps we should just go back to the occasional interpunct.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 192November 16, 2019 7:46 AM

[quote]At 45, I consider myself getting close to being considered an "old person"

Oh, honey.

by Anonymousreply 193November 16, 2019 3:11 PM

I'm 61. One space after a period is fine. Also, period goes "inside the quotation marks." It's not rocket science. It's just proper spacing of type.

by Anonymousreply 194November 16, 2019 3:54 PM

R187 nails it.

by Anonymousreply 195November 16, 2019 6:59 PM

[quote] Over 50 years old = two spaces after a period. Under 50 years old = one space after a period.

I'm 54 and use one space, as everyone should unless using a typewriter.

Oh, and I know how to write in cursive, but understand why teaching cursive is unnecessary today.

by Anonymousreply 196November 16, 2019 7:22 PM

R196, I had an argument with someone a little younger than I (age 54; he's in his 40s) about cursive writing not worth teaching because don't need it. I very much disagree--why wouldn't it be taught? No one physically writes anything anymore? Is all communication via computer, laptop and phone? I don't buy that.

by Anonymousreply 197November 16, 2019 7:57 PM

*because kids don't need it.

by Anonymousreply 198November 16, 2019 7:59 PM

R197, how do people who never learn cursive sign their names? Even in the modern world, a real signature (or e-version of same) is required on a lot of very official documents.

by Anonymousreply 199November 16, 2019 8:11 PM

Kind of funny how the people who are so adamant about (still) using two spaces aren't actually doing it in their posts here at DL.

As was shown in R111, you simply type or paste the code in to do it.

Also, isn't cursive writing becoming an elective in some schools? That's probably a good way to go with that course of study. And really, after one has been shown the basics, it's pretty simple to continue learning it with practice workbooks and videos. I remember several years ago the PBS station where I live used to have this TV show in the morning that taught it. The lessons on capital "Q" and "Z" brought me back to my childhood .. lol!

by Anonymousreply 200November 16, 2019 8:18 PM

[quote]how do people who never learn cursive sign their names?

They just make a squiggly line. Hardly anyone has a legible signature anymore.

by Anonymousreply 201November 16, 2019 8:59 PM

[quote]r200 Also, isn't cursive writing becoming an elective in some schools?

Yes.

Come mourn with us.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 202November 16, 2019 10:46 PM

[quote]r113 I see the difference. One space looks better. Two spaces is too much. In a paragraph, you would get "rivers" of space as wide as the Mississippi running through your text.

Two spaces looks drunken, like the sentences are lurching.

Although if I'm proofing something, I will often put two spaces before a sentence that begins with an I. That [italic]can[/italic] look crowded, as that particular letter is so narrow.

by Anonymousreply 203November 16, 2019 10:58 PM

[quote]The lessons on capital "Q" and "Z" brought me back to my childhood .. lol!

In second grade I decided the cursive Q was just ridiculous and made up my own that was much more aesthetically pleasing and true to the spirit of the letter.

by Anonymousreply 204November 17, 2019 1:35 AM

Like hotmail and AOL, two spaces make you look like an old fart.

by Anonymousreply 205November 17, 2019 2:26 AM

Can people who never learned cursive still read cursive writing? Reading archival sources or old memoirs or something like that? I had to do a project once that required that I read old township records which were obviously written in cursive since all adults wrote that way back then. I would think it might be difficult to read something that you've never been taught and rarely see in everyday life.

by Anonymousreply 206November 17, 2019 5:49 AM

even if untrained, if you were older you might make out the jist of cursive samples from the 20th Century. I don’t think a child could.

More antique cursive writing would be a headache because it can be very embellished. Plus the line spacing would perhaps be narrower, the paper discolored, etc. It could get terrifying very fast.

by Anonymousreply 207November 17, 2019 6:04 AM

Any literate adult English-speaker can read the Declaration of Independence in its original form, but a child who hasn't been taught cursive won't be able to read a letter his mother wrote 20 years ago. That doesn't seem like a step forward.

by Anonymousreply 208November 17, 2019 7:38 AM

We need a cursive reader App that turns cursive into printed text.

by Anonymousreply 209November 17, 2019 2:01 PM

r3, the difference isn't even noticeable. Use one or you date yourself as an elder.

by Anonymousreply 210November 17, 2019 5:11 PM

[quote] [R197], how do people who never learn cursive sign their names?

You can learn to chicken-scratch a signature without spending time on a whole course in cursive writing. I agree with the poster who said that cursive should be an elective class for those who want to learn it. Or, y'know, just go on youtube and take one of the dozens of tutorials available there. It's not difficult to learn cursive outside of school if you really want or need to, and cursive isn't useful enough to enough people to waste time teaching it in school.

As for reading a letter your mother wrote 20 years ago, she probably sent an email. And if she did handwrite a letter, modern cursive looks similar enough to the print alphabet that I don't think most people would have trouble reading it. Also, quit invading your mother's privacy.

by Anonymousreply 211November 17, 2019 5:38 PM

R111. Two spaces! I can’t change an html code. Don’t be ridiculous.

by Anonymousreply 212November 17, 2019 5:53 PM

I even use spaces after a period in my text messages. It’s a habit, and I like it. It looks better.

by Anonymousreply 213November 17, 2019 5:55 PM

I'm old enough, learned cursive, but I haven't used it for 30 years. I sign my name (beautiful signature), but when I write things, it's ALL CAP LETTERS. For post-its, etc. Otherwise, I don't write anything, just type.

by Anonymousreply 214November 17, 2019 5:55 PM

*Two spaces

by Anonymousreply 215November 17, 2019 5:55 PM

This sentence has one space after the period. Only one space.

This sentence has two space after the period. Two spaces.

by Anonymousreply 216April 24, 2020 12:10 PM

Do as you please, but it's two spaces after for me. But then I use [italic]week-end[/italic] and a few other variants and semi-archaic uses. The MLA is not my guide, though it may be yours.

by Anonymousreply 217April 24, 2020 12:19 PM

Two spaces. Always and forever.

by Anonymousreply 218April 24, 2020 12:43 PM

R86 for the win. I worked in magazine publishing for ten years. One space is standard in magazine and newspaper articles. And that's what I want everything I type to like like.

And here's how to make an 'em' dash, as in "The brief mention wasn't exactly scandalous—columnists hinted at pregnancy constantly—but MGM's stance was firm: Garland could not have a baby."

On a mac, it's option, shift, hyphen key.

by Anonymousreply 219April 24, 2020 1:02 PM

When girls have their period, 5 or 6 spaces is better, Josef. Christ, the smell of girls on their periods.

by Anonymousreply 220April 24, 2020 2:43 PM

TWO. Only.

by Anonymousreply 221April 12, 2021 10:18 PM

Two spaces.

by Anonymousreply 222April 12, 2021 10:56 PM

Two. And another insistent vote for the Oxford Comma.

by Anonymousreply 223April 12, 2021 10:59 PM
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