Breaking Bad

I believe it's the most interesting show ever both artistically and philosophically. It's Crime and Punishment for the masses.

I still think the way Bryan Cranston is able to take all of the light out of his eyes when Walter transforms into Heisenberg is remarkable.

I thought it was overrated. Great acting, but the plotting was mediocre to plain bad.

Well done but occupying the mind of terrible people is not my thing, especially over a long period of time.

R4 I wouldn’t necessarily call Walter a terrible person. People tend to vilify him while ignoring the evils in both Jessie and Skylar, who each were really abhorrent people when you think about it and watch the way they manipulate and hurt the people they claim to love most.

Same goes for Jessie et al too. If it was a movie I'd probably watch.

Best writing in the history of television. Better than The Sopranos, better than The Wire, better than everything. To me, Jesse was the least interesting character (even less interesting than boring and annoying Skylar and Marie) even though weirdly remained the most liked by the show's audience. All the interesting ones are dead. But I hate that Giancarlo Esposito talked show creator Vince Gilligan out of making Gus explicitly gay.

Jesse isdumb, a whiner but has a good heart.

Personally, I fucking hate Jessie, which is why I’m upset that El Camino is going to center around him. I’ll watch, because I’m interested in seeing how the White’s lives pan out after the dust has settled, but I’ve got no more tears left to cry for that white trash asshole. Every single thing that ever went badly in his life was very obvious his own fault, yet all he ever did was blame his fuck-up’s on other people.

When Walter watched Kristen Ritter’s girlfriend character choke and die and did nothing is when I knew this show was going places no show had gone before and I was addictively hooked.

Bryan Cranston basicallg made this show. The bitch wife and her bitch sister= annoying as fuck. The racist brother in law = annoying as fuck. The retarded son=annoying as fuck and a horrid actor. Meth head Jesse with perfect white teeth and a heart of gold , lame and annoying as fuck! If Mr. White killed Jesse, this show would have been so much better. I have zero interest in anything centered around that lame bitch!

R10 I loved Ritter’s character. I thought she was a cunt, but looking back on it, it seems like Gilligan intentionally made her awful so that when we watched her choke to death on her own vomit we wouldn’t see it for the horrific event it actually was, thus putting us in the shoes of Walt and helping the viewer understand how far gone Walter was at that point.

I met up with this fuck buddy once and he liked to have shows on in the background while he sucked my cock. One day he had Breaking Bad on and the show's intensity was fucking with my libido so I told him to turn it off.

It deserved every Emmy... probably deserved more. Shame Dean Norris wasn't nominated for Season 5. "Ozymandias" might be the best episode of television ever? I don't know... I'll get back to you on that.

R10 but then the plane crash plotline was lame.

I liked Gale very much and wanted more of him.

RJ Mitte (Walter Junior, the son with Cerebral Palsy) actually grew up quite nicely. He’s now a fashion model and activist. Hunky.

The son was cute.

RJ was always cute to me, and yes became quite handsome. Is he Italian or something?

[quote]I’m pretty sure DL has never had a thread on the show

You're so right. We somehow went from 2008 to 2013 without discussing a television programme that won more than a dozen Emmys. Thanks!

Great = Walter, Gus, Saul, Mike, Hank, Hector, Gale, Tuco, Badger, Jane, Skinny Pete,

Awful = Jesse, Skylar, Marie, Walter Jr, Steven Gomez, Bogdan, Ted Benneke, Lydia, Todd and the entire white supremacist gang.

Hector and his bell was more interesting in his few scenes than Jessie the entire series put together. I just couldn't relate to Jesse and it baffled me how the masses liked and identified with him even though most of what went wrong was his fault. And he couldn't form a single sentence without saying "bitch". Gus, was just as complex as Mr White which is why I was disappointed that he didn't last longer.

The final half of the last season was really weak, I don't think they fully explained how Hank was completely fooled in a way that made sense. They were good about him flipping out but there was a big hole where there should have been some explanation, like his ego got in the way, or he had an inkling then dismissed it because Walter was such a nerd, or something like that.

The show climbed to such heights with the Gus Fring storyline that when it ended it had nowhere to go but down.

Enjoyable show and for a meth head Jesse was hot. I'd do him anyway.

Skyler got really screwed by the show, they first wrote her as a basic bitch who emasculated Walter but after a few episodes made her more complicated, but most of the audience never got over their initial impression of her. Then the show writers and Vince Gilligan would complain that the audience was sexist when THEY were the ones who had written her as a sexist "ball and chain" stereotype.

R24 I liked that they made her more complex, but even as they developed her, the writers made it clear she’s a cunt. After she finds out Walt is a drug dealer she tries to manipulate his business and pushes him to let her become a part of it, and I think that’s partly because the drugs were always his way of gaining some sense of control. She wanted to take the one tiny drop of independence he had and infect it. She’s always been a ball and chain due to the writing, even when she was made more complex.

R22 I thought it was implied through all the times he came close that Walt being so dorky and unconfrontational was the reason why Hank never thought it was him.

Not one single post yet on probably the most hilarious character of this show, sleazeball Saul?

Loved it. The best show since the Sopranos.

It was truly brilliant. How is "Better call Saul" coming along?

Plot was too convenient for Hank. It felt like it was an old Magnum P.I. episode. Way overrated. Much like the Marvel movies.... Get a bunch of white guys hyped and they can't be wrong.

A show that feels less and less relevant as the years go by. Great for a binge, but once it was over, there was nothing left to think about— like a melody that only hammers the same three notes again and again (same for Cranston’s performance). Not a single interesting female character who existed outside of her husband/boyfriend; contrast that with all of the women on a show like Mad Men and BB seems particularly lacking. Gilligan is just too straight-line a thinker, too much a moralist for there to be any ambiguity or messiness in his world.

Will never match The Sopranos, Mad Men or The Wire in terms of characterization and writing for me.

[quote]I’m pretty sure DL has never had a thread on the show

...are you insane?

As one of the most highly regarded television shows, obviously "Breaking Bad" was talked about A LOT here while it was airing. The final season generating hundreds of posts for each episode.

You are delusional r5. Walter a (purposefully) awful human being, and the "Skylar is just as bad!" antics are honestly embarrassing. I would expect than from 14 year olds on reddit but not here.

[quote]I’m pretty sure DL has never had a thread on the show

What are you, some kind of a fucking genius?

The basic idea was the searing satire of the US medical insurance system that the latter deserves, but the show itself was so unmitigatedly awful (in the sense of immorality and gore) that it was often like torture porn. After three seasons I just didn't think I needed to put myself through it any more. Cranston was brilliant, though.

The Wire was 10 times more ambitious, and at the same time more successful at what it was doing. The years and years that the writers had been involved in its world in real life showed in its depth and confidence.

The fact that people don’t realize I was being sarcastic when I said we’ve never had a thread on this makes me afraid that cynicism and dry wit on the DL are dead.

Loved it. Mainly for its critique of capitalism and the American Dream. In reality, the way you achieve the “American Dream” is by being a sociopathic “killer” who takes advantage of others and cares only about amassing wealth for yourself at the expense of all others. It’s the repository of masculinity, Money = manhood.

Brilliant writing is number one. Acting is secondary.

This show was stunning to look at. It had it all - writing, actind, directing, stunning music, and it was beautiful as well. Cant remember another show that had it all. Some moments, like mexican brothers crawling, laughing Walt in the crawl space, spider, are ingrained in my memory.

Doesn't anyone else care that Gus was supposed to be gay then the actor talked the creator out of it?

When the teaser for El Camino came on the Emmys, showing a car sitting in the dark desert and a flash of a flame light illuminating the windows for a moment, I immediately thought “That looks just like Breaking Bad.” How many TV series have a signature cinematography?

R39

But Gus was gay. I thought it was obvious.

Vince Gilligan said he purposely left it vague whether Gus were gay, many of the straight fans didn't get he might be.

I don't know if Giancarlo was the reason, is there a link about r39?

Yeah the cinematography was epic

I’m fine with Gus not being explicitly gay. His romantic life has nothing to do with the character or the story, and having it be more ambiguous (like who he was before he came to North America) makes the character more interesting and sinister.

..did you watch the abow r44?

Gus' entire backstory was about revenge for his murdered partner. It makes more sense when you realize that wasn't just a friend/business partner but his life partner. Why has such a deep bloodlust.

Yes. Gus’s gayness was eventually made clear. It is part of why the Salamanca clan hates him.

R45 To be honest, I never really liked that backstory. Having him be mysterious and the origin of his hatred unexplained makes him a more imposing character, and a more intimidating antagonist.

R46 Tuco always kinda gave me gay vibes. He did have a thing for panache and dramatics. He was a cutie.

It was obvious he was guy. Cmon. He had a picture of his killed lover in his office, with the most important information of his empire hidden in the frame. Gilligun was lying when he said it was vague. It was obvious for everyone with a brain. But it also wasnt the point of the story.

It was obvious he was gay... Sorry.

I'd say upwards of 95% of the straight audience has no clue Gus was gay. Gilligan wanted to spell it out in the poolside scene but he says he opted to leave it vague after a very long conversation with Esposito who preferred to not have it addressed.

I got so bored with the show I did not bother with the last season.

Gus was gay. I thought that was why he had vengeance on his mind. Because they killed his bf by the pool

Gilligan himself offered a similar opinion on the show's podcast. From Boston.com:

The flashback to the murder of his “partner’’ has raised questions online about whether or not Gus is gay. Show creator Vince Gilligan’s response, from the “Breaking Bad’’ podcast: "It’s open to interpretation. It’s whatever the audience wants it to be."

R54 It’s obvious he’s gay, “open to interpretation” is bullshit. Gus is a man who slits his own business partner’s throats to send a message. He would never care that much about a person if it was just business.

Gus was falling in love with Jessie. That's what I thought. Well, i know I was lol.

R56 I don’t believe that. The only people who could fall in love with an idiotic, selfish loser like Jessie are equally trash idiots like the neighbor girl.

R57, there's people that like that trashy lifestyle. BITCH!

Strangely, the characters from this show who spilled over to "Better Call Saul" do nothing for me on that show, as much as I enjoyed them on "Breaking Bad."

I forget. Was Mike’s backstory about revenging his son’s death on BB or BCS?

R59 Me too. I think it’s because like the person upthread said, the great thing about Breaking Bad is that it’s a character study of Walter White and the journey of a man from hero to villain. Outside of that it’s just meh.

Better Call Saul, R60.

[Quote]he opted to leave it vague after a very long conversation with Esposito who preferred to not have it addressed.

If that's true how sad, Esposito should have been happy to do whatever Vince thought best. Not let his own feelings about Gus being gay get in the way.

I think Better Call Saul is better written than Breaking Bad, honestly the writing in BCS is incredibly tight. The plot itself just isn't as engaging.

I still enjoy it a lot though.

My opinion is that is a good show, but overpraised.

Never realized Gus was gay. The shooting at the pool was one of the most memorable scenes in the show - but it never occurred to me that they were lovers.

R66

Seriously? How did you explain this scene?

I know many, many straight people didn't make the connection they were lovers, but I am very surprised a gay person wouldn't (assuming you are actually gay).

R67 Regardless of who they are to you, seeing your business partner shot in the head right in front of your face because of a mistake you made would fuck up anybody. And that’s WITHOUT adding the gay subtext.

Apologies beforehand but does anyone have a link to Esposito talking Vince from being gay?

I know Breaking Bad wouldn't have been made if Vince knew Weeds was around before his show. Vince seems like a phony tbh.

Totally gay here- and would argue there was nothing gay in that scene. The emotion of expecting to be shot yourself than having your business partner blown away in front of you instead totally explained Gus’ reaction. Even in retrospect, I don’t know why anyone would see anything gay in Gus’ response.

R69

Normal person, i guess, but Gus? I think it was said he was from Chile, and it was implied he was a person in power there. He had brutal past. Also this photo of two of them in the office in season five.

[Quote]Even in retrospect, I don’t know why anyone would see anything gay in Gus’ response

You seem very repressed that you see deep love between two men and can't fathom that they could actually be in love.

Anyway, Gilligan while still keeping it vague did directly say it is okay to infer Gus being gay.

[Quote]Both Steven Bauer, the actor who plays Don Eladio, and the episode’s editor, Kelly Dixon, saw Gus as gay, to which Gilligan says “It’s okay to infer that.”

Does anyone remember the scene where Walt goes to Gus’s home for dinner?

When he walks in there’s children’s toys in the hall - and while cooking his fish stew Gus says something about how it’s an old family recipe that he loves to cook but “the kids won’t eat it”.

I have always found that very curious. Did he actually have a wife (or husband) and kids? Or as that all part of a careful constructed fake life?

I love Breaking Bad. I don’t think it’s flawless and I do accept that The Wire & Sopranos were the better shows, but BB is by far my favourite.

I have always felt that Walt’s actual motivation for everything he does is a very deep hatred of Hank. He (Walt) was a narcissist who had to cope for years with having his (in his opinion) dumb fuck brother-in-law be more successful, have a better house, more money & the respect of colleagues. Even Walt Jr hero worshipped Hank. First episode has Hank taking the piss out of Walt at his 50th birthday party - that and the cancer diagnosis made Heisenberg (who was always there, imo) start to emerge.

Yep I definitely remember that r74. Gus having a family was retconned after that. The easiest way to handwave it is that it was a ruse and he wanted Walk to think he was a family man, but honestly I'm sure the real answer is the writers just changed their mind.

Gus was a homo. He had kids toys as a ruse. Unless showrunners wanna be explicit about it then we've been played.

[quote]The only people who could fall in love with an idiotic, selfish loser like Jessie are equally trash idiots like the neighbor girl.

At least us white trash losers know how to spell Jesse correctly.

I don't get the Pinkman hate. The relationship between Walt and Jesse was one of the biggest draws of the show for me. There were so many layers to it. Like Nachos.

I think the last three epeisodes wehhre the greeateatt theings on teltesvineiaons

I always thought it was possible that Gus had a gay lover who was murdered AND a family. He was all about hiding in plain sight. It would stand to reason that he'd be in the closet when he got to the States. He was all about projecting a wholesome conservative image. Things to remember about Gus's episode, "Hermanos": Gus rescued Max off the streets of Santiago when he was a kid then put him through college so he could get his degree in Biochemistry. Yeah, that's a totally hetero thing to do. Also, Hector clearly suggests they're gay with his slurs while they're waiting for Don Eladio to show up.

I loved the show and I loved Walter but I had no sympathy for Skyler.

R79 I agree. I think Gus would have found some pretty young thing and upduffed her for appearances sake. He wanted no speculation about himself whatsoever - he was just that nice chicken man who drove a Volvo & went home every night to his family. Who I think he would have treated well but distantly.

But his kitchen...all gleaming knives & expensive equipment is the kitchen of a gay man. No one else cooks in it but Gus.

Totally, R81. It felt like the toys were all a ruse for Walter, particularly after the "man provides" speech. But I'm just saying, you can read it either way, and like others have mentioned, its what makes Gus so fascinating having that mystery to him.

R80 Completely. I don’t understand how people can call out all of Walter’s sociopathy (rightly so) but then completely ignore how characters like Skyler and Jesse are clearly one in the same with Walter in ways. Jesse represents early stage Heisenberg and Skyler represents late stage Heisenberg, but it’s clear that personality developed by Walter as a way to cope with being a doormat in his life who spent all his time being manipulated by other people, and that the personality was given freedom to fester and grow once he had the outlet of cooking to give him a taste of autonomy and control.

R77 I miss Badger. He was the only guy on the white trash side of the story I’d ever fuck. He was cute.

R83, exactly. Both Jesse and Skyler are complicit in Walt's crimes. If people want to hate Skyler for "being a bitch", they should also hate Jessie too. This is why I never liked the ending to the show. It was too neat and tidy in how it tried to portray Walt's "fall" while Skyler and Jessie pretty much get away with it. Honestly, I loved Breaking Bad when it was on tv--even my parents watched the later episodes with me--but it's not a show I have ever had the urge to revisit, not once. That's not a good sign and I know many people who feel the same way. I can say that my other favorite tv show from that time period, Enlightened, has aged very well and I still like to watch it from time to time (damn, how I wish that third season could have been released).

Jessie is complicit in Walt’s crimes. What an insight.

My pet theory was that Walt died in the car in the snow and the superhero ending was his fantasy. El Camino proves me wrong.

I always assumed Gus was gay. Not GAY. Just gay. Not a major plot point about his character. He was primarily evil and a crime boss.

Guys, it's spelled "Jesse." No "i" in the name.

R89 Who cares, bitch?

I care. I’m not ashamed to admit I have been enlightened by R89.

Bitch.

Tony Soprano

[quote]I loved Breaking Bad when it was on tv--even my parents watched the later episodes with me--but it's not a show I have ever had the urge to revisit, not once.

Who the fuck "revisits" a long-running series that they have already watched?

I do.

R55, when the show's creator refuses to explicitly state whether Gus is gay and says "it's open to interpretation", who are you to say "it's obvious"?

It is has been clear over many interviews that Giancarlo Esposito did not want Gus to be seen as gay. Here's a direct quote:

[quote]There was never any indication at all that Gus had any homosexual tendencies, other than episode 408. And I personally believe that nothing is ever black and white and I believe Gus had a way of cultivating people, whether chemists, school teachers, or as businessmen. I had long discussions with Vince Gilligan that it shouldn't be pointed up either way (and he agreed). And the audience should have to decide.

You're basically fighting for scraps. I've seen elsewhere others say Gale is the gay one because he's a nerd and a vegan. Truth is, Gilligan lives in an entirely straight world where being gay is an afterthought.

R55, when the show's creator refuses to explicitly state whether Gus is gay and says "it's open to interpretation", who are you to say "it's obvious"?

It is has been clear over many interviews that Giancarlo Esposito did not want Gus to be seen as gay. Here's a direct quote:

[quote]There was never any indication at all that Gus had any homosexual tendencies, other than episode 408. And I personally believe that nothing is ever black and white and I believe Gus had a way of cultivating people, whether chemists, school teachers, or as businessmen. I had long discussions with Vince Gilligan that it shouldn't be pointed up either way (and he agreed). And the audience should have to decide.

You're basically fighting for scraps. I've seen elsewhere others say Gale is the gay one because he's a nerd and a vegan. Truth is, Gilligan lives in an entirely straight world where being gay is an afterthought.

Esposito's reddit coments:

I'm too delicate for this show. I stopped after the first 2 or 3 episodes.

R97 so the cartel members called him a faggot (maricon) and made fun of him not being into those female hookers at the pool, for shits and giggles?

No r99, just highlighting that only (some) gay men interpreted Gus to be gay. Most of the show’s audience, the creator and the actor that played the part did not. Gilligan had originally intended for the character to be gay but Esposito convinced him to leave it up in the air.

R93, many people do. There is this thing called streaming that allows you to watch many kinds of shows at any time. Try it.

A really well written show deserves a rewatch. I enjoyed The Wire more the second time than the first actually.

Let me rephrase, "Who the fuck with an actual life has time to sit and re-watch a long-running series they have already seen once?"

It's sad if Esposito had a problem with Gus' homosexuality. But i stand by what i said - it was obvious for me that he was gay and young man that was killed was his lover/most likely love of his life. Show didnt pay much attention to it because Gus was rather secretive and mysterious character. But for me it was obvious.

Gus was so obviously gay. Esposito sounds like a phobe.

From what it sounds like, Gilligan’s first drafts of scripts are often the best, but he tends to scrap them. In the first season he originally wanted both Jesse and Walt Jr. to die, and they should have. He also wanted for Walt Jr. to die via the whit supremacists in the last season and for Skylar to finally have all her bad deeds catch up to her and for her to answer them via killing herself whilst on the run with Walt. Both of those things should have happened. Ultimately, Gilligan was afraid of getting too dark at times, which I think damaged the show in the long run. It took away some of the tension. Not to mention the first draft involving Gus being gay would have added a lot to his character and made him easier to humanize and empathize with, seeing as he watched his lover assassinated in front of him. But, que sera sera.

R106, you're right--that would have been so much better. Instead, by the end of the show, it felt too "neat".

R107 Exactly. Despite there being no real good person in the main cast of characters (with the exception of Walt Junior maybe), it felt like Walter was the only person who really had to pay for their mistakes. And even then he wanted to die. Nobody really had to answer for their crimes, especially the ones they committed against each other in terms of fucking up one another.

[quote]And even then he wanted to die. Nobody really had to answer for their crimes

Yeah, spending six months tied on a leash as a meth slave after getting the shit beat out of him, and watching not one, but two of his girlfriends die, was such a cake walk for Jesse. What an easy life that guy got. Just not enough retribution. We'll see how things continue to pan out for him in El Camino, I guess.

[quote] Every single thing that ever went badly in his life was very obvious his own fault, yet all he ever did was blame his fuck-up’s on other people

Since you brought it up R9. This is for you

[quote] Every single thing that ever went badly in his life was very obvious his own fault, yet all he ever did was blame his fuck-up’s on other people

Since you brought it up R9. This is for you

R108

Really? Probably, if you consider death is the worst thing that can happen to the person. Walt died with peace, after killing his enemies, seeing what he loved. While Jesse will have to live with horror of his trauma. And Skylar's position is horrible as well. Also she's definitely not nearly as bad as you trying to say. She's bitchy and manipulative, but not a monster as Walt.

I was leery of going into it, because it seemed like such a "bro" kind of show, but I was riveted from beginning to end. Wonderful writing and acting. I still remember getting goosebumps during Walter's breakdown in the crawlspace and thinking Cranston was genius.

R113

Yes. What a scene.

I have a feeling El Camino will be an epic disappointment. Jesse is just not interesting by himself.

The Gus situation is why you can never trust straight people to represent gay stories. Someone decided that it was something to be hidden while every straight relationship was, including Jesse fucking methhead prostitutes, was shown.

BTW, the only time I enjoyed Jesse was when he tried to claim credit for crushing that guy's head with an ATM.

Jesse is a little bitch

R116 an ugly actor like that who wasn’t all that great(his spanish was awful) should be happy to get any role!

I still can’t believe there are people defending Jesse on this thread. Those people either didn’t pay attention to the show, have no common sense, want to fuck him, or the DL has been taken over by the idiotic straight bros that see themselves as Jesse. He was a piece of shit who caused all his own problems and blamed them on everyone else. Not once did he ever take responsibility for anything bad he’s done. He kept up his “woe is me” act the whole fucking show. I wish he’d died in season five just so that we wouldn’t have to put up with him anymore. I love Aaron Paul and I want him to keep working, but every time Jesse comes on screen I keep hoping Gus is going to come out of nowhere and slice open his throat with a box cutter just so that he stops saying stupid shit.

R119 Not to mention how homophobic he is.

Jesse was a homophobic, selfish wigger. I get the douches who make up a lot of the show’s fanbase feeling bad for this piece of shit, but he should get no sympathy here.

I’m rewatching and I’m around the part where Skyler tries to intimidate Tim into paying the IRS. It’s really hard to feel bad for when people like her and Jesse fuck shit up for Walter considering how they do it so much and yet he continues to let them control important things and know important information. There’s a reason the expression goes “fool me once”, it’s because they don’t think anybody’d be dumb enough to let themselves be fooled by assholes a multitude of times as if it’s nothing.

For fuck's sake. I suppose creator Vince Gilligan was another deluded idiot who didn't know how to "watch" the show, R119. From an interview at the end of the series:

[quote]In the EW interview, Gilligan expressed his sympathy and affection for Jesse, saying, “All [of us] in the writers’ room just loved Jesse, and we just figured he had gotten in way over his head. … So this poor kid, based on a couple of really bad decisions he made early on, has been paying through the nose spiritually and physically and mentally and emotionally. In every which way, he’s just been paying the piper, and we just figured it felt right for him to get away. It would have been such a bummer for us, as the first fans of the show, for Jesse to have to pay with his life ultimately.”

The whole point of Jesse and Walt's relationship is that where they started from and where they ended up said a lot about Walt's slowly decaying morality. One was the junkie, asshole wigger piece of shit drug dealer and the other was the upstanding chemistry teacher just trying to make the money he needed to provide for his family before he died of lung cancer. However, their story arcs took opposing trajectories - the upstanding guy turned into a soulless piece of shit who got off on people fearing him, taking every chance to lord his superiority over those he supposedly cared about, while the punk drug dealer was increasingly horrified and sickened by the horrible things they continued to do and allow to happen, to the point where he just wanted to get out and retire from it all then became a recluse because he was not only being eaten away by guilt, but terrified of his former father figure partner.

And Walt's relationship with both Jesse and Skyler showed how Walter was a classic abuser the entire time. He berated Jesse at first, every chance he got, even though he supposedly cared about him enough to protect him, putting him in rehab because he felt immense guilt at letting Jesse's girlfriend die while he sat there doing nothing, and leaving her body for Jesse to wake up to. He let Jesse believe that he was responsible, that Jesse almost killing Walt for poisoning Brock was all in his head, another mindfuck over the guy, so he could use Jesse to help him take down and murder Gus. He manipulates Jesse later, and conditions him into believing that all of his instincts are wrong and its only in trusting Walter that he can achieve anything or find happiness.

I don't think those of us sympathetic to Jesse were watching the show wrong. In fact, Gilligan even calls it out when the Nazis are watching his confession tape. "Does this pussy cry through the whole thing?"

By the fifth season, it was Pinkman who had become the voice of reason.

Pinkman sucks!

R123 Enjoying a shitty character doesn’t mean you’re watching the show wrong, it means you like a shitty character. Some fans of GOT love Littlefinger, despite him being a piece of shit. There’s nothing wrong with liking a character who’s a bad person. However, there is something wrong with taking a character who is a piece of shit and pretending that they’re the wounded-puppy hero. Jesse spent the entirety of the show fucking up other people’s lives with no remorse. People seem to forget about all the instances where Jesse was perfectly okay with ruining Walt’s family. People seem to forget about the moments where he acted recklessly with no thought about the consequences beyond his own selfish endgame. The only horrible thing I can remember Jesse feeling immediate remorse for was killing Gale. As much as people like to vilify Walt, they forget that there’s only one difference between him and Jesse: Walt isn’t afraid of doing horrible things himself, Jesse is fine with doing horrible things as long as he doesn’t have to be the person to get his hands dirty. He’s the kind of person that likes to pretend he can do no wrong, the kind of person that likes to ignore his own responsibilities and blame others when he fucks up. That’s how he became a dropout white trash drug dealer despite being raised in a loving, caring, well off family. Jesse isn’t a hero, or a wounded puppy, he’s a piece of shit who refuses to acknowledge his own faults. Even Walter can do that, and as you said before, Walt is a soulless psychopath. What does that say about Jesse?

R125

What show did you watch? Wow. I don't like Pinkman, but even i can see you're wrong.

R123 Oh, almost forgot, remember that girlfriend that Walter “murdered”? She was a quickly recovering drug addict who showed genuine interest in getting help, she had great prospects and was on the fast track to a better life. And then she met Jesse, who enabled her addiction, and despite knowing she was in recovery, got her hooked on speed again. I know Jesse is a fan favorite, which I’ve begrudgingly accepted and am not surprised by considering how many douchebros watch the show, but don’t pretend he’s a saint.

I’m rewatching and have just finished season 3, so have the final two seasons to watch before El Camino drops next week. I love this show so much, although Walt is so much more unlikable this go around. Bryan Cranston really is phenomenal. And I want Aaron Paul inside me quite deeply. x

One thing I never got was why Gus was so interested in Jesse. I get that he knows how to make blue, but after everything he has put Gus through you would think that Gus would have problems with leaving someone so stupid in charge of such a big role? If it’s just about the recipe then why didn’t he just have Mike or someone else torture Jesse until he gave up how to make blue, and once it was verified as the right recipe then have him taken out back? It doesn’t make sense that someone as calculated and cunning as Gustavo would want such a reckless idiot playing such an instrumental part in his business.

This show did some amazing things with the camera. It always felt more like a low-budget HBO show than something on AMC. Vince Gilligan clearly put effort into carefully crafting each scene.

The show never was the same for me after Gus died. I still enjoyed it, but a fascinating character was gone.

R130

Low budget? You mean it in a good way? AMC are notoriously cheap, but Breaking Bad somehow always looked stunning despite probably low budget.

Marie’s purple kitchen appliances and tools probably cost a bundle.

I know he's just a fictional character and I shouldn't care, but the thing with Gus turned me off Giancarlo Esposito, the actor.

R132 - Sony produced Breaking Bad for AMC, so they might have had a little more to spend than other AMC fare like The Walking Dead. I remember reading somewhere that the final season cost about $3.5 million an episode. x

[quote]There’s nothing wrong with liking a character who’s a bad person. However, there is something wrong with taking a character who is a piece of shit and pretending that they’re the wounded-puppy hero.

Say what?

$3.5MM an episode!?! Wow. I’m shocked they made that much on the series. I thought no one paid for TV commercials anymore.

[quote] I’m pretty sure DL has never had a thread on the show,

HAHHAHAHHA Whut?

Of COURSE there have been multiple threads on it. It ended years ago, dear.

[quote]One thing I never got was why Gus was so interested in Jesse.

Because he wanted to drill that ass, duh.

(Also, Jesse was one of the few people to tell Gus, "no". Once Jesse showed his mettle at the throat cutting, Gus got more interested, and then Jesse straight up saved their lives in Juarez City).

Just rewatched the episodes where Gus first takes interest in Jesse. After Jesse turns his house into a Meth den after killing Gayle, Gus has Mike kidnap him and take him on his cash drop pick-ups and they, stage a robbery that Jesse thwarts. Gus says he wanted Jesse to be the hero. Initially, I thought he wanted to assess how big a threat Jesse was in terms of getting arrested or fucking up, but there’s more to it. Even Jesse asks Gus “Why me?” Gus says he likes to think he has an eye for talent. Really, bitch?

A methhead like Jessie would have bent over for a dime bag. Why is he being held a hero? Oh. I forget he's a skinny white guy with pretty eyes lol

But he does save Gus and Mike in Juarez.

I don’t understand the sexual appeal of Jesse. Aaron Paul has a gorgeous voice but aside from that he isn’t particularly “stunning” in any way, especially since he started shaving his head. He’s just normal looking.

Terribly thin.

Breaking Bad is kind of cartoony. It plays into the way that guerito has to be saved.

Same reason Donald Trump gets a free pass with white people. He's blonde and needs time to redeem himself

Aaron Paul does have nice eyes. But his looks are as AWG as you get. That, on top of being very short and skinny, makes me think it's just white teenage girls who are known to like boyish, sexually unthreatening, small white guys, that were attracted to him.

As for the character Jesse, that's the wrong one to center a movie around. They'll have to change him a lot to keep the audience interested.

R147 He’s a fan favorite, unfortunately, so I think he’ll probably stay the same unlikable AWG we all know and hate. As for the movie, I’ll look at spoilers to see if they explore the aftermath of Walter’s debacle on the White family and the repercussions of the whole big southwest meth circle getting exposed/the fact that a harmless chemistry teacher was able to get away with being the southwest’s biggest meth maker for years without the DEA ever getting him.

That, r148, and I also want to see if the Schwartzes (Walter White's former partners at Gray Matter Technologies) give Walt Jr the money as directed and then for them to finally get their comeuppance.

Wow, you really are a bunch of toxic Walt's fanboys. Poor helpless Walt, surrounded by monsters.

R150 Walt isn’t a good person, but let’s not pretend like he’s the only disgusting human being on the show. The only character who is truly a good person is Walter’s son.

Is Gus gay in Better Call Saul? Does anyone know? I've never watched it.

R152 I gave up after a few seasons, so dull! Mike is the only interesting thing.

Gorgeous voice R143?? To me, he sounds nasal and whiny.

Any good spoilers for El Camino?

Nothing really much to "interpret" here. Gus=very gay.

Really r155? It comes out tommorow, just watch it.

I agree R88. The surprising thing for me about Gus wasn't that he was gay, but that he could love anyone that deeply. His character was so cold and seemingly sociapathic it was quite a plot twist for me that he had real feelings for anyone.

It made him a lot more interesting that's for sure, and his death scene was memorable too. I was a bit traumatized but it tbh.

T-minus 13.5 hours. Not that I'm counting... x

R156 Reading those YouTube comments. No one thinks

^ *No one thinks he’s gay.

Tio Salamanca thinks he’s gay.

I really wished we had gotten a tiny bit more about Gus in Pinochet's secret police. In some ways, you can see how that moment of watching his lover killed in front of him (I always chose to see that relationship that way. Chicken brothers, indeed) would have left Gus cold afterward in his pursuit of revenge. But, if he had tortured prisoners in a previous life in Chile, would he have been that nervous at the meeting with Don Eladio? It's suggested many times that he's protected - in fact, one of the reasons it wasn't him floating in that pool.

Vince's idea for the Rise of Gus would have been a lot more interesting to me than an origin story on Saul Fucking Goodman. I still haven't seen S4 of that series. I just am not compelled to watch knowing that there's no Chuck in the story anymore. I find Saul/Jimmy to be the least interesting person in that entire cast of characters. Hell, Nacho is more interesting than Jimmy.

I like Jimmy.

No one on YouTube thinks Gus and the guy who got shot were more than friends.

R163 I agree. Saul isn’t boring, he’s just not interesting enough of a character for us to get invested in a whole show centered around him, especially considering that Breaking Bad had us following one of the most interesting main characters in TV history.

BB is the best tv series I've ever seen. Brilliant.

R165 - I agree. As a gay man, it never even occurred to me. Absolutely zero indication.

Zero indication? Hector whips out his dick in front of them and says they like the view. The only personal item in Fring’s office is a photo of the two friends. Fring has no wife or girlfriends. Those are indications.

I love the poster bragging about how clueless he is.

"I'm gay and I never suspected this thing that was very obviously and purposefully laid out by the writers, isn't it impressive how dense I am at following a story!"

Do you want a cookie...?

It doesn’t make sense that someone as calculated and cunning as Gustavo would want such a reckless idiot playing such an instrumental part in his business.

I remember thinking that too: Jesse-types are a dime a dozen in that world, but: I think he recognized Jesse's loyalty to Walt & wanted to switch his loyalties. Jesse was busying doing most of the work at that point with Walt fucking around, so Gus probably thought he could get rid of his troublesome starter while the back up would work just fine.

I was always puzzled about the strong feelings about Skyler; sure she was a ball buster, but Walt gave her plenty of reason to be disappointed in him and she clearly looked at her sister's comfortable life, which is not an uncommon dynamic with siblings. Ironically, if Walt had listened to her, they could've kept their scheme going - instead, Walt has to go rogue. Even Gus reminds him that they had a good thing with Gus, why screw it up?

R171 Because he cared about Hank.

People forget that Jesse is actually valuable. He bluffed his way through the cook in Mexico and ultimately saved Mike and Fring from Don Eladio’s surviiving man (Hector’s grandson.). Destroying Fring’s computer with a magnet was his idea, as was putting water back into the train tanker so the theft would not be detected. And yes, he was loyal (unless you hurt a kid).

Destroying Fring's computer turned out to be a waste because as Hank said, everything was encrypted.

They didn’t know that it was encrypted, so they had to destroy it, and Jesse was the one who figured out how.

El Camino turned out to be a big disappointment to no one’s surprise. You can’t centre a movie around the least interesting character of the series. The comments on Deadline are spot on.

Glad people are wising up and figuring out what a boring lame crybaby “Bitch” Jesse Pinkman is!

Even Skylar and Marie are more interesting than Jesse.

And every single character except Skinny Pete had noticeable weight gain. Especially Todd.

Was Todd’s weight gain a plot point? I assumed it was a fat suit

It was never not entertaining but it really was just a live action cartoon. Great art it ain't.

Even Jesse doesn't look the same. Well, they still have material for another Breaking Bad movie since Skylar, Walt Jr, Marie and Saul weren't touched.