How to spot an alcoholic

Ugh, I have bags under my eyes and I rarely drink.

Arrested development for hard core alcoholics.

They develop quite a belly and bags under eyes. Aging fast (is the biggest tell.)

Also shakes, gets sick if not consuming, has constant stench of alcohol emanating from every pore. Severe bloat, jaundiced skin, or bloodshot eyes and redness to face/nose. Also the aging in dog years.

Red face, looks older, ugly sounding old man voice, sweating a lot, high blood pressure.

Alcoholics look like this.

You can't because you are looking for the stereotype of what an alcoholic looks or acts like.

Are we talking about alcoholics in movies? Handsome, clear skin, always has a bottle of Jack Daniels nearby, yells loudly at the kids to pick up their shit and he's trying to watch the game.

Negative attitude, lover of sarcasm.

Steve Bannon. Alcoholic podter child.

Short temper, lack of impulse control. Falls down a lot.

They smell like vinegar.

Irritable during the day because they can’t drink and are always hungover. Have no money, so they’re driving a beater car and living in a shithole, even though their job pays well enough that they should be living a comfortable lifestyle. Wearing beat up clothes and shoes although they have a really good job. Always have money problems, no credit, no savings, always late with bills or rent. Can’t afford things others in their financial range can.

I had a friend like this. All his coworkers made roughly the same salary. They were all driving big new SUVs and living in nice houses, he was drinking his pay and had nothing. Not even much in the way of professional work wear. Twenty year old car. Renting an unbelievable shithole which he could have fixed up and made nice, but didn’t. He didn’t care about anything but drinking, so why clean the carpet or buy a new couch? The filthiest house I’ve ever seen.

Obvious neglect in home or car maintenance. Lots of long term maintenance that has been deferred, like dirty grout or really dirty door jambs, stains on clothes, carpet or furniture that were never removed. Empty bottles and full ashtrays everywhere.

The reason I mention this as a sign is because alcoholics just don’t care about home maintenance. They care about drinking. That’s it.

Suggesting that every meeting take place in a bar, never wanting to go anywhere else or do anything else where they can’t drink. Become very annoyed if they have to go somewhere where no drinking is allowed. Overdrink at office parties. A lot of alcoholics and drug abusers are also heavy smokers.

Hanging around with strangers a lot, or losing long term friends. Having only friends that are heavy drinkers, and weeding out any relationships that don’t revolve around alcohol and drinking.

Ex-partner or kids hate him, or behind on child support or has no relationship with his kids. Can’t keep a long term relationship.

A big one is the three drink rule: if they can stop at three when they’re someplace where heavy drinking isn’t a good idea, they probably are in control. If they completely lose it after three drinks and become belligerent, overly boisterous in an environment where nobody else is, and refuse to listen to anybody that tells them they need to slow down, they have a problem. Personality change is a big tell. Or becoming angry if you try to take their drink away or get them to eat or drink a non alcoholic drink because they’re consuming too much or too fast.

Do you really think all alcoholics wear a sign? Sometimes, you just don't know. Some are clearly broken-down drunks, sure, but not all.

Way back in the mid-2000s, I started hanging out with a group of people from work who I discovered were huge booze bags. Everything they did revolved around drinking. The more I hung around with them, I found out they drank every single day and got blotto every single weekend. I couldn't keep up with them and didn't want to, so I distanced myself. They all gained a ton of weight over the years and all of them are now obese. What surprising, though, is they all actually look pretty good for their ages (all mid-40s). Not a lot of bags under the eyes, skin is in good condition with very few wrinkles, no red blotches or veiny noses. The weight is really the only give away that they drink way too much. Maybe the weight pushes out the face and diminishes the wrinkles?

R11 yes! Yes! Yes!

R14 They're going to hot the wall by 50.

I have a few prolific drunks in my family on all sides, even step. But one in particular who is the highest functioning is the worst, was in a car accident ( curious as it was his 3rd DUI and they didn't lock him up) but having to be put in a controlled coma on an alcohol drip to prevent shock among other things were involved in saving his life that time. After he was discharged about 4 months later because half the body was shattered he looked like he'd gone back in time 30yrs. It was shocking, but hes back at it and again is a mess (with gout...isnt that fun)

Also the type of liquor imbibed also plays a HUGE part in behavior and physiological indicators that someone's drinking is problematic.

*HIT*

Almost every hardcore alcoholic I've known also smokes pot -- it helps with the nausea.

I've also known a good deal of alcoholics who are also cokeheads. These are generally the drunks who gravitate to bars.

Why should alcohol cost so much though? I don’t get the drink through his pay thing. A bottle of booze is cheaper than an ounce of coke.

Vinegar, r11? Why would that be?

You really have to take the race/ethnicity of the individual into account. Blacks can skate it easily. Easy for hispanics. Easy for NA/Inuits because of their liver enzymes. We'll get into why later. Liver enzymes and missing sweat glands found in blacks and whites. Anglos and especially Irish are dead giveaways. Bloating, ruddiness. Think Alec Baldwin, Steven Bannon, Melanie Griffith. It's a little hard to spot when people are mixed in with multiple phenotypes. But that vinegar one mentioned by R11 is new to me cause just assumed this person was using biofriendly products for cleaning the bathroom.

FUCKING LOVE YOU DATALOUNGE!

Redness in the face is common in alcoholics, but non drinkers can get it too. It's largely genetic.

The constant inexplicable money problems is a very common sign. One of my oldest friends always made more than I did. I always had more money than she did. She was always bouncing checks and then getting payday loans. For the longest time this baffled me. She kept her grooming up. I think female alcoholics are more likely to still try and keep groomed. The results aren't always great. They tend to look cheap and wear styles too young for them. I think they're expecting free drinks because they're so so sexy.

They never want to go anywhere or do anything if there won't be booze. They drink at times very few people would drink. This same friend once ordered wine with lunch at Denny's. I had no idea they had wine at Denny's. We were on a road trip. It was strange time to want to drink.

They push you to drink more than you want. Always with the "come on have another." Sometimes getting defensive when you won't join them. They'll do this when you're not even thinking anything derogatory about their drink (not yet anyway).

Accident prone. Alcoholics often have a lot of bruises. Their cars tend to get dinged up.

A lot of the signs can be easily explained away by themselves. People with experience can recognize the multiple symptoms in one person.

On a woman, skinny arms and legs.

R16, I agree they'll likely hit the wall at some point. My main hag's husband is friends with a guy who drinks an insane amount of beer every day. I seriously can't believe this guy isn't dead. He was very good looking and maintained his looks throughout his 40s despite the heavy drinking. Now he's in his mid-50s and looks very rough--crepey skin, bags under his eyes, his eyes always bloodshot and yellowish, broken capillaries on his nose. He used to have a good physique, but he's gained some weight. I'm surprised he isn't fat, though. That's one thing that he appears to have avoided.

R12, some good tells on some of the varieties of drunks. However the personality change occurs without fail if mixed with indigenous or asian. That's a tell. Some individuals are happy drunks or just mellow. Again, depends on the phenotype(s). The personality change person usually never suffers from the DTs and can't become physically addicted to the point of needing detox. It's really tricky.

They are very sullen and withdrawn... until they get one drink in them. Suddenly, they're the life of the party.

Smell like nail polish remover

Bloated face

Mint or gum in mouth

Paul Newman was an alcoholic who drank a case of beer every day. He lived to be 83, never got fat, and never showed any obvious physical or mental signs of alcoholism. Of course, if he hadn't been an alcoholic, he might have lived to be 103.

R27, the nail polish remover. What is their phenotype and what are they drinking? Need to know.

Liver keytones are nail polish remover smell

Alcoholic ketoacidosis causes the body to burn fat instead of sugar. This process produces ketones which cause the breath to smell like nail polish remover. This can occur with any race or type of alcohol.

The pot smoking is interesting, I did not know that! They hard core alcoholic I knew was also a very heavy daily pot smoker. Reeked of pot, cigarette smoke and beer all the time. His clothes, curtains, upholstery and house also smelled all the time.

It was so bad I would go home and put all my clothes straight into a plastic bag when I went home, and take a shower and wash my hair. I don’t have a very good nose and I couldn’t tell if I was smelling that way too, but my clothes did after a couple of hours in his house so I had to assume my hair did too.

Also he was a very heavy sweater, sweat pouring down his face at the smallest effort. And he smelled like stale beer all the time. He must have been sweating the alcohol out of his pores.

[quote]Why should alcohol cost so much though? I don’t get the drink through his pay thing. A bottle of booze is cheaper than an ounce of coke.

I'm wondering about this as well. If someone is raking in an upper-middle class salary, as several posters here have described, a few bottles of booze or rounds of drinks in a bar every week isn't going to put them out financially.

Most of the alcoholics I've known have been puffy and overweight, but there have been a few that were thin and fit. I think it all depends on metabolism or something like that.

R22, I’ve also known a female alcoholic and she constantly dressed extremely slutty. Was always looking to pick up guys in bars, no interest in long term relationships. This was not people going to bars to meet partners, this was a group of alcoholic “bar friends,” whose entire friendships were in the bar or bar related only.

There’s a whole bar culture of people who think hard core drinking every night is normal and those people reinforce each other into thinking their lifestyle is superior to all others. They stay up drinking all night most week nights and somehow go to work and function. They also like to play music very loud and think anyone that wants them to quiet down in a residential neighborhood late at night is a killjoy or uncool. When they’re drinking, they want to be LOUD! It’s fun!

Who cares what the neighbors think or if they have to go to work tomorrow.

Alcoholics do not trust non-drinkers and flush them out of their lives like vermin. I had one tell me being hungover every single day was normal and people who do not drink are not normal, they are freaks. “Everyone drinks,” he told me, meaning non-drinking is a sign of mental illness or some type of social disorder.

In my experience, alcoholics who face serious financial trouble are either 1) facing legal trouble stemming from their drinking (a single DUI can cost over $5,000) or 2) are also addicted to other drugs, usually cocaine.

I've also found that alcoholics seem to get buzzed almost immediately from those first few sips. Whereas most people it would take a couple of drinks for us to slightly slur or show the modest first signs, alcoholics sort of get those first signs immediately. They can then drink like a dish but that first hit immediately triggers something. I am not being clear here. It's hard to explain.

^ fish

R33, maybe it’s the cigarettes and pot that go with it.

I just know that every alcoholic I know is broke and has no money for ordinary or extra expenses. I knew one woman whose children were wearing thin sweaters in the dead of winter, while Mommy was at the bar every night, wearing a new slutty outfit. God help you if you tried to suggest, maybe Junior needs a coat. Instant belligerent attack.

Poster Boy:

R37, I knew a big heavy guy like that, no fish involved. It’s a chemical reaction, like, “here comes the stuff I need to feel happy.” Like an addict getting their fix.

Also RE: money: most alcoholics have poor impulse control. This probably spills to other areas of their lives , like financial planning.

A lot of them think they’re going to die young, so why not party to the end? But then they don’t die young, they get cancer and liver failure.

I've known alcoholics who don't smoke pot or only do it occasionally. I've also known pot heads with little interest in alcohol. I knew a guy in school who really looked down on illegal drug use while putting 6 gin and tonics a night. I've also known people who've never met a mood altering substance they didn't like.

I think a lot of it is genetic. The alcoholics I’ve known well have alcoholic parents. And they have no natural stop on any substance they can get their hands on, no matter what it is.

r39, see my post at r7.

[quote]My main hag's husband is friends with a guy who drinks an insane amount of beer every day. I seriously can't believe this guy isn't dead.

Just last month, my brother ran into our old childhood neighbor in the supermarket, a man who drank beer all day long. He was buying two cases of beer and my brother said he smelled of beer as well. In the middle of the day. I couldn't believe this guy was still alive because he was drinking all day when my brother and I were kids, 35 years ago!

Back in the day, my mother and father were incredulous that this guy could hold down a job because he was such an alcoholic.

In the Dallas suburbs here. Neighbors drink every fucking day. They're drinking right now. Trumpers with kids and a lot of guns. I brought up LSD at a party once and they acted like I just bit the head off a dove and now they feign sympathy for my son.

The vinegar odor is a new one on me. This person is one of my tenants living onsite.

He's from Norwegian stock, 2nd generation. Blue-grey eyes, blond hair and 50 years old. Had to have electrician come in an emergency and there it all was. A funnel on the office desk surrounded by empty water bottles. A few craft beers from TJ, Sky vodka and big bottles of whiskey. His laundry basket reeked of vinegar hard. He reeks of vinegar. I'm guessing this must be the whiskey coming out of his pores. He uses the vodka to hide in water bottles in daytime. That's an old trick we all know. Not sure if vodka makes a white person smell of vinegar. It's gotta be the whiskey. He'll also only dump his liquor bottles into the recyclable pail when it's already at the curb when he arrives after work around midnight. He also has two vehicles parked and used to take the bus to work until I lent him one of my older racing bikes.

Like R12 states, doesn't do a damned thing around his apartment, the property. No upkeep. Lies around in bed all day and night when he's off of work. He's so bad off he won't even bring an empty pail back from the curb. If I'm at my other place and come back a few days later, the pail will still be sitting out there. The LAZIEST Norwegian person to ever live!

Only positive thing is he likes the climate cold. Struggles to quit smoking like he's some health nut but the truth is, he can't afford it. Late with rent after he settled in. Figured he was a drinker but that's nothing compared to old crackheads and suboxone/heroin addicts who are EVERYWHERE! Figured an alcoholic isn't going to rob for his fix but he struggles with bills because he's paying off bills from the past with all of this ongoing fuckery. Thin but flabby. Obvious DTs when just home from work and in such a rush to get back to his bottle. Also a nervous facial tic comes on when he's forced to abstain. Blames it on a nervous condition. Yeah, I bet. Not much longer as I gave him the boot with a gentle excuse. He also gets very pissy when he's not drinking. Not a bad looking man but he doesn't have a boyfriend or "pool boys". A couple of enabling hags here and there who get tired of his sponging and him asking for favors.

Stingy as all get out, may I add

R31, thank you so much

R47 the weird thing is that when you add up the mental, physical, financial costs to the individual and the cost to society, alcohol is the most damaging drug. People have done studies on this. Crack is the worst thing for the individual, but not as bad for the rest of us. Alcoholics cause accidents, commit assault, and reduce workplace productivity.

[quote]Also RE: money: most alcoholics have poor impulse control. This probably spills to other areas of their lives , like financial planning.

That's a good explanation. When they get drunk they like to spend money on other things.

I had a friend who is the exact same age as me (49). She was very pretty in her younger years but she did some drugs and now just drinks and my god, if you looked at her and I standing next to each other, she looks at least 10 years older than me. I rarely drink and just last year tried pot for the pain benefits. She and I used to go and man, she could drink. And yes, she was always trying to get me to drink more with her. Thing is, she was a great person but when she hit a certain point with drinks she turned into a judgemental bitch. I finally broke off the friendship after we fought in a restaurant one night and I was just done. I feel bad for her but she's the only one who can save herself. But looking at her, she has a ton of wrinkles, her neck is getting that rooster waddle look, and she often smells of vinegar. Every picture she posts on Facebook has her either drinking or partying and her eyes are glazed over. She also rarely washes her hair which grosses me out. But whatever. On the other hand, I look pretty good for an old dame and am grateful I never got really into drugs or drinking.

OP, just look in the mirror.

When sober: withdrawn, morose, irritable, vague, self-pitying

At the beginning of a boozing session: talkative, more alert

When the booze kicks in: glassy-eyed, aggressive verbal outbursts, bullying, ranting, rambling, slurring, lack of coordination, physical intimidation (getting in your face, breaking objects), crying, self-pitying

Alcoholics use alcohol as an anti-anxiolytic.

Agree about the poor impulse control. Drugs, gambling and reckless spending are additional vices of many alcoholics.

[quote]The reason I mention this as a sign is because alcoholics just don’t care about home maintenance. They care about drinking. That’s it.

This isn't so. I know a couple in which the husband is an alcoholic, he is also OCD. He cleans like a fucking 50s housewife when he is sober and woe betide you if you use the 'wrong' spoon to stir a cup of coffee in his kitchen, which looks like a show home kitchen. It's jam packed with racks of booze, of course. He starts boozing around lunchtime, every day. Retired.

Joan Crawford was a raging alcoholic and she was mega-OCD. Crazy about cleanliness are orderliness.

Knows people named "Squee". Gets nasty and belligerent during Supreme Court hearings. Gets elected to SCOTUS regardless.

Bruise easily, spend money stupidly when drunk, paranoid due to memory lapses when drunk, crying jags, trouble maintaining relationships. friends MUST be heavy drinkers as well, get drunk super easily, blame others for your own shortcomings, history of childhood trauma, self-loathing whilst appearing overly confident, depression.

Think it’s hard to tell before 40 - except for those who are far gone. Functioning alcoholics are much more common - and they tend not show too much physical evidence except maybe skin tone. And then only if white. I know some black guys who drink insane amounts and look fine - and strangely most also seem incredibly under control even when wasted.

I also think some Irish/English can look like alkies due to poor diet, stress and absence of sleep. Just horrible skin. In summary - hard to say based purely on physical appearance. And even a lot of the personality traits are not definitive. I think the biggest indicator is behavior when drinking.

[quote]And even a lot of the personality traits are not definitive.

The characteristic behaviours and attitudes of alcoholics aren't necessarily personality traits. Any personality can become alcoholic, in theory - introverts, extroverts, loners, party queens. The thing is, excessive drinking over time alters the brain and neurological pathways, and it changes the way the body functions. That creates big changes in behaviour.

Royal alcoholic Prince Charles

Has it ever been confirmed that Charles drinks too much? He's never lost his shit in public, AFAIK.

Wernicke Korsakoff Syndrome (aka wet brain)

R50, the damage to their kids is bad, too.

These dumb bitches think it's okay to drink all day every goddamned day as long as their house is clean, they're not falling down, and their drink is in a Yeti. How fucking stupid do they think their kids are?

But they'll get super offended if you say "Jesus Christ!" Or "God damn" in front of them.

Yes bitch, Jesus loves you more, you with your boozing and your guns and your toxic Chinese sweatshop Hobby Lobby crosses on the wall.

[quote]He's never lost his shit in public,

He's usually not drunk in public. He and Camilla are both booze hounds. They lost it in public at a ceremony in Canada.

Re: the cost of alcohol. There's a big difference in price between buying bottles from a store and drinking at home vs. sitting in a bar and having alcohol (drinks) served to you. Also, if you buy bottles, you can go really cheap, e.g., Popov vodka in large size.

Some people need to drink *and* socialize with other people who are drinking (i.e., at a bar). That's where things get expensive and also risky because you could be driving home and getting a DUI or killing someone.

I kind of mixed up this thread with the fraus drinking themselves to death at alarming rates thread. Sorry.

R69 damn you.

R22,those car dings are known as"whiskey dents".

The alcoholics I’ve known like to drink in bars and socialize. They were spending a lot of money on drinks, every week. All their friends did too.

The other thing is, they drink much longer than regular drinkers. They started right after work, and ended at 3 am. Or later.

Most people would have started later or ended earlier, or only drink on weekends. Watching somebody drinking at 3 or 4 in the afternoon, knowing that by 8 pm they’re going to be totally unreasonable and unreachable, unable to understand that blasting loud music all night is not okay or that (other) people need to sleep and they’re disturbing them, gives one a feeling of dread. You know the fight is coming. They like to start a fight too.

I noticed that some alcoholics are repressing a lot of anger and resentment towards other people and they cannot express it unless they’re drunk. Most people would say, my dad’s an asshole, I hate my job, whatever. Not these people. They can only say it drunk and the rest of the time they hold in way too much. Kind of like Ray Donovan, come to think of it. “How’s everything?” “Fine.” Unless they’re drunk, then every bit of resentment comes out. (Unlike Ray Donovan).

R61, just horrible skin😂

R63 Charles and Depp have the fingers of gout.

Overweight, all of their friendships are shallow and revolve around drinking, become angry easily, incapable of working through negative emotions and thus uses alcohol/drugs to forget their troubles instead of actually fixing the problems in their life. They live in denial and may pretend to be happy and fun but when you examine their lives a little closer, they're fucking miserable.

OP, are you writing a thesis? If you are waiting for us to give you answers. Do not. Just put the bottle down and back away...

Many of the Golden Age film actresses who are held up as sleek, glamorous beauty icons on the DL were either alcoholics or would be considered so by today's standards.

R73, nah. You're mixing that up with indigenous reactions. Ye ole firewater. If you see a personality change in a North American then it is time for a DNA test. Always spouting that here to warn fellow North Americans.

This is the problem w/Depp, Locklear and Chris Brown. If someone is indigenous mixed with Irish then Lord help them. An anthropologist of mixed race knows best.♾

Whoever said skinny arms and skinny legs for women is so right.

R77, bring SOMETHING to the table, like moi or R11. Otherwise, GTFO

R80 said the woman with skinny legs 🦵 and arms.

R81 ok, does this work? I just picked a table...

R80, no. Skinny arms/legs a la pomme shape is a nordic adaption to survive the cold. Also, when fraternal twins run in the family.

They end up having to go to those damn AA meetings!

R45, this was a high functioning alcoholic:

R67😅 even the damned throat singers can't keep a straight face.

R87 that needs to be a thread. So funny.

R83, your table is a cheap pressed wood desk in a filthy hovel in an inner city ghetto a la public housing.

Please! Let us have our own place without your racist black ass injecting itself on every damned thread. Go discuss the white killer of that 7 year old black child or Wendy Williams thread.

Get the fuck outta here, you ghetto sockpuppet cretin living on the balls of your ass. Termini!

Woe! Projecting much?

Back to lipstick alley with you, Beruta. Celebitchy, Female First, Dlisted, Radiowhatever, TMZ.

Beat it, nigger

R91 end of story. You showed your true self. I love you for having such a racist tantrum. Now go take your meds...

It's the eyes. Premature weathered look around the eyes. Unhappy eyes. I can sot one a mile away.

R94 dead eyes. My grandparents were raging alcoholics. They burned down their home on multiple occasions, etc. Terrible life. Drinking destroys people and families. Destroyed my mom’s life views in a very dysfunctional manner. My mom ‘joined’ a church and went ‘Prude’ overboard.

More like I exposed your true self R92. Problem is your white/asian/latino hating old ass won't take any meds. GTFOutta here, you old shut in. Nobody gives a fuck about your slave descendant legacy, ya old racist lez.

The least desirable being on the planet. Lowest demographic. Not our legacy.

R96 you are becoming amusing now. Wait a few days... reread your posts. Who is really the angry racist man? I’ll still be here to help hold you up darling, because your meltdown is becoming huge.

R96 my song to you.

To R54's comprehensive list, I would add little to no appetite for any food, terrible breath that no amount of oral hygiene and mints can mask, a silly grin that gets more pronounced with the drinking and snoring to wake up the dead.

[quote]a silly grin that gets more pronounced with the drinking and snoring to wake up the dead.

Spot on honey

R28 He frequently sounded drunk, though.

R28/R101, the three pack a day smoking habit killed Newman.

Ben Affleck is a good example of that alcoholic 'look.' You can tell he's a drunk from a mile away. Vince Vaughan too.

R103 I think both Ben and Vince used to be closet drinkers. Now they are I do not give a shit drunks.

They both stopped giving a shit a long time ago.

Funny, I blocked R37 and R36 was blocked as well.

Paul Newman was fucking gorgeous though, alkie or not.

Scottish Genes:

R107 fuck yes! Seriously, almost like an after dinner mint. Rugged and sexy. True Marlboro man.

High functioning literary family:

R110 who is that?

R111: that’s DL Fave Joan Didion the famous writer, with her less famous writer husband John Gregory Dunne, and their adopted daughter, Quintana Roo.

Quintana would later die of Acute Pancreatitis, caused by alcoholism, in 2005, at the age of 39.

R112 gracias.

OP, the big belly could be from fluid retention caused by liver failure. Is your friend mentally vague? Do you know if his lower legs are swollen? I went through this with a friend last year.

Sometimes it’s easy.

[quote]Almost every hardcore alcoholic I've known also smokes pot

You just described my ex.

When I was younger, I could often spot them as the parents of friends. Sometimes my friends did not realize their parents were alcoholics and I never told them. But sometimes when the parent tries cold turkey, the truth is revealed.

How could you tell?

On The View thread there has been speculation that Miss Mc Cain is an alcoholic. Red face, irritable, outbursts, splotchy, always talking about drinking. Or maybe she's just a spoiled brat.

Kavanaugh is an obvious alcoholic and I hope he dies from pancriatitis or chirosis.

To the poster who noticed that the first few shots on board seemed to act faster, it was the relief. They were drinking at that point to get straight. I know it only too well.

R119 or both

Not in every case, but in many the drinking is a symptom. Many AAs would tell you it is a symptom of not having a relationship with a higher power. For me, it was all my gay angst and problems with mummy.

[quote]To the poster who noticed that the first few shots on board seemed to act faster, it was the relief. They were drinking at that point to get straight.

Do you mean they were starting to get a little into withdrawal symptoms and getting "straight" meant feeling normal?

physically its not always easy to spot unless there is red face or flush..........I have a female friend that is an alcoholic and she has farily frequent falls. SHe also gets sloppily overly senitmental and gushy. She has a variety of health problems and skin problems. Also her memory is really noticeably failing and she is in her mid 60 s. At least 2 of her 3 kids are borderline alcoholics including one son that has some brain damage from a teenage drunken car accident when he was a passenger in a car. He has had 2 recent dui s ((15 years after accident). He blames everybody but himself. A year ago his mom and he visited for 2 days The first day he had 15 beers and the second day 16. His mom did not say a word. She got bombed both days as well. I never go to a lunch or a dinner where they dont order alcoholic drinks. SHe is constantly going to drs and I cant help but wonder if any of her doctors arent picking up on the underlying alcoholism.

R120 or both

I've known many people of Irish heritage who have flushed, red faces and they are not alcoholics. Ruddiness is a very common trait with those people, even if they don't drink.

Talking about the next drink when there’s one half full in front of them, and not in a ‘where should we go next?’ breezy way. More like, panicked and anxious.

Why is everyone looking at me?

We love you Candy! I wish I had known you when you were drunk all the time.

R114, don't know about his legs and swelling. He's fine mentally and doesn't seem obviously drunk, but the eye bags and weight gain around the middle make me wonder. Belly weight is more upper abdomen than waist.

Shoulders looking hunched but don't think that would be related.

OP - here is the location of an enlarged liver. An enlarged liver is a symptom of cirrhosis, which is the final stage of alcoholic liver disease. If the alcoholic does not stop drinking, cirrhosis will lead to liver failure and death.

I'm dating them.

People who don't remember what they told you the night before

R132, what’s the green thing?

Irish w/ some indigenous on father's side and 100% Scottish on mother's side. Alcoholism runs rampant on both sides of my family. I'm a recovering alcoholic and developed full blown alcoholism in my 20's. Nearly died from it which was scary since I was so young. In my 50's now and I know if I ever picked up a drink again I would die.

r135 Gall bladder.

I’d add a shocking amount of alcoholics post pics on Facebook of just their bottles of beer on bars or their on backyard or full glasses of wine. What is that?

Also pee themselves at night. My friend had to buy a new sofa bc the drink peed on it the night before and there is no way to get that smell out. Peeing on yourself is huge.

More than usual car accidents and fights in bars.

Muscle wasting in the arms & legs, plus a bloated belly. Excuses for everything; angry and accusatory if questioned about their drinking.

They usually have an alcoholic beverage in their hand too.....continue the discussion.

Well we all knew Liz Vargas was a drunk. We knew. We ALL knew.

R140 they usually have mini booze bottle’s in their pockets, etc. continue on the conversation. They feel invincible; until they get caught. Happens to the best of people.

What R2 said. If they're 45 and act like teenagers (dependent, flighty, impulsive, lack wisdom etc.) that's a red flag.

Also if they know everything about booze, how to make mixed drinks, and where the best bars are. And if they have one of those stupid faux cocktail bars in their living room, or they display their liquor bottles prominently.

Eldergay here Remember having complete bars in your office? Bewitched, etc.

I know an alcoholic who's 52 and honest to god you would think he was 75. He looks absolutely awful.

There’s a lot of different levels of alcoholic. I think a lot of the heavy drinking “functional” alcoholics hold down jobs, go to the gym and have a life. The extreme examples here seem like Bukowski or homeless types who drink heavily 7 days a week for hours. The frau drunks and most gay drunks I know tend to be weekend warriors with a day or two during the week if they can get away. And it’s really hard to tell with a lot of them - unless they are Irish/English /Scottish (and even then, I’ve seen non alkies of those ethnicities who look shitty too thanks to bad skin)

I had a boyfriend who was never officially diagnosed, but it seemed obvious. He also loved pot (which I grew to love, because it made me strangely productive, but without that depressive comedown that Adderall has). He was/is a bartender and he thought nothing of buying everyone's drinks at any given time. I had to get him off that habit, because it seemed like these people only wanted to be around him because he'd buy their drinks.

He thought of himself as a great humorist, but he was mostly just a teller of in-jokes from the bar the night before. He thought he looked great for his age, but he always looked a good 10 years older than he was and had stomach bloat and would continue to squeeze into size 32 jeans when he really needed a 36 at least. He'd always tell me things multiple times and get mad if I told him that he told me that earlier in the day or two nights ago. He'd always get very horny when drunk and want me to get drunk so I'd want to have sex. Unfortunately, alcohol doesn't quite affect me the same way it affected him (much like pot, which made me productive and made him pass out). Sometimes, I'd humor him, but he was always limp as a noodle when he'd try to fuck when drunk.

He was always making excuses for his friends who were true pieces of shit (and almost always drunk themselves.) Hanging out with them was a truly depressing experience as I was usually the most sober person in the room and I'd have to listen to these people go on and on about their issues (most of which could be cured by not drinking.) You learn a lot by stepping into that culture. They'd defend the worst behavior on earth.

I remember being at Disney World with him once and he was so pissed that there was only alcohol in designated spots. It was like that one all our trips. We'd check in to the the hotel and the first thing he wanted was a drink.

He'd take shots of vodka throughout the day. He'd causally joke that he had a drinking problem, but God forbid you suggest he does.

Tom Hanks looks like an alcoholic.

Thanks, R137. Congratulations, R136, good luck as well.

Flushed face, bags under the eyes, etc.

r 150, damn, Ben Affleck looks AWFUL! I think he is going to die soon.

Occasional bruises and injuries sustained from “accidents” while drunk. There’s always a story about the weird accident leading to the bruised cheek or broken ankle.

Chris Pine is allegedly a raging alcoholic, as has been discussed on DL extensively. He's aging terribly.

R146 is correct that there are different levels of alcoholic. My father was a functional alcoholic. He never missed work, and he'd only drink after work but damn, you could tell he was dying for a drink as the first thing he always did when he got home was head for the refrigerator to get a beer.

He always got embarrassingly drunk at weddings and family parties and then would stubbornly insist on driving home. But for the most part he held down a job and functioned on a day-to-day basis. He also cycled. He would maybe have 2-3 beers a night, but over a 6-9 months period it would escalate to 6 a night. Then he'd start buying two six packs and have more than six a night, then it would culminate in one big, drunk blowout where he'd disappear for a whole day getting wasted at bars. After the blowout, my mother would lay into him and threaten to leave and he'd scale back again to 2-3 a night. Always the same pattern.

My dad's brother, though, he was a raging alcoholic. He'd get so bad he'd stay at home all day drinking, calling in sick to work all the time. He could not function. My aunt says that was always the way with both of them. My dad would escalate then cut back, but my uncle would get wrecked on a daily basis and not be able to go to work. My brother, who quit drinking was he was in his mid-20s, was more like our uncle than our father and he lost countless jobs over the years until he got sober.

My mom's brother was also a functional alcoholic. Even today in his 70s, he has a part-time job because if he's not working, he'll drink far too much. Even he acknowledges this. Amazingly he still drinks a 12-pack a day, so just imagine how much he drank if he didn't have his part-time job! How can anyone of any age, never mind in his 70s, drink that much every single day and not be dead? Some people must have stronger livers.

Years ago someone told me Bill Clinton is an alky because of his bulbous nose. Is that true? Doesn't seem like much to go by.

R155 you taught me a new word. Thank you.

Holy shit, is that Ben's oldest kid helping his fat, drunk ass get across the street at R150? Or, does it just look like she's helping his fat, drunk ass across the street? Never mind, it's Ben Affleck. OF COURSE he's drunk.

Clinton inherited the condition and he is not an alcoholic, he may have Irish ancestors ?

Kavanaugh seems to be an alcoholic...maybe he will stumble down some marble stairs somewhere in D.C.?

They care if you drink or not.

They “don’t trust” people who don’t drink.

They urge you to have a drink. And another.

They call you a lightweight.

They get defensive about their own drinking even if you don’t notice or care.

They think it’s funny to sneak alcohol into inappropriate places. I chaperoned a daytime field trip for my kids’ class one day. A mom brought a hard cider in a can and urged me to share it with her. Aren’t we being naughty! Lady... that’s not really cool. It wasn’t enough to get drunk or anything, but we were having a lunch break with kids. Sheesh.

R159 Wouldn't do too much damage because of the bodies state of hyper-relaxation, he'd have some good bruises. Damage to the head has already been well underway since hes a well documented binge drinker.

[quote]How can anyone of any age, never mind in his 70s, drink that much every single day and not be dead? Some people must have stronger livers.

It always amazes me how some people can drink and/or smoke and live to be elderly. Just the other day I saw an old lady sitting in a car in a parking lot - she had to be 80 if she was a day - and she was smoking a cigarette. One of my great-grandmothers drank whiskey every day and smoked unfiltered cigarettes and lived to be 91.

R154, my father was an inveterate alcoholic. Really bad. Like, swigging straight cheap vodka all day, starting first thing in the morning.

His pancreas was absolutely destroyed, but his liver was perfectly healthy.

Go figure.

A bulbous nose is a possible symptom, but not proof. A red, splotchy face might make one wonder if he drinks. And that's about it. Clinton's problems seem to be/have been overeating and chasing women. I think the nose and complexion have to do with allergies, not alcohol.

I the child of a man who poured Scotch into his coffee mug to start the day, so I know a bit about alcoholics. But I don't claim encyclopedic knowledge.

That dark haired comedian on Saturday Night Live. She is great but she looks like an alke to me. Why can't I think of her name? She is one of my favorites.

My Dad lost his teeth and most of his stomach, probably because he drank moonshine.

Ben's eyes are actually swollen...seems sick to me, not drunk. If we are talking tall drunk actors, I'll take Ben over Vince (the Republican) any time.

^ r165. You referring to Cecily Strong? I don't really see alkie traits if that's who you mean. Hmmmm

[quote] Holy shit, is that Ben's oldest kid helping his fat, drunk ass get across the street at [R150]? Or, does it just look like she's helping his fat, drunk ass across the street? Never mind, it's Ben Affleck. OF COURSE he's drunk.

It is shocking to me that his children are allowed to be with him when he is clearly not sober. Are those liver spots on the back of his hand? He's a mess. That's what you get when you breeze in and out of Mickey Mouse rehabs.

[quote]Muscle wasting in the arms & legs, plus a bloated belly. Excuses for everything; angry and accusatory if questioned about their drinking.

This describes the hag my incel neighbor moved into his house. What a pathetic couple they are.

Did Gretchen Moll ever really have a big break? She got the cover of Vanity Fair, but what was her big role. I always thought the big issue with that cover was that she didn't have the resume for it. She hadn't had big roles in big movies. It made her a joke. Every wondered why she got the cover. They wondered who she was sleeping with. She still works a lot so she must be fairly well liked in the industry.

No, r171. That's why she started drinking so heavily.

R142 Agreed. Continue the discussion....

Skinny arms and legs and a big belly are very common signs.

After they quit drinking, they aren't as much "fun" as they used to be.

Cisily Strong. Her tummy is not just fat, it is liver damage, in my opinion.

Shaking hands / fingers.

Especially in the morning r177.

I have a fuckbuddy who's an alcoholic and he's 32. He says it's been that way since his teens. He's a sweet guy loves animals and luckily for him it's not showing yet except maybe lines under his eyes. He drinks a case of beer a day. He has an extremely physical job and olive complexion so he is lucky. Sometimes when I've seen him early in the morning he's still buzzed from the night before and will drink more alcohol to feel normal again. He drinks and drives sometimes and whenever he has a free day he looks forward to sitting around just drinking. He knows he's an alcoholic but doesn't feel it's a big problem because he does pay his bills and owns a house. He's probably one of the hardest workers I've ever met and a chain smoker.

I have a functional alcoholic friend, really an acquaintance now since I only see him when with mutual friends. I got edged out of his inner circle when I quit partying in my 30s. He doesn't drink or smoke all day at his job but he cracks open a beer in the car on the way home, and passes out drunk by 10 or 11. He's open about his problem with friends and doesn't miss work. Everyone knows him as the life of the party, very successful in business, no visible dysfunction (besides drinking in the car LOL). I wonder though how long he can go on like this. He's 53.

If I drink 1 margarita, my bed and pillow start calling :)

One sign is the head-start.

Some drunks -when sober- hold onto the first syllable of a word before completing a sentence. It’s alcoholic stroke or some shit.

^ r182. I know exactly what you are talking about. It is so obscure that I wasn't even going to post it here. Amazing someone else has seen this as well. A work colleague does this incessantly.

R182, can you elaborate on that? Not trying to be a dick, I really don’t understand. And I want to!

[qoute]R182, can you elaborate on that? Not trying to be a dick, I really don’t understand. And I want to!

Becomes

[quote]Arrrrrrrr182, can you elaborate on that?

Wow another hint, thanks R185. Never subjected to an actual true tertiary stage alcoholic before. Just got rid of a tenant yesterday, finally who suffered at 51 years. The place reeks of his rotting liver. He complained about me smoking in the vestibule on frigid days because he didn't want his stuff to stink of smoke. Yet he himself was a smoker! Bumming cigs left and right mind you. Made the pretense of cutting down for health reasons but the truth is really financial. His loser drunken lifestyle had him in serious debt. Too lazy to bother with tubes and cigarette injector. Just so delusional. Mistaking kindness for weakness. Selfish. Stunted at 12 years old. In times where he'd have to abstain he'd have this annoying facial tic combined with shaking, trembling hands. Blamed it on a nervous condition. The rotting liver of vinegar and nail polish remover odor is a new one for me though. Especially after a shower the odor would seep through the vents. Just assumed he was using a spray bottle of vinegar and water to wipe down the shower after use.

[quote]Yet he himself was a smoker! Bumming cigs left and right mind you.

Ah, yes. The kind of smoker who won't buy cigarettes because they're "too expensive" or they "don't really smoke." But they're happy to smoke all of yours.

That's him R187. Getting the rotting liver stench out of the apartment is proving to be a challenge.

R188, you’re going to have to repaint. Don’t waste time trying to do something else because it won’t work.

Start with three thin coats of Kilz primer. There are several types of Kilz now, maybe they have an odor blocker. It makes a good base coat and any paint you use will really stick and last a long time.

I’ve having this same problem, the former owner of my townhouse was elderly and diabetic, and some strong odor exuded from his pores. The main rooms were all repainted, but a walk in closet wasn’t. It’s now ten years later and it still smells like that. Especially when it’s hot. I can’t hang clothes in there and everything has to be in a plastic tub wrapped in plastic. One of these days I’m going to have to pull everything out and paint it. It’s the only room in the house that wasn’t painted and the only one that smells.

The next door neighbor told me the smell permeated into their place when I moved in. There’s one common wall. I have no idea how. The A/Cs and ductwork are completely separate.

That's disgusting ^

Thanks R189 but there's no way I'm painting over that work of art when I renovated the apartment just a few years ago. Custom blended Ralph Lauren textured paint with a slight shimmer.

Being that Bed Bitch and Beyond no longer stocks the hand held steamer had to do a search online. Delivery any day now. Now I can tackle even the wooden window frames. I'll also be able to extract the stench from the grout in the bathroom. Bleaching and scrubbing that grout is not the answer because it was custom blended to a dark charcoal shade. The bathroom isn't large so I was able to splurge on the highest end imported tile. Bathroom and kitchen alone raised the value astronomically.

So the steamer will be the answer to the deep clean challenge. I've gone through about 6 Scünci steamers in the past 14 years. They only last for so long. Super addicting and rewarding as well as costly when you need to find things to steam. Like ruining the rubber seal on the refrigerator or cleaning a skylight in February. Live and learn 😅

Somewhat depressingly, I'm associating most of these traits and tells with some of my long deceased uuuuuncles.

Dated a raging alcoholic for nine months. He had the bloated red face, no impulse control, pathological liar and smelled like hell at all times. He tried to get back together with me after six months by picking a fight. To this day, I have never met a bigger piece of shit, and I told him that.

My husband used to be a social worker at an Alzheimer’s facility. Nearly all the patients had a history of alcoholism and substance abuse. It might be wise to save a few brain cells for your old age.

My dad:

Forced in to early retirement in his 50s because he was calling in sick all the time (govt. job). Distended abdomen. Anger issues. Bloodshot eyes. Smelly. Poor hygiene. Dressing in old reggedly clothes. Sits around watching TV and drinking. No interests or hobbies except drinking and bitching at his second wife, who finally left him last year. Denies he has a problem even though EVERYONE knows. Says things like "I haven't had a drink in a year," even though he drinks daily. Doesn't think he ever was or is an alcoholic and says he's "always been able to quit cold turkey" whenever he wants. Has cirrhosis and Hep C and claims a doctor told him his cirrhosis was "cured" so he started drinking again but "not all the time." Drinks daily until he vomits blood then quits for a little while. Becomes enaged if you even HINT he has a problem. Always broke.

^ To add, he's a former meth addict, which he does admit, and he really did quit that decades ago. So he thinks alcohol is no big deal and isn't a problem for him.

Neely O'Hara

R195 What a story!! I’ve seen half that in a lot of people- especially the ENDLESS lying & delusional rationalizing!

I'm so glad that my parents didn't drink.

She cohosts a morning television program with an Egyptian woman.

Hey, I can hold my own!

R200 is seconded.

Their hands may be shaking. They may be a little yellow and sometimes their waistline gets a little unsightly.

R200 Who is Boozy Lee?

R194, that’s really interesting. Alzheimer’s is always presented as something totally random. Maybe that’s because they think they can’t get money to research a disease caused by alcohol abuse.

My own grandparents had issues with dementia and did not drink, but my grandfather was a POW in WWII and nearly starved to death. He wasn’t affected until his nineties.

I read a story about nurses who were POWs of the Japanese. They were severely starved. They had several reunions years later. A lot of them were showing signs of dementia quite early, even in their sixties. They said people lost brain cells due to starvation, then when they aged, they didn’t have any extra. So that may be why my grandfather had the issue. He also had kidney damage from starvation.

My grandmother was in a serious car accident when she was about ninety. She suffered from a lot of forgetfulness and it looked like she was mentally failing. They said the accident shook loose some debris in her arteries. It took about a year for it to settle down, but she did get quite a bit better. Towards the very end, when she was really frail, she was forgetful again.

My guess is that dementia is caused by some type of physical frailty.

My great grandmother never drank and she developed dementia. Her younger sister did as well and she never drank. They never starved.

There are many people who never drank, took drugs or had any trauma and they developed dementia/Alzheimers.

R191 here. When back from dinner tonight, entered the apartment. Armed with gloves, sage, pine boughs, glade, baking soda..you name it. Didn't stay too long because the smell is vile. Permeating everything. Lock it up and start cleaning around the entrance outside for some fresh air. Finding cigarette butts just flicked even though there's a stone basin for an ashtray. Lazy fucker. A bag of recyclables loaded in the garbage pail. 100 Pipers blended scotch whiskey. Like thirty of them. It's really cold here tonight so my nose started running. Go to wipe my nose with the paper towel in my hand (it was sitting in the apartment) and just started heaving!

So the rotting liver smell is from a cheap whiskey drinking narcissistic loser. A special brand of stank.

r208 you might want to look into hiring a professional cleaning crew.

The acid test is always if the first thing they think of when they wake up is that they want a drink - then they're an alcoholic. Open bars also bring out the hardcore drunks.

And then you have the anxiety drinkers who can go months (even years) without a drink but once they start a session, they can't stop. These also tend to be your weekend warriors.

i was friends with a guy who was/is an alcoholic. he was always on the prowl for people to go out and drin with him. at one point i realized he would ask different people from the same friend group individually to hang out on different days so it doesn't become too obvious. looking back at events/parties, it was always him who drank the most.

he was in financial trouble all the time because going out and drinking every night does add up, especially if you're inviting people. also, every single day there were issues tied to his drinking. he needed his keys replaced because he lost them drunk, he needed a cab to his car, his car needed to be fixed because he drove drunk, he had to go to court for drunk driving, he needed to pay for a courier to get/bring stuff for for him at work because he forgot...and so on

I don't know how functional alcoholics can do it. They get drunk every night and they can still get up in the morning and go to work like nothing happened, I've known a few in my life. When I was younger I got rip-roaring drunk on several occasions, and I couldn't even get out of bed until noon or 1:00, and the rest of the day was a hungover fog. I am just flabbergasted that there are people who can drink that much and still function in the world.

pent-up rage

sweaty hair

puffy face

bloated

girl or boy who has already developed a belly by age 25, without actually being fat - you drinking too much, friends!

If the only thing that lightens up their face is the mention of a alcoholic beverage (for a young person) - otherwise sulky and sour

earrings

caftans

gin

regret

It's more difficult to tell for women, especially if they have good jobs. They will make more efforts to hide it, will still maintain a good overall appearance, may even look very good for their age (usually w/ quite some make-up though, rarely a "natural" look). They will often keep their weight in check. Hiding + using are the two things they'll be spending most of their energy doing.

I have a female friend whose long-term (10+ years) boyfriend I've come to realise is an alcoholic. If you meet them at their house, he will directly offer you an alcoholic drink. Not just a drink, it'll be alcohol for sure. He has every single imaginable type of alcoholic beverage in their rather small apartment. He makes good money, she does ok though a lot less than him (probably 1/3 ratio). They live well, but could be living a lot better. They're rather quiet, so I always found that very much in character for them. They're 35 but live exactly the way they did when I first met them 10+ years ago.

The thing is he *always* wants to have a drink. He's a shy guy, and so is she - but if you're not drinking (or more importantly, if he's not) it makes him unhapppy. It took me a while to notice this about him - maybe a couple years ago. I've never mentioned it to them but I hope he gets out of this condition because there is no way this is making him happy.

Again, these are very shy people, introverts both of them, they love Doctor Who... They're sort of into their own world sometimes. He's very different from the image I would have of an alcoholic.

R36 I used to have that in my drinking days. I never drank "a lot" (define "a lot"...), but I drank nearly every day and certainly every week all through my 20s. When I quit drinking cold turkey the year I turned 30, life became unbearably dull and boring. The first 4-5 sober years were very difficult. Things started to look up after that. I'm female. I imagine things might be different for men.

Of course I stopped seeing my drinking friends, who turned to drugs (coke) in the meantime.

[quote] What are the telltale signs? Red face and puffiness I know, but what else?

If it's got shit at the corners of its mouth and it answers to "Erna" chances are: ALKIE

Hard for most people to realize just how alcohol is a part of everything in our culture.

I haven't had alcohol (other than an occasional splash of wine) for almost 20 years now, simply because I am just not a fan of its taste, nor its effect on me (it either makes me depressed or sleepy).

But I've lost a fair amount of friends because they only socialize in and around alcohol. Those bonds just dissipated when I wasn't at the bar twice a week with them.

smelling like nail polish is more likely diabetes.

They show up at a bar after work...already drunk.

Female alcoholics tend to have a lot of shame and guilt about their drinking, so they will be more likely to hide it and drink at home alone. Sometimes they'll even try to hide it from themselves by buying only one or two bottles at a time so they can fool themselves into thinking they're not drinking that much because they don't have a case of liquor in the closet. They'll dispose of their empty bottles in public trash cans because they don't want to risk the chance of their neighbors seeing all the bottles in their trash bin on the curb on garbage day.

Male alcoholics don't feel as much shame or guilt, they drink in bars by themselves and can often brag about their drinking and how much they put away the night before. When out in public, they're more open about ordering an alcoholic beverage in the middle of the day.

They start drinking at home before a night out drinking with friends.

I've never understood the functioning type either. If I have 2 or 3 pints in an evening, I'm headachy in the morning. And the times I've gotten really drunk..sluring words, not making total sense...I woke up miserable and ill. Advil took the headache away but I was still puny and light headed for the rest of the day. I have a good friend who's functional. If you call him past 9pm he's all slurry when talking and he usually won't remember you called. Yet he's up at work at 7am as a bank manager. Never calls in sick.

[quote]They start drinking at home before a night out drinking with friends.

That's a BIG one.

r225 It's amazing. If I drank like that every night, I would lose my job and be homeless in about a month. Not to mention feeling sick as hell.

Curious about the mixing of coke and drinking. Every time I've done coke, which is limited, it totally negated any alcohol I consumed.

R223 good point. Men are much more open about drinking - and it can be seen as “manly”. Women do tend to be more discreet. Sexist views of behavior still exist.

My local bar tends to be all male middle aged guys - and a few retirees. They seem to be regulars and know each other. Almost supportive of each other’s alcoholism. I’m always curious how bartenders are able to deal with these people every day - and if they have any judgement about them.

Always get a real laugh at seeing what Americans define as 'alcoholism', it's long been a trope about Americans, so I knew what to expect coming into this thread but most of the replies here are unreal.

[quote]This same friend once ordered wine with lunch at Denny's.

!!!!!! Oh no the horror, a glass of wine!!

I wonder if Americans realise how provincial and backwards shit like this makes them look. Is it religion, a hangover from prohibition, the insane 21 drinking age, or what that seems to have made America unique in the Anglo-sphere? Terrified of alcohol to a point on a par with some Islamic countries.

Oh and of course this couldn't be a DL disscussion without some insane US style nazi racial eugenic psuedo science thrown in for good measure.

[quote]Female alcoholics tend to have a lot of shame and guilt about their drinking...... blah blah blah..... but what about the whammans!!

r/GenderCritical is that way sweaty ====>

Agree r230. It’s always a relief to come back to the UK where pub culture is more common. There is a real Prohibition mentality in much of America. While I agree it’s not overly healthy, it’s also part,of life. At least NYC is a little better than CA. But in general, it’s really puritanical - starting with the 21 drinking age.

Don't know if the UK posters realise they are known all over Europe as drunkards...

[quote]it’s really puritanical - starting with the 21 drinking age.

You have to realize how car-dependent the majority of the US is. That's the reason for the 21 drinking age. The drinking age used to be 18 and there were so many drunk driving fatalities the age was raised to 21. In the UK and Europe you don't have to drive after a night of drinking, for the most part.

r230 is a text book case of alcoholic denial.

This thread makes me glad I'm doing dry January. Extra drinks over the holidays were enough for me.

I had never heard of the rotting liver stench described above. Holy god that is horrifying to think that you can smell someone's innards. Bleah.

R232, R234 is right. In the U.S., a group of mothers whose children were killed by drunk drivers became a powerful lobbying group and got laws changed about drunk driving.

If you go back a few decades before that, television shows in the U.S. used to have comedy skits about how funny drunks were. Not any more.

The laws were gradually changed to make drunk driving penalties much more severe, and it followed that society in general found drunk driving much less acceptable. Then the concept of the “designated driver” came into play, a person who stayed sober so the others could drink as they pleased, and the sober person would drive them all safely home.

People in the U.S. still drink, but some social ideas have changed. Anything having to do with getting yourself into a situation where you are going to drive or operate machinery drunk is thought to be selfish and showing a lack of good character, because of the innocent people that often suffer due to doing so. People are much more aware of that now, after many publicized cases of drunks running over kids or crashing into cars full of families and killing them all.

In most of the U.S., public transportation is not great, and cab rides can be very expensive, due to long distances, so drinking without a designated driver can be cumbersome.

In LA, it’s almost impossible to drink without somebody driving you home, and that’s where most of the TV show writing is done. TV has had a big influence on how people see drunk driving. It’s not uncommon for people to meet up at a bar or restaurant thirty miles from home, with no bus available. Transportation adds to the cost of drinking.

After a couple of DUIs, they yank your driver’s license, which means you’ve probably just lost your job, since you can’t get there either.

People from other countries don’t realize how big the U.S. is, as far as commutes and other reasons to travel. If you stop at a bar after work, you may have an hour or two commute ahead of you, especially in California. You can’t drive that far drunk.

Someone here already mentioned it, and I just wanted to add: getting buzzed after the first sip is actually a sign of a damaged liver.

OP again...I have learned even more than I expected from all of these accounts. Thanks.

Yes, that's a one-drink drunk and they are pathetic, pitiable nightmares.

I feel like the DUI issue has been almost solved by Uber/Lyft. I really think one the main benefits of taxi apps is reduced drunk driving. Really no excuse to drive drunk in any major metropolitan area of US anymore. Even LA is now alcoholic-friendly thanks to abundance of Uber/Lyft.

But as discussed in other threads (Gen Z), I think most younger people are much more concerned about negative effects of alcohol - both physically and socially (drunken viral videos). Plus the legality of pot provides a safer alternative. Like the death of gay bars - don’t need to go get drunk to meet people, just stay home with Grindr/Scruff and eat an edible.

R238 thank you for adding that bit of information. I never knew that.

[quote]If you go back a few decades before that, television shows in the U.S. used to have comedy skits about how funny drunks were.

Dean Martin built his whole career around that.

I'm a bi-polar alcoholic, which is really cool.

Anatomy of alcoholic consequences right here.

Last evening, donning surgical mask, work boots, the whole nine yards did a little preliminary mopping in the rotting liver apartment. Can't bring anything in there so as I'm toiling, find myself singing old American hymns re: toiling.

The go to is always Ole John Henry. Told his captain 🎶. When that got played out moved onto Old Man River. Exasperated, sweating into the face mask and gloves found myself switching up the words. Always self entertaining when the going gets tough. Laughing, cackling hysterically when I came up with this one. Windows and doors open you could probably hear me over yonder. So apropos..

OLD MAN LIVER! 🎶

😂😅😂

R230, I might answer you later with facts but not as graciously as R234 shut down your trolling attempts unwittingly.

Your embedded cookies in your browser along with hatred of Americans and racial preoccupations reveal you to be that old racist black lez who is cotton pickin' singlehandedly ruining this site from her midwestern public housing hovel.

You destroyed Dlisted. Got booted from Lez Stick Alley and the mods at Reddit are onto you finally. Only place left is Datalounge..for now.

Apologies for the derail but an incredibly drunk woman asked me if she could sit with me at my table last night as I was having my dinner. I told her no but she kept babbling incoherently at me from her seat at the bar. I told the server and the manager about it (the bartender had made himself scarce, oddly enough). They didn't toss her out. The woman kept right on boozing and attempting to engage me in conversation. Apparently she is a regular there and harasses customers all the time-- maybe some sort of cognitive impairment is to blame on top of the extreme intoxication but it was creepy as hell.

Ugh - sorry R248. I’ve learned to be incredibly rude to those people - though my partner gets horrified. But I get so angry with people who feel,like they can intrude on you - drunk or not. Messy drunks deserve to be ignored and physically ignored. I can’t imagine being bartender because of people like that.

Sometimes it's easy to spot one.

Thanks to the poster that alluded to the "alcoholics always need a non drunkard to drink with in order to legitimise their alcoholism." dynamic. It is very true. I was looked at with complete contempt just for saying "no" to my friend's tenant when he asked if I wanted to go to the bar with both he and my compliant friend on a Tuesday night with us having to work the next day. And he is very deep into his alcoholism. His face is folded like an accordion and he has that "turtle" countenance that a lot of alcoholics get. How my friend didn't recognise it when he miraculously befriended her, I don't know.

I have started to prepare myself for a big revelation about my long time friend. You just don't befriend this type of fella with a compete different lifestyle and when up in age unless there is some quid pro quo about it. At the same time , due to some recent harshness with me when I suggested that she read up on something because she got "got" in a situation, she said "when I get home, I don't want to read, I want to smoke!" It's only now in all the decades that I have known her that I have realised that I have never seen a book in her flat and I know that she hasn't got no damn Kindle! She's a teacher of Special Needs kids, so no I'm not trying to show off on anybody. Reading shouldn't be anathema to this type of person, even if they hold back from becoming professorial.

Typing this out has made me realise that friendships sometimes need to be reassessed as "acquaintanceships" until one can get away. It's not about the length , but the strength. That'll learn me! Never too old to learn something about oneself and alleged close friends. I now know what to do . Datalounge as Therapy. Who knew?

Go away from here R251

It was an interesting thread until R251.

Back to the topic - a general unhappiness in daily living when not drinking. Generally not obese.

Did Johnboy Walton just drop by at r251?

Class, consider Steve Bannon.

R230:

Thanks, R251 and R253 . Both of those posts made me laugh.

I've started smoking weed here in CA when it became legal last year. I've never smoked it before. I'm 49. I have to say, what the fuck was all the fuss about? Weed is much milder than alcohol, you get happier, not sad, and you don't wake up the next day feeling like shit. I now look at people who drink but are against pot as complete idiots. I should know, I was one of them. And pot lasts way longer. I can buy some wax and it will last me months. So $60 of pot for about 2-3 months of a nightly smoke, or $60-$100 for drinks EACH time. Also there aren't calories in pot. I know you are supposed to get the munchies but that has yet to happen to me. It's weird.

I never got the munchies but I have gotten the giggles.

I serve hard drinks for men who wanna get DRUNK.

I actually stopped drinking 10 years ago this December 23rd (and that is a story in itself). It surprising how now I can spot them as I'm out and especially in the drug stores/discount stores buying boxes or wine and large quantities of alcohol (for a party - used that one myself). You need to be ready to quit to quit (or almost forced to in case.

Spindly legs and a belly in an old man along with a ruddy complexion. Or maybe that's just an old Irishman

Pot belly / bloated with really skinny arms.

I’m not trying to be a dick, but the big belly/skinny limbs thing is true. Isn’t that what we’re always saying about Meghan Markle?

A longtime friend who I hadn’t seen in years was passing through my city and came to visit me. She walked in the door with a big belly, but the rest of her was skinny (she was always thin). I gave her a huge smile and a hug, and didn’t say anything, because I wanted her to have the chance to tell me her big news. She caught me looking at her belly and said “I know. I put on a little weight.” And I said “Oh don’t be silly, you look great!” And then she proceeded to put a few glugs of my scotch (scotch!!) in her Starbucks.

Yeah, she wasn’t pregnant. Just an alcoholic.

R230 is scary. When a person has that much anger about the topic of alcohol... even the victims of alcoholics don’t get that worked up about it.

Yes, yes, we’re all provincial puritans because we’ve discovered your shameful secret. It’s okay. I don’t care, as long as you’re not driving.

Watch their reaction when they're at an event where they thought there'd be alcohol but find out they were wrong, or the alcohol is not currently available but will later (like some wedding events).

White-hot rage, as I recall, from someone I no longer speak to.

They can do it for a while r212, but it will catch up with them. Keep in mind it’s also a progressive disease and they will need to drink more and more and more and harder drinks as the years progress.

Nobody can stay high-functioning forever.

They look British.

R266, yes. Many years ago, we went to a dinner at a little restaurant that was BYOB but nobody knew ahead of time. The Enabler left the restaurant to run to a liquor store to get a bottle of the Alcoholic’s favorite scotch. Just to keep the peace. And the entire time he was gone, the Alcoholic complained loudly. The restaurant is still there, 25 years later.

I can spot an alcoholic from 100 miles away.

R193 just described my ex. Stank, asshole, never, ever, ever told the truth, irresponsible and blamed everyone for his problems and wouldn’t acknowledge that he was a drunk. He surrounded himself with enablers who refused to think he had a problem. Last I heard he had lost everything and was friendless.

The other hardcore alky I knew was a friend’s ex husband. Bloated midget weasel, also a pathological liar who could down three pints in the space of time it took everyone to drink one. They used to get into physical altercations. I ghosted her because their combined trashiness was out of control.

r84, are you a geneticist?

Alcoholics call holidays like New Year's Eve and St. Patrick's Day "amateur hour", as though alcoholics are superior to holiday binge drinkers.

If everything they want to do involves drinking, and if alcohol is not part of the activity, they're not interested.

If everything they want to do involves drinking, and if alcohol is not part of the activity, they're not interested.

[quote]What are the telltale signs?

Big gut / round body and really skinny arms.

Steve Bannon looks like an alcoholic, but he also could look like a fuckin' hobo without the suit.

R24: Likely he has liver damage that will kill him sooner than later.

When I told people that I was an alcoholic, many of them were shocked because I didn't really show the signs. Of course, unless I was staying in, I'd shower and make myself presentable so no one would really notice. I'm naturally a quiet person, so that helped to disguise my hangovers and fuzzy headedness. Some of the things posted here are true, but not for everyone and not all the time.

Anyone want to comment on Johnny Depp or Keith Richards?

^ Drugs, mainly.

Facts

I’m an alcoholic and WFH since last year has not been a good thing. I start at 4:30 when I end my day and drink until I pass out. Rinse repeat. At least when I went to the office I cared about not looking hungover the next morning.

Why do you do it?

it's not possible to tell. some people hide it very well.

I have a friend who drinks a lot, 8 pints in one session, not to mention shots. He drinks at least 4 or 5 times a week. when he gets his annual check ups, his liver is fine. I was quite surprised when he told me but he does have a bit of high blood pressure.

the really fucked up ones end up with dementia associated with drinking.

Just look at Shane McGowan, he's only 60 but he can barely string a sentence together. Also the man is in a wheelchair now because he fell and broke his pelvis or something, he's fallen many times before.

to be fair, he was also addicted to heroin but has quit that for many years now. He is still drinking. He is good friends with Johnny Depp.

I had a friend who was a nice, normal guy but when he drank, he turned into a demon and did and say horrible things.

When I confronted him about it, he would say, that's not me, I was drunk etc.

Do you think they show their true colors when drunk?

I've been an alcoholic since my mid-30s. I looked great and was functioning well at work into my 60s but all the physical signs came out in my mid-60s...red, puffy face; bags under the eyes; big stomach (all the carbs in booze); constantly tired. I'm 70 now and living with the face and body I deserve. Unfortunately, I have no desire to quit.

Why did you become an alcoholic? Have you ever gotten therapy?

This is tangential. Two ex-fuckbuddies of mine have enormous beautiful cocks and are alcoholics. Over 10 years I watched one degrade mentally and physically until his dick broke - couldn't get hard and we stopped fucking. Over 20 years, the other hasn't gained an ounce and has decent skin on his body and his face his craggy but that's about it. Works every day in a physically demanding job. Dick still works. Made a baby with a new GF two years ago, in his mid 50s, but still fucks guys on the side. Only an ex FB this year due to Covid. Can't wait to get that dicking again soon.

I could post a photo of my ex, but it might trigger his drinking again.

R 108 I am Native American and Scottish and can not drink. Total Jeckyl and Hyde. Its not good.

R287 No, this is not true for everyone. Alcohol brings on psychosis for some. Delusions and psychotic breaks are not uncommon. Alcohol is not “truth serum” for everybody.

Oh, Smitty, I just look in a mirror.

[quote] Do you think they show their true colors when drunk?

Yes, I do think a person's true colors come out when drunk.

Even if you a person doesn't act a certain way / isn't verbally abusive when sober, relapse is a part of addiction. Even if you're with someone who is sober, IMO, they're like a ticking time bomb.

Maybe it sounds harsh, I just have had my share of verbally abusive people in my life.

R287, I dated a guy like that for a while. He would also deliberately start fights so he had an excuse to go on a bender and drink for eight or ten hours straight. As the night went on, he would also start getting more and more angry and insulting. The next day he would claim he couldn’t remember any of it, but I sure could. He would say really nasty things like he hated me and I should kill myself. The next morning I was just supposed to give him a pass because he was blackout drunk and therefore wasn’t responsible for any of it, and I was just being a crybaby. Why was I making such a big deal out of it? He just got drunk, that’s all. I just didn’t understand how it was. His friends were all very heavy drinkers too, and they were all mean drunks. He thought that was normal. They all reinforced each other.

He was drunk every single night after work. It got so I was so anxious seeing him, gulping it down as fast as he could, I couldn’t be around people drinking for years after. He would drink until his stomach was visibly larger over the course of the night, like Mr Creosote.

I wondered too, was he really blackout drunk all those times or just wanted claim drunkenness as his excuse? I don’t know really. It seemed to me like he didn’t have the guts to express his feelings of anger and resentment while sober, so he would drink to let the demons out. His father was an alcoholic too and he had a really hard childhood, so he had a lot to be angry about.

Thanks, R296, for your post. I have a brother who is a rageaholic. I know it's not in the DSM or anything, but reading these descriptions of so-called "blackout" drinking, I am reminded of him. He and I were arguing in a car, he was the driver. Suddenly, he's running a red light, making a left turn on a red light. He claims to not remember the incident now (questionable blackout-type of excuse). Also tried to turn the tables on me: "How do you think I feel knowing that I did that?" I was incredulous. (He becomes a victim.)

[quote] I wondered too, was he really blackout drunk all those times or just wanted claim drunkenness as his excuse?

R296, hard to know. But, for practical purposes, does it really matter? If someone is verbally abusing you during a purported blackout, does it erase the experience? No, it doesn't, IMO.

[quote]On a woman, skinny arms and legs.

This is such a dead give away. Stick arms and legs with a flat ass and a rounded belly and abdomen. Not the obese gunt of the usual obese American carb eater, more like the front side of the body is slightly inflated disproportionate to the rest of her body.

Like this -

R297, same here. I was “so uncool.” He complained that all he wanted was for me to take care of him when he was drunk. I was letting him down. He would stay out until the bars closed, walk home because of his DUIs, then drink some more before bed. Sometimes until four or five am. I had to get up at six.

Just gaslighting me all the time. Everything was my fault. I was letting him down. He had to get drunk because I made him mad. He lied compulsively about everything. The lying is part of it. I got tired of being treated like I was the bad guy and he was the cool, fun one that had to lie to this party pooper who was ruining everything. I was in really bad shape financially or I would have left a lot sooner. I didn’t even realize how bad it was until after I left. You get used to it.

R299, I knew a woman exactly like that! She didn’t eat, she saved the calories for drinking. One small meal a day and cigarettes. Her butt was flat as a pancake. She had a stroke pretty young. Her arteries were blocked, probably because of the smoking. Drinkers smoke.

Tremulous, watery, opaque. Angry.

Big gut and really skinny arms.

[quote]This same friend once ordered wine with lunch at Denny's

This might be the single most trashy thing I have ever read

I drank heavily after age 18, probably a full bottle of wine per night, 5 days every week between 18 and the age of 40 when I quit.

I drank much more during the final ten years, sometimes two bottles of strong wine per night, occasionally with shots of spirits or liqueur before I went to bed. I was firm about having the two day free break for every week I drank, but other than that it would always flow freely.

I look okay now, I was fussy about my appearance before. Slightly creapy undereyes that I plan on getting tightened this year. I did get a slightly distended belly that is harder to keep pulled in in my late 40s. I have heard the fat layer is the body's way of creating a protective coat on a chronically inflamed organ.

I am not a Scientologist but I do remember their rantings about vitamin b3, 'niacin' in the 90s, and it's so called positive effects on alcoholics. I later discovered Bill Wilson, the founder of AA was one of the first to proclaim the healing powers of b3 to curb an alcoholic's desire for drink. I tried this, and it actually does work for me. I was skeptical, but since I started daily niacin (the flushing kind) 8 years ago I haven't touched a drop. I don't know the scientific reason behind it but it makes alcohol seem repulsive to me.

Probably because alcohol IS repulsive r304.

R305, I don’t really have a taste for alcohol myself, I drank socially very rarely, but it was dealing with an alcoholic that made me completely swear off drinking in any form. I haven’t had a drink for decades.

When people find out I don’t drink, they sometimes assume I must be a recovering alcoholic. The truth is I just saw so much abusive and disgusting behavior I want nothing to do with it. It’s probably more socially acceptable for people to jump to the conclusion that I must be a sober drunk, than for them to know I just want nothing to do with drinking or over-drinkers any more. People with alcohol or drug abuse problems just ruin every aspect of your life and they have no concern about how your life is being affected.

I was told a million times, my drinking doesn’t affect you, so it’s none of your business. Meanwhile, every aspect of my life was affected. Just being around somebody who was a heavy drinker ruined my reputation with my family, and I never got it back. I think it affected my reputation at work too, although I didn’t realize it at the time. My coworkers knew my partner. People just assumed I must be an out of control mess too.

Gin blossoms on the nose!

*points at Muriel*

[quote] Accident prone. Alcoholics often have a lot of bruises. Their cars tend to get dinged up.

That was one of the worst things because it's something you can't hide. I still have a huge noticeable scar from the time I tripped in my apartment and fell through my TV stand (my fat ass broke the TV stand.) People asked me about it and were concerned.

Also, being late for everything.

Alcoholics will act pretty convincing while blackout drunk and do things they afterwards don't remember (little things like putting stuff in cupboards where it doesnt belong or leaving a bike unlocked or three blocks away.) They'll have no explanation and deny they did it or claim other people put it there or stole it - it's always other people to blame. When people drink regularly, you often smell the distinct smell of alcohol emanating through every pore. It's the most obvious with beer, which gives that characteristic smell of yeast and socks. If someone drinks vodka habitually it's much harder to spot, but they'll sometimes wear a quiite strong aftershave or perfume in the hope to mask the smell. They'll also try and stand at a distance in a business environment not to breathe on you. They'll lie to themselves, then lie to others. They are also sometimes aware their days at work are counted so they steal, from petty stuff to committing fraud. Alcohol makes you self secure and dampens anxiety. Alcoholics are permanently convinced the world is bad ad they're the king of the castle.

In the early days of The Ellen DeGeneres Show a couple of lesbian friends expressed their disappointment in the show's host, suggesting that anytime someone makes too many jokes or too many entirely unprompted allusions to drink, it's a good indicator that they may be an alcoholic.

I had never watched more than a brief clip of the show and thought perhaps this might be an exaggerated concern. In time, though, I came around to agreeing that it's useful at least in a general way, a signal to watch for other behaviors.

"I'll drink to that!", "It's 5.00 somewhere!", "It's dark under the house!", "I had a glass of wine...or maybe seven!", "And who doesn't like a neat Scotch alongside a bowl of corn flakes?" A lot of people say such things, but when I her one person run through the whole catalogue of similar phrases and bringing drinking into every subject, it's a pretty good sign someone might be a drunk, not just a drinker.

R311, a lot of alcoholics are in denial, and one way they deny they have a problem is to say everybody does it. Everyone drinks stale beer from last night with breakfast, everyone is hungover every morning, everyone smells like beer through their pores. Everyone.

An alcoholic told me he would never trust a person that didn’t drink. Supposedly not drinking implies a person with a mental disorder or an untrustworthy person who doesn’t drink because they want to take advantage of you.

When your view of drinking is so slanted that you actually think almost everyone is frequently blackout drunk, and all the normal, well adjusted people at least moderately drink every day, you have no sense of normality.

You can usually smell it on them.

Look in the mirror, Erna.

A lot of you people just need to relax with a glass or two of wine and stop being so judgmental.

An old ex-boyfriend's best friend died of liver failure in July of last year. He was initially addicted to crack in his late 20's.

Went to rehab multiple times. Finally, cleaned up from that and moved to drinking hard liquor in his 30's. Was diagnosed with cirrhosis by 39.

Total wasted life. Went to an elite private school in the area. Didn't complete his college degree with a semester left. Worked in restaurants and liquor stores.

The funny thing is I was the one who spotted the drug use. It wasn't my boyfriend. All sorts of "new" friends hanging around. Some of them would show up for a short time and split.

[quote]An alcoholic told me he would never trust a person that didn’t drink. Supposedly not drinking implies a person with a mental disorder or an untrustworthy person who doesn’t drink because they want to take advantage of you.

In my first days as a dedicated non-drinker being around drinkers was fascinating, -- for 5 minutes, then it became dull. Watching the release of stress, the letting go of inhibitions, and knowing at a point ahead soon there will be inevitable stumbling and slurring of words.

The people I used to drink socially with, respectable until the weekends, in some cases the same people I got loaded with as a teenager, think getting recklessly drunk makes them seem sexy and desirable in their mid-40s. Having a sober person around tells them it's the opposite.

That's acetic acid, R11.