Karen Carpenter.

Happy Holidays, OP.

Thanks for the post -

She had a teeny-tiny voice but you wouldn’t know that from the recordings.

It's hard to sing loud when you have to sing so low. I think her brother said the bucks are in the basement (the deep contralto is her $$ tone).

Triple love her!I listen to the Christmas album every year.

Karen Carpenter had the voice of an angel. Just beautiful - a voice like that comes around only rarely.

And I remember buying their 45 vinyl single, Merry Christmas, Darling.

She had amazing vocal control.

R5 Just like mine.

The production was schmaltzy but Karen's voice cut through and elevated the material. She had a beautiful tone but she also sang with such soul and an underlying pain that resonated with listeners.

Pure Eargasm.

Carpenter and Marilyn McCoo are my favorite 70s pop vocalists.

True, they're not in the same league as Warwick and Knight. Aretha and Streisand occupy a class by themselves, not to be included with mere mortals, but still, Carpenter and McCoo are just sublime.

R9 Karen Carpenter with her velvety gorgeous voice was in a class all by herself. Her and her brother were musical prodigies.

I wonder if she was related to Pocahontas Warren?

Logs on the fire, fill me with desire!

New album came out last week:

She was a great artist. And she was uniquely American. I couldn't imagine her voice coming from anywhere else.

She was the White Boomer Aretha.

Her voice was even more amazing with the fact that she was a teen when she recorded some of those hits. She sounds so much older. Sad end for her. But she was the first big celebrity to bring Anorexia out in the open.

It’s funny that there is an Olivia Newton John thread as well because she and Karen were best friends.

That voice has been with me my whole life. I miss her so much . can you imagine what we would have today from her?

I will never ever forget her.

Lovely voice. Horrible arrangements even when the material was ok. Very sad life.

[quote]Say what you will, but that voice was from another world.

Good thing, because her skeletor body wasn’t long for this world.

Her voice was lifeless. She always sang like she was very depressed. I suppose she was.

They're both fucking annoying as fuck.

OP's link was the last in a series of documentaries that covered the same material, but each seemed to give a bit more detail as time passed. This was also the last time the guitarist was interviewed as he died just few years later...

I highly recommend visiting her mini museum at the Carpenters Performing Arts Center on the campus of Cal State Long Beach and her mausoleum in West Lake Village, CA. It was moved there after Forest Lawn Cypress became to ghetto.

[quote] It was moved there after Forest Lawn Cypress became to ghetto.

No -- i think it was because Richard moved to the north part of LA County and wanted to keep the family close.

"She had a beautiful tone but she also sang with such soul and an underlying pain that resonated with listeners."

By no stretch of the imagination did Karen Carpenter's voice have "soul." Actually, it could rightly be called soulless; bland, homogeneous, monotonous.

R27 Yes, she did have "blue-eyed soul" and a subtle emotional tone in her voice that drew you in. One of a kind!

I heard she died young from morbid obesity. So sad. They must not have known about Keto back then or how bad carbs are.

R22 - I’m with you! I think there’s always something dirge-like about her voice. To me it’s joyless and monotone. And they always had her singing very pop numbers with very cheesy arrangements...I always thought it was odd!

I would have loved to have heard her sing some Weimar cabaret stuff! She would have been perfect for that material...

Interesting tho is that she wanted to be a drummer (? I think it was) - and her voice was only discovered as an adjunct to that. Which is pretty fucking amazing! I mean -doesn’t appeal to me much - but what do I know? As is evidenced here - she had so many fans and millions love her.

Always makes me wonder how many awesome talents out there were passed over as they simply weren’t in the right place or never got a lucky break...

R27 has beat me to it. The idea that Karen Carpenter had "soul" is pretty ridiculous. It's like listening to Queen Elizabeth sing.

What do you people hear when Aretha Franklin sings? Or someone like Dusty Springfield? Can't you tell the difference?

The Carpenters should have been inducted into the Rock And Roll Hall Of Fame long ago!

R31 Queen Elizabeth should be so lucky to have a voice like Karen Carpenter - she was one of those rare once in a lifetime vocalists.

Karen Carpenter did not have an exceptional voice. She had a DISTINCTIVE voice. You always knew when a song was being sung by Karen Carpenter. But her voice was like a soporific; it was like ingesting a sleeping pill. And she sure as hell didn't sing like she had any soul, "blue-eyed" or otherwise. The Carpenter's songs were universally describe as MOR; middle of the road pop pap.

Bitch should have eaten a burger.

There was nothing soul-like about her voice, but she was incredible. She was definitely the first performer I was ever interested in following. My very first album of my own was one of their albums.

I've always thought her voice was like vanilla ice cream that has just started to melt. And I mean that as a compliment. It was soft and smooth and creamy and sweet. It was very comforting and it saddens me that she was unable to overcome her demons.

What is considered their best album? Did they have a “Rubber Soul”

You are sweet, r37.

What made Karen Carpenter's voice unique is that she began nearly every note a fraction flat (I'm talking a percentage of a comma, which is the smallest difference possible between two notes that are nearly identical in pitch ) and then centered the pitch EXACTLY in the dead center with her vibrato. In all of her recorded music that I've ever heard, there's never a note that doesn't get centered exactly in the middle. As someone who has worked with professional singers for over 40 years, I can say that that is extraordinarily rare. Maria Callas - a much greater artist - couldn't center her pitches that way. Aretha Franklin - no. Barbra Streisand - no. Others have this ability within certain parts of their range - but they don't have it across their entire range. Also, her diction is impeccable. You never miss a single word that she sings. I would agree that she doesn't sing with great passion, or with great power. I also agree with others that there is a tinge of melancholy in all of her songs, even ones that should be happy, judging by their words. She had the right type of voice for the light pop arrangements of her brother. She didn't have a Janis Joplin scream anywhere within her. I'm linking an interesting site that isolates her vocal track. In the absence of the so-called "cheesy" arrangements, you can really hear what her voice was doing.

I also found this VERY interesting Karen Carpenter version of Ave Maria. She doesn't sing it in classical style, so there's a little breathier quality to the sound than you'd hear from someone with operatic training, but the accuracy of the pitch and clarity of diction is again pretty amazing. Also she sing through to the end of even long phrases without breaking them with breathing. Not easy......

To me, her voice had clarity, like crystal. I thought her boring as a teen but have really come to appreciate her as an adult.

R38 - Toss up between The Carpenters and A Song for you.

This cracker? Please, honey. I could blow her off the stage (and her fairy brother) with one gust of ganga. And, I did. Be real.

No straight guy wants to bang a bag of bones like this skeletal white chick.

She’s someone lots of musicians greatly respect.

[quote]She’s someone lots of musicians greatly respect.

No.

Was her brother really into the cock?

I'm sure you think that's funny, r44, but...............................no.

Richard and Karen and Miss Warwick If You're Nasty were good friends .

“Horizon” was their best album.

What do you mean, "say what you will," there has never been anyone that had any argument over the fact she had a beautiful voice.

Best voice, ever.

I read a biography of her, Little Girl Blue, last year, and it makes it quite clear that there was something deeply, deeply fucked up in the Carpenter family dynamic. Her parents idolized Richard and constantly tried to keep Karen's fame in check so she wouldn't overshadow her brother. Both siblings continued to live in the Carpenter family home even after they were rich, famous adults. Karen's mother, in particular, was a stone-cold bitch who seemed to in turns dismiss and denigrate her daughter. Richard was a total control freak who did his damndest to destroy Karen's confidence when she tried to make her one solo album.

Karen's anorexia didn't come out of nowhere: She was desperately trying to control the only thing she could control, her weight (and the early press stories when a healthy Karen was called plump didn't help, either). Though the book never suggests it, I also wouldn't be surprised if there had been sexual abuse by Richard at some point in their history. That dude is really weird: He did marry his first cousin, after all. (Yes, I know Mary Rudolph was adopted, but it's still weird.)

R51. I guess I wrote "say what you will" because DL can be divisive. But that's why I love it.

[R53] says it all. She needed to be away from her controlling, possibly abusing brother but he kept her on a short leash. He was in denial about her anorexia, stating she was "allergic" to food, which caused her to be so thin. Something seriously wrong with him, and it's too bad she could never be free of his influence. I don't care for their music and agree that her voice often seemed tired and lifeless, but I wonder what she might've done if she'd gone her own way, far from her brother's influence.

Old Aggie, the mother, was a cunt to the end. She sure as fuk ain’t in heaven with Karen. I hope Aggie is burning in hell. God damned bitch.

Karen was at her best on the downbeat songs like Superstar.

I have often wondered if there was some form of physical or sexual abuse that Karen endured also. Certainly, mental abuse by mother as many have cited so far. Wonder if Richard was doing awful things. He is an odd one in that documentary.

OP, did the documentary talk about her mother's constant criticism leading to her anoxeria?

Oh yes, Agnes Carpenter was an ice-cold overly critical bitch who openly favored Richard and constantly put Karen down. Karen Ramone, who was the producer Phil Ramone's wife, was a close friend of Karen's and pulled no punches when talking about Agnes and also Richard in several Carpenters-related interviews she did. She was never fond of Richard either. Ramone said that Agnes's treatment of Karen was a major factor in the anorexia.

Unfortunately, in Karen's lifetime eating disorders were barely understood, unlike today. If Karen were around today she would've had much better treatment for her illness.

Am I the only one here who appreciates Richard's elegant arrangements and his unique songwriting gift? While he's no Bacharach, Riddle or Gaudio, he was certainly a more than competent craftsman.

Tragic

I wonder if Olivia Newton John will ever speak of their relationship....

She'd better do it fast if she's going to, R63.

The Carpenters album tracks were just as good as their singles.

I always wondered why ONJ never became as famous or revered as a singer compared to Carpenter and Streisand. She had amazing voice control, knew how to bring meaning and soul to a song (which Carpenter and esp Streisand never had).

R61 Yes! Richard Carpenter was a Master Musician and his sister was his muse. They were an unbeatable team. But when she died he kind of faded away. One without the other wasn't good.

The Carpenters were considered a joke in their day and rightly so. They were SO uncool. They had their fanbase, though, conservative people like themselves. Yes, RIchard and Karen Carpenter were conservative Republicans. They performed at the Nixon White House and he called them "American youth at its finest!" One of them would become a drug addict and the other would die of anorexia. Yes, the Carpenters were right wing snots. They had a particular dislike for glitter rockers; they called Ian Hunter from "Mott the Hoople" "that thing with the boots and the shades." My guess is that they were homophobic. Anway, all this love for the Carpenters is pretty funny when you consider how dull their music was and what awful human beings they were.

ONJ pioneered teh breathy pop singing that were stuck with today. She was awful. carpenter had a beautiful vlice with awful arrangements and often sappy material.

superb voice..........too bad she was so viciously controlled by her overly domineering brother and shrew of a mother. If she would have had more confidence she would still be with us. She was the goose that laid the golden egg and the mother and brother should have given her the space to grow as an artist.

I dont think Richard Carpenter has released one thing on his own unrelated to Karen carpenters unreleased material and the mother was nothing more than a housewife with a severe overattachment and unhealthy fascination with her son and should have stayed out of his son and daughter s careers. Richard marrying a cousin says all you need to know about his judgement. Pathetic disfunctional smothering family.

Karen fans should check out Rumer's catalog:

There are dark secrets within that family.

There was something tragic about Karen. Not just the anorexia but she seemed plagued by something else.

And Richard is insistent on controlling everything about the Carpenters like Brian May is re: Queen.

He famously blocked Todd Haynes Superstar film where he uses Barbie dolls to tell Karen's tragic story. Although, oddly, it's still on Youtube and has been there for years.

She sounded ridiculous singing uptempo numbers. No way could ever sound spritely and upbeat. Her mournful, melancholy voice was suited to depressing fare like "Superstar" and "Goodbye To Love" and "Rainy Days and Mondays" and sappy slop like "Close To You." Her range was very limited.

“Her mournful, melancholy voice was suited to depressing fare like "Superstar" and "Goodbye To Love" and "Rainy Days and Mondays"”

That is a big range.

R73 Your range of understanding is extremely limited. Karen Carpenter had one of the best, lush voices in the business.

The two things that really sent Karen over the edge were her disastrous, brief marriage to a man who was a real grifter and con artist, and the shelving of her solo album. Karen was very proud of her solo album but her record company called it unreleasable and it devastated her. Her weight really plummeted after that. When you see pictures of Karen looking like a walking skeleton, they're from the last 3 years of her life.

Is her solo album any good?

Richard took all of the good songs from her solo album and put them on “Lovelines”.

I listened to her solo album once and didn’t like it. Her voice was pure and mournful but none of the solo songs were right for her.

Superstar, A Song for You, and Goodbye to Love were her best. Everything else was overproduced schlock, thanks to “genius” Richard.

Oh, please. She was not a good singer, her vocal cords were so thin.

[quote]Is her solo album any good?

No, it isn't. The material wasn't all that great and she was singing in too high a register on most songs. The only exceptions were a song called "If I Had You," which isn't her best work by any means but it's still a pretty good song, and a very good cover of Paul Simon's "Still Crazy After All These Years."

She was falling apart by the time of the solo album.

Loved her voice,just hearing about her asshole brother puts the pieces of the puzzle together for me.They were only good singing together,which in the end destroyed her.An ultimately them.So sad.Wonder if he realized the damage he did to his own stardom?

There was always something weird and "off" about Richard.

Karen Carpenter had a magnificent voice, filled with such melancholy and hurt. I would have loved to hear her do a Broadway/standards album with tracks like "Send In The Clowns", "The Man That Got Away", "Bewitched, Bothered And Bewildered", "I Don't Know How To Love Him", "Time Heals Everything", etc.. A suicidal album, for sure, but she would have slayed.

Whenever I hear her voice I think of the JESUS CHRIST SUPERSTAR lyric, "The haunted, hunted kind". There was something so viscerally sad just below the surface (and, later, on top) that we will never probably know all the details about... what a fucked up life. RIP.

"Your range of understanding is extremely limited. Karen Carpenter had one of the best, lush voices in the business."

Your understanding of vocal ability is extremely limited. Karen Carpenter could do certain types of songs well enough (sad sound ones) but that was it. Her "lush voice" was in fact mediocre.

r85 I'm sure Karen would've eventually done standards albums, had she lived.

r86 Karen is regarded as one of the best female vocalists of the 20th century.

"Is her solo album any good?"

It was considered such a failure that it wasn't even released during her lifetime. She was trying to spread her horizons, branch out into different kinds of songs; some of the songs on the album were actually about (gasp!) MAKING LOVE. Little wholesome Karen Carpenter singing about sex? Why, it was unthinkable. Actually, aside from the shock of her singing about making love the album just wasn't very good. I think the Carpenters were on their way out as a musical act. I can't seem them doing their usual thing in the eighties and continuing to be successful.

Laughing at r86 for their lack of understanding of people who understand the range of understanding.

I loved her voice and think she is one of the greats, but the solo album really is horrible.

Didn't he solo album come about because Karen wanted to keep working, but Richard was in recovery at the time?

"Karen is regarded as one of the best female vocalists of the 20th century."

Maybe by some people. But not everyone is bowled over by her dull, bland singing. I always thought she sounded like she'd taken a few Quaaludes before recording sessions. At any rate, during their heyday thier popularity confounded critics. With their output focused on ballads and mid-tempo pop, the their music was often dismissed as being bland and saccharine, which is way. I think Karen Carpenter's early death has an invigorating effect on her and her brother's popularity. If she were still alive, I think they'd both probably be considered uncool relics from the seventies.

"Laughing at [R86] for their lack of understanding of people who understand the range of understanding."

""Lack of understanding of people who understand the range of understanding?" That doesn't even make sense. What's really understood is that you are an idiot.

Not really. It just means that you don't have a clue about what others understand innately.

And you're a smug shit about it.

Actually, R94 it just means you're in love with Karen Carpenter. You poor thing.

It's past your bedtime, little girl. Go on, now.

R91. Yep. In treatment for the Qualudes to which Mommy got him addicted.

Unreleased tracks

"Is her solo album any good?"

It was considered such a failure that producer Phil Ramone’s pal, Paul Simon, told Karen she was a washed up failure then kicked her in the vagina bone.

Karen's best solo track:

She really was unconvincing with uptempo songs. Please Mr. Postman is a good example---she just seems out of her depth with it.

Richard Carpenter blocked her solo album's release for 13 years. One critic wrote:

What, you may wonder, could Karen have done that was so offensive? Had she gone punk? Made a comedy record? Sung out of tune?

In fact, her many admirers will be relieved to hear, the album, simply titled Karen Carpenter, is reassuringly bland. As might be expected from a solo project, Karen attempted to stretch her wings, but, while she flirts with some contemporary styles, she never strays too far from the middle of the road. With accomplished producer Phil Ramone behind the controls (a role he fulfilled for Barbra Streisand, Billy Joel and Paul Simon) and Billy Joel's band backing her, the album features some lightly disco-flavoured pop, a touch of gentle rock and, predictably enough, an abundance of ballads. Karen never sings a note out of place and fills the arrangements with her trademark harmonies.

The sticking point appears to have been Karen's tentative attempt to shed her virginal image. Come-hither titles such as "Making Love in the Afternoon", "Remember When Lovin' Took All Night" and "Make Believe It's Your First Time" display a sexual awareness that had never been part of the Carpenters' repertoire.

"Phil's idea of maturity was to have her singing explicit lyrics," Richard complained to the Carpenters' biographer Ray Coleman. "Paul Williams wrote fine lyrics for Rainy Days and Mondays and We've Only Just Begun without any gratuitous reference to sex. Ramone had her singing "My Body Keeps Changing My Mind." Is that supposed to be mature?"

The whole dynamic of The Carpenters was creepy as fuck.

Karen was a grown-ass woman. She could sing about any topic she wanted. And Richard feeling the need to comment on her singing a song with chaste sexuality at the least is creepy.

"Karen was a grown-ass woman. She could sing about any topic she wanted."

I've never heard her solo album (and don't want to) but I suspect she sounded ridiculous singing those suggestive songs. Her image was set in stone; wholesome and virginal. I'm pretty sure her audience would never have accepted her as a "mature' singer. To them she would always be little Karen, one of the clean-cut Carpenters who always sang such soothing, inoffensive songs.

[quote]Her image was set in stone; wholesome and virginal. I'm pretty sure her audience would never have accepted her as a "mature' singer.

Mariah Carey had that type of image when she started out and was with Tommy Mattola. Didn’t take her long to break free.

This is not a joke post, but Karen and Mama Cass were introduced by a mutual friend and had dinner together- and spent the night singing. Too bad there weren't camera phones back then.

[quote] The whole dynamic of The Carpenters was creepy as fuck.

The whole decade of the 70s was creepy as fuck.

Thanks OP, I enjoyed that documentary.

Could their careers survived in the 80s? I don't know. A lot of the 80s was image and real songwriting ended with the end of Bacharach-David songs. We are still lacking quality songs.

In a way I could see Karen as some indie singer now. That is what she'd have to be. The radio does not play songs, real songs for a mass audience now. It 's all junk and niches that are catered to.

I agree the up-tempo songs didn't suit her.

In a way, like Whitney : a great voice, but was in a time when songwriting was dying , and surrounded by negative family and music industry forces.

Karen pinged my gaydar off the charts. Maybe her family, if they were honest, picked up on this too. Unfortunately, in Agnes' ultraconservative mind, that would have given even more reason/justification to psychologically abuse Karen.

If only Cass had given that last sandwich to Karen, R107. Both might have still been with us.

Not that sandwich story again. Even in jest, it keeps alive a pathetic urban legend.

If Karen had lived, she probably would have done Broadway in the 80's. Show like Pirates of Penzance, maybe Sondheim musicals. Gone on tours, then recorded an album of standards. Probably a few. Then she and Richard might have opened their own dinner theatre in the San Fernando Theatre. She would always work, and always keep a following.

I have Karen's solo album and I think the reason it failed is because it wasn't produced by her brother, Richard Carpenter. Without him at the helm she sound different, foreign, and not really herself. No one could handle her beautiful voice properly but Richard.

For those of you on the theatre discussion thread, she could have made a great Sally in Follies revival! ;-)

“Merry Christmas Darling” a surprising #1 Christmas song. “Last Christmas “ #2. Both classics are my all time favorites.

From VERONICA by Mary Gaitskill -

[quote]“When she shut herself up in her closet and starved herself to death, people were shocked. But starvation was in her voice all along. That was the poignancy of it. A sweet voice locked in a dark place, but focused entirely on the tiny strip of light coming under the door.”

.That is a great novel, R117.

A few minutes into this interview, the British interviewer names anorexia, and a clearly perturbed Karen denies it outright. So sad that she didn't get the "right" treatment that might have saved her.

And I realize tastes vary, but I don't know how anyone hearing that voice can not be touched by its sheer beauty.

r119 Karen looks absolutely awful in that video. I don't know how anyone could've seen that and not thought that something was seriously wrong with her.

What a cunt interviewer in the clip of R119.

Brilliant singer. Some goddamn person in her studio told her to lose a few pounds — she had an eating disorder on steroids

How is she a cunt, r121? Karen was obviously ill and at least the reporter didn't ask fawning or bullshit questions. She asked the questions people watching the interview would want to be asked. She didn't dance around the elephant in the room.

Karen Carpenter was before my time, and I wonder if people back then had some idea that something was wrong with her.

Richard looked hung. I would have sucked him and then started him fuck me raw.

My Richard, r125? He was a total bottom, dear.

Richard was the pass around bottom of Downey. How he ever produced kids is a miracle.

DL, Richard is still married to Mary and has 5 children. I thought he was gay.

R128 Married with 5 kids? First clue!

Richard looks good!

Previous poster recommended "Little Girl Blue" re the Carpenter family dynamics. "The Dragon Lady" was the name given to mother Agnes Carpenter by the musical group's tour members. Just wow.

A lot is revealed in just the book's free preview at Goodreads, linked, including a statement by Dionne Warwick.

R131 I'm optioning the movie rights!

This girl don't write "introductions", we make statements. That's just how it is, roll with it. RIP Kare

Richard was the Downey Cumdump.

Richard seemed so gay, but he was straight. As far as we know.

The mother was horrendous.

Yes something weird about the family, but I thought she hero-worshipped her brother. To the point where it seemed like she had a crush on him. And wasn’t she jealous of any interest he had in other women? It didn’t seem all Bad Richard to me.

Agnes was such a cunt to Karen. Years ago, before Richard moved his families’ bodies to their new mausoleum, I visited Karen’s resting place. Because Karen and her parents were interred into the wall, I couldn’t piss on Agnes’ grave, but I sure as fuck farted on it. The old cunt.

Back in the early 2000s, Richard had a new tomb built in a cemetery that was close to his house and had Karen, his father and his old cunt mother exhumed from Forest Lawn and planted in the new tomb. Kind of creepy, imho.

It's not unusua to rebury someone closer to where living family reside. OTOH, spent 100s of thousands on the new crypt which just seems odd.

R109 said the uptempo songs didn't suit Karen's voice, yet two of her three No. 1 songs were uptempo.

[quote]I always wondered why ONJ never became as famous or revered as a singer compared to Carpenter and Streisand

Olivia was a HUGE star back in the day. Her fame was bigger than the Carpenters without a doubt. Two number one solo albums, five number one singles. A hit movie.

She tied with Streisand several times as the most popular female singer.

Did she record this in hopes of landing the role of Evita?

"R109 said the uptempo songs didn't suit Karen's voice, yet two of her three No. 1 songs were uptempo."

She sounded ridiculous singing them. Who knows why some bad songs are so popular? I vaguely remember "Top of the World" and that version of "Please Mr. Postman" they did. They were both execrable songs but both were big hits. I guess some people adored the syrupy sound of the Carpenters and were willing to buy anything they put out.

When Gary Cooper's widow remarried, she moved from Hollywood to Long Island. After a while, she missed visiting Gary, so had him dug up from Holy Cross Cemetery in LA and moved to Sacred Heart Cemetery in Southhampton...

Someone owns Gary Cooper's original grave plaque.

Karen and her family had been in an indoor crypt before being moved. All the names/dates have been erased from that original tomb

R144, since both songs were hugely popular, I guess your opinion is in a distinct minority. I loved both songs, and wished Karen had done more uptempo songs, instead of getting pigeonholed with ballads.

"Since both songs were hugely popular, I guess your opinion is in a distinct minority."

I think a lot of people hated those songs. A lot of people hated the Carpenters. They were considered a joke by a lot of music critics in their day, totally boring, totally bland MOR crap.

Karen and her short term hubby...

Damn. He was cute and she looked happy.

The Carpenter's music has been appreciated much more as time went on, just like ABBA.

"He was cute and she looked happy."

"Cute?" I don't think so. He does look very gay, though (that hair!). And poor Karen was just trying to put a brave face on things. An article talked about her disastrous marriage:

Despite the disastrous effect Karen's weight loss had on her periods, she had always wanted children and in 1980 she met a handsome property developer called Tom Burris. Two months later they decided to marry.

This set off alarm bells for Karen's friends and as the wedding date neared, Karen discovered some devastating news. Tom had had a vasectomy before he had met her and had neglected to tell her, despite her wishes to have children as soon as possible. He offered to have the operation reversed but Karen decided to call off the wedding.

When she told her mother, Agnes said she would do "no such thing" and ordered her to go through with the wedding because friends and family were travelling especially for it and it had already been paid for. And Karen did.

The marriage to Burris was a disaster. While Karen assumed he had his own money -- he drove flash cars -- it became apparent he was broke. He spent her money, asking for anything up to $50,000 at a time until she had nothing but investments left. He was cruel and impatient with her, calling her a "bag of bones" and telling her he would never have a child with her. Karen filed for divorce in 1981.

She could have afforded to lose a few.

Karen Carpenter tracks

There’s a new commercial that copies the Carpenters.

She should've sung "If I Had A Hammer," if only for the novelty value.

At a private Globes after party last night, this legendary permanent A-list actress and comedienne was asked who the worst behaved guest on her long running, forever in reruns show was.

She answered without hesitation that the worst was the male half of that singing sibling duo, who was a complete control freak over his sister's appearance. She's also convinced he was on coke. What's worse was that the duo's mother was hovering around the set like a vulture.

The legendary funny lady said things came to a head during a lunch break in the TV studio commissary. The mother gave the chef strict orders to give her daughter a bowl of soup and a glass of water. The funny lady, concerned, offered the singer a tray of food. Enraged, the brother swooped down and took the tray from his sibling. Then, the mother came up to the legend and yelled at her to never do that again.. and slapped her daughter on the face in front of the stunned cast and crew. Her brother was also yelling at her like she was a little girl.

The legend and her producer husband had the mother kicked out of the studio. Very disturbing.

Carol Burnett (Karen Carpenter and Richard Carpenter/"The Carpenters")

Aggie was such a CUNT. I hope she’s burning in hell.

The Carpenters were on Carol Burnett's show.

It was ME. Jimmy still beats me daily!

you just watched a documentary about she and Richard, nor her and Richard.

Karen had an extremely disfuctional family and if she had more of an ego and some self esteem she would have bolted from them early on and established herself as a solo act. RIchard was taleneted behind the scenes but was a zero on stage. Richard endded up marrying a first cousin and in my opinion is a very bizarre human being. The mother was nothing but a first class cunt. Poor Karen. One HELL of a voice tho.

Karen should've told her brother and mother to fuck off and gone solo in the mid-70s. She probably would've been a very successful solo act and maybe her illness would not have become so extreme. It was in the late 70s that her anorexia really went overboard.

Fuck you forever, Aggie Carpenter. A kunt in hell.

[quote]you just watched a documentary about she and Richard, nor her and Richard.

About her and Richard is correct. Object of the preposition.

Did her pussy stink?

I bet her breathe did...from all that puking 🤮.

r168=Kelly Osbourne

They invested in Real Estate, there's apartment buildings in Downey named Close to you and Only just begun. A fan pointed out how pathetic she was on one of the Christmas specials. She's (literally) tossing salad for all the guests, her arms are mere sticks.

She was a closeted lez. That is why she starved herself.

I don’t think she was a lez. I think her mother was a CUNT! Fuck you Fucking Agnes Carpenter. Cunt.

Anorexia is such a mind boggling mental illness. All anyone who suffers from it has to do to save themselves is EAT. I understand that anorexics have a skewed version of themselves, thinking they're fat when they're bone thin. I know that's the way they think. But it still amazes me. How can they STARVE themselves to death? A gymnast name Christy Henrich was told by a gymnastics judge that she would have to lose weight if she wanted to make the Olympic team (she was 4'11 and weighed 90 lbs.). That night she virtually stopped eating. She never recovered from her anorexia; she said I know I need to eat. I know I need the nutrition. I know I need it to live. But food is like a poison to me." When she finally died of anorexia she was 22 years old and weighed less than 50 lbs. She would have lived if she had just been able to eat. Such a sad story. All she had to do to live was eat.

She has been singing for the Lord for nearly 37 years now.

[quote]She's (literally) tossing salad for all the guests

She was eating their asses? What a hostess!

[quote]She has been singing for the Lord for nearly 37 years now.

Is that why Jesus killed her? He likes an audience of one.

That BBC documentary was interesting, but It had too much Richard.

He was part of the problem, as were her horrible parents.

Lovely voice (some overly dipthong-y vowel production to my ear) but I think if she had lived she would have moved on to do albums like Streisand...standards, Broadway, duets, etc...

Karen's story enacted by Barbie Dolls is really creepy. Even creepier is the deliberately selected Carpenters' songs used to accompany the creepier scenes: "I'm on Top of the World" when Karen was long gone into Anorexia. Such a feelin's comin' over me There is wonder in 'most ev'ry thing I see Not a cloud in the sky, got the sun in my eyes And I won't be surprised if it's a dream Everything I want the world to be Is now comin' true especially for me And the reason is clear, it's because you are here You're the nearest thing to heaven that I've seen

^^ This scene was of a "Barbie Doll" starved Karen admiring herself in a full length mirror while this song is playing.

Watching that documentary made me realize that the Carpenters were basically a cover band.

Their first three singles had been recorded by other people (on was a bank commercial).

Has any other big acts succeeded so much by recording covers of other people's songs?

Covering other people’s material was something that was done a lot in the 60s and 70s. Linda Ronstadt did it until she retired but I would never consider her a covers act.

And Richard did co-write a good number of their songs: Top Of The World, Yesterday Once More, Goodbye To Love, I Need To Be In Love, Merry Christmas Darling, and Only Yesterday...to name a handful.

Covering was a rarity after the early 60s-----covers often were a matter of white acts like Pat Boone or someone similar white bread covering black artists, or they might be acts out of the same evironment like some of the early girl groups. The two Motown versions "grapevine" were very unusual. Linda Ronstadt's excrable Motown covers thankfully didn't start any trends.

Dis cracker done sang my goddamn song, too. But I did it better, as if anyone questioned. Fuck her. Peace out

Here are the "Close to You" nd "Only Just Begun" aprtments in Downey. Basically the same generic stucco covered stuff you find all over southern California.

Um, sorry Dionne: "so they sprinkled moondust in your hair, and golden starlight in your eyes of BLUE"....I don't think you could've carried off that line.

Listening to R184 is the first time I've ever truly appreciated the cheesy, creepy Richard Carpenter.

His arrangement is so much better than that one.

And Karen sang the song that made Dionne sound as if she was distracted by looking for batteries int he back of a desk drawer.

Has Karen's former husband ever given an interview?

Karen Carpenter is the motherfuckin BOMB. classy upscale white woman beautiful voice. love it. my connecticut sister. she wasn't even close to fat. that wouldn't even be an issue today. not with these girls today. haha. rest in peace Karen.

Anyone who thinks Karen Carpenter was straight seriously needs to have their gaydar fixed.

This video is so hilariously cheesy.

Two fun facts:

1. The other woman in Suzanne Somers; and

2. Whoever did Somers' makeup hated her.

Dionne praises her highly in OP's video

I'm not doubting her talent, but I can't listen to her. I have to change the channel on the radio when she comes on. Her voice flicks on a switch in my head that sends me into instant black depression. No other singer has that effect on me.

Not black depression. Sweet melancholy better describes it

Linda Ronstadt made her comeback after Stone Ponys remaking old rock covers.

36 years ago today. She’s been gone longer than she was alive. Forever missed.

February 4 , the day the music died.

She had a voice like silk, effortless and smooth.

Karen Carpenter died on February 4, 1983 at 32 years of age. She left us 36 years ago. The gifted lady with the voice of an angel will always be remembered.

Close To You.

Has anyone seen that Dunkin' Donuts commercial where the man and woman are singing? Is it just me, or does the woman look exactly like Karen?

If she had lived, it would have been interesting to see how she evolved. I am a big fan.

Did her pussy stink?

Voice of an angel

I think if Karen had lived and matured, she would've told Richard to fuck off and done more solo work.

But body of an 11 year old boy.

Voice of an angel.

She didn't have "the voice of an angel." She had the voice of a very depressed woman. No matter what she sang it always sounded as if she were down in the dumps.

Since angels don't exist, it seems rather stupid to call her the voice of one.

Bless the Beasts and the Children...

Japanese Karen.

R209 Yes, angels exist, and Karen had an angel-like voice.

R212 is an idiot.

*********

Japanese Karen is amazing!

She had the voice of a sinful whore!

Her brother liked the peen.

Very AM sound. Only old people liked The Carpenters from what I've heard.

She had the voice of a gorgeous seductress.

For R209, though I agree with you, I don't believe in angels. Anyhow - Merriam Webster - one of the definitions of "angel"

"a person who is like an angel (as in looks or behavior)" [and everybody knows the "idea" of an angel, even if they don't exist - like you could say a person could look like a leprechaun or a bridge troll, though there aren't any]

Minnie Riperton had the voice of an angel. Karen, like someone else here noted had the voice of a very depressed woman.

The haters remind me of that scene from Tommy Boy

Karen Carpenter did have the voice of an angel.

She really did have an amazing voice—very unique. But the music was pop, nothing special.

I don't know her, but I know she wouldnt dog walk the Grammys like me.

r224 the Carpenters had some great songs.

I was a radio-listening kid when the Carpenters came on the scene, and they were fun and ubiquitous but definitely not cool to openly like. I always thought her voice sounded like that of one of the old big-band songstresses, like Jo Stafford or Rosemary Clooney. She was like a crooner.

I agree with those who think Carpenter's voice was the voice of Depression with a capital "D." I can't listen to her for that reason: instant mood-killer.

I guess I'm dense - nothing about her voice makes me think of depression. Now, knowing what happened to her, I do think about that when I hear her, but growing up - I delighted in the rich, dulcet tones she had in that velvet contralto. Maybe an expert on singing would know - does she have more "layers" in her thick voice, as opposed to a thin one? Well, anyway, I love it. Reminds me a little of an oboe.

No - I think I was wrong and an oboe is higher than I thought. One of the saxophones maybe - alto or tenor.

I always wondered, did Karen record Don’t Cry for Me Argentina as a bid to play Evita? If Karen would have lived a month longer she would have died the same age as Eva at 33. She had already missed joining the 27 club with Jimi, Jim and Janis.

Acapella (near)

Karen would be 69 years old today.

Anorexia

69 - the same as her weight.

I remember their songs coming out and being everywhere on the radio and the cool kids not liking them because they were so syrupy and corny. I agreed publicly but privately I adored Karen’s beautiful voice and the gentle lyrics.

She’s been dead for so long. It takes my breath away just thinking about how long it’s been. Christ.

^^^ Her singing was so soothing. She wasn't popular among the rock n' roll crowd back in the day, so I kept it to myself as well.

She’s been dead longer than she was alive. Still beloved and missed to this day.

Whether or not one likes her music, her voice literally had a different quality to it than just sound. You could almost feel it (silk, warm cream?, molten metal thickly flowing?). I can't describe it. But there is a word for when someone senses something through a different modality than intended. "Synesthesia"? I think?? Not sure. But you almost felt her voice. It was so resonant and true and spot on. Fuck it. I can't describe it. But it hits neurons deep deep within my cortex.

"She wasn't popular among the rock n' roll crowd back in the day, so I kept it to myself as well."

Yes, the Carpenters were considered to SO uncool. And they were; bland, wholesome, squeaky clean. Pure middle of the road. They were so G-rated that Karen's solo album was deemed unreleasable because it contained songs of a sexual nature. Apparently the notion of little Karen Carpenter having sex was unthinkable.

The Carpenters recently were voted the best 70’s male/female duo group on Today’s Throw Back of the 70’s, 80’s and 90’s music. After all these years people are willing to acknowledge how well they were liked. Well, Karen that is.

I'm with R239 - her voice was so unique and rich. I have one of their Christmas CDs with "O Holy Night" as an instrumental. Does anyone know if she ever recorded it? I can't find anything on YouTube.

I read an article years ago and I can't remember who said it, but they were jokingly wondering if she had a third lung because she could sing an incredibly long phrase on one breath. Two good examples are from "I'll Say Goodby to Love:"

"Time and time again the chance for love has passed me by and all I know of love is how to live without it"

"Surely time will lose these bitter memories and I'll find that there is someone to believe in and to live for"

Japanese Karen Carpenter at R211 was splendid.

Is the"Wicked Witch" mother who created Karen's emotional problems still with us?

Agnes died in ‘96, not early enough.

[quote]Mom, I need to get some sleep. I have a test tomorrow in birds suddenly appear — I mean English.

R30, Sometimes I wonder if the best voice in the world belongs to some Amazonian tribesman, never to be discovered.

Or some cloistered nun who has been silent for the last 50 years.

I miss you Karen!

[quote]She’s been dead longer than she was alive.

That happened on Jan 6, 2016.

We still miss her to this day & listen to her music. I listen to Karen everyday instead of today’s music.

If you squint your eyes, she looks a little like Willam in the photo at OP.

I heard on the radio today that they set the record for most records hitting No. 2 on Billboard, without getting to No. 1. (We've Only Just Begun, Rainy Days and Mondays, Superstar, Hurting Each Other, and Yesterday Once More).

"I heard on the radio today that they set the record for most records hitting No. 2 on Billboard, without getting to No. 1. "

Actually that record belongs to Creedence Clearwater Revival. They sold millions of records, but never had a #1 hit. They did score five #2 hits on the Hot 100, the most of any act without a #1. The Carpenters, on the other hand, DID have a few number one hits, all of them really awful: "(They Long To Be) Close To You", "Top of the World" and "Please Mr. Postman."

R254 F you. The Carpenters #1 hits were masterful!

I preferred the Carpenters' downbeat songs to the uptempo stuff. Their album tracks were just as good as their singles. Richard Carpenter may have been a creepy fucker, but he knew how to arrange a song.

"The Carpenters #1 hits were masterful."

They sucked big time, you twit. Listening to "Close To You" was like taking a sleeping pill. And those lyrics! "Why do birds suddenly appear every time you are near?" Gag! . And Karen Carpenter always sounded like shit singing uptempo songs. That kind of music was really out of her league. She didn't have the chops for it.

R257 That’s why we’re still talking about The Carpenters, 50 years later. Bless your heart.

R258 Bingo!

r248 It would be like the Susan Boyle story all over again.