Chris Watts Killed Wife & Kids To Be w/ His MALE LOVER!

Oh dear. We'll never be able to live this one down, girls.

This claim would be more credible with a face pic and a link to the sex advertisement.

WE have nothing to live down.

[quote] This claim would be more credible with a face pic and a link to the sex advertisement.

I'm pretty sure this guy has texts and emails to back up his claim

HIS NAME IS TRENT BOLTE

OMG what even is that

You kiss your momma with those lips....and that, er, eye shadow, and the, uh, blush on your cheeks....

Goddammit, there is nothing I hate more than closet men with children. You’re too chicken to come out and get married, whatever, but don’t drag kids into it.

*closeted

[quote]I'm pretty sure this guy has texts and emails to back up his claim

What makes you sure?

This guy already went off on Facebook a few days ago about how he was Chris's lover. And it's the same voice as the mystery man in the HLN interview.

So anyone want to hazard a guess if Chris Watts was a top or a bottom?

[quote] This guy already went off on Facebook a few days ago about how he was Chris's lover.

That makes no sense why would he say online he was Chris lover, then hide his identity on TV?

[R1]Oh dear. We'll never be able to live this one down, girls. —Anonymous

That's only true if you are Chris Watts.

Here is a more macho picture

Trent Bolte on Facebook (His Facebook is now locked).

Chris obviously was looking for someone very fem (like a female), but with male plumbing - which is very common for someone who is closeted.

R15 That photo is before all the fillers and around the time they were supposedly together. If his story is true, than having sex with Chris really put Ms. Bolte in touch with his feminine side.

So, who slips who the hot beef injection?

R8 Not in this case maybe but some of them are actually bisexual. You fall in love with a woman, get married, have kids, then you don't love her anymore, get divorced (if you are honest) and now you want to date men, why not. Maybe both men and women. Mind you I dislike cheating but not every man is gay and faked feelings for the wife all the time.

We will need some receipts on this one - Trent looks like he is a few cards short of a full deck. And not because he is sorta trans. His whole manner is "off". Could totally be making shit up.

Even gay men would rather be with the wife than him.

R13 Maybe he would terrify all the viewers. He may become Lipzilla and try to destroy Denver.

r8, put done the crack pipe. He is clearly bisexual.

Dont be coming up in here being all reasonable and shit R20.You'll stir up that nest of vipers who'll hiss and writhe as they insist any man who likes another mans cock is GAY.Nothing else will be considered.

25 replies & still no one is asking what is on the dead guy's iPod?

This place is slipping up big time.

He is with an MLM (Multi Level Marketing) like Shannan Watts and Chris were, but Trent Bolte is with Younique (a makeup MLM).

If they couple was extremely religious, then Chris probably thought he had no options and felt trapped. NOT defending him as he should have just walked away, Just walk out the door and don't look back, and let the chips fall where they may

R26 What dead guy? The only male that died was the fetus in Shannan (Nico Lee).

The next big twist - Chris was the bottom.

I hope this POS dies a slow painful death. What type of motherfucker murders his own children. Then murders his wife, and has audacity to try blame the crime on his deceased wife. He has no soul. He is nothing; not even human. And I will not idolize or drool over this sick son of a bitch. Even OJ loved his own kids.

Thanks for all the publicity, cunts!

Smooches

The brother-in-law (brother of the killed wife) is cute

Fucking hell OP! We have compiled 7 threads on this subject.

Someone needs to introduce Trent to Jacob Tobia, so they can create a supernova of human ugliness! Can you imagine their superpowers if they joined forces?

[quote] Fucking hell OP! We have compiled 7 threads on this subject.

This thread is about his male LOVER

I bet that brother of hers has a BIG old dick R33 ! All fat and red and long.

From Trent's Instagram: Business Inquiries only, bitches! Snap. Trent Bolte MUA, beauty, makeup, skincare, nurse, whole package. ~Snapchat- t.bolte E-mail: trentbolte27@icloud.com-Business Inquiries only!

Trent Bolte is the mongoloid son of Jeffrey Dahmer and Andrea Yates.

I called it two or three threads ago. If you've known any of these married suburban dad closet case types, many tell tale signs were there.

Does Chris Watts have siblings? Or was he an only child?

I agree with you, R21. This could be fame-whoring fantasy on his part. The only "receipt" that will turn up will be his browsing history, showing he read the DL threads about Watts . . .

You know,something just occurred to me ! Why is it that every time some lunatic goes off,the first thing that seems to come out is the possibly gay angle ? I TOLD you bitches straight people secretly look down on you.

No, r25; only those who kill the three females in their immediate family.

What in the hell happened between R15 and R5/R38?! He transitioned from human to alien.

Was there some kind of Jeffrey MacDonald thing going on with Chris Watts? MacDonald was the Green Beret doctor who butchered his pregnant wife and two little girls. Psychological reports on him suggested he had a deep seated "boundless rage...against the female sex." MacDonald wasn't gay, but I think and this guy are on the same wavelength.

Watts is so hot I am glad SOMEONE was licking his muscled body and getting Watts's dick shoved up his ass before he's stabbed to death in maximum security.

Ashleigh Banfield later confirmed that her show, Crime & Justice, wasn't able to independently verify the anonymous man’s claims.

That is IRRESPONSIBLE. She should have insisted on some proof like texts, emails or pictures before interviewing this guy.

I knew it - Chris is too cute to be straight.

PEOPLE says that of the guy's account that it "does contain details about Chris’ life that are not readily available online and in public documents. Identifying information about Chris’ truck and his home matches PEOPLE’s reporting."

In addition, "A source close the investigation tells PEOPLE that Chris has had relationships with both men and women outside of his marriage."

Well, we can definitely conclude that Chris has terrible taste

So, file this under Evil Bisexuals?

I call bullshit.

R48 She said on HLN earlier today that their producer has seen texts between Chris and this guy (who may or may not be Trent) that corroborate his story.

R46, Jeffrey MacDonald might very well be gay; why not? Another man who slew the the females in his immediate family. This one liked hanging with the boxing team so much, he lied to Collette about accompanying the team to Russia (there was no such trip).

As for OJ, who says he loves his kids? He left their brutally slain and bloodied mother lying on the front steps where the children would have found her the next morning, but for the distraught Akita.

agree this is a 15 minutes of fame ploy

Breaking News: Some People are MESSED UP!

R49 Chris has beautiful teeth in that picture

There are so many Frauein who don't want this to be true.

Most men hate women. It is very sad but true. When I was in the closet and had lots of straight bro friends, most of them had utter contempt for women and only wanted to use their "fuck holes" and that's about it.

Misogyny runs very deep.

[quote]25 replies & still no one is asking what is on the dead guy's iPod? This place is slipping up big time.

People just realize it's no longer 2009.

[quote]Even gay men would rather be with the wife than him.

This was written by a Frau, right? A Frau who fetishizes gay man.

I'd lick the hell out of his ugly tatts.

Woah, that is a really lousy tattoo.

That heinous tattoo looks like dancing swastikas.

R33, thank you. About time someone posted some beauty in this thread to cleanse the palate after being besieged by pictures of Chris’s “male” lover.

His brother-in-law looks like an anorexic hillbilly. That bony cheek could cut a bitch.

From Shan’nann’s obituary:

“The family is survived by Shan’ann’s father, Frank Rzucek; Mother, Sandra Onorati Rzucek; Brother, Frankie Rzucek whom were inseparable and best friends”

Uneducated people need to stop using the word ‘whom’. None of them have any clue how to use it, but they’re all desperate to try. That obituary in general is a doozy—with all due respect to the deceased, I remember when obituaries were more distant and matter-of-fact. Lately they seem cobbled together from mourners’ Facebook comments, or something. When did that become a thing?

That back tattoo screams homosexual.

[quote] That heinous tattoo looks like dancing swastikas

I was just about to post that, R67.

It's a stupid tribal tattoo, sported by millions of gay men across the country. SO lame.

I wonder if Chris ever had the hots for his brother in law?

Creepy Keith Morrison is going to be ALL over this story, for Dateline.

The title of the show will probably be something cheesy like "Closeted in Colorado" or something along those lines. And creepy Keith will enjoy every minute of it!

This is why we can’t have nice things.

The most striking thing about this story is how "normal" Chris looks.

If I saw him on the street, I'd think that he looks very kind.

You really never can tell.

Chris really had it all.

Nice home, nice family.

So when some of you ask what's wrong with sleeping with a married guy, well now you have your answer.

Don't do it. Either they come out of the closet and be honest with everyone, or you don't hook up with them.

The closet kills. Literally.

"Bisexuals" are sick people, it's best to stay clear of them

R71, it’s because he has “kind eyes”—the type where the upper eyelid is slopes pointedly downward toward the outer edge of the eye. It’s a look I find myself *extremely* attracted to, along with “prominent” lower eyelids (the bug eye look, I guess?).

I am a saint and a martyr to the cause, Chris Watts. Those were my humble beginnings. I could have shown you how to rise to the levels I have reached...

Ugh, I can’t type.

The kind where the upper eyelid slopes downward toward the outer edge*

My first time was with a married guy. I have no contact with him but I do keep tabs on him via his Facebook and IG accounts. He has divorced in the last few months and I noticed via IG photos he's tagged in that he seems to be hanging out with gay guys lately (that kind of gay guy we talk a lot of here - the one who appears to be on an eternal vacation at the beach with other hot guys who look just like him).

At least his wife and son are in one piece.

Has an odd cranium and apparent irregular demeanor. Now just waiting for the sentencing and anything to leak in regards to a gambit such as the affair(s), premeditated murder, how crimes were committed, botched cover up, his psychosis Etc

Chris looks totally gay to me. The glasses, the tattoo, the facial hair- he’s a bit more put-together than your average 30 something hetero. The wife has that hardened and cold look of a porn Star. The wholesome family image presented on her social media seems contrived.

I wouldn’t be surprised if she did kill the kids before he killed her.

So tragic. I’ll never understand why people stay in relationships until they lose their minds. One of them should have left a long time ago.

r78 What?

[quote]I wouldn’t be surprised if she did kill the kids before he killed her.

Oh please.

Had this happened, Chris would've killed himself or gone to the police to turn himself in, which is what righteous killers often do.

Instead, he concealed their bodies and tried to manipulate the police and the public into sympathizing with him and searching for their bodies despite knowing where they were, which is just what a sociopathic murderer would have done.

In fact, his whole demeanor, his smirk during his interview with the media, his lack of emotion even as he was being arrested, indicate that he's your typical nonchalant sociopath. As such, the most likely is that he did all three murders.

Thanks R81, i'm not a Shanann fan, but there is no way she killed her kids.

There are so many Frauein on Twitter mad at this story and hoping it is fake, lol.

R72 I've slept with married 'hetero' guys my whole life (cuz I'm a whore, darlin') and literally not one of them has ever killed their entire families. Or part of their families. Or just the kids. So if I had followed your lame advice about "just don't do it" because LOOK WHAT THIS sociopath did, I would've missed out on a whole lotta good dick.

[quote]his smirk during his interview with the media

Dupers delight?

Start at 14:45

I wonder if this...manwoman thing...knows the guy that Omar Mateen had a torrid love affair with? And of course, none of the "ugly" killers have secret gay lovers. What a coincidence...

[quote] if I had followed your lame advice about "just don't do it" because LOOK WHAT THIS sociopath did, I would've missed out on a whole lotta good dick.

That's because you have no morals, scruples, feelings, or any sense of heart.

The PRINCIPLE being that closet cases are LIARS, CHEATS, and COWARDS, with no regard for other people. And YOU, are an accomplice to their treachery.

But by all means, just carry on with your thoughtlessness and selfishness. After all, this life is ONLY about getting "good dick." Isn't it?

Fuck everybody else, as long as you get yours.

r86 PEOPLE magazine has said that police (or "a source close to the investigation") confirmed that Chris cheated with both men and women.

Chris's lawyer has also not denied Trent's story - he merely said he has "no comments" about it, so he must know he can't refute it, probably because Chris himself has admitted it's the truth.

I'm sorry you're one of those Frauein who falls in love with male murderers and is disappointed that Chris is not totally straight.

OMG! DL you did it again. Some of you said he was a closet case from the beginning. The part about him sleeping with his extremely emotional neighbor is probably true also.

I thought so. Way too buff for a married straight guy.

I figured Watts went crazy over the obvious theft of his upper lip.

Trent the "lover" was wearing FENTANYL PATCHES around the time he says Chris and him were "dating". Look at top of right side arm. Just sayin'

R11 kill it before it lays eggs

Bisexuals are cold blooded monsters? SHOCKING

[quote]I'm sorry you're one of those Frauein who falls in love with male murderers and is disappointed that Chris is not totally straight.

And I’m sorry that you’re one of those tired, old queens who falls in love with good-looking male murderers and believes EVERYTHING that you read. Going from one page to the next--like a dog smelling a pork chop--looking for something, ANYTHING that even hints at this guy being gay.

You probably did the same thing with the Menendez brothers back when you were in college, right?

You care more about THAT than the actual victims, don’t you? MEANWHILE, even if this guy is gay and on the DL, he’d swipe left so fast on YOUR photo that his phone wouldn’t even recognize the motion. Oh, you’re so cliched and pathetic.

I thought he was gay or had molested one of his kids and was found out, he looked gay.

Agree, I thought he molested one of the kids.

R67. The center of the design is the logo of his favorite band, Metallica.

R69 Keith looks like a deflated Barbara Bush.

Wet his lips and stick him against a wall

[quote]It makes sense for sociopathic characters to be bisexual: someone so inured to social convention and so aware of the power of seduction would be extremely likely to be bisexual, even if only for utilitarian means. As M.E. Thomas, the author of Confessions of a Sociopath puts it, it’s not so much bisexuality as it is gender indifference. The sociopath doesn’t see gender; rather, they see someone to manipulate and prey on."

r61, I think the "him" was referring to trout pout.

what bothers me about this whole thing is that people believe that Trent owes Them an explanation and that they think it is okay to threaten him, for what I have no idea but this sets All of us up to be in this same position if anything ever happens to someone we know. What kind of people have the mindset that others Owe them an explanation to whatever they demand. They also believe they are the judge, jury and executioner. How many of these people are out there? I think it's also a cautionary warning to be careful what you put out there.

He literally states on the facebook rant that police contacted him because of messages they exchanged. I think this is very real. There's no way this won't come up.

R103 Trent Bolte went public with the affair on Facebook in the Chris Watts group with long messages explaining everything about the affair days before the HLN interview, and his posting pix of himself on Instagram with Fentanyl patches is his idea. He has Instagram posts where he mimics the killer from "Silence of the Lambs". I think he wants to be famous. Why he didn't show his face on HLN I don't know, maybe they were concerned because of his lips.

Trent Bolte's tiny obsession with a serial killer film... Song and lip gloss mimicking the crossdressing serial killer "Buffalo Bill" from Silence of the Lambs.

R106 Trent is referencing the serial killer's dance sequence from this scene in Silence of the Lambs.

Anyone ever use that "MeetMe" site they supposedly met on? Is it the new Craigslist?

Trent's brother is fiercely defending him on Facebook. I think this is legit.

Why would Watts hook up with that horrific-looking freak, though? He could have had a handsome man. I know there is no accounting for taste but c'mon. Even when that Trent guy LOOKED like a guy, he was still.....unfortunate looking, to say the least.

R110 Maybe they both had a thing for serial killers.

When someone's so deep in the closet they can see Narnia from there, there's no accounting as to what draws them to finally act on their desires. So, yes, I could see he would fuck someone like Trent. Young, very femme, nonthreatening, submissive, etc, etc.

Chris and Trent had some things in common. They both used transdermal patches. Chris had his Thrive on and Trent Bolte had his Fentanyl patches (on his arm in photo).

f103 Never stand between a Frau and a cute celebrity murderer she has a crush on. Just look at r95......

r95 Honey, why would PEOPLE magazine lie that a police source has said that Chris has "met" with men? Why would I not believe them when they say that? Not everything is a conspiracy to sabotage your dream of laying your vag on a cute male murderer's face.

He didn't get that tattoo for his wife, or anyone else he faced, to admire, if you catch my drift.

[quote] I thought he was gay or had molested one of his kids and was found out, he looked gay. —a lez

R96, so you're equating gay with being a molester? How very homophobic of you. And you say you're a lesbian?

Also, if he actually was gay, why would he molest a little girl?

Nothing in your post makes sense, and you sound like you have some major issues.

I want you all to know that Chris's pencil dick is 5 inches and bent.

r117 I thought she meant to say it was one or the other?

Dysmorphia much?

The guy pinged to high heaven, And that wedding photo where he is looking emotionless at his bride speaks volumes. The closet kills, in so many ways.

He will plenty of gay lovers in prison.

R118 It's a grower. 5 inches soft but hard it gets over 8. And it does bend....curves just a bit up. HEAVEN!

The Lippy lover said on HLN that Chris "was the most gentlest man I ever met." A caring top! Love.

[quote] The Lippy lover said on HLN that Chris "was the most gentlest man I ever met."

I wish I could say the same.

Fake story.

Nope. 5 inches hard. Need challis. Dribbles thin cum. Ugly scar. Also, nasty unclean hole. Enjoy your brain dead low IQ murderous stud!

cialis

Stretch marks. Razor bumps, zit scars from unsanitary manscaping.

[quote] The guy pinged to high heaven, And that wedding photo where he is looking emotionless at his bride speaks volumes. The closet kills, in so many ways.

He's a sociopath. He'd be emotionless if his picture were with a man as well.

The pose at R61 makes him look like a bottom presenting hole.

Trent could unplug my toilet

Yuck

" Jeffrey MacDonald might very well be gay; why not? Another man who slew the the females in his immediate family. This one liked hanging with the boxing team so much, he lied to Collette about accompanying the team to Russia (there was no such trip."

He told her the lie about the trip to Russia in order to get away to New York, where an old girlfriend of his resided. MacDonald, it would seem, never had a sexual relationship with a man. He fucked a lot of women. Psychologists thought his promiscuity and controlling behavior stemmed from an insecure about his masculinity, He would always make a big deal about being a Green Beret and in his marriage he was "the man" and the man is the one always in charge. Some thought he had a repressed homosexuality, and he would have been enraged at that. That was something about MacDonald too; his propensity to become enraged, which exploded on the night he killed his wife and daughters. Maybe Chris Watts had one of those moments where his rage came out in a fury. Maybe Watt's wife taunted him about being gay and he went crazy. I can see that as a possibility.

r134 The timeline doesn't match your hypothesis. Investigators believe Chris first killed his daughters, when his wife was not home, and then killed her. I doubt his daughters would have taunted him about what a big faggot he was, no matter how funny it is to imagine them doing it.

Chris is so popular we have 2 ongoing threads for him, YUMMY!

[quote]You'll stir up that nest of vipers who'll hiss and writhe as they insist any man who likes another mans cock is GAY.Nothing else will be considered.

Damn right and why do we 'insist'? Here's why - because it's TRUE

R134, I thought in "Fatal Vision" Joe McGinniss discovered that MacDonald had a sexual relationship with a man, maybe a young male hitchhiker. Perhaps I'm misremembering. I do know that MacGinniss learned about MacDonald's constant use of speed, which he believed had played an important role in the killings. It is possible that drugs played a part in these murders, too; we don't know yet.

Fuck. Now they're gonna blame us for this psycho.

[quote]Thanks for all the publicity, cunts!Smooches—TB

Great. We had Luka Magnotta, we had Bryce Williams (he was the DL's resident pro-Michael Jackson troll for years) and now we have the sassy bum chum of a homicidal maniac posting.

Look at Miss Thing, all tatted up like some TEENAGE JEZEBEL!!!!

R87 I'm rubber, you're glue. Everything you say....well you know the rest.

Interesting you changed your own topic to the morality of sleeping with a married man away from your childish, baseless claim that the closet causes those who are closeted to kill people.

And for your information - bisexuals and straight men who let a guy blow them and don't identify as gay DO exist.

But of course you're a know it all and can tell the orientation and past sexual history of the married men I've slept with and just know they are all closeted homosexuals who are miserable living life as a lie and are poised to commit multiple murders because of it and I will be guilty of triggering the onslaught. I never knew my sexual skills had such power.

I would much prefer being involved in what you call "treachery" than your pious, holier-than-thou version of life described in your petulant diatribe.

Maybe YOU should try and get some dick (if you can get that caftan over your head) - it might make you less insufferable.

TREACHERY!

still makes me laugh

[quote]He didn't get that tattoo for his wife, or anyone else he faced, to admire, if you catch my drift.

Oh I smell what you're cooking.

R135 Chris's DAUGHTERS taunting him about what a "big a faggot he was"? I can just see Celeste doing that! "Daddy is big faggggut."

Chris and his wife made a cute couple. You could see that they were equally attractive. The other 'man', on the other hand, is absolutely hideous! How could anyone be turned on by something so heinous?

R145 Nah, Chris was better looking than her for sure.

Nice catch to the poster who clocked the fentanyl patches! I haven’t been following this story but I just scrolled the wife’s Instagram and noticed her neck scar - has it been discussed?

When Shanannalanadingdong got home, Chris probably had hampers of ironing to do, and his diet patch was wearing off....

"I wouldn’t be surprised if she did kill the kids before he killed her."

Oh bull. If a frau get so angry at her husband that she goes into a murderous rage, she's going to kill the husband, not the kids!

And probably claim that he abused her and she was only defending herself, which is her only possible defense if her fingerprints and DNA are all over the murder weapon.

Oy. The kid in R144's pic is....breathtaking.

Well, you know Elaine, sometimes you say thing like that just to be nice.

A tale as out as time. Wife catches husband watching gay porn. Husband kills family.

no mention at all of this in much of the mainstream media that was squawkin bout it till it turned ….gay.

I think this could be true, but it's not the freak show that's been posting up a storm. Kodi is a better bet.

I said it before: the disappearance of the CL M4M section is what pushed him over the edge.

Did anyone watch HLN today with that ridiculous Ashleigh? Anyway, she kept saying how the investigation documents specifically do not mention the gender of the lover / person at work..she said it over and over....which sounds like it's a hint (a guy)...and then that some names and information was redacted....and then one of the specialists said perhaps it is redacted because there may be another DEFENDANT? Maybe his lover at work helped with the burials or something. The oil tanks were 40 miles from Chris's house. He says he left after 5....I think she said 5:30? Chris had to drive 40 miles, then only had about 30 minutes to put the bodies in the oil tanks and bury the wife. He probably got to the burial site at sunrise, around 6:10 and had to dig the shallow grave and put the girls in TWO different tanks then was at work 20 minutes away by 7:30. He may have had help?

r154 It's him. PEOPLE said he knew details about Chris's home and truck which are not available online but that match their own finds.

R156, what you say makes sense, except if there was another defendant he/she would have been arrested by now. Chris confessed about 48 hours after committing the murders; I find it hard to believe that if he had an accomplice he wouldn’t have sold him/her out.

Maybe he will falsely implicate Puff Lips just to be with him again.

He'll have plenty of dick (or ass) for life where he's going, no need for Puff Lips.

[quote] we had Bryce Williams (he was the DL's resident pro-Michael Jackson troll for years)

Link please

R160, what he's gonna have is a long life as some black guy's pussy bitch, so he better learn now the right exercises to keep that hole nice and tight.

And that's only if he doesn't get the shit beat out of him -- it's been long said that inmates do not take well to other inmates who killed children.

Yes, because black men are the only ones in prison right R162? The majority of prisoners are white and prisons themselves tend to be pretty segregated. So, there is a greater chance that he will be some white skinhead's pussy bitch.

r163 Way to overread what r162 said.

Btw, you're wrong that most inmates are white.

"According to the U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS) in 2013 black males accounted for 37% of the total male prison population, white males 32%, and Hispanic males 22%."

2013? Please join the rest of us in 2018. According to the Federal Bureau of Prisons, the percentage of whites in prison is greater than blacks, 58.3% to 37.8% respectively. Last Updated: Saturday, 28 July 2018

Also, check out this table thats at the same link you posted. The graph you posted is the total number of incarcerated americans.

And, I'm not overreacting. White men are accustomed to making off the cuff remarks not based in truth. Educate yourself.

r166 That graph just repeats the information that I posted. I have the impression the link at r165 doesn't distinguish between jails and prisons, hence the disparity between my figures and yours. If you count only prisons, which is where Watts to going, Blacks must outnumber whites among men. There's no way that the figure would have changed so much in just 5 years.

He didn’t want to escape so he could be with one special person.

He wanted to fuck everything.

Are you blind and stupid R168? The graph you posted doesn't show inmate race, but instead the total number of incarcerated Americans, both male and female. The graph I posted which is from 2015 also shows the demographics of US prisons, both male and female, and even then the difference is negligible. Furthermore, the graph and info you posted is from Wikipedia and 2013, mine is from a government agency and 2018. You'd be surprised how much can change in five years. The Federal Bureau of Prisons is responsible for the administration of the federal prison system. So, I'm going to assume that information is for prisons. Even if it is for both jails and prisons, my original statement stands. Thank You and Good Night!

r170 Yeah, I misspoke, call down, son. I didn't show a graph, but I did show numbers, and the numbers I showed are almost the same as the ones your graph at r166 shows, which was from 2 years later -- proof that no big change was underway from 2013 to today.

[quote]Furthermore, the graph and info you posted is from Wikipedia and 2013, mine is from a government agency and 2018

The 2013 numbers are sourced to the U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics, idiot. You're a moron if you think the editors simply pulled false data out of their ass and no one corrected it despite it being such a prominent, widely read entry on their website.

[quote]You'd be surprised how much can change in five years

You have no proof that any such change happened. There would be articles in scientific journals and newspapers, books, and lectures if in just 5 years there was such a racial revolution within the US prison system where now whites would account for about as many people in prison as in the general population. If any such change happened, you'll have no problem finding evidence of it - but I have no doubt you won't even make an attempt because you know you're bullshitting. Such a change would also not happen spontaneously. So you should probably name to me the bills, laws, and government programs that were launched in the meantime to change those numbers around. Your own post at r165 show that the numbers from 2015 are basically the same as the one I posted from 2013, which proves, again, that NO BIG change was ongoing since 2013.

[quote]Even if it is for both jails and prisons

Quit bullshitting, kid. You have presented zero proof in this respect. Your glib dismissal of the argument shows that you know you're in the wrong.

The Pew Research Center shows that Blacks were still outnumbering whites in prison as late as 2016. The gap is narrowing, but still shows the opposite pattern that r170 is portraying.

In other words, r170 is claiming that in just two years - from 2016 to today - the share of whites in prison skyrocketed from 35% to 58%. TWO YEARS. For such an extraordinary claim, there should be no lack of evidence. He will still not post any.

I'm surprised OUT, Advocate, or HuffPo have not published an article saying speculating on Chris's sexuality is irrelevant and offensive, like they did with Aaron Hernandez.

[quote]He'll have plenty of dick (or ass) for life where he's going, no need for Puff Lips.

If he ends up on death row (if they have it there), he'll most likely be separate from the main prison population and his choices will be drastically limited.

R173, just wait for it. Remember, as the Aaron Hernandez case taught us, it's ok to be a multiple murderer--just not a gay multiple murderer. That's too icky.

Wait, how do we know how big his dick is? 5” and bent? Is that an inside joke?

[quote][R173], just wait for it. Remember, as the Aaron Hernandez case taught us, it's ok to be a multiple murderer--just not a gay multiple murderer. That's too icky.

Is this really a "cause" you want to take on? Since when is it OK to be a multiple murderer period, whether hetero or not?

R169 is probably correct about Watts.

Narcissists and sociopaths don't see why they shouldn't have it all, the wife and kiddies and status as "family man", and fuck anything that catches their eyes. They just don't see why anyone should have a problem with it.

You bisexuals can have him, as far as I am concerned. Enjoy.

I want to see Rachel fucking maddow do one of her serious preachy pieces bout this shit..

AND INTERVIEW THAT HIDEOUS TRANNY WHO FUKD HIM

Finally a shirtless picture

There's a lot better one than that of him on previous threads, R181. Looks like he shaved his body for yours. In the other one, Shan'annna'ann'anana'ana'a is wearing a black bathing suit and he has on long, hideous, Pittsburgh Steeler board shorts.

Here he exercises

FINALLY the only full frontal shirtless picture

Posting the same pics over and over still does not make him hot.

R181 and R184.... you're appalling.

All I see on Shannan's Instagram page that you keep posting, are pictures of those two little girls and their mother, who were complete innocent and murdered by this psychopathic closet case, and probably encouraged by that hideous creature that he was having an affair with.

Then I'm reading the messages of condolences pouring out from all over the world, for her parents and family.

And when I compare that to your posts, lusting after shirtless pictures of this freak, all I can think of, is what a sex-crazed insensitive monster you are, that you can't see this man is nothing but a murderer.

[quote] all I can think of, is what a sex-crazed insensitive monster you are, that you can't see this man is nothing but a murderer.

R186 a bot and not gay

Was he in debt? I can’t understand why he didn’t just walk away. However, If he was in serious debt, then having his two kids and being saddled with her might have made him snap. A sociopathic narcissist will see that as a way to deal with his problems.

R188 he could still just walk away, just leave and change his identity and start a new life. Many men have done that.

He may have cheated, but if he wanted to walk away, I bet he would've just done so. If anything, I think she might have been ready to leave, and he was the "No one leaves ME" type.

He could be a sex addict. They screw anyone and anything. I just don't see how he could kill the two kids.

Someone posted this Topix link on the other thread. It has some very interesting info about Mistress Nichol and her alleged presence at the murder scene.

R186 BLOCKED! Go to judgey Facebook Shanaan Private Group Hell where you belong.

Why hasn't anyone murdered his family to be with me?? I've got so much to offer the right guy.

OMG, R186, stop being so judgey! Can any one of us honestly say we never planned to slaughter our families and dump their bodies in oil?

r184 Don't murder your family, murder my boyhole, daddy.

Trent said Chris was the gentlest lover he's ever had, so he wasn't like the typical bi guy - who avoids intimacy with men and treats gay men as mere sex toys.

[quote]You bisexuals can have him, as far as I am concerned. Enjoy.

r179, agreed, I have no idea why some gay men are so eager to 'claim' guys like Watts and Hernandez. Enough with the bi erasure, let the bis have these guys.

[quote] judgey

JUDGEMENTAL.

Sorry, pet peeve. :)

R194 wins! I laughed so hard my stomach hurts.

It’s okay. Shannnan is dating Jesus

Somebody could make tasteless memes out of these, think Strangers with Candy, and make the news.

r202 I know I shouldn't but I laughed. How could anyone?...

[quote]Was he in debt? I can’t understand why he didn’t just walk away.

Dimwit, you don't just walk away from three kids. He would be saddled with child support for decades. That's why being pregnant is the most dangerous time in a woman's life. It is literally the time she is most likely to be murdered. And the reason is 'some' immature, selfish, narcissistic men want to stick it in raw, but they don't want the burden of children.

He snapped. Mrs Golightly explains.

[quote] Dimwit, you don't just walk away from three kids. He would be saddled with child support for decades

There have been many men who walk out and change their identity to avoid child support. He could have just done that

R205: That’s why I mentioned whether he was in debt, idiot. He could have walked away like many men in his situation have done. However, being in a marriage with massive debts might have escalated the situation.

Walking out and changing his identity would have meant a loss of income and of status, which a true sociopathic narcissist would consider intolerable.

Someone like Watts would decide that what was truly important was to keep his job and his status in the community, but without the annoying wife and sickly kids that he'd decided were bad for his inflated image. If he'd gotten away with it, he probably would have married some poor simp of a girl and had a new and presumably better family, and they'd never know how much danger they were in.

You can't just walk away. He'd be on the run, a criminal. He would not be able to get a legitimate job anywhere because 2/3 of his wages would be garnished. You watch too many movies.

R210, well, his alternate plan is not working out well, either. Some people need to realize that marriage is not for them.

Hope Chris is a bottom - cause his ass is gonna get more dick than it can handle soon...

Who is that drunk frau at R206?!?

“I don’ like thinkun about it. I don’ like talkun about it . . .”

Yet she makes a 14-minute rambling video about it and posts it on the Internet?!?

R206 She's nasty.

Meanwhile, there are delusional losers over on the serialized CW thread talking about actually sending this sociopath money. Bitch, are you that desperate for a dick pic?

[italic]WTF??[/italic]

I suspect the reason for increasing white prison/jail population is the opiate epidemic in the "heartland" (and locking up all those white junkies).

r215 These bitches will lose all interest in him as soon as they learn what kind of pipe he smokes.

R215 I'm sending him money. Why not? He's all alone. He hasn't been proven guilty yet. Give him a chance.

Did he have any hot male lovers or just trout pout?

From the Daily Beast:

"Chris indicated that he was “trapped in a loveless marriage,” the alleged paramour said. The story of the unnamed caller, who also appears to have sounded off on social media, has yet to be corroborated. The man said he met Chris on an app called MeetMe, and that Chris identified himself online as heterosexual. (The Weld County DA’s office declined to comment for this story, and Chris’ public defender couldn’t be reached.)

"The alleged lover told The Daily Beast on Thursday that he believes he was the first man Chris ever slept with—and that their affair was Chris’ first during his marriage to Shanann. The men would see each other before or after work, or sometimes after 10 p.m., he claimed. He added that they’d usually meet at the man’s place and never at Chris’ home. The man believes Shanann was unaware of their rendezvous, which he claimed ended in spring of this year.

"The man said he’d been out of touch with Chris for months. The next time he saw his face was on national television, after Chris’s arrest."

R220 Just more Trent Bolte BS

Didn't he originally claim that Chris was having affairs with "men", now he claims he was the first?

Maybe Chris got with more men AFTER his first time with Trent?

[quote] But he did not know he was married until one of his daughters mentioned wanting to sleep in her parents' bed on one of their excursions.

So he was reading the kids SM accounts

r221 He's legit. If he weren't, Chris's lawyer would have already refuted him.

r222

[quote]Didn't he originally claim that Chris was having affairs with "men", now he claims he was the first?

Where did he say that? It was PEOPLE magazine that said that, after being told by a "source close to the investigation". But I wouldn't be too literal about the phrasing they used - "men and women" - because sometimes people use that plural when they just mean "an indeterminate amount".

R225, refuting his guy in the media isn't really a defense attorney's job. He's not a press agent.

Chris Watts has an unsightly mole on his fivehead. Pass!

r226 You people are so tiresome. I don't know why so many of you want to believe that he's lying when it's more parsimonious to assume he's telling the truth. Has he described unlikely details? No. Has he portrayed himself too positively? No. Does he seem to be gaining something materially or professionally to get his word out? No. So, what could he possibly gain from this story other than being sued for lying about the police, if he's indeed lying? (He did say it was police who contacted him first -- which you must believe is a lie.) Plus, PEOPLE has already confirmed independently with investigators -- after Trent spoke out -- that Chris was cheating with one or more men. What are the chances that this heterosexually married man was indeed cheating with men but is being lied about by Trent?

Lawyers contest false, or damaging, stories about their clients all the time. And this story is damaging to Chris because it adds to the picture being painted of him as a serial adulterer, therefore an immoral person, and therefore a murderer.

His lawyer must know that the spread of such stories make a conviction more likely - which is why he has demanded that the court take measures to insulate the media from the investigation.

And it's not like contesting Trent would take so much work - all that the lawyer needed to do was publish a statement on Chris's behalf denying ever meeting the person the media was interviewing, or any adulterous affair other than the one with the co-worker, which he has already admitted. His lawyer has no reason not to do it - unless, of course, Trent is telling the truth and engaging him in a word fight would only make it more likely that more details about the affair would leak to the media.

"Trent Bolte"

What's its real name?

R229 Lipzila. He is going to destroy Denver.

R228, what keeps me from believing his story is that he hid the bodies instead of calling authorities.

I do not have a good opinion of Shanann, and until the point of her death, consider her the abuser in the relationship. There are enough people seeing it in her videos and saying it.

But he dumped the bodies and that is a big hurdle for the defense. If he’d called the cops, it’d be a slam dunk to paint her as a munchhausens, emotionally abusive wife.

And another thing that bugs me is all the fraus who equate a strict bedtime schedule and immaculate home with good parenting.

As we saw with the Hart family, reality can be wildly different than what’s portrayed publicly.

Oh, Jesus!!!

r231 I'm talking about Trent, not Chris. Of course Chris is lying about what happened to his family.

R231 Shan'ann was TOTALLY munchhausens. She is Dee Dee Blanchard's long lost more glamorous cousin. I think Chris wanting some cock may had contributed some, though... but still no reason for murder.

She was also continuing to charge her way through every dime they'd ever have in the future as well, obviously.

R224, the kids were preschool aged, they did not HAVE SM accounts. Dad of the year took them along sometimes when spending quality time with his fuck buddy. Trout lips heard it from the kid directly or in the background during a phone call. He had met the kids in person. That, to me, seems unusual.

Chris told him he wanted a LTR. It's not a shock if he presented him to the kids (though I'm still leaning on no).

I agree, R237. That is the part that seems the most unlikely in the whole story. Would Chris have really taken the kids anywhere near that thing? Or have had him over to the house, let alone when they were there? Those would have both been very stupid, indiscreet, things to do for a discreet married man.

Who said that Christ told him he wanted an LTR, R238? I don't believe that for a second. He was going to take that new hot body and fuck anything and everything he wanted to.

Has this been proven?

If so, this trial will get non-stop coverage. This guy deserves a public execution.

r240 Trent said it, moron.

[quote]Would Chris have really taken the kids anywhere near that thing?

Because sociopaths are known for their good sense.

Then that makes it even more likely he is lying, R242.

r244 No, it doesn't. You're a fool who's trying to push the ridiculous idea that the wife was a Munchhausen mom (a term you don't even understand).

Lol, that isn't me, R245, and I do understand that term, I assure you. Why are you so angry over even considering the possibility that big lipped freak is lying? Unless you are Trent itself, of course.

r246 You're right, that's not you, but you (at r236) are still joining the trolls chipping away at his guilt and suggesting she deserved it.

Why can't you consider that Chris is a bisexual cheater and cold-blooded murder who would kill the innocent without a second thought?

And by the way, at r236 you were clearly agreeing with r235, who was attacking Shannan as a Munchhausen mom, so that particular insult reflects on you as well.

I think Chris' lawyer is a public defender, so it's not like he's going to spend unbillable hours going on Ashleigh Banfield to refute some wackjob's fantasy relationship story if that's what it is. He isn't getting paid enough to do what isn't essential for his client's defense.

R247, I in no way suggested that he didn't kill her or that she deserved to be killed over being the horrible completely narcissistic soul-destroyer she almost certainly was. Just because she didn't deserve to be killed doesn't mean she was a good person either. Please don't conflate her being killed with her being a saint.

If he had the kids around Trent he had to know that the clock was ticking until the wife found out. Maybe he thought he could pass him off as a friend. Maybe the girls had outings with a lot of friends of the dad? It is not like he would call him his boyfriend in front of them. Still seems weird.

I had a friend who had a disturbing childhood. Dad was pretty predatory and often had her play as his doubles partner as a kid in matches against current his lady friend and her husband or child. He even had an affair with a nun. She was pretty naive as a kid and was a mess in early adulthood as she realized she had been kind of a cover for his rampant affairs and that he had been fucking most of the people who were in her memories as family friends. The mom was depressive and drank, died young of cancer. Sad. I thought her father having her around all those women was odd too, but I guess people do it, esp when they are their own childcare for that time period.

Men who murder their children almost always do so in a borderline rage because the wife has announced she's leaving him. That is almost always the case. Such men will tend to kill themselves and the children - to say to the wife, you have destroyed me and if you don't want to keep the family together I'll destroy the family to punish you.

It's extremely rare for a man to kill his wife and kids because HE wants to leave. I don't understand what motivated Watts. He perhaps hated her and when he asked for a separation she took it badly and attacked him, then perhaps killed her by accident - slugged her and she fell and hit her head or something, then he panicked and figured his kids would be better dead than with him in jail? But it's a very unusual case given he has no prior record of violent offences or mental illness and it does not seem to have been a violent relationship.

R249 The lawyer doesn't need to go on TV to contradict Bolte's story. A brief, dry media statement calling Bolte a liar would be enough to scare the media from interviewing him.

I agree with r228: the lawyer has every reason to attack big lips dude and it's highly significant that he hasn't done so.

R252 I think your first paragraph only applies non-psychopathic dad killers, those who kill when they're under extreme emotional states.

Psychopaths kill under low levels of emotional arousal.

R218, you are a strange, sad, little man.

Watts did not exhibit any of the traits of psychopathy. No history of criminality, held down steady jobs, did not get into fights, or steal, was regarded as a low key, calm guy. The infidelities indicate his ability to be deceptive but having affairs and / or being a closet case does not make one a 'psychopath'. Even the murders do not necessarily make him psychopathic. People can behave with extreme violence without being a psychopath.

An LTR with that?

Oh, Chris...

R251, there is also this. It was on the Topix forum. This is all rumor, so take it with a salt mine, but maybe he was just careless or brazen.

R85 pretty much makes the the case for Burke being Jon Benet’s killer.

R256, psychopaths are certainly capable of holding down steady jobs, marrying, and doing everything else to maintain the appearance of a normal person. They are also capable of solving problems without violence, or covering up any violent acts.

It's the multiple murders that give away their true nature, not their public persona.

Shannan wasn't narcissistic, abusive, or evil. She was vulgar, grasping, proudly middle-middle class, greedy, dumb enough to fall for MLM scams, suburban, heterosexual, doughy, self-absorbed, fake, suburban... everything that isn't actually wrong but which the Datalounge collectively despises.

Because face it, we're a bunch of crashing snobs, particularly those of us from suburban middle-class origins.

R262, please explain the difference between being narcissistic and being self-absorbed. I'm not sure you know the meaning of the word "narcissistic." Anyone with that many selfies and posts is all about me, Me, ME.

Please, posting some selfies doesn't make a person narcissistic

R263, please find out what the DSM-5 is, before you speak about narcissism vs. self-absorption again.

That woman seems to have been as annoying as fuck-all, but she didn't deserve to die for it.

[quote]No history of criminality, held down steady jobs, did not get into fights, or steal, was regarded as a low key, calm guy.

This is true but notice that many psychopathic serial killers are known to have kept stable lives, including enduring marriages and long term employment. The BTK is one example; John Wayne Gacy is, too, though to a lesser extent.

There's some research proposing a category of psychopaths called "detached" - these people have all the personality traits of psychopathy (charm, grandiosity, manipulation, deceitfulness, emotional shallowness, fearlessness), however, they don't lead the parasitic and unstable lifestyles that many equate to psychopathy. (Though Chris, with his insane contraction of debt, seems to be far from responsible in his lifestyle.)

"Detacheds" usually come from middle- or upper-middle class families and have higher verbal IQs than the more criminal psychopath. Chris comes from a decent family and was an supposedly excellent student at university, which points to an at above IQ.

Below is an article about a serial killer whom the writers suggest is a "detached" - someone who scores highly on the personality dimension of psychopathy, but lowly on the antisocial behavioral list. The article is open access.

Virtually everyone is "self-absorbed." Even depressed or self-hating people can be totally absorbed in their own misery. Narcissism goes beyond being self-absorbed: a narcissist thinks he is the greatest guy in the world, feels free to use other people to gratify his own ego, lacks empathy towards others, and does not feel remorse. You can be foolishly self-aggrandizing on Instagram without being emotionally disturbed enough to be narcissistic.

[quote]I in no way suggested that he didn't kill her or that she deserved to be killed over being the horrible completely narcissistic soul-destroyer she almost certainly was

I would love to understand what kind of pathology makes people sound like r250.

Honey... You don't know her. And you don't know that she's done anything to make you think so lowly of her. I have no idea where all that bile is coming from, but from a healthy place it is not - of that I'm sure.

Did YOU know her, R268? If so, please set us all straight as to her many virtues; if not, STFU. Our opinions from remote observation are just as valid as yours.

r231 = Casey Anthony juror. You can't be fucking serious? Do you really think that if someone found their children murdered they would hide their bodies instead of calling the cops? JFC, they just need one of you on his jury.

the #1 cause of death in pregnant women is murder (most by spouse or significant other) and the percentage of pregnancy deaths linked to murder is 20% of total pregnant women deaths........murder is a larger factor than any other one medical complication. I dont mean to be flip but wouldnt birth control be a lot better choice?

R271 - absolutely. Unless your husband asked you to have another. “Try for a boy” in this case. It’s not like women are generally popping out 7-14 kids between marriage and menopause anymore. Most are practicing birth control.

And not that hub’s request is the last word, but God knows how it sounds if you say no (Jennifer Aniston rumors).

r269 No, I don't know her. Which is why I'm not making any claims about her character. You should follow my example. You look sick in the head for hating so much someone you didn't even know personally, know next to nothing about, and is a murder victim.

The Daily Beast article quotes Trent on how he got to know that Chris was married. Yes, he didn't bring the kids to one of their dates:

[quote]“He told me he had children but he portrayed that he was single and when there was some point in late January or February that I met up with him and I got in his Ford pickup and he had his daughters with him and the oldest pretty much spilled the beans that he was still married,” the the supposed lover continued.

And Trent's brother says it was Chris who paid for him to get his lips injected:

[quote]When reached by The Daily Beast, the man’s brother said the story was true. “I know my brother saw a different side of ‘loving’ Chris Watts,” the sibling said, adding that Chris “gave my brother his first lip botox injection.”

* Yes, he didn't bring

I meant the opposite: "Yes, he did bring..."

Chris obviously didn't care if Shania found out he had some bussy on the side. The daughter surely spilled all the tea to mom, that's what kids do. So very messy.

R276 - no: unless she had an inkling he was bi/gay....him hanging out with another guy per the kid’s report (interesting risk CW would take if true - lends to psychopathy)...wouldn’t mean a thing to a hetero female.

[quote]There's some research proposing a category of psychopaths called "detached" - these people have all the personality traits of psychopathy (charm, grandiosity, manipulation, deceitfulness, emotional shallowness, fearlessness),

Chris Watts was not charming, his wife said he had 'no game' and she had to make all the running when they met. He was the opposite of grandiose, he was quiet and introverted. Witnesses have made clear the wife was the dominant party, and that she was aggressively domineering. A grandiose, impulsive, violent psychopath simply does do not meekly submit, in public, and at home, to a woman described as 'emotionally abusive' and 'bullying' - a psychopathic character would have beaten her when she first tried that, or left her long ago. How was Watts 'exploitative'? Or 'parasitic'? She had illnesses and couldn't work when they met - she was no catch.

There's this immediate assumption online these days that anyone who does anything this awful is psychopathic. It just isn't always the case. It seems more likely that Watts had a very passive, emotionally repressed and depressive character with low self-esteem. He seems to have become more unhappy with his wife after he lost weight and became attractive. Offers came his way. He cheated as a form of rebellion against his suffocating wife. He decided to leave. That conversation went very, very badly, the details are not known. But there's no evidence he's a psychopath.

If Shanann didn’t want to have another baby, she wouldn’t have. Do people watch her videos and think she was cowering in fear of him? SHE wore the pants in that relationship.

And she had a ready medical excuse: her lupus. If Chris tried bad-mouthing her to their friends and family, she could say “Chris is bugging me because he wants another baby, but my doctor said the lupus makes it too dangerous to try.” Everyone would understand that.

It makes no sense that they’d be trying to have another baby, anyway. They were busy, in debt and had their hands full with two sick children already.

CW paid for the lip injections? LMFAO!

R278, I agree with everything you said.

And since people don’t understand the concept and you have to shout the disclaimer: NO I don’t think she deserved it.

On a strictly human level, no gender roles or final outcome considered, she did not treat him nicely. She posted lovely sentiments on her FB, but her actions said something different.

I may be projecting a bit, because my mother treated her partner the same way. It was a terrible thing to witness.

[quote]Shanann

At least she'll never have to spell that shitty name for anyone again.

Shirtless pix of this dude?

R263, her social media was literally marketing for her MLM job, just like pop singers use theirs to market their brand.

If you look at other Thrivers it is similar, they are selling a lifestyle brand using their life and they are desperate for sales. So not a clear cut, organic use of social media. Cannot read too much into it...

So [italic]this[/italic] is the thread where reasonable conversation is happening. The serialized one is fully insane. This is refreshing. Carry on!

[quote]She posted lovely sentiments on her FB, but her actions said something different.

Shanann's sm posts are odd. This woman was trying to embody an image of a dynamic, successful individual because that was her job - the MLM outfit she worked for encourages - as all MLMs do - its adherents to practice cult like 'positive thinking'. They are taught to focus on 'abundance' , not their debts, to magically attract wealth. They are taught to act, to perform being successful to make that happen. When someone is involved with these MLM cults their private, family life is ransacked by them as material for online post that have nothing to do with reality, they are essentially micro managed adverts for the promotion of the MLM products and their alleged benefits.

Shanann used Chris when he buffed up, for Thrive product placement. Her posts are never personal, she never calls him 'darling' or 'my beloved' or anything touching. Always pushing the product or noting how he's assisted her goals to become richer. 'Someone' thrivin'' she posted with a photo of him moving the lawn. It's an impersonal sales pitch and also demeaning to him, he must have felt under pressure in his home life to be very performative. She staged 'fun' activities like him being pied in the face by the kids and she live streamed them on FB. These two had no affection or deep bond.

[quote]So not a clear cut, organic use of social media. Cannot read too much into it...

Exactly. Shanann's social media was just self promotion and sale pitches for Thrive. The family were given their roles and told to act accordingly.

I am sure she felt a lot of pressure to be performative as well. Even the unborn baby had a performative role with the upcoming gender reveal party.

Their debt was staggering and their neighbors were moving toward having them foreclosed on for a trivial amount of money. Their decisions baffle me. Were the neighbors going to be at the gender reveal party? A kid was about to start kindergarten with these same families. Why not sell, get out from debt and get settled before a kid with a pretty tough row to hoe anyway had to be uprooted?

[quote]Their debt was staggering and their neighbors were moving toward having them foreclosed on for a trivial amount of money.

They were in debt to their homeowners association too?

[quote]Chris Watts was not charming, his wife said he had 'no game'

The BTK's son-in-law said the same thing about him. He still fooled everyone for decades.

And Chris, too, successfully got people to like him -- The Daily Beast story is literally titled, "Everyone Liked Him".

Sometimes, projecting an image of awkwardness and endearing helplessness is part of the con. Watts' interview after his family "disappeared" shows that his communication style, though simple, is efficient and persuasive - that he did have "game".

And if you think he was just a normal guy, and not at all a sociopath, how do you describe his demeanor during that interview? Would a non-sociopath be so flat, manipulative, and nonchalant after killing his family?

[quote]A grandiose, impulsive, violent psychopath simply does do not meekly submit, in public, and at home, to a woman described as 'emotionally abusive' and 'bullying'

Where was Shannan described as a bully? Even the Daily Beast, which quotes someone as saying she wore the pants in the family, falls far short of saying that.

[quote] - a psychopathic character would have beaten her when she first tried that, or left her long ago.

You're under the impression that psychopaths are out-of-control rageaholics. Robert Hare, who composed the Psychopathic Checklist, said they're the opposite - that they're hollow emotionally and that even their expressions of anger and fury are contrived.

[quote]How was Watts 'exploitative'? Or 'parasitic'? She had illnesses and couldn't work when they met - she was no catch.

Watts tried to get the police and the public into searching his family's bodies even though he knew full well where they all were. This is clear indication of a manipulative streak.

However, we barely know about this man - he's been in the news for less than a month. There is no reason you should expect us to have a full grasp of his biography and personality already. Maybe more will come out about him which will fit more neatly into the classical description of a sociopath.

But bear in mind that you don't need to fit every item on the Psychopathic Checklist in order to be diagnosed as a psychopath. The detached wouldn't lead a "parasitic lifestyle" because that item is on the antisocial behavioral dimension of the checklist, where they score low. According to the graduate thesis below, many serial killers often described as psychopathic - such as Ted Bundy and Dennis Rader - did not lead parasitic lifestyles.

No wonder why they were in debt - he was paying for his fem bf's plastic surgery

R286, great comment. Totally agree.

R288, some people just cannot admit defeat, and double down instead.

To the thread in general; I have a family member who makes $500k per year. She lives paycheck to paycheck. Literally. Granted, we live in NYC, but that’s not why. For those who are so inclined, the income increase just means more spending. It doesn’t matter how much the Wattses earned: it was going to be spent before it hit the account.

[quote] Chris Watts Killed Wife & Kids To Be w/ His MALE LOVER!

He killed his wife and kids to avoid child support and having to deal with an ex-wife and divorce, nothing about his kids and wife would keep him from being with any lover of any sex. Plus he is probably nuts.

I agree with r294. I would imagine that Chris was envisioning Shananana would be hell on wheels both during the divorce and afterward. He dreaded that. Which of course makes him a psycho for how he chose to handle it. But I do think his prediction for what she would behave like in the divorce was spot on — she doesn’t strike me as the type who would “play fair.” The part that’s most disturbing are the two kids.....he felt nothing for them? He didn’t feel sad thinking about life without them? He didn’t feel revulsion at causing them physical pain? It’s beyond disgusting. But I can see how the psycho “justified” killing the wife, but NOT the kids too.

R295 which makes you have to wonder if it was really him who killed the kids.

R295,if he killed her and not the kids,what then? he'd have been stuck with 2 versions of her,sickly,needy and demanding. He didnt want ANY of them,not even the son that was coming. he killed them,theres no doubt,but I dont think it was planned.

The girl hired this " hit man" -- actually, an undercover cop -- to kill her husband. The girl was clearly psychopath, like Chris. Totally nonchalant and smiley even as she was in court.

Anyway, in her conversation with the hitman, she explained her motivation for hiring him, and she didn't say anything to the effect of disliking her husband, being mistreated, and whatnot. She only says that killing him would be easier than divorcing him and then getting hassled by her own parents for the failure of her marriage.

Yeah sometimes I start to buy into a story of him as a closeted dude stuck in this miserable homelife with a bitter, evil frau ....... then I remember that he also murdered his two little daughters.

R286 you say that they had no deep bond. Do you think she knew about his secret life and that's why she had disdain for him?

"No history of criminality, held down steady jobs, did not get into fights, or steal, was regarded as a low key, calm guy."

Jeffrey Macdonald owns this statement .

I can believe he introduced the bf to the kids. People aren't always so discreet. I was in the (public) library searching for a book on a computer; I think I was 19 or 20. A really cute guy, maybe mid-20s, next to me turned and started talking to me. It quickly became clear he was hitting on me. We were sitting so close he managed to get his knee between my legs - we were facing each other at this point - and was rubbing the inside of my thighs with it.

Though I normally would have thought this a little strange I was really attracted to him. I was ready to leave with him when he asked if I had any plans that afternoon. But before I could answer a little kid ran up to him, called him Daddy and asked some question. It was then I noticed a wedding ring. I was so shocked I got up, said, "It looks like you've got your hands full," and walked away. I still don't know where he was going to stash the kid while we did whatever.

Possible discovery of Chris’s nookie account?

7.5 cut

R305, oh. That’s not him, I don’t think.

Bummer. (Pun not intended.)

R303 That's not Chris in the profile photo. The guy in the photo has less broad shoulders, much slimmer waist and hips and has a darker beard. I think it could be Chris' buddy, Kodi, who also works for Anadarko. Nichol K. is Kodi's cousin.

R307, Kodi is 22, though.

But maybe one of their other coworkers.

That kitchen pic looks like him, it even has that gross yellow stuff in a pan that Shan'Ann showed in one of her videos, board shorts, and a patch on his bicep. Or am I confused and they linked a pic of Chris with the profile of the bi-guy? I tried to go to the site but can't see the other private pics.

^^^Never mind, I saw the twitter user saying those are pics from SM of Chris, only profile pic is bi-guy, my mistake.

What is that website with the bi guy profile?

R309 Which website is it?

STILL NOT A WORD ON TV BOUT HIS QUEERNESS.

FUKIN WEIRD.

ALL THEY YELL ABOUT IS TRUMP TRUMP TRUMP

WHO WILL BE GONE BY NEW YEAR

R113 Gay not queer, queer means straight with purple hair

Is [R313] Trent himself?

[quote]Yeah sometimes I start to buy into a story of him as a closeted dude stuck in this miserable homelife with a bitter, evil frau ....... then I remember that he also murdered his two little daughters.

Aaaaah. So you think it's A-okay for a gay man to deceive a woman into thinking he loves her, marry her under false pretenses, start a family with her.....and then kill her?

R286, did you get lost on the way to an Armie and Elizabeth Hammer thread? Your post fits them to a T. All you'd have to do is change the names and occupations.

The male lover didn't provide anything that could prove that he knew CW intimately.

I'm trying to think of what would draw a sociopath like Chris to that balloon-lipped guy. It wouldn't be love, as a man who could kill his own children isn't capable of love, so IMHO the guy either has money or he's a total doormat.

My guess is probably both, but largely the latter. Probably a comparatively young Datalounger, who will do anything for a "straight" man.

Chris shirtless and clearly in murder mode (at least mentally).

What I can’t figure out is, if he looks like he *hated* her even as far back as their wedding photos (which have been posted upthread), WTF did he marry her?

Nobody put a gun to his head and their relationship timeline doesn’t match up with a “shotgun wedding”, so what gives?

He used to be fat, Look at the extra skin on his bellybutton in all the pics.

R318 - Just stay tuned . . .

[quote]I'm trying to think of what would draw a sociopath like Chris to that balloon-lipped guy. It wouldn't be love, as a man who could kill his own children isn't capable of love, so IMHO the guy either has money or he's a total doormat.

Or, you know, sex? That's the primary motivation men cheat - to enjoy more sexual variety.

Trent's brother has said that Chris did his first botox injection. I suppose that means Chris paid for it, so it doesn't seem he was exploiting Trent for money.

The bi guy in the Adam4adam profile says he's a Gemini. Chris was born on May 16th, a Taurus. The first Gemini day is May 21st. It's close but unless his birthday was misreported on the website I found, or Chris didn't really know his Zodiac sign, that's not him.

R319, maybe Trent had good drugs? Or it’s a lie.

R320, I have no idea why men put up with that shit. Some of them just like mean women, for whatever reason. My husband has a friend who married a ballbusting, snotty demanding bitch. This guy is handsome (you guys would cream over him) and mellow and courteous. He worshipped the ground she walked on and she’d just roll her eyes at him. Like Shanann, she’s not even very pretty. It wasn’t like it was a bait-and-switch. She was an absolute cunt when they were dating. These guys have low self-esteem? I can’t explain it.

The birthdate comes straight from the state’s charge sheet, which was released as a pdf to the public, so the earlier birthdate is accurate.

As said before, the primary motivation men cheat, according to research, is to get more variety in their sex lives. Very likely, sex with Trent was different from sex with Shannan. There's no need to speculate about farfetched motivations like drugs or money to understand what may have attracted Chris to Trent.

Trent's brother says Chris gave him his first botox injection. Does this mean Chris paid for it, or that he did it himself?

30 waist?

Lol r316 well put but no, I’d never go anywhere near that far. It’s just reading all these lines of sympathy for the douchebag make me start to forget what a douchebag he is. And then I remember.

[quote]Chris was born on May 16th, a Taurus.

And the motive is discovered - he was just born to be evil.

Yes r331!

My point about Pillow Lips was that Chris the Sociopath could have gotten a much more attractive man. He is the very definition of the "hot straight suburban daddy" that makes some foolish Dataloungers weak in the knees, or he was. Now he's hot cagemeat!

So if there really was a relationship with Pillow Lips, I have to assume he could have gotten someone hotter and that there were attractions other than pure sex. Such as being the doormat the wife was not, or having the money she did not.

R333, supposedly Nichol Kessinger is from money. But you know, it’s all rumor.

I wonder if he was a doormat to previous girlfriends.

I can also imagine that he just wanted to CHILL. Somewhere I read that he said “this has to stop”. It seems like Shanann was one of those nonstop bulldozer people. And they were probably getting deeper and deeper in debt and there was no end in sight.

His solution to that problem was horrifying.

[quote]My point about Pillow Lips was that Chris the Sociopath could have gotten a much more attractive man

Oh please, as if "getting hot partners" was one of the items on the Psychopathic Checklist.

I would argue that reality is the opposite - that sociopaths would get around more often with unattractive partners than ordinary people because of their heightened sociosexuality and low adherence to societal judgments about ethics and aesthetics.

A "hot" partner wouldn't bother putting up with all the drama surrounding a married closet case, since they could easily find someone just as hot with NSA.

[quote]30 waist?

Yeah Chrissy also didn't look like he ever weighed 170 either.

He was probably 200-190 with a 36 waist. Still hot tho

[quote]STILL NOT A WORD ON TV BOUT HIS QUEERNESS.

Very little coverage of Aaron Hernandez being bisexual, even after it was known. Long after it was discussed by other media outlets, conservative CBS ran a "shocking" 48 Hours special. Not a word about his sexuality.

As for why a nice looking guy would fool around with an unfortunate looking queen, any number of reasons. Maybe he liked being the hotter one. Or the more masculine one. Or maybe he's attracted to that type...some are.

limace lips has a huge dong.

r337 Also, people lie on dating profiles. I think the Adam4adam bi guy has too much in common with Chris to rule him out just yet. Even the disparate Zodiac signs are close enough to make you wonder.

R302 You should have gone. Little kids take naps. You and daddy could have taken a "nap" too.

But why would you pretend to be a duplicitous Gemini instead of the forceful, masculine Taurus?

^^Because Taurus is the least sexy sign except for maybe Virgo or Cap.

The idiotic zodiac fraus have arrived.

r344 = Pisces

The purpose of a dating profile is to be sexy enough to attract a partner, R344. And if you're going to bother to include your sign, you'd be dumb to admit to being a Taurus.

As long as Cancer is not ascending Uranus, all prospects look favorable.

R341 I only regret not going due to curiosity about whether the sex would have matched the sparks that were flying when we talked.

R342 Exactly. Geminis always cheat. Tauruses are loyal and like marathon sex sessions.

its fucked that the media wont touch his bi ness with a ten foot pole...

R325 Guys who marry mean women are marrying their moms.

I thought all het dudes marry their mom

Explain, [R350]. Please.

R325. Concise. I like it.

R351. Or maybe some marry the polar opposite. I can’t find any similarities between my late MIL and myself - except that she loved him and so do I. Maybe that’s the crux of it. *Eureka moment*

Haven’t heard a single word about Chris’s mother.

R350 Guys marry what they are used to from childhood. Had a nice mom? The marry a nice woman. Have a bitchy mom? Marry a botchy woman. Had a narcissistic mom? Marry a narcissist (ie. Prince Harry).

R353 You haven't heard about the pistachio incident with Chris' mom?

When Chris was arrested, he asked to speak with his dad. I don't know if he has a mom, but it would be interesting to find out what his relationship with her was like, as maternal abuse is linked to sociopathy.

R354, that’s right! Yes, of course. I’m very familiar with that part of the story.

Well, I guess they’re all keeping their heads down.

Chris' mom is alive in NC. She blames Shanann for taking her son away to Colorado. His parents might be divorced. He's got one married sister.

How do we know about Chris’ mom blaming Shan’ann for “taking her son away”, [R357]?

(Not that I don’t believe you, I’m just curious where you heard it and if there’s more dirt...)

Also: we’re assuming the MIL was a cunt—and maybe she was—but maybe she also knew something we didn’t: it clearly was a *very* bad idea for Shan’ann and Chris to move to CO.

They lived crazily beyond their means and for whatever reason Chris seemingly became a different person there—and now 3 out of the 4 of the family members who lived in CO are dead...

R358, it’s probably a little bit of both. Frankly, I think the Shanann/MIL thing was a case of two cunts going up against each other. Shanann won.

I’m not sure if most men can really know the subtle power games that happen among women. My opinion is that Shanann was systematically removing Chris from HIS sphere and forcing him into hers, where she had total control. He had to socialize with HER friends, spend time with HER family, have hobbies that SHE approved of, etc. I’ve seen it happen a few times. It’s like the frog in the pot - all of a sudden it’s boiling and it’s too late.

And again, I despise Chris, and Shanann and the kids aren’t to blame for what he did. But his life sucked.

^^ The MIL probably saw this happening, r358. I agree.

And she was powerless to stop it.

According to the Daily Beast, it is believed that it was Chris who moved the family to Colorado.

Interesting take, [R359]/[R360], and so true about most men not understanding the subtle power games that happen amongst women.

I can totally see what you wrote being plausible. (Both women being cunts and vying for influence with/over Chris, etc...)

[R361], I read a few articles that mentioned that the family moved there apparently “because of Chris”, but they were light on details and it seemed like they only moved there “because of Chris” because that was the only place Chris could get a decent job at the time (that oil company there), and not necessarily because he really wanted to go to CO.

I *do* hope more articles/info comes out about it though, because the move to Colorado was not something that happened when they were college kids and it really took both of them away from their extended families/families of origin for the first time in their lives—and it seemed to put way more pressure on them both (Shan’ann and especially Chris).

And it seemed to be (in some way) part of what spelled doom for the family.

There was a story a few years back about a husband who killed his wife because they were about to move to the east coast for him to begin medical school. Turns out, he was never accepted to medical school, and never even applied. Rather than come clean and admit his whole life was a lie, he decided the better option, evidently, was to kill her, report her as disappeared, and then join in the search for her body.

Some people dig a hole so deep they think they have no other option but to disappear the problem by killing. And some others, like Madoff, are able to keep digging the hole, fuck everybody around them, and never turn a hair.

Madoff is a true psychopath. Don’t know about these other cases. All speculation on CW at this point.

R363, that makes me think of Frankie’s statement about not being able to protect her. It’s heartbreaking and I think he was right.

R365, I think that was Mark Hacking. Horrific. Agree with your whole post.

Personally, I don’t think Chris is a psychopath, or even a sociopath. He’s a sick fuck, though.

R360 Or it's just that she spawned a quadruple murderer.

R358 Read it on some forum. Can't remember.

Shanann's friends moved to CO first. They told the Watts that it was easier to get jobs. Chris was hired as mechanic for a car dealership and earned $147,000/yr. Shanann was hired by the same dealership as a salesperson on the internet.

Their former boss said she boosed Chris around but "was a nice person." He said that his sales guy were leaving to work for the oil business.

It could be that business had dropped off.

He left that job and started working for Anadarko for $60,000/yr. She left the dealership and worked nights at a children's hospital for $30,000 ( think).

In a video a month before the murders, Shanann talks about how much she likes Colorado and feels at peace. Her videos and posts were selling a Thrive dream life so who knows the real truth.

lol. typo: bossed not boosed.

$60,000 was Chris' gross. With taxes taken out, it was more like $40,000 net.

Their mortgage payment alone was $3,000/month. I'm not convinced that Shanann was actually making much money with Thrive. The HOA fee that they didn't pay was $450. Then it jumped to $1500. The HOA was taking them to court scheduled for Aug 25th. They were attempting to foreclose and force an auction or at least place a lien on the house.

Bella was about to start kindergarten in a private school. I think preschool was costing $1600/month. Cece was starting preschool.

Wow, a private school on top of the $3,000 a month mortgage and another baby on the way (and Chris only taking home around $40,000 annually after taxes)?

Their financial situation was *way* worse than I thought.

The kids probably should have been in public school and they should have lived in an apartment until they got more on their feet financially.

If you’re in that much debt, each kid does not need their own room either—especially when that young.

As somebody said on DL, moms of kids at the private school have money to buy Thrive when public school moms don't.

R373, private school moms don’t go for that MLM stuff. I could write paragraphs about this, being in that particular bubble.

Then again, maybe it’s a regional thing, and the wealthy Denver suburban richies just love the hard sell from the downmarket.

Why do nice guys marry bitches? Sometimes it's because their mother are bitches, and they're re-creating the family they're used to.

And other times it's because the guys aren't actually nice, but still want to be liked. They act nice on the surface and underneath is a roiling mass of anger and resentment which they don't dare express, because they want to be like. So they marry some bitch who says all the nasty things they feel but don't want to say out loud, and she tells off all the people who he wants told off, and he gets to have everyone he dislikes bitched out while maintaining his reputation as Mr. Nice. Plus, everyone feels sorry for him because he's so nice and he's married to this raging bitch!

I've seen this a million times, including in my own parents' marriage.

[quote]I'm not convinced that Shanann was actually making much money with Thrive.

99% of people who get into multilevel marketing either never make a profit or end up deep in debt.

R375 nailed it.

They get something out of it. Otherwise they’d leave. (Some do.).

She had it coming. She only had herself to blame.

If you'd have been there If you'd have seen it I betcha you would have done the same!

Shh, don't tell that to the WSers, R346. They think she was making bank.

Wait are you serious r379? Those web sleuth fraus think she was pulling down mad coin? No way, because I bet half of them are #bossmoms too. If they do think that they are even dumber than I thought.

The author wrote the following a few days ago:

WRONG THREAD.

Maybe not r381, only prayer and Dan Peterson can now save Chris' life!

Dan will be inspired for his next Chris Creation.

His co-worker is female. She's co-operating with police and is not suspected of wrongdoing.

Authorities have confirmed they have interviewed Trent as well.

R385, that “coworker” better have a damn good lawyer. As we know, Chris doesn’t hesitate to throw a gal under the bus...

From the fb group, supposedly this chick is always doing drama shit, she takes after our own Dan: "So when I write my letter to Chris, how many of yall want me to say hey for you? I know there's gotta be at least one of you. 😂 Edit: Thanks for proving the point of how insanely hateful people are towards total strangers, and also how ridiculously rude you are about others females looks. Everyone in here has their own opinion about this case, or did yall not know that we are allowed to have our own opinion?"

I legit thought he was in his 40s.

r387 Do they think still the co-worker is Nichol Kessinger? Because this chick isn't even a co-worker of Chris' - she works for a different company in a different city. We don't even know that co-worker is in the witness list where people found Kessinger's name.

Shan'ann made a video where she talked about her lupus, and said she moved to CO to nanny for her friend and Chris came with and he got a job not long after, that they initially moved in with the friend she nannied for and seemed to imply there was some drama back home in NC. Whether the drama was the in-laws or another woman, who knows.

Not long after staying with her friends, they put a down payment on their house. I can't remember where I saw the video, but it was National Lupus Day and she started off talking about getting diagnosed at 25.

R387 Hot male killer develops insane female fandom -- shocker!

^Let's be real, R391. On DL, it's also an insane male fandom.

I dont like that we have two open threads on this subject. It makes it very difficult to follow new developments in this critically important and historical Tot Pop saga. Please do not start renegade threads!

Why, R393? Does it make you want to strangle a 3 year old?

It’s both, R387. Chris had affairs with multiple men and women, remember? This unnamed woman and his coworker (Nichol Kessinger?) were two of them.

r395 There's no evidence that it was multiple men and women.

PEOPLE's phrasing - "relationships with both men and women" - might simply mean an "indeterminate amount of men and women". People do use the plural in that sense, when they're unsure about quantity.

Also, either Nichol and this co-worker are the same woman, or Chris was not involved with Nichol.

There's NOTHING linking this Nichole person sexually to Chris - what we have is merely the online speculation that she was the co-worker mentioned before. AFAIK, she's merely one of the MANY people, male and female, in Colorado's oil and mining industry who've been listed among the witnesses of this case.

R390, I know which video you’re talking about. Please keep in mind that those videos are her version of events, presented as inspirational for her Thrive business.

Shanann seems to have exaggerated quite a bit. I still fail to see how a single woman in her early 20s working as a nanny (AFAIK) was able to build a 4,000 sf house all on her own. Even “working her butt off”. Even if it had been somehow acquired as a marital asset of her one-year-long marriage to the small-town public defender, I don’t see how she did it. It doesn’t make sense.

Even the fraus at Websleuths are doubting her claims that she “struggled to conceive”.

“I also disagree that SW had trouble getting pregnant. Pregnancy #1 was 4 months after their marriage, baby #2 came a year later. She posted on FB that they were going to try for a baby on May 8th & was pregnant with #3 that day or close to it.”

I won’t call her a LIAR, but I think she exaggerated everything. Her health issues and those of her kids. Their finances. Her relationship. Everything was some illusion.

R396 is correct, of course. We don’t know anything factual about his extramarital activities.

There are rumors and conclusions drawn on assumptions and hunches.

It’s frustrating to stick to the facts because there are so few.

There's an anonymous woman - apparently not the Co-Worker - claiming she hooked up with Chris recently as well. She said he was into animalistic sex and would choke her during intercourse. I'm finding her story a bit far-fetched. Didn't Trent claim the opposite - that Chris was the most loving guy he'd ever met?

[quote]Chris Watts was not charming, his wife said he had 'no game'

She claimed he couldn't possibly have an affair because he had no game. See how that ended.

R400, just another way she belittled him.

"She said he was into animalistic sex and would choke her during intercourse. I'm finding her story a bit far-fetched. Didn't Trent claim the opposite..."

Not impossible, people do vary what they do in bed, depending on their mood and what their partner wants.

But c'mon r402, wouldn't Bolte be the one you'd choke?

Yeah, well, I expect it was Shannen he wanted to choke. That might explain a lot.

Choking Pillow Lips would have come later.

He was choking a little Shanann, when he strangled CeCe. But Bella looked like him. Strange to be killing her but then he needed a clean slate to keep tramping around.

Just admit it R29, he is a dead man walking because he killed his wife & kids. It's really only a matter of time until his death sentence.

Why should those of us on the DL wait for the hetero majority to hand it down? We all know it's coming (by the way I support the dp & hope he gets it for his actions).

So in typical DL fashion =

What was on his ipod? His wife's ipod? His kids ipod?

I guess this was on his ipod =

Metallica covered this song too, no doubt he listened to their version but the original is best.

My partner's brother was in Amway and his life fell apart being in that MLM . Divorce, broke, etc. Unfortunately he was murdered by druggies this last spring and although my partner was very upset about this , he was glad Brother was at a better place now after his hellish life ( and wife)

So basically it’s just a few steps from MLM tool to murder victim

In an era when anything can be ordered from anywhere on Earth and delivered the next day, without ever having to deal with a salesperson, how the hell can anyone believe there's still a place in this world for in-person MLM sales? Sure, maybe when the only store within 50 miles had only one shade of lipstick then the local Avon Lady was your best source for makeup, but now it's probably quicker to order your crap form Amazon than to wait for your local Avon rep to process your order and deliver it. It's undoubtedly cheaper, too, and Amazon won't give you a guilt trip if you hate the product and send it back.

I can't believe anyone with a 3-digit IQ would sign up for market MLM crap these days.

I wouldn't be betting that Shannan'aaan'nana'aaan had a three-digit IQ.

Do you really think he was "closeted" or simply bisexual?

R391, he isn't hot

R413, you can be bisexual and closeted (in fact, most bisexual men are closeted)

Bit of the loop..so have the gay/bi hookup,rumours deflated like the filler in the lips of that creepy killer-clown looking ass fantasist? Can’t find anything on google

Yes this is fake, and I hope that freak got arrested.

R416 Yeah I knew all along he was a bullshitter..but the other reports of gay hookups was that all fake news too?

Read the transcripts from the trial, it was all fabricated