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Mary Wilson of the Supremes

What say you?

by Anonymousreply 20203/07/2015

She could use a singing teacher.

by Anonymousreply 108/01/2010

"Wilson then recruited a new friend of hers, Diane Ross"

Oops, should have gotten to know her a little better first.

by Anonymousreply 208/01/2010

Still brags about bagging Tom Jones.

by Anonymousreply 308/01/2010

She should brag about. His cock is HUGE!

by Anonymousreply 408/01/2010

I wish Diana and her and Cindy could come together and put their problems away and go ON TOUR!! I know they tried to do this several years ago and it failed, but one can WISH!!!

by Anonymousreply 508/01/2010

Flo Ballad once said that out of the two, she would rather deal with Diana, who while difficult, was blunt and honest. Mary was two faced.

by Anonymousreply 608/01/2010

Her book about the Supremes is the best selling book about pop/rock singers ever written.

by Anonymousreply 708/01/2010

Mary reigns Supreme. Diana is a big fat whore.

by Anonymousreply 808/01/2010

RuPaul said he liked Diana even more after reading Wilson's book.

by Anonymousreply 908/01/2010

Funny that of all the Motown acts, the Supremes are the only ones where you know the names of all the members.

by Anonymousreply 1008/01/2010

I can only hope they will re-unite and return to love.

by Anonymousreply 1108/01/2010

A book you should pick up is "All that Glitters" by Tony Turner, who was an assistant for Mary for years. It's a Supremes and Wilson saga, most noteworthy for a scene where in order to score some drugs in a city backalley, Mary has to perform "Stop in the Name of Love" (hand gestures and all) to convince the dealer that it's really her.

by Anonymousreply 1208/01/2010

There will always be an asterix next to Diana's name thar says "I fucked over my girlhood friends to become star."

by Anonymousreply 1308/01/2010

They couldn't reunite because Diana planned to pay herself something like $10,000,000 and Mary was to get $500 and a coupon to Chuck E. Cheese. I wouldn't have done it either.

by Anonymousreply 1408/01/2010

I would love to see a reality show about Diana, Mary and Flo trying to put a comeback act together. That would be a ratings goldmine!

by Anonymousreply 1508/01/2010

And the show would be called "Where Did Our Love Go?"

by Anonymousreply 1608/01/2010

She was a Supreme the longest.

by Anonymousreply 1708/01/2010

I meant "Cindy" not Flo.

by Anonymousreply 1808/01/2010

[quote]I would love to see a reality show about Diana, Mary and Flo trying to put a comeback act together. That would be a ratings goldmine!

Yeah, Im sure people would love to see how they bring Flo back from the dead!

by Anonymousreply 1908/01/2010

That bitch Diana got to wear a fucking "Love Child" t-shirt and us former Supremes-turned-Diana Ross backup singers didn't get to wear one.

by Anonymousreply 2008/01/2010

Those other two bitches didn't even sing on the group's final recordings.

by Anonymousreply 2108/01/2010

At Flo's funeral, they played "Someday We'll Be Together" which was great except for the fact that she didn't sing on that song.

by Anonymousreply 2208/01/2010

On the record yes but at Concert Mary and Cindy did sing the song several times.

by Anonymousreply 2308/01/2010

Honey, they were lip synching to the Andantes!

by Anonymousreply 2408/01/2010

r24 OH PLEASE!!!!

by Anonymousreply 2508/01/2010

better than she's often given credit for..

by Anonymousreply 2608/01/2010

You missed the point r23. R22 specifically pointed out the song was played at FLO's funeral. Who cares if Mary and Cindy sang the song in a few concerts?

by Anonymousreply 2708/01/2010

I was referring to r21's post.

by Anonymousreply 2808/01/2010


by Anonymousreply 2908/02/2010

Diana had star power. The other two did not.%0D %0D Show business is cruel.%0D %0D Diana also worked harder.

by Anonymousreply 3008/02/2010

Yeah, Diana did work harder, harder at fucking Berry Gordy to get ahead.%0D %0D %0D R14- You actually are not too far off. Mary said the reason she did not do the reunion concert was because she was only going to get pennies, compared to the MILLIONS that Diana was going to get. She said Diana stated she had no idea how poorly Mary was gong to get paid, but Mary didn't believe her and I don't either. There is no way in fucking hell that Diana was not aware how much the other Supremes were going to be offered. However, she thought if she was there with some scabs, the fans would flock to buy tickets. I was more than thrilled when the concert flopped.

by Anonymousreply 3108/02/2010

I worked with Mary a couple of years ago when she sang with our symphony. Very nice woman, down-to-earth and friendly. And she still has a voice. She gave a terric concert; lots of fun.%0D %0D I spoke with her back stage a few tims over the course of a couple of days. She was always pleasant. And it was noticeable that although it was only a couple of times, she always referred to Miss Ross as "Diane" (her real name), and not "Diana."

by Anonymousreply 3208/02/2010

Well, DIANE IS her real name.

by Anonymousreply 3308/02/2010

Mary was originally offered a million to do the show. The promoters upped it to two and Diana PERSONALLY doubled the amount, making it four. Mary refused every offer. She had no intention of ever taking anything, and she was a fool for not doing so.%0D %0D I'm sure Ross was no sweetheart back in those days, but Mary's pity party has worn thin. She drove the Supremes into the ground thanks to having her abusive ex-husband serve as their manager (who had zero business experience), then spent the next thirty years playing the victim. And her adoration towards Flo is a bit too much, considering that she verbally agreed with Diana and Berry in getting her ass canned from the group. %0D %0D

by Anonymousreply 3408/02/2010

They sound like old lovers, and Mary was the one who got dumped.

Mary and Cindy stayed on with the new Supremes after Diana/Diane left to make her *fortune* as a solo act.

How did Mary like the new diva, and sometimes lesbian, Jean Terrell? Jean had a good voice, looks, class and presence, though not the charisma of Ross. Hmmm?

by Anonymousreply 3508/02/2010

[quote]Mary refused every offer. She had no intention of ever taking anything, and she was a fool for not doing so.

If a deal had been made that was generous enough to Mary and Cindy to get them onboard, the "Return to Love" tour would have been a hit.

Maybe Mary was offered $4 million; I kind of doubt it. What was the offer to Cindy?

I think Wilson and Miss Birdsong knew that there was no real draw to a Supremes tour without both of them, and refused to work for pennies to Miss Ross's dollars.

And the rest is history (including an embarrassing live performance on "Today," where Diana seemed to want both of the unknown Supremes to just go away and not answer any questions between numbers).

I've seen Mary live a couple of times at festivals. I don't know if she still performs it, but I always liked her solo single "Walk the Line"

by Anonymousreply 3608/02/2010

She also had an affair with Steve McQueen.

I think the fact that when the Supremes were at their height, Mary was considered the "pretty one" always stuck in Diana Ross' craw. Even though 'The Boss' was having an affair with the boss, Barry Gordy.

Those two really should give up going on tour as the "Supremes". What's wrong with just getting back up singers who sound like the other two group members.

Works for Paul McCartney, who isn't on tour as "The Beatles".

by Anonymousreply 3708/02/2010

Um, not really. DIANA was the one who described Mary as The Beauty and Flo as The Voice. I supposed she considered herself as the one with the star quality, and if that's true, I agree with her.

by Anonymousreply 3808/02/2010

Mary Wilson was offered $4 million for the reuinion tour? Yeah, right. It probably was a hell of a lot less...and she wasn't accepting it.

by Anonymousreply 3908/02/2010

She was NOT offered a million to do the tour, more like 10 or 20k, I forget which amount.

by Anonymousreply 4008/02/2010

She was originally offered a million. The figures are all true. It was clarified on all the interviews around that time. %0D %0D Mary wanted a third of what Diana was getting ($15 million) which meant 5 million. No one in their right mind was going to pay Mary Wilson five million for ANYTHING, so she was just being a bitch about the whole situation and looking to get her face in the media again. %0D %0D Cindy's figure was much lower than Mary's initial figure, but I didn't hear Miss Wilson utter one word about it the whole time. Nor did Birdsong go on TV and cry a river. Naturally, Mary was the sole victim as always.

by Anonymousreply 4108/02/2010

Mary Wilson is a class act and always friendly when I see her. What has gone on between her and Miss Ross is their business. I do wish they'd sing together one more time though. I am a sucker for that kind of thing.

by Anonymousreply 4208/02/2010

Me too r42

by Anonymousreply 4308/02/2010

No other has been has milked as much out of what was essentially a 5 year run at the top as Mary Wilson.

by Anonymousreply 4408/02/2010

I would love to read Cindy's bio.

by Anonymousreply 4508/02/2010

Cindy won't speak ill of anyone or give the real dish. She's too much a lady and worships the Lord.

by Anonymousreply 4608/03/2010

From the Motown TV special 1983...was this the last time Mary and Cindy shared a stage with Miss Ross? And only after a big solo star turn by Diana...

And the three of them only got like 20 seconds before everyone else in the show came out onstage to close the show, at Diana's beckoning?


by Anonymousreply 4708/03/2010

oops here's the link, sorry

by Anonymousreply 4808/03/2010

All arguing aside about the Supremes, Motown, the British Invasion of the '60s and so much of the music of the mid- to late-'60s was the greatest era in pop music ever. Motown stood nearly above the rest.%0D %0D I know people will say, "You're old," but the music of today with all the electronic enhancements, rap and crappy voices, just doesn't compare with the '60s.%0D %0D And other than Frank Sinatra, Judy Garland and their music that preceded the pop artists, the music that came out of the '60s from Barbra Streisand to Sonny & Cher, The Beatles, The Supremes, Temptations and so many others of that time period was amazing and a landmark yet to be equaled in the standard and pop music field.

by Anonymousreply 4908/03/2010

Couldn't have said it any better, r49.

by Anonymousreply 5008/03/2010

Hell, Miss Mary is one Dumb Fuck!%0D %0D Four Million bucks to Sing Baby Baby @ 30 shows!%0D %0D It's all about her "significance as a founding Member?",%0D %0D Well you dumb Ho!, You never even sang on the 2 biggest Supremes hits!, #1), Love Child & #2) Someday We'll be Together!%0D %0D As for Miss Birdsong, Miss Mary put herself in charge of negotiations for Cindy!, she NEVER asked for any additional money for Cindy after the 4 Million Dollar offer was made to HER!%0D %0D It seems Mary would rahter sing @ a Supermarket opening for spare change & a hit of crack!%0D %0D She needs to be the Star I guess?%0D %0D Oh, I almost forgot, Miss Mary was the one who FIRED Cindy's ass from The Supremes, for "Letting Herself go", What a laugh,Has anyone seen all 200lb's of Miss Mary lately?%0D %0D As for Diana?, Her Legal name IS DIANA ROSS, it was not intended by her family, but was a clerical error on the Birth Certificate.%0D %0D As for Motown Sleeping arrangements, I can't think of how Diana Ross sleeping with Berry Gordy could make effect Diana's record sales?%0D %0D Miss Mary has had more "MOTOWN MEAT" than Diana, Florence & Cindy combined!%0D %0D

by Anonymousreply 5112/27/2010

"And the three of them only got like 20 seconds before everyone else in the show came out onstage to close the show, at Diana's beckoning? "%0D %0D I'd love to see the unedited footage where Diana turns and pushes Mary backwards. If it's out there, I've never seen it. Anyone?%0D %0D I believe my favorite quote about Miss Ross comes from Mary Wilson herself: "Success didn't change Diane Ross...she was always a bitch." (or "always a snob" - something like that)

by Anonymousreply 5212/27/2010

Do any of the former Supremes deal crack? Just curious.

by Anonymousreply 5312/27/2010

"As for Motown Sleeping arrangements, I can't think of how Diana Ross sleeping with Berry Gordy could make effect Diana's record sales?"%0D %0D Because Barry was throwing all of Motown's limited resources into promoting Miss Ross and her record sales, leaving other Motown acts to flounder. Not coincidentally, this is about the same time that such long time Motown acts as the Isley Brothers, The Four Tops, the Spinners and Gladys Knight and the Pips started jumping ship. The only reason Stevie Wonder didn't bail was Barry was smart enough to know what a huge talent he was about to become, and gave him the rights to all of his future compositions. %0D %0D When Jean Terrell took over Diana's spot, the newly reformed Supremes were outselling Miss Ross' solo efforts. That's when Barry pulled out all the stops and diverted money to plugging Miss Ross' sagging record sales (and to getting "Lady Sings the Blues" in the can). %0D %0D

by Anonymousreply 5412/27/2010

to add to R54...

I remember in Berry Gordy's book, he pretty much admitted as much. I remember him rationalizing it when other acts started complaining, saying that promoting Diana would help her crossover (a la Streisand etc..) and her success would raise the whole company up with her.. To his credit, he did make Diana a star, pretty much all her stardom today stems from all the investment made on her at Motown. However, not sure how much of that really helped the other acts..

by Anonymousreply 5512/27/2010

Dreamgirls--- is that based on Diana and the Supremes?

by Anonymousreply 5612/27/2010

[quote]Funny that of all the Motown acts, the Supremes are the only ones where you know the names of all the members%0D %0D Really? That would be great!

by Anonymousreply 5712/27/2010

Loved Mary's book!%0D Here is an interesting thread on "All that Glitters," the book mentioned on the first page:

by Anonymousreply 5812/27/2010

"However, not sure how much of that really helped the other acts.."%0D %0D Well, it didn't hurt Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye or Smokey Robinson.%0D %0D Diana being Motown's biggest act is debatable, and I say this as a fan. Sales wise, she never equalled her Supremes years of having a steady string of number one hits and hit albums. One or two huge hits would be followed by a couple of flops. For all the talk of how Berry pulled the strings, her biggest years of success oddly came at the time when she started managing herself and the relationship with Gordy was dissolved.%0D %0D I would say Stevie was the biggest seller at Motown during the 70's. "Songs In the Key of Life" alone sold millions. %0D %0D

by Anonymousreply 5912/27/2010

Mary Wilson is a very nice person and very professional. I worked with her when she came to perform with our symphony. She puts on a good show. Still has the voice.

by Anonymousreply 6012/27/2010

[quote]Not coincidentally, this is about the same time that such long time Motown acts as the Isley Brothers, The Four Tops, the Spinners and Gladys Knight and the Pips started jumping ship. The only reason Stevie Wonder didn't bail was%0D %0D Because he couldn't see the gang plank.

by Anonymousreply 6112/27/2010

R61: thanks for the laugh!

by Anonymousreply 6212/27/2010

Judging by R61's lame post, it doesn't take a whole hell of a lot of effort to make you laugh, does it R62?

by Anonymousreply 6312/27/2010

Oh, good one, R63! You really showed them!

by Anonymousreply 6412/27/2010

The Isley Bros weren't a longtime Motown act.

by Anonymousreply 6512/27/2010

Miss Mary was offered 4 Million to do the reunion with Diana Ross, she never responded to the offer, she was playing Hardball for even more cash.%0D %0D Cindy left Her negotiations to Mary, who never even bothered to ask for more for Cindy.%0D %0D Miss Mary also had More Motown Meat in her than Diana, Cindy & Flo combined, she was, after all "The Party Girl"!%0D %0D Tony Turner also tells a good story about how a Topless Miss Mary invited Sammy Davis Jr. into her dressing Room to snort a few lines & get a classic Motown Hummer!.%0D %0D That Girl is a PIG!, but sounds like a moose stuck in the mud.

by Anonymousreply 6601/19/2011

Hmm Just Who has Miss Mary Serviced?%0D %0D Isley's %0D Spinners%0D Contours%0D Temptations%0D Four Tops%0D Chi Lites%0D Tom Jones%0D Flip Wilson%0D Sammy Davis Jr.%0D Steve McQueen%0D %0D Now Thats just the 60's & The ones Published!%0D %0D Busy Girl (To Say the Least!)%0D

by Anonymousreply 6702/06/2011

R67,%0D %0D MARY! .... Wilson

by Anonymousreply 6803/01/2011

R12--the coke story was from his second book "Lead Us Not Into Temptation," which was about over Motown artists he worked with. Still, that book is a scream as much as "Glitters" is and it's been out of print so long it's a collector's item.

by Anonymousreply 6903/01/2011

Mary was offered $2 million and Cindy was offered $700,000 for their participation by the promoters. It was rejected by both and they came back a few months later with $3 million for Mary and $1 million for Cindy.%0D %0D Cindy was willing to accept, but decided she would wait for Mary to do so as well. Mary rejected the $3 million and Diana interceded and offered her $4 million and another $500,000 for Cindy. Mary did accept the offer in the end, but waited too long to communicate that, at which point Diana had moved on by hiring Scherrie Payne and Lynda Lawrence.%0D %0D The tour failed mainly because of the ticket prices being ridiculously high and the venues were too big.

by Anonymousreply 7003/01/2011

Mary was crazy to turn down $4 million to sing oohs and aahs in the background for thirty shows. She hasn't seen that kind of money since, although she is comfortably well-off.

by Anonymousreply 7103/01/2011

Didn't Mary lose one of her sons in a car accident?

by Anonymousreply 7203/03/2011

[quote]Well, it didn't hurt Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye or Smokey Robinson...Diana being Motown's biggest act is debatable, and I say this as a fan. Sales wise, she never equalled her Supremes years of having a steady string of number one hits and hit albums. One or two huge hits would be followed by a couple of flops.[/quote]

She may not have been THE biggest, but she definitely got a disproportionate share of attention, considering the strings of flop singles in between hits etc.. It was an easy (and not entirely illegitimate) target for some of the other acts who were down on their luck. And IIRC, it was still something Berry Gordy defended, even in his own autobiography in the 90s.

Bringing it back to Mary, I recall reading an interview that was re-published online

by Anonymousreply 7303/27/2011

So how much were Scherrie Payne and Lynda Laurence paid?

by Anonymousreply 7407/08/2011

The irony of this is that I saw Mary in SF last year and her current "show" consists almost entirely of Supremes song whose vocal she wasn't actually singing the first time around.

by Anonymousreply 7507/08/2011

Ironically, I saw Mary Wilson in SF last year and her current "show" consists almost entirely of Supremes songs she didn't even sing the vocals for the first time around!

by Anonymousreply 7607/08/2011

Ironically, I saw Mary Wilson in SF last year and her current "show" consists almost entirely of Supremes songs - whose vocals she didn't even sing the first time around!

by Anonymousreply 7707/08/2011

Sorry for the multiple post :(

by Anonymousreply 7807/08/2011

"Bringing it back to Mary, I recall reading an interview that was re-published online"%0D %0D ...and?%0D %0D Anyway, I think it's too bad they couldn't get it together for the "Return to Love" tour - it could have been great. The shows as they were actually were good, but completely overshadowed by Mary's non-participation. I guess she got her revenge in the end...

by Anonymousreply 7907/08/2011

Mary's two books were whitewashes of the truth. Supposedly, when she was writing the first book she had to have sessions with a hypnotist because she couldn't remember much that happened when she was in the Supremes.

by Anonymousreply 8011/19/2011

That's fucked up, MW.

by Anonymousreply 8111/19/2011

On the one hand, Diana Ross succeeded because of her raw star power (she did have an "it" factor) and tenacity. She pursued "the dream" harder than any of the other Supremes.

That being said, she pursued it at all costs. She stepped over anyone - including her girlhood friends and label mates - who she perceived as standing in her way.

Mary Wilson mentions in "Dreamgirls" that Berry Gordy purposefully did not promote the second incarnation of The Supremes because it was interfering with Ross' solo career.

The "new" Supremes were outselling Ross and scored two immediate Top 10 singles ("Stoned Love", "Up the Ladder to the Roof") while Ross managed a single Top 20 song ("Reach Out and Touch (Somebody's Hand)").

Gordy shifted all of his talented songwriters to Diana, marketed The Supremes with awkward album covers and ugly promotional materials, booked them in smaller tier markets, and pretty much starved them creatively. He did the same to the other famous Motown groups like The Four Tops and Martha and the Vandellas.

I don't believe Mary begrudges Diana's stardom, but she does resent Diana's ruthlessness and disloyalty when climbing to the top.

by Anonymousreply 8211/19/2011

I remember watching that live Today show appearance, where Miss Ross and the the hired backup singers performed in the street, and it was awful.

by Anonymousreply 8311/19/2011


by Anonymousreply 8411/19/2011

Didn't Patti LaBelle use to say that she wanted to bitchslap Diane for the stunts she used to pull back when the Supremes and the Blubelles used to perform in the same shows?

by Anonymousreply 8511/19/2011

I have a book called "Hollywood Feuds" that talks about what a cunt Diana could be to her peers. Patti, Gladys, Martha Reeves and Mary Wells all had issues with her because she could be bitchy. Her star power certainly did get her over, 'cause her vocals have never really been anything special.

by Anonymousreply 8611/19/2011


If they had bottled water back in the day, I would've doused that bitch!

by Anonymousreply 8711/19/2011

Diana Ross was and always will be The Supremes. It's her voice and sound on all those records, some of which don't even have The Supremes on them.

Mary made a very good living in the group and was never a talented vocalist.

by Anonymousreply 8811/19/2011

Sadly, R88 is correct about Mary's voice. And there's a great story in one of the Ross biographies that describes an encounter between the Supremes and the Bluebells. Cindy paid a surprise visit to the Supremes' dressing room between shows. Diana proceeded to make Cindy up with heavy stage makeup, complete with a big old wig. Cindy went back to her group to show off the makeover. Nona Hendryx pulled off the wig and threw it down the hallway ("You can tell Diana Ross what to do with her fake white-girl hair!") and Diana caught it in midair.

by Anonymousreply 8911/19/2011

I saw Miss Ross years ago at Caesar's Palace. She was fab.

by Anonymousreply 9011/19/2011

No wonder Mary Wilson never made solo records.

by Anonymousreply 9111/20/2011

Actually, Mary recorded a solo album as part of her Motown contract, but it sucked so they got rid of her.

by Anonymousreply 9211/20/2011

Mary wrote that Gordy gave her the solo record as a means of placating her, and that he basically sabotaged it from the get-go. I believe Mary was suing Motown at the time, so it was a way of settling with her while also sweeping her career under the rug.

Interesting fact: Mary was offered the song "Holiday" before Madonna, but turned it down!

by Anonymousreply 9311/20/2011

Diane Ross is one ugly woman with marginal singing talent and below average acting talent. It's pretty clear she never would have gotten as far as she did if Barry Gordy hadn't taken an interest in her.

by Anonymousreply 9411/20/2011

There was a Diana Ross biography a few years after Mary's. I remember reading a review, and it was not the most flatering, and more of a tell-all. However, I remember the author specifically challenging some of Mary's claims. That Diana discretely tried to help Flo finaniacially and otherwise, and did more to help her than Mary. I also remember him saying she was a pro in the recording studio. She was always prepared and a nailed her part. I know she does not have the strongest voice, but she was not without talent, and it was perfect for those Supreme songs.

by Anonymousreply 9511/20/2011

She sounds pretty good here. She's got a powerful voice, her phrasing is great and she knows how to tell a story. Most of the material she recorded trying to have a solo career wasn't very well suited to her. In fact a lot of it was absolute crap.

I've seen her three times live, and she tore the roof off it. It's unfortunate that she's had to be compared to Diana Ross for the last 40 years. There's simply no way she would ever have reached Diana's heights. She wasn't as ambitious as Diana, and didn't have Berry Gordy in her back pocket, like Diana did.

by Anonymousreply 9611/22/2011

Bitter as a fag.

by Anonymousreply 9711/22/2011

Diana Ross tapped Lou Christie's horse cock way back in the day and, for that alone, I have to respect her.

by Anonymousreply 9811/23/2011

[quote]That Diana discretely tried to help Flo finaniacially and otherwise, and did more to help her than Mary.

She did, but Flo's husband at the time was running the show, and would not let Diana give Flo any money - he wanted all checks written to him, or at least with his name on it. That's how Flo allegedly lost her home - Diana was going to write her a check, but the husband wanted his name on the check. IIRC he was a total druggie and loser. He was known to spend Flo's money and mismanaged her solo career horribly. I'm not a big fan of Miss Ross, but I can't say I blame her for saying no to him.

by Anonymousreply 9911/23/2011

I'm with R99--at least she tried to help, whereas Mary did not. Mary even said in her second book that she didn't think money would have helped Flo and she didn't have any to give to her, anyway.

by Anonymousreply 10011/23/2011


I think Diana had more money to give than Mary. Wilson states in Dreamgirls that the total earnings she was paid during her Motown days added up to approx. $100,000. Gordy had full control of the girls' finances and kept them in a gilded cage - all dolled up with homes and nice cars purchased by Motown, but with little to no money of their own.

Gordy made hundreds of millions off of the girls while literally paying them nothing. Wilson and Ballard both sued Gordy (notice Diana did not - interesting!) but were given pittance settlements. The failed lawsuit and ensuing poverty is rumored to have driven Ballard over the edge.

by Anonymousreply 10111/23/2011

Diana had a steely, almost supernatural ambition. She was not the most beautiful nor did she have the best singing voice, but she WANTED it! Mary had talent, but it sounds like she was kind of lazy. Flo's issues (like her brutal date rape) marked her from the start, poor thing, and Berry Gordy was not helpful to her at all. But in the end, she did herself in.

One of my old drinking buddies used to tell this story about how he met Flo in Atlantic City when he was a young teen. His uncle was the cook at a nightclub there and he brought my friend to work one night. Flo was there with a couple of other singers. My friend's uncle told him to wait in the car for a couple of minutes after he parked out back and went to the kitchen to get something. Flo was drunk and walked over to the car and looked in. My (ex) friend is not a handsome person at all, and he certainly was not as a teen - his words (but with his ego, he acted like he was Tyson Beckford or somebody). Flo staggered over to the car, looked in and said, "Shit! This is an ugly li'l faggot sitting in this car!". He said he hated her on the spot for this, and when he was in Florida, closeted, in the Navy, and dancing at some club, word got out that Flo had died. He said, "GOOD!" and went back to dancing. My ex-friend was/is a big, malignant narcissist of a guy, but was always brutally honest about himself, and others. So I believed him.

by Anonymousreply 10211/23/2011

R101, what Mary forgets to point out in her two biographies is that $100,000 in 1971 was the equivalent of $530,000 today. Not a bad sum of money, considering that was net of all her expenses and income taxes. A house in Beverly Hills at that time was $125,000.

Mary owned three homes at the time (two in Detroit and one in Hollywood) and was living the high life. Her royalties were $100,000 annually and she was making $1 million touring with Jean and Cindy. It's not like she was living in poverty.

Yes, Motown's royalty rates were considered below industry standards by the 70's for a seasoned act, but in the 60's, they were considered to be on par with the rest of the business, especially for black artists that had no track record.

Flo went broke from her own spending habits after she left the group. She had no idea how much money she had or was spending and it did her in.

by Anonymousreply 10311/23/2011

Diana was screwed by Motown just as badly as all the other artists. In 1980, she hired an accounting firm to audit her record sales and investigate her trust accounts managed by Berry and discovered she had about $300,000 in cash. And that was after 20 years of sold-out concerts, two successful movies and millions of records sold.

That's why she left Motown for RCA and EMI for a $20 million advance in 1981.

by Anonymousreply 10411/23/2011


Thanks for the post, but I respectfully disagree. 100K was not a reasonable amount for one of the highest selling artists (as a member of The Supremes) of the 1960s. The girls were paid a fraction of a percentage point of what they had earned for Gordy.

The fact that RCA was willing to pay tens of millions for Ross' contract speaks to how underpaid artists were at Motown.

I believe the Holland-Dozier-Holland songwriting team also left after a royalties dispute.

by Anonymousreply 10511/23/2011

Chatting about The Supremes is for fags.

by Anonymousreply 10611/23/2011

[quote]Chatting about The Supremes is for fags.

Um, yeah. And your point is...

by Anonymousreply 10711/23/2011

Awesome thread, OP. More, more, more!

by Anonymousreply 10811/24/2011

Mary put her ex-husband in charge of managing THE SUPREMES and essentially ran it into the ground, hence the group splitting up. The group was making no money towards the end, despite still having some moderate chart hits.

IM GONNA LET MY HEART DO THE WALKING hit the top forty in 1976 and was an above average disco song.

by Anonymousreply 10911/24/2011

"Gordy made hundreds of millions off of the girls while literally paying them nothing. Wilson and Ballard both sued Gordy (notice Diana did not - interesting!)"

Diana left Motown because of it. She had little money in the late 70's, despite being a huge concert draw. Motown never participated in the RIAA either, so the record sales were all at Motown's say.

She had a lot to show for it, but it was all tied up in Motown and Gordy's name (house, cars, everything.)

"The failed lawsuit and ensuing poverty is rumored to have driven Ballard over the edge."

Flo Ballard had a hard life, period. She was already troubled before the group hit it big, due to being raped when she was a teenager. It's a shame she didn't have anyone around her to get her to a therapist.

by Anonymousreply 11011/24/2011

Wow, good Motown dish!

by Anonymousreply 11111/24/2011

[quote]I'd love to see the unedited footage where Diana turns and pushes Mary backwards. If it's out there, I've never seen it. Anyone?

I have a clip on a DVD of Diana with the Jackson 5. You can clearly see Diana pushing Michael back and taking center stage.

by Anonymousreply 11211/24/2011

They were just ghetto girls, studio singers who made good. Without Berry Gordy they'd all be cashiers at Family Dollar (if they survived poverty, drugs and gunshot wounds).

Flo had too many demons and destroyed herself. Mary was just pretty. Diana was ambitious and did what she had to do to survive. Remember, it was a different time.

by Anonymousreply 11311/24/2011

Anybody got any stories about The Temptations, Martha Reeves or Smokey?

by Anonymousreply 11411/25/2011

Smokey was a majorwhore, as I reall. He also has had some horrific plastic surgery over the last couple of years.

by Anonymousreply 11511/25/2011

Well, a book I read about the Supremes said that Diana 'bragged' about hooking up with Smokey Robinson, but not as much as she did about snaring Berry Gordy. The author really seemed to dislike Diana in a way that I've never seen in a biography before - it was just so apparent. I don't care either way - I was reading more for the Smokey Robinson gossip - but it was still interesting to see this bias.

by Anonymousreply 11611/26/2011

I loved Mary's two books and agree with her completely about Diana being a cunt, but she truly cannot sing.

Also, I read Diana's autobiography years ago and she comes across as a total narcissistic hag. After reading that, I believe every bad thing that's been said about her. And she can't sing much better than Mary can - truly, the only reason she became a star is because she gave up her pussy to Berry Gordy (who is basically a black version of Whitey Bulger).

by Anonymousreply 11711/26/2011

Diana reportedly slpet with Robinson back when she was a teenager and The Supremes were starting out at Motown. Robinson began penning songs for them shortly after.

by Anonymousreply 11811/26/2011

R113 really gets it right. I think Ross must have realized at a very young age that Motown was going to be her big chance in life and that she was going to do work very hard to make things happen for her.

by Anonymousreply 11911/26/2011

Mmmhmm ... that girl had to work the boxsprings big time!

by Anonymousreply 12011/26/2011

Yeah Diana may have been a bitch, may have been a famewhore, may have slept with this person or that person (I mean who wouldn't have slept with Smokey back then? He was beautiful) and may not have been the best singer, but she had star power and charisma that none of the other artists and singers had.

by Anonymousreply 12111/26/2011

If you're a vapid queen like R121 who is impressed by things like "charisma" and "star power" over genuine musical talent, then I don't know what to say. People like you are responsible for foisting the likes of Lady Gaga and Madonna on the rest of us. A pox on you!

by Anonymousreply 12211/26/2011

It's typical of this site that some of you queens will say that anyone mentioned cannot sing- add Cher, Madonna, and many others to the list. Both Diana Ross and Mary Wilson are quite good singers by any measure. If you don't like them, their persona or their material, fine. But saying that people with enduring careers 'can't sing' is a joke.

by Anonymousreply 12311/26/2011

Something I always meant to ask here, after reading the biography of the Supremes, was whether anyone here had seen them sing live. There were reports of male audience members yelling out for Florence, "sing, girl!" kind of thing, and how she was clearly the popular one. Which, of course, meant her solos got cut.

But was it anyone here that showed her the love, back in the day? It just felt like a Datalounge kind of thing :)

by Anonymousreply 12411/27/2011

I saw them quite a bit as a child. The only good fortune of having teens as siblings, parents make them tag you along. We use to go to the Saturday matinee at the Howard Theater: the show case would be loaded with 'new' talent. Because I was small (around 8 yrs old), my teen sister and cousins would have me stand in line for them as they smoked cigarettes in the alley before door time and once the doors were open, I would squeeze past everyone, climb over the backs of seats until I secured the from row for me and mine. Seating was first come, first serve.

The front row was outrageously bad. Only black kids with no experience of theater and best sound affects would have picked it but there we would be, front row center, practically with our knees jammed on the stage, feet up on chair edges or up against the stage, heads totally back on top of chairs, staring straight up for hours as the acts would come on, one after the other. It was heaven.

We got to see showcases that included but not necessarily together: Reeves, Smokey with his wife still in the group, sometimes Tina, the Sherelles, James Brown (closing act), the Temptations, the Impressions with Mayfield, Sam Cooke, the Supremes... and other, smaller less successful acts.

After I got older, there was a venue in DC called Uline Arena where the walls would actually sweat from being so crowded. No seats; just packed in teens and a stage. Those were night events where Stevie Wonder (still a kid and kind of disappointing in person) or the Supremes or Sam and Dave would be the marquee act.

I was a child mostly and mostly I sat mesmerized by the entire showcase. But I remember the Supremes and the Tempatations were standouts, even then. Everything in those days was live, and everyone pretty much (not JB or Tina) used the same band - none of this changing the band between acts... they each gave brilliant shows and had great voices.

by Anonymousreply 12511/27/2011

r122, go away. I never said impressed by anybody, I just said you have to have some star power or charisma to be a superstar. Its not just talent. If you want to look at a vapid person (I'm not gonna be self hating to use the word queen) look at yourself for trying to start a fight or argument where there was none. And don't bother replying cause I'm not playing your game.

by Anonymousreply 12611/27/2011

I love, love, love her. A very nice person and she has survived and still entertains around the world.

by Anonymousreply 12711/27/2011

That's a great story, R125. Thanks for posting it.

by Anonymousreply 12811/27/2011

The Supremes (and most of Motown's acts from the 60s) never made as much money as they thought they were making. Motown would tell them they were selling millions of records, when in fact, they weren't.

You also have to remember that tax rates were as high as 75% in the 60s and early 70s. Because all of Motown's successful acts had their tax returns managed by Berry's accountants, the Noveck brothers, they paid their taxes on-time. That was a good thing, but the bad news was they overpayed due to the Novecks' conservative advice, which means a huge amount of money went to the IRS, rather than their bank accounts.

The Supremes were a very successful act, but their expenses were huge. The girls had no idea what they were earning or what their expenses were. They just spent like no tomorrow. Their live act cost a fortune to mount and they paid every penny of it.

Their royalty rates were no better or worse than any other recording act in the 60s. In those days, record sales paid nothing and the "real" money was performing in clubs and Vegas. Much like porn, records were considered "advertising" for the real product, which was their live act.

Motown and The Beatles broke the mold (as did The Beach Boys) with huge record sales to teenagers. Even Elvis Presley was screwed by RCA on his royalties.

You have to keep it all in perspective to the times.

by Anonymousreply 12911/27/2011

Mary has stabbed Diana in the back so many times, Diana can no longer wear backless dresses.

by Anonymousreply 13011/27/2011

R125, that's such a wonderful story. God, you're lucky. I'd have given anything for that to be my childhood. I'm particularly interested in Smokey Robinson - what do you remember most about him as a live performer?

by Anonymousreply 13111/28/2011

Mary Wilson is a so much prettier then Martha Reeves. Just saying!

by Anonymousreply 13211/28/2011

bump for more Motown stories!

by Anonymousreply 13312/01/2011

Mary Wilson just graced RuPaul's Drag Race! She was a complete class act compared to the trash that is Michelle Visage (clinger-on extraordinaire) and Rosie Perez (who still gets a pass from me because of Fearless).

She looked beautiful, gave constructive advice, and reminded us what a legend looks like.

by Anonymousreply 13411/13/2012

Mary needs to form a new group with Sonia Sotomayor and Ruth Bader Ginsburg. The REAL Supremes, bitches!

by Anonymousreply 13511/13/2012

God Mary Wilson has been Dead since the early 70's, She just hasn't had enough sense to lie down

by Anonymousreply 13612/30/2012

No mention of DeBarge? DeBarge? Burn this fucking house down!

by Anonymousreply 13712/30/2012

Yes , Lou Christie and Diana Ross,

by Anonymousreply 13802/03/2013

Yes Lou Christie is Hung.

by Anonymousreply 13907/08/2013

There was an interesting docu some time ago and I tend to believe that Ross got to superstardom because she was ambitious (meaning not lazy), driven and talented. Everything Wilson was not. In Ross' transition to solo singer they did not even use Wilson as a backup singer on the records anymore. That's how mediocre her voice and talent was. I hate people who are backstabber's to people who are more successful.

by Anonymousreply 14007/09/2013

Best looking of all the Supremes.

by Anonymousreply 14107/09/2013

Mary Wilson is a professional victim who has milked the story line that she got trampled. Through all the years of the Supremes' success, live and recorded, Mary Wilson was never had the voice to be featured. After Diana left, Mary, an original Supreme, remained in the background. Diana didn't hold her back, Mary's vocal limitations did. I have seen her solo and I understand why she was in the background.

by Anonymousreply 14207/09/2013

Just saw "Twenty Feet from Stardom," a documentary about (mostly) black female backup singers from the '70s and '80s. (Lisa Fischer, Merry Clayton, and Darlene Love are the main focus.) The Supremes were barely mentioned, although Diana gets name-checked once and there's a brief glimpse at Flo on one of their album covers. However, the last Supreme, Susaye Greene, is interviewed a bit. Not a mention of Mary in sight.

by Anonymousreply 14307/09/2013

Mary can sing and when she does material that really suits her voice, like jazz, she's wonderful in concert. The problem is no one pays to see Mary sing jazz and she has to make a living to eat.

When she sings the lead vocal on the Supremes' catalogue, it's not very good. That's because all of their big hits were written for Diana's voice, not Mary's. There's no question that Diana's voice was unique and it was her sound and charisma that brought them to superstardom.

It's too bad Mary has bashed Diana over the years to sell books and generate publicity, but like I said, she needs to eat.

by Anonymousreply 14407/09/2013

I've seen Mary in concert 3 times and all were good shows. Her voice, while capable, does lack character and distinction. What she does best is rocks. She totally rips up a few Rolling Stones numbers, and probably should have recorded "Brown Sugar". Where she falls flat are her attempts to prove she's a good "singer", like holding notes beyond reasonable or artistic sense and reaching for nuance far too out of her range. Now that her history has pretty much has been written, it's clear that Wilson has a tendency to make poor decisions, and that her lack of career has to blamed largely on her. Passing on "Holiday" when she was in need of a hit and an identity other than an ex-Supreme simply wasn't smart, especially since Jellybean was going to be involved. Instead, she doomed herself to being a professional victim, having to hamper herself with her past to get headlines and paychecks. Had she been more shrewd she too could have been a solo act, just like Ross is known as Ross before she's remembered as a Supreme. Although infamous for her own reputation, I think the fact that Ross has distanced herself from Wilson over the years says quite a bit about Wilson. After the botched reunion tour Diana Ross said in an interview (with Barbara Walters, I believe) that she decided to do the tour knowing that it would have been difficult for her to share a stage with Wilson again. I think that statement illustrates the difficulty of both women, except one moves on and the other whines about whines about it.

by Anonymousreply 14507/09/2013

Regarding the 25 years of Motown how mentioned upthread, I read somewhere it was Mary who went way off-script causing confusion. She wandered onstage in a bright red dress while every single other person was wearing all black, all white or a mix of both. Mary then took lead on the song they were singing, later claiming Diana was forgetting the words. I'm not exactly a fan of Diana but don't buy that. Think Mary just wanted to grab the limelight back a bit.

At least Diana and Mary had a history. Diana Ross did a bit of upstaging herself when she wandered onto stage when Adam Ant (of all people) was singing "Where Did Our Love Go?" and totally upstaged his moment. This was confirmed by the producer Suzanne De Passe as not being a scripted moment. She just came on stage midway through his performance and danced a little bit and ran off again. You can tell Adam was caught off guard.

by Anonymousreply 14607/09/2013

Suzanne DePasse has also confirmed that the tape containing the altercation between Mary and Diana that night is tucked away in a vault and will never see the light of day. Like I said a few posts ago, after so much time has gone by Mary does, in retrospect, seem like the kid who does some of the pushing herself then cries "I didn't do nuthin'!" or "She started it!" I'm not taking sides, but history does paint a picture.

by Anonymousreply 14707/09/2013

If the tape pf the altercation will never see the light of day, why is anybody even holding onto it?

by Anonymousreply 14807/09/2013

Diana was drunk at Motown 25 and everyone knew it. She was very nervous about seeing Berry again after all the bitterness when she left the label two years before. She didn't really want to do the Supremes segment and cut out the planned medley of four songs in favor of one. She wasn't very friendly to Mary or Cindy that night.

It just was really bad and a major disaster.

by Anonymousreply 14907/09/2013

You are right r149. Motown 25 was a disaster on many levels. The Return To Love Tour also turned into a huge disaster. Mary and Diana will never have a reunion. Even if those two women were talking about it, and they're not, Cindy is very ill and won't sing on stage again. So no reunion ever...because Flo is dead.

by Anonymousreply 15007/09/2013

Mary is a legend as an original Supreme and she has survived all these years in spite of huge obstacles and setbacks. You have to admire her strength and determination.

I think she made a huge mistake in 2000 in turning down $4 million for the Return to Love reunion tour. Her going rate at the time was $20,000 per night and she was being offered $133,333 per night to sing oohs and aahs for thirty shows. She was crazy to turn that down.

by Anonymousreply 15107/09/2013

Anyone ever get around to reading Mary's SECOND book? Whatever empathy I had for her after reading the first was vaporized by the time I was halfway through. Though Berry supposedly 'washed his hands' of The Supremes after Mary & Cindy nixed replacing Jean with Syreeta Wright, I think it was Mary's antics (along with her husband who was managing them) that torpedoed their careers.

As for her voice, I think the following clip might silence was obviously NOT the studio version (because Jean was on that)....had the 70's Supremes gotten better material, what could have been......

by Anonymousreply 15207/09/2013

Diana did all the work in the studio, yet when it came time to get paid, it was split three ways.

So Mary got paid for recordings she had nothing to do with.

by Anonymousreply 15307/09/2013

When I listen to the Supremes' catalogue, I inevitably end up singing along to the background vocals. Say what you will about Diana's talent, drive, and charisma (I agree she had all three) - but the background harmonies are simply gorgeous. Listen to "I Hear a Symphony" or "Back In My Arms Again"; Mary and Flo's interweaving voices make those songs.

The Supremes were a trio - their singles benefited from the mixture of all three voices.

Was Diana a natural lead vocal? Of course. She had a unique pop voice and a gift for interpreting material and presenting it onstage.

Mary and Flo, however, provided excellent accompaniment and helped create The Supremes' image. The notion of three singers - one charismatic, one sexy, and one sassy, has formed the template for every "girl" group from TLC to Destiny's Child.

Mary and Flo deserve their due credit as does Diana. All three contributed to the magic that is The Supremes.

by Anonymousreply 15407/09/2013

I need to go see Mary Wilson somewhere this year and the same about Diana Ross. They were magic and I would like to see them perform one more time. I know we'll never see them together.

by Anonymousreply 15507/21/2013

R154 again Mary Wilson voice is NOT on any of those Supreme recordings after Reflections.

It was done by other background singers.

Mary got paid and got credit for recordings she had nothing to do with.

by Anonymousreply 15607/21/2013


From what I understand (according to Mary's autobiography - big grain of salt, I know), Mary and Cindy were never informed of those recording sessions or were simply not invited by Gordy. Totally disrespectful of Mary and Cindy's contributions to the group. I don't think, however, that the decision had anything to do with Diana; it was all Gordy's doing. I don't begrudge Mary getting paid for those singles, either.

by Anonymousreply 15707/21/2013

After Holland-Dozier-Holland left and Florence left the group, The Andantes, the house background vocalists at Motown, sang backgrounds on "Some Things You Never Get Used To," "Love Child," "I'm Living in Shame," "The Composer" and "No Matter What Sign You Are."

On "Someday We'll Be Together" - originally conceived as Diana's first solo release - the backgrounds were sung by Julia and Maxine Waters and Johnny Bristol.

Mary was not allowed to sing on any record after Stop in the name of love. She was the flat sounding STOP.

Her job was to be pretty. The backround vocals were done by a number of different folks including the Jones Girls who created much of what we know as the 'supremes' sound and did Mary's vocals on tour. Mary just got to move her mouth and stand in the background because she was a no talent.

Diana and Flo actually did the vast majority of the Supremes' recordings, with Mary doing mostly the early stuff. Often, HDH would add Marlene Barrow instead of Mary Wilson because she sung with a different sound. The Andantes also recorded on virtually all of Motown's backgrounds for all the artists. Regardless of whether Flo or Mary (and later Cindy), were on the record, they all received their royalites anyway.

by Anonymousreply 15807/21/2013

Mary and Cindy did record the albums done with The Tempts and some material released on albums through 1969. Berry was focused on developing Diana's solo career by 1968 and felt there was no need to delay recording sessions or fly Mary and Cindy in to do background vocals. And he was right.

Mary and Flo recorded on almost all of the HDH sessions, but sometimes Marlene Barrow substituted for one or the other. The Andantes were often mixed-in later to strengthen the background, which Motown did with many of their acts.

Mary's vocal talent was limited, but she was a great performer with a lot of charisma on stage.

by Anonymousreply 15907/21/2013

Anyone have any info about her new album coming out? She's been talking about it for the looooongest time now. A single has surfaced, but...

by Anonymousreply 16007/24/2013

Yes I heard the story of Diana Ross and Lou Christie, They had a thing together, He was so in love with her. Barry didn't like the idea of Lou dating her. I think he still likes her after all these years.

by Anonymousreply 16110/02/2013

I wish Diana and Mary would sing a song together. One last time.

by Anonymousreply 16210/04/2013

Diane says the trouble all started because Mary always would grab the thighs out of the bucket. But you know Diane.

by Anonymousreply 16310/04/2013

Wasn't DR's oldest daughter Berry Gordy's? That fact has been around for a long time. No wonder why Gordy lavished all of his attention on her and blew off Flo and Mary. Ross certainly had a lot on Gordy who was married and had a family when he started up Motown.

by Anonymousreply 16410/04/2013

I used to like Mary Wilson. The Supremes were phenomenal and broke down a lot of race barriers in their prime. But Diana was the spark in that group, no matter what Berry Gordy did.

When Diana left the Supremes, Mary Wilson was not promoted to lead singer. That happened after multiple changes in the lead. Mary was still in the background with an occasional token lead. She became a professional victim, striking out at Diana with what had to be jealousy and envy. Mary's talent was limited and she was two faced and petty. Not that Diana was perfect, but people like Mary Wilson are scary because they are duplicitious.

by Anonymousreply 16510/04/2013

I though Lou Christie was a big ol' queen?

by Anonymousreply 16610/04/2013,only,whites,in,fogaineras,males.females.gays.sh3,males,.on.or.two,african,.amrica,betweeen,.the,

by Anonymousreply 16710/21/2013

Mary Wilson's husband, who became the Supremes manager, which led to their split, was black.

by Anonymousreply 16810/21/2013

And he beat her up!

by Anonymousreply 16910/21/2013

Mary likes light and dark meat. It just needs to be hot.

by Anonymousreply 17010/21/2013

She was the busiest Supreme in the bedroom apparently, which isn't surprising considering Florence was a rape victim and Diane had an eating disorder.

by Anonymousreply 17110/21/2013

What's wrong with Cindy?

by Anonymousreply 17210/21/2013

Anyone who says that Mary Wilson couldn't sing is obviously either an embittered Diana Ross fanatic or someone who simply hasn't heard her showcased vocally before. Not only was Miss Wilson an excellent harmony singer (especially on those early Supremes non-hits) but she could also shine on lead, on the rare occasion she was given a chance. She possess a rich jazzy alto & excellent phrasing. If Motown had taken the time to develop her as a lead singer she could've excelled on slow/mid-tempo Mary Wells-type numbers. (Check out Mary singing lead on a Vandellas remake I've attached that was used as filler on an early album) After The Supremes' initial success Mary's job was simply to look pretty in the background. Diana Ross was ALWAYS Berry Gordy's "pet" & concubine from almost the very beginning. Sadly, Mary & Flo never had a snowball's chance in hell.

After Diana's departure Motown saddled The (neglected) Supremes with primarily mediocre songs & the occasional gem recorded entirely by accident. Mary's 1979 solo project was obviously intended to be a throwaway. No different than what she had been doing with The Supremes for several years. The material was all completely second-rate & her vocals were badly mixed. Mary still went about recording her numbers with verve & gusto. Producer Hal Davis also produced the whole thing in extravagant/fully orchestrated/1979 style. The end result was a delicious, sophisticated, beautifully arranged Disco LP! Mary would've benefited greatly from a better lead-off single. Some extended 12" remixes of some of the excellent album cuts would've secured her at least a club hit or two! Ultimately the whole project was treated as simply a tax write-off. I'd recommend that anyone who enjoys Classic Disco & is curious about this hidden-gem search Youtube. (Check for 'Midnight Dancer', 'I Love A Warm Summer Night' & the sultry Teddy Pendergrass knockoff 'Pick Up The Pieces')

The fact of the matter is that Diana Ross truly had no more musical talent or stage presence than Mary or Flo. Miss Ross' true talent was her burning ambition & willingness to do ANYTHING to make it to the top! The fact that she found a powerful lover & ally in Berry Gordy early on didn't hurt either.

by Anonymousreply 17310/21/2013

Here's the Vandellas remake with Mary on lead that I forgot to attach............

by Anonymousreply 17410/21/2013

Mary is performing a Christmas Show in December for two weeks in the Chicago area. The 4Tops will be there, too. Could be a fun show.

by Anonymousreply 17510/23/2013

She needs to guest star as "The Supreme" on "AHS:Coven."

by Anonymousreply 17610/23/2013

[quote] she could also shine on lead, on the rare occasion she was given a chance. She possess a rich jazzy alto & excellent phrasing.

I respectfully disagree. Mary herself admits that she doesn't have a great voice. However she claims to be a "great entertainer". I haven't seen her live, so I won't comment on that claim.

The "non-famous" Supremes (Jean Terrell, Scherrie Payne, Susaye Greene) were the most talented vocally.

by Anonymousreply 17710/23/2013

R177 , we'll respectfully agree to disagree. I never stated that Miss Wilson had the greatest voice. I simply stated that "she could also shine on lead" & could be enjoyably effective when given material that suited her alto. Personally, I don't think that Diana Ross has anything resembling "a great voice." She was afforded the luxury of having songs crafted to suit her vocals. IMO, Mary was vocally talented & charismatic enough to warrant the same. A missed opportunity on Motown's part.

I'm in complete agreeance with you about Jean Terrell, Scherrie Payne & Susaye Green. I've got both Jean's solo album & the Scherrie & Susaye album. Several good numbers on both.

by Anonymousreply 17810/24/2013

"The fact of the matter is that Diana Ross truly had no more musical talent or stage presence than Mary or Flo."

I disagree. Diana had phenomenal stage presence back in the day. Watch her late 70's show from Vegas where she goes into the audience for Reach out and touch. How many performers can keep the momentum going for almost fifteen minutes doing nothing but running around and getting people to sing?

She may not be the best vocally, but girl knew how to put on a show. In fact, I don't think she gets enough credit for her stage shows of the 70's, which (along with Bowie's) were the frontrunners of melding pop/rock with a theatrical, movie like presentation. Her concerts were breaking records up until Return to love for a reason.

by Anonymousreply 17910/24/2013

I'll bet if Diana started twerking in her shows she would be all over the news. Her shows would be packed.

by Anonymousreply 18010/24/2013

I was looking at MLS listings in Los Feliz and came across this lovely (from the outside, the inside is another story) Tudor in the Oaks area, described as 'formerly the residence of Mary Wilson of the Supremes'. It's listed as pending.

I wonder if she is the seller? It looks like nothing's been touched except for the kitchen in the 1980s sometime.

by Anonymousreply 18112/29/2013

If I paid good money (would never, ever happen, then or now.) to see Diana Ross "singing," you can bet your ass that I wouldn't want to see her running around the audience and coaxing other patrons to sing the words for her. I would be like: "Hussy, you better get your narrow beehind back up on that stage and earn your paycheck, OK?...OK!"

But with that Minnie Mouse voice screeching at me, maybe I would welcome some fat ass from Kansas City fucking up the words to the song.

by Anonymousreply 18212/29/2013

r182 NARROW ass?! Why, thank you! I could reach out and touch you, sweetie!

by Anonymousreply 18312/29/2013

R181, Mary hasn't lived in that house since 1978. She owned it for a few years, but sold it when The Supremes disbanded and she was unable to use the group name to promote her solo act, rendering her unable to perform and generate income. She sued Motown and eventually settled the case by accepting a solo recording contract.

Mary recorded one LP in 1979 and was then dropped from the label the following year for extremely poor sales.

by Anonymousreply 18412/29/2013

Does Scherrie Payne have a nice house?

by Anonymousreply 18512/29/2013

R164, yes, Rhonda Ross Kendrick is Berry Gordy's daughter, but she was born months into Diana's marriage to Robert Silverstein. She didn't find out until the mid-80s.

by Anonymousreply 18612/29/2013

YES, Diana and Lou Christy were together on the Dick Clark tours. I was there , he couldn't keep his hands of her and same with Miss Ross. both had lips that called for one another. take a look

by Anonymousreply 18702/26/2014

They did not even use her as a back up singer for the later Supremes songs, that how bad of a singer she was.

by Anonymousreply 18802/27/2014

R188, the fact that Mary and Cindy were on few recordings after 1967 had nothing to do with singing ability. It was Berry's decision to record Diana alone to reduce costs and establish her as a solo artist.

by Anonymousreply 18902/27/2014

Any news on Mary Wilson lately?

by Anonymousreply 19005/08/2014

Mary Wilson has managed to make a lifetime career out of what really was 10 great years with the Supremes (1964-1974). She deserves every bit of fame she's managed to hold onto. Sometimes her voice is surprisingly good. Her work ethic has always been an issue.

As for the other Supremes, fans speak of how talented the nameless ones from the 70's were. If so, why has none of them had any success other than re-recording Supremes songs that they never had hits with? They should aspire higher.

Who wants to hear a 70 year old pleading for her lover to "wait a little bit longer" in "Love Child"? Get it before the grave does.

by Anonymousreply 19105/18/2014

At times, Mary Wilson has a very warm pleasant voice. She can surprise with the occasional jazz tune. Too often she signs sons not suited to her. If you're going to perform the Supremes repertoire you need to adjust it to your style. Racing through old hits by rote will not get you over.

In her live shows she's always focused on the 60's years and not the 70's. Since she sang lead on Floy Joy and Touch and some others, why doesn't she sing them? Please don;t ever sing "Can't Take My Eyes Off You" ever again.

by Anonymousreply 19208/11/2014

[R47] Motown 25 was an amazing night in spite of Ms. Ross's behavior. She cut a medley of Supremes hits rehearsal.

Also, she was not well received by the audience. The applause was enhanced for the Tv broadcast. Her performance was tepid by comparison to Michael Jackson and "Billy Jean".

by Anonymousreply 19308/14/2014

Miss Mary is a Pig Fucker Who gives a shit about that Old Whore anyway? Between the Andantes & the Water sisters, How can we actually determine if that occassional Ooh or Ahh was hers? Keep in mind Gurls, Miss Ross had ALREADY recorded 5 Number 1 Singles BEFORE entering an "Intimate" Relationship with the Very Divorced Berry Gordy, Obviously it was Her Voice selling those Records, He Knew he had a Potential Superstar. And to Further set the record Straight, While Diana was dating the Very Divorced Berry Gordy, Miss Mary was Going Down on Duke Fakir (The Four Tops), everytime HIS WIFE went to the store to get Diapers for the Baby. When Old Duke wasn't around, she was Giving a Little Brown Sugar to Tom Jones, while his wife sat home giving Tupperware Parties

by Anonymousreply 19411/17/2014

"She was Giving a Little Brown Sugar to Tom Jones, while his wife sat home"

With that once sentence it can be established that Mary got better dick than Diana ever did.

by Anonymousreply 19511/17/2014

Miss Mary Loves that Foreskin!!!! Detroit's Industrial Vagina remains Supreme!

by Anonymousreply 19611/17/2014

Diana is my favorite colored singer. Mary however seems somewhat lower in breeding and presence

by Anonymousreply 19702/26/2015

the reason why most of the Motown acts were seriously underpaid is because the Mob ran Motown with Gordy set up as the front man. The REAL executives/accountants/lawyers were white Jewish males who seriously knew how to skim the money and keep two sets of books, just as other record labels had been doing. The Mob runs the entire recording industry regardless of race, religion, sexual orientation, gender, age or creed.

by Anonymousreply 19802/26/2015

Happy Birthday Mary! (born March 6, 1944)

by Anonymousreply 19903/06/2015

Did Diana have a penis when Lou Christy was all over her?

by Anonymousreply 20003/06/2015

Mary needs to have her chin implant removed.

by Anonymousreply 20103/06/2015

I want to hear more about Lou Christie and his story about he and Diana. I know his lips are big.I guess the rest matches, so I've heard.

by Anonymousreply 20203/07/2015
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