What's it like living in Palm Springs?

Darling, you must be mistaken.

It's hot. Very hot.

In Palm Springs all seems to breathe freedom and peace and to make one forget the world and its sad travails.

Including your mussy, R3!

It's too hot to live there several months of the year. You can't even walk dogs outside without risking burning their paws. So unless you plan to have a second home somewhere cooler, skip it.

During my last trip to PS decades ago, I took too much E. Between the E come down, the depressing, barren desert and PS in general, I wanted to kill myself.

What are the springs like there?

Careful.. the desert wind will carry away your meth faster than the blow in a Woody Allen movie.

earrings

Caftans!

I sold my place in SF and bought a home there in cash in 2014. I was still in my early 40s, planned on semi-retiring and loved it. For about 2 months. It’s not the forever vacation I thought it would be. There’s a seedy meth side I didn’t notice while visiting vs living there. There are tons of old republican queens who basically live at the bars and suck the oxygen out them. The restaurants got boring quickly as there aren’t that many good ones, and there is absolutely nothing of note artistically there. And as others have said-it’s too fucking hot. No person should live in that kind of heat. I’m back in SF now, working full time and much happier.

What is it with leaving SF for PS?!

I shiver to think—could there be a greater downfall?

Not this best time to be asking that question OP - in the 100s during most summer months.

[quote] How is the cost to by a home?

Oh dear, they let you drive by them for free.

No touching, though. ;)

R11 is what I imagined full time life in PS would be. Better than Wilton Manors but still has a limited time appeal. I think I’ll continue to do a month in winter - but no need to commit to a home, especially at new PS prices.

“Better than Wilton Manors”

…on many a tombstone

Every couple I know fro LA and Long Beach that moved there all live almost next door to each other but don't talk to each other at the same time.

It’s “sad turmoils,” dear. Not “travails.”

Great place to get some sun.

That’s Burning Man.

You can’t fool us!

Have you ever been cremated, OP? It's a lot like that.

I loved it when my AC wouldn't cycle, the compressor was just ON 24/7 and it's still 82 degrees in the house because that's as cool as it can get when it's 113 degrees outside. I also loved the $475,00 electric bill. Ah Palm Springs.

I cremated last week—he was a cumdump in Chelsea

R23

It’s a period not a comma, in PS

That was a period that was sweating.

If it's sad, seedy and desperate- has a "last call" feeling to visit, imagine living there.

I've never been but a good friend of mine moved there a few years ago and she seems to love it. I do not get it. I figure I'll go visit sometime but it seems like a nightmare to me. I hate sun, I hate heat.

Would you rather live in PS or Santa Fe?

I know a lot of gays that moved to Santa Fe a decade ago, but I wonder if that's still happening?

My millennial niece and her husband moved to Palm Desert (just down the road) in 2020. They bought an elegant midcentury modern house that they never could have afforded in L.A..but its not so far away that visiting friends is a hardship. The heat is unbearable for three months but they have money and travel during much of that time. There is actually a positive during the scorching months since the tourists are gone and the locals get to know each other and bond. That doesn't happen in L.A. Their best friends are a gay couple who live down the street, although they split their time between the desert and La Jolla. I visited a few years ago and while it's not for me it was quite pleasant, friendly people, laid back vibe.

It has your typical nursing home smell, fecally and uriney, bur with a hint of stale cigarettes and the burp of an empty keg.

I lived there for a year, a couple of decades ago. It wasn’t a grand plan; I was in between things and stumbled on a job opening while there on a weekend getaway.

Palm Springs is great for the right kind of person. I was not that person. I came to hate it rather quickly. Why?

> the ugly, dying strip malls everywhere

> having to drive almost everywhere all the time

> the boorish behavior of the obese alcoholic men in Hawaiian shirts in the gay bars

> the surfeit of Republicans

> the lack of anything culture-wise that’s not totally MOR

I ended up running away to LA many weekends. I just felt kind of claustrophobic in PS.

To be fair, there were things I liked there.

The desert light can be mesmerizing.

There’s some stunning hiking. I wish I could remember the name of those animals you see wandering near the trails above Indian Wells.

I loved driving to Indio for amazing Mexican food.

The Palm Springs library is beautiful - and a way more peaceful place to read/study than any library near me now.

LA gays won’t say PS ….just say they went to the desert

That’s how you know.,,

R33. Exactly!

[quote]There’s some stunning hiking. I wish I could remember the name of those animals you see wandering near the trails above Indian Wells.

Blatino husbears

It’s unbearably hot 6 months out of the year not 3.

[quote] It’s unbearably hot 6 months out of the year not 3.

Nonsense.

R37, were you referring to the latest revival of "Nunsense" at Palm Springs' Plaza Theater. Starring Sally Struthers, Lucie Arnaz, Lee Roy Reams, and Eden Sher of "The Middle" fame?

What was it like living in Palm Springs while Sonny Bono was mayor?

Did he really make all the postmen wear leather bell bottoms and a fur vest like Dorothy Zbornak predicted?

It's actually been the coolest summer this year in years in Palm Springs. Normally, the worst months for heat are July, August and September.

Cooler months are mostly lovely, though in the winter and spring, residents can have 30-50 mph winds for weeks at a time. And that's even if you live below the demarcation line of Vista Chino - anything north of that will be windy year round. You'll have as much sand on your patio as you'd have snow on your porch in, say, Chicago.

There are parts of the city of Palm Springs, as well as parts of nearby towns, where there's very gay friendly neighborhoods and modern or midcentury modern homes, which is of course incredibly appealing. But a lot of people come to Palm Springs and expect the blissful vacation they had - the relaxing retreat with a few helpings of cock - can be their everyday life. And that's not always the case.

I mostly agree with R32 - there's a real absence of culture in PS beyond "let's do blow and fuck" at the bars. The aesthetics everywhere is "living in the past" - Sinatra this, Marilyn that, fitting since most residents are gay men between 60-90 who want to get in a time travel machine to return to their youths.

There's no college/university, and the music scene is either tribute bands or, you know, 2/8ths of the original members of Foreigner or what not. The moving of the cheap, tacky Marilyn Monroe statue a while back had so many over the top hysterical queens hissing and shrieking with rending of garments. The public art in the city is nearly uniformly heinously hideous. If you are uncertain whether gay men can have terrible taste, visit Palm Springs.

Nearby cities have shopping, but it's Anytown USA shopping malls and chains. And the farther east you go, the more Republican it is. In fact, PS is an oasis in a mostly desolate region, the Inland Empire. Every building was built in the 80s and looks rundown and worn down......everywhere you look.

Some day to day practical elements of living are quite challenging. The entire Inland Empire has a substantial shortage of doctors as well as veterinarians. Finding a skilled contractor in most trades can be a challenge all across the country, but especially in Palm Springs, where so many hotels and resorts already employ any decent skilled worker. Finding a decent restaurant that doesn't serve tourist slop or Golden Corral level food is a big struggle.

Many people live in Palm Springs as "snowbirds" and there's a reason why. Challenges outlined above have less of an impact if one is only dealing with those issues for a few months.

And it's EXPENSIVE. Perhaps cheaper than places on the coast, but purchasing a single family home somewhere people actually want to live can run anywhere between 650K and 1.5M. A small condo might be had for 300K or so.

But you might run into Lucie Arnaz at a restaurant, or Barry Manilow in Jensen's.

Living in PS is about fucking your best friend's boyfriend and letting everyone else in town know that he's available.

It’s exactly like the 1963 movie Palm Springs Weekend.

My friend just sold his house there and said it's the worst place to be a single gay man. He wouldn't elaborate and just shook his head.

I hear this all the time R43. I'm in LA and the dating apps are full of PS hopefuls who apparently don't care to date each other.

Not a surprise to hear that, PS is predominantly older married/partnered guys and very few single ones anywhere.

Also, since it's such a tourist town it's not exactly a great idea to go to the bar to meet someone - the guy you meet has a 50/50 chance of being from somewhere else.

In NYC, that’s a plus. ;)

Be careful if you go hiking by yourself!

[quote]It’s exactly like the 1963 movie Palm Springs Weekend.

You mean I can get raped by Robert Conrad? Sign me up!

I had a friend there who was in his 30s but lived with and took care of a guy in his 70s. They seemed to have a nice life together. The older guy eventually died and the younger guy had to move back with his family (neither was wealthy.)

Now that I'm in my 70s, I fantasize about having someone like that younger guy ... it would be nice to have someone kind and trustworthy to help me out, be my travel companion, etc. But I know I'll never find one.

R37 I said what I said. It’s hot from May to October.

Moved to PS after 35 years in San Francisco and 144 years in New York. Best move I ever made. I’ve even grown to appreciate the summers.

i would be most interested in the architecture as well

Like living in Phoenix but with more tasteful architecture.

[quote] The entire Inland Empire has a substantial shortage of doctors as well as veterinarians.

This is true. My niece mentioned this just recently. "there's a plastic surgeon on every block but good luck finding a GP taking new patients."

r54 Yep. Dermatologists and plastic surgeons everywhere. Lots of mutton desperately trying to look like lamb......

r12, about 10-15 years ago, gays of all ages were leaving SF for Palm Springs in droves because of high housing costs, plus the tediously, cold, windy, foggy summers on the Coast. Then PS became almost as expensive as SF when COVID hit, but some friends were paying $900/mo just for electricity. Those with pools pay high water bills, too. I've only visited twice, once in the Fall (pre-COVID) and once in the Summer, after getting married, when housing prices there had exploded. Partner and I each had old friends living there, who we visited. That nixed any desire to retire there. Everyone's day revolved around alcohol and socializing with the same group/clique. People who bought there long ago or who have a lot of money own beautiful houses, but those who don't live far away from town or live in the windy/dust storm parts in tiny condos with high HOA fees.

Renting in PS is incredibly expensive for very mid to decrepit apartments. And unless you purchase a home there and have solar, the electric bill can be $1000/mo in the warm months.

I don't see how anyone <40 or so, or not at retirement age, can possibly move to PS. Unless they're incredibly gorgeous/hung and can rely on the "kindness of strangers."

While the hotspots of PS seem nice, there are a lot of trashy areas surrounding them

r58 yeah, the whole area near Ramon that bleeds into Cathedral City is one, Desert Hot Springs is another.

Another downside of PS is that many of the homes are now AirBnBs. So you can have a home worth millions but your life screwed up by loud or obnoxious neighbors who change each week. They try to enforce rules on the renters, but there's only so much you can do.

R60 yeah, that's been an issue for the last decade or so, especially after COVID when out of towners bought homes.

I lived there off and on for 6 years as my partner had a house there - I was there full time for 2.5 years. It's very relaxed and there are things to do - but a lot more in 'season' which is October through April.

After several years, everything just seemed to be on repeat for me - a lot of the same restaurants, theaters, events, bars. It's not a big city - only 45,000 people, and for me, anything past Cathedral City was like visiting a dry-heat Florida. I don't find Rancho Mirage, LaQuinta, Palm Desert, etc. interesting at ALL. Boring, rich, straight retirees.

I've lived most of my life in some of the biggest cities in the US. I just couldn't shake the need for more EVERYTHING. I'm not going to diss PS - there's a lot to love, particularly for vacation and winter months. The weather can be magical and there's a LOT of beauty - 100x more than Phoenix, which is ugly in comparison.

But it's just not for me for year-round living. And mid-June through end of September is awful - although I know it wasn't as hot this year at all compared to previous 5 years.

You can use the summer to get away and see friends in cooler climates who come to see you during the winter. But the desire to 'get out' for day trips or other vacations was too overwhelming for me. It means I'm not loving where I live.

I'm back in San Diego now - and I never have that feeling of needing to leave. Ever. Just enough of everything, but not too much big city hassle like LA or NY.

I became bored in PS. And I imagine most smaller resort towns are like that - Ptown, Wilton Manors, even Puerto Vallarta.

It is still a TON better than Wilton Manors though - that's not even a question. PS is great to live there for 'the season' or to vacation - for ME. Others love it year round - but I think it depends where you came from. If you're gay and didn't live in a Big 5 American city - then I could see why it is enough.

[Quote] It’s “sad turmoils,” dear. Not “travails.”

Yes I changed that to make it gayer. 🕺🏻

I visited PS several times back in the late 80s and 90s. I always enjoyed my visits there. I find the desert enchanting, especially at dusk. There were a few things I was put off with. On some visits the heat was indeed staggering. And the preponderance of old sleazy queens in the bars who seemed to think they were hot studs was always off putting. I once had a bartender come over and relay a message from an old drunkard sot at the bar. He wanted to know if I would be interested in a night out on the town with a very wealthy queen. I gave him a glance and told the bartender to tell him I wasn't interested. He sat there for over an hour glaring at me like he wanted to cut me.

My friends there eventually sold their home and moved up to Seattle and I never felt the desire to return.

R64, that was me!!

R64 - well, that was creepy - not sure what someone who is already plastered could 'show' you in a night. Drunk thoughts, I guess.

Despite my post above, I encourage any gay or lesbian to visit Palm Springs. It's still a magical place and a gay haven. It's just living there year round is always a bit different - I think half love it and the other half, not so much.

Just the half, dear?

If you are young, you can meet other young people if you stick to big events like the annual White Party. Yes, it's still going strong. Or there are lots of small gay only boutique hotels for a 3 day weekends where you can meet lots of other men. Just realize, most will be from out of town, with maybe 50% from LA or SD. The gay hotels are kind of run down and a bit trashy but can be fun, most are clothing optional. There is also Arnez st which is basically a tiny gay area in downtown PS. Several bars, a store or two, some place to eat. PS the city is very gay friendly, close to 30% of the residence are LGBT.

Living there is a different story. Mostly gay couples +40 to death. It's quite, warm and safe. Most seem to have very nice big homes, all with a pool. Drinking and pool parties are the main entertainment. That town has the largest amount of Mid-Century homes in the US. So that can be fun, a bit tired now but better than your average 70's ranch home in the valley. If you are into architecture, there is a lot to see in that respect.

Weather wise its not as bad as people say. Yes, it can get very hot in the summer months over 100f average. But that's actually their down time. What people who have never been to PS don't know is the seasons are reversed. In other words, summer is their off season, so damn hot low tourism and lots of discounts on hotel rooms. In the winter months it can be a nice pleasant 72F. That's when you want to go. When it's cold and rainy everywhere else, it's nice weather there.

largest amount of Mid-Century homes in the US….

No. Not even close.

For Mid-Century Modern, check out the suburban SF Bay Area. They're everywhere.

[quote]largest amount of Mid-Century homes in the US….No. Not even close.

Well you would be wrong. "Palm Springs, California, is widely recognized as having the largest concentration of mid-century modern (MCM) homes in the United States—and arguably the world."

Most of the year rounders live in PS because even though it's expensive, you can still manage to find homes under a million. That gets very challenging to find anything like that on the coast.

I have friends who live there 9-10 months a year, but they always spend 2 months on the coast (or in the Midwest) and also usually travel often in between.

Can anyone explain to me how leased land works?

Whenever I look at real estate listings in the area many seem to have deceptively low prices, but are in leased land. Seems like a buyer would really need to do some due diligence to understand the ins and outs of different land leases.

I can't explain in detail, but basically the land was Native American and when it got carved up by Americans instead of pushing the natives to one corner of the valley they decided to break up the land like a checkerboard. So one block might be normal and the next block over might be leased land.

Not sure how it works but the houses are a lot cheaper if it's on leased land because when you go to sell you are not selling the land under the house, only the structure. And the lease does not reset with the sale so if it's a 100 year lease, each buyer takes a bite out of that. If it's close to being renewed, you risks the possibility of the lease going up dramatically depending on the owner. That's what I was told, but I could be wrong.

R71 that’s your authoritative source?! Lol

R74 that’s close enough for this thread.

Ground leases are used in all the time in commercial real estate. Less common in residential. The later you are in the life of the lease, the greater the risk of non-renewal or increased payments due—also harder to get a mortgage.

Yes, homes are generally cheaper when they're on leased land. They can be more complicated to get a mortgage for, or insure, due to the land lease scenario. But they can also be hundreds of thousands of dollars cheaper.

However, as R74 and R76 noted, there are risks with buying something late in its lease. Most mortgage lenders want the lease to expire 35 years or more into the future.

There's a community in Palm Springs that just made the news because their lease ends in 17 years (or something close to that) and the lease owner (a member of the tribe) wants the homeowners to cough up $100,000 more to continue the land lease beyond that 17 year period. If they can't pay that money or won't pay it, they lose their home in 17 years and walk away with nada.

[R68]: White Party wasn’t held this spring and its future is uncertain. But there are other large scale parties during season including Red Dress and various Pride events (held in early November). The gayborhood is on Arenas but there are other gay bars both in PS and Cathedral City. We now have several upscale gay, clothing optional hotels with prices to match. More importantly, there are many options for LGBTQ visitors and residents of all ages that aren’t drug and alcohol-fueled. It’s easy to meet people here, find community, and just be oneself. There’s an absence of pretense and people even say hello to one another on the street. And, for the record, I’m not employed by the tourism bureau. Just want to clear up far too many misconceptions.

R77 - that's sick. One guy from that small tribe - who are already raking in millions from the casinos.

Via Sonoma - so basically those condos and small townhouses. No way do the people have the money for that.

But it's right of Palm Canyon - so he wants to sell it for a hotel or some other development.

It's legal - but it's not right. I know the Indians historically have not gotten a fair shake in this country - but some of them are getting away with taking in millions while doing not much of anything. While other bands and tribes get nothing.

I think someone said there was like 50 or 70 members of that tribe. That's it. They get monthly payments from almost have the property in Palm Springs on top of the casinos.

Millions and millions.

Very slow. I ride my horse downtown and tie her to the Marilyn statue. I mosey over to the Big Gay Saloon and have a vegetarian plate, with a shot of Dead Eye whiskey. After that, I go to the big meetin' hall and play poker with the boys.

[quote] While other bands and tribes get nothing.

We could compensate them for the entire country to even things out a bit.

[quote]They get monthly payments from almost have the property in Palm Springs on top of the casinos. Millions and millions.

How dare they profit from what was once ALL THEIR LAND while being forced into a deal to give half of it up or die.

R79 Is upset they didn't return the Smallpox blankets washed and clean after they killed off 90% of the tribe without immunity. "sad they all died but those blankest were expensive".

[quote]several upscale gay, clothing optional hotels

"Upscale" and "clothing optional" are mutually incompatible.

I'll never understand why so many gays are into parading around naked or half naked all the time. (I realize a lot of them work out, I do too, but I'd rather be dressed.)

Questions you have to ask yourself before moving to Palm Springs.

Do you love hot sunny weather? EVERY damn day. Day after day after day.

Do you like old people? Lots and lots of old people. Mostly well off. Mostly Republican.

Do you like drinking? It's the main recreation.

Do you know lots of people there already? Or, are you moving there with the knowledge other friends will be moving there? Because established cliques can be hard to break into.

Do you like banality? REALLY like it.

How do you feel about scorpions?

Do you REALLY love running the A/C every day?

The danger of retiring to PS - or Wilton Manors - is the centrality of drinking to the social life. Something about gay men in retirement seems prone to excessive drinking,

Does one HAVE to choose. Can’t they drink AND do drugs?

[quote] White Party wasn’t held this spring and its future is uncertain.

It's probably dead, much like Jeffrey Sanker, its founder.

The Dinah - the big lezfest in Palm Springs - just had its final year of festivities as well.

The Pride celebration (held in PS in November, since summer festivities would be scorching hot) lost a third of its budget due to sponsors pulling out.

I think to some degree the market for those big circuit party events is shrinking - not necessarily just a Palm Springs thing but everywhere. Younger LGBTQ people are not necessarily interested in just hanging with other gay people. Some of the core population of attendees has died out. And after going to a particular party for a year or two or three.....most guys have seen all the sights and fucked all the attendees they might want to fuck, so it becomes a case of diminishing returns....

This should move it to Brooklyn—better drugs!

I think you're right that the market is shrinking over all, R88, but it's also shifting.

Increasingly, the big parties are attached to destinations. Spain, Mykonos in August, Brazil for NYE. Isle mujeres, etc

R90 exactly.

The people on this thread are exactly why you don’t want to live there….

R88 - there's still the Red Dress party though - that's still popular and sells out. But it is mainly locals as it is a benefit party and just one night.

I think it's a shame that Dinah Shore and White Party are basically done - but White Party did seem out of date already. I still think lesbians need their festivals and events - but I don't know if there are any left anymore.

Younger 20s and 30s would rather sit around and stare in their phones and claim social anxiety instead, while judging people for drinking too much or taking up space.

Is there a Sniffies party at Mission Hills CC this fall?