"A Woman's Face" part of Joan Crawford day on TCM

This is my favorite JC movie after Mildred Pierce. She should have won an Oscar. The scene where she beats the s**t out of Osa Massen is pretty intense.

R1 here, I meant to say she should have been nominated for an Oscar but not "won."

She gives a really dialed back performance here, very committed to the story and atmosphere. A satisfying JC film, as always.

This is a great film.

Ah I remember Marjorie Main is funny as the housekeeper jealous of Joan.

When Bette Davis was asked if there were any Joan Crawford roles she wished she had played, Davis mentioned this one in "A Woman's Face" and also 'Helen' in "Humoresque."

Crawford's scarred mug in "A Woman's Face" isn't as grotesque as Bergman's in "En kvinnas ansikte." With Bergman, you just want to look away.

Thanks r6! But we're not talking about the Bergman version. Go hijack your own thread.

As grotesque as MGM would allow. And that beat down JC gives to the silly wife is indeed startling!

The Bergman version is sometimes billed with Crawford together on TCM. It's a useful to see how the Production Code would tame content from a film industry that had fewer constraints. One of Bergman's Swedish films even dealt openly with the subject of abortion.

the sexy villain, played superbly by Conrad Veidt...

If I had a facial scar that turned someone on. that would seem creepy. Then after I got it fixed, and it seemed like he was less interested, I would be even more concerned.

The rest of the TCM JC lineup today...

There you go...

Possessed is also great.

"The Damned Don't Cry" will air at 4 pm/ET on TCM. Here's my look at Joan at circa 44, playing a young housewife who becomes a gangster moll. A ton of fun, more so than her last WB contact film, "This Woman is Dangerous," also reviewed here:

She was gorgeous as a young woman but turned into such a hard as nails gargoyle as she aged. Must've been all the booze and cigs.

"Damned" has JC tussling with Steve Cockring. Um, I mean Steve Cochran. He's more than man enough for her.

A Woman's Face is a better film than Mildred Pierce. They're both great, but I prefer this film.

Joan as young housewife Ethel Whitehead to very young Richard Egan. As gangster moll, she becomes Lorna Hansen Forbes, bangin' Cochran and sourpuss Brian!

and wanted by Kent Smith who perversely keeps calling her Ethel and not Lorna.

The Scandinavian names seemed odd.

Pauline Kael was never a Crawford fan and thought her folk outfit looked hilarious. But then so does Rick.

r21 Crawford herself was half Swedish.

[quote]Crawford herself was half Swedish.

And her name was Lucille Fay LeSueur.

Her father was French Canadian. Her mother's maiden name was Anna Johnson, and she was of Swedish heritage.

That may very well be, r25, but she comes off as American.

Nobody said she didn't r26.

[quote]With Bergman, you just want to look away.

That applies to Crawford in EVERY movie.

[quote]Nobody said she didn't [R26].

All I said, r27, was that I found the Scandinavian names odd. Knowing from r23's post that Joan is half Swedish doesn't change my opinion. It's all of the characters with Swedish names to let us know where they are yet they don't seem Swedish beyond that. In my humble opinion.

JC was a NORWEIGIAN CATHOLIC

JC was a *lot* of things.

I’m still surprised that this wasn’t Joan’s first Oscar nomination.

I don’t think she had the backing of MGM. I remember reading that one of the producers disliked the idea and Mayer hated it.

R16, JC actually aged very well; her skin, facial features, and figure remained gorgeous until she was in her early sixties. The problem was her short, matronly hair and heavy hand with the make up.

Ooooh, Torch Song is on later

Torch Song was the closest Joan Crawford ever got to make like Margo Channing in All About Eve. Joan played Jenny Stewart, the Broadway musical legend who walks all over anybody within range of her ankle strap heels. TCM airs this camp classic at 8 pm/ET. More like VOTD's Helen Lawson than Margo, my fun take here:

Torch Song is just insane.

It's like Helen Lawson, but ripping off her own wig!

Hey Rick you already did a Torch Song thread.

R9, Bergman is stunning in the original version which is, inevitably, darker than the Hollywood version.

I've seen several Crawford movies and she always seems to act exactly the same in each one. I have never understood her popularity, she's hard to look at.

"I'll go out...the way I came on... crazy!"

[quote]I've seen several Crawford movies and she always seems to act exactly the same in each one

See Robert Redford. It's called movie star acting. They're less of an actor and more of a presence.

Joan in blackface, ripping off her wig, is the stuff of nightmares

Robert Redford is prettier than Joan Crawford.

Joan had a *much* better complexion, t44.

[quote] If I had a facial scar that turned someone on. that would seem creepy.

Welcome to my world.

r44 ^

Madonna should do a Torch Song remake

Madonna *is* a Torch Song remake.

Crawford's 50s camp spectacles are so bonkers and so entertaining.

Christina said that Joan in real life was the most like her character in Queen Bee.

Harriet Craig is an oft-overlooked gem that is closest to the Mommie Dearest style I think. Boy is she a bitch in it!

Both "Torch Song" and "White Christmas" were released in 1953-54, and they both had blackface numbers, which was odd because there had not been a lot of them in the early 1950s. But 1954 also saw the release of "A Star in Born" which had the big "Swanee" number, which did songs which could have been performed by Judy Garland in blackface ("Swanee," which was originally performed by Al Jolson in blackface, and "Lose that long Face"), but were pointedly not done that way.

I have no idea why those two years seemed to be a marked turning point for Hollywood musicals, although 1954 was also the year of the landmark civil rights decision by the SCOTUS of Brown vs. Board of Education.

There is an action sequence in the last 20 or so minutes of "A Woman's Face" that is very unexpected and quite intense. MGM's technical department did a fine job in delivering this sequence.

The original Mrs. Craig - Chrystal Herne

I think there's a scene where the little boy calls Joan beautiful. This is after her operation to remove the scars but she still remembers having them and instinctively thinks she is being made fun of.

Harriet Craig has such a satisfying ending!

[quote] Both "Torch Song" and "White Christmas" were released in 1953-54, and they both had blackface numbers

You're mistaken, R53. White Christmas didn't have a blackface number.

It did have the production number, Mandy, which was inspired by minstrel shows, but was not in blackface.

Holiday Inn (1942) did have a blackface number ("Abraham.")

R54 A few years ago I won a book giveaway from TCM-- the book was by MGM's Buddy Gillespie, head of special effects. It had very detailed explanations and sketches (and stills) of many of MGM's special effects sequences. The way the winter waterfall/factory sequence was done was particularly impressive. (It was a large-size miniature that used gypsom for the waterfall...it made a "mist" at the bottom and looked very realistic.)

*gypsum

I like Harriet Craig. It didn’t need much change from the original to fit Joan like a glove.

Has anyone seen the Rosalind Russell version, Craig's Wife, from the 1930s? I have but I don't remember it.

Same here r62. Billie Burke was in it.

Roz

... and the John Donne quote at the end

JC had a lot of ethnic types in her.

I remember Roz was good, that's about it. I don't remember the quote. But Roz in a drama is, to me, frustrating, because even if she's good, I feel like I'm missing her comedy talents.

They should end the marathon with Mommie Dearest.

I tried to get through Electra in my distant youth, r67, couldn't...or maybe I did. But I've never been interested in revisiting it. Sister Kenny was her doing noble. I liked The Velvet Touch but it's not on very often.

R69 I couldn't get through Mourning Becomes Electra, either. Not because of her, it was just...endless. Sister Kenny--my mom liked it. She was actually very good in The Citadel with Robert Donat. And Night Must Fall, with Robert Montgomery.

The title of the movie was based on Joan’s answer to the question,

“What do you most like to have between your legs, Joan?”

I haven't seen those last two, r70. I didn't find fault with her in Electra, it was that *somber classic* tone. And she got her first Oscar nomination for a comedy.

When she slaps...

Did anyone watch the entire Joan-a-thon?

Not me. I forget. Even if I hadn't I don't think I could have sat through Esther Costello again.

Bitchy interviewer.

"Esther Costello" is a decent movie. A very daring subject matter and Joan and the rest of the cast are all quite good. It's just creepy, but at least it tries.

The more JC movies I watch, the more I want to watch.

They should have squeezed in "Dance, Fools, Dance" which is an early Joan hit.

Dance, Fools, Dance, or other early talkies like Posessed (1931), Chained, or Sadie McKee are enjoyable, even though I'm not a big JC fan.

"I'm still big!" Is this where Taylor Swift got the idea for her jump suits? Movies like Harriet Craig, Torch Song, and The Best of Everything played off Joan's off-screen persona...

The winter waterfall/factory sequence was done was particularly impressive

R59 - George Cukor was not known for creating action sequences so I guess he had a lot of help here.

In her autobiography, Roz said the early roles were mostly Lady Mary parts. When testing for The Women, she did it various ways, including an over-the-top version. That was the one Cukor chose her to do. "The critics will murder me!" Russell complained. It gave her a whole new aspect to her career.

"a Woman's Face" & "The Last of Mrs. Cheney" ate my two very favorite Crawford movies - and she plays criminal masterminds in both! (To very different effect, obv....)

When first working with Crawford, Cukor told her: “Joan, I see you’ve memorized the lines. Now let’s see if you can put some meaning into them.”

I haven't seen this movie in a long time, but I guess there's a scene in court where Joan is talking about her past, and Crawford was doing it too emotionally, and Cukor told her, "Do it as if you're reading a shopping list."

R84, according to TCM:

[quote]In a scene where the character tells the story of the accident that scarred her face, Cukor recalled that he wanted Crawford to speak the lines in a flat, matter-of-fact way, with no emotion. He told her to prepare by reciting the multiplication tables over and over again, until her voice faded into a monotone.

R85 Okay, yeah, that's it.

Another version:

[quote] Cukor was concerned about the courtroom scene in which Anna tells her life story. He felt that the text was so dramatic and so there was no need for Crawford to do any acting or show any self pity. Wishing to steer clear of melodrama, Cukor instructed her to play the scene it as if she were reading from the telephone book. When this ploy didn’t work, Cukor said, “Just speak the lines as if you’re saying the multiplication table.” Crawford tried, but Cukor was not pleased. “No, no, no,” he said, “it’s still got emotion. I want no emotion at all, just say it.” It took many takes, but Cukor finally got the dreary monotone he was seeking.

Doris Day and Roger Moore were in the movie as party guests (uncredited)

[quote]"A Woman's Face" part of Joan Crawford

Thanks for the clarification, I was never entirely sure.

R88 Not this movie.

R79 That photo is so unusual. It shows Joan displaying a sense of humor. That usually wasn't her image.

It basically boils down to “did she beat the kids or not”

It doesn’t matter how monotone her courtroom scene performance was in a “Woman’s Face.”

At the end of the day, that’s what people care about!

R81 I remember Russell using her whole face in Cukor’s close ups in The Women. In scenes where she gossiped, her mouth moved in all these strange ways, like she was hungry and devouring the sordid details of everyone else’s misery and humiliation. It’s so good. Masterful bitchcraft.

Also, Joan sorting out little Mary in that hot, whorish bathroom was pretty delicious. “You sit THERE!”

I think it was a surprise to some people that Crawford wanted the role of Crystal, in the The Women. Up until then she'd always played the heroine, as far as I know. I think she thought she'd surprise people and get all the acting honors in a juicy, slutty other woman role. But she didn't figure on Roz.

[quote]Cukor told her, "Do it as if you're reading a shopping list."

Did she ad lib in some Spanish sow-sage?

Crawford's last few pictures, The Bride Wore Red, The Shining Hour, Ice Follies of 1939 were box office disappointments. Only Mannequin was a modest hit, in large part due to the popularity of Spencer Tracy. JC thought taking on the unsympathetic role of gold-digging shop girl, Crystal, would prove that she could play more than just a glamour girl.

R72 Those two are both worth seeing. The Citadel (1938) was filmed in England by MGM. Roz played English and was surrounded by the real thing: Donat, Ralph Richardson, Rex Harrison, etc. Night Must Fall (1937) was made in Hollywood, but was also set in England. The first one is about an idealistic young doctor who gradually becomes materialistic; the second is about a serial killer.

Although it makes no sense, is very melodramatic and has Joan, nearing forty as a young newlywed, I can enjoy "Above Suspicion" very easily.

Pure Joan madness!

R98 I saw that on the late show once. Another time I saw her in that one with John Wayne everyone forgets they co-starred in (Reunion in France?)

I actually thought both of them were pretty good, until I saw them a second time. Some things are good once. I guess Above Suspicion is enjoyable for the craziness.

R94- the fact that George Cukor was directing must have been a big plus for her. Though he had just left Gone with the Wind. Opinions differ as to whether he left voluntarily or was pushed. It could have meant the end of his career but it wasn't. He was known as a woman's director so why not give him a film with all women?!

The Women was originally going to be directed by Ernst Lubitsch. I forget why he didn't end up doing it.

A Woman's Face was a career high for Joan at the time. After starring in a series of flops, Joan was allowed to stretch as an actress and play against type. However, that high was brief because she was back starring in movies she didn't much care for: When Ladies Meet, Reunion in France, Above Suspicion. And that's when she decided to bail and head over to Warner Bros.

The best movies Cukor had directed before 1939 were probably A bill of Divorcement, Little Women, Dinner at Eight, David Copperfield, Romeo and Juliet (debatable), Camille, and Holiday. He had a few flops in there, like Sylvia Scarlet, and Zaza, as well.

Above Suspicion was one of the films The Lady in Question paid homage to.

R103 Most of those were produced by either David O. Selznick or Irving Thalberg.

It just seems she played a lot of the tough-as-nails, utter bitches to everyone around her. Too one-note. And it got tiring.