Why is the country obsessed with bringing back manufacturing?

Dump is just adding more taxes to lower and middle class consumers to justify tax cuts at the top. And his followers are too stupid to realize or understand how much more in taxes they’re paying. He has zero interest in growing the manufacturing industry. If he did, he might instead work on free trade partners like Mexico to level the playing field by increasing wages for its workers.

It's been a complaint for at least 20 years. Some of that seems to stem from awareness that our manufacturing ability was key to our success in WWII. So, it's seen as a matter of national security as well concern about our dependence on foreign manufacturing as an economic issue.

Christ, they can't get young people to apply for manufacturing jobs even now.

They all want to be WFH "influencers."

Whatever.

Just this morning I read about an explosion in a steel mill in PA.

Because people believe that means dependable jobs with good salaries and benefits. They're clinging to nostalgia.

Why? Because manufacturing jobs pay better. Also service consumption is socially conditioned, which gives it a naturally oligarchic industry structure. If you want a middle class, you need people making stuff.

Manufacturing jobs do not pay better.

You do not need a predominantly manufacturing economy to have a healthy middle class.

Geez.

The whole world thinks otherwise R7

r7, manufacturing jobs paid more because they were UNION jobs. Nowadays, not so much.

Then the whole world is stupid. (And, no, the whole world doesn’t. This is not an obsession in other developed countries.)

r4, right

why do people want to bring THATback?

The oligarchs need a working class to exploit... that's all.

I own a business that does manufacturing. For years I looked for anybody that would work and if they would they insisted on being stoned drunk on the phone, etc while working.. They wanted to work when they did and not when they didn't. They wanted to cherry pick the work and just do the bits they wanted to do and ignore the rest of the jobs. They wanted the wages of an experienced worker on day one. I had such a hard time finding workers that when I finally found some competent workers I made them partners. People like the idea of manufacturing but few really want to do it.

A politician friend thinks he'll declare martial law at some point to retain power.

If he did, manufacturing for the military would be easier if it was done in the US.

What's odd is that nobody seems to understand the difference between the manufacturing we should be doing — the most advanced of all industries not limited to just semiconductors, while strengthening the sectors that we dominate, from innovation to IP — and Trump trying to bring back the manufacturing lost from the 70s to the 90s. He knows no such thing will happen on the scale to make it matter, but that's not the point. These tariffs don't alter the basic offshoring formula that industry developed over the course of the last half century; the tariffs would have to be 500% for it to even match the cost of production in the US. All the tariffs are doing is transferring more wealth from the poor and working class to the 1%.

Americans no longer have the income to buy anything thanks to the destruction of the middle class. Higher wages would mean skyrocketing demand for goods.

Our country isn’t obsessed with bringing back manufacturing, into the United States, our POTUS is, because he’s being manipulated/exploited by those who understand how to, & are they are deeply invested in policy that allows AI to replace MANY jobs/careers.

Because young people want something to reject!!!

[Quote] It's odd that Trump is willing to destroy the economy with tariffs just to get one sector economy to jump start--manufacturing.

Jesus wept, do people still believe Trump just because he said something?

These tariffs don’t have a fucking thing to do with bringing back manufacturing.

AI will replace all of it!

I do not think ruining the rest of the economy is a good idea. SO I agree on that part. I do think it is good to have manufacturing in the U.S. I think during Covid we all noticed how heavily we depend on other country for medications and other important things. Not good. Politicians on both sides of the aisles have discussed ways to bring it back over the last ten years. It does need to come back. But I STRONGLY DISAGREE with the method in which this administration is going about it.

And everything else these fuckers are doing,. Man am I tired of reading somethign each and every day!! UGH.

It isn't---it's a lie.

What Trump is actually obsessed with is kicking the AI scam into overdrive.

Lots of Americans have this stupid complaint. They have a very romanticized view of what those 20th century manufacturing jobs were like.

R15, lots of Americans share his stupid view, unfortunately. Especially in the midwest.

We've heard through sources that Schotz Brewery has openings.

[quote]A politician friend thinks he'll declare martial law at some point to retain power.

Retain power?

R7, you need real stuff to live and survive. Not video games, or software, or fast food restaurants. If there is no manufacturer, any country can stop the flow of manufactured goods, or a war or a natural disaster can disrupt supply chains. And manufacturing jobs allow people to move up in their careers. Fast food jobs, hotel services do not offer those opportunities.

When my sisters worked in the town sewing factory, they'd come home every day coughing up threads and pulling them out of their noses.

There's a memory.

Yes. And I also need service to survive. Try living without medical care, elder care, or child care. Doing things can be just as important as making things.

1. What is your theory or plan. Will we make absolutely everything we need in the US. Or just certain things? If everything, since it will be inefficient to produce many things in the US, how will we avoid impoverishing ourselves? 2. How is it easier to advance in manufacturing? Is there something about manufacturing that requires more management. 3. Will we enjoy/seek these manufacturing jobs more than the ones we have. Many of them, frankly, seem unpleasant even compared to lower level service jobs. Have you worked one of these jobs? If so, please describe it and the amount of pleasure you derived from working it.

The only reasons our waterways and air have even cleaned up a little is because we moved manufacturing overseas.

The Republicans took in a lot of money by promising all kinds of assholes that they'd implement their agendas, none of which really coordinate with each other. So now we're getting this random assortment of insane crap getting thrown into the mix. We're going to bring back manufacturing but it's all robotics and AI. And we're embarking on this massive genocidal ethnic cleansing while at the same time chasing after pregnant ladies and librarians and sending troops into cities to create photo ops for Fox News. This is no way to run a police state.

Because stupid people don't know anyone in modern jobs. Their richest cousins are still supermarket cashiers and bank tellers.

It's a sign of how distant our manufacturing past is. Only people who haven't held these jobs could romanticize them the way the MAGA right is. It's like people rhapsodizing about the agrarian past. One 14-hour day in a field would shatter their illusions. I think a day in a coal mine in textile factory would do the same.

Let's be honest. Manufacturing jobs, like mining jobs before them, provided a living wage to people who didn't need higher education - in fact, didn't even need a high school diploma. They provided a living wage because of unions. We now have a large population of people, particularly in the rust belt, and in coal-mining regions, who weren't encouraged to work hard in school, partly because the local populations felt that a good life could be obtained in the mills and mines without putting in all that extra time. When all of that went away, local economies plummeted. People became angry. Republicans blamed immigrants and Democrats, and the disgruntled people ate it up. They thought Trump was going to bring it all back.

The "new" manufacturing is trade, services, delivery of goods, financial transactions, and computer-related industries. Robots can and probably SHOULD do most of the manufacturing that was previously done by humans. Many kinds of manufacturing are dangerous. Heavy things moving very fast is a recipe for injury. Plus the jobs are mind-numbing and boring, which leads to inattention, which leads to accidents. Large corporations are racing to make robotic manufacturing happen around the world, because the profit margins are so much higher. The initial outlay is steep though. SOME jobs can be done at manufacturing plants using robots, but those jobs are fewer and require more skills and education.

A car manufacturing plant that formerly employed 50,000 workers, might now employ 500. Those numbers, if some manufacturing even relocates back to the US, are not going to rescue towns emptied out by the loss of manufacturers in the 1970s and 1980s.

Eventually, large swaths of mining and manufacturing parts of the country will empty out, as people flee to the larger coastal cities and transportation hubs. It remains to be seen if climate change affects that equation.

"Because stupid people don't know anyone in modern jobs. Their richest cousins are still supermarket cashiers and bank tellers."

Dude---get real. "Modern jobs," i.e. service and information sector jobs that require computer use, are everywhere. Every rural town with broadband has people working online on contracted computer/email jobs. Data centers are popping up all over the heartland.

People fantasize about factory jobs because they have little access to quality "modern jobs;" factory jobs symbolize abundance and stability. Factory jobs currently and historically are/were more likely to be unionized; you could get them when you were a teenager, and you could stay in the same position for decades. There's something to be said for not feeling pressure to lobby for a promotion every two years, which is what organizational culture at a lot of white collar places require.

Now, *no one* is getting a factory job that's going to take them through retirement. And any mass hiring that is done will likely be of robots. Factories were always hellholes in their own right, even during the golden age of the 1950s-1970s---people were used until their bodies broke down or they got hurt, and then they had to survive on some combination of disability and pension and government benefits. HOWEVER, people could expect to hold onto their jobs for as long as they didn't get hurt until offshoring and economic shift really took over. These fantasies are just as much about reversing course and righting a historic wrong (exporting our demand for uneducated labor to the third world) as they are about actually bringing manufacturing back.

R34 you brought up a great point. Manufacturing jobs are so much more efficent than they were back then. You don't need nearly as many people as you did back in the day. But people still have the same image in their head from the 60s, thinking that's still the way things are.

Was the average lifestyle of the 50s or 60s really that desirable?

[quote]Many kinds of manufacturing are dangerous. Heavy things moving very fast is a recipe for injury. Plus the jobs are mind-numbing and boring, which leads to inattention, which leads to accidents.

100% true.

The generations after the boomers are too soft to do factory work. I'm not sure you could find a Zer anywhere who could stand all day with two 15-minute breaks and a 1/2 hour lunch, much less be there to punch in before 7AM.

Not gonna happen.

Manufacturing was the only place the working class could hope to become middle class.

Stop trying to manufacture. Gretchen!

R39 no

Globalization was right—manufacturing being done in the cheapest places of the world makes everything cheaper for the rest of us and uplifts those poor places.

Anything made in the US is far too expensive for the rest of the world (and even America) to afford.

"Globalization was right—manufacturing being done in the cheapest places of the world makes everything cheaper for the rest of us and uplifts those poor places."

Globalization has been about making the rich richer, not securing supply chains or inventory.

"Cheaper" manufacturing hasn't improved the quality of life for Americans AT ALL, and it certainly hasn't "uplifted" the poor in exporting countries. It's actually correlated with growing inequality in the exporting countries.

You can't even conflate, for example, an increase in overall life expectancy and drop in preventable death (malnutrition, curable disease, diarrhea) in a place like Bangladesh with manufacturing activity because you're overlooking the *direct* drivers of these changes, which lie in the explosion of the foreign aid and NGO spheres in the late 1980s, along with the proliferation of agricultural technology.

[quote]"Cheaper" manufacturing hasn't improved the quality of life for Americans AT ALL.

Right. It's a shame we can't transport you to a world without a global supply chain. You'd probably be on the floor in a fetal position crying. It's easy for you to decry global supply chains since you are confident you will never have to live without it. You would be utterly miserable in an existence that you could not recognize if you got your moronic wish.

Manufacturing Percent of National Output (source: bookings.edu):

USA: 12%

Germany: 23%

China: 27%

GDP per capita (source: World Bank):

USA: $89,810

Germany: $55,800

China: $13,303

R44, you tiresome moron---you have no clue what you're talking about. I lived in an isolated third world country for over 2 years, and I'm old enough to remember an America where lots of things were made at home.

Don't try to conflate the last 200 years of global trade and industry with the last 40 years of neoliberal globalization to win your internet argument about the virtues of having 100% of our goods made in foreign sweatshops---it's stupid and disingenuous.

R47. "Lots of things were made at home". That's a nicely vague phrase. Unless you are 150, you don't remember when the bulk of our goods were manufactured here. The world you advocate for is a stupid fantasy, beloved of morons.

Because white men. If it was working class black and Puerto Rican men chiefly affected, no fucks would be given.

Higher GDP doesn't mean that poor people are "uplifted." Qatar is one of the most unequal countries in the world.

R50. Who are you taking to?

"Because white men. If it was working class black and Puerto Rican men chiefly affected, no fucks would be given."

Bullshit. Plenty of Black and PR guys had and lost factory jobs; plenty in these communities hate globalization. Wild that you have no compunctions about making shit up.

[quote] "Lots of things were made at home". That's a nicely vague phrase. Unless you are 150, you don't remember when the bulk of our goods were manufactured here. The world you advocate for is a stupid fantasy, beloved of morons.

Manufacturing employment was at its height in the US in 1979.

Do you have a brain at all? Why are you posting this irrelevant observation.in response to my post?

^ The one without a brain.

R48, there's nothing vague about it.

There were factories that made goods for domestic consumption and export, and they employed like 30% of the population; I was around during that period of time, and everything was great; it was a lot easier to get buy on a part-time or badly paid job than it is now. Guaranteed no one was crying over the lack of things to buy.

Trying to act as if anyone is claiming that we should return to the state of things in 1867 rather than 1967 is disingenuous.

R52 ok you’re right.

[quote] Unless you are 150, you don't remember when the bulk of our goods were manufactured here.

Said by a know-nothing idiot.

R55. Clever. Don’t dispute that you’ve been caught saying something mindless.

There's nothing wrong with revitalizing manufacturing in one's own country in and of itself.

R58. You’re on a roll! How do you come up with these?

"Do you have a brain at all? Why are you posting this irrelevant observation.in response to my post?"

Who the fuck are *you* talking to, dude?

I'm not r53, but they're right and it's 100% relevant to your deranged ramblings about the excruciating days before mass offshoring of manufacturing.

Not to mention the fact that all the factories have been sitting abandoned for decades and would cost untold billions to refurbish and get going again. Like those greedy fucks are going to part with one thin dime to make anyones life except their own better.

Because all the dumb hicks who had factory jobs in the 50s - 70s had too many kids, grandkids and great grandkids. Now there's no place for their 92 IQ progeny except Family Dollar. Or crime.

Why is there a sweatshop schill and proponent for unfettered globalization on Datalounge? Who do they think they're fooling?

R65. I don’t know. I’m sure you’ll get to the bottom of it.

[quote]Because all the dumb hicks who had factory jobs in the 50s - 70s had too many kids, grandkids and great grandkids. Now there's no place for their 92 IQ progeny except Family Dollar. Or crime.

It was the black working class that was most affected by the decline in manufacturing. Is that who you're talking about, racist fuck?

[quote] There were factories that made goods for domestic consumption and export, and they employed like 30% of the population; I was around during that period of time, and everything was great; it was a lot easier to get buy on a part-time or badly paid job than it is now. Guaranteed no one was crying over the lack of things to buy. Trying to act as if anyone is claiming that we should return to the state of things in 1867 rather than 1967 is disingenuous.

When people start longing to return to 1967 (when we incidentally reported a trade deficit) you have a pretty good picture of where they are coming from.