Trump calls for "real end" to Iran nuke program, hints war to escalate

Umm, there was a plan in place. But Dump repealed that during his first term because the black President did it.

Mr. Trump predicted that Israel would not slow its assault on Iran, which has largely decapitated the Islamic republic's military command and inflicted significant damage to its controversial nuclear program.

"You're going to find out over the next two days. You're going to find out. Nobody's slowed up so far," he said, hours after issuing an ominous warning that all of Tehran's roughly 10 million inhabitants should "immediately evacuate."

Asked about that warning on Air Force One early Tuesday, Mr. Trump said he wanted "people to be safe," without offering any further explanation. Israel on Monday warned about 300,000 residents in a central district of Tehran to evacuate, pending attacks in the area.

Mr. Trump suggested the reason he didn't want to stay in Canada was because he couldn't confidentially monitor developments in the Middle East. He said he could be "more well versed" in the White House Situation Room and avoid cellphones. "I don't believe in telephones — because people like you listen to them," he told reporters on the plane. "Being on the scene is much better."

A source with knowledge of the talks told CBS News on Monday that Tehran had indicated to negotiators in Qatar and Oman that it was prepared to discuss a new deal with the U.S. on its nuclear program, but not while it was still under Israeli attack.

The president said it was possible he could send special envoy Steve Witkoff or Vice President JD Vance, or both, to meet with Iranian negotiators, but "it depends what happens when I get back" to Washington.

"I don't know," Mr. Trump added. "I'm not too much in the mood to negotiate."

Addressing any possible threat to U.S. interests in the region, Mr. Trump said Iran knew not to target U.S. forces, as the U.S. would "come down so hard if they do anything to our people."

The president declined to say whether Joint Chiefs of Staff Chairman Lt. Gen. Dan Caine and Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth had provided him with options in the event Iran does attack U.S. bases in the Middle East.

"I can't tell you that," he said.

Asked if it would take U.S. involvement to destroy Iran's nuclear program, Mr. Trump said he hoped it would be "wiped out long before that."

Trump says Iran was "very close" to obtaining a nuclear weapon

Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has framed the attack he ordered on Iran late last week as an "existential" battle for Israel's survival. He claimed intelligence — which Israel has not shared publicly — showed the country was "racing" toward the development of a nuclear weapon. Netanyahu, along with all recent U.S. presidents including Mr. Trump, have always said they could not allow Iran to obtain a nuclear weapon.

Just several months ago, however, Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard delivered an assessment to lawmakers that said U.S. agencies continued "to assess that Iran is not building a nuclear weapon and Supreme leader Khomeini has not authorized the nuclear weapons program that he suspended in 2003."

Gabbard said the U.S. was continuing to "monitor closely if Tehran decides to reauthorize its nuclear weapons program," and she noted that "in the past year, we've seen an erosion of a decades long taboo in Iran on discussing nuclear weapons in public likely emboldening nuclear weapons advocates within Iran's decision-making apparatus."

Asked on Air Force One about that assessment from Gabbard, that Iran was not building a nuclear weapon, Mr. Trump told reporters: "I don't care what she said. I think they were very close to having them."

Iraq had WMD and now Iran has a nuclear weapon. Sure

[quote] Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has framed the attack he ordered on Iran late last week as an "existential" battle for Israel's survival. He claimed intelligence — which Israel has not shared publicly — showed the country was "racing" toward the development of a nuclear weapon.

[quote] Just several months ago, however, Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard delivered an assessment to lawmakers that said U.S. agencies continued "to assess that Iran is not building a nuclear weapon and Supreme leader Khomeini has not authorized the nuclear weapons program that he suspended in 2003."

[quote] Asked on Air Force One about that assessment from Gabbard, that Iran was not building a nuclear weapon, Mr. Trump told reporters: "I don't care what she said. I think they were very close to having them."

So once again, Netanyahu is clearly lying about the "existential threat," so he can use that reason to attack his neighbors. Again.

And he has dumped Trump into going along with the plan, even against HIS OWN COUNTRY'S intelligence information.

"I don't care what she said." That's what he thinks of his own intelligence information.

[quote] "I don't believe in telephones — because people like you listen to them," he told reporters on the plane. "Being on the scene is much better."

Multiple journalists accidently invited to Hegseth's new Middle East group chat in 5...4...3...

The US possibly joining the fight less han 24 hours from now. The UK already sending its forces there as well.

[quote]N12: Israeli assessments suggest the U.S. is likely to enter the war with Iran

[quote]Trump: We know exactly where "Supreme Leader" is hiding. He is an easy target but is safe there - We are not going to take take him out for now (kill), at least not for now.

He's gearing up to nuke Tehran, and he's practically salivating at the thought. He can't contain himself. He's wanted to drop nukes somewhere since January 20th, 2017. He'll get his way this time because everyone bows down to Trump 2.0 and he gets everything he wants without meaningful opposition from anywhere.

Mark my words. He's going to nuke Iran and then the US will be a full-blown pariah state along the lines of Russia or NK. Get ready for the new economy where we're not dealing with tariffs but endless sanctions from every developed nation. Our main trading partner will be Russia by then. We'll be ousted from NATO, shunned by EU countries and cut off entirely from the UK and it's commonwealth partners. Canada will close the border and we'll lose all of the intelligence apparatus that we partner with these nations for, which in the case of the UK and Five Eyes, is a LOT.

And notice I didn't say "every [italic]other[/italic] developed nation," because at that point we will have regressed to a point where that doesn't apply to the US anymore.

[quote]Iranian sources claim Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei has locked himself in an underground bunker with his family. In a rare message to the IRGC, he reportedly said: “I give you all the power. You will determine how to continue this war.”

[quote]IRGC commander Mohammad Fakhpour is now said to be making all major decisions, suggesting Khamenei may be stepping aside, if not officially.

No one's nuking anything, r9. Thanks to Israel's bombing, Iran is currently less of a threat than Iraq during the Gulf War, and nukes weren't needed back then either.

Besides, the whole point of having nukes is that you DON'T use them. The whole system falls apart the moment you do.

It's hilarious that you think Donald Trump would *never* break established norms, R11.

Are you under the delusion that the post-war alliances are still intact, too?

What color is the sky on your planet? Or are you posting from 1993?

He's not the supreme leader, you're watching too many movies, r12.

The military would absolutely not allow him to nuke a historical capital of a country that's on its last legs militarily already. Not to mention the millions of people still in it. It's 2025, not 1945.

Pootie won’t let Shitler bomb Tehran, you sillies 🤣

Trumps a retard. But given no one in Israel or America has seriously requested he use nukes, the reason the Israelis want the US involved is so they'll use that non nuclear bunker buster bomb not wipe out Tehran, and at the end of the day he wants to leave the White House in 4 years with his pile of loot not experience nuclear winter. The chances of Trump going nuclear in this are slim to zero.

r15 Exactly. Israel just needs those American B-52s to take out Fordow, that's it. They can mop up all on their own.

Unfortunately, that alone would almost certainly trigger Iran into fucking with the Strait of Hormuz, which will then draw the US even further into the conflict.

It is clear Israel wants Iran's ruler Ali Khamenei to be removed from power one way or the other. But wouldn't Iran simply replace him with a new ruler of similar mindset, in a fervor of Iranian nationalistic defense against "our enemy"?

[quote]IDF: Iranian forces are retreating toward central Iran following our strikes, and we are continuing to pursue them.

Soon they'll be guarding only Tehran. And it hasn't even been a week since this operation started.

r17 That might as well happen. We really have no idea how widespread the popular opposition to the regime really is, we can only estimate based on protests that it's substantial and that the people will want to at least try something else when given the chance.

At this point, after that flop of an ego-stroking parade and the massive protests on the same day, no one cares or is listening to anything Trump says or types out except the hardcore MAGA. He's done and dusted and now the rest of us are just waiting for cholesterol to do its job.

Trump about to become The Great Liberator of Persia? We live in the most surreal timeline.

r21 There are a lot of ifs there. I'm still very doubtful a general uprising is about to begin in Iran.

t.a.c.o. tuezday

He added this after the message at r8.

[quote]He followed up with a second post a few minutes later, writing: “UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER!”

[quote]In a post published about thirty minutes earlier, Trump said, “We now have complete and total control of the skies over Iran.”

Notice the "we" in there, he's already seeing this campaign as his own and wants to declare victory as soon as possible. Also, that "unconditional surrender" means the US and Israel want to topple the regime. Because they will never surrender.

R17, Iran needs to lean into this. Have Khamenei “deposed” by some suit-wearing cool guy like the new leader of Syria. Surrender; sign agreements. Inspections? No problem! Say you’ll put Trump up for a Nobel in return for lifting sanctions. Just get this moment over with.

Is there anyone who thinks that Iran should be allowed to have a nuclear weapon, if it’s possible and only possible to stop it through the use of military intervention?

I recently stated in another thread that I’ve converted to being anti-interventionist, but Iran may have to be an exception.

[quote] Pootie won’t let Shitler bomb Tehran, you sillies 🤣

That won't stop nutjob Netanyahu from "going rogue," and bombing Tehran anyway.

Nothing Trump or Putin says, has stopped Netanyahu from killing thousands of innocent civilians in Gaza.

Satanyahu knows that neither Putin nor Trump has the guts to stop him from doing whatever he wants to the Palestinians, the Gazans, or the Iranians.

Trump was just the dupe he was waiting for, to carry out his plans.

[quote] Trump demands ‘UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER’ from Iran as he issues chilling threat to Supreme Leader Khamenei

Donald Trump on Tuesday demanded that Iranian forces unconditionally lay down their arms as he issued a thinly veiled threat that American forces may target Iran’s head of state if the Islamic Republic doesn’t cease targeting Israeli civilians — or targets any American forces in the region.

In a post on Truth Social, Trump wrote that the U.S. “know exactly where” Iran’s “so-called Supreme Leader,” Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, is “hiding” and described him as an “easy target” who is currently “safe” in his current location.

“We are not going to take him out (kill!), at least not for now. But we don’t want missiles shot at civilians, or American soldiers,” the president continued before adding: “Our patience is wearing thin. Thank you for your attention to this matter!”

In a second post moments later, he added another two-word demand: “UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER!”

The president’s social media comments came less than an hour after he wrote that “we” — an allusion to the American makers of Israel’s military equipment — had achieved “complete and total control of the skies over Iran,” citing the superiority of Israel’s “American made, conceived, and manufactured ‘stuff’” over Iran’s “good sky trackers and other defensive equipment” of non-American origins.

Trump and his administration have steadfastly denied any American involvement in Israel’s days-old campaign to cripple the Iranian nuclear program by destroying nuclear sites, targeting scientists for assassination, and taking out military leaders and much of Iran’s military capabilities.

When Israel began striking Iranian targets last week, multiple administration officials, including Secretary of State Marco Rubio, stressed that the U.S. was not participating and maintained that American forces in the region were being deployed in what has been described as a defensive posture.

But Trump’s ratcheting-up of his rhetoric — and the deployment of more American forces to the region — strongly suggests that he may be considering joining the Israeli effort to take down Tehran’s nuclear program.

While Israeli forces have reported significant successes in taking out numerous targets associated with Iranian atomic weapons research and development, one obstacle that remains is the Fordow enrichment facility, located deep inside a mountain near the city of Qom.

Because the facility is deep underground, successfully destroying it would require dropping so-called “bunker-buster” munitions into the facility from heavy bomber aircraft.

Israeli forces do not possess such weapons, but the United States does.

Destroying the Fordow facility would likely involve use of a B-2 stealth bomber to a Massive Ordnance Penetrator, known by the Air Force designation GBU-57A/B.

The 30,000 pound projectile was designed specifically to attack and destroy hardened facilities such as Fordow, especially those that could house weapons of mass destruction.

Trump:

[quote]We now have total control over the skies in Teheran.

We?

Hello. Remember me?

I wonder if they're planning to do a Lenin and put him on whatever the equivalent version is in this scenario of a sealed train to St. Petersburg?

The Israeli military said it had accumulated intelligence showing that "concrete progress" had been made "in the Iranian regime's efforts to produce weapons components adapted for a nuclear bomb", including a uranium metal core and a neutron source initiator for triggering the nuclear explosion.

Kelsey Davenport, director for non-proliferation policy at the US-based Arms Control Association, said Israel's prime minister "did not present any clear or compelling evidence that Iran was on the brink of weaponizing".

"Iran has been at a near-zero breakout for months," she told the BBC, referring to the time it would take Iran to acquire enough fissile material for one bomb if it chose to do so.

"Similarly, the assessment that Iran could develop a crude nuclear weapon within a few months is not new."

She said some of Iran's nuclear activities would be applicable to developing a bomb, but US intelligence agencies had assessed that Iran was not engaged in key weaponization work.

This March, Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard told Congress that Iran's stockpile of enriched uranium was "at its highest levels" and "unprecedented for a state without nuclear weapons".

But she also said the US intelligence community "continues to assess that Iran is not building a nuclear weapon and Supreme Leader [Ayatollah Ali] Khamenei has not authorised the nuclear weapons programme that he suspended in 2003".

"If Netanyahu was purely motivated by Iran's proliferation risk, Israel would likely have shared that intelligence with the United States and the initial attack would likely have targeted all of Iran's key nuclear facilities," Ms Davenport added.

-BBC

Again, the timing of Israel's attack is an attempt to deflect increasing international denunciation of its obliteration of Gaza. It's working pretty well so far. Now we are focused on the evil empire Iran, because Israel's security needs as defined by Israel are never questioned by the U.S.

"Trump hasn’t officially “approved” anything, hasn’t committed anything to paper, and hasn't signed off on any specific act. But in the dance of phone calls and back channel messages and things said and not said, the two countries found agreement. Trump has given Israel a green light by not saying no.

It is a hellish world, when this dance of carefully worded statements, obfuscation, and even denial reign supreme. Trump, Vance, and Rubio are all lying, but then that’s the strategy."

Orange shit-everywhere.!

I do remember one of those 2016 GOP debates where Trump was going on and on about "the beauty, the power of nuclear".

He was probably BSing to fill time, but i wouldn't be at all surprised to see him try and drop a nuke.

He also proposed nuking a hurricane, so there's also that.

R32, it took Israel several decades to erode its support on the Democratic Party, but eventually that happened. It may vaporize its Republican support much more quickly. Many MAGA really are isolationists; they want the U.S. military to attack U.S. citizens, not sent overseas fighting wars that mean nothing to them.

MAGA in an uproar. MTG and Carlson skewer Trump. MAGA predicts if Trump goes to war, it will be the end of his presidency.

Majority of cabinet can replace him with Vance at any time.

[quote] MAGA predicts if Trump goes to war, it will be the end of his presidency.

Who speaks for MAGA?

[quote] Majority of cabinet can replace him with Vance at any time.

Not quite so simple.

Besides, this cabinet was selected for absolute loyalty above all.

The split between the Russia-backed/isolationist wing of MAGA (Cucker, Large Marge, etc) vs the fawning sycophant/warhawk wing (Lindsaybelle, Huckabee, etc) will be fun to watch as the world goes down in flames. Glass half full!

All Shitler has to do is fling one of his blown-out, diarrheal diapers at Tehran and the place will empty out from the sheer stench of it.

Poor Trumpy! Caught between his BFFs, Bibi and Putin. Both are pretending to listen to him and then do the opposite. He's getting humiliated at every turn lately

[quote]In a second post moments later, he added another two-word demand: “UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER!”

Oh no, Trump's typing in all caps on Truth Social again. He means business and his words are a display of American strength and power to the world.

Upon hearing 'UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER,' Iranians immediately overthrew their government, abandoned any nuclear ambitions and declared a ceasefire with Israel. As a result, both sides agree that the next Nobel Peace Prize be awarded to Donald Trump for the Truth Social post that brought an end to conflict.

Is he sure he can spare the military personnel who are keeping peace and order in California where nothing is happening?

There's far more going on here than we know about, and by "we" I mean all of us, including and specifically, Trump.

What we do know:

First, you must recognize that intelligence sharing — actionable, verified intelligence the world previously shared with us — ceased in January. Foreign leaders know that they cannot tell Trump or anyone in the US government anything that they do not want Putin to know. We have no idea how actually close Iran is to having a nuke, and Tulsi Gabard's agency can't find out. She's relying on information that is at least 6 months, if not years, old.

Second, Iran is a Russian ally.

Third, everyone knows that if the shit really hits the Israeli fan, the US will come to their aid. Our evangelicals will see to that; end days and all.

Fourth, when Trump cancelled Obama's Iranian nuclear deal, he spoke to Iran's leaders very clearly: we will not honor any commitment they make to us or the rest of the world. He tossed any hope we ever had of peacefully containing Iran in the trash (with the rest of our once-dearly-held American values).

Finally, there have been reports in just the last few days that China has been secretly supplying Iran with material necessary to build and/or power rockets (while we focus on their nuclear capabilities; classic misdirection), specifically the long-range rockets they'll need to deliver a non-nuclear crippling blow to Israel. There is a reason Netanyahu became so alarmed in the last few weeks that despite fighting Hamas on two fronts, he had to bomb Iran.

Now, what we don't know: Xi is playing three-dimensional chess while Trump fiddles with his checkerboard pieces trying to figure out how to play the game. So, Iran strikes Israel drawing the US into a broader middle eastern war, occupying all of Trump's time. Meanwhile, Israel strikes back at Russian ally Iran, occupying what's left of Putin's time and resources already stretched thin by his invasion and subsequent war with Ukraine. So for the cost of a little materiel and small risk of exposure, Xi will have his major opponents basically face their existential crisis in both their homes. Russia will collapse. The US military will be drawn into a raging conflict in a region of the world in which we have consistently and repeatedly not just lost, but had our asses handed to us again and again. The American appetite for war, with everything going on domestically, will not sustain a long, drawn out and expensive effort to protect Israel, particularly given that half the country wants to abandon Israel and the other half wants to see Israel's Jews served as canon fodder to God. All it will take is a skirmish somewhere in MAGAland and we'll be in a civil war fighting ourselves. We're effectively out of the picture.

And China emerges as the sole leader of the world as the only superpower left standing. And [italic]they[/italic] didn't have to fire a single shot.

I'm sure there are a million holes to poke in my theory, and I hope I'm wrong. But just in the last 72 hours, China ordered every Chinese person out of Israel, and did it in a hurry as we all watched Trump torch LA and then put on his miserable dog-and-pony show. And now Trump has to rush back to the WH telling reporters he can't manage the situation remotely (despite the storied history of the flying fortress-cum-White House we call Air Force 1), only coming home to issue dire evacuation warnings to Tehran and post on Truth Salad in all caps; all things he could have done anywhere he had an internet connection, so the idea that he had to be in the WH is merely... cover.

I'm so very excited to find national policy and presidential pronouncements being made on social media, especially on a small platform owned by said president. SMH, he is an ignorant carnival barker not in the league of these international dictators. When are his puppet- masters going to bench his foul ass??

Trump is always at his most threatening right before he retreats.

[quote] : Xi is playing three-dimensional chess while Trump fiddles with his checkerboard pieces trying to figure out how to play the game

Wrong! He’s not trying to figure anything out. He thinks he is an expert player. He’ll just wing it.

We are all going to die.

[quote] In a second post moments later, he added another two-word demand: “UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER!”

This was seen in the skies over Tehran, earlier today.

[quote] But just in the last 72 hours, China ordered every Chinese person out of Israel

Link, please.

Thank God Tulsi Gabbard is in charge of National Intelligence.

R52, China is evacuating its citizens from Israel and Iran. Several other countries have advised their citizens to leave.

Thanks, R54.

Welp, I guess that's it.

We haven't had a serious Middle East crisis like this, in decades.

Naturally, it would be under Trump's watch.

I don't think this will end well.

Oh goodie. Another Middle East war. What could possibly go wrong?

[quote]China is evacuating its citizens from Israel and Iran. Several other countries have advised their citizens to leave.

And they ran. They ran so far away.

How will our pockmarked Hawaiian orchid going to justify this to her boss Putin?

[quote] In a second post moments later, he added another two-word demand: “UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER!”

R28 Mary Trump has stated that you can tell which posts were written by Trump (as opposed to a staff member trying to imitate him) by Trump’s use of ALL CAPITALS.

[quote] Thank you for your attention to this matter!

The first post was probably not written by Trump, because “Thank you for your attention to this matter” is too weak an ending for Trump.

That may be why Trump quickly posted “UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER!” the way he thinks a strongman should write.

R55, any conflict involving Pete Hegseth couldn't possibly go wrong, don't be absurd!

Sorry but Israel is a bunch of motherfuckers. They think “one Israeli life = 10,000 others”. I mean, the always act like the victims but they’ve been stoking this conflict for decades. They think they’re resolving something here but this is going to be decades worth of terror attacks.

And there couldn’t be a better time for an Iranian sleeper cell in the States with all the idiots in charge there.

This is terrible. And the problem was already contained before Trump first took office. This is another one of his messes. He’s caused this.

^^ Although the same could be said of the U.S., re: 9/11 and the 100s of 1,000s of civilians that were killed in Iraq

[QUOTE]"Iran claims they hit a Mossad base in Israel. That's OK, all of us are in Iran.

This joke was posted on the other thread. It's really stunning how well Mossad has infiltrated Iran. Almost at will. It's the Mossad's playground alright.

I guess someone got accidentally included on a Signal chat.

I'm sure this war and the one in Gaza will end all the conflict....

I feel awful for hoping we attack Iran but I do. Only to shove it up the asses of the morons who voted for Trump because they thought he'd keep us out of war.

It will definitely soften his support in general.

To be honest, if I could press a button and stop it, I would. But the political hit he will take for it is a great consolation.

I'm afraid this military intervention will be a success and Trump will get the credit.

Trump is killing time until the USS Nimitz arrives to the Middle East. Which should be in the next day or two.

[quote]It will definitely soften his support in general.

Which doesn't matter one bit since he's not running for reelection. He can do whatever he wants, free as a bird. He's more interested in his legacy now, and getting rid of an almost 50-year-old vile regime would be up there, as legacies go.

[quote] I'm afraid this military intervention will be a success and Trump will get the credit.

R67 Trump won’t “get” the credit—he will TAKE the credit. He’s a “Taker.” The only thing he’s the king of is the “Takers”

Exactly. Germany's chancellor just said Israel is doing the dirty work for all of us with this operation. Trump won't be anywhere near as gracious, he'll take all the credit.

Who tf cares what you want, you degenerate p.o.s.?

Economist/YouGov poll today: 16% of Americans think US should get involved in Israel/Iraq; 60% think we shouldn't.

It's possible things could turn out for the best, but if they don't, Trump will be in major trouble politically.

correction: Israel/Iran

Gays on DL suffering from total trump derangement syndrome. Most of you will be killed under the Iranian regime, but here I am reading all the comments, so anti-Trump it is so unnerving. What has happened mentally to white gay men?

[quote]Trump will be in major trouble politically.

Explain to me how, please. He's already a president on his second term, plus he couldn't give less of a shit how much he complicates the next GOP nominee's chances in 2028.

r74 We all hate Trump, but some of these fuckers take it to the extreme and start stanning fucking Iran – a horrible regime that terrorises its own people, never mind its gays. Honestly, I think antisemitism is the only thing that explains these insane mental contortions.

I just watched a YouTube on bunker buster bombs. Fascinating! They can penetrate over 200 feet or the depth equivalent to a 20 story building through reinforced concrete. I just wonder if some of those bombs are currently in-route to the Middle East.

How to explain the world to utter morons like R74?

From Deutsche Welle (German Wave) Center-Left German International News

'Mixed feelings' in Iran — journalist Gilda Sahebi People in Iran are mostly scared, fearing for their lives, says German-Iranian journalist Gilda Sahebi.

They may be hoping that this may be the end of the regime, but although the regime is obviously weak, it is still as repressive as ever.

The Iranian people have already proved that that they are capable of successfully executing a revolution, so there’s no excuse for them now if they do actually hate the regime.

R75: when he becomes a true political liability for Republicans, they can declare him unfit. Most he could do is appeal to Congress to re-instate him. He's in a pissing contest with MTG right now!

R74 Go fuck yourself, idiot. I do not live in Iran. What Iran does is none of my fucking business. I certainly don't want Americans dying for Iran.

Did you really learn nothing from our ridiculous, shameful adventure in Iraq? Dummy.

Republicans have had endless opportunities to get rid of him, and they never have. And they never will.

R76 yeah, you're a fucking moron.

I suspect Reza Pahlavi will fill the vacuum temporarily after the fall of the current regime. He has support in the Iranian diaspora, and more importantly, increasing support in Iran. He has become especially popular with the young people. He certainly will not be bringing back the Pahlavi dynasty (for one thing, he has no sons or living brothers), but he can be a stabilizing influence during the transition.

I'll try the link again.

A constitutional monarchy would serve Iran well.

Donald the Dove, Hillary the Hawk

R87 I don't think the idea is having a new monarchy in place. There is really no good path forward with that. The crown prince's closest male relative is a cousin in his mid-60s living in Switzerland who has no interest in the crown. He would just fill a temporary void that is always a danger in the aftermath of a regime falling (look what happened there in 1979). He's recognized face there and enjoys some popularity both inside Iran and out.

↑ His cousin (Patrick) is in his mid-70s (typo). He would be next in line of succession. His own sons are 1/4 Iranian and I doubt they have any interest in becoming a shah either.

The idea that the Iranians would let anyone from the "royal family" back into the country, much less near a position of authority, sounds insane.

[quote] What has happened mentally to white gay men?

Our MAGA troll bullshit detector got better.

Since the monarchy would be starting anew, they could and should allow succession through female lines. Having a monarch in Iran would be worth it.

trump’s calling him "kooky tucker carlson."

and marje’s backing the kook

It's ww3

I think Putin made a statement

Starmer's rowed back from his statement he was certain America isn't getting involved, is chairing an emergency defence meeting, and the UK has started withdrawing non essential staff from the Israeli embassy. All which makes me think the UK government has come to the conclusion America is more likely than not joining in.

All I'm seeing is that Putin is scheduled to take questions from journalists. Putin/Russia is the one thing I'm NOT worried about with regard to Iran/Israel. The only action he might take is to offer...again...to meditate between his friends in Iran and his friend Netanyahu. Neither will take him up on it.

An interesting article from the Wall Street Journal: the U.S. has about 20 of the ultra-powerful bombs being discussed; there are two sites, not one, that would need to be hit and they would require at least 6 bombs a piece. And radiation? It's possible that that could be an issue.

r99 From the cited article:

"[O]ther nuclear experts say the radiation risks of an attack on Fordow are low. The International Atomic Energy Agency reported radiological and chemical contamination inside Natanz, which was bombed Friday, but normal radiation outside. If anything were to be dropped on Fordow, there is not a risk of radiation contamination from the attack outside of the site,” said Scott Roecker, vice president for nuclear materials security at the Nuclear Threat Initiative think tank."

R100, yes, I’m aware of that. “Low” does not mean risk-free. Obviously, there will be onsite contamination at the very least. It’s never desirable.

They were probably so glad to see the back of him so they can get some work done.

Carney winks at Macron as Trump blathers on. Macron struggles not to laugh. And the cameras are there for it.

Hilarious r102

Could Iran just get a bomb from Pakistan.I was really hoping to live my life without witnessing WW3

No, Pakistan isn't giving Iran a nuke, for a hundred different reasons. Iran has its proxies and its enablers in the Security Council, but it has no friends or allies.

r104 You know India and Pakistan nearly went to war earlier this year right? Pakistan isn't sending its "Death to Hindus" arsenal anywhere right now.

Trump killing time until USS Nimitz arrives. Three or four days away.

Serial killer Aileen Wuornos predicted the U.S. would get nuked by Iraq in 2019. Maybe her prediction was off, and she meant Iran in 2025?

Trump's full remarks.

[quote]Two very simple words, unconditional surrender. That means I've had it. Okay, I've had it, I give up, no more, you know, they had bad intentions. You know, the three for 40 years they've been saying death to America, death to Israel, that to anybody else that they didn't like. They were bullies. They were schoolyard bullies. And now they're not bullies anymore. But we'll see what happens. Look, nothing's finished until it's finished. You know, war is very complex. A lot of bad things can happen. A lot of terrorism. And so, I don't know, I wouldn't say that we won anything yet. I would say that, we sure as hell made a lot of progress. We’ll see, the next week is going to be very big, maybe less than a week, maybe less. But is there anyone here who said it would be okay to have a hostile, zealots really, to have a hostile country have a nuclear weapons that could destroy 25 miles, but much more than that. Could destroy other nations just by the breeze blowing the dust. You know that dusts blows to other nations and they get decimated. This is just not a threat you can have, and we’ve been threatened by Iran for many years. If you go back and look at my history, if you go back 15 years, I was saying we cannot let Iran get a nuclear weapon. I’ve been saying it for a long time, I mean it more now than I’ve ever meant it.

[quote]Trump's full remarks

Words that no business EVER being together in the English language.

No dignified press conferences. Just sound bites getting on planes or into cars. Or tweets.

[quote]They were bullies. They were schoolyard bullies. And now they're not bullies anymore.

How fascinating if that speaker's karmic overview was somehow visited closer to home.

Imagine all the hot OF content we'd get if Iran was liberalised, Iranians have some stunning guys. And there's like 90 million of them, so lots to choose from.

Honestly, I feel the same way about Cuba.

R74 Trump Derangement Syndrome is at a peak currently. Reading the Anton Yelchin thread and seeing people actually hoping his parents are suffering because they *might* be Trump supporters was a new low for DL.

Shameful behavior.

It's the hyper-partisan atmosphere, R74.

[quote]What has happened mentally to white gay men?

They are concerned about their safety in terms of being drafted to go to the ME to die in a fruitless war, perhaps? Or their sons, brothers, nephews or neighbors. (and daughters, nieces, etc).

Remember the quagmire in Iraq and the "weapons of mass destruction". Oh yeah that's right.

No American boots will hit the ground for at least another generation, after Iraq and Afghanistan there is no appetite for that even on the right.

He can stop pretending he is not colluding with Israel to bring Iran to its knees. The cat is out of the colostomy bag.

But I wonder what his 'deal' with Bibibop was? We help relocate the Palestinian 'refugees' to other countries? Turd gets to build casinos there?

[quote]N12 News: Israeli officials say the question is not if America will join Israel, but when. Two critical days ahead.

[Quote] Gays on DL suffering from total trump derangement syndrome. Most of you will be killed under the Iranian regime, but here I am reading all the comments, so anti-Trump it is so unnerving. What has happened mentally to white gay men?

Right wing Israelis, who currently run the country, want us dead too. We shouldn’t get involved in anything in the Middle East

Trump is giving all his MAGA followers the middle finger.

He chose Israel over them

Iran has a huge standing army. They’re not just going to roll over.

TACO is a suitable term for now

R104, no, Pakistan wants to get back on good terms with the U.S. and would prefer to be off the radar.

Pakistan is deeply concerned about the Balochis, on their western border, rising up and giving them trouble if Iran is destabilized. They will want assistance in quelling and controlling them, in the event of a regime change.

Why does that orange dumpster fire always refer to everything as “ a deal”? So sick of his scammer toddler vocabulary.

Tulsi, you in danger gurl!

“Next week is going to be big,” Trump said. He’s so excited about the idea of triggering a global conflagration. He must feel like he’s the most important person who has ever lived. If he had only known it was this great he’d have gotten into this war thing a lot sooner.

Hey listen if mvslims want to live in islamic dictatorships, allah love 'em, but they absolutely should not have nukes. The pakistani nukes need to be taken out next.

The only tiny silver lining I see in all this is that Putin appears to have lost some control over the Frankenstein monster he installed.

R130: Putin wanted Trump because he and Clinton loathe each other. By 2020, I believe Putin was sick of dealing with don't Trump regularly. He probably started pre-ghosting (so to speak) senile, ranting 2025 Trump.

Trump is either in collusion with Israel or with Russia--but he cannot be in collusion with both at the same time right now, as the two countries are mortal enemies and have been so since the 70s.

The USSR is solely responsible for strategizing and funding pan-arabism and particularly for scheming up the idea of cloaking deeply far-right religious fascism in the trappings of leftism/socialism to get the useful idiots on board. All of the incredibly successful propaganda campaigns that have come out of Iran (including making "the west" synonymous with Israel) and been recycled via each of their proxies is old-school Soviet antisemitism 101 and it's never not worked, all the way from 1979 until now.

So regardless of what Trump might be publicly saying, he can only practically be looking out for Russia or Israel when it comes to this war, as they both have completely different best interests. I think he's getting a kick out of thrusting himself into the spotlight of this war and getting to play strongman, but he has a LOT more to lose by pissing off Russia than he does Israel. He can't afford to lose Putin's loyalties or he'd be done for.

His beloved daughter and her children are Orthodox Jews. Russia supposedly mocked his "parade".

[quote]Trump is either in collusion with Israel or with Russia--but he cannot be in collusion with both at the same time right now, as the two countries are mortal enemies and have been so since the 70s.

"Russian-Israeli ties quickly warmed after the collapse of the Soviet Union and have remained strong.

Putin has maintained warm, personal ties with Netanyahu, who frequently traveled to Russia before the war in Ukraine.

Russia and Israel have built a close political, economic and cultural relationship that helped them tackle delicate and divisive issues, including developments in Syria. It survived a tough test in 2018, when a Russian military reconnaissance aircraft was shot down by Syrian forces responding to an Israeli airstrike, killing all 15 people aboard.

Even though Russia supplied Iran with sophisticated S-300 air defense missile systems, which Israel said were taken out during its strikes last year on Iran, Moscow has dragged its feet on deliveries of other weapons in an apparent response to Israeli worries. In particular, Russia has delayed providing advanced Su-35 fighter jets that Iran wants so it can upgrade its aging fleet."

Russia maintains close ties with Hamas and has funded anti-western organizations in the Middle East for years. Yes, things have improved slightly and Putin may be trying to play both sides with Netanyahu, whom he may like, but it’s a stretch to say Russia has a close relationship with Israel. Hamas uses Russian weapons and the Wagner group has trained their military members. That doesn’t sound too close to me.

Same, r126. He thinks international politics is all about, and only about, flexing your muscles at a negotiating table and making the other guy eat shit, just the way he's done business his whole life.

R134 That take and that article cannot be any more bunk. Smells like it walked straight off the Putin propaganda factory floor. Russia and Israel have been in an ice-cold war since the late 60s when Israel chose to nestle itself under the wing of the US over Russia.

[quote] At this point, after that flop of an ego-stroking parade and the massive protests on the same day, no one cares or is listening to anything Trump says or types out except the hardcore MAGA. He's done and dusted and now the rest of us are just waiting for cholesterol to do its job.

This is seriously delusional. Is Trump still the president of the United States? If so, then he's not "done" or "dusted." He's still in a position of power and influence for at least four more years. Not to mention his cabinet of clowns that he brought to the white house who also still have positions of power that they shouldn't be in. It's just lazy to think ONE protest is enough to force Maga to roll over and play dead. They're still trying to justify the assassination of Melissa Hortman, which happened on the same day as the protest. It's too soon to put the artillery away. There's more work to do.

R135, there’s never been confirmed Hamas ties to Russia or the Wagner Group. Hamas actually used a lot of Israeli weapons.

Putin's relationship with Israel and Iran

Are you kidding r139?

“Russian-made weapons had found their way to Hamas for years. In May 2021, senior Hamas leader Osama Hamdan gave an interview to Russia’s investigative Novaya Gazeta.

“In response to a question, “Where did Hamas get such a large number of Russian-made rockets used to attack Israel?” he said, “I think the Russian people should be proud they gave the oppressed peoples of the world weapons with which they can defend themselves. These weapons were sent to our region in the 60s and 70s.”

“Putin’s Russia, for its part, at the very least, provided material support to Hamas. According to a 13 October Wall Street Journal report, Hamas-linked terrorist groups found ways to circumvent Western sanctions by utilising Russia’s cryptocurrency exchanges.

Russia may be trying to play both sides, but they have long supported Hamas, and continue to do so.

I find it hard to believe that Israel doesn't have a B-52 or that huge ass plane to carry that bunker buster bomb?

R141, Ukrainian organizations and groups like the Washington Institute (which is AIPAC affiliated) make these claims, but I would want to see other, less agenda- focused reporting on this. The NY Times, for example, has done some detailed reporting on Hamas’s weapons sourcing and that stressed that their bomb materials and many of their guns did, indeed, come from Israel.

R143 If it's a pro-Israel/pro-Ukraine organization, wouldn't they be the most believable source for their true feelings about Russia?

While Hamas does steal and smuggle weapons from Israel, most of their weapons come from Iran.

Oh that's right, R143, we should only seek out dedicated anti-Israel sources (that have repeatedly published demonstrable falsehoods on the word of Hamas) to tell us whether or not we should trust Russia regarding the Wagner group. The fact that a pro-Ukraine organization is suspect to you reveals your true tankie motivation.

After all here years of fighting I hope this will be the end of the orange turd-drop dead mother/daughter fucker!