Buffy Sainte-Marie's Order of Canada terminated by Governor General

What brand of bronzer is she using? Asking for a friend...

She really played that grift for a longgggggg time. I can remember babysitting my niece in the mid 70's and seeing her on Sesame Street where she was warning the kids about fake Indians. Wow-that really came back to bite her in the a$$! They should also remind her Canadian citizenship as the application was based on all her bullsihit.

Sorry...that SHOULD read ^ recind her citizenship^

R1, she’s Italian. The color is natural.

She is a lying narcissistic grifter cunt. She literally lied about her brother sexually abusing her as retaliation for attempting to expose her years ago

Good grief that face.

[QUOTE]I can remember babysitting my niece in the mid 70's and seeing her on Sesame Street where she was warning the kids about fake Indians.

Why would kids need to be wary about fake Indians?

I beleive her.

*believe

And she'll reel, and she'll fall and she'll die on co'dine.

Born in Stoneham, Massachusetts.

what a sad story. Canada needed to take away the honour. Mental illness is sad but the final issue is nobody likes a completely fake bitch. The chutzpah! And I bought into it. She suckered millions of people.

I believe her, too.

I don't know. r7. Maybe a Freudian slip but it sure seems ironic now.

[quote] Mental illness is sad

In the documentary there was nothing to suggest she was mentally ill. She seemed to have adopted the schtick as some sort of cachet when she began performing.

She was highly manipulative with her own family in order to keep her secret, though, if that’s what you mean.

Zoom in on the face and yell, “Snap out of it!”

R15, narcissism or histrionism are personality disorders. Buffy stole an identity and the suffering and valour associated with that identity to fabricate her personal AND creative production, and maintained the grift for decades at great cost to others, to profit herself. She is mentally ill.

R17. Gotcha. Thought you may have meant that she had identity delusions.

I believe it is possible she somewhat became deluded by her grift, too. Why did she maintain it in private life? People with NPD do not always know they have a false sense of self. I am not a psychologist. I am just saying this is a sad story of a sick and dishonest person.

She used to want to be a ballerina.

I am used to being disappointed by celebrities, but this one was particularly hard. My parents had all her albums, and as a 1970's kid, I loved her so much on Sesame Street. Why, Buffy, why???

She sho is ugly!

She looks like she’s got a lot of orange looking makeup/bronzer on here.

We have an opening in Cabinet!

Growing up at our cottage in Ontario, we had a few books by Grey Owl.

I was scandalized years later when I learned he wasn't really First Nations.

[quote]We have an opening in Cabinet!

And bring your bronzer, we can share!

Why do these liberal cunts feel the need to be fake Native Americans ?

I have no idea what happened to her nose. She used to have a normal, small one.

Guess it grew with all the lies.

This really sucks. I didn’t become a fan until the mid-90s but that’s 30 years now. The depth of her deceit is something.

Like others have said, this could have been a gimmick she started in the early 60s to distinguish her from all the other female folksingers. Nothing cooler than watching a Native American singer perform In the Village! But it snowballed.

I read a quote that is purportedly from her son, Cody, where he’d say the sheets she slept on would turn orange.

Oddly, this rates *very* low on the things that are concerning me right now.

Beverly Santamaria from suburban Massachusetts didn’t have one drop of Native ancestry… but she sure loved to cosplay.

A cautionary tale for Hilaria.

Her high school yearbook photo, sans face bronzer.

She was born in Stoneham, Massachusetts home of the Stone Zoo where the Christmas Moose was a docent.

The yearbook entry at r33 already shows a schism of identity. She was a member of the Future Teachers Association, but her goal was to become an airline stewardess.

Well, which is it, Buffy?

WHICH IS IT???

I’d forgotten all about this.

[quote]I’d forgotten all about this.

How could you forget, r36, this is worse than Gaza!

Fuck this bitch - I hope she's booed everywhere she goes. Rumors and statements from family saying that she's not Indigenous have been around for 60 years - so she was probably ruthless with the potential lawsuits and intimidating anyone who said differently. God - her whole high school class kept their mouths shut too?

And no - I don't care if she's done 'a lot' for native American communities - that was a grift for PR and to distract attention away from her true identity. It was a cover-up move.

What I don't understand is that there were plenty of young women folk singers who did become famous in their own right in the 60s and 70s - why lean in on this lie?

Although not as egregious, it reminds me of John Leguizamo claiming he was half Puerto Rican for decades, when he knew full well he wasn't. Now he has amnesia about it - but both his parents were from middle-class Colombian immigrants and he was raised in a Little Colombia neighborhood in Queens. He keeps saying he was from a PR neighborhood - but even that's a lie. And then he claims his artistic and theater roots came from just him, when he knows full well his father was an aspiring film director and studied at Cinevitta Italian studios in the early 60s.

John even lies about his age - saying he was born in 1964 and then on Finding Your Roots, it showed he was born in 1960. Then all of a sudden his online age was corrected.

Film is life.

[quote]Fuck this bitch - I hope she's booed everywhere she goes.

Get a life, r38.

Buffy Sainte-Marie TERMINATED

BOOOOO R40 - BOOOOO!

I respect her consistency and commitment. And much of her music.

But....

That high school photo tells it all — she's about as Native as a plate of linguini with clam sauce.

You’re not a dream, you’re not an angel, you’re not an Indian

She wove a false identity born of convenience, her chaos, a mirror of her own misalignment.

But I am not her lesson.

I release her with compassion, knowing the universe will bring her back to herself—while I walk in the clarity of my own truth.🌈🍄🪷

R43 what puzzles me is that her record label and manager or agent must have been in on it early... and been influential in convincing her to peddle her story.

her song Universal Soldier was a hit by the mid 60s, so her moneymaking potential with her song publishing had a bright future.

R46 - Cool, and God help you then.

Her uncle wrote a letter to a newspaper who did an article about her when she was starting out stating she wasn’t Native American. She said she was adopted and didn’t know when her birthdate was. Her son and sister took a DNA test and it showed she had no Native American blood and that she was a blood relation to Buffy’s son, who is Native American through his dad.

I suspect tanning with iodine and black hair dye have been a big part of her beauty regimen for many years.

Now that I know she’s not an Indian, I totally see Donatella.

Never trust an Indian named "Buffy."

She won an Oscar as a co-writer (with her husband) for the music 🎵 for Up Where We Belong from An Officer and a Gentleman. The lyrics were written by someone else.

The very first song on her debut album is “Now That the Buffalo’s Gone” about the breaking of Indian treaties by the US government.

My ex’s father used to talk about the time he saw Joan Baez sing in a small club in Western Massachusetts and she was “dressed like an Indian”. I asked if he meant Sainte-Marie and his eyes lit up and he says yes, it was her. Was probably when she was a student at UMASS/Amherst.

I was a bank teller in Springfield, Massachusetts and a customer who was Native American was a regular avg I told her I liked Saints-Marie and she told me they had been friends at UMASS. the two Indian girls.

She peddled the deception very early.

She adopted Indian culture and lived it and supported American Indian rights and causes with all the sincerity of someone born to it.

Unfortunately she presented herself literally that way and didn't explain her background. At the time it meant less. Now, of course, "appropriation" is cause for annihilation.

Should someone tell Beyonce and her fucking country Grammy? Of course not. Because only whites are seen as evil and demented.

R27 Same reason as to why Conservative assholes pretend to be devout Christians.

[QUOTE]he adopted Indian culture and lived it and supported American Indian rights and causes with all the sincerity of someone born to it.

Are we talking about JD and Usha Vance, correct?

Yeah that is NOT her natural color. No one in her family looks like that, nor did she when she was younger.

I hope Redbone are legit.

Do we terminate honors in the United States, ‘cause Rush Limbaugh is a definite blot.

Isn’t it strange Hilaria Baldwin and Buffy Saint Marie are from the Boston area lol.

I’m from outside of Boston too and I don’t think I’ve ever met or seen a Native American person in my life yet.

R54, a black person doing a country album is not the same thing as lying about your background for years. And blackmailing others into supporting that lie. Are you going to shit on white people who do rap or R&B? Or just continue to play the white victimhood card?

[quote]Isn’t it strange Hilaria Baldwin and Buffy Saint Marie are from the Boston area lol.

"I'm from — how you say? — Boston."

"You call it Boston. We call it maize."

Gasp.

She looks like Snooki’s nonna

Why can’t Buffy have a transracial identity if she wants one?

She looks superb

The thing is, she looks Native American. She doesn't look Italian. It's not just skin color. There was another case like it. A man Grey Wolf, also in Canada. He was supposedly pure English ethnically and came from there. He looks Indian. He doesn't look English & spent his life promoting conservation.

Many people with high cheekbones and a bit of angularity about themselves - like Italians - can plausibly “pass” as having some Native American stock.

Even a lot of African Americans used to talk about their Cherokee heritage (why is it always Cherokee?) lending them their bone structure when a great many native African people have those cheekbones.

Grey Owl does look English. We think of the English as ruddy cheeked, snub nosed sorts like Wayne Rooney but that is just one type. But think of Rupert Everett, Matthew Goode, Ben Cross, John Wood, David Bradley - and Belaney fits into that category.

There's a logic to it. Cherokees were the largest Native American group prior to colonization and they were in the southeast which eventually became slave holding states.

Who?

early 60s were a different time and place.

it is hard to properly put this into context.

R54 - I don’t know if you’re willfully stupid or just a racist asshole, but maybe trace country music’s historical roots and tell us what you find. Also explain to us why someone from Texas can’t do country… or do you think only white Texans should be able to?

Her older brother gave an interview in the '70s telling the truth. She wrote a letter threatening to say he molested her if he did it again.

She is an out and out sociopath.

R54 you are dumb.

Her accoutrements were funny. She had no one historically correct style of garb and jewelry. It was a mishmash of a whole lot of tribes. I really hated this story being true though. My father loved her.

R60 I knew a part native American kid and his mom back in the 60's in the area Buffy was from. Unless they were fronting, too.

R54 A person passing as a member of another race is not the same as being a black woman who sings country. Hahahaha.

The Iron Eyes Cody anti-pollution ad I remember seeing growing up.

born Espera Oscar de Corti, April 3, 1904 – January 4, 1999) [he] was an Italian-American actor. He portrayed Native Americans in Hollywood films,[2] famously as Chief Iron Eyes in Bob Hope's The Paleface (1948). He also played a Native American shedding a tear about litter in one of the country's most well-known television public service announcements, "Keep America Beautiful".[3] Living in Hollywood, he began to insist, even in his private life, that he was Native American, over time claiming membership in several different tribes. In 1996, Cody's half-sister said that he was of Italian ancestry, but he denied it.[3][4] After his death, it was revealed that he was of Sicilian parentage, and not Native American at all.

Amateur.

The real question is:

Was she HOLDING SPACE for indigenous people or snatching it?

&9 Yeah. Exactly the same thing.

R79^

It wasn’t even an interview r73. He was a commercial airline pilot and Buffy and a sesame street producer were on his flight. Buffy introduced them and the producer noticed how different they looked and contacted her brother and asked if they were Native American. He was truthful and said no, and that’s when the letter showed up.

One of her cousins was interviewed for the CBC program and his mother begged him not to speak to the show as she and other relatives were afraid of retaliation.

Buffy would cut a bitch.

No one tell r54 about Hootie.

[quote] He was a commercial airline pilot and Buffy and a sesame street producer were on his flight. Buffy introduced them and the producer noticed how different they looked and contacted her brother and asked if they were Native American.

Can someone explain why she and her brother looked so different? Like, he looked white, and she didn't? Why didn't she? Makeup? I'm a little confused.

R85 Or Charlie Pride.

Blowfish it out your ass, Hootie!

R85, what makes you think that Darius Rucker is in the same category as Beyonce? But then you post drunk/stoned so who knows what your comprehension is.

Black Hair dye and a deep tan R86, as well as bronzer/dark makeup as well.

What makes you shits think that Charley Pride (get it right if you're trying to play) and Darius Rucker are appropriating anything? There always have been blacks in country music. Beyonce is not a country singer. She parlayed her power into the genre and parodied the CW culture. Fine, but it's appropriation.

Can't see past your racism, apparently.

I mentioned Charlie/Charley Pride. I guess I misunderstood. Sorry. I was not saying he was appropriating anything. I was saying the opposite, i. e. why should there be anything wrong in him doing country music? It's not always easy to read every post in a thread and see the progression.

I don't like Beyonce and don't listen to her, or to country music, usually--so what she did or didn't appropriate I have no idea and couldn't care less.

We all got played by the Buffster!

Iron Eyes Cody in the commercial didn't look Italian or Sicilian. He looked Indian. Italians and Sicilians are generally proud to be that and are family oriented. Maybe they're reverse race faking us by making actual Native Americans into fake fakes?

Didja ever think of that?

She's ugly as fuck

R93 No, hon.

This is very amusing

“Datalounge - where all the MAGA racists gather for the latest, erm, Buffy Sainte Marie news…”

Side note on this “Black folks doing country music” tangent.

Most of us on here are getting old and disconnected from current pop culture. We might’ve had no clue what song was #1 on the US pop chart for 19 (repeat, Nineteen) weeks in 2024.

Take a look and take a listen.

I think it was mainly just a comment about Beyonce's having done country music and that it was inauthentic.

The knee jerk defense of her is so misguided. Pretending to be a different race, and exploiting it and making money off it IS NOTHING at ALL like an artist crossing genres. Such a bizarre comparison.

What she did to her brother is pure evil. This is a bad person.

I was a fan of hers. No longer.

I was looking at the CDC doc. Was it just me or did they make it hard to see pictures of her parents and sister,/s? Dark, grainy home movies moving quickly. Briefly there are grainy side by side photos of her parents who look just like her but I don't recall another image of her mother, who is an unusual looking person. Doesn't look "English" supposedly born in Danzig? How did Buffy pick up all the skills & knowledge she needed to do what she did so quickly?

“What is your tribal ancestry?” “ oh hunny I’m from Boston, I just do this to pay the bills…”

This is the first I've heard of Buffy in decades. Not a fan of her music but she seemed to enjoy it.

R97 Shut the fuck up, KGT. Get over yourself. 99% of DL HATES Trump and would give ANYTHING for him to drop dead. You're just a lousy unhinged ragebait troll and a very shitty one at that. Go back to stalking Harry Styles and wishing death on Niall and Louis.

R67, I legit thought Roseanne had some Native American blood during her high-cheekboned, skinnier face phase.

The Governor General of Canada, Mary Simon, is a Native Canadian, so I imagine she was very angry when she found out about Buffy's fraudulent deception.

I don't get outraged at someone pretending to be a different race. It's not a crime. We tend to look back on dead people who "passed" (as a different race, or gender) with bemusement. Of course in today's society when EVERYTHING seems to center on race, it's just the most indefensible, horrible thing. The outrage would be better spent on why native Americans are still treated like second-class citizens and so many live in poverty.

R80 - Holding Snatch…

She walked in borrowed feathers, speaking words not born from her blood; yet she danced in the sacred firelight, the breaking wind still carrying her prayers.🪶🌈🪷

“Wanting to be Indian” is very much a thing. Elizabeth Warren - blonde and blue eyed - checked off the “I’m a Native American” box on her law school application because something something family hearsay, and it dogged her decades later.

Even Tina Turner who looked part native with her high cheekbones, believed her family hearsay about being part Cherokee and part Navaho. There’s a photo of her mother or grandmother in Kurt Loder’s Tina biography from the 80s, dressed a bit native in fashion. But later in life Tina got the DNA testing results… Nope. Less than 1%.

R111 Breaking wind?

Being born in Massachusetts doesn't discount Native Ancestry. Many folks were born in New England to Native parents.

But not nearly as many as those who claim it. I grew up in Maine, being told that my grandparents were Indian... and so did many of us. I believed it until I got to college and started questioning everything. I did my family history and proved that we are 100% white.

Cody Christian is half Indian --his mother is Penobscot, from Maine. She grew up on a reservation.

[quote] Being born in Massachusetts doesn't discount Native Ancestry.

Why would it? The tribes of Massachusetts are well known, since the days of the Pilgrims.

She makes a mean buffalo ravioli.

Fraud in a jingle-dress!

R112 That's a lie.

In 1984,Warren contributed recipes to a Native American cookbook and identified herself as Cherokee.

It was a cookbook that twisted your caftan, luv.

A bad year for Canadian icons. Alice Munro covered up the abuse of her daughter in the hands of her second husband for decades.

R114 you didn't know any of your 4 grandparents? They were all dead before you were born?

My mom is from the deep South. She supposedly had some Cherokee blood. Our Ancestry and 23&Me results showed no Amerindian blood (no surprise there). It turns out we have western Sub-Saharan ancestry, though!! I wish my grandmother was still alive so I could tell her she came from a long line of house n*ggers! She is probably rolling in her grave.

Pretendians are an issue here in Vermont. The state of Vermont recognizes Abenaki bands, but the Quebec Abenaki say they can't prove indigenous blood. The federal Bureau of Indian Affairs don't recognize the Abenaki bands. It's a fucking mess with lots of accusations and people being outed as pretendians.

R120 Do you enjoy picking nits?

I went to school with a girl who often mentioned her parents told her she was the descendant of an "Indian Princess," and by "Indian" she meant Native American. She was lily white, and I suspect a lot of kids were told erroneous things like that, for whatever reason, especially back in the 70s and 80s, and likely before. Maybe it was a fad--something "fashionable" to say that was not based on reality, and then the story snowballed over time and just became part of the family "legend." It seemed to die out as "a thing" after the 80s.

Isn't Indian pudding big in Massachusetts? Maybe that's where she got her Cherokee-by-injection.

She’s an Ugly fraud

Fucking fake-ass bitch

UGLY

[quote]Beyonce is not a country singer.

Neither was Hootie for a long time.

Italian, so african-adjacent.

^^unfortunately some DLers live many decades in the past when it comes to who's "white" or not.

Oh, that is sad and very harsh. I think she is a good person, fundamentally. And her music meant a lot to Canadians.

[quote] Even Tina Turner who looked part native with her high cheekbones, believed her family hearsay about being part Cherokee and part Navaho. There’s a photo of her mother or grandmother in Kurt Loder’s Tina biography from the 80s, dressed a bit native in fashion. But later in life Tina got the DNA testing results… Nope. Less than 1%.

That’s exactly the thing. There is so much self-loathing in the African American community. Tina and the decades of abuse she experienced are a case in point.

It's so weird that people lied about being Indian because it wasn't safe to be one in the not so distant past. Even weirder for parents to lie to kids about it. Lying to get stuff . . . most people would feel really bad about lying about being Indian to get a college or law school scholarship. I'd think they would also be afraid there was some kind of system that would discover them.

In the early seventies, all of a sudden a lot of people were part Indian, often Cherokee. Before that whites were not trying to claim to be anything else. Names & noses got WASPIER, if anything. Goyish geneology is a mysterious thing. People on the ancestry shows don't know who their grandparents are. Indian ancestors suddenly appear in the seventies and disappear upon DNA testing.

Justice for Buffy!!

What's on her iPod?

R136, probably not her song “Native North American Child”.

[quote]What's on her iPod?

"Jingle Dress Rock"

"Stormy Feather"

"Hip to be Squaw"

I’m a Cherokee princess 🤡

My life since then has been from man to man/ But I can't run away from what I am

--Cher-okee

Tons of pretendians-there's a whole Wikipedia page about notable cases. Including Marlon Brando's Oscar acceptor Sacheen Littlefeather.

^^Oscar rejector. Not acceptor.

>>Being born in Massachusetts doesn't discount Native Ancestry.

[quote]Why would it? The tribes of Massachusetts are well known, since the days of the Pilgrims.

R115, if you read the thread, and the linked article, many are pointing to her being born in Mass as a discount to her claims of Native American Ancestry...

from the article....

[quote]The announcement comes more than a year after an investigation from CBC's The Fifth Estate reported that her claims of Indigenous ancestry were inconsistent with publicly available documents. The investigation, from Oct. 27, 2023, found Sainte-Marie's birth certificate, which says she was born in 1941 in Massachusetts.

R11, R31, R34, R60 - those posts all cast a light on Mass as something that seems to create fake Indians, insinuating that Massholes couldn't be at all.

Do you get it yet, Mr. Days of the Pilgrims? JFC

[quote]It's so weird that people lied about being Indian because it wasn't safe to be one in the not so distant past. Even weirder for parents to lie to kids about it. Lying to get stuff . . . most people would feel really bad about lying about being Indian to get a college or law school scholarship. I'd think they would also be afraid there was some kind of system that would discover them. In the early seventies, all of a sudden a lot of people were part Indian, often Cherokee. Before that whites were not trying to claim to be anything else. Names & noses got WASPIER, if anything. Goyish geneology is a mysterious thing. People on the ancestry shows don't know who their grandparents are. Indian ancestors suddenly appear in the seventies and disappear upon DNA testing.

Because one is VERY safe claiming to have some Indian blood, when they are truly white as snow. Exoticism is different than Bravery.

R124, I was told the same thing, and grew up in the 70s and 80s.

Apparently Sacheen Littlefeather is part Yaqui Indian, a tribe from Mexico? According to DNA? She looks it. Native Americans are distinctive looking and often blessed.

I remember when supposedly Johnny Depp had no Indian heritage. I don't believe that.

R134 One reason that people lie about having Native American ancestry is to cover up Sub Saharan African ancestry. I'm white as the driven snow however I'm part Congolese, Ghanaian and Angolan according to 23&Me. Both Ancestry and Family Tree DNA have me showing roughly the same percentage of the same areas of West Africa. Extrapolating out to my great-grandfather, his percentage of SSA ancestry would have been in the range of 20-25% (a "quadroon"). In the part of the South in which he lived, a racially ambiguous person of mixed white/Native ancestry had a much easier life than that of a mulatto.

R124 It might have been said by people whose ancestors had been here a while. All my grandparents were either European, or thier parents were, so I was never told anything like that.

(Although my grandfather's first wife was French Canadian and Canadian Native.)

For years my mother's family thought we were all of Native American descent through my great-grabdparents. Even though the surnames of my great-grandparents were Dutch and English respectively.

Two of my older first cousins used the Ancestry DNA kit which confirmed no Native American ancestry at all. When I took the 23andMe DNA kit and got my results back I had 12.3% Native American DNA. Through my father. He was Puerto Rican and his family were descended from Taino Indians.

“ That’s exactly the thing. There is so much self-loathing in the African American community. Tina and the decades of abuse she experienced are a case in point.”

It might be more complicated than just self loathing — I can imagine Black people like Tina (formerly Anna Mae Bullock) wanting to believe an ancestral origin story that contains Natives: free people who had even more of a right to be here than all the white people who wronged them.

“What tribe are you from?” “Sicily”

R148 you raise a good point. If a family knows they come from way back, it's kind of easy to wonder if you go back even further than the Colonials. From there is easy to just guess that out loud, and then the next generation remembers hearing that story, and then it becomes family lore eventually.

Reminds me of Carlos Castaneda and all those wise and philosophical books that were later dismissed as bullshit. People are still buying the scam...

[quote] I remember when supposedly Johnny Depp had no Indian heritage.

He doesn’t.

I wouldn’t be surprised if his brown eyes and cheekbones were the result of African-American ancestry.

He is from Kentucky, after all.

Isn't Depp one of those storied Melungeons?

I'm from Massachusetts. I'm a goddamned Pilgrim.

R153 Thank you. Of course you don't have to go back prior to the colonists to be at least part American Indian. It could have happened any time from that time forward.

Why don't you guys take 5 minutes and look at Wikipedia?

Depp is of primarily English descent, with some French, German, Irish and African American ancestry.[18][19] Elizabeth Key Grinstead, one of the first African Americans in the North American colonies to sue for her freedom and win, is an eighth great-grandmother.[19] His surname comes from a French Huguenot immigrant, Pierre Dieppe, who settled in Virginia around 1700. In interviews in 2002 and 2011, Depp claimed to have Native American ancestry, "I guess I have some Native American somewhere down the line. My great-grandmother was quite a bit of Native American. She grew up Cherokee or maybe Creek Indian. Makes sense in terms of coming from Kentucky, which is rife with Cherokee and Creek Indian."[20]

Depp's claims came under scrutiny when Indian Country Today wrote that Depp had never inquired about his heritage or been recognized as a member of the Cherokee Nation.[21] This led to criticism of Depp, from the Native American community, as Depp has no documented Native ancestry,[21] and Native community leaders consider him "a non-Indian"[21][22] and a pretendian.[23][24][25] Depp's choice to portray Tonto, a Native American character, in The Lone Ranger was criticized,[21][22] along with his choice to name his rock band "Tonto's Giant Nuts".[26][27][28][29] During the promotion for The Lone Ranger, Depp was formally adopted as an honorary son by LaDonna Harris, a member of the Comanche Nation, making him an honorary member of her family but not a member of any tribe.[30][31]

R147, back in the 70s and 80s, when white people were claiming American Indian ancestry the most, they didn't have DNA testing to show them if any had sub-Saharan ancestry. They weren't hiding something that they didn't even know about.

Who needs to cover up African-American ancestry at this point?

Johnny Depp looks more German to me than anything else. There are a lot of dark Germans.

I always thought he was hispanic.

Johnny Depp is a Neanderthal.

R160 I am assuming that my grandmother got American Indian lore from her father to explain away his racial ambiguity. She probably died believing it. Her father changed races when he changed states (census data) so he obviously knew the truth. He wouldn't have been able to marry my great-grandmother as a mulatto and would have been subject to Jim Crow laws.

159,

"that Depp had never inquired about his heritage or been recognized as a member of the Cherokee Nation."

He learned about it from his family. How do you know YOUR ancestry? Many people with a relatively small amount of Indian ancestry don't seem to formally register with that tribe, which happens to leave more resources for those that do.

We have a lot of merky ancestry here in New England.

Migrant workers came north to harvest cranberries. Many women of the Wampanoag nation had relationships with them.

Weaponizing this was a key factor in denying tribal rights to ancestral lands. Marthas' Vineyard being just one area in dispute.

Also, murky.

Native blood sometimes turns up (quietly) in New England with the influx of Quebecois.

this aired in 2023

liar liar feathers on fire

In recent years Buffy wore more bronzer than Trump.

I didn’t realize orange would look so bad on an Italian.

She looks much more ethnic than any of the First National representatives at the Vancouver Olympics, who could have starteda skin bleaching company, they were all so white.

She's so condescending to the children. Ugh.

I’d like to punch whoever keeps adding replies to this thread. She’s not now or ever been popular. She’s ugly as a dog’s asshole and I’m tired as hell of seeing her ugly pic here!

Maybe she can hook up with Hilaria and have a reality show.

Ugly as a dog’s asshole

R175 - 7:30 - "was it a real story about injuns or was it pretend? Because some stories are real and some are just pretend" - oh girl. Out of your own damn mouth!

R179 that exchange is extra ironic, considering the "pretendian" moniker she has been saddled with.

She's lied for her whole life. God, what a fraud.

The treatment of her own family when they pointed out Buffy was actually an Italian from Massachusetts is all you need to know about this witch.

Here's the Canadian investigative news show debunking Buffy's Native identity.

There were many photos of Buffy's brother and sister in the doc and they were both lily white with blond hair and blue eyes. Her niece and nephew were both interviewed and said their Aunt Buffy was full of shit.

I barely know anything about this lady, but back in her prime, it was actually pretty normal for one’s manager to create some sort of stage persona or schtick in order to promote some sort of distinction and have a career.

I mean look at her photos? Where’d she come up with a horse and the native Indian garb? I doubt she came across them in a local thrift store. 😂

Her image was probably manufactured and then she had to stick with it or lose her income.

She was so close to the Happy Hunting Ground. Maybe revert back to Catholic?

R185 sure but to threaten to lie that your own brother molested you to keep that secret is sick. She is a sociopath.

The documentary doesn’t come right out and say she lied about the molestation. The niece does and says it never happened but her father is dead. That’s a question that will probably never be answered.

Exactly R185, among all the folksingers on the scene at the time, one had to stand out. Imagine hearing that there was a Native American folksinger at Cafe Wha? It sold. That was one better than the half-Mexican Joan Baez!

She somehow looks like she got a reverse nose job if you look at the “Sesame Street” clip and then the current photo at the top of the thread.

R188 she's a well established liar. And, if it happened and she kept it a secret to use as leverage, that's even worse. She was allowing her brother to do it to others.

I don't buy it for a second.

She's scum.

R182 Well, when you're an Italian from Massachusetts, you have to do *something.*

Why do I get the feeling someone on this thread has fucked her?

No idea, r193. Why do you get the feeling someone on this thread has fucked her?

Besides winning an Oscar for “Up Where We Belong”, she wrote “Until It’s Time For You to Go” which was covered by Elvis, Barbra, and Roberta Flack, among others.

“The Universal Soldier” is still a good anti-war song.

My grandma stinks because she plays with her pussy all day long.

Meh if she feels like she's Indian why can't she be Indian? Who's to say trans race is not a form of tranny. Buffy you are now part of the Gnocchi tribe.

Leave her alone. She's doing a rain dance right now.

Yeah why is it A OK for a man to call himself a woman but very bad to say you are Native American when you are Italian American?

I don’t understand the difference .

I guess the main difference was she was deceiving people.

R199 because gender is a construct.

Amazing how she was able to carry on her con game for so many years.

This is like finding out Nana Mouskouri isn't really Greek!

Her pic looks like a dog’s asshole!!!

[quote]Sainte-Marie's new statement says the report "didn't interview anybody who knew me or my growing-up mother but instead constructed a false narrative and then asked people to comment on it." Sainte-Marie says her Cree family "adopted me forever and this will never change."

She'll never stop the cosplay.

Why was it okay for Estelle Getty to pretend she was an old Italian woman but it's not okay for Buffy to pretend she's a Native American?

The God-Squaw

Race is even more of a construct than gender r201. In 20 years generation delta will be cancelling each other over transracism and ecomisogyny.

R205 she's STILL lying. She claims not to know her parentage. She knows goddamned well she was born to white parents in MA.

Natives don’t believe in DNA. They simply accept you as one of them if you join them.

R210 except she spent 60 years lying about her biological parentage.

Do you also perpetuate the Patti Lupone thread? If so I’m here to tell you that you suck.

I don’t think gender is a construct.

The level of deceit she engaged in is pathological. She didn't just claim to be Native American, she went all in with all the cultural stuff, the wardrobe and jewelery and the made-up backstory and everything. Just totally insane behavior.

And she was so haughty about it, as seen on Sesame Street. I bet she's a terror to people in her personal life.

Of course the CBC talked to her family. And the Town Clerk in Stoneham, MA who has her birth certificate. "...some members of Sainte-Marie’s family believe her story is built on an elaborate fabrication.

“She wasn’t born in Canada.… She’s clearly born in the United States,” said Heidi St. Marie, daughter of Sainte-Marie’s older brother, Alan. “She’s clearly not Indigenous or Native American.”

That claim is supported by documents obtained by CBC, including Sainte-Marie’s Stoneham, Mass., birth certificate. The investigation also shows that her account of her ancestry has been a shifting narrative, full of inconsistencies and inaccuracies.

In a Sept. 18 email to CBC, Sainte-Marie’s Ontario-based lawyer, Josephine de Whytell, said: “At no point has Buffy Sainte-Marie personally misrepresented her ancestry or any details about her personal history to the public.”

Any perceived inconsistencies CBC has found in Sainte-Marie’s story, de Whytell said, “can be explained by the truth.”

Sainte-Marie declined CBC’s requests for an interview."

That’s the thing, R214. She went so whole hog into this identity that I think maybe she believes it somewhat.

And nobody is concerned that she whipped out her tits on “Sesame Street”?

Buffy was kind of an avant-gardist and I always felt it was the edginess of a rather dull intellect but creative person.

I'm imagining some type of spectacular superstar singing trio (a la Dolly and Linda and Emmyloohoo), but awful.

Joan Baez, Judy Collins and Carly Simon would be interesting, but now I want Buffy Sainte-Marie, Yoko Ono and Wing.

She sang a song entitled “Moonshot” that is beautiful and sad. And I still can’t get over the fact that she made up her entire persona.

Sometimes integrity is really just styling and accessories.

It's just been announced that the Juno's...Canada's version of the Grammies-that were awarded to Buffy are being taken back. This only seems right as she won some of them specifically for the Category of Indigenous Artist . An Inuit singer that lost to the Buffster later committed suicide. I'm not saying that was the cause but it couldn't have helped and likely more collateral damage to this sociopaths 60 year grift.

Fuck you, Buffy Sainte-Marie, you whore, you bitch, eat my puff you fucking cunt.

Her Indian pizzas must outstanding.

From accounts on Reddit it seems anyone who was told a family member was “a full-blooded Indian” or an “Indian princess” as above, they get zip.

I do believe that some people did have American indigenous ancestors but it’s too long ago to show more than 1%

Sorry, OP, I have to block you only to prevent seeing this photo again. She became the ugliest woman ever.

Her Juno AND Polaris awards were revoked.

Damn.

What’s next?

She is completely and totally done. All published accounts of her life will be written with this ending. I suppose she will die quietly.

Someone has to play devil's advocate: it was a different time. Remember when Cher was native American for a while, and Yma Sumac was a secret Aztek princess, .. or maybe Littlefeather et al are just a symptom of the next iteration of a movements like orientalism. That she won the prizes and acknowledgements that real native Americans did not says something about the system that gives those awards. Rescinding the reward won't remedy the problem. She told everyone what they wanted to hear to feel better. Of course there are people for who have an oppression fetish. There was a non Jewish woman a couple of years ago who claimed to be the descendant of holocaust survivors. She had been an important person in the Jewish community for a long time - and it was just bullshit. (Try auto translate; there is no English article on Wikipedia.)

[quote] Natives don’t believe in DNA. They simply accept you as one of them if you join them.

Incorrect. I know of no Tribe that accepts you on their official membership roll based upon this criterion.

[quote]"Being an 'Indian' has little to do with sperm tracking and colonial record keeping: it has to do with community, culture, knowledge, teachings, who claims you, who you love, who loves you and who's your family," said Sainte-Marie, in a written statement to The Canadian Press.

Substitute 'Indian' with 'African American' or 'Latino' and guaranteed Sunny Hostin will rip you up one side and tear you down the other. Not happening on her watch.

^^Who?

An Italian chick from Massachusetts. Played an elaborate con game for 60 years. Crazy shit.

Remember when Cher was native American for a while, and Yma Sumac was a secret Aztek princess.

And then Cher dropped it and moved on. Cher never made an effort about it, to my recall. Everyone was aware of Yma Sumac's shtick. Except dumbasses I suppose.

I'm a Native American, officially recognized on the membership roll maintained by my tribe.

Cher perfected performative faux heritage as a marketing gimmick. She was spectacularly successful at it- "Half-Breed" and her calculated fashion and image back in the 60s and 70s are proof of that.

To be fair to Cher, I know of no instance of her expressing herself to be a Native American. Then, she finally got around to saying she was Armenian - American.

I'll say this about my decades-long reaction to Buffy Sainte-Marie.

Initially, I was shocked when her deceptive acts were disclosed. But then, in reflecting back I realized that I always had a vague sense that something wasn't meeting the eye and ear when it came to her claimed heritage.

But I too, without digging further, dismissed my doubts because I accepted and relied upon what the Canadian Cree SEEMED to be doing. That is, claiming her as one of them.

I've been observing and reading about famous people for decades, ever since my childhood best friend's mom used to leave her Photoplay Magazine on the coffee table.

I'm jaded now. Even the NY Times is in on the game what with that piece about Blake Lively being the victim of a social media ambush by Justin Baldoni.

I don't take a side in the Baldoni Lively Rumble. I just have critical thinking skills when it comes to celebrity coverage.

But this whole BS-M thing has really been unsettling, in a rare way for me.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but according to Cher's memoir, she does have native American bloodlines via her mother's side (I believe she traced it back to her great-grandmother on her mother's side). I think she moved on from that identity after the 70s when she left Sonny.

I'll take your word for it, r237. I haven't read Cher's memoir.

There was an authorized biography of Sainte-Marie that came out a few years ago. The foreword was by none other than (authentically Canadian) Joni Mitchell. I’d love to hear her take on this.

I’ll wait for a real biography that sets the record straight over that one full of fiction.

Now she's been removed from the Canadian Music Hall of Fame. Good times.

[quote]She adopted Indian culture and lived it and supported American Indian rights and causes with all the sincerity of someone born to it.

Didn’t that Rachel D girl do a lot activism for the black community? Nobody suggested she should be praised for it since she was faking her identity.

[quote]Now, of course, "appropriation" is cause for annihilation.

If not that, threatening your own brother with false sex abuse charges and then writing a book with those charges after he’s dead seems pretty good cause.

Oh please. Stop defending her. She claimed for years to have been born in Canada. NOW she continues to LIE and claim she never said that. She absolutely did.

Also, her brother told the truth about her, and she threatened to tell the press he molested her.

She's a disgusting animal.

I notice now in new photo's she's seriously subdued her Indigenous look. She's still giving Trump a run for how money with massive amounter of spray-on tan, but gone for the most part are the beads, feathers and small bone necklaces.

there are new photos? I would have thought she is hiding.

236 Thank you for weighing in. I can totally understand the sentiment. I also find it weird and distasteful.

Her songs about Native American issues and mistreatment were pretty powerful. So I am still shocked.

Her song, “Bury My Heart At Wounded Knee”, was covered by the Indigo Girls. And she sings an absolute banger called “Starwalker” which you can see live on YouTube which appears to be with an indigenous band. Sad.

She went so full-on with the Native American stuff, it's crazy that she was actually an Italian chick from Massachusetts. To keep up that lie for SIXTY years, deceiving everybody! And threatening her own family if they spoke out. That's a whole other level of psychosis.

Is isn't "psychosis" unless she believes it. She does not. It is a personality disorder. She is a nasty cunt.

I don’t see the problem.

All italian nonnas can cook. I wonder how her eggpant is.

R244 Yeah, she's really in her "Italian" era. Rumor is that she'll walk for Donatella in the fall.

Strange thing is that she did more to highlight the Indian experience than any real Indian.

Nobody can take that achievement away from her! (And it sits in our stomach like industrial corn bred and school cafeteria succotash.)

Looks like an injun that's been thru the Apache wars.

Let's face it- someone beat her with the ugly stick... and they showed NO mercy!

One intriguing bit of singer-songwriter rivalry - Joni Mitchell showed her ass on the back cover (or maybe inner gatefold panel) of For The Roses in 1973. And not to be outdone, Buffy (then newly signed to MCA) showed one tit on the cover of her 1974 album, Buffy. They were tremendously competitive.

And let’s not forget her finest hour - performing her mammoth hit, Sweet Hooker Blues, on the Midnight Special