New Abraham Lincoln documentary suggests ex-president had secret, gay sex life: ‘Important missing piece of American history�

Murdoch NY Post links give SEO and clickdollars to people who hate gays.

Many men logged some time in his cabin.

It has always been quite obvious and wasn't even really hidden at the time

No self-respecting gay man would sport that no-mo beard style.

Dick pics or it didn't happen

Ole Abe was the Miss Lindsey of his day.

Well, that explains how he was able to resist this sweet ass and bangin' pussy.

Ulysses looks like he enjoyed the man up in the man.

Lincoln Lover

He probably did. I'm surprised they don't claim he was either trans, queer or nonbinary.

What nonsense!

Abrahan Lincoln was not what we would recognize today as gay.

It was common for men to share beds with other men. As a young man on the frontier, Lincoln shared a bed with male companions.

The evidence that he shared a bed and possibly sexual relations with another man as an adult man was during the Civil War. There is evidence that Lincoln slept in the same bed with his bodyguard when Mary and Tad were away visiting Robert at Harvard. The evidence is far from conclusive. A source claims that the bodyguard wore Lincoln's nightshirt. But this is only one incident and the source are gossipy and exaggerated.

Lincoln "slept with" his bodyguard is not the same as Walt Whitman "slept with" the men he brought home at night.

The evidence is fragmentary.

I knew it!

He also most famously slept with Joshua Speed in his early years in Springfield. But they were roommates and as BPC says, sharing beds was incredibly common and not "gay" as we know it.

I want someone to make a movie about Walt Whitman's years as a Civil War nurse.

THIS is why they hate us!

When Joshua Speed flooded Abe's guts with his hot seed in Springfield, it was incredibly common and not "gay" as we now might consider it.

R13, Walt liked to visit male hospital patients in the evening. One can only imagine how many eager young cocks he sucked off on a nightly basis.

I came here to post that exact sentiment, r4.

The facial hair was a bizarre look for him.

R13, read Whitman's "The Wound Dresser," and everything is there.

“Joshua Speed had spots as soft as May violets.”

-Abe

Bet he got alot of grateful BBC from former slaves too!

The item appears on PageSix, just as "Oh, Mary!" opens on Broadway (Great review in the NYT btw)? A play where you a very gay Abe lusting after his male aide with a very pert butt and pouty lips? How coincidental!

Why does this even matter-OUR DEMOCRACY’S GOIN DOWN THE TOILET.

John Wilkes Booth was a spurned lover!

Fascinating history. Simply fascinating!!!

Abey Baby was Americas 'largest' President.

^^^ heard it was like a baby apple holding an arm.

I thought this was already out there?

And Cleopatra was black…

r26 That doesn't even make sense.

More Larry Kramer revisionist crap.

“Important missing piece of American history”

No it ain’t.

I met a hot escort in NYC’s Chelsea district called “Wound Dresser!”

I’m pretty sure that bed smelled like a barnyard, and not in a good way.

It looks hot.

There, I said it.

R32 is he an associate of "Damaged Bottom" the porn actor?

They didn’t call Abe “Stovepipe” for nothing.

I still feel bad for the much- maligned Mary Todd. Abe Lincoln was well known to be gripped by previous depressions; their son died early devasting both Mary and Abraham, she as everyone else at the time faced the tumult of the Nation during the Civil War. And then if course her husband is horrifically assassinated right before her- she ended her life impoverished and forgotten by her contemporary.

I doubt that this will be boffo at the box office.

Miss Abraham, smelling cookies for DAYS!

Widow Mary Todd Lincoln got Congress to pay off her debt and then got a good pension, in addition to a cash payout, and eventually over 1.5 million from Lincoln's estate. She lived in Europe for years, though modestly. She was not "impoverished" though the liked to cry that she was.

R40, She also reconciled with her son Robert near the end of her life, even though he’d had her institutionalized.

Was Joshua Speed a bossy bottom?

No wonder Daniel never attempted to place his log inside MY cabin during the time we were filming!

This is not news, we already knew this.

R11 still riding your19th century hot air dirigible.

Major chemsex cock-hound, huge Buchanan supporter

[bold]Alok Vaid-Menon. [/bold]Historian? Fuck this.

The term “Log Cabin Republican” refers to a group within the Republican Party that advocates for LGBT+ rights. The name honors Abraham Lincoln, who was born in a log cabin and is considered the first Republican president1. Regarding the new documentary, it is titled “Lover of Men: The Untold History of Abraham Lincoln”. This film explores the theory that Lincoln had romantic relationships with men, using historical evidence such as letters and photographs23. The documentary aims to provide a broader understanding of Lincoln’s personal life and the social norms of his time2. It’s a fascinating topic that adds another layer to the complex legacy of one of America’s most iconic presidents.

Log Cabin Republican = Jews for Hitler

Zooey Zephyr?

Interesting that IMDB dropped a lot of names off the cast list. That's not an accident. They did that on purpose. Historian Alok? Seriously?

I don’t understand what trans would have to do with this. Gay men have nothing to do with them.

[quote] Dick pics or it didn't happen

Check out those fingers!

The first authenticated image of Abraham Lincoln, a daguerreotype photo of him as U.S. Congressman-elect in 1846, attributed to Nicholas H. Shepard.

Haunk

The part where the "historian" talked about Lincoln being transfeminine was a surprise.

r52 The trans just want attention and to be fawned over so they attach themselves to projects such as this like the lampreys they are. Particularly Vaid.

Are we to blame the lack of participation of any distinguished non-queer scholars (e.g. foremost Lincoln scholar David Herbert Donald, or, say, Jill Lepore) in that documentary on homophobia?

Zooey Zephyr is a cross-dressing eunuch from Montana. Sh/e and partner Erin Reed look inbred individually and incestuous together:

Apoogies: it appears that David Herbert Donald died in 2009. My sloppiness. But there are obviously other, noteworthy, alive Lincoln historians.

*Apologies

[quote]Widow Mary Todd Lincoln got Congress to pay off her debt and then got a good pension, in addition to a cash payout, and eventually over 1.5 million from Lincoln's estate.

Okay... that$1.5M is in today's dollars.

[quote]When it comes to the richest presidents, however, he doesn’t even break the top 10. Lincoln served from 1861 until his assassination in 1865, earning $25,000 a year. In “Personal Finances of Abraham Lincoln,” author Harry E. Pratt put the value of Lincoln’s estate at $85,000 in 1865, or $ 1,355,400.61 in today’s money.

Like Cockgobbler he'll come out now that his political career is over.

Yes today's money. Your point? My point was that Mary was not "impoverished".

And their son Robert was no dunce. He was working during her life, and later became rich with his Pullman company, and built this estate.

Untwist your panties, R62. I was taken aback by the $1.5M figure because (to my knowledge) Lincoln wasn't really a wealthy man. I mean... the Lincolns were well-off, but I'd say they were like upper middle class. Yep, it was Robert Lincoln that made a KILLING financially! Thanks for the link to his home. It's very much appreciated.

Yeah Abe was a circuit kween.

Not fragmentary at all R11. People remarked about it and since predecessor was a batchelor who shared a hotel room and bed with a Senator from Alabama for years, one must conclude antigay hate was not as prevalent in those days. Indeed, Lincoln hired folk like Walt Whitman, who was rather open about his loves. Why can't you be open to evidence and not a ZMcCarhtyite bigot out of your proper time?

The "fragmentary" evidence includes love letters to Joshua Speed.

This is hardly BREAKING news.

DL has been discussing this since the Lincoln-Douglas debates.

r22 is hysterical with fear, and only wants to talk about ONE topic right now!!

Someone has to DO something to assuage her fears!!

DO YOU HEAR ME??

Old closeted Oxford Dons and the ancient kweens who still believe them R11 still tow the same hilarious line. Back in olden days:

1. Men slept in the same bed to save money and stay warm because they couldn't afford blankets. 2. Men referred to each other as 'wife", "darling of my heart" "beloved" " my dream laddie" "beautiful thighs" "persimmon lips" all the time. Common florid expressions. Means nothing. 4. Male sexuality was not the same 1864 because: 3. Homosexuality was invented by Liberace in 1954.

.

Pathetic that gay men of a certain age R11 still have that self loathing.

It's not like they didn't have bundle boards, but there is no evidece Lincoln ever used one and Speed took him into his bed the very first night!

Maybe him and Mark Twain had some time together.

As an actual Lincoln scholar with 40 years of study on the topic I’m a bit annoyed that Alok is passing themselves off as some sort of expert in the subject. Do I think Lincoln was gay? No. Bisexual? Yes. But I don’t even think Alok is an historian, let alone a Lincoln scholar.

I still have no interest in being in this, the 8798th “documentary” discussing Lincoln. But I’m annoyed that Alok, who doesn’t even have a history undergrad degree is passing as an historian. Is that something you can just declare now? Like “hey! I’m an historian!”

Abraham Lincoln is NOT a fag... and I'm the dame who can prove it.

He is not a "Lincoln scholar" with 40 years of study. He's a bigot who straight washes Lincoln.

If anyone had read the first biography of Lincoln, written by Hay and Nicolay, close personal friends, they would have no doubt.

He was sexy in that Abraham Lincoln: Vampire Hunter movie

At least 4 relationships with men? THE SLUT!!!

[quote] At least 4 relationships with men?

What an extreme amateur!

Now, that makes sense (re R77) that Lincoln had the body of a pro-wrestler and/or bodybuilder, and that he was RIPPED! All of that hard farm labor that his daddy made him do had to have made him into a lean and mean fighting machine!

Don't forget, he was also a Melungeon, so he was a POC too! Abe was too much!

[quote]Don't forget, he was also a Melungeon

OH!!! Was he???

(CLAP!) (CLAP!) (CLAP!) (CLAP!) (CLAP!!!)

BIG DICK! BIG DICK! BIG DICK!!!

Well , this surely explains a lot. It explains why Mary slept in a separate bedroom. Or... why she cried so hard at his deathbed and many days thereafter... It explains why David Derickson slept with Lincoln in the same bed for four months and definitely why Joshua Speed slept with Lincoln inn the same bed for four years!

The Lincoln boyfriends.

Number One: William G. "Slicky Bill" Greene Jr. (1812–1894) was an American businessman who was a close friend of Abraham Lincoln. He did business in Menard County, Illinois. Greene founded Tallula, Illinois in 1857, and Greenview, Illinois is named after him.

The Lincoln boyfriends.

Number Two: Joshua Fry Speed (November 14, 1814 – May 29, 1882) was an American politician who was a close friend of future President Abraham Lincoln from his days in Springfield, Illinois, where Speed was a partner in a general store. Later, Speed was a farmer and a real estate investor in Kentucky, and also served one term in the Kentucky House of Representatives in 1848.[

The Lincoln boyfriends.

Number Three: Elmer Ephraim Ellsworth (April 11, 1837 – May 24, 1861) was a United States Army officer and law clerk who was the first conspicuous casualty and the first Union officer to die in the American Civil War. He was killed while removing a Confederate flag from the roof of the Marshall House inn in Alexandria, Virginia.

The Lincoln boyfriends.

Number Four: Captain David Derickson of the 150th Pennsylvania Infantry was Lincoln's bodyguard and companion between September 1862 and April 1863. They shared a bed during the absences of Lincoln's wife, until Derickson was promoted in 1863. Derickson was twice married and fathered ten children. Tripp recounts that, whatever the level of intimacy of the relationship, it was the subject of gossip. Elizabeth Woodbury Fox, the wife of Lincoln's naval aide, wrote in her diary for November 16, 1862, "Tish says, 'Oh, there is a Bucktail soldier here devoted to the president, drives with him, and when Mrs. L. is not home, sleeps with him.' What stuff!"

People

Not sure I approve

This all screams bullshit to me.

Despite all evidence to the contrary I say YES!

There's too much stuff there to just be a rumor, Gandhi too had a boyfriend.

They’re everywhere!

When I have a bedfellow, well, we never touch!

Well he was an avid theater attendee ...

I think the whole concepts of roommates in college was intended to make lifelong gay partnerships that would be a background to heterosexual marriage.

Elmer Ephraim Ellsworth looked hot! I remember him well.

R73, if someone identifies as an historian then that makes zy/zym/zyr an historian.

Beds were expensive back in the day. And we were cold. You did what you had to do to survive.

[quote] Male sexuality was not the same 1864 because: 3. Homosexuality was invented by Liberace in 1954.

Not quite - homosexuality as a define concept started to coalesce in the late 1800s. It was those damn Germans.

I can't tell if r11 is trying to be satire or what.

Let's count the number off times R11 has slept, as an adult, with strangers in his bed and not had sex.

R100, people occasionally shared beds in a non-sexual context (e.g., when staying overnight at taverns, inns, and so forth) in the 17th and 18th centuries. Unrelated adults sharing a bed might have been viewed a different way in other times and places.

I'll take boyfriend number three.

[quote][R100], people occasionally shared beds in a non-sexual context (e.g., when staying overnight at taverns, inns, and so forth) in the 17th and 18th centuries. Unrelated adults sharing a bed might have been viewed a different way in other times and places.

But honey, this was every night for 4 years... I'll give you a few days. Maybe even 2 weeks. But men sleeping in the same bed for 4 years?

Gay as a picnic basket

HE LOVED THE MENS!!!!

Once you try back… you can’t go back

Why do think they call it a “Stink’n Lincoln?@

Well, he did enjoy the theater...

Historians have debunked this shit a million times.

Lincoln wrote lovely, romantic letters to his 🛌 sleeping partners.

Debunked until it's not, there's fire there, other historians say the letters were still too much even for the time.

Great point, R111. There have been many things that have to be revised and/or reconsidered as more and more new information is found and revealed. Who knew that Eleanor Roosevelt possibly had a lesbian affair and/or an affair with another man? The Tutankhamen history has been revised as more evidence and advancement of science/technology have happened.

What gets me is how facts can totally be altered and/or destroyed. How do generations of southerners legitimately believe that the Civil War was simply about states' rights when there has always been overwhelming evidence that it was about slavery? Okay... maybe there is a state's right issue in there someplace... They wanted the right to keep their slaves...

[quote] Debunked until it's not, there's fire there, other historians say the letters were still too much even for the time.

Wrong. You’re viewing it through a 2024 lens. There is no evidence to suggest that he was gay. This is as ridiculous as the rewriting of Stonewall. It’s all about pushing a lazy agenda.

r69 It's "toe the line," not "tow the line."

[quote]Wrong. You’re viewing it through a 2024 lens. There is no evidence to suggest that he was gay.

So, you're basically saying R113 that two grown men sleeping next to each other in the same bed for 4 years isn't (or should be viewed) as odd?

Interesting article at link. The practice, says the article, started dying out in the mid-1800s; but it would have lingered in more rural areas and among the less well-to-do. Turning to the world of film: That Laurel & Hardy were often seen sharing a bed, as were the Three Stooges, would just have struck audiences of the time as meaning that they couldn't afford the luxury of separate accommodations.

[quote] The practice, says the article, started dying out in the mid-1800s; but it would have lingered in more rural areas and among the less well-to-do.

That may be true and might be what it is. I mean.. I have heard of relatives within my own family who have slept in the same bed for some time (normally woman) because of poverty and it was the only option. But, I have never heard of such a situation that lasted for 4 years or more. HECK! Given that time, anyone could have constructed a bed and bedding. And not to move to a porn level, there are just natural "whatevers" that an individual experiences. Where these natural whatevers ignored and/or hidden?

Everyone should consider themselves. Could you sleep like this (platonically) for such a time period with either a relative or friend?

r117 Me, I'm actually on neither side in this discussion as I wait for all the facts to come in and be marshaled; but, yes, I could sleep platonically with another person in my bed for an extended period, especially if in my youth I had become accustomed to the practice. One thing to keep in mind is that, just like at DL, there will always be detractors who take a situation and try to make something of it to serve their own purposes, so others' suggestive comments at the time, or at other times, should be looked at with an attitude of, "Well, maybe yes and maybe no."

[quote][R117] Me, I'm actually on neither side in this discussion as I wait for all the facts to come in and be marshaled; but, yes, I could sleep platonically with another person in my bed for an extended period, especially if in my youth I had become accustomed to the practice.

Well, of course anything is possible, R118. I don't mean that flippantly either. However, my point is that sex is a very natural point of existence, and I find it difficult to accept that two healthy, relatively young adult individuals (of the same sex) can sleep together in the same bed for an extended period of time without one (or both) attempting or broaching something sexual--even if innocent. Yep, I know about the grandmother sleeping with the granddaughter or even daughter etc. Also, two sisters sleeping together. Quite frankly, I'm not personally aware of two brothers, grandfather and grandson, etc, but you follow my meaning...

I have slept with dozens of gentleman callers. The ones that snore too loud, I wake them up for another round. Otherwise, I move to my fainting couch to get some shuteye.

R113 is a stupid ass, go away, probably a stupid straight cunt who should be fucking ELSEWHERE

R118 not someone you never met before in your life who had no money as Speed did.

These trolls are so ridiculout it's bizarre. LINCOLN WAS GAY and there is no other interpretation which fits the facts. No he didn't call himself "gay" because people didn't talk bout gays that way. But he was a definitey nancy boy and that's not even dispute among people of that era.

If I had to breed with Sally Field, I’d have been straight-turned-gay, too!