How does it feel to be older than 40 and not have children?

Phenomenal--for me. I frankly don't understand on any level the desire for kids, but clearly it's very important for some (women, mostly).

I am the eldest of six.

I spent most of my childhood and teens raising kids because both parents were gone at work, or boozing, who knows where the fuck else they were.

I’d feed them three times a day. Change their diapers. Toilet train them, make sure they got to school, and I’d help them with their homework in the evening.

It fucking sucked. My own school performance was dismal, I had almost no social life, and to thank me for all the hard work, my parents kicked me out when I came out at 17.

I have no desire to have children. I’ve already taken care of enough of them.

Good. Half the people I know with kids seem miserable and even the happy ones are tired all the time. I have nothing to offer a child and I enjoy sleeping in.

You’re off your rocker. OP.

Being gay and childless is a gift.

Your life, your money, your choices and desires.

Just enjoy your nieces and nephews and live your best life.

I’m so sorry r2 I hope at least your siblings appreciate what you did

I constantly have console myself with all this spare time and disposable income.

the problem is when you go to family events where you will be asked, "why didn't you have kids?"

No regrets. None.

Amazing. Fuck dem kids.

I'm 51 and currently vacationing on a beautiful beach on an island. It really sucks, not having those childrens!

47, no kids, never any desire to have any. I love kids, but I also love coming and going when I want and only being responsible for myself.

Sometimes the absence of children’s laughter makes it seem a bit austere and lonely in my second home at the beach. Sometimes my Jaguar feels slightly less lived-in without fudgsicle fingerprints all over the upholstery.

I don’t think about it, really. There was never any real prospect of children, and I’m just as glad not to have had to make the decision. I’m afraid I wouldn’t have been much of a parent.

There are very occasional pangs of angst - watching a movie that features two dads, or seeing younger gay couples become parents on social media. I never felt that option was even available to me. But I realize I’m cherry-picking some Hallmark moments of parenthood and I probably wasn’t cut out for it.

OP this is a gay message board and most people here probably accepted they won’t have children when they accepted they were gay

R14 Yes but this is changing rapidly - most of the gay couples I know under 40 discuss parenthood, or are actively planning for it. I think OP’s question is valid and interesting.

I feel young, and free, and incredibly happy. In this exact moment, I am heading to bed early with my partner after sharing a bottle of Sancerre and laughing and talking all evening. Soon we will snuggle and drift off to sleep with our cat at the end of the bed. Tomorrow I will go to my job, helping to advise other people’s kids (college counselor), and go home grateful and fulfilled, despite having none of my own. Parenting is the hardest job in the world, and I have tremendous respect for them. I wouldn’t change my life for a moment, though. I have a graduate degree in a field I love, we travel the world, and feel tremendously blessed.

Best feeling in the world. I’m only just over 40 but am very glad to have escaped being part of the more recent generation where having kids is almost expected of gay couples. People actually ask it now in polite conversations.

Good for anyone gay, straight, single, etc that adopts a kid in need but I look at these younger (or older) gay couples who go through the genetic narcissism of surrogates or IVF or whatever and just think WTF. The best thing about being gay is not having to buy into the BS that we’re all meant to have kids. I wonder how many do it if they couldn’t post about it on social media or tell anyone either.

My 401K feels great about it.

It’s my biggest regret in life; not making better decisions so I would have been able to afford kids. My friends used to joke that I seemed like “Mr. Mom” and just needed to find the right rich husband. Well, that didn’t happen. I feel lonely and unfulfilled, like something is missing. But I always said I’d never have kids I couldn’t afford, and I was true to my word.

Overall I am glad I made that decision but i do sometimes think about when i am really old and what my life would be like with a son or daughter who would be there (hopefully) to comfort me. I do quickly snap out of it when I see my sister and her husband who have all but given up who they are for the sake of their kids. It’s definitely a game changer having children.

Kids born today are doomed from climate change, etc so I'd just as rather not bring another soul into this mess.

Wish I had the tax breaks.

It feels great for this 62 years old woman.

Never felt a moment of regret for not having children.

And with the USA and the climate gong to hell in a hand basket I’m glad I didn’t impose this world on any offspring

I think about this all the time R20. Seems like nothing but loneliness waits ahead and I envy the people who have family to care for them. But rose tinted glasses. I also know how fucked up family can be and you’re just as likely to end up with kids who are dysfunctional, dependent or just ungrateful.

It feels like victory.

I don’t regret my choices, but I do worry about not having anyone to advocate for me if I end up in a nursing home.

R26 Plot twist: having children is certainly not a guarantee that someone will advocate for you when you get old. Nursing homes are full of desperately lonely people - many of whom have families - and must be 100% harder if you have children and know they are just letting you rot after all the effort you put into raising the little bastards.

My friend bought an egg and hired a surrogate to hatch it when he was 53. He’s single and always dreamed of being a father. I haven’t seen much of him in the past four years but he says he’s happy.

I can't really regret it because it’s not like guys my age ever had a choice. Sometimes I catch myself wondering "what if" but stop myself as going down that road is a fruitless endeavor.

[quite]My friend bought an egg and hired a surrogate to hatch it when he was 53

Is he a capon?

R28 did he have a baby, or an ostrich

R15, gay men should never have kids, especially the test tube kind.

What is this awful, antiquated hot take R32

58 year old straight woman (been on DL since 2005 and has lived in West Hollywood since '93), I love not having children, but I have become a cat lady. My poor younger sister has to satisfy my mother's weird need for babies. Unfortunately she doesn't trust her kids alone with mom- she thinks she's getting senile at 80.

I don't have children and I'm fine with that. The only time I felt vaguely weird about it was when my PCP referred me to an oncologist to rule out a very rare form of cancer (which I didn't have). The oncologist was a fucking nightmare from beginning to end, and I won't bore you with the details. But before revealing to me that I had tested negative for cancer, she got all choked up and said, "Do you have any children?"

No bitch I don't. And if I did, what am I supposed to do? Text them all to tell them I don't have cancer?

[quote] Seems like nothing but loneliness waits ahead and I envy the people who have family to care for them

I am surrounded by elderly people whose adult children are busy with their own lives, and adult children who whine endlessly about how needy and depressed their elderly parents are, and why can’t they join a community group/volunteer/go to a nursing home instead of being an emotional burden.

I’m forever worrying about the antics my siblings and parents continue to get up to (substance abuse and mental health issues ENFLAME our family tree.)

I can’t imagine having an even more vulnerable member added to it. I’d never get a wink of sleep.

I answered above, but I feel compelled to say that having children is absolutely not insurance that you'll have someone to take care of you in your old age. I am the black sheep in a family of three children, and my parents fully expected my older siblings to take care of them in their old age. They didn't. They bolted, and had no interest in caring for them, so the black sheep stepped in. It's a crapshoot.

I worked with a woman who constantly said I needed to have kids so someone would take care of me when I was old. I said “they’re kids, not nursing staff.”

Sadly her kids ended up with severe drug problems and can’t take care of themselves let alone her in 40 years.

I’m happy with my circumstances.

I knew when I was a kid watching 70s TV like The Brady Bunch and Good Times that I never wanted kids. Too much stress,worry and responsibility. I can barely take care of myself. It's best for some to not have kids.

Interesting thread. Responses are more varied than I expected. As for me - I thank my lucky stars every day that I don't have to deal with all the nonsense that comes with parenting. My sister has aged 20 years since she had her first. He’s 5.

[quote]the problem is when you go to family events where you will be asked, "why didn't you have kids?"

Grow a spine, FFS. How is a stupid question a "problem"?

I'm sure the reason I look 15 years younger is because I never had kids. Nothing to regret there!

[quote]Seems like nothing but loneliness waits ahead and I envy the people who have family to care for them.

Having kids so that they care care for you when you're old?

Having kids because straight people have them, often without much thought?

Maybe R19, "Mr. Mom," had a real if unrealized desire for kids and might have been a fine parent. I can appreciate that because it seems to come from an actual desire for children -- not for children as adornments, not for children as presumed future caregivers, not for children to show your relatives and strangers that you are their equal.

The idea that it's every homosexual's instinct to have children is as fucked up wrong as is the idea that all straight people should reproduce having given no thought to the idea.

OP it's Fan-Bloody-Tastic not having kids. We talked about at the beginning of our relationship over 40 years ago...no sprogs. End of.

^* about it

With people openly tracking using metadata (poster ID's in urls) from individual on spreadsheets here, I won't say whether I have children or not. It's personally identifiable information. especially when strung together with other small pieces of personally identifiable information posted here. Be careful what you reveal here, people.

Never wanted them. My mother told me that I would want them but I never have and I become more certain about that the older I get. Not only did I not want to pass my genes on, I know that I wouldn't be a good parent. I wouldn't have the energy and I've never really liked people much either. I think that the world is overpopulated which is having an effect on species going extinct, climate change, resource depletion and so on. The economy and young people's mental health seems bad compared to when I was younger too. In my country housing is in short supply and very expensive - the average house is now 10x the average income to buy one - there are huge queues to try to get an affordable dentist and so on.

Thought STRONGLY about this in my early 30s. Decided not to because:

1: What if my abusive childhood passed through me to the child. No need to ruin someone else's life.

2: Have not been financially stable until 2012. Could not have supported a child.

3: There is no guarantee that the relationship between a child and parent will be successful and lasting. They might still abandon you or vice versa.

Family is a strange thing - there's an assumption that ties will be close and loving but to me it seems about as likely or not likely as if you were put together with a random person. Sometimes it gels, sometimes it doesn't, or something in between.

I remember reading sometime back about 25% of people that had kids regret it. The people who talk about having kids so they won’t be lonely or so someone will be there for them when they get old are the most selfish and delusional quacks that should be sterilized.

Anecdotally my mom came from a family of 10 and only one sibling ended up having more than 2 kids (she had 3) and there’s love there in the family most couldn’t wait to leave home and once both my grandparents died they were finally able to say it sucked having that many people in the family.

It’s my hang up but I don’t know if I could get involved with someone that had kids. The divorce rate for marriages with step kids is over 70% and that hasn’t changed in 50 years.

I had a lot of friends that divorced with kids in their 20s and that tapered off, but now I’m seeing an uptick of my friends in their 40s getting divorced not long after the last kid graduates. No regrets about having kids but it’s amusing to watch my friends try to have a second young adulthood.

[quote]Yes but this is changing rapidly - most of the gay couples I know under 40 discuss parenthood, or are actively planning for it. I think OP’s question is valid and interesting.

You must live among very wealthy gay men then. Heterosexual millennial couples have driven the birthrate to record lows. And these are people who don’t have to go through expensive fertility clinics or adoption processes to have children.

The idea that “most of the gay couples” one would know would be on the opposite side of a significant demographic trend is laughable. Heterosexual couples are putting off starting families until they turn 40 and yet most of the gay couples you know under 40 are pursuing it?

The exception of course would be the necessity of wealthy gay men under forty pursuing parenthood to ensure the legacy of generational wealth. We had a thread about do-nothing influencers who vacation every month suddenly deciding they need children and doing “womb” unboxing videos on Instagram as they share their “fertility journeys”.

Please understand that this does not represent real life and your obtuseness indicates you have little understanding of a significant crisis which will most likely lead to a very dystopian near future.

I'm 70 and I thank the heavens I never had the desire to raise children. I have for many years enjoyed having the kids in my family and friends visit me. I love when they come, but I love it even more when they leave.

Keep in mind that I am a middle class gay man of 41. The gay men my age who are buying houses are doing it for their dogs.

Honey I thank God every day I have no children. Life's great!

Nope - no regrets.

Fabulous.

It feels fabulous.

Well.......

DL may be the most depressed sad forum I have ever seen in my life. It’s often frighting and depressing to read. full of 30-40-50-60 year old men many who appear to do little but complain about their depressed sad unhappy life. No friends no family no nothing.

. Most without a mate. . So many wishing they were dead at 50 their life is so poor and unhappy. Many on so many threads looking forward to an early death.

Maybe these are just the gay men with children? If so it’s strange that not one of them ever mentioned having children.

OP. The first day of the month is tomorrow, take a trip to Walmart and Aldi to experience the wonders of the family unit.

Before I knew I was gay I knew I never wanted to have children.

I’m in my late 40s and still have my ‘My Buddy’ doll from when I was 7. Does that count?

R60, if I may, let me suggestion a small amendment to your signature line:

"DL *is* a full time shrink for the depressed and unhappy"

R60. People are miserable in general. (It’s a prime reason for not having any children-they will be miserable too.). And far from everyone is posting depressing things like that.

I used to be sad about it. But I realized that I don’t have the patience or coping skills to deal with being a parent. My father never wanted children. He was only affectionate towards us when he was inebriated. Sober, he was moody, bullying and sometimes violent. Mom married him because she was 24 and pregnant. Practically an old maid in the sixties. She wasn’t perfect but she was a better parent than my dad.

I loved my brother’s children when they were younger though. But they grew up and we don’t communicate much, if at all. Like most people, the cleave unto their mother and her side of the family. They hate my brother and I don’t blame them because he’s a first class asshat thanks to the dysfunctional upbringing that we had. Sometimes I wonder what my kids would be like, but it always passes and I realize that the best thing I ever did for my children was to not have any.

Today’s world is such an ugly, dystopian place.

[quote] The exception of course would be the necessity of wealthy gay men under forty pursuing parenthood to ensure the legacy of generational wealth.

Spend every last dime on yourself in your dotage, die, and not leave a penny.

Problem solved.

If I could do it all over again, I’d say now is too soon to be thinking about having kids

I’m deep into middle age, and it’s exhilarating. I have complete freedom, including freedom from anxiety and regret over the lives I might otherwise have created. Children have never been necessary to me to avoid loneliness.

I think my last years may be more grim than they are for some people. who have children. Although there is no guarantee children will help, you do at least have a chance they will. However, I’m not going to ruin most of my life just to have a chance that my final few years might be easier. And I’m definitely not going to make someone go through everything life entails just to be my caretaker in my final days.

[quote]Spend every last dime on yourself in your dotage, die, and not leave a penny.

Yes, or why not leave it to good causes or set up one yourself. 'Generational wealth' is often squandered within a few generations anyway - it just takes 1 spendthrift or bad decisions to do it.

R60 I’m sorry that’s what you take from DL. I find it to be a place where people are very funny, have good recommendations for travel, books, theater, etc. I learn a lot about history here. There are very smart people and very witty comments. People are quite kind when there are issues with serious illness or losing pets or having family with dementia, etc.

I’m quite tired of posters like you who act so above it all and complain how depressing it is and how pathetic everyone else is. And lament how everyone else is alone and sad, etc. Look in the mirror. Why are you so negative? And why are you continuing to visit the site if it’s filled with losers that you find so frightening?

Beyond tiresome. You go see a shrink.

And as an aside, this thread is filled with gay men (and women) who are enjoying their lives and not tied down with children.

DataLounge is my safe space

"That's a lot to impose on a child".

Those words were said to me by my wise, beautiful mother.

The context was my mother, decades ago, telling me about a couple she knew who disclosed to her that their marriage was in trouble, and they were going to have a child in an effort to stabilize it.

Those 8 words were an epiphany for me. My mother managed to sum up in one sentence all the wrong reasons, and not just a bad marriage, people, both men and women, have a child.

I decided to devote my body and my life to me, not a child. And I have not an iota of 2nd guessing myself.

The only therapeutic value I get out of DL is knowing there are other people interested in the same arcane topics I'm interested in, and want to discuss them with....er....flair. There's definitely things to complain abut, but I don't see lots of regret and self-woe here. I see more annoyance that the world isn't aligned with people's views, but that's another kettle of fish.

There is a need for wisdom, diplomacy, and restraint in raising children. We are teaching our children how to interact with the world as we do our best to survive and provide.

Fuck that.

For r60. Umm, we’re GAY and LESBIAN. While there’s something to be learned here regarding art, food, travel and pop culture, please remember that for the majority of us, it came with the filter of homophobia and discrimination. Our outlook on life is colored by our negative experiences as a result.

No way could I have handled it when I was younger, mentally or financially. I've had pets which I have completely enjoyed.

Well as gay men, very very few gay men have children so it is pretty normal. Thank goodness.

I’ve gotten so many men pregnant but I’ve never seen my babies in real life

Why god? I just want a butt baby to love and to hold.

Children are holographic copies of their parents, who are also holograms. Programs creating programs. Having children just perpetuates the suffering of humanity because this is a purposeless virtual world.

I came of age in the 80s. The only gay men with children I knew were closeted or formerly closeted dads. In some cases they had no or very strained relationships with their children. Having kids never entered my mind. I have a lot of nieces and nephews and I see how hard it is, and how tedious it can be. I honestly would hate to give up my free time to do kid-centric stuff, like spend a Saturday afternoon watching kids run around a soccer field.

R71

I have never seen a forum with so many men that claim they wish they were dead, had no future, had no sex life, had no retirement, were sick and tired of living with mom but mom won’t up and die and leave the house to the DL member.

Then the weekend angst and nonsense from the PnP contingent. I am not complaining it is life, it is life on the Internet, it all has entertainment value or as the losing potus once said it is what it is.

Yes since being on DL I have learned a lot about the arts. Taylor Swift is the Devil.

Nobody ever mentions that there are 8 billion people on this planet of limited resources as their primary reason for not having kids. WTF?

What's the purpose of having kids if you won't remember them later on? My uncle has Alzheimers, he has 3 children, 1 son and 2 daughters and has no freaking clue who they are anymore.

A relative once whined, “I’m tired of Dad keeping me poor.” The asshole was in his late 40s waiting for a death windfall.

Blood may be thicker than water, but non-relatives have a money motive in keeping you alive.

I work with attorneys. It's a new-ish job for me.

The other day, a male attorney (straight, rude, 3 children) was talking to a woman support staff member. Woman has 1 child. Male attorney never bothered, in all the years they worked together, to know much about her personal life, apparently.

He told her: "Oh, you just have one."

What a cunt (the guy).

I'm not unhappy at all that I don't have kids. My nieces and nephews are a joy, but I like that I only see them for short periods at a time. Besides, I have mental issues and I would just hand those down to any children - better to nip that in the bud.

Our empty womb aches.

R82 that’s kid stuff compared to Reddit.

You really think that having children would’ve/would improve any of those people’s mental well being? More than 90% of this place is pop culture, politics and silly snark. If the sad and miserable things are all you see then you must be seeking that out yourself and that doesn’t reflect on here as much as it does perhaps you.

Mental health issues are a motherfucker to deal with but someone who is self aware and unselfish enough to know that bringing a child into this world will not cure or alleviate the ailment they struggle with is a wonderful and responsible thing.

To be honest, I've never been more frightened in my entire life. But at least I have a husband.

R89

No I do not. Internet forums and good mental health are not two things I think of going together, kids or no kids. The mentally unstable are drawn to these forums :-)

But I also think that having something in your life that you have to care for, be responsible for, and at the same time something to love and loves you back , that might make people less depressed or in fact mentally healthier.

It’s worked for me

Get a dog.

I feel marvelous, darling. I'm fine. I send my love.

Feels great.

I'm 44 and I feel great and don't have any regret about not having kids. All of f siblings had kids before they were 20 and ruined their lives.

Like most gay men my age, having kids rarely felt like an option. I did think about it from time to time, though. I even had close lesbian friends, a couple, ask me to donate sperm. But I knew that one of them was certifiable and spared myself the drama.

I have a gay male friend my age who did help a lesbian couple get pregnant. It’s been a good experience for him. But he talks about it as nauseum.

When I see dads who have genuine affection for the kids, who are playful and gentle and encouraging, it can make me wistful. I like to think I would have been a good parent.

But if I’m honest, I never would have led the life I did if I’d had a child. I’ve lived in seven or eight countries and visited countless others. I can’t envision how that would have worked if I’d become a father. Ultimately, no regrets.

I have no problems with not having children at my age (41). I wouldn't say I'm entirely opposed to having one -- and only one -- down the line. But being 41, I figure that window of opportunity is rapidly closing, so why bother. Also, I don't really want to deal with the stress of raising a child. My cousin's two boys -- ages 4 and 2 -- are both monsters who throw insane tantrums at a moment's notice. I DO NOT want that in my life.

Having children is not a panacea.

Not having children also doesnt make me happy.

I am more financially stable without children.

I hear you, r96. I can say with complete conviction that my life is so much more enjoyable without kids, and having a kid(s) would have prevented me from having all that is good in my life. No regrets at all.

Fucking awesome.

Childfree and thrilled about not having to follow the societal script that expects you to breed.

In my thirties I noticed I was making friends with a lot of straight childfree couples who had lost their friends to the crib and the cradle. They still wanted to go to concerts and pubs and such and I was a good companion.

In later years I've had the chance to talk to young people who don't want children, and assure them from my perch on Mt. Eldergay that their feelings are completely valid and they won't miss a thing.

I have hardly ever given it thought.

For about 30 seconds many years ago I thought about it, but then realized quickly I'd rather a Porsche 911.

My financial advisor (because I have money since I have no children), tells me I have the best long term care insurance policy he's ever seen.

I'm exceedingly happy with a husband, and ex/BFF, and many friends.

Who needs or wants children?

^^Oh, I never did get the Porsche, but I love my 10 year old Honda Fit. Maybe in a few years...

R104, You sit on the floor and all the weight rests on your thighs. Trips over a half hour are killer. It’s a young person’s car.

However, Porsche makes a beautifully zaftig car the name of which looks like Panera. Look into rhat one.

R105, thanks, it's Panamera. But I'm too cheap. Maybe a Miata, maybe not.

I think the Panamera is ugly. I really like how Porsches look too but would only accept a classic one.

A lady just turned 113 yrs old today. Accredits not having children (stress) as a secret to her longevity.

Female here, early 50s and don't ever regret not having children. I knew in high school I didn't want them and never changed my mind. Being married didn't change my mind either. We both didn't want them.

As a former probate attorney/ magistrate I can assure you kids do not guarantee you will be cared for when you are old. So what good are they?

Get the Miata. So cute.

You all realise that the married people, particularly women, who urge you to have children, ask why you don’t want them, and say “you’ll change your mind” are jealous of your free time, your Lego-less floors, and your sleep hours to do with as you please, right?

They secretly want you to suffer as they do. It’s amazing when a few drinks in, on vacation, people open up about how much they regret having children.

I spent most of my twenties and thirties caring for my elderly parents. It was emotionally and physically exhausting and I had no desire to add a child to the mix. And honestly, I don’t think I like children enough to want to share a house with one.

I occasionally see family members with their kids, and feel a pang for a life I haven’t lived, but I’m generally happy to be an uncle who arrives with presents and enough energy to play silly games for a weekend and then head back to my quiet home.

Financially too, I really am glad not to be responsible for kids. My job is currently looking a little shaky, and it is some slight comfort that I onlyhave to worry about supporting myself if the worst happens.

Another old broad here. I’m in a blended family, five kids, four in their 20’s now.

I absolutely adore my kids *and* you are all correct. When I had kids, I was young, naive, and didn’t fully comprehend what was happening on this planet. Also, as women, the biological urge to make babies is as strong as crack — men are much more fortunate in this regard. It is terrifying to think about what kind of world my kids will be in once I’m gone.

I have numerous friends who are either gay or straights without kids. I always tell them I’m vicariously enjoying what my life would look like without kids through them. They have absolutely marvelous lives.

Having kids in a beautiful thing in times of peace and prosperity. We aren’t in that right now.

No, I never wanted a mini-me to buy it all the crap my parents didn't buy me and take it all the cool places that I never got to go, and throw the baseball my father didn't throw to me. No, I never felt the urge. I understand if you get stuck with one by accident but why any self -fulfilled homo would want one is a mystery to me. But I totally get it for straight people, what else would they do in Connecticut?

20 years ago, I travelled to about 20 corp HQ offices in the North (!)doing sales presentations. Each location had a happy hour and I heard the same thing over and over, the taxes, the commute, the private schools, all the crap their kids want and the taxes, the taxes, the taxes. All these interchangeable corporate drones in light blue pinI was never so happy in my life to know that I had a hot husband and a home filled with rescue animals in the only city that ever made sense to me and I don't give a shit about taxes, schools and snow tires. Darling I love you but give me 8th Ave.

[quote]Also, as women, the biological urge to make babies is as strong as crack — men are much more fortunate in this regard.

Bullshit, you mostly have kids because you have them by accident when you get swept up by the moment of having sex and men definitely aren't less likely than women to do this.

I wouldnt mind being a parent, but that depends on what kind of child. I would go nuts if I had a child who couldn’t entertain themselves. Truthfully, I’d go nuts if I had a stupid child.

Hence, no children, no regrets.

My parents, in retrospect, were lucky with me. I was rebellious but I didnt bother them with shit like: I’m bored, I need money for a new car / phone, etc.

If dogs lived for 80 years, no one would have kids at all

Yeah, not all women have that “strong as crack biological urge” to have children.

Also, lots of men are hell-bent on having children, esp. sons. For a lot of men, it’s a deal-breaker if the GF or BF doesn’t want children.

R117, kids are stupid. You edumacate them until they aint.

I wouldn't know. After all, I'm not 40 yet and I'm a [italic]grand[/italic]mother.

[quote] Also, as women, the biological urge to make babies is as strong as crack

Nope.

I'm a Gold Star heterosexual child-free woman whose only biological urge was to have as much sex as I could with as many different men as I wanted.

And, as Bette Midler's character in the movie "Outrageous Fortune" says, "And, we're talking way, way into double digits!"

I knew from my childhood that wasn't going to have children. I'm the daughter of good parents. I was an astute and perceptive child. I saw how hard parenting was for my parents.

And when mom said to me "Human beings aren't required to have children. And if mistakes are made, those can be corrected (she meant abortion)", that's all it took.

Not everybody wants to be or should be a parent.

R120, some people, including kids, are just stupid. Frankly, having a stupid child wasn’t my main worry. I was worried about chronic depression and other things like that.

With my issues, I would likely develop PPD after giving birth, so there's another good reason to pass

Never had any desire whatsoever. I'm 54 and about to visit my narcissistic dad and CPTSD/Alzheimer's mom for a week, and it will be a big reminder of why. But I do wonder, if I had had a healthy and secure family, if family had positive connotations for me instead of feelings of dread and of being trapped, would I have felt differently, or is it something more innate. It has all the appeal of eating glass. But I was a mess until my late 40s and in no shape for parenthood.

It sucks, frankly!

And after years of telling the public about overpopulation, now some experts are saying that there’s a growing under population crisis brewing.

Both thing are true; the world is fatally overpopulated AND certain countries will suffer disastrous economic crises due to underpopulation/dropping birth rates.

Relief.

At age 60 I have a full life without children. Even though I have no real regrets, sometimes I feel I would have made a good parent and it may have been nice to have children and grandchildren in my old age. But with that positive comes all the baggage and drama.

Sis, menopause is a bithch!

I prefer it this way. I have nieces, nephews and great-nieces to spoil and enjoy.

I’ve never had the strongest maternal instincts, although taking care of my mom for 15 years was very satisfying and I have zero regrets on that front. Other than wishing she were alive and I could give her 15 more.

Now I’m an old dyke, in mid fifties, and I’m just maternal enough to care for a dog and a cat.

All the responsibility, the financial drain, the worry, the time and effort you have to give to kids of your own - that’s all bad enough but having kids means having to then have other people’s kids and their parents in your life too. Urgh!

Imagine you raise the best kids ever too, get on great etc and they marry people you can’t stand.

We’re all wired differently I guess but I just don’t see any appeal at all in having kids.

[quote] the problem is when you go to family events where you will be asked, "why didn't you have kids?"

Because I met yours.

[quote] Imagine you raise the best kids ever too, get on great etc and they marry people you can’t stand.

That's true. My poor mom. Two of my siblings married horrible people.

[quote] the problem is when you go to family events where you will be asked, "why didn't you have kids?"

The good part about getting older is you can just say: "I'm fine without kids." Period.

It’s devastating and I try every single day and night

The economic elites are taking an ever-greater share of global wealth, relentlessly attacking the social safety net which previous generations built up, working hard to use AI to make millions unemployed, and at the same time they complain that people are having fewer kids.

It’s not a mystery: why would anyone take on the burden of parenthood in such uncertain times?

We’re gonna end up like the world did in THE TERMINATOR! AI will turn us into slaves.

It never occurred to me.

R127 and R128 - the main concern with underpopulation and lower birth rates has to do with the corporate parasite class being worried there won't be as many future people to program into becoming their dutiful little corporate worker bees.

Lowering birth rates and under population is not a problem for the eco-health of the planet. It's only a problem for capitalism.

You take it day by day

"I can't BEAR children."

And then change the subject.

We thought about it when adoption became a reality for gay in the 1980's.

Now we think of all the places we wouldn't have gone, all the things we wouldn't have done, and probably all the bail we'd have to pay when the kid got busted.

Fuck no! I have a dog and he's a handful but I love him because I don't have to worry about him getting blown to pieces by an AR or have to buy them a cell phone that could create depression and suicide because of social media. I help raise my nieces and nephew so that is enough for me

AND...THERE'S MORE...

Kids have gotten worse. Overstimulated by the ability to have what they want when they want.

[quote]the problem is when you go to family events where you will be asked, "why didn't you have kids?"iv

Like I really giive a fuck what a dumbass relative with no manners says. I would turn and walk away.

Thankful. Children would only get in the way of my erotic lifestyle.

R149 not mine

I figure there was a reason my brother and I never had kids. Not together you freaks. I think we were late bloomers and by the time we were settled it just didn’t happen. My sister in law didn’t want kids. I never met anyone I wanted to have kids with. I think the blessings I have now are what I get instead of family.

If more people didn’t give into the pressure to procreate we wouldn’t have so many dysfunctional families in the world.

R142, you’re a communist, which means you’re murderous scum. Fuck off.

People who have children have better outcomes. They live longer and have better mental health. Women who don’t give birth are at high risk for cancer. Humans are meant to procreate.

[quote]People who have children have better outcomes. They live longer and have better mental health. Women who don’t give birth are at high risk for cancer.

Nope, nope and nope. You are wrong on all three.

Just making shit up? Why?

Trolling from Moscow R155. Or just plain stupid.

But wait, you can be both.

Nobody in their right mind wants children. OP is clearly a frau cunt.

And the extremes that people, namely women, go through to get pregnant. It must drive some of them to the brink.

[quote]And the extremes that people, namely women, go through to get pregnant.

What extremes? I'm not a straight woman but it's very easy to find a man to fuck you. If you're talking about IVF, that's another thing and something they typically have a male partner wanting to do that with them.

r199, for some reason, I know of more couples going through IVF now in the past 5 years than ever. I think it's because they're waiting to have kids later in life, like late 30's, early 40's. I personally know 3 women who all got pregnant at 40 (through natural means).

R160 Yes, I really am not a fan of that. Because you're medically a geriatric mother at that age. There's a significantly increased chance of things like Down Syndrome for the kid. Old male sperm too. I wish people would stop talking as if it's normal and fine at that age. It is medically better to have kids in your 20s.

Old man sperm has been linked to autism.

Old man sperm has also been linked to schizophrenia.

Prefer it that way.

R160: yeah a lot of people have bought into the whole ‘you can have it all!!!’ crap, that ignores thousands of years of biology. Fair enough put off having kids as long as you want, it’s everyone’s own choice, but don’t be shocked or complain if past 40 it doesn’t happen easily.

I’ve had so much “old man sperm” in me that if it were truly a serious problem, we’d know about it by now…

R166 You're not having children though. Big difference.

I'm a lesbian in my 50's who never had a single desire to have a child. I never understood women who claimed they had this "biological clock" bullshit. I grew up with 3 siblings and we were all sort of on our own, taking care of ourselves at young ages because our parents were fucking morons.

I won't even date a woman who has them. Even if they are grown. I had friends recently try to set me up with a woman and the very first question I asked was "does she have kids?" The answer was yes and that they were 5 years old and a baby. Nope. They said, "Everyone has baggage." To which I replied, "Kids aren't baggage. They are appendages." Baggage can be tossed away. Kids cannot. I cannot believe how many lesbians I know who want or have kids. I thought one of the benefits of being a lesbo was never having to worry about having them.

R162 Old man sperm has been linked to autism.

"That's a lie!"

[quote] I had friends recently try to set me up with a woman and the very first question I asked was "does she have kids?" The answer was yes and that they were 5 years old and a baby.

Who the fuck is back on the dating scene with a newborn baby.

R170: some cunt who realises being a single-parent via medical help ain’t all it’s cracked up to be and they want someone else to help them out with their bad life choices.

I'm not sure what the story was, r170 but apparently she and her partner split up right after the baby was born...which is a huge red flag beyond the stupidity of having a kid with someone where you don't know if the relationship might last. I'm sure she's nice but she was too butch for me and I just wasn't interested. I'd rather be single as I enjoy my life sans kids immensely. Right now I don't even have pets because mine died 7 years ago and it was too heartbreaking. I am considering maybe a pet in the future but I've also enjoyed only having to take care of myself at this point in my life.

I used to think that spending time with my friend’s kids would help fill the void of wanting kids. But I can barely stand to be around them for more than a couple hours. Turns out there was no void to begin with.

I’m super grateful that I don’t have kids.

r173, same. I have a lot of friends who had them and they always wanted me to go hang out with them while their kids were around. One friend even said, "I really want you to know my kids." I get it. We've been friends over 40 years but her kids were brats and she never disciplined them and I could take about 5 mins with them and I had to leave. Same with my other friends with kids.

I do have two nieces and they were great but I even kept my distance from them for the most part. I'm just not a fan of kids. Too germy.

R155 = Boris who knows nothing about female health or what a vagina even is.

[quote] Having children seems to reduce the risk of ovarian cancer. The more children you have, the lower the risk. Breastfeeding also reduces the risk of ovarian cancer. This reduction in risk may be because while you are pregnant or breastfeeding you're not ovulating (releasing eggs).

[quote]Women who never give birth have a slightly higher risk of breast cancer compared to women who've had more than one childbirth.

[quote] Conclusive research has shown that women who give birth have a slightly lower risk of developing breast, ovarian or endometrial cancers.

There somehow seems to be a link between people’s life expectancy and the number of children they have: People with children generally live longer than those without. Parents with two children even have a small longevity bonus added to their lifespan. A new study based on data on biological and adoptive parents explores the potential reasons for this association.

Children are expensive and time consuming but the benefits of having them are huge. People with children have better health, lower depression, and live longer. Human beings are meant to reproduce, gay or straight, it doesn’t matter. Family is important for mental well-being. It also benefits you in old age. Couples don’t usually die at the same time. One is left alone. Having children helps with that, especially if you lose your marbles and need someone to make decisions.

I’m 33, and while I don’t totally rule it out, I am fine with not having a kid. I have a one-year-old niece for the time being and look forward to being her cool gay uncle who spoils the shit out of her. I can say that I never felt love for a child like I did after she was born, though. I’d sacrifice my life for her in a heartbeat.

Family is important for mental well-being. It also benefits you in old age. "

All my "family" ever did was cause me trauma and I am not alone in that. Yes, family is supposed to be for mental well being, love and support. But not everyone gets that. Not by a long shot. And now, because my parents were such assholes, they are in the their old age with only their spouses (they are divorced) to take care of them. Both picked horrible, mean spouses over their children and so both are suffering.

Children always seemed like a huge burden to me. Little leaches that demand time, space, money, and constant attention. I love my freedom and never regretted not having them. .

I have a nephew and, truthfully, I got tired of buying gifts for him. My brother (his dad) got divorced from Nephew's mother and I'm sure that didn't help things.

Once he reached early 20s, I stopped buying gifts.

I just don't feel that close to him and vice-versa.

I think most people hate having kids. Obligations they don't want that they feel forced to fulfill because of the church and societal norms. Parents loving their children was such bullshit. When I was growing up it was on people's job description for life but I saw too much unhappiness in families including own. My mother always complained about how her mother treated her but she learned from her mother and was 10 times worse. I wanted to tell her this on her deathbed but I didn't and will regret it for the rest of my life. She was such a piece of shit. Always praying to the Virgin Mary. I wanted to say to her at the end if there really is a virgin Mary she's got a chute going straight to hell.

Why the would anyone feel bad about that unless they genuinely wanted children and had not or could not for whatever reason? Are people that weak about their parents or old grannies begging for great grandchildren? How then do gay men react to the occasional stupid questions and presumptions about "finding the right girl" or "settling down" or "what does your wife think?" And lesbians similarly? How do people reach adulthood without having developed some sense of conviction about themselves and who they are and what they want? It's not 1964.

Depends what circles you're in. Where I work, the support staff all seem to have children. A few of them have second jobs, as well.

I read of women who didn't have children, and they got the meanest and hateful remarks from other women! Things like you're being selfish?!!! What does that even mean? Also, you're not ready yet, but you will be one day! No, some women just don't want children.

But I DO have childre-- oh you mean like birthing and raising. Nevermind.

OP is a frumpy frau who wasted her life raising brats and now is 40-something and dead ended, and projecting her misery onto us.

I remember women being mad at Wilt Chamberlain for not settling down and having babies, but overall, society isn't as hard on childfree straight men.

Didn't Wilt have sex with 10,000 women or something like that? 2 per day, IIRC. Anyway, I'm surprised he didn't impregnate several of them.

Who knows? He might have some love children around somewhere.

r185, when I came out to my mother as a lesbian, she sent me a letter saying that I was being selfish because "god wants women to have children." She also thought that me being gay along with my older sister meant that SHE was going to Hell.

People are weird with the shit they've been brainwashed to believe.

R191 - You should have told your mom not to worry. That two gay daughters wasn't the reason why she'd be going to hell.

[quote]the problem is when you go to family events where you will be asked, "why didn't you have kids?"

Have you not learned the most important things in life: to greet rude or unwanted questions with the slightly loud response,

Q: Why don't you have kids?

A: Why do you ask?

Q: No, really, why didn't you ever have kids?

A: But why would you ask?

Q: I'm just curious why you never had kids.

A: But why would you ask me that question?

Q: Because you don't have kids. I'm asking why you don't.

A: And I'm asking why does it interest you? And why do you ask me the question?

Q: Because I want to know!

A: But why do you ask me?

Stick unwaveringly to your plan and you will soon enough exhaust the questioner and make him feel like an asshole. All without ever answering his question.

You have strong boundaries. Kudos.

R177. What are the huge benefits of having children quantitatively? And should we perhaps be slightly unselfish and give some thought to the children and not just think about how we benefit?

Yes, R195. People like R177 think of children in terms of the benefits that children provide to their parents: longevity, health, mental health, providing someone to look after them in their final years....

It's a different perspective than I would have. As a very young kid when adults would say, "wait until you have kids of your own..." I always knew that I would not have kids of my own. As a gay man, it's never occurred to me that I would have children; that's just not the natural state of assumption -- for me. And certainly none of the reasons above convince me otherwise. There has to be more to having children than to help me grieve when I am old, to rub lotions on my skin and to change my bedsheets.

I'd like to think that were I to entertain the prospect my question would be different: not what benefit will children give to me, but what am I giving a child? It seems to me the first question for someone considering becoming a parent should be turned in another direction: Can I give a child a good life, with the comfort and opportunity and exposure to things and other resources to become (maybe) a whole and happy and curious person?

Should I make a mini-me? Should I have kids so that I don't have to go to the dreaded assisted-living center to die? Should I have kids to sort out my bills and protect me from financial fraud when I have Alzheimer's? Those shouldn't be first line considerations for having a kid.

Absolute Relief

I never wanted children. Other people’s poorly socialised little bastards are all the argument I need.

Pretty freakin' great actually, OP!

I regret some aspects of the hand I was dealt at birth and a few of the decisions I made along on the way, but never have I regretted my decision not to father and raise children.

Never, not once!

I'm a gay man. I have zero interest in children and there is zero possibility to have any children for 99% of gay men.

What a [bold]very[/bold] strange question to ask on a gay website OP. As if we are straight people who can just go and have children at the drop of a hat like straight people do.

With the increase of same sex couples who are raising children r200, I think that it’s a very valid question.

[quote]I think that it’s a very valid question.

Even on DL, it's a question only a frau would ask. OP is clearly a frau.

Look at all those stupid frau cunts posting about their empty lives as if anybody gave a shit then or gives a shit now.

[quote] I read of women who didn't have children, and they got the meanest and hateful remarks from other women! Things like you're being selfish?!!! What does that even mean? Also, you're not ready yet, but you will be one day!

It means that they want childless people (but mostly childless women) to give up their time, homes, bodies and mental peace and spend hundreds of thousands of dollars raising children because they do and it’s fucking hard and never ending. The women with children consider childless women lazy and taking the easy way through life.

Nobody gives a fuck about boring women's grievances on this site R204.

I wrote the line about the biological urge is as strong as crack. I still stand by that, but others rightfully pointed out that not all women have that urge, and I agree, I made too broad a generalization. Of the women who do have that urge, it is strong as hell.

Feels great

r206, as a woman, I don't have that urge, and I've had friends who NEEDED to have a baby. I don't understand it at all- I'm probably broken.

Agree with r206

Same, r208. And those friend who NEEDED to have a baby were the ones who weren't making any money, had no partner and were much older in life when they decided to do it. Now they are single moms struggling to make ends meet. I would NEVER bring a child into that situation no matter how much I wanted one. Talk about selfish.

R191

Yes mom is slated to live in hell for all eternity. But you and Sis can stop by for a long visit.

How does it feel, OP?

It feels good. I wouldn't want the responsibility of having children, nor the expense.

If I wanted a baby, then that's what the third world is for.

lol, sadness OP? Please be for fucking real.