Italian prime minister splits with boyfriend after he’s caught asking woman if she wants to have a ‘foursome’

Mondo Sexo!

Italian Prime Minister Giorgia Meloni has dumped her sleazy TV presenter boyfriend — after a lewd audio recording surfaced of him asking a woman if she would be interested in group sex.

“Listen, I wanted to tell you something. Do you want to join our group? Will you join our working group?” Andrea Giambruno, Meloni’s boyfriend of 10 years, is heard asking a woman on the tape aired on the Italian show “Striscia La Notizia.”

When the woman, a colleague of Giambruno’s, responds favorably, he explains that there is a catch.

“You have to give us something in return,” Giambruno, host of Italian talk show “Diario Del Giorno,” tells the woman.

“My expertise?” the woman cheekily replies.

Giambruno responds, “You have to do threesomes or foursomes with us … We f–k.”

The shocking ask came after Giambruno, who shares a 7-year-old daughter with Italy’s first female prime minister, made another obscene remark during his conversation with the woman.

“Can I touch my package while I’m talking to you?” Giambruno is heard saying.

“You already did it,” the woman shoots back, before she is quizzed by Giambruno about whether the two have met before and if he was “drunk” at the time.

The perverted exchange was apparently the last straw for Meloni, who revealed in an X post that her relationship with Giambruno has “diverged for some time.”

He’s stunning. She was lucky.

“ My relationship with Andrea Giambruno, which lasted almost ten years, ends here,” Meloni said. “I thank him for the splendid years we spent together, for the difficulties we went through, and for giving me the most important thing in my life, which is our daughter Ginevra.

“Our paths have diverged for some time, and the time has come to acknowledge it. I will defend what we were, I will defend our friendship, and I will defend, at all costs, a seven-year-old girl who loves her mother and loves her father, as I was unable to love mine. I have nothing else to say about this,” she added.

Meloni, a member of the right-wing Brothers of Italy party, was sworn into office in October of last year.

While not married to Giambruno, Meloni frequently promoted traditional family and conservative values on the campaign trail, according to Politico Europe.

“I ask the coalition government from now on to abstain from preaching traditional family values to anyone,” said Riccardo Magi, a top official with the Piu Europa party, after Meloni announced her breakup, according to the outlet.

Italy has been hindered by weak economic growth and high interest on the country’s national debt, which is expected to reach 140% of Italy’s GDP by the end of 2023, during Meloni’s first year in office.

Always younger meat to be had.

😂 European politicians give no fucks.

I want to hear the tape! I’ll need a translation of course.

R6, she certainly cares.

Can I touch my package?! Mama mia!

So conservative and traditional. /s That cunt is known for pushing family values and taking rights away from same-sex parents.

Yum. You know he’s got some prime dick.

Daddy.

R10 Right wing in Western Europe means something completely different than here in the states.

Nice cakes.

She had a bastard baby with him?! Isn’t she the traditional family values prime minister?

Yes, r13, it means Fascist.

[quote] So conservative and traditional. /s That cunt is known for pushing family values and taking rights away from same-sex parents.

Yep.

She is a Roman Catholic and has used her religious identity in part to help build her national brand. In a 2019 speech to a rally in Rome, she said: "I am Giorgia. I'm a woman, I'm a mother, I'm Italian, I'm Christian."[1][364][365] Despite her Christian beliefs and championing traditional family values, Meloni defended herself not being married to her child's father.[366] In September 2022, she reportedly continued to embrace the old Italian fascist slogan "God, fatherland and family". She has said she resents being linked to Italy's fascist past.[367]

He's gorgeous!

He’s amazing looking. I would vote for her just bc of him.

[quote] I would vote for her just bc of him.

WHY? my god, you sound so stupid.

In November 2018, Meloni declared that the celebration of the Liberation Day, also known as the Anniversary of Italy's Liberation from Nazi-Fascism on 25 April, and Festa della Repubblica, which celebrates the birth of the Italian Republic on 2 June, should be substituted with the National Unity and Armed Forces Day on 4 November, which commemorates Italy's victory in World War I. She said that Liberation Day and Festa della Repubblica are "two controversial celebrations".[339] Meloni has tried to distance herself from her close ties to Roberto Jonghi Lavarini,[340] a far-right Milanese politician and entrepreneur known as the "Black Baron".[341][342][343]

After the formation of FdI in 2012, she decided to add the tricolour flame to the party flag, a neo-fascist symbol associated with the MSI, which derived its name and ideals from the RSI.[344] The tricolour flame is said to represent Mussolini's remains, where a flame is always burning on his tomb in Predappio.[345] Heading into the 2022 general election, Segre told Pagine Ebraiche that Meloni should remove the tricolour flame from the party's logo. FdI's co-founder Ignazio La Russa rejected this view,[85] and Meloni ignored the request, keeping the tricolour flame.[346] Observers, including historians Ruth Ben-Ghiat, David Broder, and Laurence Bertrand Dorléac,[81][250][347] said that Meloni and FdI have been ambiguous about their fascist past,[348] at times rejecting it and at other times minimising it, and that this has helped to rebrand both herself and her party.[349] Responding to the 2021 Fanpage report, she minimised the investigation and refused to remove openly neo-fascist members of FdI.[350] In December 2021, FdI's Alfredo Catapano and Luigi Rispoli were among former MSI members who did a Roman salute, which was condemned by the ANPI. Rispoli told Fanpage: "I believe in the New Right and in the efforts Giorgia Meloni is making in Brothers of Italy. It makes me wonder, frankly, this clamour."[351] Shortly before the 2022 general election, she sacked a member that openly praised Adolf Hitler.[89] FdI had also distanced itself from the Ascoli Piceno party section after it celebrated the anniversary of the March on Rome in 2019.[352]

In July 2023 according to Morning Consult polls of world leaders domestic approval rating Meloni was the most approved leader of an E.U. country and sixth most approved world leader of all world leaders tracked with 46% approval and 47% disapproval for a total net approval rating of −1%.

In her 2021 biography book, she wrote that Russia under Putin defends European values and Christian identity.[299

R21: “ WHY?”

We vote for less important reasons in the US. So who cares.

Meloni opposes abortion, euthanasia, and laws that recognise same-sex marriage, and describes herself as "pro-family".[216][217][218] She has said she "wouldn't change" the abortion law in Italy but wanted to apply more fully the part of the law "about prevention", such as permitting doctors to refuse to carry them out (conscientious objection to abortion).[219][220] She also stated that the recognition of same-sex unions in Italy is good enough,[221][222] and she said it was something she would not change;[223] in 2016, while she said she would respect the law if elected mayor of Rome, she had supported a referendum to abrogate the civil-union law.[224][225] At a rally at the Piazza del Popolo in October 2019, she spoke against same-sex parenting; her speech became viral on Italian social media platforms.[226] During a February 2016 interview to Le Iene, an Italian television show, she had also said that she would "rather not have a gay child".[227][228][229] Meloni has opposed the 1993 Mancino law [it], a hate speech law.[13] She is opposed to the DDL Zan, an anti-homophobia law that would expand the Mancino law to cover LGBT discrimination, declaring in 2020 that "there is no homophobia" in Italy.

Are there other pics of him?

Elect a skank expect an orgy.

She's a homophobe.

Who cares about these assholes?

R27, two more were posted. The website LPSG has a page on him. They call him First Gentlemen. Is that a thing in Italy?

OP?

[quote]Meloni opposes abortion, euthanasia, and laws that recognise same-sex marriage, and describes herself as "pro-family".[216][217][218] She has said she "wouldn't change" the abortion law in Italy but wanted to apply more fully the part of the law "about prevention", such as permitting doctors to refuse to carry them out (conscientious objection to abortion).

She has changed no laws and won't. She's too smart for that. It would be political suicide.

As far as permitting doctors to refuse to carry out abortions: Italian doctors as well as those in Spain have that option. They always have. Has that ever bothered you?

"Nothing in the law requires doctors to provide abortions—it requires them only to consider whether to do so in each case, and gives them wide discretion to refuse. "

[quote]In her 2021 biography book, she wrote that Russia under Putin defends European values and Christian identity.

Uh...tell us what you know about her response to the war in Ukraine. Yeah, such a friend to Putin.

[quote]Italy has been hindered by weak economic growth and high interest on the country’s national debt, which is expected to reach 140% of Italy’s GDP by the end of 2023, during Meloni’s first year in office.

You know nothing about Italy. Meloni inherited an economy with a debt-to-GDP ratio of 144 per cent. It has LOWERED since she's been in office.

[quote]I thank him for the splendid years we spent together

Yep those splendid orgasms she had over and over!

[quote]You know nothing about Italy.

Oh darling, this is Datalounge. Like we give a shit about Italy other than hot guys there, such as this!

Italy is some old, rickety and creaking thing now only held together by the collective memories of past, even ancient, glory.

R36 has never been there.

Eyetalian skanks

r36 it is one of the most beautiful countries in the world.

Is r32 really defending this woman? Good god.

Italy is a beautiful country and it along with Greece is responsible for much of what we have today in way of science and the arts. That being said, the culture is still stuck in another century.

R40 Citing facts is defending Meloni?

Dirty, fascist whore needs to go. Ideally, the way of Eva Peron.

[quote]Italy is a beautiful country and it along with Greece is responsible for much of what we have today in way of science and the arts. That being said, the culture is still stuck in another century.

LOL. Are you American?

Lets see: the US has states were people can carry guns. Truly primitive.

Where. homicide rates are comparable to war zones.

The leading cause of childhood death is from GUNS.

Were state executions still exist.

Where people often need to set up GoFund me accounts to pay for health care.

Where violent crime rules swathes of many cities, as do the homeless and tent cities.

And I'm just getting started.

Talk about stuck in another century....

R44 = BLOCKED

See what children like R44 do?

Sorry meant to write: "See what children like R45 do?"

Fuck the stupid cultural debate, just show us the cock!

R44 - oh, you, stop glamorizing us!

[quote]Fuck the stupid cultural debate, just show us the cock!

Blech. He's into stanky vag. There are plenty of hot porn guys if you want that. I'll never understand why so many gay men are so into straight men - isn't it unappealing if someone isn't into you?

[quoteisn't it unappealing if someone isn't into you?

All of us...including you... find ourselves attracted to and fantasizing about men who are out of our league.

R51 Speak for yourself: being into the opposite sex is a turn-off for me.

Who was the third and fourth BF was talking about having sex with? Did he and his sugarmama have a crazy sex life but she got found out so now she's dumping him to save her image and career?

R53 well, the reports say that it was a 'working group' of colleagues at his work so I don't think she was involved. I honestly doubt it was even happening (he and his 'working group' fucking). It reads to me like that he was fantasising and jacking off at it.

[quote] He’s stunning. She was lucky.

Have you been to Italy? He's meh.

THIS is meh?

See the video.

Yup^ very pedestrian for L’Italia

"L'Italia!" Oohh La La what a SOPHISTICATED American you are. Do you also say "Napoli" instead of "Naples?" The pretensions of American gay men are so funny. It's like you're ashamed of being American and long to be more sophisticated.

That said, Andrea Giambruno is perfectly attractive by Italian standards. He's no Riccardo Stefanelli or Giulio Berruti, but no one would kick him out of bed just the same.

Italy does have more than its share of handsome men, but he's hardly "pedestrian" by anyones's standards. R57 has never been to Italy.

I have dual citizenship, doofus.

In other words, she is deeply, deeply Christian right up to the moment she wants to fuck some guy and have his kids. Great, got it, what a saintly cunt. Everyone should be proud of her.

Her baby daddy is begging to be a cuckold. 😂

[quote]In other words, she is deeply, deeply Christian right up to the moment she wants to fuck some guy and have his kids. Great, got it, what a saintly cunt. Everyone should be proud of her.

Italians identify as Catholic, it is their culture but underneath they're not particularly "religious". "The Christian Right" as Americans know it, is not an Italian thing. The fact that Meloni was not married to this guy means nothing to Italians. Also this is a Mediterranean country...there will always be a dose of hypocrisy and duplicity. Italian have no illusions.

^ should read: Italians have no illusions.

But she's still gotta just hate those fags, right r63? Just gotta. Cause anything else wouldn't be part of her deep devotion to being a Christian cunt, right?

[quote] That said, Andrea Giambruno is perfectly attractive by Italian standards. He's no Riccardo Stefanelli or Giulio Berruti, but no one would kick him out of bed just the same.

He's okay but nothing outstanding. He has hair implants, fillers and wants you to have foursomes with Mussolini fangirls. You decide which of these is the final deal breaker.

This is what would happen if Florida ruled the US.

r66 is projecting

[quote]This is what would happen if Florida ruled the US.

Are you seriously equating Florida with Italy?

You stupid fucking cunt. American ignorance knows no bounds.

R68 Gay men don't want to have foursomes with Mussolini fangirls, dummy.

Gay men will have foursomes with anyone they find attractive

[quote]This is what would happen if Florida ruled the US.

It's already happened. Trump basically proved that the US 'Christian Right' have no problems voting for one of the least traditionally Christian people (at least in his personal life and conduct) around for president.

ITALY has nothing to do with the United States.

You fucking simpleton idiot MORONS.

The "Christian Right" is nonexistent in Europe.

Isn't Italy the only country in Western Europe not to legalize same-sex marriage yet? That definitely indicates that The Vatican and Christianity still hold a lot of sway in Italy -- more so than in the rest of Western Europe.

R74 Yup -

"According to ILGA-Europe's 2021 report, the status of LGBT rights in Italy is the worst among Western European countries – such as still not recognizing same-sex marriage, lacking nationwide discrimination protections for goods and services, as well as not granting to same-sex couples parental rights, such as adoption and IVF."

Italians don't give a fuck about the Vatican r74

Provincial white trash Americans have never been to Italy.

It's still a Roman Bacchanalia. Just as it's always been.

**American trailer park FAGS looking up "Bacchanalia"

Goodnight, America~

Yes, goodnight. The adults can talk now.

R76, then why is Italy the only country in Western Europe not to allow same-sex marriage?

Because they're the monsters living under your bed r79.

mangia merda e muori

The ECHR (European Court of Human Rights) has even ruled that Italy violates human rights by not giving same-sex couples enough legal protections. But well, the Italians vote for people like Meloni and Salvini meaning that it can never get passed.

R81 has never been to Italy.

R82 I have been to Italy, three times (Venice, Rome, Florence). Also, the three Italian gay couples who took their claim to the ECHR disagree with you. They want to have legal protections.

You know he has photos of her getting impaled like a rotisserie chicken on two cocks, eating pussy, covered in cum—the whole nine.

I say reveal all!

She probably has similar photos of him.

As a tourist! Congratulations r83!

This is a beautiful song about a lonely town. Even if you don't understand, you can still get the message Mina Mazzini is sending out to the universe.

Gay American here living in Florence Italy. You knew I'd pop up eventually. I can answer any and all of your questions about what it's like being gay here. And to agree with one poster above, the boyfriend by Italian standards is meh... There is a higher proportion of attractive guys walking the streets on the daily compared to anywhere else I have ever lived - and that is including NYC for 25 years. Although funny enough, when I return to America I am like "damn people are tall here." The standard of beauty here seems to be Male beauty. I always say the Men are prettier than the women and the women are stronger than the men. Sometimes you will be hard pressed to find a really pretty Italian girl in the streets, but the men you are practically tripping over. And I say this not just because I am gay, but my straight American female friends here agree. American women tend to be prettier (when not in yoga pants or panties and bra out in public), but Italian women can dress better - they're just harder looking. The men are pretty. and not to sound super creepy, but the young men 17-25 are especially so.

I go to a gym here that has a lot of American students, "dude bros" working out, which makes the difference between Italian men and American men more apparent. Part of what makes Italian men more attractive overall is that everyone has a personality, something to say. There are no lumps on a log, mouth breathers. Even if that personality can be annoying, there is something there. They are not afraid of expressing themselves, or appearing vulnerable, or angry, or laughing. They are engaged in a way where most straight American men seem checked out.

Italians seem less religious than Americans too, for the most part. Yes there is the Catholic Church, but I hardly seen anyone attending and not one ever talks about going. Easter here is like Thanksgiving in America. It is less religious and more about getting together with family and having a big dinner. There is no talk of going to mass on Christmas. I think Italians see the church more as another governing body, than an actual religion.

R86 That's called moving the goalposts. You were wrong, just stop. It's embarrassing the way you act - not doing a good job of showcasing Italy, are you?

Tl;dr r88

[quote]Gay American here living in Florence Italy. You knew I'd pop up eventually. I can answer any and all of your questions about what it's like being gay here.

Pale, blue eyed, fair haired American of Florentine (Northern Italian) ancestry. With a sprinkle of Anglo/Scots/Irish. I am fluent in Italian.

Blue eyes. Fair hair. Fluent in Italian. BIG DICK (7.5"). They treat me like VERY WELL in Italy.

Ciao r88!

When it comes to being gay here, the Italians definitely seem to be more traditionally Roman in their outlook than Catholic. It's almost a given that when you see a priest here, he is probably gay. In ancient Rome there was no "gay," people just had sex with whomever they were attracted to. Of course the issue then is what role do you play - being a top was ok, being a bottom was something a bit more degrading. However it was done of course, with it being well known Julius Caesar, the most powerful man in Rome, liked to bottom. I do find it fascinating that the most degrading thing a man could do then was to go down on a woman.

So having said that, I find no issues with being gay here. People don't have a problem with it. It just that family is the most important thing to Italian culture. It seems like they don't care what you are or what you do sexually as long as you get married and have kids. Any pushback you see in society is against a gay lifestyle with their thinking being we don't care if you have sex with men as long as you produce kids. But even that is an older way of thinking. The gays for that reason seem to be more flamboyant here. What Italians find fascinating, or different, are Americans like me and my husband who aren't flamboyant, comfortable in their skin as men but who are also openly gay. To them gay men still act like women, want to be women. We are legally married in the states, and because of that our union is recognized as an actual marriage here and not a civil union. On our government documents we are legally married in Italy.

For those of you who are really into straight guys, Italy would be your candyland. All men, regardless of sexuality, enjoying observing each other and they have no problem admiring each other. They are like peacocks and they enjoy the attention, seek it out. And to get another man's approval on the way you look seems to be the goal. I'd imagine any man here would readily accept head from another guy if given the opportunity. It's not a big deal. And half of them fantasize about a lot more than that. As many people above said, sex is not a big deal. And recently a poll came out listing the most promiscuous countries in the world. Australia was number #1, America was #15 and Italy was #7. And for you older men out there, well put together Daddies, that seems to be the goal here too. A well dressed older man 45-60, seems to rule the roost and the younger guys kind of circle them, taking notes. There is this tall, older guy at my gym (60-65), in shape with a huge dong. He takes his time changing in the locker room and so do the younger guys, checking him out. I say all that to say that if you are a well put-together masculine older guy, with good American money living here, you could probably have your choice of very attractive younger men curious about being with another guy - of course the further north, the better. Down south you'd probably have to constantly reaffirm a guy's masculinity before you got him in bed.

An example of the peacock phenomenon here would be the Carabinieri (police) uniforms. They look like straight up Tom of Finland fetish gear - tall black boots, skin tight pants, leather gloves. And TRUST me, they know it. La Polizia (another version of the police here) aren't so bad either - less fetishy but still equally hot.

You are not suppose to take pictures of them but they don't seem to care. One time I'll always regret not knowing the language better was when I was just filming a street in Trastevere Rome because it was so pretty and this police car slowly pulled up next to me. The guy inside and his partner were so cute. The one leaned over and said very flirtatiously in Italian - Are you taking pictures of us? I was nervous and didn't understand. He said it again in the same way. When he realized I didn't know what I was saying, he and his partner just laughed and drove off. It wasn't until like 5 minutes later going over in my mind did I realize what he had said, and I was like damn, that would have been a fun flirt.

In Florence there is very little crime. So the police mostly stand around and look hot.

r92/r93 get some fucking help. You are heading for a breadown

And R95 is is a perfect example of one of the reasons I enjoy living outside of America now - confusing baseless attacks with wit. A breakdown in what sense? People like him have made posting on Datalounge such a minefield.

I want to linger in the locker room at the police station in R94’s photo.

[quote]This is what would happen if Florida ruled the US.

Well, that proves you know nothing about Italy.

[quote]The gays for that reason seem to be more flamboyant here. What Italians find fascinating, or different, are Americans like me and my husband who aren't flamboyant, comfortable in their skin as men but who are also openly gay. To them gay men still act like women, want to be women.

I think you need more time there. And more time to actually make friends with Italian men. I lived in Italy for nearly 40 years. Have been back in the States for 4. I never, ever felt that anyone ever expected me to "act like a woman" or whatever. I worked in design, fashion, advertising and was always treated with the utmost respect. My group of friends all happen to be straight, me being gay is just not an issue. And I don't live in Milan or Rome or a big city, but in a small Tuscan town and have always felt comfortable.

Meh to Andrea

R98 like that in Paris and Amsterdam too. I kept thinking people were hitting on me but they were just comfortable…like approximately two of my straight male friends in US.

Chris Pine wanted a piece of Riccardo Steffanelli's ass when Riccardo was in LA, but was politely turned down.

R92, that is pretty much what I said. I find absolutely no issue with me being gay. Actually there is a respect for a gay man who is comfortable in his skin. I am American and I assume you are as well. As American gays we have no issue because America, maybe up until recently, was viewed as progressive. I think a good number of Italians are embarrassed about being so behind on this issue.

My point was that Italian gay men tend to be more flamboyant. They haven’t seemed to reach that level where gay is so mainstream that it’s almost boring. Now that’s not all of them. I lived in Rome, I live in Florence now. But even closeted straight guys will send pics of themselves in stockings and thigh highs, act feminine because being gay means being feminine to them. There aren’t enough open, masculine gay Italian men. Italian gay men who can pass are passing. To declare you’re gay means you have to broadcast it to the world.

I remember an instance where my husband and I were at the Questura renewing our permesso (visa) and I was waiting in a hallway for my husband. A handsome guard asked if I needed something. I told him I was waiting for my “marito,” “sto aspettando mio marito.” Hearing my accent he corrected me thinking I misspoke and said “moglia.” I said no, “marito.” He just kind of looked at me surprised and smiled - kind of like, “oh,cool.” I don’t think they are used to people not apologizing for or hiding their gayness. And I think they respect it when you don’t. This was Rome. Florence isn’t quite Milan but it’s definitely not Rome.

In OP’s pic Meloni’s boyfriend looks like he could suck the seeds out of a banana.

R102 You are obviously new to Italy. That's really all I can say.

Today, "flamboyant" is the face of gay men in America. My town's Pride organization is ALL about trans. Men in dresses. It's fucking embarrassing.

Italy has some of that too...but overall things are much, much more subdued and normal. You don't know it, but in Italy you are surrounded by plenty of men who are gay and bi and invisible to your eyes. My gosh, just go to a Pride parade in Italy, the vibe is not the zoo that it is in the US.

It's not easy for Americans to understand Italy and its culture. You need time.

R104 You're not Italian either and you don't even live there. You're an American living in the U.S.

R105 I have lived in Italy for nearly 40 years. I'm now back in the US.

BTW I wasn't living as a sheltered expat, or teaching English or any of that stuff Americans usually do there. Few Americans get to know the country and its people as well as I have.

[quote]Today, "flamboyant" is the face of gay men in America. My town's Pride organization is ALL about trans. Men in dresses. It's fucking embarrassing.

Do you regularly hook up with and socialize with a variety of gay men? It's kind of clear that you don't, and you measure gay culture by Pride. Your nasty comment about it only suggests that Italian culture has more shame about being gay than other Western countries if they don't feel free to be so open. Pride is also a very narrow segment, a public celebration that doesn't last long.

R107 I was addressing the post at R102. About Italian gay men bringing largely flamboyant. The poster doesn't have a clue. "But even closeted straight guys will send pics of themselves in stockings and thigh highs, act feminine because being gay means being feminine to them. "

God God. The poster doesn't have a clue.

[quote] it only suggests that Italian culture has more shame about being gay than other Western countries if they don't feel free to be so open.

Italy is a mediterranean country. Of course you have no idea what that entails.

Its culture is similar to Greece, Malta, Turkey, Albania. Syria, Lebanon.

It's not the US. Although you expect it to be.

^ I meant to write "closer too" rather than "similar too".

[quote] The "Christian Right" is nonexistent in Europe.

Italy has one worse - the Vatican.

Some hot Italian cops in the photo at R94. Wouldn't mind sucking on their uncut Italian sausages.

I would take 90% of the dicks at R94, one after the other.

I haven't had that many dicks IRL, but I would take them all in one session, one right after the other.

[quite] Sometimes you will be hard pressed to find a really pretty Italian girl in the streets, but the men you are practically tripping over

I noticed that the 2 times I’ve been to Italy. Good looking men but hard, unattractive women with long permed and/or fizzy hair.

We got a ticket and the cop was hot. If I can find the photo I took of him I’ll post it.

I love how the older men dress with their colorful pants, loafers and a sport coat or sweater. Very nice.

You are correct sir at R104, I have not been in Italy for 40 years. Obviously you would know more than me. I am speaking on my experience of moving from NYC to Rome. In NYC you had more gay men talking about their partners, talking about their husbands. There are two gay bars in Rome right next to each other Coming Out and My Bar right by the Colosseum. The vibe is very Provincetown Commercial St. A lot of KiKi-ing and cruising. Then you have the huge gay club Muccassassina that is over the top flamboyant. The vibe overall is very 2003. And you have a TON of bath houses or gay bars where you basically have to strip down to your underwear to get a drink. I guess what I am saying is that the gay community is still very much ghettoized, where it's obvious who, what and where they are. There are not a lot of out gay couples, visible, outspoken in the mainstream culture as there are in the United States. And just like years ago in the States, people seem to be more comfortable when they can spot the gay. Being gay is still a disappointment to a lot of parents in compared to the US.

And I still stand by my statement that being gay to the straight Italian world still means men who want to be women or who are feminine. If you are gay that means you want to play the woman's part when it comes to sex. In a couple, they would still wonder who is the man and who is the woman.

Basically out and proud gay men here tend to be more flamboyant and recognizable where as other gay men tend to lead more coded lives. It's not 1950s coded lives. But you are less likely to see someone introducing their husband or partner or boyfriend casually in a group setting. If it's just assumed you are straight, the Italian gay men who can get away with it, tend to go with it. And that is not out of fear of violence, but more a fear of acceptance. There is definitely less violence towards gays here in Italy than there is in the United States. But Italy hasn't reached that point as America did where there is a fear in the straight world that gays are everywhere and taking over. Here it's just assumed - by the straight world - that you are straight unless you're flamboyant or explicitly instruct them otherwise. And for the most part the only non flamboyant gay men I have seen explicitly instructing others on their homosexuality are American gay couples. On the flip side, privately, more Italian men seem to be accepting of sexual acts between men and their isn't the gay panic you would see in the United States.

There are a lot of winks and nods as to someone's sexuality in popular culture. The winner of the San Remo festival this year was the artist Marco Mengoni (who is a straight looking man by Italian standards) who people wonder "is he or isn't he?" Meanwhile his song was titled "Due Vote" - Two Lives. Other popular artist like Mahmood have never come out publicly as gay, but produces videos like the one below.

Or this video that was a huge hit a couple of summers back. One of the dudes is married to one of the biggest Instagram influencers and has two children. Can you guess which one? This is an example of what I said above about family being so important, they don't care what you are or do, as long as you marry and have kids.

You understand nothing about that video, Fedez, Italian men or Italy.

[quote]And I still stand by my statement that being gay to the straight Italian world still means men who want to be women or who are feminine.

Gee...Tiziano Ferro one of the most popular singers in the country is seen as feminine? You honestly think Italians believe he wants to be a woman? LOL.

Or one of the country's most popular actors, out and gay, leading man Gabriel Garko ???

Or one of the most popular TV personalities out and gay Alberto Matano?

Or TV news guy Alessandro Baracchini? Or Cecchi Paone? Or Stefano Campagna?

You really think Rosario Crocetta the ex President of Sicily is seen as someone who wants to be a woman?

Or popular politicians like Alfonso Pecoraro Scanio? Or Vincenzo Spadafora? Or Nichi Vendola? Or Rocco Casalino?

Or Guglielmo Scilla an idol among young Italians with over a million subscribers to his "Vita Buttata"?

I could go on. But the point is, you know very little about Italy.

[quote]I guess what I am saying is that the gay community is still very much ghettoized, where it's obvious who, what and where they are.

You truly don't get it.