Who would you save: The "38-year-old retired prostitute?" The attorney and his alcoholic wife who refuse to be separated? The 50-year-old musician who used to be addicted to cocaine? A "drifter with no apparent skills?"
‘Who will be left out?': Controversial nuclear war homework gets NY teacher removed
|by Anonymous||reply 66||September 20, 2023 9:32 PM|
I had a very similar assignment in the 1980’s. Right down to the cop with a gun, but without the brutality charges.
And instead of a sterile female doctor, it was a med student. We had to discuss it in a group and I remember distinctly someone saying that a cop is going to know more about delivering a baby than a first year med student.
It was stupid then, too.
|by Anonymous||reply 1||September 16, 2023 1:22 AM|
[quote] A nuclear strike on Long Island is imminent and you can only have six other people join you to hide in a bunker, but 10 people are there. So who do you choose?
He copied Twilight Zone episodes.
|by Anonymous||reply 2||September 16, 2023 1:23 AM|
This is like something out of John Waters.
|by Anonymous||reply 3||September 16, 2023 1:23 AM|
The other similar Twilight Zone episode.
|by Anonymous||reply 4||September 16, 2023 1:23 AM|
In there days, it was poor judgment to give fifth graders a “play God” assignment and then also include a prostitute. The inevitable home and class discussion over what prostitutes are and whether they are worth saving is the problem. I hate this teacher censorship but the teacher should have had better sense.
|by Anonymous||reply 5||September 16, 2023 1:35 AM|
Well, we know who won’t be included!
|by Anonymous||reply 6||September 16, 2023 1:36 AM|
This is actually useful as given the world is staring at an end they're likely to encounter just such a scenario.
|by Anonymous||reply 7||September 16, 2023 1:38 AM|
[quote] In there days
|by Anonymous||reply 8||September 16, 2023 1:41 AM|
I had a similar exercise in a social work ethics class.
|by Anonymous||reply 9||September 16, 2023 1:46 AM|
[quote]A 31-year-old homosexual architect
WTF is up with that? The other options are all presumed to be heterosexual, I guess.
|by Anonymous||reply 10||September 16, 2023 2:00 AM|
It's meant to be the "bad" quality. The teacher is a cunt.
|by Anonymous||reply 11||September 16, 2023 3:06 AM|
Depends. Is the drifter with no apparent skills cute? He may indeed have "skills" that are only apparent in certain situations.
|by Anonymous||reply 12||September 16, 2023 3:15 AM|
A watered down version of "The Case of the Speluncean Explorers" for rmiddle schoolers. Is this an Ayn Rand focused school? It's a little esoteric for DL?
|by Anonymous||reply 13||September 16, 2023 9:43 PM|
[quote] Is this an Ayn Rand focused school?
|by Anonymous||reply 14||September 16, 2023 9:46 PM|
Evangelical / conservative propaganda of the 1980s used to print variants of the quiz in order to outrage conservative readers against liberal education (supposedly college educators were subjecting their students to the quiz). Their playbook was pretty much identical to the manufactured outrage surrounding LGBTQ materials in libraries, drag reading hour, and CRT.
If the 'who would you save?' quiz survives today, it's because conservatives have kept it alive.
|by Anonymous||reply 15||September 16, 2023 10:29 PM|
Mmm.... drifter cock.
|by Anonymous||reply 16||September 16, 2023 11:39 PM|
Poisoned Dragon is like the preacher who drags everything back to the Bible.
|by Anonymous||reply 17||September 17, 2023 12:05 AM|
And then everyone wonders why America seems to be dumbing down.
|by Anonymous||reply 18||September 17, 2023 3:01 AM|
[quote]R17: Poisoned Dragon is like the preacher who drags everything back to the Bible.
I didn't mention the bible. You did.
|by Anonymous||reply 19||September 17, 2023 5:35 AM|
Why the fuck was this an assignment in a 5th grade health class?
And when did 5th grade become part of middle school?
|by Anonymous||reply 20||September 17, 2023 9:25 AM|
It's just another version of The Trolley Problem. And even an infant knows the best way to address it.
|by Anonymous||reply 21||September 17, 2023 9:47 AM|
Honestly, it's the stupidity of the teacher to hand out the assignment to 5th graders.
As part of a senior year seminar class within a civics and ethics course, it would/should make for interesting conversations and hypotheticals... but in 5th grade? Really?
|by Anonymous||reply 22||September 17, 2023 9:53 AM|
This is what we used to call a balloon debate. We were given roles in groups of six or eight and had to fight our corner as to why we should be last in the hot air balloon. I remember arguing with a fellow student who I really disliked so wouldn’t back down. In the end the lesson finished so it was deemed a draw and we were both saved. That always irked me.
|by Anonymous||reply 23||September 17, 2023 10:23 AM|
Is this a "tag yourself" game? In that case, the musician, obviously.
|by Anonymous||reply 24||September 17, 2023 1:54 PM|
From the 1960 s a very similar assignment. We had a list of physical types, men and woman, some described as good looking, some really smart, some with special skills.
We had to write an essay as to which ones we took into the bunker and would be saved as the rest of humanity died.
It’s one of 1-2 HS assignments that decades later still makes an impact.
This teacher above seems to have gone out of their way to make it a political social argument meant to inflame.
|by Anonymous||reply 25||September 17, 2023 2:02 PM|
It’s an interesting thought problem but if I had been one of the students who received the assignment I’d probably have saved whoever seemed to me to fit the profile of a person for whom the teacher had shown a preference.
I was a scheming little weasel and always looked for the shortest way to get a good grade.
|by Anonymous||reply 26||September 17, 2023 2:12 PM|
Imagine any of the students had a prostitute mother and they have this to the kid???? Right wingers are awful people.
|by Anonymous||reply 27||September 17, 2023 2:17 PM|
|by Anonymous||reply 28||September 17, 2023 2:17 PM|
[quote] always looked for the shortest way to get a good grade.
You had sex with your teachers?
|by Anonymous||reply 29||September 17, 2023 2:44 PM|
[quote] Imagine any of the students had a prostitute mother and they have this to the kid???? Right wingers are awful people.
I imagine Barron Trump being assigned this.
|by Anonymous||reply 30||September 17, 2023 2:45 PM|
I went to a Catholic high school (Marianists BTW) in the '70's and we had this assignment. No upset parents or any fuss as I remembered.
The choices were better, though IIRC, a 6 year old girl, a pregnant junkie, a gay male MD, a Hispanic gardener, a black agricultural expert who openly hated whites, an elderly female MD who badly needed glasses, a priest and I forget who else. We were put into small groups to discuss our choices and then present them to the rest of the class. I remember the teacher getting mad at the group who didn't want the gay MD.
Then, about 5 years ago I was driving east across the desert towards Salt Lake City and was listening to one of thise creepy AM stations. The DJ started in about how a nearby high school did this project and how horrible it was for the school to allow a teacher to assign this. It was a call-in show but I don't remember anyone calling in. I almost pulled over and called just to tell the guy he was really scraping the bottom of the barrel if this was the best he could think of for a talk radio subject.
|by Anonymous||reply 31||September 17, 2023 11:15 PM|
R20, fifth grade has been part of middle school in many districts/areas for decades.
|by Anonymous||reply 32||September 17, 2023 11:26 PM|
Yeah we did this in our theology class in 1972. But there was no description of the people. It was just, “You’re in a bunker, the bomb is about to drop and there’s a knock at the shelter door. There are people outside begging to be let in. But you only have enough food and water for the people inside the bunker.
This is an exercise that’s been around since the original Twilight Zone episode.
My position was no way am I opening that door. As soon as I do the bomb will go off and we’ll all die. Screw ‘em.
It was not the popular answer.
|by Anonymous||reply 33||September 17, 2023 11:37 PM|
|by Anonymous||reply 34||September 17, 2023 11:41 PM|
While I don't object to the assignment or discussion that would necessarily have to be included, I do think middle schools is simply too young.
Also, such a discussion needs to be part of a broader Ethics module which includes specific approaches to ethics, including academic and religious (unfortunately), before a meaningful discussion could be had. It needs to discuss the difference between ethics and morals.
[quote]Ethics or moral philosophy is a branch of philosophy that "involves systematizing, defending, and recommending concepts of right and wrong behavior".
Ethics discussions are not about "feelings" and asserting your beliefs. Rather it's about establishing an ethical standard which can be applied.
|by Anonymous||reply 35||September 18, 2023 12:04 AM|
It’s teaching judgementalism.
|by Anonymous||reply 36||September 18, 2023 12:24 AM|
Not really, R36. It causes one to reflect upon one's own potential judgementalism. Should one decline to select the prostitute or the gay architect, the question is prompted, "why?" Because of Christian value judgements? The exercise, run correctly, stands to expose those kinds of criteria as maladaptive, and potentially non-beneficial to the survival of the group as a whole.
That's why conservatives, especially Christians, get so worked up about the quiz.
|by Anonymous||reply 37||September 18, 2023 12:33 AM|
It’s teaching judgment.
|by Anonymous||reply 38||September 18, 2023 12:35 AM|
R38, it's teaching choices and how to think about them, which one might one day be called upon to make.
|by Anonymous||reply 39||September 18, 2023 12:39 AM|
Not appropriate for fifth-graders, as others have pointed out Did the scenarios use the term "prostitution whore"?
|by Anonymous||reply 40||September 18, 2023 12:44 AM|
[quote] A 31-year-old homosexual architect; A 50-year-old musician who used to be addicted to cocaine; A 28-year-old drifter with no apparent skills
Sounds like a party
|by Anonymous||reply 41||September 18, 2023 12:52 AM|
[quote]R40: Not appropriate for fifth-graders, as others have pointed out Did the scenarios use the term "prostitution whore"?
R40, this is beginning to sound very much like R36, R38 and yourself are all the same objector, just using sock accounts.
The example cited in OP's article said "A 38-year-old retired prostitute.
Fifth graders are generally between 10-11 years old. If any of these do not know what a prostitute is, then they are waaay too sheltered.
|by Anonymous||reply 42||September 18, 2023 12:53 AM|
That teacher needs mental health intervention
|by Anonymous||reply 43||September 18, 2023 12:54 AM|
|by Anonymous||reply 44||September 18, 2023 12:55 AM|
Bless them for the important, often thankless work they do in instructing our children in school, however nobody is ever going to be able to accuse many teachers of exhibiting common sense when they open their proverbial mouths with their own ill-conceived classroom lectures or assignment directions featuring those classic "What were they thinking?!" moments.
|by Anonymous||reply 45||September 18, 2023 1:01 AM|
[quote]R45: nobody is ever going to be able to accuse many teachers of exhibiting common sense when they open their proverbial mouths with their own ill-conceived classroom lectures or assignment directions featuring those classic "What were they thinking?!" moments.
The teacher didn't cook up this assignment herself, since versions of this kind of quiz have been circulating since the 1960s.
What's your reasoning here, exactly? 'How dare she rile up the MAGAts? What was she thinking?'
|by Anonymous||reply 46||September 18, 2023 1:06 AM|
My grandmother— a most formidable woman— taught school for 42 years and raised 6 children almost single-handedly.
And nothing annoyed her more than seeing what a useless bunch of dumb skanks most teachers are these days.
These days, it is not a profession that attracts smart people. That’s just how it is. It attracts arrested-development, no-impulse-control, lower class morons who think it’s some kind of high-powered career.
|by Anonymous||reply 47||September 18, 2023 1:22 AM|
And with R47, the attacks on teachers begin. Supposed source of the opinion? His 'formidible' grandmother.
The last several replies to me have all trended the same way, and are all from separate user accounts (get a load of R43's posting history - shit like, "Ye of little faith," "Dream on… when you get to hell you’ll be shit out of luck," "Just what the DL needs….. another atheist thread. Sad"). Some religious sock user, probably the same one who started the thread, is building towards staging yet another flame war with me, and I'm not in the mood. Concentrating multiple separate account replies, all thumbing themselves up, does not strengthen a point of view, nor does the one with the most socks win by virtue of numbers. I've said what I had to say here. The story does not warrant the outrage you're trying to generate for it, no matter whose grandmother you claim said what.
|by Anonymous||reply 48||September 18, 2023 1:44 AM|
[quote]It’s teaching judgment.
Exhausting. Life is judgment. As a practical matter people and situations SHOULD be judged. Otherwise, we don't judge Russia's war on the Ukraine. We don't judge the pedo or serial killer. We don't judge cheeto and maga idiots for being, well exactly what they are, idiots. I want to judge the monsters who beat and starve toddlers to death. I insist we judge the worthless scum who brutally killed Matthew Shepard.
[quote]The exercise, run correctly, stands to expose those kinds of criteria as maladaptive, and potentially non-beneficial to the survival of the group as a whole.
r37 is correct. Run correctly, it brings to light already existing biases and forces people to confront the basis upon which they make those judgments.
Also, done correctly, it would of necessity raise questions about why the same people who are "pro life" can also support the death penalty by forcing people to articulate the underlying "rules" which underpin ethical questions and positions.
|by Anonymous||reply 49||September 18, 2023 1:51 AM|
A 75-year-old priest
An attorney and his wife, an alcoholic, who refuse to be separated
A 31-year-old homosexual architect
A 50-year-old musician who used to be addicted to cocaine
A 28-year-old drifter with no apparent skills
None of these sound like they would enhance my own chances of survival sufficiently to pay for my supplies they would consume. Too bad none of them was a doctor.
|by Anonymous||reply 50||September 18, 2023 3:43 PM|
Isn't it just supposed to be people who can breed and repopulate the earth? In which case the gay architect shouldn't matter, he can still father kids, unless he's one of those trans gays. So you want a woman of child bearing age, or two, and some dudes.
|by Anonymous||reply 51||September 18, 2023 4:17 PM|
If you take the pregnant woman you'll want a doctor or doula too, unless you want to deliver the kid yourself.
I'd also prefer a builder to an architect. More practical.
|by Anonymous||reply 52||September 18, 2023 4:22 PM|
The key is to identify what the priority actually is.
Survival is more important than repopulation. The reality is that there likely isn't enough genetic diversity in that small group to make repopulation a viable goal. So, if repopulation is your goal, you'd also need to believe that other people survived in order to get a sufficiently diverse gene pool.
Second, you actually don't want people repopulating too quickly - you will have limited supplies until you can leave the shelter. The pregnant girl would reduce the legth of time you have supplies if she gives birth within the three months before it's safe to emerge. Frankly, it doesn't sound like it's a global apocalypse where repopulating the planet would be a necessary consideration, so surviving after exiting the shelter is a consideration - who has skills that would assist in that.
Frankly, the only definite person is the doctor, even if she's sterile.
Pending charge of brutality are not proven acts of brutality. The cop has his gun and is likely physically fit. Frankly, the group may need someone who is a bit brutal for protection once you emerge from the shelter - who knows what whether other groups might not become scavengers or decide eating other people like in The Road might not be the only option.
The point is that prioritizing repopulation may not be as worthwhile as prioritizing long-term survival.
An ethics discussion focuses on that type of thing, rather than the knee jerk reaction of saving the pregnant girl because...baaaaaby.
|by Anonymous||reply 53||September 18, 2023 5:32 PM|
We did a similar assignment in high school in the early 80's. They put us in a group and gave us job titles. I was a monk and the first to be voted out but not sure if it had anything to do with my title.
|by Anonymous||reply 54||September 18, 2023 5:44 PM|
You should have told them your Monk was an expert at making potato crisps. No survivors rebuilding society could turn away a good Chip Monk
|by Anonymous||reply 55||September 18, 2023 5:50 PM|
[quote]A 38-year-old retired prostitute
She must have been *very* successful to retire at 38.
|by Anonymous||reply 56||September 18, 2023 5:58 PM|
Everyone should have a few grains of fentanyl just in case they don’t get in.
|by Anonymous||reply 57||September 18, 2023 8:54 PM|
If it’s 4th or 5th graders there doesn’t need to be all this deciding about who’s going to repopulate the earth, whose skills will we need, etc. All you need to say is that a family is at the door, two adults and 5 chikdren, one of them a baby.
That’s all you need. Are you going to save a family with a baby? Or are you going to freeze them out? Will you just take the children? Just take the baby?
The nonsense of playing Nuclear Clue with a cast of homosexual prostitute architects, sexual-abusing comedians, child molesting priests, obese drug addicts with dental problems, etc is far too much for kids that age to plow through.
|by Anonymous||reply 58||September 20, 2023 5:33 PM|
R33/R58, did you even look at the list in the article? Because you seem to be going out of your way to exaggerate and distort it. There isn't "a family with a baby," or "children," or even a baby, since it's unborn.
[quote]The nonsense of playing Nuclear Clue with a cast of homosexual prostitute architects, sexual-abusing comedians, child molesting priests, obese drug addicts with dental problems, etc is far too much for kids that age to plow through.
Good thing none of that is listed in the assignment. "Kids that age" have been coping with it just fine, for decades. It doesn't sound like you can cope with it, though.
|by Anonymous||reply 59||September 20, 2023 6:12 PM|
Be honest with and require students of any age to make choices? We don't want them thinking at all!
|by Anonymous||reply 60||September 20, 2023 6:34 PM|
1. the hottest one 2. the second hottest one 3. the third hottest one 4. the fourth hottest one 5. the fifth hottest one 6. no one, i need two seats!
|by Anonymous||reply 61||September 20, 2023 6:37 PM|
[quote]The nonsense of playing Nuclear Clue with a cast of [bold]homosexual prostitute architects
|by Anonymous||reply 62||September 20, 2023 6:39 PM|
As a high school teacher, I find that assignment highly inappropriate.
|by Anonymous||reply 63||September 20, 2023 6:41 PM|
You want to keep the retired prostitutes around. Someone needs to carry on the blowjob skills.
|by Anonymous||reply 64||September 20, 2023 6:45 PM|
What exactly pissed off the parents? The actual scenario or the mentiong of hookers and cocaine? When did parents and kids turn into such pussies? I was reading Gone with the Wind at 6 or 7 and discussing slavery with my mother.
|by Anonymous||reply 65||September 20, 2023 6:48 PM|
[quote]If it’s 4th or 5th graders there doesn’t need to be all this deciding about who’s going to repopulate the earth, whose skills will we need, etc.
r58 - that's the path to indoctrination, not critical thinking.
While this exercise is too young and too advanced for elementary school kids, not identifying the basis upon which decisions are made is why we're living in a screwed up world today that is full of hypocrites crying about their "rights" while robbing other people of their actual rights.
For children that young the discussion should be around age appropriate questions:
- You’re with friends when they start teasing an unpopular kid, taking his things and calling him names. If you stick up for him, the group could turn on you. Do you stand up for the kid or stay silent.
- Your friend asks you if you like his new jacket. You don't. Should you lie or tell the truth and hurt his feelings.
- One of your friends steals candy from a store and offers you some. Do you take the candy?
|by Anonymous||reply 66||September 20, 2023 9:32 PM|