The Case Against SUVs and Crossovers

Everything is killing us, you're not going to make it out of this world alive, so don't try to place the blame on my crossover that sits 4 inches higher than a regular car 😠

This was me, a 5'3" adult crossing in a crosswalk once at night - my turn. He/she/it didn't seem to feel like stopping for me. My nose could have touched the top of the grill on that tank. Not happy. I stood there in the middle of the crosswalk and held up my arms as if to communicate WTF? They just shrugged.

Not just killing us, but LITERALLY killing us!

My RAV 4 is a delicate snowflake. It can’t get out of its own way. Plus it has sensors that go off if something is in front…also I know how to drive.

As for gas mileage, the brand new Chevy Malibu I rented on vacation sucked up more gas than the RAV.

I love my 2005 SUV RX 330.

When I see these massive vehicles I tend to think gas prices are too low.

Thank you OP. If only more people would listen. Just like I thought, the auto industry pretty much foisted them upon us, knowing full well that they weren't really safer or even roomier (!), but because of the profit margins. Clever, as this is capitalism at work, but also mercenary.

The bigger the SUV, the smaller the cock

It's fascinating how uncomfortable "luxury" SUVs are in comparison to luxury sedans and station wagons.

I have a luxury crossover that's fast, comfortable and pretty good on gas. I have a nice size dick and I know how to use it, but I don't do guys who don't like cars or make silly assumptions about cars and their drivers 😏

fantastic video, r10!

[quote] I have a nice size dick and I know how to use it

R10 Ooh, enchanteé! 😍

As for the topic at hand...I also have a luxury crossover that's quick, comfy, and fairly fuel-efficient.

Of course I would ditch the RAV for an Audi wagon but that’s not happening for a while.

I live in an urban neighborhood with very little off street parking. I have lived here since 1998. It has been quite the transition to watch it go from an area where there was rarely an issue with finding a parking space because many people didn't have cars (8 blocks from the core downtown shopping area,) and the cars that people did have were small. Over the last 25 years, most subcompacts have been discontinued, sedans have expanded, and cross-overs, SUVs, and huge pickups have taken over the neighborhood, taking up WAY more space.

In addition, they moved the bike lane from the left of the parking lane (outside of the door zone) to the right of the parking lane. This "protected" bike lane is directly in the door zone, and is more difficult to enter and exit mid block, due to the parked cars between the traffic lanes and the parking lane, plus the stanchions that mark the lane (I live on a one-way street, and the bike lane is on the far side from me.)

Moving the parking lane out to the far side of the bike lane also makes it more difficult to see oncoming traffic from cross-streets, especially as the parked vehicles become taller and taller. This results in cars pulling out across the bike lane, blocking it as they wait until they feel safe to turn onto my street, or cross through the intersection.

Small city cars for urban neighborhoods that are easy to parallel park seem to be a thing of the past. The Smartcar wasn't a great all around car, but it was great for trips through the downtown area, and was so incredibly easy to park.

Love this guys channel and I think I've posted this in a thread before. I drive for instacart/DD/etc. and my list of grievances about American traffic norms is about a mile long. These trucks are a fucking disgrace, you should absolutely be required to show some kind of proof or evidence that you have legitimate hauling or offroading needs. Half of the drivers of these behemoths are psychopathic sadists intent on making sure everyone knows they're the big bully on the road.

Someone please tell this to the Muslim headgear-wearing women driving the hugest ones on the roads and through intersection STOP signs and traffic lights like maniacs while gabbing away on their handheld cellphones and with their kiddie brigades filling up all the seats around and bheind them, as if there were actually a thoroughfare and surrounding pedestrians to pay attention to. Who got them their licenses, Helen Keller? And their huge vehicles, Chrissy Metz?!

R15 because of their small dicks

I never wanted an SUV, crossover, or pickup. Nothing against them, but happy with my sedan - don't need to be seated higher, and like the easier maneuverability and mpg. Then I became a homeowner, and I really wish I would have bought a medium SUV or small pickup before prices went through the roof. There is SO much shit that I get for the house that doesn't fit in my sedan.

^ That's the other thing I like about my crossover, I don't often need all the space, but I never think twice about how I'm going to get something home. I just fold down the seats and everything short of a refrigerator or sofa fits easily 🙂

A few years ago I was crossing on a pedestrian crossing and one of these huge SUVs nearly ran over me because she was looking the other way. I was in front of her car but managed to run/jump backwards (fuck knows how) and she swiped my body with the side of her tank as she went past still looking the other way. She didn't even notice and just kept going. The other cars behind her stopped and people got out to see if I was ok and needed medical attention. I think many of them thought I was a goner. Where I live, if you hit someone on a pedestrian crossing you may as well just throw your drivers licence away. It's very bad. This happened in a large city - not a rural area. So that was one of my experiences with SUVs.

[quote] There is SO much shit that I get for the house that doesn't fit in my sedan.

Won't the need to bring home large stuff stop, at some point?

A few years ago I was crossing on a pedestrian crossing and one of these little Smart For Two mini cars nearly ran me over so I kicked it like a bad puppy and it started to whimper and ran off as I yelled, ""Bad dog, go home!"

😠

R20 this happened to me too. Crossing the street at a green light when this massive Yukon Denali came bouncing around the corner. I had to step back. This happened several years ago. I don’t think that the driver even saw me.

It was quite a while ago now, but I worked at the State Roads Authority and had access, among other things, to its safety data.

Regarding small children run over and killed by cars reversing in their own driveways, 100% of the offending vehicles were SUVs. That's why they hastened to put reversing cameras and alerts on the side mirrors on the things.

@r21 "Won't the need to bring home large stuff stop, at some point? "

No, because then you have to buy new big stuff to replace the old big stuff

Do you think adding emojis to your arguments improves your argument R2? It doesn’t. You’re probably typing them while driving, swerving in annd out or your lane and barreling down on some poor unsuspecting pedestrian in your enormous wanker-mobile.

^ Who are you talking to?

Big SUVs have now become the most sold new vehicles in Europe, thanks to these shitty trends coming over from the US and because they have better margins than smaller cars. But the moment China tries selling affordable regular-sized cars to us, our carmakers start screaming bloody murder and calling for protectionist measures.

Our roads and parking places were not designed for these gaudy vehicles, this blows.

Sorry R27, R10

I can relate to R2 because it's happened to me multiple times as a pedestrian. But R1 sounds like exactly the type of entitled, small-dick-energy asshole who can't bother coming to a complete stop while driving a tank down a residential street because he can't see pedestrians from his stupid truck.

I have a 16 year old Prius that I can fit a 10 foot surfboard inside. No need for a SUV, crossover, or truck. Plus the gas milage is great.

I'm surprised that Europe is embracing larger cars, as a lot of roads and parking spaces in lots are tiny.- we were in southern spain in 5 different cites, with a normal sized car and Austin Powering a lot of parking spaces in the garages.

Interesting that several of us have called them "tanks".

Also interesting that several have had the same experiences on pedestrian crossings. I wonder how many people are killed like that? I was pretty lucky as I would have gone under her car and she did hit me with the side of the bonnet and then the side of the car. I still remember how hard it felt. She didn't run my legs or feet over thankfully. I was very lucky. An older person who wasn't as fast would have been killed.

The driver didn't even notice.

I wish more pedestrians would "stand their ground" and yell "I feel threatened" and shoot the asshole drivers who run lights and ignore traffic rules. I mean, fuck, you can shoot a driver who turns around in your driveway or someone who accidently knocks on your door, why not drivers who roll through stop signs?

Florida’s law states “a person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force, if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.”

Laws in at least 28 states and Puerto Rico allow that there is no duty to retreat an attacker in any place in which one is lawfully present. (Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, Florida, Georgia, Idaho, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Michigan, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nevada, New Hampshire, North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, South Dakota, Tennessee, Texas, Utah and West Virginia Wyoming.)

as a cyclist I totally agree

Bush 2003 tax cut gave 1 100k tax break for gas guzzlers, and ZERO for e-cars, and then in 2014 congress upped it to 500k for ANY giant vehicle.

OP- The ONLY thing that is good for the enviornment is living in a community that does not necessitate the need for a vehicle( or even a public conveyance) to begin with. Where one can walk EVERYWHERE- job,school, doctor, supermarket, park, visiting friends.

@r28, "Big SUVs have now become the most sold new vehicles in Europe, thanks to these shitty trends coming over from the US"

Leave it to Europe to copy every American trend then bitch about it

@r29... Screw you 😠

- r10 🙂

I'm with r31, I have a 2009 Prius that I love. I live in Tesla and SUV Land, but I keep reminding myself that no one has their vehicles paid off yet except for me.

I'm tired of the tanks. I've seen a few just barrel into left turns as if to say, "I'm the biggest here, adjust"!

I like compact, unique crossovers like the previous generation of the Kia Sportage or the Mazda CX-30. They have carlike features like the ride and handling. Or a Volvo CC wagon. They are basically jacked wagons. But it stops there.

I hate to break it to you, but many obnoxious big-truck/SUV drivers actually have nice, non-small dicks. At this point, it's SUVs and trucks are such a norm that it's not even much of a macho statement, unless someone really goes huge, bling-y, and tricked out - but you even see those all the time.

[quote] The ONLY thing that is good for the enviornment is living in a community that does not necessitate the need for a vehicle( or even a public conveyance) to begin with. Where one can walk EVERYWHERE- job,school, doctor, supermarket, park, visiting friends

A funny thing happened on the way to creating a “walkable” town. A village decided it was the perfect place for boomers to retire. A small town with a small harbor. One block of the village was gentrified with restaurants and a bake shop. The next block over was a little sketchy, but it had some businesses.

“I know! We’ll build apartment buildings all along that area!”

Ok, so they start tearing down houses, old shops, they just pulled down a seafood restaurant that was there for 30 years. They’re building apartments like crazy. But the apartments are making the rest of the village real estate prices go sky high.

So what happened?

Businesses can no longer afford rents. The businesses shut down. Restaurants have shut down. The only supermarket in the village shut down. The supermarket right outside of town closed down. Now there is no walkable supermarket, nor even a supermarket that’s a short drive away.

McDonald’s even closed down.

And rents are outrageous in all the new apartments. It’s about $2200 for a one bedroom. And there isn’t enough parking for all the new apartment buildings because people weren’t supposed to need cars because everything was supposed to be “walkable.” But there’s almost no place to walk to, except CVS.

Late stage capitalism, folks. It’s all about using money to make more money for those who already have money. And boomers aren’t paying $2200 for a one bedroom apartment, plus having to maintain 2 cars. They’ve paid off their houses. Why sell their paid off house to live in an inconvenient place that’s far more expensive than just staying where they are?

Let’s start a grass roots movement right here on Datalounge! End the tyranny of SUVs and crossovers! Stop buying them! Don’t drink the Koolaid!

[quote]I wish more pedestrians would "stand their ground" and yell "I feel threatened" and shoot the asshole drivers who run lights and ignore traffic rules.

You first.

Walkable downtowns died in the 1970s when women went to work. Women wanted to be able to pick up kids, groceries and whatever else on the way home, so they had to drive. That meant they had to park, so malls were born, with plentiful parking and even more stuff you might want to pick up on the way home (dry cleaning, etc).

Now men buy SUVs for their wives and kids, believing that it's the best way of protecting them on the roads, particularly if they think their wives are dodgy drivers, which many do. The fact that this must endanger others doesn't feature.

Yeah that's right, blame the women for that.

[quote] particularly if they think their wives are dodgy drivers, which many do

Women are far safer drivers than men.

Proof r48?

I have fastback car with fold down seats. I never have a problem with cargo.

^ You need more stuff... Otherwise if you die nobody here will want your stuff 😏

r25 had changes in their neighborhood in 25 years!

omg!

^ I'm r25 and I have no idea what you just said 🙄

You’re about 25 years too late with this thread. But good luck changing anything. 👍🙄

Bike lanes are more dangerous than any car. People on bikes REFUSE to cede to pedestrians. I almost got run over by a bitch on a Citibike who wanted to roar through a crosswalk when I had the light, and she grumbled at me like I was supposed to give her the right of way.

Most cyclists don’t obey traffic rules. Running red lights, cutting off cars. They recently created bike lanes in my South Philadelphia neighborhood and it has fucked up traffic during rush hours.

Whenever I see one of those tanks roll by with a bubba inside I always think, “Sorry about your Dick”!

^ Then Bubba whips it out and slaps you silly 😜

[quote] Proof, R48?

[quote]Proof [R48]?

Any road crash statistics you care to look up that are organised by gender, with the possible exception of pedestrian deaths, will show you women are much better drivers than men. Many men prioritise things like getting to their destination 3 minutes faster, not letting anyone cut in front of you and how fast you can start up when the lights go green: women tend to prioritize survival, thus earning the contempt of said men, but surely the best driver is the one who lives to tell the tale. (Yes, young women are driving more aggressively these days, but trust me, they've got a loooonnngg way to go to catch up statistically.)

I was not blaming women for the closure of downtowns. I was pointing out the sociological factors that meant it was inevitable once women went to work. You could put it this way: male oppression was the reason downtowns were so successful for so long, because they exist for people who have plenty of time for shopping, which in those days was only women and retirees.

They may even rise once more if everyone keeps working from home half the week.

People got ginormous in America. Ain't no way these 400 lb mastodons going to fit in a Dodge Neon.

OP, this channel is great and I wish more people knew about it. Thanks for sharing! More people should visit Strongtowns.org. FYI, I think some of the most depressing pictures are the "before and after" pics of American cities before and after Urban Renewal. Take a small city like Dayton, Ohio. It looks like complete shit now but it was stunning not too long ago.

I’ve noticed that drivers can’t seem to make a sharp right turn in these large SUVs. The right turns are wide and I have to stop short at a stop sign so they can make the turn.

I drive a 2017 Toyota Camry LE- jealous bitches?

Being an elderly person, I have seen trends become big and disappear. There used to be "the" car, say a Chevy or Ford: 2 door coupe, 2 door hardtop (pillarlesss), 4 door same, convertible and station wagon. All they sold were variation of given one car. There are no longer any of the Thunderbird-type or Celica cars. I drive a hybrid midsize car presently. I may have to go to some kind of SUV next. Both the sedans and my ability to get in and out of keep getting lower.

[quote]I may have to go to some kind of SUV next. Both the sedans and my ability to get in and out of keep getting lower.

I drove a Toyota Camry for 20 years and would have bought another one this year when it came time for a new car. But I moved up to a RAV4 precisely because it's easier for my parents to get in and out of it when I'm shepherding them to doctors' appointments and such.

I once saw an Expedition Excursion Suburban Denali vehicle knock down a hapless Chinese grandma like she was a bowling pin.

I’m just sick of seeing them on the streets! My own protests are like a candle burning in the wind not unlike OP but the only thing I can do is to not buy one. I haven’t owned a car since the early 00’s.

Another good article about the uselessness of SUVs

I hate when they can't make a right turn but have to swing out to the left like a semi. Those Denalis are grotesquely huge and can barely fit into a parking space. Very popular with the soccer fraus here. I'm assuming they can throw the brats in the back and seal them off with their electronic parent while mom yacks on her phone.

I have a Sonic hatchback. It's enough cargo space for me, and my 5'1" frame doesn't have to jump to get into it.

Unfortunately, driving on highways is very difficult because I get caught in the 'draft' of the tanks that surround me.

How else is Elderlez going to carry around her cane collection?

What happened to all the humvees from the George Bush II era? I never see them on the road

Where have all the Humvees gone? Long time passing. Where have all the Azteks gone? Long time ago. Where have all the Daihatsu Rocky's gone? The girls have picked them every one. Wait, what Oh, When will you ever learn? Oh, When will you ever learn?

Gotta love the huge dualies that are hiked up so high the driver needs a ladder to get into them. These fucking redneck assholes should be killed.

My 2015 Honda Fit has tons of room, is very economical, and fun. There's no need for these giant vehicles.

a "crossover," r76.

I have a 2023 Bolt EUV and I love the thing. It's a small x over and has more than enough room.for my needs.

I can’t stand huge pickup trucks UNLESS the driver actually use a truck to haul stuff for their occupation.

And the majority of bullying on roads is committed by the redneck asshats who drive these hideous vehicles.

And the purposely noisy ones can go to hell. Ugh! Fucking little boys terrorizing everyone.

Their greater mass makes for slower acceleration and longer braking distances, their longer wheelbase means they can’t turn as tightly as smaller vehicles, and their higher center of gravity makes them more prone to a rollover. You may have a better chance of surviving an accident in an SUV, but you’re more likely to get in one.

R76 I was surprised at how roomy Fits are. It sucks Honda stopped making them. Great city cars.

Supposedly carmakers lose money on small cars. They usually build them to meet CAFE requirements in America. In Europe fuel has never been cheap so smaller vehicles make more sense to own. I have met Europeans who were truly appalled by how large and garish US cars were in the 80s and 90s. And this was AFTER The Great Downsizing we had.

R81, not just city. We take a 4-5k road trip in the fall. We carry everything but the kitchen sink.

My old boss has a GMC Sierra pickup. No boat, no side hustle that requires a truck. No wife and kids (not gay, just nerdy and uptight af) He just wanted one.

They all pretty much do look alike. To compensate for this, they give them ugly grilles and stupid tack-ons like floating roofs. Floating roofs are questionable on sedans and plain old ugly on these giant boxes.

What is a floating roof?