Bradley Cooper accused of ‘Jewface’ over prosthetic nose in Leonard Bernstein biopic ‘Maestro’

Not exactly MF but this couldn’t have been posted in the active thread?

If he had done the same thing to play Jimmy Durante, would it be wopface?

No r1 because then op would not get enough ATTENTION.

Go ahead and “Jewface.”

Shewfashe.

Oh lawdy, what group would be offended if he played Karl Malden?

OP - you're right, R3. I posted this just to annoy the shit out of you.

Have a great day!

Oy vey

I’m sorry to disappoint you, but the desperate thirst is amusing, not annoying.

Bernstein had was Jewish and looked Jewish. He was proud and rightly so. No reason to be ashamed.

Oh. I saw the stills the other day and then the little trailer that shows them aging. And it was clear they have prosthetics to look older, but I didn’t even notice the nose. He looks different but I thought it was the wig and eyebrows. I’m not sure I would have noticed the difference between that and his real nose without someone pointing it out to me.

This is exhausting and the producers need to push back firmly and insist on creative freedom and an unwillingness to stifle the freedom of expression.

Why didn't they just hire a jew?

R13 where on Earth were they going to find a Jewish or half-Jewish/half-Swedish bisexual who wanted to play this role?

R13 -

Apparently, Jake Gyllenhaal competed with Bradley Cooper for the music rights. Leonard Bernstein's estate chose BC's project:

Oh wow this was actually at Paramount before they stopped making prestige movies.

The Bernstein children were always going to choose the spec which portrayed their parent’s love story in rose colored glasses over I’m assuming Gyllenhaal’s tortured character study.

The Bernstein family has been in a state of denial since Lenny's death. Why stop now?

The nose was unnecessary. But honestly, who cares? Who is proud of someone because they share a race or religion?

He looks like he has a chin prosthetic too in OP.

R14 brings up an interesting point: will they straightwash Bernstein?

Very perceptive r19

Jews are pissed off and complaining about something? OMG this is something new.

Actually, they complain far less than straight white Christian men.

If the nose had been " non-Jewish," someone would have complained that the producers were trying to whitewash the character and not make him seem Jewish. You can't win, so fuck 'em all.

Everything is offensive these days.

It's a shanda for the neighbors!

I hope he doesn’t smoke!

I'm annoyed. Do you find this annoying?

Did they have to give him "gayface" too?

[quote] Why didn't they just hire a jew?

Because 1. Bradley Cooper developed the project; 2. Bradley Cooper is a star and guarantees greater viewership; 3. Bradley Cooper looks a lot more like the handsome Maestro than other stars despite him not being Jewish; 4. "They" don't ask stupid questions like you.

And how would hiring a Jew would have made it better?

Sorry, double woulds.

If you knew Lenny, Bradley is accurately portraying Big Gay Dick - face.

Isn't Bradley part Jew on his father's side?

I fear this will reignite the horrible Nicole Kidman/Woolfface scandal that tore so many families apart in 2002.

I’m still in therapy as a result R35.

No Irish father Italian mother.

BC played The Elephant Man without any prosthetics, and somehow not a single elephant complained, R24.

I watched the trailer yesterday and in the first scene with Cooper and Mulligan sitting with their backs to each other, Cooper's prosthetic nose was noticeable in a not-good way. Looked almost comical.

In scenes with Cooper playing the older Lenny, the nose wasn't so bad, probably due to it blending in better with what other makeup there was.

The nose looks like Bernstein's but it doesn't fit with Bradley's face. You can tell Bradley didn't grow that nose.

Did he get circumcised for the role? Or is he trying to dickwash us!

He's probably already circumcised. Most American men are.

Oh for fuck sake, not another fake outrage.

Wait until they discover that Lenny dabbled in the homosex

I think it’s time to cancel Lon Chaney. He’s gotten away with this long enough.

Jewish guys typically have big ones and Bradley doesn’t, so there’s that.

I've been with quite a few Jewish guys and they all had BIG ones.

R47 = He means their wallets

jewfayshe

Does Ari Melber have a big one?

R49 see r5

[quote]Shewfashe

Why would Liza pronounce 'Jew' as 'shew'?

No one criticized Oppenheimer for having 2 non Jews play the Jewish leads nor all the foreign actors playing Americans in the film.

I don't care what people get their panties in a wad about anymore. If we all just ignore the widdle biddy foot stompers, we'd all be better off.

R52 you don’t know how many drinks she’s had

[quote]Jewish guys typically have big ones and Bradley doesn’t, so there’s that.

First, I don’t think that Bernstein had a particularly big nose. He was extremely handsome and had a handsome nose. I have a bigger nose and I like it isn’t fine. It’s not oddly shaped or crooked or “hooked” (which I hate as an expression because a “hooked nose” is a negative Jewish stereotype).

But I also wouldn’t say Bradley Cooper doesn't have a big nose. His nose is longer and pointed, downturned and the tip of his nose is well below where his nostrils meet his face.

And I posted above I didn’t even NOTICE the prosthetic nose (or chin apparently) until it was news. If anything, Cooper looks slightly more handsome with the prosthetic than without it because they lowered the sides to where the tip and his nostrils are even. Cooper has a witchy nose and looks better with the prosthetic!

And I did skim the article earlier but I’ve already forgotten what it said, but I recall they mentioned Sarah Silverman talking about “Jewface” on a podcast several years ago, and SHE’S IN THE MOVIE. I kinda feel like if Sarah Silverman thinks it’s problematic and then went to work with Cooper in the movie and saw the prosthetic and was upset about it, she’d have an hour long Netflix comedy special devoted to the topic by this point.

So I’m not saying that people don’t have the right to take offense, or that Sarah Silverman is the arbiter of what crosses the line, but this all just seems like a tempest in a teapot. If these stories go on until the movie is released, I’ll be surprised, but otherwise, I’m kinda expecting Bradley Cooper and Carey Mulligan to get Oscar nominations and we’ll all have forgotten about Nosegate by the end of the year.

I like Cooper and love Mulligan as actors and even though the trailer was really just the two of them sitting back to back laughing, it seemed so sweet and genuine that I’m looking forward to seeing a movie I really didn’t think I’d be interested in otherwise.

I wonder what Bernstein’s family thinks about the prosthetics. If they release a statement saying they’ve seen the movie or clips and love how the story is being told, everyone is probably gong to have to zip it about the prosthetics.

The prosthetics made Cooper more handsome than he is in real life.

But maybe I’m biased. I like big noses.

But the Jews run Hollywood so they must be ok with it because otherwise they would have stopped it.

R56, when I said "big ones" at R46, I was referring to cock size.

No mutilation

That’s a big nose !

R56, the family issued a statement. They're fine with the faux nose.

My God, he looks like a comic accurate The Joker.

R58, my mistake. I have no comment on Cooper’s , Bernstein’s or my own cock.

R61, thanks. I just googled and read their statement. I home that’s the end of this little tempest.

The chin looks more pronounced than the nose in that photo.

In any event, this kerfuffle over prosthetic noses doesn’t bode well for any future Barbra biopics.

It isn't because his family speaks only for themselves and they, by their own admission, did not grow up in a particularly observant home. I think it sucks that when the issue of Jewish representation comes up, the response is always "Well, duh, they're actors and they can pretend to be anything they want." No other group gets this. On the other hand, most American Jews are secular Jews and many come from mixed homes. The numbers of people who feel a need to see Jewish actors in Jewish roles, apart from the slimy lawyers on SVU, is a minority within a minority.

I have no doubt that Maestro will suck, as all Bradley Cooper passion projects do, but this won't be why.

Does the man go up into the man in this movie?

Well, r66, Matt Bomer's in it for some gay reason or other, nu?

Bradley Cooper already has a large nose and he resembles Cohen enough that this was overkill. This isn't Nicole Kidman playing Virginia Woolf, which was bad enough.

Leonard Bernstein, not Leonard Cohen.

Lenny also had a big, teenager-loving dick. Is that portrayed accurately?

I didn't think so.

male teenagers.

Now he's got Jewface and Gayface.

It's a shanda for the goyim!

I wonder if Bradley got a piece of Bomer while making this movie.

[quote] Leonard Bernstein, not Leonard Cohen.

I thought we were talking about Leonard Nimoy!

[quote]Leonard Bernstein, not Leonard Cohen.

Oh lord. I am always getting these two names mixed up.

I’ve never seen more damage to a Jew’s face than that time Streisand tried to pull off crimped hair in the 80s.

Actor gets made up to look like historical real-life person he is portraying.

Yeah, "Jewface", sure, whatever.

They are going to straighwash Bernstein, aren't they?

I guess Ingrid Bergman had “Jewface” too when she played Golda Meir with makeup to make her resemble Mrs. Meir. But back then all we cared about was a good performance.

The Marxist white 'progressives' are ruining the arts.

Too much censorship and woke* propaganda being shoehorned into movies/shows/music/art in general.

*anti-white, anti-men, anti-America, anti-police, anti-femininity in women/girls, anti-masculinity in men/boys, anti-women and anti-biology when it comes to the trans/nonbinary issue.

[quote]No one criticized Oppenheimer for having 2 non Jews play the Jewish leads nor all the foreign actors playing Americans in the film.

Yes, that's getting very annoying.

A lot of that has to do with the white 'progressives' currently in charge of the U.S. media/entertainment industry.

On top of being anti-white and anti-men, they are anti-America -- pretty much self-loathing in every way if you're a male 'progressive.'

I have friends who are working actors who complain discreetly about the anti-America atmosphere in LA and NY.

Many of them resent foreigners being cast in American productions as American characters and costing them roles/opportunities.

But they're afraid to speak up publicly. At least at this time, when Hollywood is very 'woke.'

R13 "Why didn't they just hire a jew?"

Because, obviously there are not enough Jews in Hollywood (sarcasm).

As a Jew, I think being offended by this is beyond ridiculous and I think most other Jews would agree with me. It would be different if it was an exaggerated prosthesis like antisemitic caricatures of Jews. The only time I've seen that done in a modern movie is in Coming 2 America (Eddie Murphy portraying an old Jewish man as an exaggerated stereotype). That didn't upset me either, but I can see how some people could get their nose out of joint. Certainly you could not do the opposite today (Jew to look Black in a similar type comedy).

And he has scary Carey Mulligan tanning up as a spicy Costa Rican Jew.

Jewish people are still white at the end of the day. Could care less if a non Jew plays a Jew.

My sisters BF is a Russian Jew and he voted for Trump twice. Jews are still white despite the discrimination they face.

Fuck you, r86. May I direct you to my book “Jews Don’t Count”?

Did he get the gayface right, at least?

Did Bradley Cooper direct himself in a gay sex scene in this film?

This is getting ridiculous.

1.) There is no 'Jewfacing' or bigotry here: Bernstein's own *kids* handpicked Bradley to play their father. They approved the nose and said so to the Times. If, as it appears, he was in competition with Jakey G, then you have LB's *JEWISH* fam passing on *JEWISH* Jake Gyllenhaal for..... Goyim Cooper. There must be a reason. Perhaps it has to do with talent and merit and intention- things all the clannish freaks of the world have no interest in today.

2.) Nor will there be any 'straight washing.' The trailer has Bernstein tenderly caressing the face of a young MALE acolyte and then *kissing* him in yet another scene (where his wife walks in). Perhaps the film will be more suggestive than it is overt.....but given that this storyline appears in the damn *teaser*, I think it's safe to say that the filmmakers are clear on Bernstein's proclivities.... and want you to be too.

I, for one, think it looks pretty good and am eager to check it out. Let's just be thankful it's a story about a fascinating, intelligent, adult human.... and not another goddamn Marvel movie whey have to go find some glowy thing.

If you had to create a "wokeface" to play a woke person, what would it look like?

R91. Comme ça

How ridiculous. In the costume - Cooper is an excellent likeness of Bernstein. Good enough to be believable for a film.

I don't like Cooper and I won't be watching this.

The nose looks ridiculous he looks like a fucking troll.

I eat old people’s excrement.

Has Lucille Ball commented yet?

Who even remembers what Leonard Bernstein looked like? Bradley didn't need to go full 90s SNL.

And I eat it after R94 vomits it all up.

What I’m more offended by is the idea this will be like The Imitation Game and focus on a gay man’s relationship with a woman (yes, he was gay, not bisexual - he married Felicia for social safety like many high profile gay men of his time did) as a way of making him palatable.

There was outcry about nonJews playing Jews in Oppenheimer. Go look it up.

Bernstein's kids are not the authoritative voice on Jewish representation. It's nice they're happy with this performances but that doesn't replace critical opinion.

Jews come in all colors. If skin color is the criteria forc authenticity in casting, then no one would ever need to cast a gay man to play a gay man.

If you ever saw Bernstein conduct, you remember how he looked and especially how he moved. That's a critical part of the performance.

I sympathize with the Jewface arguments but no one ever points to someone better qualified for the part. Jake Gyllenhaal? Get serious.

These threads and discussion always invite antisemitic comments. There are better forums for them.

Jake Gyllenhaal is definitely a better actor.

It's all fake outrage. Like men screaming bloody murder about "the patriarchy".

Jewish groups were upset about AlecGuinness playing Fagin in David Lean’s version of Oliver Twist with an enormous ‘Semitic’ nose, only a few years after WWII. Cuts had to be made in the film in the US. This nose isn’t on that level at all.

Jake Gyllenhaal wouldn't be a bad choice.

[quote]The Bernstein children were always going to choose the spec which portrayed their parent’s love story in rose colored glasses over I’m assuming Gyllenhaal’s tortured character study.

I read this as this...

The bridge on the nose is too high and looks silly

He's always had a reptilian beak, didn't even notice a prosthetic until stumbling on this thread.

I mean that’s the oddness of it

They do makeup tests and shit

At what point did someone not say, “Hey! This is wrong!”

The problem I think is when you have somebody doing everything like Cooper, there’s no strong opposing force like a producer to correct bad ideas. Woody Allen’s films took a serious decline in quality when his sister began producing them; and if you look at Wes Anderson’s last two films which were not produced by Scott Rudin, there was a huge drop in quality.

There’s a good clip of George Lucas during the production of Phantom Menace (oddly another film full of racist stereotypes) and Lucas cracks a small joke and the crew around him laughs like it’s the funniest thing in the world. And we know how that film turned out.

I don't think that Jake Gyllenhaal with one Jewish parent, a hippie bar mitzvah at a homeless shelter, and an obvious rhinoplasty is a more authentic choice for this role. The only question is whether the prosthesis is exaggerated. Who knows?

[quote]The nose looks ridiculous he looks like a fucking troll.

You've obviously never met Leonard Bernstein

Bernstein was handsome when he was younger, but he did not age well. Short men wear added weight very badly.

^^he also smoked like a motherfucker.

"A Bradley Cooper Film"

I'll wear any nose I want.

What about the gayface?

When will the imbeciles stop clamoring for actors to be of the same ethnic and national provenance as their characters? It's called ACTING, stoopid.

Bradley Cooper is a desperate ham.

I truly don't understand why people are discussing Gyllenhaal. I looked it up and Maestro has been filmed and completed and is due for its debut at the Venice International Film Festival on September 2, 2023.

R77 lmao

Because Gyllenhaal had a competing Leonard Bernstein project which fell apart when the Bernstein family chose Cooper’s project and gave him the rights to use his recordings. Gyllenhaal had wanted to do a biopic with Cary Fukunaga.

Oh I see R119. Thanks for explaining.

Cary fuck u what?

This is so minuscule and it’s just hateful attempt to bar Cooper from the Oscar. He is the greatest mainstream actor of his peer group.

OK.

R122-Yes. He's this century's version of that incredible actor, Rock Hudson.

Rock Hudson didn’t give smarminess.

More like Diet Warren Beatty.

Leo is shooketh. BC is the hottest, closeted mainstream film star in town.

Haha, but all jokes aside BC is a really brilliant actor. He is better than Leo and Leo used to be my favorite film star because he chose or got offered the best projects.

Remember when Leo and Bradley were papped on a hotel balcony together? They looked like they'd been fucking all night. That was funny.

First Oppenheimer played by someone name Cillian, Feynman by a man who looks like a leprechaun and Einstein by an Italian Scot, now this.

Oy!

Is there nothing left in Hollywood for the Jews?

'A' gay scene? His homosexuality was a very important part of his life. There would need to be as much white washing as in the Cole Porter film 'Night and Day.'

R127 that was funny.....you know it's true.

[quote] Bradley Cooper is a desperate ham.

Your point being?

The main point being is Al Pacino is a ham, but he’s not a desperate one.

Not all Jews have big noses, for chrissake. I'm Jewish and have an average nose, as does everyone in my family. Others none big nosed Jews include Jake Gyllenhaal, Natalie Portman, Paul Rudd and plenty of others.

[quote]Jake Gyllenhaal is definitely a better actor.

That's debatable, lol.

Although Jewish, Jake has had a nose job in real life...don't want to be pigeon-holed as "too Jewy", huh?

In WHAT universe is Bradley Cooper a talented actor amongst any groups, aside from community theatre menageries?

'jew eat'?

He ought to do The Jimmy Durante Story

Gyllenhaal and Portman had nose jobs. Portman's nose wasn't particularly big but Gyllenhaal's was.

He was great bicycling across Peru on GlobeTrekker, had thighs like Eric Heiden back then.

It’s honestly fake clickbait.

No one really has a problem with it.

This is sensationalism. A few people on social media said something and it’s “OUTRAGE”.

It’s just a way to work people up, no one cares.

Completely agree with you R140. Overall - it's a very good way to drum up publicity for the film by employing social media outrage and I think this is what's going on.

Winona Ryder is also Jewish and has a nice small nose.

But she has big hands and pockets.

R127-Considering what a hairy chest Cooper had in The Hangover, it looks like he had Leo shave his body before they fucked.

Not to get too crazy but if JG’s mother was Jewish he is Jewish. And if only his father was Jewish, he isn’t,(according to Orthodox folk.)

[quote] Not to get too crazy but if JG’s mother was Jewish he is Jewish. And if only his father was Jewish, he isn’t,(according to Orthodox folk.)

The Orthodox absolutely do not get to decide for everyone else who is not Orthodox.

If his father is Jewish and he identifies as ethnically Jewish, he's ethnically Jewish.

Naomi Foner is Jewish, r145. Stephen Gyllenhaal is Swedenborgian. But as r146 asserts, if your father's Jewish, you're allowed to call yourself Jewish. IMO anyway.

Jake is looking more Jewy as he gets older.

Winona Ryder had a nosejob.

Nope,Judaism is matralineal. Your mother has to be Jewish to be considered Jewish.

Matrilineal descent is a cultural tradition

Physiognomy is not passed through traditions, it’s passed through genes

Ergo, when someone is said to “look Jewish” it is implied they have features associated with Askenazi (why they haven’t changed that spelling) Jews of Central and Eastern Europe

Thus Jake Gyllenhaal is 1/2 Askenazi Jewish whether his mother or father is an Askenazi Jewish descendant

This is shorted to half-Jewish because the inference to genes, rather than religionm is sociolinguisticly coded, like how Charlize Theron, a woman born in Africa who now lives in America, is not considered African American

Sigh

Thanks God they didn't cast Mary Martin as Fanny Brice.

I love the Jewish people. They enrich our society. Jesus Christ is Jewish as are so many prominent and influential people.

When they were creating Funny Girl and were considering Mary Martin Sondheim said whoever played Brice had to have a nose.

Before his nose job I believe Dean Martin was jewish.

Dean Martin was Italian

Fake outrage clickbait to get people to read their bullshit.

Forget the Jewface what bout the Jewcock

They didn't need to try to make Cooper look more like Bernstein. When Jimmy Stewart played Glenn Miller they gave him a pair of frameless glasses and he learned to play trombone. Robert Alda didn't look like Gershwin, Tyrone Power playing Eddie Duchin still looked like Tyrone Power. Renee Zellweger didn't look exactly like Judy Garland. Bradley Cooper could have forgone the absurd putty nose and no one would have cared how much he resembled Lenny Bernstein or not. The current movie audience is not that familiar with what Bernstein looked like, anyway.

Funny how Leonard Bernstein was such a big celebrity in his day but now he's half forgotten. I was a teenager when he died and it was huge news, the lead story in major media outlets. I doubt most people under 40 or so even know about him.

This is Bradley's "Gimme That Fuckin' Oscar Already!" film.

Well there weren't that many famous American-born symphony conductors, and he made a splash when he was young - simultaneously he was also a Broadway songwriter and a composer of jazz-inspired, American-style dance music. But it's true he's not remembered like, say, George Gershwin.

Such a collection of kuni lemels.

I was thinking that, r163. Thank you for having the presence of mind to type. You bring us naches with the old words.

Bitch stole my act.

Celebrity by its nature is ephemeral and artists live on through their work; and Leonard Bernstein’s work was interpreting other people’s work. His only widely remembered original cultural contribution is the music of West Side Story and he didn’t even write the lyrics. Seventy years of rock/pop/r&b as the dominant musical art form has conditioned people to view the singer/band as the “genius” behind whatever hope/inspiration/happiness music provides listeners. Ergo, the great affection many people of my generation have for Natalia Imbruglia’s Torn and the shock many people feel when they learn it is a cover.

Additionally, Hollywood has trained people to want to see the performer “recreated” in the music biopic.

Bradley Cooper’s failure in developing this movie was not understanding that this wasn’t a music biopic because no one remembers exactly what Leonard Bernstein performing looked like. People remember what George and Tammy looked and sounded like, they do not remember what Leonard Bernstein looked and sounded like. It was so wildly unnecessary to do the prosthetic, which is why people are offended. He could have shown up without it and people would have just accepted it, because that’s how movies work. Ergo, Cleopatra is always a raven-haired sexpot like Elizabeth Taylor, Scarlett O’Hara is always beautiful despite the very first words of the book being “Scarlett O’Hara was not beautiful,” and a Velociraptor is a six foot tall reptilian monster instead of a three-foot tall turkey with hands and claws. The movies dictate what people see.

Bernstein spent some time on campus when I was at college......he loved the boys....and some of them loved him back.

Bernstein wrote the music for On The Town and Candide in addition to West Side Story. And his recordings are readily available. The fact that most people under,40 haven’t heard of him doesn’t mean his music won’t still be listened to in years to come.

[quote]People remember what George and Tammy looked and sounded like, they do not remember what Leonard Bernstein looked and sounded like.

I have no idea what Tammy looked like (though I remember "D-I-V-O-R-C-E" from the jukebox at the Ninth Circle), and I only know what George looked like because of the links provided on DL to "He Stopped Loving Her Today." OTOH, I've known what Lenny looked like since the Young People's Concerts in the early 1960s.

R170 the problem is there are less, far, far less of you than there are people who remember George and Tammy.

^ "Less" or "fewer" in r171? I feel as if it should be "fewer," but "less of you" doesn't sound bad in this instance. Oh, dears?

Bernstein actually did write some of the lyrics for West Side Story.

I don't know who "people" are but I remember Bernstein, I remember his voice, I can hear it in my memory right now. I remember what he looked like. I even saw him conduct once.

Of course an elderly gay man from NYC would clearly remember Leonard Bernstein. 99.9% of the population would not, however.

R174 I'm a 65 year old man, not from NYC. I saw him conduct somewhere other than NYC.

Do you really think 99.9% of the population is young?

List of all the orchestras Bernstein conducted:

R166 = Stephen Sondheim.

The point is Bernstein is not very well known to the general public anymore r175

Yeah I know I was the one who said it, too - when I said B. Cooper didn't need prosthetics because the memory of what L.B. looked like isn't strong. But otoh let's not overdo it and say "no one" remembers him at all.

R178 and the world is a poorer place because of it.

Correct most people today have never hear of Lenny much less know what his snooze looked like. With all this online kerfuffle about Cooper's prosthetic all the audience will be doing is staring at his plastic cock.

^^^ whoops CONK

When I first glance said this I thought it said Betty crocker and then I started wondering if it was some row over like challah bread or matzo balls or something.

r179 he's not well remembered, I never said "no one" remembers him. God, you eldergays are so bitchy when people point out the beloved celebrities of your long-ago youth aren't very well-known anymore. It happens. It's just life.

"You eldergays" -- why do we have to read this shit here all the time? When I started reading DL around 5 years ago I don't remember as much stuff about eldergays, and not these divisive posts.

Anyway someone wrote:

[quote]People remember what George and Tammy looked and sounded like, they do not remember what Leonard Bernstein looked and sounded like.

So some posters do remember what Bernstein looked and sounded like, and responded. Is that so bad?

Fixed it for you: People in my shithole, backwater, red state neck of the woods remember what George and Tammy looked and sounded like, they do not remember what Leonard Bernstein looked and sounded like because he was a fag Communist Jew.

Honestly, when the poster said Tammy, I thought he was talking about Tom Cruise.

JFC r186 you really are a piece of work

R186, I wouldn't recognize George Jones if someone dropped him on me. I saw Tammy Wynette on TV maybe once in my life. I considered both to be caricatures. Leonard Bernstein is someone I saw in concert and on TV many times and who is indelibly printed on my brain.

So , when you speak of a world in which people have vivid memories of George and Tammy but not of Bernstein, I can only assume you're talking about red state America where the only music is C&W. It is not a stretch to assume these folk would heap those kind of pejoratives upon Bernstein if they knew of him.

I'm sorry but these are the limits of my imagination. If you can describe another type of world in which Jones and Wynette's faces are immediately recognizable but Bernstein is unknown, I'm happy to admit my error.

Make that r187

Sorry, this was intended for R188

Even in blue state America, Leonard Bernstein isn't all that well known anymore. Most people wouldn't recognize him if they saw a picture of him.

Quite possibly true, R192, but the proposition under dispute is whether George Jones and Tammy Wynette's music and faces are vividly remembered by most people. Not in my neck of the woods.

Maybe Tammy Wynette, but not George Jones. She's still pretty well known, like Patsy Cline.

But the people who would watch a miniseries about them would remember how they looked and that would be important to them.

He couldn't watch the film without thinking about the nose and all that it symbolizes.

More people just looking for something to whine about.

Including you, r197, whining about the whiners.

Look at the photo at R196

Anyone notice his eyes

Don’t they seem a little… you know…

And go to YouTube to see clips of how he was acting when they filmed this. His acting was over the top camp.

Clip

Re: that clip. It must be so annoying with the general public standing there and filming you on their phones while you're trying to act.

Well it’s his own damn fault for setting the scene outside on Central Park West.

[quote]Anyone notice his eyes

[quote]Don’t they seem a little… you know…

?

R186. If you think most people in New York City or any other major city in 2023 know what Bernstein looked like, I invite you to take an impromptu poll.

In addition, knowing who Bernstein was is hardly an indication of enormous sophistication. He spent most of his life as a conductor, which, even in the age of recordings is a pretty ephemeral pursuit. Most of his compositions, with a few exceptions, aren’t rated very highly. A modern person could consume a lot culture without ever thinking of Bernstein.

Why don't you conduct an impromptu poll showing them photos of Tammy Wynette and George Jones and ask if they can identify them. That was the point I was disputing.

Obviously, the way to shut up Sarah Silverman from bitching about "Jewface" is to cast her in your movie. Smart move.

R203 what part of 🏔️ ⛷️ 🧂 ❄️ are you failing to understand?

I didn't look at the emojis very closely. It was on a small screen. I thought it was a slice of pizza, an ice cream sundae with a cherry on top...I got the salt shaker and snowflake. Okay I get it now.

The majority of people will always know the music of Bernstein and Gershwin but not their names.

Everyone is forgotten except for major historical figures and Monroe and Audrey Hepburn. At one point I would have put Elvis and James Dean but now I'm not so sure.

I think James Dean is starting to fade. If you showed a picture of him to a bunch of 20 year olds they might not know who he is. Of course, everybody still knows who Marilyn Monroe is.

The prosthetic creator speaks

He’s falling on his sword; I just know Bradley told him “I want it BIG.”

New still

I really don’t see anything except the nose anymore

[quote] I just know Bradley told him “I want it BIG.”

That's what he always told me, too.

They’re going to have to reduce the nose with CGI now.

Bradley Cooper didn't need a prosthetic nose to play Bernstein. His own nose was fine. Bernstein had a strong nose and strong features, but he wasn't defined by having a "big nose". I think Bradley Cooper chose to use a prosthetic nose to look more stereotypically Jewish, which is why it's offensive.

does anyone actually like Bradley as an actor? i’ve always found his career mysterious.

I've never loved him or hated him, r217. I did find him attractive in early days, though.

[quote]does anyone actually like Bradley as an actor? i’ve always found his career mysterious.

He’s not Sean Penn great, but he really is good in the right role. I’ve been a big fan since The Hangover. Saw him on broadway in The Elephant Man - he was definitely robbed of a Tony for that performance.

Especially when Michael Ian Black was fucking him in Wet Hot American Summer.

He looks like a male witch witch

The nose is not even big enough to resemble Bernstein’s real nose, but the bridge is way too high and throws the whole thing off.

Bradley C. was great as Jon Peters in Licorice Pizza (better than Sean Penn, who I don't really care for, but he was okay as "Jack Holden", a take-off on William Holden - without the good looks, I guess).

I was just watching Sean Penn in an interview and even though he’s short and I don’t think Bernstein was, he reminded me of Leonard Bernstein. Guess he would be way too old for the part but he looked more like Bernstein than Bradley Cooper.

Was Bradley also fitted for a Jew cock prosthetic?

I'm sure if he already wasn't circumcised, he got a circumcision for the role. Robert DeNiro would have.

Lenny and Babs.

Lenny and Judy

It’s kind of amazing how these things blow up for a few days or a week on social media and seem like huge controversies (several threads on DL alone) - then they just die down and are forgotten. Without any particular resolution. Everybody just gets tired of it.

Because the movie hasn't been shown yet. Just wait until December when everyone will be able to see it on Netflix.

Or not.