STDs are at a shocking high

False

Who cares, they’re all curable.

What’s more important is that HIV transmission levels are way down among gay and bisexual men (not necessarily the case for black and brown men, FOR WHATEVER REASON).

It’s fine R1 is on PrEP

Lack of accessible healthcare? People not using condoms?

We are curious. Yellow.

They should begin lightly and playfully introducing STDs into pornography since it’s such a vital influence and sexual instructor.

Whores

I know you were joking about porn but a long time ago one of my friends insisted to me that nobody uses condoms and that he would never expect condom use. I was shocked but thing is, he was a virgin and a porn addict. So he saw all this porn and thought it was reality. PrEP is one thing but the named STDs in the OP are all other things.........

Public Service Announcements have virtually ceased.

Sailor beware.

R2 they are all curable? Idk if I'd go that far. Just ask those that have had warts burned or had it lead to cancer. Yeah, it's not exactly fatal, but it seems like it sucks to deal with for your entire life. Don't forget that antibiotics aren't working like they used to.

Many people on Prep believe they are immune from STDs.

R9 R2

So you think it’s all about a lack of PSAs? Such a sweet innocent take.

Gonorrhea is fast becoming untreatable, It’s hardly the ho hum that clap was 30 to 40 years ago.

Syphilis can be treated. HIV can be treated.

A man gets a Dx of syphilis and HIV, one study showed that 90% of those men had or were developing neurosyphilis. Other studies support this.

A STD that becomes untreatable. A combination of multiple STDs. A new Sexually transmitted infection. After all who knew about Mpox as something to worry about 3 years ago?

I am not comfortable that you could see significant more serious problems in the future.

Are these STDs much more a gay or MSM problem than a straight problem?

Unless they are addicts or those working the streets for drugs etc yes yes of course it’s not remotely close in the US

It’s not the sex it’s not the massive amount of sex some men have it’s the lack of safe sex.

Just going tho throw it out there that this was also in the prelude to Gilead in the Handmaids Tale. STDs were out of control and so…a new regime put a stop to that

And here is one I dont understand at all. Meningitis. Especially with men who have HIV. The Dx numbers are going up. I am not shocked at that,

Then you see these , off and on , now and then, these strange clusters of gay men , suddenly dropping dead from some type of extremely fast acting form of meningitis. Dead within hours.

Live was so simple when we thought poppers was going to be the big problem.

Lack of sex ed in schools, the GOP are removing sex ed classes in school so people don't even know about safe sex anymore.

You mean there is a lack of STD risk info aimed at the gay male community?

I find that hard to believe. I have written articles for the gay MSM community and STDs and those were distributed thru the gay media. I have seen lots of articles and health Ed aimed at the gay male community.

I see ads on DL.

I find it hard to believe that gay men are clueless as to the significantly high risk they face. Or how to lower their risk.

R16

Heath ed is mandatory in my state K thru 12 th grade. There is a lot taught about diseases, disease prevention, mental health, and sexual violence and a whole host of other topics.

You might find the similar if you look for your state.

Blaming gay male msm std rates on republicans is beyond silly. What do those republicans do steal all the condoms?

STDs and the gay male community is a self inflected problem. Lying about that will not lower Dx rates or in the long run save lives..

But, they're high! [italic]SHOCKINGLY[/italic] high!

r18 who said it was just gay men? The article said people aged 15-24 and less and less sex ed is being taught in schools these days as Karens for Trump has taken over school boards.

I don’t think anyone really believes PrEP protects them from STDs like chlamydia, etc. I think they just think those STDs are curable, and they are.

By the way, I have sex with at least a dozen different men every week and have done for the years and years, and I’ve had exactly two STDs: gonorrhea and chlamydia, and both were cleared up by single antibiotic pills.

I’m 44, and while I’m still fuckable, I’m gonna keep on fuckin’.

You pearl clutchers of Datalounge keep doin’ your thang, and I’ll continue to ignore you.

Use dental dams!

[quote]By the way, I have sex with at least a dozen different men every week and have done for the years and years

= Aaron Schock

Incel thread.

As someone who's bit the "unsafe" bullet once (raw), I cannot condone it unless it is someone most trustworthy. It was a very expensive private STD test I had to take to feel confident I was entirely okay. It was very unsettling because if I would've gotten sick my family would've abandoned me. If my ex would've gone out for some rubbers, perhaps I would've felt better about him. I still thank the heavens I'm as clean as ever.

R20

The language and data from year to year is that gay msm men about 4% of the US population accounts for nearly 50% of all new infectious syphilis P&S in the US.

Syphilis Dx are going up in the US and driven mostly by MSM gay men and and bi men and other men who have sex with men,

When you work syphilis and hiv control it’s the desperate poor, addicts, those on the streets exchanging sex for drugs, And gay msm men that you will be dealing with..

This is a problem we will just have to live with. It’s not going to improve a lot. It may get worse. It will not get a lot better.

As the orange one once said——it is what it is.

MSM are WAY more than 4% of the population, my friend. 4% is about the number of out gay men. But bisexuals and men on the down low far exceed that number. I would guess that something like 15-20% of men have had at least one sexual experience with another man, and probably at least 10% of men have sex with other men regularly, whether they think they are gay or not. I would agree that men are more of the problem. Lesbians are not powerhouses of sexually transmitted diseases.

Here is a big reason as to why syphilis rates are so high among the community.

If you read on forums for men who enjoy and look for female street walkers about the hardest thing for them to find is a worker that will give a bb blow job, forget fucking. That BJ will be covered.

It’s the same thing in the Amsterdam RLD. No one is going to be coming into contact with any fluids. They will use gloves for a handjob. It’s almost impossible to catch an std there despite the large amount of sex that occurs.

On msm hook up forums BB is often requested , often from multiple people, and condoms required is rare.

R27

I am old school I look at cdc or Williams institute estimates or data . People’s opinions who post on DL not so much.

Yes it could be a bit higher than 4% . The actual data does not support a lot higher.

Not all are curable, are quickly or cheaply treated in one session.

There are diseases that go hand in hand with casual, frequent, and unprotected sex, especially because when taking hard drugs, your immune system drops significantly, allowing access.

Strep, Giardia, Hepatitis and MRSA are all common among “weekend warriors”, these that party with meth and other recreational drugs

Also, partying every weekend AND/OR then indiscriminately treating with antibiotics wreaks havoc on your immune system and creates more aggressive strains of diseases like gonorrhea. HIV can more easily get into your system if you already have Syphilis.

MRSA, once introduced into your system with a small cut, boil or scrape, once it takes root can burrow deeper into your bloodstream, destroying muscle and heart tissue, roaring back even more aggressively every time you do more drugs.

r28, is that so? The study below estimates 4% of the general US population, but includes states with no urban areas, such as Wyoming to achieve that ratio. In big cities and big states, 10% is a more common figure.

And in the US approx half of the msm or gay men with P&S syphilis will also have HIV.

HIV+Syphilis very likely means neurosyphilis. Based on studies confirmed by spinal exams.

We can quibble about 4% vs 6% or 8% and we can quibble about exactly what % of new cases are gay men or msm account for.

But it’s a significant long standing problem

people need to sell that pussy to afford ground beef now

These “simple” STDs are not so easy to cure now. Due to CDC recommendations, doctors are now only prescribing Doxycycline for 14 days for Chlamydia, and Gonorrhea requires a shot.

It will be interesting to look back some years from now to see what role poppers play as far as long term health issues, immune function, cancers, kidney function, liver, etc and the community.

They certainly played a major role in the late 70s early 80s and aids.

Without poppers fisting would not have become as popular as it was. And fisting and the FFA was ground central for the outbreak in the early days.

Without poppers the early days of aids might have looked totally different. Maybe the future as well.

R34 they’re a different chemical now, not as strong. They’re still disgusting though.

Herpes is not curable

Am I one of the possible few gay males who's heard or read that poppers may contribute to retinal problems, maybe even a detached retina surgery where it's possible one may still lose vision?

I did poppers off and on for years until age 52 in 2012 when I had a sudden and scary detached retina requiring surgery a couple weeks later. Thankfully the vision was saved and I can psss my driver's license vision test.

But I couldn't fly for months, had to wear a medical bracelet due to a bubbl in the eye and had to wear a patch at home and keep my head down for a few weeks or more during parts (much?) of my sitting hours.

Also had to visit a doctor for updates every month that summer, while using a few kinds of prescription eye drops. I did still drive and instead of flying took a few road trips that summer after awhile, thankfully.

Even my gay male doctors have never brought up popper use and possible (probable?) vision consequences. Does yours? They probably know little or nothing about it, never mind straight or female fotctors. Maybe the retinal issues don't happen overnight unless heavy use, but years later?

No., I wasn't a heavy user or an addict. But what about those who are,? Any studies done?

I haven't used them since the eye surgery.

Be careful wirh poppers!

R37

In maybe 1983 I had a discussion about poppers with a gay MD blood expert who was brought in to work on a NIH aids project.

He just shook his head when I asked about poppers. His concern then was the liver. And he talked about what an impact poppers had on livers.

He strongly advised against using them,

R36 Herpes is not curable, as you say, and neither is genital warts and anal warts -- even if successfully removed...one is always a carrier and can spread them...even with condoms!

And what about cold sores? Not curable, right, as it's a type of herpes, right? I didn't even know that until my late 20s, as never learned it in sex ed in school. A female friend casually mentioned having them, saying it's herpes. I was shocked to letan that.

Yes, I have had cold sores, but don't tell my partners when giving oral....should. I? Am I the only DataLounger to have ever had a cold sore? (Sarcasm). No trick has ever asked if I have an active or inactive cold sore. I haven't had them since the pandemic....hmmm. I was wearing masks and no sex for 1.5 years which may have helped? Have performed oral on only one partner since, twice, and no kidding, and still no cold sores. I used the cheap Carmex gel or sometimes the expensive Abreve when I had them every winter -- but never sought a prescription.

And don't most adults and even some children have the cold sore virus, whether a virgin or not, as it's so easily transmitted by kissing a partner, or even an innocent kiss from a relative when greeting them?. It's passed from an infected mother to baby at birth?

Hmm...I never see a Grindr profile admitting to or asking about cold sores... maybe because most probably already have them, and it's maybe considered harmless by many or most, even among those negative?

I don't understand the big deal about herpes simplex. Most people have it and it's pretty much harmless - most people don't show symptoms but for those who do it's rarely serious - it's not like HIV or syphilis.

WHO says: An estimated 3.7 billion people under age 50 (67%) globally have herpes simplex virus type 1 (HSV-1) infection, the main cause of oral herpes.

[quote]Am I one of the possible few gay males who's heard or read that poppers may contribute to retinal problems, maybe even a detached retina surgery where it's possible one may still lose vision?

There was a fair amount of coverage of it five or so years ago. Popper users, as you can imagine, were quick to discount something they didn't want to hear.

Not a single guy I’ve hooked up with for reciprocal oral sex or bareback anal sex (I’m a top) has asked me if I’m “clean”—and I’ve had casual sex with like a hundred different guys so far this year. No STDs yet, either. Guess I’m a miracle slut.

R42 You can’t tactfully ask such things anymore. Asking is like calling someone fat.

Nobody cares

To chime in, I’ve also had a lot of unprotected oral and anal (also top) sex over the last few years since I went on prep (particularly since covid ended) and I’ve similarly only had two STDs (gonorrhea and chlamydia (both asymptomatic)) which were cleared up by a short course of antibiotics (and a shot in the case of the gonorrhea I think). I generally ask guys I’m gonna hook up with if they’re on prep if it’s not listed on their profile (meeting online) or if I don’t know beforehand (meeting irl), being on prep implicitly means the longest it’s been since they’ve been tested is 3 months, so you’re generally safer hooking up with guys on prep in terms of bacterial infections. The inconvenience of having those two non-symptomatic short bacterial infections (which was so minor it’s almost non existent) versus having to have used condoms the entire time which really decreases the pleasure of sex, I know I made the correct decision. But this is of course, personal, subjective, and limited to my own experience. But really you pearl clutchers are over-reacting massively.

Herpes, both oral and genital, should be included with other reported STDs. They're incurable and the side effects more than a nuisance for many people.

I wonder if the rates are as high as they were in the 1960s and 1970s.

Herpes simplex virus type 1 (HSV-1) infection (oral herpes) can be transmitted to other body parts via oral sex.

^ But maybe you whores already know that.

Societal sexual demonization had its reasons.

R47

Syphilis or the Big Pox or Bad Blood was once a major killer.world wide

Then Rx were developed and the deaths really slowed

but still In the US between 1968 and 2015 (I think I have the years correct) nearly 7000 people in the US died from syphilis. 2-1 male vs female.

Cardiovascular syphilis and neurosyphilis the main case of these deaths,

In the 1970s there was a major syphilis eradication program.

Lots of money was allocated, the feds or cdc assigned lots of public health advisors to state and local health depts. experts in casefinding,

working partnerships between cdc and the gay community flourished, especially in the baths and the gay media.

But the one thing that truly worked as far as lowering syphilis Dx was aids.

AIDS led to a major increase in condom use and safe sex among gay men, rates dropped like a heavy rock

The word eradication was being used. Than a Rx for HIV. The condoms for gay men came off and syphilis rates in the US exploded,

Gay msm may not be dying of syphilis today. But men with a dual Dx of hiv and syphilis likely have or are or were developing neurosyphilis .

Syphilis is a hard disease to catch. The infected are generally not infectious for a long period. Weeks usually.over a several month period. Even if they have syphilis for decades .

But one of the issues with syphilis today is the increased risk of hiv if you have P or S syphilis symptoms like a sore,

I expect it’s going to get worse as far as the numbers, Significant condom use among the high risk will only return when or if the body bags do. So the numbers will keep going up.

And I don’t see cdc able to hire and train 100s of those casefinders and assign them back to the locals.

It’s a clusterfuck for sure,

It would be very difficult to trace a herpes infection to a single sexual encounter, since it is so ubiquitous in the general population. 50% of the population carries it. Cold sores on the mouth are unsightly but I think people are more judgmental about genital herpes. Mostly in practical terms, it just means refraining from having sex while in an outbreak - as much from the humiliation of having someone say "What the hell is that?" as they're zeroing on someone else's genitalia.

It sucks , not in a pleasurable way, that microbes, viruses and bacteria, find human sexual activity a wonderful way to spread. There's some indication that the excessive prudishness of the Victorian Era was a reaction to the rampant spread of syphilis in the previous century. I'd be curious whether or not sexual activity in other species is also a vector for transmission of so many diseases. In most other mammallian species,, females are only receptive to sex while they are in heat - otherwise, they'll drive horny males off in a hurry. The fact that humans can (and do) have sex all the time, might contribute to our sad history of STDs

A new shortage of a type of penicillin crucial to the fight against syphilis is alarming infectious disease experts, who warn that a protracted scarcity of the drug could worsen the U.S. epidemic of the sexually transmitted infection.

R53 it’s okay, I’m on PrEP.

[quote] I’m 44, and while I’m still fuckable, I’m gonna keep on fuckin’.

Sounds like you are trying to convince yourself.

R53

What a happy upbeat article that one is. We are short on bicillin during a raging epidemic that keeps getting worse

And we have one plant in the US where the drug is made. One.

And I am surprise to read that they give bicillin routinely to all non allergic recruits in boot camp. I’d wonder what out MDs and other professionals think of this epi Rx to those not sick.

R53 and R56, if I'm not mistaken, this drug is penicillin G. That is, OG penicillin, the drug that revolutionized medicine in the 1940s and almost overnight ended the syphilis epidemic that had been raging for a long, long time. It isn't used much nowadays because of widespread resistance, but the technology to produce it should still be straightforward and well-known. I'm thinking, R56, that if the need arises, we can ramp up production pretty quickly.

(That doesn't change my opinion that we should be manufacturing almost all drugs we need right here. The exceptions would be very new drugs still on patent and produced abroad, and drugs used so rarely that it's not feasible to produce the in more than one place.)

OP IS SEX NEGATIVE!!!!!

[quote]I'm thinking, [R56], that if the need arises, we can ramp up production pretty quickly.

"Steven Danehy, a spokesman for Pfizer, said it would likely take about a year for the company to ramp up production by 50 percent at its plant in Rochester, Mich., and ultimately manufacture enough Bicillin to meet demand and shore up reserves."

[quote]gonorrhea, syphilis, and congenital syphilis

All of these are extremely detrimental to the female reproductive system. Women should just stop fucking men entirely and just start fucking each other and leave men to men.

I have zero personal incentives for this suggestion.

[quote]Sounds like you are trying to convince yourself.

…of what?

[quote]it’s not the massive amount of sex some men have it’s the lack of safe sex.

The safest sex is NO SEX!

Post Covid fiend idiots.

Guy on guy sex is the most susceptible.

[quote]I generally ask guys I’m gonna hook up with if they’re on prep if it’s not listed on their profile (meeting online)

I think one thing that's changed over the years is that many guys nowadays don't even bother filling out their profiles. They just hit the highlights (man, top, 5'11, 165) and stop there. All of the other categories are either blank or have "Ask Me."

R59, one year is "pretty quickly" in the manufacturing world.

[quote] Here is a big reason as to why syphilis rates are so high among the community.

There’s no community.

R65, that must be in your area.

Not too long ago, I was dating someone, hoping it was to go somewhere serious. It didn't, but that's a story for another time.

After a couple of dates, we had sex, and he was SHOCKED when I paused and said, "Let me get a condom". It took the wind out of the sails, and the rest of the sex wasn't all that...

I was surprised how he assumed that I'd be on PREP and that I would engage in sex without a condom.

Long story short: How young gay men think about condoms as an antiquated relic from times long gone is probably contributing to the increase in STDs.

R69

There is no probably in this story. That boat has sailed. The question is——does anyone actually care?

Not unless this all turns deadly again and lots of gay men start dying is my guess. Not saying that will happen but it very likely could.

Then gay men will do two things. They will start to use condoms and they will blame the govt for not having a cure.

[quote]one year is "pretty quickly" in the manufacturing world.

But not nearly quick enough in the medical world.

R70 let’s not forget all the woke queens that went from screaming about masks during COVID to getting bareback gangbanged during Monkeypox, then it was the government’s fault not theirs.

Well, Dutchie, why *aren’t* you on PrEP?

It’s also the Petri dish bottoms who collect 100+ loads per month

Gay men are not healthy

R73 Good question, and I will try my best to answer it :

Mostly because I wouldn't dream of taking medication without being ill and because the long-term effects of PrEP aren't known at this time (they couldn't be, of course). However, there is talk of possible loss of bone mineral density and (severe) kidney damage.

My days of several different bed partners a month are long gone, which doesn't mean I completely eliminated any possible risks of infection, but it does lower the odds.

To sum it up: I don't take PrEP because it is a strong medicine with side effects and -unknown- long-term effects, and I don't whore around as much as I used to. Therefore, I stick to condoms.

R76

If you did a study of cigarettes smokers , all smoking less than a 5 year period, you might think that cigarettes didn’t really cause all that much in the way of excess sickness and death.

I'm just glad people are fucking again. The rest will sort itself out.

[quote]I'm just glad people are fucking again. The rest will sort itself out.

Absolutely!

R78

You betcha

Would the Yasss Kweens fuck right through Super AIDS 2.0?

R82 Yep and 5 years later I’d be dancing straight out of the house.

R82 what now?

R83 Survival of the fittest. I’d be spared. I’m special.

R84 is insane

R84 = Ghost of Liberace

It makes sense that an older person who has aged out of sluttery would not see the point in taking PrEP. But for younger people who still love to fuck, the idea of not being on PrEP and insisting on condom use instead is usually a deal-breaker for sex.

A condom for a blow job? I presume that’s what we’re talking about here. I would say “Sorry, no thanks” and peace-out.

So much anti-sex trolling in this thread.

Dutchie R69, R76 being case in point. PrEP and TasP has been carefully studied for over a decade now. Its side effects are minimal for the vast majority of people, and reversible in those who have transient problems with bone density or kidney function. It's not unknown, and the side effects aren't what she claims they are.

Most of the messages here fail to note some other facts: Most of the increase in syphilis cases is among straights. Congenital syphilis is increasing the most. The increase picked during covid, when many people had less access to medical care, thanks to Trump's cutting public health funding during his tenure, and because covid measures kept people out of clinics.

Then you have R51's fear mongering. His stat of 7000 deaths from syphilis is over a 48-year period. That amounts to 145 cases a year. How many people die each year by drowning? Auto accidents? The flu? A disease that kills 150 people does not mean we should all stop having sex.

There was another explosion of syphilis and other STD rates in the 1960s and 70s, and that's because young people were having sex. Same thing is happening now.

I've tried but can't find quality easy to parse stats on syphilis rates (not total case numbers) from the 1950s until the present. I suspect rates were much higher in the earlier decades.

FF Poo Shoes and her sock puppets and fake stats spreading gay hatred.

R87 I’m 36 and I do like sex.

Just not the “10 men a month” thing that so many seem to crave.

Shocking to anyone who hasn't had sex with another person in 25 years...

So you insist on condoms even for blow jobs, Dutchie?

R88

I remember those in 1981 that accused people of being anti sex, fear mongering, anti fun for the worry about infections..

I am not anti sex, just the opposite, and I am not fear mongering. Everyone on this thread realizes gay men MSM have significant Dx issues with STDs. No one could be that clueless. I bet that just about every gay msm man on this thread has either had an STD or HIV or knows someone that has.

Everyone knows about the 100,000s of gay msm in the US that have died from sexually transmitted infections since 1981.

We all know it’s a significant problem. We all know about the high level of STDs among gay men . And we know it’s a problem that is never going away .

R92 is more trolling, comparing HIV and AIDS to syphilis and gonorrhea. They didn't die from sexually transmitted infections, troll. They died from HIV and AIDS, which was and is a very special case among infectious diseases.

Dutchie is back to more trolling at R89, implying that people who get STDs are promiscuous and deserve to be diseased.

Don't forget to FF the trolls folks! It's the only way to make them go away.

FF R93 for being a psycho and telling everyone what to do

FF R94 for spreading hate on a gay website.

R93

Well it looks to me that there is a connection between GC, Syphilis, and HIV The lack of safe sex . And I am not suggesting that should change.

But I am pointing out the fucking obvious.

No, R96, the posts in here are meant to sex-shame gay men even though straights have more sex and more STIs; and the posts are meant to equate STIs with what the American Taliban considers immoral behavior, which is then again tied to gay men. Nobody in here has been talking about straights except me.

Everything is related to everything. So what? It's the particular emphases on negatively judging gay men and their sex lives that is the fucking obvious trolling.

[quote]Nobody in here has been talking about straights except me.

Shocking on a gay board.

R97

Who on this thread is anti sex? That is a nutty thing to say,

I hope everyone on this thread has lots of Vanilla or kinky sex . And I would not sex shame anyone gay, straight, or bi from having lots of sex or lots of kinky sex.

It is possible to be pro sex and anti disease. It’s possible to be anti disease and pro sex.

It’s also possible to realize that gay men have so much in the way of diseases spread thru sexual contact because they don’t practice safe sex enough.

PrEP has been a game changer for our community. The more gay men who are on it, the better. For the people who continue to practice safe sex, more power to you. Enjoy yourselves. But now there is an option for those gay men who do not wish to wear condoms and that's great too. There have been STIs since the beginning of sex. The sky isn't falling.

Who are these men who die from the combination of syphilis and HIV, R96? Are they on PrEP? Not on PrEP? Once they’re HIV+, do antiretrovirals not keep the viral count low enough to be manageable? Are they exclusive “tops”? Versatile/bottoms?

There are a lot of factors at play. Explain how it works.

R39 and R40 while I feel bad for people who have herpes, I do not dismiss it casually and do not want it. And yes, I know a cold sore means herpes.

R99 the Yasss Kween Britney bots need to be in a delusional echo chamber of pulsating beats and jizzing cocks 24/7 or they’ll die. How dare you try to force any reality on them!

[quote] Long story short: How young gay men think about condoms as an antiquated relic from times long gone is probably contributing to the increase in STDs.

Yeah and long story short R69, the take up of prep in younger gay men has lead to massively reduced rates of HIV within those groups. You’re trying to ignore that fact and act like gonorrhea or chlamydia are as serious as HIV for some reason? They’re not a big deal sorry.

R88 great post.

R88 who said to stop having sex? Get tested. Wear a condom sometimes with random people. Yeah, maybe don’t get gangbanged and take 40 raw loads in a night.

And why should anyone be concerned about gay men and the lack of safe sex. You can look up this data easily.

For Males CDC HIV FY 2018.

M2M transmission

24,933 new Dx 81% of all new male HIV Dx in US

Hetro males

2916 new cases 10% of all new male hiv Dx.

IV drug users

1434 Dx 5%

M2M+IV drug users

1372 4%

Other males

1%

The numbers paint a picture

[quote]Wear a condom sometimes with random people. Yeah, maybe don’t get gangbanged and take 40 raw loads in a night.

Wear a condom for a blow job? Is that what you’re suggesting?

LOL R106 your ‘numbers’ add up to 101% 😂😂😂

R106, do you have any numbers for more recent years? 2018 was five years ago.

There are more gay men on PrEP than there were then.

And that aside, what point do you think you’re making? We know that HIV has always been transmitted mostly through *receptive* anal sex. Who has that the most? Gay men. Who is more likely to have multiple partners they don’t know anything about? Gay men. Because men are horny and will fuck anyone they can. If women were as horny as men, straight men would be fucking women anonymously as often as we MSM have sex with each other.

Also: PrEP works. Are those HIV infection numbers from five years ago occurring among men who diligently take PrEP? NO.

And what does anything in that data set have to do with STDs that aren’t HIV?

Stop wasting your time and ours.

And here is what years from now you may look back and see as the game changer

A study in europe of HIV pos who also have Syphilis. Other studies have shown similar. I invite you do do some reading if interested.

There were more people Dx but 72 men submitted to lumbar puncture

Average age was 33 years old and 89% of these men identified as gay

All had syphilis and hiv

90% were found to be developing neurosyphilis . 33 fucking years old and you have neurosyphilis . Something we always expected to see in untreated for syphilis 80 year olds.

This is going to be very interesting to follow over the coming decades. My advice——stay lucky.

❤️ Hep C

R107 you’re an idiot who wants to exaggerate everything. Please start seeing an oncologist soon.

[quote] 90% were found to be developing neurosyphilis . 33 fucking years old and you have neurosyphilis . Something we always expected to see in untreated for syphilis 80 year olds.

Quote the study R110. I’m guessing that ‘developing’ in this sentence is doing an enormous amount of heavy reaching / lifting, and is being used in the way that none of these men have any meaningful neurological damage, or symptoms, and it just means that if left untreated it would eventually deteriorate to that stage. But that won’t happen. In the same way you could describe someone recently HIV+ as ‘developing AIDs’ before they begin treatment, in that they most likely will not develop AIDs unless they were to discontinue treatment. This amateur hour trolling lol.

Wow. Lots of weirdos on here that have that new mentality that anything that’s not a clacking circuit fan and a “YASSSS” attitude is Trumpian propaganda. Fuck whoever you want, in whatever hole(s) you want, and never use any protection… except your PrEP and doxyPEP, of course.

Half the posters have Bug Chaser vibes. ➕❤️

Believe the science!!! Unless it’s affects my ability to take innumerable raw loads.

Human trafficking is causing this.

Yea and lots of judgmental unscientific losers on here like you R114, that don’t realize that prep (or doxyprep) is STD protection 😭😭😭. You’re stuck in the past babe.

R118 you’re obviously mentally impaired, do you see the word “except”?

What an annoying Gen Z Petri Dish Bottom.

R113

Don’t guess, it’s an important topic why guess, do a little researching and reading yourself. There is a lot out there. on the neurosyphilis issue. I am off the clock.

Maybe all these men with HIV and Syphilis , who average 33 years of age , and had lumbar punctures, all had a “light” case of neurosyphilis?

You could be right. Maybe this is the kind of neurosyphilis that no one should worry about?

Neurosyphilis? No problem mate I have the good kind. Let’s hope that is the case.

R120 like I said post the link to the study. If it even exists. And I’m welcome to being proven wrong. But something tells me I’m not.

R119 yes dickhead but your ‘never use any’ implies that you don’t consider it a valid form of protection, and it is. It’s more effective than condoms for HIV.

NATIONAL GEOGRAPHIC is lying, you old fucking geezers.

I’m getting my hole blown out raw by like 30 guys tonight and I won’t get a single STD!

R121 you have a learning disorder.

No R123 I don’t, but if I did would that make my opinion less valid? What a weird thing to say. I wouldn’t treat anyone’s opinion as less than if they had an intellectual disability, seems kinda shitty of you.

R114, this is why I generally avoid any and all discussion with gay men re prep usage. Just even mentioning (without any judgements made etc) that you don’t take prep because you use regularly condoms when fucking, immediately sends many of those “yas queenz” into this weird, overly defensive diatribe - and then invasive questioning as to why you aren’t on it. And then they get even more enraged because you’re hotter and get laid with other hotties with ease, lol. 🤷🏽‍♂️

Also, those whole doxyprep thing as prep is absolutely insane - I cannot imagine how that WOULDNT severely exacerbate the already severe antibiotic resistance issue?

I think that syphilis is a bit off the radar. People don't fear it, and don't do the sort of self-checks that people did when it was such a deadly disease. When I was a young gayling of 21 living in NYC, STDS were common, but when you went in with a symptom, you were checked for EVERYTHING (hepatitis, syphilis, gonorrhea, etc). Gay pride parades and gay events always had a booth where volunteers would draw blood to check for syphilis. Public health budgets have declined since then and have been distracted by minor things like AIDS, a COVID pandemic and a resurgence of tuberculosis among the homeless, so lots of young gay men don't even realize they are at risk for syphilis or gonorrhea either, unless they start getting symptoms. One of the places you CAN get community outreach and be tested for STDs? Your local bathhouse - for those who think that they are the epicenter of disease transmission.

R110, I have no idea what you’re trying to say.

And yet R125, the only time threads are started here on this topic is to complain about people on prep, never the other way around. Nothing as touchy as a non prep user, as you (and the rest of you gals) on here have illustrated.

^ what? The OP said nothing about prep.

Did I strike a nerve? Lol

R127

My last Pride attendance the health dept Van was still there still offering a variety of testing. I would hope they are still showing up.

In my day we offered testing in the baths, in the sex clubs. and in the bars. It was a great way to do one on one health education and meet interesting people.

[quote] this is why I generally avoid any and all discussion with gay men re prep usage.

R130 lol yes it did. I tagged the comment I was replying to and it said the above. Are you that commenter? If so, can you not remember what you said 5 minutes ago? Maybe you have neurosyphilis 😂. Read more slowly x.

The cavalier attitude so many posters here have about other STDs that aren't HIV is very bizarre and concerning.

Don’t test, don’t question. Just protect yourself and to hell with the idiots.

What point is being made about ‘neurosyphilis’ exactly? I get that there’s some kind of finger wagging involved, an “always wear a condom even if you’re taking PrEP” sort of message, but it’s impossible to parse what is being said, really.

I know you’re “off the clock” but can you please start from the beginning again and *try* to answer the following questions:

1) How many men, expressed as a percentage of the total number of men who have newly diagnosed cases of HIV, also have this “neurosyphilis”?

2) Is “neurosyphilis” untreatable?

3) how many of these men were taking PrEP diligently when they contracted HIV?

Please and thank you.

R133 who’s being cavalier? Nobody is suggesting bacterial infections are a good thing, but they’re also not that serious. I’ve had two asymptomatic stds and a short course of antibiotics cleared them. It’s not that serious. I’d be more concerned about posters here acting like having chlamydia is akin to a stage 4 pancreatic cancer diagnosis. Deluded.

The reality is that PREP has saved lives and 10s of thousands of HIV infections. That can't be discounted. I would say that someone who has gotten Prep has also been to a doctor to get the prescription and has probably gotten counseling during that visit about paying attention to symptoms of other diseases. If someone is presenting with HIV and syphilis, A. that person has probably never been on Prep, and B. that person has probably not been counseled or has gotten any sort of counseling or literature about STDs. There is a huge population of Latino and black young gay men who face community pressure not to come out and are not directed to health resources that would help them. That's one of the reason that Prep commercials on TV almost always have black and/or latino actors portraying the people taking Prep. It's an effort to get the message to people who otherwise would not even be thinking about it.

If I were between the ages of 20-45, you can bet I'd be on Prep. Just because sex happens, hormones are strong, and people aren't always thinking about things like diseases in the moment.

[quote][R133] who’s being cavalier? Nobody is suggesting bacterial infections are a good thing, but they’re also not that serious.

r136 You don't seem to understand. I'm a woman. STDs like gonorrhea, syphilis, and chlamydia can be detrimental to the female reproductive system (they can cause pelvic inflammatory disease, stillbirths, and infertility). That's why this cavalier attitude is bizarre and concerning to me. Thankfully, I don't fuck men or women who fuck men, though.

Someone give R138 a gold star!

Taking the antibiotic doxycycline after sex works to prevent syphilis and chlamydia – and to a lesser extent, gonorrhoea – in gay and bisexual men, and trans women.

A general concern about this idea is an increase in bacteria that are resistant to an antibiotic needed to treat a wide range of infections.

R138 respectfully, we have been talking about men. It kinda goes without saying that you’d be more concerned about something that has more serious implications for you personally? I’m sorry but I don’t see your point whatsoever. Also how would I have understood that you were a woman before you specifically mentioned it lol?

r141 To be honest, that was my explanation for why that mindset you expressed in r136 was harmful. Or were you unaware that bisexual men also exist? Don't try to use the excuse of "we're men" for the cavalier attitude. There are definitely men who are equally concerned as they should be because sexual health isn't just about you as an individual, it's about other people. That's why it's a [italic]community health[/italic] concern.

R91 / R107 stop with your aggressive cornering, you cunt

R142 no I had never heard of a bisexual man until just now thank you for educating me! And community health! In italics!!

Kidding aside, your twitter strategy of speaking off topic and putting words in my mouth isn’t gonna pass muster. I was talking about the physical effects of gonorrhea or chlamydia on a man and the effort it takes to address them once diagnosed, I was not talking about disclosure politics or the effect of long term chlamydia on the female reproductive system, which you know.

I think what you’re getting into (downlow, disclosure, bisexual relationships, lack of testing etc,) is interesting but you should maybe start your own thread rather than trying to setup some kind of gotcha scenario here, and I’m not gonna go back and forth with you on the way you’re trying to detail the thread in order for you to say “wow gay men really don’t care about women I was right” to yourself smugly, which I think is really what you want to do.

[quote]wow gay men really don’t care about women I was right”

r144 It's giving more you don't care about other people period. But nice try.

Don't come for me with that bullshit. You're thinking is backward and harmful I'm calling you and people who think like you out on it. You can retire the predictable "stop attacking gay men" diatribe. There are plenty of gay men here who disagree with you. Own your own bullshit and stop hiding behind the rest of the community.

*your thinking

R145 girl you’re not calling me out on anything 😂 you’re not making any sense, you’re off topic and your point (whatever it is) isn’t consistent with what this whole thread was about. We don’t need to go back and forth on this now ok? We can just leave it at that.

r147 Um, the topic is about STDs being on the rise. It's not only about the sexual health of gay men. It's about sexual health, in general. You just don't want to address this issue holistically. And that's fine. But just say that instead of being on some bullshit.

R148 oh god. Almost every single comment on this thread (yours aside) was about men, specifically msm. The initial topic was stds - but it was discussed with the focus on msm. Until you interjected. Acting like previous comments should be applied to both men and women when they were specifically about men is totally disingenuous and dishonest.

r149 Again, just say you don't want to address the STD issue/topic holistically and keep it moving. All of that ad-libbing is unnecessary.

R150 talking to you is what I imagine the first stages of neurosyphilis must feel like 😭

Dutchie, why can’t you just answer the question? It’s a legitimate one. Do you or do you not require condoms during oral sex?

r151 Well, if you're having comprehension issues, I encourage you to get tested. Cognitive impairment is a symptom.

R153 oh girl read yourself first. You haven’t addressed anything I’ve said.

And thanks for the (vaguely homophobic) tip, but I was tested two weeks ago, and was all clear. And 3 months before that I was tested again, and three months before that, and so forth. When were you last tested? And how frequently are you tested? See now both you and me know that women (especially lesbians) don’t really need to be tested as frequently as men, but I could act (using your logic) like the same rules apply for everyone and accuse you of being irresponsible towards the “community” because you don’t get tested as frequently as I do. Now please, go back to twitter and do what you need to do over there, you’re so fucking boring.

[quote]And thanks for the (vaguely homophobic)

Oh [bold]fuck. OFF.[/bold] With this tired redirection. Seriously. It's such a tired diversion tactic used whenever this topic comes up. Tired as hell.

Herpes is a lot like Covid. If you don’t test, you can deny you gave it. If you do test, and find out you have, you will be treated like a leper. People do not give a shit about doing what is needed to avoid it, but will flip out if they have been exposed.

Is the PrEP Petri Dish Bottom still fighting to collect STDs like Pokémon cards shame-free in its filthy shithole?

There are gay men who want to watch the destruction of other gay men

Whom would that be, R157?

Let’s focus on those straights . Why shame gay men. People here may or may not be concerned this is why CDC is concerned.

From CDC.

Even though gay and bisexuals and other men who have sex with men (MSM), are 4% of the US population they account for nearly half of reported P&S syphilis cases in the US.

Syphilis among MSM increased 7% from 2020 —2021. In the US almost half of MSM with P&S syphilis will have HIV.

Once again, R160, either provide the stats for the proper usage of PrEP when you mention “P&S syphilis and HIV” or shut up.

R161

Sure thing friend.

PrEP for HIV does not protect you from syphilis. (I thought everyone knew that)

Happy now?

No, R162.

You keep dancing around a crucial point: are the people WITH “P&S syphilis” who contract HIV on PrEP and taking it diligently?

Does having P&S syphilis allow HIV to ‘break through’ the PrEP ‘barrier’?

Obviously the point of your replies is to say “always wear a condom because PrEP does not protect you from other STDs” but then you keep mentioning HIV.

Let’s all jerk off, but please wash your hands before touching any door knobs.

[quote] STDs are at a shocking high

Color me not shocked.

R163

Why on earth do you think I care if you or anyone else wears a condom?

Regarding OP aka Troll #6067, when you look at her posting history, you see in addition to her gay and sex hatred, it is full of nasty shit like ragging on Britney Spears and discussing the lurid details of sex crimes. This all points to Poo Shoes/D@vida.

Then there is R34, who has also posted a large % of the posts in this thread. They are innuendo and vague claims of being some sort of medical professional, while refusing to provide sources for many of her gay-hating claims, and making other unfounded claims like 'poppers might cause AIDS and are bad for your liver because somebody told me that in 1983.' That rumor has long been disproven, Poo Shoes aka R34 don't forget to FF and block R34.

If she really understood epidemiology, she would understand the reason why some illnesses cluster in communities, like among gay men or among other groups, is because those groups tend to stick together - in this case sexually. Also, certain acts like anal sex cause the spread of STIs more easily than others.

The 4% that is getting talked about in this thread, in my observation, is a small cohort of MSM/gay men who are having a lot of sex with a lot of different guys, mostly under the influence of crystal meth. No doubt the occasional unlucky guy gets infected after a hookup or visit to the baths, but a lot of that increase is the creation of hyper-isolated sex communities where there is a lot of fucking and potential infection spreading going on among a small group, which in this case is men who do meth and perhaps other drugs but mostly men having sex with other men who do the same.

OP Troll #6067's linked article says one big difficulty in reducing infection rates is that there aren't enough public health resources to provide the sexual health services that would really make a difference in infection rates. As it is, for most people, going to the doctor or STI clinic is too fraught, too complicated, too slow, too expensive.

It's never a good day, but Lord help you if you go to the county clinic here on a Monday. You will wait for hours. It costs $20, which some people don't have. Results times are shorter than they used to be, only a day or 2, but if you test positive for gon. or syp. you will be required to return and pay another $20 to be given a dose of an injectable and/or oral med. If you test positive for HIV, they refer you out to another doc or clinic, no treatment available. The county clinic here also does not provide post-exposure prophylaxis. In an adjacent rural county, they basically have no money for STI services, so the public health clinic charges patients the standard office rate, plus fees for labs, and another office visit plus fees if you have to return for meds, potentially several hundred dollars.

One reason the situation is as poor as this is because people like Poo Shoes make it all out to be an individual moral or self control problem, rather than the public health and infectious disease problems they really are. And that's how the magat right frames all social problems, as problems of the individual, usually with a moralizing holier-than-thou flourish.

R167

That 4% is not some small cohort of gay male meth users. How funny you would jump to that. Never once have I ever seen that suggested by anyone .

That 4% is the CDC estimate for the % of gay men or msm in the country. As in 4% of the county accounts for nearly half of all new P&S syphilis.

You want to argue that 4% with cdc have at it. It’s not my % it’s theirs. You can easily look it up.

No one said poppers caused aids. Now you are just being silly. Originally poppers were thought by many to be found as the cause of AIDS. That would have been an easy fix.

You think poppers have no adverse impact on the liver? So be it.

You must have more insight on this than the doctor MD+PhD I know who was working at the NIH labs on this, At the time he told me that about poppers we still did not understand that HIV was infectious.

You are a wealth of insight

Poppers are extremely dangerous.

I love that the rabid R163 is now marked as “troll 6068”.

R167

$20 plus $20 and you have to wait for test results? Too fraught, too complicated, too slow, too expensive.

How much do condoms cost and how long does it take to buy them at your local store?

I am no economist but they must be cheaper and with less wait times. And if the folks clogging up that clinic and making you wait, had used condoms , the wait times in that clinic for you would be nil.

Public health vs individuals and their actions.

You nailed it buddy. GC among the MSM is not about individual behavior it’s about public health. Tobacco smoking is not about the individuals behavior and individual addictions. It’s about public health. Crack smoking is not about individual behavior it’s about public health.

And syphilis is not about a man with P syphilis having anal sex with another man without a condom. It’s about public health.

Well stated and great insight.

Diseased queens

[quote] had used condoms , the wait times in that clinic for you would be nil.

You know R170 you can get bacterial STDs even if you use condoms, and warts, and crabs. Both the STDs I’ve had in my life were in my throat, so unless you’re suggesting everybody start using condoms for oral then you’re still gonna need testing babe. And I can’t believe you’re suggesting that people stop testing as an effective way to approach sexual health. It’s the single most important thing to do.

R172

I am not suggesting anything. You should all make the informed decisions you are comfortable with.

I am pointing out. There is a difference, And why would anyone suggest doing away with testing? Where did you read that?

But sooner or later you knew, someone would come along with the, why use condoms , they don’t protect you from everything ,100% of the time. You could get crabs. Or warts.

Seriously I don’t care what people do. And I m not going to suggest condom use to anyone, unless of course they are really interested in avoiding a range of STDs. If they don’t care why should I.

I have accepted the fact that sexually transmitted infections and diseases will be with the gay male community forever.

The diseases they are never going away. And they may one day get a lot worse. Once you accept that fact , you start to care less what individuals do as far as avoiding infectious diseases or not avoiding them.

If just becomes an interesting topic to follow.

I can't wait until you're marked as a troll R169/Dutchie.

Poppers are very safe. They've been around since the 1860s. They were an OTC medication until about 1970. They were falsely blamed for AIDS, then vindicated. Several nations have decriminalized their use. A high quality study concerning the relative psychosocial, physical, addiction and other risks of various recreational substances was performed. Poppers were found to be the least harmful recreational drug. At the top of the list is alcohol, followed by heroin/fentanyl.

Isopropyl nitrites rather than alkyl nitrites, sometimes but not much anymore found in some brands of poppers a decade ago was implicated in temporary reversible damage to the macula of a few people, causing visual disturbances. If you have side effects from using poppers, stop. And all things in moderation. Check labels. Refuse unlabled bottles or those that list isopropyl nitrite.

[quote] Poppers are very safe.

Now I KNOW you're just trolling us, R174!

There are many such lists as I've linked below. Alcohol and heroin are always near the top of the list; alkyl nitrites (poppers) are always at the bottom. Poppers are safe when used as intended, even recreationally.

In 2021 the FDA issues a warning about popper use. They issued this warning due to the increase of hospitalizations and sudden deaths from popper use.

I don’t know the numbers but I would bet they are quite small. The FDA gets paid to worry.

Most on line articles of course tout how dangerous poppers are.

One article which used the word queer constantly suggested that they were relatively harmless. But ended that we don’t know about the risks of long term use.

People today do drop dead from popper use, but since many of these are elderly I don’t know why anyone here on DL worry about using them.

What are the warnings about long term health effects of poppers about? Damage to the heart, lungs, liver, etc.

And short term warnings , about sudden death syndrome,

The latter which most likely sounds worse than it is.

And a counter indication for poppers for those who might be taking protease inhibitors such as one might take to combat Covid or HIV. And of course ED drugs and other drugs as well.

There is a thrill in life to being a risk taker. Those who are risk adverse may live a lot longer and be a lot healthier but they don’t understand how much of a rush there is in taking those risks.

Jump out of airplanes, climb mountain peaks, don’t use condoms while getting butt fucked from someone you don’t know while enjoying the rush of poppers.

All American risk takers. Unless of course they live in Europe or somewhere else.

Doxycycline to the rescue!!

R179

We can all be sure , based on the experts at DL, that the studies that show resistance developing , will turn out to be nothing , in the long run.

Fuck a lot and take a shot load of drugs for protection.

I don’t see how this approach could possibly go wrong.

Syphilis has not shown any tendency to exhibit resistance to the antibiotics that are used to cure it. It is rather easily cured with penicillin and has always been so. It is the more deadly of the two main STDs out there, but very few people nowadays go decades between antibiotics for other conditions, even if they are not tested or specifically treated for syphilis, so tertiary syphilis, which comes on 10-30 years after initial infection is pretty rare in first world countries. Gonorrhea on the other hand, is more noticeable initially (painful urination, discharge) and people who are embarrassed about being tested and treated for it, will steal antibiotics from friends or relatives to treat it just to make symptoms disappear, without any thought to proper dosage or length of treatment. Hence antibiotic resistance is now a huge problem. It is not deadly unless some secondary infection comes on, but it wreaks havoc on male plumbing, and even more so on female plumbing, often leading to infertility. The fear is always (as with many diseases these days) that there will come a point where none of the available antibiotics will be effective against it. I'm not sure about the current state of research, but it used to be standard practice to teach men to leap out of bed, immediately after sex, wash their genitalia thoroughly with soap, working it down into the urethra and then peeing. That seemed to work pretty well as a preventative, but most men like to cuddle (or fall asleep) after sex, and one would need to be 100% consistent. We might need to go back to that method if total antibiotic resistance becomes reality. Unfortunately, there's no similar method to washing out a person's throat, or a woman's vagina, or an ass of any gender as a preventative.

[quote]Syphilis has not shown any tendency to exhibit resistance to the antibiotics that are used to cure it.

Other STDs, such as syphilis and chlamydia, have shown early signs of antibiotic resistance. The threat prompted the World Health Organization last year to release new guidelines for treating [syphilis, chlamydia and gonorrhea]. The organization says drug resistance “has increased rapidly in recent years and has reduced treatment options.”

R182

If and when GC becomes virtually impossible to treat my advice is to buy stock in what ever company makes condoms.

Not only will the bareback community start to use condoms, rates for syphilis and GC , will drop significantly. In fact GC that can’t be treated might end syphilis as a serious problem.

The lowest rates for syphilis in my life time were seen right before an Rx for HIV came along, when men were still afraid of AIDS.

Fear does have an upside when it comes to doing away with high risk behavior for many.

R182

I have absolutely no idea if syphilis becoming resistant to Rx is a significant issue or not. But there are studies out there that suggest it is at least an issue.

What is one of the main driving forces of this seen syphilis resistance——pills.

It’s not the shots of very painful Bicillin to cure syphilis that is the problem it’s people using pills. The kind of pills gay men now take after sex in an attempt to avoid syphilis or other infections.

This routine epi Rx after sex , sounds like one of the dumbest most counterproductive STD approaches I can think of at least in theory.

This is not going to get better it likely will get a lot worse.

R181 I don’t have the link offhand but I recall some recent promising research suggesting that a 30 sec gargle with an antiseptic (eg Listerine) after receiving oral sex being effective in reducing incidence of G/C

R185

60 seconds not 30. And make sure it’s the type with alcohol in it. And yes it has shown to reduce infections of GC.

And someone above mentioned a quick pee right after sex, This will not stop a STI infection , based on studies, but it might well help with preventing a UTI

The red tags are so fucking annoying and make this site look so cheap, either delete all the threads & posts by non-compliant agenda posters or delete the individual posts that are getting the slanted mods pissed off.

I think it's amusing and also helpful, R188.

On a thread like this you can see where OP's posts are antagonistic and condemning people who have unprotected sex, then making posts where he acts like he is naive about STD's and thinks prep prevents everything in an attempt to provoke.

It's funny to see wormy shit stirrers like him be revealed with a red tag. After seeing the way he does that it's easy to recognize the tactic in others threads when he will inevitably pop back up with a new account, like an incurable std on this site.

Then why bother with anonymity at all, R189? I don't understand the obsession with identifying trolls.

R187, it will also prevent snail-trails of dribbling post-coital semen, so your underwear doesn't have that nasty sticky feeling on the way home. This is convenient for everyone but vitally important for men on the DL. Down low, that is, not the Datalounge.

[quote] Fear does have an upside when it comes to doing away with high risk behavior for many.

Oh yes R183 pines for the days of the 80s and 90s when so many gay men were dying from aids because that was a much safer time for gays (the ones not dying?) because they had lower exposure to syphilis (?).

R192

GC that can’t be Rx will lead to virtual universal condom use. Is there anyone here that would deny that?

I accept the fact that at some point Gonorrhea is quite likely to become untreatable. And that lots and lots of pill taking will speed that day,

It is what it is

R190 it’s for people with a persecution fetish who desperately need something to improve their self-esteem

R190 because this place contains a few prisspots who want to monitor everything

[quote] GC that can’t be Rx will lead to virtual universal condom use. Is there anyone here that would deny that?

Yes R193. You have no proof that this will happen. There is no precedence for this. Treatments also evolve over time so your doomsdaying is just dumb.

Also I’d just like to point out, the main way that bacterial infections become antibiotic resistant is when they are allowed to develop over time, untreated in a person’s body. So antibiotic treatments such as doxyprep do also reduce the amount of infections. So while there is arguably overuse, there’s also empirically fewer infections, I don’t know if they cancel each other out, but wanted to mention it, bc ofc nobody else on this thread would acknowledge the benefits of it 😭

R193

. Brilliant absolutely brilliant to point out on DL that we can t tell the future.

Except maybe for you. You are positive that new drugs will be developed and gonorrhea will never be totally resistant to Rx. Great, That is a relief to know. I am so relieved to know there is absolutely nothing to be worried about as far as future resistance.

I am more a history major than a fortune teller. The only time in my fairly long life that condoms were used significantly by the highest risk groups was when AIDS was killing people. Then syphilis rates crashed.. once HIV became treatable the condoms came off.

I hope you are correct and lots of new drugs come along. Then bareback can indeed stay on the menu. And few things in life are more important than that.

But if you are wrong about resistance then buy stock in condom companies.

R198 lol ur so fucking stupid. My point was that you cannot predict with certainty what will happen, and neither can I. You were the one speaking in absolutes.

R199

You said that treatments will evolve so I am wrong about gc that will be untreatable in the future. Let’s hope you are correct. Risk free fucking would be so nice.

I know what direction the issue of resistance is heading. Worse not getting better. You may not be worried but a lot of people are. The worried are guessing it might get worse.

^^^Of all of life’s issues two twats debate that.

Bunch of people arguing over nothing...

R193 is a homophobic incel!

RAW IS LAW!

R200 I’m not saying that gonorrhea won’t become untreatable, I’m saying that when you said that that was an absolute fact that was incorrect.

[quote] The worried are guessing

The ‘worried’…are ‘guessing’? Wow how scientific 😂😂😂. ‘The worried’ sounds like some game of thrones tribe lol.

R194, the biggest self righteous people are also big hypocrites!!

R197 gave a prime example of the problem with the PrEP Petri dish bottoms, rather than using condoms, in between PrEP panels they’re brewing an ass kombucha. I’m sure most the people who say “no big deal, take 20 loads in a night”, were also screeching “wear a mask, listen to the scientists!” during COVID. The hypocrisy is lost on them.

Exactly r206

Loser red tagged OP is already back @ R206 screeching the same things he did at R72 and R74

R208 has 46 loads in her hole

R206 does have a point tho. Putting aside the actual studies suggesting that prep usage has indeed facilitated transmission of other STIs, which seems kinda common sense (but oh boy did I get RIPPED apart for posting that in another thread months ago! Cripes) I always found the 3 month testing window argument a bit disingenuous. Sure, if we’re comparing 2 men (one on prep and no condom usage, one not on prep but using condoms) who have roughly the same # of sexual partners and engaging in activities with the same or similar risk profiles in that 3 month window, it would seem obvious the prep user presents overall less risk from an STI transmission standpoint. But those two assumptions are exactly that - and suffice to say a lot of guys on prep (at least in NYC) seem to be having way more (bareback) sex with way more partners v. the non-prep crowd. Thus A LOT can happen (and change the risk calculus) in that 3 month window.

R206, R207, but the enforced 3 month testing window means that any infection would be detected before the time any reasonable problems could be caused, and also before any meaningful timeline could have elapsed whereby the infection could develop any resistance.

When were you both most recently tested? Be honest. Well I suppose, neither of you are having sex so you don’t rly need to be tested lol.

[quote]the enforced 3 month testing window means that any infection would be detected before the time any reasonable problems could be caused

Not if testing is inadequate:

"Levels of sexual health screening among gay men taking PrEP fall well below recommended levels, investigators from the United States report in the online edition of Clinical Infectious Diseases. Rates of testing for sexually transmitted infections (STIs) in the rectum and throat – which can be asymptomatic – were especially low, so too testing coverage in south-eastern US states which have an especially high burden of HIV and STI infections among gay and other men who have sex with men."

R212

A fairly high percent of those gay men who have been on PrEP who have never had a STI culture. And pretty high for those that only get them some of the time.

Many men may have quality follow up and monitoring but many don’t, Even with a syphilis blood test.

I'm not shocked!

- Everyone's a WHORE! nowadays troll

Save yourself folks! Get a space suit!

I blame Reagan. The fact that so many gay men don’t use condoms today , and that so many on PrEP don’t get follow up STI exams, even while on PrEP. All of that can be traced back to Reagan and not being caring or supportive enough. If only he had showed he cared this could have turned out so differently..

This increase of STIs is not the fault of those getting infected.

R211 they’re mainly only doing blood and urine testing, so throat & rectum infections go undetected, so yes the ass kombuchas are brewing.

“Antibiotic resistance is threatening the effectiveness of gonorrhea treatment in the US…..Over the years Gonorrhea has developed a resistance to nearly every drug used to treat it”

CDC

What a crock. I read just yesterday on DL this would not be a problem and new drugs would come along in no time.

Maybe CDC should be checking here on DL first before publishing such alarmist statements.

what sti can you get from rimming?

Someone is trying to FF me

R219

Syphilis, gonorrhea, hepatitis, intestinal parasites, HIV, herpes, HPV, among a few others. It’s almost , except for these, a nearly risk free activity

R221 you cannot get hiv from rimming. And don’t start with this “well if you lost a tooth right before you did it” bullshit.

R222

Granted very unlikely for HIV. As opposed to licking a primary syphilis lesion. Unless mucus membrane comes in contact with blood or you had cuts and abrasions present.

Very very unlikely which is not the same as impossible.

R212 that’s depressing - but, some interesting quotes and takeaways from that article. Seems that responsible gay men that are getting tested (both prep and non prep users) are being let down by services available, more so in republican / poor states (quelle surprise).

[quote] A sexual health screen in the previous 12 months was reported by 89% of current PrEP users, 71% of men who had previously taken PrEP and 44% of individuals who had never taken the therapy.

This quote above is particularly interesting. Gay men on prep are 2x as likely as non prep users to have been tested in the past year, and gay men that have discontinued their prep usage are 1.5x more likely to have been tested that people that have never user prep. Shows you an idea of how regular attendance enforced by prep usage gives people good habits re their sexual health.

And remember, in that group of people that have never used prep, are the group of gay men that have NEVER been tested. They are most likely to have untreated HIV. At least with a prep user you know they’ve been tested at some point in their lives. Make educated choices boys!

And yes sorry R223 while it is technically possible it’s not functionally possible so what are you trying to prove.

I'm a Scatman!

R216, I see what you did there. Nicely done, but you forgot to mention Trump slashing public health budgets and generally just being Trump. He’s at fault, too.

While there are still questions about what could happen if doxy-PEP gains popularity, researchers have tried to look for signs of increased antimicrobial resistance among those taking the treatment.

For example, Staphylococcus aureus — a bacteria that's usually found on the nose and skin — can harbor resistance to doxycycline, and the U.S. trial found an 8% increase in resistance levels among those who took doxy-PEP.

"What that trajectory would look like over time is hard to know, but it's going to be really important to understand that," says Luetkemeyer.

She points out doxycycline isn't actually used to treat most staph infections, although one exception is MRSA, a nasty type of staph that can lead to lethal infections. MRSA can also hang out in people's noses without causing serious infections in most cases. Luetkemeyer says not many people had doxycycline-resistant MRSA in their nose at the beginning of her study, and there didn't appear to be an increase in resistance among those who took the medication.

Gonorrhea is another area of concern because of its propensity to develop resistance. About a quarter of gonorrhea cases in the U.S. are already resistant to the class of antibiotics that doxycycline is a part of, and, in some parts of the world, it's much higher.

This well-documented resistance is why doxycycline isn't recommended for treating gonorrhea and other antibiotics are used instead, says Hook at the University of Alabama, Birmingham. Doxy-PEP trials do show it's less effective at preventing gonorrhea compared to chlamydia, but the fact that it made a meaningful dent in gonorrhea at all should be seen as a "bonus," rather than cause for concern, he says.

R227, only an idiot would think routinely dosing yourself with antibiotics was a good idea. This is why doctors don't - or shouldn't - prescribe antibiotics for viral infections. Not because of potential side effects, although sensitization leading to severe allergy is always a possibility, but because the bugs will develop resistance. With something like gonorrhea, where multi-drug-resistant strains already exist, it's especially foolhardy.

I mean, why not take a course of antibiotics every time you cut your finger? You never know where MRSA might be lurking!

I don't care how much people fuck around. It's their business. But fucking around and then taking antibiotics to prevent STD is idiotic, and doctors who enable this with prescriptions should be disciplined. It's a terrible public health practice, and I don't think doctors would do this for any other purpose.

[quote]It's a terrible public health practice, and I don't think doctors would do this for any other purpose.

Unfortunately, doctors routinely overprescribe antibiotics for all sorts of inappropriate uses.

"2017 research from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and The Pew Charitable Trusts shows that nearly 1 in 3 antibiotics prescribed at outpatient facilities—including physician’s offices, emergency departments, and hospital-based outpatient clinics—is unnecessary, amounting to 47 million prescriptions a year."

Doctors share a great deal of responsibility for the increasing incidence of antibiotic resistance.

R229

An interesting article I saw a while back by an MD who works with the or a San Fransisco AIDS organization.

He acknowledged that this routine epi Rx with antibiotics has risk for creating resistance. He did not deny that at all.

But he made it clear he was treating his pt s today not pt s down the road so he would do what he thought best for the Pt sitting in front of him. Not the pts or the or community to come.

Sort of like polluters that only care about the jobs needed today and fuck those who come along decades from now and the environment they have to live in.

The medical community is desperate. They realize condoms are a no go. Infections are going up. They realize safe sex is a no go. They know they have few good options left.

So we will bb and butt fuck today and let those coming down the road years from now deal with the consequences and we won’t care since we will be old or dead.

STIs in the gay male community are only going to get worse and some will be harder and harder to treat..

You know that farming is argued by many experts to be the biggest contributor to antibiotic resistance, not doxy-preppers.

R231

What a relief to know that today doxy-prepers are not the single largest cause of antibiotic resistance in the US.

So people are arguing that virtually every drug previously used to Rx gonorrhea was made resistant by the farmers of America?

This FFA being different from the other FFA. One group still alive the other not so much,

WHORES ‘ROUND THE WORLD! 🌎

PrEP has a higher success rate than condoms and 99% of STDs are curable. Get checked every three months and you’ll be fine.

[quote] But he made it clear he was treating his pt s

Oh, dear.

One of the benefits of PrEP is the frequent testing and follow up, as well as advice to test frequently for STDs. I don't even understand why people denigrate this. As in many other things, it's the people who don't even think about prevention of disease who are the major vectors for spreading them.

R228 So true, I can't even imagine what the inside of their stomach's look like with all of those antibiotics. They must have no gut biome left. They are going to get every type of autoimmune gut disease, or C diff, it would make someone miserable.

My understanding is that this prophylaxis is only one or 2 pills. I think we are most likely getting more antibiotics than that every time we eat a piece of commercially-raised beef. (Antibiotics are frequently used in farm animals to increase weight gain and to prevent diseases in overcrowded conditions). I wouldn't describe it as good for the gut biome, but most people only start to develop problems with longer duration pill regimens. Of course, if someone is having a dozen unprotected sexual encounters a week and tries to follow this regimen every time, that's definitely going to cause a problem because that person will be on antibiotics continually. If that were my lifestyle, I would be guzzling vast amounts of probiotics like yogurt and kimchee on a daily basis as part of my permanent diet

R236

Gay men on PrEP are a major factor in the steep national rise in syphilis rates. They are heavily infected with other STIs such as gonorrhea. They also are a very overly STI infected group of people.

And as we saw in a recent study posted here a significant number on PrEP are not given routine anal or oral cultures (Dx test) as suggested.

R236

r239, I didn't see your evidence for this statement: Gay men on PrEP are a major factor in the steep national rise in syphilis rates

In fact, that largest increases in syphilis and other STDs are in the South and in Alaska, among MSM, areas of the country where PrEP use is the lowest in the nation and where there are large populations of black and Latino black men, who have substandard access to health care and information. . Granted, that highest numbers are in NY and California, but that's just because their populations are so large. NY does a good bit worse than California in per capita, but it's places like Mississippi that are highest.

R240

Why would anyone look at over all state syphilis data to try understand how infected with syphilis gay men on PrEP are. That makes no sense.

You look at the syphilis rates for gay men on PrEP..

Actually, you'd need to do a quite extensive research project to determine that. Most importantly, you'd need to figure out exactly what percentage of sexually active gay men are on PrEP and then compare their syphilis infection rate with the MSM who are NOT on PrEP. That's a worthwhile study - but you haven't shown us any study that I can determine.

[quote] And as we saw in a recent study posted here a significant number on PrEP are not given routine anal or oral cultures (Dx test) as suggested.

That’s not prep users fault, it’s a failure in public health. Also in that same study it showed that men using prep were more than twice as likely as their non prep using counterparts to have been tested in the last year.

They have a new “fruity” cereal coming out, a “Queer cereal” if you will, it called DOXyPEPbles. It has DOXXY doses in every bowl. You just eat it every morning and it’ll kick the C or G to the curb!

Warning: might obliterate your microbiome 🚨

Hungry Root came through

R242

“ Syphilis ( or STI) and Gay men on PrEP”

That is all it takes several studies will show up very quickly. Its an important subject please educate yourself and do a little reading . This is being studied and reported onl.

R243

These are private doctors are they not giving 3 month prep follow up exams?

OK I hate to state the obvious but if you are on PrEP and giving BJs or being a bottom anally, without condom use, and your doctor does not do a culture then it’s the fault of the doc and the pt. Bit either way it’s a problem and it undercutsnthis——we are being tested for everything every 3 months. Not all are,

Don’t tell me gay men on PrEP don’t understand this. And if that exam is not in a city or county public clinic then Public Health has nothing to do with this.

R243

You summed up well aids, and syphilis and gonorrhea and MPox etc etc etc etc epidemics in the gay community.

It’s someone else’s fault Not Reagan s this time though.

In this case you are blaming public health. It’s not public health forcing gay men to not practice safe sex or not to ask for a culture every 3 months when in the doctors office and on PrEP.

Gay men are so cavalier about their health

Can't blame gay men for this:

"Congenital syphilis has skyrocketed across the US, particularly in the South and Southwest. Infections in newborns have risen about 700% across the country over the past decade."

R249

That is why “ men who have sex with men” MSM makes so much more sense than gay when you are talking about HIV and STIs.

It’s all about behavior not self described labels.

Gay would at least imply no sex with woman. MSM is the realization that many MSM have sex with both.

r249 Anything "congenital" is very likely the fault of bisexual men, not gay men. Gay men aren't knocking up women. That stat has nothing to do with gay men. Stop.

[quote]Gay men aren't knocking up women. That stat has nothing to do with gay men.

Hence the intro line "Can't blame gay men for this."

R251

I don’t use the word blame. I use source of infections.

In the US we have one syphilis epidemic. And it’s fueled by a few high risk groups. But they all contribute to one larger national problem.

Similar to HIV the high risk groups that feed this syphilis epidemic will be MSM White, MSM black, MSM Hispanic, black straight woman often the poorest, black straight men often the poorest, the drug addicts, and those that exchange sex for drugs or shelter. Those that are desperate.

That is your syphilis epidemic in the US

I would love to talk to someone at the Houston HD or CDC to see exactly how they are Dx those congenital Dx of syphilis that are being reported. I don’t trust the numbers without knowing exactly how they are doing the Dx.

I was once involved with a massive outbreak of congenital syphilis DX. Many dozens of pos bloods or potential cases, in a rather moderate to small urban city.

Pos bloods on moms and babies. Lots of them.

What we did not find after the intensive epi investigation , was any or very much in the way of actual congenital syphilis that was real.

Initial pos blood tests or vdrl on mom and baby was caused by a whole lot of false positives and from people previously treated etc . It was not new infections.

Have no idea what is going on in Houston it may be real it maybe much less than what it looks like now.

[quote]Similar to HIV the high risk groups that feed this syphilis epidemic will be MSM White, MSM black, MSM Hispanic, black straight woman often the poorest, black straight men often the poorest, the drug addicts, and those that exchange sex for drugs or shelter. Those that are desperate.

"MSM White" ... except that rates of STDs are much lower among whites than among blacks. I don't mean to say that whites don't get STDs or that they don't contribute to the spread of STDs, but they are far from the highest-risk group.

As far as HIV MSM White has the most number of Dx. As you point out Dx rates may be something else.

As far as syphilis those groups mentioned above are the high risk groups that drive the epidemic——which is not the same as saying no one outside those groups ever gets infected.

I read this posted by someone I knew to work for CDC STD program. Maybe 5-6 years ago now.

CDC had never had a syphilis or HIV outbreak traced back to straight swingers. And those people do a lot of fucking. A lot of unprotected fucking.

[quote] I read this posted by someone I knew to work for CDC STD program. Maybe 5-6 years ago now.

Wow well…with research such as this……thread closed!

What would really make the difference is a home test for these STDs. I am sure the technology is there. If there is a commitment to actually reduce these STDs they would develop a home test so people could find out. The reality is healthcare is just not as accessible to people, or it is not convenient enough. PLUS (not that I can imagine doing this, but you could ask someone to take a test right there before you engaged in any activity). That is where the energy and resources should be put- rather than trying to shame everyone into other behaviors or just dosing people with antibiotics.

Heartopper

Thanks to this thread and TikTok spying on my every move online and off, I've been getting vids from doctors and epidemiologists regarding STIs lately. The consensus seems to be:

2 things are causing these increases: (a) Poverty and reduced public health care budgets making screening and treatment unaffordable or unavailable; and (b) post-covid, let it all hang out making up for lost time clusters of people fucking each other via sex parties, sex clubs, swingers' groups - mostly straights according to every doc who has commented - with drug use also a contributing factor.

Of course gay men are one of these groups, but they're a rather small and isolated one, and they aren't infecting women causing congenital syphilis in newborns, where the largest increases in cases are occurring.

According to published CDC data for 2021

176,713 new Dx of syphilis of these 2855 were congenital syphilis.

53,767 of new primary and secondary syphilis. Of these 83% were found in men.

R259

MSM not so small a group as you suggest. And congenital syphilis not the cause of the steep uptake in Dx a small fraction of total syphilis numbers.

This is highlighted at the top of the current CDC info page on US syphilis stats:

“Men account for the most cases of syphilis , with the vast majority occurring among gay, bisexual and other men who have sex with men”

And on a different fact or CDC stat sheet

“In the US almost half of MSM with P&S syphilis will have HIV”

Why is this important?

Studies , based on spinal exams, are showing that up to 90% of men with both a HIV and syphilis Dx will show neurosyphilis involvement.

[quote] Asymptomatic neurosyphilis is the most common form of neurosyphilis.

[quote] People who have asymptomatic or meningeal neurosyphilis generally return to their original health if they receive proper treatment.

R261 neurosyphilis doesn’t cause problems if treated, even for HIV+ patients. You’d have to go untreated for between 3-30 years before sustaining any meaningful damage that could not be reversed. You’re so drama lol.

R262

What a relief to find a real DL expert on syphilis + hiv leading to neurosyphilis who is willing to go on record that neurosyphilis is not a big deal and will not cause harm for years..

So much more reassuring than reading studies which talk of early involvement of spine and brain after 6 months and alleged serious issues with treatment failures. And lots of strange physical symptoms not normally seen in syphilis.

Just 3 days ago another DL expert told us resistance to gonorrhea was also not a big deal because another better drug was always going to come along.

Another DL expert just recently informed us that congenital syphilis, less than 3000 Dx a year, was the reason for these steep spikes in syphilis in the US which sees over 175,000 Dx a year.

The suggested Rx for a man with hiv and syphilis which has lead to neurosyphilis, a Dx for sure only with a spinal, is 10-14 days of PenG given via IV or shots throughout the day.

Which means in patient care.

So relieved to find out from you that neurosyphilis in young men is just not a big deal. Why read NEJM when you can read DL?

[quote] early involvement of spine and brain after 6 months

R263 girl wtf is this absolute word salad lol. Post your ‘studies of….. alleged serious issues (lol)’.

[quote] Just 3 days ago another DL expert told us resistance to gonorrhea was also not a big deal because another better drug was always going to come along.

That was me…..and that’s not what I said. Go read a book babe.

Makes you wanna leave the door open at Motel 6, doesn’t it? 🧫 🦠 😷

R264

Dont be lazy do a little reading yourself.

And if that was you , and you recognized your statement, how is that not what you said?

The number of people who will argue about hiv and STI and seem to have never looked up the actual cdc data or nih studies is amazing. It’s like they make up shit that just sounds good to them, And then disagree without the ability to say exactly what they disagree with,

So much misinformation and ignorance.

I love eating ass, what kind of check ups should I get? so far, I've one done it with one person. He fucks around, I don't. So I should get STI testing once every 6 months? I have no signs of anything. what can be asymptomatic?

Bad news! I may have exposed many, many, MANY of you to chlamydia. If STDs are at a shocking high, I’m sorry to say I did my part.

Did you know chlamydia can cause lymphogranuloma venereum (LGV)? I didn’t! I thought I had IBS or colon cancer and a gastroenterologist I went to thought I might have a very mild case of ulcerative colitis. Her main advice was “diet and exercise.” I did an STD test and it came back negative. So I dieted and exercised and bitched and moaned and was in pain for a long time, learning to live with it.

Then I did another STD test. I guess the first was a false negative.

Anyway, I know STDs are bad and that I’m a dirty whore, but just a friendly PSA if you are having painful, persistent gastrointestinal issues, it could be chlamydia all up in your lymphatic system. Unlike IBS, UC, cancer etc, doxycycline should clear it up.

R267

I am trying to think of a STI that can’t be asymptomatic? I can’t think of one.

But if you are asking if you can get gonorrhea or syphilis etc from eating the ass of an infected person the answer would depend on where they had been infected.

Don’t forget parasites and amoebas.

R266 come on post your studies. Let’s see a link baby.

[quote] So much misinformation and ignorance.

Yes one thing we can agree on lol 😭

I didn’t know South Dakota had a middle name!

[quote]I am trying to think of a STI that can’t be asymptomatic? I can’t think of one.

"Many people believe that they'd know they'd have a sexually transmitted infection (STI) because they'd notice any STI symptoms. But, sadly, that isn't so. The incredible frequency of asymptomatic STIs is one factor that make STIs so common."

S-T-Deeees! Whores get DISEASES! Sex bad!

Promiscuous bottoms get infected

Ass Kombucha©

r276 As someone who loves and drinks kombucha, I beg of you, please stop saying this.

R267 if you are young enough (I think 45 and under) get an HPV vaccine. You don't want to get throat cancer and HPV is often asymptomatic. Can cause warts in some people but not everyone.

Hey R263, you’ll be glad to hear this. There’s a gonorrhea vaccine on the horizon. Guess I was right after all ☺️

[quote] However, even a partially protective vaccine could still prevent a substantial proportion of high-risk individuals from gonorrhoea infection and hence further rounds of transmission.10 When infections do occur, people who have been vaccinated might still have a reduced within-host load of N gonorrhoeae and these infections might be more susceptible to antibiotic treatments than those in unvaccinated people. Policy makers should consider the 4CMenB vaccine as a potential option for gonorrhoea prevention and control in the effort of achieving the 2030 target before a more effective approach becomes readily available.

Good news for people living with HIV & their sexual partners:

A shortage of penicillin to treat a skyrocketing number of syphilis cases is so dire that US health officials are debating the need to declare a public health emergency.

Major US medical centers are rationing the recommended treatment for the deadly sexually transmitted disease because of a supply crunch. From Michigan to Missouri to Texas, some health-care providers are prioritizing giving a key treatment — penicillin G benzathine — to pregnant patients and babies, because the drug can pass through the placenta and also treat the fetus.

R280, you gullible cunt

“Trust the science!” - Progressive Kombucha Bottoms when they could feel superior during COVID, not so much during monkeypox or other STD outbreaks