Gay-Acting Gay Guys

I don't have any problems with gay men who are less than masculine. A gentle, soft spoken gay man can be very sexy. But the big, girly exaggerated drama queens I can't tolerate.

[quote]I am asking because there's a current thread dedicated to mocking Shawn Mendes for having gay body language.

[quote]It bothers me that gay men make fun of other men for being apparently, obviously gay

We're not mocking Shawnee for being gay and fem; we're roasting her for being closeted.

Gurl, speak to the hand, the wrist is pissed!

I don't laugh at them and I can be friends with them but I would never have sex with one of them.

I like more masculine guys but if a gay guy is just being himself and some of those traits naturally show I have no problem with it. In a way it's masculine to be more comfortable to yourself. What I DO NOT LIKE is the campy HAAY Bithces! The mean spirited jokes about other people for attention, the obsession with woman's fashion, hair or housewife shows on TV. The unbridled purchases of LV, Gucci or other status symbols because they think that buys them class when in reality it makes them look like total trash. That is a total dick wilter for me.

R4 Is there any chance you are one of "them" without knowing it?

r6 About a snowball's chance in Hell.

OP, thanks for making the distinction between the more-or-less learned traits and the innate ones. Seeing someone like Mendes, who is so clearly a nelly gay and can't hide it, really turns me on but RPDR fans turn me right off.

Are you a little bit autistic OP? Is this your "good student" applied project in social understanding?

Yeah, R8, I am the same. I'm attracted to gay-acting guys, but repulsed by guys and girls who 'act gay,' meaning 'yassss' and 'YES GAWD' and so on.

One of the gay-themed podcasts I used to listen to is Homophilia. It became a joke after a while that the conversation would always come back around to discussing two shows: drag race and the real housewives.

What's up with that? I guess I understand the appeal of drag race because there's creativity in crafting a drag persona, but why is the real housewives franchise so resonate with many gay men? I've never seen the show so maybe there's something deeper that I'm not picking up on.

[quote] why is the real housewives franchise so resonate with many gay men? I've never seen the show so maybe there's something deeper that I'm not picking up on.

I've never seen the show because the commercials alone revolt me, but perhaps it's the camp factor. It's like a room full of Helen Lawsons and Neely O'Haras at each other's throats. I find it more depressing than anything.

R11 A theory: Drag Race appeals to young gay men because it's a social subculture thing in which they can be the focal points instead of sidelined, and it's a fun creative outlet. Young people have adopted RuPaul-branded drag as part of their overall 'cool' culture, and this naturally puts young gay men in the middle as the figures people look to as having the it factor. That's a radical change, like when athletics and then hiphop culture shifted attention on black men from "lesser" to "greater" and "cooler." Now that has been done to young gay men if they opt into drag culture.

The Real Housewives...well, a lot of gay men over 30 have a lot in common with women over 35, as much as people may not want it to be true. The gay subculture/society isn't all that different than socialite society, where status and appearance are central to how much attention and respect someone gets. And both older women and over-30 gay men tend to opt into unrealistic beauty standards and many—especially those who seek these sorts of social status-based lives—are competitive with one another and with life. They're both (older women, aging gay men) the types to invest a lot of money in surgeries and clothes to try to stay young and relevant, to seek attention, to see others as competitors, to both idolize youthful beauty and resent it, and to use 'mean girl' barbs as armor, which can make them cuttingly funny and simultaneously tragic figures. They have delusion, humor and deep sadness about the losses of what they believe once made them valuable in common. And I think these rich socialite ladies on these shows see gay men as harmless, court-jester type mirrors of themselves and they have gay sidekicks so they can kind of laugh at them and consider them a rung lower on the social order ladder while also enjoying their company, and I think gay men probably see these sad aging socialite ladies in exactly the same way.

Just being an armchair analyst, and also, I am right about all of it. 😁

To answer OP question: Yes, it's a turn-off. But if we're talking about a ONS and he's cute enough, it's not a dealbreaker.

R13, armchair-analyse to your heart's content, I'm interested!

R13 That explanation helps me understand this cultural moment a bit better. One of the two hosts of Homophilia is Dave Holmes. He was an MTV host back in the 90s. At the start of their podcast, he wasn't into drag race & the housewives. But his co-host and so many of their guests wanted to discuss the various characters, he eventually had to start watching these shows in order to keep up with the conversation, but it's clear his heart really isn't in it.

It would seem that resistance against the Andy Cohen/Rupaul borg is futile.

R15 OK! As a brief follow up to the long entry, I'll sum up the Housewives this way: I saw a meme this week that showed images of Sonya Morgan crying and it said that Sonya Morgan is a Tennessee Williams tragic heroine come to life. And that applies to all the 'best' Housewives.

And Tennessee Williams was a gay playwright who basically depicted gay men who are horny and ashamed of themselves as aging women because psychologically, it just makes sense.

for myself, I'd say it's more the conflict with the scene queens that are 100% plugged into the mainstream gay scene that they don't have an identity outside of it. It's not so much that it's effeminate or even feminine really but rather it's immature, always on and always over the top.... emotionally, mentally, socially arrested. Everyone knows this kind of barfly.

It's basically the male equivalent of an extreme faghag. Both are training wheels for many gay men when they come out but eventually, the gay lad will mature, broaden their horizons and outgrow the scene queens and hags.

this vid, though a comedy, it showcases well:

R5- It sounds like you’re Describing that character on the HBO show GIRLS.

Elijah who was

SCENEY

QUEENY

BITCHY

He Played a stockFAGGOT character that the straight girls on the show could play against.

R18 The It Gets Better reference in the title lands with me.

I loved the idea of the campaign and the messages that came from it because I barely survived my adolescence. It was a wicked time.

And then within a year or two, I saw that Dan and Terry were leveraging the It Gets Better campaign to promote Terry's narcissism and to sell his ultra-conformist, self-loathing-inspired gym body as he aged, and it made me sick.

No, it's not reasonable that I took it to heart and felt so betrayed by it, but I did. I'm just being honest. To create a campaign and then a whole nonprofit org based on that campaign to tell young gay people why they should not hate themselves based on others' standards and then pimp themselves out as standard-adhering sex models upset me deeply.

I am attracted to gay guys with gay mannerisms, but I am heartbroken by gay men who 'act gay' in the sense of conforming to ideals and seeking attention for being good enough and measuring up to idealized body standards and other socially prescribed standards. It makes me very sad and it keeps me distant from the so-called gay community because the whole gay community as I have ever experienced it is just a community of fascist-level conformity.

R18- That show sucks.

R20 It’s a joke and if you dare confront it, you’re exiled.

I enjoy gay-acting gay guys. Even better if they are from some improbable place such as Baku or Gaza or Cairo

R20 I've also been really disappointed with Dan Savage in the last few years.

He doesn't give a crap about gay men anymore. He's trying to appeal to a Gen Z audience by cozying up to the blue-haired gender ideology crowd.

One of the "queer non-binary" writers at his alt weekly published a story last summer critical of Bette Midler. Dan allowed this young writer to throw Bette under the bus because she dared to stand up for the rights of women.

Bette argued that it's dehumanizing to women to call them birthing-persons, chest-feeders, bleeders, uterus-havers and vagina-owners.

But Bette pissed of transwomen with her tweet, so naturally gender ideology freaks threw her under the bus.

And the writer of this piece pretty much agreed that we shouldn't show Bette Midler films anymore because she upset mentally unstable transwomen.

[quote]the obsession with woman's fashion,

Which woman?

R24 That was a very quick volley from Dan Savage to Bette Midler and resentment of transgender people. Quite a departure from the topic of gay-acting gay men. Very acrobatic.

R26 We're discussing Dan Savage. Try to keep up, sweetie.

[quote]I think we are generally very different types of people by nature, with gay men and lesbians effectively being third and fourth sexes that are apart from straight men and women behaviorally and psychologically.

This is complete bullshit and bigoted. It's like saying that you think that everyone is a normal human except for Chinese people who are like a difference species.

R27- I've mentioned this on other thread here on the datalounge- Dan Savage is a DICK.

He once said in a gay documentary that gay men who are not attracted to effeminate gay men are misogynistic. He's berating people for whom they are or are not attracted to. Sexual attraction is such a personal thing and people should not be berated for what they like or dislike.

This has been the bane of my life. It's like I've got a neon sign on my head flashing GAY! Everybody knows.

It's hard to objectively measure yourself but I think I come across to most people as a sort of Jim Parsons. Slim, small-boned, neatly dressed and I've got "that" voice which still even surprises me when I hear it back on a voicemail.

I'm 63 years old and have a lifetime of memories where in work/social situations I've spoken up or contributed, only to be met with stony silence. And no eye-contact of course. No one takes you seriously.

When I'm asked why I'm single (usually by straight women) I tell them gay men aren't interested in "gay" men like me... Huh??? They don't get it. Most gay men get it but don't want to admit it (so thanks OP).

The whole scene-queen-Real Housewives-RuPaul thing is not me and I have as much in common with that type of gay man as I do with fundamentalist Christians.

I have found enough gay guys who I do have things in common with, but do not discount how much it scares off "male-socialized" guys when they think that being gay involves being that kind of gay. The internet in general and apps in particular help a lot as you can avoid the entire scene and still get laid.

Would I have a relationship with an effeminate guy? Hard to say---I never did, but it depends on the guy and what we had in common, It would not be a hard "no" though it was when I was in my 20s. Given that I am currently married, this is largely hypothetical.

I have had sex with femme guys but it was usually of the them servicing me variety - come over and give me a blowjob and now leave sort of thing.

Big muscly guys who turn out to be very femme just sort of freak me out so that was always a hard no.

There are times I have much more respect for a gay-acting man. People like r30, about whom there was never any doubt about his being gay, sometimes have a much bigger struggle in life than those who can pass for straight. At his age, I'm sure he's dealt with some real, true homophobic shit in his life and yet persevered through and made it.

I love people like him, so, yes, I do like gay-acting men.

I have more of an issue with guys who ping heavily identifying as straight. That I do not get!

EJ Johnson thinks you're talking about Frankie Grande.

E32 Tell us what "gay acting" means to you.

Let's take your sentiment and see how this sounds:

"There are times I have much more respect for a black-acting black man"

Do you see how offensive your comment is?

Um, r35, did you not read the OP, you SJW idiot?

[quote]Are you turned off by gay-acting gay guys? By gay acting, I mean effeminate mannerisms and body language, not learned behaviors like drag lingo and saying "GURRRRL!"

[quote]I am using the term 'gay acting' instead of effeminate, by the way, intentionally.

Go find something on twitter to be outraged about, cunt.

There were a few articles written by "queer women" who argued that Mayor Pete wasn't "gay enough".

These women want gay men to act and behave a certain way.

Imagine of the reaction if gay men wrote articles where they tried to police the mannerisms of black women.

"I personally usually am attracted to a little touch of 'swishiness,' of the type seen in the Shawn Mendes and Taylor Lautner GIFs that have gone viral."

OP, same here. If a guy's good looking and starts talking and the purse falls out, I get *excited.* Same with femmy mannerisms. Nothing too OTT like those who scream YASS QUEEN but men who are just themselves and happen to exhibit gay characteristics are really attractive to me.

R37. - this is why there are a ton of books written by women for women about what they want basically asexual, lovey-dovey 100% of the time gay men to be like.

It annoys me because I don’t often discern what parts are a natural affect and which parts, besides certain phrases as, contrived.

Popular culture is at the point where ethnic stereotypes are pretty much verboten. The Mrs.Swan character on MadTV is seen nowadays as a gross stereotype of an older Asian-American woman.

So why is it OK to have flaming caricatures of gay men still representing us? Is it because those characters are seen as asexual and non-threatening?

Men being sexually attracted to other men is acting gay. Asshole.

[quote] OK, guys, it's time to discuss this

This topic has been discussed 987,654,321 times on this hellsite.

OK, so now it's 987,654,322.

R31- That's called See Tarzan Hear Jane syndrome.

[quote] By gay acting, I mean effeminate mannerisms and body language, not learned behaviors like drag lingo and saying "GURRRRL!"

The former is definitely preferable. Men can have effeminate mannerisms yet still be very masculine in other ways. The latter is just a man who wants to be a woman.

R38- Like the guy on this First Dates show. He's effeminate naturally but not a scene queen or a YES QWEEN. He's a low key gay male who happens to be effeminate.

Having lived in a few gayborhoods, I saw a lot of affected behavior. I won't call it "gay acting". I know many more men who are gay and never act overly femme. If someone's femme-ness comes naturally to them, so be it. But all that sashaying and mimicking Drag Race, Real Housewives or sassy black women is super trashy. Immediately lets me know to stay the hell away when I see all that nonsense. The younger and newly out gays seem more apt to fall into this trap. And also if they are from smaller flyover areas and they have come to the "big city".

We used to call those sorts of guys "Pro-Mos" or professional homosexuals.

Everything they do is gay-oriented -- vacations, restaurants, bars, neighborhoods, friends, movies, books, TV. They will immediately announce that they are gay even when the situation does not call for it. ("I'd like a venti cappuccino, a banana muffin and I'm gay!")

I love that, r49!

[quote]These women want gay men to act and behave a certain way.

This woman I work for is like that and she even has a gay son. She described him to me one day as not being any fun because he doesn't act like "normal" gay guys who dress nice or care about designer fashion.

So even if woman are gay allies to some extent, there is also a lot of stereotyping pushed upon us to be accepted. I witness this EVERY TIME I go to a straight wedding. Even though I am sitting there with my partner, straight woman who know I am gay come up to me and assume naturally I must want to dance with then. Usually because their husbands will not. And if I say no, what about your husband, they get really offended.

I think most people stereotype most groups of people. We are all presented with stereotypes and to some extent we buy into them until we have experience that makes us think in a more nuanced way.

And some stereotypes are largely true and some are less so and some not at all when zooming down to the individual level.

I'm 'gay acting' in the sense that I can see in still photos and especially in video how gay I am without even hearing anything. It's just apparent—gay face, gay movements and posturing—and it has been going back to home movies of me at age three. Three! It's really incredible to look back and see this obviously gay toddler and know it was me. And my voice is a gay voice, and a person can reject that and say there's no such thing as a gay voice, and yet we all realistically know exactly what that means and we all recognize it. Because these stereotypes are true even though they don't apply to every person.

And I do like a lot of pop-culture and cultural things assumed by many to be liked by gay men, from AbFab and pop singers to even Drag Race as entertainment on my TV.

But I don't have many gay male friends, I don't really have superficial relationships, I don't have a lot of casual sex partners, I'm not all that concerned about my appearance, I really care nothing at all about social status, I am not a social butterfly and don't do Sunday brunches with gaggles of gays—EVERYONE here in DC assumes all gay men do this religiously every Sunday, and I just keep to myself—and on and on.

I have never in my life called any other gay or any girl or guy "girl" or "gurrrrl" or "sister" or "hon" or "sweetie" or any of that. I think I would feel as strange forcing myself to say that as any given father or granfather in suburban Alabama would feel saying it.

So in MY individual case, anyway, a lot of the natural giveaways that someone is gay all apply to me. As my mother said when we finally discussed it openly, "if it walks like a duck, it looks like a duck and it talks like a duck, it's a duck. You've always been gay. Although, there was always a chance you were just an intellectual like Frasier."

And at the same time, the learned culturally gay stereotypes don't apply to me very much.

But I understand how people can be confused by me.

I've talked about Drag Race episodes and contestants at work with coworkers, for example, and they get all excited and ask me where I go to see drag and what local drag queens I know and sometimes will call me 'honey' or 'sweetie' or something and I have to explain that I enjoy Drag Race as dumb, mindless TV entertainment but I don't participate in drag culture or really even hang out with many gay people, and they usually seem very weirded out by that, I assume they may think I am intentionally distancing myself because of shame or something and I just don't relate or have any desire whatsoever to adopt behaviors that are not natural to me or to pretend to fit in with people by conforming to their social norms that feel foreign to me. I have never in my life been inclined to try to do that.

A person can set off gaydar and also be a loner instead of a socialite who invades friends' homes and redecorates them *fabulously* like a Queer Eye fairy godmother.

[quote]I've talked about Drag Race episodes and contestants at work with coworkers, for example, and they get all excited and ask me where I go to see drag and what local drag queens I know

That's because it's not about you. Drag has become very popular in the hetero community. Straight women especially seem to be into more that a lot of gay men I know. By you telling them that you watch that, you triggered their radar for gay guys in the office who fit their stereotype as fun corporate jester. You burst that bubble however when you say you don't know any other clowns.

R52- Invades peoples homes reminds me of that episode on the Munsters when Herman is on a diet during Thanksgiving and Grandpa has him strapped down in the dungeon. He gets so hungry watching a commercial for Thanksgiving on the tv he breaks open the straps and invades someone's home and sits down at their dinner table and starts demanding- PASS THE CRANBERRY SAUCE!

R53-The FRAUS flock to places like LIPS in Manhattan to have a night out with the GIRLS to watch the GUYS dressed up as GIRLS.

If you're a gay man who sashays in public, you can shontay on somewhere else. Even Ru Paul tones it down when he's not on camera.

Yep R55, they do that here too in LA. That's why I dont go to Hamburger Mary's anymore. Last time I went before Covid, it was FULL of house Fraus. I was only one of a handful of gay guys there outside of the bar staff. And it was boring AF.

[quote]Are you attracted to gay-acting gay men?

Fuck Yeah! In fact that there is my favorite type. Slim with gay face and gay voice is an irresistible combo for me. Hope this answers OP's question good

[quote]It's hard to objectively measure yourself but I think I come across to most people as a sort of Jim Parsons. Slim, small-boned, neatly dressed and I've got "that" voice which still even surprises me when I hear it back on a voicemail.

R30 damn that sound hot! Jim Parsons is cute too. He's kinda prissy which I find a huge turn on too

[quote]Fuck Yeah! In fact that there is my favorite type. Slim with gay face and gay voice is an irresistible combo for me.

V8fairy, I genuinely knew that this was you even before scrolling down on my phone and checking for the poster's name!

R59 likewise

[quote] The FRAUS flock to places like LIPS in Manhattan to have a night out with the GIRLS to watch the GUYS dressed up as GIRLS.

Holy shit, is LIPS still around? Last time I was there, Clinton was still in the White House.

R61-There's a LIPS in Manhattan on the Upper East Side.

[quote]R38 —TheOtherWhiteMeat

I knew someone with this nickname in L.A. in the mid to late 90s. Do you have a friend Deb D. in Chicago?

r63, "I knew someone with this nickname in L.A. in the mid to late 90s. Do you have a friend Deb D. in Chicago?"

No, but it'd be cool as hell if I did!

What does that name mean, incidentally, R64? I'm not American, so perhaps that's why I don't get it.

'Gay-acting' and 'Straight-acting' are both conservative terms and mindsets.

Effeminate =/gay. Masculine =/straight.

There is nothing wrong in being gender non-conforming, No wonder why gay men transition and become HSTS.

I think gay men and lesbians are pressured into transitioning because straights…and gays.

*by straights…

Ugggg, that Ross guy as sidekick to Drew Barrymore. So cringe.

[quote]r65 What does that name mean, incidentally,

In the 80s or 90s there was a commercial campaign in the U.S. by the Pork Lobby, extolling the food as The Other White Meat (as opposed to chicken breast.)

I don't think "gay acting" has to equal effeminate. My close circle of friends are all gay, but I'm not sure any of us is effeminate. No one goes out of his way to act purposely masculine, either. I think we're just - middle-of-the-road guys - nerdy, gay, smart, middle class, etc.

I really don't like being around overly-effeminate guys OR super butch "bro" guys. Both extremes seem like an act to me.

R69 " So cringe"

Please tell me you don't speak this stupidly in real life.

Live and let live, I don’t have a problem with effeminate stereotypically GAY gays, but I don’t find it attractive at all. I’m attracted to quite masculine and dominant guys.

But don’t most people consider “gay acting” guys to be effeminate?

R74- You like someone who's DOMINANT

therefore you sound like a bottom which is sounds pretty GAY acting.

Oooooooh

R76 Right on!

The problem with gays who say they hate gay guys who act gay is that THEY usually act the gayest.

Maybe transitioning is not bad at all.

This guy is dating currently a gay man who 'transitioned'.

R78 for whatever reason I had already blocked R76 so didn’t see the comment. That’s a fair enough assumption, but I’m not particularly “gay acting” or effeminate. People are usually surprised when I tell them I’m gay. I’m versatile but still find myself more turned on by dominant types. What can ya do. It’s not always a masc/femme yin/yang thing.

R65, "What does that name mean, incidentally, [R64]? I'm not American, so perhaps that's why I don't get it.:

There was an ad campaign in the 1990s (maybe 80s too?) which dubbed pork "The Other White Meat." And since I've occasionally been a big 'ol gay pig, sexually, I thought it suited me. Plus, you know, MEAT.

Thank you, R81. There was an earlier explanation but I still didn't get why it would be a username, so I'm glad to have it from the pigs's mouth!