THEATRE GOSSIP #506: She Doesn't Love Me No Mo

Meh

Sorry, this is a lame title but the other thread was at 599 and I realized there was no new thread, so I had to come up with something in about 30 seconds before that one got another comment and closed.

I beg forgiveness.

Here's the old thread.

My title was going to be “Audra and Laura’s Cash Registers.” 🤣🤣🤣

Again, I deeply beg pardon. But at least the new thread got linked as comment 600 on the old one.

Your title is fine OP.

Thanks for starting the thread!

OP, I condole you.

Everybody, let's just get on with the Theatre Gossip.

[Quote] OP, sentenced to hearing Porkblob sing on a loop for 8 hours

6 hours actually

[quote] My title was going to be “Audra and Laura’s Cash Registers.” 🤣🤣🤣

Well, then I guess it's a good thing OP got to it before you since that title sucks even worse.

Finale: Late Conversations with Stephen Sondheim is getting bombarded with negative comments within Amazon's reviews. However I heard the NPR All Of It interview he did with Alison Stewart and it sounds like a terrific book.

Has anyone here read it yet? What are your thoughts?

It's embarrassing.

If r10 is responding to r9, I completely agree. I've been puzzled by the number of really positive reviews. The book is as much about DT Max as it is about Sondheim, and DT Max comes off as disingenuous, self-serving, tone-deaf, and manipulative--I wouldn't be surprised if Sondheim sent him away for those reasons alone.

And before anyone asks: yes, that's how I really feel.

Am I the only regular here who is bored/disappointed with "Shy," the Mary Rodgers' book?

Mary's a bit of a bore. A windbag. Lots of inane detail about her classmates, colleagues. Not enough insight about music and theatre. It's a slog to get through.

And Mary, frankly, is a resentful cunt: about her parents, her sister (!) and extended family, other women (did she have any close female friends)?

It's fine to cunt out about Arthur Laurents, even if she cheats by not telling all. But what did these other people do to deserve public flogging?

Some Like It Hot opens tonight. Any predictions on the reviews?

"It's the big, bright, funny, entertaining new musical comedy Broadway has needed coming out of the pandemic that succeeds where the other guys-in-dresses shows didn't" R13

We had a DEI discussion that lasted several hours during rehearsals for a play I was in. The Black actors brought up so many examples of unpleasant/unfair/frustrating/ - discouraging things about our business and they all agreed these were examples of racism. The white actors sat there speechless because every anecdote was something that happens universally, to everyone (who isn't a star) in theater. You just nod, because to interject would be pointless.

The over compensating by producing all these black plays is white woke liberals competing with each other to show who is the most anti-racists.

And we're back in the Race race in the new thread...

[stifles yawn....]

SOME LIKE MY TWAT!

Any opportunity to cunt at Arthur Laurents always has immediate value…but I was disappointed in Mary’s book also. I was also slightly disappointed in Harvey Fiersteins.

I miss really juicy celebrity dish memoirs like Cybill where she talked openly about how mean Christine Baranski was to her.

Hasn't the full-out "gay play" seen a similar, if less drastic, fate in recent years though?

Thinking of The Inheritance, the Angels in America revival, Mothers and Sons, the Torch Song and M. Butterfly revivals.

The one that recouped was the Boys in the Band revival.

R20 Cybill's book was awful, for one. And she never said Christine was mean to her; she was frustrated that Christine was all business and wouldn't bond with her or be all buddy-buddy.

Gosh, Cybill, maybe it was because you were a huge cunt about it being your show?

R15, you posted the exact same thing in the previous thread. We had moved on. Your intention on cutting and pasting here is very clear.

r15 we heard you in the last thread

Isherwood's review is out in WSJ. Mixed to negative. Thinks it's relentless and exhausting, but does like Borle.

I find Audra’s voice to be a wonder of Bway—so expressive and emotion, at the level of Barbara Cook’s. I recall seeing her first in Carousel. Everyone in the audience sat up straight the second her opened her mouth to sing.

With time, the voice has gotten deeper and more velvety. That sounds just envelopes you.

I saw a Strange Loop with an understudy making his Bway debut that performance—wonderful!

After the show, the cast gathered outside and I spoke with him for a bit, congratulating him for now being a Bway star. Very sweet man

Let's do a tally of shows currently on Broadway (as of 12/11/22) or Upcoming to understand the rabid complaints on here about the over-saturation of Black shows. Let the heads explode and the debate begin.

24 White Shows (defined as white-centered stories, with some, but fewer characters are cast "colorblind"): Almost Famous Back to the Future Bad Cinderella A Beautiful Noise Beetlejuice Camelot (white story, albeit with mixed race cast) Chess Chicago (white story, ableit with mixed race cast) A Christmas Carol A Doll's House Funny Girl Good Night, Oscar Harry Potter and the Cursed Child Kimberly Akimbo Leopoldstadt The Old Man and the Pool Moulin Rouge The Music Man The Phantom of the Opera Pictures from Home Prima Facie Shucked Sweeney Todd The Thanksgiving Play

10 Black Shows: Ain't No Mo' Between Riverside and Crazy Death of a Salesman Fat Ham Jaja's African Hair Braiding The Lion King MJ Ohio State Murders The Piano Lesson A Strange Loop

2 Asian Shows: Life of Pi KPop

14 Mixed White, Black, and Other Race Shows (including shows where at least half of the characters are cast "colorblind," or the leads are non-white): & Juliet 1776 Aladdin The Book of Mormon The Collaboration Dancin' Hadestown Hamilton Into the Woods New York, New York Once Upon a One More Time Six Some Like it Hot Take Me Out

Let me format this better:

Let's do a tally of shows currently on Broadway (as of 12/11/22) or Upcoming to understand the rabid complaints on here about the over-saturation of Black shows. Let the heads explode and the debate begin.

24 White Shows (defined as white-centered stories, with some, but fewer characters are cast "colorblind"):

Almost Famous

Back to the Future

Bad Cinderella

A Beautiful Noise Beetlejuice Camelot (white story, albeit with mixed race cast)

Chess

Chicago (white story, ableit with mixed race cast)

A Christmas Carol

A Doll's House

Funny Girl

Good Night, Oscar

Harry Potter and the Cursed Child

Kimberly Akimbo

Leopoldstadt

The Old Man and the Pool

Moulin Rouge The Music Man

The Phantom of the Opera

Pictures from Home

Prima Facie

Shucked

Sweeney Todd

The Thanksgiving Play

10 Black Shows:

Ain't No Mo'

Between Riverside and Crazy

Death of a Salesman

Fat Ham

Jaja's African Hair Braiding

The Lion King

MJ

Ohio State Murders

The Piano Lesson

A Strange Loop

2 Asian Shows:

Life of Pi

KPop

14 Mixed White, Black, and Other Race Shows (including shows where at least half of the characters are cast "colorblind," or the leads are non-white):

& Juliet

1776

Aladdin

The Book of Mormon

The Collaboration

Dancin'

Hadestown

Hamilton

Into the Woods

New York, New York

Once Upon a One More Time

Six

Some Like it Hot Take Me Out

I really don't think BAD CINDERELLA, with a black woman in the lead, can be accurately described as a "white show."

Plus you somehow left out & JULIET, which also has a black actress in the central role. And, of course, both of those shows have lots of POC in other roles.

Fuck NBC local news for their pandering piece last night about "two groundbreaking shows" that will be closing because of Broadway's policy of non-representation. I wouldn't call either K-Pop or Ain't No Mo groundbreaking. The former was a muddled piece of high school-ish crap and the latter was so badly mishandled by the press agents nobody even knew it was there. Try placing blame where it belongs. On the idiots who produced both shows and brought them to Broadway on shoestring budgets. And where were Will and Jada for Pass Over, Slave Play, and a Top Dog/Underdog. Their hypocrisy and silence is so obvious.

[Quote] That sounds just envelopes you.

Oh dear

R33 & Juliet is under the "mixed" Bad Cinderella does not have a Black lead. She is Latina. Perhaps you can arguably place it under "mixed," so I'll give you that to soothe you. But one change doesn't skew the fact that white stories are the MAJORITY of shows on street.

TOP DOG should go under Black also, so that bumps that to 11.

So with these amendments:

23 White Shows

11 Black Shows

4 Asian Shows

15 "Mixed" Shows

^ 2 Asian shows

I liked Cybill’s book and she DID say Christine was mean to her because Christine walked out on Cybill’s final number on the finale. Maryann was supposed to watch and applaud Cybill singing Rockabye your Baby with a Dixie Melody and when Cybill turned around after the number, Christine had walked off. Adding insult to injury, they producers cut the song anyway and left the “To Be Continued” sign even though the show was cancelled

I assume Christine had a plane to catch, r38.

How do those percentages stack against the NYC population (or maybe more apt, NY Metro Area population)?

And if the Broadway audience is around 63% tourist traditionally, what are the percentages there?

Christine Baranski seems like a professional, no nonsense type of person so I can't imagine how she put up with crazy Cybill. The woman already had two Tonys before Cyb went on and on about how she discovered her. Ridiculous. I would have walked out, too.

No, but there was that check to cash r39.

Im listening to the 90s revival of SHE LOVES ME but can’t tell if the Amalia is Judy Kuhn or her replacement, and Apple Music doesn’t provide the cast listing. Anyone know?

Yes, the cast recording is Diane Frantantoni.

Judy Kuhn was great in that as she was in Sunset Boulevard in LA. A shame she didn't come in with it.

I saw both and preferred Fratantoni.

[quote] I liked Cybill’s book and she DID say Christine was mean to her because Christine walked out on Cybill’s final number on the finale.

Honey, Baranski should have been given a Purple Heart and a Congressional Medal of Honor for staying in there as long as she did.

There are no black shows and white shows—there are just shows.

Good theater is about the common experience we all have.

R48, you are the wisest of all. If only the resentful dregs of DL could see this.

R48 Tell that to the black authors stating exactly the opposite.

Kuhn is the queen of meh.

[quote]After the show, the cast gathered outside and I spoke with him for a bit, congratulating him for now being a Bway star. Very sweet man.

Did you really call him a 'Broadway star'? Talk about laying it on thick.

A Broadway star is a box office attraction like Lea Michele or Hugh Jackman. Someone who just performs on Broadway is not a star.

R52, it’s called being kind to someone. I’m sure the actor didn’t take it as a factual statement.

What’s weird is Cybill didn’t really have a rep of being a cunt outside of Cybill (well and Moonlighting) and Christine doesn’t have a rep of being a cunt outside of Cybill.

Maybe the Cybill set was just a vortex of Cunt

Christine is a pro and well liked. Cybill has a loooooooooooong history of being a mess, if not a cunt.

Let’s just all be grateful that Billy Porter looks FABULOUS in a dress!

I can't believe they'll give SLIH bad reviews. The crix know Broadway needs a new big, fun hit to get audiences back in force. This show feels like the one.

Yes, R50, Black authors should also strive for this. Hence the success of authors like August Wilson and Lynn Nottage. They speak to the wider human experience within the setting of Black experience.

Those who wish to write material for only Black audiences don't do anyone a service by coming into "white spaces" and then crying when a show doesn't succeed. I wonder how Ain't No Mo would have been received if it had opened in areas of the city with large Black populations. Same for KPOP within Asian communities, like if it had found a space in Koreatown.

So Broadway is a white space and non-whites should present their shows in ghettos?

Broadway is a CORPORATE space so shows with mass appeal will be more lucrative there.

Strange Loop cancelled today's matinee due to illness in the company.

Yes, "illness."

Oh no, how will those 12 people fill their afternoon now?

[quote]a vortex of Cunt

Pics please.

Have we ever discussed the Wittman/Shaiman rewrite of the "Shipoopi" lyrics? I've heard it on the radio a few times and it's just jarring to me. Of course I'm old enough to have seen the movie (as a child, of course) in a theater on its first run (Coronet, San Francisco; roadshow release. Thanks, Aunt Helen!)

I guess the original lyrics are "problematic" in today's environment ("hussy", indeed!) but they were appropriate for the era. Have we gone too far with this trend of trying to make everything palatable and inoffensive to everyone?

Even if the creative team honestly felt that the "Shipoopi" lyrics really needed to be rewritten, there must have been someone who could have done a far better job of it than Wittman/Shaiman.

Someday we will laugh at the silly censorship in the arts from the woke Left, just like we have done at the religious Right when they ran things in Hollywood in the 1930s-1960s (i.e., Hays Code).

I saw Funny Lady at the Coronet with my dear friend Tina, r65. It was a whirlwind week for the two of us...

[quote]Cybill didn’t really have a rep of being a cunt outside of Cybill (well and Moonlighting)

Fuck you, r54.

Can you give us a sample of the changed lyrics r65?

"Shipoopi, Shipoopi, Shipoopi, the boy who's seen the light/ Shipoopi, Shipoopi, Shipoopi, to treat a woman right.

Jesus...as if enlightened thinking was remotely on the radar of 1912 Iowa. The original Shipoopi lyrics were perfectly fun and fine. It's a ridiculous number to begin with, so to try and add some woke social commentary on it, with BAD lyrics that don't scan, IS offensive.

Circling back to 'She Loves Me', I thought the beautifully designed 2016 revival missed all the comedy. And Creel was woefully miscast as Kodaly. Howard McGillin was perfection in that part and evoked the best of Jack Cassidy.

And Sally Mayes was far superior to Krakowski.

Oh yeah [italic] this [/italic] will help

But, no, it must be the marketing agency at fault...

Shows fail because:

1) The show not very good, or, just outright terrible

2) Producers failed to market show to an audience.

3) Subject matter has a limited appeal; show was successful in that the people who WANTED to see it, did.

4) Show was too expensive to make a profit.

5) Show needed a Star who people want to see.

6) Bad Timing/Show was ahead of its time.

7) Evil critics purposefully destroyed it because they are just mean and evil.

8) Racism.

[Quote] Did you really call him a 'Broadway star'? Talk about laying it on thick.A Broadway star is a box office attraction like Lea Michele or Hugh Jackman. Someone who just performs on Broadway is not a star.

Next time I see him, I’ll let him know I was mistaken.

Many of these smaller shows would have a healthier run off Bway (although not as much profit it it’s a hit).

Perhaps producers should reconsider the value of a longer off Bway run over a short Bway run. And almost everyone knows so many of these shows won’t become Bway hits

The Broadway branding helps with stock & amateur.

Can anyone even name a season in which every play that opened became a hit?

The KPoP musical is/was being livestreamed. - any body seen it.

So many DLers suggest that some shows that fail on Broadway might have done better with an off-Broadway run. That may have been true in the past, but for many years now, the economics of mounting and running an off-Broadway show are far too expensive to ensure a successful/profitable outcome. The exception is when the producer(s) and theatre owners(s) are the same people or are working in partnership. That sort of pairing gives the team leverage to negotiate with some of the unions to lower costs and give the show a chance. Several of the shows at The New World Stages have an arrangement like that and can benefit by some other cost saving measures.

"...The venue has also become a location for the piggybacking model, whereby multiple shows adjust their playing times and share the same theater, set, and tech personnel to lower the costs of keeping an open-ended Off-Broadway show running. The theaters and lobby are also available for special events, including conferences, readings, workshops and receptions..." Wikipedia

Too bad Kinky Boots lost everything at New World Stages.

Off-Broadway would not bring in audiences unless the tickets were lower than $30/ea. And even then, I just don't think people are much interested in getting out and going to any sort of theater as an ongoing habit/pastime. Unless it's a real not to be missed event.

R74, it may not help but I enjoyed the video. He did it in character and he wasn't attacking or blaming anyone for the show's closing, just asking that people keep it open so that she (the character) wouldn't have to go back to working at McDonald's. Again, it may not help but it was at least an entertaining attempt at saving the show.

Sure r85 but Too. Much. Drag.

NYT review of "Some Like It Hot":

Deadline:

Of course this gets rave reviews.

Of fucking course it does.

DT Max acknowledges how many times he annoyed or confused Sondheim. It's worth a read R9 and R11, especially if you know a lot about different productions. I thought it was a good mix of insight on his personality, past work, future work, as well as Max's writing struggles. I think some people are used to bland, ghostwritten, positive biographies.

Some Like It Hot seemed pretty full when I saw it recently and audience seemed really engaged, even with some of the more challenging talk around Daphne and Osgood (incredibly silly guy who is like a teen in love for the first time). Didn't notice any walkouts or negative reactions to these two, which I thought was a good sign for the musical's future.

[quote]Jesus...as if enlightened thinking was remotely on the radar of 1912 Iowa. The original Shipoopi lyrics were perfectly fun and fine. It's a ridiculous number to begin with, so to try and add some woke social commentary on it, with BAD lyrics that don't scan, IS offensive.

Well, the lyrics DO scan, but they're still ridiculous and terrible.

Opening night audience included Bette Midler, SJP and Broderick, Martin Short and Andrea Martin. Not bad.

[quote]Too bad Kinky Boots lost everything at New World Stages.

First of all, the other poster did not state that EVERY show at New World Stages has had a healthy run due to that special arrangement. But also, umm, Kinky Boots did not play at New World Stages, you dimwit.

Chess tomorrow night is shaping up to be something very exciting. 20+ diff insta stories about the sitzprobe. Lena Hall is doing full Bonnie Tyler rock performance (which works), Darren sounds great (!) and Ramin wasn’t there so who knows, but he’s done this version before and Russian is boring anyway. He will deliver, I assume.

Borle looks like Milton Berle in that photo.

Milton Borle?

A friend of mine went to see SLIH last night (Saturday) and had a comp in the 10th row orchestra. He said it was pretty full, but I reminded him that if he was able to get a comp in such a good location (and he's a nobody), then the house must have been papered to death. On a Saturday night. In December.

Borle IS Berle!

(New show written by David Adjm-- eeer, Doug Wright.)

Forget "Chess" -- "Your Own Thing" is also playing tomorrow night! And that show was a hit in its time. The CD is actually a lot of fun with Leland Palmer, Russ (Rusty) Thacker, Marcia Rodd (in for the already departed by the recording Marian Mercer), Danny Apolinar (of the old Danny's Skylight Room) and Michaal Valenti, writer of "Oh! Brother!, a flop with a very good score.

R97, by what means did your friend get a comp? Though one of the producers, or a cast member?

A lot of negative reviews for Some Like It Hot to offset the inexplicable rave from the Times.

Call me crazy, but I have a HUNCH that Green felt particularly compelled to OVER-sing the show's praises after all the flack he's received reviewing shows with predominantly BIPOC casts or woke subject matter. If he couldn't rave about this...perhaps he must BE racist! Or transphobic! Or this! Or that!

When R97 suggests that SLIH may have been papered, are there any such services left? Didn't Audience Extras go under years ago? I know there was another one but don't recall the name of it now. Is it still in existence?

Sorry, “Your own thing” is exactly that.

Chess, on the other hand, is apparently primed for a revival, and half American/Filipino Darren doing “Bangkok” even out-wokes any haters on that.

[quote]A Broadway star is a box office attraction like Lea Michele or Hugh Jackman. Someone who just performs on Broadway is not a star.

So is Daniel Radcliffe a Broadway star? Jonathan Groff? Their names alone sold out Merrily in less than an hour at an off-Broadway that charges Broadway prices.

Jonathan Groff, Daniel Radcliffe, Darren Criss and Lea Michele are Broadway stars, no question.

R36, you're being a little disingenuous by including shows that haven't opened--if the market's over-saturated, then you'd expect a correction. Also, most of the "Black" shows have all Black casts, only one of the "White" shows does.

But even using your stats--you still have 15 percent of the population represented by more than 20 percent of the shows exclusively and, if you throw in the shows with multiple Black leads, well over half. Meanwhile, 70 percent of the population is white and "white" shows are less than half of the ones on Broadway. Particularly when you consider that several "mixed" shows, like *Six* and *Hamilton* focus on replacing historically white characters with POC. Such casting is part of a point they're trying to make. The diversity isn't truly inclusive in that sense, whereas Into the Woods is.

As I said wayyy back in the last thread, people think there's a higher percentage of Black people than there actually is and fewer white people. The reality shows up in things like ticket sales.

You can, by the way, be any kind of show with any kind of cast and if you're extraordinary, you'll get an audience. At least for a while.

Red Reed loved SLIH but not so much Adrianna Hicks.

“Some are vicious, some are fools; and, others, blind…” — EGOT Sir Tim Rice

I'm a classic brunette, certainly NOT a ginger!

SLIH is getting extremely good reviews, with many raves, will the positivity give it a solid run?

Yes, yes, yes, R107. We get it. DO we! You resent that Broadway is no longer 100% all-White shows and casts and that now there is more racially diverse representation. Now please return to the basement to play white-hooded dress-up with your dollies.

(FWIW, SIX and HAMILTON are doing pretty damn well, despite your replacement theory nonsense.)

[quote]When [R97] suggests that SLIH may have been papered, are there any such services left? Didn't Audience Extras go under years ago? I know there was another one but don't recall the name of it now. Is it still in existence?

I don't know if any of the "papering" services still exist. They always seemed sketchy. I often get tickets through colleagues. Recent tickets were Into the Woods and A Christmas Carol.

Thanks r90!

Billy Boy / R82 really nails the Off-Broadway conundrum that 98% of productions (and their producers) face with that model. Love him or loathe him, Leonard Soloway's documentary casts a BRIGHT light on the economics of making Off Broadway commercially viable (in his case, with a slightly curious vehicle for Maurice Hines).

Little Shop's staying power is largely due to brand recognition and a solid, hard-working cast putting on a fun evening IN SPITE of its director's shortcomings. The model and the spending required to get bums in seats (white bums, black bums, gay bums, trans bums) is nothing short of a slog. It's shoveling a lot of shit uphill in the hopes you'll get some editorial raves, social media buzz or a small following to direct traffic organically (ie. without spending even more!)

It's sad as Off Broadway used to be a GREAT model for a lot of these shows that really shouldn't be attempted in the very commercial, tourist-centric space of Broadway. But the times they are a changin'.

To the poster in the previous thread, r584, who agreed with me about Audra and posted that clip of her singing with Marin M and Judy K at the Leading Ladies of Broadway concert - THANK YOU. YES. EXACTLY. Their trio immediately popped into my mind when I was writing my post about how thick and heavy her vocals are, but I couldn't remember offhand exactly who she sang with.

Gosh I wish Marin and Rebecca Luker were still with us. I only discovered them as their lives were ending and now will never get to actually see them. They both have wonderful voices. RIP ladies. You were fantastic.

[quote]Gosh I wish Marin and Rebecca Luker were still with us. I only discovered them as their lives were ending and now will never get to actually see them. They both have wonderful voices. RIP ladies. You were fantastic.

They were also lovely women, r116.

Personally, I'm sick and tired of reading posts here about what percentage of America is Black or POC and how many of them buy tickets versus how many POC actors are shown in shows on Broadway now, and bla bla bla....

LISTEN: People of color did not get hired in leading roles for a very, very, very, very, VERY LONG FUCKING TIME. If they're finally getting hired a lot now in an attempt to apologize for that or compensate for it, well hey...don't you think that's okay? Don't you think that if the next ten years, every cast has 1/3 of the actors as minorities or POC or whatever that it'll help undo the DECADES of racism that kept media and theater all-white? Racism that fed into this sick idea that somehow whites are better than any other skin color? Racism that has helped tear away at the fabric of American life, to the point that the last President openly associated with White Supremacists and got their help in nearly overthrowing the government?

Visibility MATTERS. Even if it's only in the small, somewhat exclusive world of New York Theater, it fucking matters. Don't begrudge the influx of people of color into the theater world their newfound visibility. I'm guessing, if it lasts ten years, things will calm down at a certain point and maybe you won't "have to" see as many black actors playing historically white characters or whatever is bothering you.

But calm down and realize you're bitching about having ever-so-slightly less representation because of people who had virtually NONE forever.

Mickey Joe, that British guy who has a "stagey YouTube channel" said something in his review of the London production of Phantom that underwent changes before reopening following the pandemic that has been really bothering me.

He said the candelabras in the Phantom's lair are different now - that they move differently, or look different. I love that sequence and hate it when they make changes to it. So...what's different? Do they no longer rise up through the stage, or shift to the left and right? Did they redesign the face of them, so they no longer have those stylized women's bodies holding up the candles?

I tried to find a bootleg recording from London on YT, but couldn't find anything from that sequence.

Someone did film the new overture (see below). I don't mind the new chandelier (to my amazement) but I sincerely miss the Golden Angel on the proscenium, and kinda hate the "cracked beam" thingy they added, which apparently vanishes behind the proscenium as song as it rights itself so...what's the fucking point?

Maria B's designs were iconic. Why they would remove them is a mystery to me. Can they nickel-and-dime her estate if they keep using the costumes, but not all her set pieces, like the Angel?

R119 -- CamMac put in a revamped touring production into Her Majesty's to save on running costs. And the ability to remove it thereafter and use it on tour. He also reduced the orchestra by half (28 to 14). The chandelier has been revamped (it actually looks better but the fall is different than the original). The overture rise has newly timed lighting effects/sparks. Some of it works better, some not so much.

The iconic Angel in the center of the false proscenium was removed for ease of touring. Why they didn't modify for the more permanent West End production is beyond me. So the Phantom now hides behind a giant sculptural horse on stage. Less thrilling. Less ominous. Less theatrical.

There are lyrical and staging changes that also take away from the Prince staging and Victorian pageantry. The candles in the title song slide on now. It's all just a little less thrilling for those us old enough to remember the original. Even the original tour from the 90's, early 00's retained so much of the Maria B/Prince magic (and majesty). It's all down to cost cutting. I wouldn't be remotely surprised if Cameron installs a similar McPhantom on Broadway within 24 months of the original closing. Sort of like his McMiz he brought in with shit new orchestrations and a cut down run time.

Please explain the candles to me in greater detail, if you please.

Do you mean

A) The Tall candelabras all slide in from the wings, as well as the floor candles?

B) Just the Tall candelabras slide in, while the floor candles still pop up from the floor?

And what do the candelabras look like now? Do they have the classic "ladies" on them, as they still currently do on Broadway?

Shit, I didn't realize the orchestra was cut down by HALF. That's insane.

When you say "remove it thereafter", do you mean he's planning on closing the show in London? I always assumed as the "flagship Phantom" production, the idea was to keep it running on the West End for all time. Why then wouldn't he just keep things mostly the same, and allow the touring productions to be different, so the only way to see the original staging - like the Angel - would be to go to Her Majesty's?

Frankly, they should have kept the angel and adornments on the proscenium and just not lowered the Angel for the All I Ask Of You scene. They still could have integrated the (stupid) horsie statue for him to hide behind and kept the Angel up there, static, because it looks beautiful.

I am also hugely grateful I saw the show in the 90s, back when the BEST vocalists/actors were vying for the lead parts and ensemble parts and the quality of the various productions were top-notch. Even the costumes now don't look as period accurate or rich. The Hannibal outfits in particular look thin and garish, not at all like the heavy jewel-laden gowns the Christines and Carlottas of yore had to trudge around in.

That stupid fucking movie ruined so much. It lead Andrew and Cameron down the path of thinking that Maria's designs were expendable, that Phantom had to be young and "sexy" and that cheesy wailing guitars improved the score.

Such a shame.

R112, As expected, you lapsed into a personal attack instead of dealing with the facts. And, yes, of course, Hamilton is doing well--it was a break-through musical with strong performances (except for its star) and a strong score.

My point about Hamilton and Six is that when you're talking about Black representation on Broadway, you can't dump them into the same category as something like Into the Woods, which is why I included them in shows with two or more Black leads.

As for replacement theory, I'm actually making the opposite argument--audiences skew old and white and it shouldn't be a shock when a revival of Music Man with Hugh Jackman is a hit and the interest in Black identity stories doesn't support 11 such shows running at once.

Which is probably part of the reason Jeremy O. Harris is having meltdowns on Twitter--he's going to have problems getting another show up on Broadway.

R118, It doesn't matter what I think or you think about "justice"--what matters is what sells tickets. If you look at what's on Broadway now, there are plenty of attempts to show representation, but a lot of them aren't selling. The audience for those shows isn't enough to sustain all of them at one time. You may think that's terribly bad and awful, but the fact remains, these shows aren't selling enough tickets to keep running.

You really can't force people to attend a show they don't want to see--let alone spend $200 for it.

I do think there should be a place for all of these shows--and it's a shame the off-Broadway model has collapsed.

The only good thing about this thread so far is that at the rate it is going, it should be over soon.

What makes me sad about the whole thing is that Marc Shaiman walks away from this rewarded. He did that stupid video with Scott Whitman where they were too clever by half about the drag, trans, POC stuff. And then they get a love letter from the New York Times.

I'm thrilled that they are finally getting a SMASH.

I wonder if the reviews for SLIH will be enough for a show that audiences don't seem interested in. I just reread Jesse Green which seems more reservedly enthusiastic than when I first read it last night. He has lots of positive things to say, but doesn't really completely lose himself over it. I think the show needed "drop everything and go," and I'm not sure that's what they got. And they got mixed to negative reviews from some significant sources like the Wall Street Journal, Daily News, New York Post, Vulture and The Daily Beast.

The telltale sign of audience apathy is that in four weeks of performances, grosses stayed almost the same instead of building significantly. I think there will be a momentary spike, and then a decline through January.

[quote]Don't you think that if the next ten years, every cast has 1/3 of the actors as minorities or POC or whatever that it'll help undo the DECADES of racism that kept media and theater all-white? Racism that fed into this sick idea that somehow whites are better than any other skin color?

In general, whites ARE better writers, composers, lyricists, choreographers. The proof is in the pudding.

Also, whites believe in hard work and are willing to put the strong effort into something, whereas blacks hate rehearsing and don't seem to understand the concept of practice makes perfect. They think they can always wing it.

Blacks ARE better dancers, for sure, but too often they rely on jumps/spins and are not creative choreographers like, say, Fosse. Furthermore, I'm willing to bet that the reason why there were so few black dancers on Broadway was because they weren't willing/able to put in the hard work and were promptly dismissed or not hired at all. But now you'd be accused of racism for doing that because somehow hard work is being associated with white supremacy and thus bad. smh

R76's list is bang-on.

The "owns this thread" of his #6 (Bad Timing) has to be poor CHESS, which had not yet even opened in all its scheduled venues when the Berlin Wall fell and its central theme, the Cold War, ended.

GO WOKE, GO BROKE!

F&F r128. Is that you, Loon?

I think with these reviews we will see if any of the press marketing advertising folks have any chops at all. They should be able to declare a hit but between their lack of imagination and their producers' lack of smarts, they will probably blow it.

The Parker-Broderick clan attends SLIH!

Their kids have gotten so big. Sweet.

Telly Leung on Instagram: "This phenomenon is discouraging, between @kpopbroadway and @aintnomobway. There are STRUCTURAL changes to Broadway that need to happen for daring shows like @aintnomobway & @kpopbroadway to stay live. The changes will be incremental (and trickle slower than our liking) but we need to have this convo. And it begins with voting with your DOLLARs for the kind of theater we want to see. Otherwise, young brilliant voices like @jordanecooper might also pack up his gifts and leave Broadway for elsewhere - as his characters do in his play - and leave the Broadway we love(d) a desert of mediocre art."

I've been WAITING for Telly Leung to tell us how he feels. I wonder if he considers Aladin to be mediocre art. You know, the show that paid his salary for quite some time.

Poor James Broderick inherited Mama's chin.

“We need to have this convo”

These people never wanted a reasoned conversation about any of this stuff.

I’m surprised a certain LinkedIn tear down of the 5th Avenue Theatre hasn’t created more waves in the theatre world, particularly since the faults it exposes would seem to apply to a lot of organizations and the industry as a whole.

But then again it’s never been an industry that engages in much self-reflection, it’s always just been about looking at yourself in the mirror.

I am so tired of these woke assholes blaming racism for a show flopping. Shows flop. They have always flopped. If your show flops, it means one thing- you created something people had no interest in seeing. But participation trophy assholes can't possibly admit that they somehow failed so it must be racism.

KPOP and Ain't No Mo' are not equals, and I don't like that the failures of both are being tagged as some systemic failure of Broadway. KPOP lost the immersive staging from Off-Broadway which was what was most appealing and unique about it. The Broadway staging baldly exposes the writing, which is really clunky and amateurish and does not generate enough interest or dramatic stakes to sustain its running time. Ashley Park and Jason Tam in the Off-Broadway version were superior to their Broadway counterparts, and they even cut the boy group's gleefully bonkers hit song "Kpopsicle," which was a highlight.

Ain't No Mo', though slightly overlong and a little blunt, is often very very funny, sharp, outrageous, cheerfully rude and even moving. The "Real Housewives" parody with a Rachel Dolezal-like character (who describes herself as "trans-racial") was a particular highlight. I think its problem is that with Piano Lesson, Topdog/Underdog, Salesman and Ohio State Murders in the market along with other season holdovers, there are just too many Black cast or themed shows for a limited playgoing market. Broadway wants to prove it's not racist, but it is doing a disservice to these shows by producing all of them at once. It's a self-defeating proposition - when these shows fail because there are too many of them at the same time, producers then say "Black audiences do not show up without Denzel," and all the effort to produce great Black work is in vain.

SLIH papered their critic audiences heavily through their press reps, not through a papering service. They wanted and needed supportive friends in those audiences.

[quote] The "Real Housewives" parody with a Rachel Dolezal-like character (who describes herself as "trans-racial") was a particular highlight

THAT's a particular highlight? That joke is older than some of Henny Youngman's material. And about as funny.

[quote]The "owns this thread" of his #6 (Bad Timing) has to be poor CHESS, which had not yet even opened in all its scheduled venues when the Berlin Wall fell and its central theme, the Cold War, ended.

Are you suggesting that, because the Berlin Wall fell right at that time, a story about characters caught up in the Cold War SUDDENLY became irrelevant, even though the Cold War had existed for many decades? If someone wrote a drama about Vietnam that opened a year after that war ended, would that drama suddenly be dated and irrelevant?

Jesus that is Jay Leno chin on SJP’s son. Where was SJP and Jay Leno in 2002?

[quote]Jesus that is Jay Leno chin on SJP’s son. Where was SJP and Jay Leno in 2002?

Apparently, that is a terrible photo of him. If you look at the brief video clip in the article, he's far more handsome than that, and his chin doesn't look especially prominent.

[quote]IN DEVELOPMENT: "Shawn Levy Says 'Night at the Museum' Broadway Musical Has Done First Workshop" by Collider's Christopher McPherson - ""Well, I'm here to tell you that the pace of Broadway development is it makes movie development look lightning quick. It's super frustrating. But we have had our first workshop. … So it is not five to 10 years away, but it's not a year away either. I'd say it's somewhere in between.""

For fucks sake

5th Avenue Theatre LinkedIn article link please R138

What's going on at The 5th Avenue? I had fun working there.

Ain't No Mo belongs off-Broadway. Period. Who really thought this thing would fly without any publicity or names attached?

[Quote] Who really thought this thing would fly without any publicity or names attached?

Excuse me?

Telly Leung should just shut the fuck up and sit on my face.

I would imagine he could sit while talking r151.

No, R152, because he’ll have my partner’s dick in his mouth.

Telly Leung? Ugh.

Say what you will. Telly has a great ass.

I'm enjoying the Maxx-Sondheim book too. Who knew SS liked Breaking Bad and Happy Valley?

[quote] KPOP lost the immersive staging from Off-Broadway which was what was most appealing and unique about it.

Are you listening, Here Lies Love?

A few quibbles aside, I’d say Jesse Green’s review of Some Like It Hot is almost a rave.

I believe white audiences, especially the older ones, are getting a little freaked out (maybe sometimes subliminally) by seeing so many people of color, and I mean all colors, onstage now in non-Black shows, like SLIH, for example. But even stuff like Harry Potter.

There was a day when they'd see just one or two in the ensemble but now shows are more fully integrated and even lead roles are being more frequently cast with people of varying colors. And that bad feeling (again, maybe sometimes it's just subliminal) is definitely a form of racism, whether we like to admit it or not.

Gee, R159, thanks for that refreshing, and I do mean REFRESHING, opinion.

Can’t wait for the revival of No, No Nanette starring Lizzo as Nanette, Beanie Feldstein as Sue and Billy Porter as Uncle Jimmy. A sure fire must-see HIT!

[quote] Jonathan Groff, Daniel Radcliffe, Darren Criss and Lea Michele are Broadway stars, no question.

They're actually TV and movie stars who happen to be on Bway now, bringing in the tourist dollars. In fact, Bway just loves even the B-list movie stars

Of course Sondheim like Breaking Bad. What did you expect? Drag Race?

Sondheim was never comfortable with homosexuality.

He demanded that Bobby was never a gay man.

He didn’t have a relationship of merit until the 1990s when he was in his 60s

r156 Funny how not long ago someone said Sondheim didn't watch TV at all except for old films on TCM. Yet another case of a DLer making stuff up

[quote] Sondheim was never comfortable with homosexuality.

he also knew no one would see a show about gays

^ Tell us about the show that beat Sunday in the Park with George for Best Musical?

R166, Sondheim could never have written La Cage, which presents gays in a farce format.

Sondheim would have to write one about soul searching gays grappling with their loneliness. And, no, no won would want to see that.

I would have wanted to see that

R159, or maybe, at least in some people, that bad feeling only arises only when they see "color-blind" casting done in so many cases where it makes no sense in terms of when and where the action of the show is set and/or in terms of multi-racial actors playing members of the same biological family -- as if the creators of the show are trying to rewrite history or biology. And maybe that bad feeling does not arise AT ALL when people see shows with multi-racial actors and characters set in the present day in multi-cultural places like New York City, for example.

It was Hal Prince who wanted to lose the gay/bi backstory from Bobby in Company.

I like it when race/ethnicity is completely ignored in plays where the characters would absolutely be white people. I hate authenticity.

R162 Both Groff and Michele come from Broadway/theater where they had their first success.

And, the fact that all four of these people are frequent and active theater actors make them more than just "TV and movie stars. Same thing with Jackman. Yes, having big successes in film and TV boost your star appeal but they're not just TV / movie people slumming in theater to snag awards.

And, yeah, #138

WHAT LinkedIn article are you talking about in regard to the 5th Avenue Theatre? Link and/or details please.

I wonder why Hal Prince would shy away from a gay/bi backstory,.

[Quote] Both Groff and Michele come from Broadway/theater where they had their first success.

But no one rushed to buy tickets until they appeared on TV.

Their stardom comes from TV, not theatre.

People aren’t paying to dollar to see Jackman because his theatre work is oh, so great.

In fact most reviews says he’s just adequate in TMM.

Jennifer Coolidge said in an interview that she wants to come back to Broadway. Hmmmmmm. Can she do a cartwheel?

Lady Macbeth...

Delicatessen...

[quote]Are you suggesting that, because the Berlin Wall fell right at that time, a story about characters caught up in the Cold War SUDDENLY became irrelevant, even though the Cold War had existed for many decades?

Well yes, R143, I am. Because it closed in London and on Broadway in 1988-89 and the next (non-concert) attempt to stage it was a rewrite that tried to incorporate the end of the Cold War and didn't work.

The end of the Cold War was a little like the end of WWII: people who experienced it wanted to celebrate and be optimistic, not to dwell on the tensions that they had just been released from. That's why there were more WWII movies in the 60s than the 50s and why there is more interest in Chess now -- the Cold War is now a matter of historical interest and not a weight that just came off our shoulders. The Ukraine war has brought a bit of cold-war-lite to the West, adding to the interest without appearing too much of a personal threat.

[quote]I wonder why Hal Prince would shy away from a gay/bi backstory,.

Maybe he shied away from it in COMPANY because he knew it would turn the show from an interesting, complex examination of a straight man who can't commit to marriage for any number of reasons to a silly, facile, one-joke gimmick of a show about a closeted gay man.

Everything you wrote is true as far is it goes, R180, but CHESS is really not about the politics of the Cold War, which is pretty much used as just a backdrop to underscore the fact that the characters are from different worlds. In my opinion, CHESS has always been unsuccessful as a book musical NOT because the subject matter involves the Cold War, but simply because all of the "books" that have been written for the show have been bad. It can't be a coincidence that the most well-regarded presentations of the show have been concert productions that either eliminated a "book" entirely or else used very, very little spoken dialogue.

The Cold War and the game of chess aren't all that compelling as far as musicals go.

Right, R183, but the show isn't really about either of those things. It's about a love triangle between a woman and two men from two different cultures, both chess champs, one an ugly American with serious anger issues and the other a decent Russian guy who's defecting (and who also happens to be married to another woman).

THR reviews "Merrily We Roll Along":

So, r184...a soap opera. I know that. But you need something more interesting for the back drop than the game of chess which is boring for most people and is only used as a heavy-handed metaphor. And the Cold War was more threat than a war with action.

I agree with all of that, R186, but I don't think it matters how interesting or not the game of CHESS is because, of course, very little time is spent on that during the show. Same with the Cold War, which in terms of CHESS is only interesting insofar as the pressures it puts on the Russian chess champ and also on Florence, whose family has a history of Russian oppression.

I think there are enough positive-to-near rave reviews of SLIH to safely predict it as a strong contender for Best Musical next June.

What's happening with New York, New York?

Box office aside, this is shaping up to a be remarkable season artistically, and the Spring awards battles will be brutal.

Perhaps the Tony nominations should he handed out after a few rounds of Celebrity Death Match

What’s going on with the Met Opera?

Their website and computer systems still aren’t back up from the cyberattack they disclosed a week ago. As of yesterday (Monday), the box office had a big “no advance sales” sign posted and even the gift shop could only accept cash.

The NYTimes said last week that the Met usually handles about $200k per day in ticket purchases this time of year. At that rate, they’ve already missed out on more than $1 million in sales.

For them to be out of commission this long surely means someone over there must have really screwed up on cybersecurity and/or this hack was a lot worse than is publicly known.

I still haven't seen In The Heights or the new West Side Story movies.

Did any of you enjoy them? I feel like I should check them out, if only because there are so few new movie musicals each year...

NYT is a rave for Merrily.

Add to the tally, we had a black Annie and are about to get a black Belle and a black Ariel.

Just got back from the thrilling Chess concert event. Lena Hall totally stole the show, receiving a full 2-minute mid-show standing ovation for “Nobody’s Side”. Darren Criss acted the living shit out of his role, though he floated the high notes and obviously lacks the vocal power of Lena & Ramin… also, he’s definitely been hitting the gym hard, you could spot his bulging biceps from space. “Pity The Child” is one of the most difficult male theatre songs and he absolutely put it across valiantly, but lacked the vocal heft to truly make it soar. Then again, I’ve never seen it acted or “inhabited” better. Ramin was perfect, he’s done this role multiple times before and he sang like a dream. Mayer’s staging robbed both Darren and Ramin of fully embracing the 2/3 standing ovations they received for their numbers. Solea Pfeiffer was unexpectedly fantastic with a very riff-tastic “Someone Else’s Story”. What a voice! Also, “Bangkok” featured the supporting cast in various states of undress, with Christopher Vo showing off his incredible physique and technique with a very lively, fully-choreographed staging. Most importantly, the new Danny Strong book works like gangbusters (something that has never, ever been said about this show) and Bryce Pinkham (as The Arbiter/Narrator) milked every moment for all its considerable comedic and dramatic worth. A truly unforgettable evening, at least for even casual fans of the show. The audience was rapturous at intermission and afterwards, signaling that perhaps the time is finally right for Chess to return to Broadway in an open-ended production. A triumph.

[quote]Red Reed loved SLIH but not so much Adrianna Hicks.

Rex Reed adored Beanie in "Funny Girl" and told Babs to take a hike because a new star had been born.

There is no reason to revive Chess.

I joined a papering service this year and it has been wonderful. I saw Ain’t No Mo, 7th row center. I had good seats to Downstate, the best play of the year. Lots of Off-Bway plays. Even if they weren’t great, since it was basically free, it was still a rewarding experience. And it’s not just theater. I saw Asi Winds’ magic show, went to the Rose Room several times, saw the NY Philharmonic at Geffen Hall, and many recitals at Carnegie Hall. 1776 has been available for most of the run, but I have no interest even for free.

Nobody receives a 2 minute midshow standing ovation. Did you time it? 20 seconds is a LOT. 2 minutes? Didn’t happen. And shouldn’t happen since the actress should move on and continue the show.

R193- I didn’t care for ITH onstage but I loved the movie. WSS is good. It is what you think it is and if you want to see that, see it.

I saw 'Chess' in DC a few years ago and really enjoyed it. I really liked Bryce Pinkham as the Arbiter.

[quote] Most importantly, the new Danny Strong book works like gangbusters (something that has never, ever been said about this show)

How did it end? Did they slap another happy ending on this tragedy?

They do go on pretending that stories like theirs have happy ending.

Chess works better as a concert instead of a staged revival.

Believe me. I’ve been there!

Chess: Lena Hall’s ovation after Nobodys Side was indeed quite long and thrilling. Ramin has never been better. Darren was dreadful vocally and faced out to the audience the entire show like it was a night at Hedwig… Never saw his Freddy work any give and take with his scene partners. I wish Adam Pascal was around. Bradley Dean and Bryce P were amazing. The new book was very tongue and cheek, and worked quite well for a concert. It would not work in a full production. It’s a wonderful theatrical memory

"There is no reason to revive Chess."

Thank you. Certainly not with that confused book and pedestrian songs. The fact that anyone stood at all is proof positive that discerning theatre audiences are, as Fran Leibowitz pointed out, a thing of the past.

"Revelatory?" Like Billy Wilder didn't know what he was doing. And he didn't need a sledgehammer to do it. "Intersectionality?" Oh, my stars! The sound you hear are wallets and purses being snapped tightly shut across NYC.

I wish Jennifer Coolidge had played Joanne in the recent COMPANY rather than whats-her-name.

Why? We've seen the only performance Jennifer Coolidge can give several times.

[quote] In fact most reviews says he’s just adequate in TMM.

I wouldn’t even go that far.

If anyone comes across a bootleg audio link from last night's Chess concert please share :)

It’s a Russian attack R192, most likely in response to Gelb’s stated public position that they won’t hire Russians who don’t oppose the Ukrainian war, and his very public firing of the washed up Netrebko.

R212 Either this is a part of the CHESS plot none of us have seen before, or you posted in the wrong thread.

[quote] Why? We've seen the only performance Jennifer Coolidge can give several times.

And we’ve also seen the one performance Patti LuPone can give several times. Your point?

Please read R192, R213.

[quote] Add to the tally, we had a black Annie and are about to get a black Belle and a black Ariel.

And somehow we will all survive

[quote] Add to the tally, we had a black Annie and are about to get a black Belle and a black Ariel.

I never told them they were allowed to participate!

[quote] I joined a papering service this year and it has been wonderful.

which one, r199?

Has anyone read Jack O'Brien's new memoir (not his 1st memoir from several years ago)? I'm hearing about really dishy stories about the casting and problems with Kevin Kline as Falstaff, John Goodman, Mike Nichols and Diane Sawyer, Marsha Mason and Neil Simon, LOve Never Dies and ALW and a proposed revisal of Carnival that never happened, among others. I might have to buy that book.

I can't imagine how any performer could get away with "floating the high notes" in the role of Freddie Trumper in CHESS. Those notes HAVE to be sung full out with great intensity, if not pretty much screamed rock-style, for those songs to work.

[r219] Hi Jack! Welcome to DL! Hope it helps your book sales!

[quote]It’s a Russian attack [R192], most likely in response to Gelb’s stated public position that they won’t hire Russians who don’t oppose the Ukrainian war, and his very public firing of the washed up Netrebko.

That theory makes perfect sense. Do you have any sort of confirmation? Along with many other people, I've been saying for years that Gelb was running the Met into the ground, and if this is true...holy shit!

[quote]Add to the tally, we had a black Annie and are about to get a black Belle and a black Ariel.

We DEMAND a black Mulan!

[quote] It’s a Russian attack [[R192]], most likely in response to Gelb’s stated public position that they won’t hire Russians who don’t oppose the Ukrainian war, and his very public firing of the washed up Netrebko.

Makes total sense to me. It's become astonishingly easy to take control of computer systems.

The Russian mob have a long behind the scenes history with the Met getting their subpar singers and conductors hired that peaked with Joe Volpe. Gelb has made a bit of effort to route them out, peaking with the firing of Netrebko and the humiliation of Gergiev. Putin knows all about this, it was basically an international incident. The Russians, of course deserving of this treatment, are not happy and are reacting by attacking websites like they always do since they have no other real power.

Yeah, I need to hear this R220. Did Darren Criss sing all of the Ameican’s high notes in falsetto? That would be pretty shocking and embarrassing.

Add me to those asking for a link to the post about 5th Avenue Theatre.

The Tony Awards are moving uptown to Washington Heights.

It's a Christmas Miracle! Sondheim drops dead and suddenly "Merrily We Roll Along" is a great show. Bah Bullshit.

Jennifer Coolidge in Mama Mia!

Jennifer Coolidge in The Secret Affairs Of Mildred Wild!

Jennifer Coolidge in The Glass Menagerie!

Jennifer Coolidge in Same Time, Next Year!

Jennifer Coolidge and Tom Hollander in My Fat Friend!

Moving the Tony Awards to Washington Heights sounds like the plot of a Preston Sturges film.

Exactly R229. Give me a break.

Jennifer Coolidge as Mame!

I saw Coolidge in that dreadful revival of The Women at The Roundabout. And she should stay far away from the stage.

I haven't seen Chicago in ages. It used to be my go-to to take friends visiting me in NYC--but then I was over it,

How's it holding up?

r235 It's still right there on Lake Michigan like it's always been.

R236 🫤

LMM has some relationship with the United Palace, so presumably this move is being done to appease him. I'm sure he's already written the In the Heights themed opening number

It’s a beautiful theater, but talk about off-Broadway…!

[quote] LMM has some relationship with the United Palace, so presumably this move is being done to appease him

Why would the Tonys want to appease LMM?

Can Jennifer Coolidge sing?

Can she speak and walk from point A to point B?

[quote]Jennifer Coolidge in The Secret Affairs Of Mildred Wild!

This one is actually not a bad idea.

r240 Because he's the most successful modern Broadway composer and has a large social media following, meaning the Tonys need him more than he - even with his ego - needs the Tonys?

So much for the Woke is Broke theory, at least as it pertains to Broadway.

The Tonys almost always fall on the same day as Puerto Rican Day. I wonder if this will change now.

I see Jennifer Coolidge was nominated for a Drama Desk for The Women.

I thought he was pretty terrible as Fredy. Bryce P would have been better ! Darren used head voice. When he tried to rock out, he cracked and went flat as a cat’s ass on linoleum.

[quote] Because he's the most successful modern Broadway composer and has a large social media following, meaning the Tonys need him more than he - even with his ego - needs the Tonys?

So you think LMM won't mention the Tonys on his social media unless it appeases him?

Moving the Tonys has nothing to do with appeasing anyone.

They need a big theatre and for some reason, Radio City isn't available--maybe timing or cost.

Jennifer Coolidge was the best thing about that production of The Women. She played the ever-pregnant Edith, which is a much bigger and funnier part in the play than it is in the movie.

The United Palace is beautiful. And I'm sure they got it for a fraction of a fraction of the price of Radio City.

The WORST thing about that revival of THE WOMEN was Cynthia Nixon, IMHO. Shrill, one-note, just awful. (I've seen her do theatre several times now, and she's NOT all that, TONYs notwithstanding.)

So much about that production was so wrong. I remember liking Coolidge and Kristen Johnston, who quite funny.

I agree Cynthia was not good in that revival and I was surprised by how much I disliked her performance because I loved her on SATC

Cynthia's pear-shaped body and piano legs were not helped by Miss Mizrahi.

Jennifer Coolidge wore a pregnancy pad throughout The Women so, at least I didn't have to deal with that gunt.

r255=Rojo Caliente

SLIH is still on TDF for most of the week, even with those sensational reviews.

David Yazbek has had more shows (some big hits) thank LMM and is a very engaging performer. Adam Guettel is also much cuter than LMM and has a big Tony win. Why not feature them instead of ever-present LMM?

"than" not "thank"

The sob fest continues

Don't we all need a little break from Jennifer Coolidge?

....and an even bigger break from Jordan Cooper.

We certainly needed one from CALVIN Coolidge.

No one's called for Rita Coolidge for some time, either.

Cynthia Nixon as Jean Brodie was a travesty. So miscast and charmless. She's better suited to the headmistress role.

Why cast Cynthia Nixon when you can have Amy Adams?

R218- Play by Play

R244- more successful than EGOT Robert Lopez? I don’t think so.

[quote]The WORST thing about that revival of THE WOMEN was Cynthia Nixon, IMHO. Shrill, one-note, just awful. (I've seen her do theatre several times now, and she's NOT all that, TONYs notwithstanding.)

Cynthia Nixon was wonderful in RABBIT HOLE and in several of her other theater roles. She was admittedly bad in JEAN BRODIE and THE WOMEN, but guess what? BOTH of those shows were directed by Scott Elliott, one of the most notorious no-talents in the business. Coincidence? I think not.

Highlights video from the CHESS concert has just been posted.

I used to be part of alot of the papering services. I had to stop them all because, while there were sometime gems offered, most of the time, it was crap

Thanks, r271. Now I'm not sorry I missed it.

[Quote] LEE DANIELS: The reality is that we are closing but desperately trying to figure out how to get people in the seats because once people see it, they go crazy for it. It happened so fast, you know. We were just beginning to get traction and then we realized that we were in a hole

Good producing.

If people really went crazy for it, then it wouldn't be closing.

Maybe reduce the ticket prices?

r269 Yes, I'd rather have Hamilton money than an dEGOT

Darren Criss? Really? Was Adam Pascal busy?

What lyrics in Shipoopi are offensive and had to be changed? They're funny lyrics. Was the grossly unfunny Sutton Foster(who gave the worst performance of a lead I have ever seen on Broadway in TMM) offended?

Well what they needed to take out was the poop.

[quote]I used to be part of alot of the papering services.

Oh, DEAR.

[quote][R269] Yes, I'd rather have Hamilton money than an dEGOT

He's got "Book of Mormon," "Avenue Q," and "Frozen" money. Not gonna go on welfare anytime soon.

It really cries out for '80s hair, r271...

[quote] I don't know if any of the "papering" services still exist. They always seemed sketchy.

I belonged to Audience Extras and it was a totally legitimate service.

When I first joined, the membership was more populated by theater insiders. You could see every off-Broadway show and about 4-5 Broadway shows per year (if you could arrange your schedule to go to Wednesday matinees, you could see all but the most popular shows. Audience Extras was how I saw Whoopi and David Alan Grier in Forum. Had to pay full price to see Nathan).

With the rise of the internet, the well kept secret was made public and people who were not theater aficionados began joining. And they basically ruined the service. Audience Extras continually had to tell members to be discreet. Sitting next to a full priced patron, you weren’t supposed to let it be known that you had a free ticket.

Eventually, the Broadway producers quit giving tickets to Audience Extras and then the more high profile off-Broadway houses followed suit. Eventually it wasn’t worth paying the annual fee.

But in its prime, Audience Extras was a godsend for me in my early days in NYC.

Papering services are like Fight Club.

The first rule of Fight Club: you don't talk about Fight Club.

There are a couple of newer papering services around. But I don't want to ruin them. You'll have to find them on your own.

And so I asked myself, what is DL fave Sara Porkalob up to?

NOT touring with 1776. (For that matter, is anybody?)

Returning to Seattle, then back to NYC.

Lookin' for an apartment, maybe a roomie!

I think the key to those discrepancies is that Cynthia Nixon has no sense of humor

Will Sara pay the full rent or just 75%?

Jennifer Coolidge and Patti LuPone in Genet's "The Maids"!

Jennifer Coolidge as Rosalind in "As You Like It"!

Jennifer Coolidge as Desdemona to RuPaul's Othello!

Jennifer Coolidge IS Medea!

R285 That fat bitch can't have my space!

R266. She’d be better as Mary MacGregor

Gentlemen Chase Redheads

In those clips of Chess Ramin is singing “Anthem” like he’s Gaston or Javert. The song is not meant to sound so overwrought. That’s why Tommy Körberg and David James Carroll were so beautiful in the role. Karimloo is miscast.

....

And did Michael Mayer have Ramin rip his shirt open at the climax of "Anthem"?

Oh dear...

[quote]I used to be part of alot of the papering services. I had to stop them all because, while there were sometime gems offered, most of the time, it was crap

Excuse me if this is a stupid question, but.....why didn't you remain with those services for the occasional gems offered and just ignore the other stuff?

I clicked on the link above to watch the CHESS video but it says that it's private.

I was the person who posted the link R297 and it's now telling me it is private, too. It also doesn't appear in my History.

I don't know what's going on. Even though it was put out by the Entertainment Community Fund, they've now restricted it for some reason. ???

[quote]In those clips of Chess Ramin is singing “Anthem” like he’s Gaston or Javert. The song is not meant to sound so overwrought. That’s why Tommy Körberg and David James Carroll were so beautiful in the role.

It's called "Anthem" not "Lullaby" R292. And a performance in a concert setting should not be compared to a performance in the context of an actual staging. If you want to talk "overwrought", just check out what you fave Tommy Körberg did in a similar concert situation.

Anyone ever notice that the climax of "Anthem" sounds extremely similar to the main theme of "Pomp and Circumstance" that is played at gradations? Also, the lyrics of "Anthem" are pretty hard to act -- they sound almost clinical. It can be a very nice vocal showcase, but no one really every became that famous singing it, and I think it's because the lyrics let it down.

"graduations" that is

He's so full of himself, I doubt he could reign it in even if he tried. It's always his "moment" up there...but people eat it up so what can you do?

Here's a question to ponder: what are your favorite songs from musicals that flopped hard or never made it big?

It's hard to find recordings of many of these types of songs because shows that were flops rarely get cast recordings, obviously...but I really loved "Selling Out" from American Psycho on Broadway and thankfully there's this promo video to rip the tune from, since it was completely rethought from the UK version for the Broadway show.

So help me, I like "Someone Like You", "In His Eyes" and "A New Life" from Jekyll & Hyde, thanks to Linda Eder of course. "Who Will Love Me As I Am" and "I Will Never Leave You" from Side Show are obvious contenders too.

"All Falls Down" from Chaplin is a nice one as well. "Rise Above" from Spider-Man Turn Off the Dark would also be up there.

You guys like songs from more obscure flops?

What happened with that Gabriel Byrne play? I heard he had an autobiographical one-man show that was a hit in London but only lasted like a month in NYC.

Sorry, I don't follow Broadway beyond this thread. I don't remember it being discussed.

It opened and quickly closed, R302. Nobody wanted to see it.

In what world was Jekyll & Hyde a flop?

Both Jennifer Coolidge and Kristen Johnson were terrific in The Women revival. Everyone else was meh. Cynthia Nixon was miscast. The costumes were sadly bland. The production was a shrug.

R305 How was Jesse Eisenberg's sister (aka Pepsi girl)?

R303 do you suppose that if it was Hugh Jackmanwho was doing that one-man play, it would be a sold-out show?

[quote]He's so full of himself, I doubt he could reign it in even if he tried

Oh, dear, r301!

Also, maybe learn to attribute properly so that we know who "he" is?

Is it Tommy Körberg? David James Carroll? Ramin? Someone else?

I blame Issac Mizhari for those awful costumes.

It takes effort to make attractive women look homely but he pulled it off!

Beanie will be playing to role of Sveltlana in the upcoming Chess revival.

[Quote] I blame Issac Mizhari for those awful costumes.

He was the costume designer. You’re a [italic] GENIUS. [/Italic]. And congrats on that nuclear fusion thing too!!

All god’s chillun get flops.

I was about to post that R310. It’s so so so bad. He doesn’t sing in falsetto in his upper register, he didn’t need to because they transposed it down so far. He just can’t be heard in his top.

He’s completely incapable of sustaining pitch. It’s shockingly bad singing. I’m finding other excerpts on TikTok. It’s not great.

So, was Darren Criss's singing career a figment of Ryan Murphy's imagination?

I mean, he can obviously be produced heavily to reach something of a performance on TV and recordings, he could be genuinely sensational on Glee, but he is utterly incapable of singing live.

This caused a two minute ovation? Gurl, what? She misses the E, and screams the rest. This is light 80s synth pop, not Patti Smith. It’s not CBGB’s. Lena Hall is interesting, but this role is not it and not for her.

[quote] So, was Darren Criss's singing career a figment of Ryan Murphy's imagination?

fap fap fap

I’m not sure what to make of this. It’s like a Brunnhilde voice singing Susanna in Marriage of Figaro. Seriously over-miked and oversung. She’s clearly got a voice, but is totally wrong for this role.

Ramin is the closest stylistically. It’s all okay, not that exciting. He sounds like a lighter voiced David Carroll.

Jesus, Solea Pfeiffer is AWFUL. What the fuck is she doing?

R316, then how do you explain Criss’ Broadway runs of Hedwig and How to Succeed in Business…?

Never mid- I just listened to Lena Hall's track. Solea is Callas compared to her.

The excerpts I’ve heard of Criss’ HTSIBWRT are TERRIBLE. I don’t really care about Hedwig. Nobody really knows the music, it’s mostly about the attitude. How do I explain him appearing in them? He’s famous, dear. He puts asses in seats, just like the equally execrable Hugh Jackman who can at least claim to have something of a voice.

Sigh… what the fuck is happening here? Why can’t these people sing the pitches as written? Why are both either under singing or screaming? Ugh.

was Criss any good as Hedwig

Ruthie Ann Miles will be the Beggar Woman in the ST revival.

[quote]Anyone ever notice that the climax of "Anthem" sounds extremely similar to the main theme of "Pomp and Circumstance" that is played at gradations?

No, they sound VERY SLIGHTLY similar in the section that corresponds to the words "How would I leave her, where would I start," but really not similar enough that it's even worth commenting on. I don't think any two notes in succession are the same in both melodies, and it's really just the general style of the two songs and maybe a couple of the chords that make them sound at all similar.

Ramin sang “Anthem” like he was Bob fucking Cuccioli doing “This is the Moment” from Jekyll & Hyde. Körberg and Carroll sang the climax of the song with enormous powet but what leads up to it clearly requires tenderness. Something that bombast loving Karimloo doesn’t understand.

....

More Sweeney Todd casting has been announced:

Jordan Fisher as Anthony

Gaten Matarazzo as Tobias

Ruthie Ann Miles as the Beggar Woman

Maria Bilbao as Johanna

Jamie Jackson as Judge Turpin

John Rapson as Beadle Bamford

Nicholas Christopher as Pirelli and Groban's standby

Jeanna Da Waal as standby for Ashford and Miles

Wonder how many performances Fisher will actually show up to? Bit annoying he's being given another chance on Broadway given how many performances of DEH he skipped

R329, thank you. Someone here clearly has it in for Tommy Korberg, of all people, but IMHO, his perfomances of "Anthem" and the other songs in that score are pretty much definitive.

Jordan Fisher checks a box

1) effeminate straight boy

2) Person of color

3) that’s kinda it

[quote]HTSIBWRT

DIAGF, r324. You couldn't be bothered to type "How to Succeed"?

R331, I wasn't aware that Fisher was out a lot for DEH, and I'll take your word for it, but maybe the SWEENEY producers are expecting his attendance in a supporting role will be better, and maybe they're right.

r335 I don't recall the exact number, but he basically averaged out to something like 1 to 3 performances a week. Though he was still able to do guest TV spots, etc.

If true, R336, I think it's surprising and shameful that that's allowed to happen. I imagine that a great many of his fans were disappointed.

Interesting that Gaten Matarazzo is doing more Bway. He has a strong fan base from Stranger Things. One example is my niece who went to see DEH solely because he was in it. I'm sure she'll do the same for Sweeney

[quote] Nicholas Christopher as Pirelli and Groban's standby

The role was written for basically the equivalent of a dramatic baritone, but sure let’s have a character tenor standby. Makes sense considering they think a light operetta singer like Groban can sing Sweeney.

How long before another Sunday in the Park revival with rotating TV stars?

Already bought a Sweeney Ticket, but didn't even think about how different this could be compared to the older, deeper sounding Sweeneys (Hearn, etc). Hmmm.

I loved the Chess concert and was able to stay interested in spite of the political parts that were over my head. I assumed a full staging would explain things better but sounds like that has always been an issue. I wish they'd just stage it (off Broadway?) instead of having producers say "Maybe we'll produce soon, I don't know" every few months.

I've seen so many Sweeney Todds that I'm fine never seeing another again

[quote] And so I asked myself, what is DL fave Sara Porkalob up to? NOT touring with 1776. (For that matter, is anybody?)

Sara's touring in a special, stripped-down version written just for her. It's been re-titled "1332."

Didn't Judy Kuhn sing both "Nobody's Side" and "Someone Else's Story"? How id Svetlana end up with it?

I thought of Gaten for Tobias right after seeing him in Parade. He's perfect for the role. As for Jordan Fisher, blechhhh. Tommy Kail strikes again. Are we certain he's not gay?

Ruthie Ann Miles as the Beggar Woman seems. like. luxury casting. to me.

My guess would be to give her more to sing, r344.

Why thank you, r346.

She'd rather play the Beggar Woman than do Here Lies Love? Can't say I blame her.

Here Lies Love will be a rather short run. She's not stupid

But she will be taking 2 weeks off around Tony time to do Light In The Piazza? Really smart move, there.

R350 how can you be so sure?

Interesting - the original rumor was Michaela Diamond as the Beggar Woman - I wonder if that means anything about a Parade transfer.

Apparently, a major announcement about Square One is to be made tomorrow at 10:30am, according to its Twitter page, @SquareOneBway.

They're announcing Sondheim is still dead.

Sweeney again?

I wish it at the bottom of the ocean for like forever. It's at this point in Gypsy territory. And to think at one point I liked these shows. At this point I'd rather see a revival of Minnie's Boys or Dude.

"The Women" was taped for PBS

2022 and that's the best recording of Chess?

Which one, R358? What's the purpose of a post like that?

Jekyll & Hyde was definitely a flop, r304. It never recouped on Broadway even though it ran for a while and more importantly the show is pretty terrible. Linda Eder made it somewhat bearable but it never made any sense. Really ineptly put together and downright laughable at times.

Chess has been confusing since Day One. They constantly rearrange the songs with every production, so yes, sometimes Florence sings Someone Else's Story, sometimes not. Sometimes they reveal her father can be saved at the end, sometimes not.

It's weird.

Maybe someone should come up with a clear, concise term for shows that fun for a while on Broadway -- more than a year, let's say? -- but never recoup their original investments. "Soft hit" is close, but not quite right.

Soft flop?

Something rotten?

R308 I was referring to Ramin obviously, who was being discussed in the previous post. But then as I posted, apparently three others did too at the same time so my post was separated from the one it referenced.

Shit happens.

Between LMM, Ramin, Audra....I am not looking forward to hearing about this current crop referred to as "Broadway LEGENDS!" in the next 20 years as they age and people want to pretend they're as important as Sondheim or Lansbury.

God forbid they get theatres named after them.

Lin Manuel Miranda will absolutely have a theatre named for him in the future (or a school building or some other related site), I predict. But let's revisit this after his NEW YORK NEW YORK stage musical happens.

Did Jerome Robbins' Broadway recoup?

I never realized how narcissistic Ramin Karimloo was until someone on here recently linked to his Instagram. I don't follow any actors/celebrities nor do I have any social media account, so perhaps posting thirst traps are par for the course, but it was off-putting, IMO.

FWIW, not long ago I ran into Ramin at a diner near the August Wilson Theater, where FUNNY GIRL is playing. I said hi to him by his first name as he got up to pay the check or go to the men's room (not sure which), and he completely ignored me even though there's no way he didn't hear me. There were very few other people in the diner, and I remained seated when I said hi to him, so this wasn't a situation where he needed to be afraid of being "mobbed" or anything like that. Very off-putting.

[r369] that’s too bad. He’s usually gracious with fans.

So is it true Bernadette is starring in the new Sondheim musical Square one?

Guess I’m gonna have to save up for plane tickets yet again

[quote]I said hi to him by his first name as he got up to pay the check or go to the men's room (not sure which), and he completely ignored me even though there's no way he didn't hear me.

Maybe he REALLY needed to get to the men's room. Or, more likely, he was offended by having a total stranger call him by his first name.

Selfies get the most likes/engagement.

I wonder if, prior to Sondheim's death, David Ives secured from him the rights to move forward with a production of this show/these shows, or if he somehow worked that out after SS's demise.

Had you met him before?

Maybe you're right, R371. I guess I should have called him "Mr. Karimloo."

Sometimes when people are deep in thought they have no idea what's going on around them. So I'd cut Ramin some slack on this one.

Has Stephanie J Block always had a lousy attendance record because she's out of ITW alot.

I wouldn't call out to a stranger like that. If anything, I'd go up to him, excuse myself and ask if he's Ramin Karimloo. YMMV.

Do you look like Beanie, r369?

Saying hi with a first name to a celebrity you recognize but don't know is obnoxious. No one likes it and I'm not surprised he ignored you.

Has Sara Gettelfinger returned to the business? Would she be an insurance issue?

[quote]Saying hi with a first name to a celebrity you recognize but don't know is obnoxious. No one likes it and I'm not surprised he ignored you.

I don't think it was obnoxious under the circumstances. He was walking right by our table, and I didn't "call out" to him, I said "Hi, Ramin" in a conversational tone of voice. I honestly don't think I did anything inappropriate, but I guess maybe that's how he felt about it.

R373, I don't think Ives would have needed to secure Sondheim's permission; his executor(s), or someone they've designated to handle rights and permissions, could have granted it. Ives said in an interview a few months ago that the show was "looking for a home." I'm guessing The Public or Roundabout. Maybe we'll fin out tomorrow at 10.

Saying hi to a celebrity you don't know can be construed as creepy. I remember hanging out with a friend in Shubert Alley after a performance of "Sunday in the Park with George". Mandy Patinkin was signing some programs with his kid nearby and some fan calls out "Hi, Isaac" (I think his kid's name), and the kid got a little confused and flustered at this stranger; Mandy looked a bit anxious, got the kid closer to him. The kid hadn't any idea who that person is, but is taken aback that maybe he should or might know him, and Mandy rightfully got the kid close to him, just in case it was a nutjob or a possible abductor, which is a (not always written about) concern of celebs.

In other words, calling a celeb by the first name somehow might at first wonder if they know you, but then react, oh, just someone trying to ingratiate themselves. "Are you Mr. Raminoo?" or "Hi, Mr. Raminloo" would have been better. But maybe he really had to pee as well?

Say hi "by first name", that is

"Are you Mr. Raminloo" sorry

[quote]Maybe you're right, [R371]. I guess I should have called him "Mr. Karimloo."

At least you didn't make a bad joke about going to the Karim-LOO.

We *must* contact Mr. Karimloo to get to the bottom of this!

[quote]Saying hi to a celebrity you don't know can be construed as creepy.

I once startled Barbara Cook by saying hello to her during the intermission of a performance we were both attending. I also think I interrupted a conversation she was having. I had just seen her at Reno Sweeney and wanted to compliment her performance. She was gracious but aloof. I felt like an idiot and kicked myself for days afterward. But it also taught me a lesson.

R389, of course it largely depends on context -- where you are, how many people are in the immediate vicinity, how loudly you say hi to the celebrity, whether they're in the middle of a conversation at the time, etc. I didn't think I did anything wrong with Ramin, but I'm willing to admit that maybe he didn't see it that way.

R383, I remember that, sometime before his death, Sondheim said he was no longer working on the Bunuel project, but then I believe he also gave some contradictory statements. Regardless, what I meant was that Sondheim MIGHT have felt the project wasn't finished to the point where he would want a production, and in that case, he could have instructed his estate not to permit a production under any circumstances. But obviously that didn't happen, and maybe Sondheim and Ives had a talk in which Sondheim agreed that a production could go forward after his death.

Brenda Vaccaro will do a massive double take as if she's never been recognized in public before, even with the most polite and rather softspoken "Pardon me, Ms. Vaccaro?" one could imagine in a short line to go into a NYC cabaret space to watch someone else's performance.

I'm sure Ms. Cook was exactly as you say. Gracious, but to the point and a bit aloof.

Mainly it's good to not interrupt if they're chatting with someone else, and to not disturb if they're having a meal or otherwise engaged in another activity.

[quote] So is it true Bernadette is starring in the new Sondheim musical Square one? Guess I’m gonna have to save up for plane tickets yet again

Is it about nails on a chalkboard?

[quote] Lin Manuel Miranda will absolutely have a theatre named for him in the future '

He'll have to do a bit more than Hamilton and In the Heights to warrant a naming

Here's a thought about Michael Mayer. He obviously was on board with the casting of Beanie F. in FUNNY GIRL and Darren Criss in CHESS, so does this prove that sometimes he doesn't have enough integrity to refuse to cast someone in a role even when it's clear they can't handle it, as long as their star wattage is high enough and/or if there are other major considerations besides talent and suitability for the roles? Arguably, Criss in CHESS is an even more embarrassing example than Beanie in FG, because with Beanie, at least she could hit the notes, and I guess it was more of a matter of opinion as to how terribly miscast she was. Whereas with Criss.....give a listen to those bootleg recordings.

Of course, Mayer has also had lots of great casting in some of his shows, but there are also many more examples of the kind of epic miscasting I'm talking about, like Harry Connick Jr. in ON A CLEAR DAY... So, thoughts?

Jekyll & Hyde on Broadway recouped. Barely, but it recouped. I had money in it.

I would assume Jerome Robbins Broadway lost a ton of money. Huge cast and all those sets and those rights deals. I'm amazed it wasn't filmed for commercial release which I can't figure out.

Michael Mayer is a walking, talking disaster as a director

r277- I'd rather have Frozen and Frozen 2 money. Plus,The Book of Mormon money which has run longer than Hamilton.

Not to mention Avenue Q money which ran longer than Hamilton has too.

r301- This is one of my Top 5 favorite showtunes of all time.

r311- Then she'll be fired and Lea will take over. It's a proven formula for success.

r356- There hasn't been a Sweeney Todd revival since like 2005.

r369- Why should he respond to someone he doesn't know thinking they're on a first name basis? He didn't say fuck off. Why off putting?

r382- You don't know the guy and he doesn't know you. It's inappropriate.

r382- You have to at least say "excuse me" first.

r390- Regardless, I don't think it's fair to say he is "off-putting."

R403, try 2017.

Barrow Street ain't BroadWAY, r408.

That Sweeney Todd was an Off Broadway stunt. Not a proper Broadway revival. And we haven't had a production of Sweeney Todd with the full orchestrations since the original.

r399 Disney being well known for being so generous with their royalty payments, of course. And both Avenue Q and Book of Mormon payments are split between three authors. Plus, despite BoM having been open longer, Hamilton has still grossed more.

It's presumptuous and rude to say "Hi Ramin!" even if he were coming out of the stage door. No famous person likes being spoken to like that and he undoubtedly assumed you were a bore, which you are.

But everyone saw it, R409. Lewis and Carmello were popular in the community so it drew.

It ran a year and a half at Barrow Street, till August 2018.

Sweeny will have a strong first 4-6 months, and then be on TDF by Labor Day.

r399 r400 see r281.

Too late for "not to mention," R400.

[quote]I would assume Jerome Robbins Broadway lost a ton of money. Huge cast and all those sets and those rights deals. I'm amazed it wasn't filmed for commercial release which I can't figure out.

You can't figure it out? You provided your own answer. Huge cast and rights deals would also be a major consideration for a proposed filming.

I like JEROME ROBBINS' BROADWAY very much, but then I'm an old show queen.

I saw with a pack of family and friends who seemed bored with the assemblage of "Best Of" moments from his musicals. I still believe that most audiences prefer musicals with a story, no matter how contrived it may be.

Sara Gettlefinger got married soon after her release. She did The Cher Show in Maine this past summer and, I believe, she teaches. She's also stepmom to two kids so it's possible she's done with NYC theatre for now. She's very talented and a lovely person.

Can you imagine tying all of those numbers together with one plot line, r418?

Gettlefinger was wonderful off Broadway in Grey Gardens. The one who did it on Broadway was pretty lame. Gettlefinger was devastating when she realized Joe Kennedy was pulling away from her. On Broadway it went for nothing. Was she a difficult person? Did everyone hate her which is why she didn't get to make the move?

I saw Jerome…Bway in LA at the Shubert (that no longer exists).

They had enough money to schlep that cast to LA, but didn’t record it. Weird.

[quote]Beanie in FG, because with Beanie, at least she could hit the notes

Not in some of the YouTube clips I heard

It doesn’t matter that Sweeney hasn’t been on Bway since 2005. It’s been in productions all over the city since then.

I saw Robbins' Broadway 3 times. What held up for me without having any context was the bottle dance from Fiddler, I'm Flying, and the stupendous silent film parody.

The reason I heard for Sara not transferring with GG was because she was too tall. Seriously. They wanted someone closer to Ebersole's height. She was devastated.

Who doesn't already have context for I'm Flying, r425?

I saw Sara G as an understudy in Taboo. She was fantastic

She also replace Jane K. in NINE when Elfman couldn't cut it.

Gettlefinger 's wiki doesn't mention her arrest. What was the story?

Her being too tall is really too idiotic. Even though she didn't look like Ebersole she was still fantastic in the role as opposed to the slice of white bread they cast. But then the show was so much better and much less compromising off Broadway. It was going to flop on Broadway no matter what so changes were pointless in the long run.

[quote]But then the show was so much better and much less compromising off Broadway

How so, r431?

[quote]I saw Jerome…Bway in LA at the Shubert (that no longer exists).

L.A. has no Shubert Theatre!

Just off the top of my head the ending was much bleaker. From what I remember, and it is so long ago now, on Broadway there was some sort of reconciliation or at least acceptance between the mother and daughter. Off Broadway there was none. I just remember for some reason it being darker. Maybe somebody else remembers this?

[quote]on Broadway there was some sort of reconciliation or at least acceptance between the mother and daughter.

Are you suggesting it was a "happier" ending It was hardly a reconciliation. It was the daughter grimly accepting her fate and her inability to escape. It was devastating.

Take Me Out is on tdf. How long will Jesse Williams be in it? Does he have any regularly scheduled days off? I’d really like to see him.

I believe off broadway it wasn't her grimly accepting her fate. As I said it was all so long ago now. I just remember at the time thinking they cleaned it up. There was no acceptance. There was just more anger and bitterness at the end.

Sometimes you see the paparazzi yelling out at celebrities by their first names, it always seem so obnoxious and inappropriate

Hey Vicki, give us a look!

Times Square 2007

[quote]How long will Jesse Williams be in it? Does he have any regularly scheduled days off? I’d really like to see him.

Maybe just wait for his OnlyFans.

Worst thread ever?

It's like the thread has croup.

croup de theatre!

Exactly.

Smile

C,mon thread, cheer up!

You think the numbers are weak now? Wait until January and February. Some shows have to be thinking about posting.

Besides the shows that already have scheduled closures, should we expect another anouncement coming soon, or that a should will close sooner than originally announced?

C'mon kids, let's bring Data Lounge to Broadway! Pick a theatre.

Do any shows have scheduled closings?

[quote]I would assume Jerome Robbins Broadway lost a ton of money. Huge cast and all those sets and those rights deals. I'm amazed it wasn't filmed for commercial release which I can't figure out.

Can you seriously not figure it out? See 417 for a clear and concise answer, which also explains why only a minuscule number of Broadway shows have been "filmed for commercial release" over the decades. I guess you also haven't figured out why some of the few that have been "filmed for commercial release" were done in England, where the union rules just happen to be very different. And I guess you ALSO haven't figured out why the shows that were telecast Live From Lincoln Center, including the Lincoln Center Theater productions of SOUTH PACIFIC and THE LIGHT IN THE PIAZZA, were never (and probably never will be) commercially released.

Certain Broadway shows were done for commercial release like Top Banana and New Faces of '52. I'm just saying it most definitely should have been taped for PBS like those Lincoln Center productions.

If Datalounge was on Broadway these would be the shows:

1) Follies. It would be like Chicago and every few months new stars would be in it and it would run forever

2) Suzanne Somers in the Blonde in the Thunderbird

3) a musical version of Take Me Out with rotating male stars.

4) Gypsy

5) Reba McEntire in reperatory theatre of Unsinkable Molly Brown, Anything Goes and reprising Annie Get Your Gun

6) a production of a difficult play starring Tonya Pinkins and Debra Winger, with a backstage behind the scenes documentary

7) Faye Dunaway in Sunset Boulevard.

8) Betty Buckley in Carrie

9) the original cast of Merrily We Roll Along, with the original script

10) Mame starring various female stars of 80s sitcoms

Don’t forget Hazel starting Lucie Arnaz. Maybe she could do it in repertory along with TPOS (They’re Playing Our Song or That Piece of Shit, depending on your viewpoint) and, of course, Mame.

Criss was really community theatre level singing in CHESS. PU

And The Glass Menagerie with the corpse of Laurette Taylor being carried about by the stage manager.

At this point I imagine you could just pour Laurette into a thermos and roll it across the stage.

I saw a community theater production of Chess in the 90s R456, and the singing was MILES better than this concert mess. In fact, the guy who played the American ended up going on to Broadway and doing soap operas. Actually can someone help me with this? He starred in a nineties jukebox musical and I think did All My Children or another NY based soap opera? I just saw him in some Netflix show recently. He would be in his mid to late fifties now. He was quite handsome and tall with dark hair.

R458 how do you mean?

Never mind, I figured it out. It was Michael Park, and he was in the original cast of Smokey Joe’s Cafe. He did As The World Turns as a major character? Wow, I knew I’d seen him in Netflix stuff, he was in multiple episodes of Stranger Things and also the Tales of the City revival. Also just did Time Traveler’s Wife on HBO. He works on TV all the time. Good for him.

Sorry, the above was R459.

So, Trump is making some sort of major announcement today, too. Is it possible he’s going to be in the new Sondheim musical?

Charley's Aunt.

Shows scheduled to close on Broadway in the next two months include Ain't No Mo (on Sunday), A Christmas Carol (on Jan. 1), 1776, Beetlejuice and Into the Woods (on Jan. 8), Death of a Salesman, Topdog/Underdog, A Strange Loop, The Old Man & the Pool and The Music Man (on Jan. 15), The Collaboration (on Jan. 22), The Piano Lesson (on Jan. 29), Take Me Out (on Feb. 5) and Between Riverside and Crazy and Ohio State Murders (on Feb. 12). After that, it's Phantom in April. Seems like a pretty full winter cull to me.

Any word on a filming of "Take Me Out" for TV?

No, there are no scheduled closings. Everything will run for eternity.

brilliant, r463.

R465, alot of those are shows meant for white audiences.

Why aren't white audiences coming to Broadway? Why aren't they supporting their own shows???????

How much longer can ALMOST FAMOUS last?

or Kimberly Akimbo??

r461

and supposedly a fan of the homosex

Who cares? Square One slated for Fall '23 with Bernadette and Nathan.

Thanks r465, that’s very helpful.

[quote]Certain Broadway shows were done for commercial release like Top Banana and New Faces of '52. I'm just saying it most definitely should have been taped for PBS like those Lincoln Center productions.

As I said, VERY few over the decades. As in practically none. And as I also said, a show being "taped for PBS like those Lincoln Center productions" is NOT the same as a "commercial release."

[quote] Can you seriously not figure it out? See 417 for a clear and concise answer, which also explains why only a minuscule number of Broadway shows have been "filmed for commercial release" over the decades. I guess you also haven't figured out why some of the few that have been "filmed for commercial release" were done in England, where the union rules just happen to be very different. And I guess you ALSO haven't figured out why the shows that were telecast Live From Lincoln Center, including the Lincoln Center Theater productions of SOUTH PACIFIC and THE LIGHT IN THE PIAZZA, were never (and probably never will be) commercially released.

r452 I guess you ALSO haven't figured out how not to be a cunt about it.

Correction: Square One twitter announcement = fake.

Sorry, R476, but the original comment -- "I'm amazed it wasn't filmed for commercial release which I can't figure out" -- implies that the producers of JEROME ROBBINS' BROADWAY were foolish or shortsighted in not filming the show for commercial release, so I think a nasty response pointing out that poster's ignorance was completely warranted.

I hated the movie with Jennifer Lawrence. Maybe they'll get the story right this time....

And finally...

BLACK SWAN: THE MUSICAL!

There's NO SQUARE ONE

R481, because Bway has run out of ideas

Can anyone besides the smug fuck above recommend a decent papering service? I used Audience Extras for years, but they didn't make it through Covid.

For the Malcolm Gets fans, Malcolm is in a live action short film called NORTH STAR that's out now. Looking very sexy with a hot black man in a tub!

[quote] Can anyone besides the smug fuck above recommend a decent papering service? I used Audience Extras for years, but they didn't make it through Covid.

Play by play

[quote]Can anyone besides the smug fuck above recommend a decent papering service?

Dunder Mifflin

[quote] alot of those are shows meant for white audiences.

Oh, dear.

Hasn’t there been some troll here saying that Malcolm Gets has been at death’s door for at least a decade now?

I believe that poster was Boyd Gaines, r489.

[quote]Criss was really community theatre level singing in CHESS. PU

Criss's appeal and alleged talent have always eluded me.

[quote]For the Malcolm Gets fans, Malcolm is in a live action short film called NORTH STAR that's out now. Looking very sexy with a hot black man in a tub!

Is Boyd Gaines in the cast or in the tub? I kept seeing DL posts suggesting that both Gets and Gaines were at death's door, and being annoyingly coy about it.

Yeah, Malcolm looks very hot.

"Malcolm Gets Fans"....really....

Here r491

Most of the people on social media lamenting KPOP and Ain't No Mo' are either being deliberately obtuse or have no idea how business works. So many posts about how "they" want to "shut our work down". Who the fuck is "they"?

R496, I think it's a combination of both. Either way, it adds up to rank stupidity and ignorance.

Per his Instagram, DL fave Charlie Williams is now in Hamilton, the And Peggy Too touring edition in Honolulu and then Toronto.

Karen Morrow, one of the last great Broadway belters, turns 86 today.

Who gives a shit?

Darren Criss is gorgeous with a fantastic ass, but his singing only works if he's got the Glee people to autotune and sweeten his vocals. He's not a good live performer and, while he isn't the worst actor, his acting isn't good enough to make up for his bad vocals.

Sorry, [R476], but the original comment -- "I'm amazed it wasn't filmed for commercial release which I can't figure out" -- implies that the producers of JEROME ROBBINS' BROADWAY were foolish or shortsighted in not filming the show for commercial release, so I think a nasty response pointing out that poster's ignorance was completely warranted.'

I wrote that and I stand by it. By commercial release I meant filmed for PBS and then made available for home videos sales. Why not? There are plenty of stage performances available to purchase. Now please stick a gun in your mouth and blow your head off you 'I need to be a cunt about everything' moron.

Does anyone know when the Lincoln Center Performing Arts Library stared filming everything on Broadway?

[quote]Who gives a shit?

About you? Nobody.

Plenty of us, r500. Did somebody shit in your Ovaltine?

1970, r503, and they don't film everything.

[quote]I wrote that and I stand by it. By commercial release I meant filmed for PBS and then made available for home videos sales. Why not? There are plenty of stage performances available to purchase. Now please stick a gun in your mouth and blow your head off you 'I need to be a cunt about everything' moron.

Geez, r503, the other poster was being a bit of a cunt, sure, but you should maybe switch to decaf.

As several posters have pointed out, the NY labor unions make it prohibitively costly to film and sell recorded versions of Broadway shows. Some of them get around it by filming touring versions (Sweeney) or regional versions that basically use the Broadway elements/cast. The UK unions have always been easier to play ball with and offer terms that allow producers (who take on the risk of filming/distributing these things) to actually make some profit.

The Live From Lincoln Center productions come and go, never to be seen again outside of collector's circles. A shame, really! Look at Disney's "Aladdin"...they did it over in London as well! And they're Disney FFS!

There's a huge fallacy among the public that the rising costs of Broadway shows is simply due to producers (and theatre owners) greed. This factors in, but it's actually the stagehand's union (IATSE) that has rather successfully strong-armed producers into paying ever increasing rates.

The musicians' union (AFM) has taken major cuts and given way to huge allowances, but IATSE continues to make BANK on Broadway. I know this because I worked for two major producing offices and signed off on weekly payrolls. Some of these young carpenters were pulling in $2400/week (and this was back in the early 2010s). And because of flexibility in their contracts, they were often permitted to go work touring/arena shows at MSG and other venues during the week and pocket major fees there too.

I don't fault them for this, they're being advantageous. But the terms of these contracts make it impossible to do a big musical cheaply. You're employing a lot of people at a rate that's leagues better than many actors and musicians in the show. And often this is why filmed productions don't happen in NYC either. As you'd need to renegotiate the terms with IATSE and the AFM.

Let's try that again:

[quote]I wrote that and I stand by it. By commercial release I meant filmed for PBS and then made available for home videos sales. Why not? There are plenty of stage performances available to purchase. Now please stick a gun in your mouth and blow your head off you 'I need to be a cunt about everything' moron.

Geez, [R502], the other poster was being a bit of a cunt, sure, but you should maybe switch to decaf.

Sorry, r503. R506 is correct. Lincoln Center only records shows that are paid to be filmed.

r396 you had money in the original Broadway production of Jekyll & Hyde? Wow. I'm fascinated!

Can I ask some questions? Firstly - I know the original version of the show that toured the states was well-received and then the Broadway show was changed quite a bit, with many people saying it lost something in translation. Did you invest in both versions of the show - starting with the tour and then the Broadway version - or just the Broadway version?

Were you presented a complete performance of the show and then decided to chip in?

The storytelling in the show is pretty weird and surface-level, and the whole thing pretty bombastic. It got a reputation as "Phantom lite" to some degree, an attempt to cash-in on the Gothic Romance trend that was popular at the time, without really doing right by the source material. Did you feel the same way when invested, or were you thinking it'd be a smash hit and was really clever and smart?

No judgement, just curious :) Thanks!

[quote]There's a huge fallacy among the public that the rising costs of Broadway shows is simply due to producers (and theatre owners) greed. This factors in, but it's actually the stagehand's union (IATSE) that has rather successfully strong-armed producers into paying ever increasing rates.

This is demonstrably untrue, r508. IATSE did give back quite a bit during the strike of 2007, when the producers forced IATSE's hand by threatening a lockout. The cost of tickets prices does indeed lay at the feet of the producers. It started with the premium tickets for The Producers and hasn't stopped.

"...ever increasing rates", my ass. Show me a link to back that up.

Ramin is...Turkish? Iranian? Yeah, well, it's common knowledge that guys from that part of the world think they're Hot AF and carry themselves with a lot of macho attitude and swagger. Ramin happens to be good-looking too, so those two things combine to form what would be an insufferable combination, I assume (having never met the guy). Add in that he's famous and a straight (I assume?) guy in an industry dominated by straight women and gay men and...yeah. He probably walks around constantly having to brush off people flirting with him.

That said, I think it sucks when a celeb fully ignores someone who is just trying to be nice and say hi. It depends on how it was done and the timing and all that, but still...sorry you got shafted.

But don't take it personally. I'm sure he get hit on/recognized/pestered frequently as the self-appointed "stud" of musical theater.

And maybe do approach with more caution and use the last name quietly, so as to not spook any celebrities you approach in the future.

Hey, here's a thought: lets name Broadway stars we've met and had really nice experiences with, even if only stage door-ing. Lets give the nice patient and generous ones credit!

I'll start:

SJ Block - super nice

Andy Karl - same, very chill and low-key

Bernadette Peters - nice, especially considering what a star she is and how she can't walk around without getting recognized, and yet she still is willing to take a moment with a fan

Gavin Creel - also very nice, friendly/chatty

[quote] The UK unions have always been easier to play ball with and offer terms that allow producers (who take on the risk of filming/distributing these things) to actually make some profit.

Why do the filmed UK versions always suck?

r461, Hello Again is where I first heard of Michael Park, and then I remember seeing him on the cover of soap opera magazines in the checkout line when he was on As the World Turns (which I never watched)...but now I always think of him as the guy who stepped on Laura Benanti's dress in The Sound of Music Live, which she gracefully covered by saying "Oopsie!" charmingly and completely in character and proceeding as though nothing had happened.

[quote]How long will Jesse Williams be in it? Does he have any regularly scheduled days off? I’d really like to see him.

In seeing him, you mean his intense Tony nominated performance, right?

Your post is more than a little disingenuous, r508

[quote]Some of these young carpenters were pulling in $2400/week (and this was back in the early 2010s). And because of flexibility in their contracts, they were often permitted to go work touring/arena shows at MSG and other venues during the week and pocket major fees there too.

I don't understand: are you saying that they *shouldn't* be "permitted" to take on any work they can find, earning (not "pocketing fees") money for skilled and hard labor?

[quote]You're employing a lot of people at a rate that's leagues better than many actors and musicians in the show.

The stagehands are making a fair wage. So should the actors and musicians (and the ushers, and the porters, etc).

Picture it. Denver, 1974. My high school friend Louise and I were lost in the bowels of the Denver Theater Center after seeing a matinee of GYPSY. We were trying to find Miss Lansbury's dressing room to get our programs signed. There was a couple walking ahead of us. I was thrilled to recognize the woman as Miss Helen Gallagher who I knew was in town for a local production of Nanette. I just blurted out "Helen Gallagher!". She stopped in her tracks, turned , looked at me like I was an idiot and said "Right." Then turned and kept walking.

I was so shot down. We realized we had no idea where we were going so we just left. I did write Angie a letter and she sent me a lovely signed thank you note and pic. But it certainly colored my opinion of Miss Gallagher. For chrissakes, how many people were going to recognize her...in Denver?

Staff musicians on musicals take on other work for extra $$$$$ and absent themselves from their shows all the time.

R513 there's a GREAT couple of threads on the nicest and meanest Broadway encounters, but I'll throw a few here:

Gary Beach -- legitimately the sweetest, funniest, most gracious actor I've encountered

Elaine Stritch -- TOUGH but such a gem and genuinely delighted to be fawned over

Brian Stokes Mitchell -- the genuine article. Stopped for photos, signed everything and chatted a good 20 mins with everyone.

Matthew Broderick -- shy but sweet and always willing to sign

Danny Burstein -- super nice, salt of the earth, always happy to chat

Howard McGillin -- the tallest mensch you'll ever encounter. Just the best.

Donna Murphy -- Elegance personified (I know...Mary!) The epitome of grace (Mary!)

Broadway musicians make outstanding salaries and have great contract terms.

R517 -- the amount these stagehands are making is perfectly fair and reasonable. I'm saying that the stagehands union has actually done a BETTER job than Equity and the AFM for protecting and improving salaries for their workers. I'm just saying that in the basic math of it (outside of celebrity/star salaries), they're still some of the most expensive personnel on the production.

And I'm very well aware of the 2007 strike/lock out and the renegotiating that happened. If anything, my post was meant to criticize AEA and the AFM for letting producers eat into their bargaining agreements. These groups should be as well compensated (and protected) as the IATSE crew. I'm sorry if this wasn't clear in my original post -- I'm not blaming IATSE, I'm just saying there are many factors outside of producers greed that a) add to the bottom line/weekly nut and b) prohibit NYC productions from being filmed and released with ease and/or profitability.

I don’t need their signatures. I just wave a small wave when I see a theatre celebrity and they have all acknowledged the wave

R514 I wish they had recorded this 2011 Broadway revival cast instead. Those American sailors/dancers were so much better and hotter/sexier/masculine. (see link)

Not to sound shallow, but one of the reasons I was looking forward to the recent London revival recording was to see more of the sailors in action. I find it hard to believe they couldn't find attractive dancers in London.

R521 -- they do indeed. But it's still a little more complicated than that. There have been tradeoffs (some of which were necessary/overdue, some fueled out of cost-cutting greed). The house minimums have been shortchanged over the last 15 years. For those unaware -- each Broadway theater has a 'house minimum', a minimum number of musicians you need to employ based on the size of the theatre. (e.g. The St James Theatre used to have a minimum of 26 musicians).

Now, I'm very aware that the 'sound' of the contemporary Broadway show has changed drastically. So in many cases, having an orchestra house minimum of 24 or 26 musicians doesn't make ANY sense, and producers shouldn't have to pay for extra musicians if it doesn't fulfill the musical vision/style/aesthetic. However, this has also been used to cheapen the sound of scores that COULD use and benefit from 16-24 musicians -- versus installing 3 synth/keyboard players.

Now, I would say that the AFM should not be dictating the orchestration of these shows coming in (and musical directors like Paul Gemignani, Don Pippin and Larry Blank agree with this), but it's also a slippery slope to shortchanging yourself when a production SHOULD have a band bigger than 7-8 musicians.

There are a myriad of excellent discussions and debates on this very (touchy) subject via the NYPL with panels of longstanding Broadway MDs and orchestrators. It's VERY fascinating, and as with everything, you realize many things can be true at once. Steve Suskin's The Sound of Broadway Music delves into all of this as well.

Fun game of my stage door experiences

Bernadette Peters: gracious and warm, exactly as you would expect. Takes pics and signs

Patti LuPone: gracious to fans…went through a period (still may) where she doesn’t take fan photos. But will sign and gab. (Pre-Covid anyway)

Betty Buckley gracious to fans will sign and take pics

Cheyenne Jackson treats you like a friend and engages with you.

Lea Salonga: Nice and will take pics, but guarded

Fran Lebowitz: surprisingly friendly and will take pics

Joanna Gleason: delightful and funny.

Angela Lansbury: old school pro that treated fans very well

Debra Winger: Shockingly nice during The Anarchist with stage door.

Julianne Moore: very nice during the stage door for her one Broadway play. Signed and took pics

Christine Ebersole: friendly with fans

Coco Peru: treats you like an old friend

Malcom Gets is not a hot black man!

You're just realizing this *now*, r527?

Ingrid Bergman was lovely when she signed my The Constant Wife program.

Ramin Karimloo is Iranian-Canadian.

Beanie has been cast as “Pretzel” in The Wiz revival

[quote] I'm sorry if this wasn't clear in my original post -- I'm not blaming IATSE, I'm just saying there are many factors outside of producers' greed that a) add to the bottom line/weekly nut and b) prohibit NYC productions from being filmed and released with ease and/or profitability.

Yeah, I'm not letting you off the hook quite so easily, r522 (though I am grateful for the civil conversation). You used a lot of really loaded language: stagehands "permitted" to take on any work they can find (as if there was something wrong with that), "pocketing fees", "strong-armed" and yes, the unsubstantiated "...ever increasing rates".

[quote]There's a huge fallacy among the public that the rising costs of Broadway shows is simply due to producers (and theatre owners) greed. This factors in, but it's actually the stagehand's union (IATSE) that has rather successfully strong-armed producers into paying ever increasing rates.

You literally are saying that the stagehands are more responsible for higher ticket prices than the producers' greed, and this simply is not true.

[quote]Picture it. Denver, 1974. My high school friend Louise and I were lost in the bowels of the Denver Theater Center after seeing a matinee of GYPSY. We were trying to find Miss Lansbury's dressing room to get our programs signed.

'Fess up -- your friend just wanted her to say "Sing out, Louise!" to her face.

Daisy Edgar-Jones cast as Carole King in the film version of Beautiful

Jonathan Groff leads the list of nice celebrities.

As a proud member of IATSE, I retired after a 45 year Broadway career and I'm thrilled with the pension and health benefits my union provides. Granted, I paid my dues all those years. but now seeing it was well worth it.

I saw all the Broadway Hedwigs except Taye Diggs (plus Euan Morton on tour), and Criss was inferior to the rest by miles. He certainly couldn't sing it, but more importantly he had none of the edge/danger/glamor required. He was just right when playing Tommy Gnosis, which tells you all that you need to know.

Why exactly is Lansbury considered a paragon of Bway?

Yes, she was a definitive Mame, Gypsy (dont know if she played that on Bway), and Mrs Lovett.

Were there other Bway roles that justify her stardom?

She's a paragon based on her talents, the length of her career, her professionalism and her sanity, r538.

R538. Yes she played Rose on Broadway—her third Tony. She also did memorable work inATaste of Honey, Anyone can whistle (even if it flopped, it was a breakthrough for her), Dear World (Tony, Blithe Spirit (Tony), and some lesser works. She spanned five decades on Broadway. I think she earned her bonafides—only Verdon, Merman, Martin, and Rivera had as starry careers in Broadway theatre—and Lansbury’s work in film and television made her even more of an ambassador across the United States for live theatre.

Her Gypsy Tony was her third out of seven, r538, so yes she did it on Broadway. She also won a Tony for Dear World.

So basically it was three major roles

Uh . . .MAME?

She has 7 Tonys? I thought Audra had the record

Even Mary Martin. had only three major roles: Peter Pan, Nelly, Maria. No one would. question her status as a Broadway superstar.

Her last was a Lifetime Acheivment Tony, r544.

I’m not questioning their stardom. I’m questioning that Audra isn’t on the DL list of Bway icons

For one, r547, she's current.

Audra is a Broadway icon. And I’m not a fan. At all.

I don't think anyone's pointed out yet that Ain't No Mo has extended by five whole days. I would wonder why they would bother, but it's really about proving some kind of point now instead of trying to make money or truly stay afloat.

[quote]I wrote that and I stand by it. By commercial release I meant filmed for PBS and then made available for home videos sales. Why not? There are plenty of stage performances available to purchase.

This follow-up response proves you still have no idea what the fuck you are talking about. I refer you to other posts above that explain fully and clearly what you completely fail to understand, because I'm not going to spend any more time on you, especially not after you suggested I should take a gun and blow my head off just because I very accurately pointed out your stupidity.

It's early, but r538 inspired me. A new thread for when the time comes:

Imelda ruined all the filmed performances she featured in.

The Angela troll is rather stupid.

R553, that thread title was not worth jumping the gun so early.

That AMNY article is insane. And there's not one person who knows anything who is quoted. wtf?

The Producers are not greedy. Most shows fails. The Theaterowners are still making huge profits because they also get $ from the ticketing services (some of which they own) and the producers and the shows don't get any of it.

[quote] Jonathan Groff leads the list of nice celebrities.

A friend of mine was out with a large group of her friends and saw him at a West Village bar. They tried to send a drink to him but he refused it, and when they later asked to settle the bill the bartender told them that he paid their entire tab.

I also know a waiter at Saint Theo’s who told me he’s come in multiple times and always tips 100 percent.

I’ve come in Jon Groff multiple times, but only use the tip.

Wow. Nice guy!

Too bad he spits like crazy when he acts. Hate that.

Donna Murphy is indeed a doll. Totally great.

[quote]then how do you explain Criss’ Broadway runs of Hedwig and How to Succeed in Business…?

Glee fame and gay producers.

He's got a pop / crooner type voice, and a distinct timbre which does most of the legwork for him. No vibrato and strained higher register with no power so he tends to get shouty or cut off notes. But he likes to roleplay at being a rockstar and Broadway star in one.

During press for HEDWIG he made a 'friendly' jab at Michael Mayer for not casting him in AMERICAN IDIOT. Apparently he had auditioned (might even have been for Stark Sands' role) and didn't impress - but of course that was before his Glee fame.

By all accounts his singing in HOW TO SUCCEED left a lot to be desired. The bet there was he'll bring the Glee and adjacent audiences (and whatever there was of Starkid fans), and since his run was extremely short - 3 weeks if I'm not mistaken - it made some dough and put ideas into producers' heads.

I have no idea how he got the reviews for HEDWIG during the tour when he can't really sing the material as it should be sung but that's fame and connections for you.

I refuse to believe someone can be an angel AND bff's with L.M. Sarfati.

Groff was very sweet when I met him at Broadway Flea several years ago; Michael Shannon was also very nice (I had Polaroids taken with both for a donation.)

I very rarely stage door but did so with my sister at Jesus Christ Superstar (when Paul Nolan played Jesus.) Tom Hewitt was so nice and down to earth; we had a real conversation.

My sister saw Bradley Cooper in The Elephant Man; he came out afterwards in the freezing cold and patiently took selfies with the waiting crowd of fans.

[quote] So basically it was three major roles

so r452 are you trying to be insufferable, a pedant, a cunt or all three? She has 14 significant roles on Broadway. WTF point are you trying to make?

I'm sorry: R543.

We've already confirmed r452 is a cunt.

aaaaargh r542. Good night.

If all she had ever done was originate Mame and Mrs Lovett, that alone would be enough. Most actors would kill for far less.

Wonder why they're announcing this so early. But, just as everyone expected...

[quote] Nobody wants to admit that they’re not selling tickets’: Manhattan’s theaters and entertainment venues are still struggling | amNewYork

In classical performance venues like LC, Met, Carnegie Hall, etc. 30 percent of tickets sales are gone and there is every indication they won’t be coming back. People who’ve left are the older population that is a major sustainer for these houses and unlike Broadway, EVERYONE is talking about throughout the industry. It’s not in a full blown panic just yet, but 30% lost revenue in an industry that’s already in serious trouble with its audiences is extremely scary. There’s no question there will have to be a 30% reduction in services and salaries, and how that will play out at the big institutions has yet to be seen but we all know it’s coming and that’s it’s going to be very ugly in the next couple of seasons.

Everyone has been propped up the past three years by SVOG and PPP, and now the real numbers are going to come in and I think the landscape of major arts institutions is bleak, at the very best. That will manifest in season reductions, cancellations, and massive renegotiations of contracts downward all around. It’s already showing in principal artist and soloist bookings, with artistic administrations delaying booking because they don’t know what kind of money they’re going to have either donated or coming from ticket revenue. Managers are in a frenzy trying to book work that isn’t there while artists panic about their careers. We’re talking top tier multiple Grammy winning international A list artists who only have half of their season booked next year. Also, managements all over the industry are either retiring en masse or merging with bigger managements in order to survive. This is happening outside of America as well.

All I’m saying is, it’s bad and it’s going to get a lot worse over the next couple of seasons, which will be made even worse if we tip into recession. 2025 is going to look very different from 2022. Meanwhile, conservatories and universities all over the world continue to flood the industry with thousands of students who will never set foot onto a stage because they need to accept them all in order to keep functioning financially. It’s a huge fucking mess, and the reset that is coming is going to be brutal.

The Sweeney producers must be thrilled that they won’t be going up against the inevitable Merrily sweep at the Tonys this June.

Insightful and appreciated r570.

[R570], I think that the dire financial decline coupled with the drastic decline in creativity (remakes, retreads, and cannibalizing work from the movies) is going to spell the death of Broadway theater and probably theater in general.

Something will surely replace it like holograms and CGI generated images but live theater for the masses is rapidly becoming a thing of the past. Very glad I grew up tn the latter half of the 20th century.

[quote][[R570]], I think that the dire financial decline coupled with the drastic decline in creativity (remakes, retreads, and cannibalizing work from the movies) is going to spell the death of Broadway theater and probably theater in general.

The Fabulous Invalid is still dying, is she, r573?

[quote]Something will surely replace it like holograms and CGI generated images but live theater for the masses is rapidly becoming a thing of the past. Very glad I grew up tn the latter half of the 20th century.

Mary!

I couldn't believe the preponderance of seniors in the audience of Some Like It Hot last night. It was a pretty vocal crowd, too. You Could Have Knocked Me Over With A Feather stopped the show.

When I look at the latest weekly grosses, the over-a-million/week shows seem to far outweigh the lesser efforts. Is it any different than other years? Is a million/week no longer enough to turn a profit?

Could they perhaps retitle the new Sondheim SPARE ONE and put Prince Harry in the lead?

I just heard that AIN'T NO MO is extending to next Friday and that Sara Ramirez also bought out several shows.

What's the point? Why don't they just let it die? Nobody cares.

[quote]Something will surely replace it like holograms and CGI generated images but live theater for the masses is rapidly becoming a thing of the past. Very glad I grew up tn the latter half of the 20th century.

This is crazy, defeatist talk!

Some of those nutty gals from 1776 wrote a new queer musical!

[quote] The Producers are not greedy.

LOLOLOLOLLOLOLLOLOLLLLOL

Why are fans so obsessed with if actors are personally nice? Groff is NEVER going to be your friend. Your interaction with him will be restricted to his work on stage or on TV.

He's a great tipper!! How sweet. He paid someone's bill!! How sweet. He talked to me at the stage door!! How sweet,

Who cares? HE WILL NEVER BE YOUR FRIEND.

[quote] Audra is a Broadway icon. And I’m not a fan. At all.

I'm sorry.

Mary Martin had 4, not 3, major hits, SOUTH PACIFIC, PETER PAN, THE SOUND OF MUSIC and I DO! I DO!

She also played the leads in LUTE SONG and ONE TOUCH OF VENUS. Not sure if either were hits but the latter musical at least had Mary introducing the gorgeous Kurt Weill/Ogden Nash songs Speak Low, It's Him and I'm a Stranger Here Myself.

And, of course, she introduced the song My Heart Belongs to Daddy in her Broadway debut LEAVE IT TO ME. Her tours of ANNIE GET YOUR GUN and HELLO, DOLLY! were enormously successful, introducing those shows to audiences all over the world. Her AGYG was even filmed for network TV.

Not too shabby.

I’m good R583. Not everyone needs to be liked by everyone. Audra had always been average to me, with a mediocre singing voice, except for Carousel, which I thought was genuinely great. I think she’s developed into an interesting TV actress. I avoid her otherwise. I know Broadway disagrees and thinks she’s some incredible singing talent. Idc.

I will say this is why people are annoyed by activists. Buying out the theatre to pump up the box office is not going to help Broadway with its diversity problem.

It’s like a rich parent buying all the cookies from a Girl Scout instead of her working to sell them all

Well all this hullabaloo has definitely brought more attention to Aint No More. The problem is, with rich people buying out the theatre, others who want to now buy can't.

Also R542, like James Earl Jones, Lansbury had an amazing bonus round on Broadway that people may not have been expecting, and it lives in recent memory: four Broadway shows when she was over 80 where she maintained excellent attendance, Deuce, Blithe Spirit, Night Music, Best Man.

Plus, the Australian Driving Miss Daisy tour that was taped for PBS. The Blithe Spirit remount for a limited American tour, and the production in the West End.

And those benefit readings of Chalk Garden (announced for Broadway but didn't materialize), Lettice and Lovage, and Importance of Being Earnest.

She was a busy octogenarian.

Fresh upon the news of the MERRILY transfer, a reliable source reports that A MAN OF NO IMPORTANCE will be moving to Circle in the Square. I'm not sure when but I'm guessing early spring.

[quote]It’s like a rich parent buying all the cookies from a Girl Scout instead of her working to sell them all

Perfect analogy, r586.

R589-Will this be before or after Square One closes?

So when these rich peeps buy out a performance do they distribute the tickets to people who can't afford them? I love how the Playbill article says the playwrights efforts to extend the show have been successful. 5 days does not mean successful.

"A Man of No Imporatance" was one of the best theater naps I've had ever. Another tiresome tale of a closeted gay man. And the score is tedious.

[quote] Mary Martin had 4, not 3, major hits, SOUTH PACIFIC, PETER PAN, THE SOUND OF MUSIC and I DO! I DO!

Pedant.

Not me? You racists!

[quote] a new touring production of “Laramie Project” with a trans and non-binary cast.

Ok now it's just getting ridiculous. Trans is the pumpkin spice of casting.

also as a fan of Gross Indecency and, ,to a much lesser degree, Laramie, has any theater company ever milked its only two hits more to death than Moises and Tectonic?

Tranny: The Musical

My favorite celebrity encounters (not stage door, just in regular NY life) were Tommy Tune, who loved reminiscing about his career, and SJP, who was so sweet and funny.

GOLDEN RAINBOW!