Christians are the worst people

True, True, True. They are the most Repressed, Opinionated, Judgemental, and Hypocritical people I have ever met.

Your thread title is a blanket statement. Who pissed in your cornflakes this morning?!

Disgusting how they sweep so much under the rug (priest molesting boys, etc).

I agree, OP and I was raised as a Christian though I'm now an atheist. Christians all have a sense of self importance and claim that only they know "god." Which is hilarious when you think about grown people claiming to talk/know an all knowing, invisible man who lives in the sky.

I am not making fun of people's religious beliefs, but they are just terrible people in general.

[Quote]True, True, True. They are the most Repressed, Opinionated, Judgemental, and Hypocritical people I have ever met.

That's especially true about the church queens.

RACIST!^

No, R6, OP and others are talking about whites, so be careful.

[quote] Who pissed in your cornflakes this morning?!

I don't know how many times I've heard that. Very trite statement.

"christianity is a great thing, too bad nobody ever tried it"

I don't know if they're the worst people I know, but I do find most of them lacking any intelligence and phony.

OP, you're a liar and a bitch. You must be Christian yourself.

R12 I grew up in the church.

I love Jesus Christ, but I hate the Christian philosophy of they are the only ones going to heaven . It’s so off putting

OP would crawl through ground glass singing hymns to get to Tim Tebow’s nuts.

all religion should be in the DSM

No they aren't the worst people. Get out of your apt more.

More, get off Datalounge. He’s too “Datalounge”.

OP, you must not understand Christianity then. No one is perfect: Christians can lie, say hurtful things, cheat on their taxes, etc., but they don't do those things because they're Christian. If they repent, ask for forgiveness or make restitution because of their faith, that's the impact of faith. Criminals are the worst people, not Christians.

They are.

At least in the United States, people who identify as Christians are:

—Self-segregated from all others, who they hate and look down upon and believe to be inherently inferior

—Cruel

—Hypocritical

—Proudly hypocritical, trained to get off on people observing and documenting their lies

—Deceptive

—Insincere

—Manipulative

—Sexually violent

—Unempathetic

—Death fetishists, in terms of getting off on individuals' deaths through hate crimes, capital punishment and death by cop; in terms of wars; and in terms of mass shootings—nearly all of which are perpetrated by white young Christian men

—Anti-intellectual

—Anti-arts

—Aesthetically appalling

—Prone to self-destructive habits or addictions

—Secretive practitioners of what they condemn most

—Blasphemous to most of the teachings ascribed to Jesus of Nazareth

—Entirely aware Jesus was a Middle Eastern man who preached compassion and that all people are God's children, inherently both flawed and perfect creations who should not be judged, simultaneously entirely aware that people in the United States are reared to understand the term "Christian" means "good Christian" and "good-natured, altruistic person," and they leverage the cognitive dissonance caused by this direct opposition to reality in their favor, allowing them to do and say the worst possible things behind a protective shield of the label "Christian."

R19. To be fair, that's said a LOT. And yet Christians and the various Churches don't seem to do much about it.

A fundamental problem with having such a fragmented faith I suppose. It makes it very difficult to regulate.

Catholics alone fully commit themselves to:

—Volunteering and donating to charities to help other people

—Donating to the Church both to contribute to charitable efforts and to enrich and continue to gild the palace and other wealth-hoarding and wealth-displaying monuments and dwellings in Vatican City

—Refusing to acknowledge, accept, or especially do anything about well-known, impossible-to-deny longtime and ongoing systemic cruel and psychologically terrorizing sexual abuses by church employees

They do some good things. I can't deny that.

They are not good people because they directly underwrite abuses of innocent children and they directly underwrite hoarding of material wealth by lawless church leaders—contradictory to the teachings of Jesus Christ and hypocritically opposed to their purported beliefs.

And in great part, they are by far the morally superior segment of Christians in the United States. In prostestant churches throughout the US, the child raping is a democratic affair that occurs among families more often than among clergy.

Every US President has been a Christian, and hypocrisy and lying is part of that political game, of course. Hell, Clarence and Ginni Thomas are Christians and look how awful they are! But when such people lie, cheat, steal, kill, etc. those things are done because they're not acting/living in accordance with their faith.

[quote] OP, you must not understand Christianity then. No one is perfect: Christians can lie, say hurtful things, cheat on their taxes, etc., but they don't do those things because they're Christian. If they repent, ask for forgiveness or make restitution because of their faith, that's the impact of faith. Criminals are the worst people, not Christians.

But Xtians believe that they’ve been given a “get out of hell free” pass, and therefore they lie, cheat, and steal with impunity and without regret.

They have made it known explicitly that they would choose to empower and embrace Satan given the opportunity, so long as he promised them to deliver all the worldly possessions they want.

Christians' excuse for supporting Donald Trump is that they don't support the person, but they support his ascent because he has promised them to deliver all the legislation and actions they believe in—eliminating abortion, reducing taxes, keeping assault weapons legal, restoring racist and other discriminatory policies and introducing new xenophobic policies especially to punish non-Christians, defunding supports for public education and, now, tearing down the United States government altogether.

As long as they feel dominant and enriched, they gladly and eagerly and even gleefully support a man who's been accused of raping 26 women or girls, who says he wants to fuck his daughter, who hates his neighbors, who puts himself on the same level as their god, who he doesn't even believe in.

Christians have absolutely zero integrity. They are the worst people as a whole.

My dad hightailed it when I was three. Later, when I was an adult, he told me in all seriousness he was "sorry if that hurt" but he had had a conversation with Jesus who had absolved him of everything.

American "Christians" have perverted the Word of God, embraced the prosperity gospel, blame poor people for being poor, sit in judgment of others, and worship golden idols.

If Jesus Christ came back today, he would condemn them as Pharisees, and they would crucify him as a "socialist."

Yes, Jesus Christ and American Christians embrace and embody values that are diametrically opposed.

If the messiah returned in disguise and tested people's adherence to his lessons, Christians would fare the worst. Among the best-faring would be people who belong to the Satanic Temple.

[quote]But Xtians believe that they’ve been given a “get out of hell free” pass, and therefore they lie, cheat, and steal with impunity and without regret.

R24, wrong. Your third-grade knowledge of faith and morals is embarrassing.

However you may justify yourself, r29, that’s how it works in the real world.

But go ahead an masturbate yourself over how moral you are.

Right now there are Kari Lake supporters walking around in circles holding crosses and their hands in the air praying for the bitch to win.

How silly to worship a dead Jewish carpenter. He was murdered by hard liners in his own faith and has not been heard from since. (Some of his staff claimed to have seen him on Easter - but they were part of the cult.

[quote] He was murdered by hard liners in his own faith and has not been heard from since.

He was killed by Roman authorities. What you posted reflects centuries of anti-Semitism.

At the request of the hard liners in the temple. His people were given the chance to free him they chose Barabbas r33.

[quote] At the request of the hard liners in the temple. His people were given the chance to free him they chose Barabbas [R33].

That's a nonsensical story and a process that never in history happened.

Jesus was killed by the Roman authorities, the only ones to have any authority, because he disturbed the peace and was at least suspected of fomenting a rebellion agianst the Romans during Passover.

Learn how to argue, OP. The US population overwhelmingly declares itself to be Christian (I'll leave it to others to debate the reality of their professions of faith). Therefore, it logically follows that "Every person who has ever wronged me has claimed to be a Christian. Every person who acts emotionally and impulsively has said they are a Christian." Many Americans have never actually met someone who professes to be non-Christian. Of course it's the Christians who have wronged you! If you lived in Saudi Arabia it would be Muslims who have wronged you. I think you'd get farther by arguing about Christian hypocrisy in the US, and the way religion has been politicized beyond all recognition.

It's a given that there are good and bad people of all faiths (and no faith). Focus on the bad, not the faith.

OP, I have learned that nothing is what it seems.

Religion is just a word used for people to hide behind.

Nothing is ever what it appears to be.

Everything is bullshit. And there is a weird freedom in knowing that.

God entered my body! SAME SIZE

Jesus.

They love their non-biblical "Once Saved, Always Saved" crap.

Well, maybe it's time for me to kill myself. Don't worry. I won't take anyone with me. That's murder-suicide. Suicide is bad enough. On second thought, maybe I should simply ignore anti-Christianity activists.

What a rollercoaster! Phew!

Overly dramatic much, cunt?

The idea that the criticism of your beliefs would lead you to suicide is psycho.

Go flick your bean elsewhere. Your superstitious, hypocritical nonsense isn’t welcome here.

R30 According to Christian faith, God decides who is saved, there are no "get out of hell passes" ..... education must be painful to you.

R43. They're just saying that's what a lot of "Christians" believe, not what the Christian faith actually preaches.

But let's be honest, it's not like there aren't some Christian faiths that believe in something like that. Predestination and such shit can lead to some tricky conclusions. The immanence of God was another theological line that led to some unfortunate results.

Religion can be really shady. Prosperity Theology comes to mind as a big one in the modern day. Some people have been led to believe that absolution and penance are a trade-in for sins, so why not indulge and repent later? And sweeten that deal with some cash? Hell, that's why the second Schism happened in the first place - Indulgences and such.

Faith is all well and good but closing your eyes to the reality of how that faith is taught and practiced is very myopic. And unfortunately, they're all lumped in as Christian because that word basically has no meaning anymore.

^ I meant the Reformation, not the second Schism.

I got into an online debate with a guy during the Trump era and he told me that I don't know anything about the Christian evangelist worldview and had a totally wrong idea of what it means to be Christian. He said that the way Jesus said to live applies to the afterlife, not to this one, and that this material world is inherently corrupt, cruel, violent, etc.—and that it should be. We're here to suffer and to pay for our sins, he said, and that is the whole point—suffering—and making other people who are not Christians suffer and repent is doing them a favor so that they may experience peace in the afterlife.

It was pretty twisted. I discussed this with a lot of people and some told me he must have been messing with me (He seemed sincere.), some said he has a perverse understanding of evangelism, some said he's a typical Christian and some said he kind of has the basic idea right but his approach to it is questionable.

I suppose if you travel in circles where there are few Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, agnostics, and atheists, anyone mean to you is likely to be from that obe group

But don't let that stop you from another exercise in petulant, adolescent, bigotry baiting tarring hundreds of millions of people across the globe.

All the lone wolf shooters have been members. Ergo, men ate horrible people.

DL used to be snappy, ironic, subversive, and screamingly funny.

Now it's infested with posters like OP, who couldn't think his way out of a paper bag.

Dreary doesn't begin to cover it.

^* all the lone wolf shooters have been men (not members)

Fucking autocorrect.

[quote] They love their non-biblical "Once Saved, Always Saved" crap.

That's not a universal Christian position. That's part of the Reformed dogma.

It’s hysterical how this has become “#NotAllXtians!”

Yes, we realize you all have perverted Jesus’ teachings in your own unique ways. That’s the problem. You always have rationalizations about why your perversion of his words is the correct one.

Imagine there's no countries

It isn't hard to do

Nothing to kill or die for

And no religion, too

I'm amazed that journalists still use the preposterous term "lone wolf" when speaking of white men who shoot assault weapons into crowds of innocent people and use "terrorists" when referring to people they suspect of coming from the Middle East—including the Caucasian Boston bomber who they thought at first was an Arab.

[quote] It’s hysterical how this has become “#NotAllXtians!”

It's hysterical how people keeping making false blanket statements.

[quote] You always have rationalizations about why your perversion of his words is the correct one.

You always falsely assume people correcting misunderstandings are people of faith.

Church indoctrination that fetishizes hatred and rationalizes why it is endorsed by the church always > reason and logic and empathy and practiced compassion.

R51 That would be Martians he's referring to.

Especially the ones involved in the Spanish Inquisition.

So, r53, your only argument basically reduces to “I know you are but what am I?”

Go have your beliefs. Just stop denying our reality of having to deal with people who claim to believe like you do.

Jesus is ashamed of modern Christians

Not to mention rampant anti-Semitism. Many “Christians” still refer to Jews as “Christ-killers.”

And, dare I mention “Christian” homophobia? Let alone outright murder!

R58 What the fuck planet are you living on? I haven't heard anyone use the term "Christ killer" since the 1950s. "Many Christians"? Really? REALLY? How many? Where did you hear it? Did you take a poll?

"Many Christians" - which ones? Fundamentalists? Garden variety Catholics and Anglicans? Presbyterians? Methodists?

Make a statement like that, you really need to back it up.

And today's antisemitism is being driven by blacks (many of whom have never set foot in a church) and Muslims.

From 2004

In my own life, I have encountered evangelical seminarians and Bible college students who believed that contemporary Jewish people remain guilty for killing Jesus. One professor at a Christian college told his class that the New Testament blames all Jews for all time for the murder of Jesus, sarcastically noting that he would not say that too loudly in a Jewish neighborhood. I have even met anti-Semites who propound the charges of deicide and ritual murder with bumper stickers and T-shirts.

^2004? That was twenty years ago. What's happened since?

More of the same, r62

Read the fucking fine print:

"This represents a modest but statistically significant increase in the number holding this opinion when compared with a 1997 survey by ABC News which found 19% feeling this way. But a solid majority of Americans both then and now (60%) continue to say that Jews were not responsible for the death of Christ."

What is it about that last sentence do you not understand? And did you get the bit about "young people and minorities" . . . and those who viewed Mel Gibson's nakedly antisemitic film.

“How do you respond when people say that the Jews killed Jesus?”

[quote] a 1997 survey by ABC News which found 19% feeling this way. But a solid majority of Americans both then and now (60%) continue to say that Jews were not responsible for the death of Christ."

Ah yes, we’re back to #NotAllXtians!

19% is pretty damn high for such an evil delusion. Does it have to be 100% for you to take it seriously?

^And in that one, it says the "threat of anti-Judaism is there" because of the Scriptures.

It doesn't say Christians are going around calling Jews Christ killers. Antisemtism is on the rise because of Israel (mind, I'm not blaming Israel), not because of the Passion story.

You made the statement about many Christians calling Jews Christ Killers. I want to know IF YOU HEARD IT, WHEN YOU HEARD IT, AND WHO YOU HEARD SAY IT, AND HOW MANY TIMES.

Because I'm an elder gay, born Anglican, lived a life surrounded by others of Christian persuasion, and have never ONCE heard the phrase used.

Seriously, how high a percentage of you Xtians would need to be going around saying Jews killed Jesus for you to see it as the problem it is? Would 49% of Xtians slurring Jews be acceptable for you?

This evil didn’t end in the 50s, you asshole

Christians do the darndest things!

[quote] Because I'm an elder gay, born Anglican, lived a life surrounded by others of Christian persuasion, and have never ONCE heard the phrase used.

If you were Jewish, however, you might have heard it by now.

Your sheltered experience is meaningless

R68 I didn't say antisemitism ended in the 50s, you illiterate shite. I said people going around using the word Christ Killers! did. I've never heard it used once. The fucking Vatican came out and absolved the Jews of blood guilt. The fact that a few yobs and illiterate youth and hate filled blacks do it doesn't mean it's a common theme amongst Christians.

Dave Chapelle, Irving, Kanye, Louis Farrakhan . . . hey, with friends like these, who needs Christians?!

[quote] I want to know IF YOU HEARD IT, WHEN YOU HEARD IT, AND WHO YOU HEARD SAY IT, AND HOW MANY TIMES.

Shall we get the manager for you, frau?

There's only one lightsided heroic sexy acceptable one in the world, and his name's Jordan Henderson.

He can use this filthy Pagan as a footstool and read sanctimoniously to me from the Bible whenever he wants.

Again, the argument that you’ve never heard it, when you live in a goy bubble, makes you look pretty fucking stupid

I'm a good loving person who of course isn't perfect. I don't need Jesus Christ, if he existed, to teach me to be that. I don't need any God or religion. I don't need to whisper to myself or pray, as they call it. I have no interest in "eternal life." Sounds boring to me. And I'm perfectly happy. My parents identify as Christian and fervently support Trump. My brother identifies as Catholic, has a million children, and actually tweeted that “homosexual acts are evil. Transgenderism doesn’t exist. Abortion is murder. Contraception is perversion. So is masturbation and porn.” When confronted, he said that is what Catholics believe and that it is not a "fringe" belief. "Billions" believe all of this according to him. This from the church that covered up thousands of sex crimes against children. Are Christians "the worst people"? A lot of them can be hateful hypocrites, that's for sure. Or they've just been misled by their parents. And those are my words on the topic.

What’s a goy bubble and where can I purchase one?

I hope at least the "Blood Libel" myth has faded.

I forgot the link about blood libel in case someone doesn't know

If a historic Jesus of Nazareth really did spend his life teaching people of the ancient brutal Middle East to treat one another with empathy and compassion, and planting the seed in their minds that we are all one connected divine being, then I feel *really* bad for him that his name has been used in such a perverse way for 2,000 years.

Imagine if you dedicated your life to doing one thing you thought was noble and then someone misinterpreted what you meant and used your dead body as an icon of cruelty and hatred forevermore.

R79. Yeah, I sympathize with that . It's funny because Judaism never managed to attain the kind of reach Christianity did (nor did it want to I imagine).

And Islam probably wouldn't have arisen without Jesus either.

What a strange world it would be.

[quote]Criminals are the worst people, not Christians.

They are often one and the same.

[quote]Your third-grade knowledge of faith and morals is embarrassing.

Your naivete is equally so. Most people's intellectualized "faith and morals" are just mental masturbating. Ideas about goodness must translate into genuine acts of mercy and justice to be valid, but few Christians seem capable of knowing what true compassion is and what is just a belief handed to them by someone else.

[quote]Because I'm an elder gay, born Anglican, lived a life surrounded by others of Christian persuasion, and have never ONCE heard the phrase used.

Well, that settles it! Because you haven't experienced it must mean that it never happens! Ignore all the other posts and articles contradicting you, they couldn't possibly have lived different experiences than you have.

As someone who was once employed by a progressive church (it just happened, I never planned on working for a fucking church)….Christianity is great, Jesus is great. What’s not great is that Western Christianity, specifically in America, the White Evangelicals, but also almost ALL churches, they got “it” wrong.

They are NOT teaching the words of Christ, they are teaching a weird, deformed, mutated, devolved version of what Jesus taught. We have conflated religion with what being a Christian actually means, they are doing it fucking wrong.

The two things that would fix this? 1. NO judgement— Christians need to understand that while the Bible says a lot about God judging horrible behavior, it is NOT meant for US to therefore judge. The Bible tells those stories to show us more about God, NOT to turn us into judges too. Only God can judge, worry about yourself. 2. NO hypocrisy. Teach Christians how to identify their own hypocrisy by showing them the beautiful personal growth and transformation that happens. When you stop judging others, when you start living as your authentic self, when we practice fucking radical inclusion and radical compassion…..that is the shit Jesus was trying to show us. That there is hope for our own personal evolution, and that when we evolve, we are set free from the shackles of the self, and we are liberated!!!!

PS….Christians should be doing yoga, meditation, and a shit ton of ketamine too. I do all of these because I’m not a weak minded pussy who fears science and is suspicious of every goddamn new thing that challenges my beliefs because I’m a grown up. They need to toughen the fuck up, biggest victim mentally in the world, it’s pathetic, they need to just flush the whole thing and start over because they’ve fucked it up that bad. It is so nasty and unfortunate, I am sure Jesus rolls his eyes a LOT.

New progressive churches I think someday will look very very different. Maybe gather just twice a month, and it will be about the entire church community serving the poor through “love with no strings attached”. Loving people but never ever ever trying to convert them, just giving them kindness and tenderness and meeting their physical needs (food, education, work, healing from trauma). But I almost can’t this happening because white men have such a lock on churches, did i forget to mention that women must lead this paradigm? The end. You will know a church is healthy if it has a healthy amount of creatives and heavily tattooed and pierced people, it’s a good sign if those types feel safe.

Iirc all the churchgoing girls at my school in the 2000s had competitive eating disorder issues and were borderline histrionic. They went to specific modern youth-oriented sort of Baptist organisation, so idk if that has anything to do with it.

[quote] Granted, I do know some decent people who are Christian, but 97% of Christians are not Christians.

That’s the most important point. Don’t judge or stereotype Christians based on what you have seen from fake Christians.

If 97% of them are fake, it’s reality, not a stereotype.

But we know, you’re the “real Christian”. Everyone else who calls themselves “Christian” is fake, but you’re the one true Christian.

You are all confusing cause and effect.

Christianity doesn’t make people terrible.

Terrible people seek out Christianity because they need something to hide their terribleness— either from others or from themselves.

Christianity is a source of irrational self esteem for people who don’t realize how awful they are. They do bad things all day long but feel ok about themselves because they are “Christian.”

Though I honestly don’t know any people who are middle class or above who are religious. It’s increasingly a lower-middle-class and below phenomenon.

[quote] If 97% of them are fake, it’s reality, not a stereotype.

The reality and stereotypes of the group of people who are fake Christians shouldn’t be applied to the separate group who are actual Christians.

It’s a cult.

Like any other cult.

[quote] did i forget to mention that women must lead this paradigm?

There really is no burden of extra labour, especially emotional, that men won’t push onto women—who in these times, did we forget to mention, have to work fulltime as well as do child/elder/community care...

Religion is for the guilty.

Christians often lack perspective.

The Bible is simply one book undergoing much translation with the translator’s bias and motives informing the final product.

Interpretations of the text often lack discipline and a holistic view.

Learned people should join the clergy to guide the masses into a reasonable application of Christian principles elevating their critical thinking skills.

Unfortunately, leaders are often seeking fame, fortune or perpetuation of a provincial discriminating world view.

“Learned people” are not religious.

[quote] The reality and stereotypes of the group of people who are fake Christians shouldn’t be applied to the separate group who are actual Christians.

The problem is, they all call themselves the “true Christians”. And they are all lying.

Even you.

R83 Fundamentalists, for one thing, are deeply pro-Israel as the consider it the fulfillment of a Biblical prophecy. That includes Baptists.

How many "Fundamentalists" have you actually been in the presence of who used the term Christ Killers.

In fact, the people who used the term most were old-fashioned Roman Catholics.

NotAllXtians!

The worst people? Worse than Jack the Ripper? Worse than Josef Stalin? Worse than Mao ?

Are Christians worse than the occultist monster, Adolph Hitler?

Aren't you being hyperbolic?

R98. In the grand scheme of things you have to wonder if the number of people whom Christians collectively have killed in the name of their faith is equal to or more than the number of people killed by those monsters you mentioned.

Even combined I'd still suggest Christians might still have the edge.

[quote]OP: but 97% of Christians are not Christians.

You're employing a 'No True Scotsman' argument, OP, and it's fallacious.

[quote]R58: What the fuck planet are you living on? I haven't heard anyone use the term "Christ killer" since the 1950s. "Many Christians"? Really? REALLY? How many? Where did you hear it? Did you take a poll?

Try the New Testament, babe.

[quote]1 Thessalonians 2:14b For you suffered the same things from your own countrymen as they did from 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐉𝐞𝐰𝐬, 15 𝐰𝐡𝐨 𝐤𝐢𝐥𝐥𝐞𝐝 𝐛𝐨𝐭𝐡 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐋𝐨𝐫𝐝 𝐉𝐞𝐬𝐮𝐬 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐩𝐫𝐨𝐩𝐡𝐞𝐭𝐬, 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐩𝐞𝐫𝐬𝐞𝐜𝐮𝐭𝐞𝐝 𝐮𝐬, and displease God and oppose all mankind 16 by hindering us from speaking to the Gentiles that they might be saved—so as always to fill up the measure of their sins. But wrath has come upon them at last!

Calling the Jews "Christ-killers" is implicit in the passage (cf. Matthew 27:25; Acts 7:52). It is baked into Christianity, into its founding mythology, its theology, and cannot be removed. Stop offering apologetics on its behalf; you're embarrassing yourself.

[quote]R61: One professor at a Christian college told his class that the New Testament blames all Jews for all time for the murder of Jesus...

He was correct; see the citations above, especially Matthew 27:25.

[quote]R86: (referring back to OP) That’s the most important point. Don’t judge or stereotype Christians based on what you have seen from fake Christians.

It's the shittiest point, and doesn't even constitute a legitimate argument. The sooner Christians realize this and stop trying to roll that one out, the better.

[quote]R98: The worst people? Worse than Jack the Ripper? Worse than Josef Stalin?

Both Stalin and Jack the Ripper, whoever he may have been, were acculturated in Christianity. They did not cease to be informed by the concepts of Christianity and its bible.

(The Soviet Union 'pretended' to be atheist for a mere 69 years, a hiccup in the greater scheme of things; they were unable to de-Christianize their culture. Christianity survived in Russia, and emerged at the end of the USSR undamaged; Russians picked up where they left off.)

('Jack the Ripper' seems to have been informed by biblical concepts of misogynistic morality, blood atonement, and ritual sacrifice; it is highly doubtful that his pathology would have developed the way it did in the absence of Christianity. And it's entirely probable that the British government and the Monarchy, Christians all, knew who he was, and declined to identify him, much less stop him. Shielding wrongdoers is a perennial problem within Christianity.)

[quote]Worse than Mao ?

Comparatively speaking, Mao is an underachiever.

[quote]Are Christians worse than the occultist monster, Adolph Hitler?

Babe, Adolf Hitler 𝑤𝑎𝑠 a Christian, the dumptruck-load of Catholic and evangelical apologetic deflection notwithstanding. And even assuming you could reliably make the case that Hitler was not sincere in his self-professed Christianity, you simply cannot do that for the millions of Christian Germans (not to mention the rest of the Axis powers) who willingly carried out the agenda of the Third Reich and the Axis.

[quote]Aren't you being hyperbolic?

Aren't you being disingenuous?

I know a few wonderful people who are Christians and if the world was full of them is would be a beautiful place. It must be upsetting having so many people use your belief system for their agenda.

"Your belief system" is bad enough on its own, R102.

Anyone who is incapable of recognizing the flaws of Christianity is not reliable to validate the behavior of his own handpicked "few wonderful people who are Christians."

The very foundation of the Bible is that women are lesser humans than men -- that they were literally invented by taking a part from inside of a man (that's pretty fucking rich)

The trinity is three male apparitions or whatever you call them - Father Son Holy Ghost -- notice any particular type of human missing from the ruling triumvirate - the "life giving" source of all?

What about, "Wives, submit to your husbands." Uh, doesn't that condone marital rape? Doesn't the Bible talk of men marrying off their daughters - or of a rapist making a decent woman out of the person he fucking assaulted and raped by marrying her? (and this is just to bring back honor to the family - or rather the fucking father) - would you like to be forced to marry the person who assaulted and sexually attacked you?

That doesn't even begin to address slavery - and killing all the male babies unless they're marked with blood over the door or some such - and killing every creature that won't fit on a ship because God has thrown the mother of all temper tantrums? Or I guess since it's the Judeo-Christian religion, it would have to be the father of all temper tantrums because mothers don't count - for anything whatsoever - other than being rape victims and property you gain power through.

They probably took better care of their goats. (the ones they weren't sacrificing to their bloodthirsty deity.

Judeo-Christianity is evil - if there ever was such a thing.

I just can't quite stop my rant -- how many goats have been slaughtered to preserve the family (male family)'s honor? WTF does that mean? Murdering a child or young woman is not a crime - but if she talks to the wrong boy, now THAT is a crime.

[quote]How many "Fundamentalists" have you actually been in the presence of who used the term Christ Killers.

Two immediately come to mind. If there were 2 just in our small congregation, I'm sure there were likely others. They were both older ladies, Maybe they were raised Catholic and converted, but I doubt it.

Not sure why you think all Fundamentalists believe the same things or are all pro-Israel, as that wasn't my experience when I was Fundamentalist- they aren't all one denomination. Our pastor wasn't antisemitic to modern Jews, but he definitely believed the verses that the Jewish leaders of Jesus's day delivered him to Pilate, as described in the book of John, chapters18 and 19.

I think it's all horseshit, personally, and I don't care who did what even if Jesus is ever proven to have existed, because that has little to do with the here and now and Jesus supposedly had the last laugh by resurrecting.

[quote]What the fuck planet are you living on? I haven't heard anyone use the term "Christ killer" since the 1950s.

You've obviously been everywhere and met every person on the planet, staying by their sides 24/7. That's why you're such an expert on everyone else's experiences and feel qualified to contradict them, rather than broaden your own understanding, right?

[quote] As someone who was once employed by a progressive church (it just happened, I never planned on working for a fucking church)….Christianity is great, Jesus is great. What’s not great is that Western Christianity, specifically in America, the White Evangelicals, but also almost ALL churches, they got “it” wrong.

This is why I specifically said 'Let's be American Christians,' and why I always designate criticisms here and elsewhere as such. American Christianity and the teachings of Christ and, in some places, the practice of Christianity, are not at all the same.

There were many early Christian sects, and many of them were mystical practices and had practical magical elements. I am intrigued by them. I have spent years reading texts collected and labeled gnostic, almost all of which were attributed to Christian teachings and which are radically different in philosophy than conservative Christianity, and I find a lot of spiritual value in them. I can't condemn Christian teachings and followers entirely because of it.

American Christianity is an extremist dogma-based culture and practice of its own evolution and design that's anchored in churches but is not anchored in Christian teachings—Christian teachings are applied as is useful, out of context, and usually in ways to support cruelty and harm caused to outsiders. Their culture is insular and exclusive, it involves outward harassment of others, violent words and sometimes actions, and a tremendous amount of what many Christians from other times and places would regard as straightforward blasphemy. It's based in uniquely American-style pride and greed. It's tied directly to consumerism, condemning judgment of different people based on their biological natures rather than their beliefs and practices, and the fetishization of firearms and bizarre conflation of them with biblical history. It's a strange work of apocalyptic fantasy fiction being written in real time collectively by churchgoers within the United States. I've met European, Canadian and Central and South American Christians who range from liberal to conservative in their values, and none has been a political extremist in the way proud Christian people from Idaho, Florida, Texas, Washington, Oregon, Montana et al. are. American Christianity has felt to me for decades like an incubator for an Al Qaeda-type homegrown terrorist group and January 6 demonstrated that they are. And their opting into supporting an antichristlike figure like Donald Trump and opting into totally unhinged QAnon theories anout lizard people running governments, etc., shows they don't have any commitment to their purported spiritual beliefs; they just want to live as part of a wild sci-fi-fantasy apocalypse story and go out with a bang.

[quote]In fact, the people who used the term most were old-fashioned Roman Catholics.

R96 Since it's "fact" that Catholics used the term Christ Killers the most, please cite your source.

Who cares, R109?

It doesn't matter because it is nonsense. Jesus was a Jew. His whole community of people was made of Jews. They shared a common Jewish faith and culture and tradition. Jesus was a radical—surely not the first or only one—who took exception to a lot of cultural norms and preached a more compassionate way of living for the sake of spiritual liberation, much like the Buddha was said to have taught to people in India, within a different religious and political culture. But Jesus was Jewish. The people of Nazareth and many of his wanderings were Jewish people. They were Jewish people who, just like people today, lived within a certain culture and objected to many cultural norms and pushed back against them. When American people kill American people, one doesn't say that "Americans killed" that person.

Those preaching the loudest are the ones to beware of.

The moment someone announces "I'm a Christian" as some kind of proof or testament to their supposed good character, I am immediately leery of them and keep them at arm's length. They always make this announcement when they are being questioned about something dubious they've said or done. It's their go to deflection.

R110 When someone passes something along as factual but has no basis for that, it's a problem. Trump does the very same thing. No one's opinion should be a "fact" unless you can back it up.

[Quote]I haven't heard anyone use the term "Christ killer" since the 1950s.

The first time I heard something similar to that was in a comedic way, on the show "Mary Hartman, Mary Hartman." One of the characters, Loretta, was being interviewed by Dinah Shore (who was Jewish). Loretta was telling Dinah how nice her Jewish producer was. So nice, that she couldn't believe that "his were the people that what killed our Lord." (It's from 3:06 to 3:50)

[quote] When someone passes something along as factual but has no basis for that, it's a problem.

An amazing statement by a believer in zombie Jesus

[quote]R110: Jesus was a Jew. His whole community of people was made of Jews.

'Jesus' (Greek name, that) and his "whole community" were literary characters 𝑑𝑒𝑝𝑖𝑐𝑡𝑒𝑑 as Jews, in narratives written by Greek-speaking gentiles.

[quote]They shared a common Jewish faith and culture and tradition.

Jewish faiths, culture, and traditions have never been monolithic, not now, and not in the 1st century CE, in which the NT narratives were ostensibly set. But the NT was composed from the 2nd century onward, long after the temple and its cult were gone; indeed, after the Jews had been banished from Syria-Palæstina. The Jewish model the Greek Christians used for their depictions of Jews in the NT were largely drawn from contemporary 2nd century Rabbinical Judaism.

[quote]The people of Nazareth and many of his wanderings were Jewish people.

Nazareth, 'the city theology built,' was not populated during the time depicted in the gospels (see link below).

[quote]When American people kill American people, one doesn't say that "Americans killed" that person.

It depends on who's writing the narrative. If it's being written for a non-American readership by non-Americans who are hostile towards Americans, and who does not essentially believe that the person killed was an American (in the case of Jesus, the anonymous authors believed he was the Son of God), then yes, one would find the narrative written to reflect that point of view.

[quote]An amazing statement by a believer in zombie Jesus

R114, actually I've been an atheist for over 20 years. Presumptions are dangerous, Missy.

Liar

Yes, that sums you up.

R115 The old testament was written primarily in Hebrew. The new testament was written primarily in a commonly spoken version of Greek and in Aramaic by people of Jewish descent who had learned Aramaic. Greek was chosen as a primary written language because it was understood by the majority of the Mediterranean region's literate people but it was not necessarily everyone's primary spoken language. It was used as a means to get the word out to the greatest number of people.

I watched a university course on early Christianities and found it quite interesting. As you say, ancient Jewish people were not monolithic at all, and there were at least dozens of different approaches to Judaism and then to Christianity, which was practiced by Jewish people. Early on, they were followers of Christ, but the oppositional Jews vs. Christians dichotomy wasn't really a thing because many Christians came from the Jewish traditions anyway. Some early Christians were extremely conservative, some used practical magic to greater and lesser degrees, some were more dogmatic, some more philosophical and introspective. And much of all of those approaches were handed down from similar approaches to Judaism.

I wasn't raised in any kind of religious environment but it bums me out that the version of Christianity that coalesced was a version that emphasized dogma and eliminated mysticism for the most part.

Although it is interesting to me as an outside observer that the Catholic faith, which I guess is primarily responsible for exporting Christianity globally, has a lot of ritual magic and rituals that are not now seen as magic, or openly acknowledged as such, but which are meant to be so. Protestants are a lot more common in my part of the world and I find their condemnation and fear of anything mystical to be the second most annoying thing about them after the whole hatred thing.

And the thing’s arguments are back to “I know you are but what am I?”

No wonder the little shit’s so confused

Queens bitching about Christers. How unprecedented.

[quote]R119: The old testament was written primarily in Hebrew.

I'm not sure how that's relevant to a discussion of Christianity, unless you're trying to drive the idea that the authors of the Jewish Testament and the New Testament were the same people. They weren't.

It's possible that the Jewish scriptures began as Greek texts, which were later rendered into Hebrew (the theory is called Septuagint Priority, or the Gmirkin Model). But that is another discussion altogether.

[quote]The new testament was written primarily in a commonly spoken version of Greek and in Aramaic by people of Jewish descent who had learned Aramaic.

A 𝑣𝑒𝑟𝑦 small handful of Aramaic phrases appear in the gospels, usually as exoticisms, as though the words themselves had magical or apotropaic power (i.e. 'hosanna,' 'talitha cumi,' 'ephphatha', etc), or as quotes from the Septuagint ("Eli, Eli! Lama Sabachthani?" from Psalm 22). None of these instances suggest a speaking understanding of Aramaic.

[quote]Greek was chosen as a primary written language because it was understood by the majority of the Mediterranean region's literate people but it was not necessarily everyone's primary spoken language. It was used as a means to get the word out to the greatest number of people.

No. Greek was not 𝑐ℎ𝑜𝑠𝑒𝑛; Greek was what the anonymous authors 𝑠𝑝𝑜𝑘𝑒. The characters in the narratives were 𝑑𝑒𝑝𝑖𝑐𝑡𝑒𝑑 as being Jewish, and you are conflating the characters with the anonymous authors of the works. They are not the same. While it's understandable why 𝑏𝑒𝑙𝑖𝑒𝑣𝑒𝑟𝑠 do this - it's part of the faith to believe that the works were authored by the names that tradition has affixed to them - I'm not sure why you're doing it, except perhaps that it has never occurred to you to question the claims of faith-based scholarship.

[quote]I watched a university course on early Christianities and found it quite interesting. As you say, ancient Jewish people were not monolithic at all, and there were at least dozens of different approaches to Judaism and then to Christianity, which was practiced by Jewish people.

There's simply not any evidence that Christian texts were written by Jewish Christians, supposedly the first communities of believers. While that's a New Testament claim, there's no evidence that it's true. Nor is there any evidence that there were Christians in Judea in the 1st century CE, or any evidence that such believers existed prior to the point when the earliest Christian texts - written in Greek - emerged, in the mid-2nd century. See, claims of antiquity attached to pseudepigraphal names is a trope practiced by Jewish scripture authors (i.e. the Book of Daniel, set in 6th century Babylon, but actually written anonymously in the 2nd-1st centuries BCE), and it's one that was followed by Christian authors as well. While the narratives of the gospels are 𝑠𝑒𝑡 in the early 1st century, they were actually 𝑤𝑟𝑖𝑡𝑡𝑒𝑛 in the middle of the 2nd century and later - and not by any of the people which appear as characters in the narratives.

The earliest copies of New Testament texts in Hebrew do not appear until the 5th century CE.