You’ll Never Eat Lunch

It's certainly not Patti Smith, who was never big in size. My guess is heifer Stevie Nicks.

Grace Slick

It was Edina Monsoon.

What timeframe is the "his date finally arrives"? Mid 80s?

How do you like the book? I always wanted to read it but never got around to it.

Does she say who the “he” is who brought his rock star girlfriend? That may give a clue

Grace Slick was really a rock 'n' roll princess in the sixties.

I thought Stevie was just into coke.

True, R8. I thought that as well. Debbie Harry, then, maybe. She's not big in size now, though. I guess she was once?

Is this the full title of the book I can't find it? the book with a title like that is You'll never eat lunch in this town again by Julia Phillips about her freebasing habit.

R4: Not sure. Anywhere from mid 80s to early 90s is my guess

R5: It’s fun but very long

R6: No, and I don’t get the impression it’s anyone we would know

R10 That’s the full title.

This is probably Debbie at her fattest.

Doesn't she have tiny feet at r13.

You'll Never Eat Lunch In This Town Again.

Debbie's lack of a public dating life post Chris Stein makes me think that she is indeed a lesbian. Or she relapses too much to even date.

Mama Cass

It's Ann Wilson. She got (and still is, I believe) HUGE.

The book was funny. She said that Goldie Hawn had dirty stringy hair all the time. I really liked that book but the Goldie story is the only one I remember for some reason and Julias freebasing. I was thinking Mama Cass too but she might have already been dead by then. There is another book called You'll never make love in this town again which was an equally fun read.

Stevie was only heavy for a few years. The fat jokes bothered her and she thinned down fast and stayed that way.

Bonnie Raitt got fat by the mid 80s. Her last Warners album has a drawing of her instead. I don't think she was ever a princess, though.

Debbie was huge in the movie Heavy, around 1995.

[quote] Stevie was only heavy for a few years. The fat jokes bothered her and she thinned down fast and stayed that way.

Stevie is still heavy, IMO. I don't recall her ever thinning down and staying thin.

She's had damn good work done.

[quote] “His date finally arrives, a rock’n’roll princess who was big in the seventies and now is just big. Gigantic….this woman is a famous junkie…There are works, with blood, discarded carelessly in the sink…”

OP, who is the guy ("his" date)?

Don't know. Alread said don't know.

Oh, didn't catch that.

My guess would be Linda Ronstadt or Ann Wilson.

Grace Slick is / was an alcoholic, I thought. Doesn't mean she wasn't using needles. Good guess, though.

Stevie Nicks was into snorting coke, she never said she shot it up. However, who wants to admit to shooting up coke.

Anita Pallenberg?

Salemburg wasn't fat was she? I just had to look up when Joplin died but she died in 1970. She fits the fat junkie description

Linda Ronstadt was never a junkie

There was one of those celebration concerts I was at and someone introduced Ann has “half of heart”

Bitch, more like 2/3!

I can picture Debbie with blood the most out of the names mentioned. She's had some really dark times.

Food junkie.

It could be anyone...OP is just throwing names out...it could be someone not on the list.

R8, I can vouch for that.

Wasn’t there a Dler that told a story abt seeing Debbie at a party and someone who knew Debbie personally said something like - you know she’s clean when she looks like housewife. When she’s using she looks fabulous. . . . Or something like that…

Stevie didn't shoot up coke, she had someone blow it up her ass.

It was something like "You knew when Debbie was on heroin because she looked FABULOUS!" I think it was a woman who said it, though, not a DLer.

I read that book, after it was highly touted on DL. I found the author/narrator really contemptible. She was incredibly bitchy and nasty, which, I guess, endeared her to some DL denizens. I was not sure to whom she was referring in this instance, certainly not Mama Cass, who was hefty even in her prime.

She was bitchy and nasty because she had nothing to lose when she wrote the book.

Yeah, the "princess" was not Mama Cass, who was always heavy.

R37, I can vouch for that, too.

And for all of you who are saying Debbie got thin, she didn't. She's been big since the '00s. Here she is with Billie Eilish at the Hollywood Bowl three weeks ago who also seems to be a little, um, roomy around the hips.

Debbie trims down when she wants to...

Well, bitchy or not the overindulged Hollywood crowd needs to be taken down as often as possible. A bunch of narcissistic fools constantly patting themselves on the back.

Wasn’t Debbie once a smack addict, who eventually recovered & got clean & sober?

I believe she even discussed it in a book or some interview.

Yes. Debbie was into heroin. One biography I read claimed that she kicked the habit before Blondie. But their producer Mike Chapman recalled Debbie cocooning herself in that famous H.R. Geiger throne while smacked out of her mind. The Blondie split was a very dark time for Debbie and Chris Stein.

The way I read OP'S original post is that she went over to the boyfriend's house and there were syringes sitting out.

[q] “His date finally arrives, a rock’n’roll princess who was big in the seventies"

Unless the grammar/syntax from the original author were just off.

What are the works? Paintings? Pottery? Vagina capes?

R48, I may be wrong, but I think it means shooting up gear, like rubber tie offs, spoons, mini torches or lighters, vials, syringes, etc.

Basically, an IV drug use kit.

^^what r49 said

It wasn't a good book, IIRC. The tabloids leaked all the "shocking" revelations; all that was left were the whining of a has-been.

You'll Never Make Love was probably a better book.

Priscilla Presley?

Could any of these women be as heavy as Julia intimates and yet be doing heroin?

The guy is the one doing heroin, then?

Heroin is a downer. Look at Phillip Seymore Hoffman. I suppose they could be heavy. He was never skinny.

[quote] The guy is the one doing heroin, then?

Sounds like both would be doing heroin, the guy and the rock "princess."

Julia Phillips (was that the name? Memory figs) was a high flying producer who did burn all her bridges in Hollywood and became a pariah. Hence the title of her book. Hence the cuntitude. Hence the DL adoration.

R19 I read the book years ago and the Goldie Hawn comment is all I remember. It seemed to be an apt description.

She does look a little rough around the edges.

I also only remember the Goldie Hawn bits about the hair and that Goldie asked the author if she wanted to sleep over to cheer her up after a breakup or something. The book was not very good or as salacious as was advertised. I do remember the author came off as a selfish whiny cunt.

Julia Phillips and her husband produced The Sting and go an oscar for it.

Goldie always had, stringy then it was the 70s

Julia had to cut most of the real dirt before she could get it [published. So all the Spielberg drug use stuff was gone.

IIRC Helen reddys' ex husband was the only person who gave his permission to dish the dirt on him.

Ann Wilson was a big ole gal in the 80s.

Ann Wilson is still big.

Norma Desmond was big.

Maybe it's Judy from Punch and Judy and those were blood sausages.

[quote]R19 She said that Goldie Hawn had dirty stringy hair all the time. I really liked that book but the Goldie story is the only one I remember for some reason

She wrote Kathleen Turner is extremely photogenic - almost pug faced in person.

Let’s see… Amy Irving was a sly and manipulative tattletale.

Richard Dreyfus on coke during Close Encounters and at his worst she enjoyed telling him a scene he hadn’t prepared for was suddenly rescheduled for that day. (His alarm ended up giving the scene. a focused fervency.)

Mia Dillon gave her a rose on her first day on set, and Julia thought, “I wished I liked her more.”

Martin Scorsese’s frustration with Cybill Shepherd is so intense every time he calls “Action” for her it sounds like “ACT!”

Warren Beatty wants to do a three way with her and her teen daughter and Julia says, “We’re both too old for you.”

Hmmm… what else…

[quote] Mia Dillon gave her a rose on her first day on set, and Julia thought, “I wished I liked her more.”

Ouch! What a bitch!

Who’s Mia Dillon?

Melinda Dillon

No. Mia Dillon. She's married to Keir Dullea (Gone Tomorrow). Kevin Kline is one of her exes.

[quote]There are works, with blood, discarded carelessly in the sink…”

WTF does this even mean? What are "works"? Is this some drug lingo? Works of art?

Works ...needles to inject oneself with drugs.

[quote]Warren Beatty wants to do a three way with her and her teen daughter

Wow, that's pretty perverted and gross. How arrogant do you have to be to even ask a mother that.

Pretty perverted and gross.

R73 It is obvious she is talking about Melinda Dillion.

Mia played Babe in the Broadway production of "Crimes of the Heart," and got a Tony nom.

[quote]Grace Slick was really a rock 'n' roll princess in the sixties.

Well, technically, it says she was a rock 'n' roll princess AND she was big in the seventies, both of which apply to Grace Slick (Jefferson Starship had major sales in the first half of the 70s).

R79 ...and? She wasn't in Close Encounters.

Julia Phillips was a major druggie herself...its what derailed her career to begin with

Can't be Mia Dillion, the credits don't match up.

Must be,Melinda Dillon.

R81 see R71

White Rabbit is probably the anthem of the 60s. Grace Slick had some pipes. When she was at Woodstock, She wasn't in a studio and still hit that high note at the end of the song. She had an amazing voice.

It’s Anne Wilson. She’s the only one who fits.

I read the book. It was Melinda Dillon, not Mia Dillon.

Yeah, Anne Wilson got gigantic. Never heard she was a huge druggie though.

It's Ann without an E, you fat whores.

I hope Anne didn't introduce her daughter Carny to drugs.

Grace Slick or Ann Wilson

R80 So you can't correct someone without calling them a fat Whore. You really are trash.

Debbie Harry is pleasantly plump these days, so I assume it was her. I didn't know she ever did heroin, but I have read her say that's how Patti Smith looked was so thin all the time. That and Patti had a surprisingly big set of tits for a stick thin junkie.

R85, you might enjoy Pink's version of White Rabbit.

R92 It is an old DL tradition.

I enjoy this version of White Rabbit.

r93...you do realize the book was published in 1991 ?....and the author has been dead for 20 years ?

R97 She got infamously heftier in the mid-80s, so I still think it could be her.

Grace Slick, White Rabbit, 1969 Woodstock.

Sorry Pink doesn't come close Pink sounds voice sounds thin on white Rabbit. Slick is the only person who can pull that song off of all the rock people.

I’ve just started reading Julia Phillips’ book and so far it’s pretty impossible to put down. Sure, this was probably written out of spite and financial gain, but the stories are pretty believable. She’s not shy about admitting what a drugged out mess she was. I’m a huge fan of 70’s Hollywood as well, so there’s that too. I haven’t gotten to anything that is TRULY scathing and unnecessarily mean yet though. I did get a chuckle out of her saying that Erica Jong looks like Miss Piggy. Yes, Erica does/did look like Miss Piggy, as petty or unnecessary Julia’s observation was. Julia wasn’t a stupid woman from what I gather so far. A cunt, perhaps. But not stupid, and a good writer.

Her comments about Goldie aren’t really all that bad - she tells a great story about going to see The Rolling Stones at Madison Square Garden in 1975 with Goldie. She mentions that Bianca had dead eyes and that Ronnie Wood smelled to high heavens. One of the Stones’ hangers-on offers her and Goldie cocaine and they decline, as Julia always had her own stash on hand and always wanted to make it clear that she wasn’t a coke whore.

Now I want to reread that book. It was a fun read.

Does she say anything about Walter Matthau?

R104, only a couple passing comments on Walter Matthau, nothing bad and no stories specifically involving him.

Thanks, r105.

Complained about the width of Cybill Shepard's ass in Mean Streets. White knit fabric is unforgiving, Scorsese was into it. Critiqued Goldie Hawns hygiene. Boasted of making grown men cry, she fired a crew member on one of her film sets. Boasted of starting the trend of using a bottle of water as an accessory in the entertainment industry, the H20 was used to counter her reputation as a huge druggie. While dating Warren Beatty, Madonna sized her up in 2 seconds and dismissed her.

Cybill wasn't in Mean Streets, hon.

If only Madonna sized up Madonna's acting skill and dismissed herself.

Julia was mean, but not witty. Her insults rarely surpassed standard four-letter talk. Her lack of sympathy to those around her was more alarming than anything she says or does.

Did she just have no more fucks left to give? Or was she merely a spiteful cunt

On the edition I have, Anne Rice writes a glowing blurb on the back of the sleeve. Do you think Anne and Julia ever scissored together?

Was Mia Dillon in "Mean Streets"?

The beginning of the memoir tells you what the problem is.

Your parents job is to teach you to love yourself.

This has nothing to do with ignoring or rewarding bad behavior.

Her parents, specifically her father were cold and critical. Phillips boasted of having a cold piercing gaze that she used as one of her weapons, she learned the trick from her dad.

No, she was not in Mean Streets. Julia produced Taxi Driver, not Mean Streets.

You mean she sized up Madonna in 2 seconds and dismissed her...

Phillips seemed to be in awe of Madonnas star power.

She helped produce 3 huge films. Taxi Driver, Close Encounters, and the Sting garnered her and her husband an academy award. I would guess there are a lot of people in Hollywood just like her. She is just more honest about it than most. Hollywood is full of narcissists.

This is her main complaint, r118. Her male colleagues were not held to the same professional standard.

Here is an interview with her after all the fallout from the book. She really is a bitch and doesn't seem to care.

Julia in the hot seat on Phil Donahue

[quote]r71 Who’s Mia Dillon?

[quote]r72 Melinda Dillon

Yes, sorry. I meant Melinda Dillon. She’s kind of an obscure name in my brain, even though she was in the original “Who’s Afraid of Virginia Woolf” which is an amazing credit.

Now I feel obliged to look up and pay repentant homage to the mistakenly referenced Mia Dillon!

“Michael and I combine another West Coast business trip and stop off in Las Vegas to visit Barbra. I bring her a copy of The Exorcist an an Elton John album. I think she should do a cover of ‘Amoreena’….Barbra wants to discuss with Michael the size of her fees. Then she has to go do her show. She smokes a joint onstage. Afterward she asks what we thought of a certain song, and we have to admit we don’t remember it. She tries to sing a couple of bars, but she’s off-key.

‘Funny thing about that’, she muses. ‘I only seem to be able to sing for money…’”

I can’t believe she was so rude to Mia Farrow on the set of Mean Streets. What a bitch!

Calling bullshit on the rock princess anecdote. It’s probably made up like most of this “candid” book. Phony book about phony people.

I forgot about that incident, r124. It does align with Andy Warhol and his diary. Warhol spoke about people who really put Mia down, didn't specify who said what.

Black Magic? Is she talking about Morgan Freeman?

Linda Ronstadt likes Tabasco sauce on her Po’ Boys, but she ain’t no junkie.

I wonder what she meant by "the gay thing" and "the black magic thing"

Closeted actors, dark habits etc.

Inside if me, r3... INSIDE OF ME, sweetie, is a thin person screaming to get out!

Anne Murray, the Sweet Songbird of Spring Hill, Nova Scotia.

Sure OP-- scare all the fat whores on DL half to death by not indicating you were talking about a book!

Phillips did write of having an issue with bulimia.

[quote] Calling bullshit on the rock princess anecdote.

I can believe. Everyday Joes and Janes do intravenous drugs. Why not a rock star with money to burn?

Julia had a strange gait in that clip. Was that drug related?

Remember....key words...rock and roll PRINCESS in the 70s...pretty much everyone listed with the exception of Patty Smith was considered a Queen of rock and roll in the 70s...Ronstadt, Nicks, Wilson...were ALL consistent chart toppers and dominated the 70s...this is referring to someone a tier or 2 down...and possibly younger.

I feel like Ann Wilson always was destined to be a fatty but she kept it under control in the 70’s with diet pills and coke - but heroin?

[quote]Julia had a strange gait in that clip. Was that drug related?

It was related to Cybill Shepherd, Ann Wilson, and Melinda Dillon kicking her skinny ass to the curb.

Julia also says that Francois Truffaut was the biggest prick she ever had to deal with

Maybe Natalie Cole?

Did Natalie Cole ever become a fatty though

Natalie Cole was never rock and roll, either.

It probably wasn't a performer but a girlfriend. Anita Pallenberg is a good guess. Or Nico

Julia accepting her Oscar in Halston

Damn it, you naive people who believe Linda Ronstadt was a squeaky clean teen dream! I had a Christian brochure in the 1970s with damning quotes exposing the immorality of rock’s biggest stars…in their own words! Linda is clearly quoted as chortling that “performing is always better with an armful of smack!”

Stevie Nicks kicked Julia P. in the cuntbone for writing this...and Julia died.

RE129, that whole "Yale thing", I would imagine.

R140, "The biggest prick I ever had to deal with" was Julia Phillips' go-to phrase for "Person not Julia Phillips."

I believe a detractor (Spy Magazine?) counted 20 uses of the word "prick" on one page (or something similar).

R146 Linda Ronstadt was not shooting heroine in the 70s. You are just lying to make a point. She was dating the governor of CA in the 70s. My boyfriend lived two houses from gov Brown and they were not doing heroin

[quote] Julia also says that Francois Truffaut was the biggest prick she ever had to deal with.

When they were negotiating his appearance in the film, he sent her a letter she framed for her office wall. He wrote, [italic]“I remember we met at the Academy awards. You whore a beautiful black dress…”

[Quote] Damn it, you naive people who believe Linda Ronstadt was a squeaky clean teen dream! I had a Christian brochure in the 1970s with damning quotes exposing the immorality of rock’s biggest stars…in their own words! Linda is clearly quoted as chortling that “performing is always better with an armful of smack!”

That was a misquote. She really said: "armful of snacks!"

[quote]Linda Ronstadt *was* my heroine in the '70s.

Fixed.

R150, no, but Linda did coke and I wouldn’t be surprised if Jerry did it too. It was the era, lots of people did coke and it was pretty normalized then. A lot of those people were really skinny and wide eyed. Stevie Nicks is just more honest about it than most.

I don’t think Linda would have done heroin around Jerry Brown, because if it was found out, it would have ruined his career, and she wasn’t going to do that.

Ronstadt was not doing H. Blow sure, but heroin, nope.

Ronstadt's biggest foible was her drive to sleep with as many as her male band members as possible, when not paired up with a steady bf. Supposedly all of the Stone Ponys, and Frey, Henley etc when they briefly served as her backup in the very early 70s. This was always a heavily whispered rumor.

“You’ll Never Eat Lunch”? Bitch stole the title of my autobiography!

All of the above?

If Ronstadt said that about heroin, it sounds like it was a joke. In the 70s if a politician was caught doing any drugs at all they would lose their career when it came to drugs it wasn't as open as things are today.

It's Nico. Warhol called her a fat junkie

She drags her daughter and her slope eye. She's a total DataLounger. My partner met her a few time and did a funny inscription to her book to him. She would come into the production company he worked and to "borrow" paper for her printer and take a few reams with her. Total Broad.

how was she not a lesbian?

Linda Ronstadt has admitted to trying heroin “once or twice” but not liking it. But maybe she was fibbing….

Stevie hasn’t been thin since 1985. Though she was quite slender in the Destiny Rules documentary that was shot around 2003. Mae Whitman should play her in the FM biopic.

Linda Ronstadt was never on heroin. She was from the weed, hash, and cocaine generation. She's also not stupid. I bet she had the best dealers.

Debbie Harry could very well fit but she's an overall petite lady so there's really no way she could have ever been zaftig. Chubby? Yeah.

This is either Stevie Nicks or Ann Wilson. I'm going with Ann Wilson because she's from Seattle and heroin has truly always been a thing there for ages. She also really gained a ton of weight after Heart left rock and roll and went into adult contemporary. Stevie Nicks is very honest and has never spoken of once having been on heroin.

Here is something I remember from her book. She wound up being on crack but would hit the treadmill until she coughed up the screens from her crack pipe. She also had a thing going with a far younger man around this time and they would smoke crack together and she liked what it did to his eyes. He was an actor but she remained coy about him. I wonder who it was because he must have achieved fame by the time her book came out for her to have remained coy.

It was Rodney Harvey.

Marianne Faithfull is another possibility. Famous junkie, hit big in the 70s with 'Broken English'.

Nope. Marianne Faithfull pretty much sat out the 1970s, particularly in terms of relevance. Broken English was 1979, I think. I don't think she was fat in the 1970s or 1980s either.

Nobody knows what drugs Linda Ronstadt did or didn't do, with or without Jerry Brown. You're applying what you think is common sense to a situation. Not everybody plays by the same rules.

I think Dolly Parton and Emmylou Harris know.

I wish Linda had been doing blow when we did the Trio albums…might have sped things along. I had to keep telling her, “Hurry up bitch, I’ve got things to do!”

It has to be Linda Ronstadt. Ann wasn't a "princess" but Linda was definitely one. And Linda dated around the 70s rockers.

[quote]Musical Memoir” signals what Ms. Ronstadt’s book is about, but also what it’s not about — the hedonistic excesses of the pop star’s life. She sidesteps the rampant drug use, though in conversation she acknowledged, “I tried everything,” including cocaine, which she did to such excess that she needed to have her nose cauterized, twice.

Linda wasn't fat in the '80s, though.

Donna Summer, Diana Ross, Gladys Knight, Joan Blondell, Aretha Franklyn, Chaka Khan, Patti LaBelle, Roberta Flack and Tina Tuner.

"Who has been laid by Warren Beatty?", r173?

[quote]R155 Ronstadt's biggest foible was her drive to sleep with as many as her male band members as possible

As one does.

Those sunglasses nicely obscure her piggy nose.

Patti Smith was never fat.

Grace has said that she never did heroin, because she never understood taking a drug that would just make you pass out. She also had a fear of needles. She said not touching heroin is what most likely kept her from being a rock and roll casualty like many of her peers.

I doubt Linda touched it either. Linda has discussed taking coke and speed.

Fun fact, Julia Phillips' son-in-law is a mega Hollywood power player, Modi Wiczyk:

Grace liked booze and coke, she never did heroin.

Heroin wasn't really a big drug in the 60s and 70s. Coke wasn't around much in the 60s. It was weed and psychedelics. Coke was too expensive for most and just not a thing to do. It got really big in the 70s though. I lot of vets from Vietnam came home addicted to heroin.

What were all those Jazz musicians taking?

r181 - that's not true. Heroin has been around since the 1900s

Cherie Currie of The Runaways?

Also acted ('Foxes'), was an LA fixture for a hot minute.....

R183 I know that. What I am saying is that it wasn't that popular in the sixties. And a few self-destructive people got addicted and died like Joplin, and Hendrix, Billie Holliday. Holiday got addicted by one of the musicians in I believe it was Tommy Dorsey's band or one of the big bands. Jazz musicians were into it in the 30s and probably beyond but it was dangerous and a lot of people knew how destructive it was. The 60s were full of psychedelics weed and Hash. But Coke was ubiquitous in the 70s.

Ray Charles... Miles Davis...

Debbie got into heroin in the late 1960s/early 1970s. One of the brunette twins from the Shangri-Las died of a heroin overdose circa 1970.

I can't believe nobody has mentioned Helen Lawson yet! She wasn't a 'rock princess' per se, as her Broadway heyday was much earlier. Still, she had a couple of novelty 'disco/rock' hits, like her ribald cover of Penny McLean's 'Lady Bump' also titled: 'It's lower than that and really swollen!' I know she definitely 'chased the dragon' on more than one occasion.

Now I’m just thinking about Helen Lawson doing Lady Bump

She had a countertenor chorus boy do the shrieks.

Best performance. By a female vocalist. Ever!

[italic]Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaahh!

Rickie Lee Jones was on heroin when she hit it big and was dating Tom Waits. It was hardly a secret.

Here she is at the Grammys, looking............out of it.

Debbie Harry meanwhile, looks stunning and coherent.

Funny, I'm reading this book now as well, for (I think) the first time. I'm mostly skipping through, looking for names.

The book is overly long, to the point where it feels like it’s in small print.

R171...excuse me, but Ronstadt was NOT a rock and roll princess in the 70s...SHE WAS THE QUEEN. Dont believe me, look it up.

Funny how Ronstadt was SO huge back then and hasn't remained all that relevant unlike her contemporaries Ann Wilson and Stevie Nicks.

She's been sick for a long time r196.

It's not surprising. Ronstadt did a lot of hit remakes and the likes of Roy Orbison and Smokey Robinson are bigger figures in music than she is. Ronstadt is realistic about her achievements. Like Cher, she's not really a fan of her own work.

R196 it’s true - she’s was always someone “my parents listened to.” That doesn’t mean she was better or worse but she never had the cross generational appeal (not sure Ann Wilson did either, obviously Stevie did and does).

So were all the good stories already printed? It seemed that way to me so I never read it - I already knew Goldie was hygenically challenged from The Star’s exerpts.

R199 What's "The Star"?

Shes a lot more relative than some of you think...if you ask people who the greatest female singer is, her name always comes up. ALWAYS. Shes been getting major recognition in the past several years...Presidential Medal of Honor, Kennedy Center Honor, Grammy Hall of Fame, Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, etc...the only reason she doesnt register with the younger generations is she branched off later in her career into other styles, then was forced into retirement because she became sick. She was no longer able to appear in public and perform like Nicks, etc...BUT she was and is always relevant to the music world and highly respected.

You still hear old Stevie Nicks/Fleetwood Mac and Heart songs all the time. Not so much Ronstadt. Most people under a certain age are not familiar with her.

r201 well said!

Young girls like that witchy thing Stevie Nicks does. Always thought she was overrated m'self.

Fleetwood Mac and Heart made their own hits. Even "Alone," which was a cover, was not a hit before Heart took it high in the charts.

Ronstadt tried to branch off in to New Wave. No one bit. She even received backlash. I don't think Elvis Costello was especially kind.

R196 Ann Wilson is a fat, forgotten Scientologist princess.

R206 This is a gay site. Like anyone gives a fuck about that boring fuck Elvis Costello.

Julia doesn’t necessarily “badmouth “ every single person that came into her life, but she has something cunty to say about just about everything

r206, dont talk. Mad Love, the album of which youre referring, went Platinum and was her 7th consecutive album to do so. It was not a failure. Her Mexican and Latin albums did the same...as dd her albums of standards with Nelson Riddle...as did her country albums (although most of her albums contained country as well) She might not have been recording Rock and Pop, but she was far from failing and was still topping the charts until she retired...

r210 the point is that she hasn't remained all that relevant in the culture, such as Stevie and Ann have. Most people under 40 aren't all that familiar with her.

[Quote] It was not a failure.

It did not keep her relevant. No one gives a fuck about Linda Ronstadt's version of "Alison."

r212...if it didnt keep her relevant, it wouldnt have gone platinum and been one of her more successful albums...and that album was a lot more than the 3 Costello songs she included in it.

Linda was looking large in the Somewhere Out There music video. Just sayin'.

I actually love both Stevie Nicks and Linda, but Linda had the far superior voice and range and was relevant for at least 3 decades. I'd say that's pretty successful. She was experimental in that she tried so many different genres and sounded stellar in all of them. There's a reason she's been extensively rewarded.

But the person referred to as the rock n roll princess is Anne Wilson.

Mad Love wasn’t a failure or a bomb but the point is is that it’s not regarded as a classic, remembered album by most people.

It did not have staying power. People still associate "I Can't Let Go" with The Hollies, not Ronstadt (even though Evie Sands' version is the best...).

I don't know what cave some DLers live in, but Linda Ronstadt hasn't been relevant in a long time, compared to her contemporaries Stevie Nicks and Ann Wilson, whose music is still played everywhere and who are known to younger generations.

we're not talking about staying power. we're talking about how popular they were in their decades of fame, and Linda was pretty damn popular. She became experimental (see Sting, Clapton, others who decided to branch out). Then she got sick and she couldn't perform anymore, unlike who you named. Also, I'm not aware of any awards Stevie or Anne got (let me know if I'm wrong). She was far more of a talent. Stevie sounds like one of the Chipmunks now. Haven't heard anything current of Anne's. I love Heart as well, but I feel that overall, Linda was a far greater talent. You can keep arguing but i'm not going to change my mind.

Of course, we're talking about staying power. Why else would someone remark about still hearing Fleetwood Mac and Heart on the radio and not Ronstadt?

There was nothing expiremental about doing standards or mexican songs. It's pretty standard for older artists to move into Adult Contemporary, Standards/Cabaret fare etc. Hell, Vikki Carr went Spanish before Linda.

*experimental

you are all plebes who keep ignoring the fact SHE GOT SICK AND COULD NO LONGER PERFORM. And if you listened to other than current pop or hard rock stations, you'd hear her songs. Done w/all of youse. the point of this thread was she was NOT the pop princess, it's Anne Wilson.

R211 Nobody knows who the fuck Ann is. No fucker now remembers Heart. You are fucking tripping balls.

People remember "Alone" much more than "I Don't Know Much."

Ronstadt was on the Simpsons bitches.

Heart's music is still played a lot today. Their 80s stuff is ubiquitous. You can't go to any grocery store in America without hearing These Dreams. I'm in my forties and even for people my age, Ronstadt wasn't much of a presence in our formative years.

So was Charlene Tilton.

Who the fuck is Charlene Tilton?

Patti Smith was never "big." I don't think she would have qualified as a "princess", either. I never heard she ever was into heroin, although she always looked like a junkie.

I never heard Stevie Nicks was into heroin, either. She DID get big, though. I think she lost some of the weight, but is still heavy. She was a major cokehead.

Never heard of Ann Wilson being into heroin either. She was, like Nicks, a cokehead. And she was ALWAYS big, even from the early days of heart. She became REALLY big later.

I never heard Linda Ronstadt was into junk, either. I suppose she was into coke like everybody else then. And she wasn't very big in the 80s.

Deborah Harry was a junkie for a while. But I don't think she was heavy in the 80s. I seem to recall she still had her figure.

Ricky Lee Jones is a distinct possibility. She was quite a sloppy druggie and she WAS a heroin addict. I remember accepting a Grammy award stoned out of her gourd.

*

Check out Debbie's "French Kissin' In The USA" video. She is shot like she's Ann Wilson.

Rickie Lee Jones was never gigantic.

Anne Wilson was NOT always big. When they started out, she was pretty fit for quite a bit. She got BIG (as in fat) in the 80s.

Nancy Wilson changed even more. She was black in the 1960s.

Chuck E. was gigantic.

Ann Wilson is a fat cunt forgotten pile of shot. Everyone believes this....except for this silly Jew.

I LOVED Chuck E. I listened to it and even sang in front of a house party of over 60 people to one of her songs at the age of 12 with a band. She's definitely in my youth music rotation.

R227 Oh, imagine, going to a grocery store.....

r239 it's just a fact that Linda Ronstadt hasn't retained much cultural relevance. I know many eldergays are stuck in the past and have no idea about current society, but it's true.

Who gives one single rat's ass about "current society," r240, particularly in the realm of popular music. I'm gonna go listen to this album and continue not giving a fuck about Linda's cultural relevance to twats like you.

R240 Oh fuck right off. Wilson is nothing.

r241 is all "get off my lawn!"

The whole point of this discussion is that Ronstadt has really faded when it comes to the general public.

Her light touch in this song....golden.

I never bought a single Heart record, even though I bought everything by Linda, FM, and a few of Rickie Lee Jones albums, back in the '70s and '80s. The Wilson sound bored me.

Who cares, r243?

r241 yes!

How about this?! Wildly popular.

Or this?

How about this?

Who can forget Anne Wilson, with her amazing turn on Broadway as Edna Turnblad. After her amazing career with huge rock band Heart, her work on stage made sure, we would never forget her.

This one? Pretty sure most people have heard this standard.

Here's one of my favorites, "Gainesville," from Randy Newman's Faust.

And even though YOU might not think it's culturally relevant...here's a song from an entire album she knocked out of the park of 40's, 50s hits.

Adore.

And here's Hasten down the Wind, my favorite album of all time.

Only on DL could there be a Linda Ronstadt Stan. God bless you for keeping her memory alive 😂

Or this one. You're No Good.

There are at least two of us.

"cultural relevancy" is subjective. you have absolutely NO WAY of understanding (obviously) how musicians influence other musicians.

r259 everybody agrees with that. The point was that Ronstadt's popularity has faded. No arguing that.

of course it did r260. she was unable to perform much after her illness was diagnosed (I think mid 90s?). How would she maintain popularity without promoting her hits or putting out new hits.

it's sad that today's younger generation don't foray out into older rock (a la Pink Floyd, Paul McCartney, so many others). If you think the mark of a musician is radio play, that's very misguided.

Aren't the younger generations always the ones that tell us we should listen to *this* current hit.

How about this one? Or any other grunge 90s rock bands? If you stay with only the most recent shit, then you're not very learned in your understanding of music as a whole.

r261 most of us here on DL have a wide range of musical tastes, going back decades. What was mentioned is that Ronstadt is not really relevant to current mainstream audiences. You seem to be unable to grasp this.

[quote] If you stay with only the most recent shit, then you're not very learned in your understanding of music as a whole.

Again, nobody has presented that in this thread. You're really all over the place.

No, r262. What's going on is that you are the only poster to whom Linda's lack of relevance to the current mainstream matters, as you keep telling us, and telling us, and telling us, and telling us, and telling us, and telling us.

Put down the bottle and the OCD pipe and go to bed. Listen to this irrelevancy:

r263 there have been a multitude of hits that demo'ed how she's a force of rock and roll. ^^See above, idiot.

r264 others have said it too. That was the whole point. You are in denial. Nobody said she wasn't respected among her peers.

r264 that's a good example of why Linda's relevancy faded. She did covers that were already by major artists and were very well-known. She was never going to have the definitive versions. Dedicated To the One I Love, for example, is always associated with the Mamas and the Papas.

That was an album for children, r267. She wasn't trying for anything new.

I remember Julia Philips doing the talk shows rounds in the early 1990s. Her dyke spike hair was terrible. She revealed the same 3 things on every Sally, Geraldo , Oprah. 1. She and her ex husband won the oscar for producing The Sting. 2. She got fired and then blacklisted for being a coked out mess on Close Encounters and hit bottom. 3. She was surprised he career didn't pick back up when she got clean and complains of the old boss club. Her celeb reveals were few.

Still r268 most of her covers were already famous songs by famous artists. She was never going to have the definitive versions.

T think she was talking about Debbie Harry or possibly Cindy Lauper. she might have been being very sarcastic about the "fat rock princess" but it certainly wasn't Linda Ronstadt.

R208 So say we all.

She wrote that Richard Dreyfuss went on and on at a party about how great "hate fucking" was, humping the air while miming slapping his partner while saying "I hate you, I hate you."

Julia wrote "I laughed, but in my mind he went from a maybe to a never."

maybe she was talking about Prince calling him the princess. I am sure prince did heroin.

R273, that's a funny line.

It's even funnier when you consider that Julia Phillips was no one's idea of a sex bomb.

Linda Ronstadt absolutely gained weight in the 1980s. I'd been a big fan of hers when I was a kid in the 1970s, but by the time I was a teen in the 1980s, you didn't hear about her much except for tabloid comments about her weight. I remember someone on a bitchy daytime show saying she was doing "Mexican Songs" so she could wear clothes that hid the weight gain.

Her relevance today has no bearing on whether she was the person in the book's blind item or not, so I don't know why someone spent hours saying over and over again that no one remembers her anymore. I doubt she's the princess in the blind.

I also don't know what the "works" with "blood" means.

In the '70s, she was cute, young, and an Oscar-winning producer. There were a lot of men who wanted to hit that.

Isn't Julia Phillips the one to first whisper there was some sort of threesome/ sex slave thing going on between Steven Spielberg, George Lucas, and Harrison Ford with Ford being the slave? Isn't she where the "South Park" guys got the idea?

[quote]There are works, with blood, discarded carelessly in the sink…

I checked on Google Books and there are no results in the book for this phrase, so OP is going to need to come back and explain this.

I loved Linda’s What’s New album. But I think the pop princess shooting H was Debbie Harry, who looked Zaftig by the mid 80s pre-facelift

Google Books lied to me, I guess. I got the entire excerpt. I don't know what "works" means here. Drug paraphernalia, I guess.

[quote]I am meeting Holly [Knight]. She is already there. Next to us, at Peter’s [Morton's] table, a guy waits patiently for his date to arrive. Nibbles at bread. Sips at a Perrier. He waits a long time. His date finally arrives, a rock ’n’ roll princess who was big in the seventies and now is just big. Gigantic.

[quote]She alights at the table for a millisecond, then heads for the ladies’ room. Both Holly and I need to pee, but this woman is a famous junkie and neither one of us wants to take a chance on finding her dead in the bathroom. We keep shooting odds and evens until she returns to the table. I win. There are works, with blood, discarded carelessly in the sink . . .

A memory from first read of the book, back in the day: when someone asked her kid “what’s your mom doing now?” she replied “mom does ‘base” (freebase). She may have won that producing Oscar but obviously missed out on the Mother of the Year Award.

Debbie had gained weight in 1985 when this took place but was never "gigantic."

Just One Look got a bump in popularity after it was used in a Ryan Gosling movie, or was it Joseph Gordon Levitt? Anyway, it was the Doris Troy original, of course. Not Linda's cover.

It's an odd world where liking Linda Ronstadt evidently means that Ann Wilson MUST DIE.

Room on the airwaves (if not, perhaps, an elevator) for both.

Phillips was so gross and sleazy.

After you read the book, the person you end up hating the most is the author. Her toxicity and obliviousness to her complete lack of talent ooze out of every page.

As r281 notes in the quote from the book....the princess WAS A FAMOUS JUNKIE...i.e....well known. And as stated above, Ronstadt wasnt a rock and roll princess in the 70s...SHE WAS THE QUEEN.

I'm not saying it was Ronstadt that Phillips was talking about, but I distinctly remember that she had gained weight after the Trio album had been released. When Canciones de mi Padre was released at the end of '87, the review in Rolling Stone made mention of how fat she had gotten. The reviewer said of Linda's album cover photo that "she looked as though she had been nibbling on too much guacamole." I think it was the first time I had ever noticed someone's weight brought up in a music review.

You never read a review of Mama Cass'?

Funny, she doesnt look fat on the cover...

It was a review of Mas Canciones.

Again, she doesnt look fat in that picture,

She has a double chin in that pic, hon.

This paragraph from the article at r292, pretty much sums up why Ronstadt is relevant...

:So when Canciones came out, he was clueless about Linda Ronstadt’s career – as far as he was concerned she was from Tucson, her Dad owned the local hardware store and that was good enough to buy the album. But the rest of the nation knew Linda as a rock superstar who was on the cover of Rolling Stone. The rest of the nation listened to Canciones because Linda was rock royalty and her opinion on music, even strange music in another language, mattered."

Youre high r294

[quote]This paragraph from the article at [R292], pretty much sums up why Ronstadt is relevant...

She was once, but not anymore.

I can't believe you guys woke up this morning and came running here first thing to start the Ronstadt shit back up again.

Linda was too multi format to ever be rock royalty.

Yes, Rolling Stone did say she looked like she'd been "nibbling at the guacamole." Good memory. She doesn't even look large on the cover photo, but the jokes were still out there.

[quote] You never read a review of Mama Cass'?

No. Mama Cass was before my time.

r298 have you tried the guacamole?

Yeah, R300, I don't know why that's stayed with me for so many years. I never even heard the album. But I read Rolling Stone voraciously starting in the early-mid 80s for the next 10-15 years, and that line has always stuck in my head.

For what it's worth, there are several mentions online of Debbie being at the Hard Rock Cafe with Peter Morton (owner), I couldn't find photos of them together but it's possible she was the "princess" since she was seated at Morton's table. I never would have called her "gigantic," though maybe Phillips is just an enormous cunt who thinks weighing 127 lbs is "gigantic."

I think from the early nineties onward, all of Linda Ronstadt’s album covers pretty much featured her face only. She must have been very self conscious about the weight gain.

Ann Wilson was never a junkie or a princess. These Dreams and Alone are classic, timeless singles. I also hear Ann and the Loverboy guy's Almost Paradise at my supermarket all the time! What About Love, Never, Nothing at All, Who Will You Run To, There's the Girl, Stranded, Will You Be There (in the Morning)...all great singles! ❤

R283 That would be gigantic in Hollywood terms.

The Richard Dreyfuss line made me laugh.

I'd actually still do him, at least back then. And I can picture him acting out what Julia describes.

Wasn't DH joined at the hip to her band mate anf bf Chris at that time? They were both junkies then. Why would she be dating the guy mentioned in the book? Junkies are lay-abouts. Rarely get out of the house.

Chris Stein was seriously ill for a few years. Debbie was probably very happy to get out of the apartment.

I have the book, read it long ago, and enjoyed it.

Was Michelle Phillips ever fat? She was more of a princess and slept with half of the men in Hollywood.

I'm thinking whoever the junkie bitch was, she was "gigantic" by LA/Hollywood standards, which would mean a size 8.

Reading the book, you totally understand why Julia Phillips was ostracized. She was a horrible, rancid person.

Yeah, and the book is LA centric, isn't it? Debby Harry is New York.

I think this princess is/was LA based.

I read some of the book because of this thread and my goodness, Julia Phillips is just a terrible human being. She's mean to everyone for no reason, including people she apparently considers friends. I don't know how you could hang around her for long.

There were two examples in the few bits I read of her going up to groups or tables and making some mean joke and apparently no one thinking she was funny, so she would slink off. I figure that must have happened to her a lot.

I wonder if anyone ever told Julia to blow it out her ass.

Oh damn, could it be Olivia Newton John? If ever there was a rock princess....

No way.

Her comments about having overly critical parents make me totally forgive her cuntiness. It’s true. If you’re trained to alway think critically, that applies to people as well. And then schools - back then - were big on “critical thinking” so it was considered “intelligence”. The book reflects critical thinking about her life and Hollywood - which is what makes it a good book. Arguably, every good writer is a critical thinker - it’s what allows them to analyze situations and people for underlying motivation and logic. Julia also applied critical thinking to herself - so at least she was consistent.

Olivia never touched drugs.

R321, you believe "critical thinking" means "always being critical of everything all the time"?

It appears that they do, r323. They seem to take the term quite literally.

It wasn't 'critical thinking,' she was just a mean, nasty cunt. Nobody could stand her.

[Quote]Olivia never touched drugs.

ONJ was not the angel most believe. Kudos to her for maintaining a life long good girl image. In fact she was more interesting than her public image.

She did drugs in the 70s disco scene like the rest. She was a regular at fab gay parties, she pursued the ladies and she took quaaludes like everybody else.

Never heard anything about Olivia and drugs. Certainly not heroin.

Besides Sandahl Bergman, who did Olivia pursue?

I think Olivia was gigantic only once, when she was pregnant....

Large Livvy.

Critical thinking is the ability to balance subjective interpretation with objective analysis.

It doesn't mean referring to every fucking person you meet as "a prick".

Julia's book suggests one of two things:

Hollywood is unbearably toxic - in which case, she should have left it.

Conversely, she's simply an unpleasant, hypercritical, neurotic and selfish person with a toxic personality, poor self-control and countless anger management issues.

The third option - why not both? is a distinct possibility.

This is the woman who railed against her peers for letting quality of films slip - and her last project produced was "Don't Tell Mom the Babysitter's Dead."

Isn't gigantic in Hollywood just one dress size up?

Reading this book set me off reading a few other gossipy Hollywood tomes - Hollywood Wives, Hollywood Husbands, Shirley Maclaine's books and biographies of Garbo, Cary Grant and autobio of Kate Hepburn which I loved and still have.

Check out David Niven's books.

I like the YouTube comment:

[quote]Class, pay attention. This is a voice. This is what a singer is.

Linda's high notes had to be boosted when she did Pirates of Penzance, but stans will talk about how she conquered opera (well, operetta).

She didn't *quite* conquer *opera*, r336...

No, the arrangement was adapted to give her even higher notes to finish on. And how would one “boost” a live voice, onstage, in 1980 Central Park?

Fuck off haters. Whats wrong, upset because she could sing and Beyonce cant ?

She was amplified, hon r338.

Beyonce chante?

And so is everyone else, hon...youre point ?

They had to boost her high notes and they did so via (extra) amplification, you dolt.

[quote]R340 She was amplified, hon

So? PIRATES wasn’t the first musical to be amplified. Good Lord.

You're such an idiot. They had to turn up Rodstadt's mic for her highest notes. That is not standard. How dopey can you be.

The Washington Post (1980)

[italic] “She sings her part beautifully, revealing a techinical virtuosity and high range that haven't often been heard in her records. Sure, she could put a little more life into her dialogue; but since there are only about six lines of it, who cares?”

I know she didn't fare well with Boheme, but I still give her credit for attempting it and for doing Pirates. Linda Ronstadt was about her voice...her *sound*. It doesn't work as well in some genres, but at least she tried to shake her career up a bit.

At least she tried is such a lame comment. These weren't community theatre productions.

R337 I'm laughing and feeling sorry for her at the same time. Thanks.

How quaint r348...is that where you get your opinions ? Ronstadt is known as an immaculate singer. She doesnt need enhancements. Obviously you have a grudge to bear. You know thats parody, right ?

r337 The recording quality is all I didn't like about David Carroll and Linda singing "Che Gelida Manina" and "Mi Chiamano Mimi"? As it happened, his voice was harder for me to listen to than hers. Also, it was sad to listen to for reasons having nothing to do with Linda or her proficiency as an opera singer.

David Carroll played a doctor on Another World, one Marley went to to see if she could have children IIRC. He was a lovely gay man, and he died not long after, in 1992.

Anyway, thanks for sharing that with us, regardless of your motivation in doing so.

Give it up, r350. Linda couldn't sing the part without major help. That's what they're parodying.

[quote] Linda Ronstadt was about her voice...her *sound*. It doesn't work as well in some genres, but at least she tried to shake her career up a bit.

It’s interesting she never considered herself a rock singer, but a balladeer. It was always hard to find the uptempo songs for her albums… she only cared about the slow ones, and felt those were her strength.

Her autobiography is really good. She talks more about music than relationships and scandal, etc.

[quote]It’s interesting she never considered herself a rock singer, but a balladeer.

She really didn't have a rock voice, r353. The purity of her sound really was her strength.

"She has the best white pipes in the business."

Crazy that there is a Linda Ronstadt stan. It's like looking out my window and seeing a brontosaurus on my lawn.

I googled who was considered a rock princess from the 70s or 80s and the answer was Lisa Marie Presley.

^^She was a kid at the time this incident took place.

It was Amy Grant.

Mama Cass

Mama Cass died in the early 70s. What about Courtney Love

Mackenzie Phillips had a band from the 80s until the 90s called the new mamas and papas but she was never fat as far as I know. I get the feeling that the Rock Princess reference was a play on word.

The book also says she was a well known junkie...so theres that.

Tanya Tucker had a rock album or two, right?

Courtney Love would have been the '90s, so the time frame is not right.

Or maybe Julia just made it up.

It was probably someone who had one or two hits and the media gave them attention...and then they fizzled and disappeared.

Well known junkie to whom?

Laurel Canyon was the place to be if you were a musician in the 60s and 70s and living in LA.

Some ancient queen in the Palm Springs Dog Park can quickly solve this mystery.

I've stopped trying

Love was a singer in the 80s Julia's freebasing days were around 85 or so. the first I heard about anyone freebasing was around 1984. One of my best friends got addicted to it then and destroyed his life. from google: It is known that Courtney Love was one of the original singers of Faith No More in the early 80s. Her run with the band was short, until singer Chuck Mosley joined the band. It is reported that Mosley joined in 1983, but the video of Courtney Love is reported to be from 1984

[quote] Rickie Lee Jones was never gigantic.

Her first album was a huge hit. I don't know how well her second album did commercially but Rolling Stone called it "a classic." So she was quite a success for a while. But she was heavily into drink and rugs and always seemed like an idiot. One critic who saw one of her shows said it was excruciating; she was rubbing up against members of the band and told the audience she might incorporate stripping into her act. The critic was grossed out but held out hope that things might improve, muttering "Maybe she'll be able to pull it off." Which prompted someone else to say. "The show or her dress?"

Gigantic as in Great Big Fat Person.

[quote]ONJ was not the angel most believe. Kudos to her for maintaining a life long good girl image. In fact she was more interesting than her public image.

The only gossip I've heard concerning Olivia is sex related. Never heard a thing about her indulging in drugs. Olivia was very kinky and supposedly had kinky parties when she was with Matt. Like that movie The Ice Storm.

I thought of Etta James. She was a junkie in the 70s and she certainly got GIGANTIC.

But rock princess? More blues queen I would say. Plus she liked the ladies so why date a guy?

I don't remember Oliver ever getting fat though

Who scissored with Etta?

Ann Wilson was always a big girl. Never slim. But her weight didn't get out of control until later on. Poor girl, she got the "fat gene" in her family. Nancy got the thin gene.

Ronnie Spector?

Not until the 1990s.

If you Google “Debbie Harry heroin” - you get numerous articles where Debbie talks about her heroin use. She used and I’m sure everyone who associated/partied with her knew that…

If the story is even true - it’s Debbie

A lot of them were junkies plus as posted above Debbie Harry was in New York. This is an LA story.

Lydia Pense?

If we were in Vegas and I had to place a bet my money would be on Stevie Nicks.

But I do appreciate the imagery of a strung out ONJ nodding off on a toilet in a gas station.

[quote]R354 She really didn't have a rock voice

Ronstadt would agree with you. But in her era she was often referred to as “The Queen of Rock” and she felt that title was misplaced.

[quote] But I do appreciate the imagery of a strung out ONJ nodding off on a toilet in a gas station.

It would explain Chloe.

[quote]r371 But she was heavily into drink and rugs

Sounds like one of our Tasteful Friends?

Maria Muldaur?

IMO, Linda Ronstadt was dieted way down in the '70s and early '80s. It didn't look natural. I won't say that there was a fat person waiting to emerge, though.

R321 clearly you were homeschooled.

Julia Phillips used the word 'recalcitrant' in one of her books to describe an angry, coked out Glenn Frey at a business meeting. First time I saw that word, I had to look it up. I now use it frequently, and impress others when I do.

I looked up recalcitrant in the dictionary and found Julia's picture.

I love how the thread became a weird wormhole into the life and times of Linda Ronstadt.

Gotta love DL.

Julia must be irritated as hell. From hell. Probably high too.

Mama Cass died in 1974 and Debbie Harry did heroin before Blondie became famous.

Linda Ronstadt and Stevie Nicks loved their cocaine.

I can't picture either of the Wilson Sisters shooting up.

Patti Smith? Pills and coke.

Debbie was known solely as a punk rock performer back then and ‘punk princess’ would have been her likely title in this context. That plus her aforementioned east coast base versus the book’s west coast material source should rule her out as a candidate for the answer to OPs question.

[quote] And how would one “boost” a live voice, onstage, in 1980 Central Park?

Elton John used a new microphone that could boost and add echo tones to his voice in the late 1970s, you can hear it on the live version of "Feel Like a Bullet" from 1977.

The incident, if it happened, would have been in about 1985, because she ran into Spielberg at the same place that she saw the "princess junkie" and it lead to a meeting with him a few weeks later. She supposedly "accidentally" apologized to him and that year got a Christmas card from him with Max on it, who was still a baby. That would make it 85 or 86.

Bonni Bramlett? She was hardly a princess type though.

Nicolette Larson? Not sure she ever got 'fat' - but she made the Hollywood rounds.

Melanie???

Genevieve Waite?

[quote]ONJ was not the angel most believe.

Correct, she was a teen ager and was sleeping with the 35 year old host of the show she was on in Australia. She and Pat Farrar came to England and they used to sing in strip clubs.

Later she was engaged to a French singer, who was married and her record team told her to dump him or the bad rep would ruin her career, so she did. Then she got engaged to Bruce Welch, broke his heart and he killed himself.

The she used Lee Kramer as her beard for the 70s, whilst she scissored with Helen Reddy, amongst others.

She used to call her best friend Karen Carpenter fat and gave her anorexia, which she also did with her own daughter, with the same result.

Then she married, fellow gay Matt Lattanzi, who was hot for fifteen minutes, who lost his hair and got fat. Then she had her second husband pushed off a boat.

She is a clusterfuck but hid it well.

[Quote] Then she got engaged to Bruce Welch, broke his heart and he killed himself.

News to me.

Let's hear more about the key parties.

Later in life, Stevie Nicks was addicted to Klonopin.

"Klonopin (Clonazepam) was worse than the cocaine," she has said. "I lost those 8 years of my life. I didn't write, and I had gained so much weight."

One weird thing I remember from Julia Phillip's book is how she tried to convince Robert Redford that he should do a movie (The Way We Were?) with Barbra Streisand. Redford didn't want to and was all snotty ("it's like she's not even from my generation"), then admitted he'd never seen her act in a movie. Phillip's suggested he see The Owl and the Pussycat which was out at the time. He claims he did and was not impressed (I don't think he saw it.)

Years later when Streisand and Redford appeared on an Oprah show together, he said the film would only have worked if Streisand was willing to get down and do the role seriously. Streisand looked very confused when he said that. Guess Bobby thought Babs was a singer who waltzed through musicals, and probably knew her singing from hearing "People" on the radio once in 1964.

Redford was always an insufferable narcissist...he just couldnt deal working with another one and having the attention not be on him.

In terms of a talent contest between Redford and Streisand? Babs wins by a county mile. And I don't even like her.

Babs was known as a zany comedienne. That's what Redford was referencing.

No, she wasnt

No, Redford was just being a snobby asshole.

Full props to him for his political beliefs and support of small films, but as a person, he is an uninteresting, untalented douche.

Redford was very handsome as a young man, and that's pretty much the only thing I can say for him. I always found him bland and charmless, like a Ken doll brought *almost* to life.

Very good-looking people very often don't bother to grow a personality.

Whoever the rock princess is/was she appeared at the Troubadour club in West Hollywood. It was musicians central. If you were anybody you performed there and other musicians packed the audience.

I recall reading John Lennon was booted out one night for heckling a performer, a big name I've forgotten.

Judee Sill?

But the troubadour only had 2nd tier musicians. Bands like the Doors etc.

Some of these guesses....🤦🏻‍♂️

R406, Streisand was known in 1970-71 for being a singer, a Broadway musical star, and an actress in couple of movie musicals. Where does the "zany comedienne" shit come from?

[quote]Where does the "zany comedienne" shit come from?

From her I Love Babs TV series, r415?

[Quote] Where does the "zany comedienne" shit come from?

[quote]Very good-looking people very often don't bother to grow a personality.

In person, Robert Redford is not "very good looking." He's short, over bleached, has bad skin and is covered in freckles.

R417 - nice try, Robert.

Streisand stole every single scene she and Redford were in. He was a dullard compared to her. I'm sure that didn't sit too well with him.

I dunno, r419, Redford in the navy uniform was pretty upstaging IMHO.

I never got the appeal of Redford. I could always see the craters underneath the gallons of slap.

Redford had his season. However in my mind he has to be 6 ft tall to fulfill the fantasy. He isn't and that's a big boner killer. Just a pipsqueak with a hooked nose and floppy hair.

He is 5'10". Not that short. But he isn't so good-looking without makeup. Red hair and freckles. Not my favorite look.

So, who was the fat junkie?

John Belushi

Jack Lemmon *stole* the Oscar from Robert Redford! 🤬🖕😡

Lemmon stole MY Oscar too!

d&b

Patti Smith was NEVER "gigantic" so it definitely wasn't her.

I'm disappointed to see so many posters who don't know what "the works" means. I never used heroin but I hung out with musicians when I was young and that's how they talked. Maybe not anymore?

I thought "give you the works" meant a full service.

“Gigantic” in the 70’s or 80’s would be like a ladies’ size 6 or 8 now.

Totie Fields was an 8?

The "works" could be regional slang. But, yeah, surprised that there have been so many questions on this thread as to what the "works" are.

For the record, it's intravenous drug use paraphernalia.

Redford looked fifty years old in the high school and college scenes of The Way We Were.

It is Stevie Nicks. Next...

It's Norma fuckin' Zimmer.

I thought "the works" was common knowledge. I knew right away what it meant.

Works = needle, spoon, lighter.

Tea for Two

R43 Totie would probably be a 12 or 14 in today's women's sizes.

Totie or Tootie?

[quote] Works = needle, spoon, lighter.

Plus whatever you need to tie up your vein.

Julia lived in Benedict Canyon. Her home has since been razed. She was very angry and very smart.

R327 Olivia did supply backing vocals to her friend James Reyne's song 'Hammerhead', which is a song about a hardcore heroin addiction. Perhaps did have some exposure. Her vocals are actually quite chilling if you know what the meaning of the song is about.

What's become of Julia's daughter? She must be close to 40 now if not pulling it on a chain.

Julia’s daughter is married to some rich media mogul if I’m not mistaken

The mogul husband is namechecked upthread. Polish name or something.

Modi Wiczyk, well-regarded head of Media Rights Capital.

Mo D Wick Zick?

Definition of "works":

Plastic bottle cap, Q-tip/ cotton swab, hypodermic needle. 'The Works” is considered drug paraphernalia. Used together with a spoon, water and a lighter, they prepare powder heroin to go through a filtration system using (cotton swab or ball).

[quote] Works = needle, spoon, lighter.

You also need something to tie your arm off with… unless you’ve moved on to shooting drugs between your toes. (Does that work? Don’t you need a vein?)

Was it Miss Ross??

(unaltered security footage)

[quote]What's become of Julia's daughter? She must be close to 40 now if not pulling it on a chain.

Bitch she would be closer to 60 now.

This was a LONG fucking time ago.

Son what happened? Was Julia Philips ever able to eat lunch again? Or just dinner?

Julia's daughter Kate looks like Michael Phillips (the father). Kate's husband, Modi, was cute when he was younger.

I like how many posters here keep saying so and so was never fat as if that even actually matters when you consider that in 1980s Los Angeles fat could've been anything over 107 and more importantly that Julia was a rabid cunt and she's probably full of shit.

[quote]For the record, it's intravenous drug use paraphernalia.

We figured that out two days ago, but because no one reads threads, we now have a whole slew of posts explaining it yet again.

I WAS a musician in the 1980s and I never heard anyone call paraphernalia "works." "Tools" sometimes or "glass" depending on what it was, but usually vague terms like "my case" or "the stuff."

You can't find her daughter Kate's age online, r446, but a 1991 Entertainment Weekly article says she'd just gotten accepted to university, meaning she must have been born about 1972.

[quote]Streisand stole every single scene she and Redford were in. He was a dullard compared to her. I'm sure that didn't sit too well with him.

The Way We Were was the movie that turned Redford into a mega star and sex symbol because it's the one women went to. That's the role where he played the romantic lead, which was rare. Redford claims he only saw it 25 years later, but I'm sure he appreciated the increase in fees and the advantages that big fame gave him from 1973 on. Btw, he just looooves Babs now, and claims he looooved working with her.

R457 = David Ehrenstein

R454 - I think Kate Phillips-Wiczyk was born in 1972. The same year as Gwyneth Paltrow Paltrow. Julia Philips and Blyth Danner were "sorta" friends.

I love the scene where Julia makes Blythe cry.

If they had a movie out of You’ll Never Eat Lunch in 1992, who could play Julia?

In the Phil Donahue clip posted above, she is asked this question and she implies that Debra Winger may have already been suggested to her. If Debra gave herself that short grey dyke hair, I could totally see that.

Re: R463, they're at a party and Julia says Blythe is always kind of "oh you big strong man could you do this for me I don't know how." Some hippie is talking about getting their birth chart done and Blythe says she can't do hers because her mother could never remember whether she was born in the morning or evening. Julia's friend wonders aloud "What kind of mother ... ?" and Julia responds "Blythe's mother,*" which makes Blythe burst into tears and run out of the room.

*Proving that cuntitude has lasted for at least four generations.

[quote]Was Michelle Phillips ever fat? She was more of a princess and slept with half of the men in Hollywood.

Julia liked Michelle, though. The night she won the Oscar, Michelle was at her house party and danced around her in celebration.

Julia had massive hang-ups about her own weight. So maybe what she considered "big" would probably not be big in 2022 America.

It was Sue Mengers.

Michelle Phillips didn't get fat or gain weight until she was much older. I saw her in the 90s on different talk shows and she wasn't ever fat. She had a great figure.

I think that "princess" only applies to Stevie.

R380 Back in the 80s rumors circulated. I had heard that Debbie was so strung out on heroin she couldn't make it to the bathroom so she took a shit in the sink.

Times were rought for Debbie, especially in the 1990s. She was doing the down and out diva thing of singing over her old records at gay clubs.

*rough

Julia's daughter was born in 1973 and went to U Michigan and NYU Law.

And she can't get a decent dye job to save her life.