The Battle Over Gender Therapy

The article link should be free, they've opened it to non-subscribers:

Emily's Twitter thread summarizing some of the article:

I’m so sick of these posts. Every other post is about trans. It’s so fucking ridiculous.

IDGAF what anyone wants to do with their own bodies, and I don’t understand why anyone else here does, either.

Get over it!

It is an excellent article dealing with trans people in a serious way. There, were no issues with trans adults but children getting puberty blockers does have negative side effects.

Teen girls especially seem very stressed out and dealing with many gender issues. Much more than boys.

R3, this is genuinely harmful to little gay kids.

You can't trans the gay away. Many parents would like to.

IDGAF what anyone wants to do with their own children, and I don’t understand why anyone else here does, either.

R6 did you read the article?

R3 this is a long form article in the NY Times Magazine, it's being discussed all over the place, and it has special relevance here given its material. Give it a read!

[quote] IDGAF what anyone wants to do with their own bodies, and I don’t understand why anyone else here does, either.

R3 R6 It's led to the exploitation/abuse of children by their parents and medical professionals. Because kids are far too easily influenced. You don't give a fuck. Others do.

"IDGAF what anyone wants to do with their own bodies"

IDGAF what well-informed adults do to their bodies, but I DO GAF what happens to gay and non-gender-conforming kids, and I DO GAF about medical malpractice.

And right now, gay and non-gender-conforming kids are being made the victims of medical malpractice, they are definitely not being told that the medical transition process will never do what they hope it will do, it will never really change their sex, how they're perceived by others, or make all their troubles go away. That's why there needs to be pre-transition counseling and lots of it, so that absolutely everyone who transitions is aware of just how little change is possible.

[quote] That's why there needs to be psychological counseling and lots of it. So that absolutely everyone who believes humans can "transition" are aware that humans remain as they were born and that no biological change is possible..

R11 " psychological counseling" is seen as trans conversion therapy, that is trying to talk possible trans people, usually young teens, out of their transness. Here in Ireland the Irish government is going to ban such conversion therapy. Affirmation all the way.

R12 "Affirmation" of what? That humans can "transition", become something other than what they were born? That's the Irish "solution"? Banning reason and common sense?

R12, a failure to explain the risks and benefits of any possible medical procedure, and to explain exactly what it can and cannot do for a person, is considered medical malpractice.

In any field except transitioning.

R13 Certainly not just the Irish solution. It's in Scotland and I think England too. Some European countries have begin to question it (finally)

R14 I agree. But the Trans/Gender Ideology lobby says otherwise. And for now they seem to have the ear of mainstream media and the government. ANY questions, any discussion is now posited as an attack on a trans persons very existence.

So, affirmation it is. There is a ever growing mountain of byers remorse on the horizon....

Yes, I know I spelt buyers wrong...

Once again it's the British and now Irish who are letting this happen. is it any wonder?

Uh, this is mostly all coming from the US, r17. The English are now actually pushing back against it, after going along with it for years. Canada and Scotland and Ireland are pushing it to the extremes. World wide standards bodies are fully captured - it's unacceptable to publish anything but glowing praise. Scientific research can't be conducted in a situation like this. Scientists and organizations are not doing research because they are afraid of what it might find, and they fear it being used against gender believers. This is what they've actually said!

This article, for example, is pretty evenly done, even leaning in favor of "affirming care" more than many would like. But because it isn't 100% agreeing with the current stance of the gender lobby, it's being pilloried as "causing harm and literally killing people" on Twitter and reddit.

The usual suspects have already posted Twitter threads about it, trying to nitpick about parts of the article, obfuscating and when they can't do that, just ignoring it or lying about it. They tell their followers "don't read the article!!" which most wouldn't anyway because it's a long form piece, and thus the members of the gender movement are insulated from anything from "outside" that might cause them to pause.

R12, no one has to be talked out of being transgender or at a particular moment in time wanting to try different ways of dressing and socially interacting. The issue in question is the medical treatment and whether saying it prevents suicide tells the whole story. Some people were suicidal and depressed long before identifying as transgender and just want to change themselves, even though the depression doesn’t have a hormone based origin and won’t be helped by hormones. If you looked up symptoms of cancer and decided to take chemotherapy because you thought you might have cancer, and you didn’t, well chemotherapy has harmful side effects. Why not let the doctor screen for cancer first? Or let whoever wants to get their hormones checked and have a physical to diagnose any physical problems? Multiple detransitioners have expressed that there is no specialized medical support for people who detransition even though they have specific medical needs. It is also a fairly common problem that people cannot pass, so they end up being just as “othered” as they were before they transitioned. Conversation therapy would be telling the girl who plays with trucks to play with dolls. That is wrong. Therapy for depression is appropriate for girls who hear adults in their lives make misogynistic comments on a regular basis and are afraid of growing up in female bodies. That’s not conversation therapy, that’s having a conversation about how to deal with misogyny. Surgery in that case would be like a black person having surgery to look white as a means of dealing with racism. It dismisses the underlying issue from the conversation and leaves the eventual life burden for everyone who has the surgery.

r3 fuck you. We are trying to raise awareness to save the next generation from butchering themselves and realizing this is a mental illness.

I meant -conversion therapy. -R19

Raise awareness?

LMAO.

Bullshit. No one here is raising awareness about this as a mental health issue on this forum.

All people do here is bash trans and use them as punching bags in order to duke it out politically with the opposing party of the decade.

You fuck off.

If you truly want to raise awareness as this being a mental health issue, WHICH IT MOST DEFINITELY IS, (so at least we agree on this), then start treating these poor people with some compassion and respect.

People here come to this forum to shit on these people. They need HELP, not opposition. The opposition only fuels their mental health issues further.

R22 Have you read the article in the OP? If not, why should we be interested in what you are saying? You contribute nothing to the discussion but insults and untruths.

Take your own advice and "be kind"!!

TRAAANS!

[quote]They need HELP

No disagreements there!

Sweden and Finland are now restricting access to puberty blockers, and France is moving in the same direction. Apparently they can cause issues with bone density.

Plus there's the fact that drug companies like to push drugs so they can make money. I keep wondering when we'll see ads on Nickelodeon. "Talk to your doctor about puberty blockers."

R19 You may have seen this Swedish doc, it has English subs. It's about the huge rise in young people, mostly girls who say they are trans. It also discusses the unquestioning affirmation model. This model has frankly led to catastrophe for many young people. But it's what the likes of Stonewall UK and in Ireland, Teni demand.

Anyway, it's a very good, informative film.

R6, Parents don’t have the right to abuse their kids simply because they are their kids. So why are they able to medically castrate them?

R22, You are completely insane.

The distaste is akin tot he crowd that posts these articles.

They don't necessarily agree with the articles because they, themselves, take a more aradical stance but they'll do anything to draw others in their obsessive hate and moral crusade... that much is transparent and tends to leave a foul taste.

Even when people would otherwise agree with aspects of their position... but said people are not reasonable, ethical, they're fundamentalists to the worst degree. It's an obsession that fills their life 24/7 with the threat of trannies lurking in every shadow, suspecting them everywhere... and yet way too often can never understand when their rhetoric comes back to haunt them as so many find others questioning their gender in public restrooms.

R30 you sound like you're having an episode. Did you read the OP article? Nothing you're talking about is relevant.

WTF are you going on about, R30?

OP is a far right wingnut who pillories people while accusing others of doing the same

That's cute r33; I see I taught you a new word.

Go read the article. It is a fairly even view of the situation. You may learn more new words!

R17 There's a reason that Great Britain is known as Terf Island and it's because women are fighting back.

Trans Regret

A Dutch tv doc. It's interesting or really dispiriting that shows like this won't make on to tv in Ireland and the UK. If they did they would be immediately be attacked as" triggering, abusive, hates speech..."

Gimme a break, it's all coming from the UK, they have gone way over the line and have elected trannies to public office. It's completely normal to have trannies running the show. You nasty Brits need to STFU, you started all the tranny shit.

[quote]There, were no issues with trans adults

No, there are serious issues with trans adults, who are violating women's spaces and and identity. A man in a frock and slap is not a woman and poses a serious threat to our safety. They are just as much, and likely more, of a threat to womanhood even when compared with the horror that is mutilated young lesbians.

Trans activists are the worst. They are against trans adults forced to being sterilized and consider it against human rights but it’s totally fine to do it to CHILDREN

bump

Puberty blockers also lower IQ by 8+ points and can cause internal organ growth and development to be stunted.

Ads on Nickelodeon are sure to come, and in the meantime, it is being taught in schools from very early ages.

Bump

Where is it taught in schools?

R44, Everywhere. White women are obsessed with gender ideology.

R42, there are already pro-child-transition ads here in my red state. The narration is something like "my trans child is a normal child". Yes ma'am, your little girl is normal. Even if she likes sports and climbing trees and playing with trucks. You've given her a haircut and a lifelong psychological trauma because YOU have decided she isn't "really" a girl.

There is a LOT of money behind the trans shit.