Margaux Hemingway

[quote] Why did she have such a tragic ending?

Why did Eric Bohleart ride his bicycle into a train?

Why did that Midwestern ecologist self-immolate?

Why did Marilyn swallow a bottle of Aspirin ?

Well yes R1 she was depressed duh but I don’t know much about her life or why a beautiful, well connected former supermodel would end up committing suicide in Santa Monica. Mariel seems like a raging bitch.

She wasn't all that beautiful. She had a strange jawline like a square box.

It was worse than Jean Simmons' jawline. It was like a square box like those people from Indo-China and South East Asia.

You could have made your point without the ugly in its casualness racism R3

She had a lovely profile

A number of supermodels over the years have had “square box” jawlines.

Who, R6?

Mariel Hemingway?

Maybe she 'was' stupid.

I saw that documentary with Mariel commenting on Margaux. I didn't find it bitchy. Mariel and the family obviously knew Margaux was troubled, and possibly not bright enough to make better choices.

R4 How do you perceive 'ugliness' in R3's comment? Do you think Jean Simmons as ugly?

A family of grifters, riding on the coattails of a talented yet anguished relative. You can bet none of them would have made it out of the flyover states if not for that illustrious, tragically glamorous last name.

True, Margaux was a beauty - for about five minutes - but she attempted to segue into movie stardom (challenging when you’re utterly bereft of talent), and was quickly outclassed by her cutie pie little sis. That probably did a number on her self-esteem. Speaking of cutie pie, her daughter, Margaux’s niece, was just at the Vanity Fair party looking ancient and mummified:

She had a very on trend look for the 1970s and early 1980s mixed with some classically beautiful features but the voice....like a baby chainsmoker.

No R10 I think making a sweeping generalization about how “those people” from Indo-China and South East Asia have ugly jawlines, is ugly.

Even if she was R8, saying so about your dead sister reads as needlessly uncaring and heartless.

Margaux supposedly landed the first $1 million dollar contract when she signed with Fabergé. However, Lauren Hutton claims that she landed the first million dollar contract when she signed with Revlon. So who knows.

She reminds me a lot of Billie Piper, an actress who despite not being “conventionally” attractive has a certain kind of unique beauty about her.

Margaux’s movie was a turkey and she couldn’t act but wow did she ever look breathtakingly beautiful in it

I was obsessed with her. I wanted to look like her. I drew dark eyebrows on everyday, no other make up. I can’t believe nobody said anything. Maybe it wasn’t as bad as I remember.

Margaux was quite a bit prettier than Mariel though. I always thought Mariel looked a bit hard and mannish.

Elle Fanning is trying to be a Hemingway redux. But. It’s not working

I watched the documentary and I too thought Muriel’s comments about Margaux were disgusting.

Mental illness runs rampant in that family, obviously. It wasn't her fault, she couldn't help her genes.

Why did Marilyn swallow a bottle of Aspirin ?

Monroe overdosed on chloral hydrate and nembutal

She was cross eyed and very stupid. A true alcoholic - one who becomes instantly addicted. Terrible speaking voice and not an ounce of sense. She was never a beauty, but that profile manipulation shot is nice R5. She didn't actually look like that. Quite possibly legitimately mentally ill.

Why would Elle Fanning emulate Margot Hemingway? Nobody knows who Margot Hemingway was. I had to ask my mother who had to google it. We know her bitchy dumb sister better because Woody Allen gave her a part and tried to fuck her. Both sisters were talentless, and neither were beautiful. Magot had nice hair and full lips before that was a thing.

Janice Dickinson did it better.

“My sister Margaux’s pain was a lot more palpable. She dropped me on my head the day I was brought home from the hospital and later on she knocked out my two front teeth. She just didn’t want to have this mistake of a baby sister in her life.” - Mariel

[quote] Was she considered a great beauty

Um, yes.

Grandpa Ernest shot himself in the head. Much more messy.

Photogenic yes. Beautiful and talented, hell no. She looked "special."

^ Too much mascara; buck teeth; box-like jaw.

Hmm r24 if you had to ask mummy to google it, how do you know so much about her?? Let alone that she was “a true alcoholic and very stupid.”

Oh look the racist jaw nazi is back r29

Same way I know that you are a true alcoholic and very stupid, R30.

Of all people, you nasty bitches on here should know that no one chooses to be mentally ill or stupid.

Girls, girls!

No unnecessary squabbling, please!

All this furor over dead Margaux. Keep going girls, she’d love it !!

Well, she was no Cheryl Tiegs, that's for sure.

Apparently they didn't find her body for a while and it was in a warm climate and the body was a mess

[quote] Margaux is present simply as a sentence in Mariel's bio.

Obituary

[quote] the body was a mess

I hope they were able to scoop up that mess to place in the funereal box.

R21 You’re terrible, Muriel.

But you’re okay with the overt misogyny, R4?

She was molested by her father as a child, she had debilitating depression. Why you bitches so mean?

This thread is a disaster.

Margaux was one of the most talented models ever. She also had a lot of pain and struggle throughout her life. Despite that, she had a good heart, which is hard to encounter in fashion. At a time when gay people were oppressed beyond belief, they identified with her struggles and she theirs.

[quote] At a time when gay people were oppressed beyond belief, they identified with her struggles.

Do you think the clothes buyers realised that Mariel was 'callously cruel' about her sister?

LMAO

^^ thank you, Ms. Judy Pills

^^ For r44

[quote]R28 Photogenic, yes.

For starters.

Loved her in Lipstick.

Ironically or non ironically r50

Muriel looks like a slutty transgender skeleton these days, so I got the last laugh.

R10 wow - she used to be quite pretty but clearly I haven’t seen a picture of her in a while. She’s early 30s at most but looks way older - her cheeks are hollowed out in a very weird aging way - she looks like Gabriela Hearst now.

R6 that is true for some reason - generally I don’t find square jaws flattering on women at all, but on her it worked.

Nothing wrong with square jaws!

What about lantern jaws?

The problem with square jaws is that the hairdresser has to work overtime on making big hair to make the woman look less masculine.

I never thought either sister was even pretty, let alone beautiful. Which wouldn't matter, except that both were sold as raving beauties (and admittedly, I seem to be an outlier in this respect).

That said, from the article posted above, Mariel seems to be an interesting and strong person

Her body when they found it

She has sanpaku eyes in the photos at r17 and r49.

The photographers at R26 and R49 have carefully contrived to hide her problematic square jaw.

There’s a good You Must Remember This podcast on her

I read once where someone claimed Ernest Hemmingway was a suppressed homosexual and had bipolar. The bipolar I believe, never heard anything else about him being gay though.

The spelling of her first name is so fucked up. I mean, WTF?

R63, she was named after Chateau Margaux champagne. I kid you not.

OP and R2 are taking what Mariel said about Margaux out of context. If you watch the documentary, she was crying at certain points and saying how she deeply regrets her behavior earlier in life in shunning Margaux and being ashamed of any association with her.

She admits she didn’t pay enough attention to how Margaux was clearly in a lot of emotional pain and acting out through alcohol, drugs, and outrageous behavior. On the other hand, Mariel was really still just a kid and probably didn’t have the maturity or understanding of how to even begin dealing with a highly addictive and destructive personality like Margaux… who by many accounts was verbally abusive and openly hostile towards her younger sister and her newfound acclaim as an actress. It’s totally understandable why, at the time, Mariel wouldn’t want to be anywhere near her.

But, I believe Mariel has genuine grief over her sister’s suicide and regrets that they didn’t have a closer relationship. Although with someone like Margaux probably no one could have made a difference. She was an addict with bouts of severe depression and a combative attitude that drove away most everyone that tried to help her. She was also pretty dumb, but bright enough to know it, which is a sad place to be on the intelligence scale when it comes to ruining a person’s self esteem.

When someone is gone over 20 years and you didn't really love them - there's nothing left to miss.

Watching Lipstick now. Can’t resist Chris Sarandon and Perry King.

[quote] Ernest Hemmingway was a suppressed homosexual

I care not for Hemmingway.

Margot Hemingway resembles a young Karla Homolka.

Wow. This is really brutal.

Yeah r70 people here seem to have a noticeable and disturbing lack of compassion.

R71 He is talking about the comment Mariel made.

R72 And I’m talking about the people in this thread.

Underrated in Lipstick.

To be fair, Mariel had a rough start herself. Making Manhattan and having to fend off perv Woody's advances off screen.

She then got shit for playing a lesbian in the controversial Personal Best, and then doing the even more controversial Star 80 which a lot of people and critics hated at the time of its release. Much discussion was made over whether she had her breasts done or not for it.

R75 Mariel was great in Star 80. Underrated flick, such a sad story.

R73 You sound weak. And deluded.

R77 and you sound like one of the emotionally disturbed black holes who make this place more annoying for the rest of us.

[quote] I belong wherever the fuck I choose to belong

I belong here because I am very, very special.

R79 it’s true.

We're all special. Margeaux was certainly "special."

R76 well she was certainly better than Jamie Lee, who gave her movie a “drag queen does Dorothy Stratton” feel.

Poor Margaux.

That was proper trashy.

I was talking about the film.

Is that other Hemmingway woman still alive?

R86 unfortunately. It should have been HER!!

R7, square jawlines are nothing new in the fashion industry. For better or for worse, designers love androgyny and hire women who have strong, masculine bone structures. Some top models with squarish jaws:

2000s: Gisele Bundchen, Carolyn Murphy

1990s: Karen Mulder, Vendela

1980s: Christie Brinkley, Carol Alt, Paulina Porizkova

1970s: Lauren Hutton, Rene Russo

1960s: Jean Shrimpton, Veruschka

R88 speaking some sense. All of these women, including Margaux, are striking and unique to look at. The obsession with square jaws reads as some old fashioned Victorian beauty standard.

Well, R89, the photographers at [R26] and [R49] share the aesthetic that you describe as an 'obsession' with square box-like jaws.

R90 I was referring to the poster who’s constantly pointing out square jaws and how ugly they are.

James Mason had one of the square-box-shaped jaws and I found him very attractive.

R92 he’s a man, baby

Margaux should have cross-dressed as a handsome, short man.

She was quite tall r94

Christie Brinkley, ordinary as she is - does NOT have a square jaw. Her face is more heart shaped to oval. Classic.

Kate Moss and Angelina Jolie have square jaws.

Margaux Hemingway has all her unattractiveness taken out in those photos that the weirdo keeps referencing. They aren't even photos, but movie poster art. They blot out her huge jaw and square chin, her constantly agape open mouth and wide regressive brow.

Jesus fucking Christ will you all shut the fuck up about jaws? Let’s discuss literally anything else about this woman. Or nothing. Just not jaws.

Nope I want to talk about it r97

Actually, Christie Brinkley has a very square, box-like jaw. I ‘ve seen her up close in person during her Billy Joel years. I am the person unthread who said many supermodels have square jaws. See also: Brooke Shields.

Also to the racist upthread who is dismissive of Southeast Asian beauty, Thai women are considered to be some of the most beautiful women on earth.

[quote] Thai women are considered to be some of the most beautiful women on earth.

Who considers that?

Says who, hunty?

A defined jaw and a square jaw are different things. Christie Brinkley did not have a square jaw. Who the fuck knows what she has implanted in there now.

[quote]R99 Actually, Christie Brinkley has a very square, box-like jaw… See also: Brooke Shields.

In what sense was Brooke Shields’ jawline “boxy”?

This is a very strange obsession to have.

Can you post comparative pics of a classic vs. a “boxy” jaw, so some of us can understand you better?

ENOUGH.

Olivia Wilde, square jaw.

Margaux was married to that hamburger heir and she brought Mariel to NYC and kind of pimped her out to the the highest bidder, which eventually ended up being Woody Allen. To see Mariel in bed with Woody in Manhattan was to throw up. But Mariel totally eclipsed Margaux in popularity and became the new "It" girl while Margaux headed off on a downhill slide. Mariel Hemingway is a survivor considering the suicides in that family. Plus she ended up with the hot guy.

Margaux had a classic heart-shaped face. The square jaw troll sounds like a tranny off his meds.

^^ you’re an asshole

Margot's square jaw is what killed her.

Margaux had a wide face, but she was still striking looking—and, yes, beautiful IMO—maybe not in a cookie cutter way, but she was still a gorgeous woman. In some photos, Melissa George reminds me of her (similar smiles, thick eyebrows, a general aura). She looked rough near the end of her life because she was a mentally-ill alcoholic who did not take care of herself. I would think that most gay men would appreciate a beauty like hers, but I suppose this thread has proven otherwise.

A square face on a woman is easily defined as someone whose forehead, cheeks and jaw are of pretty much equal width, with a pretty sharply defined jawline.

Margot Robbie and Olivia Wilde are perfect examples.

When the cheeks are wider and the chin jaw tapers, your face is either oval or depending on your brow width and hairline - heart shaped. Elizabeth Taylor and Marilyn both had the MOST beautiful heart shaped faces.

Many of the most pleasing female faces in the world are oval or slightly rectangular. A bit longer than square or round.

If the brow is widest and the jaw tapers and the chin is small or pointy - you have a triangular face. Yes Reese Witherspoon obviously but also Jennifer Love Hewitt and Scarlett Johansson.

A round face is exactly as you would imagine and has nothing to do with weight. Michelle Williams, Mila Kunis, Kirsten Dunst, Selena Gomez, Olivia Munn, Christina Ricci, Emma Stone.

There are diamond shaped faces too. Narrower foreheads and jawlines with pronounced cheekbones.

Any hairdresser or makeup artist or lighting technician can tell you this.

She was an epileptic, that would cause some mental distress

My god you fags are like a cat chasing a laser pointer. NO ONE CARES. Someone says boxy jaw and boom we’re off to the races, discussing every woman ever born since Eve and totally ignoring the thread topic. Who CARES about Olivia Wilde’s fucking jawline? Make a square jaw thread.

Adam and Steve.

It's Margot Hemingway that no one cares about - not in terms of discussing a great beauty or adequate actress. She's not even as well known as Gia Garagemi - that other ordinary looking model remembered only for the way she DIED.

R117 there’s the door.

Mariel pings hard.

Over 40 of the posts on this thread come from R118! And then he answers himself from another account!!

How SAD is that?

Margaux was briefly considered for the leading lady part in that other Dino De Laurentiis flick of 1976, "King Kong." "Lipstick" baddie, Chris Sarandon, was offered the part that eventually went to Jeff Bridges, who ironically, was the first choice for the Sarandon part in "Lipstick," but Bridges read the script and found it distasteful. As we all know, "King Kong" marked the debut of Wilhelmina model, Jessica Lange, who was never in the same league as million dollar supermodel, Margaux.

She was OK but she was no Shelley Hack.

Her lady part did not lead. But Margox could have played King Kong.

Mariel is more delicate than Margaux was (not to mention shorter, which helped) plus was 10 times the actress, but all three Hemingway sisters had those annoying, unsupported baby voices. It's very weird.

I've read that high pitched, little girl voices in grown women are often a hint that they were molested in their youth. They subconsciously want to stay frozen in time as children and not be sexually mature, because that would mean they're ready for sex. And they're inhibited about sex and their sexuality, thinking that's what lead to the abuse.

It's a theory, anyway.

Does this look like a heart or oval shaped face to you, R96? The width of Christie's jaw, cheeks, and forehead are about the same. This is how she appeared when she was young—square—before any cosmetic procedures.

[quote]Kate Moss and Angelina Jolie have square jaws.

Angelina paid for her sharp square jaw. Prior to her major overhaul by the plastic surgeon, she had more of an oval face.

That’s chilling R66. And profound.

The most beautiful women have square jaws.

It turns out her death was a suicide. She had taken so much phenobarbital there were at least two tablets in her stomach that were undigested.

"Make a square jaw thread" is so data lounge Im the one in fits

She had her name spelled wrong. It's MARGO.

Sure they spelled Muriel wrong too but she bluffed through that by saying they named her after the Cuban city.

r125 I saw Mariel's doc a few yrs ago and I'm pretty sure she said toward the end that Margot was fucking their father....

Margot changed the spelling of her name because she was an alcoholic and the other speeling was a reminder of the drinker that she had been

^ Completely false. Why do you spread stupid lies over something so trivial? Also, to the poster who linked to the documentary thank you; it was really good.

I remember they were pushing Mariel Hemingway as some sort of sex symbol back in the day, and all I could think was she was such a hard looking woman. I like unconventional beauties, but she's just ugly. Apparently, all it takes to be considered attractive, is to be thin, tall and have blonde hair. She's very hard looking.

[quote]R135 I remember they were pushing Mariel Hemingway as some sort of sex symbol back in the day

That was just for one specific role, where she played a Playboy Playmate. She even got breast implants for it.

Other than that she’s never played overtly “sexy” women (that I can think of.) She’s too inherently preppie to be a bombshell. Critic Pauline Kael wrote of her in that role, “Hemingway is touching, but she’s just not Playmate material.”

Star 80 was awful. Fosse's worst film.

Star 80 was criminally underrated as a film and the reason no one cared for it was that it was a true story with a horrific, unhappy ending.

Star 80 was terribly cast and not a good film. Eric Roberts was a total ham and Mariel is a weak to poor actress. Bad movie of the week. DePalma should have made it. He lives for that kind of torture porn/glamour.

Pauline Kael was right. Mariel Hemingway didn't look at all like a Playmate of the month or year. She's not even pretty.

I was a senior in high school when Manhattan came out. I thought Mariel was the most beautiful woman I’d ever seen. And she got an Oscar nomination for the movie.

That's because she looks like a trans/man, r140.

Margaux's suicide as written seemed so lonely and sad that the details still stick with me. She left a note saying something like "peace and healing for Margaux." She was not found for days.

Mariel is average looking. She was cute when young but certainly there is nothing special about her. No "it" factor. Looks like an average corporate HR woman. Her family history is very dark and she is brave to talk about it and her personal struggles.

R143 is without eyes to see. Sign the post next time, Stevie Wonder.

It's Mariel who has no eyes. All that broad face and wide head, a very low brow, piggish nose and no lips plus tiny, tiny eyes. Her features are not harmonious - she's a bit odd looking to be honest. Very mannish. Like her sister, she looks and sounds "special."

As for Papa Hemingway being gay, when Max Eastman told him “Come out from behind that false hair on your chest, Ernest. We all know you." Papa slapped him and had to be physically restrained from attacking him further. Perhaps Eastman struck a little too close for comfort

Oh, Daddy. Or Grandpa.

(1) No.

(2) Because!

Mariel never lived up to the promise she showed in “Manhattan”.

Watching her scenes is uncomfortable today. Especially since a real life underage girl, Babi Christina Engelhard, has come forward, stating the character of Tracy was based on her.

R150 not Stacey Nelkin? Damn I need to keep up.

As with most predators, there’s more than one victim.

Interesting podcast about the sisters, mentioned upthread:

[italic]You Must Remember This[/italic] #158 “The Hemingway Curse? Mariel and Margaux (Make Me Over, Episode 7)”

Interesting points: Third sister Joan (“Muffet”) was (permanently?) institutionalized while still in high school, both older sisters were molested by the alcoholic dad, Margaux’s modeling agent wanted her to weigh 136 lbs. although she was 6 feet tall, the photos used in and to promote STAR 80 were shot by a real Playboy photographer, and Mariel developed an eating disorder while a teen. This increased, with Mariel living on just burnt popcorn or coffee, after Margaux’s fall because Mariel associated extra weight with her famous sister’s craziness and failure.

136 lbs r153? No wonder her career was short lived. What a hog!

Muffet

R155 she was quite striking. Reminds me of Liv Tyler. I’d have to be institutionalized if my parents called me “Muffet” too.

Mariel made a serious effort to deepen her voice after all the criticism, but at least she was working. Margaux was too far in a hole to care and still spoke in the raspy Minnie Mouse on helium voice until the end.

[quote]r157 Mariel made a serious effort to deepen her voice after all the criticism

Brooke Shields would have benefited from vocal coaching to deepen her voice. It was just so piping when she was in her teens and 20s that it was hard to take her seriously (not that anyone was inclined to, anyway.)

R157 Margaux’s voice didn’t match her body whatsoever. Seeing her in photos for years, looking waspy and gorgeous, and then hearing this blowsy, coarse, pack-a-day trailer park voice come out of her mouth was so jarring. I remember being stunned the first time I saw her interviewed. It’s no wonder her acting career didn’t take off.

It took a while to realize who Margaux reminds me of in this pic.

Priscilla Barnes.

Mariel’s daughter, Dree.

A friend was working the racks at a place similar to Loehmann's, discount designer duds, and looked behind her and saw Mariel. This was in the early 80s. She said Mariel was the WASPiest, preppiest girl she had ever seen. She did not use the word "beautiful."

She calls herself Hemingway, R161? I wonder if she also tries to play the "I've earned everything I have on my own" card.

[quote]She then got shit for playing a lesbian in the controversial Personal Best, and then doing the even more controversial Star 80 which a lot of people and critics hated at the time of its release. Much discussion was made over whether she had her breasts done or not for it.

Both Personal Best and Star 80 had good reviews when they were released. They were both small films.

Star 80 was great. It didn’t do well because it was such a depressing topic and the murder was still fresh in the public’s mind, not because it wasn’t a good film.

Star 80 does hold up, IMO.

Dree seems bored, flat and vapid in the documentary.

136 lbs - what is it about 4 lbs per inch? So if she were 5’8” that would be equivalent to about 120? Thin for sure but within a relatively normal range.

Well, imagine a 6 foot man weighing 136 lbs.

Would that alarm you?

Photo of Margeaux in 1990 with Jaclyn Smith and Ivanka Trump. Why does 32 year-old Margeaux look older than these two then-middle-aged women?

Because she’d been through hell.

R169 she’d been through the wringer. Drugs, booze, mental illness, sexual abuse - you’d probably look even worse. That photo was taken around the time she did this interview. She had obviously had an incredibly difficult few years and was trying to put her life back together. Which makes the eventual outcome even sadder.

Not to mention the rampant bulimia, which she discusses in the above interview.

Margaux does have sad eyes in most all of her photos - don't let the flung back head and too wide smile distract you. She still wasn't interesting enough as a model or person or actress to feel much about. She did sound like a trailer park 2 pack a day dumb girl. She was in Amazon time or she would not even have been a successful model. Modelling is about trends, not talent. (a few remarkable exceptions)

It's like Gia Garagme. She was a difficult, selfish, dumb, unprofessional, garbage human being. Pretty girl, but not that beautiful. Her modelling career was over by the time she was 22 years old! Who the fuck cares that she later died of AIDS? She was a total asshole. Lots of people are junkies. There's nothing to jizz over old fashion layouts. Jesus.

The only interesting part is sometimes about how the industry exploited and used these fucked up creatures without care. That is not even the case with Margaux Hemingway. She was given as great a golden launch into a chance at superstardom as any model in history.

You sound lovely r173. Are you single?

I wonder if R173 is a failed model.

Is there a dusty, creased graduation certificate from the Barbizon School of Modeling somewhere in his scrapbook? Spotted with gin and tears?

R169, it's Margaux. Margeaux changes the hard 'g' to a /zh/.

"Gia Garagme" was a dear friend of mine.

I once had a long taxi ride with a driver that used to be an airline steward back in the day. We got to talking about celebrities and he that that without question, Margaux was the most beautiful celebrity that he had ever seen during the 70s "jet set" era. She was always up for a laugh and very sweet and chatty, which kind of blows her unstable diva image out of the water. He said he was very upset when he heard of her death and she seemed such a fun, sweet lady.

I think Mariel, Margaux”s dad and stepmom were estranged from her at the end because she had come out and said her father molested her and their father accused her of lying and Mariel sided with their dad.

I thought she was striking and had a warm smile and was a great model. Her spider voice was kind of jarring and if she wanted to act I think she would’ve done better in parts where the dialogue was minimal (the bo Derek part in 10 would’ve been ideal) I think lipstick also took the sails out of Chris Sarandons career as well. Anne Bancroft and Mariel were the only ones that came out unscathed.

Unstable divas can laugh and chat. Drunk people high on coke are good at that. Taxis used to be fun.

You sure seem to know a lot of service people who once knew other people who had a casual contact with some celebrity from 50 years ago, R178.

How old a gentleman are you?

[quote] She has sanpaku eyes

R59 Are you making a reference to the Indo-Chinese jawline, as per R3?

[quote] James Mason had one of the square-box-shaped jaws and I found him very attractive.

Of course, James' square-box-shaped head came in handy when portraying the ambassador Kam Ling.

Part of Margaux’s attempted comeback in the 90s included posing for Playboy, long after she was past her sell-by date. She didn’t look too bad all things considered but the comeback didn’t pan out.

None of these chicks was beautiful enough to play Dorothy Stratten.

Granted, she was better looking naturally than 92% of the women on earth.

R184 Excuse me

,,,,,

R169 She seriously looks brain damaged.

Manly looking women, while striking when young, tend to look older overall.

She's standing between two totally made up, ultra feminine doll women.

Margaux was the IT girl when I lived in NYC in the 70s. The story of a man following her to her hotel room and leaving roses for her and then proposing-- it was the most romantic thing I'd ever heard in real life. Those were the days when stalkers meant business She married him, and then she kind of vanished. All those people I envied how sad they became.

189 she.. what?? This took an expected turn.

R189 she.. what?? This took an unexpected turn. **

R64 She was, but her birth name was Margot; she changed the spelling herself when she learned that she was named after the wine her parents were drinking the night she was conceived, according to (their) family lore (and Wikipedia). I guess they named her after the wine but misspelled it. ???

Margaux was a gorgeous model with a lot of character. She got into it on her glamorous name and she didn't have to work hard - I wouldn't say she was fashion top model but rather a model who was instantly at the highest rate for spokesmodel / égerié. Didn't she get some record breaking contracts? There were "names" in the 60s too, such as Penelope Tree, daughter of famous socialite American blueblood Marietta Peabody Tree.

Now of course its all celebrity spawn.

First model to make $1 million R193.

Christie Brinkley wasn't my kind of model at all, and she was well off the runway before I worked in fashion in the 90s and met and filmed all the supermodels. But Christie Brinkley was the most radiant woman to meet in real life. She was 1000 watts of radiating glamour. Which is strange because in magazines I thought she wasn't very glamorous. Christie wasn't chic, though. She was BARBIE LIVE.

Edward Hemingway, Ernest's grandson, was a very fetching young man. But his looks were quite fleeting.

Ernest was charming and pleasant looking when he smiled

Interesting R195. Give us some more dish. Who else was surprisingly glamorous or surprisingly unattractive in person? I saw Kate Moss outside a nightclub in London (circa 2002 or so) and she looked like an unkempt little troll with pitted skin. I didn’t get “supermodel” vibes at all. And I like Kate Moss.

Dorothy Stratten really was just completely gorgeous.

Lmao [97]!

[195] I stayed in Christie Brinkley's NYC apartment in the 1990s. We used it as a rehearsal space for a play. A friend of hers was involved in the rehearsal. It was truly the ugliest, tackiest decor I've ever seen. Like PETTICOAT JUNCTION. Frilly and flowery, cheap furniture. Thanks for reminding me!

R195 ⇧⇧⇧ ( I'm up too late.)

I think margaux looked like Guy Pierce.

R191

It was all in the gossip columns in the 70s. But I found this recap somewhere online.

"But as Margaux told PEOPLE in 1988, the turning point of her life came at the Plaza Hotel in New York City in 1974, when the 19-year-old high school graduate, working for a Ketchum-based PR firm, tagged along on a business trip to meet a boxing promoter. "I was basically a little s--t in cowboy boots going 'Yippie skippie' and 'Yahoo' with a big grin," she recalled years later. The small-town routine—and perhaps her big-time name—worked wonders on one Errol Wetson, a hamburger-chain heir and marketing entrepreneur 14 years her senior, who spied her sipping tea in the hotel's Palm Court. "He knocked on the door of my suite with a rose and a bottle of champagne," she said, "and I fell in love."

Four months later, Margaux moved to Manhattan—and into Wetson's apartment. "He started thinking of himself as my Svengali," she said. "He told me what colors to wear and to cover my legs because they were too heavy." He took her to the right parties and, most important, introduced her to the folks at Fabergé. Within a year, Hemingway was on the covers of Vogue and TIME magazine—and hanging out with Halston, Liza Minnelli and Bianca Jagger.

Back in Ketchum, her family was taking Margaux's rapid rise in stride. Her big sister, nicknamed Muffet, declared her intention to move to Manhattan and try a little modeling herself. (Nothing came of the plan.) Her mother declared the hullabaloo "exciting." Mary Hemingway, Ernest's fourth and last wife, reveled in Margaux's free spirit. "I shacked up with Ernest for years before we were married," his widow, who died in 1986, told Newsweek in 1975. And, in th . . ."

[quote] Like PETTICOAT JUNCTION.

Mary!

I concur r198. I saw Kate Moss in Beverly Hills and she looks like a blowsy little alkie. She was bombed, smoking like a chimney and hanging off every guy in the bar, even the ugly ones. She’s a sex pest. We actually thought she was a “lady of the night” who’d had a few too many and was trying to rustle up a customer. It wasn’t until people started oohing and aahing that I began to wonder, and when she opened her mouth and that indecipherable cockney gibberish fell out, it hit me. I will never understand how she made it as a top model. If only because she’s leprechaun sized in person.

LMAO R206

R206 did she have ripped nylons, matted extensions and a tattered leopard coat? I can envisage it.

All this talking about women with square jawlines and no mention of Grace Kelly?

^ Grace had the box shape head and carried a lot of weight.

She was a nightmare to groom.

R198 yes, Moss is a pig. It's off the topic but so for the 90s during my time, the one who radiated energy and owned every room, every party every runway was Naomi Campbell of course. As everyone knows. Effortlessness. Goddess. Naomi could do it all. I was a video camera man and caller for several seasons in Europe and NY. Naomi just lit up. Also like Brinkley before her, Naomi smiled even if her lips were closed. Her eyes were OPEN to the gaze and giving back. Her vibe was optimistic, upbeat, in command, having fun, and of course every thing looked fantastic on her body and with the way she moved. And Naomi was chic too. I guess she became quite a bitch but that was long after.

[quote]R210 [Grace Kelly] was a nightmare to groom.

The makeup artist for “To Catch a Thief” said she’s the only actress he didn’t use foundation on, that her skin was flawless.

The only defect I’ve read of Kelly’s is her hair was somewhat thin, and very fine. That’s probably why she wore it up a lot when not onscreen - it was just easier to twist it up rather than try to style it to look fuller, or hold a setting on her own.

Grace Kelly, like Kim Novak, had a very heavy lower face. She had near perfect symmetrical features of a Miss America contestant. But without makeup and blonde hair she was quite plain looking. She was boring looking - except when she was totally starved down for her wedding day. Her face was usually so wide and heavy and her eyes were not very pretty or distinct.

Grace was never beautiful like Marilyn or Sophia, Vivien, Elizabeth and Ava. Beauty is more than just symmetry and blonde hair.

Grace looked like some 50's TV mother and housewife. She was impeccable and symmetrical. Neither distracting or beautiful.

That frumpy 50s hair and styling doesn’t help.

R195 Same! She bored me to the teeth; I thought she was banal, cookie-cutter, even flat and bloated -- compared to the (few) angular, interesting beauties of the day. And then I saw her one day, being interviewed in a movie theater entrance when I was in high school walking home, and it was like she had golden Klieg angel lights illuminating her. She was radiant.

[quote]R215 her eyes were not very pretty or distinct.

Um, okay…

R209: Well, the conversation was mostly about Margaux and other fashion models, not movie stars. Fashion designers tend to favor women with bone structure that's on the masculine side. The movie industry still hires actresses with more feminine features, thankfully.

R12 That is a perfect description of her voice.

[quote]her eyes were not very pretty or distinct.

True. Who doctored the photo at R219, Kim Kardashian? Grace Kelly never once looked like that in real life.

[quote]R222 Grace Kelly never once looked like that in real life.

Except she did. That photo shoot was done in Jamaica with Kelly’s favorite photographer, Howell Conant. She was going on vacation and invited him to come along.

There were no stylists or makeup artists used on the trip… the pair just shot the pictures how they wanted. They’re among her best images. Later some were sold to Colliers magazine.

Grace Kelly was ethereal for about 15 years. She had her season, but what a season it was!

Don't hate me, but I give almost no fucks about fashion or beauty trends in the 1970s. There are a few exceptions of course, but mostly everyone looked like they were playing in their mother's closet.

Grace Kelly was pretty. She's not some great beauty.

Margot Hemingway looks like a cartoon horse. Her sister is a simp. Who were they?

[quote]r225 Grace Kelly was pretty. She's not some great beauty.

Reality disagrees.

Yikes, is that supposed to be proof, R226? She looks like a robot with a badly designed jaw.

R227, there are all types of beauty—and Grace Kelly was the epitome of icy blond beauty just as Liz Taylor and Sophia Loren (to name contemporaries) were of dark haired women. I don’t know what you’re seeing (everyone has their opinion) but objectively, Grace Kelly is seen as a great beauty. Her square jaw resulted in high cheekbones and her nose and eyes were perfectly symmetrical and proportional.

I've been to the Grace Kelly car crash site. Just sayin'.

[quote]Grace was never beautiful like Marilyn or Sophia, Vivien, Elizabeth and Ava. Beauty is more than just symmetry and blonde hair.

Oh listen to the queen at R215!

Didn't Cecil Beaton himself say Grace wasn't symmetrical, and one side was perfection while the other was a cow's face?

Cecil was speaking from the grave about Claudia Schiffer.

[quote]The movie industry still hires actresses with more feminine features, thankfully.

Modern actresses are a homely lot. Most look like hillbillies, bug-eyed dullards with no capacity for glamour.

[quote]“If both sides of Grace Kelly’s face were the same as the right half, she wouldn’t be on the screen,” Beaton wrote in his diary, describing said half as “very heavy, like a bull calf.”

Harsh, but true.

I’ve always thought Beaton was a mediocre photographer. Though he did take one very evocative pic of the great MM.

Never understood arguing about who is/was beautiful, but I'll happily serve up my opinions. Margaux Hemingway had some beautiful moments -- or at least photos. Grace Kelly was luminous (at times) and was blandly beautiful in movies like "Rear Window." She got boxy later on -- but most do. My vintage-female-beauty tastes run more to the likes of the young, sizzling Lauren Bacall and Charlotte Rampling, and, fast-forwarding a couple of decades, Gia Carangi and Yasmin Le Bon. I never found Claudia Schiffer attractive, and I'll never in a zillion years understand the appeal of Heidi Klum (gag), but I don't understand arguing about it. Anyone wanna step outside?

Someone wants $16,000 for Richard Amsel’s TV Guide art of Cheryl Ladd as Grace Kelly.

I didn’t know he died from AIDS complications.

Cheryl Lass is a dead-ringer for Cheryl Ladd!

Haha! OMG

R236 My beauty ideals are completely opposite of yours. I think Kelly in Rear Window is the most beautiful woman I have ever seen on screen. A lot is about the wardrobe and coiffing tho, but she is sublime. She is equally alluring in High Society. But I find her pasty and uninteresting in Mogambo. While Bacall had moments when very young, by How to Marry a Millionaire she was already old beyond her years and looked bored and pissed off constantly. Charlotte Rampling? Not attractive to me at all! But I do love Jacqueline Bisset and they did look very similar.

Heidi Klum looks like a pretty but dirty hippy chick or groupie from the late 60s.

LOVE the above description of Margaux’s voice as a “baby chainsmoker”! I remember when she was an “It” girl — the Babe ads were everywhere, and she was even on the cover of “Time” magazine. Dino de Laurentiis signed her for “Lipstick” and Hollywood was excited about her prospects.

Then she appeared as a presenter at the Oscars.

For a lot of us, it was the first time we’d heard that voice (tellingly, she didn’t speak in the Babe ads).

Whoa — THAT voice came out of her?!

The illusion was ruined, and after “Lipstick” flopped, Hollywood turned its back on her.

If Kate Jackson had offered to let her stay in her hoarder-packed van down by the river, maybe things would have turned out okay.

Look at the photos posted above of Liz and Marilyn. Those two are very different in coloring and presentation, but share some things in common. Beauty is subjective. But.

Grace Kelly had the lower face and jaw of a truck driver. She can't compete. She wasn't even the Prince's first choice. He needed and wanted a movie star to raise the profile and keep the monarchy of Monaco. It's well documented that Marilyn was approached to marry him. She wasn't even interested in meeting him. There were others from Hollywood. Grace was his third or fourth choice.

Her insecurities and not so hidden snobbery lead her to say yes and choose a life she came to hate. And SHE paid him two million dollars to marry him. It ain't no fairytale.

No beauty, Grace Kelly. Pretty lady.

Did she pay her own dowery or did her father?

Where exactly did Margaux die? Address?

I think Grace Kelly was a true beauty; there is nothing wrong with a square jaw on a woman.

[quote]R245 Did she pay her own dowery or did her father?

Her dad. But it was diverted from her inheritance.

[quote] I’ve always thought Beaton was a mediocre photographer.

Is your name Dick Avedon, R235?

Beaton was excellent at analysis and grooming. He knew how to photograph 'Grace the cow' and noseless Claudette..

[quote]R249 Beaton was excellent at analysis and grooming.

Except that’s not being a photographer. It’s being a diarist and costume designer.

Look, anyone who shoots the young Audrey Hepburn and gets only this as a result isn’t some genius photographer.

This is how a talented photographer shoots a young Audrey Hepburn:

Grace Kelly was elegance and class - with basic Aryan beauty. The Hemingway’s were unique looking WASPS with a little bit of crazy in the eye - and personality. Agree about Kate Moss - how did she become a supermodel?

Monroe's jaw was kind of strong when she closed her mouth completely. She clearly favored how she looked with her mouth agape. She knew it softened her face, along with making her look more open and sensual.

"Marilyn was so fresh, beautiful and pure."

No one would ever describe Kim K that way.

R24 "I had to ask my mother who had to google it."

LOL, you and your mother, riding herd over all those no-account celebrities from decades past.

Margaux Hemingway was not a celebrity. That's the point. Neither was Gia Garagme. Their famous only for being DEAD.

R253 a little round but not at all strong/square.

Her features were very soft, almost too soft By todays standards (which I don’t agree with at all but whatever)

[quote] She clearly favored how she looked with her mouth agape

All her male photographers asked her to keep her mouth agape so they could stick their penis into it.

God I think Mariel is so strange looking, now and always. And Margaux had fucking buck teeth ok.

R256 Does your mother google fixes for your grammatical mistakes?

R256 I'll hazard a guess that you weren't around (or aware) at the time. Margaux Hemingway was a huge celebrity at the time -- ad campaigns, gossip columns, Vogue features, and one of the first models to score a huge contract with a beauty company for those Babe ads. Gia Carangi was also a legend within fashion and fashion-magazine-readership circles, even if she might not have bee known by name the way (much lesser) models are in the Instagram age. Gia was one of Scavullo's (heard of him?) favorite subjects, and he discussed her in news snippets at the time. They were both giants compared to today's cesspool of "influencers" and celebrity-spawn "supermodels."

Margaux Hemingway and Lauren Hutton became top glamour models despite their teeth.

Hutton - never got her appeal. And her manner and way of speaking is so affected. Hard pass.

Margaux auditioned for the role of Fallon #1 on (old) Dynasty.

Gia Caragme was a dog faced girl whose career was over at 21. She is famous because she died of AIDS.

Scavullo made everyone look the same. His photographs dehumanized women. He's ancient history and a complete anachronism. He's more niche than Tom of Finland. And nowhere near as important. Gia was NOT famous or beautiful. Some ancient white fags on here wouldn't understand that - because their mommy is the only woman they ever saw up close.

Christ - give it a rest R261. You are aptly named. But you have other accounts here too! Show some objectivity or ask someone under 80 years old to help y'all.

R265 You've got issues, honey. And you make no sense whatsoever.

"Glamour models". Ok that's funny if you mean it to be.

Did Elizabeth Taylor have a nose job? Just wondering after looking at the pic in r234.

Mariel Hemingway produced a documentary about her family’s history of depression and mental illness. Also, it doesn’t help that your parents were mentally ill and you made stupid life decisions like that Lipstick movie.

I wonder if Margaux really lost her shit when baby sis started doing some Vogue covers.

The article about Cecil Beaton at r234 has some fascinating quotes and observations. About Marilyn Monroe: [quote] “If this star is an abandoned sprite, she touchingly looks to her audience for approval. She is strikingly like an over-excited child asked downstairs after tea. The initial shyness over, excitement has now got the better of her. She romps, she squeals with delight, she leaps on to the sofa. She puts a flower stem in her mouth, puffing on daisy as though it were a cigarette. It is an artless, impromptu, high-spirited, infectiously gay performance. It will probably end in tears.”

For some reason this quote also reminded me of Princess Diana.

Does the article mention how Beaton hid the word “kike” several times in that fashion illustration he once did for Vogue?

I think there were some little swastikas in the drawing, too,… or maybe it was Stars of David. Anyway, revolting.

Is Cecil Beaton one of the ancient white Dataloungers? They all ARE notoriously racist and misogynist. They can only compliment women in the most minimizing or degrading ways. Were old gay men all created from a smothering or controlling mommy? Like in that mental illness book. DSMIII.

R273 Golly, you're SO contemptuous of the DLers and yet you're constantly here, constantly making cunty comments and spreading your toxicity. Why can't you stay away?

I LOVED "Lipstick"! "He tried to kill me! With his COCK!!!"

Another Margaux cinema gem: “Killer Fish”!

R276 watching this gem right now! What a cast. Margaux, Karen Black, Marisa Berenson, Lee Majors and James Franciscus

[quote]Was she considered a great beauty/top supermodel back in the day? Why did she have such a tragic ending? I watched a documentary about the family and her sister Mariel was callously cruel about Margaux, going as far as calling her stupid and saying she used to be embarrassed to be associated with her. Even if true, it seemed so unnecessarily cruel.

Lipstick opening with Francesco Scavullo photographing Margaux.

Margaux in six words:

Beauty and fame yet totally fucked.

It was Margaux (and Mariel) , Brooke Shields, Nastassja Kinski, and Jodie Foster. These were the girls who were always, always in the teenage gurl magazines, at the turn of the 80s.

Margaux should have recorded an album with that voice.

R282 It couldn’t have been any worse than Princess Stephanie’s attempt at pop stardom. Although I will admit, the song IS catchy.

Monroe didn't have strong jawline. Grace Kelly did.

R284, this is why they called Grace “The Battering Ram of Monaco.”

"Papa" Ernest Hemingway also committed suicide.

There was a family history.

Is Margaux the classy way to spell it?

Lipstick is a cruel film, quite ugly in its story making. But at the very end, the heroine pulls up in a luxury vehicle, wearing a full length sequinned gown and carrying a shotgun. Amazing. Very crazy, very American and very glamorous.

Belinda Carlisle once said Margaux was the only person who could keep up with her on the ski slopes.

I waited on Margaux and male friend in 85 at a restaurant in Soho. She was heavy and bloated. She drank an entire bottle of red wine. It was shocking to see what happened to her looks, Sad.

Cecil Beaton was a thoroughgoing cunt.

I think genetics was against her. Family history of addiction and mental health issues. It's important to understand what your potential risk are genetically and take action to prevent or minimize any impact.

HER VOICE

R293 It was beautiful, wasn’t it?

I worked on a low budget movie she appeared in circa ‘95 or so, and she did plenty of screaming and yelling. Most of us didn’t even know who this washed up bloated mess of a woman was, but that didn’t stop her “don’t you know who I am?” bullshit. Maybe that’s why her career faltered (in addition to the boozing and doping).

Margaux had a face like nobody else. The problem was she was six feet tall and was really just too big to model. If you look how she was photographed for fashion, she is always dressed and posed to hide her wide (for a model) hips and big legs. Same issue with Deborah Raffin when she briefly modeled.

I didn't like her eyebrows.

What was the name of the restaurant in Soho back then

R295 was it this masterpiece you worked on with Margaux?

You're fabulous, babe!

Fun Fact: Burt Reynolds gave tennis ace Chrissie Evert a BABE necklace when they were dating circa 1977...

Also, in that opening sequence of Lipstick, Margaux reminds me of Kim Alexis...

A lipstick lesbian who included a lot of gay observations in her act. A person into meta and masquerade when it was new and trendy, and a snarky bitch but not TOO bitchy to you the audience, who were invited into to share her tales which were a mix of caustic putdown and heartfelt idolatry of false idols in the zeitgeist. She personally was living an exciting High and Low lifestyle, comfortable Uptown and Downtown, with glamorous friends, a bit jet-setty, she was an insider but not too. Of course some gays were drawn in.

Margaux bombed out of her head alongside other impaired persons

She could have been a great film star BUT ...that voice!

R302 Huh?

Mental illness runs in the family. Supposedly she was named after the wine they drank while conceiving her.

I must be the only person who likes that voice. Reminds me of Carol Channing

Poor Margaux

Why do you ask stupid ass questions that are impossible to answer?? Is there something wrong with you? Are you from an uncivilized culture trying to acclimate yourself to Western pop culture ??