Russia's Invasion of Ukraine, Part V

A reminder that in R600 of the last thread, the Putin troll dropped all pretense of not being a Putin troll, along with the tattered remains of his English syntax and diction:

[quote][R598], Thank God, good riddance American junk. You enjoy your shitburgers in whatever some shithole in Alabama you are. Fat ass, Yankee.

It was a little like Ann Margret's "bourbles and bangles" moment in *The Cheap Detective*.

Ok hopefully we can get this down to a single thread to keep track.

R1, get lost, grammur nazie.

What happened with the hospital today?

Where are all the live updates?

Thanks OP. I started the real Part IV but was at lunch when it got full and was just about to start a part V.

Carry on...

R4, what happened was that the Ukrainian nazi scum set up their camp near the hospital in Mariupol with the evil intent that Russians won't hit it. Using pregnant women as a shield.

Thanks to a precision strike by the glorious Russian military nobody died, babies are alive and all everyone escaped safely with just some cuts and bruises.

Don't believe Zelensky propaganda.

Muriel can you please increase our daily allotment of FFs?

Oh, thanks, R6—that's all very credible and, in hindsight, just what one would have expected. Very relieved!

Meanwhile, the sun has now set on the fourteenth day of battle and the Russians are still not in control of Kyiv or Kharkiv. Their only success is in civilian casualties.

FF and ignore the Russian Nazi.

So Russia has now admitted they used thermobaric weapons? WTF?

To Help Ukraine, Cancel Its Foreign Debt

AN INTERVIEW WITH ALEXANDER KRAVCHUK

Ukraine’s public debt has ballooned over years of war, with European authorities and the IMF offering loans in return for pro-business “reforms.” Ukrainians are calling for the debt to be canceled, to aid the country’s future recovery.

Just posted.

Was R6 not being sarcastic?

Haha I can only see 9 of the 15 replies so far.

R6 - if you see their posting history, they are absolutely serious.

Meduza talks to local journalist Konstantin Ryzhenko about life in Kherson under Russian occupation: “A lot of the Russian soldiers are just getting wasted, wandering around, and shooting at stuff at random.”

"With the civilian death toll mounting, Mariupol’s local authorities have resorted to digging a mass grave, saying normal burials have become impossible. 'Sadly, there are just too many bodies, the morgues are overflowing.'"

There's videos showing Russian soldiers looting Ukrainian homes.

China’s biggest smartphone makers are slashing their shipments to Russia because of the rouble’s collapse and western sanctions despite pressure from Beijing to support Vladimir Putin. Shipments from Xiaomi, Oppo and Huawei have fallen by half since outbreak of war. The cutbacks, led by Huawei and Xiaomi, show that efforts by Xi Jinping and Putin to build personal relationship are not shielding Chinese groups from economic fallout.

The official account of the Russian MoD on Telegram has posted a Soviet Union flag that was flying from one of the Russian tanks.

What game is the Polish government playing?? Just park those fighter jets near the Ukrainian border and let Ukrainian pilots 'steal' them.

Geez, why is this so hard??

The head of Russia's Central Bank, Elvira Nabiullina reportedly tried to resign—twice. The Kremlin denies knowing anything about it.

Previously: “‘I respect her so much. She’s so smart,’ says a senior Russian banker. ‘But she once told me that if capital controls were introduced, she would resign. Now capital controls have been introduced and she didn’t resign.’”

Thank you very much R10, R11 for providing a proper analysis of this situation, as opposed to the grotesque warmongering in which most of the Western media is engaging, ignoring the fact that we're on the verge of a nuclear war that could wipe the entirety of life on earth in a matter of minutes.

They are not doing that because it would be an active participation in the war, R23. That would cause Russia to retaliate and it would cause a terrible escalation the likes of which have never been seen before. Your imbecility is jarring, in short.

Yeah, I don't think she can resign R24. Seems like the Kremlin is trying to force everyone to play along like nothing's wrong.

Isn't it funny that Angela Merkel resigned from office just before this shit show, she in large parts caused by appeasing Putin for years, in Ukraine began?

- Obama going through the NSA files

We are already providing anti aircraft and anti tank missiles, which some officials think are actually more useful and deadly then fighter jets. The fighter jet 'red line' seems silly.

Bellingcat's Christo Grozev in an interview to Julia Latynina in Russian on 4 March: he said that he has info that, if conventional war fails, Putin will use tactical nuclear against Poland.

Oh R27, that sentence structure......could you please try a little harder?

Russia is a fascist state with these Z Brown Shirts.

Russian troops brought Mariupol under their control. So many dead, the Ukrainians are digging mass graves.

I don't know how much fire power and bombs Putin has left, but Mariupol is a strategic win for Putin.

[quote] if conventional war fails, Putin will use tactical nuclear against Poland

Which way do the winds blow again?

The Oliver Stone produced documentary Ukraine On Fire is a must watch, as it exposes the historical events that lead to today's situation, in which the US has played a nefarious and very active role. Which is why it is being censored.

Journalists are talking about how they are getting reliable reports that Russian soldiers are kidnapping and raping Ukrainian women now.

Oliver Stone, Putin BFF? That Oliver Stone?

[quote] but Mariupol is a strategic win for Putin

And Nanking was a strategic win for the Japanese.

That doesn't surprise me R35. It was exactly what happened in Berlin in 1945.

SURE, R35. In the same way that they were deliberately bombing civilians , but in reality a malfunctioning Ukrainian missile had hit a building, there was a Gost of Kyiv that never existed and the Russians were carrying mobile crematoriums to burn Ukrainian soldiers and the "heroic" little girl who was shouting at a Russian soldier, who in reality was a Palestinian girl shouting at an Israeli soldier... And let's not even talk about the images from the war that were taken from videogames and other conflicts, and the CNN journalist who died in Afghanistan and then was revived, so he could be killed by the Russians in Ukraine.

Stop lying, you ghoul. Even the NYT has admitted that msot of the informationc oming from Ukraine is nothing more than "mythmaking", designed to keep morale up and wage a media campaign against Russia.

They have Mariupol surrounded and besieged R32 but I'm not seeing anything about them actually having captured the city yet.

Obviously, the humanitarian situation there is extremely dire though.

Also, R36, Oliver Stone was friends with Castro. He doesn't have anything to do with Putin, as he only interviewed him once. Moreover, he has condemned the war.

And Mariupol was not evacuated because it is controlled by the Azov Battalion, which is using its inhabitants as human shields.

Love you R33.

Is anyone else starting to find the RT amusing? RT if you are secretly on our side and just desperately posting to up your increasingly worthless paid by the post ruble paycheck please mention fast food again.

[quote] Russian troops brought Mariupol under their control.

R32, where did you hear this? Did they!?

Shall we all agree to block the Putin-apologist troll and reserve this thread for serious discussion rather than propaganda? At least his English is better than the last troll's.

Love you, too, ElderLez!

R42, posters who disagree with you aren't trolls. They just don't agree with you. Not everyone agrees with what CNN is telling everyone.

Blocking that troll has made everything so much better.

I'm sorry, R45 but somebody coming in and essentially saying the Ukrainians are bombing themselves is a troll.

[quote]There's videos showing Russian soldiers looting Ukrainian homes.

Ukrainian crisis actors! Paid by the Wicked Witch of the West!

R47, when have I said that the Ukrainians are bombing themselves? But the missile that hit that tower block wasn't one of the Russian cruise missiles, because it would have caused much greater destruction.

You need to improve your reading comprehension, as it's clear that you're not as intelligent as you think you are.

[quote]The Oliver Stone produced documentary Ukraine On Fire is a must watch, as it exposes the historical events that lead to today's situation, in which the US has played a nefarious and very active role. Which is why it is being censored.

Being available for all and sundry to watch is a strange form of censorship.

The woman killed along with her family by Russians while fleeing in the "safe corridor" worked for a Silicon Valley tech firm; she was staying for as long as she could in order to care for her aging mother and because her son (who was also killed) had just started college.

This is the kind of thing that condescending scum like R49 is trying to make us look past.

Silicon Valley helped to create the conditions for powerful dictators. I hope this changes.

Wow, R51. Jesus Christ.

Thank goodness.

China looked like it might be pulling back from its support of Russia but:

[quote][R42], posters who disagree with you aren't trolls. They just don't agree with you. Not everyone agrees with what CNN is telling everyone.

Oh muffin, this is DL, we know from trolls here.

I believe Zelensky's prediction today in an interview with Sky News are correct: NATO will get involved to establish a NFZ eventually. It's just a matter of time before the atrocities become too much to stomach. Like in the Balkan Wars.

R52 has been expertly trained in turning any data into pro-Putin schlock (even while insinuating that he's a dictator). Breathtakingly amoral.

Mariupol Mayor: Russia officially captures city. This item is part of our running news digest

March 6, 2022 12:29 am by The Kyiv Independent news desk Mariupol Mayor: Russia officially captures city. Russian forces, who blocked the evacuation of civilians from the city, have taken Mariupol, according to the city’s mayor Vadym Boychenko. 400,000 citizens have now fallen under Russian control. The city has been left without water and electricity.

R58 you’re paranoia is justified but in this case incorrect.

The longer this war continues the greater the risks of U.S. and NATO involvement. America Must Do More to Help Ukraine Fight Russia and bring the war to an end/ Lend-Lease is the answer.

- Alexander Vindman

Stinky linky, r61.

"The FSB is recruiting a new form of online trolls: young people whose job is to scour comments under social media posts or news items for statements that might be considered "extremist" or "seditious". Starting salary is $500 per month. Creating the world's biggest network of snitches.!

$500 per month in what currency?

oops, sorry the link @ R61 should be a Foreign Affairs article written by Alexander Vindman. Disregard the link #R61 and use this one.

The FSB really must be desperate if they think that trolling DL will win hearts and minds to their cause, R63. They are certainly assigning their crappiest, bottom-tier hacks here. The increasing hostility we see from them is just a sign that they have nothing to say.

Not only do they have nothing to say, r66, they say it with horrid syntax!

How to defuse a Russian bomb Ukraine style

Putin is to address the Russian people tomorrow about the "economic war" on Russia.

Babushka takes down Russian drone by throwing a jar of home-preserved tomatoes at it (not pickles cucumbers, as earlier reports had it).

Are we sure this is just one troll stinking up the place? I'm counting at least five trolls carpet-bombing us with Putinesque garbage.

If it's one person they've certainly got him on good drugs.

Speaking of good drugs.

Remember that Trump whore, AJ Delgado, the one fucking fat fuck Jason Miller? She thinks this all a Ukrainian false flag operation.

^ r73

[quote]She managed to disparage Ukraine, play apologist for Putin and add in a little positive PR for the Nazis all in one tweet. Impressive really.

"@MrKovalenko

The #Ukrainian Navy shared details of the operation which was aimed to destroy the modern #Russian patrol boat 'Ivan Bykov' in Black Sea two days ago. Burned out, it finally sank today.

As the #Odesa-based newspaper Dumskaya reported, it was a specially designed secret operation of the Ukraine Navy. Two #Ukrainian speedboats provoked the Russian boat to follow them, so it sailed right into the prepared area of artillery fire and was successfully destroyed.

The Dumskaya claims that this is for the first time in the world military history when the military vessel was destroyed by the land-based MLRS system. (To be verified by historians)."

Anyone know why the words or numbers are covered up on the bomb in R68's link? Were they afraid it would give away their location because the Russians would know where they dropped that particular bomb and drop another one? Seems like a weird thing to take the time to do before diffusing the thing.

I was watching one of the news stations last night and someone in the gov said that we have a huge group of right-wingers who are pro-Putin. Not all of the Russian trolls are Russian. A lot of them are American.

That is so sad R77. And the more tragic part is their English is probably worse than that of the Russian trolls.

More seriously, these American pro-Putin trolls need to be exposed. They're traitors.

Right R74? WTF with the blatant .pro-Nazi comment. I’m sure all the pregnant women shot on the edge of mass graves or the post partum women and their infants gas chambered are so thankful for the good war manners of the Nazis.

How stupid do you need to be to think saying Little Pootie respects pregnant women and babies like Hitler is helpful to the Russian cause? Unless you are trying to appeal to Nazi sympathizers?

I am going to go out on a limb and say that I expect that there’s a pretty big overlap between Putin sympathizers and Nazi sympathizers in the US.

[quote]"The FSB is recruiting a new form of online trolls: young people whose job is to scour comments under social media posts or news items for statements that might be considered "extremist" or "seditious".

Are they going to tattle on us to Daddy Vlad? I'M-A SKEERED!

I would say that Venn diagram is almost a perfect circle R79.

r79 - She's a real pip, ElderLez...

R77, and there are trolls who are in it just for the sadism. A lot of the troll comments on this thread and the previous one seemed to be obviously by Americans who were enjoying saying cruel things to upset people. There may not be much ideology behind it.

The Russians have launched 710 missiles so far. I wonder how many they have and also how much this war is costing. If they're having to use conscripts and recruit from Syria and Chechnya, that doesn't seem great.

R78 what is worse is the same news program also said that a lot of the trump republicans in office are also pro-Putin but I think we already knew that. Remember Rohrbarquer (can't spell his name and am too lazy to look it up) remember when he was saying that they were getting money from Russia but no one was supposed to talk about it. Rubio was also part of that. One for the 4th of July a group of republicans went to Russia

^^^On the 4th of july

Muslim soldiers and mercenaries from Chechnya and Syria attacking Christian Ukrainians—surely our right-wingers will have a case of the vapors!

How quickly can those 710 missiles be replaced? I'm thinking their weapons manufacturing capabilities are probably not the best in the world, either.

[quote]I am going to go out on a limb and say that I expect that there’s a pretty big overlap between Putin sympathizers and Nazi sympathizers in the US.

Between Trump, Putin, and Hitler, what's up with them worshipping small-dicked impotent assholes?

r85...

NEW from @CBSDavidMartin : A U.S. official estimates Russians have lost 5,000-6,000 killed in the first 2 weeks of battle. Standard battlefield math assumes 3x as many wounded as killed, so that puts the number of wounded at 15,000-18,000.

Do you think they killed John McCain? Using some kind of radioactive poisoning?

I have my suspicions about Scalia too.

Per @CBSDavidMartin : The U.S. official called them “very, very significant casualties” and compared them to the losses of some World War II battles. (2/2)

White House press secretary Jen Psaki reports that Russia may arrange a provocation using chemical weapons and blame it on Ukraine:

Kremlin Vet: They’ll Overthrow Putin Before Giving Him ‘Bad News’ About Russian Setbacks In Ukraine

[quote] NEW from @CBSDavidMartin : A U.S. official estimates Russians have lost 5,000-6,000 killed in the first 2 weeks of battle. Standard battlefield math assumes 3x as many wounded as killed, so that puts the number of wounded at 15,000-18,000.

Not to mention the number (thousands?) who’ve been captured or surrendered.

I'm surprised our current troll hasn't leapt in to deny these numbers as NATO propaganda. Is it past bedtime where he lives?

If those guesses are correct, and adding POWs (as R95 says), we could easily have about 19,000 Russian soldiers out of commission—i.e. 1 out of 10 of the 190,000 Russia was said to have amassed in preparation for the invasion last month.

Lavrov and Kuleba are meeting in Turkey tomorrow.

Oh wait, I didn't factor in the 5-6 thousand killed—that's more than 1 out of 10.

Moldova coverage.

I might buy some of their wine to show support.

Ben Shapiro is outraged that Ukraine can't get the MiGs.

Slight non-serious tangent

At the risk of being accused of watching MSNBC, Ali Velshi described Marie Yovanovich as stunning and brave. I think she looks much better with the gray hair and am pretty sure she was wearing the Etsuko dress in crackle.

Shapiro is right. Ukraine needs the fighters to bomb the Russian tanks.

Why can't Poland give them the fighters directly? Russia would nuke Poland?

Tucker addressed the biolabs today.

Russia is responding to sanctions and suspensions by nationalizing the property of Western businesses. Great long-term economic strategy.

I don’t know if McPutin’s will be all that successful.

Shut down the labs ASAP.

^Serious question -- who pays this chick Tulsi?

Which country might Russia invade next?

Russia’s Defense Ministry has now accused Ukraine of using U.S. money to create and develop biolabs that experimented with … coronavirus samples from bats, weaponising coronavirus.

And the stupid useful idiots like Tulsi and Tucker just eat it up.

R102 I thought the same about Yovanovich.....she looked great tonight with the grey hair. The red hair from when she took part in the first Trumpturd impeachment trials looked too harsh on her. She was a good interview today.

[quote]and there are trolls who are in it just for the sadism

[quote]There may not be much ideology behind it

I think they're tremendous.

[QUOTE] I am a half-Chinese, half Nordic Russian (Eurasian) American male

What a terrifying combination.

Beware the smell of apples.

An estimated 5,000 men, women, and children died a terrible death in Halabja, Iraq in 1988. The chemical attack lasted some 45 min. Survivors describe white-yellowish clouds that sank to the ground. They describe the smell of apples —some say it was rather a smell of garlic or banana, the sense of burning in eyes and on the skin, the inability to breathe.

Many died immediately in the shelters or their houses; thousands ran out in panic to the streets and died there. Others tried to flee the town, but died minutes or hours later after “burning and blistering” and “coughing green vomit” (Human Rights Watch 1991). Survivors report victims hysterically laughing moments before their death (ibid.). Some 7,000 were severely injured—their eyes and skin burned.

Due to the presence of Iranian and Turkish journalists at the time, photos of the victims have gone around the world, giving stirring evidence of the destructive effects of chemical weapons: scores of corpses of men, women, and children in unnatural positions spread all over the streets of Halabja; dreadfully distorted faces of children captured at the moment of death; disoriented survivors, wandering among the corpses, crying out for their loved ones; images of injured survivors with burned eyes and skin peeling off from their faces, arms, and legs in big pieces.

I have an ominous feeling that chemical attacks will happen on Thursday. The White House mentioned intel today that indicates Putin may plan to use chemical or biological weapons and so far everything they communicate to the public seems to happen within a day or so. This is all so horrific.

Most media outlets have pulled all their reporters out of Russia. But today ABC's James Longman was reporting from Moscow! Get outta there James!

I do wonder R97 how many of those 190,000 soldiers are actually combatants as opposed to logistics or other less confrontational roles. I'm no military expert but they must have medics and other servicemen who don't or can't fight right? That would make the 24,000 wounded or dead soldiers quite significant.

Although based on the success of their logistics so far soldiers fulfilling that role must be scarce indeed.

LOL, R107! Once they find out that the U.S. had the first McPutins, it'll be back to the restaurant name drawing board. (The NYC restaurant changed its name from McPutins to Chi Chi's Chicken after the invasion.)

R93, the Pentagon ought to be more original. They already did that in Iraq and Syria - isn't it curious how every single country they want to demonize, resorts to exactly the same tactics within a few weeks? The OPCW already fumbled the Syria nonsense by producing a blatantly falsified report that was exposed by their own members, and Iraq's weapons of mass destruction never materialized at all.

These are just excuses to escalate things further, and we should be EXTREMELY weary of it all. We're talking about nuclear powers here, which have enough weapons to destroy all life on earth. Someone should tell the ghouls of the military industrial complex that they won't enjoy a few months of record profits if all life on earth is extinguished by a nuclear holocaust - I know they see themselves as above humanity but, sadly for them, they're far from gods.

Anyway R115 / R116, stop scaremongering. We all know that you are CIA spooks who have come here to magnify the feelings of hysteria over this issue. Isn't it curious that as soon as that evil murderer Victoria Nuland has been forced to admit that the US was financing military labs in Ukraine where chemical WMDs were developed, accusations against Russia are made? Please, be more original!

R11- "Russia’s Defense Ministry has now accused Ukraine of using U.S. money to create and develop biolabs that experimented with … coronavirus samples from bats, weaponising coronavirus."

Straight from the republican play book. Always accuse the other side of what they are doing.

R109. I still can’t get over how effectively Hillz exposed and totally destroyed Tulsi Gabbard! And to top it off this traitor was from my state of Hawaii. She’s since been run out of here. It’s all good.

The pitiful attempt to accuse Ukraine of using biological weapons while Xi can’t stock fellating Puttie’s micro penis.

I brought up the idea in the early part of this thread that it’s the separatist Russian army contingent from Donbas that is not acknowledging any cease fire on Mariupol. It would've been easy for them to travel south from the Donbas region and this time heavily armed southward.

They are a rogue group of pro-Russian separatists that do not adhere to orders from Moscow. Neither does Puttie take any responsibility for their atrocities. They also enjoy killing civilians. Something they got used to doing since they are inept and not properly trained on how to use weaponry and aim indiscriminately. Just as they mistakenly shot down that Malaysian commercial jet as it took off from Norway and entered their airspace in Donbas.

Any attempt to stop their attack on Mariupol is thus nothing but a lie. Anyone choosing to remain there will not survive. Somehow we need to get women, children and elderly out of there or find some drastic way to provide them with humanitarian aid so they can survive in bomb shelters until there’s an opportunity to evacuate.

Just like Victoria Nuland does here, R121?

"Yes, we have financed bio pathogen labs in Ukraine that could be used against Russia, but it's the Russians who are to blame! They want to use these weapons we paid for so a country that hates Russia could use them, but the Russians are the ones who will use them in the end, 'cause that's the Russian way: blame what you do on other people!"

Apparently, Killary protégée Nuland is a Republican, now?

Well, I see that we're halfway through the fifteenth day of the war and, once again, the mighty Russian army has yet to control the major cities. Thanks, R124, for the possible explanation of why the Russians are still bombing Mariupol even though they supposedly conquered the city—I'd wondered about that. I look forward to our resident troll's explanation that the attackers are actually Ukrainians perpetrating a "false flag" incident, or members of the "Azov Legion," or some other agents of anti-Russian mayhem. "Killary," perhaps?

You're right, r77, and I've said this before but it bears repeating: at least two of the pro-Russia trolls are people I have very high on my ignore list, meaning I must have blocked them over a year ago, long before this invasion.

I really believe we have some homegrown trolls who aren't paid at all but just looney enough to think that coming here every day and trolling is worthwhile.

Clint Watts has a great thread about what's happening with Russian disinformation at the moment (we see the same disinformation in our own DL trolls).

Thanks, R128—I think we can all share a sense of pride that OUR trolls were spreading these same lies days ago. DL trolls are always ahead of the curve!

Eastern cauldron closing in.

And here comes another Putin troll at R130. Block.

Already blocked, R131! In suspect a lot of trolls have been FF'd so many times they've magically disappeared from my feed—I myself haven't had to put anyone on ignore for at least a few days.

Really good thread discussing the cauldron.

Rather, block anyone who calls anyone else, including you, a troll. Invariably they're low-information types who can't look at this objectively and/or know nothing about Ukraine other than what's been said on TV in the last two weeks.

Or just don't block anybody, read or skip their posts and enjoy your life.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

So skip their posts but don't use the block feature to achieve that? Weird.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

R135, it eliminates all the paranoia and accusatory fluff from the ignorant. I want a curated experience.

Good discussion at Yale last week.

Ukraine foreign minister Dmytro Kuleba has once again reiterated that Ukraine is not going to surrender, which they (frustratingly) have to say repeatedly thanks to Russian disinfo that claims every few hours that they're just about to surrender any second now.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

No need for the fridge. Those burgers live on like Twinkies.

No thanks, I'm tired of dragging through naZi garbage and prefer to block. I don't even check in the trash anymore. Why bother?

Excuse my comment at r137, I said that because I didn't realize the troll obsessed with blocking people was posting on this thread, because I've (not coincidentally!) had him blocked for-fucking-ever.

Carry on.

Gentle r144: Your comment at r137 was actually my comment at r137.

I'm going to try to NOT derail the thread with this, r145, but you're incorrect, I'm r137. You're r135.

I was responding to your comment at r135 because I didn't understand what you were saying. Once I realized the troll who is obsessed with blocking is on this thread, I understood what you meant at r135.

The Kremlin is desperately trying to crack down on any dissent to the brutal invasion of Ukraine and a total of 13,500 demonstrators have now been arrested since the war was waged, 100 of them on Wednesday.

Anti-Putin sentiment is hitting the high street with consumers told to limit the number of items in their shopping baskets as sanctions start to bite.

Some say they may have to leave the country to secure a better life for their families, with Russians facing a return to the hardships of the 1990s when the country experienced food queues and hyperinflation after the fall of the Soviet Union.

One notice to shoppers in St Petersburg read: 'It is important that there are enough goods for everyone. We are forced to temporarily impose restrictions on high-demand goods. Up to ten pieces per purchase.'

There are suggestions that some groceries are already being rationed by Putin, who is anticipating a prolonged period without the normal influx of Western goods and money.

I stand corrected r146.

Good point, R142, but a country that may soon run out of toilet paper may not want to test the shelf life of Special Sauce.

From last night. Now the war is supposedly a way to get us to accept "lower living standards."

A tidbit of possible sunshine: UK has sanctioned Putin BFF Roman Abramovich, who was already trying to unload London properties and Chelsea FC.

Russian billionaire owner Roman Abramovich is sanctioned by UK government

Clarifying my R151 list -- sanctions mean the properties and FC sales are in limbo.

ROMAN Abramovich has been BANNED from selling Chelsea after being slapped with sanctions today for being a Putin crony.

The club was thrown into limbo this morning after the oligarch had his assets frozen and blocked from visiting or doing business in Britain.

Chelsea has been granted a special licence by the government to continue playing, allowing tonight's match against Norwich to kick off.

Fans who already have tickets will still be able to attend games, but the club is banned from selling any more tickets.

However The Sun understands Chelsea can still release tickets to rival clubs so their away fans can come to matches.

Chelsea is also forbidden from selling any club merchandise from its official stores. Strips can still be bought from shops like JD Sports but the club cannot get a cut.

Today's fresh round of sanctions will prevent a sale from happening unless ministers specifically allow it.

The Government "is open" to a sale but is clear Abramovich will not get a penny.

Under the terms of the licence - which expires on May 31 - players and staff can still be paid but Abramovich is barred from pumping anymore money into the club, leaving its future uncertain.

It will likely mean an effective salary freeze for stars who will not be awarded new contracts.

The club also has a £20,000 travel cap per game, meaning players and coaching staff could have to slum it rather than take private jets.

It includes a luxury Kensington Palace Garden mansion and penthouse in Chelsea.

Part of Abramovich's wealth also includes a Code d'Azur mansion which was lived in by King Edward, who abdicated the British throne in 1936, along with a bond style ski lodge and ranch in the US.

He bought Chelsea in 2003 but has not attended a match at Stamford Bridge for months.

The last home game attended by Abramovich was when Chelsea drew 1-1 with Man Utd at Stamford Bridge in November 2021.

The Blues owner was then seen celebrating when his side became champions of the world in Abu Dhabi on February 12 this year.

The billionaire was seen grinning holding the World Cup as Chelsea won 2-1 against Palmeiras.

Any video of lightly armed or unarmed fighting-age men going through the humanitarian corridors? I'm looking to see if they're UA troops or nationalist militia surrendering to go home or to Kiev to fight.

I'm thrilled the humanitarian corridors are holding, as it means fewer people die and things are actually substantively proceeding towards an end to the war.

They just have to do this about what, 20 more times? Odessa in two weeks or so?

R137 R151 R135 Who's on first.

I give the Ukrainian people credit. They keep holding. They have proven again and again they are not going to go gently into that good night. Good for them!

cut off all the oligarchs

Chernobyl plant disconnected from power grid

UN nuclear watchdog said it had lost contact with monitoring systems that transmit key data from Chernobyl.

Why can't the UK government let (or require) Abramovich sell Chelsea but prevent him from doing anything with the proceeds? That way Chelsea could continue business under new ownership with minimal disruption to the employees and fans.

Russia is temporarily suspending fertilizer exports.

CF popped on the news re fertilizer.

[quote]UN nuclear watchdog said it had lost contact with monitoring systems that transmit key data from Chernobyl.

Ah, jeez, that's upsetting.

Someone yesterday was saying that Zelensky's concerns about Chernobyl were "propaganda" and that really kind of pissed me off.

Food's headed higher.

R138 - That Russian soldier looks like a trannie. Just sayin' . . .

[quote]Or just don't block anybody, read or skip their posts and enjoy your life.

By the same token, you could let the trash pile up inside your home and just move around it.

R152/R151- Please excuse my embarrassing lack of knowledge, but does that mean that he will lose those properties? That would be the cherry on the karma pie.

I was also confused about that, r165, but they were replying to this troll on here who is going on and on about who he has blocked and who has blocked him. If you have that troll on ignore, you won't realize that r135 was replying to him specifically.

Goldman Sachs is leaving.

Conflicts that we now think of as uniting the country were still political. Americans were torn over what to do in World War II, for example. Congress passed a series of neutrality acts in the 1930s, and these isolationist policies were responsible for America’s late entry into the war. And, of course, unity sometimes came at a price. The U.S. government’s steps to punish anti-war speech during World War I, for instance, are good examples of going too far with the idea that dissent is inherently harmful to war efforts.

The reality is that foreign policy has always been contested — and, more often than not, linked to questions of identity and ideology. But debates about war are so interwoven with our larger culture-war politics now that most questions of how to handle military conflict have been largely reduced to partisan scoring. And that’s a problem — not because we need to get back to some bygone bipartisan era, but because real dissension is vital in a democracy, especially in matters of foreign policy.

I'm thinking perhaps things will flare up in Bosnia soon. It increases chaos in Europe and provides a distraction, though since it's the Serbs there's still the Russian angle.

Some of r134's other posts:

[quote]He's used chemical? Where?

[quote]I think "genocide" is overused. If it were genocide, why is he letting any Ukrainians through the border towards the EU? Why would he allow humanitarian corridors in the east to lead to the western border?

[quote]Putin can't let the war go on too long. The US wants this to drag on: it unifies NATO behind the US, ups military spending, and could be another 70s Afghanistan for Russia.

[quote]Zelensky can't do jack w/o US approval. There's no peace anytime soon.

[quote]Zelensky's family is probably in the EU somewhere. The US has access to them. Zelensky is going to obey the US, and it's going to drag on.

[quote]R42, posters who disagree with you aren't trolls. They just don't agree with you. Not everyone agrees with what CNN is telling everyone.

The Netherlands opposes Ukraine's EU application.

Ukrainians are burying their dead in pits because they can't have funerals. Someone needs to make Putin suffer.

I wondered why we weren't seeing a cyber war:

Russia temporarily suspends grain exports to the EU. The prohibition will remain in effect until August 31.

R173, Ukrainian troll!

Now Western Union is out.

Let Ukrainians — not Ukraine — join the EU

Letting the country join will take time, allowing its people to live and work here will not.

Abramovich's yacht left Spain this morning right before his sanctioning was announced. Perhaps UK can have a tete a tete on the high seas?

Yes R166, he has lost the London properties (~100Mil) and the FC ($2-3Bil). I imagine footie fans are upset (some still send nessages We Love You Roman), but I don't feel much sorrow for players who basked in the oligarchs' sunshine, including Brittney Griner.

Haha, Japan using Putie's bullshit against him to revisit the Kuril Islands dispute. Go on, Putie, tell us why the rationale behind your "historical" claim to Ukraine doesn't apply even more so here.

I know this is totally not important, but my brain is stuck on the Russian guy who filled his fridge with McDonald's. Has anyone ever tried to microwave their leftover McD's? Aside from maybe the chicken mcnuggets and fries, it is VILE when reheated.

Okay, that's my extremely important observation. Sorry.

Viler than the average Russian diet, R181? This is a nation that sent their troops to invade a neighboring country on MREs that expired in 2002.

I suspect the actual, humiliating strategic purpose of taking Kiev is to remove Ukraine's delectable chicken-dish reserves back to the Motherland.

[quote]Desperate Russian fills his entire fridge with McDONALD'S after the restaurant suspends trading over Ukraine… as others cash in by selling Big Mac meals for £250!

It'll be funny if the thing that finally makes the Russians overthrow Putin is the loss of Western products. Talk about humiliating for him.

R181 I'm sure that guy is so used to crap food he doesn't even care.

Maybe they'll have a McDonald's party this w/e

R183 I'm old enough to remember all the bargain basement commentary about how the breakup of the Soviet Union was all about things like designer blue jeans.

Colbert

Julia Ioffe @juliaioffe · 1h Hearing from several friends that there are now limits in Moscow grocery stores on how many items a person can buy at a time. Back in the U.S.S.R.

Zelinsky has announced Ukraine is no longer interested in joining NATO.

That’s step one.

Step 2 will be Russian takeover. The question is, will Russia allow Zelinsky to stay in charge for a little while if he promises to be pro-Russia. He cannot stay long term as Ukraine president if he does. He’ll have to go in a year or so & be replaced by a hand picked Putin slave. Or will Zelinsky immediately leave and Putin outs a puppet in place.

The father of the president of Chechnya was a huge leader of the opposition in Chechnya. Then he switched sides. He was assassinated but his son took over and was first prime minister, then president of Chechnya and has been for 20 years. There are millions of pro-Russians in Ukraine. Putin already has someone waiting in the wings. You can thank Paul Manifirt, Roger Stone & Peter Gates for this shit. He’ll, we’ve got tons of pro Russians in the US. Mike Flynn, his brother, Tulsi Gabbard, Jill Stein, Ron Johnson, John Kennedy…….

[quote]Zelinsky has announced Ukraine is no longer interested in joining NATO.

Link, r189?

N. N

R189 wouldn't it be easier to split the country, and let Ukrainian speakers take the western part, and the Russians take the eastern and southern (Odessa)?

…… ….

I’ve heard Putin wants Kyiv, no matter what.

McDonald's closing its stores is probably the only way to keep trump out of Russia.

The Times of India argument is quite a far cry from what R189 (who spells the president's name wrong) claims.

Funny that, r196.

Yes, we know he's flexible re NATO membership now. That was two days ago. It's in the previous thread.

The thing is, he said it as part of a passive-aggressive criticism of NATO's refusal to help, so I'm not sure how serious he was.

Here, R196. It’s from Yahoo

“Regarding NATO, I have cooled down regarding this question long ago after we understood that NATO is not prepared to accept Ukraine," Zelensky told ABC News in an exclusive interview that aired Monday night.

Zelensky added: "The alliance is afraid of controversial things and confrontation with Russia. I never wanted to be a country which is begging something on its knees. We are not going to be that country, and I don't want to be that president."

Luxury homes for sale in Kiev.

In addition to his NATO comments, Zelensky said on Tuesday that he was open to discussions about the control of Russian-backed separatist regions in eastern Ukraine, which could be an opening for peace talks with Russia.

"It is important to me how people who want to be part of Ukraine will live there. I am interested in the opinion of those who see themselves as citizens of the Russian Federation. However, we must discuss this issue," Zelensky said.

R199 yes the impression I have is Zelenskyy's attitude is more "fuck NATO" than "this is a fair concession to Russia."

R201 The taste factor should be reported as a war crime to the International Criminal Court at The Hague.

[quote]Haha, Japan using Putie's bullshit against him

Japan kicked russia's ass once. . . .

Just posted by The Duran.

"No Fly Zone" Is A Euphemism For A Declaration Of War - Amb. Michael McFaul

Some pundits on Russian state TV have begun to sound the alarm about sanctions.

yeah, it's not a good idea. no-fly is about shooting air force units out of the air. that is possible with something like Iraq, not a country like Russia with a nuclear arsenal her size

also, many comments on this thread are meaningless to me as they reference posters who I blocked years ago. gaps of six or seven posts drift by. . . .

R208, that's cute that they think all the sanctions will just go bye-bye when the "special operation" stops. Putin created this new reality for Russia; if they don't like it, they can apply to China.

Some nice Ukraine trolling:

Head of Anti-corruption agency of Ukraine sent a letter to Russian defense minister Shoigu thanking him for embezzlement of Russian army

[quote]Has anyone ever tried to microwave their leftover McD's?

The cheeseburgers are fine, the thicker burgers can't really be reheated. Nuggets are fine in the oven. Use the fries to pave your driveway if they're more than 20 minutes old.

I think the dust bunnies under my bed are worth more than the ruble at this point.

If Russia escalates its demands as threatens should negotiations fail, what might they ask for? What will be the "5th" demand? Odessa?

FAT WHORES REJOICE: DL has an expert on reheating McDonald's food!

OK, back to the subject, it will be interesting to see how committed NATO countries and the rest of the world are to keep Russia in check and how after this war ends (which of course likely depends on how it ends). Even if Putin raised the white flag right now and withdrew all troops, I think he reached a point of no return where the international community has realized Russia is too big and corrupt and dangerous to simply go back to status quo.

burn, baby, burn

Zelensky probably still wants to be in NATO, I think anyone in his position would, but he said a couple of days ago that he had "cooled" on the idea and would no longer demand it because NATO is "afraid of Russia," plus he felt at that point that continued requests to join were basically "begging on our knees" which I'm sure didn't sit well with him.

I did see a couple of news outlets (including a French one) say that he was making a concession to Russia but I think that's more analysis and opinion than fact.

[quote]FAT WHORES REJOICE: DL has an expert on reheating McDonald's food!

You flatter me, but I'm no expert, just an enthusiast.

Russia used ceasefires and humanitarian corridors in Syria as 'tactics' to buy time and repositioning forces, says the Washington Institute's Anna Borshchevskaya.

"Borshchevskaya"? Those Russian names.

Regarding Chernobyl:

While the IAEA is not getting current information, they see no immediate threat. We can pick up radiation levels via satellite, and any leaks would be quickly detected by neighboring countries.

Apparently, power was restored this morning.

Fucking with Chernobyl would be an act of insanity. The worst Fallout from the meltdown impacted Belarus, not Ukraine.

The Russians moved through Chernobyl because it was the easiest pathway to Kiev. Nobody lives there, so they weren't likely to encounter resistance. Any increases in radiation we've seen is because the moving army has kicked up dust and dirt that is radioactive.

[quote] the impression I have is Zelenskyy's attitude is more "fuck NATO" than "this is a fair concession to Russia."

Of course he’s framing it as the fault of NATO. He’s been swearing to fight to the last man since the beginning. But it was to boost morale of his people. They wanted to put up a fight and they did.

Putin blasted Grozny to dust & he’d do the same to Kyiv. Putin has absolutely no fucks to give. He’s been strengthening the Russian military for years, coming up with long range missiles and supersonic drones that can be fitted with nuclear warheads. He’s been buzzing US Navy ships and putting submarines all over the planet in threatening positions (near international communications cables). And what was done about it? Nothing.

Nothing was done about Crimea except some weak sauce sanctions. How well did those sanctions work, now that we know Russia spent those 7years under sanctions beefing up its military & planning an attack on Ukraine? They didn’t work very well.

You believe ridiculous propaganda like “look! Outdated military rations!” As if they couldn’t be faked and as if they weren’t left behind in 2014 when Russia moved into Crimea. Cities are being crushed, hospitals are being bombed, tanks are surrounding cities & you’re excited about leftover rations.

Putin is the most dangerous person on the earth. Not Un, not Xi, but Putin. Go do a search on “Russia new weapons, new aircraft, new missiles” and see how “incompetent” this guy is. Do “Russian enters airspace/ waters” search to see how often he’s been testing what he can get away with.

This guy who started & won wars in Chechnya, Georgia, Armenia, South Ossetia, Artsakh, Nagorno-Karabakh, Crimea and Transnistra.

Just because you never heard of those conflicts doesn’t mean they didn’t exist. Putin’s been causing armed conflicts across the Caucusus and Eastern Europe since he got into power, all the while the west has been obsessed with celebrity reality stars and culture wars.

Now go ahead and tell me I’m licking Putin’s taint while I tell you about wars you have no fucking clue happened because our media couldn’t be bothered to cover them. And let me tell you this…I don’t think there’s anything stopping Putin from going into Lithuania. NATO won’t risk world war for the Baltics. America knows Russia can now reach us with nukes that don’t require clunky intercontinental ballistic missiles. And Putin doesn’t care. He’s isnt crazy or stupid. He’s devoted to war, conquest and covetous power. He’s a modern day Ghengis Khan who doesn’t give a fuck how many people die. He wants to be the most powerful man on earth and I hate to tell you but it’s starting to look like he is. Nobody has stopped him so far. If he was weak, if the Russian military was an underfunded flop, and if Russia was just itching to rise up and depose him, we’d be in Ukraine fighting right now, just like we fought in Syria, Iraq & Afghanistan.

He knows he can go further. He knows the west is afraid of him. It’s only been 2 weeks, not 20 years since he entered Ukraine.

I'm surprised that post didn't give you carpal tunnel, r223.

he entered ukraine long ago

Ukraine can not defeat Russia but Russia can lose even if they defeat Ukraine. In two weeks, they have gained about 20% of the country. There's alot more to "conquer."

[quote]The Russians moved through Chernobyl because it was the easiest pathway to Kiev.

That, but it wasn't just that. There was absolutely an element of psych warfare there as well. Shelling ANYTHING in the vicinity of Chernobyl would set off a wave of hysterical coverage and there's no way Putie didn't intend that.

R212 that’s brilliant. I am sure that part of the Russian military issues are absolutely related to funds going into pockets.

About Chernobyl, I just want mention to people who might not be aware that some of the Christian nationalists who support Putin believe that Chernobyl is the bitter star of Revelations. This belief goes back to the 1980s at least, So there’s another potential non-rational reason for what is going on.

And finally I am sure the sanctions would go away if the Oligarchs/generals overthrew Putin and agreed to immediately de-nuke.

Well, that is the thing r223. You are not wrong about those other wars, but that is because we really didn't give a damn, deep down. There was some mooing and moaning, but you are right, nothing real came out of all that. But now the U.S. and the rest of NATO, and all of Western Europe and a great deal more actually care. And that will make all the difference in the world. He is not a modern day Genghis Khan in that he doesn't actually have the best fighting force in the world. He has very, very, very much the second best, or maybe third or fourth. Not sure, but it ain't looking great right now. Can he "win" in Ukraine, like Russia and then we "won" in Afghanistan, in a very temporary way? Oh, probably. But long term, the situation for Putin looks very bleak indeed. Sometimes presiding over a thoroughly corrupt and dishonest regime has its drawbacks. Sometimes those lies and corruptions come back to haunt you, when you realize your army is just kind of shitty after all and those generals and oligarchs have been lying to you about what is actually happening with it. This may be one of those times.

[quote]I don’t think there’s anything stopping Putin from going into Lithuania. NATO won’t risk world war for the Baltics

That's absurd. Any attack on a NATO country will be an attack on the alliance and they'll defend and retaliate.

France, UK and US have nukes. If Putin is so dumb as to pull that trigger, he'll get hit by those nukes within 10 seconds.

And so will we.

US Government Agency Sent $500,000 Of Taxpayer Funds To Russian Animal Testing Lab

The ‘monstrous’ experiments involved cutting and removing sections of the animals’ brains

...

Threatening national security

Congressperson Lisa McClain (R-MI) voiced her disapproval of the findings. In a statement sent to Plant Based News, she said: “Our tax dollars should never be sent to state-run labs in adversary nations like Russia and China that threaten our national security.

“My AFAR Act would prohibit tax dollars from being shipped to animal testing labs in any countries that are deemed foreign adversaries,” she added, referring to the Accountability in Foreign Animal Research (AFAR) Act.

Mackie Burr, vice president at WCW, shared similar thoughts.

“Taxpayers shouldn’t be forced to pay white coats in the Russian government to torture and kill cats in wasteful treadmill experiments,” Burr commented. “As White Coat Waste Project exposed, there are four Kremlin-run animal testing labs that NIH has authorized to receive our money and U.S. sanctions against Russia should include defunding them.”

...

Three years ago...

'This Is A Nightmare For China': Why Joe Thinks Putin's War Spells Doom For China's Plans

I see by the clock on the wall that another sun has set upon a day's fighting in Ukraine, and Putin still doesn't control Kyiv or Kharkiv. And for some reason the Russians are still bombarding Mariupol as if they didn't hold it.

fascinating that the trolls are pushing this biolabs thing hard, which is blatant Russian propaganda. I mean, the US gives money to bio research in a lot of countries, including the Chinese lab the virus is alleged to have originated from!

The counter-sanctions start but we all know that the sanctions war will hurt the Russian Federation more: "Russia bans wheat, meslin, rye, barley, and corn exports to Eurasian Economic Union countries until August 31"

And now J. P. Morgan is OUTTA there.

The lying the Russians are engaging in simply isn't believable to anyone except the hardcore. First Lavrov said today that the Russians haven't attacked Ukraine at all, now they're saying that the photos are of actors.

Here's a good thread about Lavrov's stepdaughter, just illustrating 1 example of how insanely wealthy the people close to Putin become. It's how he keeps them loyal to him (and why I have doubts that there'll be a traditional coup).

Hey, guess which bank's status with Russia is "hey it's complicated"?

Deutsche Bank. (just stated today that they won't be pulling out of business in Russia anytime soon)

Things that make you go hmmm....

Quelle surprise.

The amount of dirty Russian money floating around London is staggering. Lavrov's daughter needs to be kicked out of the UK and her million dollar apartment confiscated.

Londongrad

These people....

Massive crush of people at Victoria’s Secret in Moscow doing their last bit of lingerie shopping before the brand shuts down.

I am picturing weeping Russian matrons eating reheated Quarter Pounders in their lacy lingerie (tags still attached), bits of cold fries falling into their cleavage. Sic transit gloria mundi.

“I had to wait in line but successfully bought my favorite lingerie,” said Marina, 29, at a packed central Moscow store. She is angered with the company’s decision.

“I’m upset they are closing, but it shows the West don’t understand Putin needs to rid Ukraine of so many Nazis to make us safe. Why are the US and Britain so blind?”

R248, her country's economy is about to crumble and she's off buying lingerie? What a gullible idiot.

All those boys not getting proper burials will drive a lot of their mothers insane. And Putin and his cronies have no idea of how bad that will bite them in their asses.

Russia is going to seize McDonald’s stores and reopen them under state control. Back in the USSR, baby.

So tasteless. The head of RT, Simonyan, tweets a new song lyric:

"European, tell it like it is,

Speak up:

The Russian is your new kike,

You want to burn us all in an oven."

They can turn Victoria's Secret into Putin's Panties.

R240, interesting. If the maternity ward had "long been taken" by the Azov Battalion, one of our Russian defenders here could find a contemporaneous news article reporting when it happened. Surely the pravda-telling Russian media didn't just let something like that go unnoticed?

Jeans as well:

"@juliaioffe

Wow. There are now reports that the sewing factory "Bolshevichka" ("Bolshevik woman") will dust off its Soviet-era equipment and begin producing jeans now that companies like Levi's have left the Russian market. Is this real or am I dreaming?"

Sky News: Boris Johnson now stating Russia might use chemical weapons Why use this kind of rhetoric? It plays into Putin's hand IMO.

Da, is true! Russian fashion will again be envy of world!

R256 To counter Russian disinformation. If you tell people they're likely to do this (and they absolutely are, given what they've signalled) in advance, fewer people are likely to believe Russian lies about it.

This is almost sad. How much Russia sucks at propaganda. Okay, it's kind of hilarious. But it's inevitably what happens when it becomes so overwhelmingly corrupt and fraudulent that it becomes lazy. The Soviet propaganda machine no doubt started out smart and skillful. It took a lot of clever advertising strategy, at first. But eventually it became fat, dumb, and lazy, churning out shit, not expecting anybody to believe it and not really caring because who cares what the peasants really think anyway. And that is the world Putin inherited. And now he needs real propagandists, and they just suck so much they can't help him. False Flag! Crisis Actors! Fake News! Jesus Fuck!

"[R248], her country's economy is about to crumble and she's off buying lingerie? What a gullible idiot."

True, but what's disturbing is that there's a LOT of gullible idiots. Gullible along with being ego-driven, wanting to be on the "winning" side. Brainwashing of large numbers of people is common and that's scary. People (not all obviously) absolutely want to be led and told what's the truth and told what to do.

Zelensky just now (and by the way he looks and sounds completely exhausted, the poor guy): "This really worries me, because more than once we have found if you want to find out Russia's plans, you should look at what Russia is accusing others of. [....] There is no chemical or any other weapon of mass destruction is being developed on our land."

R249, honestly, not so dumb. Things like lingerie will very soon be a luxury item in Russian and will be very valuable in the black market.

R259, makes you realize that the US rightwingers all use the same stupid rhetoric, “winning” and “fake news” bullshite

R256, for several days, there’s been a big Russian PR push—from FOX News to trolls on DL—trying to sell the idea that Ukraine has chemical and biological weapons. This alone, absent any other information from intelligence sources, should tell you that Russia is planning chemical attacks.

"@maria_avdv

Russia has just attacked the Kharkiv Institute of Physics and Technology. There is an experimental nuclear reactor there. A nearby dormitory is also on fire. Personnel staying in the shelter, shelling continues. Russia systematically attacks nuclear facilities in Ukraine."

Putin uses bully rhetoric to alarm the West into paralysis. It's such bullshit. He's not going to do shit except what he's doing now. I say get the NFZ up and running.

@biannagolodryga

Good lord. 2 weeks of mass destruction and they’re still looking for a casus belli.

“Russia wants UN meeting over 'US biological activities' in Ukraine”

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

FYI R268 posted these posts:

"Tucker addressed the biolabs today."

"Shut down the labs ASAP."

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

FYI R270 is the same poster as R268. He is spreading pro-Russia propaganda.

SCANDAL!!!!!

Meta, the parent company of Facebook and Instagram, has confirmed that it is changing its rules on violent speech in several countries because of the Ukraine invasion.

The company says that it has "temporarily" made allowances for violent speech - for example “death to the Russian invaders” - that would usually break its rules.

Meta said, though, it won’t allow credible calls for violence against Russian civilians.

The internal emails discussing the policy were obtained by Reuters, and have not been seen by the BBC.

The Reuters report says that posts that call for death to Russian President Vladimir Putin or Belarusian President Alexander Lukashenko will be allowed in several countries.

The temporary policy change allowing for calls for violence against Russian soldiers applies to Armenia, Azerbaijan, Estonia, Georgia, Hungary, Latvia, Lithuania, Poland, Romania, Russia, Slovakia, and Ukraine, according to one email.

FYI R272 posted this:

"R4, what happened was that the Ukrainian nazi scum set up their camp near the hospital in Mariupol with the evil intent that Russians won't hit it. Using pregnant women as a shield.

Thanks to a precision strike by the glorious Russian military nobody died, babies are alive and all everyone escaped safely with just some cuts and bruises.

Don't believe Zelensky propaganda."

Puttie big mad:

Ukraine war: Putin 'fires eight generals and rages at FSB' over battlefield failures, Kyiv says | Daily Mail Online

How many days has Mariupol been without electricity, heat, water (and food) now? It gets down in the 20s at night and barely above freezing during the day, shit. Old people, little kids, everyone freezing and hungy and terrorized by constant explosions and shelling. Fuck.

Soldiers helping evacuate pets.

That’s what gets me, all these people running for their lives clutching their pets.

You'd think they'd surrender but they're not. Wonder what's up Mariupol. 🤔

Putin needs to burn in hell for this.

Lavrov said the longer they fight, the more demands Russia will add to the current list.

Ukraine won't look like Ukraine without a coastline.

The latest map.

[quote]How many days has Mariupol been without electricity, heat, water (and food) now? It gets down in the 20s at night and barely above freezing during the day, shit. Old people, little kids, everyone freezing and hungy and terrorized by constant explosions and shelling. Fuck.

The deputy mayor says 1200 civilians are dead but he believes the number is much higher.

Putin, Russia and it's people should rot in hell.

Marie Yovanovitch looks fantastic with Chris Hayes tonight. The gray bob makes her look younger.

The Red Cross says conditions in Mariupol are "apocalyptic."

Trying to escape by wading across the river, carrying their kids on their backs.

Will the EU start to take Ukraine’s membership seriously?

Analysis: Zelenskiy once played a TV president turned down by Merkel, but how real are his country’s prospects

Reminds me of the Korean War, R285.

Lay off the Russian people, R282. They didn’t ask for this and they’ll be the ones to suffer the effects of these sanctions, not Putin. And a lot of them, the ones who can afford to, are fleeing Russia too.

So Pooty appears to have three things in common with old uncle Adolf:

a. drugs;

b. batshit fucking crazy (cf: drugs;

c. worst military strategist ever.

Anything else I'm forgetting?

He's short!

Poor judge of own looks

f. Obsession with bringing back lost empires and settling old scores.

R285 is that photo real? It does not look real.

Bioweapon labs in Ukraine. The fact checkers screwed up.

White people trying to wrangle POC into their drama.

Not happening.

Thanks Boris at R294, but in classic Faux News style Fucker doesn't actually directly quote her nor show any clip or transcript of what she said.

She did not say the Biden Administration funds bioweapons labs in Ukraine. Fucker made that up.

[quote] doesn't actually directly quote her nor show any clip or transcript of what she said.

That was yesterday, r296. It was in the last thread. Enjoy.

Western entitlement.

Thanks R297. Very nice of you to demonstrate she did not say the Biden Administration funds secret bio weapon labs and Fucker is a big fat liar.

3:40

We gotta help these guys.

Fox News "Invasion Expert" is Trump-Appointed Putin Propagandist

Again, all the trolls posts are blocked out by trolls from years ago. Either the trolls are us, or the russky cunts have been here for a while

Selling a war.

Troll seems quite concerned that he/she/it is perceived as a troll.

Imagine that.

No sweetie, having differing opinions doesn't make you a troll. Bulk-shitposting hysterically false Kremlin-generated horseshit over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over makes you troll.

Many of us can't see (most of) the trolls; we can only see the responses to the trolls. This thread is going by very rapidly without a whole lot being said, partly because of the troll posts, but I think also partly because there's so little new to report in Ukraine, where civilians are getting blown up and the Russians are on the verge of taking Kyiv for the fifteenth damn day in a row.

R285 photo is faux. Looks like a pic from years ago.

Does the EU and/or NATO actually want Ukraine? Russia will always have issues with Ukraine and then the EU or NATO is obligated to get directly involved. What's the upside? Natural resources, agriculture commodities, a sense of doing the right thing?

R308, it very much matters what Ukraine itself wants, which is to be a democracy. It's the principle of self-determination. Plus a lot of natural resources and agricultural commodities, those too.

Why do many Brits on news stations pronounce Vlad's name "Pyu-tin"? WTF?

Same reason they say "nica-RAG-yoo-a."

Whoa. Just blocked 294, and a good chunk of the thread disappeared.

Every once in awhile I will go through my trolldar and clear it out. That was clearly a mistake.

bloombergbusiness-------- Russia's government moved closer to seizing and even nationalizing foreign-owned companies that are leaving the market over the invasion of Ukraine.

In its first explicit response to the exodus of foreign businesses from Ikea to McDonald's, the Economy Ministry has outlined new policies to take temporary control of departing companies where foreign ownership exceeds 25%.

The Kremlin is also drawing up measures to coax other companies into staying, with a spokesman saying the country should remain an attractive destination for investors from countries that aren't waging an "economic war" against it.

‘A necessary war’: reporting on the Ukraine ‘disagreement’ outside the west

Venezuela says Putin is a victim, China blames the US, and a South African pundit calls out western hypocrisy

.....

The west v Russia: why the global south isn’t taking sides

The map of global participation in the sanctions against Russia suggests a new non-aligned movement might be on the rise

I think she's implying that this is a #wypipo thing.

Yes because they dirt fucking poor and can now got to do biz in Russia. Previously, their products and services were too shit and couldn't compete with the legit companies from USA and Europe. Now, they have a chance but Russians are fucking broke and got no money.

So…this Biolabs thing is not Russian disinformation but is a real thing?

I don’t even know who or what to believe anymore..

[quote]this Biolabs thing is not Russian disinformation but is a real thing?

It's real, but the Russians are lying about it. The Russians built it, the U.S. & Ukraine jointly took over management of it after to fall of the USSR. It is NOT being used to make bioweapons as the Russians are claiming.

R312 - Thanks for the pro-tip! I did the same and it cleaned the shit right away👍

"Putin offered Russian citizens a social contract-- he would provide economic stability and growth in return for them accepting his autocratic rule. With his idiotic war in Ukraine, Putin has now not held up up his side of this bargain."

The other day I saw a graph which showed how the ruble fell after every time Putin invaded a foreign country and never really recovered. Another big argument for Putin was that he provided 'political stability' but I don't think people mean a totalitarian dictatorship by that. One of the protestors in Moscow who was arrested took a decoy phone and secretly recorded the police with her other phone and it's horrifying to read the transcript. They hit her, cruelly insulted her, did not respect her rights, etc. Things are regressing a lot in Russia and it really is necessary for someone to get Putin out but how?

I have doubts it will happen but 73% of European respondents to a new Reuters/Ipsos poll said they would support a move by the U.S. and NATO allies to enforce a no-fly zone over Ukraine, even if that brought NATO into conflict with Russia’s military.

Dnipro airstrikes

Update from Mariupol, now 6 days into siege, from Mayor Boichenko: “Airstrikes on residential districts every thirty minutes, killing civilians. Last 2 days have been hell, an armageddon made by Russian fascists. Today they shelled a rescue unit.”

Hmmmm, China has been toeing Russia's propaganda lines so far but maybe there are some small cracks if this story is true:

Russia says China refuses to supply aircraft parts after sanctions

March 10 (Reuters) - China has refused to supply Russian airlines with aircraft parts, an official at Russia's aviation authority was quoted by Russian news agencies as saying on Thursday, after Boeing (BA.N) and Airbus (AIR.PA) halted supply of components.

Agencies including Interfax quoted Valery Kudinov, a Rosaviatsia official responsible for maintaining airplane airworthiness, as saying that Russia would look for opportunities to source parts from countries including Turkey and India after a failed attempt to obtain them from China.

Chynna was trying to improve her reputation around town, then she started dating that trashy Vlad. How soon before she protests, "I don't know him"?

"In areas captured in southern Ukraine, the Russian government is already arresting and searching the homes of activists from the Crimean Tatar community. (The Crimean Tatars, who are Muslim, are indigenous to Crimea, where the Kremlin has been persecuting them since 2014.)"

"Russian lawmakers just passed legislation that will introduce nationwide electronic voting (which is extremely vulnerable to manipulation by the authorities). This will make election monitoring virtually impossible. The Kremlin is clearly bracing for declining real popularity."

The Russians are trying to mobilize reservists and volunteers in Dagestan, offering minimum pay of 177,369RUB. The average salary in Dagestan is 31k, so this is almost 6 times the average salary..

[quote]I am picturing weeping Russian matrons eating reheated Quarter Pounders in their lacy lingerie (tags still attached), bits of cold fries falling into their cleavage. Sic transit gloria mundi.

You forgot the now greasy Ikea pillow she's hugging to herself with her non-Big Mac encumbered arm.

[quote]You forgot the now greasy Ikea pillow

I beg your pardon?

I check the Institute for the Study of War which does reports on the Ukraine conflict.

Russia is really screwed. Some key parts from today's:

KEY POINTS: "Russian forces continue to struggle in efforts to seize Chernihiv city and to secure the long ground lines of communication from Sumy, which the Ukrainians still hold, to eastern Kyiv." "Russian forces remain pinned down attempting to reduce Mariupol by siege and bombardment." "Russian efforts to bypass Mykolayiv and establish a reliable ground line of communication across the Southern Bug River to the north of Mykolayiv remain stalled."

KYIV AXIS: "Individual Russian attacks at roughly regiment size reported on March 8-9 may represent the maximum scale of offensive operations Russian forces can conduct on this axis at any one time. Russian forces will likely require a period longer than the previous operational pauses of 48-72 hours to sufficiently reinforce their forces to resume advances on Kyiv, if they are able to at all."

OVERALL: "There are as yet no indications that the Russian military is reorganizing, reforming, learning lessons, or taking other measures that would lead to a sudden change in the pace or success of its operations, although the numerical disparities between Russia and Ukraine leave open the possibility that Moscow will be able to restore rapid mobility or effective urban warfare to the battlefield."

r330 Dagestan is an Islamic Republic and home to Khabib the UFC champion one of the most popular and recognized Muslim in the world

Putin already sent his Muslim Chechen dogs to Ukraine where his propagandist began to frame this war as Muslims vs Nato. By dragging another Muslim province into this conflict he can now harness the widespread anti-Americanism in the Muslim world to his side.

Several points I wish we could address here on DL:

Why aren’t US/NATO not imposing similar sanctions on Belarus which is clearly supporting Russia? On the news, NATO air surveillance clearly showed Belarus allowing Russian Air Force jets to use their airports?

Can satellite images reveal exactly where artillery and missiles are being launched from Russian strongholds used to bombard Mariupol? Can we provide exact intelligence locations that Ukraine forces can use to take out these relentless artillery fire. If it is artillery, any rocket launcher/anti-tank weaponry can wipe them out. ( I understand artillery can be moved quickly, but any offense is better than allowing a continuous bombing of Mariupol. Just get these civilians out now!).

Why are Ukrainian forces not using anti-tank missiles to take out each Russian tank in that 40-mile line up?

Why are the US sending in Patriot missiles into Poland? Why are they not sending this weapon into Ukraine?

Does anyone think not all Refugees need to go into Poland/Hungary/Moldova, etc.? It looks safe enough in Lviv?

Why is the US the only nation sending $billions$ of aid to Ukraine? WTF is Germany and fucking France sending not sending any $$$$$? Is the US taxpayers supposed to pay for everything again? Do these f-ing European countries think the US is THEIR atm machine? JFC this is war is happening in Europe, their own backyard! The US should donate money only if it’s matched by the EU!

"@AndreiSoldatov

Putin appears to be truly unhappy with the FSB in Ukraine: he attacked the 5 Service SOiMS (FSB's foreign Intelligence branch). Sergei Beseda, head of the Service, and his deputy Bolukh, head of the DOI, placed under house arrest, according to my sources inside."

"@maryilyushina

Would be big if confirmed: @AndreiSoldatov outlet says the reasons for measures against these agents are the theft of funds allocated for subversive and undercover work in Ukraine, as well as false information about the political situation in Ukraine."

Putin and Shoigu announce that 16,000 men from the Middle East will be going to fight in Ukraine. He seems locked on this :S

The UN says 2.5 million people have now fled Ukraine and another 2 million have been forced from their homes inside Ukraine.

R337. That won't end well. Mercenaries fight for gold or plunder. Even if they do end up seizing Ukraine, how can Putin guarantee those 16,000 men will submit to him? They could easily carve up their own little fiefdom.

[quote]Why is the US the only nation sending $billions$ of aid to Ukraine?

R335, you're wrong about that.

"This latest assistance package brings the total amount of UK Government aid pledged to Ukraine this year to £140 million. Last week the Prime Minister also announced the UK would guarantee up to $500 million of loans to Ukraine through Multilateral Development Banks.

The UK also continues to supply defensive military equipment to the Ukrainian military to bolster their resistance against invading Russian forces"

Max Blumenthal already exposed in 2018, that the US, UK, Sweden, Poland and France were providing training and weapons to the Azov Battalion and S-14. This is not something new and it has been building up to cause a confrontation with Russia since before 2014.

That must be one of the stories that makes Max Blumenthal so much in demand as a commentator on right-wing broadcasts like Tucker Carlson's show and on Russia Today.

One of the reasons why Trump was so detested by the Washington establishment is because he temporarily stopped sending economic and military support to Ukraine, which he rapidly reversed when the military undustrial complex's lobby demanded that this were reversed. Quite interesting.

R342, since when is denouncing radical Nazism something that right wing people would do? The only reason why the so-called "Left" isn't against the war, is because they are beholden to the energy companies and military industrial complex, which have been demanding a war with Russia and opening the European energy market to US operators, for decades. Also, the one and only person in the entirety of the FOX network who opposes this particular war, is Tucker Carlson - in fact, he is one of the very few dissenting voices in both the left and right. It's only natural that he would invite anyone who is anti-war, regardless of their political orientation.

As far as RT is concerned, have you ever even watched it? They invited all sorts of people and the fact that they've been censored is only a testament to the fact that we live in a covert totalitarian regime. If we refuse to hear the other side's arguments and we don't want to ask any questions and negotiate, something is going seriously wrong and it simply means that we cannot defend our position - thus, we must silence those people whose arguments can effectively nullify our own.

R340. So the UK will give Ukraine a budget busting £140 million = US$13 billion. Seems about “equal” to retards.

[quote] The only reason why the so-called "Left" isn't against the war, is because they are beholden to the energy companies and military industrial complex

So "the war" is Ukraine's aggression against Russia? Otherwise you would have said "for the war." The convolutions here! FYI right-wingers denounce Nazis all the time while opposing antifascism; it's called rhetoric and hypocrisy. Putin's repeated line is that he's fighting a Nazi government in Kyiv—even while he advances an illiberal nationalist autocracy in Russia. You're either trusting to the point of naïveté, or a pro-Putin troll.

Well….I’m guessing no one hear can answer these questions.

Your questions are readily answered by a quick google; some have already been answered above and on other threads. Most of us are either still asleep, or tired of the ingenuous and disingenuous questions that clog up these threads.

[quote] Why are the US sending in Patriot missiles into Poland? Why are they not sending this weapon into Ukraine?

R335 if the US military handed your the keys to a Patriot missile system would you have even the first clue about how to operate it? If given some training, how long would it take before you could competently use it? You can’t just “give” a Patriot missile system to someone, even to another military. These systems are incredibly complex and require dozens of skilled people to operate and maintain - giving such a system to Ukraine by default means putting U.S. military personnel on the ground in Ukraine.

[quote]As far as RT is concerned, have you ever even watched it?

Pretty gutsy:

An American in Kharkiv yesterday.

Nice, well done Kazakhstan. I did see that Air Astana said that they have had to quit flying to Russia because they can't get insurance for flying to/from Russia or over Russia, so sanctions have been affecting them too.

Guys, R335 is just asking questions, OK? And is very hurt that we all haven't dropped everything to answer his incredibly stupid questions.

Completely benign questions too I am sure. Like why isn’t the US sanctioning Belarus.

Oh look a squirrel.

@holger_r

I talked with an Estonian analyst who has access to info and who I regard as one of the best we have here. His main conclusion: "The danger is far from over but there is reason for a very cautious optimism. Russian advance has clearly stalled."

Since last Sat it's been relatively stable on the fronts. There is an expectation of a reforming of RU units and a new line of attack, but so far little evidence of it. "If Russia doesn't achieve a remarkable advance by end of week, difficult to see how it should come at all."

The sth line of attack has split in 2, one advancing twd Mykolaiv, the other to Kryvyi Rih. This is serious risk to RU forces as the supply lines, which we already know are crap, will be dragged even longer. "This leaves the Ukrainians plenty of chance to 'beat them to pieces'.

The question is if Moscow today forces Lukashenko to send in the troops from Belarus, but BY troops' motivation is even lower than that of RU. "The Western-Ukrainian national & anti-Russian environment would be extra hostile towards them."

The idea of bringing in Syrian fighter is extra desperate. "One thing is to fight in the narrow streets of Arabian cities. It's something else in Kyiv or Kharkiv where the boulevards are 100m wide." Also refers to cold climate and low morale of Syrians.

About possible mobilization in RU. That was on the agenda last Friday in Fed Council and duma but allegedly high-ranking military re-convinced Putin. "Reserve units have no training, they even don't have enough uniforms for them."

"They've included very few reservists in Zapad exercises. Of the few thousand they usually include, the officers complain about them "messing up" the exercise."

Fatigue of RU units "massive". A third has been replaced, but incoming units have even worse quality. Another third has been destroyed, killed or wounded. Re-formation of units doesn't have a good impact on combat capability.

Ukraine's counter-offensive has so far been small-scale but when RU stalls, they have resources to start pressing. First aim would be to drive RU out of country in the North (Kyiv and Kharkiv).

It will be more difficult to gain back ground in South, also because of terrain. "In steppe you will be an open target from air."

Regarding Russia's shortage of missiles. "Putin was told he had 10,000 missiles. In fact, he had 1,000. It's peculiar he didn't remember how he was lying to his own bosses as a young KGB officer. Such lying is common in the culture."

[quote] "Reserve units have no training, they even don't have enough uniforms for them."

They seem to have proceeded to the Volkssturm phase of this war in record time—took Hitler half a decade.

Unconfirmed reports of another top Russian officer killed in Ukraine: Maj. Gen. Andriy Kolesnikov, 29th Army of the Eastern Military District. (if confirmed, it would be at least the 3rd, maybe 4th, Russian officer killed in the past couple weeks).

Ukraine still has 56 operational fighter jets in its inventory and the Ukraine Air Force is still flying 5-10 sorties a day: senior US defense official.

A joke from Ian Bremmer:

You have two cows Putin steals your cows

Putin: It’s a milking operation

Lavrov: Look what you’ve done to your cows

World: We stand with the cows

Snake Island: Cow fuck yourself

Zelenskyy: Have fun milking those bulls

Are we imposing the exact same same sanctions on Belarus as we are to Russia? Have American companies, you know Visa/Mastercard, SWIFT, and major corps like McDs, Pepsi, Coca Cola, etc. pulled out of Belarus? Don’t try to flick off these important questions because you believe you are some sort of Sunday morning arm chair quarterback!. Don’t post weak-ass links that make you feel superior! Where and how do you get off acting so fucking all-knowing and dismissive of everyone else? Go take your superiority complex some other fucking place off! I’d like to see your pimpled ass on TV being interviewed by other experts. Go fuck yourself bitter queen who has never experienced putting your own ass on the line. Answer the question! It’s very simple. Get off your high horse.

Instagram officially blocked in Russia. Internet watchdog Roskomnadzor just posted a statement that it "will restrict access to Instagram due to calls for violence against Russians".

Big, because Instagram is popular there and it'll hit small businesses who use it to take bookings and so on.

R360 Take a chill pill. You can look the answer to the question up yourself (yes, some sanctions have been levied against Belarus but not as many against Russia). And if your question is rhetorical, Belarus has not sent troops in, only hosted Russia so they are not on the same level as what Russia is doing.

Ukraine military drone crashes into Croatian capital Zagreb

‘Pilotless military aircraft’ crosses Hungary into Croatia triggering loud blast but no injuries reported

... Ukraine is the only known operator of the Tu-141.

Putin approves Russian use of Middle East fighters against Ukraine

Up to 16,000 volunteers to be deployed alongside Russian-backed rebels in Donbas region

I don't understand why no one wants to engage with R360's just asking of very important questions. I mean, don't you all wonder why countries don't donate the same amount of money despite vast disparities in their GDP or other wealth measures? Don't you all sit around second-guessing why people would flee their country being invaded instead of just hop over to a city that hasn't been taken yet? Aren't you mad we aren't penalizing the tiny country being strongarmed by the invading country exactly as harshly as we're penalizing the invader? Don't you all see these are deep SERIOUS philosophical questions that MUST be addressed!

You take a high horse chill pill. Since when are you an expert on this invasion? If you are so assured, why don’t you inform the US on what to do based on your extensive and irrefutable knowledge and expertise? It’s always some wise ass that appears on these boards that act all-knowing.

Again, if Belarus is offering Russia a staging area to launch their military offensives, we need to stop them right now. Get it? Are you also an apologist for China? After all, they have not sent troops in. What kind of logic is that? We’re all cool until we send in troops….right? A true military genius, aren’t you.

Bet they take out the remaining airfields in western Ukraine and any weapons resupply vehicles entering Ukraine from the EU.

If you're interested in Belarus democracy movement news.

wow, you sound really stupid as well as unhinged, R366. Sympathies.. it must be hard living like that.

R364 I'm very curious about this. Do they really have anything close to 16,000 volunteers ready to go and where are they coming from? Of what interest is the Donbas region to Middle Eastern mercenaries, especially if it means potentially taking fighters out of Syria and Yemen?

R369 you just don't understand how frustrating it is when you're just asking very important stupid questions and no one takes you seriously.

I know R365 and me with my weak ass link to the official US government statement regarding the sanctions against Belarus. Which of course doesn’t involve McDonalds or Victoria’s Secret, because ummm those aren’t sanctions. Those are business decisions by private companies. But it isn’t fair to point that out to the trolls from fascist countries (or especially uninformed Americans) who don’t understand the difference between a sanction, a boycott and avoidance of certain commercial markets. And are just asking questions.

Sad and weak, so wounded that you need to resort to ad hominem attacks. I’m non-plussed. Why don’t you, I beg you, just answer the question…

He’s going to say What question. You watch.

R373 The question HAS been answered.

[quote] Go take your superiority complex some other fucking place off!

Oh, dear, R360—and you were doing so well, drawing on a veritable anthology of "American idioms/subclass: gay shade." Take some advice? Dial it back a bit; don't overreach.

Yes, sanctions are different from private American corps pulling out of Belarus. Yes, sanctions are not the same as taking Belarus out of Most Favored Nations trading either. My original assertion that the US is not responding equally with sanctions upon Belarus includes any and all actions by the West that can be brought to bear on Belarus. Can I somehow make that clear? It’s tiresome dealing with semantics sometimes.

Russians still killing ethnic Russians and destroying their lives. How the hell do they think this will end well for them?

Quick. Change the subject. Thread going off course. Flame wars.

Thank you r377.

New tactic afoot! The very patient 40-mile convoy is being dispersed and regrouped in aid of the siege of Kiev.

There's talk that the Russians have staged a false flag attack on Belarus to blame on Ukraine and try to provoke Belarus into entering the war against Ukraine:

"Today, at 2:30pm, Ukrainian Border Guard Service reported that Russian planes left Dubrovytsia airfield in Belarus, flied into Ukrainian airspace, turned around over our towns of Horodychi and Tumeni, after which set a fire in Kopani town in Belarus"

To all the brave heroes here, and the genius tacticians, the Ukrainian government set this website up to volunteer. The Guardian mentioned it today in this article:

‘My plan is there is no plan’: the foreign fighters flocking to Ukraine

Thousands of people from around the world have joined the war effort, unsure when or if they will return home

I like how all of the Russian lies are anticipated and publicized, thus disarmed (at least for those who haven't drunk the Koolaid).

Casus belli? Belarusian troops are widely rumored to not want to fight Ukraine so Russia needs a pretext.

Interesting discussion about Russia's strategy from India.

[quote] giving such a system to Ukraine by default means putting U.S. military personnel on the ground in Ukraine.

Or US military-trained personnel on the ground in Ukraine. Or former US military personnel. I am sure that there are other people apart from active-duty US military personnel who can operate the equipment and systems. The US must have trained our allies in how to use such equipment. Perhaps Ukrainians have benefitted from that training eithr directly or indirectly. The world is a complex place.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

Does the celebrated UA fighter pilot the Gray Ghost exist?

He was huge on social media last week.

Seven ways to spot fake photographs of the war in Ukraine

The Ghost of Kyiv is an ace fighter pilot dominating the skies above Ukraine—but does he exist? Here's how to stay ahead

chilling

Terrifying news about Chernobyl.

I’d put nothing past Putin, The Madman. He knows his days are numbered and he has nothing to lose now. I can’t imagine a more terrifying situation for the world to be in.

Republic World's nonstop coverage is wild. A big Indian news channel.

Live coverage and debate from Republic World. Major figures are debating. The live chat is nuts.

Russia is now estimated to have killed 1 in every 250 pre-war Mariupol residents.

This doesn't seem good...

Belarus’ defense ministry has denied the Ukrainian claim of the Russian false flag airstrike on a Belarusian village. Calls it a “provocation” and an attempt to “stir up Belarusian society”.

The Russian federation is testifying about the US involved in bio weapon factories. US television not playing.

The BBC and Sky are playing the UN debate.

Sky News live. You can scroll back. Russia already delivered its opening.

It's like Colin Powell at the UN talking about Iraq, but instead of a vial of cornstarch the guys has documents.

Big surprise:

the *guy

"According to the Ukrainian military and civil servants, #Belarus is preparing to invade Ukraine today by 21:00.

We don’t have confirmation of these plans yet. But given that Lukashenko went to Moscow today it all looks very worrying"

Belarus may invade UA.

The mighty Belarusian army and its regiments of disciplined, highly motivated soldiers must have the Ukrainians trembling, especially given the element of surprise.

That Putin is calling in his one ally for reinforcements after is telling the Ukrainians a lot.

Why Does Ukraine Have Biological Labs? Arnab Grills An Ex-American Official On The Debate

Can we get a list of *every* country that has biological labs?

(Reuters) - Russian-backed separatists have captured the Ukrainian city of Volnovakha north of the besieged Azov Sea port of Mariupol, the RIA news agency quoted Russia's defence ministry as saying on Friday.

Volnovakha is strategically important as the northern gateway to Mariupol.

(Reporting by Reuters; editing by Guy Faulconbridge)

OMG Ukraine has biological labs because the USSR had biological warfare labs, just like they had nukes. At the end of the Cold War the nukes were removed but the labs were not. In recent years the US has assisted Ukraine in identifying and safely disposing of the various toxins, an important, but daunting and time consuming, process.

Ascribing malfeasance to the US in this case is like blaming the landline sniffing rats for planting the land mines decades ago.

Of course Kazakstan is going to supply Ukraine. They know that they're next. Large country geographically, but a very small population, not tied to international organizations like NATO, lots of ethnic Russians, and lots of oil.

I would be wary about the Ukrainian claims on Chernobyl. Propaganda comes from both sides, remember. Due to its location, any action on Chernobyl will be more of a danger to Belarus than most of Ukraine. Follow what the IAEA says.

Tank loses at Volnovakha.

*losses

Javelins, too.

NYET!!

Ukraine does not have biolabs.

Southern Ukraine had an H1N1 outbreak a decade and a half ago, before anyone knew what it was. The US, then a rational country whose populace and parts of government weren’t anti science, helped Ukraine set up labs to test highly pathogenic diseases that could become world epidemics. The labs were open to international inspection. It would be impossible to conduct biological warfare tests there.

Note that the only ones spreading lies about this are the usual suspects who also denied COVID.

I can't click on the link on R415, but I found it on Youtube, and that anchor has pre-bunker levels of delusion going on. "Our boys are wiping out the fascist scum! This is a triumph of Russian weaponry! This is the rebirth of Russia!" Liars.

R411 ElderLez, just want you to know I'm a fan of yours. One of many, I suspect. (We might have traded messages on one of the Treason threads awhile back).

Your posts are always insightful, informative and concise. I wish I had a lists of your posts over the years in chronological order. It might serve as a nice history lesson.

Thank you!!

Suck-up

Turkey moved its embassy to Chernivtsi. It looks like a gorgeous city.

Just out from Russell Brand.

Has Rogan discussed Ukraine at all? I haven't listen in few months.

Glenn Greenwald today.

r418 - goody -twoshoes

[quote]Ukraine does not have biolabs.

It pains me to say this, but real, actual people believe that Ukraine has bioweapon labs and that the US owns them and admitted to it all.

They got this from the World Socialist website which claims the Undersecretary of State "admitted" all of this when questioned by Marco Rubio. That's a lie.

The truth is that she said Ukraine has biological research facilities (not bioweapon labs) and that the US is concerned Russia will take control of them, plus she said that if there WAS a bioweapon attack in Ukraine, it would be from Russia, not Ukraine.

When some asshole fake leftist on Twitter lectured me about this today, I checked his feed and saw a LOT of the asshole fake leftists on there are pushing TONS of anti-Ukraine, pro-Russian propaganda. It's fucking insane, and a few of them have enough of a web presence that I could tell they were real people, not AI-generated trolls.

It's fucking depressing.

Remarkable in its way to observe the Russian at the UN Security Council. Arrogantly he read out his meticulous verbiage about Ukrainian 'chemical weapons plants' - as though to dim students unlikely to grasp his superior 'learning.'

They grasped it all too well, denouncing him and all his boss's works as an 'alternate reality' the whole world was watching. It's a mystery why he even bothered, save the insistent mindset of a cult which has sealed itself against all objective reality. Another manifestation of insanity.

Putin Has Accidentally Unified & Strengthened the West

"I have doubts it will happen but 73% of European respondents to a new Reuters/Ipsos poll said they would support a move by the U.S. and NATO allies to enforce a no-fly zone over Ukraine, even if that brought NATO into conflict with Russia’s military."

I'm not sure The People's Choice Awards for military intervention is a good thing.

I thought the Russian Army was 900k or so strong. I've read that the Ukraine operation deployed 150-160k. So, if he's losing soldiers, why doesn't Vlad send in more - beyond the mercenaries?

Russia's War Machine Slowed By Cheap Gear, Expired Rations | Ukraine's Ballerinas Join The Fight

I wish writers, observers, commentators would stop saying "this won't end well for Russia" as if this is somehow a a great victory for everyone else. I don't think Putin cares if it ends well for Russia, as long as it ends terribly for others. Even he has to know that Russia won't be "well" in the broader sense in his lifetime.

R429, the whole Russian military = about 900,000. Of that, the army = about 280,000. He's committed a lot of his ground forces to Ukraine already. He may have held back his more valuable, experienced troops and sent in the conscripted cannon fodder first.

[quote]why doesn't Vlad send in more - beyond the mercenaries?

Bear in mind that he has to keep a large portion of his military elsewhere, to secure the Russian borders and for population control.

Good screaming match among representatives of the parties, including Kira Rudick.

Red Phone

Mykolaiv heavy bombardment. Probably working their way to Odessa.

Victoria Nuland confesses that the US was financing "biological research facilities" the contents of which she claims must not fall in Russian hands under any circumstances. So, it's NOT propaganda - Putin's invasion may not be morally correct, but this would make it justified and THAT is precisely why they want to accuse anyone who mentions this of being a Russian asset / conspiracy theorist.

[quote]Putin's invasion may not be morally correct, but this would make it justified

Oh seriously fuck the fuck off. So now it's not fighting the Nazi control of Ukraine, it's fighting Nazi biolabs. Just shut the fuck up. Nobody is ever going to buy that this was some noble Putin saves the world bullshit.

As so often on this thread BETTER TROLLS NEEDED!

Do keep up, R437. We've been through this already, and Russell Brand has about as much credibility on DL as Alex Jones.

Victoria Nuland has confessed that the US was financing "biological research facilities" in Ukraine, and she has highlighted that their contents must not fall in Russian hands. This is NOT a conspiracy theory, as it has been confirmed by Nuland herself before Congress. What was the US doing financing biological research in Ukraine, especially research of pathogens so dangerous that it would be dangerous for the US and its allies if Russia got hold of them? Also, what sort of danger would that be? Is it that the US would be exposed for engaging in biological war against Russia, thus giving Putin a justification for his invasion?

These are question that we must ask ourselves.

[quote]These are question that we must ask ourselves

Sure, Jan

These are questions that, to the contrary, have been asked and sifted through and answered. Here's a fairly thorough debunking. Or go ahead and believe Putin, Tucker Carlson, and your fellow right-wing disinformers.

R439, do not be dishonest. The fact that you don't like him doesn't mean that he doesn't have any credibility, and it doesn't mean that he is lying by providing information from an article written by Glenn Greenwald, who is by all means a brilliant journalist.

Moreover R442, the NYT actually promoted the fallacy of WMD in Iraq and supported the narrative of "moderate rebels" fighting against Al-Assad. Why should they be more credible than anybody else, especially those whose track record has been proven to be immaculate and have never, ever had to issue even ONE retraction?

We already had this go-round about two hours ago ... and R425 settled it for rational people.

R443, are you disputing (or more likely dismissing) Linda Qui's arguments and refutations on the grounds that the NYT has published crap and disinformation in the past? The answer to your supposedly rhetorical question is that a single newspaper publishes many different authors and articles, and columns from the early 2000s have no bearing on the information in this piece—I'm going to assume that you're not interested in accuracy, which, as R444 points out, is already available. In other words, you're a troll.

Sorry, r443, you lost me at:

[quote]...an article written by Glenn Greenwald, who is by all means a brilliant journalist.

No, R444 - R425 has limited himself to say "the World Socialist website and people who are to the left of my own ideology are lending creedence to an argument I do not like because it compromises the US-held narrative, and moreover they can see and value the other side's argument - therefore, they are crazy conspiracy theorists and we shouldn't even listen to them".

There is nothing rational about that. It's the equivalent of inserting your fingers in your ear canals and saying "la-la-la-la-la-la-la" while the other person speaks, only to turn around and say 'that person refuses to engage in a mature discussion by agreeing with everything I say, so they are to blame for my refusal to listen to their arguments'.

There is no rationality to infantile behaviour, no matter how much you might try to dismiss the other side by saying that they are too stupid, deluded, fanatic or evil to understand you.

Greenwald a brilliant journalist?? LMFAO the dude is a clown

Glenn Greenwald is a tenacious lawyer and his current client, so to speak, is Putin.

You keep digging yourself deeper, r447. You may not know this about DL, but we know from trolls.

Update from Volnovakha. Just posted.

R447, you're just spewing ad hominems and projection. Let's make it simple: do you see evidence that the labs in question were used to create weapons for the use of the US or NATO or whatever charge Russell Brand is raising? Others have shown what they were in fact used for; can you refute their evidence and arguments, or will you persist in your own fingers-in-the-ears denials?

In any case, this after-the-fact casus belli—as you yourself said—does nothing to mitigate the enormity of Putin's war. It's on a par with Bush and Cheney's fake claims of Iraqi weapons, which you so decry.

If Ukraine really was a seething hotbed of biochemical weaponry, Russia would not be randomly bombing the hell out. That seems unwise. You'd also think Putin might have mentioned this claim earlier, instead of suddenly "remembering" it after his "Ukraine is full of Nazis" claim flopped.

When the war started the population of Ukraine was 44 million. It's said that 2 million have evacuated. Can it be that there are still 42 milliion there? I feel sick.

R196 Zelenskyy is the Ukrainian spelling. It is how President Zelenskyy spells his name.

[post redacted because independent.co.uk thinks that links to their ridiculous rag are a bad thing. Somebody might want to tell them how the internet works. Or not. We don't really care. They do suck though. Our advice is that you should not click on the link and whatever you do, don't read their truly terrible articles.]

R451 That guy is about to be banned from YouTube for posting Russian propaganda.

I have no more patience with Russian whore trolls repeating the same disinformation coming out of the Kremlin. There is no point arguing with them. Just block and move on.

R455, R189 spelled the name "Zelinsky." That's what I was referring to.

Love it when the trolls reveal themselves by pushing clickbait reporting when they clearly didn't bother to check the source material (just what frauds like Tucker Carlson and Glenn Greenwald count on).

Victoria Nuland did not "hint," "suggest", "say," confirm," or "reveal" that the US was funding bioweapons labs in Ukraine. Not even close. Go listen to her exchange with Marco Rubio and hear it for yourself.

And this fake wide-eyed "ZOMG WHAT IS UKRAINE DOING WITH BIO RESEARCH FACILITIES?!" bullshit is so idiotic it's not worth responding to (but grateful R411/R416 did anyway).

I should have added posting YouTube videos of Katy Perry’s ex-boyfriends to fast food comments as a secret signal that the trolls were really just desperate for rubles.

R418 you are too kind. I think I might find that mortifying though given my propensity to typos and occasional tipsy posts on a weekend night. (Amongst all the entertaining snark and bitchery and the annoying trolls there are a bunch of good eggs on DataLounge and so many of them have been Treason thread posters)

Is there an update on the state of the sun in Ukraine and the status of Kyiv?

^Oh, and the US' partnership with Ukraine re bioresearch and storage/containment of biohazards to PREVENT the proliferation of bioweapons has never been a secret.

The head of Ukraine’s Luhansk region says Russian soldiers have seized 70% of the territory until recently under govt control. Occupiers promptly connect these areas to Russian TV broadcasts, he says. Moscow is really relying on its propaganda to pacify the territories it grabs.

The Russian military has attacked an oncology hospital in Mykolaiv, says a regional health official. Cue Lavrov’s statement about it being another secret Azov base in five, four, three…

How is he spreading misinformation when he is on the ground, interviewing live witnesses, R457? The fact that he is showing a reality that you don't like, because it doesn't comply with the narrative that is being spread by most Western media, doesn't mean that he is lying. And if he is spreading propaganda, so are Ukraine and NATO countries - why shouldn't we get the chance to see everyone's point of view and make our own decisions, like adults?

[quote]If Ukraine really was a seething hotbed of biochemical weaponry, Russia would not be randomly bombing the hell out.

If this was a real danger Russia wouldn't be staying mum for decades.

ElderLez, forgive my tardy update on the sun's setting on the sixteenth day of fighting, which happened over seven hours ago upon a Kyiv battered but unbowed.

"Why shouldn't we take Russian lies more seriously? It's just a different point of view. Both sides!"

May the Lord’s Puppet and his family live to see another morning R467.

Don't even justify this biochemical nonsense guys. It's just pathetic.

I'm really liking Biden's response to this. Russia will be completely cut off soon once they lose access to the IMF and World Bank.

I want 2 things. I want Russian citizens to know exactly what is going on in Ukraine. Considering new media, I am surprised this is not more achievable. I also want to know what Russian citizens think about Putin and Ukraine. Could these things happen any time soon?

Lots of Russians still on Chaturbate. Go on there and tell them what Putin is doing to Ukraine. Tell that what the world is doing as they are blocked from hearing the truth.

Poland has said it can no longer take in refugees, they’ve run out of room. 10% of Warsaw’s population is Ukrainian refugees.

Re China: A Chinese economist living in Europe (interview isn't in English) says China's interest is to play all sides and be the intermediary. Their tactic will be to slow-walk their mediation in order to weaken all sides of the conflict - the weaker Europe, US, Russia can get, the better for China.

China will play with Russia to get resources, but they'll play more with the US, Europe, Australia etc. to preserve markets and investment. The economy is top priority for Xi esp. this year when he's supposed to be reappointed by the CCP. The Chinese revolt only when there's no food on the table.

R475, he's a disgruntled overseas Chinese who's telling white people what they want to hear about oh-so-scary China. Feeding their sinophobia.

Don't be a rube.

[quote]He may have held back his more valuable, experienced troops and sent in the conscripted cannon fodder first.

I've heard this said by some pundits, but that's so much hooey, IMO. Military actions are won on momentum. You send in the commandos and top divisions to quickly grab the advantage, then shore up your lines and territory with your lesser troops. Sending in the untrained reservists and conscripts first was a first-class blunder and arrogance.

From yesterday.

R476, actually the guy was raised in Europe and is very open-minded. He just knows China and what he says sounds very plausible.

He also says China will be ok with Russian annexation of Donbas but not with the whole country going back under Russia. China won't accept Russian enlargement to Soviet size.

[quote]I've heard this said by some pundits, but that's so much hooey, IMO. Military actions are won on momentum. You send in the commandos and top divisions to quickly grab the advantage, then shore up your lines and territory with your lesser troops. Sending in the untrained reservists and conscripts first was a first-class blunder and arrogance.

It's another Russian disinformation talking point about why their military sucks. Something about how nobody knew they sent in conscripts and it was just some 'clerical error.'

I hope Putin dies a horrible, painful, slow death.

China's position can be described as 'pro-Russia neutrality'.

China's position is always what's best for China.

[quote] actually the guy was raised in Europe and is very open-minded.

R479, oh yeah, actually he sounds just like a boba assimilationist sellout cum Gordon Chang type. Desperate for white people's approval. That's why white people like what he has to say; his BS resonates with their sinophobia.

Actually, overseas Chinese can be born in Europe, r479.

Ukraine says that the mayor of occupied Melitopol, Ivan Fedorov, who had insisted the city remained Ukrainian, was kidnapped by Russian forces today- CCTV shows him led away. He has been charged with 'terrorism'.

Even their disinformation campaigns suck now. You don’t force your experienced troops to hang back and risk them wasting time and resources having to fix the fuck ups of the cannon fodder.

At this point their lies make them look more pathetic than the truth.

R484, time for your meds

Please put them on block. The conversation will not suffer if stupid trolls are ignored.

Remember when Japan was going to own the entire world? That was fun.

There was a lot of paranoia about that in the 1980s when Japanese investors were on a real estate buying binge in the U.S.

Putin has placed the head of his foreign intelligence branch under HOUSE ARREST in the latest sign that he’s FURIOUS about how badly things are going for his military forces in Ukraine.

R492 already posted at R336

R492, if Putin cares that much, maybe, just maybe, he shouldn’t have made a former construction manager his Minister of Defense.

It just shows how a lack of democracy stagnates: these people are too afraid to tell Putin the truth and he has no real checks on him.

exactly r494, if the one and only qualification is 100% loyalty to the Asshole in Chief you are going to get some shitty ministers. It happens. It's actually inevitable. Like the entire Trump Administration, shit from top to bottom.

"The #Russian Service of BBC writes that they have information about what is happening in the Mozyr morgue

Earlier, Belarusian and #Ukrainian independent media reported that hospitals in southern #Belarus were allegedly overfilled with the bodies of the Russian soldiers.

“The bodies are not even taken to a refrigerator, but to an ordinary room - 5x5 m2, they are stored there for a while, they rot, stink - then bodies are taken away somewhere.”

“The soldiers themselves do this everything is guarded only the head of the department has access.”

According to his BBC source, "no one knows how many dead bodies there are, but everyone is horrified by what's happening. Doctors think that somewhere there is a mobile crematorium or they just bury them somewhere"."

Interesting thread on Russia and Soviet history. The basic premise is this is the Russian we've always known. This is the Russia we knew in the 19th century. the Russia from the 20th century. This isn't about NATO or 'Ukrainian Nazis.'

"Russia is a remarkable civilization: in the arts, music, literature, dance, film. In every sphere, it's a profound, remarkable place - a whole civilization more than just a country. At the same time, Russia feels like it has a "special place" in the world, a special mission. It's Eastern Orthodox, not Western. And it wants to stand out as a great power. It's problem has been not this sense of self or identity but the fact it's capabilities have never matched its aspirations. It's always in a struggle to live up to those aspirations, but it can't, because the West has always been more powerful.

Video shows Russian state TV host yelling at a veteran who complained that troops were dying in Ukraine

R499, meet R414.

Oops, I mean, meet R415.

Well, whether r499 or r415, the truth remains: some people are such stupid whores they can't even admit there are actual casualties in wars. This is the thing Putin is apparently insisting on, and why his whole stupid regime will crack wide open.

I wonder how all of the military power of the West can have an effect against any country that goes rogue. How can we combat Russia that is breaking every single rule? This could happen again with any nuclear-armed nation. (and there aren’t that many First World nations that do not have nuclear weapons). We need to look forward to the future because trust and international laws will no longer protect us against despots.

Trust and international law have never protected anybody from shit. They are background noise for the actual calculations those despots make: can I get away with this? Will there be any cost to pay for my bullshit? Is this actually a good idea in the long term? Putin is in the process of learning that his calculations have gone awry. Others will learn from this.

I think Putin wants to flatten Ukraine and we'll probably be horrified in the next few weeks. I don't want to see nukes fly but I don't think we can sit back and watch him kill millions of people.

But that is all ‘after the fact’ when 1000s of innocent civilians are killed and we watch and standby this genocide. I’m wondering what can we do prevent? I hope after this for a complete de-nuclearization of Russia before we lift all that’s been brought on against them(?) if possible.

I was looking at an interview with Julia Ioffe, who’s an expert on Putin and his government, and she made a comment saying she thinks Putin is hopelessly out of touch, has been super isolated because of Covid, but has spent years getting rid of anybody that isn’t a yes man. She thinks he could possibly use nukes. She says the people working for him now are so scared of him because in his world, if he gets mad at you, he doesn’t fire you, you go to prison (or fall out of a window). So the people who have whitewashed the war for him are probably still doing it. He can’t take any criticism at all and is very oversensitive.

There’s a Frontline PBS interview with her that has a lot of good information at the link, also some other interviews. The PBS interview is “Putin’s Road to War”

This is supposedly from FSB sources, sent to a Russian activist in exile.

Julia Ioffe also says a lot of people in Russia, especially older and less educated people, get all their news from TV and Putin controls all the TV channels now. They don’t get news online as much as we do. They’re locked in a news-free propaganda vacuum, and nobody can get to them.

There’s been reports that a lot of Ukrainians have family and friends in Russia who are totally brainwashed and refuse to believe their own family’s phone calls and eyewitness accounts that there’s a war on in Ukraine. Although they could get fifteen years in prison for even saying there’s a war in Ukraine, so who knows if they really believe it or not.

Both Michael McFaul and Julie Ioffe (love her) have said the country is very much polarized, similar to the US. The educated/urban/middle class/young tend to be anti Putin, but the older/poorer/more rural you are, the more you buy into Putin and state run media.

We're now an hour and a half until sunrise in Ukraine, and the Russians still don't control Kyiv and Kharkiv.

"I think Putin wants to flatten Ukraine"

The worst part is if afterwards the world forgives and forgets, just to keep the peace. And everything goes back to fairly normal.

This is finally a chance for the world to shun that cancerous nation back to the Stone Age. What a great opportunity to totally turn our backs on them.

I don't think it will r512. Could be true of course, the usual caveats. But he seems to have crossed some line here and the whole world is pissed in a way it wasn't before.

I do think he could have gotten away with swiping the Eastern Provinces. If he had just occupied those, the pressure to accept that would be intense on Ukraine and everybody else, to avoid a wider conflict. But he fucked up. His greed and isolation and at this point probably madness made him decide that he wanted the whole damn thing, and that is probably what will fuck him over now. The Western world is pissed. It takes awhile, it takes a lot for largely self-satisfied western powers to get truly pissed, but I think Putin has succeeded there. I don't think he or his regime will survive this.

Somebody said on MSNBC today that when the West hands down sanctions, those sanctions almost never go away or rolled back. I think Russia as a pariah state is here to stay.

The next question is, is China going to stabilize Russia by trading with them and trying to shore them up? China + Russia together would be a huge threat.

China is a rising power but it is so far from dominance it is silly. China and Russia together would still be a backwater as far as the rest of the world is concerned. Right now, not forever, but right now, the U.S. and the EU are still dominant in a way that Russia and China can barely dream of. If China chooses to retreat into some stubborn opposition to the world, along with Russia ... well, they won't.

R516, this isn't sarcastic: how did you know how to notate "U.S." with periods and "EU" without?

I really wish the standard notation for both were like the former but it's not changing in most media.

That's funny r517, ddn't think about it. Guess I've just seen it enough.

Can someone explain that bitch that told the UN that the US does have bio weapons in Ukraine and that it’s dangerous to leave them there? She works for Biden.

Link, r519?

[quote]The educated/urban/middle class/young tend to be anti Putin, but the older/poorer/more rural you are, the more you buy into Putin and state run media.

But what happens when those older, poorer, more rural citizens have to start standing in line for their potato and half a loaf of bread again?

R519, put the exact quote you think she said because she didn't say what you are purporting she said. But, I do give you credit for being a second tier troll with at least a bit of nuance.

[quote]But what happens when those older, poorer, more rural citizens have to start standing in line for their potato and half a loaf of bread again?

Funny, I remember asking Alex that exact same question.

[quote]It just shows how a lack of democracy stagnates: these people are too afraid to tell Putin the truth and he has no real checks on him

That's an age-old Russian tradition, along with the tradition for "Potemkin villages".

Russian fighter jets are now bombing western Ukraine. These jets are most likely stationed in Belarus and taking off from there. There is confirmation from NATO surveillance planes that have spotted Russian Air Force stationed on the southern border of Belarus.

When is the West going to bring sanctions and all other deterrents to bear on Belarus? Clearly they are allied with Putin. The easiest way to take Kyiv is to encircle it with troops leaving from Belarus. Why is nothing being done and instead all attention and suspicion solely on China. Why is our media not taking this issue.to task?

Maps

Well, damn…

Well, it may work. At this point, Zelenskyy has to see if something sticks (if this tweet is true). Unfortunately, Putin has cut off most media outlets so such conventional messaging is problematic. Ukraine is getting cash and military hardware from NATO for now. It’s one way for our US money to go to help.

The acting head of Energoatom, Pyotr Kotin, said that staff had been gathered at the Zaporozhye NPP and informed that the plant was now owned by Rosatom.

hmmm r528. There comes that moment, and I am not sure it is here, but there comes a moment when the nobles look at the king and start to wonder, do we need him? Or does he need us?

“The educated/urban/middle class/young tend to be anti Putin, but the older/poorer/more rural you are, the more you buy into Putin and state run media.”

Just substitute Trump for Putin and the exact same would apply. It’s eerie how we experienced the same treachery under Cheeto. He certainly read Puties playbook when he took a dump every night. On a side note, I’m so happy that the news is not giving Dump as much airtime. (It’s bad to say that, I know).

ISW reported the false-flag attack on Belarus but noted that "Lukashenko’s continued claims that Belarusian forces are needed to defend western Belarus and that any attacks on Belarus are Western attempts to bring Belarus into the war are likely intended to push back on Russian pressure on him to order Belarusian forces to enter the war."

I kind of love that Lukashenko is turning Putin's own propaganda against him to avoid having to enter the war.

R526 I'm pretty sure that tanks and military helicopters cost a lot more than that so they'd be getting a bargain too.

When he closes off his country from providing a Russian staging base and not allow them to enter their airspace, then I’ll believe him. Otherwise he’s a POS sucking Puttie’s moobs.

We need to start sanctions on Belarus! Now! Not after Russia takes Kiev and slaughters them.

R531 It's also self-interest because if Belarus sent troops in that is likely to spark off another uprising of the Belarusian people. I believe that part of the deal Lukashenko made with Putin was that Russia would provide security.

Hope the Belarusian people and troops continue to make it clear that they don't want to fight Ukraine.

We need to know if Lukashenko is allowing Russian forces enter in their southern border along Ukraine.

Yeah, definitely R534. Nobody should be under the illusion that Lukoshenko is avoiding this out of disloyalty to Putin or sympathies for Ukraine.

This is completely self-interest mixed with a blatant inability to actually lend forces who don't want to fight in Ukraine.

Provide security? From whom? Ukraine? Why would Ukraine invade Belarus territory. That makes no sense.

To the poster hopping mad about that Belarus doesn't have the exact same sanctions as Russia does, that is probably another calculation holding Lukashenko off for now. Save it for if he sends troops in.

R537 From his own people. Yes. That was likely the deal Lukashenko made with Putin when there were those extensive democracy marches by the Belarusian people the other year, and is why Lukashenko is Putin's bitch now.

R537. Putin's propaganda is that Ukraine was planning to invade Belarus before Russia invaded them. Lukoshenko is using that, mixed with propaganda about the West trying to create and lengthen the war to destroy Russia, to avoid having to commit forces (particularly those who have apparently refused to obey) to Ukraine.

R540 No, sorry, that's bullshit. It's because Lukashenko came very close to losing power until Russia stepped in to support him.

I just blocked the pro-‘Belarus needs security’ troll and all many replies instantly vanished. It’s funny when a troll starts replying to himself while pretending they are different people who are following him and agreeing.

No need to respond BTW. You’ve been blocked so I can’t read it. You should block me back so you can continue talking to yourself.

Pathetic.

Of course it's bullshit R541. That's why it's propaganda. But Lukashenko knows that he owes Russia so the pressure will be on him to step in against Ukraine eventually.

The Russian false-flags are just pretext. I suspect there will be more of them until Lukashenko is forced to address the situation one way or another.

R543 You know, this could be a perfect time for the Belarusian people to try to take Lukashenko down again. Especially if Russia gets defeated or very bogged down by the Ukraine conflict. Here's hoping another movement is inspired and that MAYBE the troops will join to pull off a coup.

Mariupol official says that 10,000 people may have been killed in the besieged city since the war began. “And if the Russians keep shelling, we may see more than 20,000 people killed”.

Russians targeting Ukrainian food storage now.

r520, that troll doesn't have a link. I will quote the actual transcript of the exchange:

[quote] Sen. Marco Rubio: Does Ukraine have chemical or biological weapons?

[quote] Victoria Nuland: Ukraine has biological research facilities which, in fact, we’re now quite concerned Russian troops, Russian forces may be seeking to gain control of, so we are working with the Ukrainians on how we can prevent any of those research materials from falling into the hands of Russian forces should they approach.

[quote] Sen. Marco Rubio: I’m sure you’re aware that the Russian propaganda groups are already putting out there all kinds of information about how they have uncovered a plot by the Ukrainians to unleash biological weapons in the country, and with NATO’s coordination.

[quote] If there is a biological or chemical weapon incident or attack inside Ukraine, is there any doubt in your mind that 100% it would be the Russians behind it?

[quote] Victoria Nuland: There is no doubt in my mind, senator. And in fact, it is a classic Russian technique to blame the other guy for what they are planning to do themselves.

The World Socialist website insists that "The extraordinary admission by Nuland about Ukrainian bioweapons labs confirms reports from Moscow that a military biological program was being operated inside the country by the US."

As you can read for yourself, it does no such thing, but the people who believe Russian propaganda keep pushing this article as "proof." Also, the World Socialist website itself keeps posting new articles at a rate of 2-3 a day, all along the lines of "the mainstream media and the White House won't report on this because they're liars, not like us, we're the only ones with the truth."

This is a common propaganda tactic: take a real quote and then deliberately misinterpret it. Then when people point out that no one else is reporting on this alleged "fact," their excuse is that it's because everyone else is corrupt.

Also wanted to mention that the idea of US bioweapon labs in Ukraine is ridiculous on its face. If the US had bioweapon labs in Ukraine, we'd be doing a LOT more to stop the Russians than we are.

But who would be stupid enough to put bioweapon labs in a country that Putin has been trying to get his hands on for over a decade? It doesn't make any sense.

WTF is with the drone that crashed outside of Zagreb? Both sides claim it's not theirs. WTF. Does a drone/missle have to fall in central Vienna to get a fucking NFZ estalished?

One qualification, R530: in the US, Trump voters were on average richer than Clinton (and Biden) voters, not poorer. Could be different in Russia, of course.

Yes, of course richer. They are all about white straight male superiority. They are afraid of losing this privilege. Who wouldn’t? However, they will not preserve their place in hierocracy via violence and wanton disregard for the law. Ironically, the very laws they themselves put in place. It seems to be dawning on them.

This is the kind of propaganda Russians see and hear about what's going on Ukraine. And given that Putin is blocking social media and independent news, it's just going to become more and more insular.

Soviet citizens got so good at seeing through their government's lies; can't the same be true of Russians now? Or can they all have been brainwashed by Putin? What I gather from reports is that younger Russians are skeptical, older ones more trusting of Putin. They've all mostly accepted if not welcomed him, since he seemed to bring security and wealth, but now the costs of authoritarianism—of an inflexible, closed-off, oblivious leadership and a court too afraid to tell their superiors the truth—might hopefully be clearer.

That’s great R526 and while the Russians might block Twitter I suspect the Ukrainians still have tarps (or bed sheets) and paint.

Let me see if I have this straight.

Russian troops are slowly advancing further into Ukraine. The booms of battle can be heard in Kyiv.

Ukrainian deaths, destruction and those seeking refuge is staggering.

Ukraine doesn't have the hardware, fighter jets, etc. to slow or stop the advance.

No other country will take an active part, within Ukraine, to militarily come to their aid nor will a "no fly zone" be engaged because it will be an overt act of war and then we're in WWIII.

And Putin knows all of the foregoing, too, right?

So, in effect, in fact, in reality, this single person- Putin- is emotionally blackmailing the other 9 billion human beings on planet Earth, and, so far, is succeeding at it.

In the immortal words Charlie Sheen: "Uh...Winning!"

[quote]I hope after this for a complete de-nuclearization of Russia

How do you think that would happen?

You can’t park your nuke off Cannes.

“Pictures have been posted of Russians using cheap, unencrypted Chinese radios, and their own mobile phones to contact commanders. As a result even radio enthusiasts miles away have been able to tune into real-time Russian military communications.”

Send in the IAEA and allow other agencies to oversee and spot check the dissembling process. Seriously, it’s been done before. SALT? Strategic Arms Limitations Talks? Have the so the called elderly developed amnesia? The US has agreed in the past to mutually disarm. I was a teenager at the time, not giving a shit, but even I understood what this was about. The weapons will not be “parked” but disarmed. I can’t believe no one remembers this happening under Reagan during the Cold War. WTF? Who’s side are you on?

[quote]Send in the IAEA and allow other agencies to oversee and spot check the dissembling process. Seriously, it’s been done before.

Let me know when you get Putin to agree to disarmament.

[quote]The US has agreed in the past to mutually disarm.

And yet, the US and Russia still have more than enough nuclear weapons to destroy the planet many times over.

Nuclear Weapon Stockpiles:

Russia — 6,257 (1,458 active, 3039 available, 1,760 retired)

United States — 5,550 (1,389 active, 2,361 available, 1,800 retired)

[quote]Send in the IAEA and allow other agencies to oversee and spot check the dissembling process.

Better yet, send in Ikea and everyone will be distracted by assembling their shitty new furniture.

Listen, I’m not trying to pick a fight here. I’m simply suggesting that we should exact as much as we possibly can from Russia with Poutine’s gross miscalculation regarding his invasion of Ukraine. That’s all. I’m thinking we’d all be safer if we take away these autocrat’s toys. I’m not trying to dismiss anyone here. I’m just saying we should make them lay a high price.

PAY a high price.

Overthrow Putin and disarm and give us the documents regarding the troll farms and you can have the yachts and Swiss bank accounts back seems very reasonable to me.

Euronews and NPR reporting that the mayor of Mariupol's mayor might have been abducted by the Russians:

Mariupol's mayor has a mayor?

Ha, It's early morning for me, the caffeine hasn't kicked in yet.

I want to block Della because she's a heterosexual AA Cult member, but then the Russia threads would become slow to scroll through since she posts so much.

I don't want to read AA recruitment lies.

Am I the only one who finds Glenn Greenwald breathlessly proclaiming the existence of WMDs in Ukraine fucking HILARIOUS?

[Quote]So, in effect, in fact, in reality, this single person- Putin- is emotionally blackmailing the other 9 billion human beings on planet Earth, and, so far, is succeeding at it.

Last national leader that did this, ended up dead by his own hand in a bunker.

But this guy is basically shooting someone in broad daylight on Fifth Avenue and getting away with it.

Touché.

R552, Putin is censoring independent news outlets and social media, but the West isn't? What about banning Russia Today, blocking RT from Facebook, eliminating podcasts from Spotify, deleting entire Twitter pages, blocking YouTube videos and channels such as The Hill and preventing certain people and opinions from being accessible online? Even Russia media outlets have been blocked by Google, for God's sake.

You cannot pretend that we're the good guys when we're behaving just as badly as Russia, only to then turn around and say "OMG! Russians are censoring!". That is the worst kind of hipocrisy imaginable.

And yet you are still freely posting here R572.

The mind boggles.

Dig a little deeper into those equivalencies you're drawing, R572. I'm sure you'll figure it out.

More info.

A little more.

Funny how the vast majority of Ukrainians seem to have bought into an American "zero-sum proxy war" against Putin's kleptocratic closed society, not realizing that Russia only wants to protect them from NATO imperialism.

R565 it's not Mariupol. Look at the title.

It's fake, right?

Belarus

Analysis from someone who is actually in Ukraine...

Of course r572 is:

[quote]R439, do not be dishonest. The fact that you don't like him doesn't mean that he doesn't have any credibility, and it doesn't mean that he is lying by providing information from an article written by Glenn Greenwald, who is by all means a brilliant journalist.

Does...not...compute, r581.

Awww, I was wondering when we'd get to Putin just HAD to do this to save Ukraine from HUNTER BIDEN!!!

No one has ever said that R584, but if it makes you feel better to lie about it, be my guest...

Funny how all these critics (like the guy in R581's link), so deeply concerned about oligarchic corruption in the Ukraine and the US, are inexorably led to conclusions that somehow coincide with the interests of the even more deeply oligarchic, corrupt Kremlin.

Latest from the Duran.

If we all manage to survive this than Russia will end up turning into North Korea.

honestly, I don't think it will r588. I think it will end in Putin's collapse. If Putin and his clique are overthrown a new clique will emerge that absolutely does not want to be isolated from the world. It'll want all the yachts and money laundering real estate their predecessors had. They've seen Paree and they ain't going back to the farm.

The elites are still getting to the EU via Serbia. Air Serbia takes them to Belgrade, and they transfer to Paris, etc.

I guess it depends on which elites, and I'm not entirely sure how the sanctions work, but I wonder if they can be arrested r590? There are at least some travel bans, I believe.

R591, I think you're right.

Zelensky says Russia will take Kiev only by razing it. Yikes.

There are several ways of handling corruption that do NOT include starting an unjust, unprovoked war and murdering thousands of innocent people.

Just posted from newly captured Volnovakha.

R595, it's a Russian area. Thus the nasty comments about the Ukrainian soldiers who left.

This is wild. When the Russians and rebels seize and secure territory, they bring a bank truck in to exchange Ukrainian currency for rubles.

This interview with a Russia expert is excellent, thanks to whoever posted it originally.

I recommend reading it, as the audio version is edited.

R593 That is exactly what I'm fearing will happen.

New thread?