"And I Am Telling You I'm Not Going" is bombastic and overrated

After hearing this song, I feel like I need to join a support group.

It's another showtune stalker song.

Let's just say I'm grateful Glenn Close never sang it.

^ And I'm not M.

The first time I heard it was on the Tony Awards in 1982, and I was just blown away by it. That final note at 7:56! On the one hand it's incredible, but as someone on Datalounge once brilliantly noted, it also sounds and looks like Jennifer Holliday has just had a giant pine cone shoved up her asshole.

It also showed me that the performance of the song never works on stage as well as it can without the Dreams coming on singing "Love, Love Ya Baby" immediately after that note, which is such a brilliant ironic capper to the scene, and the chorus then singing "Show biz... it's just show biz..." In some productions of the show they omit that so the actress playing Effie can garner all the applause, but the number just doesn't work nearly as well without that cinematic "cut".

I was the Only one in my group when we saw DREAMGIRLS who was NOT blown away by Jennifer Holliday. I knew it was all performance and no real emotion. It got worse later on, when she would do that ridiculous gasping-for-air thing at the end. Never never a fan at all.

I’m a huge musicals fan and I agree with OP.

It’s not a “park and bark” song like most Broadway ballads, it’s a “stand and scream” song.

Forty years later, how is the musical itself ageing?

In this day and age, it's hard to watch a story about women allowing themselves to be victimized.

I completely agree. I don’t like songs (or singers) that try to beat me over the head. Sing TO me, not AT me.

Sounds better sung by a white girl.

You're just realising this now some 40 odd years later?

I think the song has a great build.

Like everything else in the show, though, its pretty much surface level and literal.

Holliday sold it well though. Jennifer just is Effie. You can't deny her ability. It's not easy growling out all that despair and making it sound good.

She's been ever-growling it for years though.

Dreamgirls?

More like Supremegirls.

R10 - The definitive version.

R10 reminds of the time I tried to ride my bike the mile home on a flat tire when I was a kid - all the hissing and thumping.

r14

try this one

R16 - Hearing her redemption story, she is actually more Effie than either Jennifer.

In the context of the musical, it is devastating.

Did Diana Ross and the Supremes copy Dreamgirls?

I Am Changing is actually the better song.

I agree OP. It's a song that almost always brings out the "I'm going to bring down the house if it kills me and everyone else" tendencies in performers. And of course so many people in the audience cheer on this kind of oversinging that it only encourages more of the same and become caricatures of divas. Witness the reaction to Holliday's performance at the last Tony Awards.

It's been overdone so many times that if someone came along and did a less loud version, she'd probably get trashed.

I prefer Jennifer Hudson's rendition in the film to Holliday's. I recall watching Holliday do it on a TV special at Radio City honoring Clive Davis, and the exaggerated way she did that last intake of sounded like she was sucking up every last molecule of oxygen in the place.

There's a certain kind of gay man who has non-stop orgasms at every over-the-top diva singer.

The worst version of the song I ever heard was by Titus Burgess. God, what a bunch of caterwauling!

[quote]I prefer Jennifer Hudson's rendition in the film to Holliday's.

Blasphemy!!! Agree sometimes Miss Holliday has overdone the end more recently in live shows but listen to the cast recording. Nothing tops it.

There are actually very very few people should even attempt the song

you have to remember that Jennifer Holiday actually created the entire way the song is performed when she was an 18 or 19-year-old on Broadway

The only other really good rendition of it was by Whitney Houston at the Oscars or Grammys one year.

And Holliday was the only one to make it a number one hit on the R&B charts and won a Grammy from the song. The only other singer who gained a number one hit on the R&B charts from a Broadway tune was Stephanie Mills with Home.

So, no, Holliday's version is the definitive version. As Armond White once said, the song only works when Holliday sings it because she brings just the right amount of psychodrama to make it believable.

Ok, don't laugh but you really gotta hear late-career Sammy Davis sing it.

His show-biz Vegas persona only adds to it.

And the guy is an absolute PRO at interpreting lyrics.

Listen how the story the song tells becomes clearer in his version.

The song has a weak bridge.

If Billy Porter ever sang it, his version would be the best, hands down.

From the YouTube link

[quote] She blows away almost anyone else in modern times with this performance

MARY!

Sorry, R27, but I think you mean Billie Eilish. Girl would slay this song. She has the pipes AND the backstory.

A comment - again from the YouTube link at R5

[quote] I was 18 years old when I witnessed this history-making performance in my room on TV. Needless to say, after she ended this song, I went absolutely berserk. I was screaming and broke out in a cold sweat and I cried. Later that year, I read everything I could about this vocal beast because I was obsessed with her talent. I read that she was supposed to die at the end of this act, but they rewrote the musical to bring her back. All I could remember feeling is that she killed me and resurrected my soul when she hit that glass-shattering note and raised her hands to the sky and I could feel all the pain of my ancestors resonate through her fingertips as her face and hands ascended toward the heavens.

MARY!

MARY!

MARY!

MARY!

I am telling you NOW, so I don’t have to tell you THEN.

[quote] If Billy Porter ever sang it, his version would be the best, hands down.

He was in the famous 2001 staged version with Lilias White as Effie and Audra McDonald as Denna. He played James Thunder Early (opposite a hilarious Heather Headley as Lorrell). Already his singing voice was getting very raspy from overstrain.

*"Deena" not "Denna."

Heather Headley’s voice sounded like hammered dog shit in that production. It sounds like she blew her cords out in the rehearsals and performances before they recorded it.

Every gay guy does this in the shower.

Screamgirls is a fucking awful, overrated piece of shit featuring Star Search type obese, obnoxious shriekers yelling, screaming and having a nervous breakdown on every other note. That entire style of oversinging and overemoting is hideous, vulgar and an assault on the senses.

Jennifer Holliday should have been whipped and committed to an asylum. Nothing about this ghastly, grotesque creature is even remotely appealing.

Cynthia Erivo sang the best version.

Holliday's facial expressions always looked like she was being fucked in the ass for the first time with a 12 inch cock and no lube.

Love the show but hate the way the song is normally performed. Sharon Brown’s Effie was the exception. The only time I ever felt Effie’s pain during that number. She was understated and wonderful.

Well, it's not like Jennifer Holliday couldn't be understated in her singing. She sounded really good here singing Good Morning Heartache.

Dreamgirls was the last of the great Broadway musicals. That show that everyone was talking about and a who's who attended. And a cast album without a dud in the bunch.

Hamilton has been the only exception since then.

Holiday sings every songlike AIATYING and that's why she's been so incredibly unsuccessful as a recording artist. Every song is so tortured and excessive. I was in a gay bookstore when one of her CDs was playing. The clerk pulled it out midway through and said "Jesus Christ, shut up."

[quote]Holiday sings every songlike AIATYING Not True. Though a lot of them. But she has amazing control and technique.

It's like watching and hearing a fat schizophrenic on a meth jag lurch towards murder-suicide via her own enormous picket fangs.

In other words, It's essential.

I did enjoy her style on No Frills Love.

jenny's second best song

When I saw it in LA, Jennifer got a standing ovation that lasted throughout the intermission. I've never seen anything like it.

And most nights after the show, she was at the Hamburger Hamlet on Sunset eating at the counter, by herself.

"And I Am Telling You I'm Not Going" is great BECAUSE it's bombastic and overrated!

The chord changes. Hmmm...

R49 - How much did she eat?

I saw Dreamgirls (the film) opening weekend and the theater was PACKED. People cheered during The Key Change -- including the straight white guy with his wife who was sitting next to me -- and a third of the audience stood up and cheered at the end.

I also read that when Jennifer Hudson first did that scene, she had tears in her eyes, and the director made her redo it without the crying. I don't know what that means for the idea that it's overwrought but I think it does say that sometimes less is more.

I don't know. I feel like the song just fits the narrative. 60s girl group, the girl with the strongest voice and strongest personality pushed to the side for the pretty one with the more palatable, softer voice. AIATY is the culmination of the "you're too loud" and "you're too fat" commentary. The fact that it's fierce is just a testament to the fact that if you give any heavy black woman who grew up singing in church a song she's going to turn it into a moment.

It's a horrible song. An unmelodious and bombastic number meant to showcase Effie's refusal to accept the fact that she's about to hit rock bottom, even though she's about ready to painfully crash and burn. Still, it's a whole load of screaming set to one of the ugliest non-melodies in history. What's the point of having a big, powerful voice and an impressive range, when you are going to use this ugly monstrosity to showcase it?

By the way R10, that is absolutely HIDEOUS. That girl is always a full tone off key, but she sort of redeemed herself in R16, where it's evident that she had taken vocal lessons. Still, her voice isn't impressive, but the affination does improve a lot and this time, she can hit the high notes.

The Sammy Davis Jr performance at R25 is great. The song is still awful, but he had an extremely beautiful voice and was a consummate performer. It's only too bad that he wasted part of his show singing this grotesque cacophony of a number.

Diana Ross was a very good singer.

I like bombast, I like over-the-top. Sing it, girl!

There is no Key Change in this song. I Am Changing has one

R25, That was actually beautiful and well done, and probably the clearest pronunciation of the lyrics I've ever heard.

Sam Harris did a good version, lol.

Interesting, R15. I think that a less-psycho declamation of a love command that doesn't work would have been good. Some tears would have shown that the horrible bravura was not a break from reality but a desperate plea from a wounded woman who doesn't want to admit she's lost it all.

Crazy Bloody MARY! versus Poor Proud MARY!

Chicken wings with apricot sauce, baked potato and a salad- Jen's usual dinner.

R36 -- L.O.L.!!!!!!

Bombastic?

Really?

It is the greatest showstopper ever written for musical theater. Nothing else comes close. It's great within the context of the stage show. When the show first came out, it was a huge surprise. Having the lead in scene really sets it up. I love the show.

All of that stated, Amber Riley is who does it best. Too bad her version of the show didn't move from London to Broadway.

Amber isn't fit to wipe Jennifer Holiday's ass.

"It is the greatest showstopper ever written for musical theater."

Hello, Gorgeous!

Both And I'm Telling You and Don't Rain aren't technically showstoppers because they come at the end of Act 1.

Now THIS is a showstopper. And better than both those titles. Ironically, I think Holliday shares a lot of the same qualities, positive and negative with Merman.

Dreamgirls wasn't all that successful. It was only the 61st longest-running show in Broadway history. Let's not exaggerate its importance or popularity.

R68, the show itself wasn't that big but And I'm Telling You has to be one of the most performed Broadway songs in mainstream media in the last 50 years. Any of the "audition" reality contests had contestants doing it annually. It's hard to think of another show song from the 80s on that has had this type of longevity.

Well it was nominated for 13 Tony's, won 6 including Best Musical.

But yeah, not that important. (Moron)

R70, And it's still only #61 in the list of longest-running Broadway shows.

R70, successful and important aren't the same. Two Gentlemen of Verona was nominated for 8 Tonys and won 2 including Best Musical over another show......oh, its name escapes me.

Interesting to see Sammy, the Sammala himself, tackle a song so clearly meant for a woman.

It is an extremely ugly song.

Holliday kept threatening to drop out of the original production so much that Michael Bennett spent as much time mollycoddling her personally as he did directing the rest of the production. I've never understood his devotion to her.

R70, please. Awards as your argument? IT DIDN"T WIN THE TONY FOR BEST MUSICAL. "Nine" did. (Moron)

DREAMGIRLS losing to NINE must have been bittersweet to Bennett as Tune had been his close friend and protégé.

Yeah, bittersweet is one word for it. But they weren't so close afterwards and then Bennett died.

Let's make this about me, okay?

Thank you.

Nell Carter played Effie White when it was in workshop but left to go to Hollywood soon after.

[quote]Two Gentlemen of Verona was nominated for 8 Tonys and won 2 including Best Musical over another show......oh, its name escapes me.

Grease.

[quote]Amber isn't fit to wipe Jennifer Holiday's ass.

NO!! NO - I’m really not!

Fantasia for the win.

Bennett wanted Cheryl Barnes for Effie and she did it in workshops but quit. He just couldn't see any man with Jennifer Holliday. LOL. Barnes did the show at LBCLO to great acclaim.

Cheryl Barnes is a gay icon.

Sorry R67, but I've never understood the fascination with Rose's Turn. It is just ugly and more than dramatic, it is comical in its exaggeration. Also, Ethel Merman's voice made her sounds of a goose with a potato stuck in its throat.

Simply horrible.

[quote]but I've never understood the fascination with Rose's Turn

There's a small group of gay men on here who think the musical atrophied after Follies and Gypsy. There's a certain Miss Havisham quality to the DL theater threads, which always turn into critical dissertations on one or both of these ancient warhorses.

And yes, you have to laugh at people saying Jennifer Holliday is overwrought while praising Ethel Merman, who wouldn't know subtle if it bit her on the ass.

With Effie gone, The Dreams could finally break loose and shake their groove thang.

I say GOOD RIDDANCE!

[quote] In some productions of the show they omit that so the actress playing Effie can garner all the applause, but the number just doesn't work nearly as well without that cinematic "cut".

r5 yes and the heartbreak is the audience applauding for the Dreams instead of for Effie.

R88 - That look on Jennifer Hudson's face at 1:40 evokes Divine as Dawn Davenport in the superior film Female Trouble.

Wait. Did Holliday die? Do we really not have to suffer another performance of this bombastic thing from her?

she's fine. She was just on the Tony Awards this year performing that song

r91 you're a real piece of shit cheering for her death

R87, did you not get "Holliday shares a lot of the same qualities, positive and negative with Merman." in the Rose's Turn post? Merman herself is something of a joke on DL as shown for the amusement over her commercials for Vel.

Follies freaks and Dreamgirls dorks on DL actually have a lot in common. The shows remarkably are only 8 years apart but their fans go on and on about them. Both fan groups are like crack addicts searching for that high they got when they originally saw it and in the case of Follies, very few actually saw the original so it's really a bizarre situation.

[quote] very few actually saw the original so it's really a bizarre situation.

Please. Most saw the original of Hamlet

[quote]The shows remarkably are only 8 years apart

Follies opened in 1971

Dreamgirls in 1981

This is DL. 10 years = 8 years.

I never saw Dreamgirls but saw the revival of Follies ten years ago (!) and it was brilliant.

RIP Jan Maxwell.

Jennifer can rein it in on more middle-of-the-road songs.

Good God, that's reined in R100?

Okay. Imagine Jennifer Holliday playing Rose in GYPSY. "Rose's Turn" would be 10 minutes longer while JH gasped for..breath..and tried to....make it....look dramatic...and awesome. "For Me! For Me! For Me! For......sucking the air out of the theatre, the studio, the audience, the earth...Meeeeeeeeeee!!"

Her first single as a solo artist, had a nice slow build, a great climax and bridge, and then she brings it down for the end.

A very beautiful and complex composition that she delivers exquisitely.

R102 that gif is hilarious. Holliday was such a terrible actress and her line readings on Screamgirls made her sound like an amateur playing the lead in some local church production of a show.

The Forbidden Broadway parody of her was so accurate.

"Nobody cares what lyrics I sing, as long as I make your inner ear ring....I'm rantin' and I'm ravin', and you and you and you, you're gon' HEAR me! Cos I'm a Screamgirl..."

I saw it the third time it was performed in its Boston tryout in 1981.

The applause for Holliday's performance at the end of Act One went on for a full three fucking minutes.

R105, you timed it?

WWFD?

(What would Flo do?)

Florence Ballard was NOTHING like Jennifer Hudson's character in Dreamgirls!

Dreamgirls was total fiction. It had NOTHING to do with reality.

R102

BA-HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

R105 Lucky!

Was it a very different show then from the Broadway version?

When is singing no longer singing?

r112 when it's rap.