“EUPHORIA” season 2- The Finale Thread

Oh shit. It just hit me that it’s tomorrow.

[quote] Between what is happening in Ukraine and knowing the season 2 finale is this weekend

MARY!

SEMI-SPOILER

Be ready for Nate’s full redemption in the finale. Nate is officially a “good guy”.

Adults watching Euphoria is pretty cringe.

Get a life, you ephebophiles

It’s a show for adults. It would be NC-17 if a film, not even R. Idiot.

They can try to make Nate a 'good guy' but I'm not buying it. And frankly, I'm not seeing it on my screen. He's a psychopath. Even if we're supposed to believe he got twisted because he saw his dad's sex tapes at an early age, it's not making me any more sympathetic towards him. Maybe this is what the writers want me to think but it's not working.

43 years old. Very strange. I just "discovered" this show 2 years late. NONE of the guys /girls I know from 20-30 watch this show. I was given one semi nice response- "Zendaya is a good actress"... Shocked.

Just finished Season 1 last night- I did not like the musical aspect of the Season 1 finale, but found it all very good with some great "subtle" cliffhangers. Elordi surprised me the most with his performance.

My favorite character is Fez. I fucking love that kid!

Its so weird, I watch this show and feel this fatherly protection mechanism kicking in. I just want to take all these fuck ups into my home and keep them safe. They are all so fucked up.

Binging this show is NOT advised. It gets under your skin.

I love the juxtaposition of sunny California with this show's production design. All of that dark lighting and 70's/80's vibe homes.. Its pretty cool.

And can SOMEONE explain to me Fez's storyline in the Season 1 finale??? I could not understand it- the doctor/the cartel type dude(fuck he is scary)

Kind of leery of Season 2, as I may wait until the holidays or something

Fez’s storyline is the easiest to follow. Yet you (now twice) claim you couldn’t understand it.

Fez is a drug dealer. Mouse gave him tons of drugs to sell. Fez confronts Nate and tells him to leave Rue etc. alone. Nate calls the cops to get Fez in trouble. The feds show up banging on Fez’s door so him and Ash flush all the drugs down the toilet. In the finale Mouse is going to come collect the money from all the drugs he gave Fez to sell, but Fez had to flush the drugs down the toilet due to Nate ratting him out, so there is no money. Because of this, Fez goes to the wealthy man’s house and robs him so he has the money to give to Mouse, and because the man pulls a gun out on him and beats him badly, takes the money, and leaves. He now has the money to give to Mouse so he won’t end up dead.

Very easy.

*and because the man pulls a gun out on him Fez beats him up badly

R8- Love the nasty response- What the fuck?

The wealthy man? How does he come in to play- I seriously do not understand this!

It’s not a nasty response. You did the same shit on one of the other threads and now are asking the same shit and acting like you just watched it for the first time even though you’re all over the other threads. You keep doing the same exact thing. It’s weird.

Not everyone you see needs some big backstory. The wealthy man is clearly someone Fez knows about but the man doesn’t know Fez. Fez scopes him out, stalks him one day and then robs him. It’s literally that simple.

Yo, R-11-

This is my first time posting this question. Ever.

Go trolldar me or something.

I appreciate the explanation regardless.

That last episode was so unrealistic. That play would cost more money than random Hollywood b movie. Even Broadway don't have this type of a budget. And is this play being preformed in school? No way would so much swearing and that gay musical part where they are stimulating sex and cumming on each other with beer, be allowed in an American school for the kids to watch.

R5 a show for adults watching naked teens.

You’re dumb and cringe.

R14 but you watch. You’re all over the threads J. Lmao. Who are you to talk???

Tonight is the night!

I don't care about Rue's dead dad.

Elliott’s song sucked. I wasn’t sure why they played all 10 my minutes of it, and then I remembered that shitty Zendaya music video at the end of season 1. I guess that’s Euphoria’s thing now.

This show is more long form music video than TV show.

The finale sucked.

This episode was a self-indulgent crapfest, especially compared to last week’s excellent episode.

p.s. How did this become the Lexi show instead of the Rue show? Did Judd Apatow fund the film stock?

I prefer it when Rue isn't on screen. I find every single character more interesting then Rue, although I understand it's the Zendaya show.

The fact so many of you don’t get the “music video” at the end of the season 1 finale is alarming. But I shouldn’t be surprised you don’t understand it when Fez’s storyline needs to be explained to you.

I fell asleep during that boring (and way too long) Elliot song. I hope Fez is okay. I am truly happy to have that ridiculous play over and done with.

Ash did it to himself. He wanted to go out shooting rather than surrendering.

The Elliott scene didn’t bother me. I was more bothered by the Rue/Lexi scene. I’m glad Rue finally apologized to Lexi and they spoke but it went on too long. And they’re sitting alone speaking yet both of them are whispering which was annoying the fuck out of me.

Nate’s “redemption” did not exactly absolve him of every shitty thing he’s done. So he turned in his dad. He’s still a psycho.

Nate did the “right thing” but his reasoning behind doing it wasn’t good. He didn’t do it because it was right, he did it because he wanted to hurt his father.

[Quote]I fell asleep during that boring (and way too long) Elliot song.

I got up to use the bathroom and when I came back he was still singing.

Nate's actions pissed me the fuck off, though I really felt for Cal. Cal didn't know Jules was underage but recording her and everyone else was illegal so he's going down for his crimes.

Nate being the one to take down his father makes zero sense. He's all upset that kids at school laughed along with Lexi's homophobic play, so he decides that the best way forward is to be known as the closet case jock with a pedo father? Was there even a point to him bringing the gun? Not like it would matter if Cal stole the USB since Nate already showed the cops, hence them arresting Cal.

Show has so much potential that's been wasted on Sam's stupid vanity plot lines. Guess I can only count on Secession to give me good old quality HBO content.

Yes the dialog was very clear in that scene r28. Nate talking about how he likes to hurt people, Nate saying that he just wants revenge. In spite of that poster who reads too many reddit spoilers the scene wasn't actually about trying to redeem Nate.

From the other thread

“Not that great of a finale, though the season 1 finale wasn't that great either. Guess it is not Sam Levinson's specialty. It felt pretty disjointed. Though I guess the main point he wanted to focus on was getting Rue to a point where she could move past her drug addiction phase.

Though the casual line about the "rest of the school year" makes Laurie's absence seem very noticeable if that much time is passing.”

I get where you’re coming from about the “rest of the school year” line but Rue has always been narrating from the future. Levinson already said we will see the Laurie storyline unfold in season 3.

R30 have your watched any of the episodes leading up to the finale??? Real question. Because Nate and Cal’s relationship has been the foundation of Nate’s character since episode 2 of season 1. He didn’t do this because of the play.

Jacob Elordi said this season is about “redemption” in regards to Nate Jacobs. We may see it as bad, but to some this is the beginning to him redeeming himself and getting his shit together. To start that, he needs to get rid of the one thing he feels is in his way, Cal.

I still don't think that's redemption, like are we supposed to feel good or bad about Nate tossing his daddy in jail? How does that help anyone? Jules was passed it and thriving in her life, Cal was thriving, Nate was the only one not working through his shit.

Of course I have r33. If he didn't do this because of the play then why the hell did he waste time chasing down Maddy with a gun for the CD? He kept saying he did everything to protect his father so when did he flip the switch if not during the play when he got all embarrassed for people laughing at him? Why did he even care if Maddy had the CD if by your account his plan was to release it to the cops anyway.

past it^

“I still don't think that's redemption, like are we supposed to feel good or bad about Nate tossing his daddy in jail? How does that help anyone? Jules was passed it and thriving in her life, Cal was thriving, Nate was the only one not working through his shit.”

Everyone deals with shit differently. Hate to break it to you, but we are not collectively one person, who react and heal to things the same way. He couldn’t heal because his father haunts his mind, which is why we are shown he has nightmares of his father raping him. He was trying to protect his father, but in the end realized the only way to clear his own mind of his father is to get rid of him.

Love that Faye protected Fez.

It seemed to glorify guns and the play was endless and boring. They could have made the Cassie beat down more dramatic. I also don’t buy Nate as a good guy. He’s as psychotic as his father.

Glorify guns? The character shooting ended up dead.

Yes, but not until a protracted shoot out with a child killing people.

R41 a shootout doesn’t mean it was glorifying guns. Shootouts happen.

No one speaks about how tragic the Ash character really is. He’s a kid who was abandoned by his mom as a baby and raised in the world of crime and drug dealing. Killing and crime is his normal. He knows nothing else. And that’s not his fault.

The episode started out so promising, but Elliott’s long, pointless song killed the momentum. And the Rue and Lexi scene was so boring, I’m not even sure what happened in the last 5 minutes.

As if a girl in a high school play would say “I love fucking.” This show is so OTT.

I liked the episode. It gave closure to the Nate/Cal storyline and to Rue as a whole. We saw Rue finally learn to stop hating herself and is working on herself, trying to fix her relationships (Lexi and Elliott), and throwing away one she feels isn’t good for her anymore (Jules).

I just felt the Lexi/Rue scene was too long.

Lmao I will laugh my ass off if in season 3 we see them in prison together 😂

😂😂😂😂

Is Cal now off the show?

I hope that Cassie and Lexie’s father comes back as a recovered addict, who is suspiciously wealthy.

Or as an addict who causes hell.

Faye is trending on twitter

r37 if he wanted his father out of his life he already got his wish. Cal was living his best life away from Nate. Nate just couldn't stand for his father to be happy because Nate is unhappy and it doesn't really have shit to do with Cal. Nate wasn't molested or beaten by his father, so if he had just talked to his dad about his feelings or taken his ass to therapy instead of that play, he'd be in a better place. Now, he has to live with the shame of everyone knowing Cal's crimes. It's stupid writing based on what we know about Nate.

If Sam wanted to show Nate turning on Cal he should have made it clear at which point he changed alliances because it remains unclear and makes his actions with Maddy and Jules seem very odd over the past 2 episodes.

Ugh. It’s not stupid writing. The Nate character is quick to hurt others. He even admitted to getting off to it. He will sleep like a baby now that he did this to his father.

We will probably see that in season 3. Jesus. Why don’t people get that season 3 is continuing the stories from 2? It’s been said that whatever stories weren’t answered for 2 will be in 3. Levinson said the Laurie story will continue in 3. The Nate/Cassie story will 100% continue in 3. They didn’t kill Fez off because we will see what happens with him next season. Get it?

This wasn’t the series finale. It was the season finale.

It seems like the damage to Nate was watching his father’s videos and his father being a jerk to him. That character has no where to go.

Jules got the worst storyline. They are spending way too much time in boring Ethan.

What time was spent on Ethan? He was in the play but he got like 30 seconds of screen time this episode.

It’s been established that Nate watching those videos since 11 damaged him. That’s not a secret (and very realistic). His father wasn’t even that much of a jerk to him. Nate was a jerk to his father though. Nate has always been mad at his father because of those tapes. Why has Cal not once told him “listen you little fucker, you shouldn’t have been going through my stuff in the first place?” Cal was wrong for what he did but it’s not like he took his 11 year old son and showed him those videos. His nosy son found them and made watching them (more like studying them) a hobby.

Sorry, not Ethan, meant the boring one with a guitar.

Thank you r55. Nate doesn't make sense. He hates his father so much yet can't wait to watch his dad fuck videos? He was like 17 in S1 so why was he still watching if he hates his big bad father? I'm still waiting to see what Cal did to Nate to make Nate that his father hated him. Like that felt like a reach.

r53 it is stupid writing. Sure Sam covered his ass by making Nate say he just likes to hurt people, but that doesn't;'t excuse Nate blowing up his own life. He has shown that he cares about inheriting his father's company and his reputation. How did taking down Cal help with either of those things?

We basically didn't get enough information about what's going on in Nate's head to make this little scene a pay off. Not to mention the purpose of the gun. The cops were on the way, the cops already had the evidence (hence the arrest warrant). Why bother with the gun? I guess to scare Cal and make the viewers think something sinister would happen? Naw, sloppy execution and sloppy writing.

The finale was like the rest of the season -- good, but not great. The emotional moments didn't land as well as they could have.

The scenes with Rue dragged on forever, as did Elliott's audition for an open mike. It was nice Rue and Lexi reconnected, but their talk could have been shorter.

Nate was not redeemed. He's still a psycho who gets off on hurting others. His character arc this season either removed or softened the elements that made him compelling in the first place. If that was Jacob's idea, he needs to take a writing class.

Season two wasn't as good as one. The writing was lazier. The characters were too siloed off from each other, which made the flow of the episodes kind of disjointed. Season one had more momentum, better world-building and more humor. Jules had no story; neither did Kat (looks like the rumors were true ...) and Maddie just barely had one.

The first four episodes of the season differed a lot from the last four. In the first four, Rue was in the background, Elliott was a major character and every episode had a million music cues. In the last four, Rue is back to being the main character, Elliott is gone and the music cues were fewer.

If Rue stays clean for the remainder of the school year, does that mean season three will pick up with her as a senior?

I love Faye, hope to see her back. MVP of the episode.

Jacob Elordi is more supple an actor than you’d expect from someone SO handsome. More interesting by far when he’s crazy though.

Rue was always the main character r58. What show are you watching? Did you get a special cut? Rue is the central character of every episode, unless you’re saying her having less screen time means she was background? That’s not how it works. She had a storyline and was the central character and narrator.

R57 WE KNOW WHY NATE HATES HIS DAD!!! I’ve told you this before and I will tell you again, this show is not for you. If you can’t understand the show and CONSTANTLY need the show explained to you, you shouldn’t be watching. You’re a grown man. Yet you can’t ever understand anything unless it’s broken down in a way for a 5 year old to understand.

R60 he’s attractive but I don’t think he’s SO handsome.

Seasons 1 and 2 are intentionally different than each other. At the beginning of the season Levinson said this season was shot on specific film to give it the look that will go along with the vibe of season 2, darker. He said 2 will be much darker and more mature than 1 was, and he wanted the look to match the darker storylines and themes.

Fun Fact, the execs at HBO hated the direction season 2 took because of how dark and serious the stories became. But the show has done so well that they like it now.

Cut the shit r61. Nate said, even up to the point of his father’s arrest, that he was protecting Cal. How, we don’t know besides his crazy stunts with Jules. Now, suddenly he’s done protecting Cal and wants him to go to jail, destroying the family business and the family’s reputation?

It’s not spelling it out if you need a character’s motivations explained since Nate was just holding Maddy by gunpoint over Jules Tape, 2 episodes ago. So between that time and this episode he decided to turn his father over to the cops. My question is why and when. Cal already left the house before Nate snuck into Maddy’s room.

I don’t want you to bother answering because clearly something has crawls up you ass and died, given your attitude.

R63 this season felt less dark to me, but maybe because Rue faced no consequences for her actions abs Nate’s big drama was over a typical high school TV love triangle. In S1, Rue was still a junkie but we had Mouse, Tyler getting his ass kicked, Tyler going to jail, Jules getting blackmailed, Maddy getting choked.

S2 was like child’s play compared to S1.

Nate blames his father for all his mental and emotional and anger issues. Every issue Nate has, he blames his dad for. He feels he inherited all his fathers “best” qualities, which are actually his worst. Nate blames his father so much for how angry and miserable he is that the idea of his father living his life how he wants to and being happy now makes him even more angry and miserable inside. The only thing that will make Nate’s anger and misery lessen is seeing his (now happy) father suffer. Cal suffering makes Nate feel better inside.

I can understand that and thanks r66. Nate’s other stated motivations were his reputation and getting ahold of his father’s company. He’s destroyed both by his actions. 8 know I shouldn’t but the lack of consistency or at least a trigger point is what’s annoying me. I accept that this is the Sam and Zendaya show, but a little side character development would kill Euphoria. Especially if we have time for open mic nights from Elliott.

Dear God, I can’t believe this needs to be explained, just like Fez’s simple storyline. Yikes.

Nate was “protecting” Cal by never exposing him for what he’s been doing. Nate has known since he was 11 that his father is A. Cheating on his mother with men, women and trannys, and B. Has been recording them, most of them never knowing they’re being recorded. His never exposing his father to anyone, including his mother, is him protecting his dad.

The show even shows Nate protecting his father.

After Cal fucks Jules, things get worse, especially because Jules tells Rue and Cal knows this. Nate collects nudes from Jules as an unknown person to blackmail her into making sure she never exposes his father, leading to Jules saying her popular line “Wanna know what I think? I think you’re a fucking faggot just like your daddy” which clearly hits a deep nerve with Nate.

We also see Nate try to manipulate Rue during the season 1 finale when she threatens to expose Cal.

When Rue threatens to expose Cal to Nate, so he quickly tries to “butter her up” in a manipulation tactic so she doesn’t expose his father.

R65 I disagree. Season 2 starts with a murder (Mouse), Rue ending up at Laurie’s with Fez and Ash, and her heart stopping because of how many drugs she took, so she takes something else to revive her heart! Episode 5 alone makes this season more serious.

The love triangle isn’t typical because of Cassie. That love triangle exposed how mentally ill Cassie is, so much so that some therapists and psychologists have made videos breaking down the mental and emotional illness of that character. That entire storyline played out dark and serious, not 90210 type at all.

Jules was cheating on Rue, even if she doesn’t know still.

Cal abandons his family to live the life he feels robbed of. We see Cal is in love with his best friend but can’t be with him because Marsha gets pregnant and decides to keep it.

Ash just killed someone else and ended up getting himself killed. Fez and Faye are arrested. Nate just got his father arrested. Nate held his ex at gunpoint.

There is so much more.

Also, Rue is clean in a lot of season 1. She is addicted to opioids but she cleans up for Jules. She relapsed at the end of the season 1 finale. Season 2 we see her taking everything, even shooting up heroine.

R67 I understand, but I do think Levinson left it sort of “open” because next season we will see Nate’s motivations and why he made these choices etc. i don’t think we will never know.

Here’s my hope for season three. Nate appears to be continuing his redemption and acting kinder and nicer. He even forgives Lexi about her play and tells her it’s helped him see the light and he’s healing because of it and turning in his father. He flirts with her and pursues her and starts to be come the perfect loving boyfriend and proving his heterosexual prowess. It all culminates in what ultimately should be the happiest night, senior prom. But it’s there in front of everyone that he completely publicly eviscerates and humiliates her destroying every aspect of her for all to see as revenge for the play.

Here’s my take on the play, it has threes sources and inspirations- if they are from Lexi or Sam I can’t tell you, but if she’s watching Little House on the Prairie I think it’s possible that she’s exposed to anything.

1) A Small Opening from Absolutely Fabulous. Lexi is obviously the Saffy of this show and would deeply identify with her. She too has had to be “…a self raising flower.” And doing this play is the way to give voice to the trauma she’s experienced and begin to exercise it. Her telling the Cassie actress to not do it so broad and it’s not a comedy, but all the actors seeing it as comedy, is a direct callback. As is the mother being played in drag and over the top, reflects back to the Patsy actor in Saffy’s play. Even her stage mangers crush on her is recalls the actress playing Saffy crushing on her. I would have to watch Opening again, but I think there are many other parallels.

2) The locker room scene is definitely an ode to the Best Little Whore House’s getting ready to go to the Chicken Ranch production number. And despite playing football players, those chorus boys were all Gayer then a two dollar bill, as are the kids in this production, Ethan is also theater kid Queer at the very least as well. Because they are in on it and dialing it up to 100 it’s not homophobic, but empowering. I hope theater kids become a bigger feature next season, I would love to see Sean Grandillo and Ted Sutherland transfer in from that high school in Rise to join the cast and be Gayboy leads.

3) More then anything the whole production is practically stolen from the season finale of Sex Education, where an outlandish over the top, not possible by any actual school and sexualized musical space age production of Romeo and Juliet allows the whole cast to be brought together and secrets exposed and revealed and many have their comeuppance.

I seem to be interpreting this differently than many others, but:

- This season ended on a much less depressing note than Season 1, because Rue got clean rather than relapsing, the girls have somewhat hashed out their secrets and differences, and Cal’s secrets are out.

- Nate is not at all redeemed, it just seems like Cal is the pawn he’s using to work out his revenge fantasies now, instead of Lukas Gage’s character.

- Maddie is the best character on this show, her scene with Cassie in the bathroom—jaded, betrayed and angry, still sympathetic for her friend underneath it—was excellent.

- Elliot’s character was a waste of time and worsened the show’s momentum, his screen time should have been for Jules and Kat.

- Fez is dead, which is fine, he got too much screen time this season and some of the story lines need to resolve. Lexi needs to transition back to a minor character, or fit a little better into this universe. Her character made more sense in Season One as a little more alienated from the “bad girls” group.

- I’m torn between giving the Best Supporting Actor Emmy to Cal for his drunken trip to the gay bar and then home to pee in his hall, or to Ethan for his spectacular performance in last week’s play part one episode.

- Jacob Elordi’s acting was flat this season and I missed this spice of his more psycho attitude from Season One, as well as the tension between Nate and Jules—if he wants a redemption story, it needs to run through his feelings for Jules, not a love triangle with two attractive straight girls.

- The show is at a crossroads and can either get back to excellence or descend further into naval-gazing and get even worse. The show runner needs to get his shit together here.

R74 has spoken!

Fez is likely not dead

Ash got what he deserved. He was a loose cannon.

I think it’s hilarious Rue is essentially off the hook for wasting $10,000 of Laurie’s drugs and escaping out of her kitchen window.

Fez should be dead, I hate death fake-outs like that. And I agree with the poster above who thought the shoot-out was ridiculous. It reminded me of “Angels with Dirty Wings” or whatever the fake gangster movie was in Home Alone. Ridiculous.

Ash is dead. Fez was shot in the side but was very much conscious so it's not a fake death.

I agree. Nate isn't redeemed but he's simply not as interesting when he isn't being a full out psycho. Jacob Elordi's appeal eludes me.

The finale fell flat.

Nate’s storyline was so anti-climactic and stupid, I get the impression Elordi isn’t interested in coming back next season.

If Nate gave up the video with Jules to the police, then he also fucked over Jules by telling her it was hers to do what she wanted with it. Unless Cal was banging other underage people, which was never exactly made clear.

[Quote]I get the impression Elordi isn’t interested in coming back next season.

This show is incredibly popular, and popular with the "right crowd". I assure you he would not want to leave it.

So Rue went the rest of the school year owing a drug dealer $8000 with zero fallout? Absurd. The worst writing of the series. Real dealers do NOT play. Laurie didn’t exactly look like a millionaire either

I assume Fez is still alive, which is unfortunate, because the drug dealer with a heart of gold storyline is ridiculous – especially the part about Lexi's infatuation with the guy that helped supply her best friend with the drugs that ruined her life.

I'm probably reading too much into it, but I was annoyed by the Cal set-up in the finale. For starters, it was weird that he was just hanging out and yucking it up with a gaggle of randos (sex workers?) that were obviously assembled by casting to scream LGBTQ(!). Did they all just fuck or are these his new "friends"? Then you've got Kylie Minogue playing in the background just to really drive home what seemed like a stereotypical point. It all felt clichéd and contrived. I get that we're supposed to see Cal supposedly living a more authentic queer life, but none of it really rang true and the execution was cheesy.

As a whole, the episode was kind of a mess and didn't have any of the exciting and frenetic flow of the preceding episode, which felt more like a finale than the sloppy scotch-taped together one we got. I personally thought season 2 was just as strong as season 1, but this finale was a dud.

[Quote]I personally thought season 2 was just as strong as season 1, but this finale was a dud

Agree with this sentiment.

ITA, R185. It was an insulting, cliche scene.

I think it's interesting that the show seems to have turned into the Nate Show with Jules sidelined; Nate might be sorry for dropping a dime on the old man because if the cops bring in Jules about Cal, she might just come clean about how she lied about the rape because Nate blackmailed her into it. I don't think Rue is off the hook by any means, but rather they're saving Laurie coming for her for the next season. If you believe the stuff you read about this show (because everything on the internet is true, of course), it appears that storylines are driven by whoever is in/out with Levenson (as well as a desire to please Apatow too, no doubt) rather than some sort of overarching strategy story and that's kind of a shame because it is a smart, entertaining show (for now)

Do we know how long “the rest of the school year” was if the season started at New Year’s? I was thinking this was maybe around March/April? It’s hard to tell with this show.

Where the hell were all the school administrators and teachers ? No one stepped up to stop what was happening on that stage ?

The other problem is setting of the show. You can get away with saying Rue, Jules and Lexi are juniors I guess. But isn't this the senior year of Maddie, Cassie and Nate. They were all referred to as 18 this season so rest of the school would mean they aren't in high school anymore.

I found some classroom footage of a teacher addressing his students at Euphoria High:

Ash was a fucked up dangerous kid and he needed to go or be sent to Ukraine to fight.

This season was such letdown. The first season felt different and subversive and this season felt completely conventional and cliche. I know Kat was sidelined for behind the scenes reasons, but the storyline she was left with was nonsensical and pointless. Levinson should have just cut all of it. I don't know why Jules's screen time was so minimal this season. She was the most interesting character last year and at the heart of most of the storylines. This year she flirted with Elliot, staged an intervention for Rue, and that was about it. Instead of the interesting and original content of season 1 we mostly got endless cliche drama about a love triangle and a school play. Take away the cursing and the nudity and that was total CW-level shit. I know everyone has been praising Sydney Sweeney's performance, but Cassie has two modes: whining and whimpering. She should definitely not be the focus of so much storyline given how underdeveloped she is as a character. Neither should Lexi who feels like she's on an entirely different show most of the time, including her completely cliche relationship with the bad boy who can only be redeemed by her love. And then that fucking play. Couldn't they have at least made it a community theater production? At least then the budget and content could have been passably realistic. Or the fact that it was Barb who had to break up the fight and not a single teacher or administrator was anywhere to be found.

Well, that finale was a complete and total mess. Confusing, nonsensical, cliched, stupid, and completely dropping entire plot threads...

Rue and the drug dealer and the missing suitcase/drugs and the huge debt was just DROPPED. Yet that was easily the most interesting/compelling plot set up by that intense episode 5.

The whole season was just a mess. I hope that whole Fez/Fish-lips/kid part of the story is just gone forever now.

And I feel like I'm the only person who really, really doesn't like Lexi, and really, really found the whole "friendship" with Fez to be totally unbelievable and forced and ridiculous.

I don't think I care if there's a season three.

Season two certainly had highlights. Episode 5 should win Emmys. That flashback of Cal's was masterful.

But the whole school play thing was terrible. The finale was awful. Everything felt forced and contrived and disconnected.

The finale sucked, big time.

There were about 3 exciting moments: Ash killing that guy, Nate confronting and turning in his father, and the shootout.

Everything else was a complete snoozefest.

Oh and Elliot's fucking song. I didn't watch the show live so I was mercifully able to fast forward through most of it. Wtf was that shit??

Actually, my favorite thing was Maddy and Kat running up on stage. THat made me laugh out loud.

R95 I don't like Lexi either, she's a huge yawn.

I don't disagree about the comments about Lexi, but if Apatow's connections got her on the show, her connections ensure a prominent role going forward, particularly since she got good press this year with her romance with Fez

This season was like a gymnastics or ice skating event at the Olympics. Despite the beautiful choreography and flawless execution early on, the only thing people remember is the performer falling right on their ass at the very end. I literally had to rewind and rewatch the last 5 minutes multiple times because I couldn’t remain interested in Rue’s inexplicably long scene with Lexi.

And I’m going to go back and time Elliott’s song, because that shit seemed like it lasted 10 minutes.

Yep r93. Ash as portrayed was a severely damaged kid who responded to every situation with murderous violence. He was always going to end up dead or in prison.

Ok, I timed Elliott’s song and it lasted 3 minutes and 30 seconds (and he was still working on it!!!)

Wouldn’t it have been more interesting to see anything else in that amount of time?

Yo. Why is J replying so much, just repeating himself from sock accounts? Some of them repeat what he already said word for word. Wtf. Dude, get off the internet already.

As pointed out by more than one poster r95, the Laurie storyline was not dropped! Jesus. It will be handled in season 3. What is not registering???? What is wrong with your brain? Why does everything need to be explained to you over and over?

R91 a lot of people turn 18 during their senior year. We saw Maddie’s birthday.

They’re around February 2020. The episodes all take place close together. We don’t see big fast forwards with this show. At least not yet.

I don’t mind Lexi but she works better how she was used in season one. However, I 100% find her friendship with Fez believable. Lexi has expressed how guys don’t notice her or look at her. She says this during season 1, she doesn’t know what it’s like to be her sister because guys don’t ever take notice of her. Fez took notice of her and was very sweet to her during the season 1 premiere. You could see her reactions to his compliments etc. like it was the first time someone said these things to her (and it was). It made complete sense that she saw him as a friend or someone special because he made her feel a way no one else does, especially guys.

She’s a passive and quiet person learning to have a voice around a lot of loud people with outrageous personalities. Fez contributed to her confidence boost.

Also, she was never a part of the “mean girls” group, as someone called them. She sort of there by association because she is Cassie’s sister. They used to all hang out more but we see Lexi and Rue are friends while the rest are close. They rarely are all together. Just here and there.

See what this girl says about Nate, this is the type of comments and TT videos I’m seeing about Nate. DL sees that scene and doesn’t see a redemption story, but a lot of young people do and feel “he did something right”. The way they see it is how Levinson sees it. Nate is being “good” now. At least for Nate standards.

[quote]I 100% find her friendship with Fez believable.

"I really like you, person who enabled my best friend's descent into a drug-filled hellhole."

Right you are agreeing with me r105. That we are currently in their senior year so the end of the school year is going to mean those characters are no longer highschool students. It's a significant change for the show.

I'm assuming the Fez/Lexi romance is over since he's going to be incarcerated. From what others have said I guess Lexi is here to stay via nepotism.

Lexi’s going to become the next Faye.

Being that Maude Apatow was a main character for both seasons, and is Cassie’s sister, I don’t see why anyone would think she was going anywhere. She’s also a Junior with Rue and Jules.

R109 yes. But season 3 is most likely continuing weeks after 2 ends. We know Rue stays clean but the seniors will still be here. If the show goes on past season 3 it will probably be different, unless the show does a fast forward.

There is a lot of talk of whether Zendaya will even come back post 3. It took so long to get 3 officially greenlit because they were in negotiations with her and her schedule is so busy they aren’t sure when they will even be able to film it.

They will most likely have to film 3 the way they did 2, the supporting cast getting more scenes and Rue getting less scenes but still the center so they can film around Zendaya until she can film her scenes.

It took over 9 months to film season 2’s 8 episodes because of many factors, but her schedule and having to work around it was one. It took over a month to finish filming episode 5, which was a Rue centered episode, because of her schedule.

R108 she doesn’t hold Rue’s drug use against her and doesn’t hold where she got her drugs against either of them either.

Rue’s addiction started by using her dads meds. Fez just fed the addiction because he’s a drug dealer.

Lexi wasn’t a character in the original script. Levinson added the character and gave Cassie a sister because Maude wanted to start acting as a career. She is a lot of peoples favorite character now, or one of them.

They gave her so little to do season 1 because she struggled to remember lines and couldn’t hit her marks. She got training and practice in between seasons 1 and 2 and did much better and was given more to do.

Idk about Zendaya, because the show was a vehicle for her, but everyone else had to go through many auditions before landing their roles minus Maude, who was given the Lexi role.

People like Angus Cloud had to come read for people after being picked off the street more than once and given the role.

Barbie Ferreira said she had to go through a 7 part process before they gave her the role.

It's a real shame this show's narrative is shaped by petty grievances and actor whims because Barbie's lack of arc hurt the season.

And did they really cut out Maddie and Cassie's bloody fight for that stupid Eliot music video or the boring 10 minute conversation between Lexi and Rue (it was so bad I tuned out and still don't know what they discussed. And I don't care).

Personally, Jules absence was more glaring this season than Kat's. Her character seemed much more peripheral given how pivotal she was to season 1.

The timeline is really fuzzy with this show and they set themselves up for some definite continuity errors be being too specific at the start of the series. In the first episode of the series, we learn that Rue was born three days after September 11 (2001) and she references it being 2019 in one of the first season voiceovers. 2019 is the year someone would likely graduate high school if they were born in 2001. Even if Rue was a Junior in the first season, wouldn't she be a senior by now and wouldn't the kids who are supposedly a year older (Nate, Maddy, Cassie, etc.) have already graduated? Granted, the COVID filming made timeline matters more difficult to discern, but at some point soon, some of these kids are going to have to start graduating.

Can someone please explain Nate more?

Op the Brooklyn Seacow Ed.win how did Mcdonalds cope with you leaving early? Did you calm your jiggly tits?

R117 season 2 takes place the same school year as season 1. They’re still in the same grade. Season 2 starts 3 weeks after season 1 ended. Season 3 will most likely continue and end this school year.

Omg we really do have to wait until 2024 😢

If that’s the case, R121,they might as well pull the plug.

Maybe that's why they had to kill off Ash. He'd by 20 by the time this show came back.

Why r122? Season 2 came out over 2 1/2 years after season 1.

R123 he would be 17 lmao.

He was 12 when he filmed 1 and 15 filming 2.

HBOs 2nd most watched show ever

Maddy is already in her 30’s. They all look 25 plus.

Alexa is 31.

Why do people keep bringing up their age as if it’s new for adults to play teens? This has been common for DECADES, yet some people (like r127) act like this is some new thing…

R114 Maude knew Sam Levinson already from being in his film “Assassination Nation” …

Maddie is the Andrea Zuckerman of Euphoria

I think the show could work without Zendaya.

Not really. The rest aren’t much younger than her.

R131 you always say that. But that’s not happening anytime soon.

The problem, R128 is that time is supposed to only be moving a few months here or there within the show and yet these actors are going to be pushing 30. With other teenage dramas each season is roughly a 'year' so the aging isn't as noticeable.

And yes - I wouldn't mind eliminating Rue. I think she's the weakest link.

Same r134. Is she worth holding up the entire show? She could have been sent to rehab or kidnapped so placed into 1 or 2 episodes of S3 to get shooting started.

What I like about Euphoria is there is none of the awful racial crap, or slurs you would find in say a Quentin Tarantino film or any film where ethic slurs are tossed around.

There's none of that. Everyone is just equal. It's like they transcended racial controversy and I think Zendaya as a producer may have had a part in that.

It's like a world where racism never existed.

Why are you replying to yourself?

On another note, clearly the execs and Levinson feel she’s worth holding up production for. She’s a star.

R136 there aren’t enough black people on the show to even think about that, and Zendaya isn’t much darker than her peers.

The fact you even thought of that says a lot, actually, because I haven’t thought about race on this show once time.

What's weak about Rue's storyline is a lot of people have lost parents but they don't all become strung out drug addicts because of it.

In the first episode I think they alluded to her anxiety disorder and addicted but it's not prescient in the later episodes.

R139 so because others haven’t become drug addicts to cope means she couldn’t have? Are you serious?

R138 I was mostly thinking of the latina and blonde white girl friendship, but yeah you think what you want. Live in your mind of what my mind is. Make it as evil as you want. Go ahead. I won't be there.

Boring song

Isn't Rue supposed to be bipolar? That probably has more to do with her drug addiction then her father dying. But they don't really mention that.

R141 J, you know what you’re doing….

[Quote] Maude knew Sam Levinson already from being in his film “Assassination Nation” …

Sam should bring in Cody Christian too.

Given that we're going to have to wait 2 years (WTF?!) for the next season, I wish the finale was stronger than it was. Long waits like this can go one of two ways: it will either allow time for even more people to discover the show and build anticipation for its return or it can be a total momentum killer. If they're going to take a hiatus for this long, then hopefully the quality of the next 8 episodes will be stellar. There really is no excuse for poor or sloppy storytelling when they have this much time to write and map out the new season.

I realize that Zendaya wants to segue to film while her popularity is cresting, but it kind of sucks for the supporting players that may not have the same opportunities that she does during the extended pause in filming.

We know she knew Levinson. What was said is he created a character for her when he was contacted that she wanted to make acting a career and was looking for a new role. No one said he didn’t know her…

It’s the biggest show on TV. Who doesn’t know it r146? If someone isn’t watching is because they don’t want to at this point. The show is huge, and all over social media, so much to the point people complain they don’t watch it yet know everything that happens every week.

Two years for cable and streaming shows is normal. Stranger Things, Westworld, Russian Doll, Master of None etc.

This isn’t new.

[Quote] I realize that Zendaya wants to segue to film while her popularity is cresting,

So she can do another Spiderman movie? Or Malcolm & Marie?? The more interesting roles are on tv.

[quote]The more interesting roles are on tv.

But the biggest money is in the movies.

“ I realize that Zendaya wants to segue to film while her popularity is cresting, but it kind of sucks for the supporting players that may not have the same opportunities that she does during the extended pause in filming.”

Not Zendaya’s business or fault. She’s already starred and starring in films. She signed onto a few projects before they greenlit a third season. Maybe they should have renewed it sooner, then she would have to make that a priority over the films. But they didn’t.

HBO execs already said they think she may wanna leave after season 3, but of course no one knows for sure. That’s her call to make.

I wish that Cal would have told the cops that Nate has a gun on him and pointed it at him as they arrested him. Then Nate would get 5150’d at least. That would have been divine

r148, I'm aware that longer breaks between seasons is now becoming more common in streaming, but that doesn't always equate to continued excitement in the franchise. I imagine that not as many people are excited about Stranger Things as they were three years ago and same for some of the other shows you mentioned (Russian Doll, Westworld, etc.).

I think Levinson deliberately wrapped most of the storylines (prematurely?) so that season 3 could be an almost total reboot. The Covid time lapse really fucked things up for the series. There's no way season 3 can be the continuation of this year of high school.

Yeah they were supposed to start filming season two around March of 2020. Covid shut it down. Once Hollywood was allowed to start filming again, they couldn’t get everyone back because they had other obligations so it took long to be able to start filming.

They finally began filming last year and it took 9 months to film 8 episodes.

The original season 2 storylines and scripts were completely scrapped and everything was changed. What we got was not what we were originally supposed to have.

They should do one more season and wrap it up. Given all the actors will be over 25 (Maddie 35) it’s not going to work anymore for high school.

Ugh. Alexa is 30/31. So she won’t be 35 in two years. I swear, some of you need mental help. 30somethings have been playing teens for years!

I am really not convinced Zendaya will have a big career after Dune and Spider-Man. She tried a drama and it flopped.

The drama that went straight to Netflix and came out in 2020 during Covid? That one?

Javon Walton (Ash) said Fez was originally supposed to die but Levinson rewrote the entire script the day before filming it began so everyone had to learn the new script.

R157 - you keep saying that like we don’t notice or don’t think it’s stupid. Waiting another two years for another season, for me, would kill the momentum. You forget storylines, and you focus more on aspects like how different Jules looked when only a few weeks is supposed to have elapsed between seasons. I get that Covid happened, but why are they stretching S3 out by another two years?

R161 and you keep saying that, but that’s not the case for everyone. That’s YOU. Some of us are unhappy it’s 2 years but I can almost bet you once a trailer is dropped in 22/23 months from now, you will be like the rest of us excited to see the show. 🤷 putting up a front ain’t cute.

It when S2 sucked balls, R162.

Fuck, “not”….

Again, that’s called an OPINION J. Not a fact r163

So they dropped the planned storyline about Ashtray getting pussy from season 1 to 2 and fathering a child with some of the more desperate druggies. This was never to be shown just implied. Insider, can you confirm?

Seems so stupid that Zendaya would not make this series a priority. She's the star of it. She's actually very good in it even if I hate the character. She will definitely be getting award recognition for this season. People are talking about it and her. She is not a box office draw. The Spiderman films and Dune were not hits because of her.

Not to sound creepy, but the actor who plays Ash is going to be a super-hot teen.

He is a teen. He’s 15 now.

R167 stupid comment. It would be stupid for an actor to focus on one project and character and not branch out and show versatility and range. Putting all her eggs in one basket isn’t gonna help her career in the long run.

Good thing she isn’t being cast to carry blockbusters. Everything she’s signed onto are dramas with limited budgets.

Makes sense r160, it did seen like they were setting it up for Fez to die.

In other interview news Eric Dane has confirmed in interviews that he is coming back for season 3. Which seemed obvious to me but some people were worried he was going to be off the show.

If there's going to be a long wait between seasons then make more than eight episodes.

Okay my bitches, I finally spoke to the person I know who is related to a crew member on the show to see if I can find out any new scoop to share with you. They gave me some tea.

1- Barbie Ferreira filmed scenes for episodes that Sam Levinson left on the cutting room floor. He did not only cut down her role on paper, but also in editing. There were scenes she filmed with Ethan that would give more insight into their relationship and her not liking being with him (he’s just too nice and safe) but all those scenes were cut.

2- No one knows if Sam will bring Barbie back for season 3 or write Kat out, but he was considering the latter at one point, but she has been speaking highly of him and the show during interviews (kissing his ass) so it’s possible he may restore Kat in season 3.

3- Fez was supposed to die, and that was the plan since they began filming but then at the last minute Sam rewrote it and had him survive. The entire shootout scene with Ash wasn’t ever in the script but he changed it to that last minute, shocking the actors.

4- The show went over-budget and they went over schedule (they took almost 10 months to film those 8 episodes) so the finale was sort of rushed and things Sam originally intended to do were cut so it would be a faster shoot.

5- They took long to renew season 3 despite the show being huge because of negotiations and working out schedules with Zendaya. She is getting another pay raise, too.

6- Expect season 3 to have a different feel/look than 2, the way 2 was different from 1. Sam Levinson doesn’t like to do the same thing more than once so he may change up the look/vibe/stories again for season 3.

7- Sam is unsure if he wants to make season 3 the rest of the school year, make half the school year then fast-forward, or just fast-forward from the start and we find out what happened with some stories via flashbacks.

8- HBO execs rarely interfere with the show and Levinson is given full control of his show.

9- HBO Execs (who allow Levinson to do what he wants with his baby) didn’t like season 2 while screening it and felt Sam ruined the show by making it so dark and serious in tone and taking away to fun colors and glamour of season 1. They feared this would kill the show but the show took off big time and became a phenomenon in ways so they are happy.

10 - The actress who plays Maddie is actually 40

R173 no. Her age is pretty unknown to most.

I have another one I will be posting in a bit when I get inside.

Interesting, R172. All of it sounds plausible. A fast-forward might be necessary at this point, since the actors are noticeably older than the characters they play, and the show's timeline is screwed up.

I would be curious to know what the original storylines planned for the season were. Zendaya and others said the season would have been a lot different had COVID not shut down filming. Also, Zendaya and Hunter not wanting to film with Jacob (if true) seems like it forced changes -- which led to the Nate/Maddy/Cassie love triangle.

We know Hunter unfollowed Jacob on social media and only recently followed him again. Clearly there was drama there.

The obsessed Euphoria Troll is shitting all over this thread, just like they did in previous Euphoria threads, berating anyone who doesn't 'understand' some of the convoluted and just plain absurd plot lines.

Someone needs to get a fucking life, it's a fucking TV SERIES, nothing more, take your meds, son!

Season two may have been a huge hit ratings-wise, but it was definitely such a drop in quality. There were some great moments(episode 5 was stellar)), but Levinson is not as talented as he believes. Much of this season felt disjointed and gaudily excessive. The ratings were high and the show is being talked about, so Levinson will probably see himself as a genius and go further with his fancies in season three. That, I fear could be a huge misstep

Euphoria seems to be Sam Levinson's version of, possibly, his own drug and alcohol fueled high school experience, it's more than exaggerated, of course. There's way too much teen angst and over the type self-created drama. Most high schoolers are not dealing with this absurd level of drama. Hell, most adults aren't dealing with this ridiculous level of drama.

As someone else pointed out, Levinson paints sunny California as a very dark depressing downbeat place.

I'm not rooting for anyone. I don't feel for any of these characters, they are all so unlikable and off-putting. Jules is somewhat sympathetic. One hopes the kids watching this don't find the characters aspirational. Most of the characters are flawed with severe mental health issues.

This series isn't very deep nor is it the pinnacle of any sort of great writing or acting. I cannot believe the non-stop gushing about how great this series is. Levinson is no genius.

Tea continued-

Mr. Jacob Elordi… we know that there are rumors of drama with him, but we don’t know why. No one knows if there are more issues, but the first issue is that he cheated on Zendaya during their short lived relationship. They were a couple, he even brought her back to Australia to meet the parents during the week of Thanksgiving here in the states and they celebrated for her there, she spoke highly of him etc. then he cheated. Zendaya dropped him and moved on. Hunter and Zen are besties and Hunter didn’t like what he did and unfollowed him on social media.

Here is where the drama continues-

Jacob went to Levinson and requested the Nate/Jules storyline be scrapped. He did not want that storyline to continue into season 2 because he feared it would affect his career and limit roles being offered to him if he continues the relationship with Jules, played by a transgender actress. Levinson wanted him to think about it but Elordi got his team to contact Levinson and they said that if the storyline is not scrapped he is walking. Levinson then obliged not to lose Elordi. They all then agreed that if the story ever leaks to say it was his team that forced him out of the storyline so Elordi doesn’t look bad.

Hunter/Zen already weren’t fond of him after what he did to Zendaya but they were willing to work with him briefly. After Zendaya found out “his team” demanded the storyline be dropped or he walks, she refused to film any scenes with him. Hunter agreed to film that one scene with him.

That is why the Jules/Nate storyline was abandoned in season 2 and in episode 6 the car scene gives a little closure to that story.

[Quote]Levinson is no genius.

The show is far from perfect but he has managed to create HBOs biggest show since Game of Thrones, it's not easy to create a big hit that manages to a pop culture phenomenon like this.

It does seem like the Nate/Jules story was meant to continue into season two, based on how it went in season one. The way the show dropped it so abruptly and made Jules a nonentity in season two was kind of jarring and disappointing.

[quote]The show is far from perfect but he has managed to create HBOs biggest show since Game of Thrones, it's not easy to create a big hit that manages to a pop culture phenomenon like this.

Something being popular and loved by the masses never means its good. Popularity is never a barometer of greatness. The same can be said of certain films, music and TV shows.

Look at the garbage most people buy into. Reality TV anyone? Honestly, who cares about the 'stars' of reality TV, a bunch of fake, empty, shallow superficial people with tons of self-created drama. Humans should spend more time on their own lives, why waste time investing in the bullshit of these vile reality show assholes? Life is way to short to waste precious time on these people.

Lots of people are easily duped, that's the power of social media.

The general public doesn't exactly have great taste. Look at who they vote for, we had a grifting lying moron for president. Case closed.

R183 if you don’t like it, don’t watch it.

I think it’s a very well done series and a lot stronger than many shows on right now.

Jacob Elordi refused to do any nudity in season 2 or he wanted out. Levinson obliged.

Jacob Elordi was upset that Rue and Jules were given their own specials and him not given one. Rumor is that we may get a special or two before season 3 comes, but it’s not confirmed if it will happen, and what/who it will focus on.

[quote][R183] if you don’t like it, don’t watch it.

This isn't about not liking something, it's about the ridiculous hype surrounding this series. The over-the-top gushing is just crazy. It's also not about bad acting, the performers are good. I could see most of moving on to a better series or getting hired for film work. The general hype surrounding this series is annoying.

I also don't understand the praise of Angus Cloud, the dude needs some acting lessons. He just finished a film, if his droopy monotone acting is the same in the film he just finished, it will prove, he cannot actually act. Acting is not about playing yourself. Acting is about becoming a character.

You have to feel for people investing money and studying their craft, then some random waiter is discovered walking down a NYC street, then asked to be in a major HBO series. That's how Cloud got this acting gig. Unreal.

Levinson? He's there because of nepotism. He's not telling any kind of new story, just an exaggerated version of teen angst.

Cloud’s acting as Fez is terrific.

I don't know how you can say "Fez" is a well acted character. He's not.

Also, there's a ton of hype about this show, and while I liked parts of it, the final two episodes were pretty terrible, so ridiculous it veered into silliness. I'm just not looking forward to season 3 the way I was for season 2 after that amazing Season 1, and those two "extra" episodes.

Parts of it are brilliant, but... it really fell flat for me this season. And I just don't really care anymore.

I'm not angry, I'm just disappointed.

Disagree. He is great as Fez. The monotoned way he speak works well for drug dealer Fez. I don’t know why everyone needs to be super animated to be considered “good” to you. His style works great.

That's way too generous r187. Cloud is largely just playing his own personality and you can tell he is an amateur. It is still effective, he has innate charisma that comes across on screen.

R189, I will agree that the way he speaks is exactly like a drug dealer. He even has that accent. I grew up around a few in my time, and I'd always ask my parents why they all had a southern accent when we were living in New Jersey. It was only later that I realized it was AAVE.

R190 to you. Most would disagree it seems.

This weird idea that it’s so easy to even just play yourself is strange. You still are ACTING and need to come across as natural. Most of us would still suck at playing ourselves to a scripted series. He also did very well this last episode.

Eldori probably broke up with Zendaya when he realized he could get lots of pussy everywhere.

He didn’t break up with her. He cheated. He didn’t have the balls.

Most of his girlfriends are just business opportunities in his mind.

[quote]3- Fez was supposed to die, and that was the plan since they began filming but then at the last minute Sam rewrote it and had him survive.

That's interesting because the whole season was clearly pointing to the end of the line for Fez, but he gets that puppy love story line with Apatow who also gets a lot praise & attention this year and poof - he improbably survives a Seal Team Six level shoot out! I liked the character - he has an understanding the hard, cold realities of the world otherwise spoiled & coddled Rue does not - but letting him live was clearly a nod to fan service & to Apatow who is able to increase her screen time with him because her own character really doesn't have much to do now that she went nuclear on her sister.

Fez was supposed to die at the end of season 1 but Levinson decided to keep him around for season 2 and kill him off there but then, again, kept him alive and killed Ash instead. Realistically they both should have died.

“Ash” speaks about the last minute rewrite here.

They gave season 2 a 4/5 but feel it’s not as good as season 1.

Oh here is the link

Re Angus Cloud, Lens Dunham, was given a lot of flack for essentially playing herself in GIRLS. Not saying Cloud was a drug dealer in real life, however, it's obvious he's not an actor. Much in the same way Lens isn't an actress.

In GIRLS, the Hannah character was a self-absorbed delusional hipster who moved to Brooklyn and was trying be a writer. The only difference was Hannah wasn’t a native New Yorker. Lens was essentially playing a version of herself, which is what Angus Cloud seems to be doing.

I gather he memorized his lines and wasn’t improvising, that doesn’t prove that Cloud will have an acting career after this gig. Due to the hype he’s getting from this series, he was essentially hired for the film he just completed. Unless he steps up and learns how to act, I don’t see him having a successful career as an actor. This guy must prove he has a range besides 'monotone drug dealer'. If not, he'd better prepare for his future career.

Cloud doesn’t have to be loud or overly expressive to be a better actor, he doesn't have to scream and act menacing like the typical drug thug seen on most cop shows, he just seems so detached. How 'monotone' reads as charismatic, I don't know.

It seems as if he was reading from cue cards or just discovered his lines when the cameras were pointed at him. More like he stumbled on to the set from craft services. Seriously!

Actually he’s very much an actor in season 2. He’s been training. I thought he was great in the finale. Playing yourself is still acting.

And he isn’t a drug dealer.

[quote]I don’t know why everyone needs to be super animated to be considered “good” to you.

Dude, I never said anyone needs to be super-animated. I just don't think he's a very good actor. The flat affect isn't the problem. (I'm not the idiot who has trashed the woman drug dealer, I think she's pretty good).

I'm not saying he SUCKS either. I'm just saying I don't get the Fez love. Either in here for the actor, or in-show by someone like Lexi.

The worst actor though is the Fish-Lips chick. I hope she's gone for good. Ugh. She's fucking terrible.

I don't think Angus Cloud is a great actor but I do think he's interesting and has lots of charisma, which is sometimes more important. At least for this show. He'll probably end up being a one trick pony.

I don't really like any of the characters on the show but if I had to pick, I'd say Fez is my favorite. It's weird to say a drug dealing murderer is the most likable out of this annoying lot but there it is.

He’s gained a massive following.

PLEASE tell me Fish-Lips isn't ever coming back. PLEASE! God she's awful. I can't even stand looking at her.

The Ash actor is already a teen. He’s 15. And he short and stocky. Way short.

I'm one of those people who watches a show and doesn't retain that much of what happened after it's over. Unless I find it really, really impactful in some way, I mostly forget about it after I'm done watching it.

So for me, when I started seeing previews for S2 of "Euphoria", I'd pretty much forgotten everything about the show. I know I watched it and enjoyed it, and I had a vague memory of it being about a bunch of high school kids behaving badly, but that was about it.

After 2 1/2 years, I'd lost interest. In the end, I watched S2, but I just as easily could have skipped it and never given it a second thought. Admittedly, I was a little lost at certain points, since I had no recollection of anything that happened the first season. I suppose I could have re-watched S1, but who has that kind of time? So, who knows where my head will be at in another 2 1/2 years when S3 comes out. I feel bad for the diehards, it seems like a really, really long time to wait.

R207 he’s short. Nothing he can do about that. But he isn’t sticky. He’s a boxer who is working to become Olympian level. His dream is to win the boxing category at the Olympics. He still looks like a 12 year old with abs.

He has a fraternal twin.

R208 sounds like you have a memory issue. You should see a doctor about that. That’s your issue, not HBO’s.

I’m thankful I don’t have that issue.

[quote]The worst actor though is the Fish-Lips chick. I hope she's gone for good. Ugh. She's fucking terrible.

Miss Fish Lips is actually a porn actress, she'll likely go back to her day job. Few porn performers succeed when they try to cross over to non-porn films.

Oddest transition was a soap actress, forgot her name, who started to do porn.

Actually “Faye” is modeling now and walking runways for designers. She did an interview recently and is done with porn. Euphoria has opened up doors for her.

Chloe Cherry is now being hired as a runway model. She thanks Euphoria for opening doors for her.

Her for iD magazine

Some of her outfits at London Fashion Week

Her getting recognized because of Euphoria

[quote] (I'm not the idiot who has trashed the woman drug dealer, I think she's pretty good).

How old are you, 12?

Because someone disliked the acting of a woman who is basically a comedian, you call them an "idiot"? You must be amazing at parties. Do you always name-call a person when they don't agree with you?

This actress, with her deadpan delivery, which she's used in every role she's done so far, and also uses in her comedy act, she comes across like a female Steven Wright, which doesn't work for her role in this series.

I personally think her portrayal of this character is ridiculous, she's not at all believable as a menacing female drug dealer, especially as most women in powerful positions always have to come across much tougher than men. In real life, this character would be the opposite of Fez.

The way this woman portrays the character is laughable, she's not menacing or scary in the least.

Her Vice article

Her Variety article

[quote]This actress, with her deadpan delivery, which she's used in every role she's done so far, and also uses in her comedy act, she comes across like a female Steven Wright, which doesn't work for her role in this series.

Chacun à son goût. The New Yorker:

"Laurie (Martha Kelly), a dealer whose suburban-mom looks and creepily flat manner make her the most terrifying character in recent television."

PopBuzz:

"There's absolutely no denying that Laurie is Euphoria's most terrifying villain."

Most your complaints are at Sam Levinson, not the actor r219.

You don't find the concept and characterization of her believable, that's the writing. The acting is just how to portray what is written for them. Laurie is written to be calm and nonassuming, I mean he had the character kindly talking to and bathing Zendaya before drugging her.

So many people start conflating the writing of a character when they are talking about the actor, when those are two different things.

[quote]The New Yorker: "Laurie (Martha Kelly), a dealer whose suburban-mom looks and creepily flat manner make her the most terrifying character in recent television."

PopBuzz: "There's absolutely no denying that Laurie is Euphoria's most terrifying villain."

Exactly dear, each to their OWN taste and that includes critics.

Are the the opinions of a few magazine critics more important than the viewers? After all, it's always the fans who make films, music and TV shows popular. Personally, I could give a flying shit what any critic thinks about anything, that includes music, art, film and TV shows.

Jeez, can one fucking person learn to think for themselves?! Are you all sheep?

R224 but almost all users find her terrifying. You’re a MAJOR minority.

“I don’t care what critics say, only viewers matter!”

“The viewers agree with the critics.”

“You’re all sheep!”

[quote]Most your complaints are at Sam Levinson, not the actor [R219]. You don't find the concept and characterization of her believable, that's the writing. The acting is just how to portray what is written for them. Laurie is written to be calm and nonassuming, I mean he had the character kindly talking to and bathing Zendaya before drugging her. So many people start conflating the writing of a character when they are talking about the actor, when those are two different things.

Actually they're not "two different things". This woman always does a flat monotone delivery in all her other roles as well as her stand-up act, did you miss that? That's an important fact to know, it means she doesn't have a range. It's not at all about "conflating the writing of a character when they are talking about the actor".

If Levinson asked her to act differently, to be soft, non-menacing and almost likable, he could have simple requested she not basically do a re-thread of all her other roles. If this woman had a range, that would have been easy. It obvious she doesn't.

Again, using the same delivery for every role, that's not acting, it's basically playing the same type of character in every role, the only difference, the dialog is different. This isn't that difficult to comprehend.

Was it confirmed it would be 2 1/2 years until S3?

It’s coming in 2 years

Javon Walton aka Ashtray just got cast for Umbrella Academy season 3.

R219 - what’s scary about her, or I guess unsettling, is how she comes across as nice and supportive in her deadpan way, then you see her shoving the needle in and out of Rue’s arm. Consider if you didn’t know the actress r her other roles. There’s a creepiness to her.

She was perfectly cast despite being cast against-type.

So I was on CDAN and found this blind about Jacob Elordi. It’s pretty much what r180 said.

Yes. Elordi is a diva who has a sweet image.

Elordi and his character are not worth all of the creative compromises that the show has had to make in order to appease his demands.

Sam is gay and probably fantasize about sucking Jacob’s uncut Aussie cock.

Sam is supposedly straight. It's what he (strenuously?) claims. But with all the whims he's given into, his obvious film references, he sure seems like he might be gay to me.

Did he ever whore himself out and suck dick or get fucked for drugs?

Elordi is hot AF but he did not need to dictate story. The show suffered because of it. This was a weird season.

R201 Are you serious that she played herself? I thought surely she had to be making her character a stupid, shallow conceited twit on purpose. It explains why she's fat in a bad way.

Barbie should have been in season 2 more. She's fat in a good way. She's likeable.

Levinson isn’t gay. He grew up around all types of people in Hollywood. Straight men naturally feel drawn to other straight men in a non sexual way, especially good looking ones that they like to take under their wing.

I definitely don't think Levinson is gay but I doubt he is strictly straight either. He is the sole writer on Euphoria and the show embraces sexuality fluidity in a way that makes me think Levinson is a little fluid himself. He has talked about how he liked to wear dresses to parties in his younger days.

That doesn’t mean he likes having sex with men. That’s what gay is. Not wearing a dress.

I love that the show is so popular people go out around California to find the filming locations. I’ve seen videos of people finding Fez’s store, the hideaway bar Cal and Derek were at, the bridge Rue and Jules were at in season 1, the gas station Jules and Elliott robbed etc.

That’s when you know a show is popular, the filming locations become tourist spots almost.

I don't think he is gay r243. But if you look at Rue, Jules, Cal and Elliot Levinson really seems to believe in sexual fluidity, it's noticeable that all these characters are neither gay nor straight but more fluid. It's noteworthy in how he writes.

Not every character but yeah, he adds a lot of fluidity to the characters. But they’re also all fucked up in serious ways.

[quote][R201] Are you serious that she played herself? I thought surely she had to be making her character a stupid, shallow conceited twit on purpose. It explains why she's fat in a bad way. Barbie should have been in season 2 more. She's fat in a good way. She's likeable.

I guess you have to know about Lens own background to see how much she resembled the Hannah character. Her real life parents, the NYC 'fine arts' photographer Laurie Simmons and her kooky gay father Carroll Dunham, he paints mainly vaginas and assholes, yes, vaginas and assholes, in a cartoony style. He gets big bucks for this garbage.

Her parents are as ridiculous as her parents on the series. Lens grew up without much guidance, just had lots of money thrown at her, she was coddled, very much like the shallow self-absorbed dizzy Hannah.

So, yes, Lens sure did base Hannah on herself. Her mom Laurie essentially played herself in Lens first film, "Tiny Furniture". Laurie played a downtown NYC photographer who worked with dollhouse furniture and dolls, which is exactly what she does in real life.

In GIRLS, Hannah's father came out. In Lens real life, everyone in the downtown NYC art circles knows her father is gay.

"Tiny Furniture" was actually shot in the Dunham's former Tribeca loft, which, after Lens success, the parents cashed in, then sold it for $6-7 million. They also have a home in Connecticut, or they did.

Lens parents. Her father never smiles. Her mom is Jewish and her father is a Wasp.

Fascinating tea r180 and it makes a lot of sense. The whole Nate-Jules dynamic was so charged and intriguing and I wish they hadn't dropped it. The season overall was a disappointment, even if a ratings bonanza. Sad that it seems the egos/careerism of the actors got in the way of good drama.

[quote]The whole Nate-Jules dynamic was so charged and intriguing and I wish they hadn't dropped it.

I don't think it was dropped necessarily, but in S1, Rue gloms on to Jules as a kind of replacement for drugs and you can see that Jules is smothered by her neediness. Even Ali tells her that. S2 she didn't need Jules because she was using again. Presumably in S3, Rue will try to have more mature relationships with her Jules & her family that aren't warped by addiction.

What does that have to do with Nate and Jules, R249? This show seems to be beholden to actor whims and tantrums - to the detriment of story lines. Jacob Elordi isn't a big enough star to start making demands on what character arcs he's willing to play. And forget about this bullshit about Zendaya and Hunter refusing to film with Jacob because of...what....cheating? Be a professional and get on with your job.

How can they abandon the story when he is in love with her There were few scenes this season where he imagines her and the Fez asked his dad "You slept with a girl your son is in love with?"

So, was Jacob’s flirting, kissing and canoodling with Tommy Dorfman just a paparazzi walk to fend off accusations that he was Transphobic in regards to wanting the Hunter storyline dropped?

[quote]The season overall was a disappointment, even if a ratings bonanza. Sad that it seems the egos/careerism of the actors got in the way of good drama.

Just want to repeat that, because it's an excellent and succinct summary of S2. Regardless of ratings, it was a disappointment.

And everything after episode 5 was down-hill. The final two episodes were a silly mess.

There was certainly a tonal shift this season (supposedly intentional) that clearly changed the formula from the first season, but I think each of the episodes besides the final one was strong or had excellent elements to them that hold up against any of the episodes from season 1. Episode 7 was structured really well and despite the implausibility of a school play being that sophisticated and uncensored, it was really well done as a whole because we learned a lot about the various relationship dynamics and histories. For me, the only real disappointment was episode 8 which was just simply bad on all accounts, which is a shame because a season finale should essentially be a season's strongest episode and in this instance it was a sloppy piecemeal mess.

Don't these people sign contracts? Who are they to make demands?

All the posters moaning about the play are sheltered/dim/tragic.The whole show is heightened reality, magical realism. It’s not a documentary. Dozy lumps.

When Laurie shot Rue with the morphine I assumed she wanted to get her hooked on intravaneous drugs and have her be sex trade. I don't think the Laurie story line is over, I can't imagine she is going to just let her losing money go.

Is Fez's grandma still alive and just a vegetable?

R257 Yeah but why did that bitch repeatedly stab her in the fucking arm? Trying to find a vein?

It was like she put extra holes in her arm on purpose.

There must be a reason r259 I noticed that too but I don't know much about drug habits, the most I have ever done is smoked a joint passed at a party in college.

Apatow is the king of nepotism with his wife and kids. I used to kind of like him until he inflicted Lens on us.

The fact that they utterly dropped the whole drug dealer/suitcase/trafficking plot line is just part of why this season was so bad. There's no way that just gets ignored.

And that line in the end, "I stayed clean the rest of the school year" really makes it seem like that plot line was dropped entirely, because no way it takes months for that shoe to drop.

The kid playing Ash was great. He barely said a word and was surprisingly compelling.

I’m unclear why we had to watch Zendaya’s funeral speech so many times.

Maude Apatow is fine but no way in hell she would have gotten this part without her parents. She would be waiting tables.

Kat and Maddy made me laugh too.

Judd puts his kids in everything. It's really annoying.

Yes, I’m sure Maude Apatow, born to millionaires, would have to wait tables if not for Euphoria 🙄🙄🙄

Javon Walton had a lot more lines in season 1 than 2, and that’s because he’s playing the same age in 2 (12) that he was in 1 but his voice doesn’t sound the same so they barely had him speak. Fortunately, he turned out to be short and has a baby face so he could physically stay around. He didn’t go through some growth spurt. He will be 17 when they film season 3. I think that may be why they killed him off last minute, because 3 will continue the rest of the school year, with Rue remaining sober.

The Laurie storyline is continuing in season 3. The fact this has been said like 50 times and that same user keeps crying about it being dropped… take a pill.

Laurie repeatedly stabbed Rue in the arm to give the appearance that she’s addicted to heroine etc. for the people she sells her into sex trafficking to. That was clearly Laurie’s intention.

I detest Martha Kelly. I detest Martha Kelly as Laurie. Her voice on the show is as cringe inducing as it is in real life.

Jacob and Maude were recently at the Paris Saint Laurent show, typical and expected.

[quote]The Laurie storyline is continuing in season 3. The fact this has been said like 50 times and that same user keeps crying about it being dropped… take a pill.

The fact that you cannot seem to grasp that it was dropped for three entire episodes this season AND NOT MENTIONED OR EVEN HINTED AT makes you the fucking moron that needs to take a fucking pill. And the fact that the season ended with her voice-over saying "And I remained clean for the rest of the school year" sure makes it sound like things just continued on for the next four-five months with no repercussions as well.

Your ASSERTION that next season picks up before the end of the school year and just follows the school year to graduation while she's sober seems to be an ASSUMPTION more than anything else. I wager the season isn't even broken down let alone written.

Seriously. It's a FACT that entire plot line was dropped after episode 5. If they pick it up in season 3 again, that doesn't negate the fact that it was utterly and completely dropped THIS SEASON. You fucking dumbass.

[quote]That was clearly Laurie’s intention.

Obviously that WASN'T so clear, given you're the first and only person to assert such a thing and nobody else got that.

So kindly fuck off with your arrogant holier than though bullshit.

R268 buddy, we learn in episode 5 she has a month or so to get Laurie the money. Episodes 6-8 take place over the course of a few days. Actually, episodes 7/8 are the same day. So hardly any time has passed, yet alone a month. The story wasn’t dropped. It hadn’t happened yet.

I don’t get what you’re struggling to understand, but I shouldn’t be shocked as you never ever understand shit.

I agree with R268. It's sloppy story telling.

I am rewatching episode 6 and Nate says to Jules that he’s been protecting someone who doesn’t deserve to be protected. He shows regret in protecting his father. So what he did in episode 8 isn’t out of the blue. They showed us that he’s regretful of protecting Cal and feels he should have let him fall years ago.

My sisters and I went to dinner and drinks yesterday and the one who watches the show (the other didn’t like it after trying a few episodes) said that when Faye’s loser BF kept saying we need to talk etc. that Fez should have still been like well I have to go so you should go too and left to the play anyway, act normal. That could have stalled some time and he could come up with a plan with Ash and Faye to pin it on Laurie, like Faye tried.

Is Rue going to get sold into sex trafficking? I must have missed that.

R265 jfc seriously? I meant if she WASN’T Maude apatow she would be waiting tables. You thought I meant if she was still Judd Apatow’s daughter but not on Euphoria she would be a waitress? WTF?

A girl from Florida with middle class parents and the same looks and talent of Maude Apatow would be waiting tables in LA. She would not be on a hit HBO show. Is that clear enough for you?

We'll never know because Judd cast her in everything he's ever touched. She'll never be an actor who stood on her own merit. She'll always be that person boosted by her director dad.

Honestly Maude is fine - she’s not distractingly bad or unattractive on the snow - I liked her in the finale actually - I was just MARYing over r265 failing to understand a very basic statement.

Lol, he took you bitches’s nasty criticism and adjusted his song.

The length of a song was fine…it just didn’t need to be shoe-horned into the season finale. That moment killed the episode’s momentum.

The song was actually beautiful

[quote]I detest Martha Kelly. I detest Martha Kelly as Laurie. Her voice on the show is as cringe inducing as it is in real life.

There's more than one person mentioning the awful 'Laurie' actress. Cringe is right! I stopped talking about her in this and other Euphoria threads. I still think this woman is completely horrible as an actress. To each his/her own. To keep using the same delivery in every role, isn't acting.

Why anyone would think her drowsy down-beat delivery makes her "scary" is beyond me. Laurie comes across as detached, nothing more. Obviously, Laurie is only in it for the money, she doesn't care whose lives she destroys, she's a drug dealer. Well, duh.

Sure, she's an evil piece of shit, the worst kind of human, but her demeanor isn't scary.

Very late to the thread, but Euphoria takes me a while to get into but once I'm past the first couple of episodes, I can binge it. It took me a while to start season 2. With regards to the Cal/Nate situation, I was under the impressions based on Nate's dream and the final confrontation that Cal might have molested Nate and perhaps filmed it??? Nobody is mentioning this. I think Nate says in reference to the memory stick "it has EVERYTHING"...and Cal is like "Everything?" and then clears all the whores from his place.

This has also been discussed in depth upthread, but I don't understand that characters motivation for his dad to suffer after we had a long drawn out scene about Nate wanting the family business and holding Maddie up at gunpoint to get it, only to turn it over to the police. Was the dream of his dad fucking him while in bed w/ Cassie that catalyst that changed his mind? It doesn't quite make sense to me. I think what I am missing is the BTS gossip about the actors, which I haven't paid attention to. So I have this, Elordi and Hunter Schaffer don't get along IRL? That was the reason for the arch switch to Sydney Sweeney? Elordi wants a receptive arc for Nate? He is such a talented actor, especially seeing his rather meek real life personality. I hope he doesn't fuck himself thinking he is too good for the show and ends up leaving. This happens all the time.

[quote]With regards to the Cal/Nate situation, I was under the impressions based on Nate's dream and the final confrontation that Cal might have molested Nate and perhaps filmed it??? Nobody is mentioning this.

Nobody's mentioning it because nobody's dumb enough to assume that's what's happening. What's happening is that watching those videos of his dad from a very young age fucked him up and he has these awful dreams. But Cal never molested his son.

Angus Cloud high as balls in this interview. Fez really is him being himself.

R284 hilarious!

"And what's next for you?"

"Shit. Idk. Take some pictures and what not."