Remembering Natalie Merchant

“Verdi Cries”

Nobody knows it, but it’s so lovey.

Is Natalie lez? I always got a lez vibe.

Verdi cries is my favorite ever R1. I was told when I sang in my younger days that my voice was similar to hers which was likely a bit of a stretch but it still made me feel very proud.

No, R2, she married a man and had a kid. She is a hippie and she was planning to be a special education teacher. She's an advocate for children with disabilities.

One of my best celebrity sightings of all time was a Natalie sighting in a chicken exhibit at. 4H fair in Rhinebeck, NY about 10 years ago

Talented, industrious in what she was able to do with her voice. She seems like a reluctant participant in the public aspects of performing and selling her content.

I think the band members in the 10,000 Maniacs lineup got sick of her. In the popular MTV Unplugged special, she sounded good, but looked “separate” and disconnected from the other musicians. Maybe she was just young and irritating. But she is certainly not without talent.

That song, Carnival, is a good one. I remember she wanted the video to be forgettable, and not distract from the music. That was pretty cool.

I was a 10,000 as a teen, before they even had any hits. I was happy when they got more popular and their songs were played on radio and MTV.

I remember seeing 10000 Maniacs open up for The Cure at Pier 84 in the summer of 1986. I was in front of the stage and I still have the lasting image of Natalie dancing around in her floral dress.

She said in interviews when Tigerlily and Motherland came out that she paid for her own studio time because she wanted to record her music on her own terms and not have to answer to the label, and she said that she's not really motivated by sales and charts. She said she probably would be doing something other than making mainstream music in 10 or 20 years. People thought she was pretentious but it seems like she was genuine. She just kind of dropped out for the most part and doesn't even dye her hair even though she does record music. She's just not into superficial and celebrity stuff.

Don’t worry? I don’t care if she’s dead or not. She sucks.

[quote] Doctors have come from distant cities Just to see me Stand over my bed Disbelieving what they're seeing They say I must be one of the wonders Of god's own creation And as far as they can see they can offer No explanation People see me I'm a challenge to your balance I'm over your heads How I confound you and astound you To know I must be one of the wonders Of god's own creation

She told Rosie O'Donnell that some critics slammed her for being the most egotistical person alive because of this song...which is written for and about children with disabilities.

She told Rosie that she wrote it in first-person perspective as a literary device because it helps her personalize the lyrics when she sings them.

Rosie said "first person, literary device, you're so intellectual...I have no idea what you are talking about right now!"

Natalie Merchant said that Wonder is a celebration of woman.

She and Jeneane Garofalo could have played sisters in a movie musical.

She’s talented but she seems to recycle the same crap over and over.

R12 I heard her say it was written with two girls in mind who she met while touring. They had a disabling congenital disease that causes blistering on their skin. She said she became friends with them into adulthood and they inspired the song.

[quote] This song, which reached No. 20 on the Billboard Hot 100 chart in 1995 was inspired by a set of twins whom Natalie Merchant knew personally that had been born with a congenital disease. The topic of the song (that a physically handicapped person can overcome their disability) is continued in RJ Palacio’s book of the same name, which is named directly after the song.

Just saw her pic and realized Elliota Page could have played her before transiotioning, they look alot alike

I'd rather forget her.

Amen r17 she really sucked.

"Carnival" always got me into a murdery mood with my johns!

Whenever I hear her sing, I want to kill somebody...preferably her but anyone within reach will do.

The Natalie Merchant persona was so unbelievably pretentious, I almost chuckle thinking about it. The weird/affected foreign accent she sang with, the twirling around on stage, the overbearingly obvious political agenda, the bizarre way that she teased her ongoing romance/whatever it was with Michael Stipe (the man is GAY, who cares?). I mean, I understand the degree of backlash against this well-meaning but obnoxious/over-the-top type of which she was emblematic.

That said, "Verdi Cries" was a nice song that reminds me of a simpler time and makes me feel a little bad for bitching about her.

I say this with love in my heart, but she and Michael Stipe remind me of people who describe themselves as “shy” but are actually standoffish and moody. But they are both gifted, and indifferent to celebrity.

Great song. I love walking and it's in my phone. Natalie has a unique voice and talent.

Her music takes me right back to the 90s. I don't think she expected she would become so famous (Tigerlily was a huge album and you couldn't escape those songs) and she wasn't prepared for that and decided to lower her profile. She lives a quiet life somewhere in Upstate NY.

I was often told I looked like her when young. I hated it, because I found everything about her bland and boring. Not that I was any sort of livewire myself. But hey, don't just tell me to my face. Rude!

I love her dearly. Her 90s persona is exactly what we needed at the time. One of the best things ever is the incredibly awkward interview she did with Jon Stewart right after she left the band. She out and out tells him she could care less about talking to him.

I have an older friend in the Woodstock area, who lives alone. A big storm hit some 2 weeks ago and the area was without power. Turns out Natalie is her neighbor and helped her out.

Carnival is one of my favorite songs.

Her voice sounds strong at this NPR Tiny Desk performance.

Yes, she does ping and give off Garofalo vibes.

I admire a natural woman who ages with grace. We're two peas in a pod.

Was just talking about this with someone yesterday. Her Tigerlily album is a fantastic album.

I saw her a few years ago when she played a semi-private show at the Mohonk Mountain House outside of New Paltz. It was intimate and a lot of fun.

My teenage self loved her album Ophelia. "Life Is Sweet", "Frozen Charlotte", "My Skin", "King of May"... such beautiful songs. Never really liked Tigerlily, although it's much more popular than Ophelia.

I was more a Deborah Iyall fan, myself.

The last I heard of Natalie she was writing songs for the New York anti-fracking campaign. They weren't very good. Loved her in 10,000 though. She dances more dorky then even I do.

She’s a phony cunt

she was able to cut through the mtv clutter / instantly identifiable vocals.....but she's not someone I ever want to put on the stereo.

I find her music and voice strangely wistful and evocative. As R36 said her vocals are instantly identifiable. I liked all the music of hers that I've heard but it's not really music you can get passionate about. Norah Jones reminded me a lot of her when she first came out, in terms of style.

Like the Weather was my teenage depresso lullaby.

Pretentious artiste. She exudes the attitude that R26 describes. I also agree with what R21 wrote. I like some of her songs despite her affectations.

I saw her in concert with 10,000 Maniacs in 1988. Their opening act was Tracy Chapman who had just released her first album. Natalie talked about how important Tracy’s message was. You could tell how sincerely Natalie felt that, but it always did feel like she was too preachy for her own good.

I remember reading an interview with Natalie where she said she realized she’d gone off the deep end when she started crying on a first date because the guy had ordered meat as his entree.

At least she acknowledges where she let her interests in the environment and social justice get out of hand.

She looks a very old bitter grandma now.

R34 Wait, what? The director of that video is Jennifer Saunders’ husband? I never knew that.

R40 I saw them on that tour as well. I just remember her spinning a lot.

I didn't like Tiger Lilly, because it was so overplayed in the mid 90s. However, watching the video, "Wonder" above, it's beautiful, and so are the song's melody and lyrics.

There are some really beautiful songs on Tigerlily, if I recall correctly, "I May Know the Word," is on that album. I remember loving it.

I loved 10,000 Maniacs. I saw them on the above-mentioned 1988 tour with Tracy Chapman and again in 1989 during their "Blind Man's Zoo" tour. Both shows were great. Yes, Natalie could get a little preachy, but I could forgive her that. I lost interest when she went solo. Like Boy George, I always felt like she was one of those singers who needed a band behind her to rein her eccentricities in a bit ... and write good songs. I never felt her solo songs were as good as those she wrote and performed with 10,000 Maniacs. Again, because I'm sure the band made her music a little more listener friendly.

I think I heard a few years of griping about how awful and affected she was before ever listening to her. It was a surprise then that she has a gorgeous voice. I remember thinking if I could sing half so well I would never stop.

The versions of Wonder and These Are Days just with her voice and piano are so great I could forgive her anything, but he'll, she's awkward and sometimes grumpy and a little impressed with herself and sometimes pretentious - as if I didn't count those as sinerimes traits among friends. I think a lot of the anger toward her stems from 10,000 Maniacs days, when I paid no attention at all - and not my favorite work of hers, either. Her self produced work is great

For me, her voice is brilliant, one of a few that stand above all others.

I felt the opposite regarding Merchant and 10,000 Maniacs. I thought she was better without them than with her. Didn't 10,000 Maniacs pretty much not have a career after she left them?

An ex-bf of mine was abused as a child and he couldn't hear "What's the Matter Here" without crying. It's a powerful song.

The Tigerlily album contains some of the best songwriting of the 90s.

I love this cover, and remember seeing it on MTV when it aired.

Former 10,000 Maniacs fan here.

I always thought she was a wet blanket when she went solo. All of that whining and shit.

On one of her solo albums I swear her voice was so tired tired she sounded like she recorded it lying down.

R51 I love her cover of, "One Fine Day." Is was on the movie Soundtrack of the same name, but it's hard to find anywhere.

Overrated, bland, boring, mediocre, and pretentious. Natalie Merchant to music is Parker Posey to movie.

Were she and Stipe in a relationship? Or were they just pretending?

I remember years ago on the Usenet newsgroup. one fan used to troll the REM group, infuriating fans by claiming that she had encountered Stipe several times with his friends at restaurants...and that Stipe was straight.

Merchant and Stipe seem very well suited for each other.

R55 the way I remember it was that Stipe used to throw her name around as evidence that he wasn't gay. He was "bi" and his dating Natalie proved that.

I am pretty sure Natalie did an interview where she refuted that saying she and Stipe had never dated.

Here's the Jon Stewart appearance. She was grumpy and obviously exhausted. He sort of played it up and took more offense than she meant, IMO. When she said "this is my last obligation," I would have interpreted it as industry-speak for "this is my last publicit appearance and I'm tired," but Jon was offended and said so, and that seemed to clam her up even more.

Always liked her voice and some great songwriting. She put her heart into her work. My impression is that she’s a bit off center or off. She may come across as pretentious but my take was that she lacked awareness of how she came across and was perceived by the public. Or maybe substance issues? Just looking at her dancing I don’t think she was trying to impress anyone, just did her thing.

And I really liked a Campfire Song with Michael Stipe.

I really liked Natalie with the Maniacs.

When she left, I thought Tigerlily was good, but beyond that I didn't care much for her music. Like actors on an ensemble show, sometimes a set of people will bring out the best in each other, and if/when those artists are on their own, their work isn't as strong.

I think that when unchecked by fellow band members, some of Natalie's excesses kind of overwhelmed what I'd always liked about her stuff.

I knew a few of her peers from Jamestown. She's always been the cuntiest cunt that ever cunted. Warm is not a word anyone would use to describe her. And she was far more driven and ambitious than she'd ever publicly let on. But she had the talent to back it up.

Break Your Heart is one of those songs that makes you cry when you're drunk AF.

R62 I love N'Dea Davenport on that.

I've always just assumed any "coldness" around Merchant was because she's Aspie.

R58: Jon Stewart is now and again plenty prickly. I recall many years ago he was interviewed by Teri Gross and took offense very early in the interview to something she said that was meant to be laughing at her own shortcomings but he misinterpreted it as a slight and now amount of explanation or apology would suffice. He was a count for the rest of the interview which was obviously cut short because what was in fact a compliment had been misinterpreted as criticism. He was a spoiled child who was having none of it from that point forward, no matter how much the host apologized. No matter how he tried to paint himself as a reasoned person and a careful listener, I always remember that interview and some other interactions where he came off as a first-class asshole. Not surprised that Merchant rubbed him the wrong way

Same, R63. She seems to be on the spectrum. She has that eccentric emotional heft and seems to kind of keep to herself and doesn't make a lot of eye contact. There has to be a deeply personal reason she wanted to be a special ed teacher and writes songs for disabled kids. Something is different about her. She's a step removed from typical interpersonal engagements, but her music is deeply sympathetic.

Yeah R64 in the Jon Stewart clip above she talks about her European press tour and she says "this is my last obligation" and then quietly "I get to go home after this." Stewart says "Obligation? Like taking out the trash" and she looks down and mutters "I didn't mean it like that."

She was clearly uncomfortable and seemed to be embarrassed that he was offended when she was misunderstood saying it was her last press obligation and she is excited to go home finally.

I looked up the video because someone here mentioned that "she told Jon Stewart she didn't want to do the interview," and that's not at all what she said but decades later, that interpretation colors someone's opinion about her. She was tired and seemed intimidated. She wasn't being bitchy.

Aileen Wournos’ favorite song was “Carnival”. I love it too.

R63, I agree, I avoided saying that but agree with aspie tendencies. You said it better. Sometimes anxiety or depression couples with avoidant social skills, like eye contact and can come across as aloof or arrogant,

She's talented with a unique voice, I liked to watch her spin in a dervish, I was totally captivated by this reluctant angel of musicality who did her own thing and didn't give a fuck. She's a goddess!

^^ditto^^

N”DEA Danvenpot of the Brand New Heavies I loved them in 90s

Do you know the story of her doing an interview and she jumped off the sofa to say hello to some star?

[quote]Aileen Wournos’ favorite song was “Carnival”.

Well isn't that just a ringing endorsement!

Merchant has always seemed to be on the spectrum to me.

BTW I love the Brand New Heavies. They should've been a lot bigger in the 90s. Great band with a great sound but they just weren't pushed hard enough. And then when you think of some of the artists who got a big push at the same time and were total SHIT, it's so depressing.

I just remember the rumors about her and Stipe. Less about Stipe being bi, more that they would play their own little mind games with people. Someone called it "very Dangerous Liasions" - just that sort of, let's fuck with people because we can fuck with them.

[quote]Well isn't that just a ringing endorsement!

Makes me like the song even more.

Love 10,000 Maniacs and love her voice. In the late 80s she strongly resembled my mom back when I was a little kid, so there’s also that.

If Circus was the last 10,000 Maniacs album, this is where I got on. I was a grumpy teen living in a very conservative town. Her activism inspired me. I love her voice, but her ideas of social justice rang true to me. Natalie made me a Democrat.

Is she dead? Dibs.

I was never a big fan. But god, my older sister was obsessed. I like a few of her songs though.

I will say this about Natalie: She's a dying breed of artist. She's marches to her own drum. Sang/sings the songs that speak to her. Even if she is pretentious for days, you can tell that's actually authentic for her.

Makes her much more interesting than an Adele, say. I miss artists in the 80s and 90s not necessarily because I like all their music, but because they were, at the very least, their own animals.

And today, they are grossly over payed for their auto-tuned lip sync.

[quote] If Circus was the last 10,000 Maniacs album, this is where I got on

They have never, in any way, shape or form, had an album called "Circus."

They’re probably referring to Blind Man’s Zoo, many people lump zoos and circuses together for some reason.

10k maniacs we’re from Western NY I got to see them multiple times in my youth .I went to school in the western Finger Lakes they performed often.

She had the same ethereal voice like that FADE INTO YOU song

In 2022 I find those voices grating and annoying.

As a fan since the late 80s, I think I admire that she has remained true to herself after all these years. It's quite refreshing.

She's not chasing the fame she had 25 or 30 years ago but spends most of her time doing charity work, donating her time and music to causes she believes in. She's stopped dying her hair, doesn't really seek out attention, and lives the comfortable life of an aging Hudson Valley hippie. I remember when she put out a new album a few years ago she said that she's doesn't try to live above the means of a successful, small-town dentist.

I've always loved her cover of Bowie's Space Oddity.

She's a very grounded person, as r86 describes. Unlike some other singers, Natalie isn't trying to pretend she's still young and it's still 1990.

^🙄 Madonna and Natalie Merchant aren’t even the same genre.

I get a shiver in my bones just thinking about her.

I was shocked to hear she's of Sicilian descent, I always assumed she was a dark haired Wasp. Nat's real last name is: Mercante.

"Her paternal grandfather, who played the accordion, mandolin and guitar, emigrated to the United States from Sicily; his surname was "Mercante" before it was Anglicized."

Nat kind of looks like one of my elderly Italian aunts.

r88 I was just saying that it's refreshing to see a famous singer who doesn't try to hold on to past fame and youth. Natalie is an anomaly.

I think Our Time in Eden was Merchant's last album with original songs with the 10,000 Maniacs. I believe after the MTV's Unplugged album, they parted ways.

Love Merchant's Golden Boy on Motherland.

Strange, I thought Natalie was copying Björk's hyperactive dancing, but "These Are The Days" video was released about a year before Björk's Big Time Sensuality.

[quote] 10k maniacs we’re from Western NY I got to see them multiple times in my youth .I went to school in the western Finger Lakes they performed often.

From that post, it seems like grammar was not a priority at your school......

Some people's prime reason for posting on Datalounge is to point out grammatical or spelling mistakes.

Yes R95 - Trolls like R94 would be pitiful if they weren’t so smugly cunty. And like R94, half the time they’re just calling out random autocorrect errors that get made when you post via your phone.

They are the worst aspect of DL culture - at least some of the unhinged stans can be amusing.

Sometimes you can tell it's the last thing they have. Grammatical / spelling errors can be annoying but people need to start considering how many people are using Voice to text or having autocorrect change their posts. Pointing out someone's error is o longer the cunt flex people think it is. It just makes people sound old and like they're not aware that it's not always human error.

It's fucking Datalounge, not the New Yorker. It's a bullshit forum where people quickly type their random thoughts, often on a smartphone. The grammar trolls all deserve to be face down in Rosie O'Donnell's pussy.

[quote]people need to start considering how many people are using Voice to text or having autocorrect change their posts.

Eldergays have no idea what this is.

I heard her song today while at the mall and had a nice retro moment. I remember reading she's so shy she used to sing with her back to the audience. A unique voice . Wasn't she tight with Michael Stipe?

She had a moment back in the 90's. And that moment is LONG over.

[quote] Wasn't she tight with Michael Stipe?

If only this had been discussed elsewhere in the thread.....

[quote]She had a moment back in the 90's. And that moment is LONG over.

Wow, you sound like such a bloody moron. You are dismissing good rock, pop, jazz and R'n'B music because it was produced years ago?!

The people who now post at DL are completely brain dead.

I guess we also have to dismiss classical music, opera and well anything other music produced before 2022?!

Absolutely mind boggling!

Natalie did a concert at an American Library Association Conference when Leave Your Sleep came out, owing to its literary inspiration and allusions. She was lovely and genuinely excited to be there and sharing her project with people who would understand what she was trying to do.

She had a very distinct voice and political/social perspective that was perfect for her time.

Natalie Merchant? Cunt.

Bumping. Love 10,000 maniacs a lot but not her solo stuff so much. Just added a bunch of their songs to my Spotify master playlist.

After her 1st solo album I decided I wouldn’t like her going forward. She lost it.

Keep Your Courage is great. I love all of stuff, Ophelia is an album I can listen to in its entirety again and again (and do).

Oh I just remembered her. It’s been 20 years.

Time to carve her in half and count the rings!

Remember the old ugly cunt with a bitchass attitude? No thanks. Get better celebrities to post about op. You have miserable tastes.

Removed a cover of “Peace Train” from later pressings of In My Tribe in the wake of one of Cat Stevens’ controversies. It was a good cover too.

I had forgotten to remember her, OP. Thank you for the reminder! Actually who are we remembering again? I forgot.

Bitch is probably a MAGAT now.

And the cover of Peace Train is on their greatest hits compilation.

r106 is obviously Angry Young Brit/Sausages McGee of the DL Facebook Page, "artiste", and British Far Right derangement "fame"

Nevertheless, Merchant seems like hard work, despite Tigerlily being a great album.

When did she die?

I wish OP would go to bed

R58, what a moody cunt!

Saw her in concert with REM in the 90s promoting her first solo album. It was a huge outdoor venue and the crowd was there for a big fun concert. Her mellow, coffee shop set did not pump up the crowd for headliner REM. Big arenas are not a good match for her style. She came out a few times and sang with Stipe which was more fun.

Radiohead opened for both of them and cursed out the audience after playing a short set when the crowd paid them little attention. It was summer in Texas, miserably hot and their whiny college rock was even more boring than Merchant. Not a concert I remember very fondly

I always found her interesting/gratingly annoying at the same time. Somebody up above described an "empathic" vibe to her songwriting and that's so true. Her sense of poetry and melody were always strong. But that affected accent irked me so much. She's from some simple upstate NY town an hour south of Buffalo, as generic white American as it gets, and she speaks like a regular American woman, yet she insisted on singing in a stilted, pretentious "fragile girl from the Old World" enunciation like she's not from this side of the globe.

Her 2014 self-titled album is fantastic!

I'm Gen X, have always liked her solo and with 10,000 Maniacs. She reminds me of the MTV heyday of the 80s and the alternative two-hour show 120 Minutes. I'd never seen her, or 10K Maniacs, in concert until I finally caught a solo show in SF, July 2017, at the Nob Hill Masonic Auditorium. She gave a great performance, and between songs and sets she was really engaging with the audience. She said she was happy to be in SF and enjoyed walking around the city sightseeing before the show. I forget what it was, but she bought some quirky thing in a local thrift shop and bantered with the crowd to decide who she'd give it to at the end of the show.

Her performance was very good. Her vocals were as strong and distinctive as they ever were. When she broke into the chorus of "Life is Sweet," I started crying and couldn't help myself. The day before, we found out my mom might have a cancer recurrence. It turned out she did, stage 4, and she was gone by the end of August. This show and that summer are things I remember better than I'd like. ❤️

The set list from her San Francisco show that I mentioned.

Life is Sweet is such a great tune. Her lyrics are so well done and clever.

R117, last night. She twirled about the stage and broke a hip bone

No, Stevie Nicks kicked her in the vagina bone for stealing her twirling moves

Always loved her and her vibe. In My Tribe was a college staple album. Takes me back like nothing else. Grateful for Natalie and her talnet

Her music transports me right back to my college days in the mid-late 90s. She was HUGE with the college crowd back then. I find her voice very soothing.

These Are Days reminds me of running the streets with my degenerate pals in the mid-90s. Ah, youth.

Not a huge fan of her solo work, but man did I love 10,000 Maniacs. “Trouble Me” and “Eat For Two” remind me so much of my last year of college.

Also love “Photograph”, her duet with Stipe.

R130 same here. It was a soundtrack of our lives.

Hey Jack Kerouac

My Mother the War

I've been enchanted by Natalie since I first heard Trouble Me as a young precocious 9 year old. My love for her grew with every new album but most especially Tigerlily. I've traveled all over the country just to see her and it's taken me to parts I might not have visited or appreciated otherwise such as a Shaker village in Western Massachusetts.

When she released her cover of Morrissey's "Every Day Is Like Sunday," a reviewer for British music weekly NME grumbled that she, as an American, did not understand the dreariness of English seaside towns and mocked her for sounding far too wistful and romantic singing it ("Share some greeeeased teeeeeea with meeeee"). Morrissey himself (as noted upthread) detested her version as well.

Who gives a shit about English seaside towns?

[quote]Morrissey himself (as noted upthread) detested her version as well.

Is there anything Morrissey doesn't detest though?

R135 what doesn't Morrissey detest? He's got sand in his vadge about everything.

[quote]Who gives a shit about English seaside towns?

The point he made was that her interpretation of the song (for which he wrote the lyrics) was completely off. She did not understand the meaning of the song she chose to blandly cover, making it sound like completely anodyne and like every other song she ever recorded. I'm not remotely a Morrissey fan *or* the song, but I can see what he means.

[quote]She did not understand the meaning of the song she chose to blandly cover, making it sound like completely anodyne and like every other song she ever recorded. I'm not remotely a Morrissey fan *or* the song, but I can see what he means.

Hardly worth repeating, but here's the edited version: She did not understand the meaning of the song she chose to blandly cover, making it sound completely anodyne and like every other song she ever recorded. I'm not remotely a fan of Morrissey *or* the song, but I can see what he means. There's a monotony to Merchant's delivery that you don't find to the same extent in, say, Suzanne Vega (who seems to put a lot more feeling into her songs).

I think Natalie was great w/the Maniacs, but once she went solo her work got progressively more up-her-own-ass and boring.

Without other musicians around to shake out some of those ideas, she became unbearable.

But loved the Maniacs' stuff with Natalie, and her earliest solo album was solid.

And that being said, I saw them for the Blind Man's Zoo tour and it was an amazing show.

The show ended with Verdi Cries.....it was in a big theater but you could hear a pin drop and people everywhere were sobbing.....followed by a standing ovation.

A poster upthread mentioned Stevie Nicks, and I think it's a good comparison not that often made. Stevie was more of a rock chick, but Natalie definitely played with a lot of the same imagery - the witchy thrift store chic, the twirling, even their unique voices share a quality.

I read this interview years ago and it kind of cemented the impression I've always had of her... pretentious, a little bit schoolmarmish. But I still like a lot of her music (mostly before she went solo and went full Lilith Fair).