Madonna vs. Janet: White Privilege vs. Racism

Jabba has Covid delirium.

Oh no, Joseph Mora (aka Janbot) is back.

LMAO Janet's single was bombing before the Super Bowl.

Nobody forced Janet to show her titty to the world. At least when Madonna flashed her goods, she did it in a coffee table book sold to people 18 and over. She didn't do it at an event where families watched.

And Janet released albums after the Super Bowl. They sucked. The world moved on from Janet, titty or no titty

Madonna= Icon

Janet= Failure

Janbot / vadgebot, we surrender!

Janbot, Janbot, gophers live in your twat.

Janbot, Janbot, eat a bowl of sticky snot.

Janbot, Janbot, think you're smart, grrrl U not.

Janbot, Janbot, we hate you a lot.

The reason Janet had any popularity was because of her last name. If she had been born a " Johnson," she would have been ignored.

How come her brother had white privilege even before he bleach... I mean before his vitiligo?

You are correct, OP. Janet deserves reparations.

I think it awful that snivelling snot Timberlake got away with no repercussions when he conspired in that stupid stunt. Now there's privilege

Sorry, Janet came out with more than her fair share of duds. It didn't help that she kept trying to play off that she was 23 cause she didn't look it. Maybe if she grew up just a little. Ironic I know, Madonna who expanded her musical horizons and had more hits than Janet is also trying to play off that she's 23.

Neither has had a substantial hit in over twenty years.

These threads always turn into a pissing contest over who is the lesser has been.

Madge had Hung Up in 2005 which sold a ton and that awful 4 Minutes which was a big hit in 2008.

[quote]Madge had Hung Up in 2005 which sold a ton and that awful 4 Minutes which was a big hit in 2008.

None of those songs hit number one.

Don't Tell Me is her last well known hit in the US.

4 Minutes was a big hit worldwide -- and a hit with Timberlake.

Interesting that Beyonce worked with Timberlake as well as... Rihanna... Eminem... all after Super Bowl.

Madonna has more talent in her fake ass than Janet has in 900 million lifetimes. Just voice wise, can you image Janet singing Sondheim (respectfully and to his satisfaction) or Evita, Or Ray Of Light, or virtually everything? Madonna had her last top ten in 2012. Yes, it was forgettable but it was a top 10 single. Period. Janet’s tour numbers? Ahahahaahahahahahahaha

There is no contest. Madonna was more successful because she was waaaaay more talented and waaaaaay more liked by BOTH white AND black.

R14 Hung Up was no.1 globally and sold over 6 million copies. Radio wouldn't play her much by then so she couldn't get past no. 7 in the US.

4 Minutes is shite but it sold over 3 million in the US alone.

Madonna vs Janet = the patriarchy pitting women against each other

Hung Up was retired at #1 by TRL because it was there for so long. Also, it was #1 on i-tunes for weeks. It would have been a US #1 had radio, which was BOYCOTTING HER due to the American Life video and ageism. So WHO WAS BOYCOTTED and WHO JUST SHOWED THEY NASTY ASS TITS ON A FAMILY SPORTS PROGRAM MAKING MILLIONS VOMIT?

I'm so tired of this "feud." They have nothing in common musically except for that period in the 90s when they dabbled in R&B and house music. It's misogynistic to pin these two female pop stars against each other. Both have accomplished a lot and they are about equal in talent. Neither can sing and music videos, excellent choreography, a good ear for hits and hard work took them a long way. I enjoy both of their work and they both started to suck in the late 2000s.

You can take away my gay card because I have no interest in stanning female pop stars and pitting them in battles.

Madonna- happens to be white (though people liked her music even when they thought she was black)

Janet- fat old Denny’s waitress if not or NEPOTISM

R16 Actually, Madonna has little talent. Janet can at least dance well. Both are mediocre singers to me. Madonna's voce actually sounds worse to me than Janet. Janet had the benefit of being a showbiz family because she got some rhythm in her steps and her voice can sound pretty enough. That said, stop acting like Madonna is a great talent, she jus got lucky and was a brilliant businesswoman. She connected with the right producers and songwriters, had the right attitude and look for MTV and used shock value to maintain her career. Nobody under the age of 30 cares about Madonna. She is a laughingstock far more than Janet. Her last decent-sounding album was in 2005, Confessions. And most of her hits that are played are from the 80s, she will always be associated with the 80s. You can dislike Janet but stop lying about Madonna being exceptionally talented. She isn't and she opened the doors for Janet (which you hate ironically), Paula, Britney and other marginally talented singers.

Poor JanBot, it's clearly severed all ties with reality. This isn't funny anymore.

Oh, great, the Janet Jackson troll is back. The woman is simply not on the radar anymore; I never hear her mentioned outside of DL. Please give it, and her, a rest.

[quote] If it wasn't for the Super Bowl fiasco, where Janet was blacklisted, Janet would be as big as her brother.

No she wouldn't. Janet, Michael, Madonna, Whitney were all doneso by the mid 2000s as far as 4 or 5 hit songs from an album like in their heyday. Times had changed, less talented artists came on the scene with mediocre songs that were considered hits. Honestly by 1995 most of them had hit their peak.

Pitting two marginally-talented has-beens together. Neither had the talent of Tina Turner or Whitney Houston or Teena Marie.

Michael ruined his own career with all the plastic surgery and slumber parties at Neverland. His voice was ruined to the point that he lip-synced. His music was the decline since Thriller with Dangerous and HIStory being bloated messes.

Madonna willed herself hard. She was brilliant in her brand and found the best producers and writers to help craft pop albums with artfulness. She reinvented herself with each album but by Ray of Light, she peaked creatively. Everything after was uninspired. Her last decent effort was Confessions. Once she started collaborating with Justin Timberlake it was over for her. Plus she got too old to be sexy and edgy and just came across as obnoxious.

Janet similarly had concept albums and reinvented her sound with each album. The Velvet Rope was her most ambitious. Then All For You which was a nice throwback to the disco sound and her last hit album. By the time of Damita Jo, she got too obsessed with her sex kitten image despite getting old. The Super Bowl was the last straw.

Whitney peaked with The Bodyguard but her last great album was the underrated My Love is Your Love. She unfortunately was not able to recreate that moment as she got too deep into drugs and stooped to her lowest by filming that reality show with Bobby Brown. She never really had the will of Janet or Madonna to take full control of her work. She was a very classic studio-trained singer who answered to record execs. That in many ways left her with a dismal discography due to the lack of risk-taking.

Madonna had another golden era from 1998 to 2008.

The person saying Janet would have been as big as her brother is just saying that to get reaction because it is such an outrageous statement. In fact, all the pro-Janet statements are outrageous by design. Nobody has seriously thought about her since the late 90s at the most.

You could say Madonna then pivoted to touring from 2008-2018 when she cemented herself as the most successful female(and solo) touring artist by far. She was without a record label. Her and WBR were in a feud so both were keeping each other down which is why Madonna pivoted to the lucrative touring market because she knew she could sell out millions of tickets.

So many people love Janet, think she is the most talented artist, and feel she is a victim. Sadly, most of those are multiple personalities of Jabba and it can only buy so many records/concert seats.

Nobody gives a shit about Madonna just as much as nobody gives a shit about Janet anymore. Pop music is for the young. And if you are an aging pop star you can choose to do a more tasteful classy but still campy image like Kylie Minogue.

Why is that hard for Madge stans to comprehend that she is not (never was) universally beloved and she's a laughingstock now?

Seriously, Janet just hasn't got the star quality. She seems nice, much nicer than her deranged brother or bitchy Madonna, but she has no appeal to broader public.

Janet was unfairly hounded due to the Super Bowl incident. I do believe it was a publicity stunt that backfired but it's bullshit Justin Timberlake got nowhere near the harsh treatment. The US is such a puritanical nation with crazy Evangelical Republicans obsessed with policing the media. She should not have had to apologize for that. It's just a tit. It was only one for a fraction of a section. All women have them. Big deal.

Madonna was also a victim of that mob when the Sex book scandal hit. Madonna was affected by misogyny and in some circles anti-Italian sentiments (who would not see her as white). She's a narcissistic bitch but she didn't deserve all that hate for that Sex book either (even though she talked about having sex with little boys and animals which I assume was just to be edgy). Plus Madonna got in hot water over the music videos for Justify My Love, Like A Prayer, What It Feels Like For A Girl and This American Life. Weird how that is ignored.

by that logic, wouldn't madonna be more popular than any other black performer? likewise, wouldn't janet for that matter?

R34 OP is just trolling and race baiting

Janets whisper-singing makes the pitchy but loud Madonna seem like a vocal powerhouse.

r35 no, it was genuine response rather than trolling or race baiting.

but to be real, the jacksons as a whole have been akin to a reality show family. she as many of the others in her family would always be minimized by michael especially after he went solo.

Janet had several episodes of epic stardom. she even got on fame, the television series, at it's height. and of course, her prior acting fame. some would attribute her rise in the 90s more to her beau at the time but her celebrity had a lot of peaks and valleys for a variety of reasons. but largely growing up in front of billions and the realities of her family. there's janet friends but it's difficult to nail down what her specific primary demographcs are. and with most performers it's not a question.

and didn't they hide madonna's image because they allegedly believed she could only get played by black djs and radio stations? of course, though, you also have her stealing things from the black gay community and the extended history of how she treated her backup singers, dancers, entourage...

nice try but I'm gonna go with intentional trolling on this one from OP. Thanks for heating up the boards tho!

Who cares?

So, tell us Mr. Mora (r37), how did Madonna "steal" from the gay community? That's a myth. She put gay people in the mainstream at a time it was considered wrong to do so. She ALWAYS credited where she got Vogue from. In fact, she hired people from the ballroom community to create Vogue. This "stealing" thing (not only in Madonna's case) is so played out.

r40 isn't that baiting? so, played out? a history of theft that has continued throughout her career, even going as far as taking advantage of poor developmentally challenged brit brit's mental health?

[R41] Okay Janbot aka Joseph Mora

r42 mr. glass, you just have to accept it's over between us.

Who is this Joseph Mora guy? Why do people keep mentioning him.

Ah, Mr. Mora is a sex offender from San Francisco (allegedly). He spends HOURS each day on Twitter and different forums positing about how great Janet is, and always has to bring Madonna into it. He also spends SEVERAL hours a day on the Internet making vicious threads about Madonna. He actually used to be a Madonna fan until he was called out for lying about being her friend. He's a psychopath, for sure. And he IS Janbot. It's rather obvious.

Lmao, Janet is mediocre. Her skin color doesn't change that. She could be a white bitch and still suck.

[quote]Madonna willed herself hard. She was brilliant in her brand and found the best producers and writers to help craft pop albums with artfulness.

This is the answer, Madonna IS a brand and she has never been out of the public eye which means her private life contributes to that brand which helps sell records. Janet is secretive, she disappears for years at a time and while she was a good entertainer in years past she isn't very interesting. That said, Madonna gives me second hand embarrassment, her schtick doesn't work anymore.

Janet has never come close to any Madonna vocal performance. Madonna is mid-tier vocally along with most singers. Janet is bottom tier where even Britany can outsing her.

So, this is Janbot. Yikes. She looks very scary. Total criminal.

Talk about race-baiting bullshit. Janet had her time and it’s over. Same with Madonna. Skin colour has nothing to do with either woman’s career decline.

R50 Madonna hardly had a decline. She’s still a touring force if she is physically well now(not to mention mentally). If she decided to play the hits from now on, her touring would be massive.

That said, all musical artists have shorter careers now. They may still be around but there are no true massive superstars now. Most of it is dubious streaming numbers and the backing of one of the 5 huge conglomerates who control most of how big and in our faces/shoved down our throats somebody is pushed.

R51 is right. Madonna is a legend, while Janet is only remembered as MJ’s sister. If she wasn’t his sister, she will be one these musicians that, when you watch 80s hour, you exclaim: what the hell happened to that girl, is she working in some diner or did she made some clever investments.

Jabba wishes he was that normal looking. Jabba is an obese, greasy, near-homeless neanderthal.

R51 is correct, Madge may be insane but everyone knows at least one or two of her songs.

I'm 35 and only know "Together Again" and "Feedback" from Janet. I think she's likely a much nicer, happier and more stable person than Madge though.

Shame Madonna didn't keep on her 2000s trajectory and grow older in style.

R54 I highly doubt Janet is nice, just as I don’t think Madonna is this huge bitch people make her out to be. She’s more aloof to others if she is not interested instead of bitch. Even Sandra Bernhardt has said she is very warm and down to earth when she lets down her guard.

R55 I have no doubt Madonna is a decent person at heart but I mean if we approached her as humble fans she would not give us the time of day. She is a much harder cookie than Janet

R56 Can you imagine somebody of her fame being approached constantly by not only fans but other celebs? People close to her like Penn, Rosie, Debi, and the like have said she rarely gets any peace at all when out and about. Even among stars Rosie has said she is approached and hassled nonstop. I don’t know how most stars do it.

Madonna is an icon world wide. Janet MAYBE in the US if at all….

Madonna has classic abandonment issues with her mom dying when she was so young and her father never acknowledging it and simply moved on. She rarely lets people in her life, keeps most at arms length, and is quick to cut them out before she feels they’d ditch her.

Janet is classic nepotism.

It’s more like White Privilege vs. Black Entitlement

Filtergate vs. Nipplegate

I still love Boy George's story about meeting Janet at some awards show. He introduced himself to her and she didn't realize it was him and acted like a huge cunt. When she realized it was Boy George, she approached him and did the innocent routine and BG wasn't having it.

R62 That doesn't prove Jabba is a cunt at all. Why would a celebrity want some nobody chatting with them like they're a celebrity. If anything it proves how thin Boy George's celebrity was.

R63 Her AND BG are huge cunts.

R64 ...............

Her and BG! Are you fucking serious, stupid illiterate cunt. It is: she and BG.

There is no VS. Madonna won this in every conceivable way a long time ago. I’d even take current crazy Madonna over the boring, bland MJ sister.

R66 Calm down. I’m Madison Cawthorne.

Madonna and Janet had a lot of sexual content in their work which leads me to believe they were both sexually traumatized when they were younger. They were acting out their sexual aggression in their work. When Justin Timberlake ripped off that piece of clothing to reveal Janet's breast, he exposed the wounds of Janet's sexual trauma.

R69 Madonna really didn’t if you go through her work. She acted out, out of anger, in 1992 with the Sex book. She said she was in a white hot rage at the hypocrisy of the US. Prince had way more sexual content in his work, especially his earlier work.

A titty on a Sunday afternoon!

Hey Jabba, it looks like this thread didn't go the way you planned.

R69 As if, stupid cunt. Squeeze us out some more nuggets from your loaded up tampon, bitch.

R3 We didn't understand the big deal here in Europe. We chalked it up to Americans somehow managing to be oversexualized and prude at the same time back then. As if a child had been traumatized by flashing a titty, come on! It was entirely unfair what they did to her in the aftermath. I do believe that Madonna had the better hits though. Like a Prayer, for example, still seems fresh today, mainly because of the amazing bassline and the choir. (That's obviously a personal preference I'm expressing there.)

R51 Madonna couldn’t even sell out 2000 seat auditoriums on her last tour, and has been irrelevant for decades, but go off.

Nice try, Jabba at R75.

R75 See, this poster says things so outrageous it is laughable. Let’s please compare Madonna’s sold out Madame X tour vs any of Janet’s last few tours. Also, look at Madonna’s tours in her entire career with mostly playing newer material, not the hits, and still setting all time records. Janet, pitiful sales.

Madonna hurt her touring sales because she has alienated herself further and further from the public. Confessions and Sticky and Sweet were huge tours.

MDNA did well, too, but she really should have capitalized on the Super Bowl performance and made that tour a greatest hits show and not a majority of MDNA songs. But her excessive plastic surgery, horrible social media, hesitation to play most of her hits, and exorbitant ticket prices have damaged her reputation.

Janet's problem was that she just regurgitated her tours. The Rhythm Nation performance always looked the same. She would do a medley with a Wonderland setting and then just revamp it for the next tour. Then a song where she invites a guy up on stage and ties him up in a chair and she dances sexily around him. At least Madonna tries to change up her tours. And while Madonna does lip-synch some songs on her tours, she does sing live. Janet mimes most of her show.

R78 I wouldn’t say Madonna hurt her touring when all her tours were insanely successful. What you said is true. I’m not arguing that. If you are suggesting Madonna could have out done Sticky and Sweet in box office you’re 100% correct. Her not doing the hits is insane, but Springsteen doesn’t either. And he is just as successful touring. Her erratic behavior on her last few tours hurt her more than anything but we now know she was in a huge amount of physical pain which led to her being late often.

Why is Janet even in the conversation when her sales are joke compared to Madonna?

Even on Spotify she is miles below in streams compared to Madonna, Mariah, Celine, Whitney etc.

Her music is forgotten.

R80 And that is streaming when Madonna has had no record company and was feuding with WBR. Those streaming sales are about to skyrocket since she is getting back with them soon.

I JUST heard a commercial using Like A Virgin. The WBR deal is already happening. They are about to put her catalog out there big time.

You can add up all of the YouTube views from the music videos of Madonna’s last album and all of them together are less than Janet’s most recent music video.

liar

R84 Look it up, cunt. Virgin cruises out of Miami.

I wasn't talking to you, dumb ass.

JanBot is on a rampage today (I think JanBot is also the one who screams about Klan Grannies in every royal thread).

Anyway, JanBot doesn’t actually want you to look it up. Because then you’ll see Janet's 2 most viewed videos on youtube are songs she recorded and released with higher-profile men, and only one of them has views over 100 million. By herself, Janet's view totals are quite pitiful. Madonna all by herself has several videos with over 100m views, her biggest has over 500 million views. So right there a youtube comparison was a bad idea for Janet, but JanBot is all about failure.

But back to the "look it up!" comparison, Madonna's official videos from Madame X singles have a combined count well over Janet’s last official video. So JanBot is not only a failure, but full of shit.

Now I'm sure JanBot will come back and move the goalposts to make some other nonsensical (and likely false) claim, but there is no escaping your failures, J.

[quote]Madonna couldn’t even sell out 2000 seat auditoriums on her last tour,

Try 200 seat auditoriums.

Janet sold only 80% of seats for her Vegas residence.

And capacity for some of the dates on her State of the World Tour was as low as 40%.

R87 And that is with WBR taking her videos (among others) off YouTube back in 2006 and when they returned them their view counts started over.

Fat ass gorilla Jabba is always wrong. Always.

R89 Madonna canceled multiple shows in auditoriums with 1500 seats during her last tour…also cancelled all the Boston shows because she couldn’t even sell half of a 3000 seat on any night, she was too embarrassed to perform…

There continues to be very little interest in Madonnas music (past or current), her album reached number one because her team cooked the books

Nobody was going to pay those prices for Madame X. Nobody cared about the album and we all knew the setlist was going to be Madame X heavy plus maybe a few hits.

She had toured in 2004, 2006, 2008/09, 2012, and 2015. Why pay $400 a ticket (or more) to listen to her new (horrible) album in a theatre? It was a dumb idea. She and Guy Oseary are really stupid and overestimated their touring prowess.

Madonna only seems to have “ex friends” compare that with all of the praise Janet is getting from her contemporaries in her new documentary

R92 you can lie all you want, but none of that explains Janet's poor ticket sales over multiple tours.

Jabba can't handle the truth. i remember back when Janet was flopping in Vegas, people would post all the empty seats available on Ticketmaster that particular evening's show. Every single time there were hundreds of seats not sold (not to mention the ones ticket brokers had bought and were unable to unload) yet Jabba would say we were making it all up.

I am more of a Madonna fan than a Janet fan but Madonna's last two tours struggled. I am not Jabba, but let's face it, neither of them are strong sellers anymore.

Madonna *might* be able to have another successful tour if she promotes it as a hits tour and doesn't remix the songs to unrecognizablity, but she takes herself too seriously and thinks she's a serious artist and revolutionary so that will never happen. She can't embrace being a nostalgic act like she cannot embrace getting older.

Madonna should do Vegas because she is unable to sell out even small auditoriums. She would definitely sell some tickets in Vegas, but I wouldn’t put her where Janet, Gaga and Aerosmith play, maybe she could play the Flamingo like Paula Abdul. She should also consider the Golden Nugget.

Quit staring threads about these two talentless, narcissistic, has been, BINTS..

Jabba is PRESSED!

R100 I don’t start them, I finish them