Spielberg’s “West Side Story” is flopping and the fans of it are blaming Ansel Elgort’s casting

Even if the accuser's story and her interpretation of what happened are 100 percent true, the fact that she made her accusations not through a lawyer via legal channels but through Twitter marks her as an idiotic and pathetic member of Generation Z, and severely if not fatally damages her credibility.

Anyone else sick of this thirsty end-run attention getting?

Me too.

Call the cops, people. Kick and scream and pull their hair. Knee them in the balls. If you let sexual predators get a away you’re responsible for keeping sickos on the streets.

Don’t wait until 5 years later. That is not the way. Everybody is a victim of something but most people don’t just sit around and take it. Fight back or make things worse in the long run

Sucks for Rita

On Wednesday Nov. 24 when it first hit theaters House of Gaga made 4,204,000 which is a little more than WSS made yesterday. Maybe over familiarity with the story is to blame as well.

I was reading the comment section to the TMZ post on FB and mostly everyone is saying the same thing… no one wanted a remake to a beloved classic. They almost never do amazing.

It didn’t need a remake. Neither does Sound of Music or Fiddler. All three screen adaptations are close to perfect. I’ll watch it on cable but it’s not something I’d rush to the theatre to see.

The movie is a flop because it’s dated and nobody cares about musicals anymore.

It’s because no one wants a remake to a beloved film. People aren’t embracing it.

Yep, R8, I saw it Thursday night - it was outdated, clunky, and had some bad casting choices. Ansel Elgort was not butch enough for the role and he didn't have believable chemistry with the female lead which is probably the most important thing of all.

[quote]It’s because no one wants a remake to a beloved film. People aren’t embracing it.

Ding. Ding. Ding.

Whether you subscribe to the idiotic notion that this version is "superior" simply because it casts actual latinos, the original is loved. No remake was ever going to be as well-regarded.

I can't think of remake of a beloved classic that is as well-liked, except maybe a few versions of A Christmas Carroll.

Makes no sense to remake a classic, make a sequel instead.

Ansel looks like those ugly inbred euro trash boys from belami.

ROFL I would say less than five percent, maybe even less than one percent of people under 25 have seen the original WSS. The fact is that the under 25 quadrant only comes out for Marvel movies opening weekend and WSS audience of older theatergoers will come out for it over the next three months.

It's Rita's fault. You can practically smell the crotch rot!

This was misguided from the get go. I hope it gets zero Oscar nominations.

Gaga is a huge star, R5. Don't let DL fool you.

No big star in WSS. It's ONLY the familiarity of the story that's selling tickets.

Aren't they planning a remake of Fiddler? I wouldn't mind because I'm not really a fan of Topol. He was too young. Tevya needs a few years on him.

I thought this new West side story was getting a lot of love and people are saying it's one of Spielberg's best films.

R17 of course gag is a big name, she's still obnoxious and fake though.

Certain classics shouldn’t be remade. There’s a reason they don’t remake the original “The Wizard of Oz”, “Gone With The Wind” or “The Godfather”…. They know it will get hate and backlash. Spielberg thought he could pull it off with this one but again, people are saying they won’t watch it.

The movie isn’t getting panned. It’s getting good to excellent reviews.

This shit cost $100 million! Spielberg can stick his virtue signaling up his ass too! Blowhard.

My stepfather mentioned how they always want to remake movies that were good and/or classics or did well… how about they remake movies that didn’t go over well and try making them right? Instead they want to remake a beloved film like WSS, thinking people will wanna see that. They won’t.

He was right.

R21, reviews are payed for. They don’t mean shit. All that matters is money. They spent $100 on this crap.

The relentless hype and marketing after the delayed release has been overkill.

R21 ummmmm NO ONE CARES ABOUT CRITICS. You’re the only one on here that thinks critics still have a hold over the public.

R22 how is he virtue signaling?

[quote] Aren't they planning a remake of Fiddler?

That would end up being the biggest bomb in history. The public doesn’t want musicals and they’re tired of the PC crap.

R27, you didn’t hear his Latinx nonsense? His not putting Spanish subtitles and going on and on about Latinx representation. He didn’t even cast an Italian. He’s a fucking idiot like 99% of Hollywood. They don’t live in the real world or reality.

[quote] It’s because no one wants a remake to a beloved film. People aren’t embracing it.

Which is so surprising, given how audiences just flocked to see Gus van Sant's remake of "Psycho"!

One disappointing opening day and the bitter queens are all ready to label it a " flop."

But there’s a few breaths we need to take, and know that even after we poke some holes here, the end game for West Side Story is a marathon, not a sprint. This isn’t necessarily a repeat of Cats, which tanked over the 2019 holiday with a $95M production cost, $6.6M opening, a C+ CinemaScore and disastrous reviews at 19% on Rotten Tomatoes for Andrew Lloyd Weber’s feline uncanny valley.

West Side Story has an A CinemaScore out of the gate, an 88% positive on Comscore/Screen Engine’s PostTrak and a huge 70% definite recommend, along with 93% certified fresh on Rotten Tomatoes.

One insider close to the film tells me that the reason why Disney executed this distribution strategy was because they looked at the sleeper trajectories of Spielberg’s adult films and figured their plan off that. A rival studio boss remarks that West Side Story will be fine in the long run; that it’s just having two weeks of previews in the run-up to Christmas before it really takes off.

Similar to In the Heights, West Side Story is seeing most of its business in the Broadway capital, New York City, with AMC Lincoln Square a top performing location. Box office analytics firm EntTelligence is reporting that NYC has double the occupancy rate of this weekend’s moviegoing national average. Three hundred thousand have bought tickets to West Side Story so far, and 82% of the movie’s ticketholders are watching this two-hour and 36 minute running movie before 8PM.

American cinema will never stop flopping because wokism has invaded every scenarios. Contrary to what some people think on the DL, Europe and the rest of the world do not like your totalitarian wokism and the distortion you impose on the whole planet. There is a Trans role in this version that replaces a woman. Something that will not be accepted in the rest of the world. Hollywood will continue to flop while Asian movies with more diverse scenarios, made by very talented directors, are already the most popular with the youth and the middle class who reject Wokism and the never ending Marvel craps. Spielberg who is a genius has fallen very low with his revisionism. More than ever with the pandemic cinema is supposed to make people dream. It serves the little people to escape from real life and not to take American minority ideologies in the face. People are not stupid, fortunally.

lol.

Racism! Racism! Racism! Pronouns! Trannies!

A lot of people want new and original content for adults.

And Hollywood and today’s liberalism with its believe all victims crap had Ansel lay low and said nothing just to make a buck. This isn’t lost on people. Spielberg is so 80s too. Retire, old fuck. We remember how you killed three people, which included two kids on the set of the Twilight Zone and tried covering it up with your pal, Landis. POS.

R29 who is supposed to be Italian???

He was right in casting Latinos in Latino roles.

R35, people don’t want propaganda and forced diversity. Films in pre-1950 in Hollywood were also remakes. They weren’t original either. Hollywood needs to drop the PC shit and stop congratulating itself. They’re whores. Everyone is someone’s relative.

R38 the story is literally about diversity … how is he supposed to not cast POC? I’m confused.

[quote] Films in pre-1950 in Hollywood were also remakes. They weren’t original either.

Maybe that's why the '70s were the best decade for America cinema? Original, cutting-edge, gritty.

Americans don’t care about musicals beyond that Hamilton bullshit.

[quote] the story is literally about diversity … how is he supposed to not cast POC?

It’s a movie. Fantasy. Yet another stupid liberal who thinks as long as entertainment is diverse all is right in the world. Hello, Jada! TV and film doesn’t mean shit. It’s not real. Make a good movie. Stop acting like you’re curing cancer.

R42 dude. Seriously. You need to get off this site. It’s old and boring. You’re in the wrong place.

Who is this shrill freak bleating on about liberals, Hollywood and diversity?? Can you point me to the wonderful cinema being made by conservatives nowadays?

R44 seriously. And he’s upset that Latinos were cast as Latinos… wtf? Like seriously. He needs to get help already. Years of the same shit. It’s old and boring.

I agree with r10 saying it's clunky. The pace of it is off and the songs do not seem to flow naturally into the story in all cases. I also expected the dance numbers to be more visually exciting given Speilberg's eye for staging but I didn't love it. The best staged number was "Cool" and "Officer Kruptke" had a grim vibe to it the original doesn't have, the setting in the police station adds to that.

[quote]ROFL I would say less than five percent, maybe even less than one percent of people under 25 have seen the original WSS.

WSS still gets productions in high schools all over the country. Those songs are a staple of pop culture.

Rachel Zegler played Maria in a school production of WSS. R47 is correct. It’s also shown in many HS’s.

This film really should have opened over Christmas. Now is the time it’s audience (this is an over 25 quadrant film despite the cast) is busy preparing for Christmas.

Get woke, go broke.

I never expected it to do well, another totally unnecessary remake.

FF22 Trump supporting scum.

R29 Shut up, Trump supporting SCUMBAG. There was no need for subtitles. There wasn't that much Spanish in it. And what there was was easy to get.

The original is a beloved classic. Any theater person in your local high school or college knows the words to at least one of the WSS songs. This was just a pointless remake that at its best still would not have equaled the impact of the original, no matter how many awards they try to throw at it.

Rita badmouthing Natalie Wood and the original movie in recent interviews did not go over well on social media either. Again, pretty stupid to trash a movie that is fondly remembered by the general public.

It will be interesting to see how this affects its oscar chances. They have been pushing it hard in the last two weeks, but with lukewarm public support, they might reassess its chances. Licorice Pizza and Tragedy of MacBeth have yet to open as well.

Them speaking Spanish at times was not a problem but what was a problem was Anita consistently correcting Bernardo and Maria telling them to speak English. Either have them speak English all the time or let them break into Spanish at certain times but don't have someone correcting them about it.

Spielberg was not the right person to remake this.

[quote] Any theater person in your local high school or college knows the words to at least one of the WSS songs.

ROFL you really don’t know any Zoomers do you. They think an old movie musical is “Chicago.”

Anita kept correcting them because she loves America and wants them to speak English well so they have a better chance at succeeding.

Anita’s story is sad when you see her going from bright eyes enthusiast who loves Manhattan and Americans to someone who not has grief and hate in her heart for the people she would defend to Bernardo. She went from singing “America” to wanting out after the Pharmacy scene. It’s sad.

R56 ummmm they know WSS. As usual, you’re out of touch. You need to get off this site.

R58 =

No. I just know who you are. You’re best bet is to get off this site.

Your*

Lots of Dumpers on here blaming “wokeness” for the failure of this movie, not realizing that the failure is just that it’s a boring movie. Plenty of “woke” movies and tv shows are succeeding but you won’t hear a peep from them.

But HOW IS IT WOKE?!!!!! It isn’t woke by casting Latinos in Latino roles. That’s not “woke” and much better than casting white actors and painting them brown.

R17 I'm not fooled or swayed by DL. I was merely making a comparison and should have added that on Thanksgiving Eve 11/24 House of Gaga had a limited number of screenings at theaters and on Friday made an additional $5.7M. Gaga's film even with mixed reviews will far outgross WSS.

Algot is fine in the movie. And what he did with that girl was something that every hot straight young actor has done. A complete non story.

The movie is flopping because it's an old musical. This isn't 2000 anymore, when Chicago was released.

Gaga’s film is flopping.

I thought it was a big hit at least in its first week r66.

Others? Is it?

How did Ricardos do?

It truly is Woke Side Story. And it's not because the Puerto Rican characters are played by actual Latinos -- in 2021, that is correct and proper, and it should be noted that Arian de Bose and David Alvarez give the best performances in the movie.

It's the preachy script by Tony Kushner at fault here: everything hinted at or referred to in the original is now shown or, worse, lectured to the audience. Tony isn't just out from a juvenile delinquent facility as in the original, now he's an ex-con; the prejudicial dialogue is extended and amplified to the point where it beats you over the head; and then there's the lesbian/tomboy erasure by making Anybodys trans.

On top of that, the movie is boring, lacking the energy and vitality that made the '61 film so exciting. Jerome Robbins and Robert Wise made a movie that you want to repeatedly escape into; Spielberg and Kushner made a movie that you want to escape from.

Maybe this is why it is a flop.

[quote] The first song from :West Side Story” is “Tonight, tonight…” But the second line shouldn’t be “We’ll be spending $58 on a pair of movie tickets tonight.” Yet, Disney has made a huge miscalculation with the price of tickets for Steven Spielberg’s “West Side Story.” At New York’s Upper West Side AMC Cinema at Broadway and 68th St. — the same corner at which “West Side Story” takes place in 1957 — seats are on sale for $27.99. That’s in the regular theater, not IMAX. The Senior Citizen price is $26.49 and the price per child is $24.99. Per child. Add in popcorn, soda, and maybe a baby sitter and you’ve got a $100 experience for a couple going to the movies– or more.

People are tired of fake woke crap

Only "Follies" can revive the screen musical as a blockbuster attracting moviegoers of every generation!

^Sorry, Ariana

Spielberg deserves a bomb .

Didn’t Ready Player One also flop?

In normal times my friends and I would be there opening day. Spent twenty years of my life in theaters, but I'm not going back until this pandemic is behind us.

Can I assume that when this movie is shown in Spanish speaking countries, there will be subtitles for the sections spoken/sung in English?

He is fucking ugly. They need to stop trying to make him a leading man.

Tony dies at the end.

spoiler alert

I found him handsome in the movie

It would be cool to see M and G together in Follies.

Heck, I'd even play the maid to work with M and G.

R66 R67 now in its 3rd week House of Gaga was #4 Friday with a YTD of $38M while King Richard in its 4th week has a YTD of $14M

Most movies that aren't super hero movies are flopping. People just aren't going out to the movies. They can just watch movies at home on their big screen tvs.

R82 both are flops.

r68 at first I was excited by the opening. The rubble of apartment buildings being demolished and the wrecking balls poised to continue that work and the pan overhead leading us into the neighborhood. That is all we needed, after that any person with a working brain should understand the implications. Why not just let the story roll? Instead we kept getting hit over the head with that same message the entire movie.

Spielberg is known for doing that though, he does have the tendency to slather his themes on thickly.

I didn’t like the movie as much as everyone else but didn’t find it preach either

Ariana did a great job. Her performance in the "Own kind/I Have A Love" scene was heartbreaking.

38 million in a pandemic and starring a new movie star is not a flop. Gaga has a hit.

It’s not a hit, no matter how you keep trying to spin it.

Pandemic keeping older audiences home plus a remake of a 1960s musical with no stars. How great could it do?

R75 Don't blame the pandemic: Venom has made over $200M, Eternals and No Time to Die over $150M and Dune and Ghostbusters over $100M each.

You don’t need stars for a story like WSS.

Actually, r92, with a musical film, you absolutely need stars. It's the superhero movies that don't need stars.

R92 are your sure of that?

No. WSS is a film that doesn’t need “stars”. It’s a classic that won’t be embraced by the public, the way Psycho wasn’t. Certain classics are to be left alone.

Lucy was a very big star and made Mame the smash that it was.

[quote]That is all we needed, after that any person with a working brain should understand the implications

But what about the other 90% of the country?

I'm no fan of Elgort, but idiot fangirls trying to dump the blame on him over accusations most people haven't even heard of is ridiculous.

DESTRY! Bring me... THE AXE!

I wrote this before but I was surprised that in a preview Maria says she is going to think for herself to Bernardo. Ernest Lehman was too smart a screenwriter to put that kind of clunky literalism into a movie. Is there more of that?

Oh, YES, r99. Pretty much all the dialogue has been re-written -- gone are all the Daddy-o's, replaced by heavy-handed dialogue explicating the evils of racism and sexism.

How do you make a movie about racism without racism?

You show it, you don't need to have every other character spell it out repeatedly.

You’re right, r100, they should have kept the Daddy-O references, that’s much more realistic.

It wasn’t shown any more than it was then. Only reason it feels that way is because they’re allowed to use words now they couldn’t then.

"... no one wanted a remake to a beloved classic."

But the other one is OLD, with dead white people wearing funny clothes!

The old one is loved and shown in many schools.

[quote]It will be interesting to see how this affects its oscar chances.

I personally hope it gets tons of Oscar nominations and hopefully wins, too. Anything to piss off racist Trump trash like R42 would be an utter joy.

r107, you might want to work on that spitefulness problem.

When you worry more about virtue signaling than making a good film/show, you deserve to fail. Hollywood needs to wise the fuck up before they go bankrupt. They’re living in an echo chamber. Social media is not the world. Stop taking cues from crackpots.

Why would anyone give them an Oscar? Oscars are paid for by the studio. They’re not going to throw more money at a failure.

Gaga’s film is not a flop. It’s making shitloads both domestically and internationally. West Side Story is $100m flop.

I was watching the dance at the gym on you tube. I forgot how wonderful John Astin is in that brief cameo. He makes a meal of that very small part. As he does the next year as the clerk in the unemployment office in That Touch of Mink.

I wanna see Flower Drum Song remade

Still set in modern-day San Francisco but with Asian drag queens.

Riff is incredible in this one.

You can make a movie that’s “woke” and still good. Stop blaming the wokeness for the film being boring. Plenty of filmmakers make great movies with diverse characters and messages.

It’s not woke though. It’s literally the same story as it’s always been.

Who wants to pay to see an actor named "Ansel Elgort"? Could the name be any clunkier?

Some really weird psychology where people love to run here heralding projects as flops as if any movie's success or failure actually affects their life at all.

It’s 2021, almost 2022.

Musicals don’t work anymore.

“The Greatest Showman” wasn’t some big smash hit either. I think it performed OK but nobody wants to see musicals anymore. People dancing and shit out of nowhere. It’s not cool anymore.

That’s really it.

R116 I know it is. I was addressing the Dumpers who are annoyed that this film is “woke” and blame it for the film’s “failure.”

There's nothing particularly woke about it. At all. Idiot.

[quote] It’s not woke though. It’s literally the same story as it’s always been.

The dialogue has literally been re-written so that what was a light tap on your shoulder in the original ("You shouldn't do that") is now a sledge hammer repeatedly banging on your head ("Don't do that you evil, racist, sexist, transphobic white man!").

R119, I think you’re right. If a musical wants to succeed, it really has to present a different view and modern vibe. I think Fame did that very well when it was released. Not many musicals have been able to achieve that different look and feel since.

It will be a grower. Word of mouth is very strong.

[quote] Makes no sense to remake a classic, make a sequel instead.

“WEST SIDE 2: ELECTRIC BOOGALOO”

[quote] but with Asian drag queens.

What do you think fucking Nancy Kwan was?

R118 Not as weird as people who run here to white knight.

R121 if you’re addressing my post at r120 please reread it. I’m not commenting on the film being “woke.” In fact I haven’t even seen it. I’m commenting on the Dumpers who blame the film’s failure on the fact that they think it is too “woke.” Instead of blaming the film’s failure on the fact that it’s boring they want to slam the fact that it’s diverse.

Why do so many INCELs like R107 bring Trump into every discussion?

[quote]I wouldn't mind because I'm not really a fan of Topol. He was too young. Tevya needs a few years on him.

That makes no sense. In the late nineteenth century people got married very young and had children right away. Lives were shorter back then. Tevye, like his daughter Tzeitel, likely would have had an arranged marriage at eighteen, or nineteen years of age with his first child arriving a year or so later, or not long after. To be true to life, it would be likely that Tevye and Golde would be only forty, or even a year or two younger!

If you're going to remake a movie musical, remake "The Wiz".

Remake it because the film sucked. But the original B'way musical has lots of possibilities.

Next up, remake of Oliver!

Can’t remember when Hollywood had an original thought.

If they re-made 'The Wiz" for the movies today, Dorothy would be played by Jazz Jennings and Glinda would be played by Laverne Cox.

R65 RU certain he's straight? Please tell me he might be bisexual!

[quote]“The Greatest Showman” wasn’t some big smash hit either.

No, it actually was a huge hit.

WSS is incredibly acted and produced. It is entertaining on every level, I think it will hold and grow. The word of mouth is fantastic. I was a hater until I saw it, and changed my mind. It is not overtly woke at all, rather it highlights elements of the script that were more or less already in the piece. Go see it, it's great.

"tick, tick...Boom" on the other hand.....

R131 and make Dorothy a girl again like in the musical it's based on and not an elementary teacher from Harlem to accommodate Miss Ross!

R119 the greatest showman made almost 1/2 a billion dollars and the soundtrack was a smash which is rare for original soundtracks.

R93 Roz and I made Gypsy a smash. Who wanted to see a movie with Ethel Merman?

I really don’t think it’s bombing. It’s doing very well in theater circles.

While the actor who played Bernardo was amazing, I stand by my opinion that Mike Fairst gives the best performance in the film. He played Riff like no one else has and made that character his own. Ariana DeBose had some elements that were her own for Anita but there are moments it feels like she was mimicking Moreno.

It’ll most likely have legs and become even bigger due to repeat broadcasts like the wizard of Oz and Hocus Pocus.

Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeth one luuuuuuuuuuuuuuhk....

R139 In the Heights made more on its opening day in theaters even though it was available on HBO Max as well. WSS is 'theaters only' ITH's BO was considered disappointing and WSS was a much costlier production.

GaGa’s film has yet to recoup its budget before prints and advertising. Stop pretending it’s a smash film.

I thought it wasnt eeven out yet.

Most people knew this would be a flop since it was announced. People said making this movie was a mistake. Looks like they were right.

R144 and it looks like that won’t happen. It’s only made $38 million domestically and yet it’s stan on here thinks it’s some smash.

West Side Story is well known by the over 50 crowd but that's it. Those people aren't going to theaters in huge numbers and every time the demographic starts inching towards returning to movie theaters, the pandemic picks up again.

WSS isn't fun either. I cant imagine what a person under 30 would think about watching that trailer. They don't worship Spielberg. So what's left for them?

What i can guarantee is a full on PR war if the grosses remain soft. Spielberg's PR people have to do something to earn their money and keep the failure off his shoulders.

Just watched WWS. Honestly, Ansel’s performance was the stand out. The guy playing Bernardo was great too. That said, there was no reason to film a remake. The original is still way better with great momentum. This version was very talky (trying to flesh out the narrative more), which made it drag somewhat.

Musicals are a hard sell nowadays.

Ansel surprised me. He’s always terrible. He was amazing here. I feel bad for him.

Its a remake of a film that while entertaining wasn't exactly groundbreaking itself. People know the story and those who don't it spells it out in the trailer. The actors being puerto ricans isnt going to be enough to get people in

R147 I don't think anyone has said it's a smash. But Gucci is clearly not a flop.

It will end up with roughly $60 million domestically, probably $130 worldwide. That's a modest hit for an adult, non sequel, non franchise, non comic book, non remake movie during a pandemic.

So, in conclusion: Gucci is not a flop, not a smash.

Back to WSS, I think it might end up doing okay over Christmas. I can see my sisters (and people like them)finding time to see it once the kids are on their break.

R147 well compared to WSS, In the Heights and Dear Evan Hansen, House of Gaga looks like a hit. Dear Evan Hansen's opening day gross was $3.2M compared to WSS at $4.1M. And Hansen was mocked and derided on DL and scorned by the critics!

Gucci won’t even make $50 million domestically probably lmao

R154 and your predictions for WSS?

Sure, Jan. Gucci will go from $72M to $130M worldwide. Tell another one.

[quote] reviews are payed for

Oh, dear R24!

I don't think the world is that familiar with WSS. It's more Oklahoma! territory than Sound of Music or even Mary Poppins.

This is yet another musical flop after In the Heights, Dear Evan Hansen, and maybe Tick tick Boom.

It’s time to stop making musical movies for a while

I found that making sure Latinos portrayed Latinos added nothing special to the movie.

Natalie Wood was better

Shut up R159. Just shut it.

R152 will it still be in theaters by then?

I suspect the tornado in Kentucky had a lot to do with the poor BO showing. You know how those Kentuckians love musicals! Once it blows over, I'm sure BO business will pick up.

R42, the racist MAGAT, needs to die in a grease fire, started by people of all colors.

R159 its not the musicals, its the themes. ITH seemed like a corny psa musical...WSS was an unneeded remake that had no reason to be remade other than to be pc. Bring on something hresh, original and cutting edge and it could work.

[quote]I'm not really a fan of Topol. He was too young. Tevya needs a few years on him.

Your tangential comment is so strange. I'm aware of Topol's actual age when he made the film, but do you really think he looks too young? How old do you think he's supposed to be? His oldest daughter should be no older than her late teens, so Tevye should probably be about 40, maybe a few years older than that at most.

R164 get laid much?

Perhaps Spielsberg was gambling on a Leo DiCaprio Romeo & Juliet type hit. A more sure fire formula for remaking West Side Story as a moneymaker would be a Pixar reimagining featuring warring gangs of anthropomorphic pinto vs pinquito beans competing for the chance to be harvested into the local factory's chili bean cans.

Given all the tension with Russia right now, and the renewed popularity of ABBA, a big screen version of Chess could succeed. Of course, you'll need stars for the leads and some careful work on the script....

R164 is the mirror image of Kyle Rittenhouse

How about a big screen version of Miss Saigon with Ansel Elgort as Chris?

What about a film version of the Sunset Boulevard starring Glenn Close?

I saw it yesterday. I thought it magnificent. But the ending was pure Spielberg shmaltz. He just can’t help himself.

Oh and cutting away from dancing to bystander reactions was stupid. And of course he had to break to a gratuitous scene of pre adolescent kids dancing during America.

Other than that, I loved it. Thought Ansel was good! And I liked his voice. The rest of the cast was exceptional. Movie made me so joyful…until everyone started dying.

Miss Saigon could be a better choice, it hasn't been filmed and it's much less shmaltzy than most musicals. Even has some action in it. That's where I'd put my money if I were a producer.-

duh, its an old timey musical.....buncha bullshit. rather see spidey man

R148 saw Belfast last Sunday afternoon and the theater was packed with the over 50 crowd myself included and the audience applauded at the end. I would think people my age who have probably seen it several times wouldn't be the audience for WSS. Too familiar

i pray it gets zero award noms....was boring as fug

Now if David Alvarez had only shown pinga . . .

Speaking of flop movies . . .

'West Side Story has quiet Thursday night with 800K'-DEADLINE

Just in time for Christmas!

The trouble is this year the musical films were projects that were not really wanted by anyone. "West Side Story" was a remake no one wanted to see of a much beloved film; "Dear Evan Hansen," "In the Heights," and "Tick, Tick... Boom!" were all films of musicals that were only moderately successful shows on stage, and which were made only because they were someone powerful's misguided pet project.

They need to make films of shows that were legitimate hits in their own right, like "Wicked" (which is coming up).

I saw it tonight in IMAX at the Chinese Theater. It was awful, but everyone clapped after each musical number. The loudest applause was for Stephen Sondheim.

one third of the audience was left by the end of the horrid movie...

Spielberg's 'West Side Story' is simply fabulous-Rex Reed the Observer

The movie is flopping because no one under 50 gives a shit about West Side Story. And no one over 50 goes to the movies. At least that's the reason given in one commentary as to why the film isn't doing well and I tend to agree.

R14, I agree with supposition #1, but not supposition #2, to wit:

We old fogies who saw the OG "WSS" in the movies are now safely ensconced at home, awaiting the release of movies on TV.

Yesterday I was within 50 yards of a small local theatre showing "HoG," and thought, though I'd like to see it for LG, the 2 hours+ running time screamed "Couch! Wait!" to me.

How did the lead actress do?

I did just fine R187, thanks for asking.

I could be the first EGOOT.

R189 you mean EGOPOT

That's nice, r182, but I don't think it's necessarily going to be indicative of much--you were with a West Hollywood crowd.

Ansel Elgort is the reason *I* decided not to go see it, but I'd thought my distaste for him was an outlier and wouldn't reflect the moviegoing public. If it flops I imagine it'll be a combo of the pandemic, younger audiences not being into musicals, and older audiences preferring to watch the original instead.

I loved it

The young girl playing Maria was wonderful

R184, Are Rex Reed and Tony Kushner fuck buddies?

Rex Reed also highly praised the Gucci movie.

Two reasons.

Younger generations don't care to see some 50's musical that doesn't have hip hop rap crap in it.

Older generations love the original and see no reason to see some PC remake.

And a pair of leads they have never heard of doesn't help either.

It was always a recipe for box office disaster from the get go.

Maybe this will finally tell Hollywood, we are tired of them remaking everything.

R23 while that makes the most sense from an artistic perspective, it’s clear to see why the studios don’t want to take a risk on a film that failed the first time particularly today where IMDb will tell you just how rubbish most found the film the first time around, they’d have to work so hard trying to persuade people that they’ve improved it.

But west side story lost me when they seemed to start jumping on the this one uses actual ethically accurate actors… I’m left wondering is that all there is!? It’s like ted turner when he believed people wanted to see all the classics in color… I don’t think most people cared.

R197, agreed. That, and the fact it was a musical about DANCING GANGS, and there ya go.

It's going to get a boat load of Oscar nominations regardless. It was actually way better than i expected. I liked it

r174 that's probably why you're not a producer. Miss Saigon is a drag. It's not fun or uplifting. When they do go to see musicals, audiences like fun, upbeat, uplifting material. Miss Saigon is for a more mature audience (and also lacks fun pop or showtune music).

And in film, producers don't have money. They more or less sell the rights to a project to a studio and their producing deal (money and credit) is attached as part of that. Whether they spend a day on set or not, they end up with the same credit and fee. Producers sometimes die and still get credit years later.

R196 he liked Gaga and gave the movie 3 out of 4 stars. He gave WSS 4 stars

The cinematography was breathtaking too. I liked the the camera moving about the neighborhood

Whenever I wonder which critic has his finger on the pulse of America in the 2020s, Rex Reed is the first name that comes to mind!

What is it with today's directors who cast people who either cant sing or can barely carry a tune. It's a musical, you know.

Anson whataface? I mean, really?

R137 R135 There’s no way the movie studio was happy with the box office performance. It made $175 million in the US. That’s not bad but there’s no way they were happy with the reception or the box office numbers.

R123 Yeah, big musicals are cheesy and corny. I like some old musicals because they’re old but watching “The Greatest Showman” and “Cats” is just awful. It’s for school theater geeks and grandparents and those types of grandparents you’d see them with are almost all dead.

“Grease” and “Rocky Horror Picture Show” are still popular because they’re kind of seen as alternative. They’re not big and jazzy. They’re tacky and cheap in a charming way. I would add “Little Shop of Horrors” and yes even “Fame”.

I think musicals should drop the budget and be more indie-like and less Vincent Minnelli and “jazz hands”. Showtunes aren’t cool anymore. It’s for old people and purple haired theater kids.

It’s a bit why “La La Land” was popular but it’s not what I mean.

I think it’s denial to think this movie will play well through the holidays. It’s a major disappointment. Spielberg is out of touch.

Even though WSS is from the 1950s, it was remarkably edgy and ahead of its time. It’s not so surprising that voters preferred the easy, feel-good Music Man to WSS. (Interestingly enough, Hugh & Sutton’s presence in the upcoming Music Man will make it a smash hit beyond belief.)

I’m excited to see this new version. As brilliant as WSS is, the weakest element is Arthur’s book. Having Kushner rewrite it was not a bad idea.

[quote] It’s for school theater geeks and grandparents and those types of grandparents you’d see them with are almost all dead.

Come again??

R205 name another critic!

It has a 93% on Rotten Tomatoes

I think this will have legs. It's getting good reviews. I think people were skeptical because the original is such a classic but it sounds like Spielberg has pulled it off.

Musicals are a hard sell but I think good word of mouth will help it.

Could it be worse than LaLa Land which almost won the Oscar?

[quote]There’s no way the movie studio was happy with the box office performance. It made $175 million in the US. That’s not bad but there’s no way they were happy with the reception or the box office numbers.

Just admit you said something stupid instead of continuing to dig this hole for yourself.

The girl that played Anita smoked everyone but I'm completely enamored with the lead's voice. She has a naturally beautiful sounding voice. It sounds like she doesn't have to fuss with it.

R207 In what alternate universe do you live and where were you schooled in syntax and grammar?

It was actually kind of corny and dated even when I saw it, on tv in the late 70s I think it was.

I was a teenager. I mean I enjoyed it but the smart aleckyness of the street kids sounded more like hep cat 50s stuff and made me roll my eyes, like when you watch B movies from the 40s or 50s and the tough types use really stupid slang.

It's a musical where people break into song constantly. You must not understand how suspension of disbelief works.

R76 in non-English speaking countries movies are dubbed, sometimes including the songs.

[quote] [R35], people don’t want propaganda and forced diversity. Films in pre-1950 in Hollywood were also remakes. They weren’t original either. Hollywood needs to drop the PC shit and stop congratulating itself. They’re whores. Everyone is someone’s relative.

[quote] American cinema will never stop flopping because wokism has invaded every scenarios. Contrary to what some people think on the DL, Europe and the rest of the world do not like your totalitarian wokism and the distortion you impose on the whole planet. There is a Trans role in this version that replaces a woman. Something that will not be accepted in the rest of the world. Hollywood will continue to flop while Asian movies with more diverse scenarios, made by very talented directors, are already the most popular with the youth and the middle class who reject Wokism and the never ending Marvel craps. Spielberg who is a genius has fallen very low with his revisionism. More than ever with the pandemic cinema is supposed to make people dream. It serves the little people to escape from real life and not to take American minority ideologies in the face. People are not stupid, fortunally.

Um hm lets review this list of virtually exclusively white cis gender heterosexual remakes that were big gigantic FLOPS. Every single yr Hollywood turns out mostly non Hispanic white cis gender hetero movies and most flop or disappoint at the box office. You're attempting to rewrite history because 99% white/hetero is not enough for you. With hundreds of tv networks, a long list of streaming services, YouTube and all of the other options to access endless amounts of old and new exclusively white content. Its still not enough for you white supremacists. You're literally outraged about Puerto Ricans being cast for a movie about Puerto Ricans. Do you know how ridiculous you sound?

18 Movie Remakes That Totally Flopped

1. Swept Away (2002) Screen Gems

2. The Mummy (2017)

3. Total Recall (2012)

4. Let Me In (2010)

5. Ben-Hur (2016)

6. Around the World in 80 Days (2004)

7. Get Carter (2000)

8. Poseidon (2006)

9. Tomb Raider (2018)

10. The Wicker Man (2006)

11. The Thing (2011)

12. Rollerball (2002)

13. The Wolfman (2010)

15. Conan the Barbarian (2011)

16. Oldboy (2013)

17. The Stepford Wives (2004)

18. Psycho (1998)

It’s funny, the original was so progressive for its time.

I think people unfamiliar with the film/musical, living in this climate, are burned out by the rhetoric and automatically assumed that a movie with a half white/half Latino cast was gonna be another lecture about how shitty white people are.

Also, the songs are way too old-fashioned to appeal to anyone outside of the baby boomers. And let’s just say they’re not fiending to go to a cinema in a pandemic when they can just watch stuff safely in their home.

The real test will be when it makes it to VOD/streaming

[quote] Could it be worse than LaLa Land which almost won the Oscar?

That depends. Will Faye Dunaway be trotted out to give it all of three minutes of Best Picture glory?

bad casting, egbort was poor choice

[quote] It’s funny, the original was so progressive for its time. I think people unfamiliar with the film/musical, living in this climate, are burned out by the rhetoric and automatically assumed that a movie with a half white/half Latino cast was gonna be another lecture about how shitty white people are. Also, the songs are way too old-fashioned to appeal to anyone outside of the baby boomers. And let’s just say they’re not fiending to go to a cinema in a pandemic when they can just watch stuff safely in their home. The real test will be when it makes it to VOD/streaming

Because lectured about institutional white supremacist racism is certainly so much more devastating than being oppressed by white supremacist racism. Its so very hard for whites in this country.

Did the Mary Poppins remake too flop because viewers assumed there would be a racial lecture?

The Hairspray musical remake is overtly racial and progressive and yet it was huge success.

I loved it. But I only saw it because a friend wanted it to be the thing we did before he goes away for a month for Christmas. The theatregoing experience has become something I endure rather than enjoy. I hate the loudness of the previews and commercials, as well as the presence of commercials in the first place.

I much prefer watching movies at home, and I agree with the ones among you who argue that we elders don't feel like going to movie theatres anymore, something exacerbated by the pandemic, though that is hardly the only reason to avoid the moviegoing experience. It's just easier at home.

Anyway, Anita's was my favorite performance, and Maria was quite wonderful. I loved her voice and her lovely red belt. As for Ansel, I wondered, just as I always have when seeing him in a movie, just what is he doing here? Wouldn't his talents be put to much greater use if he were to become a banker or an attorney? He's not unattractive, but I kept thinking during a number of his blackhead-revealing closeups how this should be some other actor.

[quote]I can't think of remake of a beloved classic that is as well-liked, except maybe a few versions of A Christmas Carroll.

Oh, dear. Did any of those versions star Carroll O'Connor?

I haven't seen it, but, obviously, there is no Jerome Robbins working on this on version. He co-directed with Robert Wise (even though he did leave the production before its completion). I don't think there are any brilliant directors of musicals working in film today, and Spielberg surely isn't one. I wouldn't think he's be good at the genre. And at his age it may be too late to learn.

*he'd

R221, no need to add the pretentious 'cis gender' crap to your diatribe. We're grown up to know that heterosexual means HETEROSEXUAL.

This movie is flopping because it's about singing and dancing gang members. Only aging eldergays who WORSHIP the theater are interested in seeing it.

“ And of course he had to break to a gratuitous scene of pre adolescent kids dancing during America.”

Of course. How else was he supposed to cum?

R221 That list is pretty spot on except Let Me In was highly acclaimed.

is Glover a Q person?

I’d eat Ansel’s ass.

When you look back at all the big hits during WWII, it was aspirational, light, and much needed escape. Right now we are going through one of the darkest times in American history and people in charge of the dream factory have instead doubled down on their rhetoric and turned even light hearted entertainment into a lecture.

What’s going to happen is that some production company or studio is going to see a major void and make a fuck ton of cash on escapist, apolitical, and even conservative leaning content.

There’s a reason why Friends and The Office are two of the most successful shows on the planet and they’re around thirty years old. I work in healthcare and people watch Friends non stop. And these are people with REAL problems — illness or the illness of a loved one — not idiotic shit like a white woman calling them “articulate.” And how do they spend their time? Watching light, silly shows with stupid problems that are easily solved. It’s healthy and normal and much needed.

People watch entertainment to be entertained or distracted. When you look at an audience like they’re rubes you need to correct AND demand money from them for the privilege, you lose the audience.

He's very handsome

[quote] People watch entertainment to be entertained or distracted.

This type of thinking is what has led to Iron Man 19, Shrek 7, and Superman vs. Wonderwoman III, or whatever other horrible little CGI project is shat forth for 13-year-olds and comic book fanboys doomed to a life of arrested development.

There is a market for adults who want to watch serious adult storylines that challenges and provokes thought. Streaming television has its finger on this pulse vs. what's been churned out as cinema lately.

He probably dickmatizes a lot of girls with that big dick and those beautiful cock sucking lips.

R201 Both the National Board of Review and the AFI listed it as one of the years 10 best films and the reviews are largely positive. Definitely see it as a Best Picture nominee.

I loved it too. But Im super gay and would've seen it anyway. But i thought it would be horrible and i loved it.

[quote]In normal times my friends and I would be there opening day. Spent twenty years of my life in theaters, but I'm not going back until this pandemic is behind us.

LOL. This sentiment has been churned out on this thread ad nauseum. I went to the theater to watch WWS on Friday night. There were about 12 people in the audience. The whole place was a damn ghost town. How are you catching Covid in that environment?

The opposite is true for restaurants. We went out to dinner last night and the place was packed with older people. Seriously....packed like sardines. Yet, no one is afraid they will get the plague there. Why is that? You think Covid is lurking in every movie theater, but not in restaurants?

Depressing to see the death of movie theaters...... for no good reason.

This made just 2.5 million more than the turd Evan Hansen. on opening weekend It will be lucky to get half of it’s total budget back.

[quote]the songs are way too old-fashioned to appeal to anyone outside of the baby boomers.

The music and choreography are masterpieces. I feel sorry for your lack of appreciation of a true artistic gem.

For those of you bleating on about the death of musicals--how they're so dated, corny, young people can't relate....etc. How do you explain that shit show Hamilton everyone slobbers over, young AND old? It's pure garbage compared to the genius of WSS.

R202 riiiiiiight because more dramatic musicals never succeed....things like Rent or Le Mis or Miss Saigon were absolute bombs...dumbass

Also I'm not a producer because I chose to do something else....what a foolish thing to say..

From one of the first Australian reviews

"As for the set-piece songs, Elgort struggles to breathe much life into Maria, his voice tinged with a touch of the Tony Hadleys whenever he gets into his upper register. It’s a shortcoming laid bare when he duets with Zegler, the agility of her voice putting his to shame. Odd, too, that Elgort, a hoofer who literally danced his way through the opening credits of Baby Driver, seems somewhat flat-footed when compared to his springy Jet counterparts. Could this duck-lipped, baby-faced Tony really have been just one punch away from murder?"

To add to my post at R243, Le Miserables, which was considered a semi success in 2012 made 27.3 million on opening weekend, also during the Christmas holidays. Afaik Le Mis is a bit of a "drag" itself yet here we are. Of course, the cast was star studded which is likely another factor that has not helped WSS..but perhaps infantilizing and dumbing down an audience like the op I am responding too did is as big a reason?

[quote]fortunally

Oh, DEAR!

[quote]To add to my post at [R243]

Why on earth would anyone want to do that?

[quote] the rest of the world do not like your totalitarian wokism

I, too, hate it when Yan Can Cook gets feisty with the soy sauce.

R205, I would prefer a Rex Reed review over one by Johnny Oleksinski.

This was shockingly good. I did not expect to like it as much as I did since I hated every single musical adapted to the screen lately. The orchestrations, signing, acting, and technical aspects all were out of this world. Top shelf Spielberg.

Ansel Elgort was fine. If it wasn't for the "me too", he would have probably been praised.

R77: Same with TimoTay. He can’t play the heroic type.

Get Woke, Go BROKE!

The movie is actually done well but no one gives a crap about seeing a musical movie.

[quote]this one uses actual ethically accurate actors…

Oh, dear.

[quote]As for the set-piece songs, Elgort struggles to breathe much life into Maria, his voice tinged with a touch of the Tony Hadleys whenever he gets into his upper register.

Wow, this production really is woke. I had no idea Maria was played by a man.

[quote]this one uses actual ethically accurate actors

Thank you for the kind words!

[Quote] The young girl playing Maria was wonderful

She was okay—great voice, general acting.

I’m waiting for the remake of Gone with the Wind. Ashley will be gay for sure

I would have written a much better script, because I am in no way influenced by wokeism. FYI, I am about to sign a contract to write the script for the " Follies" movie, since the producers have realized my genius.

Rita Moreno was fine but not really Oscar worthy.

The only people under 50 who care about WSS are outraged SJWs, who only care enough to shit all over it.

R236, the Ironman/Marvel/superhero crap Hollywood turns out are not “feel good” movies. They’re products designed and manufactured to be sold overseas and to American teenage boys (and adult men who never grew up). Shriek and other cartoon crap are produced for parents who want to shut their kids up for a few hours.

I agree with the poster upthread—a lot of the moviegoing public (particularly older white adults who’d otherwise be the target audience for this film) are tired of the constant cinematic scoldings over shit they can’t control. SS is about as subtle as a jackhammer when it comes to getting a message across. Miss Rita Moreno going on TCM a few months ago to bash Natalie Wood for not being a Latina (in the presence of her very GREEK costar and fellow Oscar winner George Chakiris, no less!) didn’t help matters—especially considering she herself played Asians, Indians, etc. throughout her own career. That, and the SS’s declaration that there would be no English subtitles because it would suggest that English is superior to Spanish was another misfire. Ironically, no one would have minded the lack of subtitles had he just kept his noble intentions to himself.

^^Shrek^^ (although “Shriek” works too!)

R262, your last sentence is quite revealing. The problem you and others seem to have has nothing to do with the movie itself, just the way it’s creators are taking about it. Which, not incidentally, is the typical right wing approach to racism, sexism, homophobia - “I just don’t want to hear about it.”

I think it will build like The Greatest Showman did.

What r264 said.

r265: could you please repeat that one more time on the "Have you ever sipped champagne on a yacht?" thread please.

Uh, no, R264. The only it “reveals” is the fact that Hollywood continues to be completely out of touch with large segments of the moviegoing public (of all races, creeds, and colors) who don’t frame their entire life experience through the lens of Twitter or Buzzfeed. You know, intelligent adults who can watch a film and embrace the message because they are moved by the experience, not because SS or RM tell them how they should think and feel in interviews.

R197 how is it PC?

Have you seen it?

Casting Latinos in Latino parts isn’t PC, it’s common sense.

R264 and it’s quite telling that you have no response to the FACT that RM is the last person talking about actors “stealing” roles from people of other ethnicities. See: The King and I. People who live in glass houses…

'That makes no sense. In the late nineteenth century people got married very young and had children right away. Lives were shorter back then. Tevye, like his daughter Tzeitel, likely would have had an arranged marriage at eighteen, or nineteen years of age with his first child arriving a year or so later, or not long after. To be true to life, it would be likely that Tevye and Golde would be only forty, or even a year or two younger!'

All the men who played the role on stage at the time were noticeably older. So you say but that was a convention of the stage. But people like Tevya had very hard lives and aged so much more quickly. You'll see pictures of old people or at least in late middle age in the early 20th Century and it will turn out they were in their early 40s. I also wish Mostel did the movie. He was so much more colorful and a far better actor. He's brilliant on the obc. Topol is bland. In fact the best actors are Molly Picon, Leonard Frey and Rosalind Harris.

I had no interest in this until all the hit pieces stated coming out trying to tank this movie. And it’s all the “usual suspects” right wing trash so now I want to see it.

Also, DL is a bad place to try to get a feel for a movie or piece of entertainment these days because the trolls try to skew the perception and anything on their target list.

Then you go and watch it and it will be something good. Like Dune. They spent months trashing it and it was really good.

You can’t trust this place anymore for reviews.

Is there anybody today who thinks George Chakiris was miscast because he was greek and not latino and it's a blot on the movie?

When will it come to TCM? I’ll watch it then.

R270 I think its fine that they recasted with latino actots however irs not quite as simple as just casting a "latino" for any latino role. Casting a mexican in a puerto rican role or a Dominican in an argentinean role would likely not go over well. In these cases them being played by american actors would be pretty much the same. Every country in Latam has its own identity and people identify more with that than the blanket term "latino". Its similar to why its looked down on now to cast, say, japanese actors in chinese roles etc.

[quote] Can you point me to the wonderful cinema being made by conservatives nowadays?

Conservatives do not make great films. Conservatives are capable only of treacle like Kirk Cameron's direct-to-video Christian propaganda. They do not produce any music, art, literature, film, TV, comedy, dance, etc. worth noting.

To be fair, no good cinema is being made nowadays.

Well, that is just errant nonsense.

I didn't like Le Mis, but one-man shows are tricky.

I loved it.

It was much better than CATS.

I'm going to see it again and again.

My guy is getting tons of attention for his great performance

R273, so first with was Ansel Elgort tanking the movie, now it’s right wing trolls. Got it.

Anyone else want to step up and take the blame for Mr. S? Where oh where is John Landis when you need him!

Latinx!

[quote]Aren't they planning a remake of Fiddler?

Not anymore.

You people who claim this one is a flop because the original is so "beloved" are just showing your age.

It may be "beloved" by people over 70, but it is otherwise forgotten.

I know you will claim otherwise because that is difficult to hear as it speaks to your own fading relevance, but it is the truth.

The ones claiming that people who prefer the og version are out of touch oldsters are also the ones thinking young people would want to see this. They seem to be the ones really out of touch.

It's a BUTT CRUSHER!

It needed stars that appeal to young people to get young people.

Harry Styles and Ariana Grande.

[quoe]Also, DL is a bad place to try to get a feel for a movie or piece of entertainment these days because the trolls try to skew the perception and anything on their target list.

It has been that way here since day one. DL has always shit on anyone or anything that might be popular, successful, groundbreaking, enjoyable, beloved, interesting, etc. There is some innate need for gays to be cynical, negative and downright nasty towards everything.

I'm going to see WSS in a couple of hours. I've been looking forward to this as WSS is my favorite musical. I'm sure I'll enjoy it because I don't spend my entire existence looking for things to shit on.

According to the seat map when I purchased my tickets, there will be about 20 people in the theater. That doesn't seem like a lot. But for a 11:00 am showing on a Sunday morning, I'm surprised it's that many. I also saw House of Gucci this week and again there were only about 10-15 in the audience. That's the way it has been for every movie I've watched in a theater this year. Belfast, The French Dispatch, No Time To Die, Last Night in Soho, The Last Duel. All have had fewer than 30 people in the audience.

[quote]There were about 12 people in the audience. The whole place was a damn ghost town. How are you catching Covid in that environment?

Are you under the impression that covid is only transmitted in crowds, or that aerosol transmission doesn't occur?

I'm in my 70s, and I thought this new version of West Side Story was well worth seeing. It brought me joy to see something I've always loved so much, in a theatre in 2021. Do I like the original better? I don't know. Maybe. I just know I enjoyed this new version very, very much.

What I am quite sure of is that it might have been another five years before I looked at the original again. And I don't know if I have another five years. So thank you, SS and TK and all the stars (especially all those beautiful boys), for bringing this back to me for what may be the last time.

[quote]a BUTT CRUSHER!

Pics please.

[quote]I saw it yesterday. I thought it magnificent. But the ending was pure Spielberg shmaltz. He just can’t help himself.

What are you referring to specificalyl? The ending of the new WEST SIDE STORY is almost exactly the same as the original, which just some slightly rewritten lines and a couple of minor changes.

[quote]Oh and cutting away from dancing to bystander reactions was stupid. And of course he had to break to a gratuitous scene of pre adolescent kids dancing during America.

What's wrong with that? And why would things like that bother you?

[quote]Miss Saigon could be a better choice, it hasn't been filmed and it's much less shmaltzy than most musicals.

Really? I think it's far more schmaltzy than most musicals. Also a piece of crap as far as both the score and the libretto.

[quote]Don't blame the pandemic: Venom has made over $200M, Eternals and No Time to Die over $150M and Dune and Ghostbusters over $100M each.

All unvaccinated MAGA movies.

Gap did it better in Y2K!

Gap did it better in Y2K!

Gap did it better in Y2K!

R296 are Clifford the Big Red Dog, Jungle Cruise, Candyman, Encanto, Halloween Kills ...unvaccinated MAGA movies as well? They all did much better BO than WSS. Do you blame Trump for everything including the fact that you can't get laid?

Every time I read the thread title all I can think of it Angie Jordan and My Single Is Dropping.

R300, if those movies did much better at the box office than WSS, I'm sure a major reason for that has to do with the tragic dumbing-down of the American citizenry. So you should weep over the situation, rather than derive some sort of sick satisfaction from it.

R302 What sick satisfaction? From what? And why see the failure of a film at the BO as tragic?

R273 so do you think WSS did better BO in blue states?

R295 actually no. The ending was different.

West Side Story is seeing most of its business in the Broadway capital, New York City, with AMC Lincoln Square and Regal Empire on 42nd Street top performing locations. Box office analytics firm EntTelligence is reporting that NYC has double the occupancy rate of this weekend’s moviegoing national average. Eight hundred thousand have bought tickets to West Side Story so far, and 88% of the movie’s ticketholders are watching this two-hour and 36 minute running movie before 8PM. In the Upper West Side of Manhattan, tickets for West Side Story, per EntTelligence, ranged from over $12 to a high of $28 for those seeking a more immersive premium experience. So far, the average national ticket price offered has been $12.68, while NY movie lovers are paying an average of $16.87.

So people in NYC are flocking to it, but no one else is as interested. Are filmgoers in "flyover country" no longer interested in films taking place in or historically relevant to NY-LA? Does the antagonism that been building the past few years between the geopolitical regions now extend into entertainment habits. Is it that simple an explanation.

R306 many more theater queens in NY and simply more people as well as strict mandates for vaccines and masks.

I’m born and raised NY, and I always say I find it weird how almost every show and movie is in either LA or NYC. It’s very very strange to me.

R306 Tickets cost almost 3 X in NYC than most of the rest of the country. And WSS is a NY story.

The influx of Puerto Ricans to NYC in the late 1940s and 1950s inspired the story, as well as the white vs Mexican gangs happening out west in LA.

The creator combined it all.

[quote]I think its fine that they recasted

Oh, dear.

[quote]with latino actots

Actots? Like Shirley Temple and Margaret O'Brien?

[quote] I’m waiting for the remake of Gone with the Wind.

So am ah!

It's not the whole explanation, r307, but it's part of it.

Why is this thread greyed out? Is OP a known racist?

Has this killed his career? Are the MeToo allegations finally gonna come out?

He will be fine regardless. He’s from a wealthy family and a product of nepotism.

Did Spacey have Ansel during the filming of Baby Driver?

I meant Stevie, R317. It’s certain no one is hiring Ansel after this.

Ansel has already signed up to do other projects.

But don’t let a little thing like the truth distract you from you hate.

1) There was no appetite for a remake of what to many is an untouchable classic.

2) Recent musicals are all but certain flops at the box office, hence the reason Paramount opted not to move forward with Glenn Close in Sunset Boulevard.

3) The perception of this being another "woke" remake (right or wrongly) turns off about 50% of the US audience right there.

4) COVID resurgence is keeping people away from seeing movies at theaters.

5) Outside of the gays, no one is interested in this movie.

I want him in me, deeply.

[quote]an untouchable classic

Literally no such thing.

Elgort’s father is a fashion photographer who has worked for Vogue for many years, as well as many others.

His mother is a stage producer and opera director.

He is born and raised in NYC, like Timmy. They even both went to the same HS in Manhattan.

r207 No I think the newer musicals suffer from being too cool. They strive to not be corny or sincere, earnest. No one seems transported by the music, old musicals the actors gazed upward while singing and the look in their eye took you up with them into the place they were singing about. It would be interesting to see how it would go if those making musicals just decided to have fun and let the corny sincerity happen.

Schmigadoon! and the musical numbers in Crazy Ex Girlfriend are fun, joyful, silly and that is a welcome relief from everyone needing to be so fucking cool at all times. This cool shit is killing everything, dragging things down and hampering imagination.

Oh I found this video r324. I didn’t know they went to HS together. That’s cute.

Say what you want about Ansel, he’s a beautiful guy and ridiculously charming in interviews.

It’s a musical. Like every other musical released during the pandemic, it will flop

He said Rita Moreno was extremely flirtatious with him lol. Did she want some of that pinga?

R325 In what planet were the trailers of In the heights and WSS not a major earnest psa corn fest?

Does a very young man really find a 90 year old woman flirting with him flattering or just macabre.

Probably just funny r331

Drew Barrymore says there hasn’t been a revelation of a performance like Ansel’s since Brando in “On The Waterfront”

R249 or the idiotic Peter Travers

His monsterous cock tore her hymen. He needs to rally the girls (and maybe a few boys) who have partaken of it!

Elgort is a good looking and talented and wealthy young man. Like all straight men, he needs to be careful. You never know the motive of these young chicks

West Side Story is my favorite musical, but the original movie opened 60 years ago. Why would young people be interested in it? When I was 20, a 60 year old movie would be Birth Of A Nation.

More like the 1903 The Great Train Robbery.

It’s all woke! It’s woke. It’s WOKE people saying WOKE words. They’re using WOKE terms! It’s WOKE WOKE WOKE!

1. Most people don't know who Ansel Elgort is and the details of whatever his problems are are even more obscure.

2. In what sense is this "woke"?

3. Saying "I was reading the Facebook comments of the TMZ article" is something like a suicide note. Get help, dear.

r330 maybe to you they were corny. . .

I find Ansel Elgort utterly sexless.

He's plain. Nothing special. Like most of the guys I went to high school with.

I was ambivalent about watching this version of WSS, but I was pleasantly surprised at how good it is and how engaged I was throughout.

I watched the old version about a decade ago and enjoyed, but this version of the musical left the original film version behind. This version's main strengths are the supporting roles and the empathy Spielberg shows to each character. David Alvarez (Bernardo), Ariana DeBose (Anita), and Mike Faist (Riff) are beyond excellent. They are the whole package - good actors, singers, and exceptional dancers. Spierberg and Kushner went beyond the first film version's stereotypes about the characters - both Puerto Rican and White - and showed how and why each character felt and acted the way they did.

The Jets, who you want to hate because of their blatant racism and xenophobia, are shown to be that of course, but you see why. They are actually quite hearbreaking - White kids abandoned and neglected by their parents and society, building a family with each other, and terrified at losing their home and each other. There is a scene in this film version that precedes the "Cool Boy" song, where the Jets are playing in the rubble of a torn down building, and you realized these kids truly are boys and how destructive they are in their ignorance and misdirected hate.

The Puerto Rican characters are shown as working class men who are forced to defend themselves. The "I don't want to fight, but you know where to find me" kind of men. Bernardo and Chino are both given a lot of depth despite their few scenes. Ariana DeBose is a relevation and I hope she has a great career.

People can relax about some of the Spanish dialogue being in unsubtitled - there is very little Spanish in the film and what is there can easily be figured out if you're paying attention.

The main criticism I have is that the drama of the two leads somehow pales in relation to the drama happening between the the supporting characters. I'm not complaining about centering the supporting players, but when you watch scenes between Maria and Tony, you are anxious to get back to watching the other characters. You almost want the supporting characters to be the leads instead of Maria and Tony.

Despite that, Rachel Zegler is magnificent. She acted beautifully and her voice is clear as a bell. Ansel Elgort is ok. He's not bad, but he looks bad in comparison to the other actors. When he's dancing with Mike Faist, it's painfully obvious how superior the supporting cast is, and I mean all of the supporting players, not just the three I mentioned earlier. I wish they'd cast a better actor, but Elgort doesn't detract that much. To his credit, he does have a good singing voice.

If WSS is not doing well right now, I suspect it will do better in the next few weeks. I watched it because my partner wanted to see it, and he's been raving about it to everyone, so word of mouth will help. I also think a lot of people are waiting to see it during the holidays.

He’s better looking in person. He’s one of those who is better in person. The camera does him no favors. He’s actually very handsome and sweet.

Which PR firm do you work for 344?

And by PR I mean public relations.

R337, why have young people continued to flock to revival after revival of the stage show? WSS is a masterpiece, created by four of the geniuses of the theater.

I’m 38 and have been obsessed with the OBCR ever since I first heard it as a gayling. (Who here didn’t try to recreate Carol Lawrence’s pose on the album cover or dream of inhabiting Chita’s Anita during the Quintet?)

Why is the Company revival on Broadway right now? Caroline, Or Change? The Music Man (very shortly now)? Will these new productions best of the originals? Company is wonderful, but it doesn’t even best Doyle’s revival let alone the OBC and Tonya Pinkins IS Caroline, but we still go, celebrate these shows and derive some enjoyment from seeing them again.

R346 I don't work in PR, don't be silly. You and everyone else is welcome to dislike the film, it makes no difference to me. I just liked the film and thought I'd share why this forum.

***^^^*why in this forum.

R341 they certainly were but I am a pretty big cynic.

How will it do in China that's what I want to know. Without China the film will tank big time.

[quote] Ansel Elgort is ok. He's not bad, but he looks bad in comparison to the other actors.

One online reviewer put it this way: it's like the other actors are in Godfather 1 & 2, and Elgort is in Godfather 3.

Wtf are you people seeing? Look at his huge platypus nose and creepy smile. He's ugly.

"...Maria was quite wonderful. I loved her voice and her LOVELY RED BELT."

That is really all you need to know.

She looked adorable in that white dress and red belt.

Rita should have kept her big fat mouth shut.

I think people are just waiting for this to be on DVD as the original has been seen so many times

So while people won't rush to the theater to see this, they will download at home or buy the DVD out of curiously

This is not a movie people are going to line-up to watch.

R357 I said they should have released it to stream at the same time, it would do well on streaming.

R357 still thinks DVDs are a thing. Jesus Christ, dude, what fucking century are you living in??!

I'm waiting for the stream. Sorry, COVID. No desire to sit in a theater.

If I were a girl and he hit on me I’d be on that dick so fast. That’s just me.

R361 same.

R359 you’d be shocked how many people still buy Blu-ray or dvd.

Ansel’s career is over. He was hanging in there just for this film. They would have dumped him had the sex scandal dropped before filming. Now he’s over.

The sex scandal amounted to nothing. It didn’t hurt him at all.

He’s starring in an upcoming streaming series called Tokyo Vice.

Only on The DL is Lady Gaga not a big star.

Most people don’t know about it. The girl vanished from social media. No one knows what happened to her or if she was paid to stay quiet etc.

Hollywood is so unforgiving and has a very long memory.

R366 a big star by force. The general public is not interested in her but they’ll keep shoving her down our throats nonetheless. She’s fucking ugly, too. And now she’s into that annoying vocal fry. There’s nothing organic about her.

Huh, r369? Organic? Are you serious? Obviously you don’t like her, which is your right, but she’s a huge fucking star. You sound like you’re in total denial. Are you waiting for JFK Jr. to come back too?

Oh please. She hasn’t even had that many hits. She’s a celebrity for sure but as far as hits, it’s limited.

Had this movie been white militias and had a country-western soundtrack it would have been a huge success White people no longer watch anything ethnic or black. Things are getting worse, more polarized.

r372 who is to say only white people didn't watch this. And even if true, blame people like Spielberg and his moronic ramblings about not wanting to use subtitles for the spanish bits to "give power to the english".

Ugh why do people give attention to people like r372?

The idiot trying to insist Lady Gaga isn’t a star is just wrong. I’m not a fan, but it doesn’t stop me from acknowledging the fact that yeah, she’s a huge star.

What is wrong with you, r371? Seriously, what is wrong with you?

R375 the whole world laughed with him

In denial? As 371 points out she doesn’t have many hits ON HER OWN in over a decade. Nothing. She is forced on us. She can’t do anything on her own with success. Tony, Bradley, RedOne, Ronson(who actually wrote Shallow), the more popular Ariana. She’s a gimmick. Yeah, she’s a star but by sheer force meaning forcing herself on a public who yawns at her. She’s not popular. There are dozens of other singers who have eclipsed her with ease. And bitch will never be a movie star. Oh they’ll try but she’s too ugly, too limited, and lacks star quality.

Her and Katy Perry started at the same time, just a few months apart, like Britney and Christina did. Katy eclipsed her with hits.

Ansel is sexy. I wouldn’t say shit if I were a girl and got that big D.

R377 = Madonna

Katy Perry vs GaGa Hot 100.

Perry crushes her.

. Just because you don’t like her doesn’t change the facts. Gaga is a huge international star. Geez I’m ambivalent but I’m not in denial.

Yeah, Bradley Cooper is why Shallow was such a huge hit, R377. Sure Jan.

Honestly, hate Gaga all you want but please do so in a way that makes sense.

(R378, Perry has more number one singles, Gaga has more top tens. Gaga has sold millions of more albums. Both have had very successful careers. Just an FYI.)

I wonder if the producers of the film would have a defamation & damages lawsuit claim against the "accuser" for unleashing this social media storm - thereby profoundly effecting ticket sales - based on the unfounded/unvetted/unproven nature of her claims.

R383 Perry outsold GaGa by millions in singles.

14 Top 10 (9 of them #1) vs 16 Top 10 (5 of them #1)

The numbers don’t lie. Not to mention Katy’s #1s and Top 10s tended to stay on the charts longer.

Another article

Basically, Spielberg released the movie a few weeks before Christmas instead of on Christmas (when adults tend to go to the movies) hoping word of mouth would help the film grow an audience, but some feel that may backfire and he just set himself up for failure.

The Gaga loons are triggered the cunt isn’t that popular.

Perry has far far more legit hits than gags songs which briefly hit the top ten then quickly fell into oblivion.

Relevance to WSS?

What the fuck does Gaga have to do with WSS?

Shut the fuck up all of you.

Video of Ansel and his ex Kevin Spacey flirting off script.....You are a victim or a participant and people like Ansel and Tom D. decided to be participants....TRASH..

R305, since you obviously THINK you know what you're talking about, please explain to us how you THINK the ending of the new WEST SIDE STORY is different from the original ending.

For the rest of you -- SPOILERS AHEAD, arguably -- the new ending is almost exactly the same as the old, except that some of the lines in Maria's speech are modified. Also, instead of carrying Tony's body off screen, the Jets and Sharks carry it into Doc's, and instead of Officer Krupke leading Chino into custody, he's led to the cop car by Rita Moreno's character, Valentina.

[quote] The sex scandal amounted to nothing. It didn’t hurt him at all.

Because they put him into hiding. The industry knows. They won’t gamble on him again.

Oh, god, Madonnabot is with us. Let it go, hag. Gaga beat you. Drop dead, boring cunt.

The movie is receiving good to excellent reviews. (And I mean from legitimate sources.) It seems like maybe the marketing strategy is faulty…or, as many have said here, people aren’t interested in musicals or musical remakes. But I don’t think the reason it’s not making money is because it’s supposedly too “woke” (it isn’t) or that it’s a bad movie.

R393, the sex scandal was a year and a half ago. To show you how little impact it’s had, this thread is the first time I even read about it. And he is the lead in a new show, so I don’t what the industry is hiding. I’m following the thread because I’m a fan of the original movie btw.

The good reviews are surprising.

It's not good.

It’s COVID. Everything is underperforming during these times. People don’t want to go to the theater anymore. Besides, every movie theater in my city has closed down.

I’m 36. Never saw the original and not sure about this one.

I told my mother about the new WSS ( she saw the original Broadway show and the 1961 movie when it came out) and the first thing she asked me was where she could stream it. I told her it was only in theaters, and she said she’ll probably wait to see it on streaming. She fears going out to a movie while Covid is still around.

And IMHO therein lies the problem.

Clearly, Lady Gaga should've played Maria.

[quote]The good reviews are surprising. It's not good.

Says R396, with the certainty of a fool.

R397 not true. Many films have done well, very well. The main issue is the films. They suck. There isn’t one fucking film worth a damn.

R396, in your opinion.

No honey, it's really not good.

I’ve seen it; I thought it was great.

I am the Earth Mother, and it's a flop!

Rita Moreno really needs to give it a rest. Sit down Granny. We get it---you were around 75 years ago for the original.

So, R385 exactly what I said: Katy has more number ones, Gaga more top 10s. No idea how long their respective songs stay(ed) on the charts. Both of their biggest hits are super well known, I assume.

Anyway, who cares...

I adored De Bose who I thought was just amazing. And the lead girl has a beautiful voice.

And the lead boy has a hot ass.

Yes, he does. He is beautiful. Marlon Brando quality but not as pretty

It's reall unfair a random hook up pissed on his chance to get huge. He is very handsome. Yes, he seems like a snobby, cocky privileged white boy. But he has that something.

R323 Untouchable classics: Some Like It Hot, Sunset Boulevard, North by Northwest, Rosemary's Baby. The Miracle Worker . . .

Only for small-minded, limited people.

Ironically, Moreno in recent interviews talked about how she felt that the original WSS was not going to be a success and said so to her costar George Chakiris.

Rita moreno will never be president

R408 obviously you do Gaga loon. Stfu

R391 Mary you know Ansel is too old for Miss Kevin.

I saw it today. Loved it.

Just saw it in Chelsea (plenty of people there!) and I really, really loved it. Tony Kushner proves his genius once again and deserves so much praise for making this a success. Sorry, Arthur, but your book stinks in comparison.

They do leave in several of the film changes. America is sung with Bernardo and the men and although I would have loved to see the original restored, it’s so thrillingly filmed and performed that the audience burst into applause when it was over.

Gee Officer Krupke is performed before the rumble, which I kind of get, but I think it’s more effective post rumble.

Cool is before the rumble and I Feel Pretty immediately follows the fight.

No spoilers, but I loved the new concept for One Hand, One Heart, a number that I’ve seen fall flat on stage. Here it’s touching and beautifully shot.

Enough can’t be said about Riff, Anita and Bernardo. Yes, Kushner fleshed them out, but the actors brought so much to the roles.

The Somewhere ballet has been cut (!), but a piece of the music has been retained and played while New York wakes up Maria gets ready one morning.

Overall it’s excellent and would only have been made perfect by a cameo from Chita. Would Rita not share the film with her? She stole the role after all; it’s the least she could have done.

I loved the guy the played Riff too. He was wonderful

Someone upthread mentioned DVD/Blu-ray editions.

I'm in my 50s and haven't had either for over 10yrs. My 82 year old Mother still has one to stream HEVC from USB..

About time that hack started flopping.

R423 He’s been flopping for a while?

Please feel free to share any of the genius work you’ve created or even something others have done that you hold dear that doesn’t star Bea Arthur and Betty White.

R425 Bitch why are you white knighting for Spielberg?

Is it true that the word "gay" is cut out of " I Feel Pretty"?

I believe there was a lyric change in I Feel Pretty.

They definitely used the movie lyrics changes for Officer Krupke rather than the stage lyrics.

Overall though it’s very faithful. Nothing (besides the ballet) has been totally cut and there aren’t any new songs/interpolations into the score. You just know some other director would have plopped Lonely Town in there for Tony if he or she has the chance.

Um the movie is really fucking good. How is he flopping here?

R429 at the BO obviously as mentioned in a number of reports. $10M puts it between Dear Evan Hansen and In the Heights respective opening weekends.

BO is such an unfortunate abbreviation for Box Office.

For those that have seen this, can you tell me your opinion of the youngest age that it would be appropriate to see?

Is it too racy for any certain age?

R431 and BO does seem appropriate when talking about flops

[quote] Um the movie is really fucking good. How is he flopping here?

Gee, do you think anyone potentially discussed that in the 428 posts that preceded yours??

R432, the attempted rape might be too much for a young child, but 12/13 seems a reasonable age to show the film.

They have a trans thing thrown in there. But if you are a normal person it's as totally appropriate for any age as the original.

Let's hope Spielberg learns that it's hubris to remake beloved, widely known and available film classics. Some films are the confluence of the right people coming together at the right time. Would anyone want to see such untouchable films as Goodfellas, Night of the Living Dead or The Wizard of Oz remade? That dreadful TV version of Rosemary's Baby demonstrated that the people responsible for it didn't understand what made the original so effective?

Omg. Did someone try to remake Rosemary's Baby? WHAT?

[quote]I believe there was a lyric change in I Feel Pretty.

The lyric in the original Broadway production was "I feel pretty and witty and bright, and I pity any girl who isn't me tonight." In the 1961 movie, because the position of the song was shifted, that was changed to "I feel pretty and witty and gay, and I pity any girl who isn't me today." (This was not a problem in 1961, as gay did not yet have that other meaning, at least not as far as the general public was concerned.) For the new movie, because the position of the song has been shifted back to nighttime, the original stage lyric is used.

[quote]They definitely used the movie lyrics changes for Officer Krupke rather than the stage lyrics.

No, they DEFINITELY do not.

P.S. I just listened to the soundtrack of "The Jet Song" from the new movie, and I would swear all of the guys sing "every last fuckin' gang on the whole fuckin' street" rather than substituting "buggin'" for "fuckin'." Give a listen and see what you all think.

"I know. Let's keep making expensive films for the Latino audience and then have them NOT SHOW UP yet again. Same as at the voting booths. Makes sense to me."

The most surprising thing I learned here is that Rex Reed is still alive.

R439, I saw it earlier today. At first, I thought they might have sung "every last fuckin' gang", but I'm pretty sure they sung "on the whole buggin' street". Having just listened to track on Spotify, I'm pretty sure that's the way it is: "fuckin'" in the first phrase and "buggin'" in the second.

R438 Yes, a two-part 2014 NBC miniseries spread out over 4 hours starring Zoe Saldana. It was set in Paris and the Castavettes were a relatively young hip couple. In this version they showed the baby whose only distinguishing feature was abnormally bright, blue eyes. Otherwise, Adrian was a normally formed infant.

R440 They show up if they aren’t crappy musicals, as has been proven time and time again.

They show up for "Fast and Furious"and good for them. So stop with all the victim woke shit, not even THEY are interested.

R372 Yeah that's why films like Shang-Chi and Black Panther were such huge box office successes.

Tonight! Tonight! I’ll get that pint sized harlot TONIGHT!!!

Whether or not we like it, R372 speaks the truth. If Black Panther was released in today's environment, there's no way it would have become the same cultural phenomenon. It would have made money, for sure, but it definitely would not have reached the same levels, Covid or no Covid.

There are no more expensively-made, predominantly Latino or black (non-superhero) movies coming up anyway and it will be years before any more are made. White people will not go see any film with a predominantly non-white casts, They won't even watch them on cable.

Look at the online responses to Kyle Smith's New Republic article about West Side Story's flop to get a better understanding of life outside Datalounge.com.

[quote] The rubble of apartment buildings being demolished and the wrecking balls poised to continue that work and the pan overhead leading us into the neighborhood.

Thank you, R85. The film 'came in like a wrecking ball!'

R448 Um Black Panther was only released two years ago (at the height of Trump era) and Shang-Chi is 2021's highest grossing movie by far. Now, yes there is backlash to the perceived "wokeness" of Hollywood there is no way to deny that, but I don't buy the idea that white people are not going to see diverse films is untrue.

West Side Story is a flop because musicals have been bombing at the box office for several years now, and it was a remake no one really wanted.

Non-American rolling is eyes at how virtually every discussion among Americans on DL starts talking about race!

[quote] It’s COVID. Everything is underperforming during these times.

Not true.

White people have, for the most part, no problems in diverse casts. But preachy wokeness is another thing. It's like feminists that complain that men have a problem seeing films with women in power, meanwhile the Alien trilogy, The Terminator trilogy, Lare Croft, etc were huge sucesses because they weren't trying to ram an ideology down their throats and concentrated on making a kick ass movie.

R448, you mean The National Review.

R450, Black Panther was released nearly 5 years ago in Feburary 2018. Not 2 years ago. While the Shang-Chi movie did well for the Covid era, it had absolutely none of the cultural impact of Black Panther. Chadwick Boseman became a household name. Very few can tell you the name of the lead starring in Shang-Chi.

And yes thanks r454! I meant the National Review, not the New Republic. It's essential reading.

R333 is there anyone more obsequious than Drew.

Ansel had all the charm and allure of a plain baked potato.

Maybe people are waiting to see it at home in order to have Closed Captioning turned on so they will know what is being said in Spanish. Spielberg had the dumbest comments about not having subtitles. No, Spielberg, non-Spanish speakers honor the Spanish being spoken in the film because it is important. We want to know what is being said!

R458 It deserves to flop.

I find Ansel really creepy. His height is a distraction. He looks like a mutant.

The girl is cute but I can't stand the wrong proportions in the skirt and sweater she is wearing while standing next to Ansel in the promo photo. It makes her body look like she has a really long, strange torso. She deserved a better costume for that scene.

[quote]His height is a distraction. He looks like a mutant.

But that's the what the movie is missing for today's low IQ audiences: superheroes. Marvel should have made it!

It went overboard on the "preachy wokeness". It's too bad Spielberg felt the audience was so dense that everyone needed for him to beat the message into the ground. It sucked all the energy out of the piece.

R455 2018 was 5 years ago? You’re truly mentally ill and keep proving us right with each thing you post. You should sign off the internet and seek the help you need.

Also, this wasn’t a film “for Latinos”. Wtf.

I’m curious to see it, but won’t spend theater prices to see it. Like probably everyone else who’ll wait to rent it at home.

WSS is a dreary affair, at best. Bernstein's work is suffused with his genius, but we haven't been able to escape it for a day since 1957. Every classical radio station plays a West Side Story dance suite every day. I never need to hear this music again. And without Jermone Robbins? No. Just no. Not interested.

Shakespeare did it better.

R452

But it IS true. No film is getting the numbers they would’ve gotten pre-pandemic. It’s also ignoring that MANY theaters have closed down permanently nationwide recently. You COVID deniers are ignoring reality.

The only ones that have made huge numbers are the Marvel movies, James Bond, and Fast & the Furious. All action films which are not anywhere near the genre of West Side Story. And even then, all of these films did suffer huge losses due to the pandemic.

What really matters these days is the streaming numbers, and it will continue to move more that way as the years go by.

R465, dreary?! WSS?

It’s a thrill ride from start to finish. Yes, we’ve heard the music an awful lot, but the score has more than stood the test of time and the drama is just as potent now as it was then.

If anything, by allowing New York to actually be a character in this new adaptation, it has given the story a specificity that allows it to breathe new life. It’s hard to imagine something this exhilarating to be labeled as “dreary.”

Zoomers hate musicals in general, film or theater. It's a data that comes up every marketing research I come across.

R442, listen again!

[quote]Maybe people are waiting to see it at home in order to have Closed Captioning turned on so they will know what is being said in Spanish. Spielberg had the dumbest comments about not having subtitles

And it sure didn't help that some fool posters have given the impression that the movie contains tons of untranslated Spanish dialogue, whereas in reality it's probably a total of about 20 lines sprinkled throughout. The only line I really missed understanding is whatever Anita screams at Valentina after the attempted rape.

r470, it's much more than 20 lines; about 30 to 40 percent of the dialogue between the Sharks and their girls is un-subtitled Spanish. It's clear there are more than basic narrative sentences being said, statements that might provide more color to the characterizations, which audiences that don't speak Spanish won't get. And, ironically, Spielberg IS raising the superiority of English in a global world by not subtitling the Spanish -- are there subtitles for the English but not the Spanish when the movie is released in France? In Germany? In China?

R471, I guess my estimate of the amount of Spanish is lower than yours, but also, there aren't that many scenes involving just the Puerto Ricans among themselves, so "30 to 40 percent of the dialogue between the Sharks and their girls" is probably not much more than 20 lines.

Nevertheless, I agree that the Spanish lines should have subtitled.

r467, I agree with the dreary comment about this new film.

The 1961 film has an electric narrative momentum that never relents; the new film gets bogged down in, yes, dreary declamations about how shitty life is for these people. So when they burst into song, it doesn't feel genuine, like the songs are being shoe-horned into the story where ever they can fit. Indeed, far too many of the songs -- especially "Gee, Officer Krupke" and "Cool," and even "America" and "I Feel Pretty" -- could be removed from the new film without disrupting the story at all.

As for recreation of New York -- yes, impressive, but at the same time, it feels like a sentimental recreation of the past, a fantasy New York. One of the brilliant devices of the 1961 film is the opening overhead shots of NYC, moving across Manhattan before zeroing in on the Jets in the playground. Robbins and Wise do more in a 2 and a half minute montage to establish NYC as an integral character than Spielberg does in 2 and a half hours.

R471, the German and French releases of US films are always dubbed. I’ll be curious to know if they dub the Spanish dialogue, too. I’ll be seeing it soon in the Netherlands where they only use dubbing for animated films. I’ll let you know if they use subtitles for the Spanish dialogue, too.

There is like 5% Spanish in this.

[quote]The 1961 film has an electric narrative momentum that never relents; the new film gets bogged down in, yes, dreary declamations about how shitty life is for these people. So when they burst into song, it doesn't feel genuine, like the songs are being shoe-horned into the story where ever they can fit. Indeed, far too many of the songs -- especially "Gee, Officer Krupke" and "Cool," and even "America" and "I Feel Pretty" -- could be removed from the new film without disrupting the story at all.

This is the sort of comment that may seem intelligent on first reading but, in my opinion, is really just blather that makes no sense. All of the songs you mentioned could just as well be removed from the original film "without disrupting the story at all," but of course, that film (or this one) would be much, much poorer for doing so.

[quote]As for recreation of New York -- yes, impressive, but at the same time, it feels like a sentimental recreation of the past, a fantasy New York. One of the brilliant devices of the 1961 film is the opening overhead shots of NYC, moving across Manhattan before zeroing in on the Jets in the playground. Robbins and Wise do more in a 2 and a half minute montage to establish NYC as an integral character than Spielberg does in 2 and a half hours.

First of all, they couldn't recreate that helicopter pan over Manhattan island in the new film even if they wanted to, for obvious reasons. And are you really saying you think those opening shots of tenements and other old building being demolished into rubble to clear the site for the creation of Lincoln Center is a "sentimental recreation of the past?" What an odd comment.

They were literally tearing down buildings around the cast and crew while filming the original…

You could argue that showing the tearing down of the west side for Lincoln Center as shown in the new film, including close-ups of the wrecking balls, signals that the Spielberg-Kushner film will be a literal post-modern deconstruction of WSS.

You obviously haven’t seen the film, R474. Around 30% of the dialogue is in Spanish.

[quote]I think its fine that they recasted with...

You know what's not fine.....

I’m going to see it this weekend which is a big deal for me since I avoid crowded indoor spaces. I think they should have released it for streaming for those that want to watch it without having their health. I’m sure this is really hurting the sales figures.

R466 but so many films that didn't have the hype of WSS have done far better at the box office: CLIFFORD THE BIG RED DOG, CANDY MAN, JUNGLE CRUISE, HALLOWEEN KILLS, ENCANTO, GHOSTBUSTERS AFTERLIFE, ETERNALS, DUNE, VENOM, BLAVK WIDOW, A QUIET PLACE II, THE CONJURING ...

Gonna see it, but I can wait.

R479 do you have a link? People just make stuff up here left and right these days.

Especially around entertainment. They can’t just give a straight review without dragging some agenda into it.

Can we get any straight facts anymore about entertainment. I wish the trolls would leave Hollywood alone.

He’s making it up, r484.

R429, the fact that you can barely write a complete sentence, explains why you thought it was good.

""West Side Story" did manage to top the box office this weekend domestically, taking in $10.5 million. That is the only good news, and quite frankly that's bad news overall, as it means it was another very quiet weekend for moviegoers. To illustrate how rough it was for the musical, Disney's "Encanto," an animated musical not based on any previously existing IP, came in second place with $9.4 million in its third weekend. And, to further drive home the point, "West Side Story" was playing in more than 3,700 theaters, whereas "Encanto" was on about 2,500. Ouch."

R468 is correct. All the zoomers know is RAP, which ain't music. It's talking to music.

OP, you're full of shit.

It's also bombing in the foreign markets:

In its debut session at the international box office, however, the Steven Spielberg-directed version of the classic musical landed well below expectations. In 37 material markets, which include six majors, WSS grossed $4.4M — far under the low end of the projected range coming into the session. The global total through Sunday is $15M. In IMAX, WSS delivered $1.3M globally.

R486 Encanto a Colombian based movie has grossed over 70 million domestically in just 3 weeks. Some sad LSA queen upthread r440 says latinos don’t support latin themed movies??

Latino is a useless construct of differing peoples as the Democrats keep failing to understand.

R467 = Out of touch Elder-eldergay.

R325 Too cool?

All the recent musicals I’ve seen were not cool at all.

Is this cool?

r207 Yeah, you can take a break now from your concepts about entertainment business issues. Just enjoy what's produced for you.

The Greatest Showman grosses probably shocked the hell out of Lionsgate, a studio that isn't really a studio and has basically coasted on Saw and The Hunger Games. The $175 domestic gross was probably 3x what they expected. I have no idea what the financing looked like but many of Lionsgate's movies are barely financed by them. They are the American distribution part of an international finance deal. They step in when every studio has passed and often contribute nothing but the cost of advertising and distribution of the film. (American distribution is what triggers a lot of international financing deals. The internationals say for example "we'll give you $10 million once you secure an American distributor").

Also, no movie in the past 40 years has performed as well as Greatest Showman in terms of week to week after a wide release. It kept going up. It kept selling more tickets. And it started in a huge hole because it opened at $6 million opening weekend. Its not like Titanic where the seats were sold out and it kept going. But Titanic is the only thing similar to Greatest Showman's box office performance.

PS I hated this movie. Its a geniuine piece of shit with some good musical numbers. Couldn't finish it.

Saw it the other night and thoroughly enjoyed it. I thought Elgort did fine, although he was definitely outshined by other performances. I am apparently the odd man out with this opinion, but I thought Moreno, as the Doc character, was just silly and clunky. She was a fabulous performer in her youth, but she just sucked in this version. And her acting just didn't convey the anger and frustration that character is supposed to have towards the Jets and their horrible attitudes and beliefs. Plus, it didn't really make any sense for the Jets to be so xenophobic to PRs, but accepting of her ( I believe the script attempted to explain this anomaly but don't recall what the resolution was). It wad stunt casting that just fell flat.

I also really disliked the film's staging of cool as some fight over a gun. In both the musical and the '61 film, it's a large production number for the Jets and their girlfriends that is supposed to be a vent of their frustrations. This version was half-dance/half-fighting. The deteriorating pier set added a fun element, but the small scale number just didn't have the effect I wanted.

However, Dance at the Gym, America, et al. were very well done, although I also thought the scene of the children dancing in America was too "Spielberg-y" and gimmicky. But I generally don't like it when kids sing and dance. Another weird thing I found out was that the young girl dancer from Sia's Chandelier music video was one of the dancers. Don't recall who she was but thought it interesting.

I saw it and loved it. It's thrilling. The movie gallops along and you don't realize it's almost 3 hours.

I have no idea how you can stuff "wokeness" into this. There's almost no change to the plot. The only issue I could maybe see is you want white people cast a Puerto Ricans?

[quote]People just make stuff up here left and right these days.

Yes. For example, the statement that around 30 percent of the movie's dialogue is in Spanish. It's much less than that, even if we're only counting the spoken dialogue and not the lyrics, all of which are in English.

[quote]I am apparently the odd man out with this opinion, but I thought Moreno, as the Doc character, was just silly and clunky. She was a fabulous performer in her youth, but she just sucked in this version. And her acting just didn't convey the anger and frustration that character is supposed to have towards the Jets and their horrible attitudes and beliefs. Plus, it didn't really make any sense for the Jets to be so xenophobic to PRs, but accepting of her ( I believe the script attempted to explain this anomaly but don't recall what the resolution was).

I think we're supposed to feel that the Jets accept Valentina because she's an old lady who has been a part of the neighborhood for decades, and she was married to a white guy. I think the Jets' hatred is focused on young Puerto Rican males, whom they perceive as infringing on "their territory." Also, of course, the gangs have set themselves up as factions warring against each other. I don't think the Jets would bother to go after young Puerto Rican men, or the Sharks after young white guys, who were not gang members.

R394 says new ending is almost exactly the same as the old one, proceeds to tell us all the ways the new ending differs from the old one.

Valentina has been in those boys lives since they were born. She says that she knew them their whole lives and watched them grow to be criminals and rapists.

They don’t view her as Puerto Rican because she was in their lives for as long as they can remember, and was married to a white guy, so she’s “American” aka white to them.

They have hate and contempt for all Puerto Ricans. It’s not just the males either. The Anita scene is proof of that.

R499, I guess you typed the wrong number, but where does anyone in this thread tell us "all the ways the new ending differs from the old one?" That would be a neat trick, as the two endings are very similar, different only in minor details.

This ending didn’t have that punch the original did. This one fell flat.

R448, that's, in part, our fault on the left.

Liberals used to find high value in seeking a world that was as colorblind as possible. (Of course, that's not ever a reality. But it was our goal.) I always made every attempt to learn about different cultures in terms of film, lit, etc. I LOVE doing that still.

But things have changed of late.

Everything is so much more segregated now than any time in my life. And it's NOT just the conservatives who are doing the segregating. Which makes things very confusing for me, to be honest. Frankly, I don't know if it's a good thing or a bad thing. But it a thing, that's for sure.

White people are only allowed to follow, dress like, quote etc., other white people. Everything is possibly racist now, even from well intended white liberals trying to learn or be a part of a culture that isn't white.

I don't know if I'm allowed to watch a movie aimed for a latin audience. I mean that seriously. I try to be respectful and do what's right. But that's changing every minute! I know I can't comment or critique music or film that isn't "for" me. That's for sure. So why watch it?

Again, maybe this isn't a bad thing? I don't know.

R486 Encanto made $71.9M in 3 weeks and took in $10M this past weekend scarcely less than WSS's $10.6M. Encanto made $40M in its first weekend. Maybe they should have remade WSS as an animated film. So much cheaper to produce too.

R501

[quote]R305since you obviously THINK you know what you're talking about, please explain to us how you THINK the ending of the new WEST SIDE STORY is different from the original ending. For the rest of you -- SPOILERS AHEAD, arguably -- the new ending is almost exactly the same as the old, except that some of the lines in Maria's speech are modified. Also, instead of carrying Tony's body off screen, the Jets and Sharks carry it into Doc's, and instead of Officer Krupke leading Chino into custody, he's led to the cop car by Rita Moreno's character, Valentina.

R305 since you obviously THINK you know what you're talking about, please explain to us how you THINK the ending of the new WEST SIDE STORY is different from the original ending.

For the rest of you -- SPOILERS AHEAD, arguably -- the new ending is almost exactly the same as the old, except that some of the lines in Maria's speech are modified. Also, instead of carrying Tony's body off screen, the Jets and Sharks carry it into Doc's, and instead of Officer Krupke leading Chino into custody, he's led to the cop car by Rita Moreno's character, Valentina.

So, R505, I guess the issue here is that I consider the changes in the ending to be very minor, and you don't.

To me, it's basically the same ending in both: Chino guns down Tony, and the Jets and Sharks come running on. Maria says goodbye to Tony as he dies in her arms. Then she takes the gun from Chino and points it at the Jets and the Sharks, saying that now she too can kill because now she has hate in her heart. Then the Jets carry off Tony's body, with help from some the Sharks, and Chino is led off into custody as the orchestra plays a very soft, sad, and somewhat dissonant version of "Somewhere."

Rita Moreno as Valentina being there is a big change. And it happens near Doc’s store not at a basketball court which was the setting in the 1961 version

[quote]I don't know if I'm allowed to watch a movie aimed for a latin audience. I mean that seriously. I try to be respectful and do what's right. But that's changing every minute! I know I can't comment or critique music or film that isn't "for" me. That's for sure. So why watch it?

Go watch WSS in peace. No one, not one soul, is going to stop you. You'll be in an audience of with people of different races, White people included. This movie is for everyone. It's not specifically for a Latino audience.

[quote]Rita Moreno as Valentina being there is a big change. And it happens near Doc’s store not at a basketball court which was the setting in the 1961 version

I don't consider those big changes, especially not the change from the playground to the street. And yes, Rita as Valentina is in the scene, but I don't think she says anything in it, though she does take Chino by the hand and leads him to the cop car, rather than Krupke doing so, which is what happens in the original film.

None of those changes are of any significance, R507. You might as well also point out that in the new version that Chino was wearing glasses, Maria was wearing a blue dress instead of a red one and was carrying a suitcase, and Baby John didn't place a scarf on Maria's head. Those details are about as significant to the story as the ones you mentioned.

By the way, Doc is in the original final scene. Since Valentina is his proxy in the new version, her being there is no different.

Thanks, R510. I forget that Doc is in the final scene of the original film, though the focus is not on him at all.

I used to get really emotional over the 1961 movie as a kid. It was so progressive and eloquent in the way it talked about what we then called prejudice. And so heartbreakingly idealistic, dissonant notes and all. It was a work of art that was authentically fresh and new for its time, and still has that energy. It didn't need remaking, except to correct what some think needed correcting, a very trendy concept in society today overall, but one that's getting to be a turnoff to a lot of people. I won't bother seeing this WSS, but from the clips I've watched, there does seem to be a lovely, talented young woman emerging from it, and with luck she'll find some other good roles. And if it's truly a flop, maybe we'll start seeing some fucking originality from Hollywood, or at least a slight turn away from remakes. Dream up some new works, ffs!

[quote] that's, in part, our fault on the left.

Anytime someone says “our fault on the left” or “we liberals,” or some such, you can be sure they aren’t actually “on the left.”

[quote] we'll start seeing some fucking originality from Hollywood, or at least a slight turn away from remakes. Dream up some new works, ffs!

Remakes aren’t the problem, there aren’t that many of them. The problem is all the super hero movies. They’re all shit but make a fortune and it’s all the studios want to make.

Shop and compare!

Except I very much am on the left and very much am a liberal, R513. I would happily prove it to you if that was possible.

Might it be better to see if you glean anything from what I wrote other than you thinking I'm something I'm not?

[quote]Valentina has been in those boys

Pics please.

R514 I’m thinking of tv too.

You all do know that the 1961 movie was a version of a Broadway musical? Which itself was a version of "Romeo and Juliet", right?

All this talk of remaking classics is confusing.

I love the 61 WSS. Still do.

WSS 2021 is thrilling. I'm going back to see it on the super screen before Spider-Man comes in like a tsunami, washing away every other film and the popcorn, too.

One can appreciate both, but even in my little kid eyes watching the 61 film annually when "event" TV still existed in 60s and 70s, I could see how dated and problematic it is with its make-up and casting.

Spielberg's WSS 2021, to use a cliched word, is a triumph. He has earns every accolade already offered in the reviews and reactions. The proof of that is right before your eyes and ears watching WSS 2021.

Still, the "he can even direct a musical, too!" gush is absent an acknowledgment that I'll make now. He already, before the first day of filming, was on 3rd base without swinging the bat.

Bernstein, Sondheim, Robbins and Laurents shoulders have Spielberg's footprints on them.

It's because that genre is dying.

R154 Gucci is currently at $40M and is still playing in 3,400+ theaters. Will WSS catch up! LMAO!

I watched it. The boy isn’t good - no emotion in his singing. The real problem with it is how dated the piece is. It reminds me of the female Company now on BroadwY. It works with a female Bobbi yet everything else in it is old fashioned.. Museum pieces

R512, I sort of understand your perspective, but why not see the new WSS anyway? It's not going to erase your memories of the first one, and of course, you can re-watch the first one whenever you want via home video. You'll probably even have chances to see it again in a movie theater, as it was recently brought back for a Fathom event.

R523, maybe these really are dated museum pieces, as you say -- or MAYBE the problem is that you're so small-minded and ignorant that you can't appreciate a play or movie set in a previous time, even if it's generally considered a classic. I'm going to go with the second theory.

No, R523 is looking for more cutting-edge theater like "SIX" or "...AND JULIET."

It's a shame, because it's really, really good. And I wasn't looking forward to it at all. Too bad so many posters want to revel in it's failure. It doesn't bode well for any future musicals in the works.

I find it funny that people mock superhero films when West Side Story is a laughable superhero movie written by a white guy about people he knew nothing about. This camp fest is closer to Marvel than you think.

A NOVEL??!!! My sister wrote a NOVEL!!!!

I just saw it. It was good, and I usually dislike musicals. None of my friends wanted to see it though, and some have never heard of it. I was the youngest person in the theater by far

R519 A film adaptation of a Broadway musical is not a remake. An original musical loosely inspired by Shakespeare is not a remake. Spielberg's film is a remake. But "you do know that, right?"

When is the WICKED film scheduled for release? Christmas 2022?

That will be the test whether the live-action film musical is truly dead.

R531, It's being filmed this summer in London, so it will probably be released Christmas 2023. Wicked has music that appeals to contemporary musical tastes and it has a cult-like following, so I think it will do very well. Oz the Great and Powerful made $500 million worldwide a few years ago.

"Wicked" made its debut in 2003, which means it's almost 20 years old. I admit, that qualifies as "contemporary" in DL terms, but to normal people, that's some old shit.

[quote]Too bad so many posters want to revel in it's failure. It doesn't bode well for any future musicals in the works.

Indeed. Very sad, and a very twisted response.

[quote]I find it funny that people mock superhero films when West Side Story is a laughable superhero movie written by a white guy about people he knew nothing about. This camp fest is closer to Marvel than you think.

Step away from the hallucinogens. Oops, too late.....

[quote]WSS 2021 is thrilling. I'm going back to see it on the super screen before Spider-Man comes in like a tsunami, washing away every other film and the popcorn, too.

What's a super screen?

Btw, did Sondheim have any input into this version?

It's interesting that they cast Rita Moreno as the "doc" character because at the time she was in the movie, many people thought the part should have been cast with Chita Rivera from the Broadway show, who was actually a brilliant dancer, etc.

R512 You write so thoughtfully about how the first film version affected and inspired you. Don't deny yourself the pleasure of seeing the 2021 film version. I honestly think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

R535, I should have written the Super-size screen. Marcus pretty much operates all the first run films in my region.

They have at 8 screens under one roof and they reserve, for a higher admission fee, of course, some showings the larger screens.

I understood the lyrics better in this version.

Although there are tons of commenters who claim that the "I feel pretty" dilemma was solved here (as in would a new immigrant who has trouble with English really say "It's alarming how charming I feel"?). I don't think it was particularly solved here. It would have been better if she had been daydreaming about saying those words--then it's as if she said them in Spanish, her native language.

Spider-Man No Way Home is bumping WSS of the large screens and onto the smaller theatre screens.

I just read that Disney and theatres entered a contract which requires them to show WSS through the holidays and into the néw year even if the showings are empty of people watching.

Such is the power of Disney which owns 20th Century Fox.

Why are Latinos STILL angry about this movie? Please explain.

It's wonderful but watching gang members dance in the streets is still a hard sell.

I found the Anita characters less enthralling here. Moreno played her as more calculating. I liked that.

OP? A lot of us would've given our eye-teeth to lose our virginity to big-dicked Ansel Elgort, even if we did cry all the way through it! I mean, how long did he last?

Watch Moreno in the original during the America scene. She really lives it every moment. Her facial expressions are so strong and so in the character.

[quote]I found the Anita characters less enthralling here. Moreno played her as more calculating. I liked that.

More calculating? I don't see that at all. Can you explain? Do you mean the moment when she lies about Chino having killed Maria? I would say that maybe Moreno played that scene with more edge (and I think that really helped win her the Oscar), but I wouldn't use the word "calculating."

R545, Moreno's Anita seemed more mature and suspicious--less happy-go-luck, like the recent Anita. Hard to explain, but you see it on Moreno's face. The scene in doc's store was more real in the original because she's just pissed off at the world.

R546, okay, I think that's a valid opinion. But I still say "calculating" is the wrong word.

[quote] He probably dickmatizes a lot of girls with that big dick and those beautiful cock sucking lips.

The lips are really beautiful on the big screen. And i missed the nude pic so I never got to see the dick.

The Latin dude is hot

I will see this movie, preferrably in a theater this week. Whether I like it less than the original...or like it more than the original, I will buy the DVD when it comes out. It's WSS, for goodness sake. I saw the original when I was 6 or 7, probably the first musical I've seen. I loved it. It had...and still has that impression on me. I would like for this movie to be successful. It still could be...

[quote]It's wonderful but watching gang members dance in the streets is still a hard sell.

Yet we have a lot of movies about normal looking people who have superpowers and that's not a hard sell.

“Wicked” will also bomb. NO ONE wants THAT shit.

R552 = the cast of “Natasha, Pierre, and the Great Comet…”, still pissed

[quote] Moreno's Anita seemed more mature and suspicious--less happy-go-luck, like the recent Anita. Hard to explain, but you see it on Moreno's face. The scene in doc's store was more real in the original because she's just pissed off at the world.

r546 because Rita was an actor who'd experienced some shit rather than the new one who's just complained about some shit

Yes, if only WSS had the hard-edged realism of a spider-boy or a space opera with ewoks or the giant killer dinosaur movie.

Oh, if it's a giant dinosaur movie, let me recommend my good friend Sally Struthers. She's certainly as big as a dinosaur these days!

R154 did Rita experience any of Brando's shit? I heard he was into scat!

^ R554

I know a lot of fat girls who are looking forward to Wicked the Movie!

She experienced his assholery. I've never heard of him being into scat. He was no Danny Thomas.

R550 You can say that again!

R550 I wouldn't order that DVD just yet. I don't think you're going to want to watch WSS 2021 over and over if not ever again.

R536 Oh, I probably will.

Several of the choices in the new film are quite ingenious, including the specific line that triggers the rumble, the use of the Cloisters, and the entire scenario for Cool.

I loved the new WSS but I wouldn’t buy it. I don’t really need to see it again

[quote]And, to further drive home the point, "West Side Story" was playing in more than 3,700 theaters, whereas "Encanto" was on about 2,500. Ouch."

'West Side Story" is an hour longer than "Encanto", so they had more showings.

"And West Side Story" and "Encanto" had the same audience.

I saw it Sunday and loved it. I'm planning to see it again. I would like to see it before the new Spider-Man pushes it out of theaters, but I don't know if I'll get a chance before that happens. I'll probably watch it on streaming too whenever it shows up there. WSS is my all-time favorite musical and I think this version is as good as the '61 movie. In some ways, it's even better.

[quote] And, to further drive home the point, "West Side Story" was playing in more than 3,700 theaters, whereas "Encanto" was on about 2,500. Ouch."

That was commentary from Slashfilm.com. I couldn't find those number for theaters on IMDB BoxOffice Mojo.

Domestic Box Office

Encanto - 3,750 theaters

West Side Story - 2,820 theaters

I think the Slashfilm.com author mixed up the columns and mistook "dollars per theater" for "number of theaters."

So WSS played in about 930 FEWER theaters last weekend than Encanto.

Posted this on the other threads. I just arrived home from my 2nd time watching WSS. The theatre was full except the first 3 rows.

What kind of presumptuous asshole would have the fucking nerve to predict that someone else, whom they've never met, won't like a movie and therefore shouldn't order it on DVD? That would be R562.

I was looking forward to this until I read in another thread that the whole thing is in Spanish without subtitles and then I heard that Moreno plays Doc in drag. WTF? NO THANKS!

I'm not going to see it because I heard Big dies in the first hour.

[quote]'West Side Story" is an hour longer than "Encanto", so they had more showings.

R566 Wouldn't a movie being longer mean it has fewer showings? (A shorter movie could have more screenings per day).

I know I'm old but I remember a time when no one, other than people in the industry, cared about box office numbers, opening day numbers, and all that. I think it was Entertainment Tonight that started all that reporting to mainstream audiences. I still don't understand why the general public cares about movie profits. all we used to care about was if it was good or not.

Because, R574, Capitalism has poisoned our souls!

I loved it. It was much better than CATS....

R575 I'm sorry, but it's pointless. What does it matter to anyone how much money a movie makes, or where a record or song is on the charts? It only matters to the movie company or the record company, and the creative people who stand to make money. It has nothing to do with entertainment.

[quote] 'West Side Story" is an hour longer than "Encanto", so they had more showings.

[R566] Wouldn't a movie being longer mean it has fewer showings? (A shorter movie could have more screenings per day). ... [R566] Wouldn't a movie being longer mean it has fewer showings? (A shorter movie could have more screenings per day).

Yes ,"Encanto" had more showings. Sorry, I didn't think I had to write 'West Side Story" is an hour longer than "Encanto", so "Encanto" had more showings. My bad.

[quote] I know I'm old but I remember a time when no one, other than people in the industry, cared about box office numbers, opening day numbers, and all that.

And now it's self-fulfilling, because people only go to the popular movies. I'm hoping with WSS that the people who went early, who's word of mouth really seems to be great, at least in my circles, keep it going in a way that sustains its sales rather than the usual after-opening-weekend drop.

I was going to see it but Gary talked me out of it.

[quote] the rest of the world do not like your totalitarian wokism

So totalitarian bigotry is better, idiot? Remember that includes homophobia too.

I'm trying to read as many of the Latinx complaints about the film so I can understand. Yo quiero comprender (and I won't subtitle because that is disrespectful. SO far, I'm finding mostly issues with the fact of the film and its creators, but precious few actual problems. They're talking about unflattering characteristics, but nearly ALL the characters are deeply flawed in this remake, except for Rita's.

R527, And the super-powers in WSS would be?

Anyone critiquing West Side Story in any of its incarnations cannot be taken seriously if there is included no acknowledgement of the genius of Leonard Bernstein and Jerome Robbins.

West Side Story is not sociological commentary. Anyone who tries to treat it as such is much too uninformed about the arts and unwise in general to be critiquing a play. Those two artists and their work on West Side Story are enormously important. They are towering artists and cannot be ignored or shunted out of the way during any discussion of this musical play.

I agree that there is nothing authentic about the lives of anyone in West Side Story, whether Puerto Rican or not. Four affluent mostly middle aged Jews had very little knowledge of working class poverty, and even less knowledge or insight about Puerto Rico, its people or their culture. But it's not really about America or about Puerto Rico. The text is about some bigger universal ideas about love and hatred and youth. The score is about Bernstein's infinite musical gift and his interests.

If the culture of Puerto Rico is not richly and accurately portrayed, it's not fatal to the mission of West Side Story. It's not about that. And it's silly to excoriate it for failing to succeed at something that it never tries to examine. Likewise, it's naive to take some statements mostly manufactured by a press agent over 60 years ago to market a Broadway musical and point to them as proof of anything at all.

West Side Story is first and foremost about Bernstein. Next, it's about Robbins. Everything else falls in line after that. You decide where, but you can't leave them out of the analysis. They are not Moose Charlap and Rob Marshall.

R584, I hope you are a professional writer, because you're REALLY good at it.

[quote] West Side Story is first and foremost about Bernstein. Next, it's about Robbins. Everything else falls in line after that.

You remind me of the old (apochryphal?) story of Mrs. Hammerstein and Mrs. Kern at a party. Mrs. Kern says, "My husband wrote 'Old Man River.' And Mrs. Hammerstein corrects her, saying, 'Your husband wrote mmm-mmm-mm-mm [humming the melody]. My husband wrote 'Old Man River.'"

While Bernstein and Robbins did GENIUS work, everyone knows the songs by their lyrics. So I don't think you can demote Sondheim so categorically.

[quote]I know I'm old but I remember a time when no one, other than people in the industry, cared about box office numbers, opening day numbers, and all that.

Well, with all the unfulfilled Queens here, flop is actually a happy word. Celebrating other's misfortune is as close to a sport many here will get.

R584 gives a lot of food for thought. So much being written about this re-make and the original, but the fresh take is to remember its about the art, in the end. The message is universal and the exact details are not the main point.

I do agree with r586 re Sondheim. It's about Bernstein, then Robbins, then Sondheim.

R582 If you are concerned about Hispanic people start by dropping Latin X because 5% of us like to use it or identify with it.

Second, if you want to be cpncerned about a demographic's issues with the film, worry specifically about Puerto Rican-American's....they are the ones being portrayed but they do not represent the entirety of theLatino/Hispanic community and a Mexican american or Chilean american do not have any reason to relate to it. And if you actually knew a damnyhing about us isthat we resent all being put in the same bag.

R599, I'm glad to hear that about Latinx, as it has always read and sounded very dumb to me. But for the record, what is the preferred term? Latino used for both sexes, or Latino/Latina used as appropriate? And I'm unclear as to whether or not Hispanic is currently considered acceptable.

R571 =Karen

R591: First of all, "Karen" is only used as a derogatory term by idiots such as yourself. And anyway, my getting angry over some fool being certain that some stranger will not like a movie and therefore should not buy the DVD isn't an example of me being a "Karen." I wasn't screaming at a manager, you dipshit.

R591 =off her meds

Here's an interesting opinion piece about the movie from the New York Times. I personally enjoyed the film very much.

Sondheim himself said he didn't do all the lyrics. "Somewhere" is basically Lenny, so is "Tonight, Tonight." "Officer Krupke" and "Maria" and "SOmething's Coming" is Steve.

He said the only good lyric he wrote for the show was "I just met a girl named Maria."

R595, apparently that's inaccurate, and very few if any of Bernstein's lyrics remain in the songs you noted.

[quote]I have to confess that I never saw the original “West Side Story.” All I knew is that it somehow involved gang members dance-fighting and singing about how much they loved America.

There is no point reading the ridiculous article posted at R594 beyond these ridiculous opening sentences. But if you do read beyond that, it gets worse....

R594 seems like the usual moan, moan, moan academic or other purist: give money to obscure people producing art that no one will see.

This has all gotten so dull. And if the New York Times think it's found a good business strategy as the catalogue of this week's whines, it may have it's hand out in future too.

SURE. That's the reason.

[quote] If you are concerned about Hispanic people start by dropping Latin X because 5% of us like to use it or identify with it.

[quote] Second, if you want to be cpncerned about a demographic's issues with the film, worry specifically about Puerto Rican-American's....they are the ones being portrayed but they do not represent the entirety of theLatino/Hispanic community and a Mexican american or Chilean american do not have any reason to relate to it. And if you actually knew a damnyhing about us isthat we resent all being put in the same bag.

Being the language police helps no one, including the folks you are speaking for, in that is distracts from the actual content of every discussion. I actually said I was reading as much as I can to understand both sides, so your misspelled anger is tolatty misplaced.