Marlene Dietrich

I love Dietrich.

Is this the era her daughter said she was being held together by wires on a stand under her fur coat cause she was so drunk?

She's a regular Jeanne Durand, sweetie.

A decade ago I showed Dietrich's Bacharach show to my straight adult brother who was fascinated and started watching her movies, too. Here's an upscaled version.

The show works on many different levels and is sublimely professional show biz artistry. The levels include monstrous and pathos but those are just thrown into the mix.

"Oh boy, she's going to come out looking great..."

I remember seeing that special and I had seen her live on Broadway shortly before that.

R5, did you ever meet Coolidge when he was president?

Better, OP. I saw her 1972 concert in person...in Denver.

[quote] she was being held together by wires on a stand under her fur coat cause she was so drunk

No. Her skinny bones were riddled with osteoporosis. The wires held up her wizened teats.

I don't wish to be rude about the elderly but English octogenarians such as Maggie Smith and Vanessa Redgrave don't display themselves in a pseudo-sexy charade the way that poor, raddled Marlene did.

That was seriously amazing. Thank you, OP

R7 Linking is so difficult

Young Marlene was sensual but not striking. In this perfectly restored 1927 silent pic, some of the men are prettier than she is.

So a “concert” of someone basically talking? Even if I’m curious to see Dietrich, 30 seconds of that was too much. Painful.

Judy was fabulous in that clip.

R12 Probably because you're used to Real Housewives of Jersey

One has to be a bit of pervert to appreciate Dietrich. And have some show biz culture.

[quote] One has to be a bit of pervert to appreciate Dietrich.

Pervert?

Sounds like late life Dietrich is a role Glenn could actually sing.

Get my agent on the phone.

She was the embodiment of Golden Age Hollywood glamour. In 1972 she was still able to pull that off on stage (and not in close-up) and doing all of the tortuous things she did to maintain the illusion. You knew it was all illusion but it didn't matter. She was magical. I mean...it was Marlene friggin' Dietrich!

She is why I wish I was older. I am obsessed with people like her, Bette Davis, Joan Crawford, etc. - all very different, but all just magical.

I can tell a lot. As I've written here before, I've had Marlene's drunken tongue down my throat.

In the attic of a theatre, I also came across the negotiations for one of her tours, and also the stage manager's notes of each performance. She considered her exit from the stage door into her Daimler part of the act, and there was a typewritten document stating that ushers were instructed at intermission to talk amongst themselves loudly, saying: "Isn't it marvellous the way Miss Dietrich greets patrons at the stage door after the show..." I shit you not.

A theatre manager, now long dead of AIDS, told me that the greatest ovation he ever witnessed in a theatre was in Dietrich's tour in 1962. He said that the curtain went up, and Dietrich was standing behind a second spangled scrim curtain, just a shadow, standing side on, but with her legs astride, a light shining behind her. He said you could see the shadow of her legs through her dress right up to her twat. The scrim curtain slowly opened, but she held the other side of it in front of her with an outstretched arm, while the other side of the curtain drew fully back. He said people were screaming and practically falling out the boxes. And this was opening night with patrons in jewels and a Vice Regal party. At the very last minute she let go of the curtain and it flew back revealing herself. A fantastic coup de theatre.

Of course, when she toured 10 years later she was practically a mannequin: it was act of a will. The musical arrangements of her sometime lover Burt Bacharach were genius: they wrapped round her minor voice and were the making of it.

I'm the bitch who stole her act.

So great, so camp, so utterly bizarre.

Marlene could sing. She had complete control. She was an "intérprete" - a respected tradition and she was great at it in 3 languages.

A chanteuse...if you will.

Marie Marie is more famous in her French version but her German version is perfect.

Also what comes out is how German language can be charming and even pretty - nowadays few people know that.

She enters...

Her daughter Maria Riva's biography of Dietrich is the best written biography of any Hollywood star.

True, r28. It is an amazing book.

A few years after this concert Dietrich retired and became a total recluse, never leaving her Paris apartment.

What's the best Marlene movie, DL?

La la la la la la la...

This recording of her show was not released at the time. She was paid a small fortune to record it and chose Wimbledon theatre because the acoustics are supposedly the best. When she finally saw it she refused to let it be released. The ‘magic’ that came over in her live performances didn’t come across in this recording and she knew it so she vetoed it completely. Not sure if she gave the money back.£250.000 was the sum often quoted, A huge sum at the time. so we fans at the time didn’t get to see it until years later. Wish I’d never watched it. Shrewd lady and so right. it’s fucking awful! I saw her live 3 times. By the time I saw her in 74 it was well overdue to call it a day. The dense pink lights, the wig, Throwing that fucking coat around like a duvet. All looks like bad drag. Still love her, a style icon like no other but that concert recording should have been buried without trace.

...some kind of man

Our mother, an icy number, took us to see Miss Marlene when she did a concert in our hometown Chicago.

Even as a young girl, I knew that the auditorium was full of sisters. While Marlene sang "Till There Was You," I tried to get the attention of the man across the aisle, hoping we could lure him back to the bathroom to sample his meat and let him touch our no-no. But our nosy mother, probably just angry that she hadn't had a drink in 30 minutes, slapped our hand away when she saw us toying with our left nipple as we licked our teeth for the hot gentleman. Mother, always competitive, was just angry that the hot number her age was interested in us.

We spend the rest of the concert plotting mother's deserved death so didn't pay attention to the Kraut on the stage. We had looked forward to seeing her because she was German. But when we discovered that she had hated real Germans, we lost interest and devoted our lives to Peggy--after Saint Judy, of course.

[quote] devoted our lives to Peggy

The lovely Peggy Ashcroft.

"Marlene MIGHT do it. But she looks far too young." - Noel Coward

The Lady is Willing is fun. Dietrich attempts a Teutonic Lombard performance. The writer gives her lots of 'R's and Aline MacMahon is her usual wonderful self.

I noticed that Destry was on tonight. Unfortunately it's the 1954 version with...Mari Blanchard.

OP is that how old white women rap?

"Is it twue what they say about black men??? IT'S TWUE, IT'S TWUE!!!"

She's pooped...

R37 Young Fred looks as young and sexy as Ryan Reynolds in that clip.

His cleft chin was enormous.

Other than Marlene being a great face for photography I don't get the fascination with her. She wasn't a thespian, wasn't a singer. They made a career out of her face, her legs and whatever clothes she was wearing.

From Marlene Dietrich's A*B*C...

Greenland...Should be named Iceland (see Iceland)

Iceland...Should be named Greenland (see Greenland)

And yet she made many movies and recordings and concert/nightclub appearances, r43. Have a piece of fruit.

[quote] She wasn't a thespian, wasn't a singer. They made a career out of her face, her legs and whatever clothes she was wearing.

You say "They made a career out of her". She made a career out of herself. She had meagre talents but—

1. she was knowledgeable about clothes and lighting and presentation 2. she was pushy and aggressive and initiated those two movies with Wilder 3. she was European and made a bridge with European artistic talents (like Chanel, Cocteau and Gabin) with the US industry.

George Burns) Run along now Gracie you can leave Marlene and me alone

Gracie Allen) I don't know if I like that?

Marlene) Neither do I. What would I do if he collapsed?

I think she was a great actress and millions of ticket buyers once thought so too. Its very easy for today's ingrates to dismiss what they know nothing about and can't appreciate.

By the way, not only was she a great artist and the consummate professional about it, she was a fine person and had terrific character. She had a lot of charisma.

After reading this thread, I think I'm falling in love with her again. I can't help it.

[quote] falling in love with her again

My infatuation lasted 3 weeks when I was in my 20s.

But Marlene 'wore out her welcome'; Greta disappeared like a wraith and continues to fascinate.

Marlene became "box office poison" early in her career, soon after her meteoric rise to international stardom. Kind of like Jennifer Lawrence. Marlene then continued to work for decades, branching out to a cabaret career as well. She eventually did her finish acting work long after her brief ability to open and headline movie hits. I don't think that is wearing out a welcome. She was pretty classy through her life and career and didn't make a point of being a bitch or a snob or a social climber, or any of that bullshit.

oops * her finest acting work.

I didn't like her making a public fool of herself over that bald man and that angry Englishman.

I thought Jessica Lange's circus mistress on AHS was pure 1930's Marlene. And well done!

She had circus looks in her act

She looked chic doing it. Madonna ripped it off many times but never well.

She was more a presence than great actress, r48.

You are splitting hairs. She was economical but there was acting going on. She carried movies effortlessly, occasionally. She gave great performances many times, not a one or 2 trick pony, like Sharon Stone, for example.

I didn't say she was a bad actress, I said she was more of a presence than a great actress. I'd say the same about Garbo...or Streisand.

MD in Australia 1965

Basically the same show but in b&w which always worked better for Marlene

[quote] She was the embodiment of Golden Age Hollywood glamour.

Glamour existed before Hollywood and it can cope very well without the sharks of La La Land and Los Angeles.

Correct me if I’m wrong but my understanding is that Paramount wanted a duplicate of Garbo to sell to the masses. Paramount paid Dietrich and Von Sternberg to take up a contract for eight films and after that she was let loose.

She had no contract so she wandered to France to make a French-language film with Jean Gabin (who most of us would consider ugly) and then she was in Britain doing 'Knight without Armour opposite Robert Donat (who was already looking like a stuffed tabby-cat) and then the war came and she did cabaret appearances for the troops.

But after that she was on the loose again showing off her skinny shanks in a rather tacky production about gypsies called 'Kismet' or 'Golden Earrings' with old Ray Milland and she was off freelance again. She was offered a role opposite Stewart Granger in a baroque film in England about 1948 and two years later she was in England getting second billing to dreary Jane Wyman for Hitchcock.

She initiated two projects with Billy Wilder (the second of which was capable 'Witness for the Prosecution) and then she was off wandering around again and —under the influence of Noel Coward who reinvigorated his career in Las Vegas cabaret— she tried to invite her flagging career with similarly rather-tacky cabaret.

[quote]Correct me if I’m wrong but my understanding is that Paramount wanted a duplicate of Garbo to sell to the masses. Paramount paid Dietrich and Von Sternberg to take up a contract for eight films and after that she was let loose.

Greta Garbo was a movie fan favorite, and every rival studio imported and groomed their very own foreign-born contract player to duplicate the Garbo mystique. Marlene Dietrich came closest to matching Garbo in popularity, but she did it by establishing her own unique persona and style. While Garbo specialized in playing doomed and hopeless romantics, Dietrich's characters were frequently bold and transgressive, preferring a quick roll in the hay before surrendering to romance. But by the late '30s, with the world at war, America's interest in mysterious foreign beauties with Teutonic accents had waned.

[quote] every rival studio imported and groomed their very own foreign-born contract player

I guess that includes Hedy Lamarr, Vera Zorina and Anna Sten.

[quote] I guess that includes Hedy Lamarr

It’s Hedley!

Curiously, Marlene's own studio, Paramount, tried to strike twice by signing the "Italian Marlene Dietrich," Isa Miranda.

Fuck you r60...GARBO is a Goddess. ..and a terrific actress. Ninotchka, Camille, etc...

Don't trash Jean Gabin either! He was actually "ugly hot," unlike that Pete troll. Super sexy and charismatic guy in his prime.

[quote] Jean Gabin … Super sexy and charismatic…

How can I experience some of that? Can you recommend any particular movies?

I found her laugh...forced, r67.

[quote] She wasn't a thespian, wasn't a singer. They made a career out of her face, her legs and whatever clothes she was wearing.

She was to film what Sade is to music.

They both have/had a captivating presence and a limited, but genuine, gift. They both tirelessly work a very small sliver of material and deliver/ed time and time again. They know what worked for them.

R69 Jean Renoir’s The Lower Depths + Grand Illusion + Le Bete Humaine. Le Jour Se Leve, Pepe Le Moko, You either get it or don’t. He’s certainly not Rock Hudson but he’s not dismissible as a standard uggo. This was back when actors had to have charisma, talent, personality (much like Marlene herself did, who I never found conventionally attractive either but quite sexy)

Dietrich was like a walking instagram account who photobombed almost a whole century.

I don´t think i´ve ever seen a stylish frock ore outfit that Marlene hasn´t worn decades before.

Her friendslist: Ernest Hemingway, Jean Cocteau, Edith Piaf, Erich Maria Remarque, Alberto Giacometti,Billy Wilder,Orson Wells,Tallulah Bankhead;etc

Probably the most perfect film technician who ever "acted" in front of a movie camera with the precision of a swiss clockwork.

Her seven films with Josef von Sternberg are a stange oddity in movie history to me but i like to watch them over and over again . Just for the refined , skillfull,loving lightning to begin with.

To hold an audiences attention for an hour "doing nothing" / sprechsinging takes charisma,power and talent.

Trained in all fields of showbiz in the roaring 20ies of Berlin, Movie Godess Diva in the early 30ies she rebranded herself by hopping of the pedastal and beating the shit out of Una Merkel in Destry Rides Again.

What followed was a long list of bad movies for the money (her words) but always making sure at least the look of Dietrich was fun ;intresting ore camp crazy (the golden legs "dance" in Kismet)

Off to WW II in a custom fit uniform and a practial goldfrock ( iron-free so she could roll it up and use as cushion) . The second most famous german at the time saying fuck you to Hitler. Danke Marlene!

When she went Vegas to do a cabaret act in the 50ies in her nude dresses it were the legion of soldiers she entertained who flocked there to see their gal and gave her a start as chanteuse. Being a "whore" can pay off, no? "Whore" being used with irony as Marlene only had a massive eye-roll for those "gawd-awfull boring american puritans".

She gave some solid performances in her 50ies for Billy Wilder, Hitchcock and Orson Wells and her live act advanced to theater concert till she kept "falling off stage again" in the 70ies.

She was quite something!

[quote]By the time I saw her in 74 it was well overdue to call it a day.

In his diaries, Noel Coward goes from praising Marlene for continually learning how to improve her act in the 1950s, to eventually, at some point in the 1960s, saying she was all facade and no substance, but her fans surely had figured that out on their own.

Toward the end of 1972 when Coward was obviously quite ill, she made some snotty comment to the press about how she had no real friends, and they protested that Noel was still alive and she could spend Christmas with him, and she said "he could be dead by the time I get there," and caused an uproar. Of course, Coward chose her to accompany him to what turned out to be his last public appearance a few weeks later, apparently having gotten used to Marlene's strange way of showing friendship and loyalty.

[quote]I don´t think i´ve ever seen a stylish frock ore outfit that Marlene hasn´t worn decades before.

I know, I know...

And despite all the glamor she wan't above washing her dressing room floor with a bucket of vinegar and water, and boiling up a Jägerkohl on a hot plate next to her Parisian bed.

[64] you’re getting you’re era’s a bit mixed. Dietrich ruled the 30’s. Brought in to rival Garbo she took off in her own right and survived longer than all of them. Anna Stern was tried as a rival to Dietrich but failed miserably. Hedy Lamar wasn’t brought in as a European copy of anything! For a short while her astonishing beauty stunned everyone. She took the 40s by storm making her rivals scramble for the black hair dye and centre parting. Even Crawford copied it.

Good ol' Anna Sten...

Marlene and Hedy, with Billy Wilder

R73

[quote] Orson Wells

Orson Welles

R76 You cannot be claiming that Hedwig Kiesle (Hedy Lamarr) invented black hair with a centre parting.

Vegas

[quote][R76]You cannot be claiming that Hedwig Kiesle (Hedy Lamarr) invented black hair with a centre parting.

We love our centre parts!

[quote] centre parts!

You daffy Dataloungers will be telling me that Zeffirelli invented them for his Romeo and Juliet movie.

R83 [quote] Hedwig Kiesle

Hedwig Kiesler

Marlenes daugther called Gabin "the most instinctive gentlemen of all my mothers lovers. A simple soul,a little boy in gruff mans body,easy to love,easy to hurt."

In the 50ies Marlene discussed her many lovers with her husband and a friend and asked them which she loved most. Her husband guessed right - Gabin.

He holds the distinction of being the only of her lovers- and we´re speaking of 3 figure numbers- who left HER.

& dared to beat her because she did not want to marry him after the war but insisted on refreshing her relationship with war hero General James Gavin. She moved into the generals hotel when he was in paris and joined him for a victory parade in NY. The generals wife sued for divorce explaining:"I can compete with ordinary women but not Marlene Dietrich".

Voilà!

It’s interesting that Dietrich’s style of cabaret has become synonymous with Nazi-era decadence, even though she was virulently anti-Nazi and had left Germany in 1930.

R86, Interesting. Cabaret was big in the Weimar Republic era, so to me, it is the last gasp of liberation and decadence before the Nazis took over.

LB Mayer had had enough of Garbo and her demands and also recognized that the public was tiring of her as well. So Hedy Lamarr was the perfect solution...until she became far more difficult (with less talent) than Garbo ever was.

Hedy was LB's Garbo replacement.

Greer Garson was the Norma Shearer replacement.

And Lana Turner was the Joan Crawford (and Jean Harlow) replacement.

8. Marlene Dietrich made a name for herself as an icon of the Weimar era before she headed to Hollywood and global fame

Before she became a Hollywood superstar in the 1930s, Marlene Dietrich made a name for herself as an actress and socialite during the heady days of Weimar-era Berlin. As an extrovert and as bisexual, she thrived in the liberal atmosphere of 1920s Berlin. Indeed, one newspaper dubbed Dietrich “perhaps the busiest and most passionate bisexual in theatrical Berlin” – quite an accolade given the competition. Her exploits made her as infamous as she was famous, and soon she became almost as well known for her colorful private life as she was for her movie career.

Dietrich had just turned 20 when she started making a name for herself in Berlin. Like many future stars, she started out as a chorus girl, progressing to bit-parts in cabaret shows and then movies. Though she married fellow actor Rudolf Sieber in 1923, even having a daughter with him, this didn’t slow her down. In fact, Sieber was well aware of her nature and she was open about the numerous affairs she conducted with both men and women.

Even for Weimar Berlin, Dietrich’s behavior was often seen as shocking, especially her love of women. Klaus Kinski, one of Germany’s biggest-ever movie stars, recalled in his biography how Dietrich’s passionate affair with actress Edith Edwards was particularly scandalous. In his autobiography, Kinski writes breathlessly: “Marlene tore down Edith’s panties backstage in a Berlin theater and, using just her mouth, brought Edith to orgasm.” Such behavior certainly didn’t hinder her career. In 1929, Dietrich landed the lead role in Lola Lola and then starred in The Blue Angel. This brought her to the attention of Hollywood and, within a year, she had moved to the United States, where she soon became a genuine A-lister

Cinnamon gives it a go...

[quote] Cabaret was big in the Weimar Republic era

And in London and NY too

R85 Jean Gabin was no beauty

R64 and R80 . I’m not suggesting Lamar invented dark hair and the centre parting. I’m saying at the time most if not all the Hollywood reigning beauties were or had been blonde. Garbo, Dietrich, Harlow, Carole Lombard, Constance Bennet, Ginger Rogers, Betty Grable, Bette Davis, Lana Turner. Crawford tried every shade blonde. Lamarr appeared on the scene and created such an impact many stars imitated her look darkening their hair and centre parting it. The same way they all copied Crawford’s natural eyebrows and exaggerated mouth. Am well aware of the kissing pic with Marlene, yes they were girlfriends perhaps not just platonic but at that point Dietrich is in her 40’s. She is not the reigning queen of Hollywood any more. Lamarr was a contemporary of Judy Garland, Lana Turner and being hailed as the most beautiful woman in the world. You can’t link her with a foreign copy cat failure like Anna Sten.

r93, when was Garbo ever a blonde? And Bette Davis' brief blonde years were BEFORE she achieved real stardom. I can't really think of a single Joan Crawford film of any decade where she could be described as a blonde.

It's true though that most of the big brunette stars of the 30s and 40s were not primarily sex symbols: Norma Shearer, Katharine Hepburn, Myrna Loy, Kay Francis, Irene Dunne, Rosalind Russell, Loretta Young, Eleanor Powell, Olivia de Havilland, Vivien Leigh, Ruby Keeler, though a few brunettes were: Paulette Goddard, Ann Sheridan, Dorothy Lamour.

Garbo was a natural dark blonde swede that photographed a bit darker. Dietrich was a redistribution blonde until she went full blonde. Some pictures of stars as blondes.

Crawford was a redhead in the early 30s, not a blonde.

I wasn't a brunette, r94.

[quote]when was Garbo ever a blonde?

She may have had light brown hair, I'm not sure, but it read as blonde.

[quote]And Bette Davis' brief blonde years were BEFORE she achieved real stardom.

She became a huge star with Of Human Bondage when she was most definitely blonde and won an Oscar for Dangerous where she was blonde. I think you could say her hair was blonde, or at least read that way in B&W film, in Petrified Forest and the posters and lobby cards colored her hair as such.

It was ash blonde, r94.

Until it wasn't...

Not trying to derail this Marlene thread. I am a great fan. So my last reference to miss Lamarr. Our Joanie looking decidedly Hedy

Crawford had more going on with her eyes than Hedy.

Goddess!

Yes but the look is decidedly dark as opposed to this 1931 film Laughing Sinners. Pretty fair for any era wouldn’t you say R93 ? And at this stage she was top billing world famous. Give her her due Our Joan rocked a million looks.

Oh that's a good catch, a lot of the publicity for Laughing Sinners has Joan's hair blonde, too. I never realized that before.

R103 totally agree. Joan could look more beautiful than any of them, time after time. I took a pic of my 1973 programme of Dietrich’s live show. (Can’t seem to download it here) My mum and Dad took me. After, we waited outside the stage door with a huge crowd. I couldn’t get any where near but my mother got right through to Dietrich.(there was a picture of them both in the local rag at the time). My mother didn’t have a pen, so got out her lipstick for Dietrich to sign with. Dietrich replied but it’s a lovely new lipstick. A shame to spoil it and put it back in my mum’s handbag. She signed the programme with a pen she already had and kissed the programme. A perfect lip print. I varnished over the lipstick kiss so it wouldn’t get smudged. Still have it, great memory.

R103 couldn’t agree more. I still have my programme from Dietrich’s 73 tour. My mum and Dad took me. After the show we stood outside the stage door with the huge crowd. When Dietrich emerged I couldn’t get near but my mother got next to Dietrich. There was a picture next day in the local rag. My mother didn’t have a pen so gave Dietrich her lipstick to use. Dietrich said ‘it’s a lovely new lipstick. A shame to ruin it.’ And put it back in my mother’s bag. She then signed the programme with a pen she already had and kissed the programme. I have a perfect lip print next to the picture. I varnished over it so as not to smudge it. Still have it, perfect lip print same coral colour as she’s wearing in the photo. fond memories. (Photographed it but can’t download it onto the site from my personal photos)

When I saw her in Denver, r107, Peter Bogdanovitch and Ryan O'Neal were in the audience. Afterwards, they accompanied Marlene out the stage door and into the limo...no autographs. Although I did get Ryan's before the show.

Should have got his phone number!

A friend of mine told me many years ago knew her and saw her preparing for a performance. He said she stretched a fish skin over her face that pulled her skin tight when it dried. I have never read that in any books or online, but my friend knew lots of famous stars and celebs when he was rich and famous. He told me other things about Marlene, but I don't remember them right now.

Witness...

Wow, fantastic story r106, love it!

Well, Lucille Ball's hair looks blonde in black & white photos, too!

An example, r113?

Shoppin' for rags...

[quote] Our Joanie

No, your Joanie

She didn't look ageless. She looked elderly and weird in that 1965 concert. Her mouth was hideous later in life - too many face pulls and those tiny little green teeth. Her expression is so downward and disdainful. Such an affected way. She looked like a well dressed 80 year old in her sixties. She was a great looking woman in everyday life in her thirties. Never a beauty though.

"Don´t kill the illusion"

MD to a person in the front row checking her out with binoculars.

When she went to Israel she knew all those refugees uprooted from their homeland would allow her to sing in their native language to them.

I don't think she was trying to look ageless. She just wanted to be feminine and "seamless". Thus the pinning back of the face and German engineered supporting garments.

In 1962 Marlene narrated the documentary "Black Fox: The Rise and Fall of Adolf Hitler"

The documentary used Johann Wolfgang von Goethe's 1794 version of Reynard the Fox as a parallel.

Garbo went blonde for half of As You Desire Me.

Marlene Dietrich was "held up" if you will by fact by gown worn in above clip (like nearly all others) had foundations built into the thing.

IIRC it was performance in OP link and or maybe even others were upon Ms. Dietrich coming on stage conductor knew at once she was sloshed, he then told his orchestra to watch him closely because it was going to be a bumpy ride.

Have never understood the appeal of Marlene Dietrich as an actress or singer. Greta Keller was vastly superior to MD as a chanteuse.

R120

Ms. Dietrich's gowns and other outfits were not result of "German" engineering, but French.

Jean Louis was strongly influenced by Christian Dior who pioneered building gowns and other garments upon a foundation.

Women for centuries had been stuffing themselves into corsets, then bodices went over. Latter may or may not have had boning, but if it did was secondary to heavy duty foundations underneath.

Building a gown, suit or whatever upon its own foundation allows for less or no corseting underneath, this gives a smoother line... Thus while Marlene Dietrich's gowns may have appeared "nude" from a distance up close they were anything but, however thanks to foundation wearer had required figure.

Jean Louis was also responsible for Marilyn Monroe's famous "Happy Birthday Mr. Kennedy" dress. Again showing off same talents regarding built in foundations. Even so rumor has it Ms. Monroe was literally sew into the gown in order that it would hug her curves more carefully.

Soufflé a type of marquisette net fabric was used for such gowns. It was and still is very popular with film and stage costumes because of it being sheer, flesh colored and thus giving appearance of being nude. It has some stretch (more so if made from spandex blends which occur post 1959). Other popular uses include ballet and skating costumes, corsetry, bras, girdles and other foundation garments.

Sag mir, wo die Blumen sind.

Look carefully at the girls in "You Gotta Have A Gimmick". Though it appears they are nude aside from their costumes, all are wearing body stockings made from soufflé or similar fabric. You can see material crunch up when Miss Mezzapa bends and otherwise moves.

On stage many local laws forbade or heavily restricted performances in nude, this goes back to burlesque or vaudeville days, if not further. Body stockings got around those laws because technically wearers were not nude.

OCD much? German engineering was just a throwaway joke. We all know the techniques of Miss Dietrich's gowns for crissakes. But do carry on.

Crawford has such a bitchface!

Stage Fright 1950 opening scene

Gowns by Dior

When asked during the filming about working with the famously controlling, and technically adept Dietrich, Hitchcock replied "Everything is fine. Miss Dietrich has arranged the whole thing. She has told them exactly where to place the lights and how to photograph her." Later, he said of Dietrich "Marlene was a professional star. She was also a professional cameraman, art director, editor, costume designer, hairdresser, makeup woman, composer, producer and director."

Desire (1936 )

Her first post von Sternberg movie is quite charming and Gary Cooper is goofy hotness personified.

She was convincing in several languages. Really convincing use of voice.

R57 She wore a tux like nobody else. Some of them were made by Knize in Vienna,a famous men´s outfitter. They also made blouses for Marilyn Monroe and ski pants for Josephine Baker.

[quote] Really convincing use of voice

Yet unable to produce one of the 26 letters of the alphabet.