Dune 2021 So??? Did you see it?

Lynch’s version was more interesting visually. The HBO version is easier to understand. I kept waiting for a hissing Bene Gesserit.

I think Lynch's is closer to mark visually because Hebert worked as an advisor.

Agreed that this was less complicated than Dune 84, but not nearly near as good as the SciFi miniseries script, which, aside from Irulan kept close to the story. I honestly thought thought HBO Dune got a bit dull about halfway through.

R2) Agree the attack on the city just kept going on and on. I fast forwarded through those scenes. Maybe they were trying to appeal to teenage boys or something.

It ends so anticlimactically.

I think this is going to bomb. It just doesn't have the narrative beats of a box office hit--it's too slow and ponderous.

And the dialogue is so arch.

Bump for the daytime folks

They haven't even filmed the next part yet.

Weird, you'd think they'd film the whole thing and then just break it up for release.

I don't get why they didn't film the whole thing all at once, since there was no way they could let this stand on its own as a complete film. they would HAVE to make a second film or it would make no sense. But now they have to bring all the actors back and clear out time for them--I hope they saved all the sets they'll need.

The problem is that they didn't construct it so you felt like the film was a whole. Even in a film like "The Empire Strikes Back" which obviously set things up for a completion of the story, there was a sense of climax--here there was just the knife fight.

The overall problem with the story for me has always been that there seems to be no struggles for Paul Atreides--he's better at everything than anyone could ever expect, so unlike Harry Potter or Luke Skywalker (who are also promised messiah-types), you never have to worry about him. Plus unlike Harry or Luke, he's always been raised in the lap of luxury, so you just feel he's the young prince for whom everything is easy. Plus, he spends much of the story protected by his mother! How many action heroes could you say that about?

People will either love it or hate it. I’m in the latter camp. In a nutshell, beautiful to look at and boring to watch. Ratboy messiah basically mumbles for two hours.

They should have included a scene of Duncan Idaho rimming Paul.

Ratboy is not a very good actor in this film. It's not entirely his fault because the dialogue is so awful, but unlike in "Call me By Your Name" he couldn;t give a passable performance (I have yet to see anyone do that in this role, though--and Kyle MacLachlan is a very good actor in other things).

In this film, I was so aware that Ratboy was chosen simply because the camera loves the weird planes of his face. Although he's a weak actor, there's no denying the camera does love him, even though I do not find him sexually attractive. He's more interesting as a model than as an actor.

Unpopular opinion, but I thought the SciFi version was the best, especially given they had a small budget. Yes, William Hurt was miscast and it was a bit bland visually compared to Lynch, but I thought the script was the better of the three.

Somehow I don't think Jason Momoa could have made even that seem believable, r10.

By contrast, Josh Brolin was just acting rings around him. It was funny for me with this film's weak script to see how much the film split the cast into people who actually CAN act (Brolin, Oscar Isaac, Zendaya, Charlotte Rampling) and those who cannot but who just look impressive (Ratboy, Jason Momoa, Dave Bautista).

You know, r8, you're right about Paul and danger. This version , moreso than the other two, does a piss poor job at conveying anything other than Paul is pampered, which makes the Messiah thing even less believable.

One of the things I did like about the David Lynch version was that you did get a better sense hat paul's entire world was upended by the escape from the palace and his father's death. In that version, the Atreides side seemed mroe confident about taking over Arrakis: your only real sense that disaster was coming was because of the conversation of the Emperor with the navigator. Here, since we did not get those characters you had everyone else on Arrakis and the Atreides home planet making the prediction, so the attack seemed poorly prepared for and I kept thinking Paul and his mother must have expected all this to happen.

An odd question that occurred to me in this version but has never come up before: when the sandworms travel, do they just burrow through loose sand or do they actually burrow through the harder earth underneath it? They can't seem to make it through rock, which is why the city and the Fremen live on rocky settlements, but I can't figure out how they move so quickly if they are burrowing through earth and not just loose sand.

Also, why do the sandworms swallow giant equipment whole and then not spit it out? I would doubt they could digest that gigantic treatment plant for the spice ithe one swallowed up.

R15 IIRC the other thing missing from this version was the Reverend Mother foreshadowing some of the doom to come with Paul during the hand/box scene.

I thought it was gorgeous to look at and I wasn't bored by it. I think being really high and familiar with the story helped.

Did Chalamet remind anyone else of Edward Scissorhands?

R19 No

Especially when he wore the still suit.

Tom Holland can carry a major motion picture. Timothee cannot.

There isn't going to be a part 2.

If it does then I doubt it will have another $165 million production budget. It would have been cheaper just to keep filming.

I also don't get the wisdom of simultaneously releasing a big budget film in the theaters and "free" streaming. What I mean by "free" is at least Disney charges extra for theatrical releases in addition to a monthly fee.

I loved it, which was a very nice surprise because I didn't have any expectations to do so. It is visually stunning. I thought Timothee was very good. He gets a bad wrap here and people are so divisive about him. Yes, it just sort of peters out without any resolution, but it did end in a fairly natural break in the story timeline. As long as you know going in to it that you aren't going to get the full story, it's fine.

[quote]As long as you know going in to it that you aren't going to get the full story, it's fine.

How many people will know that going in, though? Petering out without resolution is a whole problem. The movie needed to be both a setup for the future sequels AND a complete story unto itself like the original Star Wars, and it doesn't succeed there.

Salon reviewer calls it a masterpiece:

[quote]He gets a bad wrap here

We should use fresher ingredients, I suppose.

[quote] Really, really weird thing and I don't think they thought this through...the Fremen are all POC so it makes Paul Atredies comes across as a white savior.

Ah yes the Freman, led by that notable POC actor Javier Bardem.

Do you even know what Paul’s story is?

[quote] Tom Holland can carry a major motion picture. Timothee cannot.

A gnat could carry a marvel movie. The comic book stuff is a guaranteed blockbuster and not because Tom Holland’s acting.

I love the nerdly contempt dripping from Miss Mary's last sentence at r29!

[quote]Do you even know what Paul’s story is?

Yes, he's the Kwisatz Haderach. A messiah of sorts. The center of a prophecy that the Bene Gesserit planted amongst the Fremen. He eventually becomes a sandworm as does his son leto.

Did you even know that I'm not the only one who picked up on the white savior oops.

Just saw it in the theater. Highly recommend seeing it on a big screen. I thought it was great. Not quite sure why Zendaya received top billing. She's barely in it, and had even less lines. I'm sure her character will be an integral part in the next one though.

The visuals, and even more so the score are both award worthy.

Just finished watching it. I’m a big fan of the books (only the first four and not the later ones), and I thought this movie came as close to capturing the book as anything done previously. It was very faithful to the source material. I did find myself wondering at times where the break was going to come in the story. Really looking forward to the second part.

It's a fatally flawed story. Paul Atreides must be the only heroic messiah-figure to originate in 20th literature/culture who is accompanied on his path to final triumph by his watchful and fretful mother.

Liked it more than I thought I would. Oscar Isaac and Sharon Duncan-Brewster (Kynes) were both wonderful. Mamoa simply cannot act despite having purdy eyes. Chalamet didn't ruin it but he's just too modern as is Zendaya for a film like this-they are so 2021. At one point Paul says "You good?" to his mother and the theatre started laughing. I expected his to say "sup" and take a hit off a bong at any moment.

The laughter never happened

R37 Timmy’s never gonna fist you, sweetheart.

The white savior issue is interesting take on this version of the story. Visually this movie is stunning and brave, ha ha. But seriously I think the imagery is worth the experience, I think they perhaps could’ve done a better job with illustrating the connection between the Bene Gesserit breeding program and the mythology they created on Arrakis. Also they could’ve made it clearer the horror that Paul experienced after his prescient visions of the holy wars that will be fought in his name, as it is central to his character. R8 Paul is able to see the consequences of every single action and is therefore able to choose his most desired outcomes, so get used to things turning out in his favor. Also unlike Potter or Skywalker who are messiah-like, Paul is explicitly the physical embodiment of a long awaited religious savior figure to the Fremen.

I agree with you about imagery being the best part R39.

There's also to many characters important to moving the plot forward that have been so diminished that if you blink you'll miss that they're even in the movie.

I came across this review on Esquire and jesus the author needs to be killed for his bloated writing.

Lol, r41, a number of comments seem to be schooling the reviewer on his inaccuracies.

The film MUST be seen on IMAX screen ti truly appreciate the technical achievement here. Techs and the cast are the best parts. As for the story, it is extremely difficult to adapt and noticeable in this adaptation. Lady Jessica wasn't supposed to be just a messiah's mother, she is much more complex in the books and by trimming down some key scenes from her backstory they markedly reduced the understanding of significance of some plotlines, her actions , and main characters' motivations for casual moviegoers.

The book can’t ever be adapted well to film. The book is a bloated mess. I don’t get why it’s loved.

As a mini-series, maybe, but they won’t get the massive budget.

I'm not a sci-fi fan. I saw Dune only because Tim O'Tay was the star. I liked him in Dune more than I've liked him in anything since CMBYN. I agree with the critic who said the movie was "spectacular and engrossing...until it isn't.

It's so densely packed, it's almost pure exposition until halfway through, when the conflict (finally) becomes more "show" than "tell." And the "show" was just twenty-first century "shoot 'em up, bang bang" crossed with "all that sand" from Lawrence of Arabia.

I imagine the religious allusions were part of the original novel. Every time I heard the name "Bene Gesserit," I thought of a synagogue named B'nai Jeshrun on the UWS. The people wearing what looked like hijabs suggested Moslems, of course. Christianity was doubly represented (in my mind) by the Finnish-sounding Harkonnen name, as well as the son and mother story in the second half, which reminded me of Christ and Mary. (I hope Paul doesn't die, but those Harkonnens wear whips on their belts. Foreshadowing for Part 2? Look out, Paul.)

I thought Timmy was wonderful, but that's my default setting. I like everything about him (not a frau, btw). His hair was magnifcent, and so were his line readings (I have no idea how to critique actors; I just know what I like).

Zendaya is so moon-faced. She reminds me of my brother, whom my mother nicknamed "O," because his head is so perfectly round. She also reminded me of John Eliot Gardner's second series of Bach Cantatas (below).

[quote]Oscar Isaac and Sharon Duncan-Brewster (Kynes) were both wonderful.

She was [italic]awful[/italic], stiff and non-expressive. I think she might be better on TV than on the big screen. I just got nothing from her.

I did like Jamis being a slightly bigger character. Technically, the thopters and the hunter-seeker were well done.

Generally, Villeneuve portrayed the story using strange, eerie and exotic elements. Lynch veered into the grotesque too often and made his movie repulsive.

FWIW

I miss the days when films had recognizable themes to their soundtracks.....I kept humming Toto's Dune 84 themes during then entire film. Zimmer is great at the atmospheric stuff, but did absolute shit for this film in terms of a score....check out the soundtracks for the miniseries (I love Children of Dune's score by Brian Tyler)....all superior to Hans Zimmer's mess.

Something about the Reverend Mother kept reminding me of Patsy from “Absolutely Fabulous.” I was waiting for Jessica to say, “She hasn’t eaten since 10174, darling.”

[quote]Lynch veered into the grotesque too often and made his movie repulsive

Herbert was heavily involved with in making of Lynch's Dune. He called the film "a visual feast" so I gather the grotesque was what Herbert intended.

[quote]Zimmer is great at the atmospheric stuff, but did absolute shit for this film in terms of a score....check out the soundtracks for the miniseries (I love Children of Dune's score by Brian Tyler)....all superior to Hans Zimmer's mess.

Yes! I generally love Zimmer soundtracks but this one was just 'meh'. It really was unrecognizable as a Zimmer soundtrack...so much so that I was surprised to see his name in the credits.

Another big YES on the Children of Dune soundtrack. Inama Nushif is one of my favorite songs.

The film is beautiful, unlike the 1984 trash.

"Yes, he's the Kwisatz Haderach. A messiah of sorts. The center of a prophecy that the Bene Gesserit planted amongst the Fremen."

THIS is why it'll bomb.

Timmy and Jason should grab Oscar Issac and make a manwich.

It is going to bomb because it’s an atmospheric slow-burn film. We don’t live in the past where these films did well. Everything needs to be fast paced with shot changes every few seconds to keep the attention of today’s youth. Many of them find older films boring because back then it was not tons of editing tricks and fast shots, back then a lot of scenes were filmed at once vs now where they cut and paste together a performance if needed. Also, movies use music now more than the last for the same reason.

Look it up. I learned this in college over a decade ago. I can only imagine it’s worse now than it was then.

Dune will have the same fate as the Blade Runner sequel. Very stylish and beautiful and atmospheric with long shots of silence and moodiness, but that isn’t gonna work as a blockbuster in 2021.

r53, Timmy would obviously be in the middle.

I went to a 2:15 show yesterday and the theater was PACKED! This will not be a bomb.

It won’t be a bomb but it’s not gonna be a blockbuster. It will do fine. Maybe make back what it cost.

It's having a good opening weekend...box office expected at $40 million. Question is will it have legs.

The movie is visually great but Timotay's mumbling is extremely annoying.

The seasoned actors like Rampling, Brolin, Isaac, Ferguson deliver lines clearly and with cadence matching the genre and story. Timmy's line readings belong to a mumblecore Greta Gerwig production. The "you good?" type scripting didn't help him either. He's coasting here only on his looks.

R59 I enjoyed the movie, but Timmy could have a second career as a ventriloquist the way he speaks without opening or moving his mouth.

Same as Selena Gomez's close-mouth delivery (see Only Murders in the Building).

For you r48...

That’s how young people speak.

You are ridiculous r48. Zimmer's score was brilliant.

[quote]Herbert was heavily involved with in making of Lynch's Dune. He called the film "a visual feast" so I gather the grotesque was what Herbert intended.

See what happens when you pay attention to the writer? Really, as much as I loved the book, I hated looking at the navigator in its tank and Baron Harkonnen (IKenneth McMillan) with sores on his face. I did like the navigators clad in black speaking through the translation device that looked like a 1920s radio microphone.

R65 I enjoyed being spared the Baron's incessant pedo antics in this new version.

R66 the book was even worse. At least in the movie Lynch made the victim a twink.

White savior? The Fremen save Paul, not the other way around.

Paul leads the Fremen to revolt against the Harkonnen (their oppressors).

Seems like most of the cast was dead before the end. Is this the type of fantasy where there’s a good chance they will return?

Yes r70. There are a few characters who are not dead that will show up again.

It's a great movie, and I don't think I can be friends with anyone who actually hated it.

I eagerly look forward to Part 2. The movie seems to be doing well enough that Part 2 should be given the go-ahead any minute now.

[quote]Seems like most of the cast was dead before the end. Is this the type of fantasy where there’s a good chance they will return?

No. The dead are gone.

If you've seen the character die then they're gone for good. Anyone who didn't die on camera and just disappears will be back.

R73

Some may come back.

In the Dune universe (Duniverse?) there is cloning technology.

Closest thing that comes to it are gholas.

Yeah, but not in THIS movie.

The sequel has awakened!

Well, part 2 anyways...due in 2-years.

I watched this yesterday on HBO.

The dialogue was truly awful. Visuals were great.

I thought Momoa did an ok job, considering. The mother was god awful!

Duke Leto is really the only dead one, and the blink-and-you-miss-her Shadout Mapes. The rest all come back, even Idaho eventually.

I liked the black clad, shrouded mystics.

I would absolutely watch a movie about a futuristic convent.