Midnight Mass

He was also the brains behind Oculus... The Mirror That [italic]Kills![/italic]

Bump

So is the reverend turning the townspeople into vampires?

OOooooh, this is good! I'm almost done with the 5th episode of 7. I won't spoil anything.

It sounds like Storm of the Century.

More like Salem's Lot.

I've never seen the lead guy (Zach Gilford) before, but he's great. Handsome and intensely charismatic on screen. He's a real find.

Also, the Muslim sheriff (Rahul Kohli) is also sexy.

I wonder why Flanagan set it on an island off he coast of Maine, though, since that is so clearly Stephen King territory. Why not set it in Massachusetts, where he's from?

Hamish Linklater is fantastic as the priest and sexy in a strange way.

Zach Gilford is only 5'8", which makes things difficult when Kate Siegel wears combat boots--she's the same height, and in the boots she towers over him.

I don’t know. I’m finding this OK…as long as I’m working at the same time.

Haunting of Bly Manor was unwatchably bad, from beginning to end. Just a total mess.

The Haunting of Hill House was very good, but the ending was terrible.

Don't have high hopes for this one. Flanagan seems like another M. Night Schmuck.

I hope this is Mike Flanagan's final word on alcohol addiction and AA.

It's not a super-interesting topic in and of itself.

I will check this out. Heard it makes you think after the end

Watching the last episode now.

Flanagan needs to cut back on the poignant speeches. I FF a couple of times. But the last two episodes are amazing.

I had the complete opposite opinion.

I loved the Haunting of Bly Manor. I liked the fact that there was something genuinely to be scared of.

I hated The Haunting of Hill House. There were a few episodes I liked but by the end, I was over it.

Agree about the long speeches, r16

Just watched the end. Her last speech about how we are all a part of everything - a one thing that encompasses every single bit, plant, animal, person and all of the universe - is exactly how i've always felt about things. i commented on this in another thread - maybe a reincarnation thread?

All in all though, a bit underwhelming. Really did like Zach Gilford...he's going places.

Why are there no Protestants on this island? Plenty of Catholics, two Muslims, lots of non-believers and some lapsed Catholics, but no Protestants.

OMG, I'm on episode 4, and the long meditative existentialist speeches given to every character are just wrecking this. I feel like I'm hearing a first-year Catholic seminarian sharing his banal religious anxieties through the mouths of his characters for a play-writing course for night school.

Mike Flanagan REALLY needed to be told, "Show, don't tell."

Zach Gilford is SO sexy.

Agree, r22. Great presence. I hope to see him again in future stuff.

The super religious hag is a bitch. I loved to watch her.

Zach Gilford has been around since Friday Night Lights- 2006. Starting watching and I sort of immediately hated it.

R7, if you like Zach Gilford, you ought to stream Friday Night Lights. Hulu has all five seasons.

SPOILERS

It's an interesting idea for a series, although the long speeches should have been severely cut back. I do like the idea that the villain/monster is making almost everyone's lives in the community much better. I like also that the monster doesn't pussyfoot around and attacks almost instantly and decisively when he's been discovered by someone. I also like the way it looks, with the leathery skin and the icy white eyes that faintly glow.

It definitely needed a bigger budget given the terms under which it was conceived. The storm scenes in the first episode looked very fake, and so do all the overhead shots of the island and the community (and so does the recurring image of the dead girl from the car crash with the pieces of windshield glass stuck in her body reflecting the ambulance and police lights). The surprise of all the older folks becoming younger as the series went on would have been helped immensely had the actors not all been so clearly wearing really bad aging makeup in the first episode, especially Millie the doctor's mother. Also, Henry Thomas is so familiar (not only because of ET but now to almost all of Flanagan's series's watchers) that he is instantly recognizable, and it was clear from his first scene he was wearing bad aging makeup.

Annabeth Gish has the worst case of resting bitchface I have ever seen. She makes Anna Kendrick look sweetfaced and approachable by comparison.

Annabeth does resemble Hamish Linklater whose character we later discover is her father.

Does Henry Thomas do anything else but work with Flanagan? Do they have a thing going?

I've seen it.

Anyone want to know how it ends?

SPOILERS

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Just finished it. Wow--those final two episodes go somewhere most series do not go.

I see why r6 compared it to "Salem's Lot"--he was right, because the novel all over this, from the Angel looking like Kurt Barlow (and being the unseen vampiric partner, who is also brought to the town in a box), to the town going up in flames at the end with only two people surviving.

Hugely impressed with most of the acting, especially Hamish Linklater and Samantha Sloyan (Bev) in the two over-the-top parts. Although I wish her character had not been named "Bev" (which was too much), I liked how Sloyan's character showed you what someone like that would do if they were in charge at the end of the world, and how spiteful and petty she would be. The other actor who really impressed me was Kristin Lehman as Annie, Riley's mother--it is really hard to make such a sweet and forgiving character so memorable at the end, and she really did it. I was also impressed with Kate Siegel, who gave a genuinely fine performance in this--she is not just a Sherri Moon Zombie.

I also think this had potentially star-making parts for Zach Gilford and Rahul Kohli, both of whom are very sexy as well as intensely charismatic onscreen.

Weirdly, the only people who I thought were weak were the teenage actors--none of them was any good.

I would bet word of mouth spreads for this because the two final episodes are almost unbearably suspenseful in a way few horror TV shows are anymore (none of the AHS seasons, nor The Haunting of Hill House nor The Haunting of Bly Manor anywhere near as intense as this was at the end). There are too many speeches (even in the final episode Kate Siegel delivers this incredibly long speech at the very end), but it's a slow burn that really pays off at the end spectacularly.

It also had a great final line (followed up by a smile).

One glaring plot hole-Father Pruitt had been on the island for decades. Wouldn't people have noticed that the new priest looked familiar?

I guess we're supposed to assume that vampires are unheard of in this universe.

Why would the Vampire/Angel not have realized that Erin slicing up its wings while it fed on her would be a problem?

Every church has a Bev!

It seemed very fitting that Bev's smug face disintegrated first.

I haven't read the entire thread to avoid spoilers but I finished the first episode. His family is overbearing--at least the mother. This reeks of Stephen King (setting, characters, creepy religious people etc.) and Zach Gilford needs to sit on my face. Will he be shirtless in any future episodes? Hamish Linklater is aging well.

Anybody notice the Gillian Anderson poster in his room juxtapositioned with Annabeth Gish--who replaced her on the X-files--playing the dowdy baby doctor?

Zach Gilford I think needs a bigger career. I know he's been working for awhile and on Friday Night Lights (never seen), but damn...hot, intense, sexy as hell.

Speaking of Salem's Lot, supposedly a remake is in the works & was filming (pre-pandemic, I think) outside of Boston.

R40, Filming started the beginning of this month. Also the spfx mu team behind the Angel are doing Barlow. I’m pretty sure they weren’t behind the bad aging makeups.

As soon as I saw the aging makeups, I knew they were going to de-age the actors during the series. This is one of Flanagan’s better projects- I have 2 more episodes to go,

That's exciting news R41; in the right hands, Salem's Lot & the story about the townspeople living lives of quiet desperation could really be re-imagined in a post Trump/Making American Great that never really happened for poor rural areas. Sure, you'd have to explain people disappearing an era when people are almost always connected, but that could be explained away with poor internet/cellphone service in rural areas.

R34, that's a classic trope of vampire films. No one in them has ever heard of vampires; no one recognizes the signs.

[quote] Will he be shirtless in any future episodes?

No, unfortunately. He does wear some tight t-shirts, though, and clearly has a great body.

[quote] Anybody notice the Gillian Anderson poster in his room juxtapositioned with Annabeth Gish--who replaced her on the X-files--playing the dowdy baby doctor?

He also had a "Se7en" movie poster in his bedroom, and I thought the two posters were much more the sort of thing that Mike Flanaghan himself would have had in his teenage bedroom than what this character would ever have had.

This is one of the biggest problems with successful TV showrunners & auteurs--they want the main character to share traits with themselves, when they've written the character and cast him to be nothing like themselves. The only thing that pudgy and dumpy Flanaghan and hot Riley Flynn really have in common is that they're Irish-American alcoholics.

I like it, but I agree about the speeches. There are too many of them. There are also too many musical montages. The other thing I don't understand is the older people in this town look weird and I'm not sure why. I'm on episode 4 so maybe that will be answered. But at this point this show will not be getting a nomination for makeup.

Love, love, love this show. Definitely my favorite vampire story. Subversive and funny.

And I actually enjoyed the speeches. ESPECIALLY when Riley and Erin exchange their opinions on what happens when they die. I am inclined to agree with Riley, but from a purely selfish standpoint I am attracted to Erin's hopeful outlook.

Saving the final episode for tomorrow.

Just watched first episode. Skipped all the posts here so I won’t see spoilers. I love Zach Gilford and Hamish Linklater, so I was interested. Liked it so far, but…

My, what a DIVERSE, tiny island!

50 year old Henry Thomas and 49 year old Kristin Lehman (loved her in The Killing and didn’t even recognize her here) playing the parents of 39 year old Zach Gilford threw me a bit at first, but it pretty much works. They make the parents look older so I guess it won’t be too distracting.

I just binged the whole thing. I really liked it, but... it needed some script editing (those speeches - damn) and some film editing (each episode ran way too long). As I said in an earlier post the musical montages were a little too much and heavy handed. The old age makeup was horrible. It was a satisfying ending and overall enjoyable, but I wouldn't expect it to win any awards.

Bev is clearly a Datalounger.

This is better than any show that heavily relies on Neil Diamond songs has a right to be.

That said, I have some complaints. Bev is a tedious villain. You are never tempted to understand anything she does; she’s just tiresome. And the dialog exists mostly to announce, loudly, the Big Themes, or to drop Giant Clues. (Do you think the cruets used for mass have been mentioned enough? Did you notice there’s a giant flying creature in town?)

Toward the end of the first episode, when I finally realized that it was Michael Trucco (Sam from Battlestar Galactica) I burst out, "What the fuck did they do to him?" They made him ugly. Once they started easing back on the aging makeup he didn't look that much better with the terrible mustache.

I thought it was okay. It bothered me that nobody looked at the "angel," and said, "uhm, dude, I think that's a demon."

Overall, I thought it was okay, but I was bummed that pretty Zach Gilford bowed out so early, and that his parents never found out about the sacrifice that he made.

PS. I liked it MUCH better than The Haunting of Hill House, which I HATED. In part because Shirley Jackson is one of my favorite writers, and that book has the best opening paragraph in all of American Literature.

Why bother to license a book, and basically use the title, a few character names, and little bits and pieces of the book's setting, and then tell a totally different story. Just call it something else, because that was not The Haunting of Hill House.

Journeys end in lovers meeting, motherfuckers.

So Bev didn't even believe the bullshit she was spouting. She just used it to bully and manipulate the townsfolk. I enjoyed her meltdown when she realized non existence was inevitable.

It's worth noting that Mike Flanagan and his production partner, Trevor Macy, had almost nothing to do with The Haunting of Bly Manor. He only wrote the first episode and then left to do this show and then gave the rest to a lot of lesser known writers and directors, each which were responsible for exactly one episode, which is why every episode had wildly different pacing and directorial styles and that ridiculously campy black and white episode out of nowhere. Put less kindly, it's why it was a hot mess and isn't really representative of his - yes, very very wordy - writing and directorial style.

As a horror fan I like that we have a Mike Flanagan right now. I haven’t loved everything he’s done but he is wordy and thoughtful and really thinks about characters and relationships. His projects aren’t just loud dumb slash fests. And he makes stories for the Most part about ADULTS which is also rare when it comes to the genre’ and which adds its own flavor too

OK, so now to the actual meaning of the ending, courtesy of Flanagan: “We’re not saying he died… Our hope really there was just to say that Leeza’s concentration in her blood had begun to tip back, that she was going to be OK. We didn’t want it to confirm about The Angel, in that way that you can never kill fanaticism, it’ll always kind of come back. But I love that that’s what it meant to you!”

I think Riley's mom pretty much nailed it where Bev was concerned and her motivation. Everybody knows a Bev.

I like that Hamish Linklater is handsome but in such an atypical way.

f it's at all successful, there will be a sequel, just because it was so clar the Angel/Demon was set up to have escaped and bvecauyse we never got any explanation what it was doing in a cave in Israel in the first place.

It's interesting to realize there was no sex in this series, nor even shirtlessness;

Why did the Angel/Demon go around wearing Msgr. Pruitt's hat and coat at night, since that basically ensured it would be recognized?

I ended up loving this. First time I enjoyed Mike Flanagan's work.

While the speeches could have been shorter, I think the lengthy "what happens after death" dialogue made sense. I actually teared up at Riley's take on the subject, especially after the way he decided to die.

Didn't realize that was Henry Thomas until a scene from the second episode where his character is wearing a regular long-sleeve shirt. I was like..."His father has a nice body. Wait..."

Yeah, i also didn't notice it was Henry Thomas until Riley and his father are having the discussion on the boat. Almost unrecognizable.

Awkward that they made Henry Thomas's character rant and rave about his son having a DUI though.

He was kind of a dick about it too. He tampered with his urine test and threatened to have the officer fired.

To be totally fair, as I understand what happened, he wasn't actually driving when he was arrested - his car was running, but he'd pulled over and put the car in park and had fallen asleep at the wheel. A police officer noticed and stopped to check on what was going on, but of course, he must've driven drunk to even get there. What a dumbass - certainly he could afford to call an Uber.

He also brought out the "Do you know who I am?" line.

I hope that was met with snickers from the cops, r66.

Who is going to be intimidated by threats from the kid from "E.T."?? "I'll make sure you never get to work with Drew Barrymore in your miserable lives! OR Dee Wallace Stone!"

So many actors made up with terrible age makeup or made up to look older than their actual age, like Henry Thomas. I thought there was going to be a flashback episode where we see all the characters twenty years earlier or something.

I thought Thomas was supposed to look prematurely aged because he's a fisherman.

Before I figure out what was going on, I was blaming Covid for the really bad makeup. I'm really surprised by how bad it was.

I also want to give a shout out to the actress who played Riley's mom. She did a great job.

Agree Riley’s Mom is best performance

I tried to watch this, but too much f'ing religion. Oh well, I suppose that's to be expected with a show with the word 'mass' in its title.

r72 i actually found it the opposite...that anyone, anywhere no matter what the situation could try to match up any bible verse/passage to match up ANY situation. it's pretty subjective to whatever you want to apply it to.

Watched the final episode yesterday. Once again, I really love this show.

Sorry about the religiosity r72. I initially felt the same way and almost abandoned watching. As the series progresses, however, I realized that religion is very much not the point. The exposure of an hypocritical, opportunistic use of religion is actually why it is used. By the same token, it is not really a vampire story. It is actually an examination of how humanity strives to understand life and death and the vast mystery between the two.

I commented upthread how much I appreciated the discussion of how differently Riley and Erin view what happens after they die. This comes up again in the final episode in the last moments of Erin's life when she sees the truth of Riley's idea of the disintegration of the body and mind into atoms and energy. However, the revelation is not that this represents an ending but rather a reunion with all atoms and energy. Due to recent events in my own life I have been examining just this question and find her ultimate realization extraordinarily hopeful. The joy of awakening into a larger understanding of what it means to be reunited with those who have died before us is an idea that I find deeply satisfying.

I see no need for a second season, but I will watch the fuck out if it if it happens.

The sheriff was cute. There were too many long speeches. I fast forwarded a couple. The awful old-person makeup on the doctor’s mom let me know what was going to happen the first time I saw her. Terrible job there.

Fuck Father Pruitt/Hill. He got everyone except two people killed all because he wanted to cure/de-age his old hookup? What a dick. The “Angel” was clearly a demon. He’s a moron.

At least the acting wasn’t too bad.

I used "Buffy" logic and assumed that the demon was "The Master" the OG, the original vampire. But I kind of get why they thought he was an angel. Angels have complicated depictions across all forms of storytelling, they are not always cute little cherubs. Plus this guy was offering enteral, everlasting life. Seems kind of angel-like to me.I'm no Bible scholar, far from it, but aren't they always talking about "the blood" in the Bible. And for some reason in vampire stories, the concept of vampires never exists until they encounter one.

Don’t t Anne Rice’s vampires descend from an archangel or something like that? It’s been so long since I read the books.

In Guillermo Del Toro and Chuck Hogan's Strain trilogy, vampires sprang from the dismembered body and blood of an Archangel. I haven't watched the series, but I assume that they carrier that over from the novels.

Huh, I posted something here earlier and it seems to have vanished. Oh well, it was just expressing my thirst for Rahul Kohli. Maybe I'll post something more substantive after gathering my thoughts. On the whole I liked it a lot, but I think it had some issues.

Haven't read all of the Anne Rice books but from I remember of Queen of the Damned, the first vampire was a sort of possession; a spirit entered the body of a dying person, creating a hybrid creature.

Was the doctor the only one who didn’t come back to life at the end? Why was that? She was a churchgoer who (unknowingly) regularly drank the communion blood right? Or did she not go to church and stayed home with her mom? I can’t remember.

It’d make sense if she didn’t go to church and drank the blood that she stayed dead.

I guess Riley’s parents and everyone else had enough vampire blood in them that when they died they were resurrected.

I figured vampires as soon as I saw the dead cats and trunk. Only watched first episode but looking forward to religious cunts dear already.

From what I've read, which isn't much since I'm completely uninterested in religion, the idea of angels as beautiful isn't quite accurate. Angels and demons have more in common than people have been led to believe.

The old monsignor was an obvious makeup job too (not as bad as the senile old woman). However I did not see the actual reveal regarding his character coming, so that was a nice surprise - for me, anyway….I’m probably the only one who didn’t see that coming 🙃.

The actress playing the old senile woman was good as the lead in the low budget horror film “Starry Eyes”. She wasn’t so great in this one, unfortunately.

It was cute how they snuck in Carla Gugino.

How many Flanagan projects does an actor have to be in to be considered part of the family? This is the second time for Trucco and Kohli.

Brenton for the sequel: “Midnight Massive Thighs”!

They won’t do a second season of this. The “series” is basically anthology with no connection other than actors he likes to have return.

Once father Pruitt realized he couldn’t go out in the sunlight and had to drink blood to survive, he should’ve called the plan off. Why would he want to make his followers have to exist like that? For eternal life? Isn’t that unnatural? That has to be a sin.

For every season.... yada yada. We live, we die. Everlasting life isn’t gods plan, surely.

He definitely shouldn’t have been giving them blood without giving them a choice.

One thing you can be sure that Mike Flanagan, a straight man, is gonna do is put lesbians in all of his work.

Both on screen and off, too - Alex Essoe, the woman who played the doctor's senile mother, is an out lesbian.

I spoiled myself on this show, looking for gay [male] content -- a missed opportunity with the Riley character -- but I suppose it wasn't meant to be.

Flanagan's wife is always in his films. She's an out bisexual.

That's HAWT, R89!

[quote] They won’t do a second season of this

Definitely and Mike is already filming his next series for Netflix starring some of the cast here as well. He seems to have a pool of actors like Ryan Murphy. About MM - I felt it didn't stick its landing. The finale is a hot mess but otherwise the whole series is very good.

The new upcoming series is based on YA novels, I think?

The Midnight Club based on a book by RL Stine. It's about five terminally ill patients in a hospital telling ghost stories to each other. Heather Langenkamp will star.

R80 no the Dr only went to church with her mother & frowned upon the whole thing; she was an out lesbian & didn’t seem interested in the church.

R83 where was Carla Gugino? I must’ve missed her, she’s my fave & I was expecting to see her.

Rahul Kohli is hot, but I thought he looked better in Bly Manor.

Carla Gugino did a voice over as the judge in Riley's case.

I really liked the 2nd haunted series but I guess I’m one of the few. I liked the characters more in that one than in MM (though I enjoyed both series).

[quote] Once father Pruitt realized he couldn’t go out in the sunlight and had to drink blood to survive, he should’ve called the plan off. Why would he want to make his followers have to exist like that? For eternal life? Isn’t that unnatural? That has to be a sin.

He reveals in the last episode he finally realized he did it all because he could not bear to lose Millie, the doctor's mother, and that it was indeed a selfish plan. He does not sue the word "sinful," but I assume he realized as much.

The miniseries is in many ways about the nature of fanaticism, and how both he and Bev twisted Biblical scripture around to justify getting what they wanted for selfish reasons. Msgr. Pruitt wanted Millie to be his and for them both to be young again; Bev wanted to be on the winning side of whom she saw as the just, and be punishing whom she was as the wicked. Both of them were willing to embrace evil in order to get what they wanted.

[quote]Everlasting life isn’t gods plan, surely.

Isn't eternal life all over the Bible? If you have faith, you will live forever. Isn't that kind of whole point of Christian religion?

[quote]Fuck Father Pruitt/Hill. He got everyone except two people killed all because he wanted to cure/de-age his old hookup? What a dick. The “Angel” was clearly a demon. He’s a moron.

Agreed. I didn't like that he got a happy ending (more or less). He brought actual evil to that island and most ended up dead... all because he was selfish and arrogant. I did enjoy the moment when he told Mildred that he had wanted to be with her, and she replied something to the effect of, "I would never have left my husband for you." John really thought it was all up to him? His hubris is the reason so many of those people met an incredibly gruesome and painful end.

He should have been howling in agony and clawing at the earth alongside his little Tracey Flick. That would have been more fitting. Not that little sappy kiss on the bridge.

Anyone would have been better in the Erin Greene role than fucking Kate Siegel. She's going to be the streaming version of Leslie Mann--they can't get substantive work unless their husband gives it to them. Siegel is so earnest, I can't stand her.

Stephen King must be on the phone with his lawyer, because Mike Flanigan absolutely ripped off his style and tropes. Vampires? Check? Rural Maine? Check. Religious zealots? Check. Dimwitted rednecks? Check. Demonic beast smuggled into town in a trunk? CHECK PLEASE!

Sorry to you Flanigan fans, but she's a shit writer and this project could have been so much better in someone else's hands. The pacing was awful; almost nothing happened in the first two episodes and yet the final two were overstuffed with chaos to the point where it became tedious.

And let's talk about the goddamn, plot-killing,, action-stopping deadening MONOLOGUES!! Good God!! Each and every one brought the show to a screeching halt. Why did every character need at least a couple of mind-numbing soliloquies? People don't actually speak that way! When the Annabeth Gish character begs the sheriff for immediate help with bloodsucking vampires and he interrupts to tell her all about how he fell into his career, she just sits there without a word!! It was so absurd, it played like an SNL parody.

I think Flanigan had enough plot for a 4-episode order and Netflix ordered 7, so he padded the whole damn thing.

Flanagan directed Doctor Sleep…so he and King are friendly, I think.

The whole thing had a…Canadian whiff about it.

R100 the sheriff telling his backstory was terrible. It went on and on and on. And after all that, the only thing she asks is, “You don’t carry a gun?”

I’d be like, “ look, man, I get you just want a quiet place to be a cop, but you still have to be a fucking cop. Serious shit is going on in the church, you must investigate.”

He was told/ knew that three people were missing at that point- Riley, bowl, and Joe, and he seemed to forget that. And nothing was done about Bev poisoning the dog. The church is suddenly having mass at night, and that’s not odd? He was an idiot.

Doctor Sleep was a good movie, I thought. A decent sequel to The Shining.

It was allowed to be decent because Flanagan didn't force his untalented wife into any of the roles.

I'm sure he wanted to cast her as Rose the Hat but the studio told him to fuck off.

[quote] He seems to have a pool of actors like Ryan Murphy.

Meh. RM is mediocre, but at least his shows include gay guy storylines.

This series isn't set in Maine, it's set in Washington State (or off the coast of)

The lady who played Rose the Hat was perfect. And her sidekick (Crow?) was pretty hot.

I had to look up Flanagan's wife, I had no idea it was the lady who played Erin Greene. She was okay in MM, nothing great.

I thought she was really great in Hush. She was just okay in MM.

I just recognized the priest as Christine's brother in the New Adventures of Old Christine..

Hamish Linklater's partner is Lily Rabe.

Rabe should have been Erin Greene, would have been a huge improvement!

They could have at least gotten Zach Gilford’s shirt off for a scene.

R113, you can tell when a straight man's eye is in charge of things..

Yeah,we got of lesbian action in Hill House and Bly Manor.

*** SPOILER***

The most shocking thing for me was when Riley died. I thought for sure that he was the hero of the story and we were gearing up for some epic battle. Then I just read an article with the writer who says that the show originally was about Riley versus Hill, then he switched it and it became about Erin versus Bev.

Gag. The wife probably read the final screenplays and bitched up a storm until he changed it all for her.

Hamish Linklater is a terrible name. He should have changed it.

[quote] Then I just read an article with the writer who says that the show originally was about Riley versus Hill, then he switched it and it became about Erin versus Bev.

Which may have been a good idea, because it did make it seem less like "Salem's Lot" then it would have otherwise to center more on the women than on the men.

It was weird, though, that Riley dropped out as the lead after being set up as such in the first few episodes.

[quote]because it did make it seem less like "Salem's Lot" then it would have

Oh [italic]dear[/italic] to myself: I meant "than," not "then."

Flanagan's wife, Kate Siegel, is TERRIBLE. She does not have the right look for any of the characters that she is cast in for these Netflix shows. She has obvious veneers, nose job, and probably other plastic surgeries that just do not work for her characters.

Honey, she done got up and walked.

R121 that's the funniest and bitchiest thing here yet

Agree about Katie Siegel. I've never seen her before and don't think she had the "it factor" to carry this role. About the best performance was when she was dying and her face barely changed during her whole monologue.

Thanks for the poster that mentioned Carla Gugino was snuck in here...I didn't catch it at all.

Hamish Linklater is a very Brit name. I don't know why he should change it at all and don't agree.

I don't see how Hamish Linklater is any worse a name than Benedict Cumberbatch or Yahya Abdul-Mateen II.

Yo-Yo Ma? Elon Musk?

They're all ridiculous!

Doja Cat, Megan Thee the Stallion??? all stupid names.

I watched the whole thing wondering how the terrible actress playing Erin was cast. NOW it makes sense.

The actress playing the doctor’s mother was bad, too.

Okay, got some info about the bad aging makeup-Even though they did tests, the lighting design changed without telling the makeup crew (who will buy colors and pieces for the entire show in pre-production after the camera tests are approved). To purchase new colors and pieces would have cost in the hundreds of thousands, so that wasn’t happening, and since the looks were established, they would have to keep continuity to avoid a jarring change.

The makeup team would take the actor out in the natural light, and the makeup would look great, but as soon as they got on set, the lighting would make it look like shit, and MF would scream and complain about it. They also filmed out of sequence, so it was on/off/on, which led to 20 hour days for the makeup crew (applications can take up to 4 hours, with removal at up to an hour).

What I don’t get is why they didn’t even try to cast Annabelle’s character with an older woman, a la the excellent German series, « Dark », which successfully casts teens, adults, and elderly people as the same character.

I wanted to like it, but yeah, the run-on monologues, especially Hamish’s and that religious bitch’s, we’re excruciating to get through. I wanted to kill them both. Overall, I’d give it a 5/10.

[quote]What I don’t get is why they didn’t even try to cast Annabelle’s character with an older woman

That's an interesting point. I looked up Annabelle's age. She's 50 and I'm assuming she was playing somewhere between 45-50. They had her parents, in their original states, look really old. How old were they supposed to be when they had her.

I also like the idea of casting different, yet similar looking actors, to play the characters as they de-aged. It would have been better than that makeup.

[quote]Flanagan directed Doctor Sleep…so he and King are friendly, I think.

I follow King on twitter & he highly recommended this show, which is how I heard about it in the first place. Particularly since Salem's Lot is in the process of yet another remake, he must believe that a well done knock off can only be good publicity for the real thing. But King's stories - particularly early ones - were very much inspired by Stoker or Lovecraft, so maybe he has a broader view of the situation.

Either that or he's got so much $$ at this point, he just doesn't care.

I'm not complaining but I wonder why Flanagan includes lesbian characters in all of his projects on Netflix? I suppose the Netflix audience enjoys shit like "ticking the boxes" or whatever. But it is curious. Apparently his plastic wife is "bisexual" so perhaps that's why.

Yep, King was plugging the show well before it aired, so he's not calling a lawyer.

The actor playing Sturge used to be hot.

Hamish Linklater isn't British. He's from Massachusetts.

Hamish Linklater does not move his lips when he's trying to be dramatic. It's been bugging me for several episodes.

He has a lot of forehead wrinkles that kind of bug me.

He also went to the Neve Campbell In Party Of Five school of acting. "I-i-i- never... THOUGHT it-it-it... it would... COME to... to..."

The lesbian characters in The Haunting of Bly Manor were originally supposed to be a man and a woman. The male lead character, Jamie the Groundskeeper, was to be played by Oliver Jackson-Cohen, and the female lead was Victoria Pedretti. This is why they were announced as "the leads" originally. However, Netflix thought it would be too strange to have them play lovers, so they, yes, checked a box by casting the character as a woman and changing nothing else. And then cutting all of OJC's role down to 3-4 episodes.

Nevertheless, it IS strange that he never, ever has gay male characters or even bisexuals. It's just lesbians all the way down.

This show has become a huge hit for Netflix and everybody is talking about it. Do you think that Ryan Murphy is green with jealousy over fellow gay Mike Flanagan's tremendous success on Netflix?

[quote] Nevertheless, it IS strange that he never, ever has gay male characters or even bisexuals.

Not that strange. He's just your typical horny straight man of a certain age who has a fixation with les/bi women -- as if that's not played-out and derivative at all.

R140, are you Yvonne Elliman?

Mike Flanagan isn't straight.

[quote]Mike Flanagan isn't straight.

And I'm the dame who can prove it!

,/-“

On my Block Season 4 drops Monday!

I’m lost as to why this show was so coddled by most reviewers. I’m in five episodes and while it’s okay enough to keep me interested, it drags on and on and on and on….. There’s a reason nobody’s seen the Hamish guy in anything since that mid-2000’s sitcom he did with Julia Louis-Dreyfus: he drones on from one sentence to another and can make one line feel like a boring 15 minute soliloquy. I want to fast forward every time he starts up again, which is pretty much the entire series after about the second episode. There is zero character development outside his unlikable priest character. He starts chewing the scenery to pieces around episode three and gets worse from there, melting down into full-blown camp. Deep into it, they kill off the protagonist that’s been leading you through the story. It’s just one, big mess. Is it supposed to be “sophisticated” because it shows a bunch of crazy Christians being cult like, balanced by the ever-pious Muslim cop, (who’s essentially a updated version of “the magic negroe”character)?

The campy 15-minute-long sermons and Hamish Linklater scenes where he’s droning on in male vocal fry for up to 20 minute non-stop scenes are too much on their own. But then you’ve got all the rest that makes huge portions of the show nearly unbearably boring and difficult not to fast forward through or leave the room during. I’m not getting the reviews making it some precious TV masterpiece. It’s a cheesy camp fest.

My opinions are FACTUALLY CORRECT. I have stated my boundaries!

I tried watching an episode last night that I ended up fast forwarding because the lead female and male, can't remember their names, had some insufferably long scene discussing death. It went on and on until I was comatose from boredom.

While Hamish Linklater does have a certain "style", I don't think it's fair to blame him, solely, for what was on the page and how he was directed. Because it's clear this is what Mike Flanagan was going for. I liked the series, but the scripts were first year film school level.

^ that was actually the only monologue I enjoyed in the series.

[quote] The Midnight Club based on a book by RL Stine. It's about five terminally ill patients in a hospital telling ghost stories to each other. Heather Langenkamp will star.

Christopher Pike actually (unless you are implying he and Stine are actually the same person)?

Zach Gilford and the actors playing Bev, Sturge and Zach’s little brother are in the cast. I don’t see the wife listed on IMDB so maybe she is sitting this one out?

He will start filming his fifth series (Something Is Killing The Children) soon. That one is based on a comic book series.

[quote] (who’s essentially a updated version of “the magic negroe”character)?

Oh, [italic]dear.[/italic]

It was certainly an... interesting narrative choice that even the atheist character wasn't spared from succumbing to the religious zealotry, albeit against his will, and only the agnostic lesbian and one of the Muslims were strong enough to really fully reject it.

Can anyone who's watching this mess even imagine having to sit in a room with "Hamish Linklater" for more than 10 minutes, while he moans on about his "craft" and the characters he's played? (Which is, from my count, all of two at this point?) I would poison myself.

[quote] Weirdly, the only people who I thought were weak were the teenage actors--none of them was any good.

Weird as I was just going to post how terrific Leeza (crippled, black teen) was in the scene with the drunk that shot her. She did a terrific job with that.

The other kids, not so much.

The teen actor in Flanagan's DOCTOR SLEEP was dreadful too, almost ruining the film.

Question and comment. What was in that can that they kept pouring into the communion wine. The label said something like "1000" on it. Poison?

Comment. In a few scenes (not close ups) Hamish looked like Anthony Perkins. And, sound a lot like Anthony Perkins.

PS: Zach Gilford was just on the recently cancelled "Good Girls" show.

BUMP

Sorry - did we discuss what exactly killed the Monsignor (the scene where he miraculously revives)? Did he ingest the rat poison?

With all due respect, I think you missed a big plot point.

[quote]What was in that can that they kept pouring into the communion wine.

It was either the Monsignor's or the "angel's" blood. They're a kind of vampire, and ingesting their blood slowly infected the congregation.

[quote]what exactly killed the Monsignor (the scene where he miraculously revives)? Did he ingest the rat poison?

He was a vampire. Unless you mean the flashback scene where it tells how he became a vampire. In which case, it was because he was turned into a vampire.

It was rat poison. Bev used it to poison the dog and she was poisoning Father Hill.

Bev did use rat poison to poison Joe's dog, but she did not poison the Monsignor.

R164 - that was my assumption as well. He wasn’t converted to a vampire until he died via the rat poison, then revived.

Internet explains it all:

[quote] Father Paul is a vampire, albeit a reluctant one, who becomes sick and dies when he refuses to feed on anyone's blood (he eventually spurts back to life). He was created by the Angel, the original "vampire," who fed Father Paul its own blood when Father Paul was still the 80-year-old Monsignor Pruitt, going on pilgrimage for two weeks in the Holy Land. When Pruitt returned, his youth restored, he pretended to be a different priest.

I felt like the ending was one big climate change metaphor. Religious fanatics high on power, burning it all down and only after realizing they had nowhere to shelter.

I liked the show. Some of the monologues were fantastic and delivered well but a few fell flat.

I also enjoyed subverting the Christ resurrection myth as a vampiric experience. If they do a sequel, they should have it focus on vampire Jesus.

The townsfolk are comical cliches. One episode of this mess was enough.

R167 here - I googled some more and apparently they did not fully explain what killed Father Paul. Was he a vampire who died (again) from not drinking blood and, if so, what revived him? Also, if he was already a vampire at that point how was he able to go out into the sunlight?

A Reddit poster suggested he was drinking the tainted blood of the main vampire who had been feasting on the rats poisoned by Bev (the townspeople drank it too but in much smaller quantities).

Another one suggested Bev was purposely poisoning him because he was a potential obstacle to her money pilfering.

[quote]A Reddit poster suggested he was drinking the tainted blood of the main vampire who had been feasting on the rats poisoned by Bev (the townspeople drank it too but in much smaller quantities).

Yep this is what happened. The congregation was drinking his blood, albeit very diluted.

He first became a vampire when he died and then revived after the angel vampire gave him his blood right after draining in him the cave. That's how he turned the Monsignor. He died and then was resurrected in the cave, hence all the Christ allegory. This is also why Bev tells the distraught old man who killed his wife and sons at the end that he could've revived them after feeding on them.

R170, it was a plot hole in a show with MANY plot holes.

I also can't figure out why he was able to go into the sunlight and why he "died" only to be revived. If it was Bev who poisoned him, any scenes indicating that must have been deleted from the final cut.

What about the stache of corpses in the barn the monster was feeding on in the last episode? Where did they come from? If they were townsfolk, are we to believe no one reported them missing? On an island with only around 100 residents? And who was feeding on the dead cats? The monsignor? If he was already a vampire at that point, why could he go in the sunlight at first? Riley sure couldn't - and the monsignor drank from the monster's blood just as Riley presumably did.

And while we're on the subject, what differentiated someone as merely a food source rather than someone to be resurrected.

People did report them missing, R172. They showed the face of Bowl, the pot dealer from the first couple of episodes, and it was the angel that fed on him.

[quote]what differentiated someone as merely a food source rather than someone to be resurrected.

In the finale, Bev tells Sturge that the criteria is to make exceptions to revive someone in only special, rare cases, implying she didn't think he should've resurrected his best friend, who was now living with the crushing guilt of having murdered his wife and children in a feeding frenzy. Basically the resurrection "gift" was only for the "elect" and "the faithful."

The more that I think about it, you guys must be right and I must be wrong and the death we see in episode 3 or 4 must be when he turns into a vampire. The angel's blood simply healed him and brought him back from the brink, which is what he was trying to do for his daughter in the finale, so he must not have been fully dead in the cave. This is why he only stopped being able to go out in the sunlight after that point.

There's no evidence that Bev did it, though - she needed him around to keep up her piety act. Also all the dead cats - Wade (Michael Trucco) said in the second episode that weird things like that happened routinely to the town and that they'd had previous similar incidents with dolphins and starlings. What was that about? Just a weird red herring?

I loved the angel’s feeding frenzy in the abandoned house in the last episode! The formerly wheel chair-bound girl was shooting at it and it was like “shoo, bitch…can’t you see I’m eating??”

Like me at a Chinese buffet.

I would be interested in watching a prequel about the angel/vampire wreaking havoc in the Holy Land. How did that thing survive being buried for so long (and how long)? I think that civilizations buried in the desert are fascinating.

Why would a Muslim sheriff, unusual in itself, settle in a creepy, dreary fishing village with no halal grocery or Muslim community?

The original monsignor didn't die. Angel's blood made him younger or or the best version of himself. When Paul came back to town he wasn't a vamp yet, he just had Angel's blood in him which is why he could go out in the sun. Paul wasn't a vampire until he died and was reborn. What killed him seemed to be what's up for debate. If it was Bev with the rat poison that was quite unclear, at least to me. I'm not sure what killed him.

I'm also confused by the deeper meaning of Bev when you peel all the layers away. On the surface we all know who Bev is. But, did she really believe that Paul was some kind of messenger from God there to lead their to righteousness? I want a Bev series.

R177 oh, he tells you- during his ridiculous 8 minute long monologue after the doctor asks him to check out the church.

That priest is a regular Jim Jones.

Fuck what a piece of shot this was!! And why the FUCK didn’t shitty little “Leeza” get a peaceful ending? She was a cunt to that drunk before she “forgave” him, and she was in on ALLLL the planning with her evil parents. But she gets to live?! Fuck her.

Hamish Linklater is my new Bobby Cannavale - I’ll forever avoid, or hate anything he’s ever in again. He’s an awful, irritating actor.

Bobby is hot so I forgive him for being a bad actor.

So everyone dies but the kids?

Yup.

R173, it seemed obvious in the first two episode that the "angel" was, in fact, feeding on the dead cats: we saw something flying around on the island and then stalk and kill cats. Plus we were treated to images showing the cats with throat wounds. A lot of vampire stories start out this way; the vampire starts by feeding on animals and transitions to humans. It's a signal to us in the audience that a vampire is present, although the characters on screen don't get the message.

Hamish must have something going for him. He and Lily Rabe are expecting their third baby in four years!

I was kind of rooting for the sheriff to live.

I wish the kids would have died, too. Such terrible, earnest actors but it's not their fault--I'll blame the director. He's no Kubrick or Fincher, doing 100 takes to beat the earnestness out of his actors. You see how wide-eyed his wife always acts when she's in things. He's clearly blind to that which is why his projects might be good but will never be great.

I must have missed when the Muslim kid drank the communion blood.

[quote]I must have missed when the Muslim kid drank the communion blood.

He didn't/couldn't as he wasn't baptized and had never been to confession.

R187, the sheriff was a natural protagonist. Because of his commitment to his own religious beliefs, he was never going to weaken and take communion. I would have liked him to have played a stronger role in the story.

And R168, there has already been at least one vampire Jesus that I know of. Bram Stoker's Dracula made a big production of mocking Catholic communion by making his followers drink his blood as he promised them eternal life, so it was a logical development. In fact, I've read at least one horror story in which there is a secret sect in the Catholic Church composed solely of vampire priests.

I really wanted the Muslim kid to get it. His father was trying to tell him, but the dumb ass wouldn't listen. I know that kids rebel, but that was too much for me. It would have made more sense for him to rebel by saying all religion is bullshit.

I feel violated that I was tricked into attending several Catholic Church services.

That's a plot hole with the Muslim kid isn't it? The others all had a bit of vampire blood so they survived the poison. If the kid didn't how did he resurrect? Or was the poison spiked with blood?

I also had several of the same "missing" parts or potential potholes:

1. How did the Monsignor actually die (in front of the town's people)? The foaming at the mouth suggests poisoning, but it's never very clear

2. When did the Muslim kid take communion? did i miss it? he would have had to have ingested some of the "wine" to survive dying and being resurrected

3. Bev started to try to dig in the sand toward the end but didn't finish...and what vampire wouldn't have had the urge to hide themselves from the daylight? couldn't they all have just dug holes and covered themselves up with dirt to avoid being burnt to a crisp? Dumbest vamps ever.

4. And carried over from the last thread, can you believe that NO ONE has ever heard of vampires and they think this is some sort of "blood disease" LOL

They left it open-ended whether the Muslim sheriff and the angel vampire both lived IMO. I think we're supposed to think that the former didn't make it and maybe the latter did, but it's up for debate and Rahul Kohli is firmly up Mike Flanagan's ass now so I wouldn't be surprised if we saw him in a sequel, should it ever come to pass.

R194 the plot hole to me is that the kids who survived both had at least as much vampire blood running through their veins as everyone else, so when they die, won't they become vampires too? Or is that handwaved away by the lesbian doctor's throwaway mention about how we hope that with time the effects dissipate and the fact that, for whatever reason, she couldn't feel her legs again?

I hate the religious speeches.

You would think Bev would've immediately started digging when she realized what happened to the rec center because, yes, they could've all survived by just burying themselves during the day. It was also idiotic of them to burn all but one building. All eggs, one basket, as it were.

[quote] they could've all survived by just burying themselves during the day. It was also idiotic of them to burn all but one building.

Religious zealots making idiotic decisions 🤔…

The townsfolk were horrified by what they had become and wanted to die. Even Bev had a moment of grace - or despair - and went to meet the sunrise, though she panicked at the last moment.

I wonder what it is about monologues that make them such a sticking point for some. Movies are full of unrealistic things, including non-naturalistic speech, but monologues are a bridge too far. It's interesting. Of course the monologues in Hill House and Bly Manor were generally better written, but people complained about them too.

r200 - they are too long and unrealistic. pretty much nobody would sit through that without interrupting at some point to agree or ask a question. IRL, these types of monologues are rare. instead of actually "showing" the meaning, they are explaining the point, which is kind of a no-no. You're supposed to get the audience to that point without a lot of long narrations.

What R201 said. Also, I'll give you one monologue over an entire series, but with this show it was an overused device and as I said earlier, very beginner script writing. If a character is giving a speech, or is an attorney giving opening or closing arguments, or the monologue is used as a voiceover over a montage that's when you use a monologue.

As someone said upthread, did we really need the sheriff explaining how he ended up in the town, especially during that moment? We kind of figured it out earlier with the line from his son that he left his old job because of racism.

With all due respect, you two missed my point. Movies are full of unrealistic things including unrealistic speech patterns. But why is this particular unrealistic thing so damaging to suspension of disbelief? Not saying anyone's reactions are wrongbad, I just find it interesting.

R203, a monologue is, obviously, just an artistic device; it’s not intrinsically good or bad. But there was a sense here that the monologues were being used to tell us what to think about what we were watching, that the material was being interpreted for us.

Monologues were too long and too frequent.

The vampire couldn't fly very fast and was burned in the sun. That's why the vampire "magic" ended for the crippled girl.

I wasn't sure if the sheriff was dead. He was shot twice in the leg and then slumped over but that didn't need to be fatal, not if help came from the mainland in time. I immediately googled and the internet seems to believe that he's dead.

Pruitt having some kind of attack in front of the mayor, Bev and others WAS an attempted poisoning, I think. Bev was a murderer and she poisoned him with the same stuff that she gave that dog and then later gave to the parishioners. The vomit looked the same in all cases. Not sure why she poisoned Pruitt unless she thought he was an abomination and then when he was resurrected fully believe he was a miracle or whatever.

The Muslim boy had been attending mass so he had been ingesting the blood wine.

R191, I would be interested to know about the story you read. Can you remember the author/title?

Another huge hole...the row boat would have caught fire when Riley burned.

"With all due respect" Ms. R200 / R203, R's 201 and 202 didn't miss your point at all. In fact, they gave you an excellent reply and explanation. R201 also said it succinctly and very well; that the tiresome monologue device, abused, bastardized, and made common by awful television writers like Aaron Sorkin, was made even worse in this otherwise interesting series. All the more horrible because the writer/producer had a generally respectable track record before unleashing this absurd mess of a show onto an unsuspecting but trusted viewer. Both replies noted why the use of the monologue here was so damaging to the suspension of disbelief: Primarily due to its over-use, but also due to it being way too heavy-handed, preachy, sanctimonious and ham-fisted for an early autumn cable horror series.

No doubt it worked alright with you. And frankly, maybe that makes you a much more patient, or forgiving viewer than most of us. Maybe there's some sophistication that I miss which you picked-up on, who knows. But for the pay-off in the end, which felt like the writers hit a stone wall and just got up and walked out of the writer's room, it kind of leaves a bitter taste in your mouth as far as entertainment goes. You invest many hours into a story and want to see that story played out. There will always be dead spots in a series or the more dramatic, long-winded scenes which are often perfectly written and produced. But on this series, they felt employed solely to burn time. As someone else said, like Netflix came back and told Flanagan to stretch four episodes into seven.

Meanwhile, with all the time spent on sermons and random living room dancing and "deep" discussions on death or why a secondary character left his former job, imagine if, instead, they would have used all that droning and wasted time to plug-up all the holes and mistakes? What happened to the "angel"? Why did it just let the senile mother go and drop her off in the lawn after flying away with her? Why was the crazed, wild-eyed evangelical bitch going around with rat poison since the opening of the show? Why would she have been poisoning the priest? With all the other backstories, why not her's? What made her such a psycho/angry/vengeful woman? Why didn't Riley, the presumed protagonist, stick around long enough to help save the town and the people he loved instead of being a nelly, emo little bitch and rowing his girlfriend out into the ocean and forcing her to be life-alteringly horrified by watching him explode flames? WHY did all of the evil characters receive a moment of peacefulness toward the end after all they had done, all the death they committed? So what if they stood out in the sun to die, they didn't have anyplace to go. It isn't like they were really doing it to make amends. They gave-in to their fate being sealed. So why would the writer provide them a 'moment of grace' and allow them the same level of peaceful sing-a-long that the few innocent people left deserved more than them? Why was the nasty little crippled allow to escape even a bit of scorn after her actions with the drunk and with knowing and assisting her evil parents in their scheme?

The concept was a little fun but I wouldn't mind having that 7 hours back to watch something that someone put more effort into.

[quote] The Muslim boy had been attending mass so he had been ingesting the blood wine.

No, he would not have been able to take communion since he was not baptized and hadn't been to confession. Catholics take that shit seriously and make you work for it. Mere visitors of other faiths are not allowed to partake of the body and blood of Christ.

Uhm . . . I'm Catholic and haven't been baptized, and have taken the wafer before.

Somebody's triggered!

^^^^🙄

[quote] I really wanted the Muslim kid to get it. His father was trying to tell him, but the dumb ass wouldn't listen. I know that kids rebel, but that was too much for me. It would have made more sense for him to rebel by saying all religion is bullshit.

Wow, THAT would certainly have advanced the plot!

Whatever, I thought Rachel Maddox was fantastic!

Flanagan needs to bring back sexy Michael Huisman for his next project.

r216 100% agree. Also Oliver Jackson-Cohen.

There is a really fun Instagram I follow, but yesterday the gay who runs it called this a “masterpiece “ and now I’m doubting his credibility.

My biggest beef is how the hell the Priest got the Angel into a box and kept it docile for travelling.

It’s a masterpiece

My question is if zealot Bev spread the gospel all over and created too many bloodsucking wouldn't they starve eventually?

The vampires in Ann Rice novels addressed this and were careful.

I finished the series last night. It was alright but I didn't enjoy it as much as I enjoyed the Haunting of Hill House.

- The Zach, the actress that played Riley's mother, Hamish, and the actress that played Bev did a great job.

- The teenagers were annoying, as expected. I don't like children/teen characters in media and this series didn't change my mind.

- I don't dislike Kate Siegel as an actress but she should really hold off on any further cosmetic procedures. She initially looked like a Angelina Jolie clone, but whatever she's injecting is giving her an oddly thick face.

- I find it hard to believe that the demon wouldn't have felt his wings being cut.

The final girl shot at the creature and it barely flinched. Pain was not something that registered in the midst of its feeding frenzy.

I think that scene partially set up the wing cutting scene to make us buy into Erin being able to do it without the creature noticing.

[quote]he tiresome monologue device, abused, bastardized, and made common by awful television writers like Aaron Sorkin, was made even worse in this otherwise interesting series

Says the poster who then proceeds to type out a screed that is ten times more abused, bastardized and common than any monologue in this series.

“ - The teenagers were annoying, as expected. I don't like children/teen characters in media.”

Something horrible people say

R219, the “angel” seemed willing to wait for a good final pay-off. It had, by implication at least, been stuck in a cave for a long time before Pruitt stumbled on it, yet it didn’t kill him. It was also willing to make do with cats for a while, even though it had clear chances to attack people.

The kid who played Riley’s brother is named Igby Rigney. I think I’d rather be named Hamish Linklater.

Maybe.

They’re both awful names.

So is the angel Lucifer? A random vampire? An alien?

Someone mentioned the Henry Thomas DUI connection but another eerie coincide is that Zach Gilford's wife had a well-publicized miscarriage.

The monologues weren't used to further the plot. It was used as a thematic or literary device and I enjoyed them for the most part.

[quote] Bev started to try to dig in the sand toward the end but didn't finish...and what vampire wouldn't have had the urge to hide themselves from the daylight? couldn't they all have just dug holes and covered themselves up with dirt to avoid being burnt to a crisp? Dumbest vamps ever.

Being buried alive would be painful even if they could somehow survive. But the irony was that Bev was the most scared to die even though she was portrayed as the most religious.

Isn't that the way it always is.

I didn't buy a brown Muslim man moving to a town where he didn't know anyone with no other Muslims, no mosques, and only one other adult of color, especially after what he experienced in New York.

Masterpiece? Nah. Entertaining? Absolutely...UNTIL the last episode.

The monologues were BRUTAL and by the time the hot “Sharif” went into his--I had enough and FF’d. I had a different experience with this than most of the posts here. I thought Linklater was great actually. Lehman as the mother wasn’t really doing it for me. A little over-the-top. Henry Thomas--a little under-the-top. Siegel was fine. I thought she did well playing the outlier who comes back after some growth. To me, It was obvious that her character is “smarter than everyone in the room” and that she’s miserable but it was really understated. Her character was COMPLETELY out of place.

The star for me is Samantha Sloyan. We’ve seen THAT character a gazillion times, but she really knocked that shit out of the park. I love a sinister, self-righteous, zealotty, scene-chewing role. I mean….toward the end, I was really DONE with it all, and it seems like the writers were as well. It was both rushed AND like it was never going to end. I think they should’ve added one more episode instead of cramming all of the deaths AND the father’s secret AND Greene’s monologue about death (talk about neverending) in the last 10 minutes.

The number of potholes was ridiculous. I’m ASSUMING that Greene damaged the angel’s wings so much that it couldn’t fly off the island and died during the massive fire. I’m ASSUMING the sheriff died from his wounds. I’m ASSUMING Bev added poison to the blood for the congregation to die while in service. Too many glaring holes to assume, especially if there’s not going to be a second season.

My issues with religion are plenty and this series touched on ALL of them. I don’t trust ANYTHING that can be twisted and used to oppress like religion so using it as justification for allowing vampirism to turn an entire town is brilliant. If anyone is questioning their faith, they should look at this and think about it. Are THESE the kind of people you want in your life? Teaching your children? Leading the country?

They’re so fucking dumb and lost that they let a vampire pull a Jonestown on them. I just can't imagine people being this oblivious, but we've certainly seen it recently. Haven't we?

[quote]"With all due respect" Ms. [R200] / [R203], R's 201 and 202 didn't miss your point at all. In fact, they gave you an excellent reply and explanation.

They basically just said "unrealistic", but some later replies were more thoughtful, especially yours. Thanks for that, really appreciate your post. Ultimately it's a matter of taste.

[quote]I’m ASSUMING that Greene

[quote]I’m ASSUMING the sheriff

[quote]I’m ASSUMING Bev

Well, you certainly didn't make an ass out of me.

Bev definitely poisoned the parishioners. All those little Dixie cups were filled with poison. It showed her with the bottle before the last mass.

I thought it was pretty clear that they used poison on the church congregation, but they had a choice to drink it. I also think that some things in film and TV and fine to be left open for the viewers to decide. I don't think we will ever know if Angel died. Based on previous vampires, when the OG dies all of his/her power and sires die. This show really didn't go into too much mythology so that's left up to interpretation. When the girl could no longer feel her legs, that was a big clue about Angel.

Omg, the monologue at r234!

(Just kidding) 😉

Samantha Sloyan’s Bev >>> Marcia Gay Harden’s Mrs. Carmody

The answer to all your long, tedious, OCD, minuteluy detailed plot hole observations:

It was a wizard!

[quote] The number of potholes was ridiculous. I’m ASSUMING that Greene damaged the angel’s wings so much that it couldn’t fly off the island and died during the massive fire. I’m ASSUMING the sheriff died from his wounds. I’m ASSUMING Bev added poison to the blood for the congregation to die while in service. Too many glaring holes to assume, especially if there’s not going to be a second season.

I watched it and didn't know any of the above was meant to be ambiguous. We literally saw the sheriff die, Bev poison the congregation etc.

[quote] That's a plot hole with the Muslim kid isn't it? The others all had a bit of vampire blood so they survived the poison. If the kid didn't how did he resurrect? Or was the poison spiked with blood?

I thought the blood was mixed with poison but now I can't remember if that was made explicit.

I believe the angel died at the end in the sunlight while trying to make it off the island to the mainland. After seeing the angel fly with hurt wings, the teenage boy said that he didn't think that the angel could make it 30 miles before sunrise. Then, the series ends with the teenage girl saying that she can't feel her legs, implying that the angel died and that the his gifts went with him.

The creature’s death is supposed to be a tad ambiguous, as it is with the endings of most horror films. I didn’t find that part unsatisfactory at all.

Watching Kate Siegel always reminds me of the Dick Tracey character, 88 Keyes.

She's certainly what is referred to as a "tooth actor" - the majority of her acting is done through her teeth. She also flashes a smile a lot to show she's nervous or agitated. I'm aware some people do this IRL, but on screen, it's quite a distracting tic.

Mike Flanagan disagrees that Leeza's last line means anything about the fate of the angel creature, for the record. He says the reason he had her say that was to call back to the conversation between the doctor, her mother, and Erin in episode 7 where her mother asks if there's any going back to normal if a person has ingested some of the angel's blood, and the doctor says that, yes, in theory, without continuing to ingest it, the person could go back to normal.

As others have noted, MM has some serious plot holes, but overall it was very entertaining. It was the first time in a long time I binge watched a series from start to end. The vampire sing along at the end - what hoot! No wonder Stephen King loved it.

I thought the show borrowed not just from Salem's Lot, but the Mist (the crazy religious lady & the religious fervor that takes over & blinds people to what's really going on) and 30 Days of Night. Even still, the whole idea of being visited not by a monster by an angel (and that's a fair point - isn't everyone in the bible - including Mary, freaked out when they're visited by an angel?) was a unique take.

- I thought the sheriff definitely died and while the whole muslim/9-11 storyline was a bit ham handed, the actor was excellent & it offered a different perspective on what it means to be devout. I thought it was moving it at the end that everyone (including the obnoxious Bev) was crying & freaking out, while the sheriff & his son ended their lives peacefully praying.

- When the minister got sick & died, my interpretation is that he's going through some kind of withdrawal from the blood. He was sort of Bev's meal ticket to importance, she'd be the last person to kill him off.

- Even though the minister keeps talking about being healed from the blood, he clearly remembers living a life full of regret & what could've been. I thought that's how he was able to connect so well to the two local pariahs. The whole thing with the doctor being his daughter was kind of cheesy, but I guess that it explains why they made the lesbian doctor wear that awful black wig.

- I never thought Zack Gilford was that great in FNL - it was clearly Taylor Kitsch's show - but he was very good in this one. That scene with his father telling him how much he resented him was devastating & it was genuinely moving when his last image was the girl that he killed offering him her hand.

- I didn't really buy Bev having that much power; yeah, she's some religious old biddy and every small town has one, but she had no husband & it's hard to imagine the local (male) elders not pushing her to the side over the important stuff.

Bev had power. She obtained her power the way people like that always obtain power, they are willing to do the work that no one else wants to do. This gives access and control.

By *power*, I meant the role she played in getting the townspeople to sign off on the bad settlement with the oil company that broke the back of local economy. But she definitely controlled access to the priest who appeared to work miracles & then of course after he kills the guy, then she really has power over him. But as a general rule, she seemed like someone the locals would roll their eyes at and begrudgingly tolerate

[quote]But, did she really believe that Paul was some kind of messenger from God there to lead their to righteousness?

I thought he was just a means to an end for her; she didn't blink when he killed the old alkie - he was killing off people she didn't like. She was clearly pissed that he brought back Riley because she thought he wasn't worth it. She's a classic fundie Trump supporter type - one that uses religion for their own cynical purposes and has 0 fucks to give over what Jesus *actually* said

R248 Thanks. I guess I didn't notice any significant plot holes but that may be because I guessed the writer's intention even if by accident. I even wondered if that character would become paralyzed again before it happened.

So what happened to the baby? Why did it disappear from her womb??

[quote]R172: What about the stache of corpses in the barn…

Oh, dear.

R254 It was rejected after she drank the communion blood.

Not Christian and have never been to a church in my life but the songs were beautiful. Got chills. Episodes 5 and 6 are some of the best television I've ever seen.

R256 is correct. In the scene where Erin, the doctor and the doctor's mother are discussing the blood findings, Erin asks what would happen if someone pregnant drank the blood and the doctor responds that it would probably cause the body to totally reject it and implies that's what caused her full and spontaneous "healing" from the miscarriage so that she showed no signs of pregnancy. Basically the blood "heals" whatever is ailing you and would recognize a fetus as a foreign invader that needed to be eradicated, like a virus. This to me had some interesting sci-fi implications: the idea that vampirism is a sort of supercharged immune-boosting blood disorder. But like many other plot points on this show, it didn't really go anywhere.

Bev was a sour-faced, over zealous old bitch. I loved her! Props to the actress who played her. I also thought it was interesting how she was doling out all the poison but then seemed to flee scared into the back room, almost like she was going to back out. Unless she was a bit gutless and wanted to get shot thinking death/resurrection would come more quickly.

She was written as a typical religious fanatic - especially towards the end where she became increasingly deranged, while quoting the Bible to justify all the bad things she was doing. So true to life for so many religious zealots, if a little over the top.

Even the Muslim cop was two dimensional. A nice guy on the surface, but still a slave to his religion, believing it was "better" than Christianity and being pissed off that his son didn't want to follow it and guilting him with his dead mother. Quite dark when you think about it.

I was raised Catholic so a lot of it brought back memories... First Holy Communion, going to confession, the over pious parishioners and do-gooders who aren't so good. My mum said I had to attend Church until I was 18, which reminded me a bit of the Muslim cop forcing his religion on his son.

[quote]This to me had some interesting sci-fi implications: the idea that vampirism is a sort of supercharged immune-boosting blood disorder.

A new take on the "a dingo ate your baby" line - Vampire blood ate your baby!

I didn't think Bev chewed scenery at all. I thought the fact that she was a stone-cold bitch who never lost her cool made her that much more creepy!

[quote] This to me had some interesting sci-fi implications: the idea that vampirism is a sort of supercharged immune-boosting blood disorder. But like many other plot points on this show, it didn't really go anywhere.

I thought it was dealt with quite well actually, to the extent that the series can remain grounded. I also liked that the characters ultimately chose their humanity and mortality at the end. I also like that the paralyzed girl was relieved at the end when she went back to normal.

[quote]Basically the blood "heals" whatever is ailing you and would recognize a fetus as a foreign invader that needed to be eradicated, like a virus.

Intriguing.

Also liked the fact that the Muslim sheriff rejected it even after seeing his wife die in an agonizing way.

It was also accurate for Islam, which has fairly strict dietary laws, including the prohibition of drinking or eating anything with blood.

As a Brit just two questions.

Why was the lead character a midget (Riley)?

And who would live on that shithole Island.?

I've been to more appealing 3rd world countries. It makes Jaywick in the UK look desirable.

I live in MD not far from Smith Island and that place is literally sinking due to climate change and there are very few people left, but people continue to live there because their families have always lived there and worked on the bay. Also, the inhabitants were largely fairly poor, it's not like they can afford to go live in Seattle.

The island had once been prosperous and thriving but the oil spill, or whatever it was, started its decline and people started leaving and the ones left couldn't afford to leave or stayed for family ties. Bev just like being a big fish in a little pond.

Netflix+Flanagan 4eva

Wonder who his wife will play in that one.

She'll play Madeline Usher with Hamish Linklator as Roderick.

I like Siegel but found her jarringly modern in the Bly Manor flashback, so I'm hoping she doesn't have a big role in Usher. Unless the whole thing is going to be contemporary.

The entire Bly Manor flashback episode was jarring and B-movie campy. It was directed by a first-time director who is a fan of horror B-movies so it probably couldn't be helped.

This one'll almost certainly be contemporary and it's not going to be an exact retelling of The Fall Of The House of Usher - it's going to be like Hill House and Bly Manor were, incorporating aspects of all of Edgar Allan Poe's work in the story and introducing new characters and villains. But I think it won't happen for a while since he's first developing and shooting an adaptation series of "Something Is Killing the Children."

I don't understand why he doesn't want to call it a continuation of The Haunting anthology when it so plainly is.

Loved it. Loved everything about it. Loved the directing, the writing, and, especially, the acting. Loved the plaintive hymn underscoring. "Nearer My God to Thee" gets me every time and was so effective at the end. Loved the monologues...every one f them. The first AA meeting with Hamish and Zach was especially good all the way around. Hamish spectacularly carried off what could have been a completely over-the-top character. Loved it.

I liked this better than Mare of Eastown and I really enjoyed that.

Why hasn't anyone mentioned that the sheriff looks exactly like an Arabic John Krasinski? It was uncanny.

The Rahul Kohli/John Krasinski comparison has been a thing for years, starting when Kohli was on “iZombie. He had British Jim Halpert down to a tee in that one. He’s referenced it several times too on Twitter.

Rahul Kohli is Punjabi Hindu.

Just what exactly is the cause of Usher's fall? Someone once mentioned generations of incest but I've never really read it or had much interest when younger.

R277, it’s ambiguous in a way that’s hard to capture on film. Roderick Usher is ill when we meet him, and he seems to draw the narrator into his craziness as the story progresses, to the point that the narrator participates in the near-murder of Roderick’s sister. Or, perhaps, Roderick is telling the truth and the house itself is sentient and evil and doing bad things to all of them.

bump

Just watched the first three episodes and thought they were the dullest pieces of tv I've seen in years. Extremely vapid people talking at great length. Instead of watching the rest, I'll read the spoilelrs on this thread.

But wow, what a bad, bad show. And I was a real fan of Hill House.

I could not figure out who the actor playing Riley reminded me of throughout the entire series and it was really bugging me. After he burst into flames (which was truly shocking) I realized who it was: Steve Gold from Million Dollar Listing NY. Anyone else see it?

The actor who plays Riley looks like James Norton to me.

Relax OP it's Midnight MASS not Midnight ASS

Midnight Ass is the porn version.

Finished it last night. I know this is a common criticism but goddamn, some of those monologues got way too wordy and took away from the impact of the special moments, like Erin’s final speech. I fastforwarded through several, especially the Sherriff’s, whose attempt at an American accent was very spotty. The Brit kept jumping out. I also think it took way too long to get to the action, but overall it worked far better for me than Bly Manor did. And very relevant to the current climate where idolatry and tribalism are so rampant. People see the monstrous, know it’s monstrous, and yet are convinced it’s righteous. The scene where Bev hands out the cups of poison was very Jim Jones.

r156 what? Riley literally killed himself rather than carry on being a vampire. That’s the ultimate rejection of religious zealotry (conflated with vampirism as it was here). As Bev was quick to point out, he forsook the “gift” he’d been given.

I just couldn't get past how small Riley (Zach Gilford) was, it was distracting.

When he was sat net to Erin (Kate Siegel) on the sofa in the death episode (4, "Book IV: Lamentations") his feet didn't even reach the floor.

^^^next not net^^^^

So what? What difference does his height make? It isn't like he is a little person. He's attractive and was very good in the show. He's just not tall.

R286 I meant that he became a vampire against his will even though he rejected the zealotry. Is the metaphor for the zealotry being a vampire, or being happy about being a vampire?

I didn't get why only the one very old lady kept getting younger? When no one else did

R290, Riley is an addict, an alcoholic. Addiction and religion are linked in the very first scene, in which we see Riley praying for forgiveness after the car crash; his sobriety seems to be linked to his renunciation of Catholicism. Pruitt may have focused on him in particular because Riley had learned to resist addictive behavior, making him harder to break down. Once Riley had recognized what he had become (which he originally interpreted as a sign that he was relapsing), he proved his psychological strength; he went up in flames rather than survive as a vampire.

They did, R291, but not as dramatically. Riley's parents were getting appreciably more youthful. His father's back problems vanished and his mother's eyesight improved to the point that she no longer needed her glasses.

[quote] His father's back problems vanished and his mother's eyesight improved to the point that she no longer needed her glasses.

They also showed a scene that once the father was "younger", he started drinking a couple of beers at a time. I thought it was kind of interesting that the father was probably an old alkie too, particularly given how unforgiving he was towards Riley.

Riley's Mother got younger but I'm not sure of the original age?

Presumably Riley was late 30's and his Brother was in his late teenage years.

I don't think that distracted from the story much

I sort of take offense of age being something to be « corrected », like a disease. Why didn’t that bearded guy get younger? Yeesh.

It wasn't as good as Hill House but much better than Bly Manor.

The monologues were completely over the top - Mike Flanagan must be exhausting to deal with in real life.

Hamish was amazing. I find Annabeth Gish really irritating - in every role she seems like the ultimate snippy frau. Whoever played Bev was great - some of her bitchy line readings made me lol.

His wife did a good job with the lead - nice part for her.

One more thing - did Hamish bring over the demon in that huge trunk from his vacation to Israel? How did he get it through customs?

And weird the demon didn't notice when the director's wife was cutting up his wings. Not the most effective demon I've ever seen. He really let her carve up those wings.

I find Gish oddly compelling to watch, but Flanagan does tend to typecast her.

The thing could have just flown to the US during the night. I suppose it's more disturbing for viewers to have it arrive in a trunk.

It's a callback to vampire lore. Dracula is smuggled into England in a trunk. That's also how the vampire is transported in Salem's Lot.

Ohh okay got it. I still think he was a dud demon to allow the frau to cut up his wings. I did like how sexual it was though when he was feasting on them.

[quote]One more thing - did Hamish bring over the demon in that huge trunk from his vacation to Israel? How did he get it through customs?

That would be just like TSA "whadda ya got in that trunk? An angel, huh. Is he wearing shoes? does he have a bottle of water? Wearing a belt? Any batteries? Alright, whatever bring him in, but the airline is going to charge you for that oversized luggage!"

R298, remember, vampires have hypnotic powers. That can cover up a lot of plot holes. “Trunk? What trunk? You didn’t see a trunk.”

Yes I’m sure Israeli customs was chill enough for the priest to drag that huge ass demon in a trunk past airport security.

[quote]Another huge hole...the row boat would have caught fire when Riley burned.

At the least I was expecting to see the shape of his ass burned into the seat of the boat.

It wasn't like he slowly burned like a yule log; he went up like magician's paper. That would be why he turned to ashes so quickly and didn't burn the boat.

That demon really made sexy time sounds when he was writhing around feeding on people. Maybe if he hadn't been so horny and distracted, the director's wife wouldn't have been able to chop up his wings.

He did R296. He was substantially older looking in the earlier episodes. So was the psycho bitch church assistant. They all de-aged.

It wasn't that age needed to be corrected; it was that the demon blood made people revert to their bodies in their "prime," which is an allusion to Christian resurrection theology where once Jesus comes to reign again on earth, disease and aging will cease and everyone's bodies will be made whole and in the healthiest most perfect condition. This is why the teenage girl's paralysis improved and Riley's mom didn't need her glasses and so on. It's a Christian dogma thing.

Hmmm r310, thank you for that. If they really wanted to hew to that, then the fat bearded guy would have lost weight. But then I’m being pedantic.

[quote]It wasn't that age needed to be corrected; it was that the demon blood made people revert to their bodies in their "prime," which is an allusion to Christian resurrection theology where once Jesus comes to reign again on earth, disease and aging will cease and everyone's bodies will be made whole and in the healthiest most perfect condition.

That's actually one of the elements I enjoyed about the show; all the speeches came out of actual scripture, not just so bizarro theory someone made up. And even though it got somewhat overshadowed by the burning of the town, I liked the speech that Riley's mother gave to Bev about how she just couldn't stand the idea that in the eyes of God, *everyone* is equal.

Ugh, is Mike Flanagan‘s wife in it?

She’s the female lead r313 - the brunette.

T 314, in a barrel full of bad acting, she scrapes the bottom of the barrel...as do her inflated lips.

R315 is very wrong. There is a lot of very good acting, and she is good in this as well.

She's competent enough. Nothing special but she doesn't stick out as awful either. She's also always had very large lips.

If anyone is the female lead in this ensemble it's Samantha Sloyan. Great role for her and she killed it.

R318, agree that she was fantastic in what could have been a complete caricature of a role. She was very impressive.

^^bitch killed my husband!!

Didn't the priest tell his congregation that the monsignor was in a hospital on the main land?

No one from the town though to leave the island to go visit him? Even that smug nutcase religious zealot, Bev?

He told them the Monsignor preferred not to have visitors.

[quote]Why hasn't anyone mentioned that the sheriff looks exactly like an Arabic John Krasinski? It was uncanny.

British actor Rahul Kohli isn't an Arab, he's a Punjabi Hindu. Both sides of his family are South Asian, they're Indian.

Do you know the difference between Arabs and Indians?

[quote]No one from the town though to leave the island to go visit him? Even that smug nutcase religious zealot, Bev?

Based on multiple things the townspeople said, the monsignor had just kind of faded away due to old age & dementia. From a story standpoint, you could reasonably assume that townspeople figured he wouldn't even recognize them if they did show up. If you've ever gone to a church where you've had some boring old fuck droning on for years & years, you're not exactly sad when a young, new vibrant replacement shows up.

I remember a young priest who was gay as a goose, but everyone - even the old farmers who typically slept in the back - showed up to mass because he was so entertaining compared to the old priest that *finally* retired in his mid-seventies

R324, it was just lazy writing. Not even one of the older people, who knew the old priest personally, wasn't curious to see how he was doing, especially the town gossip? However, if someone did visit, there would be no series.

One of the old lady busybodies in my building is very involved in the local church, she knows everything going on with the priests and the others she interacts with through the local church. We don't exactly live in a small town. This woman is a major busy body in our NYC neighborhood, she sure would have visited one of the priests if he was in the hospital.

Vampires, Jonestown and Christians, what a mix.

WORST SHOW EVER!

Why did you fucks get me to watch this drivel?

Let's just talk about what's going on and not act.

SHOW DON'T TELL!

You call yourselves screenwriters?!

A least I didn't pay to watch this garbage, I watched this series on one of the free online sites.

Once again, a good cast wasted on yet another hyped up mess of a series.

This wasn't as bad as the most recent AHS, but it was a close second!

[quote]At the least I was expecting to see the shape of his ass burned into the seat of the boat.

You sir are a disgusting, filthy pervert.

[quote]Why did you fucks get me to watch this drivel?

While I liked this show - it was campy fun for a Sunday afternoon - I appreciate your frustration. The "Halloween movies" thread convinced me to watch, against my better judgement, Lords of Salem which was absolute shit. Whatever one may say about Flanagan & his muse Mrs. Big Lips, they're geniuses compared to Zombie & his horrible actress of a wife.

Bev had to be one of the most annoying insufferable horror series characters I've ever endured.

Kill it with 🔥🔥🔥!!!

WTF does Rob Zombie have to do with any of this?

Who keeps bringing him up?

Midnight mass for your ass

Midnight Mass was so crass, it definitely suffered from a lack of class!

So many strong performances in this show but I couldn’t get past the Voldemort cartoonish dude.. Ruined it for me.

Sigh, I just mentioned Rob Zombie because I get the point of being annoyed when you discover something that everyone else is raving about turns about to crap & used LoS as an example of that. Plus, the connection of a director casting his hot wife who may or may not be up to the task.

Bev is annoying & one dimensional as you never get a backstory, but Facebook is full of Bev types who fancy themselves to be die hard christians, but are so full of rage & hatred

Sigh, I just don't give a fuck.

Easy enough show to have on in the background while you dick around on your phone. Only have to look up and watch occasionally.

Loudly hating TV shows makes me look clever!

Bev was very typical of many Christians, especially Evangelicals.

Look at all the Evangelicals who are filled with so much hate and rage which they direct at anyone who doesn't fit their narrow description of how the world should be.

I can't believe the great reviews this garbage got. Almost every review praised this mess.

This series could have been reduced to 5 episodes. The long drawn out 'speeches' were ridiculous, after awhile, I wanted to throw something at the screen. I kept saying, "Please STFU!!" Especially that Bev character, I wish her death was more horrific.

Is there going to be a second series? The vampire angel did get away. Hopefully the sun got it.

[quote]Is there going to be a second series?

Why the fuck would you care? You hated it, so you surely won't watch it.

It's a limited stand-alone series and there are no plans for a second season.

I.e., hard pass on a repass for Midnight Mass. Alas.

[quote]Why the fuck would you care? You hated it, so you surely won't watch it.

How do you know WTF I'd watch? I enjoyed the bizarre vampire angel! I might watch a show featuring bunch of menacing vampire angels.

I enjoy EVIL, it's a much better series than this snooze-fest. The characters don't give long winded speeches in place of coherent dialog.

Coincidentally, a new winged evil entity was featured in the last two episodes. The entity looked a lot like the MM vampire angel, except the skin was a dark midnight blue. Andrea Martin in a serious role as a nun, is a huge plus, she's excellent.

EVIL has been renewed.

We condole you for having no taste, R341.

[quote]We condole you for having no taste, [R341].

You don't need to 'condole' me. This series mostly SUCKED. It was one of those series where the acting transcended the terrible script.

I have great taste. I usually don't watch a TV series or movie based on what any reviewer says. This series was so hyped, I was curious. I always choose what I want to watch, it's usually dependent on the genre and the performers.

I only watched this series because I enjoy Hamish Linklater's acting. HL was the best thing about "The New Adventures of Old Christine". On that series, he had the best lines and the best delivery.

[quote]I enjoy Hamish Linklater's acting. HL was the best thing about "The New Adventures of Old Christine".

The bar was not very high there, was it, dear.

[quote]The bar was not very high there, was it, dear.

That comedy series was great, he is a good actor. Linklater definitely has range. He can play dramatic and comedic characters, DEAR.

Please, this series wasn't bad because of any of the acting. It was terrible because it was all over the place, the 'message' was pounded into our heads, the dialog was mostly cringeworthy (how many people give long speeches and deep psychological insights to each other during a simple conversation?!) and it was two episodes too long.

[quote]Why the fuck would you care?

I always need fresh targets. If I don't endlessly vent my bottomless negativity I will explode.

[quote]If I don't endlessly vent my bottomless negativity I will explode.

Pics please.

I feel like Mike Flanagan and Kate Siegal are this generation's Brian De Palma and Nancy Allen in every way.

[quote]If I don't endlessly vent my bottomless negativity I will explode.

More like your verbal diarrhea is exploding.

[quote]And weird the demon didn't notice when the director's wife was cutting up his wings. Not the most effective demon I've ever seen. He really let her carve up those wings.

It was obvious that the vampires were in a euphoric/hypnotic state when they were feeding. He would have barely noticed that she was cutting his wings. They even showed him a few minutes earlier waving off gunshots that were being fired at him while feeding. And Riley's mother even slit her own throat to distract Bev so the other could escape because she knew it would hypnotize them. Feeding for a vampire is like having sex.

Honestly, I shouldn't have to explain this simple concept to some of you. It was all blatantly obvious.

[quote]Honestly, I shouldn't have to explain this simple concept to some of you. It was all blatantly obvious.

We're sowwy Mommy.

Lol r353 fair enough

Mike Flanagan is obsessed with lesbians. Every one of his shows has a lesbian or a lesbian couple among the main characters.

I interpreted Pruitt as having poisoned the dog so he could see how the poison worked, and then poisoned himself so he could resurrect. Am I wrong?

Bev poisoned the dog.

I think Pruitt died because he wasn’t feeding.

Would there be so many black people on this tiny redneck island? They are not even part of the same family, it looks like they all have white partners.

R360, and yet you accept the existence of vampire angels?

R361 Are you saying that black people on the island are also part of the supernatural?

No, that r360 questions if black people would be living in that area, yet totally accepts something completely fabricated.

So r361, any show that features supernatural elements gets a pass on casting? What about sets and costumes?

The casting was terrible. If you look at the church, there's many young and pretty people. There would mostly be old white bearded dudes, some with wives and maybe some young kids on this fisherman's island.

Just finished episode 5. So many distracting things. The CGI is terrible. When he dreams he's on the boat in the middle of the ocean. The ocean and the sky look soooo fake. They were filming this on a shore, so why not just film those scenes on an actual sea? And those cats on the first episode? Cats eyes don't look like flash lights in the dark and cats don't move that way. And why cast 50 year old man and a woman to play parents to a 40 year old? That just bugged me and could get past it. Then there's doctor's mother and the old priest, obviously being young people in a terrible make up. Why not just cast old people for those roles? I know that the old lady was getting casually younger over time, but still. In those first few episodes it just looked so awful, having a young woman in bad makeup pretending to be an old lady.

The dumbest of it all, no one on the island recognizing that the "new" priest is actually just the younger version of the priest that they've known for decades. Some of these people aren't even that much older than the old priest, so they knew him when he was much younger. But no, no one recognized him. Or even his voice. And the guys burning in the wooden boat? How moronic was that? That boat would burn down in just a few minutes and the hot lady would drown.

Jew as a Catholic priest.

There's your problem.

Well, plot holes notwithstanding, I think one problem with a lot of Netflix series/movies is that they just don't have the kind of budget that HBO, for example, has & it really shows. I agree with R366 in that the scene with Riley & Erin on the water was so fake it was distracting, which was kind of too bad since I thought it was moving scene & great work from the actor (though I am confused by DL's fixation that the boat would've burned, when as someone else noted, the guy burst into flames and didn't smolder like a log - but whatever). HBO shows that have topnotch production values, like Succession really spoil us. High def TV also really accentuate poor/low production

How were that annoying woman and the big guy able to burn down hundreds and hundreds of houses and buildings (it is said that many hundreds of people used to live on the island) in just an hour or two? And how did she alone got all those beds to that recreation center? Where did she even got the beds? Also, they could have all squeezed into priest's house? It wasn't burned down. Hell, there were many places where they could hide from the sunlight.

What was with both of the kids smiling when the girl said she can't feel her legs? Not really a reaction that would occur in that situation, even if it meant that the enemy is dead.

R368 Isn't Netflix extremely rich?

It’s clear that this show needed better pacing. A good horror story doesn’t leave you worrying about logistics and plot holes; you should just be basking in the atmosphere of fear.

R370, I do think that Netflix is very rich, but it acts like a Poverty Row production outfit back in the 1940s. It cranks out a lot of product as quickly as possible.

Hamish Linklater is Irish.

“And how did she alone get all those beds to the recreation center.”

Well R369, vampires, just like retards, have the strength of an ape. Oh, and they all want cake.

[quote]Hamish Linklater is Irish.

HL is an American of Scottish, Swedish and Irish descent.

"Linklater was born in Great Barrington, Massachusetts, the son of Kristin Linklater and James Lincoln Cormeny.

His mother was a Scottish-born Professor of Theatre and Chair of the Acting Division at Columbia University and a teacher of vocal technique. A single mother, she raised her son partly in the Berkshires, where she was a founder of the Shakespeare & Company drama troupe. Linklater was eight years old when he began doing small Shakespearean roles.

His maternal grandparents were Marjorie Linklater, an arts campaigner, and Eric Linklater, who was a Scottish novelist of partly Swedish origin."

The Midnight Mass twinks celebrating Halloween together:

Cute! Looks like Leeza's actress was there too. I can't believe that guy has to go through life with the name Igby Rigny.

Anna (Leeza) and Louis (curly altar boy) are on each other's Instagrams a lot, maybe they're dating.

Sorry, *Annarah

It was a good show but I don’t think it has longevity: people aren’t going to be talking about it in 10 years time like The Haunting of Hill House.

Totally agree, Hill House was lightning in a bottle, one of the best shows I’ve seen in the last decade. Bly Manor, which I was very much looking forward to, was a major downgrade. MM was slightly better, but it doesn’t resonate like HH does.

Got to this show late, but I loved it. I agree it wasn't perfect in every sense -- the monologues WERE a bit a much -- but overall I liked its slow build, the atmosphere and aura of religious wonder and ancient evil, and a couple of the actors were really great - especially Hamish Linklater and Samantha Sloyan.

Really glad I watched this - a great contrast to the gaudy maximalist approach to the genre taken by "American Horror Story."

I just read that Mike Flanagan is an atheist, that kinda surprised me! I assumed he was a Catholic, at the very least…

irish jew

I believe he said in interviews that he grew up Catholic and while he was no longer a practicing Catholic, the church was a heavy influence in his early years. MM kind of reads like a guy that no longer believes, but still has some awe & respect for the Catholic rituals

OK, they are:

Just finished watching the show and loved it very much. I loved how these self-righteous zealots could easily quote bible verses to back up or excuse their evil intentions and demonize their opposition. The whole thing with the monsignor telling the congregation to not be afraid of the monster, because it's an angel and mention over and over again how in the Bible people were afraid and unsettled by the angles at first, too.

Great performances. The monologues didn't bother me much. The one of the sheriff just was an elaborate way of him saying he does not want to rock the boat. Which was a bit of a surprise to me, since I thought he would jump on the chance to put a stop to his son's intentions of converting.

I was raised roman catholic myself, but have become an atheist as an adult. I thought the big monologue scene of the two leads explaining their opinion of death was very well done.

The bad special effects didn't bother me that much, I think they might even be deliberate when it comes to Riley's dream sequences, giving them a surreal feel.

Bev was a such a delightful cunt. She so did poison the dog with the rat poison and used the same poison to kill the congregation. She was such a self righteous bitch who was jumping on every opportunity that could give her more power. She even pushed the monsignor aside when he was in her way of her devious plans to spread the gospel.

Nice review R386 ! I've seen a lot of tv over the past three years and while i didn't think it was a masterpiece it generated a genuine sense of dread and developed an unsettling atmosphere. You can certainly argue it's derivative of Stephen King or other horror writers and that's fair but so what? If it works it works.