Gunshot Victims Left Waiting as Horse Dewormer Overdoses Overwhelm Oklahoma Hospitals, Doctor Says

So! What they dun to get theyseff shot?

How is this not an Onion headline? Talk about Darwin’s waiting room

I feel so sorry for the Democrats living in places like Oklahoma--I know a few who are college professoirs who have to work there since academic jobs are so scarce.

The people who overdose on dewormer should be given bleach injections in the hospital parking lot by volunteers who got their medical training on Facebook.

[quote]So! What they dun to get theyseff shot?

The usual. Drug deals gone wrong. Drunks getting into fights. Estranged husbands shooting the wife and kids. Kids shooting each other with guns they found around the house. Attempted suicides. Guys accidentally shooting themselves in the dick.

Now, it’s getting funny

[quote]Even podcaster and anti-vaccine conspiracy theorist Joe Rogan bragged that he took ivermectin along with other experimental treatments after he tested positive for Covid-19. As a result of the drug’s increased publicity, calls to poison control centers nationwide regarding ivermectin have multiplied, as have hospital and emergency room visits, the CDC said.

Joe Rogan singlehandedly is taking out the heehaws several trailer parks at a time. Love.

Shouldn't they be going to veterinarians anyway? Why are they in the ER?

If you're living in a place where the two main groups of people vying for space in an ER are those voluntarily taking poison, and those involved in a gunfight, maybe you should think seriously about MOVING.

Oddly enough, there's a vet clinic less than a mile from where I live. The place was jam-packes (at least 20 vehicles). What on earth would cause so many people to visit a vet at 4:00 pm on a Saturday?

some unrelated facts here, both ivermectin and hydroxychloroquine are dirty cheap in the rest of the world, ivermectin cost 15 cents in countries like India, in the US it cost 100 times more ($15~20) but even with that inflated price tag it is still a low cost medication for American, the average price for a prescription drug is more than hundred dollars. We heard a lot of news reports of hydroxychloroquine or ivermectin overdose in the US, people grabbed those pills made for animals and took them, but you don't hear such negative reports from other countries. Indians prescribed ivermectin en masse during the summer surge but people didn't die from them, and hydroxychloroquine was used in China in the very first month of outbreak and there was no death caused by it either.

There are a lot debates on whether ivermectiin or hydroxychloroquine are effective against Covid-19, some clinical trials showed positive sign but others said there were no detectable improvements among patients, all those different results or debates are normal in medical research and there is nothing controversial here , but do we have to put these drugs in the condemned list and why? The universal disproval from the government agency and leading experts in the US made people wonder who is afraid of those low cost pills? Are big pharma behind the negative campaign, because they worry they will lose billion dollar profit if a pill cost 15 cents can treat Covid?

The Australians are very successful in treating covid-19 with ivermectin. Probably because they look like horse and cow.

Gunshot victims in rural Oklahoma? Riiight.

(This guy’s lying.)

If they are pushing back on Ivermectin this hard because of its obvious threat to their profits pushing EUA therapeutics, just imagine what they've done against potential cures for cancer.

People are stupid and paranoid. Pharmaceutical companies don't work like that. People are overdosing because they are taking large doses intended for horses. It isn't being prescribed regularly because it's not proven yet.

they have not reached the conclusion whether ivermectin or hydroxychloroquine are effective to treat patients or they are nothing but placebos, but these drugs are very safe, even if it turned out they didn't help to fight against Covid, they won't kill you or cause any major health issues if administered by a doctor, then why the news media push so hard to portray them as some "death" drugs to scare people?

I'm telling all my Deplorable friends that it's true, horse paste DOES prevent and cure COVID. And all Liberals know this, have secret message boards and meetings where we swap it, FOR FREE.

I do warn them to "be careful" with their dosages since, you know, even equine medicine instructions don't come in airbrushed meme format.

This is one of those "only in Oklahoma" stories.

My biggest problem is not even that I think Ivermectin in particular is the solution. It could be, we don't know. My real problem is just the conversation around it. I see people all the time now saying "wow you think people should take horse medicine." It's obviously a medicine for people too, but people are just using it to deflect.

We should be able to have conversations about treatments for covid that aren't the vaccine. But the media specifically wants the solution to be vaccines, despite their lackluster track record with covid currently. Nobody on that side of the aisle wants any other solution. Which I find insane. They'd rather just get 4 covid booster shots a year indefinitely.

I can't speak for Ivermectin, but hydroxychloroquine was proven effective if taken early.

R19 exactly, both ivermectin and hydroxychloroquine are widely used even in America, but now if they are mentioned on news media, they use phrases like fish tank cleaner or horse dewormer to distort the fact those are well established drugs for human, they are really trying to demonize those drugs.

You know your state needs to take a good, hard look at itself when the main hospital emergencies are gunshot wounds and Ivermectin overdoses.

#CultureofLife

I'm having fun FFing the pro-Ivermectin / hydroxychloroquine Qunt-loon and all of his sock puppets on here.

What's insane are science denialists like r19 and the Republican Party.

Vaccines are proven to work; Ivermectin is not. Do your homework and prove it before you become a cuckold "ginny pig" for QAnon loons.

R19 you appear to have no clue what's going on.

The vaccine does not treat Covid. That's... not what a vaccine is.

People are taking the HORSE MEDICINE VERSION of the drug. That's why everyone is talking about horse medicine.

And there are a bunch of trials of drugs going on for Covid treatment in the US and around the world, and some have been approved in the US. Ivermectin is currently NOT approved to treat or prevent Covid. So the problem is not "oh people can't talk about it," the problem is people are pointlessly poisoning themselves with the dangerous HORSE MEDICINE VERSION of the drug as a preventative measure without any guidance from any kind of medical professional because for entirely political reasons they want to refuse a free, tested, safe, and approved vaccine.

I have lived in Oklahoma (OKC). Honestly, never met a stupider people in my whole life. At first you think "wow, that person is a clown". Then you realize the whole state is full of stupid people. Texas has nothing on Oklahomans. I never knew more first hand victims of crime than living in Oklahoma City. The gay bashings go unreported but they are a serious problem there. I went to the hospital to pick up more than one friend who got beat up. I took a friend to the dentist and he filled out paperwork and one of the questions was HIV, and the dentist refused to treat him because he was POZ and checked the box. This was 2006. LINK = This guy (a self proclaimed video vigilante) would go to a gay park and film people there and jump out of his truck and shove a camera in their face to confront the sinners. Then post it on Youtube. He also created multiple "donation accepted" websites. The whole state was a dump and run by the GOP and religious zealots. So glad I left. They deserve every tornado they get.

This post reminded me it's the first of the month, time for the dogs IVERMECTIN! Thanks friends.

Ivermectin Full study-

Conclusions: Moderate-certainty evidence finds that large reductions in COVID-19 deaths are possible using ivermectin. Using ivermectin early in the clinical course may reduce numbers progressing to severe disease. The apparent safety and low cost suggest that ivermectin is likely to have a significant impact on the SARS-CoV-2 pandemic globally.

↑ That's one angry-looking butternut squash.

[quote] they want to refuse a free, tested, safe, and approved vaccine.

R25 I am fully vaccinated but I have to disagree with this statement. When you talk about "safe" and "tested", there is no way for a vaccine developed within a year to match the drugs like hydroxychloroquine which has been used for more than 50 years in every part of the world. Safety wise, it's definitely Ivermectin or hydroxychloroquine wins.

R30, please shoot up yourself and all of your kinfolk and relations with as much ivermectin and hydroxychloroquine as possible. Pass them out liberally at your klan meetin's and tent revivals. You'll be doing the planet a favor. Seriously.

R30 absolute garbage. The vaccine was developed that fast because they built on work that's been happening for over a decade. And the rollout was one of the biggest in history--more people have gotten this vaccine already than in the first year of the polio or smallpox vaccines combined, for example.

It's safe. Go elsewhere with your bullshit.

"a decade" barely past the clinical trial period, dont know why you think that equals "safe" or "proven"

Almost one-third of new drugs approved by U.S. regulators over a decade ended up years later with warnings about unexpected, sometimes life-threatening side effects or complications, a new analysis found.

[quote]Safety wise, it's definitely Ivermectin or hydroxychloroquine wins.

I've taken hydroxychloroquine for lupus. I'm off it now, but I had to see the eye doctor annually to screen for damage. It is not risk free. I much preferred receiving Moderna shots to resuming taking it.

Oh, and guess what? People are reporting vision problems after taking ivermectin.

Why are trolls devoting so much effort to Datalounge lately?

As a current Oklahoma resident, I can safely say there are not that many gunshot victims, sorry to ruin everyone’s good time. This is not Chicago, or parts of L. A.

I have honestly not heard that much about ivermectin use, a bit here and there, but most folks around here try and pray it away and are not headed to the feed store. Yes, people around here tend to be deeply religious, and not the brightest or up to date on the newest trends or gadgets, but Oklahoma has some good salt of the Earth folks who would give their last dime away to help others, regardless of sexual orientation or color.

Democratic numbers are (very) slowly rising, you saw last year how terribly the Republican convention went over. No one I know attended. I know it’s the popular thing to do here, gang up and call Oklahoma stupid, but I think this article is fake.

(and due to climate change, tornadoes have been fewer and fewer—it appears Alabama is the hotspot now!)

It shouldn’t be a contest between the vaccine and hcq. The problem was that people were being denied an effective treatment when others were not available or prohibitively expensive.

I'm sure that many of the ambulance-chaser law firms that advertise on the mesothelioma channels are licking their chops at the prospect of suing the manufacturers of ivermectin.

America, everyone.

Oklahoman is lying. Oklahoman is lying. Gunshot deaths are more prevalent there than Illinois or other such places.

Fake News! Ha Ha

Is Oklahoma the new Florida?

Clinical studies show that Ivermectin (for humans) does NOT work for Covid Treatment, at all.

Medication for Horses, are not meant for Humans, and can kill you.

WHAT THE FUCK!

The number of trolls here is off the charts. I'm headed into year 18, and I've never seen it this bad. It's been bad, but never like this.

[quote]My real problem is just the conversation around it. I see people all the time now saying "wow you think people should take horse medicine." It's obviously a medicine for people too, but people are just using it to deflect.

It's not to deflect, it's accurately stating that these people are taking horse dewormer because they can't get ivermectin in human pill form.

This is the equivalent of a person taking antibiotics which also contain chlorine, specifically formulated for fish.

R45 When you have the people in power constantly lying and trying to suppress information, then people will look for others to fill that void. The best antidote would be to be frank with the American people, but those conglomerates can't allow that, and neither can those who profit off of peoples' naivete. However, the media can put a halt to this immediately but they are too driven by profit and greed, so instead they will go to war with anyone who threatens their bottom line. They essentially declare war on independent journalists. Their motives are completely self serving. They don't give a damn about public health or individual freedom.

^They may have been able to get away with this shit before social media, for better or worse, has made their motives ultra transparent.

True r45, and what's surprising to me is how there are several accounts that have been posting non-stop for around 10 days or so and haven't been flagged or grayed out. You know they're getting FFs so what's going on?

r28 linked a very official looking study, that essentially touted ivermectin as some miracle cure for COVID. Except that it wasn't a study - it was an analysis of studies done in a variety of labs. If you look at the locations (Bangladesh, Egypt, Nigeria) you begin to realize that the quality of the studies was probably not very rigorous. If you look at the numbers and the types of control (double-blind, placebos, etc). the quality drops even further, because most of these studies had VERY FEW subjects. It's not being suppressed because it's a miracle cure that won't make money for pharmaceutical companies, it's that it's a shitty megadata analysis, which was ridiculed the moment it was released. Also, the group that released it doesn't disclose that it's part of a lobbying group to have ivermectin approved as a COVID treatment - and the group's existence preceded the study, so it's a major violation of scientific neutrality.

MISINFORMATION CENTRAL FOLKS. This it how they do it.

R50 The article says that "more research is needed". That's not exactly a refutation. It certainly doesn't warrant the hyperbolic headlines.

Not exactly:

"He added: "The few existing higher quality clinical trials testing ivermectin against the disease uniformly have failed to find a positive result. It’s only the smaller, lower-quality trials that have been positive. This is a good indication that the drug probably doesn’t work."

"Another meta-analysis, published June 28, arrived at an opposite conclusion.

That study was led by a University of Connecticut researcher and appeared in the peer-reviewed journal Clinical Infectious Diseases, a publication of the Infectious Diseases Society of America. It found that in comparison to standard of care or placebo, ivermectin "did not reduce all-cause mortality." The study concluded saying that the drug "is not a viable option to treat COVID-19 patients.""

One of the people interviewed said that IF the metanalysis of r28 were found to be accurate, then ivermectin might be worth further study. That's a big IF to hang a hat on, especially when a number of high-quality of studies have shown the opposite. Given the fact that we've had 10 high-profile deaths in the past 3 weeks of people who admitted to using ivermectin as their preferred prophylactic against COVID, with how many hundreds more dying but not in the news for that because they weren't radio hosts or bloggers, anyone seeing it as a cure-all needs to be reconsidering using it that way.

I'm heading off to Zero Hedge to check the latest misinformed right wing talking points. Forewarned is forearmed....yesterday New Zealand was a fascist dictatorship and Florida a beacon of calm rational public policy.

^Further the article above says the fault of the study is that it was taken from meta analysis yet the refutation is also based on meta analysis. The drug does warrant further study if for no other reason then its widespread use. In the case of HCQ, it was determined that it was effective when taken early, yet the most well known studies were from patients who took it on their deathbeds. It may not be the most successful treatment, yet other treatments remain such as the one given to Trump are still inaccessible to most people.

Gee, I wish I was smart enough to invest in some ridiculous drug then spread the word on Parler (or wherever these morons go) that it's the next best COVID remedy.

We don’t need them doctors, until we need them doctors! 🤡

I can't wait for PolitiFact to rightfully rate this story as, "Liar, liar, pants on fire!"

Now that the media has gotten caught red-handed running with a wildly-exaggerated (at best) story about ambulances lined up and overwhelming hospitals due to people taking Ivermectin, I suspect the various organizations (esp. "poison control hotlines") are going to find themselves getting grilled for hard numbers over the next few days, and no attempt to spin them is going to be able to hide the fact that they've all been contributing to the narrative of moral hysteria (like claiming 11 vs 1 call out of tens of thousands constitutes a "surge" or "avalanche" of calls).

And just to make it clear, this isn't an either/or thing. Lots of people (Joe Rogan included) take ivermectin IN ADDITION to being fully-vaccinated, and think the antivaxxers promoting ivermectin INSTEAD of vaccination are idiots. Less-effective (for delta) vaccine is still better than none, but vaccine augmented with ivermectin is no worse (and possibly at least a tiny bit better) than vaccine alone (and ENORMOUSLY better than ivermectin alone).

Incidentally, Rolling Stone's photo was misleading propaganda, too.

Ask yourself, "what month is it?"That's right, it's August.

Now, look at the photo of people wearing winter coats, and ask why in god's unholy name people alleged to be waiting in line for treatment at a hospital anywhere in the US -- Alaska included -- would be wearing winter coats in August?

ivermectin: the clinical studies show they do not work, at all. This is human medication. They do not meet the criteria to advance to more advance clinical trials.

Ivermectin for horses: Horse medications are dangerous for humans. This is clear. Humans should not be on medications for horses.

They were wearing jackets, not coats, and they were in line for the vaccine, not medical treatment.

You're the one telling lies, r58.

Oh, and the date was January, r58, which is clearly labeled under the photo.

r59 No, Ivermectin has some human uses (in very small doses) and has been studied for those. Obviously, pharmaceutical grade Ivermectin for humans has more rigorous quality controls that than designed for horses and other animals, so people who can't get pharmaceutical grade should not be headed over to their local feed and pet store to get the horse version. Ivermectin thus far has not been shown to be effective against COVID in any large, well-designed studies so far. I have nothing against continued research, but if were the miracle cure its believers think it is, there would be a lot fewer deaths and hospitalizations in the deep south right now.

This thread sums things up pretty well:

r60/r61, the caption under the photo when you visit the link might say that, but the headline accompanying the photo in the link itself deliberately gives a wildly different & misleading impression.

For the past few weeks, the media have been willing to regurgitate almost ANY anti-ivermectin narrative with ZERO fact-checking, and just totally got caught with its pants down. As long as a quote amplified the official "ivermectin is bad" narrative, you could freely embellish & amplify whatever someone else said & get 10 minutes of your own internet fame.

Dr. McElyea is going to be getting (rightfully) memed and ridiculed over this for the rest of his life.

This is some of the most emotionally manipulative bullshit-ass journalism I've ever read in my mother fuckin' life. Where was their report when all of those damn opioid addicts were overdosing and also causing backups? Addicts who overdose get themselves in that position because of bad life choices and no I don't feel sorry for someone who actively makes the choice to do drugs and ends up with a drug problem and ODs.

Talk about an unavoidable ER visit. Getting real tired of this "let's demonize sick people" bullshit. It's a lot of mother fuckers who get completely unavoidable illnesses and wind up in the hospital. Especially with all of the fat-asses in 'Murica; literally the most unhealthy country in the world and all due to poor life choices. Fuck outta here with this. Anyways...

R36 = WRONG. You sound exactly how the Gay Okies sound = deny what a shithole Oklahoma is and how it will someday get "better", and it never does....READ THIS---->>."in an unprecedented act of partisanship, House Republican leaders have refused to allow any legislation authored by a House Democrat to be brought up for a vote on the House floor."...........Thats right. DEMOCRATS cannot even get any legislation to the HOUSE FLOOR in Oklahoma......R36 = Wake Up and escape Oklahoma.....I also noticed you didn't dispute any of the crime abuses against LGBT in Oklahoma.

Although taking ivermectin for COVID is certainly stupid, and in addition, can be dangerous to a person's health in the wrong dosage, I agree that the Rolling Stone article was poorly researched and vetted. It should have been taken down the instant that the Sequoyah health system denied it. It's absolutely true that many people are being turned away from hospitals in Oklahoma and in the deep south because of the emergency rooms and ICU beds being swamped with COVID patients. That has been reported in many places. SOME of those patients have probably also been taking ivermectin in improper doses and might have concomitant heath issues because of that. But the headline is sensationalist and misleading.

r59 Um, no baby. There are legitimate large-scale, government-funded clinical trials currently underway for Ivermectin. Stop it.

Straight clownery on here. Acting like this shit is like taking a bottle of arsenic. It's not being ruled out you absolute dingbats.

Last one.

r70, that last youtube is EXACTLY the one referenced before from the journal of therapeutics . So it's not new to this thread, and it has been refuted by the politifact article in terms of the lack of quality of the studies it used.

r71 I know that. Watch it any damn way. Watch both of them. Both of the videos are by actual physicians and they succinctly explain the data.

r71 Like seriously, do you have any idea how unscientific it is to just go with one opinion from one source on scientific data as opposed to multiple specialists? What do you think a peer-review is? Diversify your data review sources, man. Jfc.

Actually both of them reference the same article with the same drawbacks. Not buying it, because the premise of the article itself was flawed, due to the nature of the studies it used

Also, some people are more visual/auditory learners as opposed to just reading and may have not even bothered to click on the nih.gov study or the politifact article. The point is, it is not being ruled out as a possible treatment and is currently in clinical trials in the UK and the US (ACTIV-6). To completely write it off as rubbish taking all of these factors into consideration is, I'm sorry, just asinine.

The MAGA CULT = Blatant disregard of face masks. Fake Vaccine Cards. Refusal of Vaccine. Taking Horse Medicine. Let's face facts = They WANT Covid. They do it for their leader. The same way the Nazis followed Hitler. Who cares if they fall off a cliff as long as King Trump praises them. Let them get Covid. They do it---NOT for love of country, but for love of Trump!!

No one is writing it off. The sensible approach is to wait until a large number of studies have been done and THEN make a recommendation about whether it's both safe and efficacious. But that's NOT what is happening. People are using the information from this flawed metadata analysis to make a decision to take a drug randomly, not knowing dosage, not being aware of side effects, and most importantly, not knowing if it has any effect whatsoever. We might as well be shining flashlights up our assholes...remember that one?

[quote] People are using the information from this flawed metadata analysis to make a decision to take a drug randomly, not knowing dosage, not being aware of side effects, and most importantly, not knowing if it has any effect whatsoever.

Which has everything to do with those individuals' stupidity and absolutely nothing to do with the medication itself. So, articles like this are just unneeded sensationalism meant to exaggerate an issue for clicks and change the conversation. It's disingenuous. Ketamine still isn't an approved treatment for severe depression but is still being studied. Are we going to start changing the conversation around that because some idiots don't consult a physician and just get some special K from the local dealer and end up ODing on the shit?

My point is, the article is stupid, and this constant focus on people taking horse dewormers is a stupid way to deflect a conversation from a legitimate drug that also has human use and is, legitimately being studied as a possible treatment for COVID. Seems like they'd want to wait for the data from these clinical trials to come out as opposed to muddying the public's knowledge about this medication as a whole.

Hospitals will be the new war zones. People will fight over who gets cared for first. And that will usually mean that Deplorables fight other Deplorables and the hospital staff is right in the middle of it.

r78 , what you are failing to acknowledge is that the REASON that articles and statements such as those released by the AMA are coming about regarding the off-label usage of ivermectin is that it IS dangerous in the wrong dosage and potentially millions of people could dose themselves with it on the basis of incorrect understanding of what they are reading.

I haven't read one comment on this thread, but every thing about the title is so jarringly perfect, so astoundingly sad, I can't even breathe.

Pfffft, so parts of the Rolling Stone article OP posted has been debunked HARD. I guess after 7 years since their rape article fuckup they've slacked off on due diligence.

But for all you questioning these random rumored COVID treatments, [bold]THERE IS A TREATMENT FOR COVID[/bold]

[bold]It's Monoclonal Antibodies.[/bold] But you have to get treatment FAST after exposure-infection. So early testing and getting the treatment quickly is paramount.

Therein lies the problem, vax-hestitant people will find some Ivermectin, Hydroxychloroquine, or whatever whoohoo they've "researched" and start taking that when they start having symptoms INSTEAD of getting to the doctor for a test and treatment plan.

So by the time they realize their bunk treatments don't work, they've lost the time needed for Monoclonal Antibodies to get a jump on things and onto a ventilator they go.

What ironic is that Monoclonal Antibodies is also only on an Emergency Use Authorization like the vaccine was - and was cited by many as to why they wouldn't take the vaccine - but I bet when people are offered MA as a treatment for their actual COVID they'll take it in a heartbeat. Performative hypocrites.

Oklahoma is now trying to get out of state doctors in to help them with THEIR stupidity. Oklahoma is a worthless state. I lived there. Texas is bad but at least they have areas of smart gay people, like Oak Lawn. The whole state of Oklahoma is nothing but a septic tank of right wing lunatics. Good Riddance.

Rolling Stone seems to have taken their cue from KFOR, who made a link between ivermectin and the crowding of ER beds that the doctor himself doesn't seem to have made. What he says about hospitals overflowing is true, what he said about ivermectin causing health problems is true, but he didn't strictly link ivermectin to overflowing ERs. It was the journalist who did, and the anchors repeated it.

I'm not saying that Rolling Stone was practicing good journalism here but I also think that the umbrage taken over this particular spin is a little suspect. It sounds a lot like "KFOR and Rolling Stone made a specious connection, therefore, ivermectin isn't dangerous at all and the media is lying about everything" and that's not true, either.

The debunked part of the RS article is one of the main Doctors they used as a source hasn't worked at the hospital location cited for over 2 months AND the hospital cited said they've not seen any cases of Ivermectin overdoses and have not had to turn any patients away.

The hospital corps debunking message pops up when you visit their homepage (at link).

Thanks Rolling Stone, you fuckers aren’t helping.

We in the known *Industrialized* nations are so utterly blind to our utter privilege, accessibility and just plain Ole purchasing power as the Center of Modern day Capitalism in the U.S. it is absolutely. astounding.

While arm-chair "Scientists" bicker back and forth about their 10 cent opinions gleaned from a few articles they've recently read let me give you insight to how Ivermectin works On-the-Ground in the real War to fight Covid and keep patients alive: it is a Complete and Disatrous humanitarian failure for the foreign Nations who are limited to fight this awful virus with this piss-poor 4th-place pharmaceutical in the absence of the "REAL" Goods. How do I know? Half my friends and family in Latin America are succumbing in droves to this Hellish virus without the benefit of our first-class Vaccines ( Pfizer/Moderna, etc) nor access to Remdesivir, which currently the U.S. has bought/stockpiled in totality for the upcoming year. What do you ask are they left to use prophylactically or to treat Covid? A few Inferior Chinese vaccines, and you guessed it -Ivermectin.

The latest Casualty, just last month( and there have been many) was an Aunt by marriage. And she was of no mean character: although middle aged, she had already reached the highest echelons of wealth and privilege within the political ruling class at the national level. In the end however, when she was exposed to Covid, even with her wealth and privilege made no difference: she was prescribed Ivermectin like so many before her ( in tablet form for human consumption) and assured it would do the trick. For a week she felt fine, and felt only slightly dizzy- a side effect of the treatment. But in the second week, she suddenly stopped breathing. She was rushed to a local ICU where she was placed on Oxygen. The hospital facilities were second to none in terms of infection control, staff training and equipment. , But alas- the shortage of Remdesivir was such, she had to wait until another patient being treated with it got better and left- or much, much worse. In other words Dead. In the end my Aunt was allowed 3 days worth of the precious medicine- the same amount of time she lingered on a Respirator.

I cannot even tell you how many friends, family members and acquaintances this has been repeated with.

Now STFU, until a thorough study has been completed with Ivermectin that is NOT IN VITRO, INCLUDES PATIENTS WITH CO-MORBID CONDITIONS, ON A WIDE VARIETY OF MEDICATIONS, AND HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH EXOTIC AFRICAN RIVER BLINDNESS OR OTHER FORMS OF PARASITES THERE IN.

And thank the Gods above, that we live in a Nation that allows us access to true prophylactic Vaccines, and somewhat effective treatments. Or at least until the next Variant kicks our butts.

That doctor didn't say ANYTHING about ivermectin overdoses filling the ER, r85.

That's what I'm trying to tell you guys. Watch the KFOR video interview and see for yourself! He NEVER says that. He talks separately about ivermectin potentially causing serious problems, and about the ERs being overflowing with patients, but never links the two together. It's the local journalist who does, then Rolling Stone repeats it in their own article that's taken largely from KFOR's information.

Your story, R87, highlights what I said a R82. Sorry for your terrible losses.

Tho Remdesivir is different from Monoclonal Antibody, getting these actually effective treatments SOON after exposure is the key.

And if people spend their time waiting to see if "cousin recommended drugs" do the trick, they'll be too far along for one of these REAL treatments to be effective.

Sadly, your Aunt was thwarted from getting the treatment asap due to under-supplied and over-burdened hospital - but it goes to show that timeliness is key.

[quote]That doctor didn't say ANYTHING about ivermectin overdoses filling the ER, R-85

R85 here. I didn't claim that's what the doctor said, R88. I merely stated the claim about overdoses, in the article, was contradicted by the hospital cited.

Here's from my post: "...the hospital cited said they've not seen any cases of Ivermectin overdoses"

I can see how, since I mentioned the Dr in the first part of the sentence, one might bleed that into the next part but they shouldn't.

I wasn't trying to chide you specifically r90 and I'm sorry it sounded like that. I'm just irritated at the hospital saying that this doctor's claims were invalid because he hadn't worked for them in two months, when the doctor never made those claims in the first place. The hospital should be blaming KFOR, they're the ones who caused all this. Rolling Stone shouldn't have just published what KFOR said without investigating on their own.

I honestly don't care anymore. If those morons want to cure covid with bleach, horse de-wormer or hydro...whatever, let them. Take the whole bottle guys, the more, the better and please do it before the next election Nov 2022.

This is already the week's best thread headline.

The FDA says STAY AWAY ... unless you moo or neigh

So where does that leave me?

R11 THEY DON'T FUCKING WORK YOU STUPID IDIOT.

Northeastern Health System—Sequoyah was never named specifically in the Rolling Stone article. This is the source of Dr. Jason McElyea's story:

Oklahoma hospitals and physicians are sounding alarms that haven’t changed Gov. Kevin Stitt’s view that the government won’t solve COVID-19 and that “personal responsibility” is the way to go.Hospitals are trying to reserve beds for the “sickest of the sick” but are at capacity, with no apparent relief in sight as exhausted caregivers say the burden is untenable, according to Oklahoma Hospital Association President Patti Davis.She and other medical professionals described a troubled scene across the state during the Healthier Oklahoma Coalition’s weekly COVID-19 briefing with reporters Tuesday.

Dr. Jason McElyea, a rural emergency room physician, had a gunshot victim in his facility whom for hours he was unable to transfer to a higher level of care because no one had space. One of McElyea’s colleagues had to send a severely ill COVID patient all the way to South Dakota.

“They had sat in a small hospital needing to be in an ICU for several days and that was the closest ICU that was available,” McElyea said.

Dr. Mary Clarke, president of the Oklahoma State Medical Association, said Stillwater Medical Center has a patient with a cardiac issue that it can’t handle. The patient has been in its care for three days as health care workers keep her stable while trying to find a hospital in Oklahoma City where it can send her, Clarke said.

“I’m trying to help people understand this is not just COVID,” said Clarke, a family practitioner based in Stillwater. “This is a domino effect to every other health condition that may need a hospital bed. Everything else. Period.

“COVID — yes — is taking up room, but COVID we can prevent (with vaccination). I can’t prevent someone tomorrow from having a heart attack.”

Davis said the Oklahoma Hospital Association’s recent survey of hospitals found there are about 200 fewer staffed beds in the state than in December.

“That is very much a concern because we know there’s a great deal of fatigue right now of health care providers just saying, ‘We can’t continue to do that,’” Davis said. “That’s affecting them not only professionally but personally, and we are very concerned about that.”

Three major Oklahoma City hospital systems have reported no available ICU beds — and a fourth has reported no room for COVID patients — in point-in-time census counts. Some hospitals have halted select services or are delaying nonemergency procedures.

The governor appears to have no intention of pivoting toward some level of restrictions rather than relying on a message of “personal responsibility” to help hospitals or protect vulnerable individuals.

“The Governor’s position has not changed,” wrote Carly Atchison, spokesperson for Stitt. “He does not believe government will solve the COVID virus now or at any point in time. He will always trust Oklahomans to do the right thing.”

Davis said the Oklahoma Hospital Association’s top concern is the availability of intensive care beds, which she knows is “very tight.” She described how an ICU bed might open at 11 a.m. and be filled five minutes later.

“We know that patients are being transferred out of state for beds,” Davis said. “We are increasingly concerned about the number of holds that are in emergency rooms waiting for ICU beds.”

She said the recent growth in confirmed cases — particularly among school-age children — is alarming because that often is a harbinger of more hospitalizations to come in the near future. Sick children might not need hospitalization as often as adults, but Davis said they could infect their parents.

“We need every tool used right now that we can possibly use to keep people out of the hospital because we’ve got to reserve those beds for the sickest of the sick,” Davis said, referencing monoclonal antibodies and other strategies, such as vaccination, wearing masks, socially distancing, and washing hands or using hand sanitizer frequently.

(continued)

(continued, 2/2)

McElyea, a frontline family physician working in emergency rooms in eastern and southern Oklahoma, said the gunshot victim who came in normally would have been no problem to transfer out of a small hospital that had no neurosurgeon and minimal critical-care capacities.

“We had a critical patient sitting in our ER for hours, and we simply couldn’t find a place for him to go,” McElyea said. “Another colleague in a place across the state: same situation. A traumatic brain injury with internal bleeding — couldn’t find a place to place these patients.”

The other patient with head trauma and internal bleeding was sent to Missouri, he said.

McElyea touched on one of the financial ramifications to families, too. He noted that insurers don’t pay for patients to be transferred back in state.

“Where it recently hit home for me was I had a colleague tell me they transferred a patient to South Dakota,” McElyea said. “These families have to worry about not just how their loved one is doing but how to get them back when they’re better.”

Dr. David Kendrick, chairman of the Department of Medical Informatics at the OU School of Community Medicine, said COVID patients are staying longer in ICU beds because they are trending younger and healthier.

Kendrick said that means they can tolerate being on a ventilator longer to hopefully come off it than those who were already ill before infection.

Davis said the Oklahoma Hospital Association’s members aren’t conveying any sense of a light at the end of the tunnel for overwhelmed hospitals.

“I think we’ve got a ways to go to get to a level where as a state the hospitals can breathe a sigh of relief and say, ‘We’re headed in the right direction,’” Davis said.

Watch: Dr. Jason McElyea's own words about the ivermectin problem in Oklahoma (you have to watch the interview at the link)

Note: Northeastern Health System—Sequoyah's posted disclaimer DID NOT DEBUNK any claims in the Rolling Stone article, nor in the KFOR interview, nor anything stated by Dr. McElyea himself.

R29 no, the media doesn’t want people consuming a drug dosed for use in horses, because, you know, that is dangerous.

Hysteria-driven journalism like this is making the push to get people vaccinated more difficult.

My trust in the media is at an all-time low.

They are taking doses meant for cows and horses. The dose I give for heartworms for my 45lbs dog is in MICROGRAMS not even milligrams.

Dying worm-free is a life well lived

[quote] It's Monoclonal Antibodies. But you have to get treatment FAST after exposure-infection. So early testing and getting the treatment quickly is paramount.

Ivermectin is being studied as an alternative treatment. Monoclonial Antibodies are only available to high risk individuals and are taken by infusion.

r100, the central point of contention is that KFOR and Rolling Stone ran a story with a completely misleading, emotionally-manipulative headline, then doubled down when challenged over its factual and logical basis & confronted with direct evidence contradicting it.

If a news report hailing Ivermectin as a "wonder drug" took even a FRACTION of the liberties with factual accuracy KFOR & RS did, and other media picked up the story & ran with it, people would be screaming for their heads.

This starkly illustrates the total double standard that presently clouds Covid-related journalism. If you publish something that supports (or better yet, "creatively amplifies") the official narrative, you can get away with literally making shit up and even after it's debunked, the headline will "virally" live on and continue to influence people, even if a lame, weak disclaimer that essentially says, "the headline, if not the article itself, is bullshit" gets printed at the very end.

Yes, a few high-profile studies showing ivermectin's efficacy have been discredited. There are now close to 100 others that haven't. Most of them can be summarized as, "It seems like under certain conditions, ivermectin *might* be better than nothing... and even IF its value is low, it's mostly harmless."

Somehow, over the past year, people have gotten the idea that every "approved" drug and use has been rigorously demonstrated to be perfectly safe & highly effective using "gold standard" double-blind trials. The reality is, most have only been shown to be acceptably safe & reasonably-efficacious for one or two conditions, and everything else they get used for is "off label" and based on little more than anecdote or theory.

Is ivermectin a highly effective treatment for c19? Almost certainly not. Is it potentially "better than nothing" and generally non-harmful at dosages likely to be safe, especially when given early in an infection's course to someone who IS fully-vaccinated? Probably.

Studies involving ivermectin given early pretty uniformly suggest ivermectin reduces viral load slightly compared to nothing at all. The disagreement mostly lies with "does it actually matter?" because it's kind of like holding a sheet of paper over your head in a downpour.

If your goal were to remain dry, the sheet of paper would fail miserably, because you're still going to get soaked. If your goal were, "keep your glasses dry & avoid having rain dripping into your eyes", it might work well enough to bother with, assuming it's not windy, too.

In ivermectin's case, the strongest hypothetical scenario for usefulness is, "fully-vaccinated individual begins taking it shortly after eating virus-laden food that results in a primary infection in the gut (where ivermectin concentrates a bit), and it slows progression a bit so that when the immune system finally notices the infection & kicks in, it has less work to do, and less collateral damage & injury results. And possibly some other mechanisms that might be better than nothing, but are less likely to work equally well for everyone.

I wonder if there is any Kool Aid left?

Just using DL as an example there shouldn't be.

I'd argue that an effective way to boost vaccination rates would be for states to give out free ivermectin to anyone able to prove vaccination status, while making the sale or transfer of that same free ivermectin to anyone who isn't vaccinated a felony (and prominently noted on all packaging).

The unvaccinated could still take veterinary ivermectin, or pay premium prices for prescription human-certified ivermectin, but it would constructively revise the narrative in a way that rewards & encourages vaccination, while toning down the already-questionable 'ivermectin is deadly poison' narrative.

I'd argue that it would convince at least a few percent of unvaccinated individuals to get vaccinated, if only due to squeamishness over the use of "animal" products.

A state like Florida could even play "good cop/bad cop" with it, using a message like:

Last year, the CDC urged people to 'wait for studies'. Well, we've HAD studies, and they weakly suggest that ivermectin might be useful as an adjunct to vaccination, so we're going to take the sensible middle road: if you're vaccinated, you can now get ivermectin for your own personal use for free.

For the first few weeks (while supplies are limited), we'll be handing them out when you get your shot. For the first week, we'll prioritize people getting their second shot. Starting in week 2, we'll extend it to first shots. Starting in week 3, we'll extend it to booster shots. Then, as soon as supplies are available, probably around weeks 4 to 6, we'll make it available to everyone whose vaccination is current.

To skirt the FDA, Florida would pass a law enabling ivermectin to be prescribed by nurse practitioners via telemedicine, and hire retired doctors to nominally approve ivermectin prescriptions while working freelance from home.

Eventually, Florida would phase the free ivermectin out, or work with other states to get the FDA to approve it for OTC so it could just transition into a cheap med at Dollar Tree (say, 3-5 x 12mg for $1).

The anti-ivermectin brigade will rage and foam at the mouth, but I think Florida's vaccination rate would SOAR, driven by presently-unvaccinated people desperate to get their hands on "the good stuff". Even if the ivermectin itself didn't do a damn thing, if it motivated people to get vaccinated & boosters, it would be totally worth it.

R108 I don't think it would make a difference quite honestly. Ivermectin is no more harmful to someone who isn't vaccinated. Nearly three-quarters of unvaccinated would rather quit their jobs than take a vaccine and there is a well-publicized case of a woman giving up custody of her children for refusing the vaccine. One thing you can't argue is that they are doing this to own the libs. Someone who was willing to give up their job or even kids are afraid of vaccines and that's not going to change.

Incidentally, a revised 3-prong strategy of vaccine + masks + ivermectin is scientifically rational:

* vaccine, because it's the single most effective protection.

* ivermectin, because vaccine isn't quite good enough on its own, and ivermectin can synergize with it for potential benefits greater than either one individually.

* masks, to reduce aerosol from infected people sneezing, and to reduce inhaled aerosol. Ivermectin is unlikely to help much in the upper respiratory tract (only the GI tract), so the mask provides added protection in the place where ivermectin is the LEAST likely to help.

The usual. Drug deals gone wrong. Drunks getting into fights. Estranged husbands shooting the wife and kids. Kids shooting each other with guns they found around the house. Attempted suicides. Guys accidentally shooting themselves in the dick.

Also getting shot by violent maga incels and also the gun owning mentally ill. I have never wished for much in this life. I am not materialistic but never have I envied people who have the option of leaving this shitty third world country more.

r109, you're right that the hardcore antivaxxers would likely be unswayed, but there are still a lot (in Florida, anyway) who are on the line, and dangling free ivermectin WOULD probably be enough of a carrot to motivate them to go through with it.

Promoting a "stronger together" (vaccine + ivermectin) message would be easy, because it's closer to "truth". Ivermectin probably isn't *totally* worthless, and claiming that it IS leaves the message vulnerable to debunking with even weak evidence suggesting it *might* be "a little" useful. Strong black/white messages make for good propaganda, but are ultimately vulnerable to getting nitpicked apart by determined fact-checkers.

R106, E108, R109, R110: using this thread as an ivermectin infomercial.

Bottom line: GET THE VACCINE; it's free, it's proven effective, and Pfizer-BioNTech's vaccine has full FDA approval. Moderna's will follow shortly.

Ivermectin is being self-administered by idiots and purposefully misled souls who largely have no idea what they're doing, taking it in formulations and doses intended for farm animals, and they're injuring and, in some cases, killing themselves. What's more, their obstinacy toward taking the vaccine is costing thousands of collateral lives throughout the country.

DO NOT LISTEN to the pro-ivermectin and pro-hydroxychloroquine trolls such as the one(s) on this thread. Their misinformation and outright lies, spurred by whatever conspiracy theories fuel them, are killing Americans.

I say we give out free ivermectin along with this book:

Meta-studies aren't scientific.

The media is the enemy of the people.

I love that they put UPDATE in quotations.

No retraction because that’s dangerously close to wrongthink.

^The poster put “UPDATE” -

r113 perfectly illustrates the personality type that sees everything as black & white, with no shades of gray (let alone color), is passively-deferential towards hierarchy & authority (partly, because it means they don't have to think about things they aren't interested in), and gets annoyed & stressed-out when forced to make "too many choices".

r106/108/109/110 illustrates the 'analytical' type who's determined to make his own decisions while seeing *everything* as a multidimensional spectrum of hue, saturation, and intensity... applied to a 3-dimensional shape... that additionally changes with respect to both over time.

Both are opposites, yet arguably lie along the same plane of thought.

Ivermectin-using antivaxxers aren't ON that plane... they require a third dimension. They aren't analytical enough to hunt down & read actual medical journal articles, but they don't passively buy into the same blind acceptance of authority as r113... or more precisely, they pick their own authorities (Trump, Alex Jones, etc) & delegate to them as hard as r113 does to the 'official' ones.

In reality, plotting the various attitudes requires a graph with 4 axes... but if you ignore the distinction between "evangelists/enforcers determined to make everyone else think/behave the way they advocate/demand" and "individualists who don't give a shit what anyone else does, as long as they're left alone", you can collapse it down to 3:

* analytical about EVERYTHING, vs willing to mostly delegate analysis to those they deem 'experts'.

* driven primarily by feelings (including sense of duty/honor) or logic

Google: "personality functional stack". It's loosely based upon Jungian theory (including MBTI and Socionics), but delves deeper into WHY different personality types manifest the way they do, with particular focus upon addressing the very real shortcomings of MBTI (like, why an INTP "looks" intuitive according to the official test instrument, but is "really" the most hardcore 'analytical' type of all, and why introverted sensors are positively social butterflies compared to a nominally-extroverted ENTP who tolerates socialization only if it furthers his goal of global disruptive innovation).

[quote] UPDATE: Northeastern Hospital System Sequoyah issued a statement: Although Dr. Jason McElyea is not an employee of NHS Sequoyah, he is affiliated with a medical staffing group that provides coverage for our emergency room. With that said, Dr. McElyea has not worked at our Sallisaw location in over 2 months. NHS Sequoyah has not treated any patients due to complications related to taking ivermectin. This includes not treating any patients for ivermectin overdose.

R118 so the good and conscious doctor lied and made up a story... and Rolling Stone again? Have they learned anything from their beloved rape victim Jackie? You need to contact other parties involved (in this case, the hospital and other doctors ) to verify the story before publishing it.

Oh if only the story was true OP. But it isn't. And you knew that.

R123, I'm curious — the Rolling Stone story is incorrect [bold]according to whom?[/bold]

Oh, and btw:

[quote]The Post Millennial is a conservative Canadian online news magazine started in 2017. It publishes national and local news and has a large amount of opinion content. It has been criticized for publishing COVID-19 disinformation and for its opaque funding and political connections.

Nice, try, Canadian Boris.

The Rolling Stone article has portions that are factually correct, but the HEADLINE (which everyone keeps reposting, repeating, and ultimately remembering) was debunked.

It's sensationalist tabloid journalism at its worst. It's like The National Enquirer running headlines circa 2016 like, "Hillary's NUDE Lesbian Romp!", then carefully writing the article to "allege" everything and including a disclaimer somewhere near the end that basically says it's all hearsay & bullshit. Or, they'd write an article about some other woman named "Hillary" with some tenuous connection to Hillary Clinton, then post a huge photo of Hillary Clinton with a caption that said something like, "Hillary Lezbeen is the neighbor of Hillary Clinton's third-grade schoolmate".

[quote]Gunshot Victims Left Waiting as Horse Dewormer Overdoses Overwhelm Oklahoma Hospitals, Doctor Says

R125, I noticed you didn't answer the question posted byR124?

Who exactly has "debunked" Dr. McElyea's claim?

Just thinning the herd. Nothing to see here...

I have lived in Oklahoma. A hellhole. I left. I have always said if America knew how much retardation Oklahoma has, they would have built a wall around it years ago to keep the Oklahoma stupidity from infecting the rest of the United States. Oklahoma is a joyless, tornado ridden, dump.

R126, the hospital where this quack said he worked says he doesn't work there.

Anybody who read this story and couldn't tell right off the bat that it was completely made up must have shit for brains.

The doctor is real and does youtubes. He is, however, a chiropractor.

If he's a chiropractor, he's not a real doctor.

[quote]but these drugs are very safe, even if it turned out they didn't help to fight against Covid, they won't kill you or cause any major health issues

They aren't "very safe" in the amounts being taken, which is why so many people are in the ER due to having ingested them.

[quote]drugs like hydroxychloroquine which has been used for more than 50 years in every part of the world. Safety wise, it's definitely Ivermectin or hydroxychloroquine wins.

We've learned in "more than 50 years" that a common side effect of hydroxychlorquinine is vision loss, which my friend with lupus is experiencing as a result of taking it for 10 years. "Safety wise," neither of these drugs are sold over the counter for human consumption their side effects can be far from harmless.

[quote] Rolling Stone humiliated after story about hospitals 'overwhelmed' by patients overdosing on Ivermectin falls apart. The false claim went viral and was promoted by MSNBC's Rachel Maddow.

Naturally Maddow would be blindly invested in it.

This is the hospital's full unequivocal rebuttal

[quote]so the good and conscious doctor lied and made up a story

I don't think so, unless there was something missing from that radio interview or maybe something I missed. He first gave a radio interview, and then was interviewed via Zoom for a TV station, and that's the reporting Rolling Stone picked up. A couple days ago I listened to all of it and this doctor never said people are clogging up the ER because they're overdosing on ivermectin. He said ivermectin can have dangerous side effects and he listed gastric problems and one "scary" incidence of blindness.

Then he said that ERs are full to bursting and ambulances are sitting there for hours, waiting to be able to admit their patients. At one point he does say some of those unvaccinated patients surely tried ivermectin and other home remedies. I think that's where the local TV station got their headline that Rolling Stone repeated.

That doctor is really getting screwed over with this, he's being blamed for something the media did.

On top of that, this clickbait headline stunt has started another round of right wing "the media lies about everything" posts, which is doing far more harm than good. Just a huge mess all around.

[quote]This is the hospital's full unequivocal rebuttal

Oh great gadzooks 134. Scan the thread, ya dummy, that's already been posted and established.

What's also been established there was also a DIFFERENT HOSPITAL mentioned in the RS article. So NHSSequoyah's statement doesn't negate all the claims.

Nice link to "Gateway Pundit" tho, a totally idiotic source that's consistently wrong and false more than any site including satire ones. You're just laying a turd here to give them some clicks like the dumb little soldier you are. GP's founder and Editor, Jim Hoft, isn't knows as The Dumbest Man on the Internet for nothing.

One more reason to never move to, or even visit, Oklahoma.

Unfortunately, there are plenty of physicians encouraging this deeply ignorant behavior. All of the idiots at the link should lose their medical license.

Example:

VIRGINIA

Carolina Health & Wellness Services (IVM) (843) 996-4908 admin@chwpeds.com

Telehealth for Virginia and South Carolina,  www.chwpeds.com

Our physician is an MD with over 25 years of experience and is a practitioner of Functional Medicine. We are located in Johns Island, SC and provide in-person care at this location. We also offer telemedicine appointments to patients statewide throughout South Carolina and Virginia. We can provide consultations on COVID-19 from a Functional Medicine perspective. We may prescribe Ivermectin, provided it is not contraindicated for the patient. In addition, we can recommend certain vitamins and supplements to help boost the immune system. Patients may call 843-996-4908 for details and to set up a telemedicine appointment.

[quote]The doctor is real and does youtubes. He is, however, a chiropractor.

You're a liar, R131. Dr. Jason McElyea, DO, practices family medicine, not chiropractic. He does not have a YouTube channel.

Am I the only one curious what the MAGAs will come up with for the Mu Variant "cure"?.....You know it's going to be something odd like Breast Milk Cheese or Cow Manure Baths....Wait and See.

Is it any wonder we Americans aren’t being allowed to travel abroad?

[quote]The source was discredited

No, "the source" was not. By the way, ten bucks says none of these right-wing rags would be able to identify "the source" if pressed.

[quote]the hospital came out and said it was crap

Northeastern Health System - Sequoyah aka "the hospital" posted a disclaimer stating that ivermectin overdoses were not an issue in their facilities. Dr. McElyea works for a medical staffing group that contracts with several hospitals. Dr. McElyea did not identify any specific hospitals, other than saying that the hospitals in the eastern and southern parts of Oklahoma — the region he serves — were having the capacity issues.

There's a serious (intentional) reading comprehension problem among the far right. Obviously, the dissemination of yet more misinformation and claims of "fake news" only serve their political agenda. No surprise there.

[quote]Am I the only one curious what the MAGAs will come up with for the Mu Variant "cure"?

In the first year of the pandemic, when it was hitting places like New York City and Detroit the hardest, the Trump administration took the tack that since it was killing Democratic voters mostly the best strategy was to let it run its course. So they set the stage for their own immiseration. Miring themselves in more lies won't save any of them from getting permanent holes torn in their lungs. Their only hope is in individuals quietly peeling away and getting vaccinated. Of course they'll still get it and spread it if they refuse to use masks and social distancing, but at least there'll be less of them clogging the hospitals.

[quote] Trump administration took the tack that since it was killing Democratic voters mostly the best strategy was to let it run its course

Why did Trump successfully implement operation Warp Speed, which gave us not one but three approved vaccines in under a year then? The facts do not support your hysteria.

The Tennessee Poison Center has seen a dramatic increase in calls for people experiencing issues after taking ivermectin for COVID-19.

Many of those calls were for people accidentally getting the drug on their skin, Dr. Rebecca Bruccoleri said.

“It can cause GI upset, it can cause neurological symptoms too,” Dr. Bruccoleri said. “We’ve been seeing people who have been having altered mental states because of this come in, so this can be a serious ingestion.”

[quote]“We’ve been seeing people who have been having altered mental states because of this"

How do they distinguish between the altered mental state post horse de-wormer and the altered mental state that impels one to take the horse de-wormer in the first place?

R147 took it right out from under me.

Fake news

R144 I could very well accuse Joe Biden of being a murderer because 2021 looks to equal or even surpass 2020 deaths from Covid but that will upset the narrative that Trump is somehow responsible for a GLOBAL pandemic. Never mind Democrats did not want to hold the Chinese directly responsible and were initially skeptical of the vaccine and any further study of alternative treatments just because Trump's name was attached.

It won't surpass the deaths under Trump.

Operation Warped Speed

They also shied away from Masks, when it was obvious by March 1 at the latest that masks were the answer. They could have taken over a Koch brothers plant and turned out billions, but instead they spent their time threatening to takeover meat packing plants to keep workers on the job in unsafe conditions. We won't forget, you Trump loving traitor.

YOU are guilty of treason and murder for supporting him.

Do means chiro, you moron.

R152 Businessinsider is a left-wing scandal sheet. It has about as much credibility as HuffPo.

> Many of those calls were for people accidentally getting the drug on their skin,

Jesus Fucking Christ, the anti-ivermectin brigade just doesn't know when to just quietly STOP doubling down on FUD. They're as bad as the antivaxxers... just in the opposite direction. Now, they're trying to draw parallels between ivermectin and synthetic opiods. Ironically, indirectly referencing a video that itself was either staged, or involved a rookie cop having a panic attack after his coworkers completely freaked him out.

Ivermectin isn't a deadly poison. It's not a synthetic opiod, nor is it a dangerous-on-contact drug like methimazole (used to treat hyperthyroidism, but can induce hypothyroidism in caregivers who handle it without gloves). You'd have to consume approximately 10 times the usual 200mcg/kg dose to even SHOW visible overdose symptoms.

Even if you got topical "sheep drench" sprayed on you from head to toe & left it there for hours without showering, you'd be unlikely to even notice anything besides 'itchy skin', let alone be "poisoned" by it.

Seriously, this hysteria (and attempts by some to fan its flames) is completely out of hand and absurd. Get vaccinated, then augment it with sane amounts of ivermectin if it makes you feel safer & more protected. Or, just get vaccinated & forget ivermectin exists if you disapprove of it.

Either way, note the media outlets who uncritically promote any anti-ivermectin message they encounter without bothering to do even minimal fact-checking first, and view their future reports about anything with healthy skepticism, because if nothing else, they've demonstrated their willingness to blindly and uncritically parrot ANY "official" message, and to take advantage of every possible opportunity to lay clickbait.

R157, thank you. At this point, I no longer trust anything that the corporate media has to say. And that's not good.

R156 It doesn't even make sense. These are the same people saying that Trump doesn't care about his supporters and only cares about making money and yet they'll run with something like this that completely contradicts their own messaging. TDS is a real thing.

[quote] a common side effect of hydroxychlorquinine is vision loss

Only when taken for years and years. One study showed vision loss in 6.3% of people who took it for 10 years or more.

The incidence of vision loss in people who took it for less than one year was 0.12%. That was within the margin of error of the study. In other words, that's about the same as the incidence of vision loss in people who DIDN"T take it.

[quote]Seriously, this hysteria (and attempts by some to fan its flames) is completely out of hand and absurd. Get vaccinated, then augment it with sane amounts of ivermectin

There is no "sane" amount of a drug formulated for animals that humans can take. These articles are almost all about human reaction to the animal version of the drug, though you seek to conflate the animal version and the human version.

R155, DO means doctor of osteopathic medicine. In other words, he's a legitimate physician, not a "chiropractor," you retarded cousin-fucking Tucker-watching backwater hick.

"Altered mental state" can also mean "panic attack, possibly induced or amplified by a freaking-out/screaming/nagging family member/spouse/parent"

Given how they've been compiling statistics, it honestly wouldn't surprise me if someone who came in histrionically freaking out about SOMEBODY ELSE's ivermectin use were counted as an "indirect ivermectin victim", just so they can boost the statistics a little.

Insofar as "human vs animal product" goes, it's more a difference of recordkeeping and liability than anything. They might try a little harder to optimize a hypothetical human injectable med's formula for "small quantity and lack of stinging at the injection site" vs "long shelf life under adverse storage conditions" (vs storage in a refrigerator, and possibly requiring that it be discarded shortly after unsealing it), but frankly, a manufacturer that went around intentionally adulterating veterinary products wouldn't be in business for long. Worst-case, a veterinary med MIGHT have a longer nominal shelf life (at the cost of more variable potency). For a med like ivermectin (with an extraordinarily WIDE margin of safety), that's a minor quibble.

Putting it into perspective, you'd have to "overdose" with ivermectin approximately 10x the usual dosage to even NOTICE any obvious symptoms (most of which would clear up on their own within hours or a few days). Compare that to the margin of safety for... say... Tylenol, where taking double the approved dose combined with alcohol puts you at serious risk of permanent liver damage, and a 10x overdose could end up being fatal (several weeks later... Tylenol overdose is "suicide in slow motion").

Hell, even a 10x IBUPROFEN "overdose" (2000mg vs 200mg) would almost certainly result in "GI issues". When you set the bar SO LOW that "upset stomach" and "panic attacks" get lumped together with cardiac arrest, liver failure, and stroke, even table salt or exposure to dihydrogen monoxide could theoretically be counted as potentially poisonous substances.

I'm a native born Texan and still live here. I can assure you all that the Okie deplorables are 20x worse than the ones here. OK is way more conservative and biblethumping than Texas.

So, R164, that makes Texas all right?

Di I say that R165? No, I just said OK is worse.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I live in Texas, as well. Most of my neighbors look like this. Stop generalizing.

The false news story is really about the current state of mainstream journalism.

This is quite a damning thread.

Q: should I take Ivermectin?

Q: Are you a horse?

Q: Have you been diagnosed with worms or scabies?

If either is 'no', you have your answer.

Drew raised an excellent point about the response of platforms like Twitter to the whole debacle. No flags, no warnings, no NOTHING... because the message, while false, is consistent with the officially-blessed narrative, so therefore it's OK to spread widely and shout from the highest metaphorical rooftops regardless of whether or not it's factually-correct.

Meanwhile, someone daring to tweet a link to a newly-published study about Ivermectin would be instantly swatted down for "spreading disinformation" by their automated bot army.

Funny how the idiot trolls aggressively pushing the efforts to debunk this RS story are the same people aggressively pushing COVID patients to take livestock dewormer.

Almost like you've got an agenda or something.

You're assuming that the Venn Diagrams for "People who think ivermectin might be at least slightly useful" and "Pedantic individuals who delight in pointing out factual errors in EVERYTHING" don't substantially overlap.

Another recent AP article discreetly retracted. It's amazing how factually-incorrect narrative-supporting articles get trumpeted, yet their retractions end up getting whispered & rarely result in the original article itself being taken down or blatantly altered to make it abundantly clear that it's no longer considered accurate.

The factually-incorrect claim made by the retracted article: "70% of recent calls to Mississippi Poison Control hotline were due to ivermectin"

The correction: "Only 2% of recent calls to Mississippi Poison Control involved ivermectin... and only 70% of THOSE calls were made by people who themselves had taken it and were later "concerned" about it".

I can't argue with any of this.

I wouldn't use Ivermectin even on my horses. It's vile and toxic. There's a safe and effective human grade product. Don't tell the Refugs.

I really think self medicating is a bad idea but the propaganda campaign being waged against these people is over the top. Meanwhile the woke people are pushing to legalize narcotics.

Last month, an Ohio judge ordered a hospital to treat covid patient Jeffrey Smith with ivermectin after his wife sued, alleging that the facility refused to give her husband the drug, despite him having a doctor’s prescription.

Since mid-July, Smith has been under care in West Chester Hospital’s intensive care unit, battling a severe case of the coronavirus, according to court records. Ivermectin — a deworming drug that some people are using to prevent or treat covid-19, despite several public health agencies advising against it — was Smith’s last shot at survival, his wife and guardian, Julie Smith, argued.

But on Monday, after Smith’s wife and the doctor who prescribed him the ivermectin failed to provide “convincing evidence” at a court hearing to show that the drug could significantly improve his condition, a different judge reversed course. Butler County Judge Michael A. Oster Jr. ordered the hospital to cease administering Smith, 51, the unproven treatment, arguing that “judges are not doctors or nurses.”

“Based on the current evidence, ivermectin is not effective as a treatment for COVID-19 … Even Plaintiff’s own doctor could not say [that] continued use of ivermectin would benefit [Jeffrey] Smith,” Oster wrote in an order filed on Monday.

Oster added: “After considering all of the evidence presented in this case, there can be no doubt that the medical and scientific communities do not support the use of ivermectin as a treatment for COVID-19.”

The judge’s reversal is the latest attempt by a government official to steer people away from using the medicine — long used to kill parasites in animals and humans — as a treatment for the coronavirus. In recent months, the Food and Drug Administration and other public health agencies have urged people to refrain from taking the unproven treatment, warning it could be “dangerous” and potentially fatal.

“You are not a horse,” the Food and Drug Administration tweeted last month. “You are not a cow. Seriously, y’all. Stop it.”

The drug, which has garnered support in conservative circles, has been promoted by some doctors, Republican lawmakers and talk-show hosts.

Smith, a father of three, tested positive for the coronavirus on July 9 and was admitted to West Chester Hospital’s ICU less than a week later, according to the lawsuit his wife filed in Butler County Common Pleas Court. The hospital treated Smith with remdesivir, plasma and steroids, and he eventually reached a “period of relative stability,” court records state.

But on July 27, his condition deteriorated, according to the lawsuit, and he was sedated and put on a ventilator days later. When Smith was placed in a medically induced coma on Aug. 20, his wife reached out to Fred Wagshul, who prescribed the drug without seeing Smith, court records state.

Wagshul is listed as a founding physician of Front Line Covid-19 Critical Care Alliance. The nonprofit organization, which promotes ivermectin as a preventive treatment for covid, is referenced in the lawsuit. Neither Wagshul nor the nonprofit responded immediately to a message from The Washington Post late Monday. Wagshul does not have medical privileges to work at West Chester Hospital, according to Oster’s order.

(continued)

(continued, 2/2)

Smith’s wife requested that the hospital administer the drug, but doctors told Julie Smith they could not treat her husband with ivermectin because it could interfere with other medications, the lawsuit states. There was nothing left to be done for him, the doctors said.

Julie Smith alleges that she offered to sign a release relieving the hospital and its doctors of any liability related to the drug treatment, a statement the hospital denied in its response to the court. Jonathan Davidson, an attorney representing Julie Smith, told The Post that his client was not available for an interview Monday night.

On Aug. 23, Butler County Judge J. Gregory Howard ordered the hospital to administer 30 milligrams of ivermectin to Smith daily for three weeks, as requested by his wife. The order, which was first reported by the Ohio Capital Journal and the Cincinnati Enquirer, did not include any explanation for the judge’s decision.

But Oster on Monday struck down that order, saying that neither Julie Smith nor Wagshul were able to demonstrate how the ivermectin treatment had changed Smith’s prognosis.

When asked whether the drug was improving Smith’s health, Wagshul “was only able to say that [Jeffrey] Smith ‘seems to be’ getting better after receiving ivermectin,” Oster wrote. And when Oster asked whether continued use of ivermectin would benefit Smith, Wagshul answered, “I honestly don’t know,” court records state.

Julie Smith, for her part, told the judge she believes the drug is working.

The judge wrote in his order that several public health organizations, including the FDA and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, do not recommend the drug be used to treat covid-19. At the moment, no studies or data analysis support said treatment for the virus, Oster wrote.

“While this court is sympathetic to the Plaintiff and understands the idea of wanting to do anything to help her loved one, public policy should not and does not support allowing a physician to try ‘any’ type of treatment on human beings,” the judge wrote.

Nevertheless, Oster said that Jeffrey Smith could safely be transferred to another hospital where Wagshul has medical privileges if he wishes to continue with the ivermectin treatment, an option that would not require the court’s intervention.

The attorney representing Julie Smith said his client was “disappointed” by the court’s decision, adding that the drug has improved her husband’s illness.

“I know this was a decision that Judge Oster did not take lightly,” Davidson told The Post in an email. “Fortunately, Mr. Smith was able to receive 14 days of treatment of Ivermectin, during which time his condition did improve. While he has likely received his last dose at UC West Chester hospital, we can only hope his condition continues to trend positively.”

Neither a spokesperson for UC Health, which includes West Chester Hospital, nor an attorney representing the hospital immediately responded to messages from The Post late Monday. Julie Smith’s attorney did not respond to a question about whether the couple had been vaccinated.

Nevermind

R178 Why wasn't this patient given monoclonal antibody treatment?

Apparently, monoclonal antibodies are given as a preventative treatment and are not available to those patients who are hospitalized.

I give my dog horse ivermectin as a treatment for mites and preventative for heartworm and some other worms. It's inexpensive and I know how to dose it properly. Since COVID, it's often out of stock at the feed store, the price has doubled or tripled, and there are signs everywhere demanding I not use it on humans. Last time I bought it I got questioned at the cashier. I was going to stock up but there were only 3 syringes left and I'm not an asshole so I only took 1. I'm concerned all this media nonsense will get it banned for livestock use. I don't want to be indentured to a veterinarian for my dog's routine treatments.

R183, what's a "dog horse"?

[quote]when it was hitting places like New York City and Detroit

r144 Because the governors of both states were mandating that COVID positive patients be housed with COVID negative patients in nursing homes like the absolute morons that they are (Cuomo and Whitmer).

^And because of that policy, a COVID positive patient was moved to a Detroit nursing home and this was allowed to happen:

[quote] Apparently, monoclonal antibodies are given as a preventative treatment and are not available to those patients who are hospitalized.

Nope, R182. It's used when someone tests positive for Covid and is within 10 days of showing symptoms.

It's only effective when taken with a full 8oz. glass of Clorox.

I had a carrot in my lunch today. Or as CNN calls them, ‘horse food’.