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Nothing to buy, nothing to rent: Some Americans are stuck in housing limbo

When Rebecca DiLorenzo’s landlord of 14 months informed her that he would be raising the rent by $300 a month on the apartment in East Greenwich, Rhode Island, she shares with her fiancé, Kyle, she started to look around for a place to buy.

“Our mindset last spring was, ‘We’re getting married, we need to buy a house’ and for a while we were going to open houses every weekend, but the market was just getting crazier and crazier,” she said.

After getting outbid on four houses — by as much as $50,000 — DiLorenzo knew they needed a Plan B. “We didn’t want to stay in our rental because it would have cost almost double what a mortgage would have been, but we also didn’t want to buy a house we really couldn’t afford,” she said.

Priced out of both the sales and rental market, the soon-to-be newlyweds are now living with family until things settle down.

This scenario is becoming increasingly familiar, said Rick Sharga, executive vice president of RealtyTrac, a real estate information company.

“First there was nothing to buy and now there’s nothing to rent," he said. "The eviction ban has also frozen a lot of inventory that would have otherwise come to market.”

Availability is limited across the board, said Jay Parsons, deputy chief economist for RealPage, a leading provider of home rental analytics. “Apartment occupancy is now at the highest level in at least three decades, and it’s a similar story in single-family rentals,” Parsons said.

“There’s a great reshuffling under way and everyone’s moving all at once,” said Nicole Bachaud, an economic data analyst with Zillow. This includes workers moving out of shared situations and transitioning back to the office, ‘digital nomads’ exploring new locations now that they have more guidance from their employers, and new grads moving for their first jobs.

Competition is pushing rents higher in places like Phoenix, Riverside in California, Tampa, South Florida (especially West Palm Beach and Fort Lauderdale, but even Miami as well), Atlanta, Memphis, as well as Texas, the Carolinas, and most of the Sun Belt and Mountain regions, according to Parsons.

“It’s bonkers,” said Jeff Andrews, data journalist at Zumper, a national rental listing platform. “In ‘normal’ times you see steady growth in any given market, but the rent increases that are happening now — and the intensity and pace of it — is unprecedented. It’s not something we’ve ever seen in the U.S.”

In some markets, prices are increasing daily. Nowhere is this more apparent than in markets that were hit the hardest and are now rebounding quickly, such as New York City.

“Things started turning around in April as the city reopened, and now everything’s going in a ‘New York minute,’” said Brown Harris Stevens’ Justine Bray, who has worked in real estate in city for 27 years. “It’s insane.”

Recently, Bray was working with a client in Thailand who was eyeing an apartment in New York City’s Murray Hill.

“This apartment went from $5,164 to $5,559, then $5,715, $5,882, $5,929," she recalled. "So every day my client was waking up and seeing it was costing more. We ended up getting it in July for a little over $6,200."

Prices are escalating even after contracts have been signed.

Pam Crocker recently experienced this firsthand when she put in an offer — at full asking price — for a luxury two-bedroom rental apartment on Manhattan’s Upper East Side. After making a deposit (including first months’ rent plus security), and signing the lease, she waited patiently for the owner who had accepted the offer to countersign.

“There was one delay after the next and they kept telling me there were all these other higher offers," Crocker said. "I was getting annoyed to the point where I almost backed out, but I had my heart set on this apartment.”

It ended up costing her $1,200 more per month than the initially accepted offer. “I’ve done a lot of real estate transactions and owned villas in Jamaica, but had never been jerked around like this,” said Crocker.

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by Anonymousreply 209October 3, 2021 5:19 PM

When will Americans finally get sick and tired of this bullshit, and say "enough is enough!"

The government is complicit in this outrage. They encourage these ridiculous prices.

And everyone wonders why the homeless situation is getting worse and worse.

by Anonymousreply 1August 31, 2021 2:36 PM

My Redfin search is turning up nothing but trash these days.

by Anonymousreply 2August 31, 2021 2:37 PM

God forbid we learn from other countries. Jesus.

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by Anonymousreply 3August 31, 2021 2:37 PM

BY buddy just sold his absolute shithole house that was 45,000 during the crash for 365,000 in Phoenix.

by Anonymousreply 4August 31, 2021 2:39 PM

^^ Which crash? ^^

by Anonymousreply 5August 31, 2021 2:42 PM

R5, you have to ask, really?

by Anonymousreply 6August 31, 2021 2:42 PM

The problem is that people get it locked in their brain to limit themselves to one specific area. If there is nothing available in a particular market, people need to look at relocating to a new city or state, and potentially finding work elsewhere. There are houses available, just not where you are choosing to limit yourself.

by Anonymousreply 7August 31, 2021 2:44 PM

Well, that was in the wrong place ^

by Anonymousreply 8August 31, 2021 2:45 PM

We're in this situation because of real estate agents and banks.

by Anonymousreply 9August 31, 2021 2:47 PM

[qyote]and potentially finding work elsewhere

Here's the problem with your theory.

by Anonymousreply 10August 31, 2021 2:47 PM

Exactly, R9.

And it's pure GREED.

by Anonymousreply 11August 31, 2021 2:49 PM

[quote] people need to look at relocating to a new city or state, and potentially finding work elsewhere.

Much easier to write than to actually implement.

by Anonymousreply 12August 31, 2021 2:50 PM

[quote] people need to look at relocating to a new city or state, and potentially finding work elsewhere.

This is the real estate mentality.

Fuck you, move somewhere else. You can't afford to live here.

Never mind that you've lived in that city or town your entire life, and all your family and friends are there.

It's so fucking twisted.

by Anonymousreply 13August 31, 2021 2:52 PM

[quote]Priced out of both the sales and rental market, the soon-to-be newlyweds are now living with family until things settle down.

They aren't going to settle down. This is the hedge-funding takeover of American housing. They are corporatizing the ability to have shelter, more than they already had, that is. Have to keep the rich overlords rich. They are creating a feudal society outright. The landed aristocracy and the rest of us serfs working ourselves to death with no hope of improving out lot in life.

This could actually be a simple message for Democrats to use. People, no matter how stupid, remember a little bit about lords and serfs from whatever history class they paid half attention to in school. We keep hitting this simple idea that the wealthy are trying to become lords and turn us all into lowly serfs and we might even get it to resonate with the "freedumbers" across the country. "Don't let the rich turn you into their mule boy!"

by Anonymousreply 14August 31, 2021 2:53 PM

[quote] Much easier to write than to actually implement.

It’s much easier to write that a person can’t find work elsewhere or relocate than to actually put a little effort into checking out the opportunities in other locations.

by Anonymousreply 15August 31, 2021 2:58 PM

This is due to Fed monetary policy, plain and simple. They are fueling inflation in every asset class and then denying that it exists. That's why AOC wants Powell out. She's right. At this point, he's just evil, making the rich richer at the expense the other 99%.

by Anonymousreply 16August 31, 2021 2:59 PM

It’s a winning issue for democrats. This is happening in all 50 states. There is nowhere else to move. There needs to be jobs to support a move.

This is the hedges at their worst. Can you imitate a woman trying to leave an abusive husband right now? She is fucked. Nowhere to go.

by Anonymousreply 17August 31, 2021 2:59 PM

Starting killing rich people. One here, one there. Randomly. Especially their families. Until they get the message.

by Anonymousreply 18August 31, 2021 3:01 PM

I'm with you, R18.

It's time.

Heads on pikes.

by Anonymousreply 19August 31, 2021 3:01 PM

It’s also the landlords are preventing any new developments. Infrastructure bill should include 25 million new housing units nationwide.

Rich people don’t get what’s going on for the average worker. It’s hell out there. Complete hell. Either this terrible option or that terrible option. Reminds me of Charles Dickens.

by Anonymousreply 20August 31, 2021 3:02 PM

[quote] It’s a winning issue for democrats. This is happening in all 50 states. There is nowhere else to move.

Great. It's a winning issue for Democrats.

But what will actually be DONE about being priced out of real estate?

Absolutely NOTHING.

Politicians on both sides don't give a crap about this issue. They see it as a good thing. Capitalism at work. People are making money!

Lousy fuckers.

The only people who are making money, are the ones who are already rich.

by Anonymousreply 21August 31, 2021 3:03 PM

R14 Yeah, it’s fucked.

This situation is happening in England, too. Take me, for example—I’ve lived and worked in the South West countryside almost my entire life, grew up here and went to school here. My family are all here. But as homes here get bought up by the upper & upper-middle class—especially since the pandemic, as the elites are fleeing from cities—young local people like me have been priced totally out of the market. Unless I happen to get lucky enough to meet and marry a rich farmer or posho newcomer, I am forced to leave either for the city/town (not a locale I know or am bred to thrive in) or to another region (North, basically, which is fucking cold and dreadful) or country (hence why I’m temporarily trying to scratch out an existence in Wales). And even if I could afford to buy, there’s nothing on the market anyway because the gentry and the investors have snaffled it all up. Most of the young friends I knew have been moved on for the same reasons, country people who should have been allowed to stay in their place of origin.

It makes me want to fucking cry.

by Anonymousreply 22August 31, 2021 3:06 PM

They need to do something. These corporations get away with everything.

Many of these landlords now require the tenants to maintain the properties and are responsible for any repairs.

Can you believe this crap? We’re not slaves.

by Anonymousreply 23August 31, 2021 3:07 PM

[quote] It’s a winning issue for democrats.

This is a money-making issue for democrats. Fixed it for you.

Democrats want this to happen as much as Republicans because they all get their cut. Ask yourself why during eight years of Obama’s “hope and change” did nothing change? The Obamas got theirs having parties on Martha’s Vineyard with celebrities. Where’s yours?

by Anonymousreply 24August 31, 2021 3:08 PM

There is no way this was in accident. These large landods like TRICON are absolute slum lords and the tenants get sick from the mold and mildew and god knows what else. These companies are MAKING A FORTUNE. And they get to keep the assets once the tenants get sick, lose their jobs and then evicted.

Then they rent it out to the next sucker.

by Anonymousreply 25August 31, 2021 3:09 PM

R24 is full of shit. Millions of people got healthcare from Obama. They would have died without it. Don’t pretend like health insurance was a real thing before the ACA. It was like the Easter bunny.

by Anonymousreply 26August 31, 2021 3:11 PM

[quote] Infrastructure bill should include 25 million new housing units nationwide.

Infrastructure bill should include 25 million new AFFORDABLE housing units nationwide.

But you know what I've noticed about new developments?

They are ALWAYS scooped up by corporations, international investors, or local people with lots of money.

They're the ones with the cash. They can outbid the individual home buyers who are just looking for a place to live.

It's happening in EVERY SINGLE real estate market.

They're the first in line, first to buy, and then first to "FLIP" the property and make a profit. Then they go to a new development and do the same thing. And they keep making more profit, and more profit and more profit. Which they use to outbid the poor individual buyers in another development.

Not only that, but these rich corporations, international investors and rich local buyers will buy an "affordable" property, and then turn around and rent it out to some schmuck for double or triple what they paid for it. Not only does the mortgage get paid, but they get a ton of profit in their pockets.

Real estate is the biggest SCAM to ever hit the human race.

Real estate is no longer there for people to find a home and live in it.

Real estate is now there for greedy people to make more and more and more money off of the lower and middle classes.

And the funny thing is that there are no limits or caps on the price of real estate. Our government calls it "the market." And "the market" can dictate any price it wants.

Which means that anyone who currently does not own real estate, is FUCKED.

by Anonymousreply 27August 31, 2021 3:11 PM

Biden reduced child poverty by 25% since January.

Things can be done, but you have to get the republicans out of the way. They are always stalling so that things stay the same and they get their checks. Always keeping the status quo.

by Anonymousreply 28August 31, 2021 3:12 PM

R27 25 million new housing units would make them affordable no matter what. There isn’t enough supply, thanks the rethugs and hedges blocking new developments on behalf of mega landlords corps. They block new development. In every market.

If we are going to go by the free markets, then they should be free markets for supply as well. You can’t have it one way.

by Anonymousreply 29August 31, 2021 3:15 PM

If you build more housing you take the air out of the hedge funds and everything becomes affordable. They will never let it happen.

They want tight inventory so they can make serfs out of us.

by Anonymousreply 30August 31, 2021 3:16 PM

We are 10 years behind on building and need to catch up.

People need to relearn how to fight back again instead of just accepting $2500 average rent for a dilapidated, dangerous studio apartment that is likely a fire hazard as well.

How much money are these landlords making? Trillions.

by Anonymousreply 31August 31, 2021 3:19 PM

I don't get it. Loads of people have lost jobs during the pandemic but house prices are soaring, so not many people seem to be struggling.

I kept my job so I'm OK. I'm only annoyed because I've just been shopping and the place was packed. I thought more people were meant to be poor.

by Anonymousreply 32August 31, 2021 3:23 PM

[quote] 25 million new housing units would make them affordable no matter what. There isn’t enough supply, thanks the rethugs and hedges blocking new developments on behalf of mega landlords corps.

That is absolutely not true.

You must live in a cheap city. Because where I live, NOTHING is affordable. And the few "affordable" developments are still expensive. I'm talking over $350,000 at starting price. For a condo.

There is development all around my city. Yet I see thousands of unoccupied units high-end buidings, which have a starting price between $750,000 and $1,000,000. All sitting there empty.

But the builders keep building.

Ask yourself why.

I'm telling you, it's all a fucking SCAM.

Real estate prices will never go down. They are kept artificially high, propped up by these new developments you are proposing.

R29 MUST be either a real estate agent, a developer, or very rich.

But I'm not buying the bullshit you're selling, because I know better. I live this shit every day, and you're talking out of your ass.

Build 25 million new housing units, and they will STILL be priced artificially high. I guarantee it.

Real estate is a racket.

by Anonymousreply 33August 31, 2021 3:23 PM

This will be a major issue in 2022. People can hide their struggles for a while. But what is happening in the housing market is now effecting everyone and we will be hearing a lot more about it.

A lot of people don’t even know about it because they are not in the market.

by Anonymousreply 34August 31, 2021 3:27 PM

The fucking shithole Chinese have been buying up everything everywhere. Just ban them and houses will become available again.

by Anonymousreply 35August 31, 2021 3:32 PM

This is a foreseeable problem - at the 2008 crash there was so much housing developed in the previous 5-8 years, that they predicted we would have an 8-10 year supply of housing. Well, that ran out and there was not enough new housing starts the past 5 years. It was still very low and anemic.

Now we're in a housing crunch - not helped by eviction moratoriums and extremely low interest rates. Corporations should not be allowed to own residential housing or only under special circumstances.

There should be higher taxes on flipping homes - i.e. the purchase and sale of a home within 18 months. There should be no foreign ownership of homes.

There are no 'middle' level housing or apartments being made - they're all 'luxury' and have very high prices. It's insane.

by Anonymousreply 36August 31, 2021 3:34 PM

In my low income zip code (flyover prices in the $30,000 - $60,000 six years ago) developers were buying-up these decrepit houses, doing some cosmetic improvements and flipping them for a $100,000 - $300,000 profit. The Millennials are snapping them up because it's 'near downtown'.

There's still rats and gunshots at night, though.

by Anonymousreply 37August 31, 2021 3:34 PM

That too, R35.

The silent problem no one dares discuss, because they don't want to be called racist.

by Anonymousreply 38August 31, 2021 3:34 PM

Oh, and the shithole Arabs too, when their desert lands will be uninhabitable in 2050. Just ban them from buying homes too.

by Anonymousreply 39August 31, 2021 3:35 PM

My sister is attempting to be a renter and live on a 1200 dollar a month social security payment. Her rent went up 200 bucks in Phoenix and she just bought a little 4000. dollar trailer in Yuma. It is 400 square feet and built in 1971. She is happy to have it. I had to lend her the money to buy it. It seems lots of older people are being forced out of many places.

by Anonymousreply 40August 31, 2021 3:35 PM

I'll take India's shitting over America's shootings.

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by Anonymousreply 41August 31, 2021 3:38 PM

Same boat, but no fiancee or family.

by Anonymousreply 42August 31, 2021 3:41 PM

[quote] Well, that ran out and there was not enough new housing starts the past 5 years. It was still very low and anemic.

[quote] Now we're in a housing crunch

There is NOT a housing shortage or "housing crunch."

I keep hearing this bullshit over and over again, and it's a FALSEHOOD.

The problem isn't that homes and apartments are not getting built.

The PROBLEM is that they are instantly getting purchased by rich people!!!

I reiterate: WEALTHY DEVELOPERS, WEALTHY INTERNATIONAL INVESTORS, and WEALTHY LOCAL INVESTORS. Even real estate agents are getting in on the action.

Our government puts absolutely NO RESTRICTIONS on how much property any of the above ^^^^ can purchase.

If they have the money, they can buy it.

So they're buying it. And buying it. And buying it.

The builders build it. The rich buy it.

Then they sell it back to the middle class or rent it back to them, at EXHORBITANT PRICES. Then they use that money to buy even more!

It's not very complicated.

But most people don't pay attention, because they're not in the market.

Until they ARE in the market, and then they're smacked in the face with reality.

Need a home? Need to rent? Well I hope you're a millionaire. Because soon, that's what it's going to take, if you want a place to live.

by Anonymousreply 43August 31, 2021 3:41 PM

R40 there are now 3 camper/trailers in my area that were not there in the spring. These are not poor people. Their relatives must be struggling. Very odd sight to see in an older, urban neighborhood.

by Anonymousreply 44August 31, 2021 3:44 PM

“The eviction ban has also frozen a lot of inventory that would have otherwise come to market.”

Where does this economist expect all the evicted tenants to live? Housing crisis solved!

by Anonymousreply 45August 31, 2021 3:46 PM

Half the houses on this block went up for sale or rent in July, and they all went fast except for my neighbor's house, which he listed at $155K when it's probably not worth more than $130K. No one is touching it.

by Anonymousreply 46August 31, 2021 3:48 PM

[quote]There are no 'middle' level housing or apartments being made - they're all 'luxury' and have very high prices.

That's the problem we're finding ourselves facing right now. This development was specifically made for small single-family homes with maybe one or two kids, plus retired people. As people move, landlords buy the houses and turn them into rentals for transient college kids, low-income families and Army enlisteds. The neighborhood isn't as safe as it was but there are no other mid-level homes to buy in safer neighborhoods, anything that comes up for sale gets snapped up by greedy landlords.

by Anonymousreply 47August 31, 2021 3:52 PM

R43 - calm your tits - both can be true. Here's a graph of new housing built versus new households.

We had a huge number of younger people forced to live with their parents and they are now able to move out - but nothing is there.

We also have the beginning of the great wealth transfer - the Lost Generation and Baby Boomers are dying and leaving their assets to the next generation. Suddenly some younger people have a good amount of money to purchase a home.

A friend of mine recently had his father pass and a single uncle (no kids) pass the following week. He's now looking at inheriting $3 million in his share from the two estates. This is a guy who sometimes couldn't pay his bills each month. Baby Boomers and older have something like 60% of all the wealth in this country and it is going to go somewhere.

It's going to make this nation even more of a 'haves' and 'have nots'.

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by Anonymousreply 48August 31, 2021 4:09 PM

r22 = Working class MARY!

by Anonymousreply 49August 31, 2021 4:18 PM

Don't forget the AirBnB assholes who take available housing off the market to turn into short term rentals. They make me sick. Many of them don't even own the property themselves, just lease it and rent it out under the landlords noses.

by Anonymousreply 50August 31, 2021 4:37 PM

If people would do research instead of complaining, they could find where the best places to move to are.

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by Anonymousreply 51August 31, 2021 4:48 PM

R6, yes, I really need to ask. There wasn't some circa 1929 crash, and if you're talking about the crash generally attributed to Covid 19, it did not universally affect markets across the US. So which crash are you referring to, because houses in Phoenix haven't sold for $45k for over two decades.

by Anonymousreply 52August 31, 2021 5:00 PM

Yes, R50!!

That's another one.

There are so many real estate scams out there right now, it's sickening.

by Anonymousreply 53August 31, 2021 5:13 PM

[quote] what is happening in the housing market is now effecting everyone

Oh, dear!

by Anonymousreply 54August 31, 2021 5:14 PM

Is this happening in the more socialized Western European countries? Germany? France? In Switzerland, there are no real estate bubbles, it NEVER goes down. There IS a lot of rent control. And there are some subsidized apartment stock for people with lower incomes. Is this happening in developing countries? Nobody can pay rent anymore? Or rent is 50% of income?

by Anonymousreply 55August 31, 2021 5:15 PM

I’m still shocked at the prices in the OP!

6,000/month?! For RENT?

by Anonymousreply 56August 31, 2021 5:18 PM

To add to r48, there was a recent article stating that Gen X is now the wealthiest generation, I assume because their parents are dying (likely being spurred along by COVID) and they're getting inheritances.

by Anonymousreply 57August 31, 2021 5:19 PM

[quote]If people would do research instead of complaining, they could find where the best places to move to are.

True, R51. For most people who could consider buying a home, there very often are options where they could find both comparable or lower priced housing and better general employment prospects. But the tendency toward deep-rootedness is indeed deep.

There was a widely reported New York Times survey from 2015 that said that "a person in the U.S. lives on average just 18 miles away from his or her mother."

In a 2019 travel market research survey of 2000 people reported by Forbes:

[quote]Eleven percent of survey respondents have never traveled outside of the state where they were born.

[quote]Over half of those surveyed (54 percent) say they’ve visited 10 states or fewer.

[quote]As many as 13 percent say they have never flown in an airplane.

by Anonymousreply 58August 31, 2021 6:15 PM

R58 - well, around 30% of the population are 'lower-class', 50% middle class, and 20% in the upper class income categories. It's not surprising that those in the bottom tier can't afford to travel. Some people can't afford cars, which is a large expense between payments, gas, insurance and maintenance each month.

There are a lot of poor people in this country.

by Anonymousreply 59August 31, 2021 7:11 PM

Maybe the Dollar Tree can build dormitories. A dollar per bed per night.

by Anonymousreply 60August 31, 2021 7:13 PM

R51 is a joke.

by Anonymousreply 61August 31, 2021 7:20 PM

Shameful.

by Anonymousreply 62August 31, 2021 10:40 PM

Corporations should not be allowed to buy single family homes or condos. Foreign investors should not be allowed to buy single family homes or condos if they are not going to live in them.

Big cities need to remove some of the toxic red tape that emerged in the 1960s. It had its day, now it just serves rich corporations that can afford to spend a decade lawyering before breaking ground.

Single family homes should be allowed to be divided. Most places dont allow this. More guest houses should be built. Most zoning makes this difficult and cost prohibitive.

Eminent domain should be used more often to clear out property owners, especially in big cities. Renters who find their shitty 6 unit buildings torn down to build giant complexes should be treated like lottery winners--cash payments, housing allowances, and the ability to return when new place is built with many more units. People should be like "the government wants to buy our house--fuck yeah!!!"

Its such a shame LA has awful public transportation because the valley is filled with space to build. Barely anyhting there is over 1 story high and a lot of it is ready to be torn down.

by Anonymousreply 63September 1, 2021 3:36 AM

AIR BNB needs to be fucking outlawed. It is one of the greatest failures of political lobbying that the hotel industry, which is well established, allowed air bnb to conspire with landlords to take tens of thousands of units off the market and turn them into hotel rooms, often in cities that didn't need more hotel rooms.

Doing that kills jobs in the hotel industry and drives up rental prices as well as removes units during a housing crisis. LA has tens of thousands of people on the streets and you're allowing landlords to rent out apartment units to FUCKING TOURISTS?

by Anonymousreply 64September 1, 2021 3:39 AM

Today I looked at what $1 million gets you in South Central LA and wanted to cry.

by Anonymousreply 65September 1, 2021 3:40 AM

It's engineered.

"It's just the free market working as it should."

The "free" market is engineered - at least partially.

by Anonymousreply 66September 1, 2021 3:41 AM

Investment corporations are creating artificial shortages and sky high prices. This would be fine if your tax dollars were not used for this grift. When the bottom falls out, they will be 'too big to fail".

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by Anonymousreply 67September 1, 2021 3:46 AM

[quote] Single family homes should be allowed to be divided. Most places dont allow this. More guest houses should be built. Most zoning makes this difficult and cost prohibitive.

Absolutely NOT.

That would be a fucking disaster.

I was reading an article about a huge problem in Honolulu, because of exactly what you are proposing.

Real estate investors are buying properties in residential neighborhoods, and building so-called "monster homes." Then they're dividing those homes into individual units and renting them out to multiple renters.

Can you imagine what it would be like, if you lived in a residential neighborhood, and one of your neighbors built a gigantic home next to you, and rented it out to six or more families??

It would be a fucking NIGHTMARE.

Again, this is rich people working the system to their advantage and for their own personal greed, while making others SUFFER.

I fucking HATE real estate people so much.

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by Anonymousreply 68September 1, 2021 4:36 AM

They need to start penalizing people who buy property as an investment. Hawaii charges an extra tax for people who buy homes and don't like in them full time, places like Seattle and NYC need to start doing that. Too many people benefit from the problem, that is a barrier to solving it.

by Anonymousreply 69September 1, 2021 4:52 AM

Read this article on monster homes.

It's an outrage.

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by Anonymousreply 70September 1, 2021 4:58 AM

How do people get loans for homes that cost more than they earn in 4 years?

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by Anonymousreply 71September 1, 2021 5:10 AM

They also need to allow for smaller houses to be built on smaller lots. They could put hundreds of small houses in the same footprints they're still building McMansions in for single people or the elderly to buy but because of lot size requirements, they can't build like that in most places. Imagine an entire subdivision of tiny homes on half size lots that cost $50,000.

by Anonymousreply 72September 1, 2021 6:32 AM

I just bought a van and plan to move into it when I get tossed out of my present place.

by Anonymousreply 73September 1, 2021 6:59 AM

In what other business or industry can a dumb schmuck like Trump survive as well as he has? There are so many federal, state, local, and foreign tax preferences for real estate developers and investors that an idiot can hire a real estate attorney that knows the gray areas of the tax code and a bankruptcy attorney that knows the ins and outs of bankruptcy law, and become president of the United States. Tax preferences and bankruptcy regulations originate from elected politicians, who want/need political contributions from wealthy real estate developers/investors to keep their power. Until the cycle is broken, it's hard to imagine how things can get better.

by Anonymousreply 74September 1, 2021 7:00 AM

The starting point continue to be pushed back for many.

"Everyone can't own property" becomes "well,maybe you have to pay 80 percent of your wages to rent indefinitely".

"Get a job no one owes you a living" became "Get an education, no one owes you a job" in 2008. People lost their homes in 2008. Investors purchased these homes at rock bottom prices and are now selling for 800 percent return, sounds like a rigged game to me.

People need a place to live, period. Housing is a necessity of life.

What is a market rent when the prices are fixed by the property owners?

Large property owners receive tax breaks to build and tax breaks when their units don't rent for the price they want. They make money hand over fist and pay no taxes.

This is an industry that needed regulation a long time ago. Just as someone pointed out up thread, it's no coincidence Dump came out of this industry, his SIL too.

by Anonymousreply 75September 1, 2021 8:14 AM

These are the exact same conditions that prompted tens of millions of Europeans to migrate to North America in the 20th century. Where should North Americans go?

by Anonymousreply 76September 1, 2021 8:20 AM

A multi unit property constructed on a single home lot? Charge an additional monthly fee to the owners for the burden their construction places on municipal water, energy and even trash collection!

by Anonymousreply 77September 1, 2021 8:28 AM

Isn't that just disgusting, R77?

The greed is off the charts with these despicable pigs.

by Anonymousreply 78September 1, 2021 8:31 AM

I understand greed. But people need a place to live.

by Anonymousreply 79September 1, 2021 8:38 AM

[quote]Is this happening in the more socialized Western European countries? Germany? France? In Switzerland, there are no real estate bubbles, it NEVER goes down. There IS a lot of rent control. And there are some subsidized apartment stock for people with lower incomes. Is this happening in developing countries? Nobody can pay rent anymore? Or rent is 50% of income?

R55, There's this from an opinion piece in OECD Forum, 21 January, 2021 on affordability:

[quote]Europe is in the midst of a housing crisis. From Paris to Warsaw, Dublin to Athens, an increasing number of people in the EU are struggling to afford the rising cost of housing. Even before the start of the pandemic, one in ten Europeans were spending more than 40% of their income on housing. In urban areas in particular, many people find themselves in a dire situation and are driven out of the city. Also, the quality of housing is often deplorable. Far too many people in Europe are living in overcrowded dwellings and damp or poorly insulated homes, with unaffordable utility bills.

On the risk of a bubble, a Bloomberg analysis of 38 OECD countries found 10 at highest risk for a real estate bubble: New Zealand (1st), Canada (2nd), Sweden (3rd), U.S. (7th), with Norway, UK, Denmark, Belgium, Austria, and France also in top risk spots.

Spain renters spend on average half their income on rent (along with Greece and Netherlands; and a longer list of OECD countries where the rate is 40%, with 30% being the suggested maximum.) But Spain has a high home ownership rate 76.2% and after its last economic crisis requires 10% or 20% as downpayment on mortgaged properties lowering risk, with a substantial number bought in cash. Home ownership rates in the U.S. are 65.3%, and Switzerland's are quite low at 41.6%, like Germany (51%) a country where renting is common. Spain housing prices are more stable as you suggest for Switzerland, though certainly they fell in the 2008 crisis from which levels housing prices have recovered but not advanced much; it's much more stable, a long flattish line rather than the steep rises (and some falls) that the U.S. saw from the very late 1970s to the present.

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by Anonymousreply 80September 1, 2021 11:24 AM

[quote] How do people get loans for homes that cost more than they earn in 4 years?

We as a society could curtail home prices by having the government limit how much people could borrow. The same is true for college tuition.

by Anonymousreply 81September 1, 2021 2:54 PM

[quote] These are the exact same conditions that prompted tens of millions of Europeans to migrate to North America in the 20th century. Where should North Americans go?

The Midwest and South.

by Anonymousreply 82September 1, 2021 2:59 PM

This sounds familiar

Republicans’ upper end tax cuts, and the Fed, have flooded the rich individuals and businesses with cash. But with too many investors awash in money, that extra $600,000 barely earns $5,000 a year in interest safe bonds. What’s a millionaire to do?

Investment firms pool those $600,000 chunks and use it for “all cash” offers to beat out the contingency-laden offers of middle class buyers for $600,000 homes. They then rent their trophies out to other defeated buyers for $3,000 a month + utilities.

Each rental generates $36,000 a year (minus taxes, insurance, basic maintenance and perhaps a 15% management & vacancy allowance). The Result: $36,000 in rent minus $14 000 in expenses, produces an annual $22,000 net profit.

The firms promise $15,000 to the (pension fund) investors - three times what they would otherwise have gotten - and pocket nearly 1/2 that much themselves. Sweet deal.

Until the next downturn.

Neely Un and underemployed renters now can only afford an average of $2,000/month. Net profit drops to around $12,000. Firms can’t make their $15,000 promise to the pension funds (not to mention pay themselves) without dumping millions of homes on the market. Prices plummet. Middle class people with mortgaged homes are under water.

We’ve seen this rodeo before.

Investment firms tell Congress, “You need to bail us out to save grandma’s pension.”

by Anonymousreply 83September 1, 2021 3:01 PM

I know I'm overpaying for rent yet I can't afford a house. Not sure what to do (honestly).

by Anonymousreply 84September 1, 2021 3:17 PM

[quote] I know I'm overpaying for rent yet I can't afford a house. Not sure what to do (honestly).

You need to find a cheaper place to rent, in a new city if necessary, and then save your money for a down payment for a house in one of the areas with affordable housing.

by Anonymousreply 85September 1, 2021 3:35 PM

[quote] It’s a winning issue for democrats. This is happening in all 50 states. There is nowhere else to move. There needs to be jobs to support a move.

Why would Democrats care? In California, Democrat politicians consider this an assett and like to brag about how desirable it is live in the state. When asked about the homeless problem, they say it's because of the weather. These people are fucked up beyond any recognition.

by Anonymousreply 86September 1, 2021 3:55 PM

[quote]I know I'm overpaying for rent yet I can't afford a house. Not sure what to do (honestly).

Understand what you want (home, career, relationship, geography) and your prospects for getting it (career, geography, marriage, inheritance.)

No one ever made money renting, in the long term it's money lost, even if there are short term situations where it may make sense.

Buying a home + time = money, or can do. Housing bought wisely, with a substantial downpayment and within your budget and with the idea of investing time as well as money produces the same result. It's possible to be tripped up by terrible-in-retrospect timing, or by bad choices in a home, or by changes in plans where you move house prematurely. But the simple dumb luck of having bought a house, or a successive string of houses accounts for the money and comfortable position that a lot of people have; inheritance and/or having stumbled into homeownership and stayed in it are more likely the reason that someone has money than his career. And at the end of 15- or 30-years of leasing, no one ever got excited to count the money they had made in equity, in rise in market value, in the freedom of living mortgage or rent free, or the choice in buying a place in cash or renting in your retirement.

by Anonymousreply 87September 1, 2021 4:33 PM

R85 is living in 1990s.

by Anonymousreply 88September 1, 2021 6:00 PM

r88, they have moving trucks in 2021 also. Rent one.

by Anonymousreply 89September 1, 2021 6:11 PM

Move to a place that pays half the income so that you can never save and keep renting but in flyover hell instead of at least being able to stomach your place of residence?

Getting caught up in flyover is deadly in 2021.

by Anonymousreply 90September 1, 2021 6:15 PM

If you move to a small town flyover hellhole, you’ll be trapped there and never leave.

by Anonymousreply 91September 1, 2021 6:16 PM

I’m gonna Midtown Manhattan on $20 an hour complain so they put me in one of those woe is me millennial articles.

by Anonymousreply 92September 1, 2021 6:24 PM

Move to*

by Anonymousreply 93September 1, 2021 6:24 PM

r90, at least you’re being honest that it’s about you not wanting to move to an affordable location and not at all about not being able to.

by Anonymousreply 94September 1, 2021 6:31 PM

First health care, now housing. What's next? Water?

by Anonymousreply 95September 1, 2021 6:32 PM

It’s not fair that rich people get to use the government as welfare but the poors are told to go find a nice tent and settle down in a nice tent city.

by Anonymousreply 96September 1, 2021 6:36 PM

Lots of people would be flocking to these “affordable places”if there weren’t deadly Covid outbreaks, stripping of human rights, including voting rights, and dangerous mercenaries at every turn. Doesn’t seem like much a choice to me. Not to mention the state assemblies in some of these places is as bad as the taliban.

by Anonymousreply 97September 1, 2021 6:40 PM

Do remember that these backward places wouldn't be so backwards if more people from the coasts moved to them. Imagine is 100000 New Yorkers moved to Wyoming and voted for Democratic senators. We could change the entire political landscape.

by Anonymousreply 98September 1, 2021 6:45 PM

R98 More people need to think like this.

by Anonymousreply 99September 1, 2021 6:46 PM

Great idea. You first.

by Anonymousreply 100September 1, 2021 6:47 PM

r97, as you have stated, it’s the personal choice of the people who choose not to live where there is affordable housing. No economic or housing policy is going to fix that kind of obstinacy.

by Anonymousreply 101September 1, 2021 6:48 PM

I already moved to flyover country and now we have two senators who are democrats. (Well, sort of.)

by Anonymousreply 102September 1, 2021 6:49 PM

R100 I did 5 years ago. I can save money and still have enough left over to visit these more bustling places once in awhile.

by Anonymousreply 103September 1, 2021 6:52 PM

[Quote] Never mind that you've lived in that city or town your entire life, and all your family and friends are there.

So fucking what? You sound like a child. Grow up, pussy!

by Anonymousreply 104September 1, 2021 6:54 PM

I’m going to start a community group that targets egregious slumlords, shady developers, their friends on the planning boards and the real-estate scumbags that keep it all going.

I think we have to deal with this ourselves through activis. I’m not backing down to these corporate vultures. You have to fight back in anyway you can. Don’t make it easy for these slumlords to thrive off the suffering of the downtrodden, who have already been victimized enough.

Thanks for the encouragement! Today is a new dawn.

by Anonymousreply 105September 1, 2021 6:59 PM

I'm with you 100% R105.

Let me know if I can help in any way.

We need to take them down.

by Anonymousreply 106September 1, 2021 7:08 PM

“No economic or housing policy is going to fix that kind of obstinacy.”

The policy now allows for slumlords to rent moldy apartments for outrageous sums and to rig the local markets.

Changing that policy would benefit renters.

by Anonymousreply 107September 1, 2021 7:10 PM

The "just move to a cheaper city" argument is such a load of shit. Assuming that you can find a city to move to with affordable homes to buy or rent, AND can find a job there that will allow you to pay the rent or mortgage, that is just the first step. Moving is expensive, you have to be able to afford to pay movers, or to rent a moving truck, and pay for gas. You have deposits or a down-payment to make. Fees to set up services like phone, internet, utilities. If you have been barely scraping by, paying your rent in an expensive city, with no ability to save, how are you supposed to afford those costs?

How do you afford to travel there, and see if it is a place you can live? Should people just blindly move somewhere and hope they like it? Hope that the services they need are nearby and easily accessible?

Oh, and then there is the fact that people shouldn't have to uproot their lives, and leave behind everyone they know because that's just how it is, and we need to protect investors, the rich, and corporations at the expense of everyone else. Then, when people start flocking to these places, the whole cycle starts again, and then where do people go? Uproot again in hopes of finding somewhere that hasn't already had this happen?

by Anonymousreply 108September 1, 2021 7:13 PM

Just buy a van and move into and the issue is solved

by Anonymousreply 109September 1, 2021 7:15 PM

R105 the main thing you can do is gather facts about your city and figure out who the shady players are. Then scale it out to the national players, like TRICON and the like.

Otherwise it’s all local. The planning boards, the real estate groups, legal aid, etc. We have to get active. Local politicians who are on the right side of this will sail to office. It’s bubbling up right now. Wait until all the evictions.

If this movement against these corps and slumlords starts happening everywhere, then a national movement will follow.

by Anonymousreply 110September 1, 2021 7:16 PM

[quote] The "just move to a cheaper city" argument is such a load of shit

Ignore the assholes who post this.

They're probably disgusting real estate agents or creepy slumlords, trying to justify their disgusting behavior.

As if it's so easy for people to leave their hometowns, their friends, and their family. Just to accommodate rich cunts who are pricing them out of their lives.

by Anonymousreply 111September 1, 2021 7:17 PM

If people don’t start fight back against all these types of oppressive moves by rethugs and the 1% then we are really going all be slaves. It’s not a joke anymore. These rethugs are for real.

by Anonymousreply 112September 1, 2021 7:17 PM

[quote]If you move to a small town flyover hellhole, you’ll be trapped there and never leave.

Not to mention you'll be forever branded as a class-free dumpster woman by the social arbiters of Datalounge!

by Anonymousreply 113September 1, 2021 7:26 PM

"Find something new! Then stand outside your sad $450-a-month hovel in Keokuk so I can drive by in my purple Cadillac and pelt you with empty caviar tins!"

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by Anonymousreply 114September 1, 2021 7:32 PM

It’s not even what is happening right now in deplloraville right now that worries me.

It’s what comes next.

by Anonymousreply 115September 1, 2021 7:33 PM

The nastiest "just move somewhere" posters are also the airbnb landlords with multiple properties.

by Anonymousreply 116September 1, 2021 7:36 PM

What I've observed in my region, not overly populated, expensive housing, and short supply, is that once people get theirs they want to shut the door behind them.

Both conservatives and liberals lose their minds at the thought of more and more people moving in and disrupting the uncrowded luxury of living near vast open spaces in a land of plenty.

I understand that feeling, who doesn't want to live in a nice place that's safe and secure? But at the bottom of it is a very dysfunctional society that favors the wealthy and oppresses the poor. Add the fact that more and more people move into my state from around the world, driving up costs due to a lack of supply and laws that prohibit growth.

We as humans need to stop reproducing in large numbers and work harder to improve quality of life on all accounts. Instead we greedily grasp for wealth and exclusivity without a thought what we're doing to future generations by rapidly diminishing the earth's resources to feed our gluttonous desires.

I really feel sorry for people stuck in housing limbo. Add to that, low wages and high cost of living. It really sucks for house hunters now.

by Anonymousreply 117September 1, 2021 7:39 PM

Let's start by shutting HGTV down and making the management live in RVs parked on the street somewhere in the Bay area.

by Anonymousreply 118September 1, 2021 7:50 PM

[Quote] As if it's so easy for people to leave their hometowns, their friends, and their family. Just to accommodate rich cunts who are pricing them out of their lives.

You are not entitled to that. No one is. Your posts scream entitlement and you stating anyone who disagrees with you is a "rich person" or a "landlord" is fucking ridiculous. Your emotions have gotten the best of you. Calm down and go after the real problem and THAT IS the 1% and more importantly Wallstreet cunts who set this crisis up decades ago. That is the real problem no one goes after because they are afraid of the rich who run everything in the US. FACT. Go after the the heart of the beast you kill the problem.

by Anonymousreply 119September 1, 2021 7:55 PM

[quote] As if it's so easy for people to leave their hometowns, their friends, and their family.

It’s good that people are being more honest in the more recent relies, confessing that it’s just that they don’t want to leave their unaffordable location, not that they can’t. R108 is still grasping for excuses not to move, but I appreciate the honesty of others who admit there are better places to live, but they don’t want to live in those places.

by Anonymousreply 120September 1, 2021 8:23 PM

“others who admit there are better places to live” you are having hallucinations dude. Nobody said this. You’re making stuff up.

by Anonymousreply 121September 1, 2021 8:40 PM

[quote]You need to find a cheaper place to rent, in a new city if necessary, and then save your money for a down payment for a house in one of the areas with affordable housing.

You are so fucking ignorant. I live in nowhere Illinois. Houses here are ridiculously expensive and even then they are being snapped up by hedge funds and other investors. A condo that was $40,000 two years ago is now on the market for $95,000. I've been looking at houses in 'supernowhere' Illinois but they are being bought up, too, and the land is being bought up to create more McMansionvilles. Plus, there are no fucking jobs there at all even if I could snap up a house before the developers and investors show up. Like I said, you're just an ignorant asshole so desperate for attention that you post this contrarian, holier-than-thou shit on DL. Pathetic.

by Anonymousreply 122September 1, 2021 8:42 PM

A lot of people have no idea this is going on. They think it’s just black people who are being displaced. When they realize that they are in the same boat, they have a meltdown.

There were a lot of middle class families in hotels this summer and they were all tense and miserable. Looking for houses week after week.

If you’re not in the market, you probably have no clue.

by Anonymousreply 123September 1, 2021 8:47 PM

[quote] I live in nowhere Illinois. Houses here are ridiculously expensive

If you were to overcome your resistance to leaving Illinois and move, you’d have company. As this article indicates, Illinois was the third most moved from state in 2020. The article also mentions the six states that were the most popular for moving to from Illinois.

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by Anonymousreply 124September 1, 2021 9:00 PM

[Quote] Houses here are ridiculously expensive and even then they are being snapped up by hedge funds and other investors.

Like I said, focus on Wall street cunts and the 1%ers. They are doing this. Plus, off seas investors who are also connected to them. If everyday Americans would have kept their eyes on Wall Street during W and after the crash things would be different today. We instead focused of other things { also related and controlled by Wall street and the 1%ers } but we didn't. I've been saying this here for a few decades. No one listened.

by Anonymousreply 125September 1, 2021 9:09 PM

SF Bay Area home prices are up 21.9% year over year, pandemic notwithstanding. Phoenix up 29.3%, San Diego 27.1%, Seattle up 25%. 18.1% aggregate increase nationally over the past 12 months. All are the biggest year over year gains on record. Huge demand + almost free mortgage money.

by Anonymousreply 126September 1, 2021 9:19 PM

If you have partial custody of your children you can't just move wherever the goddamned invisible hand tells you to. Not unless you convince your ex to move to the same place. Give me a break.

by Anonymousreply 127September 1, 2021 10:21 PM

Some of these assholes should tell the homeless population in Cali that there are more affordable places to live in the country. Problem solved.

by Anonymousreply 128September 1, 2021 10:46 PM

The people who tell others to find some other place to live are the epitome of entitles asshole elitists. They don't want to rub shoulders with anyone they consider beneath them. It doesn't matter if some of these people can't survive without the support (either financial or emotional) of their friends or family and that a number of them are elderly. They cheer this on because they want to think it will change the landscape of the country. Fuck these assholes.

by Anonymousreply 129September 1, 2021 10:48 PM

In LA, the cost of single family homes is being driven up because many are crammed with multiple or extended families. These areas, which start to resemble ghettos from third world countries, have appreciated in value due to the population explosion. It's single people and middle class families who are being driven out of California.

by Anonymousreply 130September 1, 2021 10:59 PM

Exactly. R83. When does the grift end?

by Anonymousreply 131September 1, 2021 11:37 PM

R129, they also can not read. This phenomenon is happening all over the US, not just prime areas.

by Anonymousreply 132September 1, 2021 11:41 PM

R132 yes the irony of people leaving prime areas is that they will end up gentrifying the areas they are moving to. The elite cannot live side by side with a burgeoning middle class, only with other elites and a subservient serf class, as long as they don’t have to see them.

by Anonymousreply 133September 2, 2021 12:09 AM

People moved during covid. And rightly so. A major city is the very worst place to be with an uncontrolled and raging infection in circulation. Prices for homes skyrocketed for suburbia and are now higher than ever in major cities. The grift never ends.

by Anonymousreply 134September 2, 2021 12:14 AM

So what are we going to do about it?

R105 is the only one who came up with an idea to fight this cancer.

by Anonymousreply 135September 2, 2021 12:23 AM

Many cities are going to turn into Lords and serfs environments.

This will be exacerbated by the Great Wealth Transfer - if you're lucky enough to be a recipient. If you're not, you're going to be in really bad shape in 15-20 years after if you don't get your hands on the $60-70 trillion that will be passed down to younger generations.

Yes, $60-70 trillion. Most of it from white Silent Generation and Baby Boomers.

by Anonymousreply 136September 2, 2021 5:33 AM

And then the Baby Boomers turn around and reverse mortgage their house, spend down their 401Ks to buy summer homes and take vacations, and leave nothing or anyone else to inherit. Selfish generation until the end. Greed is good was their generational mantra and should be inscribed on their tombstones.

by Anonymousreply 137September 2, 2021 6:37 AM

Why shouldn’t they reverse mortgage their homes to pay for live in care you won’t provide?

And you’ll still inherit the Summer House

by Anonymousreply 138September 2, 2021 7:16 AM

[quote]And then the Baby Boomers turn around and reverse mortgage their house, spend down their 401Ks to buy summer homes and take vacations, and leave nothing or anyone else to inherit. Selfish generation until the end. Greed is good was their generational mantra and should be inscribed on their tombstones.

What makes you think greed is unique to one generation? Money is not finite. There's loads more money now than when the Boomers or their parents' or the childrens' generation were born. You blame them for not giving over the fruits of their labor or investment or simple dumb luck while they're alive. If you are talking about people who reverse mortgage their houses "to buy summer homes and take vacations," you're not talking about the filthy rich or even the rich, just middle class people with a paid off mortgage.

And if old people should "spend down their 401Ks," what was the point of them other than to provide for their retirement years, like it says on the tin?

Greed is everywhere, and runs deep, across generations, across centuries. It's only generosity that stands out as unusual, as not the natural inclination for many people. Do you think being a scold is an act of generosity? Or waiting for older people to turn over their stuff: their jobs, their houses, their money. That somehow that would be generous on their part but not greedy on the part of people waiting with their hands out scolds with their hands to get theirs by inheritance or gift?

by Anonymousreply 139September 2, 2021 8:02 AM

R124 Did you read your whole article?

“ In Illinois, the most common reasons people moved out in 2020 included a new job, retirement, and to be closer to family.

Most of the people moving out of Illinois were 55 or older, and had an income of $100,000 or more, according to the study.”

by Anonymousreply 140September 2, 2021 2:39 PM

Yes, there are a number of reasons for people choosing to move from Illinois to enjoy a better life elsewhere. This article states, “Major reasons Illinoisans are choosing to leave the state are for better housing and employment opportunities, both of which have been made worse by poor public policy in Illinois. Nearly half of Illinoisans have thought about moving away, and they said taxes were their No. 1 reason.” It’s fortunate that people in Illinois who are faced with unaffordable housing costs are able to find better, more affordable places to live.

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by Anonymousreply 141September 2, 2021 2:52 PM

R84 here. Thanks for the advice. I'm open to moving almost anywhere and already live in "flyover" country.

by Anonymousreply 142September 2, 2021 3:00 PM

R140 - to be fair, there's the Chicago area and the rest of the state of Illinois. Like most states, the non-urban areas are turning into depressing, economically deprived waste areas. People have to or SHOULD move.

It's not unique to Illinois.

by Anonymousreply 143September 2, 2021 3:10 PM

R141, Illinois Policy, that you linked to, is a conservative fuckhole site with a Repug agenda.

by Anonymousreply 144September 2, 2021 6:52 PM

People of all political persuasions have been able to escape Illinois for a better, more affordable life elsewhere.

by Anonymousreply 145September 2, 2021 7:54 PM

Believe it!

by Anonymousreply 146September 2, 2021 8:51 PM

You can't even buy a "tiny house" any more, for less than $100,000.

And that's not including the LAND you have to put it on. And electrical hook up. And water. And sewage.

by Anonymousreply 147September 3, 2021 4:48 AM

[quote] And electrical hook up. And water. And sewage.

Other people have also mentioned this. Is this a big deal in some places? When you buy a house, you just have the utilities switched to you. It’s not a difficult task in my experience.

by Anonymousreply 148September 3, 2021 5:50 AM

R148, I believe they are talking about building new housing units or subdivisions, etc.

by Anonymousreply 149September 3, 2021 8:28 AM

[quote]Other people have also mentioned this [hook up for electrical, water, sewage, gas.] Is this a big deal in some places? When you buy a house, you just have the utilities switched to you. It’s not a difficult task in my experience.

It's a big deal any place that doesn't already have connections for those things, which would be almost any place you might plant a tiny house other than in your own back garden.

If it's in the city, houses on wheel and tiny houses are often prohibited.

If its in the country, there's no well and no septic system available unless they were already in place for a previous structure. A well and a septic system would be tens of thousands of dollars; even having the electric company come to the property and run a short service line from the roadway to your tiny house would cost $1500 or so in a lot of jurisdictions — more if the structure set more than a certain number of feet from the roadway.

Americans have very strange ideas about their tiny houses, not least that they must be portable and on wheels so that they can move them about like a heavy suitcase, and that there are lots of places ready to accommodate something that is often classed neither as house nor a mobile home.

by Anonymousreply 150September 3, 2021 11:44 AM

It's desperation, R150.

by Anonymousreply 151September 3, 2021 11:46 AM

Don't forget those Million Dollar Listing assholes, also working hard to drive NY prices up.

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by Anonymousreply 152September 3, 2021 3:56 PM

Interesting that this thread got grayed out.

I guess "the powers that be" don't like to hear the truth.

There must be a lot of real estate agents here on Datalounge.

by Anonymousreply 153September 3, 2021 3:57 PM

...........

by Anonymousreply 154September 5, 2021 8:18 PM

So that's the grift? "investors" scoop up entire subdivisions driving up the cost of housing. The average buyer is outbid and forced to rent indefinitely. Rents are sky high to protect the investment of the property owner.

by Anonymousreply 155September 5, 2021 8:25 PM

I've noticed in my area that several condo buildings have been bought and suddenly a bunch, if not all, the condos in that building go up for sale at super high prices. The only thing I can think of that could cause that would be a large, rich corporation or hedge fund buying out the people in the building, quickly doing some upgrades, and then doubling or tripling the prices when they resell. So, again, lower to middle income condos are being turned into expensive condos. If you aren't rich, you can't afford a house or condo anymore and are then forced to rent from the huge conglomerates buying up all the rental properties.

by Anonymousreply 156September 5, 2021 8:29 PM

All of this is sad but true.

by Anonymousreply 157September 5, 2021 8:33 PM

In addition “Investors” often get a slightly better price for the properties they scoop up for all “Gov’t gifted” cash because they can settle quickly and spread the risk of an occasional bad-apple purchase across the several properties they buy at once.

OTOH, to protect themselves, ordinary one-off buyers often do detailed inspections which can create delays and contingencies that can cause sellers to favor the aggressive (slightly lower offering price) corporate buyers.

by Anonymousreply 158September 5, 2021 8:38 PM

R147, true. There are a handful of "tiny" homes (500-600 sq feet) in my midwestern city. They are going for just under 200K. They are cute but feel extremely overpriced.

by Anonymousreply 159September 6, 2021 4:51 PM

And STILL no one does anything about it except complain on social media. Carry on cell phone addicted, bots.

by Anonymousreply 160September 6, 2021 4:59 PM

You can't fight city hall.

by Anonymousreply 161September 6, 2021 5:03 PM

[quote] And STILL no one does anything

People on DL who really care about the issue could buy rental property and then allow tenants to stay there for free or at a rate far below what can legally be charged, but of course, hell would have to freeze over first.

by Anonymousreply 162September 6, 2021 5:17 PM

Or, R162, the big corps and investors could just play the game fairly but, of course, hell would have to freeze over first, right asshole?

by Anonymousreply 163September 6, 2021 6:46 PM

They ARE playing the game fairly. There are no laws against what's happening (because lobbyists and donations).

by Anonymousreply 164September 6, 2021 7:18 PM

[quote] the big corps and investors could just play the game fairly

As long as it’s someone other than you that needs to do something, you’re good with it, right?

by Anonymousreply 165September 6, 2021 11:00 PM

What the fuck are you even talking about, R165? The entire thread is about regular people being completely locked out of the market. Are you stupid? I mean, your agenda is obvious, but are you stupid, too?

by Anonymousreply 166September 7, 2021 12:09 AM

r166, you want other people to make your life better, but you aren’t willing to do anything to help yourself or to help anyone else.

by Anonymousreply 167September 7, 2021 2:26 AM

What are we supposed to do, R167? Start a tenant's union and go on a rent strike?

by Anonymousreply 168September 7, 2021 10:39 AM

r168, you’re still wanting other people to make your life better, but you aren’t willing to sacrifice anything yourself to help anyone else.

by Anonymousreply 169September 7, 2021 1:26 PM

What are you, the ghost of Ayn Rand? Can't we be done with that type if propaganda? Aren't the Republicans completely sub-literate by now? Reduced to throwing poo and shrieking? Lets just stick with that.

by Anonymousreply 170September 7, 2021 4:00 PM

r170, you got caught wanting other people to give, but not willing to do anything yourself to help people.

by Anonymousreply 171September 7, 2021 4:47 PM

R171, you're talking to a different person. And, like I actually did say, above, you are still wrong. First, you've changed the premise of your bullshit now from taking on the rich people gaming the system to not helping other people. The problem is that people other than the uber wealthy are being locked out.

Go ahead and explain all the ways the average person should fight the corporations and hedge funds in the real estate market. I'll wait here for your list that will never come.

by Anonymousreply 172September 7, 2021 6:34 PM

[Quote] What are you, the ghost of Ayn Rand?

A future classic DL tagline. Brilliant! Thank you, r170!

by Anonymousreply 173September 7, 2021 7:08 PM

r172, you’re demanding that other people give, but you’re not willing to do anything yourself to help people.

by Anonymousreply 174September 7, 2021 8:37 PM

[quote] Go ahead and explain all the ways the average person should fight the corporations and hedge funds in the real estate market. I'll wait here for your list that will never come.

Many things average people can do are already mentioned in the thread. Maybe some of them were mentioned by you. One thing that the average person can do is to increase job opportunities for people who can no longer afford college, encourage job growth by patronizing local businesses, protesting big tech monopolies who don't provide insurance for their employees, protesting the gig economy that doesn't provide long term stability for their employees, limiting investment properties, and so on.

by Anonymousreply 175September 7, 2021 8:52 PM

Single people are also less likely to invest in long term housing.

by Anonymousreply 176September 7, 2021 8:54 PM

Also limit the number of occupants per housing unit. Single family buildings are not meant to house 15 people who together can outbid other potential buyers.

by Anonymousreply 177September 7, 2021 9:02 PM

That's not how it works, R177. And my town DOES have a law against it and we have unaffordable housing.

by Anonymousreply 178September 7, 2021 9:28 PM

Real estate agents, investors, and developers are all crooks and scammers.

A certain type of person is drawn to this occupation. The Donald Trump type.

They're all scumbags.

by Anonymousreply 179September 8, 2021 12:55 AM

The things you are all listing aren't things individuals can do, they are things businesses and corporations can do but those businesses and corporations won't do it because they're making money off of the fixed market. The government only cares what rich people, businesses, and corporations want. They don't give two shits about individual voters. So, again, I ask what is it you want one single person to do? (And, R174, no need to repeat your nebulous and meaningless bullshit.)

by Anonymousreply 180September 8, 2021 5:18 AM

r180, if you want others to provide assistance to renters, you should be willing to do something yourself.

by Anonymousreply 181September 8, 2021 5:33 AM

.......

by Anonymousreply 182September 11, 2021 12:49 AM

R181, moron, I've asked multiple times what one non-rich individual can do versus the hedge fungs and corporations. You have no answer so you keep spewing the same nothing over and over. You are, by definition, a troll.

by Anonymousreply 183September 11, 2021 12:58 AM

r183, you’re expecting other people to do something, but you’re not willing to do anything yourself.

by Anonymousreply 184September 11, 2021 3:35 AM

You people arguing back and forth, are derailing this thread.

Be like Elsa.

LET IT GO.

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by Anonymousreply 185September 11, 2021 3:38 AM

R184, give one example of what a non-rich person can do. Of course you won't because you can't.

by Anonymousreply 186September 11, 2021 5:39 AM

r186, you’re always wanting others to do stuff for you instead of you doing it yourself.

by Anonymousreply 187September 11, 2021 5:45 AM

Okay. I'm done playing your little game. Not sure why you carried on saying the same thing over and over but whatever. I knew you wouldn't have even one example. Your trolling wasn't even funny. I thought maybe you actually had some input to give but you don't because you are literally without ideas. Enjoy talking to yourself.

by Anonymousreply 188September 11, 2021 6:35 AM

Go troll somewhere else, r188. You’re only ever going to complain and never do anything yourself to help anyone.

by Anonymousreply 189September 11, 2021 6:48 AM

[quote] Mohamed Hadid's Bel-Air mega-mansion is set for auction, then demolition

“This house will last forever,” developer Mohamed Hadid once said about his 30,000-square-foot mega-mansion perched in the hills of Bel-Air. “Bel-Air will fall before this will.”

An L.A. County court disagreed in 2019, declaring the massive, unfinished structure a “danger to the public” and ordering it to be torn down. Now, the infamous estate on Strada Vecchia Road will be auctioned off to the highest bidder.

The auction is the latest, and perhaps final, chapter in a saga that stretches back years filled with criminal charges, government investigations and heated courtroom battles.

Hadid — father to models Bella and Gigi Hadid and star of the reality shows “The Real Housewives of Beverly Hills” and “Shahs of Sunset” — is no stranger to lavish real estate projects, but the Strada Vecchia mansion might be his most ambitious to date.

He built the mammoth home both bigger and taller than city rules allow and crammed it onto a steep hillside lot of just over an acre, leaving neighbors below worried that it would slide down the hill and crush their homes.

They sued Hadid in 2018, citing construction violations. In December 2019, Los Angeles County Superior Court Judge Craig D. Karlan ordered it to be torn down because of an inadequate foundation.

After years of court battles that saw Hadid plead no contest to criminal misdemeanor charges and sentenced to community service and fines, the doomed home hit the market this year for $8.5 million, with proceeds of the sale going toward its destruction. In court, Hadid’s attorneys said the cost of the tear-down would be $5 million.

A possible deal fell through a month after it listed for sale. After the property languished on the market the last few months, state-appointed receiver Douglas Wilson Cos. ordered it to be auctioned off. Bids are due by Sept. 27, and the court will confirm the sale on Oct. 1. Potential buyers will have to provide a $250,000 refundable deposit in order to bid.

“This auction is about certainty,” said Todd Wohl, co-founder of Premiere Estates Auction Co., which is handling the sale. “The court and receiver elected to have it auctioned so they can ensure it will be sold by Oct. 1.”

Wohl added that the home’s destruction, which has been delayed while it’s been on the market, will be funded by the sale and will begin immediately after the court confirms the deal. He estimated the complete tear-down will take four months.

“Essentially, the buyer is getting a piece of dirt in one of the most prestigious markets on the Westside,” Wohl said. “The market will decide what it’s worth.”

According to Redfin, there are currently 18 pieces of raw land on the market in Bel-Air. The largest is a massive 264-acre spread listed at $70 million, and the smallest is a 2,500-square-foot lot near Stone Canyon Reservoir listed at $18,500.

Dubbed “the Starship Enterprise” by disgruntled neighbors, the dramatic mansion towers over the neighboring homes with a striking, curved exterior. Hadid’s original plans for the place included an enormous wine cellar and 70-seat Imax theater, as well as a series of bedrooms and decks that were never approved by the city.

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by Anonymousreply 190September 11, 2021 1:51 PM

Fucking disgusting.

Real estate people should all drop DEAD!

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by Anonymousreply 191September 11, 2021 1:53 PM

[quote] Now, the infamous estate on Strada Vecchia Road will be auctioned off to the highest bidder.

I bid two bucks. When will I find out if I won?

by Anonymousreply 192September 11, 2021 1:57 PM

Housing has, for most of the last 100 years, been a representation of class, wealth, status, caste and yes, race in this country.

If this was an epidemic of people of color struggling to find housing, this wouldn't be news, because that struggle has been going on since the beginning.

Investors, foreign owners and conglomerates all play a role, as many other posters have commented. The US is increasingly under corporate rule, where a smaller and smaller group of corporations make decisions that affect all of us every day in housing, utilities, medical costs, and more.

But we have lopsided, broken housing and zoning policies that were influenced by the push for richer, whiter people to push poorer, darker people far away. Many places have shortages of affordable housing, apartment buildings or even condos because zoning restrictions were implemented 50-80 years ago to prevent any kind of multidwelling units from being built, lest a *gasp* black person move into one.

by Anonymousreply 193September 11, 2021 2:05 PM

White Americans want an endlessly appreciating asset and the ability to police who their neighbors are and what they do. Housing segregation, suburban sprawl, and planned communities are how they won those things, and how they protect them.

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by Anonymousreply 194September 11, 2021 5:37 PM

[quote]White Americans want an endlessly appreciating asset and the ability to police who their neighbors are and what they do.

Uh, everyone wants those things. As soon as any minority family reaches the middle class, they move to those areas as fast as possible. It's not a race thing. It's a class thing. Different classes have different cultural mores. The title of the opinion piece you linked to R194 is "Americans Don't Really Hate Density, They hate other Americans". Everyone hates everyone lower than them on the societal ladder. We need to stop blaming everything on race and start looking at class structure in this country.

by Anonymousreply 195September 11, 2021 6:21 PM

Certainly seems so, R194. I'm always amazed at how Americans crave their buffer space as if we were still in the age of Westward Expansion. Even on Data Lounge, any Tasteful Friends edition is certain to set off a number of posters who want no no neighbors in sight or sound, and can't understand why someone would pay $15M for a house in Belgravia or Bel-Air with neighbors close at hand. If it's a place in the suburbs or the countryside, they want wide open spaces and nothing in sight. If it's a floor-through pre-war UES apartment overlooking the park well above the treeline, they worry they they might hear footfall in the mausoleum above them. It's not so much that they want "good" neighbors as it is that they want no neighbors.

I lived in the country where there were no near neighbors, and no one visible or audible, but between bucolic and urban and old suburban were many many miles of exurbs of houses built on minimum 5-acre lots, that sold quickly and profitably to developers who met the zoning codes. The owners were always enchanted by the prospect of getting away from everyone, from neighbors, and tried to overlook that they could see a roofline of the house next door or a backyard fence of a neighbor. They trued to pretend that they would like tending a 5-acre lawn but discovered that that took big expensive equipment or many hours each week fucking around on a riding lawmower — or hiring a crew to mow their lawn for $150 every week in spring and summer.

"Oh, it's only 3-acres, I wish it had more land so I could have a little farm?" What are you? Stupid? Retired? Both? Farms aren't practical on the little scale, what they want is a garden, or maybe just a long day at a dirty county fair.

Americans want space that they don't know what to do with and can't manage to maintain simple because they hate the idea they might smell someone else's barbeque, hear someone else's lawnmower, see someone else walking in their neighboring garden. What they want and what's realistic are wildly at odds, but they make the same land grab mistakes again and again.

by Anonymousreply 196September 11, 2021 6:34 PM

[quote] We need to stop blaming everything on race and start looking at class structure in this country.

Except race and class/poverty are so intricately entwined it's nearly impossible to untangle.

by Anonymousreply 197September 11, 2021 7:51 PM

[quote] Americans want space that they don't know what to do with and can't manage to maintain simple because they hate the idea they might smell someone else's barbeque, hear someone else's lawnmower, see someone else walking in their neighboring garden. What they want and what's realistic are wildly at odds, but they make the same land grab mistakes again and again.

And they want to be safe before the next pandemic. People were not meant to be living in such close proximity.

by Anonymousreply 198September 12, 2021 3:38 PM

[quote]And they want to be safe before the next pandemic. People were not meant to be living in such close proximity.

Yes, R198, let your own worries speak on behalf of everyone. People having been living in cities for 11,000 years or so and they're still around. Do you really think there is room and resources enough for 7.9 Billion people to live each in an English country house estate, a Loire valley chateau, an American Gothic farm in Eldon, Iowa?

by Anonymousreply 199September 13, 2021 11:09 AM

Heads on PIKES for all real estate agents.

by Anonymousreply 200September 13, 2021 2:43 PM

I can't wait until the real estate market collapses.

I want to see all these investors, brokers, and developers completely DESTROYED!!!

by Anonymousreply 201September 13, 2021 6:09 PM

R200 - nah - they're not anywhere as bad as the wolves on Wall Street or Republicans in Congress. Let's start with them first.

Real estate agents are just annoying and unnecessary - they don't manipulate the market like the above groups do.

by Anonymousreply 202September 14, 2021 3:03 AM

........

by Anonymousreply 203September 15, 2021 1:28 AM

That's not happening until the grift of the 401k ends.

by Anonymousreply 204September 15, 2021 1:52 AM

Watch the video at R68.

And then realize that Gavin Newsom just made it a nightmare reality for all of California.

It's a motherfucking OUTRAGE.

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by Anonymousreply 205September 19, 2021 6:20 AM

That list of “best” affordable cities is full of red state shit holes and fucking Ohio. Hard pass.

by Anonymousreply 206September 19, 2021 4:41 PM

[quote]That list of “best” affordable cities is full of red state shit holes and fucking Ohio. Hard pass.

Of course, a lot of them are blue cities in red states. If you want to stick to solidly blue states, there are just 20, a number that's probably shrinking.

In an ideal world no one would need to move to another place unless he wanted — to find work, to earn more money, to spend less money, for better health care, for better schools, as a better place to retire, etc. But people do make these decisions, often. Sometimes they move to a red state and hold their nose, buffered to some extent by living in a blue city or county.

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by Anonymousreply 207September 20, 2021 12:34 PM

The extractor class has learned the lessons of a pay-as-you-do anything society.

by Anonymousreply 208October 3, 2021 5:13 PM

.........

by Anonymousreply 209October 3, 2021 5:19 PM
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