The "Greatest Screen Legends" re-evaluation thread

Are you 105 OP? Are live ones not included?

NO, it's the AFI golden age list. You need to have started your career before 1950 or have a significant body of work in the 50's

The AFI lists are all garbage honestly. This one included. I remember The Wizard of Oz was on their list of "Greatest Scares".

was THE LAST HOUSE ON THE LEFT on the " Greatest laughs" list ?

R4 that would be perfect. Along with Dead Ringers on "Greatest Romances".

Seriously, how many people, even on DL, can name two "Claudette FUCKING colbert" movies ?

I can

okay go ahead, "it happened one night " and ???

Palm Beach story for one

Skylark and Midnight. Sleep My Love, Three Came Home, Imitation of Life, Drums Along The Mohawk, Cleopatra.

Imitation of life is a LANA TURNER movie

R11, that was a remake.

btw WHERE IS LANA on the fucking list ?

OP, the list is not perfect but it's probably the best one by any highly regarded publication. If I were to pick top 10, my list would be

Kate Hepburn ( undisputedly )

Elizabeth Taylor

Bette Davis

Greta Garbo

Ingrid Bergman

Marilyn Monroe

Audrey Hepburn

Judy Garland

Joan Crawford

Vivien Leigh

nice list R14 but i dispute that. Kate hepburn wasn't thought better than Davis, or more important, in Davis's lifetime. She was on a hype renaissance a t the time the list was made, but Davis was the undisputed queen of HW

Since You Went Away is another great Claudette Colbert movie, co-starring Jennifer Jones, Robert Walker, Monty Woolley and Shirley Temple. It was produced by the great David O. Selznick.

Colbert also starred in the pre-code epic Cleopatra (1934), which was so hot it was condemned by every church group in America.

BTW, Colbert was the original choice to play Margo Channing in All About Eve but illness forced her to withdraw. Bette Davis got the role and made screen history.

So, it's basically the spoken bridge of "Vogue", then.

Is there no end to the world stealing from me?

Excuse you bitch OP???

Ingrid Bergman > Katharine Hepburn (and I like Hepburn).

Hepburn could comedic and tragic and could perform the classics, why shouldn't she be top spot. I would put Stanwyck before Davis. Davis dipped into horror/horror-adjacent.

I gave an excellent performance for 70 years

Joan Collins

Mamie Van Doren

Chesty Morgan

R22 is that satire?

Where do Julia Roberts and Meryl Streep fit in there if we opened it up to modern legends?

And Jane and Faye?

It's hard to take any list that doesn't have Davis as number one seriously.

Really R26? I'm not challenging you but Kate Hepburn is hardly a slouch. She won 4 Oscars in her career and has a much better filmography in my opinion than Bette. I don't deny Bette anything but a lot of her movies weren't that great. I find quite a few of them awful.

It's not about how many oscars you win

If we are strictly talking about the best actresses of that generation, I think Davis and Stanwyck should be tied....or Stanwyck on top.

Kate never did schlock/horror pics. She rebounded in Philadelphia Story and never looked back. Filmography counts for a lot.

[quote]It's not about how many oscars you win

Ve agree.

Davis' acting is outdated and was pure ham. If you want to talk about whose acting is still natural and still stands as believable as it was back in the day then it's Ingrid Bergman. But in terms of sheer acting legacy and iconography no one comes close to Kate.

Like David Niven said about Kate, the great once at the Oscars in 1970s, "A star is a star is a star but ladies and gentlemen, this is a STAR".

I noticed that the title is "Greatest Screen Legends" not "Greatest Screen Actresses." Wouldn't that make Marilyn Monroe #1. She is often cited as Hollywood's greatest screen legend.

Vivien Leigh gave what are arguably the two greatest performances in screen history. Inarguably, they're the two greatest by a female actor, plus GWTW is the highest-grossing film of all time. Her ranking is hurt by making so few films (eight after achieving global stardom), but she should be in the top five for sure.

I think Vivien Leigh belongs in the top 10, even though she didn't make as many films as Davis or Hepburn.

The real actresses came with the New American Cinema.

Gone With the Wind has been cancelled, it's very problematic now.

R37, GWTW hasn't been canceled. It was shown in L.A. a couple of weeks ago and is still available on streaming services and TCM. What a stupid comment.

Greatest Screen Legends (not actresses) Davis, Monroe, Leigh, Garland, Audrey H, Kate H, Liz, Crawford, not necessarily in that order though. Bacall wasn't a great actress but i suppose she was iconic, only because of Bogart. Bergman , not that legendary.

R37, Just a couple of years ago the readers of Entertainment Weekly voted Vivien Leigh's performance as Scarlett the greatest female performance in cinema history. That's not exactly canceled.

r38 it's not revered as it used to be.

R1 eats Drew Barrymore's pussy.

A new list should be: Streep

Davis

Monroe

K. Hepburn

Taylor

Leigh

Crawford

Garland

Streisand

Stanwyck

Temple does not belong on this list, although she is iconic - she was a child actress, which is a different thing. I would substitute Gloria Swanson, whose omission is bizarre - as is that of Olivia de Haviland.

R36 Actually, I've been watching a lot of Pre-Code (1929-1934) movies lately and I've noticed that the acting in them is a lot more natural than in the films from the Golden Age. After the Code was enforced in the mid '30s, the acting became very melodramatic and you begin to hear the faux Mid-Atlantic accent more and more in American films, which would last until the '50s when people like Marlon Brando began to bring realism back to acting.

What gives?

R44 I agree you have to include Swanson and Olivia.

But the worst omission is Doris Day.

I agree partially with R29. Stanwyck should be on top. She acted circles around both Crawford and Davis.

Where would Jamie Lee Curtis land on the list?

R39, Bacall was iconic for being the only woman who could play off Bogart and make it work. That's not a low bar to cross.

R49, you're forgetting Ingrid Bergman, Gloria Grahame, Kate Hepburn, and Audrey Hepburn.

OP, Natalie Wood doesn't belong on ANY list of Screen 'Legends', let alone 'Greatest Screen Legends'. Poor thing was pushed into films by her evil stage mom, someone so desperate for any connection to fame that she whored out her own daughter to any director within 10 feet.

She couldn't act at all, because she never really wanted to be in the biz in the first place.

R51, Natalie was naturally gifted. She was wonderful in a number of films. You're stupid.

R50, you are right, and I should have been more clear - Bacall owned Bogart in an explicitly sexual way, which the others did not, or did so fitfully or according to narrative.

It might seem like a weird distinction to make, but it gave her her power.

Not only can I name a few Colbert movies I saw her in three different plays on Broadway.

And if you don't know Midnight it is a must see.

I'd hardly call Davis's performances in Jezebel, The Little Foxes and The Letter pure ham. They are among the best performances I've ever seen.

Name one R52, that shows that her 'gift' as you say, is comparable to any of the actresses mentioned above.

R56, Rebel Without a Cause (think of all the emotions that flash across her face in an instant and she was only 15 when she made it), Marjorie Morningstar, Splendor in the Grass, West Side Story, Gypsy, Love with the Proper Stranger, she has many good scenes in Inside Daisy Clover, Bob & Carol & Ted & Alice...

Thanks R56, quite a list of bad examples.

She was passable in Rebel, but nothing compared to Julie Harris in East of Eden. The rest of your list isn't even worth commenting on.

Incidentally, I have always loved Natalie Wood's laugh. It was so girlish and cute. She sounded (and looked) like the girl next door.

The list is for "The Greatest Screen Legends".

It says nothing about acting ability.

So yes, you can make a good argument for Natalie Wood and even Kim Novak for that matter.

Shirley Temple deserves her place on the list.

Leaving out Gloria Swanson is criminal.

R58, Julie Harris is the worst thing about East of Eden. She was said to be a fine actress on stage, but apart from Member of the Wedding, she didn't translate to the screen. She had zero chemistry with Dean so the romantic angle defied belief. Plus, she was many years older than he was and looked it.

From Variety's review of Marjorie Morningstar: Natalie Wood gives a glowing and touching performance as the title heroine.

R57, Laurence Olivier was a big fan of Natalie Wood. It's been written about in biographies and Maureen Stapleton even talked about it.

R32, had to see it after reading your post.

R58, is Jill St. John

If it's about screen legends, then Shirley Temple definitely deserves a spot in the Top 10. Not only was she a big child star, but she was one of the biggest movie stars of her day. She was the biggest top star of the Great Depression. In fact, Shirley Temple has gone down in history as the most legendary child star ever.

Child stars are not women stars. Shirley Temple's iconic performances are those given before she was 12.

She belongs on a list of screen icons - just not this list.

Bette Davis, because she's still the first name that comes to mind when people think of ACTING!

Marilyn Monroe, who is perhaps the most legendary of all screen stars. People in Pakistan recognize her image.

Elizabeth Taylor, she changed the way we view film stars. Her private life became as famous as any film she starred in, and she starred in many excellent films and many huge hits.

Katharine Hepburn, for sheer career longevity. She didn't have much range, but when she had a role suited to her talents, she nailed it.

Meryl Streep, because she's been the first lady of the screen since the late 1970s. Love her or hate her, there's no denying that she's the most accomplished, acclaimed actress of the modern era.

After these five in some order, it can get ambiguous. I think the top 10 should include Joan Crawford (for reasons that are well known to her), Vivien Leigh (for essentially playing the two toughest and most famous female characters in film history to absolute perfection), Judy Garland (the greatest of the tears of a clown stories in Hollywood history), Barbra Stresiand (she overcame countless obstacles to become the biggest star of her era through sheer force of an incredible talent), and Doris Day (delightful on screen presence, eternally underrated and a huge box office star).

And then there's Doris Day. Could do drama, comedy, musicals. One of the top female box office stars of all time.

R67 Meryl cannot be on the list. She was not a Golden Age star with a career begun before 1950.

R69, it's a RE-EVALUATION thread. This list was compiled more than two decades ago. It needs to be updated.

Doris Day should be added....delete Bacall from the list.

They were the GREAT ACTRESSES of all time, the actresses today coukdnt hold a candle, but maybe its because all the crappy films of today

[quote] it's a RE-EVALUATION thread. This list was compiled more than two decades ago. It needs to be updated.

Hollywood's Golden Age is what it is.

It does NOT include Meryl or Barbra. They are not from that era.

There is no way to "update" a list about that era unless you want to redefine the definition of Hollywood's Golden Age.

R73, the title of this thread clearly says Greatest Screen Legends. I'll pause while you reread it. Meryl Streep is a legend. Barbra Streisand is a legend. Deal with it.

Marjorie Morningstar...sigh.

R74 Please tell us what you don't understand about: "the AFI golden age list"

See R2

Katherine Hepburn could do musicals. On Broadway no less. And 8 performances a week. None of this 7 bullshit.

We have no sense today of what a huge star Mary Pickford was. I've only seen her in one movie My Best Girl and I totally got why she was so beloved. It's a remarkable performance.

R75, NYT: "Natalie Wood, who only yesterday was playing with dolls in films, has blossomed into a vivacious pretty brunette who very likely is as close to a personification of Marjorie as one could wish."

R74, Queen, I'm gonna type this slowly. The list needs to be revised and updated to include more contemporary actresses. What is the point of saying "These are the biggest stars up until this one came along." Lists are fluid and should be updated with less rigid guidelines. You're welcome.

For the tiresome idiot at R80:

If the list were updated to include more contemporary actresses, then it would not be a list about Hollywood's Golden Age.

I think people confusion is AFI titling the list simply "Greatest Screen Legends." That is so broad. It should really be "Greatest Screen Legends of the Golden Age" or something like that.

Kate Hepburn > Liz Taylor > Garbo >>>>>>> everyone else .

R83, Garbo is a bore to watch onscreen today. I think she'd place outside the top 10 if people are honest.

Miriam Hopkins never makes these lists but she was hot shit int he early '30s/pre-Code days. She was fearless and starred in very racy films and was quite a deft comedic actress. It's a shame that she's become a footnote in Bette Davis bios.

R81, you seem angry. Go on Grindr and use a fake photo and get laid in a dark room.

What about Roz Russell and the deHaviland sisters? I guess they aren’t that well remembered today and aren’t considered “legends” but they are three of my favorite “Golden Age” actresses. When I was younger and started getting into old films, I thought Fontaine was terrible, but now when I watch her films I have a new appreciation for her work.

And the biggest female box office star of the 1940s - top ten for ten uninterrupted years 1942-1952 - is completely forgotten.

I love her but she would be the first to admit her movies are mostly not memorable and some are real stinkers. Making box-office history is not the same as making legendary movies.

"I'm a success in show business for only two reasons. Put me in a long dress and I'd starve to death."

Doris Day certainly belongs on the list and her omission at the time was noted by many. In 20 years she starred in 39 motion pictures. With the exception of one, they all made a profit.

She ran the gamut from musicals, suspense thrillers, biographical dramas, domestic comedies, sophisticated comedies, and screen versions of Broadway musicals. Five songs she introduced in films were nominated for Oscars with two of them winning.

She topped all box-office polls, finishing in the number one spot an unprecedented, for a woman, four times.

Whatever you may think of her, she was enormously popular with movie audiences and her name still strikes a familiar chord. even with those who might have never seen a Doris Day film.

She walked away from it, refusing scores of offers to return and never went about promoting her previous film career, choosing instead to devote her life to animal welfare.

R14 I think this is most accurate for a top ten except I don't agree with the exact order. Joan and Judy should be much higher.

R39 Bergman has Casablanca which alone would make her qualify

R87 I think all three of them should have been included as well. Same with Gene Tierney and Hedy Lamarr. I also think Miriam Hopkins was so underrated and doesn't deserve to be forgotten. The fact that she was the star of the first ever color film should alone make her qualify.

Bump.

Didn't Gielgud say something once like "poor Ingrid, speaks 4 languages and can't act in any of them!"

She is iconic and some of her films were great, but yeah--he was right about that!

Ingrid was a real ham. Her Joan of Arc is a laugh riot for anyone who's trudged through it. She plays her character so holier than though and smugly. In the battle scenes, every few seconds there is a cut to Ingrid shouting some generic "inspiring" mumbo jumbo to the troops and everytime she does so she stops dead in her tracks. Finally she does this right in front of an armed enemy troop and he shoots her with an arrow while she's too busy pontificating and oblivious to anything else. Still doesn't learn her lesson.