Strict division between tops and bottoms

Quick Autocorrect for Grammar Nazi: "every man"

Tops and bottoms aren't as easily identifiable by looks/mannerisms/etc, as some assume.

And strict tops and bottoms aren't as prolific as some assume.

Life's a little more complicated than that.

R2 I agree.

OP you clearly don't know gay men in real life if you think top/bottom jokes are just a DL thing.

There's a lot of shit-talking and a constant flood of opinions on DL, but not nearly as much lived experience. The most frequent posters are social outcasts for whom life is largely experienced through the Internet and other electronic mediums, so what you see is at best a deeply distorted view of the totality of the gay experience.

Visarionovic , if a guy is "vers " on Grindr, I pass. I want a real top.

Well, at least you're not embarrassed to admit you're a bitchy bottom

Masc4Masc here.a top must be a top, a bottom must be a slutty bitch. That's the rule of nature

My ass and mouth need to be pounded raw

There are a few tops and a whole bunch of bottoms. Sometimes, some of those bottoms like to pretend they’re tops, but they can never be the real thing.

A butter knife can dream of being a jackhammer, but that won't make it so.

LOL at the "tops " who ask if they can suck my dick. OUTA HERE!

Bottoms who think a being a top means you don't suck dick are weird r12. Any guy who doesn't want their dick engaged at all I wonder if they are secretly trans or something.

If a top wants to pleasure me I run away

EXACTLY R14 ! R13 when I want to use my dick I use it with a frau. When I want a man I want a MAN

Yeah, I have no interest in dick at all...just ass. Never been into it. However, a bottom who doesn't like his dick or wants to forget it exists...just a bit weird for me. At least acknowledge it...?

R16, what are jockstraps for ?

Ignore my needs and use my mouth and ass be selfish

Fuck yeah R18. Spit on me, call me a piece of shit, hurt me, ignore me, be a MAN

Stallone definitely is a bottom. Arnie is a power top though.

R17 - major turn off for me...it's honestly even weird for a gay man. I mean, I like men and everything about them...jock straps, lack of pride (witness R19), and all the other crap is a turn off for me despite the fact that I am a top. I want my partner to enjoy his body and mine. Sorry, otherwise...they seem damaged and I may be wrong but it's just how I feel. A gorgeous man who understands he is beautiful...now THAT is a turn on.

pERFECT. He doesn't even shoot in the bottom's mouth

[quote] r me despite the fact that I am a top.

Or so YOU say. You sure ain't a top for me, sissy!

R13, I agree. What guy doesn't want their dick sucked? That's so weird to me

Same r14.

A top who wants to PLEASE a bottom ? Yuck. weak.

no wonder you're single R21. grow a pair

I'm telling you, if you freak out because your sexual partner wants to acknowledge your dick...it sounds like you wish you didn't have a dick at all.

R28, meet R15

R23 and R27 sound like trans. Being an exclusive top doesn't mean catering to a damaged millennial or younger. The older bottoms didn't complain when I fucked them and felt them up and them kind of held them in a huge bear grasp when they moaned. If you want to be degraded and spit on you aren't looking for a man...you are looking for a dominatrix. Also, you are probably damaged and not accepting of your own gender....a MAJOR turn-off and why I always pursue older bottoms.

This argument is so tired. I give great blowjobs and I know how to throw a good fuck, but in the vast scheme of things this focus only on our sexuality is belittling, discouraging, and disappointing.

Are you kind? Are you able to help right a wrong? Are you responsible and socially involved/informed--with people not your effing social media? Are you compassionate, loving, generous?

We are so much more than dick and ass, top or bottom.

[quote]The older bottoms didn't complain when I fucked them

we didn't dare. We were afraid you would start crying, did you see us a second time ? that's your answer gurl

R31 you must be so BORING. Are you actually getting any ? thought so

R30 not hot.

R30 = pussy

What percentage of tops and of bottoms refer to the bottom's hole as his "mancunt"?

0% R36. PUSSY is the word

So many guys say they're a top until that door closes and their legs fly into the air.

[quote] We are so much more than dick and ass, top or bottom.

You're not really gay, are you.

I am the existential ass, the ectoplasmic orgasm ejaculated from a paranormal penis!

R34 - my exes would beg to differ. Then again, they are older and more secure men....don't date millennials. Then again, I haven't ever had any problems getting younger ass, even with the COVID weight. Respectably hung tops with looks usually don't. Also, we can afford to discriminate.

R6 Hey future husband, how are you. Dont worry , I ll be the ral top in our marriage. But no more Grindr after wedding. You know I m a guy from Balkans.

OKay Balkan stud

What about the “blouse”, the feminine top?

R44 Never heard, what is it, effeminate top?

R41 millenials are 40+ by now, you fucking fossil, no one wants to date you

R46 - I fucked 2 in the last 2 months though. Strictly as I was pressed for time. Also, I am not 43. I don't want to date THEM. My rule is nobody under 45, except for a fuck. Given the top to bottom ratio, it's NEVER problem. Especially when they find out I don't and haven't ever bottomed in my life or sucked a cock. I rim and I top. Period. Don't do bareback and don't fuck around with damaged babies who want to be degraded. Also, skinny, smooth little bodies don't do it. Give me a slightly portly older bottom, over 45, nelly and who can talk about SOMETHING and I take him out, hang out, have drinks and rim and fuck him into oblivion. THAT is a gay MAN who and the sex is mindblowing...the rest remind me of the whole "binary" and BS crowd with the whiny voice and "literal violence" that is a complete dick wilter. Hell, fucking a woman sounds better...least she knows she's a woman and owns it.

[quote] Also, I am ONLY 43.

Correction. And I am 6 feet tall and, according to most, pretty good looking. Women still flirt with me everywhere I go...and there is no shortage of good looking young guys out here. IT guys aren't Zuckerberg dorks in Romania...they are macho and date the best looking women around. Then again, you sound like you judge by stereotypes. Tops HAVE to be assholes and bottoms have to be "wimpy" and "faggish". See why it's a turn off? I have seen macho nelly guys in France, here, Spain...people aren't stereotypes from some tired US suburb.

If you read this thread as a parody, it's actually sort of funny.

Sadly though, I think some of the posters are not keeping in that spirit and expressing their true feelings.

R41 is english a third language for you ?

[QUOTE] Also, I am ONLY 43. Correction. And I am 6 feet tall and, according to most, pretty good looking. Women still flirt with me everywhere I

AND R41 IRL =

R51 = frustrated bottom who is 350 lbs.

R41 = triggered and crying

This rigid dichotomy emerged after HIV. In the bronze age we were happy to find a willing parter that we actually liked as a person. Who did what to who - you sorted out along the way

[QUOTE] willing parter that we actually liked as a person

what does that mean ? how could you "like a partner as a person " ? did you know their name and everything ?

R12, R14, R18, R23 Well girls, I dont want to preach, but I am genuinely worried about your self confidence. Not mocking you, quite the opposite I think you should value yourself more. My future husband at R6 and I will have a traditional relationship, but the one with respect and affection, not degradation, and you shouldnt let some sadistic assholes to treat you like dirt.

hu....darling, I AM R12/R23.

[quote] What guy doesn't want their dick sucked?

Most bottoms don't.

R57 OMG, I seem like an insensitive top, i cant even recognize my fiance. You should know before marriage that I am not some kind of brute just because I am from Balkans. I am a gentle and protective guy. Never mind, we ll have to do some marraige therapy.

I'll wake up the balkanic beast in you

serbian muscle

This article is slander!

R58 Why? Are they ashamed of their dick?

Maybe among guys who take being a total bottom as a big part of their identity r58, but that doesn't describe all guys who like to bottom by a long shot.

Its fine as a hook up, but I wouldn't date/hook up on a regular basis with a guy who never wanted me want to me touch or suck his dick.

Are there many guys who really don’t want their dicks touched???

My bottom puts on his jock when he wants his dick ignored. When he is not wearing the jock I let him wank while I fuck him.

That remind me of very religious catholic women in the past centuries, who wanted to have sex through the hole in their nightgown, and took pride that their husbands never touched (with hands) or seen their intimate parts.

R66 That is very woke of you to call a man "my bottom"

Where is my fiance. That Masc4masc is suspicious, he might have stole him because he would ne attractive for him with that nick, but I would kick him in the balls if he tries something funny with my future husband.

I am also "Masc4masc" honey

Its a relief, because I thought he might have taken you, but it will be hard with you, how many personas have you got?

On a good day, 2

There are certain men who I want to fuck; others that I want to be fucked by. Hope that makes sense.

lmfao. OP and his passive aggressive fiancé are hilarious

R72 I m afraid to ask about the bad day

If I'm in a good mood, I'm Frenchie, the nice, kind, sweet guy from french descent. If I'm in a bad mood, I'm the slutty and evil SloppyH

You re so misterious it feels like Im marrying a woman.

I'll like to make a good comfy little home for my top, I'm a very good househusb

Nice, cos I see youre not the type of simple guy to drink beer and watch a football match together.

It ll be more like Rhett Butler and Scarlett o Hara relationship.

I don't drink alcohol honey, but I would suck you while you're watching TV

But Im tolerant, you can watch some soup operas too

like mushroom soup ?

visarionovic, I don't know where you got the idea that I'm the effeminate type. I'm a muscle bottom and I am quite masc and macho

Aha, youre the Grammar Nazi! I almost married the Grammar Nazi!

have we broken up already ?

Haha, I brought an agressive guy willing to fight out of you, see youre not that sweet passive bottom willing to please

R87 when ? are we fighting ? our first fight ?

Im glad you ve shown your claws, I was worried that you might be without self confidence, but I was wrong. But now Im self conscious writting knowing you are Grammar Nazi

sweety I don't care about your grammar, I care about your dark good looks, your lanky, hairy body, your musky smell and your big cock

Actually, I smell very nice.

Why is R75 through r91 talking to himself?

R92 Not talking to myself, but to my sweet young fiance.

r93 Honey...this is a bit awkward...I'm over 50...BUT I LOOK VERY YOUNG

Nobody is perfect. Its important that youre young at heart

Overall, generally speaking, boomers and, to a somewhat lesser extent, Gen-Xers have had much stricter gender-role bullshit drilled into their heads from childhood onward. And, yeah, that's reflected in common perspectives on sex-position-roles and perceptions of the masculinity/femininity of those roles.

A lot of older gay men desperately tried to be 'heterosexual-adjacent', 'straight-acting', 'not like the flamers & femmes', etc.

I think it's very safe to say that a lot of their rage toward any kind of ambiguity/fluidity/in-betweenness in sexuality/gender is tied to that. They like pure, clear-cut, unchanging, traditional, binary categories to put people into (man/woman, straight/gay, top/bottom, masc/femme).

I mean, the existence of bisexuals still pisses off a lot of them (many still claim that bisexuals are just pretending to be bi). Don't expect them to suddenly get enlightened about the top/bottom false dichotomies... unless you're prepared for disappointment.

R13 They are trannies but most will never will have the guts to go all out.

R94 I should only inform my mama that her son in law will be closer to her age. How many over 50, not 20?

R96, Well said!

Why do I get the feeling that most people on this thread are just pretending they're gay men?

Being a polite person, I never EVER began any sort of conversation with the question, "are you a top or a bottom"? Nor did I start a conversation with "do you have a big dick"? These questions used to be part of the mystery and fun of picking someone up and bringing him home. Without a clear answer on those questions in advance, people were more likely to be mentally prepared to be versatile. My experience was that, while some people took to the role of top more naturally than others, when push came to shove (so to speak), the vast majority of gay men were able to be versatile no matter their preference, and sometimes relished taking the position to which they were less accustomed. I have one long time friend who insisted for decades that he was basically a top. I would just roll my eyeballs, because the first time we met, I fucked him. When quizzed about it, (which I've already stated I think is impolite) I always say that I'm versatile. That has caused many a cynical gay to say, "oh, that means you're a bottom" - and then I take him home and fuck him. I haven't bottomed in decades - but I still consider myself versatile, because when I was in the height of my sexual activities (basically age 21-40), I enjoyed bottoming just as much as topping. Then I only topped for the next 15 years, and now I'd say that I've lost most of my interest in both (except seeing it in porn videos), and only want to have oral sex with people.

I find total bottoms to be a turn-off, I am not really interested in any man who is completely passive and essentially just sees themselves as a hole. Be a fucking MAN who loves getting your dick sucked, your hole eaten and fucked, and once in a while likes to flip and fuck like a stallion yourself. Extremes of anything usually aren't healthy, or interesting at all to me.

R96 I dont like labels neither, but must admit that I have some problems understanding bisexuality, except in very young guys who are still exploring their sexuality. There is a very rooted belief that bisexual men are gays who dont want to admit to the world and themselves they are into men. Or nowadays, in America, seems like some straight guys in showbiz claim this to attract attention. Also there are some sketchy types that would fuck anything with the pulse but I dont know whether to call that bisexuality cos I think those types see sex just as domination. But I try to be open minded, I see maybe its because I myself am mono, not stereo. I would like to hear from real bisexuals, or someone who knows some of them.

R102 - you make my point (except I don't get fucked or suck cock) but a man, even the nelliest, has to be a man.

R100 - because the majority of the posts are by screwed up younger Millennials or Gen Z types. They don't have to be gay or even talk about sex. This is how they are all the time...about EVERYTHING. Can you imagine coming home to one every day? Can you blame me when I say if I don't find a partner who is over 45 now, in 2021, by the time I turn 55, I will marry a woman for companionship and caretaking? Seriously. These aren't even men, women, trans...just a screwy living and (worst of all) talking temper tantrum.

I don't understand the huge difference between rimming and giving a blow-job. Yes, I get that they involve different body parts. But to say you'll do one (rim) and not the other (give a blow job) doesn't make that much sense to me. You're still orally pleasuring a man and, arguably, by doing so, in a somewhat submissive position. (Nothing wrong with that.)

[quote] I find total bottoms to be a turn-off

Shut your face, you nasty piece of foreign trash.

Yes OP we have evolved into a heteronormative strict t/b bifurcation. I blame gay marriage. Now you can tell top and bottoms apart like Morlocks and elois.

All this fear and division. MARY

I'm a man. I like men. I like my body, I love the male physique. I like what two men can do with each other's bodies. I like when we suck each other and take turns fucking each other. I like when we show each other what we've got. To me, that's a whole lot of pleasure. I let prospective partners know my standing. If you are a strict "anything" I'm not interested.

Back when I was a youngling, this eldergay loved being versatile. And had many thanks for it.

All of my friends are what one would call "versatile". Neither top not bottom. In fact, most seem to not indulge in anal sex at all.

Still waiting for those real gay men to comment ...

R111 no, you would call them versatile. I would call them bottoms.

R113 - Bitch if a man is topping and bottoming, he is versatile. Do you understand what the word "versatile" means in this context?

Vers = Bottom in disguise

R114 = Bottom in denial

R100, hardly any millennials or Gen z people are posting here. It's mostly eldergays so blame them for the posts here

Someone's trolling, my lord, kum-bah-yah

DLers are biting my lord, kum-bah-yah

Arguing fiercely, my lord, kum-bah-yah

Trolls troll, kum-bah-yah

Dejure is a millennial, R117. Or claims to be.

I am a millennial but I am very much not scene and never have been. The scene millennials all subscribe to the “vers” myth.

The op is clearly a woman.

im GenZ

R121 Yes, Im a trans teenage girl

strictly a bottom.

R121 But with a big girldick

R124 I’m thinking asexual.

OP, shut the fuck up! Sex has become so much better since gay men started embracing their preferred sexual roles. Oh my God, I remember the lame 90s, hooking up with men and not knowing what you were gonna’ get. Just stop with romanticizing of the way things were. Jesus Christ!

R127 Dont you like some suspense?

R128 Hi there, R127 here. No, I like some good sex though. It’s funny you mention “suspense”. I remember, late 90s, arriving at the conclusion that the whole game of chasing other men was so much funnier than the actual act. I briefly went through a depression because of it. From the early 2000s to the present things have gotten soooo much better. The expectation of clean holes, good anal sex, clear delineation between top and bottom.

R129 Expectations are nice, but how it ends is another thing. You can expect and hope for good sex but its not guaranteed. But sometimes the wooing can be fun as well.

I was expecting the wedding, but my fiance ran away

😁 = smelling cookies

The strict top/bottom thing is mostly a relic of an older generation.

r5 That paragraph should be a click through warning whenever someone arrives at this website. :)

[quote] I was expecting the wedding, but my fiance ran away

I'm sorry darling, something unexpected came up out of the blue, almost. I was invited for a trip , a little holiday on the french riviera, nothing extravagant, I'm back now, all yours

R133 no, it’s not. These terms have been made more relevant in recent years.

OP, the top/bottom divide is much like the gay/straight one - the DL believes no other options exist.

[quote] The strict top/bottom thing is mostly a relic of an older generation.

That's right! The younger generation does NOT restrict itself to strict top/bottom roles!

Our sexuality is "let's be ambivalent about what kind of sex we want - and literally everything in life - until we annoy the absolute fuck out of each other/our potential partners and everyone goes home frustrated."

But hey, at least we didn't force some old, outdated idea on someone!

Oh FFS r138 it just means that younger gay men are more versatile. Of course there are still strict top/bottoms but versatility is more common than it used to be. Take your out-of-touch old ass shaking your fist at the wind and fuck right off.

Versatility has been way more common than anyone thinks. Top/bottom BS arose with the apps.

R135 Hey, you must be even handsomer well tenned. What places have you been?

R140 do you prefer naive or ignorant?

R139 It has nothing to do with versatility, you daft cunt.

The app culture has made ambivalent, whiny bitches out of many gay men, who negotiate or talk a potential hookup to death and then complain that they're unwanted and/or think that they're asexual.

r143 there have always been flaky gay guys who are indecisive about a hookup. Back in the days of hooking up in bars there were guys like that.

I love to bottom, but I love other guy’s asses, everything about them. What does that make me?

R140 surejan.gif

R138 The interesting thing is that, as a millennial who does believe in strictly assigned roles, I never ever advertised my role when I used to use the app. IMO, there is just something so crass, slutty, and pessimistic about advertising your role, as it assumes that all encounters will lead to sex and dehumanizes the person down to a sex position.

And yet, I can confidently say that I have never once experienced anyone doubting that I would be the bottom. There is just something in my eyes that lets the world know that I’m a strict bottom.

And then there are the rare homosexual unicorns like me who are not turned on by anal sex at all and are oral only.

R144 It’s even easier to be flaky from the convenience of your phone. I could see how it’s gotten worse

R147 I agree with you. I have nothing against people having a preference in sexual role-position, I do too, but its silly when a persone is defined by role, or when someone calls a person by his sexusl position, "my bottom", how ugly. Or when someone proudly intriduces himself as a top. Anyhow, guys who like to bottom are dominant in my experience. Like my fiance who left me yesterday.

Heteronormativity is damaging gay relationships. Enough with the tops and bottoms

R148, that’s not rare. You must not keep up with all the articles and forums about it

Total top are still viewed as more desirable add more manly. Facts.

I can't date a guy unless he's versatile. No exceptions.

And there are guys who only are interested in guys who are 100% one role strictly. People Have different tastes

Sleep

R156 Then I am a virgin!

R154 is a sick perv.

I'm a mostly bottom masculine gay guy but I also love taking control and being sucked. I've top many guys that lied to me about their preferences, but I don't really like to top. Though I prefer other masculine guys, I've hooked up with effeminate gays who are great tops, they're usually more masculine fucking than in real life, which just proves to me that it's all performance.

My personal experience is that masculine gay men have more prejudice toward bottoms than bi men, that's why I mostly date bisexual men now. Bi guys love to fuck me but also love sucking a dick and they won't belittle me just because I'm a bottom, unlike other gay men. They see me and treat me like an equal.

Effeminate gay men are particularly catty to me once they find out I'd rather be a bottom and I assume that is due to perceiving me as competition, that's something women do and many bi men try to run away from when they decide to date other men, so be warned annoying bossy bottoms.

[quote] There are a few tops and a whole bunch of bottoms. Sometimes, some of those bottoms like to pretend they’re tops, but they can never be the real thing.

I'm a bottom and I never feel like there are few tops, that's usually what people who fuck everyone on their app say, gay or straight. I have straight and bi friends saying the same about women on tinder. They're just whores that ran out of options because they either fucked everyone available or blocked everyone too.

Sexy