Working parents who complain about no time and money

Heterosexual parents are some of the biggest whiners! A sick and boring life they lead!

Right? So glad single, gay working ppl never complain about no time or money.

I have a lot of sympathy for parents under the present circumstances. Being stuck in the same house as several other (noisy) people while trying to work must be hell.

I think most heterosexual parents have children not because they have given the question any great thought, but because it's what society expects. For a lot of straight men, I believe it's an ego thing too.

In other words, most people have kids for the wrong reasons.

Paradoxically, a lot of socially responsible people choose not to have kids, although they'd probably make great parents.

And the beat goes on.

US Corporations are tone-deaf to the challenges and struggles of rearing children. It doesn't have to be this difficult and I would argue it's harder in the US than most developed countries to have kids.

Both men and women need to be part of the process. Giving somebody else something to help them takes nothing away from me. Hell, they probably would be easier to work with and more productive.

Just because I don't have kids doesn't mean that I don't see that something is fucked up in this country and it's not good for everyone involved. Hell, there was a point I wanted to have kids in my 30's or early 40's but work just wouldn't allow for it. I didn't feel right about even owning a GOD DAMN DOG because of my commute and work hours.

^They're parents that's what they signed up for when they had children, suck it up and shut up.

Who fucking cares? They just spend their extra time on Facebook anyway.

When women started entering the workforce, it was like extra money for the family and the rest of the families couldn’t wait to cash in. Not fond of common people having extra money in their pockets, the government now structures things so there is little choice.

How does "the government" do that, R8?

My parents made this complaint endlessly to us, their crotchfruit, while we were growing up, so no, I don't have sympathy for parents who whine about how having kids ruined their lives.

Don't want kids? Use birth control.

R8 - it was more of a matter that they felt they no longer had to provide a single wage that a family could live on.

50% of all american pregnancies are unplaned

R12 Birth control is readily available.

I'm not surprised a lot of pregnancies are unplanned. It almost seems cruel that straight people's hormones drive them to seek sex, and for 15 minutes of release, the consequence could be 9 months of uncomfortable pregnancy, 2 years of a screaming baby, several years of an uncontrollable teenager, and some offspring expect their parents to clean up their messes into their 20s, 30s, and 40s.

But many straight people have kids because society expects it. Their parents pressure them to produce grand babies. Their extended family pressures them. Their friends and coworkers pressure them to have kids so they'll have someone to share their misery. The pressure never stops for straight people. And then there are the freaks who keep pumping out babies just so they'll have continued content for their social media.

I don't blame them for being upset. Everyone told them how perfect it was going to be; no one told them they would rarely have 30 quiet minutes alone for ten years. And that kids would cost so much money. I'll listen to them whine for a few minutes. But don't expect me to cover when you want to take time off work every damn week to deal with something kid-related. You chose to have those kids. Just like I chose not to go to a sperm bank and get knocked up.

R12 I'd bet it's even higher.

Most of the parents I have worked with wanted kids and enjoy them, although raising kids is a challenge no matter how much you wanted it. But there were definitely some on the other side of that. One former co-worker and her husband were both raised Catholic. He was more staunchly Catholic than she was. She wanted to use birth control, but he bought into the the church's line that God would provide. They had five kids, all stair steps, all about a year or two apart. She started secretly taking the pill. She was exhausted all the time because, typical of rabidly Catholic men, he expected the mother to do everything, and that's what she did.

After I left that job, I found out from co-workers I had stayed in touch with that Mr. Catholic found the birth control pills and it led to constant fighting. She told him no birth control, no sex. The marriage disintegrated, she left the Catholic Church, and she filed for divorce. He fought the divorce because he thought it was a sin, but it was finalized. Custody was split 50/50, something he wanted since he now thought she was a fallen Catholic. She insisted on one week on, one week off and got it. They lived in a smaller town, so it was no big deal to go from one house to the other every week. He finally got a taste of what it was like to do all the work. She got a week off and loved it.

She eventually remarried and is happy. Her new husband doesn't want kids. Of course her ex-husband got remarried so he could have a wife to take care of his kids, and that's exactly what the new wife did. A group of us from my old job went out just before the pandemic and my old co-worker came along. She seemed so much happier, so different. She said the step-mother was very nice, but she was just like her when she was younger and deferred to the husband and did everything, but the kids like her so that was all good. She said the step-mother always looked exhausted after their week with the father. Three are now out of high school, one in college and the other two got jobs and moved in with friends. The other two are in high school. Oh, and the ex-husband now believes in birth control. Ha!

r8 - The majority of women have been part of the workforce since always. Working class women have always had to work. Middle class women worked, too, except for a brief historical period (interrupted by WWII) when it was unfashionable for them to be working. Upper middle class women have never had to work, but even so, a small percentage of them got education and chose to have careers.

So stop with the "the economy went to hell when women entered the workforce" myth. It ignores the majority of women who financially never had the option to not work.

As for birth control, the only form that is nearly guaranteed to work all the time is sterilization. All of the other forms of birth control have failure percentages. Over the length of a woman's fertile lifespan, that means that if she uses anything except sterilization, even if she uses it consistently and correctly, the odds are high that she'll end up with at least one unplanned pregnancy. Which is why abortion needs to be legal, even with access to birth control.

Personally, I think anyone who chooses to have kids is nuts, considering what a hit you'll take with your personal finances and free time even with normal healthy kids. And god help you if one or more of your kids has any kind of disability or personality disorder. Not to mention that what with the ongoing disruption of our climate and economy, the future looks pretty damned bleak. You're just better off not having them. It's not as if there will ever be a shortage of people.

[Bold] " WHAT ABOUT THE CHILDREN?!?!?!?! "

[quote]I'm not surprised a lot of pregnancies are unplanned. It almost seems cruel that straight people's hormones drive them to seek sex, and for 15 minutes of release, the consequence could be 9 months of uncomfortable pregnancy, 2 years of a screaming baby, several years of an uncontrollable teenager, and some offspring expect their parents to clean up their messes into their 20s, 30s, and 40s.

“Doing, a filthy pleasure is, and short; / And done, we straight repent us of the sport."

-Gaius Petronius, trans. Ben Johnson

*Jonson at r19

By allowing wages to stagnate, R9, and not having a decent federal minimum wage, and allowing pay gaps based on gender, and allowing companies to ditch benefits and pensions.

[quote]unplaned

[quote] I don't blame them for being upset. Everyone told them how perfect it was going to be; no one told them they would rarely have 30 quiet minutes alone for ten years. And that kids would cost so much money.

What about doing your own math. How many hours are there in a day? How much does ___ cost? How much does ___ cost?

Yet you care enough to drag yourself out of your pig pen and start a stupid thread, OP. Too much free time and no one to talk to in real life?

I don't think straight people are at all honest with young hets who are trying to decide whether to reproduce. They're not honest about the emotional strain, they're not honest about how much work it is, and they sure as hell aren't honest about financial issues! I'm not sure why they feel impelled to push breeding, perhaps it's hormonal or instinctive, perhaps it's because they think that other people are all happy to have bred even if they secretly aren't, perhaps they have ulterior motives like wanting grandchildren, perhaps they're just in denial about how much strain breeding has put them under.

And in a few rare cases, maybe they're genuinely happy to have a family of their own, but that's rare.

But the fact is, it's absolutely NOT DONE for a straight person to say that they regret having children. That's just not socially acceptable.

It's important to look at this generationally. Within ONE generation: most wages stopped growing entirely with inflation (and in some cases, actually decreased), college went from "expensive, but worth it for job security" to enslaving one into debt for the next 30 years with the inability to ever buy a home. Working mom's went from being somewhat rare to becoming the new normal. Parents also are pressured to be an omnipresent helicopter parent 24/7 - which was never a thing before. Parenting always had its pitfalls, but IMO it only took one generation to make it a life-destroying decision for the average American. Putting all of this aside, there are also a lot more personal pleasures to pursue in today's world (endless TV to watch, more consumables to consume, amazing restaurants, fitness, accessible international travel, etc.). I think Millennials are the first to start catching on to this in an impactful way (look at the current birth rate of non-immigrants in the US); you will continue to see less children produced for the next few decades.

R17, I think you misunderstood me. I do not blame women re-entering the workforce on messing up the economy. My point was that when these middle class moms started generating a second income in the household it didn't take long for that luxury to become a necessity. Sure, a lot of it was keeping up with the Jones's. But it was also impacted by tax structures that anticipated that second income. NOT having the woman work is now more of the luxury.

Interestingly, in the lower middle class women with children must have jobs that justify not staying home due to the cost of daycare, work clothes, food and transportation. The break even line is pretty high. Especially if there is no family to help.

And I agree with you on abortion. As for having children, if you can support them and raise them to not be a drag on society, then it is nobody else's business. I will admit that I am a screwed up gay that married and had kids and is now divorced. Thankfully, I have a good relationship with them and an amicable one with their Mom now, but I don't know if I would do it again. I do know if I could snap a finger now and change it all, I wouldn't. But that is just emotion. Then again, I don't understand people who spend thousands of dollars keeping a 12 year old cat alive. We certainly have enough cats.

I remember this one guy from years ago in AA (big surprise I was there, right?) talking about when his family was struggling right after he beat his addiction. He talked about how it seems like things were better back then as opposed to now when everything is better. I understand what he meant.

Yep, no sympathy. Kids are exhausting. I'm so glad I never had them. I have a single friend in her 50's who had her eggs frozen a long time ago. Just before the pandemic hit, she decided to finally have a kid. She's a D list actress with no income. She had a kid and now is freaking out because of how much work it is. She had her sister move in with her to help and now the sister is working from home most of the day and cannot help out.

Oh well.

Single gay mom here. The pandemic changed everything.

I’m never not working, cleaning, cooking, tutoring the kids and keeping them on task in their online classes, or walking the dog. I get up 5 on weekdays, 7 on weekends, am lucky to get a shower all day, and go to bed at midnight.

Every need but my own is being met. It’s been really, really hard.

I had a single friend who wanted a baby. She went the fertilization route. She had one and then decided a year later to have another one! You should hear our calls. Kids screaming in the back. She always has to stop talking to take care of things. She's exhausted. All I can think is "why the fuck did you do that to yourself?" I never wanted kids. I love my nieces and nephews but they go home to their parents. Kids are overrated.

OP, what if your mom hadn't had kids?

So, stop it with this "kids are overrated" stuff - if everyone felt that way you wouldn't be here

R25: interesting point and I think another reason straight people with kids encourage others to do it is jealousy. They don’t want childless friends around showing them the life they could still have (freedom, money, fewer obligations and responsibilities, etc) if they hadn’t gone along with society’s view of how to live your life.

I’m so glad to be a gay man and to have avoided all the baby/kids crap.

R31: that’s a ridiculous reply to someone saying they wouldn’t want kids and think having them is overrated. You can be glad your parents had you without liking kids yourself or wanting to give up a huge chunk of your life to having kids of your own.

[quote] what did you expect having a kid

I always want to ask the big whiners why they thought it would be easy to be a parent. Did they never pay attention to their own parents and notice how much work they had to do to provide for them?

I knew when I was 10 yrs old that being a parent wasn't for me. My mom was a single mom and she went through hell just to provide for us

[quote] So, stop it with this "kids are overrated" stuff - if everyone felt that way you wouldn't be here

That has to be one of the stupidest things I've ever read. So what what if our parents didn't have us? That means nothing

Absolutely NOTHING

Why are gay men so concerned about something they don’t have to deal with? Bunch of whiny shits.

[quote] I knew when I was 10 yrs old that being a parent wasn't for me.

Me too, r34. My Mom was way ahead of her time and told me that human beings aren't required to have children. She never encouraged any of my siblings or me to have children.

I'm so glad not to be a parent, but I'm not smug about it. I take no pleasure in suffering parents.

Parenting nowadays? Well, as my Mom said about current parenting few years before she died in 2017, "It's overwhelming". She said that in the context of a conversation we were having about an article I read written by a father of teenagers and how popular culture rules everything.

R32 I grew up next to a girl (5 years older than me) who had a baby in her teens. Of course, when the relationship with her baby daddy didn't work out, she moved back in with her mom. She practically seethed with jealousy towards my little sister for not getting stuck with a kid as a teenager. I'm pretty sure she said things that turned my mom against my sister out of bitterness.

Mom was forced to raise us kids when Dad decided to continue to party and not do the whole parenthood bit.

Mom was and still is furious about this and she has a right to be.

No money. No time. No support.

Lots of women in many societies around d the world have babies because it's expected and, in ours, it is also something that makes them fit in. Granted, there are also hormones at play. My ex didn't feel ready for kids, but her friends, jerk of a husband and family put pressure and made her feel "useless" (despite the fact that she is an accomplished person and kind). My sister had the baby fever as soon as her 30's hit and was a mess trying and taking hormones but she was almost crazy. Nature meant females for reproduction as a survival of the species so I guess I got it.

American society is not very supportive of parents. Having worked at a multinational company now for 2 years, I do see that giving men 3-6 months of paternity leave (as they do in a large part of the EU) and 85% salary and women a year off makes for far more relaxed co-workers. Also, our Danish colleague who get childcare stipends and benefits unthinkable to us in the US are far more relaxed and still have a low birth rate yet report the highest level of life satisfaction. Of course, I don't realistically think this can be done in a country with a population the size of the US. Also, many societies have extended families close by which means more support for parents. The US is pretty hostile to kids and parents.

[quote]Working parents who complain about no money

Lies.

R32, you couldn’t be more wrong. They may not be correct, but they feel sorry for their childless friends.

[quote]What did you expect having a kid - that it was cheap and easy? Pregnancy is one of the most preventable conditions - just below lying on train tracks.

On NBC-TV news tonight, they did a report on a woman who runs some sort of a food delivery service for lower-income people in Detroit. One of her clients was a family that has -- wait for it! -- FIVE CHILDREN UNDER THE AGE OF 10. There are no words.....

I'm calling bullshit on the whole "women are pressured to have babies" thing. This is 2021. They are not. Life isn't a Cathy comic anymore. I'm a single woman in my early 30's who wants babies like I want a hemorrhoid-a-day for the next 25 years (and that hemorrhoid is also constantly breaking my shit and stealing $20's from my wallet and ruining my tits). I've never been pressured to get married or have babies because I don't surround myself with breeding mare fraus. If you willingly surround yourself with that ilk and even worse, actually let them influence you, then I have zero sympathy for your station in life. Grow a spine and book an abortion like a big girl.

[quote] I have a single friend in her 50's who had her eggs frozen a long time ago. Just before the pandemic hit, she decided to finally have a kid.

It's hard enough to chase after a noisy kid in your 20s/30s. Who the hell wants to chase after a kid in their 50s. Especially without a partner to help out. If this woman had a job, she wouldn't be able to retire in 15 years. And now some kid is going to grow up embarrassed when everyone thinks his mom is his grandma. A 70-year-old parent at high school graduation.

R45, go to the childfree forum on reddit. It's filled with straight people, aged late teens to 40s, who regularly are "bingoed" (hounded) to reproduce. The pressure comes from their parents, their friends, coworkers, and strangers. It's worse in rural (religious) areas and in suburbs (insta-ready nuclear families). In cities, though, it's more common to find childfree people are are more than satisfied with their careers, partners, and pets.

R45 - yeah not every woman has the privilege to live in a Western society or even a big city where nobody cares. Also, it takes all kinds, and for you to say that women who are probably poorer (usually surrounded with more traditional types) or less educated are somehow your inferiors shows arrogance. Not everyone is strong, so you can't just every woman by your privilege.

I have zero sympathy for people who have kids and then complain about shit that is inherently part of parenthood. The only time I feel sorry for them is when their children have serious illnesses or die.

My sister has been a stay at home mom for 10 years and all she does is bitch about it. Nobody told her to have multiple children in succession.

In the rural suburb where I grew up, many people get knocked up within a year of high school graduation, get married, move into a house just five miles from mom and dad, and start cranking out more kids. Some folks want their grown children financially dependent on them so they'll never leave.

And then there are the breeders who have a kid for the sole purpose of taking care of them when they get old. (Uh, nursing homes are full of people with lots of kids who never visit.)

The older I get, the more I learn that many (perhaps most) Americans have no personality, no curiosity, and no interests outside of TV, sports, eating, and shopping. The average anti-intellectual American leads a very dull life, and many cannot escape their low income brackets. I often wonder if most have children out of boredom and to create meaning to their futile lives (and also because it never occurs to them NOT TO).

Another thread that can be summed up as "Get Off My Lawn!!!!"

"you couldn’t be more wrong. They may not be correct, but they feel sorry for their childless friends."

Hahahahaha! Good. Let them "feel sorry" for me while I'm on a beach in Hawaii with a pina colada while they're at Lego Land standing in hour long lines.

R48 "...and for you to say that women who are probably poorer (usually surrounded with more traditional types) or less educated are somehow your inferiors shows arrogance"

Uhhh, is this your first time visiting DL?

R48 You can't throw a nickel around these parts without hitting a comment harping on about some flyover frau and her carbon spewing crotch droppings, but as soon as a woman agrees she's a heartless cunt? Spare me the lenny letter on my "privilege", mmk?

No sympathy. I have no kids and don't care about parents' problems. You signed up for it. Our entire society, including the tax system, is designed to cater to parents. Having kids is selfish and indulgent.

The pattern I usually see among middle class breeders is this: they have one or two kids and they will usually be ok. Then the compulsion to have a third hits and everything goes downhill.

American culture and media glamorizes large families. But only if you're a white suburbanite of course.

[quote] American society is not very supportive of parents.

Seems like single taxpayers, no dependents, have it worse.

R55 - what are you doing on a gay men's site anyway? Just be happy you are sooooo far above the rest of other women and move on. Not like we are going to sit here and find you "special".

R54 - absolutely not, but most DL-ers are not really arrogant. In fact, they are some of the most liberal people online. There are some women who, for some reason, decide to show up on here and show us how "different" and "special" they are. Total straight, single white female privilege. I can't believe these entitled cunts dare lecture gay men, or for that matter, the women I am talking about (underprivileged and probably lacking access to basic commodities that every civilized country besides our Repuke-run one) have. It's exhausting. I can just hear their vocal fry and self-importance and it's a huge turn-off.

[quote] The pattern I usually see among middle class breeders is this: they have one or two kids and they will usually be ok. Then the compulsion to have a third hits and everything goes downhill.

It's very hard for middle class people to raise more than two kids in modern American society and most of them fail. But people do it anyway. My cousin is 43 and has three kids all under 5. She decided to have a third kid because she thought 3 kids was a "good size" for a family. Yeah, good luck with that.

[quote] She practically seethed with jealousy towards my little sister for not getting stuck with a kid as a teenager.

She's jealous of someone for not becoming a teen mom? That's mighty high standards these people have set for themselves.

R60 While I am neither straight nor white, my twat is just tickled at the thought of being lectured on feminism from possibly the only man who hates women more than Trump. And thank you for proving my point with your personality alone about why more women ought to embrace abortions (regrettably, your own mother's didn't take).

Most parents are abusive assholes, they deserve to suffer.

R63 - well if you aren't straight or white you sure learned to disregard and disrespect women who aren't as privileged as you from your "masters". Talk about Trump...you sound just like a Republican on truth serum. Yeah, let's have zero subsidies for single mothers, minorities who are "underprivileged anyway" (circa Barbara Bush...another entitled cunt), or women who just maybe made a mistake...after all "she asked for it" so "she deserves it". Yeah, deplorable much?

All women who birth children have asked for the responsibility of raising them.

No sympathy from me.

You bitches are showing your age. Gay people are parents now all over this country. Sometimes we are cranky and complain about stressful moments. Just like DL does about everything.

Gay men don't whine like ciswomen do.

R65 Oh jesus–you're the psycho-troll from my sex worker post (can't imagine how else you would know I went to grad school). I have no idea what you're mawing on about this time but I did not express anything even remotely resembling the rabid foam you're spewing in your responses. In fact, nothing I said in my original comment substantively differs from dozens of other comments in this thread.

You're dangerously veering into Margie T. Greene territory, my friend.

[quote] No sympathy. I have no kids and don't care about parents' problems. You signed up for it. Our entire society, including the tax system, is designed to cater to parents. Having kids is selfish and indulgent.

Agree, R56.

[quote] Sometimes we are cranky and complain about stressful moments.

Your choice, your responsibility.

Saw Latino young woman in the grocery store last week with five kids, must have been ages10-11 and below, and she was in advanced stage of pregnancy. She was at check-out and didn't know English or how to use her Snap card. Being the second customer back, I stepped closer oand served as an interpreter for both, given the confusion exhibited. The woman was on a cell phone looking for clarity.

The unsettled kids weren't wearing masks, and the woman used a scarf as a mask but was pulled below her chin. She was in shorts and tank-top. It was cold outside.

I believe people who have a bunch of kids need to be in a situation to afford them. This woman wasn't. Her husband/partner must be an undocumented laborer, and certainly not earning enough to care for a pregnant wife and five young kids.

So so far in this thread, there seems to be no “working parents who complain.” Just a bunch of people without kids who complain.

While I am astonished at times at the amount of time, energy, and resources parenting requires, I don't complain about it. In fact, I just assume no one wants me to complain about anything to them. So I don't.

R69 - I have no clue what sex worker troll you are even talking about. I am not a sex worker, I am a writer and analyst. I am just saying you are clearly coming from a Western cultural perspective and an urban one at that where you have the privilege to not care because you live in a free world. Try my female friends from Iran who ran from abusive husbands, or women here in Eastern Europe or many small states and communities with less opportunity. Also, try not to be so judgmental or right wing about everything. Humanity has a right to suffer and complain. Jesus! Look at my post and try to see that other parts of the civilized world don't all think on our terms. Hell, loads of the folks at my multinational company have kids and guess what? The EU provides for paternity leave so women get a break and men do...less divorce, drug abuse. You should see the benefits Danes have and how they report being the most satisfied. Hell yeah, American mothers have a right to complain as do American seniors, gay folks, sick people and others because we are living in a society quickly moving into fascism.

R75 This will likely be my last response to you because you are tedious, humorless, and mildly psychotic. What in god's name did I say in my [clearly sardonic and not nearly as serious as the voices in your head are suggesting] post that made you think I was directing my sentiments towards women in war-torn developing nations, women fleeing persecution and/or abuse, or pregnancies that were the product of sexual violence? Similarly, what did I say that in any way suggested I do not support state subsidized health care or childcare for mothers or anything at all to do with maternity or paternity leave? All that aside, as I've repeated over and over to you, 98% of the contributors on this thread have expressed opinions that mirror my own, and yet for some reason you've chosen solely to direct your delusional ire on me.

Now, kindly dismount my leg and focus your incomprehensible inanities elsewhere.

I see kids w/out masks all the time. I would not take this risk as a parent.

I think OP, most posters and 'working parents who complain' in their posts all come from Western culture, mostly not stuck in rural hick towns, definitely not Third Worlders.

R67, you attention whore, this thread isn't about you and your kids...unless you regularly complain about having no time and money.

Just male gay male misogyny.

Women who dare speak about the burden placed on them by bringing life into the world are mocked by the queens with childfree privilege.

Such fun.

When I was a youngin, parents didn’t have the pressure to spend all this quality time and put their stupid kids in tutoring and fencing lessons and all that crazy shit. We were latchkey kids and roamed freely. Parents had their adult lives and didn’t feel obligated to helicopter and get their kids into Harvard. It was a lot more lax.

Now everything is so extra.

R80: I can’t be bothered to re-read all the comments but I don’t think many single out women only - the topic is ‘parents’. Men who complain about having kids are just as insufferable to gay men as women who do it I’m sure.

Also you mention the ‘burden placed on’ women who have kids and complain about ‘queens with childfree privilege’. Other than women who are raped and for some reason have no choice but to keep the baby, all these women have a choice to keep their ‘childfree privilege’ too.

I only know a few couples who had children responsibly. They are level headed people who went into it knowing it would become their life’s work and they waited until they were older and made enough money. Most people who have kids really have no business being parents. I’ve known many self proclaimed female slurs in my lifetime one who solely relied on the pull out method and they managed to not have children. Some breeders act like it’s something they have no control over.

Women give life. Gay men hate us for that.

My mom was a young single parent and she stressed to us kids growing how important it was to make a conscious decision to have kids and wait until we were ready. She acknowledged it was her choice having us and she didn’t regret it but it was hard work and she didn’t want us or her grandchildren suffering.

What I'm always amazed at is the people who go on and on about how being a stay at home parent is the hardest job in the world. Uh, no. The working parents are doing the exact same raising of the kids and taking care of the house that those staying home are doing AND working outside the home at the same time. It's especially laughable when they make this statement after the kids are in school. I mean, the fucking kids aren't even around for eight hours every day.

Working parents, especially those doing variable shift work, are the hardest working people on the planet. They'd love to be able to stay at home all the time instead. (During normal times because I'm sure there are plenty of parents, at home or working, who are losing it now that they actually are locked away with their own kids all day and all night.)

"Working parents, especially those doing variable shift work, are the hardest working people on the planet."

Bahhahahaha! You have obviously never worked with someone who is a "working parent." These people take the most time off, pass off their unfinished shit to those of us who have to cover for them when little Madysen and Jaiden have a sniffle or a soccer game. They are usually the ones who leave early (gotta pick up my kidlet from skool!) and come in late (had to help little Sophie pick out her outfit for picture day!) and constantly bitch to their co workers about their spouses not helping them. I'm so tired of listening to other women talk about nothing else but their sex trophies. At least the men who complain throw in the juicy details of the hot young ass they are getting on the side.

[quote] The older I get, the more I learn that many (perhaps most) Americans have no personality, no curiosity, and no interests outside of TV, sports, eating, and shopping. The average anti-intellectual American leads a very dull life, and many cannot escape their low income brackets. I often wonder if most have children out of boredom and to create meaning to their futile lives (and also because it never occurs to them NOT TO).

That's mostly what kids are. Something to do, out of boredom. They're, a hobby

So is religion

R87, your thinking in a very classist way. No, lower income wage slaves are not acting like that and, shockingly, that's a huge percentage of Americans now that our society has almost entered a lord/serf level of economic bifurcation. They are struggling and juggling their jobs and kids and spouses schedules. Trying to find someone to watch the kids all the time.

Then don't have kids, r89. If you can't afford to have them on your wages or one wage, why would you think it was a good idea?

r4 no, most of them didn't bother with condoms or birth control

R90, not everyone only fucks themselves like you. I wish I believed in fate or karma because you'd be knocked down enough to understand that life shits on people sometimes, even when they've done everything they were supposed to do. Do you realize how many formerly safely middle class people with kids are at the end of their ropes financially right now? Some of them will never recover. Maybe they should eat the children, huh, asshole? Even Jonathan Swift's dead ass sees that you're a fucking moron.

How much of this “no time to spare” is spent scrolling Social Media and binge watching Netflix? The time is there, everyone is just exhibiting Schizophrenia- & OCD- Lite symptoms from the inundation of dopamine-altering technology.

Most people are just awful these days and that includes most parents.