Theatre Gossip #410: More Sex, Please, We're American

There ARE a few good numbers in "Bajour" -- Nancy Dussault sounds like she's stealing the show with this one.

Going back to the last thread, now that I can post -- thanks heaps to the poster who found the Angela Lansbury Dance Break "Together Wherever We Go." I had no idea it had ever been written into the show. It gives a nice glimpse of the performer Rose could have been. I wonder why all the major revivals of Gypsy since have (I think...) left it out. You don't have to be a Gwen Verdon to pull it off, and it could surely be re-choreographed to suit the dance skills of whoever's playing Rose.

As the last thread was wrapping up, there was talk about Tommy Tune, including the surprising to me claim about much of the cast of NINE coming up with staging/choreography. Could anyone elaborate or share some info. about MY ONE AND ONLY (I always thought the trouble stopped when it opened)?

I know no one here will miss it (I certainly won't), but Mean Girls closing is kinda shocking. It was a hit. Maybe not a Hamilton or Book Of Mormon-level hit, but it had found its audience and I don’t believe it ever had a money-losing week. What else is going to go away?

"Nine" had a great staging, but not that much actual dancing. Anita Morris' body moves were staged (and she was just great) and probably some moves by Liliane Montevecchi in "Nine" she probably told Tune about from the Folies Bergere, but I mostly remember some stuff with tambourines and maybe some tarantella movement during "Be Italian" number. Plus Tune staged movement throughout the show, but otherwise, not a big dance show at all. But an incredible staging!

I'm sure Miss Medford could have danced up an absolute *storm*, r2!

Danny Burstein’s piece talks about the two of them being under stress the past five years. What is he referring to?

Anita Morris was married to choreographer Grover Dale and it's well known that he staged A Call from the Vatican.

Max Von Essen is so lucky. He’ll be playing newly elected Senator Jon Ossof in every biopic and drama in the pipeline.

R6 Sounds terrible. Flat and dreary. A high school production could do it better. Saw Bernadette Peters and Tammy Blanchard in a Broadway revival directed by Sam (American Beauty) Mendes. It was definitive!

Isn’t Ossoff a pocket gay? Von Essen is too beefy.

R11, I think Ossoff has a gf. Not that that means anything but just sayin'.

R10. I think that’s always the point, when people post Medford’s studio recording of Gypsy. I tried listening to it once—didn’t last more than 2 minutes. It’s such a head-scratcher—why did anyone think this was a good idea?

I can only imagine that Kay Medford was a last minute replacement. Those UK studio cast recordings usually had British TV stars in the leads. Beryl Reid did a number of them, for example. Medford was probably in the right place at the right time, or... the wrong place, depending on your opinion...

Medford repeated her Broadway role of Fanny's mother, Rose, in "Funny Girl" in London and in the film. So someone got the idea to have her record another musical Rose in another Jule Styne musical.

But Medford did not suddenly have name value in the UK. The show didn't even last long over there thanks to Streisand's pregnancy.

Kay was no Florence Henderson.

Watching Lazarus....this is one incredibly well done recording of a musical. The musical still does not work but it looks and sounds great.

Watching Lazarus....this is one incredibly well done recording of a musical. The musical still does not work but it looks and sounds great.

Watching Lazarus....this is one incredibly well done recording of a musical. The musical still does not work but it looks and sounds great.

What are you watching?

R16 I never said that Kay had name value, and indeed many of the leads on those British studio casts of the '60s were nobodies---ever hear the Music for Pleasure "Funny Girl" starring Miss Julie Dawn?

People play/post Medford's Gypsy recording in the same spirit that Ethel used to play Roz Russel's unedited first vocal takes of Gypsy for the amusement of her party guests.

Here's a piece on those EMI/Music For Pleasure Studio Cast albums. They often featured notable performers, such as Patricia Routledge.

R24 Patricia Routledge was actually not much of a draw in the '60s when she recorded those albums for Music for Pleasure. And I was not referring exclusively to Music for Pleasure in my comments above; there were plenty of other labels issuing British studio-cast show recordings with non-famous singers.

Julie Dawn Cole, r22?

I'm sure that, on stage, Key Medford might have made a fairly good Rose dramatically speaking, but she was never a songbird and no matter how great she would have been in the role, it makes for a lousy recording. The same happened with Tyne Daly, whom I saw and loved in the role, but she wasn't much of a singer and the recording made it even more obvious than when you were seeing her on stage. I don't remember minding it as I was watching her., but when all you have is the voice and none of the actual acting, it's a painful experience.

R26 Yes, I used to wonder if "Funny Girl" Julie Dawn was "Willy Wonka"'s Julie Dawn Cole. But I believe they're not the same lady.

I've always had the impression from TV appearances that Jon Ossoff is quite tall, guessing 6'? Maybe it's just his lean frame and long neck that give the illusion.

I know Max is not particularly tall, maybe 5'10".

[quote]ever hear the Music for Pleasure "Funny Girl" starring Miss Julie Dawn?

Any relation?

You saw Max outside of a sling?

A slice of life that probably no one will be interested in: I saw the original production of "Gypsy" twice, first at the Broadway in 1959, then at the Imperial in 1960. The second visit was a special Labor Day matinee, and in attendance, along with me and my family, was none other than Kay Medford, then appearing in "Bye Bye Birdie" across the street. Kay autographed my "Gypsy" Playbill!

Did anyone see Merman's understudy in GYPSY? I believe the actress died young.

Who's had Max Crumm?! I want Max Crumm!

Merman's standby was Jane Romano. Gypsy was her last Broadway credit. She was a replacement Cleo in Most Happy Fella, and played Jane in Body Beautiful. She died in 1962 at the age of 32.

Recently deceased Peg Murray, who created the role of Miss Cratchitt and went on to play Tessie Tura, was Ethel's understudy later in the run. Romano did go on; don't know if Peg ever did.

I've stood next to MVE and think R29 is on the nose.

Oh and Jon Ossoff is definitely married, Sorry, boys!

You might also be shocked to learn he's only 33, the youngest senator to be elected since.....Joe Biden, who was 29 when he was elected and 30 when sworn in.

Is Max von Essen too old to play 33?

Julie Dawn (-Cole) sang well through the 1950s; she was into her 40s when she recorded "Funny Girl" and her voice wasn't up to it. She later hosted a couple of successful BBC radio programs.

[quote]Is Max von Essen too old to play 33?

He turns 47 on Monday.

Gavin Creel played 19 when he was pushing 40.

WHET Gavin Creel?

She's no Miss Carole Carr, r39.

There is no one more boring onstage than Gavin Creel. His career is a real head scratcher...

R27 Wasn't Tyne sick when they recorded that version?

Max Crumm has a really sexy, furry bod.

Tell more r46

The Brits should have had Miss Kathy Kirby record the Funny Girl score.

Peg Murray was also the original Kost in Cabaret.

Peg Murray was also the original Kost in Cabaret

R27, that comparison is a big stretch. Even on a bad day, Tyne Daly has a FAR better singing voice than Kay Medford did. As someone above mentioned, Tyne was ill for the GYPSY recording. I'm not saying she ever had a great voice, but she sounds a lot better on her recordings of CALL ME MADAM and ON THE TOWN.

Someone posted video of the concert of "Call Me Madam" a while back. Tyne didn't so hot.

*didn't sound so hot

You may think Tyne didn't sound so hot in CALL ME MADAM, but as I said, she's still a far better singer with a far better voice than Kay Medford was.

[quote]Peg Murray was also the original Kost in Cabaret

For which she won a Tony.

In the Lansbury Gypsy, Mary Louise Wilson brilliantly played Tessie Tura but also played Miss Cratchit in Act I. Was the casting not done like that originally? I noted a poster upthread said that Peg Murray played the original Miss Cratchit.

Do you imagine Mary Louise Wilson and Peg Murray often ran into each other at auditions? Oh, and Rae Allen was probably there as well.

Don't forget Marilyn Cooper!

How's that for a "Let's Be ..." thread: Let's be auditions for a not-quite golden age of Broadway production.

Mary Louise Wilson did not play Miss Cratchett, that was Gloria Rossi who played Mazeppa. Wilson was the understudy for Lansbury and in LA, thee was such demand for the matinees that she did a couple of Thursday matinees as the announced Rose.

Liza should have played Mama Rose. It would have been amazing.

There's probably zero chance that the West Side Story revival would be one of the returning productions whenever Broadway reopens right? I know it was pretty divisive, but I was still interested in seeing it.

[quote] Liza should have played Mama Rose. It would have been amazing.

If her manic and over-the-top (and coke-fueled?) concert renditions of “Some People” are any indication, I’ll pass.

Now if Judy could have made the movie, on the other hand...preferably with a better director.

I suspect Kay Medford worked cheap in those days.

Carmen Cusack...

Lorna played Rose and she was quite good. Her vocals are great. The production was shit but she was terrific and Rose’s Turn was scary when she cried out MAMA! I know, Mary!!!!!

I’m in the middle of watching a stream of the David Bowie/Enda Walsh/Ivo van Hove ‘Lazarus’, which I missed at NYTW.

Lord, what a hot mess.

I have been reading Bob Avian's autiobio and he mentions his time in Funny Girl. He says Carol Haney committed suicide, which is the first time I've heard that. Does he know something we don't or is he just confusing her with someone else?

Carol Haney died six weeks after the opening of "Funny Girl" in 1964. The official cause was pneumonia, complicated by diabetes and alcoholism.

I'm waiting for the 1pm stream of Lazarus to start and the sound keeps cutting out when I cast it to my TV which means I have to watch the fucking thing on my laptop. I HATE that.

Hot Mess should be on Ivon Von Hoes tombstone.

Goddamn it, this thing is fucking atrocious.

I'm throwing in the towel with 42 min to go. At least the money will go to a good cause.

I watched LAZARUS the other night and made it all the way to the end, hoping that at some point it would make some sense. WRONG.

It's really quite abysmal and I am scratching my head over the good reviews it received.

Did it receive good reviews? My memory is that it got bad reviews in NYC.

Early Shirl...

There is no one more boring onstage than Gavin Creel. His career is a real head scratcher...

More likely a real ball scratcher.

Ben Brantley was fairly positive about LAZARUS in the NYT (far more than it deserves).

I remember reading other reviews along the same lines. Not raves, but making it sound intriguing overall. I bet noone understood a single fucking thing about it, but - hey! it's Bowie and van Hove, so it must be good.

I enjoyed Lazarus in Amsterdam. The male lead could ‘t sing but the female lead was fabulous and one of the supporting actors was sex on a stick.

Here’s the Dutch cast performing “Absolute Beginners”:

Maureen's Rose's Turn...

Sarah Jessica Parker is going to start shooting Sex and the City reboot this Spring for at least 3 mos. I hope Plaza Suite still plans on reopening.

Papi a bit chunky on SVU this week.

I like Papi chunky. He is neat.

I would put Lazarus up there with the David Byrne Public Theater musical of Joan of Arc in terms of the worst things I have ever seen onstage. I also had no idea how many Bowie catalog songs were in it. I thought it was mostly new stuff he'd written expressly for the show. The catalog songs made zero sense in the story (not that the story itself made much sense).

tyne was wretched the nite i saw her in Gypsy....she raced thru it. bummer.

What the FUCK is going on with DL? I can't get this new theater thread to stay in my list of threads in which I've participated, AND sometimes no thumbnail image appears for URLs linked to in post, AND sometimes when I hover over an [R86] or whatever in a post, I can't see the post that's being quoted. WHAT IS HAPPENING????

I'm not having exactly the same issues, but I did have trouble getting the thread to go into my participation list. It took three or four manual tries before it would go in, but since then it has stayed in. Good luck, R86.

Thanks, R87. I think it just worked, after my last comment.

Having the same problem. Thanks for the encouragement,

and not to sidetrack this thread, but DL is also behaving more erratically than ever on mobile (i.e., safari on iPhone)

Yeah, something bad is definitely up with DL. I hope they fix it soon, otherwise they won't be getting any more money from me.

It’s been problematic on iPhone for years now.

Same here. I had the same issue on the last Theatre thread. The issue happened with several other threads, too, so perhaps it's a coincidence that two of those happen to be this thread and #409.

Did anyone see FOSSE? Was it considered a success at the time -- artistically/financially? Was Gwen involved at all? It was a little before her death.

Fosse wasn’t great. It was polished and presentable but didn’t entirely work. Same can be said for Dancin’ but that show was never dull. Fosse appealed to foreign tourists who don’t speak English which is why it had a long run.

I also found Fosse dull as fuck. I also felt like they chose all the wrong numbers to spotlight his talent. Fuck "Mr. Bojangles" and "Bye Bye Blackbird," show me something exciting, show me why Fosse was exciting.

The only part of “Fosse” I hated were the endless slow motion transitions.

Seeing the more obscure dances was one of its pluses.

Fosse was more museum-y than Dancin. The former was a retrospective-tribute done by others so it didn’t have the spark of, say, Jerome Robbins Broadway done by the master himself, dick though he was. Thank goodness Robbins was around to do it himself.

Wasn’t Dancin all new material created for the show?

Dancin’ was all new. I Wanna Be A Dancin Man and Sing Sing Sing were brilliant.

This thread and DL and general are still totally fucked up, I see. I still can't get this thread to stick in my "followed" list, even if I click on the eye, and no matter how many times I contribute to the thread. Again, I sure hope they fix this soon or I will not contribute money to the site ever again, and if I even continue to visit it, I'll do so as a freeloader.

I cried because I had no shoes...

Late Fall? 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

Who will play Fauci in the inevitable: "Pandemic! The Musical"?

If it's not Denis O'Hare r102, I ain't going.

R99 Nobody really cares, love.

Kelli O'Hara, no doubt, r102.

Adam Feldman has been furloughed from Time Out:

Well, with NO theater to review, what can be expected? He's very lucky if he's been paid the past 9 months.

Speaking of critics, Ben Brantley says "A critic is a mirror, not a shaper":

^ Deluded.

If I were Ben, I’d avoid mirrors...

Brantley has a face for criticism.

[quote]Speaking of critics, Ben Brantley says "A critic is a mirror, not a shaper"

Not a face I would want to see when I look at a mirror.

[quote]Not a face I would want to see when I look at a mirror.

Or when you peek over the wall of a glory hole.

Which is why you NEVER, EVER do that r113.

lol, r114

I always presume that's the kind of face that would be on the other side, so can't ever do a glory hole.

If you really want to get the full blast of that face, try watching the doc "Show Business." You ain't seen nothin' til you get a gander at Brantley's yellowed horse choppers in HD.

Isn’t there some kind of work Brantley could have done so he’s not so ugly?

Wonder what Adam will do for $$?

Brantley was a total waste for The Times. In all his writings, there is nothing -- NOTHING -- that reaches the legacy of Kerr and Rich. He really was just a B-, but he managed to hold on because his writing did manage to convince you that he knew what he was writing about, but there was no insight, no passion, no wit or interesting thinking. It was Bryn Mawr book reports. Why the Times let this go on forever is just bizarre.

I agree wholeheartedly with r120. His taste (questionable, but that's subjective, of course) notwithstanding, his tone, style and standards were all weak and limited. Did his mediocrity reflect a mediocre era in theater, or vice versa. Because for all his bullshit about being a mirror not a shaper, it's absolutely untrue. Every NY producer chose creative teams with an eye towards their track record with Brantley.

Really, R120? I see no major difference in the general level and style of Rich's writing as compared to Brantley's. Kerr was a different story, as that was a very different time.

Rich could make me want to see a show. Brantley, never. Rich's writing was evocative enough to excite a reader. And Brantley's reviews bored me, an avid theatergoer, every time.

Brantley actually discouraged me from seeing shows he raved about. Such a turn-off.

[quote]Rich could make me want to see a show. Brantley, never.

[quote]Brantley actually discouraged me from seeing shows he raved about. Such a turn-off.

These comments strike me as nasty just for the sake of nastiness, and pretty dumb. Even if you hated Brantley's writing style AND felt he had terrible taste, I should think at least some of his rave reviews would have made you want to see those shows if only for his descriptions of them, just as I could tell from reading John Simon whether or not I might be interested in seeing the show he was reviewing even though I hated his writing (for obvious reasons).

Considering Brantley is gay, why was he always so tough and cynical on gay-themed plays? It always really bothered me.

Because most gay themed plays are dreadful, R126?

My distrust of Brantley's taste came from long years of disappointment in the theatre he wagged his tongue over, r125. I don't know why you'd characterize that as a "nasty" reaction.

R128, because (if I may repeat myself), I should think you'd be able to make a judgment on whether or not you'd like a show based on Brantley's description of it -- not to mention your knowledge of the cast, the playwright, the production team, and also not to mention the reaction of other reviewers -- even if you think Brantley had terrible taste and was a bad writer. So to say that Brantley's raving about a show would actually discourage you from seeing it, or that no Brantley review could ever make you want to see a show, strikes me as nasty and silly. That's my opinion of your comment(s), and I'm sticking to it.

Critic's Choice

r129, I respect your right to disagree with me and my method of choosing what shows I see. And, forgive me, but I didn't mean I'd NEVER see any show Brantley raved about. Of course, I use other criteria.

But again, I don't understand why you would judge my actions as "nasty."

I had a dream last night with Anita Gillette in it.

Brantley constantly tried to make an event out of EVERY revival of EVERY Horton Foote play and they were all turgid and boring, and he would wax on and on and on....It was bizarre. I totally agree with r123. When Rich wrote a positive review, it engaged you in a way that made you want to see the show and be apart of the conversation about it. That didn't happen once with Brantley. Not once. It happened several times with Rich.

[quote]When Rich wrote a positive review, it engaged you in a way that made you want to see the show and be apart of the conversation about it. That didn't happen once with Brantley. Not once. It happened several times with Rich.

Really? Never???? NOT ONCE?????!!!!!

Ridiculous exaggerations and gross generalizations are the province of simple minded people who feel they have to paint everything in black and white, when there are VERY few if any things in this world that can be correctly categorized that way -- certainly not opinions on theater and theater criticism, for fuck's sake.

Since the thread on They're Playing Our Song seems to have died, I'm going to rerun a comment I made:

It's interesting to consider the difference between the Tony Awards in 1979 and how things would have gone 40 years later. Hell yes, Whorehouse and TPOS would have gotten nominations for Best Score. They'd likely have given a special award to Eubie Blake rather than nominate him and others for Best Original Score (did he write anything new for Eubie!?). The roles of Ed Earl and especially Miss Mona in Whorehouse would be considered lead, not featured (and who knows, maybe you could get 1-2 more nominees from that show, like the actors playing Watchdog and the governor or the actress playing Jewel). Among Turpin, Anthony, Johanna and maybe even Toby, Sweeney Todd would also have been guaranteed at least one nomination in the featured actors category.

[quote]Since the thread on They're Playing Our Song seems to have died,

It took long enough. More than 500 posts on a thread about a mediocre late '70s musical that I forgot about before I left the theater.

I believe we were celebrating its mediocrity, r136.

R129, so you say that someone should be able to judge whether or not to see a show based on Brantley's description, but claim that R124 is being nasty for saying that he did just that..

It is funny, but over the years I have talked to a number of people who avoided the shows Brantley raved about. There have always been critics that people disagreed with, but Brantley really is in another category. It was like his values were at odds with those of people who love theater.

Thank you, r138!

withonelook is in overdrive. And r125 is an ass.

Natasha's Clowns...

DREAM!

Who has Lesley Ann Warren stories. Apparently she was a terror at Dream

[quote]It is funny, but over the years I have talked to a number of people who avoided the shows Brantley raved about. There have always been critics that people disagreed with, but Brantley really is in another category. It was like his values were at odds with those of people who love theater.

I don't want to spend the time, because I don't care about the issue that much, to do a survey of Brantley's reviews, but I'm fairly certain that if you looked up his reviews of some of the shows that were the most highly regarded among critics and audiences in general during his tenure at the NY Times, there would be many Brantley raves among those. And if you did it from the other direction, and were easily able to look up some of the greatest raves among Brantley's reviews, I'm pretty sure you would find many of them were for shows that were also highly praised by other critics.

So, although I frequently disagreed with Brantley (as, for example, in his very positive assessment of plays by Horton Foote), I still think your statements that "Brantley really is in another category" and "It was like his values were at odds with those of people who love theater" are, indeed, pretty ridiculous.

For some reason that I can’t quite explain, I remember back when I was a graduate student that BB’s review of the final part of The Coast of Utopia left a huge impression.

And in defence of BB, he wasn’t always that exciting a writer, but his reviews were consistently well-reasoned summaries, even if I was rarely of the same opinion.

[quote] consistently well-reasoned summaries

That’s the problem right there.

You're the problem right there.

R143 I remember Lesley Ann Warren being mentioned as a possible Roxie Hart but her reputation was so bad during Dream that she was never seriously considered and that’s too bad because she would have been great.

R148, yes. It's very sad that Warren became SO difficult at some point in her career, as she was so talented. From all reports, she was an absolute horror during DREAM -- so much so that I remember someone telling me her behavior was responsible for Scott Wise leaving the production. I wonder what was behind that. Insecurity? Or just plain mental illness?

r142. - Susan Misner at 11:15 really shows Lesley Ann (with her unflattering heels) how it's done. She's sensational. I first became aware of her with her two very diverse performances on Law & Order and Law & Order CI. I was impressed with her as an actress long before I found out she was a superb dancer.

I could hunt around, but why bother -- what were some of Lesley's horrors during DREAM?

Miss Greene...

Mary! Wow, there's some Brantley apologists on this thread. WTF? If you feel you're correct, post a link to a review of Brantley's that reaches the standard of Rich or Kerr. Good luck...People still quote the opening line to Rich's "March of The Falsettos" review or his "Dreamgirls" review. When he wrote with clarity and passion, something necessary, important and somewhat wonderful happened. That never happened with a Brantley review. Never.

I only know Susan Misner from "The Americans" (she was Stan's wife) and "Nashville." I had no idea she was a dancer.

She's in CHICAGO and she played Joan McCracken in FOSSE/VERDON, r154.

I'm loving what withonelook has been adding. Miss Cook and *that* voice...

I'm amazed at the high opinions of Kerr here. On past threads, he was vilified as a stuffy, homophobic old poop who hated FOLLIES. I for one thought he was a brilliant writer, especially considering the little amount of time he had to craft a review.

As for Brantley, I thought he was a decent writer, but I hated how he would sometime obsess on a specific aspect of a performance (was it Eileen Atkins' knee he loved?) that would exclude anyone not sitting in the first five rows.

Whenever I think of Walter Kerr I remember David Niven in Please Don't Eat the Daisies getting slapped hard in the face at Sardi's by Janis Paige. And how mean he was to Doris Day who was only trying to make a nice country home for him.

WithOneLook deserves a Kennedy Center Honors for posting that Barbara Cook clip. Heavenly to listen to...

Still waiting for that Brantley link...

I am second to no one in my love for Barbara Cook (I know, Mary!), but Betty Buckley is far superior (both singing and acting) in her press reel video performing that same song. There’s no passion in Babs’ version.

Up...

R159. More deserving than Debbie Allen?

Ouch, r147. You really got me.

R153 / R160, in this case I would say it's the accuser who has the burden of proof, so I have no intention of spending my time to find individual reviews by Brantley that I feel were well written, compelling theater criticism. But I did find the following, which includes an interview with Brantley by Jesse Green, plus -- at the end -- links to multiple Brantley reviews, so you and/or others can care to go through and sample those if you care to.

Um, r165, let me get this straight. You have to find that piece of propaganda where of course Jesse had no choice to suck up to Brantley, and you use that as evidence, but also say you don't have the time to search? That's because there is nothing to search for. Since Brantley's retirement, there hasn't been one article about his work, his legacy, his era from anyone but The Times. Google "Frank Rich retires..." and see what you find.

WTF!

I love Betty, but that's....scary.

And sad.

Miss Andrea Martin...

I still believe.

I watched The Prom last night. It was even worse than I imagined. Jesus fucking Christ. It actually infuriated me. I haven't heard such a bad score since High Fidelity (though from the excerpts I've listened to from Mean Girls, I would imagine that would qualify if I heard it in full). Fuck, those songs were AWFUL.

But christ, what a nauseating mouthful of pure, unadulterated saccharine. And everyone was terrible (outside of the lesbian chick, who wasn't bad). Ryan Murphy can't direct to save his life. And Meryl needs to start saying "No" more often. She's in danger of becoming DeNiro. I hated, hated, hated it.

The only positive thing I will say is that I didn't get the brouhaha over James Corden's "gayface" performance. I actually thought he gave a measured portrayal of what was really just a queeny actor. Hell, I've seen Brooks Ashmanskas be more nelly in real life. And Corden's co-star Kevin Chamberlin has made a career of playing characters 10x worse. I wasn't offended at all by anything he did. Of course I was too busy gagging over everything else.

Lazarus is just as bad. Fuck, when listing bad directors always start with mother fucking Von Hoe.

Von Hoe could ruin a wet dream.

One of only a handful of occasions where I saw the show literally stop. Happy Birthday, Andrea Martin.

Thanks R175. That was great to see again.

One buttock...

So who's going to write the score to Trump: The Opera?

Yes! How soon before Trump; The Opera? The mini-series? The 2 part Broadway play?

I know it will all happen but I think we need several years of relief first. And how do you make any of it more theatrical than it actually was?

[quote]But christ, what a nauseating mouthful of pure, unadulterated saccharine.

There are a few moments in THE PROM -- the movie version, anyway -- that I'm sure many people would agree are "saccharine," but they are MORE than balanced by all that humor, snark, and satire. So the fact that your main impression of the movie is that it's "saccharine" strikes me as extremely freaking weird and makes me wonder if you somehow saw some alternate version.

R180 Playing something 'knowing', does not make it a true moment.

[quote] they are MORE than balanced by all that humor, snark, and satire.

That "humor, snark and satire" are as toothless as the score. You must be one of those flyovers who think theater begins and ends with Dear Evan Hansen.

[quote] I hated, hated, hated it.

I enjoyed, enjoyed, enjoyed it.

The below-mediocrity of that score - [italic]those lyrics![/italic] - is impossible to defend. Pedestrian, prosaic, and clunky, wrongly accented rhymes.

Clips from the only complete video of the Broadway production of "They're Playing Our Song," Imperial Theater, 1980, with replacements Tony Roberts and Stockard Channing.

FOLLIES!

I would love to see that entire TPOS vid. Stockard and Tony are cute together.

R187 They were good choices as first replacements. Tony had already done well in Neil Simon's "Promises, Promises" (London and Broadway) and "Barefoot in the Park." Stockard's appearance in the movie of "Grease" was seen by everyone, and she had already had two (unsuccessful) TV series of her own, so she was reasonably famous at this time.

What I find very charming about that clip of TPOS is that neither Channing nor Roberts speak Simon's dialogue in his usual cadences. They make it sound like it's coming out of the mouths of actual people. The thing I find so grating about Simon is that he writes for the joke, not the character. His lines are funny, but they sound really artificial coming out of most actors' mouths. It's even more grating on film than onstage. I can imagine Robert Klein performed it well, but I'll just bet Lucie Arnaz was all schtick and the worst kind of Simon actor.

Not to mention that mega-hit The Big Bus, r188...

[quote]What I find very charming about that clip of TPOS is that neither Channing nor Roberts speak Simon's dialogue in his usual cadences.

Great. That Piece of Shit is now being discussed on two threads.

Well....we *could* discuss how badly miscast Miss Miss Ebersole was...

Make that one Miss.

Ebersole was sick during the run of Applause. She should have been home in bed but I don’t think Encores had a back up plan.

[quote] Well....we *could* discuss how badly miscast Miss Miss Ebersole was...

Not as badly as Sheryl Lee Ralph was in the Reprise version.

Richard Greenberg has the same problem as Neil Simon. Witty dialogue but it all sounds like it's coming out of Greenberg's mouth, not the characters. This was especially true in the locker room and shower scenes of Take Me Out.

"ENCORES had no back up?" They read from scripts for Christ's sake. You could have put. someone in about 4 hours...

Yes r197 because everyone can learn an entire score in 4 hours

They shoulda called me!

They should have cast Patti LuPone as Margo to begin with.

I'm sitting here imagining Patti swinging on the hanging light over the pool table during But Alive.

R182, I'm not a "flyover," I've lived in NYC all my life, I started going to the theater in the late 1960s, and I've seen literally hundreds of shows over the years. Sorry you didn't like THE PROM, but I think my strongly positive opinion of the show and my commentary on it deserve some respect even if you disagree.

Well...we could discuss...Pia...

The Prom is the theatrical love child of AIDS and CoVID

R202 Smell her.

R205. LOL

R204, that comment is disgusting. And so are you.

Emma Thompson as Miss Trunchbull?

I love Emma Thompson, and she could deliver a brilliant performance, but casting her as Trunchbull seems like a betrayal of the show. The role was written for a man. It has always been played by a man. She is not physically intimidating at all!

Eddie Izzard is perfect. Ugly as fuck and a woman.

she'll be great. Really good casting, if they decided not to do man-in-drag which wouldn't be OK now anyway

I'm having a hard time picturing Emma as Trunchbull. (I didn't love her Lovett.) But I guess we should be thankful they didn't go with Meryl -- or James Corden.

I wonder what happened to Ralph Fiennes.

^ Presume he read the script and heard the score.

A man dressed a woman wouldn't play these days

For the one other Rock Follies fan who comes here, lovely Charlotte Cornwell has died. Sob.

I always thought it was contrived that a man played Trunchbull anyway. Part of that lame British Musical Hall/Panto tradition that the rest of th world finds wearying and curious. Thompson is a very smart idea.

Very sad to hear about Charlotte. I would get very excited every time she popped up in a movie or tv show. RIP

What's LULU up to?

The cross-gender casting of Trunchbull is an exaggerated theatrical conceit that would be difficult to recreate on screen.

But - dare I say it - Emma Thompson has become a bit of a hack during the past couple of years. The last role I saw her do was the mother in Last Christmas, in which she and her Yugoslav accent were absolutely dreadful. She also co-wrote the film, which was a pile of contrived shit.

They should have cast Toni Collette.

Emma has been a hack for far longer than a year.

And she's a lousy writer.

FOLLIES!

How is cross-gender casting in "Matilda" any different from "Hairspray?"

Oh no, R215. That’s sad. I loved her in Rock Follies. Her character could so easily have been an unbearable pain in the ass but she always kept that from happening.

Moss & Kitty

I think Brantley is no genius but I value some of his reviews including this one.

Has anyone read Riedel's new book, Singular Sensation? I got it from the library and am enjoying it very much. Say what you will about Riedel, he's an engaging writer and his books read very well.

I read it as well and agree. He really abandons his snarky side for some very entertaining and intelligent prose.

So Moss is good at shopping, acc to Kitty. No surprise here. I've been watching a lot of To Tell the Truth reruns (it's been a long winter) and she seems like a very agreeable soul, although not much of a heavyweight in the brains department.

Da fuq????? Cocaine is a hell of a drug. Reinking in "When Johnny Comes Marching Home..."

And Tovah comes on later, r229? Does Lucie get to slap her silly?

Lucie would have made a wonderful Phyllis in FOLLIES!

[quote]How is cross-gender casting in "Matilda" any different from "Hairspray?"

I would say it isn't, really, although the British panto tradition is obviously not quite the same as drag in American entertainment.

I haven't yet read Riedel's new book, but I read the first one and enjoyed it very much. His writing style in that is completely different, and far suprerior, to that stuff he wrote over the years in his column in the hateful New York Post. Obviously, there's the major difference of long-form writing compared to brief columns, but I still didn't expect a book by Riedel to be so good.

So....I just flipped from the L&O on Bounce to the different episode of L&O on ION which features your Miss Susan Misner!

Awww.....my favorite DVD episode was just on.

Remember when they're used to be an active Broadway Sex Thread as well as this? Now we have an active They're Playing Our Song Thread and this. The times, they are a-sucking.

Ummmm the 'times' have indeed, totally changed.

I long for the day we’ll have an active Broadway Chorus Boys’ Onlyfans Pages thread.

I long for the old view.

I haven't read Singular Sensation yet, but I see it ends with 2001 and 9/11. If he covers the 2000s, an okay throughline might be the attempts to find "The next PRODUCERS."

Riedel's research is always paper thin. He talks to five people -- usually the richest theatre owners and producers -- and writes based on those shallow conversations and shallower people. If you want to see how dim Riedel truly is, watch him unfiltered in "Show Business."

Have you read the book?

Yes, I have. My favorite part was in the forward where he acknowledges in rereading his columns "How much I got wrong"....Only accurate observation in the book..

^ Come, sit by me.

RAGTIME opened on Broadway on this date in 1998.

In memory of the late, great Marin Mazzie, here is her Act Two showstopper "Back to Before".

I’ll miss very little about the last four years. But I will miss Laura Benanti’s Melania.

[quote] Riedel's research is always paper thin. He talks to five people -- usually the richest theatre owners and producers -- and writes based on those shallow conversations and shallower people.

It's clear you've never read his books if this is the line you're pushing. Riedel interviews many different types of theater artists and businesspeople for his books.

He’s in bed (yuck) with too many producers. Too eager to be in the club to be objective.

Then you haven't read the book.

Hey, Michael! Figured you'd be here.

Also, Michael, as long as you're here- whose cock is tastier: Tommy Schumacher's or Scotty Rudin's?

Laura Benanti. 'nut said.

FUCK autocorrect. That was "'nuf" said.

Just now it tried to make it "nun said" -which would be an entirely different direction...

It is well known that Riedel printed whatever Rudin or the Shubert told him.

Yes r253. Check his columns in the last 2–3 years and see how many are pushing Rudin shows. It's staggering. I still with my point at r247 that he's too much of a bad wannabe to be a good journalist.

Our long national nightmare is over!

No--not the Trump presidency--the "They're Playing Our Song" thread is CLOSED!

Sorry to have to tell you, R255, but there's now a Part 2.

And the sequel is going strong. We [bold]still[/bold] believe in love, r255, even if you don't.

FROZEN London postponed -- again.

Who gives a fuck about Riedel's columns? We're talking about the books. They are completely different.

The books are cobbled together by a cheap propagandist who basically did whatever the overlords told him to do. There is not one original thought in his books, and he's basically transcribing the history that belongs to the richest.

Christ, this Riedel critic is the same one who went apeshit about how bad Brantley was and never shut up about it even when he found no encouragement. I thought Muriel was instituting Prime Time more often these days to get rid of people like this.

[quote]Sorry to have to tell you, [R255], but there's now a Part 2.

Well, I may have to kill myself now. Thanks.

Bye.

Can I have your stuff, r262?

Scott Rudin is planning a revival, starring Laurie Metcalf and Joe Mantello, directed by Ivo van Hove. Interested now, r262 and r248?

All 6 "voices" will be nude, covered in goat's blood, and played by Glenda Jackson.

[quote]Christ, this Riedel critic is the same one who went apeshit about how bad Brantley was and never shut up about it even when he found no encouragement.

R262, can you explain or review how you can tell this? Do you just have to hit "f/f" on one of the person's posts?

What will be on the video screens, r265?

I blocked him, R266

R268, if you blocked him, how can you read his posts to know that the person going after Riedel is the same one who went after Brantley?

JFC, are you new here?

The posts show up on your Ignored list for that poster, r269.

The cast of the Broadway musical Ragtime performs the amazing opening title number on The Rosie O'Donnell Show, January 19, 1998.

Still thrilling, even on the tiny TV studio stage...

[quote]The posts show up on your Ignored list for that poster, [R269].

Not r269, but what the holy fuck is the point of blocking someone so that you don't have to see their posts and then rushing over to your blocked list to see what they posted?

IATSE Calls for Live Venues to Become COVID Vaccination Sites Using Union Labor:

Sometimes there are reasons, r273, and I don't think rushing is involved.

...and even though it's been very heavily cut, R272. I would so love to have a well-filmed version of the whole opening number, with all the political stuff in. My favorite line:

"They called it the Crime of the Century, but Goldman knew it was only 1906, and there were 94 years to go (Evelyn: Whee!)"

Following R244's link led me down a bit of a YouTube rabbit-hole where I found this. The DL has always spoken of this performance as legendary, and I usually follow these threads, but I've never seen this clip before. Please don't jump on me if you have. There are also clips up of her singing Maybe This Time, and of the end of the show. A truly gobsmacking production.

how would Glenn been as Desiree? Anyone know why that revival with G didn't get off the ground?

So someone isn't allowed to not respect the work of Ben Brantley and/or Michael Reidel? What, darling?

Say, Darling!

I've never quite gotten Say, Darling. Was it actually a play with music, not a real musical? Is this the show where young Robert Morse played a character based on young Hal Prince? But then I noticed he didn't get star billing in r280s's link. A supporting character based on Prince....wtf?

Does anyone here know this show? Is it ripe for a revival? Maybe at Encores? With a color-blind cast??

"Say, Darling" is a play with some original songs, performed as songs, not as numbers in a musical.

A truly mediocre show, Say Darling.

It was no Happy Hunting!

"Gee, But It's Good To Be Here" is one of the greatest intro songs written for a musical. That sounds like a later recording at R284, when her voice had a bit more of a wobble. It sure wasn't a fun show for the Merm, though. She refused to talk to the composer after he dared to critique one of her vocal choices. And she famously feuded with her leading man, Fernando Lamas, especially after he gave a TV interview and said that kissing Merman onstage was “somewhere between kissing your uncle and a Sherman tank”. She had the power to get him fired. Instead she made him KEEP his job, which prevented him from playing the lead in the South Pacific movie.

One more "Happy Hunting" fun fact. During the pre-Broadway tryout, Fernando Lamas asked the costume team to make his pants tighter so that his huge dick would upstage Merman.

Sorry, no pics to share.

Did anyone subscribe to the National Theatre's streaming service? If so, anything in particular you enjoyed?

Mosquitos. Most has already been released.

R285, that's amazing. I don't think I had ever heard that Fernando Lamas was even considered for the male lead in the movie of SOUTH PACIFIC, but that makes perfect sense. I guess he was a little young for the role at the time, but they could have aged him a bit as they did Brazzi.

DL icon Seth Sikes has been singing his Garland show down in Puerto Vallarta, defying the local "no shows" order. Cancellation coming?

Emile de Becque is French, correct? I wonder if Louis Jourdan or Jacques Bergerac were ever considered, as a real singing voice never seemed to be the issue? Is there any reason he needs to be much older than Nellie? And if Nellie is realistically in her early 20s, a man of 35 would be fine.

That said, Ezio Pinza's gorgeous voice on the OBC has always slayed me. Shivers up and down the spine. Is it thought too operatic these days?

R291, I don't know if a specific age for Emile de Becque is given in the original novel or anywhere in the stage directions for the musical, but he is supposed to be considerably older than Nellie. There are several lines to that effect, including one line where Emile says to Nellie something like. "If we have children, when I die they will be growing up. You could afford to take them to America, if you like." I think he's supposed to be about 50, and Nellie should indeed be in her early 20s.

I disagree.

Darling Glenn, was the Lucille Ball Mame filter not available when you filmed South Pacific?

On Antiques Roadshow this week...

Since when do DL Theater Queens like Riedel or Brantley? They've never been DL Faves unless you mean the kind of "Faves We Love To Mock".

They're both hacks though at least Riedel is a modestly entertaining one. Brantley is just a yutz with questionable taste and writing skills.

R287 I don't subscribe but, of the ones I've seen:

OTHELLO was excellent. Stunning performances and a modernized setting (the Gulf War) that actually worked. One of the best productions of OTHELLO I've seen.

I liked CORIOLANUS quite a lot, but am glad I read the play first. It's a minimalist production with a lot of role-doubling, so it might be a bit confusing if you're not familiar with it.

MEDEA was also very good. But very, very bleak.

I though AMADEUS was dreadful - overlong, overdone, and quite boring.

[quote] I though AMADEUS was dreadful - overlong, overdone, and quite boring.

Agreed. One of my fondest memories in the theatre was seeing Ian McKellan on Broadway in the original Peter Hall production. There are clips of Phillip Scofield out there that are thrilling, too. But this production was the pits. The worst kind of modern British theatre; faux-hip, unnecessarily busy and flat-out grating.

R298 Make that PAUL Scofield as the original star of "Amadeus." Phillip Schofield is a TV "presenter," West End star of "Joseph" and "Dr. Doolittle," and came out as gay last year.

Oh God. I’m genuinely embarrassed. Thank you for the correction, r299.

R299 Make that "Dr. Dolittle"

R300 No need to feel embarrassed--I misspelled "Dolittle"

The original Broadway production of Amadeus with Ian McKellan was truly one of the most thrilling shows I've seen. The recent NT production couldn't hold McKellan's wig (I only liked having the chamber orchestra on stage).

Because I'm sure we've got some Playbill savers here. I went through two large boxes of programs early in the pandemic and recycled a LOT of them, mostly symphony and dance programs, but more than a few theater ones, too, some for shows I'd completely forgotten I'd seen. One of the best things about looking through old programs is all the ads. People sure smoked a lot of Benson & Hedges and Tareytons then.

R297 Yeah. We watched all those over lockdown here.

Sammy Stops The World - with Sammy Davis Jr and Marian Mercer.

Is Amadeus one of those plays that hasn't aged well? I've only seen one live production and it didn't blow me away.

It was from a minor semi-professional local theater but the script felt very long and very creaky.

Even the best scripts can seem long and creaky in the hands of less-than-stellar actors/directors/producers.

The one Broadway revival of "Amadeus," with David Suchet and Michael Sheen, was something of a disappointment.

Work is also of its time. Lots of "great" novels and plays don't seem so great as time passes. Something that was considered stylish and daring when it first debuted may not seem so daring and stylish years later. Many of those acclaimed "well made" plays of the 1950s like "Inherit the Wind" don't play so well today and now many of those similarly acclaimed works of the 1980s like "Amadeus" and "Crimes of the Heart" can also feel creaky as hell.

I thought Crimes of the Heart was creaky as hell even back then.

R310 TBH, I thought the same. It's just a Lifetime TV movie crossed with a Southern Gothic and an episode of "Mama's Family".

Beth Henley is a terrible writer.

R312 She needed anal. At least Wendy got that from Terence.

Callas.

The original Broadway Amadeus also had some great replacements. I think saw John Wood and later a really terrific David Dukes. I bet Langella was fantastic.

Why is the play Amadeus called Amadeus? It's just Mozart's middle name. Shouldn't it be called Wolfgang?

To play up the connotations of the name "Amadeus".

Ama = Love

Deus = God

Fun Fact: Amadeus wasn't Mozart's real middle name. It's the Latin form of one of his middle names Theophilus which means "Lover of God" in Greek. Mozart also used Amadeo (Italian) and Amadè (French) at different times in his life. In fact, he only used Amadeus a few times and most of those appear to be in jest (such as when he signed letters by adding -us to the end of all of his names, i.e. Wolfgangus Amadeus Mozartus).

[quote]Many of those acclaimed "well made" plays of the 1950s like "Inherit the Wind" don't play so well today

I have to disagree with you on that one. I think it still plays like gangbusters on stage, and when I very recently re-watched the movie version, I found that it still packs a wallop. This is partly because the play is so well written but also because the subject matter is, sadly and incredibly, still relevant.

I saw Langella and Dennis Boutsikaris. They were both wonderful in it.

I agree with r317. Bad productions give these shows a bad name or reputation. And then out of nowhere, someone will do something really strong (and it doesn't have to be gimmicky. I'm looking at [italic]you[/italic], Ivo!), and we all wonder where this "lost classic" has been.

Meanwhile what the hell is "Josh Swallows" podcast. Here is his new episode with Tay Tay and Isaac Powell. I'm afraid to listen.

With those two, I'm pretty sure we know what Josh is swallowing...

Seems like someone should repost that full length (ahem) nude of Isaac from a few threads ago.

Poor Josh Lamon. They only cast him in The Prom so that Brooks Ashmanskas would look svelte in comparison

Inherit the Wind is prohibitive to produce on Broadway because it requires a huge cast (35+) and 2 big stars. I was involved with the Broadway revival in the 1990s that starred George C. Scott and Charles Durning that was produced by Tony Randall's old theater company National Actors Theatre, but it closed quickly because Scott was too ill and left the production in early previews. He was riveting, even in his lessened state, a true stage star. IIRC he died shortly after.

But, as others have stated above, the play can be phenomenal in the right hands and yet a big pompous bore in the wrong ones (I've seen that, too). Nevertheless, when theaters reopen, and with the political climate changing, I can imagine the right production being a big success on Broadway.

Nude courtroom. With video and monkey blood. And real monkeys for monkey trial. I like.

R309 Yup, try staging "Equus" with the boy and girl stripping down to bathing suits instead of nude and see how the production is reviewed and received.

I didn’t know they did this

Everyone must have seen this already but it is worth putting here

When everything was fine

Act 1.

R330 so in 2005, LuPone, McDonald, and Cerveris did ANYONE CAN WHISTLE and PASSION?

[quote]Tony Randall's old theater company National Actors Theatre

I don't think Randall's theater ever really took off, did it? Kind of a shame -- creating a national theater wasn't a bad idea.

It wasn't a bad idea, but the productions weren't that hot.

Tony ran that thing into the ground within the first season and coasted on fumes and the good graces of Jack Klugman for two more before he had to settle for one production per season at various theaters before packing it in by the end of the decade. By the time The Gin Game rolled around, they weren't really using the NAT moniker because it was the kiss of death.

Miss Cook's tribute to love songs...

Could a generous soul share a link to the West End King and I and the pro shot Pippin? I think at this point I´ve finished Netflix...

David Dukes was such a marvelous actor and left us much too soon.

Definitely r337. Wish he were better known.

Sublime Dame Maggie...

Lettice and Lovage was a wonderful play. I saw Dame Maggie in London he week it opened. Absolutely one of the most entertaining evenings I have spent in the theatre.

‘Moulin Rouge!’ Was Their Ticket. Then 2020 Happened:

Broadway Legend Joel Grey on Why He Got Vaccinated -- "Hope is Everything":

Why wouldn't he get vaccinated? What a stupid headline.

Tits! When am I gonna grow tits?

Jesus, that article about Moulin Rouge makes it sound like one of the greatest tragedies of the modern world that it was stopped in its tracks. It was a fucking jukebox musical based on a movie. They're like subways. Miss one and another comes along in 10 minutes to take you for a crowded, not terribly exciting ride.

I love you r345....And I have money in Moulin...

Bob Avian has died. Cardiac arrest yesterday at his home in Florida.

Broadway credits...

So sad about Bob Avian. I only met and spoke with him once, very briefly, but he seemed like a genuinely sweet guy. Rest in peace.

I’ll be reading his book on Kindle this weekend.

The NT Live Amadeus starts badly. But the second act is amazing. I have seen the play many times and most productions after the Peter Hall with the original cast have completely fucked it up.

The original and this are the only two that made sense of the second act. This production emphasizes how Salieri keeps getting richer and richer and Mozart crumbles. That is something I have never seen before.

And the Mozart is the best since Tim Curry.

Most productions miss the humor and while this one is not as funny as Hall's production, it is funnier than most. (I am guessing that the movie jettisoned the gags so stage productions imitate it by downplaying the jokes.)

Bob Avian had an amazing career and was a part of some of the all-time greats. (Including, of course, that little show that played the Winter Garden all those years ago.)

It’s sad to think we lost a connection to one of Broadway's greatest eras. It’s even sadder that we lost such a sweet, generous and wise man. He was an absolute doll.

Lettice & Lovage is one of the Top 10 on my all-time Favorite Plays list. Maggie Smith ate up the scenery, but that's exactly what the role needed. The part was written for her, so hard to duplicate.

...and the Tony Award goes to.... MAGGIE SMITH!!!

Her Mary McGregor played the role at the Pasadena Playhouse a quarter century ago, r353, opposite Miss Mary Jo Catlett.

Avian. Perhaps he just...flew away?

Streep should do Lettice and Lovage. She'd be brilliant.

I'm watching Jack Benny on Dick Cavett going on how wonderful Danny Kaye was in Two by Two and how terrible it was that he didn't get a Tony nomination.

Doubt Streep would walk in the footsteps someone like Dame Maggie.

[quote]I'm watching Jack Benny on Dick Cavett going on how wonderful Danny Kaye was in Two by Two and how terrible it was that he didn't get a Tony nomination.

That's one closet queen supporting another.

The MR article in the Times made it sound very ominous.... I wonder when theaters will be back up.

R361, your post is useless without a link.

He was commenting on a link in a post, you clod.

R362, I think R361 may be talking about this:

I thought the article at r364 sounded ominous, too. Like the producers were VERY concerned about raising the 3 million to revive such an expensive show knowing it would absolutely be dependent on outrageously high ticket prices to ultimately make a profit.

Will post-covid audiences really go for it and will they be able to afford it?

withonelook just posted a number from [italic]Nine[/italic] with Sergio Franchi from 1983. I still don't understand how folks got bootlegs in those days before video was so portable. 8mm cameras were noisy. What did they use?

Catching up on this thread and slightly related to Tony Randall's NAT, I was amazed at how many short-lived productions the Roundabout did at Criterion Center Stage Right. They were averaging about four a season.

circle of life... OG Desiree as her mom

[quote] Catching up on this thread and slightly related to Tony Randall's NAT, I was amazed at how many short-lived productions the Roundabout did at Criterion Center Stage Right. They were averaging about four a season.

I'm not sure I understand your amazement. This was pretty much what a Roundabout season was like for many years. And a few years after Stage Right opened, they opened the first Laura Pels theater right next to it which did a mix of new plays and revivals. And it's what they still do now, only it's spread out amongst four different stages.

I loved that theater complex. I understand why they branched out, but I wish they could have found a way to keep that particular venue open instead of it being razed for a fucking Toys R Us.

[quote]fucking Toys R Us

Pics please.

Here she is boys! Here she is world! Here's...LORNA!!!

Many shows are not reopening- tours especially. The decisions have been made but the producers/GMs are opting not to tell any of their (former) employees ahead of time because with social media there is no way to control the announcement, so unfortunately a lot of people who think they have a job to go back to do not. Some tours that were to go out are cancelled or are going out on lower tier contracts than previously planned. It's going to be ugly.

R366 Meh, I would appreciate what AuroraNutBar and WithOneKiss shared if they shared the whole fucking shows. These little 'snippets' they deem share worthy, controlling all...betrays deep seated mental heath issues.

Christ, the orchestra in that audio clip of Lorna Luft in GYPSY is beyond horrible. Where the hell was this? Epic fail. As for Lorna's performance, I would say the singing is very good, the acting only okay.

R369, I guess I was just surprised that Roundabout could fit 4-5 shows at one place in a season, but as you mention, it was a model they were used to.

Lorna did Gypsy at a university. It was pretty much an amateur production with a drag queen as Electra. Now if Lorna wanted to play Rose couldn’t she have been cast at Papermill or a professional stock production?

R376, do you mean that GYPSY was a production of the university's theater department with Lorna in the lead for some reason, or was it just an amateur production in a university theater? Either way, the orchestral playing in that clip is embarrassing.

r373

did you ever think maybe they don't have the whole show? Maybe the clips were the only thing the person filming could get?

If you follow the underground bootleg video gangs the full shows are available if you’re willing to pay or have something to trade.

I still can't picture how they got the boots filmed

Then pay or have something to trade, r379. The whining at r373 is tedious and reeks of entitlement...

I do pay and I do have full shows but I don’t post them online. I’m happy with the clips Aurora posts. I don’t always need to see the full show.

I'm happy with them as well, r382. And really, some of the bootlegs aren't great and I wouldn't watch an entire show of that quality.

How does one find a way to buy the full ones? I don't live in NYC...

I also miss Roundabout in the Criterion. Those 2 spaces brought some its most interesting and engaging productions in their history. They have too many spaces to fill now and most of the filler is star-driven junk and under-developed new work, all carelessly produced. I hope Todd takes covid time to realize he's done and bow out gracefully.

R384 Here's a site that might be worth checking out:

Try Tumblr. Search bootleg broadway videos.

[quote] [R369], I guess I was just surprised that Roundabout could fit 4-5 shows at one place in a season, but as you mention, it was a model they were used to.

Yes, they had been around for a while before they moved to the Criterion Center and had a space in the 20s, and then one in Union Sq. I never went to either of those spaces, as I wasn't in NYC yet, but I've read about their seasons at both and they did the same kind of season every year- 4-5 productions. But both those houses were Off-Broadway spaces only.

Before they moved to the Criterion, the Roundabout mostly produced cheap-looking and deadly dull revivals of 19th and 18th century plays....Shaw, Moliere and the like as well as the occasional Williams, Miller and Inge.

Somehow they got Liam Neeson and Natasha Richardson to do O'Neill's Anna Christie as one of their first shows at the Criterion and that truly wonderful production changed everything and gave them access to bigger star names and smarter directors.

The first time I ever went to Stage Right was 1990. Someone gave me a free ticket to a play called Stand Up Tragedy with Jack Coleman from Dynasty starring in it. Then when Roundabout moved in, they used to have great student pricing, so I went to see some of their first season there. I remember absolutely loving their production of The Visit with Jane Alexander. And then I found out about being able to usher there to see the show for free and I saw their entire next two seasons that way (and a lot of other off-Broadway shows), until I got sick of doing that and decided I'd rather just pay for tickets. Of course, this was back when Off-Broadway shows were around $25-$35 each. Those were the days.

Anyway, here's a photo of Criterion Stage Right about a year before Roundabout moved in. Mastergate was playing there at the time.

R381 Handbags...how common.

Watched the PBS Lincoln Center production of The Nance starring Nathan Lane, damn he was great as was the rest of the cast. Very enjoyable and heartbreaking play. It was a good reminder of how dangerous it was to be gay back in the “old days”.

It was also a great reminder how much I miss watching really talented people perform live.

WHET Jonny Orsini?

Not really accurate r389. They had some other great stuff down at FIT like Jim Dale & Stockard Channing in Joe Egg

Wanda Richert in Nine also got posted today. Was always curious about how she did. Better than I expected. She doesn't have Anita Morris' humor but she sings and moves well. I guess it is ok just not as special as Morris' unique performance.

Wanda only took the role because she misinterpreted the title of her song.

I don't get it r396. Explain!

Wanda is now a Reverend of some kind I think. I followed her on twitter and she followed back.

I noticed her account got deleted after the Trump/capitol riot.

I kind of think she was posting Trump won type stuff but not sure. But her account is suspended now.

Yeah, she was a religious loon for a while. Went full on insane.

r395 her performance seems like it's got more dancer razzmatazz but much less allure. She's hitting her marks well and hard. But she's dripping sequins instead of sex.

Jonny Orsini became Jon Orsini in the indie film THE ASSISTANT with Julia Garner. He had a small role, and kept his clothes on. Alas.

R367, that 4-play kind of season is pretty normal for institutional theaters across the country--and in NYC.

And not too much different from the 3-play season they currently run.

Incidentally, at 499 seats, the theater was about the same size as some off-Broadway houses.

r394, you're right about the Roundabout's pre-Criterion programming. There were occasionally some gems like Joe Egg. I was (unintentionally) exaggerating in my earlier post to make a point.

But I do remember that 1993 Anna Christie directed by David Leveaux was a major turning point in the theater's success. I think it was also where Liam met Natasha; they didn't sign on as a couple but left as one.

So Moulin Rouge is going to have to spend $3 million to re-open? What will shows like WICKED and PHANTOM and LION KING need to spend?

That includes advertising etc I’m sure

R403, Richardson had played Anna in Britain a few years earlier and with her husband, Robert Fox, tried desperately to get an American theater to put it up here, knowing it would help her career.

Within the first few days of rehearsal she and Neeson were fucking. Redgrave said to the husband that she thought Natasha treated him terribly after he worked so hard to make Anna Christie happen in New York. She comforted him by saying that they would make a lot of money with the tour of Lettice and Lovage she would do for him across America.

Then she made a statement about Israel and each stop on the tour cancelled.

So poor Robert Fox got fucked over by two Redgraves in one season.

Neeson was also cast in Schindlers List during the run. He had already tested but when Spielberg saw him in AC that cinched it.

Nicely done r406

r391=Lady Bracknell

But what about me? I was Tash's best friend. And Liam's!!

Very well put, R400.

FOLLIES!

Gee Natasha Richardson was a real tramp. Who knew! That was lousy to leave a husband like that.

Hickey really knows how to be a sycophant to those successful actresses and they eat it up for some reason. Laura Linney, Allison Janney, Sandra Bernhard, Goop all fawn over him.

(but if you are non-famous he's just an awful bully.)

R413 Love is love.

Didn't Liam then cheat on her constantly?

Natasha came from a very bohemian family so I guess cheating came naturally to her.

And if the 🍆 rumors about Liam are true..........

R414 Hickey can be forgiven somewhat for doing lots of full-frontal nudity on both stage and screen!

R418 Rumors?

There's EVIDENCE! The man was full frontally naked in a movie with his huge cock flapping in the wind!

Vanessa Redgrave was let go early from filming one day and went home to find her husband Tony Richardson naked in bed with her father, Sir Michael Redgrave. They asked her to join in. Instead she turned around, walked out and started divorce proceedings not long after.

The Redgraves have publicly denied this happened but it was published in a biography of the Redgrave family and then republished in the Daily Mail when the book was serialized. They never sued.

Oh, r421...

But then Vanessa hooked up with the absolutely gorgeous Franco Nero and all was well with the world.

Alfred and Lynnie slept with Mossie and Kitty.

R412 compare that Lucy & Jessie with this one. Caroline comes out the winner!

Juliet in her pants.

Redgrave had a big breakdown after Richardson left. She had bouts of stage fright and trouble acting. I think it was the politics she got involved with that gave her her confidence back.

So....I recorded that Lorna GYPSY. Always funny to see something you record turn up on YouTube . It was at an university in Richmond,Virginia. I am not sure how it originally came about but the original announced Rose was Ebersole, someone I wouldn’t make a road trip to see. Her charms elude me (altho I did like GG). I’m not going to bother to lookup the date but memory says Ebersole got a Bway gig and suddenly Lorna was announced.

Now Lorna in GYPSY. Obvious road trip. I had never seen her and was very curious And yes, Mazeppa was a guy in drag. My original intention was to videotape it but it was too light , my seat was good and would have been perfect but it wasn’t feasible. Too exposed.

She returned the following year and her tribute show to Mama. I actually ended up talking with her for quite a while afterwards. She seemed to be a “broad” in the best sense of the word. We really hit it off actually and I had recently seen Peters. That peeked her interest and we actually dished(I hated BP). Actually, her husband had to come get her we were having so much fun.

The other thing I can say is the kids and crew from that production obviously liked her a lot. She spent a lot of time with them. The owners of the dog that played Chowzie even brought the dog to see her. I waited after all that to get her to sign her bookend that’s how we ended up talking for so long. I have a friend who actually knows both sisters and has worked with them. He said Lorna can be a bit much but really didn’t elaborate. Said Liza was actually the nicer of the two and the thing that really stayed with him was she always sent thank you notes etc for anything someone did for her and truly was very nice. Sounded like she’s very old school was the impression I got.

Why do the theater gossip threads keep getting grayed out?

That Caroline O’Connor clip is great. Thanks, R412.

[quote] That peeked her interest

Oh, dear

r428, are you by any chance mlop from ATC?

We should only be so lucky r432.

Mlop could never string that many sentences together without numerous typos, misspellings and malapropisms.

True, that, r434.

What is a mlop?

OMG I miss mlop!!!!

Check out ATC, r437. She's often still there.

Yes, mlop has made quite the resurgence on ATC. Wonder where she's been.

Curley McDimple

I started reading up about this off-Broadway show from the 60s, featuring Bernadette Peters and later included Butterfly (Gone With The Wind) McQueen. The plot is very reminiscent of Annie, and I wonder if Strouse, Adams, and Charnin "borrowed" anything from the musical. I'm sure there are eldergays here who saw the original production. I'd love to hear more about it, and wonder why it has't been revived?

...Wikipedia's take on Curley McDimple. Apparently there was a Bill "Bojangles" Robinson character as well.

mlop is also a Broadway/theater/art photographer, but she can't use the written language very well. If she could act, she could indeed be well cast as Mrs. Malaprop.

She's a nice lady, btw, but quite a character!

I found this a bit scary...

Curly McDimple...

Mary Testa is almost as annoying as COVID.

Nobody revives Curly McDimple because Ruthless! is as easy to produce and so much more satisfying

I love Mary Testa!

Well, CM was of its off-Broadway time like Dames, r447. They were products of the '30s nostalgia craze, so they were going for charm.

Exactly, r449, but charming child killer is so much more fun than Rebecca of Sunnybrook Farm.

BTW, by the 70s, it was 30s and 40s nostalgia which gave us the wonderful Over Here!

I think it's high time for some '90s nostalgia! Who's up for a Macaulay Culkin-themed musical?

We also had Shirley Dimple.

It was certainly a craze by the beginning of 1971, r450. Ruthless! is also really of its time, as to fully appreciate it you have to be a Bad Seed fan. And I'd guess there were more of us around when it opened almost 30 years ago.

Tyne's Gypsy, Part 1....

It's so tragic that the 1980s and 1990s are now what's considered "nostalgic" by millions.

Uhhh....r455 ...that's sorta the way it works. The '20s and '30s were the same distance from the '70s. And what it comes down to is that what we're nostalgic for is our youth.

I realize that, of course, r456. But when I was young in the 1970s, the nostalgia craze was about the 1920s, 30s and 40s, all wonderfully interesting decades before I was born. I wish kids today were more into the 1950s, 60s and 70s.

Today, 2009 qualifies as nostalgic.

R457 Didn't Grease come out in the 70s?

Grease - stage show 1972. Film version 1978. So it was fewer than 15 years since the show was set. It would be the equivalent of a new musical opening now looking back on the halcyon days of 2005.

R460, but music, fashion, social behavior, and so many other things had changed radically between the time period in which GREASE is set (late '50s) and the writing and the production of the musical (early '70s). And anyway, yes, people who were teenagers in the late '50s were thirtyish adults in the '70s, and they're the ones who ate up GREASE.

[quote]Wanda is now a Reverend of some kind I think. I followed her on twitter and she followed back. I noticed her account got deleted after the Trump/capitol riot. I kind of think she was posting Trump won type stuff but not sure. But her account is suspended now.

Wanda Richert is a straight-up Qhole, [r398]/[r399]. Her FB page is littered with Q quotes and groupthink. Yes, she is some kind of self-proclaimed "Reverend", complete with miracle cures and crackpot theories. About 5 years ago, she lived in Florida and had a heavy drug problem. Ketamine, Molly. Cocaine. Lived in poverty and was homeless. An attempted intervention by her ex-husband, Irwin Myers, and their daughter was met by suicide threats. There was talk of 51/50ing her, and suddenly she was in flyover country and became a Reverend.

She was never stable, though. I worked with her on 42nd Street, and she was a nut job then. Oddly, drugs and religion do not appear to have been helpful.

That was terrifying, [r444], though Diedre Goodwin is my 2nd favorite Velma. My favorite was Mamie Duncan-Gibbs. Diedre is in this clip, as are Michael Berresse, Bruce Anthony Davis (RIP), John Mineo (RIP), Jim Borstelmann, Caitlin Carter. Rosa Curry, Rocker Verastique, Michael Kubala, David Warren-Gibson, and a few others I cannot identify for a certainty.

Also, because it cannot be overstated, apt and elegantly put, [r400]

I saw Mamie play Mama and she was fantastic.

I bet she was, r463!

thanks r462

I miss Valens' videos.

A big difference in nostalgia is that fashion has changed very little in the past 20 years. The reason for this is there really aren't the dos and don'ts rules that were always in place in past decades. In the last 20 years we've all been encouraged to wear what we like and not pay too much attention to the latest trends., which are mostly just followed by well-to-do teenagers and 20-somethings.

I miss Valens, too. Amazing stuff.

I'm only sorry I didn't get to watch more of them before they disappeared

R469. I copy youtube vids as soon as they pop up. There’s free software online that allows you to copy and save to your computer.

i know, i have the software, too, but I got lazy about ripping and just saved the links. i won't make that mistake anymore. thank you, though.

Isn’t Valens now WithOneLook on YT? I think so.

Fuck No I Am Not.

I am building back up, finally reupped Rock Follies, woop, am going back to my original plan, of posting things in relation to discussions, rather than the endless posting I was doing during lockdown. But, as always, do requests.

Aloha.

Love you, Valens!

You are THE BEST Valens. I’m just the carbon copy you read when you can’t find the original.

R475 Bwahahah bless. You do good work, son. x

Looks like Emma, indeed, made a pretty swell Sally...

She was also a delight as a company member unlike Michelle Williams

I've said before that I think a film remake of "Cabaret" with Emma Stone as Sally Bowles and Alan Cumming as the Emcee would be pretty awesome. (Even at this point I think he's still young enough to pull it off.) The "re-revival" from a few years ago was terrific, particularly when Stone took over the role.

Cabaret with Alan Cumming and Jane Horrocks.

mwah, Valens!

Hi Valens, any chance you could post the recent Lincoln Center MFL revival? Any cast will do :).

Only bootlegs of that.

Thank you, Valens. You are a gift, a true gift! Show Queens all over the world adore you!

[quote]and i like full length

Size queen!

R479. I stood in the cancellation line for two hours in the rain to see Emma Stone and Alan Cumming—worth every minute.

I can see you now, r486...

R484 Follies!

Valens and WithOneLook - you're both wonderful! Now, if only Muriel would fix the damn theatre threads. Why do they -- seemingly more than any other thread -- keep dropping off of so many of our watchlists? Does Muriel hate the theatre?

Was this from the Lebanese production of Night Music?

If this is a bootleg it has to be one of the oldest boots in the history of boots.

R490 Oh girrrrrl, that is good.

Lois is so neat.

R490 Is that John McMartin?

Well, if you're wondering why anyone with eyes would find him attractive, then it must be John McMartin.

[quote] If this is a bootleg it has to be one of the oldest boots in the history of boots.

There were no bootlegs until 1980. The "Fiddler" footage at R491 is pro-shot, from an early '80s tour with Bernardi and a recreation of the original staging and design.

^ Really?

Lebanese Jean as Desiree???

oh dear

I remember Curley McDimple being all over TV in the early 70s.

We miss you Bayn Johnson!

I wish the sound quality was better, r490. But it looks like Miss Nettleton was a lovely and elegant Desiree.

Will Girl From North Country come. back or throw in the shredded, Depression era towel?

It's...Bayn!

There were certainly audio bootlegs and home movies, r495.

"That's the one where I ACTED!" -- The Term

What's it all about, World?

R495, Ruth Jaroslaw is definitely Yente in that footage. And I think either Dolores Wilson or Peg Murray is playing Golde. I think it’s actually pre-shot from 1967 or 1968, not the early 80s.

[quote]But it looks like Miss Nettleton was a lovely and elegant Desiree.

I saw this production. 1991 at the Doolittle Theatre in Hollywood.

I remember being enchanted by the whole thing (but, then, it was my first time seeing ALNM on stage). In addition to Lois Nettleton and John McMartin, the cast included Michelle Nicastro as Anne and Glynis Johns as Madame Armfeldt. Carl-Magnus was played by Jeff McCarthy.

Here's a video of "A Weekend in the Country" that is in much better shape than the "Send in the Clowns" above.

R502 [quote] There were certainly audio bootlegs and home movies.

I was obviously referring to the fact that there were no video bootlegs--full shows with sound--until 1980.

R505 [quote] I think it’s actually pre-shot from 1967 or 1968, not the early 80s.

It's not. I've had the same video, in better quality, for well over thirty years. It consists of one hour of pro-shot musical numbers from a 1983 Herschel Bernardi tour, with Thelma Lee, Ruth Jaraslow (who made an entire career of Yente), and Paul Lipson.

I went to see a small production of ALNM in North Hollywood about 20 years ago directed by John Rubinstein. It was the first time ever seeing the show and the only songs I knew were Send in the Clowns and A Weekend in Country (from the Sondheim Celebration in 93). I wasn't even sure what the show was about. The only people in the cast I knew of were Jane Lanier, Matthew Ashford and Rubinstein himself.

The theater was awful, and the seats were basically folding chairs on bleachers. It was a real low rent event. Act One was absolutely interminable. The performances were bad, the direction was bad, the whole thing was sub-high school. At intermission, we were debating whether or not to stay for the 2nd act when I noticed that Joanna Gleason was sitting in the row in front of me a few seats over. I looked horrified and wondered what someone who worked w/ Sondheim so spectacularly must be thinking of this thing when she turned and looked right at me. My face must have said it all, because she discretely nodded and then we both laughed.

Piaf with Jane Lapotaire and Zoe Wanamaker.

[quote] Piaf with Jane Lapotaire and Zoe Wanamaker.

Plus a young Jean Smart as Marlene Dietrich!

Oh yes. She is marvellous.

Great story, r508!

When I saw Piaf on broadway Jane was out and some unknown named Judith Ivey went on in her place. She was amazing. Thanks for the video. Now I can finally see Jane :)

R513 Judith is also in it. She has a small dog.....

r513 - fun! I was surprised to find how much I enjoyed Judith Ivey in the excellent LA Opera production of A Little Night Music from the early 2000s. LA Opera very smartly loaded the cast with Broadway vets, rather than opera singers. Really excellent cast... Victor Garber, Laura Benanti, Michelle Pawk, Zoe Caldwell, Marc Kudisch and a young pre-movies fame Kristen Bell.

I'll admit from the start I'm an eldergay but can someone please explain to me where Kristen Bell's fame and attachment to musical theater comes from?

Wasn't Kristen in Ruthless? I know she did Reefer Madness Off Broadway.

Tom Sawyer, r516!

[quote] When I saw Piaf on broadway Jane was out and some unknown named Judith Ivey went on in her place. She was amazing. Thanks for the video. Now I can finally see Jane :)

Judith Ivey was the matinee alternate for Jane; it was quite a taxing role.

[quote] I was surprised to find how much I enjoyed Judith Ivey in the excellent LA Opera production of A Little Night Music from the early 2000s. LA Opera very smartly loaded the cast with Broadway vets, rather than opera singers. Really excellent cast... Victor Garber, Laura Benanti, Michelle Pawk, Zoe Caldwell, Marc Kudisch and a young pre-movies fame Kristen Bell.

Some clips from the L.A. Opera production:

Kristen Bell in the off-Broadway production of "Reefer Madness" that preceded the TV film:

^ I bloody loved that show, the LA cast album was brilliant. Shame 9/11 killed it in New York.

The vanishing Tony Awards must go on:

Please. Only Jeremy O. Harris and Danny Burstein give a shit.

And little sad Aaron.

In honor of National Swing Day, 9 Broadway Stars Who Made Their Debut as Swings: