Why Do I Drink?

Because you want to feel good, happy and giddy. It's a quick fix. Try to identify why you want the drink.

Is it to feel better? To release anxiety? As a treat, because you deserve it?

It becomes a mindless habit - as many things do. Of course, all the AA people on here will tell you the usual story that you have no control and you're a helpless alcoholic.

There's a gray area.

I was the same. I am an alcoholic and this is exactly how alcoholism works. Complete abstinence is my only solution and AA helped me lay that ground work .

6 years sober this past weekend

R2 Do you think I might be an alcoholic? My dad’s side all are. Mom’s side are tee-total. I think I’m in denial.

I am the same. I never "hit bottom" or lost anything due to drinking. I rarely drank alone. But once I started, I couldn't stop. I was a 3-4 times a week binge drinker, usually on weekends, and I started realizing that I started the week SO ANXIOUS and decided to quit drinking for 30 days to see what happened.

I felt so good I never drank again. It has been 5 years. You can do it. Sparkling water 24/7, and a brainwashing book called This Naked Mind helped.

I don't call myself an alcoholic, but I probably am one. I consider myself a problem drinker who is infinitely happier sober.

It is so nice to wake up and feel the same every day. And to not worry about how I acted or what I said.

Not OP, but I definitely drank so I would feel good. Giddy, as R1 said. And to relieve anxiety. I wish doctors would just come out and tell people that anxiety is the reason most alcoholics drink. It would make the condition less shameful and help treat the actual problem!

You covet. That is your nature. And how do we begin to covet? We begin by coveting what we see every day. Don't you feel eyes moving over your body, OP? And don't your eyes seek out the things you want?

R6 my anxiety was greatly relieved when I quit drinking.

Drinking causes anxiety and depression.

OP, are you in therapy? Sounds like the underlying issue needs to be treated before you can control your drinking.

Our OP is not a real alcoholic, R7, but he thinks he is. He tries to be. He's tried to be a lot of things, I expect. Our OP wasn't born an alcoholic. He was made one through years of systematic alcohol abuse. Our OP hates his own identity, you see, and he thinks that makes him an alcoholic. But his pathology is a thousand times more savage and more terrifying.

For another chance to disapprove and another brilliant zinger. Also, another reason not to move. I imagine.

I hope the H troll becomes a thing. He's very entertaining.

R10 Wait, what? What in holy heck are you talking about? I wish I understood what you were saying, even as a dig. And um, thanks for the assessment. Really resonates with me a lot. Not.

All that is incidental R13. First principles. What needs do you serve by drinking?

God I'd love a drink. Life is so empty without one. I mean the man I had the best sex with has been dead a long time and I'm old so what else is there?

R6 Yeah I do have anxiety. I also noticed that when I had my years of not drinking, my anxiety levels would go way down. And life satisfaction would go up. Why I would ever start up again when I felt so good, is a mystery.

I started drinking regularly when I was 15, because I was a latch key kid/only child, and it became a substitute for parental love, comfort etc. I felt more confident with my peers when I would drink. A tale as old as time. Thirty years later, it's really a false god. I know that it is, I'm not fooling myself. Anticipating the drink is way more exciting than after I've had the drink. But then I feel sad that broke my vow and had the drink... so then I will have another drink (or three) to push down the sadness and shame of the first drink. Such a dumb, weird cycle.

Socially, drinking is so way past being a threadbare party trick. Any phone call or text I make when I've had a drink, I immediately discount the next day, even if I would have said the exact same things while sober.

I certainly don't feel the warm fuzzy of the fake comfort that I used to feel in my teens, alone in my house, wishing I had parents who were there to check in with me, hang out with me, help me with my math, or even fucking ground my ass for being a delinquent. Anything,. These days I just feel shame. And yet, I can't seem to stop until some external force intervenes, like an operation. Or like when I started Lamictal and I felt amazing in my brain for the first time in my adult life. I stopped drinking for a year and a half. I was very happy and productive. Then the Lamictal pooped out, and I found myself reaching for alcohol again. And SSRI's actually making my cravings go through the roof. It's a real thing, it happens to some people. I have read forums about people who were rare drinkers turn into raging drunks because they started an SSRI.

I am wishing for some magic wand that could take away the cravings. In the meantime, is there anything anyone of you that has ever been in my position has tried -- that worked? AA meetings seem out of the question. I guess there are Zoom meetings. I am not sure that would flip the switch in my brain the way an in-person group meeting would do. Naltrexone? Kudzu? A shaman?

And one for Mahler, r11.

R14 I may have answered your question in the above post at R16. It's a great question. What needs am I medicating or ignoring, indeed. I think I'm very lonely, deep inside. Because I was very neglected growing up. And I found alcohol at an impressionable age, and so it sort of hardwired into my brain. The connection between "I feel so lonely and neglected" and "Hey! I can drink and it takes away the lonely feelings."

Then the question is, how to heal the long-held residual neglect so I am free?

R15 "What else is there" is YOU.

Here's a list of AA Zoom meetings, OP / R16. Or google "AA Zoom" and your city.

OP If you started to drink at 15 that has effected your mental development. Your brain was still growing then. I have represented many addicts who started when they were a pre- teen, let alone a teenager. Any drug mixed with a growing brain will effect that brain. For a great many people addiction was a survival technique when they were young. Many times because they are being sexually abused. And the abuser serves them drugs. I will say this: a great many addictions involve OCD. The making of the drink, the lighting the pipe, the rush of the needle- all OCD.

R21 I understand. You are saying there is some developmental issues from drinking heavily before I was an adult. What are the implications of that? The anxiety? The OCD? As a result of the drinking/brain impact? I've done therapy much of my adult life but I am not currently in therapy because of the pandemic. I have worked super duper hard to evolve and grow and "adult" but I am sure I have big deficits. I know there's online therapy resources, but I haven't tried it. I hope there is a way for me to heal my brain. I know not drinking, for like, the rest of my life, would be a big step forward.

I was sexually abused as a pre-schooler, and then while I was taken out of that environment, I was still very neglected the rest of my upbringing. Yes I can see a ritualistic aspect of the drinking. I definitely do set the stage the same way every day. I know I'm self-soothing and I know it's also a total lie and a false god.

You sound very knowledgable and caring. Thank you for your input.

R20 I adore you. Thank you. Such a little gesture but so caring and powerful. I just emailed a volunteer with my plight and apparently they have people ready 24/7 to respond to people. I will check my email shortly.

Maybe just getting this out of my shame closet, into the open, will initiate some sort of sea change. I am very moved by the sincere replies.

Of course each situation is different, but as one who really has been around the block with these experiences, I can almost guarantee that when you hit your own personal bottom the light will come on & you will either give up/in, or fight for your life--the one thing I remember my counselor telling me was "be good to yourself"--no one had ever come close to telling me that, & from that point I began to take steps to do exactly that. It's been a lifetime journey & is not over, but you are the only one who can change your own behaviour--not to sound harsh, but put on your big boy pants & get a clue--you have the power within you to change and become a better person. I'm not a joiner & never did AA, but there are those who need that type of support. Good luck!

I think it's related to anxiety. The alcohol temporarily subsides anxiety, giving you some relief from worry, bad memories, fear, insecurity, regret, guilt. Eventually, you get addicted to the chemical. But you also get addicted to the regular short-term relief from anxiety. Unfortunately, a long-term addiction ultimately makes your anxiety worse.

OP, I'm essentially in the same boat as you, so I have empathy for what you're feeling. (Granted, I didn't start drinking until I was 29 and I'm now 40, but I made up for lost time. Alcoholism also runs on both sides of my family, hence I didn't drink until age 29.) Naltrexone actually works exactly as it's designed to, but you have to take it about an hour before you have a drink. I'll admit I have a prescription but haven't taken any in weeks. This thread has reminded me I need to try it again and let it work its magic.

Also, Google the Sinclair Method when you get a chance. I'll attach a great YouTube video on it that someone shared on here back last summer. It helped me when I was religiously taking my Naltrexone.

OP, I think you just had a break through about why you drink and that's awesome.

I replaced drinking with exercise. It's kind of swapping one addiction for another but every time I get that end of the day craving (never, ever thought about drinking during the day, day drinking just wasn't my habit - in fact, if I was at a daytime event, I might have one drink and then come home and get blotto in the evening). Anyway, I was trying to lose weight and to do that I knew I had to give up drinking. So on day 1 instead of mixing a cocktail, I put on my sneakers and went for a run. I eventually joined a gym for strength training and the ability to do cardio inside when the weather is bad, but to this day nothing makes me feel better than a run, bike ride or hike outside. It literally clears my head and gives me insane energy. And the rare moments that I crave a drink, again, I put on my sneakers and reflective vest, my headlamp, and head outside for a run. Exercise and not drinking have also helped a lot with my anxiety.

Speaking of anxiety, it's a bit of a chicken and egg situation. Does drinking cause anxiety or do people start drinking excessively because of anxiety? There was an interesting study a few years ago on the effect of histimines (allergens) and anxiety. Alcoholics have a high amount of histimine in their blood.

R26 Hey, thank you that looks great! I will check it out.

R24 I'm laughing at "put your big boy pants on" because I do say that to myself a lot. But in a mean way. I need to say it (and do it) in a way that is self-loving, and self-empowering, not adding more hurt to my hurt. Like putting on my "big boy battle armor", and kicking some ass, because I care about myself. That's a good way to flip the script of that phrase.

I had the same problem for years with gambling. It sucked my finances dry for a long time. It wrecked me hard emotionally every time I lost huge amounts of money. The closing of the casinos for almost a year now has been a godsend. It’s allowed me to almost completely dig myself out of debt and convince me to never gamble again. The huge benefits outweigh the misery of the addiction. I wish I could go back and change the impulsive decisions I made, but I can’t. The past is past.

It’s funny because one of the casinos sent me a Christmas postcard that they would have sent out to all of their customers, saying how much they missed me and hoped to see me soon whenever the casinos open. All I could think of was “You wish!” It’s nice to know that they’re now the ones losing money.

R27 OMG yes! Histamines!! So, I read that too. It resonated with me intuitively. So I started taking a Quercetin/Bromelain supplement, which are two all-natural bioflavanoids that are meant to lower histamines. They do make my brain feel less anxious... I feel the "ocd" feelings in my brain recede. But they do nothing to curb my cravings.

I even tried straight up Zirtec. Again, my anxiety/stress/ocd brain feels a lot better on the antihistamine, but it doesn't stop the cravings. Interesting though.

People like OP believe in two things:

- All they deserve is misery and pain.

- Anything good can only come with a heavy price aka more misery and pain.

The few happy moments alcohol does provide (aka release from a miserable state of mind) are followed by misery, physical pain, and regret which, based on established beliefs, is rightfully deserved for being so damn stupid to think one can escape his miserable state of mind.

This isn't about addiction alone. It's about the belief that they are unworthy of happiness and good things and life is about suffering and going through one miserable experience after the other.

R31, I'm not OP, but you just described me. How do I change?

r10, that's terrifying

R31 I disagree 1000%. I have internalized neglect, sure—but I have a love of life. I am in awe of life. I have creative pursuits. I think I’m a good person. I have friends and loved ones. I’m a good friend to others.

Yes. It’s easier to give of myself to others, than to care for myself in consistently healthy ways. But I raised myself l, and I think I found early on, I was too young for all of that freedom and self-responsibility. So I learned to cope in different ways. This is standard for children of neglect. To cope we learn escape tricks, to escape the terror of realizing no one is there to protect you.

But I have been sober many times in my life, and when I am sober, I treat myself to travel, culture, spa treatments, massage, Even now, I will reach out for a truly self-loving choice, like a hike or a massage. But I also have slipped back into this other thing. Which is unhealthy.

You are either a troll, or you have not been wounded enough to understand, so you judge others who you deem as “weak.”

Or you just lack empathy. Perhaps you are a bitter asshole.

R33 It’s not terrifying, it’s bullshit.

Dear r34, replace your current established beliefs with ones that make you feel better about yourself.

However, different approaches and strategies work for different people. It may help for you to see your deliberate desire to change for the better as a quest or journey that can only lead to a glorious victory. Trust that there is the perfect solution or path for you out there and all it takes is doing some research to get you there to find the right one for you.

Self help books can be a good way to start. Some find comfort and support in local groups dealing with issues like yours.

OP, don't waste time responding to anything not constructive, i.e., don't waste your time "fighting" with others on this thread. Accept what's helpful and ignore the rest.

[quote] I have internalized neglect, sure—but I have a love of life. I am in awe of life. I have creative pursuits. I think I’m a good person. I have friends and loved ones. I’m a good friend to others.

And yet here you are at DL starting a thread about self-destructive behaviors.

Defensive comments like at r34 just out you as a troll.

OP - alcohol will take its toll on your looks, your face, your skin, your gut, etc.

Forgot to post a photo about alcohol & looks.

You're trying to fill some type of void, OP. Find out why you have a void and if you can fill it with something else that would be more satisfying.

R16 / OP, they're having very successful trials using psilocybin to treat alcohol use disorder, depression, anxiety, and end of life issues. One treatment seems to be all that is needed.

R38 Fucking A. F & F for being an insane person.

R41 Yes. Distilled into a nutshell, yes. Totally. Thank you, sweetheart.

R42. I am. All. In.

Ps I’ve tried Trans-Cranial magnetic therapy, various meds, EMDR - (weeklong 8 he per day intensive), chakra balancing, yoga, cranial-da tail therapy, shamanic soul retrieval, homeopathy...soooo many things. Prayer. Getting saved. (I’m a Jew-Bu but I tried it.). I’m. not being lazy. I am not sitting idly by allowing myself to deteriorate. It’s something very very deep and tenacious. PTSD.

OP, just order yourself a copy of the book "Alcoholics Anonymous". The first 100 or so pages described to me the baffling nature of my relationship with alcohol. I may go months or years w/o it but ultimately, if i touch it again its right back to the beginning or worse. No self help book or licensed professional could begin to explain the situation I was in , but i took to this book immediately, even with the odd 1930's vernacular. It was a relief to find i wasn't alone in this predicament and there seemed to be a solution. Good Luck!

OP, R26 here, and this thread inspired/convicted me to take a Naltrexone and wait an hour before I drank. I went for a walk and read a book I've had checked out from the library for months down at our clubhouse by the tennis courts. (I would usually be drinking and sending buzzed texts, unable to concentrate on a book.) After an hour I walked back home and poured a drink. I've literally had about three sips and feel nothing...the Naltrexone completely blocks the urge to drink. It's just a matter of taking it properly and consistently. In fact, I just sent my psychiatrist PA an overdue e-mail that the meds work (in conjunction with my antidepressant).

Thanks for the reminder that this is nothing to be ashamed of. People can be snarky assholes on here, but it's also nice to know others are dealing with the same challenges. Thanks to everyone on this thread who's offered encouragement and other treatment suggestions as well. Much appreciated!

r31 you literally described me too. I am also in OP's boat. I've surrounded myself with shitty people that I try to please, and I truly don't believe I deserve anything good. How the fuck do I get out of this? It's like I'm stuck in Groundhog Day.

The funny thing is that I am relatively good-looking, kind, and intelligent. I just can't seen to believe I am worth success.

Here's the Big Book, r45:

24 years sober here. It was similar for me, OP. The urges kept coming and I determined I could do nothing about it. Then I screwed over a friend while drunk. I really screwed him. It was then I knew I had to get sober. You have to give yourself over to the admission you have a problem. Check yourself into an addiction treatment ward at a hospital. I refused to admit I was an alcoholic the first few days, after some education and listening to stories of the other patients in the ward, I admitted it on the third day. I was responsible for not taking care of this problem and I had to be responsible for the solution. Once it's set in your mind you don't want to be that person ever again, you've taken a big step toward success. But it has to come from you. You need to work on it. It's not a simple transition. I had to pick up new interests, adjust my daily routine, visit with friends who gave me support. Now every time I see or smell alcohol, those cravings are there, but I just have to remind myself of the person I was when I was drinking. That's all it takes for me, now.

The treatment was covered by my insurance, but I did have a lot of out-of-pocket costs. Paying those off was difficult during the first years, but I know they were well worth the expense now. The money spent for a 12-pack of beer every day then helped me pay those costs.

If you are asking "Why do I drink?", it's the first step you are taking toward recovery. Keep asking yourself that question. You will realize the answer eventually. That's when you know it's time to get to work solving this. Don't be afraid to jump on it.

I used to drink because it made other people more interesting, then that stopped working.

R36, it's easier said than done. I'm in therapy now, but it's going so slow.

I love the H troll. Brill.

It doesn't happen in a predictable way, R51. If it takes five years, let it take five years. We are all at different points in our journey, and we move at our own speed. Trust you ARE making progress.

R48 Thank you ❤️

R49 Thank you, too

Thanks to all of you

Drink and think

R47 Oh honey. Look at your childhood first. If you don’t think there’s anything there, then you may be an introvert in an extroverted world, and that gave you low-self worth just not fitting in to the dominant societal paradigms. You have as much worth as anyone. No one is better than anyone else. Even I know that, and I’ the OP. You need love. And acceptance. I love you. Please be kind to yourself. We all deserve acceptance and support.

For me it was helpful to realize my father basically hated being a father. He is a very dysfunctional person— a nutjob, really. But we were stuck with him when my mom died when we were young.

For a long time, I made all kids of excuses for him. But the truth is, he has never loved another human being and he’s the one with the problem. I could be bitter about the complete lack of parental love, but on the other hand I’m not Darfur orphan. Many people had it worse. My own child has a pretty great life, though not perfect of course.

Confronting the truth that my father is a psychopath allowed me to make my peace with some childhood pain and anger. This takes time— when you are young, you don’t trust your judgment and it’s less painful to think you are the crazy one.

R58 That's so true. It's easier to blame yourself than to stand tall and blame the broken parent. Could not relate more. Then that becomes the default and you will take full blame anytime you have conflict with anyone ever. And never trust your own feelings, observations, assessments or instincts. I apologized for everything all the time to absolve others of their mistakes, to retain my illusions, and to keep the peace. Did it most of my life.

Kudos to you for being so brave in your clear-eyed inventory of your childhood. I hope you find peace.

My mother became a problem drinker after my father died—she may well have been an alcoholic, but none of us ever addressed it. But she had two or three scotches by prime time and it was not pleasant. She could be mean when drunk. Finally she really nasty to my sister one too many times and my sister, a fairly timid person, said “I don’t deserve this” and hung up on her. My mom immediately called me, distraught and copping to the truth of what my sister said. She went to a kindly psychiatrist, who mainly listened to her check in mood and loneliness, and prescribed mild levels of Zoloft and Xanax. My mother, who had been a nurse decades before, was terrified of mixing meds and alcohol, so stopped the alcohol overnight. Trite as it may sound, it was clear that she had been self-medicating with alcohol; so, she may have been trading one form of medication for another, but the latter was monitored monthly and did not cause cirrhosis. She adopted a cat. Alas, she died a year later from a triple play of myeloid dysplasitic syndrome, emphysema, and a stroke, but most of that last year was happier and more peaceful for her. I inherited her cat (my siblings didn’t want her$, in one of our phone calls she said, in remarking on the shift from liquor to meds, “Well at least we know I wasn’t an alcoholic.” I didn’t know what to say—it was the first and only time she recognized her drinking may have been a problem. I made some noises about how glad I was the meds were alleviating her distress, but felt sad to know she had been carrying some unspoken shame for over ten years.

All of which is to say, if my mom could face her drinking at 76, OP, I bet you can. AA, CBT, talk therapy, meds—whatever works for you.. I tried OA at the encouragement of a colleague and I made it through two meetings. I’m not built for such groups. Individual therapy and, later, bariatric surgery were what worked for me (good was my substance of choice). Bariatric surgery is no simple cure-all, but it’s a great kickstart.

The best therapist I ever had was an alcoholic who eventually killed himself. The epitome of the wounded healer—a wonderful healer (alcoholic with multiple DUIS and, I assume other demons) who could not save himself.

Good luck with whatever path you choose.

It says “Drink me!”

[quote]R33 It’s not terrifying, it’s bullshit.

R35, it's not bullshit, but one of a series of quotes from the film, 𝐓𝐡𝐞 𝐒𝐢𝐥𝐞𝐧𝐜𝐞 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐋𝐚𝐦𝐛𝐬 (1991), at R7, R10, and R14. 'H' is supposed to stand for 'Hannibal.' It's why R12's 'Clarice' appreciates it.

Hard to believe so many on this thread don't recognize any of it.

Maybe it is just a bad habit. We all have some bad habits we don't like and wish to quit but couldn't. Don't give yourself too much pressure. Think of it as part of life and cut off alcohol little by little.

In old country, we begin when we learn the potty.

Sure, Jan.

Thanks r57. Your kind words did make me feel a lot better. I hope this thread is helping you as much as it is me :)

R7 and R12, OP is Buffalo Bill.

[quote]AA, CBT, talk therapy, meds—whatever works for you..

Introducing cock and ball torture to this situation doesn't seem like the best idea.

Garden-variety alcoholic. Tedious, very tedious.

^ I meant to sign H.

I heard back from two different AA support people last night via email, after I sent my "emergency--help!" submission through the site that R20 posted. They were both lovely responses, both nudging me towards AA and testifying how AA saved them. But beyond the specific AA rhetoric was the theme that drinking was destructive, and stopping drinking was life-changing. Regardless of what method was used, the act of quitting drinking and purging it out of their lives was a ticket to freedom and happiness, and relief.

So today, in honor of those women who wrote back to me in my moment of despair, and for those of you on DL either maintaining sobriety, or desperately seeking it....I am not going to have a drink. I can always have one tomorrow. One day at a time, right? Today, I can go without. And tomorrow will be tomorrow. I don't need to worry about that right now.

I'll check in later and I'll be honest if I wasn't able to pull it off. But this is good - being accountable to an outside "other" is a big motivator. Talk to you guys later!

^^^ OP ^^^^

ps Have a lovely day xo

[quote] I can always have one tomorrow

After all tomorrow IS another day!

R71 Praying for you! You can do it :)

R74. I did it!!!!

I went all yesterday without a drink. This is major!!!! Kept myself very busy all day. I also made sure my blood sugar didn’t dip in the afternoon, because I have noticed a connection between a 3 pm blood sugar dip and the onset of the alcohol cravings

Most of all, I was determined to come on here today and say “I DID IT, BITCHES!” It can only be the perceived accountability to some presence outside of myself that is making a huge difference in my ability to resist the deeply engrained habitual drinking.

Gonna try it again today.

OP Congratulations!

R76 Aw, thank you. I feel pretty proud today. Cautiously optimistic.

Happy for you, OP. Glad you reported back. Keep posting here.

OP you should honestly look into disulfiram. It's commonly known as Antabuse and it's very effective in the sense that it obviates the decision to drink or not. If you drink you get sick. It's a chemical boost of willpower, as I call it. I'm a pharmacist and have recommended it to several friends who wanted to curtail their drinking.

Naltrexone is what worked for me. A totally different model than AA. But if you are able to stay with AA - great.

Maybe Naltrexone /Sinclair is for the weak-willed like me. But it also relies on the scientific evidence that abstinence breeds craving - and results in more extreme alcoholism. Over a year, the use of naltrexone along with conscious attempts to minimize drinking allowed by brain to be rewired and reduce that subconscious, almost biological mental switch that was connected to drinking. Have gone this year without any drinking - made easier by closures of bars. But I have had zero urge to drink at home and don’t fear myself.

R80 I feel like the cravings do cease with abstinence, but the wiring doesn’t change. So when I stop, it gets easy to forget I used to drink. Until...I start to have a social drink again once in awhile. And then it eventually snowballs again. I guess because that’ll program/ pleasure connection is still wired in there. I’d love to extinguish that wired connection.

But then again, tbh,I don’t know I I am even interested in “moderate drinking” which the Sinclair method is supposed to allow to happen. I kinda just want alcohol out of my life. But of course right now I’m coming from a place of shame and fear around alcohol.

OP, part of "wiring" has to do with patterns. Someone mentioned above that the whole "paraphernalia" portion of drinking / using becomes something familiar & pleasurable (a pattern of pleasure).

IME, you have to start doing different things in combination, create different patterns.

For example: you're bored and lonely --> you drink. You've done that 10,000 times before.

New pattern: you're bored and lonely --> you ____ (something different). Keep doing this until it's a new pattern.

R26 / R46. How are you doing today? Do you take the naltrexone again yesterday? Keep going with it. Let us know how it’s going. I am emboldened by my history yesterday and o keep re-reading this thread, which is making me feel so much more seen. I don’t feel lonely today at all.

You DL peeps are blowing my mind with your insights, compassion and willingness to share your own struggles.

^^^ Typos galore, sorry. Emboldened by my victory ^^^

R82 yes 💯 per cent. Thank you for affirming my hunch. It’s become a strong reflexive habit. Plus quarantining means way more free time and alone time to indulge and solidify the habits. No accountability.

Yesterday I stayed hella busy cooking, cleaning and working on a creative present for a friend. If o can just stay creative during that 3-7 pm window, and well-fed (ie not let my blood sugar drop) I think this is going to become my new normal.

Keep going!

THE REAL QUESHTION ISH :WHY WOULDN'T YOU???

To come off of your Adderall and/or meth at the end of the day, silly!

Seriously though, plenty of drinkers drink heavily because they can't handle their routine amphetamine comedown.

OP, remember the HALT acronym. (Times when you are susceptible to drinking.)

H: Hungry.

A: Angry.

L: Lonely.

T: Tired.

I was in the habit of a couple of vodka tonics at least every other night. After trashing myself on Thanksgiving, I stopped drinking on December 1, just as an experiment. It’s now been 35 days. I’m not going to say I feel so much better, but I’ve stopped feeling bad. I’m also rather proud of myself. I’ve never gone this long dry since college, and I’m old. It sounds ridiculous but every day in my date book I place a little sticker, just those stickers you get when you donate to charity. I find that if I make a dumb game out of something it helps. I have had to find a “mocktail” for myself. I’m currently into diet cranberry juice and sparkling water, like a teenage girl. We’ll see how this goes. When eventually I dine again in a restaurant, I do intend to order a martini and really enjoy it.

Oh and yeah, instead of drinking at 5 o’clock I now eat dinner, which is so much better for sleep and diet and everything else. I do recognize that at that hour I get frantic to have SOMETHING. Once I eat, I’m not interested in booze, since you don’t get a good buzz when you’re full.

Why do you drink?

You're a drunk.

Accept it and get outside help. Don't ask the drunks here, because they'll just tell you it's someone else's problem.

R89 I love this! H.A.L.T. Gonna post it on my fridge. It's so accurate.

R91 Yep. I would get a glycemic dip in the afternoon because I was hungry, usually because I was skipping lunch. Then, instead of eating to alleviate my low blood sugar, I would start to drink. The ritual became: get to the point where my stomach was empty and my brain was crying for calories, and then grab a drink and get a buzz going quickly. I might have then eaten later on, but it would be like at 10 or 11 pm, which only added to my fog the next day, not to mention I've put on probably 10-15 lbs since the virus began.

So yesterday and today I've been snacking and loading up on protein all day. The "dip" didn't happen today. And so even though this is within my typical "window" of craving, I feel like I could not care less about having a drink. In fact it sounds bad to think of putting alcohol on top of the power protein smoothie I just drank.

R92 I don't think I'm a "drunk." I think I have poor habits for coping with stress, habits I learned young. Habits I have to finally accept don't work, never worked, and will never work. It's time to let go of the fucking charade. I can do it.

During this pandemic, me reaching out to DL was my way of "getting outside support." I was fantasizing about going to a clinic or even to in-person AA meeting just to jumpstart things. But the virus is preventing some of those classic options from feeling accessible. Most people on this thread have given invaluable advice and support. Today is my second day, so something about having simply created this thread is working. Something about feeling accountable to this thread, as ridiculous as that sounds, is working. I'm not a tree falling in the forest with no one around to hear it. So thanks, everyone! I know I'm relying on DL a lot right now, and I am probably annoying as hell. But I appreciate you all for reading my posts and sharing your stories and advice.

If ever there were a day to validate having a drink or five, it's today, with all the insanity in DC right now. But that really would be merely an act of taking out on our own bodies the betrayal of Trump on the American people. It's a stressful, disappointing situation, but it is not our fault, and I'm not going to hurt myself because of someone else's awful actions.

[quote] I was skipping lunch. Then, instead of eating to alleviate my low blood sugar, I would start to drink. The ritual became: get to the point where my stomach was empty and my brain was crying for calories, and then grab a drink and get a buzz going quickly. I might have then eaten later on, but it would be like at 10 or 11 pm, which only added to my fog the next day

I have the same ritual, except when I make sure to eat at lunchtime and perhaps have a snack at 4 or 4.30pm. I know what to do: eat lunch; but I don't always do it because I want to drink. I have to conclude that not all of me wants to stop drinking.

R97. Yes. Same with me. I clearly could recognize, in the moment, that I had that choice - eat, or go buy alcohol. It was a clear moment and a clear choice. And I would go get the alcohol.

Maybe you don't have the same heavy shame debt that I've been carrying? When/if you get to that point that you are walking around with shame and guilt every day, you will be more motivated. Cuz it's very hard to stop without a pretty compelling reason.

Second day down, in bed laptopping, no booze in the house. Loving this feeling of safety that I feel.

^^^ OP ^^^

Keep going OP.

You need AA. And a therapist if you can afford one. But mainly AA. (I dont have issues with alcohol or drugs but I've joined a different 12 step program)

Part of your problem is that you are trying to figure out why, like you can discover the root, rip it out, and fix yourself. That's not how it works. That's how it works in movie psychology. Not in real life. Join AA before your life is destroyed. it will get there.

I'm with you, OP. On day 3. Following this thread - keep updating! I'm just off the gym. Allowing myself to eat whatever at the moment, but no booze. I'm ok for now, but it's when the cravings come....

R101 Why doesn't it work that way in real life? Not trying to be snarky. I'm really curious. It seems like you should be able to heal issues at the root. But I also kind of understand what you are saying. It's confusing.

R102 YAY!!! Partners in crime! Happy for you.

I have been reading a lot about the amino acid l-glutamine. It's supposed to stop alcohol and sugar cravings. I'm curious to try it although I haven't had cravings today. But I'm only on day 2, and it would be arrogant of me to think I won't ever have a craving just because I have not had a drink in two days.

L-Glutamine looks interesting.

OP, you described my relationship with alcohol perfectly. I see alcohol as a reward. I need to convince myself that it is a poison and not a reward.

R11 One time I was able to quit drinking by imagining a skull and crossbones every time I craved a drink. I'd think of the cocktail or the bottle of wine and visualize the skull or the word "poison" over the image. It actually worked, if only because it reminded me to shift out of exactly the mindset your are talking about - "mmm candy yummy!" mode -- and back to reality -- this shit is poison to me.

Just that extra few seconds of seeing behind the curtain helped me stop myself before I gave in to the urge. I forget how long I stopped drinking doing that, but it did help for awhile.

I see it as a reward too, r106. I think you've posted that here before r107, and I used that visualisation when I quit last year. Another person said to imagine it's straight ethanol that you're drinking.

The strange thing is that even writing about this makes me want to drink.

I have had eating disorders all of my adult life. I have lived the same way with food. I would binge even though it made me feel disgusting and guilty when I did. It was temporary satisfaction. Then I’d end up vomiting all of it back out. I was so unhealthy at one point my hair was falling out and I was anemic. Thankfully I’m a lot better now after getting help. Addiction is a bitch.

Just checking in. Today is Day 3. I got very poor sleep last night because of the drama in DC and I haven’t eaten yet today. I’m picking up food right now and it would be SO easy to go grab a bottle of something. So instead I’m doing a check in with you guys to stay accountable. I hope you are all doing well today.

OP, I had a hard time sleeping as well. I thought it was because I had caffeine late in the day.

Anyway, good that you checked in.

I'm on day 7 OP. I've had a few strong cravings but just ate something so they would pass. Keep on keepin' on!

You're a lush, darlin'.

Day 37 for me. Another sticker in my datebook. I’m a good boy!

R114 You sure are! You get a big lollipop at day 40.

R112 Thank you. And great job! Proud of you.

R111 Caffeine keeps me up too. Also though, yesterday was CRAZY.

R110 the sleeping should get easier after a few weeks. Then it gets amazing as you will realize that drunk sleep wasn’t really sleep.

R118 I have read that you don't go into certain phases of sleep when you have alcohol in your system. That is...really not good. Sleep is like liquid gold, so precious.

before i went to AA i went online to soberrecovery.com. Very helpful especially when not leaving the house and also for counting the hours and days, not months and years early on!

[quote] [R118] I have read that you don't go into certain phases of sleep when you have alcohol in your system. That is...really not good. Sleep is like liquid gold, so precious.

R119, I noticed that when I used to drink, I could probably fall asleep easier, but it was harder to stay asleep.

Cause it's fun?

Today is Day 4. If I could get through yesterday without succumbing, then Magic Is Real, kids. I was really sleep deprived, stressed by the political unrest, had crazy low blood sugar, extreme work pressure, back ached. And then during the Window of Habitual Drinking, I was out in my car, empty stomach and no one to tell me "no, do not go to the liquor store." And somehow, I held my ground.

Anyone who is struggling, please come on here and let us hold you accountable. It is really working for me. I may even start a new thread for that exact purpose. Like an "accountability" thread. Or is that crazzzzzy dorky?

Congrats OP. If you can get through this week without drinking, I think you have a good shot at making it stick. I suggest you keep this thread as your accountability thread. There is a lot of good information and inspiration in this thread.

Three weeks, OP. That's how long it takes to form a new habit, they say. Whether it's proven or not, I have decided it's true. Therefore after three weeks of a diet or abstinence or a new routine, whatever, it kicks in with me and I really feel it. So just tell yourself - three weeks!

R125 Yesssss. I've heard that. Thank you! It's very true that at some point, the NOT drinking becomes the habit, and it feels really foreign to even consider drinking. I remember those times. Don't know how I slipped back into drinking, but oh well. That was then, this is now.

Day 4, done. I'm in bed for the night.

Hope everyone is doing good. Another crazy news day. Not nearly as stressful ,though.

^^^ OP ^^^

Day 5 in da house! How is everyone doing today?

Question: Is it normal to feel pain in the joints? Am I detoxing? I'm having a lot of random stabbing pains everywhere. My neck, shoulders and back are killing me. And I feel like maybe a kidney is aching? Lower right, sort of in the back. I thought I would feel totally invigorated by now. I used to feel amazing quite quickly after stopping drinking. Now that i'm almost 50 maybe it's a slower healing process? Any insights would be appreciated. I'm not going to stop but....yeah, I thought I would feel amazing by now.

It doesn't sound right that you should be feeling like that, OP. Maybe you should consult with a medical professional.

R129 My only theory is that maybe without alcohol I am experiencing the effects of all the anxiety and stress that I was previously drinking away. Anxiety/stress = tight, aching muscles? Is been a very stressful week for our country, maybe I'm more stressed than I even realize.

The kidney ache is more perplexing. I hope it's not a kidney infection. That would be quite ironic, after going through the process of getting sober to be more healthy. If it keeps hurting, or the stabby pains keep stabbing, I guess I will need to go see someone. Ugh

OP, All I know is It happened to me. I hate alcohol, hate it. If I could have received anxiety meds I would never touched it. The feeling with me was I had to end the pressure. Had to feel tne click in my head thats released the unbearable pressure. It was like releasing air from some over inflated balloon. It harmed me , my health, my relationships, my dignity. When I said no more, I really thought my days would always be spent craving it. It was shockingly easy. A relief. No more sick hangovers. I have never wanted it again. I wish I had the confidence in myself sooner. You can do it. Don't allow the fear of quitting stop you. It is a mind fuck that addiction does to us. Good luck dear, and hugs to you.

R130, I understand your theory about a deluge of anxiety now that you're not drinking. But you're saying you can't explain away the kidney part, so you should get that looked at. My health insurance provides an after-hours / weekend phone service. Maybe you can call this weekend and explain your symptoms.

My anxiety and insomnia increases as alcohol leaves my system. It takes a few weeks for my body to get into sync. Hang in there.

I last drank on the 23rd and was horribly hung over on the 24th.

R131 I hear ya, friend! Curious how you ended up dealing with your anxiety once you gave up alcohol. Because I'm assuming it was still there waiting for you to attend to it in a different way. What worked?

R132 Well, now I'm thinking it's just part of the general constellation of pains. Like maybe pain is being referred from my neck and shoulders down through my back to that area. Right now I'm feeling a slight spasming of the muscle in that area. Not fun, but probably not kidney disease. Hopefully what R133 wrote is all that is happening right now. A readjustment period. I hope that's all it is. Cuz I'm tightening up all through my neck, shoulders and back. And even scrunching up my toes and clenching my jaws. Tension everywhere.

Not gonna fucking drink though!

OP, I finaly received medical care . I was diagnosed with PTSD, depression, panic attacks. My ex-husband was a 6ft 6 bipolar nightmare. He threw me out of a moving vehicle, slammed my head into walls. It was brutal. I am a very small, skinny person. He was deadly violent. The worse part was he was 2 different people and you never knew when the monster would appear. It was dangerous to leave him. He said he would kill my baby , then me. I had to plan our escape very carefully. I told him I needed help with our daughter, who was a preemie on a apnea monitor. I need my mom. So I left that motherfucker and everything I owned, took my girl and never looked back. I had no idea I was in such bad shape. It was such a relief for my baby to be safe that I thought I would be ok now. Nurses are known to be stubborn as hell about needing help. Lol. I o not know why. Much love to you.

R136 Oh my God. What a complete nightmare and living hell. I have heard about how having a baby has been the impetus for leaving an abusive marriage, but that then the stakes are even higher because of the child. I am so glad you got away!

Since this is an anonymous forum, would you be willing to share which meds have helped you? I have PTSD from childhood stuff, and have never found a med yet that really stuck and put me in long-term remission (and yes, I've done years of therapy as well, which has made me a more grounded, level-headed person, but has not removed the hypervigilance piece). Lamictal worked for six months. Best six months of my adult life. Then it pooped out. SSRIs have too many side effects. I have never been prescribed benzos except in the short-term for immediate relief, or for occasional sleeplessness. Never as a daily lifestyle maintenance therapy. And I understand why, because of the potential for addiction and abuse. But...the older I get, the worse the generalized anxiety gets. I need to find something that works consistently, so I can "set it and forget it" and live my life.

detoxing from alcohol has very real side effects. That is why many heavy drinkers go into a medical detox facility to avoid dangerous stiatuaions and be under watch while going thru it.

detoxing from alcohol has very real side effects. That is why many heavy drinkers go into a medical detox facility to avoid dangerous situations and be under watch while going thru it.

R139 Ok I just looked it up. You are right. I definitely don't think I falll into the hardcore lifelong alcoholic category, but... For maybe two years now it's been chronic, I was drinking practically every single day, from moderate to heavy consumption. And then it got even MORE intense at certain points during this pandemic to where I was waking up and starting my drinking without even eating. (OMG, I can't believe I was doing that -- it sounds barbaric to me right now. Shit.)

It's saying that alcohol artificially manipulates GABA levels (the neurotransmitter that produces relaxation and calm). And it looks like once you take the alcohol away, you brain has downregulated GABA receptors to the point where one is going to have very low GABA levels when they quit drinking. And low GABA = anxiety, insomnia and muscle tension. Makes a lot of sense.

Also says dehydration must be addressed with electrolytes. And dehydration itself can cause muscle contractions. Oh boy, guess I gotta dig out my Emergen-C packets from the closet. Maybe I've been taking this whole quitting drinking thing a little too casually.

BTW this is Day 5 of abstinence.

[quote]And it looks like once you take the alcohol away, you brain has downregulated GABA receptors to the point where one is going to have very low GABA levels when they quit drinking. And low GABA = anxiety, insomnia and muscle tension.

I didn’t know that, but it sounds right to me. I don’t feel that I’m 100% there mentally/emotionally like I was before drinking, and although I’ve gotten a bit better, there does seem to be some permanent damage. Hard to quantify, but that’s just how I feel 1.5 years into recovery. But when I think about how much I drank and for how long, then I feel lucky I didn’t do even more damage.

If you'd spent 7 of the past 9 months in effective lockdown as we have in the North-West of England drinking would be the least of your issues. Try 'why do I want to get up tomorrow with no end in sight'.

It'll be almost a year when the current phase ends and we can't be certain much will be open then.

R143 Yes I'm in New England in the US and we've been in various phases of lockdown since, I reckon, mid-March.

R142 "Different brain regions heal at different paces, including the thinking part of the brain that need longer to recover."

Aches and pains of all sorts are normal when abstaining. I would give it a month before worrying about anything. The anxiety of worry about your health is just part of the general return of anxiety and nerves resulting from eliminating the sedative and cleansing your body. It eventually settles into a new normal - without the roller coaster you’ve been used to.

R146 Thanks for this info. Day 6 and I don't intend to stop now.

OP I was prescribed 3 mg xanax a day and effexor. As someone mentioned up thread these antidepressant meds can and do have lethal side effects. Later I was prescribed Wellbutrin. I am lucky it did cause a stoke. Anger, rage at everything. The bezo's are dangerous to stop taking. No matter how carefully you lower the dose , you can go into a seizure. Never stop a benzo without a doctors care.À It depends on the patient needs. Just always be under a competent doctors care . Also, loneliness can be another reason for drinking. Nothing is worse than the hell of alcoholism. Nothing. It is very insidious. You are only drinking socially for a time. Before you realize it, it has you by the throat. You can do it and will be damn glad you did. Please get help if you need to. If you like weed, edibles, it can help with anxiety, but know what you are getting. It can also cause paranoia, panic attacks, heart attack in some people. Every drug has risks and side effects. The thing to do is get treatment and advice from competent people. Very proud that you are seeking help. There is no doubt that you can do this. Much love and luck to you!

OP, are you that alcoholic lesbian who’s obsessed with autistic people?

R148 omg thank you, and back at you!

R148 omg thank you, and back at you!

R150 LMAO no I’m for sure not that person

R150 LMAO no I’m for sure not that person

Try going to AA meetings.

DAY 6. On the one hand, I had to go look up which day I'm on, cuz I've just been looking straight ahead, moving forward with this new lifestyle. But on the other hand, I just had the worst cravings since I quit. About an hour ago it came on so strong I could practically smell the booze in my nostrils. I don't know what kept me from succumbing to it; there is nothing stopping me from going to the liquor store right now, except for this new habit-muscle that I'm flexing. And this thread. So anyway, I ended up eating a third of a jar of cashew butter. I had some celery sticks and I just went to town dipping them in the jar of cashew butter until I was stuffed. It occurred to me that I had not eaten much today and that this is an ongoing theme. I'm full now, but I still am romanticizing the idea of going and getting a bottle of Prosecco. But the reality is, I am not going to do it. I'm sick of being grabbed by the balls and squeezed. Fuck you, booze.

R155, I can guarantee you that you would have felt shitty had you started drinking.

Also, I hope you are now saving $$$ by not spending it on alcohol. Use it on something else or start a savings.

I say go ahead and eat a little more if you need to right now, OP, to get through this. You'll settle down in time.

R156 Yes I finally have the ability to have forethought and go "I will regret it if I buckle and drink. I will feel bad physically, and I will feel even worse mentally." That is a BIG deal to have that moment of forethought. As for the money, I guess I hadn't thought of that. I'm sort of scared to do the math because I'd have to face how much money I drank away in 2020, which is going to be a depressing figure.

Thank you for your support.

R157 You were right, thank you! I just had a bunch of trail mix, and a very satisfying pomegranate seltzer. Seltzer is magical. It really fills that need for something crisp and sparkling. I feel complete now. No cravings.

Day Six done and done. In bed for the night.

I really hope someone else is getting something out of this besides myself. It feels so decadent or narcissistic to come on here every day and give my little updates. But it's seriously working for me, so thanks to all of you!

I do hope, though, that someone else can get something out of this, too. Just to see, hey, see? You CAN quit.

Seltzer with a squeeze of lemon or lime over ice is good for me too. When I stopped drinking for a sober January years ago, I would only drink soda with a lime and splash of cranberry when I went out to bars with friends. It was a treat which is weird. I felt so great back then when I woke up in the morning. I am sick of drinking now too. So over the extra weight I carry. Glad you are doing well, you sound strong and I am sending you good thoughts of sticking to your goals.

Hi everybody! Today is the one-week anniversary of starting this thread. Pretty cool, huh? God, what a week to stop drinking, too. Jeeeeeeez. Anyway, I hope you all have a lovely day (as much as possible for a Monday).

OP While intense, the cravings will subside usually within 30 minutes, give or take. Having things to do really helps.

IF for some odd reason you do drink, keep this thread going so as to analyze that scenario and how you would feel about it , since this is completely anonymous anyway.

R162 I’ve been throwing myself into making arts and crafts (Mary!). It’s definitely helping me stay busy. And keeping up with the news is a full-time job right now, too, even though it’s very disturbing and stressful.

Day 42 for me. No real desire to drink. Very pleased.

R165 I am so happy for you! Keep moving forward.

Worst craving yet. I am not sure what is even stopping me right now from going down the street and buying some booze. I threw some potatoes in the oven but that takes and hour and I could leave the house, it's not like they are boiling in a pot and I have to watch them. I am trying to remember all the good feelings and the pride and relief I felt when I have quit in the past.

The difference between then and now, though, is that I wasn't cooped up in my house alone for days on end. I was in a long-term relationship and that person needed me to be the best version of me that I could be. I was also interfacing with the human race. I had places to go. I had co-workers and friends that I was seeing regularly. I felt like I wanted to present a better version of myself to these people. I felt more "seen." I had something to prove.

This time, I don't have any reasons, except that there is a me that is bearing witness to myself, and that part of me has decided "I don't like this version of you. It's gross. You're acting like a loser. You're complaining of feeling depressed but you are drinking a depressant every day. Sort yourself out." But I am also very aware right now, that no one would care, or even know, if I were to drink tonight. I'm in a vacuum because of this virus, and because I'm single.

I thought the clouds would part and the sun would come out and the angels would sing. I don't feel suddenly super energetic and healthy. I feel slightly less tired and foggy, but I'm still low energy, I am still dealing with seasonal sadness, and I'm still "aching in places where I used to play," as Leonard Cohen once sang.

I'm probably not going to drink tonight. Cuz inertia. But I'm also not feeling any kind of self-righteous pleasure from sticking to my guns. It's just....blah.

R167 ..sounds about right

It took me several "go's" of quitting and then starting ,then quitting then starting before the madness of all that sent me over the cliff . I began to realize i truly was "powerless" over alcohol no matter what i tried. Ultimately i had to succumb to some or most of the principles of AA to lay a groundwork of living without alcohol and eventually became neutral to it. Wasn't easy but am so grateful that monkey is off my back

R168 What are some of the principles you live by? Besides admitting to your powerlessness? I'm being sincere here.

R168 and other AA'ers. How do I do these things (see below)? Is it a specific technique? Because I have prayed many times over the past months for my "Higher Power" to take the cravings out of me, to direct me out of my addiction onto the path of sobriety, to soothe me, to guide me. I even would stop, for three days, five days. And then start again when an irresistible urge would take over my thinking and tell me that it was going to make me feel good if I could have a few drinks.

I don't understand what else I am supposed to do. I believe in a higher power. It just didn't feel like anything alchemical was happening, or had any longevity at least, when I prayed for guidance and prayed for help. Literally the only thing that is helping is this thread. So I'm pretty sad about that. I don't feel particularly "guided" or "buouyed" by a higher presence at the moment.

-------------

We admitted we were powerless over alcohol—that our lives had become unmanageable

Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity

Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him

Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves

Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character

Humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings

it just more or less Golden rules kind of stuff. When i drank i was selfish and self centered and either hungover or anticipating the next drink. I would get drunk and cheat on my partner, i would avoid some family functions because i was too shit faced or knew booze was not going to be available and was generally cranky at work from feeling like shit most of the time. I am more "out of self" and do for others , but i am retired now so i have the time . I retired early in fact as i knew it would be difficult to stay stopped while still working . Its just better now and am really too old (63) to be carrying on like that. Typically men my age that drink like i did will die in their 50's or 60's. but its been a lifetime battle. Don 't get me wrong, it was a ton of fun back in the early days but i still consumed way too much from the get go. it just creeps up on you as you age and difficulties with health, relationships , work ,etc., start to develop "out of nowhere"

[quote] I was in a long-term relationship and that person needed me to be the best version of me that I could be.

OP, must have been nice ... for the other person. You should want the best version of yourself ... for yourself.

[quote] I thought the clouds would part and the sun would come out and the angels would sing.

No, that's what happens after the first drink. Unfortunately, ten more drinks follow that first drink.

Welcome to the adult world, OP. You can do this.

R172 No I thought the clouds would part and the angels would sing when I QUIT a week ago.

[quote] I don't understand what else I am supposed to do. I believe in a higher power. It just didn't feel like anything alchemical was happening ... when I prayed for guidance and prayed for help.

You don't always get answers or help immediately. All you can do is throw it out there and ask for help. If you go to the gym, you don't expect your biceps to immediately bulge out of your shirt sleeves.

I've been through this, too, OP. Wanting this immediate-type gratification is part of why you get dependent on stuff in the first place.

I feel like I might be making people mad here and that is not my intent. I've struggled as well.

R172. Yes. It should be that I'm doing this for me ,and not to please others or prove something to others. That's a huge lesson I'm still trying to learn, and I'm almost 50. But the main thing I would want for myself, from this, is to physically feel a whole lot better physically and mentally. And I really don't feel that different yet. I still feel kind of unwell, physically. I think I may be depressed because of seasonal affective stuff, and/or because of the virus, and/or or because of the political upheaval. But regardless, I quit drinking a week ago, and I don't yet feel much of a lift from that lifestyle upgrade.

R174 I'm not mad at all. I'm so grateful to have anyone spelling anything out to me right now. I appreciate the time you are taking to even type these things to me. And I'm hearing you. It's not instant rainbows.

OP, don't forget to drink water. I can almost guarantee you that, in a couple of months, you will look in the mirror and say: "My skin looks better."

R176 And my brain goes straight to "Who gives a shit about if my skin looks better? No one. I am alone all the time and no one cares." Which is both true, but also makes me think I've been medicating an underlying depression that I have not addressed yet. A kind of worthlessness. "Who the fuck even cares if I'm healthy? It's meaningless. We all die." That sort of thinking.

Stinkin' Thinkin'!!!!!

Let go and let GOD!!!!!!!

Cigarettes & Coffee!!!!!

Pray to JESUS!!!!!!!!!

R178 AA troll?

Ok this is making sense to me. Perhaps the other times I quit drinking, I wasn’t depressed? I was just drinking regularly, but still sort of upbeat within myself? So when I stopped, I didn’t have any underlying depression weighing me down, and I I felt better sooner.

I think the code has been cracked! Now...what to do about the depression, when the way things are right now is legitimately depressing?

This OP is pulling over one big EST on y'all.

Maybe if he quit posting DOZENS of replies on every single Trump thread, he might have an actual life.

But, instead, he pretends to be an "alcoholic," in order to get attention.

KEEP COMING BACK! IT WORKS IF YOU WERK IT!

Update: Did not drink. It's that damn WINDOW. 3 to 7 pm. Thanks to all who messaged me during my hour of need. I really mean it, I probably would have EASILY given in if I didn't have this thread.

You are supposed to take actions connected to the steps to show a sponsor that you did them. Or not, depending on who you get.

The principles of honesty, openness, self-examination, and service to something larger than yourself, is what the steps are supposed to lead to. If you are asked to do something that is not related to those things==run away.

No Tuesday check in from OP. How you doing OP?

The photos of my friend, Mark, drinking and enjoying himself drove the OP of this EST back to the bottle.

R186 Oh hey, hi! How sweet are you?

Well... I must be phasing into a new normal, because I didn't think to post yesterday. It's Day 9. Staying the course. Weary from the political stuff. Trying to unplug from it, but keep getting sucked back in. The weirdest thing is that I have all of this pain running through my neck and my back every day, for about five days now. I made a doctor's appointment. I can't imagine a "detoxing" thing, but what do I know, maybe it is? Or maybe it's anxiety. Other than that, I still think about drinking, but it's getting easier and easier to ignore the thoughts. I love you for checking in on me. Hope you are doing well today, too.

R183 Thank you that all makes sense. "honesty, openness, self-examination, and service to something larger than yourself" -- I think I was doing those already, which LED to me choosing to STOP drinking. So I guess that's good. Good news.

UPDATE: I threw my cigarettes out this morning because I suspected that is what is behind all of this body pain I've been experiencing. Inflammation or something. I only started up again, after years and years of not smoking, because I got so BORED during the pandemic. The problem was that smoking is not pleasurable to me without alcohol. And alcohol did not as fun without smoking. It was a two-pronged addictive dopamine bomb. And now, without alcohol to mask the gross smell and tase and feelings of cigarettes, I can gauge much more clearly how poorly smoking makes me feel.

Now that I've eliminated the alcohol, the smoking had weaned itself down to between three and four cigs a day. But I was having all of this unexplained pain. So, I threw out my remaining American Spirits this morning. And you know what? All of the cramping, stabby, arthritic pains are, in fact, receding. It's like magic. I feel this sense of well-being washing over me, in my body and in my brain. I think this was the missing ingredient to finally accessing the feel-good chemicals of sobriety.

That’s great, op. I’m on day 42 or 43, and I no longer have the Pavlovian urge to drink at 5 PM. It’s truly gone away, even when I consciously ponder it. I just make dinner instead. And I feel pretty good.

I’ve been dry 14 days. I want to start working out again to lose my Covid weight gain, but I’m still drained and tired most of the time. I usually have to dry out for a month before my energy levels feel normal.

You’re an alcoholic, Mabel. Go to bed.

R192 That's good to hear. I was expecting to feel more energetic immediately but yeah, maybe it will take a few weeks. Although, I notice that I'm cleaning my kitchen every day now, and cooking too. And the laundry is getting done all the time now, too. So I think I have more functionality in that way. But like you, I'm waiting to feel really energetic so I can start working out.

R191 "Pavlovian" is exactly right! It's conditioning. I had this window from 3 pm to 7 pm and that's when the urges have hit me since I quit. And if I sweat it out, by 7:30 pm I can't even remember why I wanted to drink. But it was the conditioning.

Vitamin B1 (thiamine) reduces cravings. It helped my alcoholic brother.

R196 That is awesome information, thank you!

I was looking at my "Ignored" stuff and noticed there was someone who I already had on ignore, that posted on this thread so I never saw it. And he basically called the thread an EST. I'm scratching my head now, because to me, someone grappling with trying to quit drinking, IN JANUARY OF THE NEW YEAR, NO LESS, is one of the least "elaborate" stories in the known universe. It's a tale as old as time. So....yeah. Not an EST. Just a flawed human trying to get my life to a healthier, happier place, like millions before me. Reaching out to others anonymously for support, again, not for a hunger for "attention" but to create a system of accountability for myself during a global pandemic. Anonymous reaching out for support is a cornerstone of, oh, ya know...AA.

And apparently it's working, cuz:

Day 10 of no drinking Day 2 of no smoking

What the fuck is an EST?

R199 EST = “Elaborate Scenario Troll/Thread “

Quitting drinking in January is not so elaborate of a scenario as to beggar belief, IMHO. But ok.

Just to keep track, if even for my own self, this is Day 11 no drinking, and Day 3 no smoking. At the two week mark of sobriety, I will abandon this thread. This has worked so well for me. I'm very grateful that it worked. Still kind of can't believe it. Today is the best I've felt in forever. No smoking, too. I just felt wonderful today, physically and mentally.

OP, can't believe you quit smoking, too! Quitting smoking was really hard for me. Now, you've gotta be saving even more $$$. If you're now paying more attention to your food (cooking) and caring about a clean house, that proves you are on the right track.

R202 When I wasn't smoking for the 18 years I was free of it, before the pandemic drove me back into the arms of cigarettes, I would have dreams occasionally that I had started up again. Then I'd wake up so freaked out! But then I felt this huge sense of relief that it was just a dream. Because quitting is SUCH A BITCH. Even though I only smoked for 11 months this time, it felt like I was waking up in one of my old "nightmares" of having started again, except it was reality. So many failed attempts in the past several months, leading up to the miracle of success. Drinking and the smoking support each other like tea and toast. I am sure the quitting drinking is the thing that has allowed me to let go of the smoking. Needless to say, I'm elated. Still craving nicotine but I no longer feel like a disempowered person, which has completely alleviated the depression that I was existing in this whole pandemic. I see all of my healthy choices and options now and it all sounds fun and exciting instead of boredom-inducing. Which is what healthy actions feel like when you are addicted to unhealthy things.

Day 12 no booze

Day 4 no smoking

Day 13 No booze

Day 5 No cigs

Whaaaa??? Did I really type that?

Feeling clear. No depression whatsoever. No lethargy. No anxiety. Just a feeling of calm normality. I feel in control. Grounded. Mature. Normal. I like this person. I’m realizing that my habitual use of toxic substances was creating an imbalance in my neurochemistry and generating a feeling of ill-health, sadness and worry. And shame. So many painful emotions. But then I would double down on the substances in order to escape from the anxiety and sadness that the substances were causing! I’m sure it’s a tale as old as time, but you have to come out the other side to see it. When you are in it, you can’t see how much of your pain and shame is being self-inflicted. You want to protect the addictions, so you skew reality (“I must have low-T or a thyroid issue and that’s what is making me feel sick and exhausted all the time”; or “I’m sad because of the pandemic, we’re all drinking more because of the pandemic, so it’s ok even though I feel like shit every day” etc etc). I finally had to call bullshit on the whole affair when all of my myriad hormone, thyroid, iron, liver, metabolic, etc test results came back NORMAL.

I had to finally get sick enough of my own lies and whining and helplessness that I was willing to admit that I was doing this all to myself. All of the fatigue, the depression, the anxiety spikes, the malaise... I was generating it all by abusing alcohol and by picking smoking back up. The shame that engulfed me this past year was, I see now, connected to the bullshit lies I was always telling myself, and to the false front I worked so hard to portray to others. This false mask of “I’m totally fine, my drinking is manageable, I’m not even slurring my speech right now. This is all totally normal and not spiraling out of control. “. I maintained that facade for a long, long time. I was so skilled at hiding addictions that it became lonely. It was this burdensome dirty secret that only I knew. Secrets = shame. It’s insane that no one in my life could even detect how bad things really were. They still don’t know.

My friend is in AA and we were hanging out during my worst phase of drinking, and he STILL insists I’m not a “real” addict and that I was never out of control. Ha! I was often drinking my breakfast, lunch and dinner and then eating crappy junk at 11 pm. I just got superstore good at acting.

[quote] My friend is in AA and we were hanging out during my worst phase of drinking, and he STILL insists I’m not a “real” addict and that I was never out of control.

OP, you're sounding better and better. You don't have to commit vehicular homicide in order to quit drinking. Don't listen to this kind of BS.

Well...shit. I slipped.

Six hours ago I was feeling clean, happy, and in control. But I just slipped. And yes, I know exactly why I slipped. It's because I haven't eaten all day. I stupidly doubled-down on my (low) daily dose of Adderall this morning because I was going to be very busy with family today, and I got poor sleep last night. Not the right way to use Adderall but that's what I did. And then it killed my appetite dead. And I totally forgot about the concept of food, all day. Around six pm I found myself driving a relative home. During "The Window" of when I used to drink every day. As soon as I dropped them off, I had the urge to buy alcohol and cigarettes. It hijacked my brain so hard and so fast that I didn't care about all the progress I've made, or how good I've been feeling, or consequences, or anything. I knew exactly what I was throwing away, and I Did. Not. Care.

I bought a single can of Gin and Tonic canned cocktail. I commend myself that had the presence of mind not to buy the four-pack. I bought one small can of 12% alcohol Gin and Tonic and a pack of American Spirits. Instead of food. I sat in my car in my driveway and drank the cocktail slowly. And I smoked three cigarettes. Then I realized that my relative forgot something in my car and I needed to go back and drop off their forgotten item. I sat awhile longer, and when I determined that I was not buzzed and I was okay to drive, I headed back to their house, ten minutes away. Sure enough, even though I was basically in full command of my faculties, I felt the same old sense of hiding, of acting, of holding back that was my daily existence prior to 13 days ago. I was hyper-aware of if I smelled like smoke or booze. I had shoved three sticks of gum in my mouth and spritzed cologne all over my clothes and hands before I went back over there but I still felt like I was "acting." I did eat a pear at their house. I didn't want it but I forced myself to eat it.

After I succumbed, it would have been soooooo easy to go back and buy more booze and just give in totally to the slip. But to my credit, I drove myself straight back home. But not before pouring bottled water all over the rest of the pack of cigarettes and throwing them in a trash can downtown. So they are out of the picture now. I am home. There is no booze and no cigarettes in my house. I just feel toxic now. I have a faint ringing in my ears. I feel that weird buzzy feeling in my brain of when you have a drink without food, and it's not enough to get a happy buzz but enough to make you feel sort tired and sad. Kind of like when you take too long of a nap, and when you wake up you feel ennui instead of refreshed. I'm really feeling the low-blood sugar now, too. I still have not fully addressed that, because the Adderall erased my appetite completely today, and nothing sounds good to eat, even 12 hours later from when I took it this morning.

I was going to stop this thread tomorrow at Day 14, too. Ha. Well, I'm very grateful that I caught myself early on in the slip tonight, but I do feel sort of scuzzy right now. I am not going to beat myself up. I know this happens to a lot of people early on, and that I'm only human, and that it's not a matter of black/white, win/lose, success/failure. Maintaining sobriety is an ongoing process. I just cannot believe that I felt so good and so clear six hours ago, wrote that whole philosophical novel at R2014.... and now I feel so yuck. I am not interesting in creating a dramatic narrative around this lapse. I just feel disappointed. I have to stay vigilant from here on out or I will lose whatever trust I have accrued in myself.

So here's my big question: Do I start over with my daily count? Is tomorrow Day 1 again? Or...can I continue tomorrow at Day 14 and allow the slip to be part of the timeline, without feeling like I am going back totally to square one?

R205 Your message was so lovely today. It made me feel really good and I am embarrassed now. Ugh.

OP, yes, you start at Day 1 again. You said you hadn't eaten all day. Remember HALT (Hungry, Angry, Lonely, Tired). Get some hard-boiled eggs, string cheese, bananas, whatever. Have those things on hand.

OP, try to look at it this way.

Even though you drank 1 out of the past 14 days, you have still reduced your drinking by 93%! That is an amazing accomplishment.

Each non-drinking day you add will improve your stats even more.

I think it’s very important to dwell on your accomplishments in addition to being aware of what caused the slip.

All-or-nothing thinking causes so many problems. Don’t let your brain go there.

Sending you good thoughts.

r1 that sounds like me and overeating

R208 Day 1 again?? Nooooooooooo!!!!!!

Ugh. Ok. And yes HALT. HALT!!! I blew it so completely today with the HALT. What I also realized was, besides the sheer stupidity of forgetting to eat, I think I was feeling trepidation, because I had family in my home all weekend. It was such a warm, happy and lively vibe. And then suddenly it is a cold dark Sunday evening, and I was driving my last relative home. I knew subconsciously that I was going to go back home to a quiet, empty house. So maybe that was another trigger. When my family was here this weekend, I didn't think about smoking or drinking. And I ate. A lot!

R209 Thank you, that does make me feel a lot better. It puts things in perspective. I wish I could get rid of this throbbing headache. It feels like I irritated my whole brain, or at least my sinuses, with the cigarette smoke and that one Gin and Tonic. I am still pretty darn proud of myself that I didn't double down on the slip and go buy more booze after the first drink. And I am still way healthier than I was 13 days ago. Thank you so much for keeping me grounded in reality. Honestly, thanks xo

It's 6:15 am. I've been up all night with a migraine. Wide awake. Because of one small cocktail and three cigarettes that I had nine hours ago Play stupid games, win stupid prizes, I guess.

[quote] I was driving my last relative home. I knew subconsciously that I was going to go back home to a quiet, empty house.... When my family was here this weekend, I didn't think about smoking or drinking....

OP, you anticipated feeling Lonely (another HALT word). Sounds like your family members do not drink and do not smoke, so you're lucky in that respect (you can be with them & not be pressured). Most of my family members quit smoking, but many of them drink.

R206 is the literal definition of ELABORATE SCENARIO TROLL.

R214 Yes that is correct, that side of my family is very healthy and tee-total which means that I can surround myself with them and not be tempted in anyway. The flip side was all of the "acting"and hiding that I did during this past year of chronic alcohol abuse which intensified my feelings of shame. But that's over... and yes I am very lucky in many respects regarding my sweet wholesome family!

And...I guess this is DAY 1 again.

r13/OP, how are you doing?

R217 Well.....first of all, thank you for asking. Seriously. How lovely of you! Means a lot to me.

But basically....I fucked up. I got so big for my britches, that I tried to create a whole AA thread here on DL, and it backfired. Because it was a very dumb idea. It's only because DL is the only site I post on, that I thought "Hey, let's all band together, those of us on the same page, let's do it here. Let's dedicate a thread to accountability and keeping track of one another.

But someone immediately reminded me that this is a place for bitchery and cuntery, not touchy-feely group accountability. I'm not being snarky. They were right. I was so embarrassed!!! And the shame and embarrassment left me in a weird headspace. So....I have been teetering on and off with everything since then. I've had some non-drinking days, and some drinking days. Still not bad like it was. Definitely not wake-and-drink. But like tonight, I bought a four-pack of cocktails and I"m on my third one. And I started smoking again, but only about three a day. It sucks because I was totally off everything, and I blew it by being so dumb...thinking I could just create a whole world of accountability and friendship on....a fucking gay gossip forum.

What I really want is real friends, or real in-person meetings. I hate zoom. I dunno. I feel embarrassed. I imagine there are AA forums and I should try that. I just feel most comfortable here. This is my home. Anyway, I guess I'm in limbo but it's not a horrible limbo. I'm on solid ground.

I know you hate Zoom but it is what is available now. You might want to bite the bullet and try it till f2f comes back.

R219 Yeah you are right. It's not as big of a deal as I'm making it. I have some social anxiety but it's not going to kill me to try. Thank you.

AA is not for everyone. But it is a good place to start.

OP - I am in a worse space than you with smoking and drinking because I am far from home and mostly stuck inside working. I am thinking of an online therapist. Obviously, there are some great ppl on DL and frankly it would be nice if there were separate sections...gossip, support, etc...but it is what it is. Most importantly we know we have an issue that HAS to change. For me, I know I am a f2f person and social, so work at home is kind of messing with me, but I know I have a problem and just bought a smartwatch and phone to pair with it and going walking counting steps and calories. Also, a thing to track how much I eat and smoke and drink. Sound tedious? Yeah, but it's a start.

R222 / Tedious Top (lol) -- I hear you!!!!!! I really do. Like you, I am realizing that being alone all the time is reaching a crisis point. Because when I engage with family or feel safe, my desire to drink and smoke goes down. Well I didn't even smoke until the pandemic. Not for 20 years. So yeah, it really is messing with us. Feeling "seen" equates, for me, to feeling safe. When it's just me, for several days in a row, I lose the will power to take care of myself.

I have some unhealed trauma that stems from childhood neglect. I was alone all the time, from a very young age. I often had to tuck myself in on a school night, even in first grade. So right now, being alone in a house in the cold dark of winter really is quite triggering. I get flashbacks of being alone in the house as an only child and feeling very scared and unsafe. I get a knot in my stomach and I just want to take the edge off and veg out however many ways that I can.

One night of drinking every once in a while is not the end of the world for most people. But for us, once you open that door, it's never just going to be "one night." It opens up Pandora's Box. I will think, what's the big deal, and go get a couple beers or whatever, and then if that goes well, I will think, hey, that didn't end in chaos, I could do it again sometime, but not soon." And then the next night, I'm running back to the store. But regular drinking starts to mess with my neurotransmitters and I end up with MORE anxiety and MORE loneliness. Rinse repeat.

When I stopped for the 13 days I was charting here, I was using DL to check in every day. My anxiety melted away. But...I got insomnia. So I was up until 5 am several nights in a row. And while I felt physically better, I was not accomplishing anything. I just hung out in my bedroom on my laptop, doing minimal work. I was scrolling DL or watching Netflix all day and night. It isn't like I sprung to life. I allowed myself to veg because... at least I wasn't drinking or smoking! But I was sleeping poorly. The underlying lack of safety was still unresolved.

I need to actually function. But I need to get to the root of my stuff. Which is so hard right now. It is SUCH an isolating time in the world. I hate online meetings. We need people. Face to face interaction. Support. Hugs. Reality checks. Places to go. Goals. Just simply quitting booze doesn't solve everything that was underneath it.

People on here have been amazing, but yeah, as you say...ultimately, this forum isn't set up for serving multiple purposes. It's a fun, gossip forum. With occasional sincere threads. I tried to start the support thread and instantly knew it was a bad call and that sent me on a shame spiral. I am grateful I'm holding it together and not getting trashed. I'm sipping on the remaining cocktail can from last night but I'm not buying more and I'm not trying to even get a buzz. I just feel a little uninspired right now. And lonely.

I hope your smartwatch provides you with some real accountability and organization to your days. I understand what you are going through. If you want to try not drinking tomorrow, I will do the same, and whether we check in or not on DL, I can think of you while I'm doing it. Accountability to someone or something outside of your own small self is, for me, THE most powerful tool to stay on track.

OP ISH SHOBER FOR SHTRECHESH BUT THEN IT SHNOWBALLSH

Thanks for stating the obviousch, Liza.

Hey! Its the OP. So, I Lizsha was absolutely corrects. I was sober for stretches but then it snowballed back.

Well, it's been 11 days of no drinking or smoking. And what I realized, is I really had to really REALLY see and feel tangibly, a new, better life without it. I had to want it so so badly that I was willing to experience temporary discomforts to get there. I had to recommit to my life in a loving, protective way, from the gut.

It cannot be all about accountability to others. Because then, you are giving your power away. Its a form of people pleasing.

This time, was FOR ME.

And it helps to start exercising immediately as part of reclaiming your new better, healthier, happier self.

This has been the best time of my life. I also suddenly have had so much good swoop into my life, including job opportunities and a love interest. But I HAD to make the choice this time, for ME. Out of a hunger for a better relationship with myself. Not to please or impress some outside authority. But out of self-love and the wish to be a better steward of my body, my life, and the blessings I have been given in this life.

Hope I can inspire even one person today.

Read "Drinking: A Love Story" - I think it's one of the best books about why we drink to excess, often times to cope with loneliness & sadness

I am not going to make an EST judgement. I am just putting my experience out there.

It is best to detox under the care of a medical professional, period. People have died detoxing. You don't have to do the 30 day vacation / rehab, but most people need a few days to stop the cycle.

Yes, you will hurt. Your body is used to getting the feel goods and once you remove that, there is an adjustment. I actually got gout for some reason. But your body was used to operating like a well oiled machine. Too well oiled.

Drinking fires the same dopamine that your body is used to for survival instincts. Eating and sex fire the same happy gas. The drinking moves from being a decision in your neocortex to being an essential in your middle brain, the Amygdala to be specific. So when you feel like the car is driving itself to the liquor store, it is actually your brain. And it won't listen to you. If you are a serious drinker, you will recognize the similarities between Parkinsons and alcoholism. It is why they shake.

If you manage to get off for 48 hours, I would suggest acamprosate (campral is the brand name). It helps to return your Gaba receptors back to normal. But it works best when coupled with group or individual counseling. I am one of the poor schlubs that did have 3 DUIs and had to attend AA per court order for a few years actually. I listened, but didn't pay attention. Once I cleaned up, I found AA a decent place to kill time. Yes, some of it is ridiculous. There are a lot of people there just for the attention. I just went for the show and I am a social person, so I found people there to talk about sports, current events, etc... In my experience, I have run into a lot of people who just want someone to talk to. Maybe I am one of them.

But you have to replace your drinking with something. I became a gym rat. This is quite common. I recommend AA because it makes you deal with what might be the real issues that are making you drink. But I support anybody who is trying to recover, by whatever fashion.

R228 - fell off the wagon when the pandemic hit and I had to move to Romania. I only drank seriously for 6 months back in the late 1990's after my late partner and the great love of my life succumbed to cancer. The weird part was how strong I was when taking care of him and how, when I found myself waking up and realizing the day would have to be without him, I shut down. I only saw drinking as the highlight of my day. However, at that time my parents and sister were young and supportive and I was young. Now, I am away from my family and friends and, though I don't dare complain when so many have died due to COVID or remained jobless and have a good living situation, I feel again as if alcohol is my only "highlight". I need to stop again but I feel as if, even when I go home, it will be an empty life. It's so easy to turn to a few glasses every night for comfort and wake up feeling guilty.

R228, not everyone needs to detox under the care of a medical professional - it depends on the person and how advanced their alcoholism is. I drank at least a bottle of wine every day for years, couldn't quit, and if I bought a bottle of whisky, vodka or similar, I would not be able to stop after a few drinks. So I definitely had a problem but did not get DTs or the shakes.

I was on a monthlong bender from about the middle of December 2020 to MLK weekend 2021. I woke up that Tuesday still drunk, and had to work. I struggled all day long to seem sober and unexpected calls came in and I had to jump on Zoom meetings that I kept the camera off for. I happened to have an appt with my shrink that day, that I couldn't cancel. He could tell I was drunk pretty much instantly.

I stopped that day. For the next three or four days, I couldn't keep any food down. I probably should have gone to a hospital or something. But where I am Covid has taken over everything. I puked and puked and puked and puked. I couldn't hold down water. I vomited up an apple. It was horrible.

I joined AA. I have a sponsor. It's been 88 days. So far, so good.

Second the recommendation of Drinking: A Love Story. Knapp writes well, and if there is one thing crucial about stopping drinking, it’s that moment of recognition when one alcoholic talks to another.

This is why everyone needs to do Sinclair method. White knuckling it and perpetually fighting biological cravings is noble - but leads to constant internal turmoil and, more often than not, a slip which is much more likely to devolve into an abyss of guilt and frequently even more extreme drinking.

Naltrexone will sever that biological tie between alcohol and your brain that is the driving force of addiction. AA is noble and abstinence impressive - but not sure why newer, scientific methods are ignored in favor of a 1940s pseudo-religion.

....

OP alcoholics drink because they are alcoholic. It's a nature and nurture thing. Some people biologically metabolize alcohol differently. If those same people have psychological issues (depression, anxiety, ill-formed social skills, stress management deficits) that’s a perfect storm for alcohol abuse.

Some people can leave half a glass of wine unfinished. Other people have to drink the whole bottle.

That’s why alcoholics drink. You may be one. Check out one of the zoom AA meetings. You can do it anonymously. Couldn’t hurt.

Oh baby. I just found this thread. OP, I'm in the same situation and many of these posts have great suggestions.

I'm going to try; I hope you do, too.

This thread helped me find my way to online AA meetings. I've been sober for 120 days. It's not a TON of time, but it's not nothing. If I can do it, you can too.

Why do you drink? Because it feels good! Drugs, alcohol, tobacco, etc. all are used because they feel good. Not that complicated. Why can't people stop? Lack of self-control, paired with emotional issues.

[quote] I woke up that Tuesday still drunk, and had to work. I struggled all day long to seem sober and unexpected calls came in and I had to jump on Zoom meetings that I kept the camera off for. I happened to have an appt with my shrink that day, that I couldn't cancel. He could tell I was drunk pretty much instantly.

Sounds like a nightmare and I've been through similar stuff. This is the worst, IMO, when your private drinking habit becomes apparent to others. I stopped drinking about 2 years ago. I work in the legal field and there are a lot of drinkers. It's hilarious (and sad) how people can figure out who the heavy drinkers are (amongst colleagues). I hope to never go back to my old ways.

Good luck to everybody trying to make a change.

Trying to change. I didn't drink at all for years and now fell off the wagon since they sent me abroad. I am uncertain about how long I will be here now that they outsourced jobs and let so many go back in the US. Horrible and stressful year. I feel like a loser but I cave into it each night. It's really put o the pounds in the last few months and I need to get my ass back in the shape I was in before.

Weight gain is a huge deterrent for me.

Weight gain from drinking or from not drinking, R241?

One thing you can look forward to by not drinking is that the skin on your face will look better. Not overnight, but in about 3 months, my face looked better.

Pretty much everything physical gets better. My blood pressure went down. My liver enzymes went back to normal. I lost weight. I slept better. My skin improved. I had more money.

The only thing is I'm not invited to anything any more. I can't figure out if its because everyone got tired of my drunkenness or no one wants a Sober Sally around.

I decided last week to give up drinking. I was just tired of feeling terrible the next day and that will be my motivation. I'm a Southern Comfort drinker and love the taste. I can have any other type of alcohol in the house and will not touch it. I've always wondered, do I drink because I'm depressed or am I depressed because I drink. Over the years I've also gained 30 pounds and hate the extra weight. This first week or two I am just going to concentrate on not drinking and slowly I will be adding exercising back to my routine. I saw a friend die from alcoholism and smoking and I don't want to be that person. I gave up smoking 7 years ago.

I've cut way back this year. On average, I now go about 10 days without a drink. Unfortunately, when I then treat myself, it hits me harder and the hangover is worse. I'm still recovering from too much wine on Saturday. It takes me about three days to feel really normal again.

I drink too much wine— probably 3 bottles a week. But there have been times in early pandemic when it was more like a bottle per day.

The person who said it’s their only way to “treat” themselves was right on. Ive lost so many things I used to enjoy. I don’t enjoy reading any more (grad school destroyed that), movies are shit, I don’t even watch tv which I used to enjoy as lame as that sounds. No restaurants. Friends have been pretty flaky, don’t return calls. So the wine becomes the only thing I look forward to.

Also, I have some family responsibilities that are overwhelming. I take care of a family member who is very controlling and demanding. I’m with her from 6am until 9:00pm 4 days a week.

On those days, I can’t even get my work done because this person constantly interrupts and won’t tolerate my attention being off of them for any length of time. It’s oppressive, but I also feel terrible for feeling this way.

Anyway, my point is on those days the wine is literally the only thing I have that’s just for me. I get very belligerent (in my head) if I can’t have it.

It’s a mess.

R246 The caretaker role is very hard. Maybe it would help to think of this as a temporary situation. Try to cut back just a little bit for starters, to feel better?

Thank you r246, you are very kind. I am cutting back and feel much better. But I need to find something fun to replace it. I think that would help a lot.

Meant to reply to r247.

R248 I've been there. It did pass.

I visited a friend recently who is now basically 3 and half years sober. she'll take a sip of wine, but it no longer appeals. she agrees than complete abstinence is best. but doesn't judge friends who drink. she thinks AA is nonsense

Switch to a liquid cannabis THC/CBD cocktail. Delightful and no calories or hangovers!

Alcohol is just distilled liquid from grain and fruit. Isn't the liquid mostly sugars? Why is alcohol destruction for so many?Is alcoholism a form of diabetes?

It can be

BUMP! Hi everyone! OP here.

Suffice it to say, I haven't been on Datalounge for a long time. At the time I stepped away, I was legitimately burned out on forums. in hindsight, it was an important outlet for me. As silly as it feels to admit, this IS a community, and I actually was getting a lot out of spending time on here. Between working from home, eschewing social media, having no local family and no close friends near me, and the pandemic trauma drama, it would seem that when I stepped away from DL I lost the one semblance of a reliable, accessible community that I had. Glad to be back.

MY UPDATE:

During the first half of 2021, I was very invested in quitting. I was motivated to quit and I cared deeply about wanting to be a healthier version of myself. I would have some successes, like a week here, two weeks there. I just couldn't figure out how to make it stick. Once the novel joy of waking up every day shame-free started to recede, that old niggle would inevitably rear it's head -- typically in the afternoon when my blood sugar was dipping. And then instead of just eating a snack like a normal person, I would give in to the niggle and go buy some booze. I'd delude myself into thinking I could manage folding a drink here and there back in. Why would I ever go back to daily drinking, right? And thus, another cycle of drinking would rev up.

And of course as you all know, once you are fully ensconced in a hangover-shame phase, drinking feels like the only way to cope with how shitty you feel...from the drinking.

Then, at the end of August, I woke up one morning, cringing once again at the latest batch of unhinged texts I didn't remember sending the night before. I felt fed up and ashamed enough to finally scream "NO MORE!" I stopped that day. Started doing Orange Theory, and long hikes multiple times a week. I was losing weight, my face looked younger, no more bloat. I had energy and drive. God, I felt amazing! I could not imagine that I would ever go back to drinking again. I did it. Phew.

Fast forward six weeks: I had that niggle suddenly come over me one afternoon out of the blue. I was arrogant enough to think I could "treat" myself to an IPA after my workout without consequence. The next day I had two, and the next day three. Soon I was drinking heavily again. Stopped working out. It was like I had never stopped.

So at this point, I stopped caring. I stopped hoping. I felt like it was hopeless and I started to feel SO isolated from the rest of the functional world, that my sense of my own worth as a member of the human family basically disappeared. So there was no longer a reason to try. I didn't matter.

That went on from about November to April. Things really in March. Relationships stress, a dying parent and work pressures sent me over the edge. I ended up in the ER three times in six weeks due to alcohol poisoning. The first two times didn't phase me, but the third time, they sent a crisis person to my gurney to talk to me, and I guess that made things feel real.

Slowly I am beginning to wake back up. My fight has started to return. I know that I am not THAT PERSON. I'm not broken, and I'm not worthless. I know that there is a very different version of me, worthy of happiness, health and love. I love myself. I am not prepared to go out like this. I'm only 50. I could still have an amazing second act, and it seems within reach.

AS OF TODAY: I am not yet sober, but my drinking is way down. I don't drink every single day. Yesterday I caved. Today I feel confident I can make it until bedtime without drinking. I am awake and aware. I've also set some new healthy boundaries with certain relationships that were draining me. I am making changes in my life that reflect my worth, such as moving to a nicer home this summer, and finding more satisfying work. Realizing that the drinking is simply conditioned habit and not a "treat" helps somewhat. But the biggest challenge for me still, is what to do when that little niggle kicks in all of a sudden. As someone on DL said recently, the anticipation of the drink is more of a driver than the actual drink, and the niggle is the way I get that dopamine hit of anticipation. So maybe it's as simple as locating a new thing to anticipate...a new dopamine activator...and substituting alcohol with that. Whatever it is.

So, yeah. I am still dealing with this. But I have renewed hope. I KNOW that quitting drinking is not a form of deprivation, but freedom. I NKOW that sobriety makes my life WORK. I KNOW that when I am sober, my shame and depression goes away. I KNOW that when I stop drinking, I immediately shift back to the person I really am and am proud to be.

Reading the struggles of others is a comfort, and hearing about the success stories of others is a huge source of motivation. Keep 'em coming.

Seriously try cannabis. Game changer.

I have a drink most days, but only one, & am circumspect & measure exactly. I have what I’d call OCD when it comes to not throwing away food (or liquor). Cleaning out my cabinet I found ancient near-empty bottles of triple sec, kirsch, & Amaretto, & am having my daily drink to throw out the bottles.

I made margaritas with the triple sec & have moved on to the kirsch, which I’m adding grenadine to, though it tastes like cough medicine (I only do mixed drinks).

I’ll probably move onto the Amaretto by Tuesday & am thinking of putting it in coffee, over ice cream, or just adding to milk.

My grandmother was an alcoholic & my sister went through a phase of being a blackout drunk, so I’m leery of it. For me it’s all about the taste, I don’t really get drunk or buzzed from one drink. I try to match my drink with what I’m eating for dinner.

When I see people drinking in films, my mouth sometimes waters. But on days I don’t drink, like during cleanses or diets, I don’t really miss it.

I had a coworker who was a severe alcoholic, quit it cold turkey style, but became a gambling addict. She hated AA & thought people who went were fake & wanted attention, & was really hardcore anti-alcohol, saying that anyone who drinks in any capacity is an alcoholic. She even would say so and so “does alcohol” like it’s heroin or meth. Most of her work friends were partiers & if they’d so much as talk about drinking, she’d flounce off in a huff.

I guess people drink for different reasons; if it’s affecting your life in a negative way, seek help.

Cheers! 🍻🍷🍸🍹🍺🥂🍾

Any update OP R257?

I’m on day 10 of no alcohol. I’m 37 and this is the longest stretch of not drinking that I’ve had since my early 20’s. After 10 consecutive days I still get the cravings but I can actually say that my desire to not drink outweighs my desire to drink.

Hi R261 I just came back to this thread just now because it seems that the thread has had a longevity and an impact I didn't anticipate but I am so happy if it has helped sustain a dialogue and offer support.

I was thinking of starting a new thread, a sequel, named "I FOUND OUT WHY I DRINK" lol. Because I think I did figure it out.

I'll explain in the next post.

I've been in a yearlong out-patient program, I'm at week 50 of 52 weeks. I have two coaches, a therapist and a case manager. The goal has of course been to maintain sobriety, and they do urine tests every two weeks, but if you slip, they don't call it a relapse. The call it a recurrence, and nothing punitive happens.

I have been mostly sober during this time, although I have had a few drinks here and there. But for me, the goal changed over time from "I have to stay away from this devil substance" to really, really digging deep and trying to understand what needs are chronically unmet, what wounds have been festering inside of me for so long, and just growing a deeper sense of authenticity, vulnerability, self-worth, all that good stuff.

What I have realized is that I had become conditioned to feel like my feelings and needs don't matter. I don't matter. This is rooted in early childhood. I have had a running narrative that when I have a feeling or a need that is inconvenient for others, there is a terror of being abandoned or punished. I have feared being an inconvenience to others my entire life. I have an anxious attachment style and social anxiety in general. I discovered that I am gripped with terror that if I put myself first, or put myself out there, or stand up for myself, then I will be crucified. So I became a people-pleaser. You wouldn't be able to detect any of this by looking at how I behave in social situations. But in my intimate relationships and deeper connections with friends and family, it's a constant thread that runs through my entire adult life.

Because it is all I knew, I also have always chosen partners who are emotionally anxious-avoidant, who don't open up, who freak out if I try to initiate a discussion about feelings or needs. Their fear and defensiveness around emotional communication, the stuff that is really normal and necessary relationship work, further conditioned and reinforced that I was wrong, or bad, to want to express a need.

I found early on in my teens, that drinking alcohol allowed me to be more outgoing and confident. To take social risks, go on dates, say yes to relationships, and to have sex - which are all things I would have been terrified to face sober.

So my maladaptive drinking was twofold: 1) it numbed the fear of rejection so that I could engage both in the world at large generally, and to have the courage to be with people intimately, and 2) it soothed the roiling cauldron of unmet childhood needs, soothed the shame that I was undeserving, soothed the sting when my attempts to approach my partner with a need were rebuked.

And here's the real kicker: if I fundamentally don't matter as a human being, and that's my working premise, then...why would it matter if I am healthy or not? Why would it matter if I drink or not? Why would it matter if I drink myself to death or not? It wouldn't.

So here I am, now, realizing all of this stuff. And I can say that at this point, the drinking, the actual alcohol itself, is so much less of the enemy, than these tenacious beliefs and fears that I have uncovered. The alcohol was just a learned coping tool, it's not my foe. If I were to remain sober, and still not deal with the underlying issues that started me on this path of self-medicating at age 15, I will just replace alcohol with another maladaptive coping strategy: food, or porn, screens, excessive spending, etc.

I don't even really get phased now if I have a drink. Which is rare. But if I do, I just have compassion for myself that hey, whatever. It's just a drink. And it doesn't spiral out of control now like it was doing before when I started this thread. Alcohol has lost its power over me. Because I've seen behind the curtain and I'm working on healing the real issues every day of my life. I see that I have damage, and it wasn't my fault, but it is my responsibility as an adult to take care of myself and manage it. Not manage my drinking. Manage ME. My inner landscape.

And yeah, I matter. And so do you.

^^^^ Love from OP ^^^^

R264 that sounds exactly like me. Are you still sober, or do you occasionally enjoy a drink now?

R266 checked out before the last paragraph...

R266, As I was saying in my magnum opus (lol) I can enjoy a drink now and then. I can choose it, rather than it choosing me, because I'm not fixated on it anymore. I'm fixated on my inner world, and one being responsive to and responsible for my feelings.

However, I still generally find I rarely choose it now, because it just seems superfluous to my goals and aims for my day, or my week, or my life.

So like, I did drink Saturday night, because I had worked hard all week and had received some amazing good news and positive feedback about a work matter. And I haven't done anything remotely fun or freeing all summer. So I said, aww fuck it, let's do it.

I also had a lot of texts to catch up on, phone calls to make, and the alcohol smoothed me out so that I could pick up the phone to, for instance, call my father, whom I rarely talk to for reasons that are well known to him. I knew exactly what I was doing, and why I was using the drink to facilitate the call. I was terrified of calling him,. but I was in control of the means by which I chose to make the call happen. And it was, weirdly, the best phone call we've had in years, and we talked for two hours. I didn't keep drinking while on the phone. I had a couple of strong canned cocktails while listing to some fun "woo hoo it's Saturday night!" music, celebrated the week and the summer weather, and then I called my dad, and that was that.

Having said that, I was then kind of tired on Sunday. And that's fine for Sunday, but it's not gonna fly to feel like that during my week. Nothing and no one could ever get me to go back to feeling sludgy and hungover during a weekday. I just simply refuse. I'm literally bored at the thought of drinking and then not being able to function in all these other ways that I want and need to function. It's not compelling now because I have these other clear goals I'm working towards, and I think I just don't require that crutch now. I probably won't drink again for several weeks, if not months.

I big boy now.

R1 you really helped me with what you wrote there. I've cut down my drinking from at least once a week (excessively) to a few times over the last year.

Getting to grips with why you drink and seeing it as just a temporary solution can really make a difference

If you drink when you really don't want to, drink when you're hungover from before, drink when it seriously undermines your best interest, and when it destroys your most cherished relationships and jeopardizes your career, YOU ARE AN ALCOHOLIC. If you can tell you are getting sick chronically (cardio, skin, gut, vascular, lungs, teeth) and can't seem to help yourself get better, YOU ARE AN ALCOHOLIC. If you drink yourself into a blackout, lose an appreciable amount of time, and find bad or crazy things happened that you can't explain, if you find that your thinking seems confused and only terrorizes you instead of calming you down, if you have the shakes very badly so it becomes a chore to walk, dress, shave, or eat, YOU ARE CLOSE TO THE END MY FRIEND. Look on the bright side! Another ten or fifteen years of this and things should take care of themselves. Maybe some kids will set you on fire when they run across you passed out. Maybe your esophageal varices wil rupture and you'll bleed out. Be proud, Jack Kerouac died this way. Maybe you'll fall off a boat. Oh, wait, I guess there isn't any bright side. If all this seems attractive to you, go right on, mate! Cheers!

The OP posted this thread two years and eight months ago.